#054 - Lois Perry - Net Zero, Government Lies, and the Future of Britain

Summary

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The Peter McCormack Show — Episode #054

Guest: Lois Perry
Topic: Net Zero, Government Lies, and the Future of Britain
Date: February 26, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Peter McCormack hosts activist and commentator Lois Perry for a candid, wide-ranging discussion on Net Zero policy, UK government dysfunction, civil service bloat, widespread public disillusionment, and the shifting landscape of British politics. Lois shares her perspectives as a vocal critic of Net Zero, her campaigning journey, the reality behind energy policy, and her involvement with the Heartland Institute. The episode traverses topics including media trust, public apathy, government corruption, and the rise of the Reform party—punctuated by memorable anecdotes, cultural references, and Lois’s distinctive Essex wit.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Net Zero Policy and Government Hypocrisy

• Critique of Current Policy: Lois argues the UK's Net Zero commitment has not reduced fossil fuel use, only shifted its production offshore, making Britain poorer (00:00, 05:41).
  • “We’re not using any less gas or oil, we’re not using any less at all. And we’re importing it all and we’re paying absolute fortunes because of it...” — Lois (00:00)
• Economic Consequences: She highlights soaring energy prices, half of which are attributed to carbon tax, and emergencies where the UK paid record sums to avoid blackouts (21:09, 22:19, 23:26).
  • “At the moment we’re paying £110 on average per megawatt hour of electricity. Now, £60 of that is actually carbon tax. It’s just madness.” — Lois (00:07)
• Renewables Paradox: Discussion on inefficiencies—UK pays wind companies to turn off turbines while struggling for backup power, missing market incentives for scaling practical energy solutions (25:26, 32:06).

2. Political and Media Culture

• Government Dysfunction & Civil Service Growth:
  • Rapid expansion of the civil service is contrasted with historical benchmarks—exposing modern inefficiency and lack of accountability (15:53).
  • “The UK government employs over half a million...That’s grown over a hundred thousand in the last five years.” — Lois (15:53)
  • Procurement waste highlighted with comical examples, e.g., £200,000 spent studying Star Wars's impact on the environment (16:43).
• Media Distrust and BBC's Legacy:
  • Lois and Peter critique modern media—especially the BBC—for lacking transparency, failing public trust, and suppressing dissent on issues like Covid and climate change (36:12, 37:28).
  • “We don’t trust you anymore.” — Lois (36:38)
  • The pair discuss cultural nostalgia for the BBC and its recent irrelevance, referencing long-suppressed reports and lost confidence.

3. Public Apathy & the “Enough is Enough” Mood

• Societal Disillusionment:
  • Existential dissatisfaction with “uni-party" politics—both Labour and Tories seen as globalist, unrepresentative, and out of touch. The Overton Window has shifted: what was once quietly discussed is foregrounded in public debate (04:31, 05:06, 15:14, 36:04).
  • “It’s gone from people being a little bit ashamed...to saying, hold on, why the fuck aren’t you voting reform?” — Host (04:31)
• Desire for Change: Hope is pinned on alternatives like Reform, which are seen as “untainted” by legacy political baggage and more connected to real business and everyday experience (19:08, 19:11, 62:19).
  • "Maybe that’s what we need, a bunch of people who haven’t got the experience to come in, who aren’t trapped by legacy and history...” — Host (13:14)

4. Debate, Free Speech, and Institutional Censorship

• Suppression of Dissent: Lois recounts being “cancelled” and ejected from COP26 for contrarian environmental views (43:05), and describes how public discourse around Covid vaccinations and Net Zero is policed rather than debated (06:14, 48:40, 97:11).
  • “They can’t— you can’t have debate. Because if you have any debate it exposes a load of old tosh...”— Lois (43:05)
  • “You were not allowed to have a different opinion, and then suddenly now...the accurate [opinions].” — Lois (06:14)
• Regulatory Shifts: Changes to Ofcom rules mean official climate policy now goes unchallenged in UK broadcast media—a unique situation not applying to other subjects (96:43).

5. Heartland Institute and Libertarian Values

• Lois’s Activism: Describes the move from her own organization ‘CAR26’ to leading Heartland Institute’s UK/Europe branch—bringing a US-style free-market, liberty-centric approach (41:43, 97:30).
• Mission: Promote open debate, liberty, minimal government, and challenge Net Zero orthodoxy (97:30); Lois projects Heartland’s influence on shaping US policy under Trump and its aspiration to shift UK discourse.

6. The Future of British Politics & the Rise of Reform

• Reform Party Dynamics:
  • Discusses the practical challenge of building Reform’s organizational infrastructure and the hope among their supporters for a political reset (63:33, 62:19).
  • Leadership profiles—Nigel Farage and others—are lauded for real-world business acumen and connection with regular voters versus career politicians (19:15, 61:36).
• Challenges Ahead:
  • The scale of organizational work needed for Reform’s parliamentary ambitions; the likelihood of surprise if they entered government with limited experience (11:25, 13:14, 64:23).
• Media and Public Sentiment:
  • Anticipation of media attacks if/when Reform succeeds, mirroring US coverage of Trump—a dynamic already visible in UK political panels and media (13:35, 65:18).

7. Social & Cultural Observations

• Woke Ideology and Generational Change:

  • Lois notes her daughter (and many teens) are fatigued with “wokeness,” referencing school experiences and peer attitudes (84:21, 85:48).
  • Critique of DEI (Diversity, Equity, Inclusion) frameworks in schools and corporations—examples include Starbucks being sued for allegedly unlawful discrimination in hiring (88:34).
  • "All this woke is the whole framework...is starting to collapse now.” — Host (88:06)

• Growth of Regulation & Decline of Private Enterprise:

  • Host and Lois observe governmental hostility to private business, growing regulation, and consequences for economic growth and personal freedoms (78:01, 78:05, 90:01).

• Anecdotes & Dark Humor:

  • Lois and Peter discuss societal double standards, dark British humor as a coping mechanism, and high-profile legal inconsistencies (76:09, 78:09, 80:00).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On UK Energy Madness

  • “CO2 is life...the whole CO2 being a pollutant thing, I think, is an actual bad joke by a globalist sitting in a cave, stroking a white cat, laughing at us.” — Lois (21:09)

• On Government Growth

  • “Contrast this with the 15,000 civil servants who ran the British Empire when it covered 25% of the world in 1854...the UK government employs over half a million now.” — Lois (15:53)

• On Media and Trust

  • “We saw on our social media...tens of thousands of people protesting outside the BBC...and they weren’t reporting on it...We don’t trust you anymore.” — Lois (36:12–36:38)

• On Political Farce

  • “At least the Tories used to hide it...This lot, they don’t care.” — Lois, on open political corruption (35:13)

• On Reform Party Appeal

  • “Maybe that’s what we need, a bunch of people who haven’t got the experience to come in, who aren’t trapped by legacy and history, like Elon Musk.” — Host (13:14)

Key Timestamps for Reference

• 00:00–07:00 – Lois critiques Net Zero, discusses imports, energy pricing, and civil service dysfunction
• 15:53 – Civil service bloat vs historical benchmarks
• 21:09–23:39 – Breakdown of energy costs, blackout emergency pricing
• 36:12–38:06 – BBC distrust, media suppression of stories
• 41:43–47:43 – Lois’s activist journey, forming and moving from CAR26 to Heartland Institute
• 62:19–65:23 – Reform Party’s rise, polling, and political climate
• 78:00–80:11 – Legal double standards (Hugh Edwards, BBC scandals)
• 84:21–85:48 – Wokeness fatigue among youth; school experiences
• 88:34–90:01 – DEI lawsuits and corporate pushback
• 97:11–97:30 – Ofcom rule change: climate “consensus” and media bias
• 103:06 – Lois on her mission with Heartland and the broader liberty movement

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Tone & Language

True to the show’s brand, the episode is direct, irreverent, and free from political correctness. Lois’s style is humorous, bold, and grounded in personal stories; Peter balances with pragmatism and curiosity. The exchanges are raw, informed by skepticism of institutions and a populist, libertarian thread.

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For Listeners: Why This Episode Matters

This conversation serves as an accessible microcosm of Britain’s current political turbulence—a rare blend of policy critique, inside anecdotes, and cultural commentary. It decodes why record numbers are disillusioned with mainstream politics and media, exposes the economic realities behind the green agenda, and highlights new-right activism shaping the public mood. The episode is a must-listen for those grappling with disinformation, seeking new ideas for political engagement, and curious about the next chapter in UK public life.

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Transcript

[Lois]

I mean, Ed Miliband doing what he's doing. I mean, we're not using any less gas or oil, we're not using any less at all. And we're importing it all. That's all that's happening. We're importing it all and we're paying absolute fortunes because of it. So, for example, at the moment we're paying £110 on average per megawatt hour of electricity. Now, £60 of that is actually carbon tax. It's just madness.

[Interviewer]

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[Lois]

You did drama? History and English and English lit and then I did drama and politics and English at A level. And so what I've been doing with. Since I'd started doing the campaigning anti Net zero, because I see it very much as libertarian issue and nothing to do with green stuff. So I'll, you know, explain. I had to get my head around physics, science and I was having to have arguments with climate scientists, having been very well braved by our people, mainly canceled scientists and physicists defunded people because they weren't going with the Net zero narrative. And I was having arguments with these people and winning because the thing about people that are all very pro, all the Net zero stuff, is they don't expect to be challenged even by a little blond Essex girl that hasn't got a science background. They don't expect it. So they didn't have any arguments back. So I started winning arguments with scientists on national television. So that was quite cool. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Did the drama help?

[Lois]

I think the drama helps me a lot. I think if you talk to anyone I've ever been involved with romantically, the word drama and lovis go hand in hand. Although, you know, I think they love it, really.

[Interviewer]

Hold on, you must be friends with Alex Phillips.

[Lois]

Alex Phillips. I know Alex. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I think you Two here together would be wild.

[Lois]

Really? Yeah, yeah. But we have a mutual friend, which is Nigel.

[Interviewer]

Oh. So I've interviewed Nigel before.

[Lois]

Yeah, he's lovely and he's a big supporter of what I've been doing. Yeah, he's been really good. Actually.

[Interviewer]

One of my favorite things about interviewing Nigel was actually I got to have a coffee with him before the interview and I felt I got to really see a side of him I hadn't seen.

[Lois]

Yeah, the real him.

[Interviewer]

The real him, he's way. I think a lot of people don't see that side and they think he's somebody he isn't.

[Lois]

And I think that people got to see the real Nigel in the jungle.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Lois]

And you know, obviously it's not scientific, but chatting to black taxi drivers, you get a feel for what people are thinking. And I certainly got that impression from black taxi drivers of all different backgrounds, religion, race. They all said, oh, yeah, yeah. Nigel on I'm a Celebrity. He was cool. He was cool. I don't know why people start talking to me about him. Wherever I go, I don't mention him. And people start going, reform Nigel Farage. Maybe I am linked and they don't in terms of my media presence, but they don't wanna say anything. But black taxi drivers, that's literally the first thing they say to me.

[Interviewer]

Well, I think there's been this change. I was talking about it earlier. I think there's been this change where when reform first came on the scene, I think people didn't want to publicly admit or talk about the fact that they were voting reform or they liked Nigel.

[Lois]

Do you mean before Nigel became the leader? When he became.

[Interviewer]

When he became the leader and this period, up until, I would say up until about. Honestly, a few months before the election, because I remember pre election, when you were talking about reform to people, there were still these kind of like, really? But Nigel and Brexit and.

[Lois]

Yeah, it was. That's gone, hasn't it? It's gone. Well, we can see in the polling.

[Interviewer]

That it's gone, but it's now. It's gone from people being a little bit ashamed or shy about admitted it to saying, hold on, why the fuck aren't you voting reform?

[Lois]

Yeah, what's wrong with you?

[Interviewer]

What's wrong with you?

[Lois]

Are you mental? Are you awoke?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah. Are you a woke conservative?

[Lois]

Do you want kids to be mutilated? Is that what you want? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

It's been this real shift now and I mean, I blame the media for a lot of where we've got To. And then I also blame this whole Uni party bollocks that's been going on.

[Lois]

Oh, I know. The same policies in every single party.

[Interviewer]

Same thing, same thing. But it's watching, watching the Overton window shift on reform. I think it's, Personally, I think it's fascinating.

[Lois]

A good friend of mine made a joke the other day. He said that he should start selling Overton windows because all he keeps hearing is about how Overton windows are shifting. I thought that was quite funny.

[Interviewer]

There's a, there's a hotel in, it's in Texas. Where. Texas. Texas University is called the Overton.

[Lois]

Right.

[Interviewer]

I took a nice big picture of the window.

[Lois]

That's good. That is good.

[Interviewer]

I said it's shifting.

[Lois]

Literally the Overton window.

[Interviewer]

The fascinating thing about that is I actually was out there interviewing a climate scientist.

[Lois]

Oh, really? Well, a real one.

[Interviewer]

A real. Well, that's in.

[Lois]

Oh, okay.

[Interviewer]

She's, I don't think she's a net zero, but I think she's a. So this is the argument on this one I, I always find fascinating. It's not whether net zero is a good idea or not because it's obviously moronic for our country to impoverish ourselves.

