Hour 3: Disaster Zone

Summary

The Paul Finebaum Show – Hour 3: “Disaster Zone”

Date: July 29, 2026
Host: Paul Finebaum (ESPN)
Special Guest: Matt Hayes
Main Theme: SEC college football analysis, listener calls focused on prison/hospital access to SEC Network, and candid discussions about coaching turmoil, program futures, and hot topics in the SEC.

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into two distinct but intertwined themes:

1. Listener Stories: Unusual listener tales about following college football—and the Paul Finebaum Show—from prisons and hospitals, sparking frank talk about prison conditions in Alabama and access to sports programming.
2. SEC Coaching Hot Seats: With Matt Hayes, Paul breaks down major coaching drama, notably Bill Belichick’s disastrous stint at North Carolina, roster mismanagement, and big-picture worries at Alabama and Florida. Appraisals of Lane Kiffin and new Florida coach John Sumrall round out the substantive football talk.

The hour is filled with memorable calls, behind-the-scenes anecdotes from Paul, and a signature mix of humor, candor, and analytical insight.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. SEC Network Access—Prisons and Hospitals

• Access Issues: Multiple callers (Frank, Mitch, Swamp Dog, James) detail the challenges of watching or listening to the SEC Network from different institutions.
  • Frank: Explains the difference between honor camps (where inmates can watch TV and follow sports) and regular prisons (radio only), noting how inmates are devoted Finebaum listeners ([01:07]–[02:38]).
  • Mitch: Shares his frustration about not getting the SEC Network after a heart attack in an SEC town hospital in Knoxville, saying it led to the "only day I've missed since 2015" ([03:34]–[03:58]).
  • Paul’s Take: “Hospitals and hotels usually have the worst TV selection… just your random hotel usually has very few television selections.” ([04:09])

Notable Quote

• Frank: “The ones that's in the regular prison is walking the track with their headphones on listening to you… they can tell you everything word for word you say on that show, Adam.” ([01:26])

2. Prison Conditions in Alabama

• James: Candidly describes the corruption, poor living conditions, and lack of mental health resources in Alabama prisons ([08:51]–[11:36]).
  • Highlights issues like overcrowding, violence, and collusion with some correctional officers.
  • Claims, “The COs are gangsters… They kick you out of your rack to where you have no place to go… a lot of these people are sleeping on the floor.” ([10:21]–[10:58])
  • On system oversight: “They turn their head. They count on it.” ([11:15])
• Paul: Vows to “clean this mess up,” treating callers’ stories seriously, providing a platform for unheard voices ([12:24]).

Notable Quote

• James: “There are some good people in prison, Paul… they’ll beat the hell out of you, lock you up and hide you…” ([11:36])

3. Jeopardy! ESPN Special—Why Not Paul?

• Swamp Dog brings up ESPN’s sports trivia “Jeopardy” special and laments Paul wasn’t on it. Paul recounts nearly being on the show before plans fizzled ([05:44]–[07:17]).
  • Swamp Dog: “I don't think any of them know more about… the wide world of sports as Paul Finebaum does.”
  • Paul: “I think I would have won. I think I would have won the whole thing.” ([07:31])

4. SEC Coaches—Turmoil & High Stakes

A. Bill Belichick’s UNC Disaster (w/ Matt Hayes)

• Paul & Matt Hayes dissect the chaos:
  • Matt: “He’s had two chances to build a roster at North Carolina and he's signed 130 players… that's gotta be a high percentage of failure on those first 70.” ([25:11]–[26:10])
  • Paul wonders how long before Belichick admits coming to college was a “bad move” ([26:10]–[26:37]).
  • Matt: “I think North Carolina could absolutely fire him after this year… give him his 10 million and that's it. Bye bye.” ([27:11])

B. Kaylen DeBoer/Alabama’s Uncertainty

• Matt on DeBoer: Expresses skepticism—questioning doubling down with huge money and job security after “8 losses in two years” and few signs of turnaround ([27:53]–[29:32]).
  • “This is year three. He’s got a brand new quarterback… If they lose four games again, what does that say?” ([29:32])
• Bash (Caller): Asks if Alabama risks becoming a “basketball school” after years of 4-loss seasons ([33:24]–[37:42]).
  • Paul strongly rebuffs: “That kind of talk is for losers... Alabama is one of the greatest football schools of all time.” ([37:42])

C. Lane Kiffin at LSU

• Matt: Drama “overshadowed” his coaching ability. Notes Kiffin’s high salary, lack of power conference titles, missed playoff opportunities with Ole Miss, but praises his recent growth ([30:53]–[31:55]).

D. Florida Football Under John Sumrall

• Matt: Praises Sumrall’s popularity and locker room presence, but stresses it won’t matter without on-field success ([31:55]–[32:55]).
  • “At the end of the day, he's got to win… majority of the fan base is bought in… but when the team gets on the field, I got to win games.”

