1:00 P.M. with Amielynn Abellera, Kristin Villanueva and Dr. Kathleen Sekula

Summary

The Pitt Podcast – Episode: 1:00 P.M.

With Amielynn Abellera, Kristin Villanueva, and Dr. Kathleen Sekula

Release Date: February 20, 2026
Hosts: Dr. Alok Patel & Hunter Harris
Podcast Premise: A behind-the-scenes, medically-savvy, and culturally aware breakdown of each episode of HBO Max’s "The Pitt," blending real-life ER realities, show analysis, and cast/consultant interviews.

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Episode Overview

This episode focuses on "1:00 P.M.," Episode 7 of Season 2 of The Pitt, spotlighting the crucible of a hospital Code Black triggered by a cyber attack, and the powerful depiction of a sexual assault patient’s journey through the ER. Central themes include real nursing challenges, trauma-informed care, the dynamics of hospital crises, and cultural identity—brought to life through in-depth discussions with cast members Amielynn Abellera (Nurse Perla), Kristin Villanueva (Nurse Princess), and forensic nursing expert Dr. Kathleen Sekula.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Nurses at the Center of Care

• Chemistry and Intuition: Kristen Villanueva (Princess) and Amielynn Abellera (Perla) discuss the unspoken understanding between nurses, both on and off-screen.
  • Kristen Villanueva (01:41):
    "I can just look at Amylyn, Nurse Perla, and I know that something's up. ...so I can feel her energy and no words are needed."
• Nursing Anticipation: Nurses operate steps ahead, balancing doctor and patient needs, epitomized in Perla's anticipation during a code situation (20:34).
  • Amielynn Abellera:
    "I think that is such a beautiful thing about being a nurse, is that they are sort of three or four or five steps ahead all the time and have a way of anticipating what's about to happen, mostly because they're so experienced."

2. Sexual Assault, Forensic Nursing & Trauma-Informed Care

• Depiction in the Episode: The lengthy, authentic portrayal of a sexual assault exam is commended for its realism and emotional resonance.
  • Hunter Harris (02:19):
    "This examination kind of takes the whole episode... how invasive this is and how vulnerable it is for this woman."
  • Dr. Alok Patel (03:46):
    "She follows a protocol, but also just the language she uses, the trauma-informed wording... 'you're in control now.' Really powerful scene."
• Real-World Expertise:
  • Dr. Kathleen Sekula (SANE consultant, 34:50):
    "SANEs are sexual assault nurse examiners...specially trained to assess and treat patients who have been victims of really any types of assault, but sexual assault in particular."
  • On Trauma Responses:
    "One of the biggest misconceptions in caring for a patient who's been assaulted is that they all present in the same way... they can present in many different ways. Some of them can be totally silent, some may be very anxious... some might be giggling, and that's their reaction to anxiety." (35:29)
  • On SANE Protocols & Training:
    – 40-60 hours didactic, hands-on training, preceptorship, and re-certification every three years (37:07–38:17).
  • Addressing Systemic Change: Handling, reporting, law enforcement partnership, and how only one patient statement is now prioritized for trauma minimization (40:59–42:57).
  • Advice for Survivors:
    "The first thing that we would want them to do, we want them to report it..." (44:05)
• Empathy & Trust-Building: The show emphasizes giving agency back to the patient, not overwhelming them, and respecting boundaries.

3. Code Black: Cyber Attack & Healthcare Systems

• Show Plot:
  • Multiple area hospitals losing computer systems to cyber attack, catalyzing a total return to paper charts (06:31–07:36).
  • Hunter Harris, reacting (07:13):
    "I literally gasped so loud... what do you mean every computer's done...?"
  • *Dr. Alok Patel explains the real-life transition in hospitals from old-school paper to EMRs, and the chaos when tech fails.
• Real-Life Reflections:
  • Both actors and real ER nurses confirm a cyber outage as their worst nightmare (22:13–22:52):
    • Kristen Villanueva:
      "I asked our med techs, our real ER nurses on set... they used curse words, like, right away."
    • Amielynn Abellera:
      "On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being a pain in the ass, the nurse techs were saying this is the worst."
  • Security Training & Phishing Threats:
    Dr. Patel relays personal anecdotes of medical records held hostage, increased cybersecurity protocols in hospitals (08:43–09:26).

