B (2:39)

CBP officers are performing their duties in a challenging environment under tremendous circumstances, but they're trying to do it with professionalism. If they don't, they'll be dealt with like any other federal agency. We have standards of conduct. They are sworn law enforcement officers working tirelessly to enforce our country's border security, immigration laws, protection, protecting the interests of our country and preventing dangerous people from walking the streets of this nation when.

A (3:12)

They'Re not saying they will be held accountable. So very interesting stuff happening right now. The administration is desperately looking for a narrative shift. It's potentially getting one. Democrats are still holding firm. I spoke to Dr. Erin Stevens and OB GYN in a Minneapolis based hospital this afternoon. I need you to hear what she has to say because it is very serious about how literally pregnant women who have high risk pregnancies are afraid to go to the hospital right now because of what ICE is doing. Giving birth by themselves in their own homes. That is terrifying. Make sure to like, comment, share and subscribe. Here is my interview with Dr. Stevens. I am super excited and honored today to be joined by Dr. Erin Stevens who's a Minneapolis St. Paul based hospital, OBGYN and a member of the Committee to protect healthcare. Now Dr. Stevens, I just want to talk to you. What is the feeling right now on the ground in Minneapolis hospitals as ICE agents and CBP agents continue to conduct enforcement throughout the Twin Cities?

C (4:06)

Yeah, it's really a mix of kind of tension, fear, uncertainty. I think uncertainty is the best way to sum it up. We're not sure where this is going to go, how long this is going to linger on and continue to impact our patients in a negative way.

A (4:23)

Are your patients at all fearful of coming to the hospital in these times?

C (4:29)

Yeah, absolutely. We definitely know in like office based, clinic based settings, patients are calling to cancel appointments or just not showing up. They're asking to convert to telehealth in the hospitals themselves. We know patients are scared to come in. We have patients asking how they can get care at home. How can they maybe support a home birth instead of having to come to the hospital doors. So we're really worried about healthcare access being obstructed by this ICE intimidation and violence.

A (4:56)

Well, I do want to ask you about ICE specifically. Are ICE agents going into hospitals right now in Minneapolis, Is that what's happening?

C (5:02)

Yes, definitely. And I think the hard part is what they're saying is they're only going in if someone is in their custody. But we definitely have reports of that happening. Otherwise, that someone might not actually be in custody, yet they're following them in to try to get them in custody. The spaces they're entering might not be spaces they are allowed to be in. They then also have exposure to other patients, other states, staff members who might be immigrants in the hospital. And so that's part of the uncertainty too, is why are they coming in? Are they supposed to be there, where can they go? And how do we keep everyone safe?

A (5:37)

Can hospitals do anything to prevent agents from coming in the doors?

C (5:41)

Yeah, absolutely. I think each hospital system is trying to solidify, strengthen protocols so that they know exactly what to do when an ICE agent shows up. But there aren't great guidelines federally on exactly how that should go. Previously, there were protections for hospitals, clinics, hospital grounds, even those were spaces that were protected from ICE activity and they're no longer. And so I think we would really like to see that come back, that those ICE agents can't come there at all. And no matter what the protocol is, I think it's very intimidating to have an ICE agent come in, try to be accessing patients and other people. What do you, as an individual health provider say? What power do you have to really have them follow those directions?

A (6:26)

I do want to ask you, since you're an OB gyn, have you seen these ICE enforcement raids and activities impact maternal care in the community?

C (6:35)