[Lois]

And import it elsewhere.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

If you believe in it. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

It's just nuts.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But, but, but actually the conversations about what is climate change, is it real? Are, is it man made? And I think there's a blurring of the lines on that conversation.

[Lois]

Possibly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

The thing is about being able to have the conversation. That's the thing. Absolutely. I get what you're saying. There are arguments. Of course there are arguments. But when you're not allowed to put forward arguments that oppose the mainstream narrative, that's when I get very suspicious. And we saw that very much during whole Covid thing. You know, you weren't allowed to have a different opinion and then suddenly now all the diff, different opinions are the ones that are coming out as the correct, you know, the accurate. What Description of what actually occurred.

[Interviewer]

So yeah, that was my, that was my moment. Covid was where like everything finally.

[Lois]

Was it. Did you have a bit of a ding dong moment?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, because I, God, I mean I, I, I'm vaccinated and regret it.

[Lois]

Okay. Yeah. None of my family were. We decided not. We're all, we're all, you know, pains in the bottom. We all decided not to do it. My nan had one and got shingles immediately. Within two days.

[Interviewer]

Well, I wanted to get. So my dad lives in Ireland. I wanted to go and visit him I had to be vaccinated to go. So I was like. But I wasn't worried.

[Lois]

There was a way of.

[Interviewer]

I know, I know, I know, I know.

[Lois]

I'm not gonna say it because I would never, ever endorse anything that wasn't 100% legit.

[Interviewer]

I just. I just. I wasn't. I've done. I mean, I've done a lot of drugs in dodgy toilets in London. A little. A little jab didn't worry me. I wasn't actually concerned about it.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And actually, I thought. I actually thought, why is everyone concerned about this? And I've now, I think Covid was the kind of the. The period where a lot of people finally went, oh, yeah, basically everyone is lying to us about everything. And when they're lying, they're either lying because they've got some weird incentive or they're lying because they up, or they're lying because they don't know what they're doing because they're incompetent. But basically they're all listening.

[Lois]

Scary as each other, aren't they? Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And then you go, we have this guy in, well, earlier, Noel.

[Lois]

Yeah, I know. No, I saw him. Yeah, he's great. He's a proper campaigner. He.

[Interviewer]

Well, he was talking about this scandal with the cms, with the child maintenance service.

[Lois]

Terrific. Yeah, Well, I had. I've had meetings with him about it because he wanted me to make some introductions to people in reform for him.

[Interviewer]

Right, okay. So I'm like, okay, so this is just another scandal, you know, potentially hundreds, maybe a couple of thousand people could have committed suicide based on being overcharged by the cms. And that's another scandal. On top of a rape gang scandal. On top of a scandal with the. With the post offices. On top of, you know, the fact that we have a government that is taxing the hell out of us. On top of the fact that we have these ULEZ cameras in London tracking us and finding us every way they can. On top of the fact that businesses are closing down, people are leaving. I'm like, everything has gone to shit.

[Lois]

Yeah, everything has.

[Interviewer]

Everything has gone to shit.

[Lois]

But I have hope. I have hope. And it's interesting, actually, you see the photographs of the people that are heading up these agencies, like the child maintenance thing, like the woman that was in charge of the post office and everything. And why are they always such unattractive women?

[Interviewer]

You know, I can't say this, but.

[Lois]

You can't. No, no, but they are. And you think you're a bit unhappy with what. What you've been presented with and you're going to decide you've made a decision that you're going to take it out on everyone else, aren't you? You know, it's just that the lack of empathy, absolute lack of empathy. For example, the woman that chaired up the child maintenance thing, you know, she was being told about these suicides. So what? You know, the Post Office. The woman who was heading up the Post Office, she was being told that, you know, people were taking. Taking their own lives or becoming depressed or suicidal. Doesn't matter.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. I mean, look, I just look at these rooms of people and I just think they don't look like a private enterprise.

[Lois]

No. They wouldn't last five minutes.

[Interviewer]

No. And so what is it about government that attracts. Does it attract shit people? Is that the only place for shit people to go? And are the structures so poor that people just get away with something? Something is.

[Lois]

There's. There's a lot in. Yeah. Everything you've said, I think, is correct, but I also think it's about that people can achieve power, whereas in ordinary circumstances they would never have any power. They would not be able to. To generate the budgets through private enterprise that they are playing with as well because of public money. So. Yeah, and you can't get rid of them for being incompetent. That's the main thing.

[Interviewer]

You can't get rid of them and you have to pay them expensive pensions.

[Lois]

And they have quotas for gender and all sorts of other things as well.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And so even if someone like reform could be successful, what. What then stops a party like that? Not just becoming more government. Because this must be hard. Like, I don't want to just say, oh, reform coming, everything will be different. There's something about government that creates dysfunction, incompetence.

[Lois]

Well, you could. Yeah, but you could argue that. You could say why. I understand completely where you're coming from. And it is different in this country because we have a permanent civil service and it's not the same as the States, but. But to a certain extent they have a permanent civil service. But it is different. It is slightly different. Trump is making a bit of an impact, isn't he?

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Lois]

So why couldn't we. Why couldn't. I mean, this country not reform, but this. Why couldn't a party come in and make big changes? I mean, if. And if. Hopefully it's a when. Well, no, I mustn't say that I must endorse any particular political party. Told you I was going to make some Cock ups, didn't I? If Reform win at the next election and they need to form a government, I mean they're going to be. The Civil Service have never had to deal with anything like this before. You've got a party that's got five MPs, they've got no one in the Lords, they've got no one with any ministerial experience. No one. I mean they've got, they've got obviously they've got Richard Tice and Nigel that served in the European Parliament. Obviously Lee Anderson has been an mp, but not for a tremendous amount of time, you know. So suddenly they're going to have to put 130 people in the Lords. They're just going to have to do it straight away and they're going to be having to put them in the Lord to create them to be ministers. They're going to have all these brand new MPs but no one with any experience. So, okay, so we wake up may in I think would be four years time and Reform have to form a government. They've got five MPs, they've got no one in the Lords, they've got no one with any ministerial experience. They've got. And because of the way the funding works whereby political parties are given funding from the government to get advisors and people in place that have an understanding of how the system works, because they've only got five MPs, they haven't been allocated anywhere near the amount of funding that they need to hire all these different people who've got experience in different departments and treasury or whatever. So this is going to be, if it happens, monumental that the Civil Service will never have dealt with anything like this before.

[Interviewer]

Well, they'll be crapping themselves that they're all going to lose their jobs. But I think it's one of those interesting things. Cause it's like maybe that's what we need is a bunch of people who haven't got the experience to come in, who aren't trapped by legacy in history, like Elon Musk.

[Lois]

He's a businessman.

[Interviewer]

Just go and go, this is nonsense, let's get rid of it. This is nonsense, let's get rid of it.

[Lois]

Yeah, no, you're right.

[Interviewer]

I was listening to those tosses on the Rest of Politics the other day and they would.

[Lois]

Is that a technical term?

[Interviewer]

Just they're doing my. I used to like that show because there used to be a separation between the two and they would challenge each other and you would understand what the establishment thinks. And I, you know, figure out now it's just the two of them crying about Trump all the time, and it's just. Look, there. I think there are fair questions to raise about Trump. Of course you should. You should be objective. But.

[Lois]

But this is like. They call it Trump Derangement Syndrome.

[Interviewer]

It's just like. Shut up. It's like whenever Alistair Campbell starts talking about any kind of conflict with his, you know. You know, with this, like, patronizing turn, I'm like, you. You contributed to the dodgy dossier, the sentence to war. Shut the fuck up, man. Wait up a second.

[Lois]

But, yeah, the moral high ground. It is a bit difficult for him to take that, isn't it? But.

[Interviewer]

But I was listening, thinking, well, hold on a second. They were complaining. I can't remember what they were complaining about, but all I was thinking was, well, hold on. You presided over the. The City, you've presided over government. Both of you presided over multiple administrations that have left us in this state.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Where we have.

[Lois]

Or engineered it, if you depend on how you want to look at it. You could say that the Labour government, the 97 Labour government engineered us to get to this point.

[Interviewer]

Certainly engineered us here. Yeah. The. The. What we have with the Civil Service now. But. But even under Rory Stewart, he was in government.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, like.

[Lois]

Do you think he looks a bit like the Green Goblin?

[Interviewer]

I think he looks like a.

[Lois]

My son thinks he does. No, I think William Defoe, isn't it? Is it William Defoe?

[Interviewer]

A little bit, yeah. But I don't know, he's an odd character. I got, you know, sometimes.

[Lois]

He's not a Tory, you know that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, No, I mean, he's a Liberal Democrat, if any.

[Lois]

You know, in fact, he might be slightly left to the Liberal Democrats.

[Interviewer]

Well, I think. I think in some ways, parts of the Labour Party are now to the right of the Conservatives.

[Lois]

You couldn't make it up, could you? You just couldn't.

[Interviewer]

I honestly, I can see a scenario where the Labour Party and the Conservatives form a coalition to try and stop reform, which would be the weirdest scenario ever.

[Lois]

Well, it would just prove what everyone's been saying, that you've got a uni party with uni policies, Net zero being one of them. And, yeah, they're just globalist stooges.

[Interviewer]

But if everything is shit, I think we do need a change. I mean, the just size of the civil service, the growth in our tax, the stagnant growth of the economy, like all this shit.

[Lois]

Let me give you a figure here. I should know off by heart. This is what I was Saying about everything about that. I should know these figures off by heart, but this is just quite funny. The UK government employs over half a million. That's grown over a hundred thousand in the last five years. But this is brilliant.

[Interviewer]

Contrast is that's a 20% increase in five years.

[Lois]

In five years.

[Interviewer]

But doing what?

[Lois]

Well, exactly a load of rubbish. Probably doing LGBTQI trans books for four year olds. Contrast this with the 15,000 civil servants who ran the British Empire when it covered 25% of the world in 1854. I mean, you know, I imagine that there was a lot of. Well, it would have all been men. Well, you've seen it and they would have all been in the office.

[Interviewer]

You've been going through the procurement files, right?

[Lois]

I've been having a look at them. Oh, my goodness.

[Interviewer]

I mean, that's where the significant amount of money is being wasted.

[Lois]

Oh, yeah. One of them Nigel's things actually I thought was quite funny. Right, so the. Which one? Hang on a minute, which one is it? The UK taxpayer was. Oh, no. Government spent £200,000 on studying the impact of Star wars on the environment.

[Interviewer]

I know, I know.

[Lois]

200,000 quid.

[Interviewer]

By the way, did you see the.

[Lois]

I could have bought a little flat in Essex for that.

[Interviewer]

I've got the funniest thing to show you. Connor, can you bring up Marty Bent's Twitter?

[Lois]

Marty Ho.

[Interviewer]

He's a friend of mine in America because, you know, they've been Elon Musk and has been going through their own Doge thing, exposing things. This. I saw the funniest thing yesterday. This is brilliant.

[Lois]

Let's have a look.

[Interviewer]

Right, scroll down. We're looking for the blind guy. You'll see him with glasses on. Keep going. I'm sure Marty tweeted this out. Keep going, keep going. That's it.

[Lois]

Okay, let's have a look at this.

[Interviewer]

Not to be insensitive, but it's beyond ironic that the Democrats witness defending the government's horrific record on finding waste and fraud is an actual blind. Blind man.

[Lois]

Don't make me laugh at that. God forgive me. Please don't make me laugh.

[Interviewer]

But I. I'm pretty sure someone put something out saying that he couldn't see any waste.

[Lois]

Oh, no.

[Interviewer]

Everything's got so. Lois, everything's got so ridiculous now. It's.

[Lois]

You know, one of my super fans on Twitter is blind.

[Interviewer]

Well, that's.

[Lois]

Oh, I know, but I feel really mean now. But I do get your point. It is quite funny.

[Interviewer]

No, I'm just not. I'm not picking on him. For being blind. The fact that he, he's at a. I don't know, is that a testament.

[Lois]

Hearing an irony that someone that thinks that I'm really stunning is actually blind?

[Interviewer]

That's a different topic. But, but no, look, listen, look, we, we're, we're in this position now where I think we have a. I think there's a lot of British people handed it like, British people. Like, it's almost laughable how shit everything is like nothing.

[Lois]

It's got to the point where it's actually funny.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. We've got a incompetent government. We've got no experience in running business that are actively destro.

[Lois]

No, there's no private enterprise experience on the front bench whatsoever. When you compare that to Trump's team, which is, I think it's got like a few hundred years between them of, of making millions from scratch.

[Interviewer]

But this is why I think people were finding reform interesting because Rupert Lowe is a successful businessman.

[Lois]

He is.

[Interviewer]

Richard Tice is a successful businessman.

[Lois]

Nigel, Nigel was a very successful businessman. Run a big firm.

[Interviewer]

You know, we want more of that. I'm run businesses, I want people in charge for country. I don't like paying tax, but people who understand the challenges of running business.

[Lois]

Yeah. And they don't just want to spend other people's money. No, absolutely. I completely agree with you. 100.

[Interviewer]

So talk to me about this net zero stuff because.

[Lois]

God.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, what, what, what the is admin.