5. Paul’s Personal Prison Story

• Paul recounts his own (brief) time inside a prison facility as part of a grand jury, describing a moment when guards overreacted as he interacted with an inmate:
  • “All of a sudden… one of them over there is making lunch and he starts waving at me… I started walking over to… him and like six guards jumped in front of me.” ([18:02]–[19:07])
  • Memorable moment: “That guy wasn't going to do any more than talk football with me, but… we didn't need six guns out because I’m over there talking to somebody in prison.”

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Timestamps for Major Segments

| Segment | Time | |-----------------------------------------|-------------| | SEC Network in Prisons/Hospitals | 00:45-04:46 | | SEC Jeopardy & Paul’s Non-Appearance | 05:44-07:37 | | Alabama Prison Conditions (James) | 08:45-12:24 | | Paul’s Grand Jury Prison Visit Story | 18:02-19:25 | | Callers on SEC Teams, Rehabilitation | 14:02-17:12 | | Clarifications on Black Adders | 20:02-23:03 | | Bill Belichick at UNC (Matt Hayes) | 24:35-27:24 | | Alabama Under DeBoer, Buyout Concerns | 27:53-29:32 | | Lane Kiffin’s Status at LSU | 30:28-31:55 | | Florida’s John Sumrall, Hopes/Concerns | 31:55-32:55 | | Alabama “Basketball School?” debate | 33:13-38:55 |

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Notable Quotes

• Paul Finebaum (on Alabama’s future):
  “Alabama is one of the greatest football schools of all time. And if it's not a football school, then it needs changes. This is not the old days when basketball… was enough. Basketball is very important, but it's not football.” ([37:42])
• Matt Hayes (on Belichick):
  “You hire this guy because of his football knowledge and clearly it’s not working.” ([26:10])
• Frank (Caller, on prison listenership):
  “They're walking the track with their headphones on listening to you… they can tell you everything word for word you say on that show.” ([01:26])
• James (Caller, on Alabama prisons):
  “There's like homelessness in prison… they kick you out of your rack to where you have no place to go… a lot of these people are sleeping on the floor.” ([10:38])
• Swamp Dog (on Paul missing ESPN Jeopardy):
  “I don't think any of them know more about… sports as Paul Finebaum does.” ([06:53])
• Matt Hayes (on DeBoer’s job security):
  “That's 60, 70 million dollars to make somebody go if they don't… That's hard to imagine, actually.” ([28:08])
• Paul Finebaum (on SEC program identity):
  “That kind of talk [becoming a basketball school] is for losers… Alabama is one of the greatest football schools of all time.” ([37:42])

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Tone & Style

• Authentic and Unfiltered: Callers are blunt, often humorous, and unafraid to discuss sensitive topics (prison, hospital stays, corruption).
• Paul’s Signature Balance: Mixes deadpan humor, empathy, and sharp football analysis, handling offbeat callers and serious topics with equal skill.
• Matt Hayes: Analytical, candid, focusing on hard data (track records, wins/losses, contracts).

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Takeaways for Listeners

• SEC Network fandom knows no bounds—including prisons, hospitals, everywhere in the South.
• Serious issues in Alabama’s prison system surfaced through raw listener testimony, highlighting a side of fandom rarely discussed.
• Coaching volatility is at an all-time high: From Belichick’s failed experiment, to DeBoer’s uncertain future at Alabama, to the pressure on Florida and LSU, the SEC is a pressure cooker—big money, big expectations.
• Alabama football remains a sacred identity—despite current doubts, most agree that “basketball school” talk is blasphemous in Tuscaloosa.
• Paul’s community, both on air and off, is a weird and wonderful family—for many, the show is more than sports: it’s a lifeline.

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Transcript

[Commercial Announcer]

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[Paul Feinbaum]

the pride, passion and pageantry of college football lives here. This is the Paul Feinbaum Show. Our three podcasts this Might Be College

[Frank (Caller)]

Football

[Paul Feinbaum]

and welcome back. And we'll talk to Matt Hayes coming up here in just a few minutes. We were talking to Frank a minute ago. I'm not sure we finished that call. Frank, you back?

[Frank (Caller)]

Yeah, I just want to straighten something up. The Josh guy from Alabama called talking about the prisoners couldn't get ESPN and

[Caller/Listener]

they couldn't get the hospital, right?

[Frank (Caller)]

No, the prisoners at the under camps and the work releases can get it because they contribute. But if you in a regular prison in Alabama, you can't get it, basically honor camp or a work release. And I guarantee you the people that run slick pics in there, in there right now, they watch you. And the ones that's in the regular prison is walking the track with their headphones on listening to you, because that's the ones that listen to you. And they can tell you everything word for word you say on that show, Adam.

[Paul Feinbaum]

So you, you. So Frank, you can listen to the radio in prison, is that right?