4. Dramatic Arcs and Character Relationships

• Dr. Ravi & Langdon – Trust and Professionalism:
  • High-tension elevator scene:
    Langdon, confessing (11:16):
    "I'm sorry I betrayed your trust. ...I'm really fucking sorry. It'll never happen again." Dr. Ravi’s cold response:
    "I'm really happy that you got the help that you need, but I don't know that I want you working in my ER." (12:06–12:18)
  • Hunter Harris:
    "I think Langdon is, like, so shaken by that...not only, like, does he lose this, you know, very clear sense of...brotherhood, friendship, whatever, but also that now Ravi, like, doesn't trust him as a doctor..."
• Flirtation & Tension:
  • Abbott and Mohan ("sexy" moment with the shirtless wound-tending, comedic double take from Dr. Ravi – 15:10–16:24)

5. Cultural Dynamics & Nurse Identity

• Tagalog Banter & Filipino Nurse Representation:
  • The value of scripting Tagalog banter, representing real ER halls—giving cultural texture and nuance.
  • Amylyn Abellera (24:22):
    "[Writers] would write it in English and then they would say, this will be spoken in Tagalog. So kudos to them. They know exactly what happens in real hospitals."
  • Kristen Villanueva & Amylyn Abellera: Discuss how these asides are like "Shakespearean asides," offering levity and insight into the ER dynamic (24:19–25:54).
  • Hunter Harris:
    "I, like, want to be gossiping with them...they are kind of an audience proxy..." (32:48)

6. Grounded Medical Reality, Small Details, and Burnout

• Medical Burning the Candle: Sleep deprivation, eating on the run, and the ever-present risk of burnout are depicted for both drama and realism.
  • Dr. Alok Patel, on small details (17:40–18:39):
    • "This episode also has... this subtle nod to kind of burnout... quick nap... protein bar... you got to eat on the go..."
    • "Dr. Abbott makes this comment about how even with a bulletproof vest, an AR15 can still cause damage..."
    • Heat illness in athletes, vigilance for hidden dangers.

7. Actors' Real-Life Preparation & Insights

• Trackers and Timelines: Both actors maintain intricate trackers to keep storylines coherent among chaos (26:02–27:25).
• Family in Medicine: Amielynn Abellera’s own family’s healthcare background provided invaluable insight and comfort with medical settings and terminology (27:41–28:46).
• Language & Character Depth: Villanueva relishes playing a polyglot nurse, striving for authenticity (29:19–30:18).

8. Reality of Violence Against Nurses

• Routine Assaults: Nurses on the show and in real life regularly face violence, often handled as just part of the job—which is lamented and highlighted for awareness.
  • Amylyn Abellera:
    "The trauma of nurses being assaulted and that fear every day is real...That's just daily life." (31:53)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• On Trauma-Informed Care:
  "You're in control now, Alana. We're here to help and support you. Once I open this kit, I cannot leave the room. But if you need a break or some air, just let us know. Okay?"
  — Nurse Dana (quoted by panel, 03:01)

• On Cyber Threats:
  "Hospitals over the last few years have really built up stronger security standards, not only in their own IT departments, but also...sending us physicians, nurses, anyone working in the hospital, more of these trainings, make more ways to look out for phishing schemes on emails and things like that."
  — Dr. Alok Patel (09:05)

• Bullying and Allyship:
  "It really felt like bullying to me, honestly, to watch Robbie, like, kind of send him out without, like, okay, let's see what you can do. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. Like, this is not the Robbie that we know from Season one."
  — Hunter Harris (14:41)

• On Real-World Nurse Burnout:
  "That actually does happen sometimes—we're sleeping on floors and sofas, whatever—in empty conference rooms just to cut a quick nap in."
  — Dr. Alok Patel (17:53)

• On Violence Against Nurses:
  "We've all been assaulted. That's just daily life."
  — Amielynn Abellera, as Nurse Perla (31:53)

• SANE Expertise:
  "One of the biggest misconceptions...is that they all present in the same way...now we know that they present in many different ways."
  — Dr. Kathleen Sekula (35:29)

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Noteworthy Timestamps

• 01:41: Kristen Villanueva on the intuitive connection between Perla and Princess.
• 03:46–05:05: Real talk on trauma-informed nursing language and patient-centered care.
• 06:31–09:26: Cyber attack fallout; chaos in the ER, reliance on tech, real-world hospital anecdotes.
• 11:16–14:53: The pivotal Langdon–Dr. Ravi confrontation.
• 19:44–25:54: Main interview with Villanueva and Abellera on cultural roots, real nursing, and behind-the-scenes prep.
• 31:53: The reality of regular assault faced by nurses.
• 34:50–45:20: Extended segment with Dr. Kathleen Sekula, SANE protocol, and trauma-informed evolution.
• 47:25: Empathy, trust, and progress in sexual assault victim care.