[Lois]

I was unfortunate enough actually to meet him at a party once and, and we were talking about Net zero stuff and he was very hyper, Very, very hyper. And I said to him that I, that the science needed to be challenged. I questioned the science to him anyway. No, Louis, no, Lois, you don't understand. And he kept grabbing me, right, trying to take me to this stairwell to talk to me about why Net zero was not just, you know, necessary, but was the. Well, was that what was absolutely necessary? And he really believes in it. And I was, and I was saying to him, because they're so unused to being challenged on the science, I was saying, well, you know, I think this and I think that and I've been told this, but there's a, there's a noble Nobel prize winning physicist that doesn't agree with. And he was like his whole body was shaking because he's not used to being contradicted and he wanted, he really wanted to impress upon me that it was real and it was necessary. But even Ed Miliband knows that if we decarbonize in this, in this Country. It just goes abroad. It just goes abroad. So if you believe that CO2 is causing any problems, by the way, CO2 is life. Yeah. You and I are carbon. We exhale carbon. Everything is carbon. Yeah. So the whole CO2 being a pollutant thing, I think, is an actual bad joke by a globalist sitting in a cave, stroking a white cat, laughing at us. I really do that. The fact that CO2 could actually be a pollutant.

[Interviewer]

But anyway, that's not the claim, though it's a polluted, is it?

[Lois]

I think they're saying it's a pollutant. They're describing CO2 as needing to be reduced because its very existence is causing. First of all, they said global warming and then the planet got colder. I thought, oh, no, we better change it. So then they said climate change, which climate change could cover literally anything. So, I mean, Ed Miliband doing what he's doing, it's just madness. I mean, we're not using any less gas or oil. We're not using any less at all. And we're importing it all. That's all that's happening. We're importing it all and we're paying absolute fortunes because of it. So, for example, at the moment, we're paying 110 pounds on average per megawatt hour of electric. Electricity. Now, 60 pounds of that is actually carbon tax. Right.

[Interviewer]

Is that true?

[Lois]

Yep. So £50 is what we're. What we're paying. Right. So that figure has gone up when we were about to have a blackout a few months ago to. To £6,000 per megawatt.

[Interviewer]

Who's paying that? Us as customers. Yeah, the same business. And residential.

[Lois]

Yep. That's why everyone's going out of business.

[Interviewer]

Hold on. So. So the, the carbon tax.

[Lois]

So half, basically, it's over half.

[Interviewer]

But we have the highest energy prices in Europe.

[Lois]

We do, yeah, we. We do, and it's because of the carbon tax, but it's also because we are not exploiting our own resources and the resources that we are. New, new resources. But in the resources that we already have, we closed down. So we closed down the coal mines and we're not fracking and we're. We're not granting any more. Any new licenses for North Sea oil as well. I mean, it's. It's complete madness. So 110 quid, large majority of that is. Is carbon tax. We have paid in the last few months to stop the lights going off. £6,000 per megawatt hour. Because we desperately. Because they know that the lights are going to go off. They're going to charge us a fortune, aren't they? Because to give it, you know, using the interconnectors between us and France, but France will say no eventually with their nuclear energy. And. And recently in London, it's my understanding that the mayor had to strike a deal. We were hours away from l losing all electricity in London. Right. Can you imagine?

[Interviewer]

Publicly?

[Lois]

Yeah. 9,000 quid we paid per megawatt hour. 9,000 quid. So it's normally 110 pound and that's expensive now in Norway.

[Interviewer]

So what we bought as an emergency.

[Lois]

Powerful emergency power, 9,000.

[Interviewer]

But who pays it as a government subsidizing it?

[Lois]

The government? Well, no, it goes on our energy bills.

[Interviewer]

Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. What are we looking at? 12% of electricity bills are made up of environmental and social levels. Just 3.4% of gas bills, levies. Hold on.

[Lois]

Yeah, but there's that. There's all different things that. Things that things are called. It works out just over half of the 110 pounds.

[Interviewer]

Hold on. So, hold on. So wholesale adjustment, net worth. What's policy?

[Lois]

Yeah, that's probably one of the percentages that would be green policy, I should imagine.

[Interviewer]

Policy. Headroom. I don't even understand what this all means. That I don't understand what I.

[Lois]

You know what, what. I will introduce you to a good friend of mine called Professor Brian Catt and he will sit down and explain everything with you and. And your head will explode. I love Brian, but your head will explode. But he, he has all of the facts and figures from. From publicly available material that he goes through with me at considerable length. And. Yeah, but the 9,000 quid thing, yeah, that's. That's publicly known and that was to stop. Imagine if the lights went out in London.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but hold on. That would have meant our energy bills.

[Lois]

Went up, but it was for a very short while, it.

[Interviewer]

So we bugged a gap.

[Lois]

Yeah, so. So, but, but what happens is renewables don't. Don't work at the moment. Like for example, actually, Nigel told me this two weeks ago, there was one particular night where there was not just a little bit of wind and solar, but zero. Yeah, there was zero. So the renewable dream, if we didn't have 100% gas backup. 100%, that would have been it.

[Interviewer]

There's a flip side to that as well. Do you know how much we're paying the wind companies to turn off? Do you know about this?

[Lois]

Yeah, yeah, I know about it because we're paying.

[Interviewer]

What did we discover, Connor? It was over a billion a year. Billion pound a year. 1.7 billion. Do you know what they do in America for this in Texas?

[Lois]

What?

[Interviewer]

There's these bitcoin companies. They plug their miners into the network and they just use that unused power and they mine bitcoin. They sell it on the open network. We could go up to Scotland. We could plug these bitcoin miners in.

[Lois]

I literally don't know what you're talking about.

[Interviewer]

Do you know what bitcoin is?

[Lois]

I do know what it is. But when you're saying about plugging it.

[Interviewer]

In and stuff, you'll love this.

[Lois]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

As a conservative, you'll love this.

[Lois]

Okay?

[Interviewer]

Do you like the fact that the government controls our money?

[Lois]

The answer is no.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Would you like to have a form of money that the government can't control, they can't manipulate, they can't print?

[Lois]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

A digital gold. Say that's what bitcoin is. That's all it is. It's digital gold.

[Lois]

You could teach me some sales techniques.

[Interviewer]

I keep all my money in bitcoin. I have done for eight, nine years. I know. Fuck the government and. But the way bitcoin works is very quickly.

[Lois]

Aren't you supposed to diversify?

[Interviewer]

Into what?

[Lois]

No. Aren't you supposed to have, like, physical gold, property money in certain. All different things in case something happens?

[Interviewer]

You're supposed to. I just never have.

[Lois]

You shouldn't tell people that.

[Interviewer]

I just. This is just my decision.

[Lois]

Yeah. No, I appreciate what you're saying. So what you're saying is that.

[Interviewer]

So the way bitcoin works is because it's money the government can't turn off. These are bitcoin miners. The way it works. My simplest.

[Lois]

I thought you meant people. Little hats.

[Interviewer]

No, no. That's what. The simplest explanation I can give you is the way that bitcoin works. The inventor wanted to create money that government can't turn off. And so the way they do it is most financial systems have a central database. Lois has this much money. Peter has this much money. I sent Lois a thousand pound. So they deduct a bit.

[Lois]

Thank you.

[Interviewer]

And there's one copy of that ledger. The way bitcoin works is everybody has an identical copy of the ledger. So if they try and turn it off at one place, it exists everywhere.

[Lois]

Oh, I see. Oh, okay. So there's no, like, no one can flick a switch or bomb somewhere or whatever.

[Interviewer]

China banned bitcoin. Didn't matter because everyone has a copy of the ledger. And so the way it does. That is your copy of the ledger. Is this thing. You must have heard of a blockchain.

[Lois]

I have heard.

[Interviewer]

Okay? The blockchain is very simple. It's a series of blocks and each block is a group of transactions. And every 10 minutes a new block is created and it's sent to everyone in the world. So everyone knows the state of the bitcoin network. But the way that works is you have to have those machines whizzing around processing the transactions and creating the blocks, okay?

[Lois]

And so a friend of mine called Adam actually, who's got adhd goes very, very quick. But he, he, he, he specializes in what you're talking about. And he tried to explain it to me, but I didn't get it. I think I get it now.

[Interviewer]

So these machines, they're all competing to create the next block. That's what decentralizes it, okay? They're all competing and when they find a block, they get a payment. And that payment is a little bit of bitcoin that's worth a few hundred thousand dollars, right? You can plug. All those machines care about is getting the cheapest energy possible. So these companies, they're all around the world trying to find the cheapest energy possible. Here's a site that's a bitcoin mining site and look, it's near a wind farm. And so what they'll do is say, you know, when a wind farm gets created, but they haven't maybe done the interconnectors yet to connect it to the network. They're idle and wasted time. Bitcoin company comes in, they take the energy on the cheap, they mine bitcoin and they turn it into real money. For those of you out there who want to protect your bitcoin, I want to tell you about casa, the lead in bitcoin security solution and a solution that I use for my bitcoin and my football club's bitcoin treasury. Now if you're serious about protecting your bitcoin, you will need a rock solid security plan. And CASA gives you just that. With their multi signature security and key management services, CASA makes it easier than ever to take control of your bitcoin without ever having the risk of a single point of failure. Now they offer multiple levels of protection, all designed with simplicity and ease of use in mind. And that works even if you're not a tech expert. So don't leave your bitcoin security to chance. Go to Casa I.O. and check out the services that I am using today to protect my bitcoin. So you can protect your stack and sleep easily. You can find out more@ Casa IO which is C A S A IO that is Casa IO this episode is brought to you by Bitcasino, the world's first licensed Bitcoin casino. Now, whether you're into slots, table games or live casino experiences, Bitcasino has it all. And they have lightning fast transactions, no deposit limits and no waiting on withdrawals. You can enjoy gaming the way it was meant to be, seamless and secure. Now, Bitcasino you can play with Bitcoin, making your experience faster, safer and more private. Plus, they offer some of the best rewards in the industry from bonuses to loyalty programs to keep the fun going. Now, if you're looking for a top tier gaming experience, head over to Bitcasino IO which is B I T C A S I N o IO that is Bitcasino IO and please remember to gamble responsibly. Zappo bank is the world's first fully licensed and regulated Bitcoin enabled bank. Zappo Bank's all in one app allows you to secure, transact and grow your Bitcoin. And you can also earn Bitcoin daily with interest on your savings for both BTC and USD as well as get cash back on all your card spending. With over a decade of experience in Bitcoin custody, you can trust that your assets are safe with Zapo Bank. They blend no hold security with military grade Swiss bunkers and strict regulatory oversight to ensure your funds are always protected. And as a member, you'll get a dedicated account manager who can guide you through their products and help with everything you need. Now if you want to find out more, please head over to zappobank.com wbd which is x a p o b a n-k.com wbd well that's, that's amazing.

[Lois]

I mean the problem obviously that we've got right this second in February in, in England is I think that's brilliant by the way. But just in terms of wind farms in general, there isn't much wind in February and there isn't any solar. So you've got a situation for example now where we've got our coldest month month and our stillest month in many ways before we get blustery sort of spring and there's no, there is no renewable energy.

[Interviewer]

Where are the, where are the incentives on all this?

[Lois]

Because government incentives, that's why reform, funnily enough have just announced. And also it's something that we advocate in the institute that I've brought to the UK and Europe, the Hartnett Institute, which is an American institute, free thinking think tank, you know that advocate free market solutions. So what we say is okay, if they're so great, let's let the market decide. Of course the market would just go.

[Interviewer]

You know what would happen to Dale Vince at that point?

[Lois]

Oh, I really don't like that man. When he got divorced he said some really nasty things about his ex wife outside the court. That's so uncool, isn't it? To talk about a girl like that. She didn't deserve that.

[Interviewer]

Did she come out and say he flies on private jets?

[Lois]

She. Well she did, but he did.

[Interviewer]

Oh, after that though I think.

[Lois]

Well yeah, probably, but I don't know, I just thought you have no class whatsoever. Zero class. And he's completely, completely made all his money on government subsidies. He's. It's so dodgy. He's donated money to the labor party. Got it back in subsidies and allowances and grants. I think they gave him a grant to pay for. For a 2,300,000 pound electric Ferrari or something like that. Or a really a supercar. I can't remember which brand, which one it was.

[Interviewer]

Connor, ping up Google for a second because I love this. Yeah, he's a labor supporter.

[Lois]

He's a. Yeah, he's a nasty one actually.

[Interviewer]

Well he's just full of shit and.

[Lois]

He lies, he tells fibs and he sues everyone. He does.

[Interviewer]

He might sue us. Just search for Dale Vince labor donations.

[Lois]

Yeah, and maybe look at the sports car thing. That was quite funny. He doesn't like me anyway.

[Interviewer]

He won't like me.

[Lois]

No.

[Interviewer]

All right, so Dale Vince demands man on political donations despite donating almost 5.5. So. So he hates the fact that he has to donate.

[Lois]

Well he gets it all back.

[Interviewer]

So he's donated 5 million pound to the Labour Party. Now look up ecotricity.

[Lois]

That's right. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Ecotricity. E C O T R I C I T Y Subsidies.

[Lois]

Right, Taxpayers. There you go. They'll be good. They're good. The taxpayers alliance.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, that first one.

[Lois]

Yeah, that'll be the one. Let's have a look.