[Frank (Caller)]

Right. Right. That's the first thing you buy when you hit Kilby, is you get your little radio, little Sony radio used to be. And you listen to the gangs all the time because when they took cable out of the regular prison, that's all you had to listen to, was the radio. But the regular at the regular camps, like Donaldson, Draper, Limestone, any of those camps, they're walking the track with their headphones on listening to you right now. If you had a worklose or honor camp and you're, you're in camp right now, they're watching you and every one of the ones are on the slick pics and the gangs in there can't tell you word for word what you said today

[Caller/Listener]

that might not sound.

[Paul Feinbaum]

What, what, what, what do they let you watch in those prisons?

[Frank (Caller)]

Soap operas, cartoons.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Okay.

[Frank (Caller)]

And news. That's it. And okay, the sports time. That's it. Because one TV's on sports, the other zone of the soap operas.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Okay. Hey, well, Frank, thank you. Thank you very much for sharing that with us. Okay. Keep that in mind. Yeah. Hey, thanks for the call. I don't know what happened to you, but we, we appreciate Mitch is up next in Tennessee. Hey, Mitch. Hey, Mitch.

[Mitch (Caller)]

Hey, let's talk about not having the SEC network in the hospitals.

[James (Caller)]

Why?

[Mitch (Caller)]

Had a heart attack on February 26th and they sent me the Knoxville and Knoxville didn't have the SEC network and it's a SEC town.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Yeah, that makes no sense at all.

[Mitch (Caller)]

Yeah, I couldn't believe that Knoxville didn't have the SEC network. It's the only day I've missed since 2015.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Hey, thanks for the call. Now let me explain. In the city of Knoxville, you can get the SEC network, of course. And I'll repeat this, and I don't, I've never been in hospital administration, but hospitals and hotels usually have the worst TV selection. Not, not high end hotels, but just your, your random hotel usually has very few television selections. Swamp Dog is up next.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

Good afternoon, Paul. Thanks for taking my call, man. Hey, I never been in prison or anything and I hear a lot of talk about that I have been in jail several times and that nobody's fault but mine. I, I, I deserve to be there when I was there, but thank. Thankfully I've never had to go to actual prison. But what I want to talk to you about is that this, this new show that's coming up that I've been watching, I've been hearing about is called Jeopardy. ESPN Jeopardy Show. I want to know if they asked you to be take part in that. You know, it's, it's all about sports as a Jeopardy in the form of the Jeopardy. Game show, and it's all about sports. Today they asked Paul Fine bomb, do you want to take part in this? I would think that they would. I know you got a business, you

[Paul Feinbaum]

know, Swamp Dog, it's funny, it's funny you bring that up. This was all going on in May, so I get a call from my boss who asked me, he said, can you be. This was like on a Tuesday. He said, can you be in Los Angeles Friday afternoon? And I checked with our guys, Jamari and Danny, and we had it worked out. So for about three days, I was, I was in the plan, in the, in the process of making plans, and then they put it off and then that was it. I was never, I was never contacted again. So I was, I was on the ESPN Jeopardy. For about two, about two minutes.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

Well, I would think that you would be one of the best contestants on that show. I look around and I see, well, who the people are gonna be there. I don't think any of them know more about, you know, the wide world sports as Paul Findmob does. I think you'd be great on there if you could do it because you got the time to do it. I, I figured your job.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Well, here's the problem. It's. It's already been, it's already been done. They taped it. And this was like in the middle of May as a second week of May, and then like the third, fourth week, so he had to go back twice. I don't. Listen, I, I forgot all about it until the other day when I saw Joe Buck on tv. But yeah, I guess it would have been fun. I don't know. But it didn't happen.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

Hey, hey, let me ask you this. Now, just be honest with me. How do you think you, you would compete if you were there with all these other people? That's all on there. How do you think you would stack up against them? Your knowledge and their knowledge?

[Paul Feinbaum]

I think I, I think, I think I would have won. I think I would have won the whole thing.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

I think you would too. I, you know, ever since I saw that, I said, man, why ain't they got Paul Vine Bomb on there? You know, I know Paul. Paul smart guy, you know, I know that, man. Dude, I think I know a lot about music. You know more about music than I do and you know more about sports than I do. But I like to compete with you about it anyhow.

[Caller/Listener]

But I, I would.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

I, I said to myself, man, they got to get Paul Fine bomb on that thing because I've heard all these. I know these other people are good too. You know, I've seen, you know, Hannah Storm and Jay Harris and, you know, people like that. I know, I know they know their stuff, but, uh, I ain't never seen anybody knows your stuff any better than Paul Fine Bob does. Because you gotta. You got one heck of a memory, man. And when it comes to history of any kind of sport, you seem to have every answer there is available. I don't know how you do it, man, but I love you to death, Paul. And I. I appreciate you.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Thank you, Swamp Dog. I appreciate it. And if I, if I end up doing it again next year, I'll make sure I take you with me. James is up next in Alabama.