Yeah, definitely. So as far as I know, they haven't been on any actual labor and delivery units, which is great. But if they're in the hospital, outside the hospital, or obstructing that pathway from home to the hospital, you. It doesn't matter where exactly they are, they're in the hospital. Patients particularly, even patients who we know have complications in the pregnancy already, who are seeing high risk OB doctors and need to be seen at a more frequent rate, sometimes up to twice a week. We need to do monitoring for the babies in high risk circumstances. Those patients aren't showing up or they're asking, is there a way to do this type of special monitoring at home? And that's really scary when there's already a known complication and patients. Patients aren't accessing their care. But the whole point of prenatal care is so that we can catch things before they become bad. So if people aren't showing up to that routine care either that's a setup for bad circumstances. Anecdotally, at least in my labor and delivery triage units and others of colleagues, they've noticed just a lower volume of people coming in for urgent concerns as well. So even when people are scared about something like bleeding or contractions, they're not sure if it's labor. Something else is going on that they're worried about. They're not coming to the hospital. They're kind of trying to figure it out at home. And we know that people are trying to access supportive circumstances for home birth. And there's probably many who are going it alone who are just having birth in their own homes without anybody there to support them. There was a patient, we had a press conference here a couple weeks ago, and one of the doctors shared that one of her patients had stopped showing up for prenatal appointments. They couldn't get a hold of her, so they sent a nurse to her house. And the patient was alone in her home in active labor, 8cm dilated. Like that is terrifying to imagine for anybody, even if you've gone through it before. Like that is a vulnerable, scary circumstance to be doing all by yourself.

A (8:24)

I guess my question is then, what if someone is watching this and they say, well, I'm terrified. I don't want to go. What should they do?

C (8:30)

Yeah. So right now, kind of our directives in general are first reaching out to if they have a health care provider that they've already been seeing, reach out to them to see if they have alternative options for care. Is there something that can be done either at home or via telehealth, or do they have resources to try to support that patient in transportation to the hospital, in making sure there's protections in place? Second step is if it's not possible within your own health system, going to existing systems that we know exist for home care and various alternative forms of care. So making sure we're using the systems that we already have and not putting patients at risk if it's unnecessary.

A (9:07)

Now, I do want to get your take on another issue that's been really talked about lately, and that is in the eight minutes after Renee Goode was shot and killed, she still had a weak pulse, but ambulances weren't allowed in, physicians weren't allowed in. What is your take from a medical perspective? Could something have changed? Could Renee Goode be potentially alive today if there was immediate medical intervention?

C (9:27)

I, you know, obviously we can't say anything with certainty, but there would at least have been a chance in emergent circumstances like that the sooner that we can perform cpr, do resuscitative measures, the better outcomes people are going to have. And knowing that there was a doctor on site who was trying to access her or at least tell them what to do, you know, I understand that secure the scene or whatever. I. I've had that said to me many, many times on social media at this point, you need to secure the scene. But he was at least saying, hey, let's try to control the bleeding. Someone check a pulse, someone start doing cpr. And nobody was doing that. And even with Alex Preddy as well, there was a physician on site there, walked up to the victim when they finally let them through, and. And the victim had been repositioned to count bullet wounds rather than position in a safe way to perform cpr. No one was doing cpr. No one was checking a pulse. No one was doing the standard things you do when someone is in that circumstance and has a life threatening situation. They were just kind of left to die.

A (10:30)

I mean, I think that's very hard to hear. Now, before I let you go, I do just want to talk to you generally about the feeling right now in Minneapolis and just across the Twin Cities. How is the community rallying together in this moment that you've seen?

C (10:42)

Yeah, yeah. While there is that sense of kind of fear and apprehension and uncertainty, there is so much hope and so much strength in the community coming together in so many wonderful ways. I mean, there's community choirs and craft nights and things where people are just, hey, let's do the things we love and try to support others. There are donation drives, food drives. There are people, parents kind of patrolling outside of the schools to protect people, pick up and drop off from ice activity. There are physicians and other healthcare workers coming together to figure out how do we deliver prescriptions to people, how do we deliver groceries, how do we transport people to care? So no matter what the problem or obstruction is, there are people who are really rallying together to try to solve that problem and amplify systems that are in place to help people out. And I think that's really wonderful and hopeful to see.

A (11:32)

Well, Dr. Stevens, thank you so much for taking a few minutes to join me today.

C (11:35)

Absolutely. Thanks so much for having me.

A (11:37)

Hey, folks, thanks so much for watching. Feel free to add this podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or anywhere you watch for the latest breaking news and daily hits throughout the day. Make sure to follow. Subscribe. See you soon for more.