[Interviewer]

Delvin's, which is our funds to Leopold received 179. No, there's one.

[Lois]

Yeah, but there's that. That's, that's just then. And it'll be a lot more than that. Millions and millions and millions.

[Interviewer]

Can you go back a couple of pages? Con. Right.

[Lois]

Labor's biggest corporate donor.

[Interviewer]

No, there we go. The wind tycoon. The donations.

[Lois]

Labor and 36 million in subsidies. Yeah, they're slightly different. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I mean, just like.

[Lois]

And you. And you think all that money and he dresses like that?

[Interviewer]

Well, I mean.

[Lois]

No, you look good.

[Interviewer]

I mean, I think I dress.

[Lois]

No, but. No, no, you look good. He's. He dresses. I don't know what he dresses like, to be honest, but.

[Interviewer]

But this to me is just kind of like in your face. Open corruption.

[Lois]

They don't care.

[Interviewer]

It's. I'm giving the Labour Party millions of pounds.

[Lois]

At least the Tories used to hide it. I mean, at least they used to make an effort, you know? Do you know what I mean? I mean, when we were kids and we were watching the news, if. If it came out, they would resign, wouldn't they? They would. There was an honor in them. You know, this lot, they don't care.

[Interviewer]

It is just. Just open in your face. Corruption that we're all paying for.

[Lois]

Doesn't matter. No one will. No one resigns anymore. I don't know if you've noticed that. They just wait for it to blow over, you know, some. Someone's boyfriend buys them a pair of glasses and a couple of suits. Doesn't matter. We'll just, you know, we'll just plow on and make up some fake story about a love child and then suddenly everything's okay again. I'm not gonna name any names.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, you're gonna get me in trouble here, but. Okay, but, yeah, but I just. So I think we're getting to this point now where. Where people have said, I've had enough. This is enough. Enough is enough.

[Lois]

Enough is enough.

[Interviewer]

Enough of the incompetence, enough of the corruption, enough of the lying, I think. And it's not just the government, it's the media as well.

[Lois]

Oh, it's awful. They've become so far circle. And we said before, didn't we cover. Changed everything, you know, when we saw that. We saw on our social media, hundred, well. Well at least tens of thousands of people protesting outside the BBC at the way they were portraying. And you had people, the news presented, you could see them in the background behind them through the glasses. And they weren't reporting on it. The BBC were not reporting on the protest against them. And you think we don't trust you anymore?

[Interviewer]

What do you think will happen with the BBC, do you think. Do you think it feels like it's cooked, but it's got a bit of time? Problem is, it's possible. I like.

[Lois]

I think I do.

[Interviewer]

I like radio. I like Radio 5. I think this sport they do is Good.

[Lois]

I've got very nostalgic about the BBC and it's taken me a lot to turn me against. Against it. And even now there's still a little part of me that's got that sort of nostalgic thing. I must say, my Jewish friends have zero nostalgia for the BBC. Like there's not even a half a percent. You know, there's a report actually called the Balin Report about antisemitism, which has been suppressed for 20, 20 years. They did their own internal inquiry into institutional antisemitism in the BBC and the findings have been suppressed for 20 years.

[Interviewer]

I think. I think if the BBC was defunded and wound down, we would find a lot of shit out that's gone on.

[Lois]

But, yeah, I think you're absolutely.

[Interviewer]

But I almost said. I mean, I love Top of the Pops. I miss Top of the Pops.

[Lois]

Where is Top of the Pops? Yeah. I mean, you know what, you know, when you have the. The Top of the Pops, they show on BBC4.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

Which I do watch. And I feel sorry for the bands that were always introduced by Jimmy Savile, because I read this article as someone noted that any band that was, you know, normally introduced by Jimmy doesn't get, you know, does. Doesn't get shown again on BBC4.

[Interviewer]

So they miss out on their royalties.

[Lois]

They miss out and the coverage. But I had a bit of an alarming experience for Jimmy Savile.

[Interviewer]

Do I want to hear this? How old are you?

[Lois]

Well, funnily enough, I was in my early 20s, but I was with a friend of mine called Simon Woodruff that owns. Was Yo Sushi. Yeah, yeah. And he had his little daughter, their beautiful little girl. Well, she wasn't a little girl, but she was 15. Right. So I'm 21, 22. She's 15. We have a picture taken with Sir Jimmy. Yeah. And he waits for the camera click. Because it was cameras and. And Goose, both of us.

[Interviewer]

What, like on that live.

[Lois]

Like, like, like just as he clicked. Because, I mean, I mean, I've been to weddings in the 80s, you know, 90s, I'm used to it in Essex. But poor little Charlotte jumped about 100 foot in the air, shouldn't it?

[Interviewer]

Well, there's that famous video where he's doing it on Jim Will Fix it, where you can see the girl bouncing around. She's getting all uncomfortable.

[Lois]

Yeah, well, anyway, yeah, exactly. But. So I thought, oh, okay. Bloody hell. And any. But it was, you know, as I say, it didn't bother me, but Charlotte was only 15 and that was our experience of Sir. Sir Jimmy Savile. It's difficult to explain to people when we were kids how famous he was.

[Interviewer]

He was the best.

[Lois]

Even though he goosed me, I still didn't say anything bad about him.

[Interviewer]

We all wanted to go on General Fix it. Cause we had the thing we wanted. I wanted him to fix it for me to play for Liverpool.

[Lois]

I wanted him to fix it for me to meet Michael Jackson.

[Interviewer]

Okay. I mean, you've got.

[Lois]

I've got some weird stuff going on now.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. This is not a good track record of people.

[Lois]

Come on. It was the 80s. Come on, come on.

[Interviewer]

But the thing about the BBC is like a lot of my American friends, they don't understand the BBC. They're like, they. They just think it is just state television, state propaganda. They don't understand the nostalgia, the things, the good TV shows. I know and I do have. I wish they just wouldn't do news anymore. I think they shouldn't do news anymore.

[Lois]

Yeah. But even their programs are woke. Oh, by the way, there's a new it. There's a series that I love or that I did love on ITV called Unforgotten. It's like a detective drama series. It's quite big actually. And in their most recent series, they've got a character who appears on something that's basically GB News. That's anti. Net zero. But it's a. But they. I think so. Because some of the lines they've given her I recognize of me having come out.

[Interviewer]

Hold on, can we find it?

[Lois]

But she's got. No, hasn't got long blonde hair. They've given her a little brown bob. But it's definitely supposed to be me. She's. Yeah, she's not posh.

[Interviewer]

No, I didn't say that. You can be posh from ethics. I mean. Posh Spice.

[Lois]

Oh, yeah. Actually it's quite interesting because Posh Spice was on television a couple years ago and I was in the kitchen and my kids had the telly on and I thought it was me on the telly because it was. I came in, I said, is it me? And then. And Richard, my son, said, no, it's Victoria Beckham. And it's the only. Only girl that I've ever heard with a very similar voice to mine. So. But I am from Leon Sea. So I know it sounds like an oxymoron, but that is actually the poshest part of Essex.

[Interviewer]

I've never been there. What Leon say what I've done anything about it?

[Lois]

No, no, it's. It's nice. It's. It's been consistently voted the nicest place to live but probably by people that live in Lyonse. But I, I live in London now anyway.

[Interviewer]

So you're alive.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So back to Heartland.

[Lois]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

What's the thing to bring it to the uk? Because I don't know a lot about them but I'm aware of them as a think tank in. Conservative think tank. Yeah.

[Lois]

It's 40 years. Yeah. The University of Pennsylvania named them the number one think tank in the US in terms of their influence.

[Interviewer]

And so what, what's the, what was the steps to end up bringing that here? Why and how did you get involved in that?

[Lois]

Right. So my, so I used to run an organization. I started an organization with a group of Brexiteer donors backers. No oil money or anything, just. Just a few guys who wanted to put some money behind a project behind to, to highlight what they saw as the biggest threat, much bigger threat than Brexit to the UK and to the Western world actually, which was net zero being used as a horse of Troy to bring in social control, anti capitalist principles, Trotskyism if you like. And, and, and all of the, all of the above. And so I, and we called it car 26 because we launched at the same time as cop 26 which I quite famously got thrown out of live on talk TV and I had to go and hide in the toilet. It was brilliant. It was so funny. It's like that's on YouTube. Me in the toilet doing my broadcast with Mike Graham with the, with the security banging on the door.

[Interviewer]

Oh Connie, you'll find that.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Why'd you get thrown out?

[Lois]

Well, because they realized that I was anti Net zero person. They can't. You can't have debate because. Because if you have any debate it exposes a load of old tosh. So you can't have debate. So they saw who, they recognized me. I don't know why they'd recognize me. I, I sort of noticed them noticing me and I was about to go live. I ran with my ring light, my phone into the toilet, the disabled toilet. And then I'm doing this broadcast with Mike Graham. He's laughing his head off, right. Holding the phone like this, talking about what's going on at COP26 with the security guards banging on the door and Mike's saying to me, don't they want to have a debate about Net zero? You know, I said a debate. I said they're throwing me out, Mike. I'm being thrown out. So anyway, so we launched it around that time. I was called a climate denier, I was called a nut job, I was called everything under the sun just for wanting to have a debate because no one was talking about it at that point. I mean, even the first time I was on Farage's show on GB News, he really made me, you know, sing for my supper. I had to, I was almost accused of being not a conspiracy theorist, but he said, well, why would you have these green policies if it wasn't to help the environment? And I had to say what I believed, that they were being used as an excuse to usher in other stuff in the same way that happened during the pandemic. So anyway, so, yeah, so I did car 26 for quite a long time and then I became the leader of UKIP briefly and then I had a couple of months off and I mean, when I say off, I mean off. No phone, no laptop, nothing. I read lots of books, I cooked, I went to the gym. It's quite nice actually. I only had five numbers on my little burner. Nokia phone 3210. And because I put my other one in the sink and then when it didn't die, I smashed it up with a hammer. I just, I just had enough, I needed a break, I'd had pneumonia, I'd nearly died. I, I, I needed to have some proper time.

[Interviewer]

Do you romanticize back to that period? Because I had a year when I stopped work, had a whole year, got in shape, went to the gym, there.

[Lois]

Were nice bits about it. But then I did get itchy. Itchy, Itchy, yeah, yeah. And so I, I had been in, I'd had a relationship with the Heartland Institute from my car 26 days. I used to host regular dinners which were attended by mps and other like minded people and media people as well. And they come to a couple of my dinners in London at the Carlton Club, St. James. And anyway, they, they had asked me to attend their dinner, their 40th anniversary dinner in Chicago. And I went over there and I had some preliminary chats with them about, I was at loose end. I had all of this experience. The loose end's the wrong word. I was available is the right way. I had all this experience. My brand in the UK was, what did I get called the other day by one of these lefty magazines? The notorious climate denier. I was pleased about that. Anyway.

[Interviewer]

So you deny there's a climate?

[Lois]

No, I know, it's hilarious. And also it's rude using. Not just rude, but completely insensitive and Inappropriate using the term denier for something like this when the connotation with the Holocaust and all of that. So I think that's particularly insensitive. Anyway, so had some talks with them. I mean it was amazing actually at the dinner I wasn't expecting any of this, that I was asked to stand up and was given a standing ovation by all these donors in the Hilton in Chicago, which is where the Fugitive, you know that. Have you seen the film.

[Interviewer]

What's that Harrison Ford?

[Lois]

You know the bit at the end where he comes in and there's all like a black tie. It was in that room and I, and they asked me to stand up and they said that this, this, they didn't say girl. Cause you know they're a bit PC. This lady, woman, whatever has changed the, the narrative in the UK on, on Net Zero. Because the polling that we've done by the time I came to the end of my tenure at Car26 showed that over 50% in a YouGov poll of those expressed an opinion. British people thought that climate change wasn't man made. And that was not the figure when I started.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, see I really struggle with this one because I, I, I wonder where ideology comes in, where people have done their own research or they will repeat things they say or say things. I don't wonder where the influence is because you can have influence both sides.

[Lois]

Absolutely right. I do think that there's, There is, there is, it's an influence, but actually more CO2 is much better for the planet. I mean the, since we've had more. There's a lot of physicists and scientists that believe that we need a lot more CO2, that we're actually on a level now which if it gets too much lower, all of human life and all of green life will, will stop existing. Since CO2 has increased since in the, in the last, I don't know, 100 years we've had global greening.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. See this is where I really struggle because I don't understand.

[Lois]

Put it in greenhouses, don't you?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I know, I know, but I just don't, I don't understand why we can't, with the scientists that we have, have get a consensus on what is actually happening.

[Lois]

Because they don't want a consensus because they're using it to usher in stuff that has nothing to do with the planet.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but there's also like there are, there are credible scientists who believe that humans are causing a rise in temperatures and there are credible scientists who believe alternative opinions.

[Lois]

No, I I agree with you and I just.

[Interviewer]

You know what, it's a frustrates me though. I just want to know.

[Lois]

But the thing is, even, even if, I mean, so we've had 0.1% increase in temperature, right. So over the last hundred years and. But we're coming out of a mini ice age.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but again, I just, this is. Do you know what's gonna happen? The funny thing is this part of the conversation, if you go into YouTube, look at the comments, there'll be people going, no, but have you not read this and have you not.