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Summary Takeaways

• Nurses as Pillars: The episode celebrates nurses as the logical, empathetic backbone of the ER, experts at reading the room and anchoring cultural nuance.
• Cyber Vulnerability: Hospitals remain acutely vulnerable to tech failures and attacks, which can wreak havoc on patient care.
• Sexual Assault Depictions: The show, with guidance by medical consultants, offers a nuanced and thorough portrayal of sexual assault cases, both in medical and emotional dimensions—a marked evolution from earlier, less-informed times.
• Workplace Realism: The show’s accuracy extends to nurse lingo, banter, and the often-overlooked specter of violence and burnout among frontline healthcare staff.
• Cultural & Multilingual Representation: Filipino nurses and Tagalog dialogue are celebrated not as tokenistic color but integral, real-life ER reality.
• Changing Attitudes: Both within and outside TV fiction, trauma-informed approaches, respect for survivors, and authentic representation are seen as signs of progress.

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Final Thought:
"If they're freaking out, I'm freaking out. If they're calm, that gives me a little bit of calmness, too. ...They really do set the tone of a busy hospital."
— Dr. Alok Patel (33:27)

This episode is an ode to nurses—not just as medical professionals but as wise, resilient, and deeply human anchors in medicine’s stormiest seas.

Transcript

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[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Swat.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Really?

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

I suck at golf.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

You spend time in the Middle East?

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

More than I would have liked.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I worked in Kabul with medicines enfrontieres. And in 2020, at the maternity hospital, I met the most incredible, bravest doctors there.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Vashti Barchi Tragedy. We should grab a beer sometime, share war stories.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I'd like that.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

She seems cool.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Yep.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Maybe I'm not gonna be around long enough to find out.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Welcome to the Pit Podcast, the official companion to the Pit on HBO Max. I'm Dr. Alok Patel, physician, journalist, and I would talk about the show every day if I could.

[Hunter Harris]

And I'm Hunter Harris, a screenwriter and cultural critic. Today it's one o' clock on the Pit. It's episode seven, and we get to hear from the people who keep the Pit running, the nurses. We'll hear from Amylyn Avalara, who plays nurse Perla, and Kristen Villanueva, who plays nurse Princess.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I can just look at Amylyn, Nurse Perla, and I know that something's up. You know, we work alongside together. It also helps that we're friends both on camera and off camera, so I can feel her energy and no words are needed.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

We want to talk about the real challenges nurses face in today's world. And we're going to talk to the people who make sure those stories are told accurately in the Pit. Today's shift starts now.

[Hunter Harris]

Let's start with character, and then we can move to medicine. How does that sound?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I mean, you know how I roll. That sounds perfect.

[Hunter Harris]

Okay. The most maybe heartbreaking sequence this episode was the sexual assault victim that nurse Dana is giving this examination to. And I really appreciated that. This examination kind of takes the whole episode. Like, we keep kind of going back and watching Dana with this patient, and you get a sense of, like, how invasive this is and how vulnerable it is for this woman.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I think that's exactly why it was included this. This situation happens. Sexual assault is a known issue. And there's so much that happens in the duality of medical care, but also in kind of giving. Giving a victim that. That privacy rebuilt. Re establishing trust, kind of that Duality of humanity and medicine, which charges are stain and nails.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly a guest or co-host)]

You are in control now, Alana. We're here to help and support you. Once I open this kit, I cannot leave the room. But if you need a break or some air, just let us know. Okay?