[James (Caller)]

Hey, Paul, how you doing?

[Paul Feinbaum]

Hey there.

[James (Caller)]

Hey, I was calling. You've been talking about this Alabama prison stuff. You doing a show in prison or whatever. Yeah, that will never happen. Alabama prisons Are so. Because the prisons. So they're so corrupt. You will never. They won't let you in there to sit. Not unless K ivey built. Yeah, well, she's in the process of building that mega prison.

[Matt Hayes]

That would be the only way you'd get in.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Well, don't forget, James, as I'm sure there will be a new governor here in a couple of months and we. We. I don't know. I don't know Kay very well, but I do know that I do know the next governor.

[Caller/Listener]

I hope so.

[James (Caller)]

I mean, look, I've been out. I was 47 years old when I went to prison. And yeah, it's horrible.

[Caller/Listener]

It is horrible.

[James (Caller)]

The conditions they have in. They have no mental health, the drugs are abundant and the overcrowdedness is horrible. They, they wouldn't let you come within a stone's throw of that place.

[Paul Feinbaum]

How. When you, we. James, when you say corrupt, I mean, I have a reasonably good understanding what that means, but from a prison standpoint, what does that mean,

[James (Caller)]

corrupt? The place I was at, I'm not going to mention where I was at. The COs or gangsters. I mean, they come in with,

[Frank (Caller)]

with

[James (Caller)]

their colors, you know, I mean, it's just as horrible. There's like homelessness in prison. They will kick, they kick you out of your rack to where you have no place to go

[Frank (Caller)]

sleep on the

[James (Caller)]

floor is what a lot of these people are doing because they have no place to go because people around them won't let them on their bed.

[Paul Feinbaum]

And, and, and the, and the, the internal system does not manage that at all.

[James (Caller)]

No sir. They turn their head.

[Caller/Listener]

They count on.

[James (Caller)]

Look, Paul, I've been listening to you for forever. I, I can remember when, when legend used to have to put you on hold to go get counted.

[Mitch (Caller)]

That would.

[Frank (Caller)]

Long before I went to prison.

[James (Caller)]

But yeah, I mean, it's, I mean, I get speechless and I'm glad this actually came up because, you know, there are some good people in prison, Paul, and they're so, and, and guys talking. I mean, they got all kinds of stuff, you know, you can go to store. You can get your Cokes and cigarettes and dip and whatever. You got cable. But other than that, I mean, they'll beat the hell out of you, lock you up and hide you. Yeah, go watch Alabama Solutions, YouTube, Alabama Solutions, and that'll give you a start.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Okay. Hey, appreciate it, James. We'll stay in touch on that. We're gonna, we're going to clean this mess up. Thank you for the call. Up against the break back with more right after this.

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[Caller/Listener]

from beyond the logo, every.

[Commercial Announcer]

Did you see that moment? What records are going to be broken this season? All of it. Right here. Lock in. It's the WNBA on ESPN all season long.

[Paul Feinbaum]

You're listening to the Paul Feinbaum show podcast.

And welcome back. Let's race right back to the phones and say hello to Iman. Who is next? Handsome Joe is up next.

[Caller/Listener]

Roll tight rope off on Bob. Hey, I mean, he'll be there in a minute. He'll be there in a minute. But Paul, hey, I kind of like the conversation today. But you know what, all this, you know, prison talking stuff, I think, you know, it's basically like the SEC network. I don't know how it is now. They used to have TVs, but, you know, be only limited amounts. Usually news or sport basketball games because, you know, they usually vote on what people want to watch and the guards run the channel. So I mean, that's, that's the way that used to work. But now I, you know, of course, back in the 80s, you know, there was no, you know, Paul Fine bomb show. So, you know, I can't speak for that now, but, you know, it was, I know the highlight used to be like, like, like Draper prison. It's no longer a prison no more. It's been down for, I know, over 10 years or so. So long like that. But now one of the highlights there was maybe Sunday mornings people would come around and give you like you had these little green cups. That's what you drank everything out of your coffee, you know, whatever. And coffee, instant coffee, by the way, you know, that's all you had. But they'd get a cup of julep and they would make this, you know, home brew somewhere around the kitchen area, somewhere through there. I don't know how they got by with it because I didn't work the kitchen but they would give you that. And I'm telling you, a cup of that right there would knock you, you know, it would knock you dizzy all day long. But I think a good idea. But you know what they ought to do, Paul, is take these little tenor coaches, put every one of them in. In prison, shackle them down, make them go out on the farm squad, you know, flame, blade, glass, you know, grass, dig a hole, dig another hole to fill that hole up and so forth. And then shackle them all down on the seat, you know, and just put on the Paul Fine Bob show, you know, play it 24 hours a day and let them sit down. So they coach it up there like. Like, oh, well, Fred Flintstone, believe me. You know, some of these coaches, they can may learn a little bit something, Paul. And then the Regulators and Blackheads can come in, do a little motivational speech to them like, you know, y' all need to shut the hell up and just pay attention to Paul Fine Bomb and get. Rehabilitate. That's what you got to do. You got to rehabilitate and that, you

[Frank (Caller)]

know, that's, you know, that's.