[Lois]

I know, I know.

[Interviewer]

I just, you know.

[Lois]

But did you know. Okay, all right, I'll just throw a couple of things out there. We've had medieval warming period, roaming Roman warming period. Much warmer. Warmer than it is now. And I mean a lot warmer. They were growing grapes and making wine in Manchester. Okay, right. If that doesn't tell you everything you need to know, I don't know.

[Interviewer]

I think it would have been shit wine though.

[Lois]

Well, yeah, but it, but it was hot enough is what I'm saying, to grow. We had. If you want to go back.

[Interviewer]

But that's not really scientific.

[Lois]

Well, no, it isn't, but it was a lot warmer. And the CO2, there wasn't many, you know, Chris Eubank was not driving around in his hump in, in medieval England and Roman England, you know, and, and we, we've had periods in our, in our history and global history where CO2 levels have been much higher and it's been much colder. It, honestly, it's, it's not, it's, it's not what they're saying it is. It really, really is.

[Interviewer]

That's why I just want to know, because you see the reports on, you know, ice, ice in green and melting.

[Lois]

But actually ice in other parts of the world, even the IPCC acknowledge this is increasing.

[Interviewer]

But that's the seasonal stuff, right?

[Lois]

If, you know, if you look at it on average over the entire globe and you. There is an, it's balanced, it's melting in some places and increasing in others.

[Interviewer]

Okay, I'd have to see that because I'm seeing that.

[Lois]

But like, no, that's fine.

[Interviewer]

And then, but there are two groups of people have an opposing argument and you can, you can make a, you can do an observation. Why would someone argue one way? I think there's a whole group of.

[Lois]

People just like, can I, can I make one point?

[Interviewer]

Can we just get the truth?

[Lois]

Look at the look. And I'm not saying the right isn't guilty of this as well, that if you have one opinion, you tend to have certain same opinions and other things. Yeah, but you know, they tend to be the people who believe in all this stuff, anti capitalist, pro Gaza, pro Hamas, you know, they. They tend to be pro kids. Kids being given hormones to. There seems to be a set of beliefs that comes not, not with normal people that have certain views. But you know, the extreme people, the just stop oil people, they could literally go on any one of a number of like six or seven process. Equally. They all tend. The belief system seems to be lumped in with a sort of neo Marxist ideology. And, and also they tend to be people that don't have any faith. And of course there's nothing wrong with that. But then if you make something else your faith, faith and become just as. What's the word? Not pathological. But if you become just as fanatical about Net zero and, and the, and the climate stuff as you would if you were a fanatical extremist of it of another religion, you know, then that is a problem. And I do think it's replaced that for kids. You know, this whole thing about denying yourself, about being a good person. Saint Greta, you know, God, David Attenborough sitting there telling us that there's too many humans in the world. I bet it won't be his family that's depopulated.

[Interviewer]

Have you read the. The Righteous Behind?

[Lois]

No, I haven't.

[Interviewer]

It's a really, really good book. It's. It's fascinating. Jonathan Haidt wrote it.

[Lois]

Right.

[Interviewer]

It's one of my favorite books I've read because he explains why some people are conservative and once some people are more.

[Lois]

My background is the Labour Party.

[Interviewer]

Well, I might not. I've never been a communist.

[Lois]

I didn't see myself like that at all. I mean, my.

[Interviewer]

You're in a red dress today.

[Lois]

Yeah, well, that's because men like me in red don't go any deeper than that. That is literally the base reason why I wear red. Okay.

[Interviewer]

But this book, this book's brilliant, Lois. I think you really like it because I wanted to know why is it all these people think this way and share views on conservatives? And why is it all these people are progressive and think the same and share the same views and apparently it's some of its nature, some of its nurture, but it's to do with the basis of where your foundational principles come from. Like if you're progressive, your foundational principles tend to be about care and do no harm. So if you start to look at all these issues, it's like, oh, I'm caring for the environment, I'm caring for.

[Lois]

I see myself as an environmentalist.

[Interviewer]

No, no, I'm not saying you're not, but like, if the prouding principle comes from that point, whereas if you're a conservative, your founding principle tends to become focused on the family and the individual unit. And it's a fascinating. I think you'd really enjoy the book.

[Lois]

No, I, I'd love to. I'd love to read that. I mean, my, my upbringing, I was brought up primarily by my grandparents. My, my mum's a bit of a wild artist character. I'm the oldest of six, actually, but I, I've lived with my grandparents as an only child sort of thing. But my grandad dad was. Had a labor background, but was not a fan of the unions at all. He didn't, he thought they were thugs. But he, he was a capitalist socialist that believed that you needed capitalism to fund socialism. But his version of socialism wasn't what's going on at the moment. It was about having safety nets and the original principles, the founding principles, traditional, traditional principles. So like, for example, he resigned from the local Labour Party when they introduced prescription charges because he said it'll just, it'll just go mad and no one be able to afford it. But. Yeah, but he believed he, he had his own business, he ran a factory with 80 staff and he believed in looking after everyone, believed in paying taxes, all of that. I mean, yeah, I do idolize him, but. But, you know, so my upbringing was quite interesting in that. And he was very much an individual. He didn't want anyone to tell him what to do. He wanted to do what he wanted to do when he wanted to do it. So it's traditional labor. It's a traditional labor. They're the people that are coming over to reform, actually, interestingly enough. But. So, yeah, I always saw myself as labor. And when Tony Blair presented himself, how old was I when. Okay, So I was 13 or 14 when he became the leader, I think. And I thought, oh, this is great. Bear in mind, I was 13 or 14. This is great. You know, you can be labor and you can be pro business and you know, as Peter Mandelson famously said, I'm decidedly relaxed about people being filthy rich or something like that. And I just thought, yeah, this works for me, you know, and I was door knocking and all of that kind of stuff for him when I was 15 in the election. Little did I know what was actually going on, but things really, really, really changed. For me, you know, later on when all this, you know, all this woke stuff and all this anti business stuff and and I I never saw myself as a conservative so I actually went right off politics for a long while and what woke me up? I bet you can guess.

[Interviewer]

Covid.

[Lois]

Covid.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

And then I thought no, no no no no no no no no. Something needs to happen here. And I got involved with the Reclaim Party with Lawrence Fox's Things. First of all, I became the and the woman spokesperson for a while, but.

[Interviewer]

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[Lois]

I know because I get on really well with Lawrence and Martin now. I don't want to say anything. Do you know what? I think what they did at the time that they did, it was really significant. I think they did make the cut through, but they made the cut through when it was necessary. Effectively. They were an anti lockdown party and so they were of their time. And I would say if you encapsulate what Reclaimed did during that period, it was extremely important actually, and then became less significant once the lockdown had, you know, had stopped. And. But I mean, you know, Lawrence Fox and Martin Daubny at the time, they, you know, they were heroes, heroic in what they were doing. I actually got. I am now permanently banned from the BBC because of Lawrence. But, you know, it's not such a bad thing. So I was a regular, a regular on Jeremy Vine Channel 5 show panelist, and a regular on BBC radio too, on his show and other shows. And so they had me on talking about something or other and it's live, and I decided to use my slot, which I shouldn't have been. I didn't tell them I was going to do this to endorse Lawrence Fox as mayor of London. You're right.

[Interviewer]

Does that break some kind of com rule?

[Lois]

Well, I mean, I doubt they'd given him much coverage, so I probably actually made them ofcom. Complicit. Not complicit. Compliant. Sorry. Compliant. Yeah, complicit. Yeah. But anyway, that was the last time I was on the BBC. But they loved it at the Reclaim Party. They thought. Thought great. And I was. Yeah, I was involved with them for a while and then I made a decision to. To step away from that. There was disorganized.

[Interviewer]

There's been a few, like, attempts to break this. Yeah. Historical, you know, Labor Conservative stronghold of politics with the Lib Dems kind of swimming around and maybe getting in the coalition like Reclaim and Ukip.

[Lois]

And now they're insidious. You've got to watch them.

[Interviewer]

But the first time that we've Seen real cut through to break. Yeah. And Nigel has done a really impressive job.

[Lois]

He is, he's a hero.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, he's done a really impressive job to have them now leading a poll. And look, we know polls are different, but it's impressive to see somebody get to that.

[Lois]

But he's leading the polls. Reform are leading the polls. Him, he's leading the polls when they're very weighted against him. So even with the weighting. So for example, I think up until Extremely recently when YouGov did voting intention polling, they didn't even have reform on the list. It had Greens, so it had Conservatives, Labor, Lib Dems and Greens. And then other party had to click go onto another page and then reformer towards the bottom of that list. Even with weighting against them like that. Waiting, as in W e I G H T I g N g n G. Yeah. Even with waiting against them like that, they've still win.

[Interviewer]

Well, I, I just think it's really impressive. I, I'm intrigued to see what happens over this next four years.

[Lois]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

Because everything's going a bit weird, like labor of coming at a time when the country is not in a good state. And I've tried to implement some traditional labor things, which is higher tax.

[Lois]

Traditional.

[Interviewer]

The higher tax and the, you know.

[Lois]

Well, a lot of things.

[Interviewer]

Not working class tradition, but it's not working, working.

[Lois]

And so actually, because we're not interested, are we?

[Interviewer]

No, but it's almost, I think in the scene, it's not working. And so they have to go a little bit more conservative in some of their ideas. I can see a switch where labor realize we're absolutely going to get eviscerated in the next election if we don't get this economy growing. And I think they're going to have to start reducing taxes.

[Lois]

I think the way it's taxing is.

[Interviewer]

A big yes, but the weight of public opinion against them is huge. The amount of labor voters who, who, who really voted as a protest vote against the conservatives who are now like, oh, I totally regret this. This has been a nightmare. So seeing, seeing what they're doing, seeing the conservatives, how they're gonna have to try and reform what they're doing and their policies, while at the same time you've got reform leading this kind of exciting new charge, but having to establish.

[Lois]

Themselves, they're having to retrofit. That's the word that they use in property, isn't it? Yeah. They're retrofitting an organizational structure, a party organizational structure of branches and everything at every level. And another hero is Zia. Zia Youssef.

[Interviewer]

I saw him on Question Time the other day. I thought it was very impressive.

[Lois]

He's great friend of mine. Great guy. What he's doing is extraordinary in terms of structuring. It's not restructuring, it's structuring the party. When you look at Labor, Conservative. Hundreds, hundreds of years of, you know, infrastructure, party infrastructure, you got reform and they've got the momentum, they've got the people behind them, but they've got to do all of this stuff now, you know.

[Interviewer]

Did you watch him on Question Time?

[Lois]

Yes, I did, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Do you know what I thought was very clever guy? Well, what I thought was really interesting about him is he just sat there, very calm.

[Lois]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Let everyone speak. And then he would just cut his in and he would just focus on the issue and give a very articulate, sensible reply to the issues. No emotion. He didn't look like he was trying to play the audience.

[Lois]

I've been in meetings with him. You know what I'm like. I'm a bouncy tigger. And he could, if he can, he can manage me. And if he. If he can, someone can manage me. They can manage. They can manage a political party.

[Interviewer]

But building out that infrastructure over the next four years is going to be a huge challenge and. And trying to see how the media is going to respond. Cause you know what the media's like. Once they know something works, they're gonna go after it and try and get involved. It's a bit like how we have the. I talk about the rest of politics guys a lot. They're moaning about Trump, but they talk about him all the time. Cause they actually said they're giving him.

[Lois]

Energy, they're giving him oxygen, literally.

[Interviewer]

Well, they said eight of their 10 biggest shows are about Trump.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And so they're incentivized to cover him. There's this.

[Lois]

Well, it was like when I did the show, I was a permanent team captain on a show called that Was the Woke that was. Was present. Oh, it was brilliant. In its heyday, we were on YouTube. I mean, this. Look, this is probably not big compared to you, but we were getting like 2,300,000 viewers a week on YouTube. Talk TV. It was a talk TV show presented by Andre Walker, who's a good friend of mine. And. And actually, we are going to be doing. I'm sure I'm allowed to say this. If I'm not, it's too late. Andre and I are doing our own show, a sort of version of the Quiz, the news quiz show. That was the work that was at the Reform Ral next month in Birmingham. So anyone that's coming along to that, please come and see Andre and I's.

[Interviewer]

Show this a reform rally. It's this an attempt to start to do similar to what happens in America. Because talking about a rally rather than a conference, the idea that you actually. You bring a group of people together and start to create a momentum behind the party.

[Lois]

I can't speak for them, I don't work say. I would say. Yeah. I would say that it's not an unfair appraisal. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Because it's quite. It'd be quite an interesting approach. Cause it's not. It feels very American and it works in America. I'd be intrigued to see how it would work here.

[Lois]

Well, some of the conferences that I've seen on television and online and attended, that they've done.

[Interviewer]

Conferences are stodgy. Conferences are stodgy.

[Lois]

Yeah. But the most recent ones that they've done have been. Have been a bit American. Y feel. The feel has been American. Yeah, absolutely. Because in a way, what we've got now is. What we've got with Nigel Farage is. You remember the momentum that Blair had behind him. It was Blair, wasn't it? It wasn't the Labour Party. It was Blair.

[Interviewer]

It was impressive.