[Hunter Harris]

There's also so many logistical things to collecting all this evidence. And I did not realize that Dana can't leave the room, that she has to kind of be glued to her chair and she can't be in the ed, like, running stuff as she normally would be. So everyone else is kind of caught a little bit off guard, I would say, without her leaving the ship.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

And she really owns her role and she kind of steps, like as you mentioned, they keep going back to the episode. And she's in that room and obviously it's a private room. There's privacy and there's nothing in the background. And nurse Dana is focused on that situation.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

You know, Dr. Al Hashemi comes in, runs the medical screen, which is appropriate to. To make sure is there any acute injuries that need to be addressed. And then charge Nurse Dana is assuming the role of a sane or a safe nurse, a sexual assault nurse examiner or a sexual assault forensic examiner. And you're right, she's follows a protocol, but also just the language she uses, the trauma informed wording, when she says things like, you're in control now. Really powerful scene.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, I was also. There was one moment where I think she was like, about to hug the patient and then kind of takes a little bit of a step back. And I think you're right. It's very trauma informed. Like maybe they don't. Maybe she doesn't want to be touched right now, just after what she's just experienced. I thought that was really, really moving.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I was honestly wondering when this was going to show up in the pit. And, you know, it's a horrific scenario and it does happen. But to kind of show the protocol and how trust is re established, I think is important. And, you know, the hope is that if somebody unfortunately is going through some type of scenario of sexual assault, they kind of have a little bit more of an understanding of what happens in an er. The safety, the trust, the precautions. And maybe this convinces one person to go and, you know, regain their agency. Get in there.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. Just even seeing like that woman kind of alone in the frame, alone in the shots, like, you can feel the loneliness there. And I just cannot imagine. I mean, I would always want nursing in my corner, but like, in that moment, she was fully present for that patient. I thought that was really special.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

She's. She's explaining each step and kind of showing her this is why we're doing what we're doing, to kind of reassure Alana that she is in control and she has the ability to say no. But, you know, Charge said the minute I open this forensic kit, I have to stay in the room, just kind of that clear communication, I think, is important.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. But I also like that she said, you know, you can take breaks, we can pause if you need. If, like, this feels too overwhelming, part of me is like, what are these people going to do without her in, like, the ed, like, running, like, charging her stay now? But it's important that she is, like, fully present. I think for Alana, that's really special.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Yeah. Do you think Dr. Al Hashmi was a little too quick in the scene? Like, she. She did her part, like, you got to make sure you're checking for acute injuries. She was. She was in and out.

[Hunter Harris]

No, I sort of like how quick and concise Dr. Alhashmi is in that way, because Nursina is one who's really building a relationship with Alana in that moment. And, you know, you don't want. You don't want to kind of overwhelm her with, like, too many people, too much information at the same time.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

So I'm just gonna slow clap to all the nurses who are fans of the show or watching, who are sane or save trained. You have an incredibly important job.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Uh oh, this can't be good.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Who's this?

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

That is hospital CEO Trent Norris. He's the big boss.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Hmm.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Nice outfit. Hey, Rockstar. Gather your staff, please.

[Hunter Harris]

Sure.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Anything you want to tell me first?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

No.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Hey, everybody, can you gather around, listen

[Dr. Alok Patel]

up for a moment, please, and have your attention, everyone. The internal disaster at Westbridge has been identified as a cyber attack.

[Hunter Harris]

So Westbridge is down, there's been a cyber attack. And then another hospital, Old Dominion, is going down, too. And preemptively, um, the, like, you know, big head exec of the hospital comes down and says, we're gonna, like, cut off all the computers ourselves. We're going back on paper that I. I literally gasped so loud. I was watching my dog, and she, like, jumped up and looked at me because I was like, what do you mean every computer's done and, like, rushing to take a photo of the board. Oh, my gosh.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Any physicians, nurses, anyone who has worked in healthcare for, let's say, more than 10 years or. Or even in some sites in underserved areas or in international communities has been In a clinical setting where we did not have electronic charts, like, not having computers at all. That's, like, even older than that. But when I started residency, you know, I was at a few hospitals where you were paper charting everything.

[Hunter Harris]

Oh, no.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

And we still had these situations where we call them downtime sometimes. It usually happens in, like, the middle of the night when they run maintenance and they shut down the electronic medical records, sometimes the computers. And when that happens, you're sitting there and you're like, oh, my gosh. You, like, really realize how much the medical system relies on, well, electricity in general, obviously, but electronic medical records, like sending prescriptions to pharmacies, sending orders to a radiology center, sending lab orders. Like, everything happens electronically, including patient records, including triaging patients and the board, like, it's. It's wild. I'm actually like, I'm sitting here, I'm like, we should have thought of cyber attack. Like, there's.