[Caller/Listener]

That's how you solve that, Paul, because that's what they need up there. They need every one of them damn coaches up there to be, you know, to serve at least, you know, 10 years in prison. And, you know, they'll have a different attitude by then. And, you know, there's a lot of talk also about these teams. Like, you know, they're saying, well, you know, each. Each conference has probably got two or three, you know, top heavy team. But they say we've got, you know, four or five, possibly even six out goes that could actually win this conference. You know, there's no conference out there that's got the quality of teams that the SEC has. And so that's, you know, that's.

[Matt Hayes]

That's, you know, so anybody that wants

[Caller/Listener]

to keep talking up to the little tenors up there, they're full of crap, Paul. They're full of crap. But, you know, I'm glad I got to talk to you, Paul, but I don't know if they'd let you in prison. I think it would be a good idea. I know you remember they did a record, Johnny Cash, when he went to Sam San Quentin, I think it was prison and did a concert there, you know, So I don't know how. How it would do today. I don't know if criminals are more violent today than they were then. I don't know. But that last call you had there are some good people in there, and there's some that got out and.

[Paul Feinbaum]

But Joe, let me. Let me tell you something.

[James (Caller)]

I really.

[Paul Feinbaum]

I'm not crazy, but I feel like I know the audience. It wouldn't bother me at all to walk around prison. I don't think there's a single person in there that would give me or you a hard time.

[Caller/Listener]

No, no, they wouldn't, Paul.

[James (Caller)]

They wouldn't.

[Caller/Listener]

I think you'd make it good. And security would be good, too, because, I mean, there used to be folks that would come in, men and women, for church services, for instance, and nobody ever gave them any problem. I was like, one time we had a church service and had to lock prison down, but it had something to do that wouldn't even, you know, wouldn't end during the church service.

[James (Caller)]

So.

[Caller/Listener]

But yeah, most. Most cases, I mean, you'd make it five through there. I've been out on the yard, Paul. And they'd walk. I remember them walking college students across the yard. I mean, they would have a couple of guards with them, but they wouldn't. Nobody messing with them. I mean, because for one thing.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Did I tell you what happened? Did I tell you what happened a couple of years ago, Joe? I was on a. I was on a grand jury in Shelby county. And the last day of the grand jury, you're supposed to inspect. I think it's once a month you have to inspect the prison. So they took us all to the prison and, you know, we went through the, you know, where the. Where the cells were, and a lot of guys were waving and I kind of got close and they finally said, let's go into the kitchen now. Do not. They said, you know how guards are. You've been in prison. Oh, yeah, a little over the top. They said, do not. Do not engage with the prisoners making food. So we're all of a sudden, one of them. One of them over there is making lunch and he starts waving at me and talking to me. So I did not give it a second thought. I started walking over to. I mean, I'm about a foot from him and like six guards jumped in front of me.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

Yeah.

[Caller/Listener]

Hey, you never know.

[Paul Feinbaum]

That guy was. That guy wasn't going to do any more than. And talk football with me, but that's how. And, you know, I understand the security, mate, but there was no reason for that. We didn't need six. Six guns out because I'm over there talking to somebody in prison, right?

[Caller/Listener]

And plus kitchen. If you're working in the kitchen, you're ain't you ain't one of the crazy ones anyway. I mean, hey, trust me, everybody in the jail knows our prison, whatever. They know who the crazy ones are and they try to stay away from their sales and guards know who they are and they're not going to be out, you know, like walking out in the yard unless they're by theirself. You know, some, some, some crazy ones that they keep locked down and they let them out.

[Paul Feinbaum]

No, I'm not. Well, I'm not walking around the psych ward, you know, wearing an I hate I hate auburn T shirt. I mean, I'm not stupid. Hey, thanks for the call. I Man is up next. Good afternoon, I Man.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

Well, hey there, Paul.

[Caller]

Good afternoon. Thank you for taking my call. And I tell you, Joe's kind of stole some of my thunder there. I mean, the closest thing I got is I hear that trainer coming rolling around the bend.

[James (Caller)]

I mean.