[Lois]

This is similar. This is similar, but different. This is much more presidential than momentum behind him. Personally, this is much more Trumpian and I think it works with the whole rally thing. I really do see the Blair comparison.

[Interviewer]

Is an interesting one because, I mean, I never voted for Blair and I wouldn't. I wasn't old enough to vote, so I was.

[Lois]

You were just.

[Interviewer]

I was just old enough. I was. I think I was 19. No, I was 18. It was my first ever election. I voted in. I obviously didn't vote for Labour, I never would, but. But you could.

[Lois]

You stop rubbing it in.

[Interviewer]

You could have. You could observe the. The momentum behind it. There was an excitement.

[Lois]

It was an excitement. It was. And that is something that, again, they have, is the positivity. Positivity and hope.

[Interviewer]

Well, that's the thing. So even though I didn't vote for them, when they came in, you could.

[Lois]

Fit, I don't know, Britannia and all that. It felt like the country lifted.

[Interviewer]

Even though I didn't vote for them, it felt like the country.

[Lois]

It was a lift. And you had Patsy Kensett and Liam Gallagher on the front cover of. What was it? Was it Rolling Stone with Cool Britannia and wrapped in a Union Jack and yeah, there was a vibe, there was a thing going on and it's not.

[Interviewer]

The same, but I can imagine at a time, if reform win, there would be an excitement around it. But that's because there's so much expectation and hope that reform can do something that neither the Conservatives or Labor have done recently.

[Lois]

Well, they don't want to. I think that. I think the point is that. That they would. They actually. The difference is that the public think, feel that they want to make change, whereas they have no faith in the Uni Party, that they. That they have any intention or desire.

[Interviewer]

Well, can they even. Can they actually do it? Do it? You mean Liz Truss talked about it.

[Lois]

Yeah, but it's. It's slightly different. She didn't have a party behind her. They would. They'd be all brand new, fresh mps.

[Interviewer]

Well, but that's what I mean. It's like I say, she was pulled.

[Lois]

Down by her own party. And the globalists that wanted Rishi out. I. I am. I actually did a piece to camera for Mark Stein on GB News years ago when, when they deposed Liz tripping trust and put Rishi in, that had the record number of complaints they've ever had from MPS. 55 MPs rung in and complained about my piece to camera.

[Interviewer]

Why? What did you say?

[Lois]

So I've got notorious climate denier and the person that sparked the most complaint.

[Interviewer]

I said, Cop 26 banned from the BBC.

[Lois]

Is it. Is it something wrong with me? I loosen. Oh, no. I'm a focused, loose cannon. But anyway, I just said I thought there'd been a globalist. I said that Liz Truss had been deposed, that there were sleeper agents within the government and they put Rishi, their boy in, their banker boy in, and that everyone should be frightened that the name of my piece of camera is Democracy is Dead. I can't imagine why 55 MPs rung in and complained, can you? But it got over a million views.

[Interviewer]

It's this long decline that. What do you put as a background to this? Why, for example? Or is the Conservative Party not conservative anymore?

[Lois]

Because it's been. It's been taken over.

[Interviewer]

By who?

[Lois]

By people. By the. It's quite interesting, actually. I watched a documentary recently that said that everyone assumes that the globalist sort of agenda has come from, I don't know, un Davos, all of these kind of sinister groups or whatever.

[Interviewer]

Is it venture capital?

[Lois]

Well, this documentary said that it's actually come from Silicon Valley because there was a group of people that believed that if computers were running the world that we were all linked by computer, the Internet and everything. That there would be no need for nation states, there would be no need for individual government, there would be no need for any restrictions on movement, that the computers would manage the world and the computers would run the financial markets as well. And that everything was sort of self balancing and self manage. I know it sounds absolutely crazy, but this was the, the orthodoxy and the way of thinking of a huge number of the, of the big and original computer online software entrepreneurs, million multi millionaires in Silicon Valley and in the sort of 90s and everything. So everyone does make the assumption that is some sin, you know, sinister Klaus stroking the cat in Davos or whatever. But actually I think there's other things at play. I think you've got the financial institutions, I think you've got the big tech companies and then of course you do have the big institutions that are multi nation, that incorporate things like the who and stuff like that. But he was asked, our Prime Minister was asked by Emily Maitlis, who wears more makeup than I do, right? And that's no mean feat, but at least mine's the right color for my fact place. She asked Keir Starmer, are you happy? Where are you happiest? Davos or west or Westminster? And he replied, davos. They're not hiding it. There's no. He said, I prefer Davos to Westminster. Our own Prime Minister, it's like the farming minister the other day he actually made a statement to the farmers. Farming and farmers are not top of the list, priority list for labor either. Why don't you get a farming minister that actually does think that it's a priority? You know, they're not hiding the fact that they don't care about certain things and that their agenda is, is bigger than, than the uk it's, you know, they don't believe in borders. They don't believe in, they don't believe we should have sovereignty. They don't believe in any of it.

[Interviewer]

But what is it they believe in then?

[Lois]

They believe that, that, that we are one way. That, that it's, that it's, it's a global project, there's no borders. And that based. That they're Neo Marxists. They are, they know that you know what it is. I was talking to my daughter about this, right? And she said, I was talking to you about net zero, who profits from subsidies, who profits from this, who profits from that? And she said, oh my God, Mommy. Is it like when the pigs go and live in the house in Animal Farm? And I said, yeah, good girl. Yeah, it is, it's exactly. We are all equal, but some of us are more equal than others. So we're not going to be allowed to drive, we're not going to be allowed to go on holiday. Ed Miliband has announced in the last couple of days they're imposing an immediate tax on flights that will come into before this summer for working class people to make flights unaffordable for normal ordinary families that were work bloody hard all year for their two weeks or 10 days. You know, they won't be able to travel, they won't have their own car, they won't be able to do anything whatsoever. But the pigs who live in the house, they're all right. They're flying all over the place, they're eating meat, they're doing whatever the hell they want. So.

[Interviewer]

That's very observant of your daughter.

[Lois]

She's a good girl.

[Interviewer]

I like that. It's making me feel.

[Lois]

Do you want to hear her remarks on feminism?

[Interviewer]

Go.

[Lois]

So we were. So she was being a bit.

[Interviewer]

How old is she? You don't have to say if you don't want.

[Lois]

No, she's 14.

[Interviewer]

So I've got a 14 year old.

[Lois]

She's not like I was at 14. She's like a little girl. 14. I. Yeah, it's a bit different for me. But anyway, she, she was at the. She went out with that. She was supposed to be at a friend's house and we found out that she was in a park late at night and the friend had disappeared then couldn't find her. And Lola was in a park on her own at night, night 14 and you know, she looks like a supermodel basically, although she doesn't wear any makeup or anything. And we freaked out, as you can imagine, it was a total freak out. Then we couldn't find her, her phone was off, everything. Anyway, so I've got a place in London. So she splits her time between London and Essex, right. So we were, we went and got some food and we were walking back to my flat, right. And she goes to me, it's not fair anyway, you know, boys can go to the park. It's not. She, she doesn't want to be a boy, obviously. She said it's not fair that because I'm a girl, it's a. About me being out at night, you know, she said, why are boys so. Why can't they control themselves? What is. You know why when they see boobs, anyway, she goes, what's wrong with them? You know, it just Annoyed her, you know, that the very fact that she was a girl made it different about her being out on her own at night. And I thought, yeah, you've got a point. She wasn't saying that she wasn't gonna do what we asked her to. She was just saying it's just unfair and why can't they control themselves? Anyway, she's going. And I thought, that's my. My daughter doing feminism. Which I thought was quite well, because boys are.

[Interviewer]

Boys are idiots.

[Lois]

Yeah. I just said, you know what? I said, yeah, it isn't fair, but it's the way it is, you know, and that. And she was like, yeah, I know. But it was just funny how she went off on this rant about it.

[Interviewer]

I don't know if my daughter's read Animal Farm. I'm gonna have to check. You had to read it at school, did you? Yeah, you liked it?

[Lois]

It's a good cartoon version of it. She's read the book. But there's also really, really good cartoon version of it.

[Interviewer]

I'm gonna dig it out and make sure my daughter reads it.

[Lois]

Well, Kia would definitely be one of the pigs living in the house. House, yeah. But the other thing that's interesting in Animal Farm is about the. The left hatred of old people and I think. So for example, in, in the. In the book or where the pigs promise that there'll be land that is for the horses when they retire so they can just chill.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

And then one of the most sinister parts of the book is when one of the other animals notices that the area that's supposed to be for the horses for. For their retirement, it's been used for something else. And there's no sign of the horses and dunno, scrapping winter fuel payments, you know, assisted suicide burdens. I don't know. It's all looking a bit Orwellian, isn't it? I think even Orwell would look at what was going on and think, Christ alive, I couldn't come up with this.

[Interviewer]

You know, it's that meme make. What was it? Make Orwell fiction again.

[Lois]

Yeah, Elon Musk.

[Interviewer]

Musk did it.

[Lois]

Yeah, I saw that. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

It's just. Just this really weird time. It's take. I think one interesting thing is watching people kind of wake up to it and realize I've certainly later than other people. I know they used to say wake up. He, you can't see what's going on. You've stayed his car key, blah, blah, blah. And you know, they're right. There's certain things I'm just starting to think like, this is enough is enough.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, it's so obvious what's going on again. I say it again, I can sound like a broken record. Taxes are going up.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Growth is stagnant. Government's getting bigger, there's more regulation, there's.

[Lois]

More attack on private enterprise, attacks on private freedom.

[Interviewer]

Attacks on freedom, attacks on liberty, attacks on free speech. You go to jail for sending, sending a tweet, but you get a suspended sentence if you're a nonce. All the millionaires are leaving. If you work for the BBC. I mean, Hugh Edwards, how he was not sent to. Like you had a chance here to just say, here, let's prove that there is an elite that protects each other. We have a TV presenter on his phone, they catch the highest, most disgusting grade nonsense and they give him a suspended sentence because of his mental health. And it was just like. Do you ever. Do you follow Dapper Laughs on Twitter?

[Lois]

No.

[Interviewer]

Oh, you will love this guy. Con, can you find Dapper Laughs? You will.

[Lois]

I gave some good, you know, recommendations today.

[Interviewer]

So search for on Twitter for Dapper Laughs. But go in the videos, there's the one where he talks about Hugh Edwards, if you can find that. It's brilliant.

[Lois]

Yeah, you're right. Hugh Edwards. They hadn't, I hadn't thought of it like that. They had an opportunity to, to, to, to prove that there wasn't a cover up, that the BBC wasn't, you know, Pedophile paradise. Yeah. And they didn't take it.

[Interviewer]

They didn't take it.

[Lois]

I wonder if it's for the same reason that they never did Jimmy Savile. Because Jimmy Savile used to boast, they will never do me because I know where the bodies are buried.

[Interviewer]

This is the one.

[Lois]

All right.

[Interviewer]

You're gonna love this. I'm trying to get him on the pod, I think.

[Lois]

Is he Essex?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

Yeah. Going on here, boys.

[Interviewer]

This one's mental. Another breaking news story. Yeah.

[Lois]

Another win for the state funded pedo factory.

[Interviewer]

I am of course talking about the old BBC.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Their flagship presenter, Hugh Edwards, who paid for 41 indecent images. I'm talking about the worst, skanky, dirty rotten images of children that you could think of. The most abusive stuff. He just got a suspended sentence. No jail time.

[Lois]

Now make this make sense.

[Interviewer]

The other day we put a pensioner, a pensioner, 67 year old man in.

[Lois]

Prison for 20 months. Yeah. For shouting you're not English anymore. At the Old Bill. Is this the guy?

[Interviewer]

Words in the uk now, according to.

[Lois]

No, not him.

[Interviewer]

To the UK justice system, words are.

[Lois]

Worse than nonsense, mate.

[Interviewer]

Where you off to? Hold up. Someone posted something on Facebook.

[Lois]

I like this guy, right.

[Interviewer]

He is amazing. So he was cancelled at one point. I think he made a rape joke and he was cancelled. But he's kind of rebuilt his career as a, you know, back on tour. You know, he's doing very well.

[Lois]

You miss dark humor a bit. I do.

[Interviewer]

Well. So interestingly, you know, I'm gonna say something's gonna sound really controversial. Might piss some people off at the moment, but, you know this thing that's come out about these labor mps in this WhatsApp group.

[Lois]

Yeah. It was private.

[Interviewer]

It was private.

[Lois]

And I wonder, I do feel, feel a bit conflicted.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I feel conflicted because he didn't.

[Lois]

Say it to the woman, did he?

[Interviewer]

No, I'm not sure. Did he mean it or was he trying to say in Jess. And they all come out. Some other guys come out, say, I was in that group and like, if my WhatsApps came out, I would be cancelled a million times. We just.

[Lois]

Because you joke.

[Interviewer]

You make jokes.

[Lois]

You don't even want to know about mine because you wanted a bit of fun.

[Interviewer]

Honestly. I, I.

[Lois]

It's privately supposed to be.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, because you can't say these things publicly because Keir Starmer might send you to jail. So you say things privately. Just have a joke. And sometimes the humor's a bit dark at times, but you're just having a joke. Right.

[Lois]

And sometimes people make jokes about things that are dark because otherwise it's the old adage, isn't it? If you don't laugh, you cry. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You go.

[Lois]

Gallows humor. We're very good at it in this.

[Interviewer]

Country and I'm not comfortable about people apologizing for things. So. In a private group because there was.

[Lois]

Nothing to do with them.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it was said privately. It's, you know, it might be distasteful and it might be, you know, gross. And I don't, I haven't seen the messages. All I could think was at the time, I 100% have said things privately to other people. That is a, maybe a joke. Like he, it might not. Like, what did he say? As you said, trigger me. Timber, Andrew.

[Lois]

But it's, he did say something about somebody had a Jewish sounding name, so we don't want him there.

[Interviewer]

Well, that's not good.

[Lois]

Yeah, that's not a dark joke. That's just horrible. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Oh, I know, love, but I get his mother a ticket to the pensions party. Every year. Definitely Labor. Haha. I know her from Morris Agruta. I mean look, it looks like they're having a joke with each.

[Lois]

That particular bit. Yeah. I do agree with you to a certain extent, I think. Yeah, yeah. That particular comment about somebody having the wrong sounding surname is different. But again it is a private WhatsApp group.

[Interviewer]

But, but we're canceling people for saying things privately. It gets you to.

[Lois]

But that's very sinister. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Because you worry about like you know, at any point you can't. What can I say? Can I say stuff privately? Can you know, in any situation am I going to be in a conversation privately? In Project Veritas have been quite good at, you know, trick making people think they're on a day and getting them to exposing. It's their form of journalism.

[Lois]

But am I at some point I think that's horrible. That's entrapment. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But if would I. Could I end up being in a conversation probably with somebody I think who's a friend and suddenly they're recording it and I make some dumb dark joke and then. And, and that's it. I'm done.

[Lois]

I'm finished. No, that's not fair.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. No. And I just, I don't feel 100% comfortable.

[Lois]

The legislation that, that, that Angela Rainer is trying to bring in whereby someone could say something in a pub that was, I don't know, said they didn't agree with kids being transitioned or whatever and that X could affect. They could upset technically the person working behind the bar and so that person has committed a crime because they've said a non woke thing in a pub.

[Interviewer]

I mean that's just absolutely nonsense.

[Lois]

Well, that's. Again, it's overused term but that's all.

[Interviewer]

Helio, I think that. I think the WOKE stuff's dying. We had. Do you know Eric Kaufman?

[Lois]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, we had him in last week. I thought it was super interesting when he was explaining where it starts from that the, the WOKE ideology starts from within schools. It's the teachers who do that. And look, by the way, if, if kids are a bit left with their ideas, I think that's kind of fair. I would expect a kid to have misplaced empathy and misplaced understanding about how the world works. But he said it's. But when you've got teachers indoctrinated.

[Lois]

Yeah. Then that's very different.

[Interviewer]

That's a problem.

[Lois]

Although they, the. My daughter's generation aren't particularly woke. They're sick of.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I know, I agree.

[Lois]

Lola is absolutely sick of it. She really is. She's. She could. You can't say this. You can't say. She. She's. She says that she. It's a very. You know, people from all different backgrounds and stuff at her school and certain kids can make jokes about someone's background, but you can't retaliate. Not that. Not that they want to, but it's all very unfair.

[Interviewer]

We had this stuff this week with Sam Kerr that. The footballer. She came out. I think she was a. I think she got off. She got off on her racially aggravated crime or wherever it was. But she'd been out. Do you know her? She's a footballer.

[Lois]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

She'd been out drinking. She vomited in a taxi and then the taxi driver get to pay and then she got arrested.

[Lois]

It sounds like a good night out.

[Interviewer]

Well, but then with the police, she said something. You'll probably find this. Connor said something about the police, about being. Being stupid and white. Yeah, stupid and white.

[Lois]

Oh, right.

[Interviewer]

And I think the point that people were making is if somebody said, yeah, here we go. I don't know who needs to hear this, but Sam Kerr is a vile racist.

[Lois]

Yeah, right. Okay. And I think it's not fair.

[Interviewer]

I think what some of the commentary had come back said, well, what if that had been a white person said stupid and black? You would be canceled instantly. And why? Why? Yeah, yeah. It's just. It's a bit skewy. How people are gonna wait is.

[Lois]

Is it's making their generation not woke. Yeah, it really is. And I mean, Lola, there's a girl that thought she was a cat. And Lola and her friends, they weren't. They weren't bullying her, but they were asking her questions like, do you identify as a cat? And stuff like that? You know, it's all they should address.

[Interviewer]

As a dog and chase.

[Lois]

Yeah, absolutely. And what was the other. There's like lesbianism and all of that kind of stuff. And Lola's. We sent Lola to a Roman Catholic girls school mainly because, I mean, we do have faith. I'm not Roman Catholic, I'm high Church of England. Her dad's Roman Catholic. We're divorced now. But one of the reasons that we chose that school is A, no boys, B, we didn't have to pay for it finally, not having to pay school fees, and C, and most importantly, they weren't going to be pushing the whole trans ideology. They were going to be doing the minimum that they could get away with being a state school in terms of pushing all of that kind of stuff.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. But you say this. My. My daughter's in a private school and I got a letter recently from.

[Lois]

How old she. Same age.

[Interviewer]

Same age? Yeah. From the head of. Yeah, but it's edi. For some reason, they flipped it. Equity, diversity, inclusion. They flip the letters around.

[Lois]

Oh, wow.

[Interviewer]

And they talk to me about the frameworks coming. I was like. And just the thing is, there was no DEI when I was at school. No, I didn't need it. No, we weren't racist, we weren't idiots. We understood how the world worked. But we were taught math, biology, chemistry, and we did some debating and business.

[Lois]

I remember everyone getting on okay.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, we did business skills and we had young entrepreneurs where we created our first business. We printed teachers when we got told to write letters to fame. So we did all this stuff. Stuff. And now I'm like, what. What is it you think you're going to teach my daughter that she's not alone at home? And by the way, what happens if that contradicts it?

[Lois]

Yes. So did they. What was.

[Interviewer]

I haven't seen the framework. We've been told it's coming. And I, like I say the head.

[Lois]

Teacher assured us when we made the decision for her to go to that school that, that they. They don't have an exemption because they're Roman Catholic. But they are. They don't. They do what they have to and no more. In terms of the PHSC and all that.

[Interviewer]

Have you seen what's happened with Starbucks in. I think it's. Is it Minnesota or Maryland? Search for Starbucks being sued. This is super interesting because it's all starting to collapse now. All this woke is the whole framework.

[Lois]

I'm gonna try and pour some water. Wrong.

[Interviewer]

No, no, you're fine, fine. Just go.

[Lois]

Okay. Because I was told to keep my eye on arms.

[Interviewer]

If we leave it that side of the bike, it's better for us.

[Lois]

Leave it over here. Yeah, right. Okay.

[Interviewer]

You found it? Yeah. Here you go. Let's check this out. State as Missouri sue Starbucks over coffee giants DI practices. The state of Missouri has filed a lawsuit against Starbucks on Tuesday accusing the coffee giant of using its DEI initiatives to engage in systematic discrimination based on race, gender and sexual orientation. Filed in the Federal Court of St. Louis, the lawsuit alleges that Starbucks linked executive pay to meeting racial and gender hiring quotas. It also claims the company favors certain groups for training and advancement opportunities and maintained a quota system to diverse itself.

[Lois]

And they're saying that that's illegal?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. That all of this is unflawful. Missouri's Republican attorney General Andrew Bailey said in the complaint argue the policies violate federal state civil rights laws. Bailey also alleged that Missouri consumers faced higher prices and longer wait times at Starbucks because the company prioritizes diversity over.

[Lois]

No talent whatsoever working there. Well, they just very slow.

[Interviewer]

Well, they're basically saying, you think you're anti racist by doing this, but you are being racist because you're.

[Lois]

You're discriminating.

[Interviewer]

You're discriminating.

[Lois]

And the law, I should imagine civil rights having no discrimination.

[Interviewer]

Well, and probably the law was originally established during the civil rights movement when.

[Lois]

There was black people, but that's not needed anymore. So. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And then I think the. The problem is that what they're trying. The thing they're trying to fix.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Is the outcome, but they're not trying to fix the opportunity. I've got no issue like people should be trying to, you know, if there are certain areas and certain cities where there's certain communities that are deprived, got less opportunity, let's try and give them more opportunity. Don't fix the outcome. And the fact that this is. It's like nature is starting to heal.

[Lois]

Was it my. The most gorgeous man the entire planet says in Jurassic Park, Jeff Goldblum.

[Interviewer]

I met him on a plane once.

[Lois]

I met him once. I'll tell you the story in a minute. Cause there are two or three humans alive in the world that haven't heard my Jeff Goldblum story. And you're one of them. But in Jurassic park he says, life will find a way. Do you remember?

[Interviewer]

Yep.

[Lois]

Yeah. Cause they're all supposed to be girls, aren't they, in Jurassic Park? And something happens and. And they start fertilizing each other. Anyway, but do you want to hear my Jeff Goldblum story? Okay, so, all right. I have to go from the beginning. So everyone has a moment where they realize that they're either straight or not or whatever. They have. I don't know, maybe you might see somebody on television or in a magazine and you think, oh, that's a funny feeling. I never felt that before. Well, mine was. I was 10 years old and my mum, being very naughty and I was staying with her, let me watch the Fly, which I believe is a 15. But anyway, it's another story. And there was particular scene in it where he's turning it from normal Jeff into the Fly and he's doing all this sort of aerobic, acrobatic stuff. Right. Anyway, I had my ping moment during that. I thought, wow, okay, that was weird.

[Interviewer]

Anyway, so mine was Beverly Hills Cop.

[Lois]

Oh, Not Eddie Murphy? No.

[Interviewer]

The blonde police lady.

[Lois]

Oh, I'm joking, of course. Yeah, yeah, good, good choice. But anyway, you can't control it. It just happens, doesn't it? And anyway, When I was 18, I was dating a guy who is an MBE now, a guy called Morris Bright, MBE. He's the chairman of Pyman Studios for a time. And we were at a party and he knew my Goldblum thing and he. And Jeff was there and he took me over, right? He said, oh, Mr. Goldblum, I'd like you to meet my. My girlfriend. He was a bit older than me, Lois. And so Jeff said, oh, hi, Lois, lovely to meet you. Silence can speak. So then he goes, so, are you enjoying the party? You know, nothing. No words. And I never shut up, ever, do I? And. And then he tried again. Nothing was happening. I was completely, you know, nothing, no words. There was no. There was no communication. And he turned to Maurice and he said, she's cute. She's mute, but she's cute. Yeah. So, unfortunately, he thinks I'm retarded.

[Interviewer]

Well, I mean, I met him. I was flying up to LA and I met him in the toilets between first class, where he was, and, you know, peasant class, where I was. I went to the. I went to the toilet. I came out of the toilet and.

[Lois]

And there was.

[Interviewer]

James was like, you're Jeff. Cool. And he was like, yeah. And he was so nice. We had a photo.

[Lois]

Unfortunately, he thinks I'm a Muppet.

[Interviewer]

Well, he asked me what I was doing in la and then I. Yeah, and then he said. And his bat. He was. Told me he was in a band and they're playing a concert and he told me to come down. I didn't go, but.

[Lois]

Really?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, he's in a band.

[Lois]

He's like, mega gel here.

[Interviewer]

The photo's up on my Instagram. This is a lot thinner back then.

[Lois]

I'll have to have a look.

[Interviewer]

He was so nice.

[Lois]

Well, I still. I mean, I still have a framed picture of Jeff in my kitchen, but it's from Jurassic Park. You know, that one with the black shirt?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I know. Yeah, I know.

[Lois]

Anyway, you better change your subject.

[Interviewer]

So, anyway, so. But since it must be an interesting time to be bringing Heartland to the. And I know no conservatives here know Heartland anyway, in the us, but bringing them to UK now must be an interesting time because it's at a time where I think there's a general shift for a certain number of people towards conservatism.

[Lois]

I think you're right. There's the genuine Conservatives and not the conservatives that we have in power.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

Not in opposition.

[Interviewer]

And I'm sure you're friends with Mark Littlewood. I'm sure you talk to him. Him and another small C conservative. He's very interested what's happening at the moment. But traditionally it would be the Conservative big C party.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But now you've got two, essentially. One by name, one by action. Conservative parties.

[Lois]

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that was made even more. That's even more the case since the coalition, because you had loads of. With. With Clegg and Cameron, because you effectively had lots of liberal Democrats. Democrats in their hearts become Conservative mps. They were selected as Conservative mps, but they're not conservative.

[Interviewer]

Well, they've dragged the party down.

[Lois]

They have.

[Interviewer]

And they're still there.

[Lois]

They have. They are still there. They're all. Yeah. I would say CCHQ is totally Liberal Democrat now.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. But I do think. I think. I do think Kemi's trying to change things. I do.

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I mean, you could have a different opinion. I think I. I think. What the. I'm trying to read between the lines.

[Lois]

Embarrassing.

[Interviewer]

I don't know. I quite like her. I quite like her. But I'm trying to read between the lines of what I've read in Liz Truss's book and what she said at this table, the various people I've spoken to, is that there's what you want to do and what you can do and the certain amount of it is a bit of maneuvering. You can't just. I don't think a chemie can just come in and suddenly it completely changed the party overnight to what she wants it to be. I think she's got to maneuver it towards it. That's my read.