[Caller]

But listen, I really appreciate the clarification you gave when, when Daryl called in because that, that, that, you know, there's a lot of people out there with opinions. Well, where the Black Adders. I mean, you know, and everybody knows, everybody knows everything that took place

[Caller/Listener]

and

[Caller]

I do appreciate the explanation because what you said is exactly what I've heard. And, and we're standing down and we're just being patient, you know, before any comments because this, this is a pretty serious matter that's taking place and it's developing and unfolding and, and there's a lot of people still talking behind the scenes and, and that's what we all said we would do. We would just wait and see and talk as needed and. But yeah, I really do appreciate you explaining all that. And you know, there's a concern about where am I and how come I'm not saying anything, you know, that kind of thing. It's because that's who we are. I mean, we're patient people. We don't have to run up in front of everybody, say I know something, I know something, I was there. This is my opinion. And but that you find out who the loose lip ones are and, and that's why they kind of sit over there in the group Debbie seats. I mean, and I just kind of separate myself from a lot of those people that talk about stuff they have no opinion about. But that's all they do is they gather just four opinions and especially stuff they don't know anything about. I mean, talking football and playoffs, one thing. But when you start talking about people's personal lives and that kind of thing, that's that's a whole different ball game. I just feel like that there should be some restraint and, and just listening to the people talking about people's personal lives, I see they have no restraint. So I got them in special. You know, just keep moving through the crowd box, you know, not hello, keep moving. Not hello, keep moving. But that was outstanding, the way you handled that. And like I said, word for word, that's what I've heard. And I haven't heard any new charges or anything. And it seems to me if there was any new charges, that would be a lot of afterthought stuff. And if that was, if those charges were legit, why didn't they bring all them charges out up front? So, you know, I'm in a pretty much wait and see the, you know, kind of mode. Let's just see how this thing develops.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

And.

[Caller]

And we're not boycotting anybody or anything like that. You know, we're just standing back and just being patient because once it gets to this level, that's. That's what it is. It's all about patience. Is that correct?

[Paul Feinbaum]

It is. And, I mean, I don't claim to know anything more than I, but I did talk to an SEC official and I talked to Kipkeeper. Kip Kiefer. Kip Kiefer. So I feel like you and I are both in fairly similar stead. We don't know everything, but I can assure you, I mean, we know more than Daryl knew. Thank you for the call. Up against the break, Matt Hayes will join us next.

[Podcast Narrator]

In a sunny Californian suburb, one family's home is unusually quiet.

[Paul Feinbaum]

When detectives walked into that house, they said that it was like time just stood still.

[Podcast Narrator]

It's 2010, and the McStay family is nowhere to be found inside the home. No clear answer where the family could have gone.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Husband, wife, and two children, all gone. Like, poof.

[Caller/Listener]

Disappeared.

[Podcast Narrator]

The search for the McStays quickly captures the nation. But for years, the search for answers only brings more questions.

[Matt Hayes]

Who's ever heard of an entire family going missing? A family of four doesn't just drop off the face of the earth with no contact.

[Podcast Narrator]

Is this a family on the run? Or is the truth far more sinister? From ABC Audio in 2020, this is what happened to the mixed days coming August 11th, wherever you get your podcasts or subscribe to 2020 True Crime plus on Apple Podcasts for ad free episodes, early access to new episodes, and so much more.

[Paul Feinbaum]

You're listening to the Paul Feinbaum Show.

Podcast Camp has not even opened Yet. And controversy reigning for the second year in a row over Bill Belichick. Remember the all time greatest NFL coach trending toward maybe the worst college coach ever. Maybe not, but Matt Hayes joining us now. Good to see Matt down in Florida, Matt. We'll get to the SEC in a minute, but just with Michael Lombardi on administrative leave, try to make sense out of the mess that is Bill Belichick. Good afternoon.

[Caller/Listener]

Good afternoon, Paul.

[Matt Hayes]

I don't know that anyone can, to be honest with you. I think we can hit at it a number of ways by how it happened, why it happened, what in the world North Carolina was thinking because Bill Belichick couldn't get a job in the NFL, no one wanted him. Michael Lombardi couldn't get a job in the NFL, no one wanted him. Yet somehow, magically, North Carolina did. I think the most damning thing of all, honestly, Paul is in. He's had two chances to build a roster at North Carolina and he's signed 130 players. 70 the first year and then 60 the second. Again, I'm not great at math, but that's got to be a high, high percentage of failure on those first 70. High percentage ball. So that to me is the most damning thing of all. You hire this guy because of his football knowledge and clearly it's not working.

[Paul Feinbaum]

So, Matt, I don't think anybody expects a big season out of North Carolina. And I'm also not suggesting that the school, which has a big investment in him, is just going to fire him. But at what point do you think, assuming he can even make sense out of his own situation, that Belichick takes a good look and go, this was a bad move. What am I gaining from this humiliation?