[Lois]

And that's the difference between having someone that's put in like Kemi and someone coming in potentially like Nigel, almost presidentially.

[Interviewer]

But he can do what he wants.

[Lois]

Yeah. So this is the. This is the difference between. She's got all of that weight on her shoulders, like you said, some. Something fresh coming in that doesn't have all the baggage. So. So. So, yeah. I mean, I don't know what to say about Kemi.

[Interviewer]

Well, but I have to.

[Lois]

I work with all of the political parties. Yeah. And including. Including the Conservatives and the Greens, funnily enough, I. I wanted to have a stand when I was doing car 26 at the green Party Conference in Brighton and, you know, obviously, debate. Why not have a debate? It's going to bring some of my scientists and physicists down with me and it was all full steam ahead. They had the form, paid the deposit and they blocked it at the last minute. My doctor said don't want to debate, you can't have a debate. You can only debate something when you can defend it.

[Interviewer]

Well, you can't debate everything in this country now because you can't say certain done things.

[Lois]

Well, I mean, you know the BB Ofcom changed the law so that in the past, right, if you wanted to have an idea or a proposition made on television, you had to always have somebody on the other side of the argument. Yeah, but they changed the law so that they said that climate change, if they talk about man made climate change, they don't need to do that anymore. It's, it's almost the only topic, topic that you can have on television where it doesn't have to be changed.

[Interviewer]

But that's what happened to Covid, right?

[Lois]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

We couldn't have alternative theories, alternative ideas.

[Lois]

No, that's absolutely right. So that, that, you know, that does tell you something, doesn't it?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So, so in bringing Heartland, what is the goal is it, What's Heartland bringing to the UK that we don't have at the moment?

[Lois]

Well we, we are, we, we're bringing a little bit of that American magic over to the, over to the uk. So we're go. We want to improve influence, policymakers, we want to talk to politicians, we're already doing all this stuff. We want to encourage debate, we want to talk about minimal government and free speech and, and all of those things and really, really, really push it. And liberty, liberty, climate realism, climate debate, rational thinking, science or all of those things that we've done so well in the States, we want to bring to this country and there isn't anyone doing a quite, quite what we're doing in the UK at the moment. I mean when I did car 26 we were the, we were the only. There was a gwpf, but they were much more on the fence and much more stage. The Global Warming Policy foundation that was previously run by Lord Lawson and Net Zero Watch is part of that as well. In, in actual fact they launched net zero watch when we did car 26 because my tactics were much more griller and much more, more. Well, they're different basically, you know, less stuffy and so they thought oh, we better do something as well, which is great, but we've got a very good relationship with them. But, but car 26 was at the time the own, the only organization challenging the, the very premise of the Net Zero argument. And also we were the only people saying what we thought was really going on. And that's what the heartland. But the heartland has got 40 years behind it. It's got top scientists, it's worked with. As I said, it's been named most influential think tank in the United States by Pennsylvania University. It's got that heritage. It's got that, it's got money behind it. It's got affiliations, very strong affiliations with, with certain big individuals I'm not allowed to mention politically.

[Interviewer]

And why not?

[Lois]

Or. Because all I will say is that the heartland has been extremely influential in helping to shape policy at the highest level under Trump's administration and in other Republican administrations. But there's no endorsement as such.

[Interviewer]

How would we know? So I like some of the, the idea. I think America's got a better culture of liberty. I don't want.

[Lois]

They certainly have.

[Interviewer]

I don't guns here. I know that America.

[Lois]

No, we wouldn't know how to hand. I mean they've grown up the guns in America.

[Interviewer]

But the culture of free speech is something I envy. I envy the idea of a constitution. And, and there's certain things where I go to America I really do appreciate. I think, I think there's some hypocrisies there because they have a culture of liberty, but then have a prison industrial complex which monetizes keep people in prison. So there's like these weird contradictions where by the liberty and the freedom and lack of checks on maybe certain areas of business allows people to, to monetize things they shouldn't monetize. You know, the food system in America. I think a lot of that's like I say, the, the prison industrial complex. I, I disagree with.

[Lois]

Yeah, nothing's perfect.

[Interviewer]

It's. How do you strike a balance whereby you get more liberty but that liberty isn't exploited by big business and rich people to have rules changed in their favor to monetize because that's, you know, like you hear about, you know, certain families are considered libertarian in America, but is it libertarian because that benefits their business or they really libertarian?

[Lois]

But does it matter ultimately if certain individuals or families do well? If ultimate. If, if overall everyone has a good standard living and has their own personal liberty as well, and, and, and, and there's not harm being done?

[Interviewer]

Well, I think it depends. I think it depends on the consequences of how, how they're doing. Well, if, if there's a family who does very well out of imprisoning young black men who've maybe dealt with weed like.

[Lois]

No, I know what you're saying.

[Interviewer]

But if it's. Sorry, just.

[Lois]

Sorry.

[Interviewer]

You know, if it's regulations with regards to maybe chemical companies and they want, you know, and they've been poisoning the land and killing cows and causing cancers. Again. Again, you know, I, I don't want to push freedom to the point of exploitation.

[Lois]

Oh, no, no. I would completely and utterly agree with you on all of those points. But you don't. It doesn't. Yeah. There has to be checks and balances. Absolutely. But then it's about, you know, any reasonable person would not think that it's okay for, for, for people to be poisoned by chemicals being put into the water.

[Interviewer]

It's reasonable to think it's okay. But, but do people get away with.

[Lois]

Making that profit at all costs? I do not agree with, with that. Absolutely. But if you've got one particular family, for example, that has done very well, but they create thousands of jobs and the, and they look after their employees. This is my background.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

Then so what if they've got loads of money?

[Interviewer]

Oh no, we want to, we want.

[Lois]

I don't care. Like, good for them.

[Interviewer]

We want, we want to make the nation wealthier, more prosperous and prosperous and a happy workforce.

[Lois]

Work. You know, my granddad said the happier his employees were, the harder they worked, you know?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

They're happy. Happy workforce, good profit margins, you know, and, and you go and get through the pearly gates.

[Interviewer]

So how's this, how's this next four years gonna play out, Lewis?

[Lois]

I am going to work my little socks off building up heartland UK and Europe. I'm gonna be working closely with all of the political partners, parties and I'm going to be pushing my agenda of. Our agenda of freedom and liberty and all of. All of the above and you know, making sure that no one takes the sorry the piss out of us ever again through either net zero or lockdowns or any of that kind of stuff. I'm gonna be. Gonna be fighting.

[Interviewer]

That's good. Well, I think we need it. Yeah. Everywhere I look and everyone I speak to, people just piss.

[Lois]

You know Boadicea was an Essex girl, don't you?

[Interviewer]

No, I don't.

[Lois]

Well, you do now.

[Interviewer]

Well.

[Lois]

And Amberlyn.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Lois]

Rochford, where I was born. Okay. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I didn't know that.

[Lois]

You don't mess with us. I tell you.

[Interviewer]

Never, never mess with a sexes girl. But I just, you know, there's, there's a, there's a level of despondency and, and apathy that's grown because we are at the very start of A administration which hasn't recognized that you cannot tax your way into growth. And they are, they are realizing. I think you're right, they are, but. And I just think there's like, we've got four more years of this shit. Yeah. How do we get through this without destroying the country any worse? And I just don't see anything come from the Labour Party that gives me an optimism.

[Lois]

I think the polling, though, being so consistently for reform is making is actually acting almost as a check and balance for the Labour Party. I am noticing, like, for example, I mean, a lot of people said that Kemi Badenoch had a terrible PMQS yesterday and she's. She sort of did because unfortunately she had a script and Keir Starmer backed down immediately and she didn't know what to do. She was saying the law must be changed. And he said, yes, you're right. And then the rest of her script didn't work. But I mean, even him saying we need to close the loophole so that the judges can't overturn it was about a Gazan family settling. You know, I don't think he would be saying that if Reform weren't consistently polling where they are.

[Interviewer]

Well, the immigration thing's interesting because it was Reform who've led a lot of the. And old small C. Conservatives who feel disenfranchised with the Conservative Party have been saying there is an issue issue with immigration. Matt Goodwin's talked about it a lot. Constantine Kissing was just pressurizing Kemi in his interview on trigonometry.

[Lois]

I like him.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I do. We've had him here, I think.

[Lois]

Have you?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

Very esteemed company. Thank you so much for having me.

[Interviewer]

Well, you know, you come under strong recommendation.

[Lois]

Really. Oh, that's good.

[Interviewer]

But, but now labor at all. We had Mike Tapp, MP from Dover here. He's talking, talking about immigration. Everyone's talking about it. It's.

[Lois]

It's especially people coming over no papers on boats. I mean, it's ridiculous.

[Interviewer]

Well, it's an issue you can't. You're not going to win votes on by. Not by, by not recognizing. It's an issue that people of making.

[Lois]

People say they tried to do for a very long time.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Lois]

That's why we've got this massive backlash now.

[Interviewer]

And the sad thing about it is there are genuine people who are genuine asylum seekers that we would want to support as a civilized good nature.

[Lois]

And I always would, would hope and expect that the UK continues in their long history of looking after genuine asylum seekers and refugees.

[Interviewer]

But We've lost. I think there's been a lac. Lack of, there's been a lot of empathy for their people now. And, and I think the lack of. I, you know, one of my things that thoughts that keeps going to my mind. I think not dealing with the immigration issue has caused a rise in racism. We see it.

[Lois]

Oh I know for a fact it.

[Interviewer]

Has just see in the comments on our YouTube when it comes up, you just see outright racism now.

[Lois]

Well, my, my stepfather is Jamaican and my sister's a mixed race and they, they think it's ridiculous. The advertisement surprising my, my brothers, funnily enough, experience. Experience race. My, my sisters are both like supermodels so they don't get racism, but my brothers do. And because they're boys. I know it's terrible, but it's true. And they said that since these adverts have had 90 or 99 black mixed race people that they've experienced rising racism that they'd never, never had before, you know, ever. And it suddenly. So, and my, my stepfather believes that it's deliberate. I think it's actually because it's winding people up.

[Interviewer]

People are certainly wound up. Well, look, listen, I think, I think the next four years are going to be interesting. It'll be interesting to see what happens with Heartland.

[Lois]

Thank you.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I don't, I, I haven't allocated my vote, but we will see.

[Lois]

Oh, come off it.

[Interviewer]

No, look, look, really, I, I, I am, I don't trust any politician. I think, you know, I just don't trust politicians.

[Lois]

Well, you gotta, you've gotta vote though.

[Interviewer]

But no, no, I should and I haven't the last ones and but I also, I'm, I'm reluctant to align myself too much to one party because I want to do.

[Lois]

No, you're absolutely right.

[Interviewer]

I want to do this job better.

[Lois]

Yeah, you need to have an open mind.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I get it.

[Lois]

Same as me.

[Interviewer]

I can say I wouldn't vote labor because I just, I'm, I'm not a socialist. I don't believe in what labor stands for. But I want to interview people from their fairly and I want to interview conservatives and reform people from fairly.

[Lois]

Absolutely right.

[Interviewer]

So I've not allocated a vote yet.

[Lois]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

I think this.

[Lois]

Will you tell people how you vote?

[Interviewer]

If I vote, I won't tell them ahead of an election, but I'll tell them afterwards and tell them why.

[Lois]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

And I could tell them the things I'm wrestling with. Like I'm wrestling with. I would like to see some proper thatch. Right. Conservatism come from the Conservative Party and I would like to see some work from reform on their structure. And I was like to see labor.

[Lois]

To be fair, they've only had a brain truck eight months or something, not, not centuries, but.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. But it'll be interesting. Look, these next four, let's wait and see.

[Lois]

Let's see.

[Interviewer]

I tell you what, get the popcorn out.

[Lois]

It's exciting. Yes, it is exciting. My granddad used to tell me this story. He said his mum used to say to. When he used to go around there for a little bit of a pep talk or whatever, he. She'd say, I can't give you money, but I can give you hope. And, and he loved that. And, and that's what I'd like to say to everyone. Yeah, I want to give you hope. Come on, let's, let's, let's be positive.

[Interviewer]

Well, if you can get. If, if, if reform start to pull some proper structured plans for what they would do in government and parliament, not just, I think people. There's a note. They're knocking on an open door. They're pushing on an open door. People want to hear it.

[Lois]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

And so I'm excited to see it. We'll. We'll have this chat again in.

[Lois]

Watch this space.

[Interviewer]

You don't have to wait four years, but we'll do it four years anyway.

[Lois]

No, don't wait four years.

[Interviewer]

All right. Thank you so much. It was good to see you.

[Lois]

Thank you.

[Interviewer]

Appreciate it.

[Lois]

I loved it.

[Interviewer]

Thank you to everyone for listening and hopefully I'll meet your son at some point.

[Lois]

Yeah, yeah, I'd love. He'd love to meet you.

[Interviewer]

Bring him in next time.

[Lois]

Okay, I will.

[Interviewer]

We'll get him to chore. And, and your base daughter, she, she's.

[Lois]

Got some views, I tell you.

[Interviewer]

Thank you, everyone, for listening.