[Matt Hayes]

I guess he already thinks it was a, wasn't a good move. I mean, I don't know him. I don't think anybody knows him other than, you know, a few people that he trusts. But I mean, I don't know how he could think this is a good move after what's happened, not only on the field, but also the fact that both he and Michael Lombardi have just completely botched two chances to build a roster. It just, they just, they had no one drafted this past year. They're just a bunch of guys in that roster. It's hard to watch it. Look, I think, I think North Carolina could absolutely fire him after this year, give him his 10 million and that's it. Bye bye. Let's start over. Let's find something different. There's a lot of money in that in that program, a lot of money in that university, they can handle a $10 million going away. President

[Paul Feinbaum]

Matt Hayes joining us. Matt, I want to go back a couple of days and try to put a bow on what we learned in Tampa. There are so many interesting characters there. I know you wrote about Kaylen DeBoer. He was there a week ago today. Seems like a year ago. Take away from DeBoer's visit to media days, that's not what's going to determine his future, but it certainly has determined what people are saying about him in late July.

[Matt Hayes]

Paul, I'm very big on track records, okay? And I just look at the fact they've lost eight games in the last two years and they've lost them every way imaginable. And there are times when they don't look prepared. There are times when they look just very pedestrian on defense, same as offense. They have the number 13 overall pick in the draft as quarterback, Ty Simpson, and they just looked really poor in big games on offense. And that's really what you hired him for. You hired Caleb DeBoer and Ryan Grubb, the OC. He came along with him because they were, you know, offensive geniuses. They knew how to score points. They showed it everywhere they've been. That, to me would be a huge red flag. And then, you know, I understand why Greg Byrne doubled down this offseason, Paul. Because Michigan and Penn State were showing interest in Caleb DeBore, but boy, do you double down with a $2 million annual raise and literally like give the University of Alabama a buyout if they want to fire him. The size of like a third world economy, Paul. I mean, that's 60, 70 million dollars to make somebody go if they don't, if it doesn't work out. Wow, that's. That's hard to imagine, actually. Now, again, Caleb could turn it around. But this is year three. This is year three. He's got a brand new quarterback, one of two guys either Macaron, so that I don't think either one of us knows what it's going to look like or anyone knows what it's going to look like. You know, obviously you got to go with, all right, I'm a guy big on track records. We saw what he did with Michael Penix. You saw how Ty Simpson developed quickly.

[James (Caller)]

The hope is that one of those

[Matt Hayes]

two guys develops quickly, if not Paul, and they lose four games again. I mean, what does that say at that point? What does it say where you go three seasons with a guy and he's got 12 losses. And I always go back to Indiana and KIRK Signetti because DeBoer and Signetti arrived at the exact same time.

[Swamp Dog (Caller)]

Okay.

[Matt Hayes]

One guy took over the worst, statistically the worst program in the history of college football. That's Indiana. The other guy took over arguably the greatest program in the history of college football. One guy went 272 and won the national title. One guy, what, 20 and 8, didn't make the playoffs, made the playoff, got annihilated in the Rose bowl quarterfinal. I don't know how much you look at that, Paul. Honestly, I don't know how else you can look at it just like that because that's literally same time, same completely different situations and completely different results.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Well said. Matt Hayes, let me ask you about Lane Kiffin, because he got in and out of Tampa. Well, didn't say anything, really didn't do anything. Disappointed a lot of people. But I know people like you were not surprised by his theatrics or lack of them. What about Kiffin now? What's in store for all of us during this season, his first at lsu?

[Matt Hayes]

Well, you know, I mean, all this drama in the offseason I think is overshadowed was the fact that I think he really developed into a pretty darn good coach the last couple years. And I think all this drama has overshadowed that. Again, you're still talking about a guy who's never won a power conference championship, who's never coached in a college football playoff game. And he's the highest paid coach in college football right now or right at the highest paid. And I think we're. All we talk about now is what happened Ole Miss and the breakup and how ugly it was. And the reality is he really did a good job coaching that team the last few years. Ole Miss should have gone to the playoff two years ago and they blew that game, both games really, against Kentucky and Florida. And then last year he had them roaring at the end of the season, so. So much so that Pete Golding stepped right in there and they all. They were a play away from playing for the national title, Paul. I mean, imagine that. Imagine last year if they'd gotten the national title game, Paul, and we had Indiana vs Ole Miss in the national championship game. That would have just been absolutely mind boggling.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Wasn't far from it. Before you go, let me get closer to home there. You live in Florida and you once covered the Gator program. It felt different this week. I mean, it felt a lot different. It just didn't feel marginally different. How are you seeing John Sumrall's first season at Florida.

[Matt Hayes]

I mean, he's winning the room, he's winning the press conferences. I think he's a very popular guy right now within the fan base. But at the end of the day, he's got to win. You know, I spoke with him in the spring and he was very clear about that. Look, these guys can love me all they want right now. They can like I'm talking and how it's different from the guys before me. But when, when the team gets on the field, I got to win games. He's very clear about that. So I think there's the majority of the fan base is bought in. I think a lot of people outside the fan base are saying, all right, I'll believe it when I see it. And I think that's probably where we are right now with him.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Matt Hayes, great to talk to you. Matt, always a pleasure. Good to see you. Matt Hayes joining us. We are callers all the way. It's been wild show today. We're not done yet. An hour and 15 minutes and we will talk to you right after this.

You're listening to the Paul Feinbaum show

podcast and welcome back as we continue. Let's go to Bash right now who is in the zoom. Hey, Bash, good afternoon.

[Bash (Caller)]

Back in the zoom, Paul. I'm feeling better from yesterday, but I am not feeling better from listening to Matt Hayes talk about my team, Alabama just a minute ago. Let me ask you a question, Paul. If he's correct that this season coming forward is going to lead to 12 losses in the three year span of Kalyn DeBoer's career, does that mean that Alabama is officially a basketball school? Bash Brother

[Caller/Listener]

Yeah.

[Paul Feinbaum]

I mean, first of all, I am not in his camp. I know a lot of people are. But I think Alabama looks like a better, a minimum a 9 and 3 team.

[Bash (Caller)]

Minimum of 9 and 3 teams. So you don't think 10 and 2 is possible? Definitely not 11 and 1 or 12 0. It would be absolutely.

[Paul Feinbaum]

No, I have, I have, I have the floor at 9 and 3 and yeah, they could, they could. I mean you've heard me say this a thousand times. Their schedule is just manageable. So they could, there's only two games that they really probably going to be in the realm of pick them or an underdog and that's Georgia and lsu. I think other than that they should be favored.

[Bash (Caller)]

I give you credit for that, Paul. You are right. But I will say some of those games in the middle, they're usually like heart attacks that make us Alabama fans, you know, you know, brace for impact for like the amount of, you know, stress and chaos that's going to happen. Like in the South Carolina game, the Vanderbilt game, that we still have to play Kentucky with Will Stein the second week of the season. It's like I better like what Caleb DeBoer said. He better use that ECU games that get us like on track like we didn't have the chance to do last year against Florida State. But I'm just saying, Paul, if some of those games don't go the way that they did last year and two years ago, that 8 and 4 possibility is, is realistic.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Well, if Alabama goes 8 and 4, there had, there had better be rampant enthusiasm about Q on Russell, meaning that he got in late. His last couple of games were sensational. Other than that, I mean if this season ends 8 and 4 and there's no enthusiasm, then the program is going to flatline.

[Bash (Caller)]

It could be very similar, Paul, to like how Billy Napier's Florida program kind of led to where he had Graham Ertz, where he's his boy, he puts him in the first and starts. Then injuries and complications. It's mainly injuries. That's the reason that DJ Lagway, the guy that's the five star, the next, the future of the program, gets his opportunity but then he gets hurt. And then Billy Napier, you know, obviously goes through his horrible season last year. And that is potentially, Paul, what I see happening to Caleb DeBoer not this year, but next year. If this season is another four loss year, there will be no momentum going forward to 2027. Do you agree or disagree on that?

[Paul Feinbaum]

Yeah, I don't think there is a lot of momentum now, Ash. And you talk to a lot of Alabama players. I was with a group today that, I mean in front of a large group of people with their peers, they're all going to say the right thing. But privately there's not much confidence. There's not much confidence in Kaylon DeBoer.

[Bash (Caller)]

That's what I agree 100%. Like they can say everything on paper. What a school. Who is Alabama the example of excellence like we've always been for the last night or last since 2009. But for me, Paul, it's like the last three years after Nick Saban retired to four losses every year and a possibility of this year being just like the same thing. There will be no momentum for Alabama to compete in the nil football world. So that's why I was telling you and I was asking the beginning of this conversation. Are we just going to start embracing the fact that we are a basketball school? Kentucky has fallen off the. The tier of being.

[Paul Feinbaum]

I want, I want to, I want to, I want, I want to caution you. And congratulations to Nate Oates. It just came out that he's been married, so hope he has a happy life. But Alabama's not a basketball school, and that. That kind of talk is for losers. I don't mean you, but Alabama is one of the greatest football schools of all time. And if it's not a football school, then it needs changes. This is not the old days when basketball. When you could live on that for a while. Basketball. Basketball is very important, but it's not football. And that's pretty obvious to everyone that understands college athletics.

[Bash (Caller)]

I agree, Paul, but Penn State used to be known as a football school. What are they known for now? They're a wrestling school.

[Paul Feinbaum]

Well, they're not a wrestling school. They may win championship. Bash. I tell you what, if you want to be a basketball school, you be a basketball school.

[Bash (Caller)]

But I get more happiness watching basketball, Paul, than watching football the last two years. Like, as an Alabama fan, that's true.

[Paul Feinbaum]

I think Alabama basketball is very exciting, but I've lived in Alabama a long time, and that's a bad trend. If you want to talk basketball on the eve of fall season about to begin. Wow. Coming up, we'll talk about Alabama basketball recruiting right after this.

You're listening to the Paul Feinbaum Show Podcast.