[Hunter Harris]

Why would I think of cyber?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Because, you know, it's kind of like. It's kind of like happening right now in other news headlines. And, like, we kind of got this hint about, like, the uprising of AI in this season.

[Interviewer/Host]

Like, I don't.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I feel like I thought. I should have thought of that.

[Hunter Harris]

That's another thing. I mean, what is Dr. Alhashmi going to do with her app now that, like, there's no paper and pencil? Yeah, yeah. How is AI going to help us now? No, I'm like, why can't cyber attacks happen to, like, things that we really need to be attacked, like student loans? Like, why is it a hospital? Like, what's the benefit there?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Listen, I mean, we have to. We're going to have to cut tape when I say, why can't they be attacking that? But the reality is, and this does happen, I've been involved in one of them. Like, well, I shouldn't say I. I didn't do the attack, but I've been at an institution where hackers held the medical records hostage. But they will essentially prove to a hospital that we can hack into your EMR and give us X amount of money.

[Hunter Harris]

Emr O Electronic Medical records.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Give us X amount of money or we're going to release this patient information. And so hospitals over the last few years have really built up stronger security standards, not only in their own IT departments, but also, you know, sending us physicians, nurses, anyone working in the hospital. More of these trainings, make more ways to look out for phishing schemes on emails and things like that.

[Hunter Harris]

Once again, why can't they hack an insurance like, stop. Like, why the hospital? But I think this is a really good moment of tension between Dr. Robbie and Dr. Alhashmi again, where Dr. Alhashmi is the one who hears about who, like, learns that they're shutting everything down first. Why couldn't Dr. Alhashmi have given Dr. Robbie, like, a heads up? And why would they tell her and not him?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

That is interesting.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

It's almost like C suite. The leadership is pitting people in the pit against each other. But it's like, you know, they kind of told her. And, I mean, I feel like she should have immediately told Dr. Ravi.

[Interviewer/Host]

Like, oh, my gosh.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Like, I needed. Like, that's not the way for him to find out.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Right.

[Hunter Harris]

Especially when kind of this whole day she's been telling him, like, communicate with me. We are a team. We're doing this together. And then this big piece of information has dropped, and she kind of. You see her, she's like. Feels awkward, I guess.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Yeah.

[Hunter Harris]

But I kind of wish that they could rely on each other maybe, like, they're both a little bit, like, not trusting one another completely.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

His sabbatical could not come soon enough.

[Hunter Harris]

I wonder, too, how you explain to patients, like, don't freak out, but we don't have computers right now. Like, how's that going to work?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Patients are like, damn it, what now? Like, seriously, this is. This is like, the same day where

[Interviewer/Host]

all this is happening.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

And now we're going to shut down now.

[Hunter Harris]

Like, the wait's going to be even longer now. Like, they're going to be more diversions.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

And guess what? Guess what? They're still probably gonna blame the doctors for this because that's just what happens. Everything's our fault.

[Hunter Harris]

No, not to me.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

No. I appreciate you. Let's just make a PSA of Hunter Harris being like, not everything is the doctor's fault.

[Hunter Harris]

All day, we've seen Langdon try to talk to Dr. Ravi, and Dr. Ravi, honestly, very, like, cold, very cruel, really. Like, playing him off, pushing him away, actively avoiding him. And finally, they are stuck in an elevator together. They have this moment when they're on the roof waiting for another patient.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

And.

[Hunter Harris]

And it is. I mean, you can cut the tension with a knife. Like, I felt so bad for Langdon in that moment.

[Unidentified Character (possibly Dr. Langdon)]

Okay, I'm just gonna say it. I'm sorry I betrayed your trust. I betrayed our patient's trust, and I'm really fucking sorry. It'll never happen again, I swear. I'm really glad that you got the help that you need,

[Hunter Harris]

But I don't

[Unidentified Character (possibly Dr. Langdon)]

know if I want you working in my er.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

It was funny because it almost felt like a weird romcom motif when, like, two people are trying to talk, and then they get stuck in a room in an elevator, and they're forced to, like, confront their feelings. And I know this isn't a rom com, but, like, they're in an elevator together, and you're right. Like, they kind of look, then they don't look at each other, and I'm like, I'm sitting here. I'm like, Dr. Robbie, come on. Like, you know, he's trying. You know, he went through this. You're leaving for three months. I know you're hurt, but say something. Say anything.

[Hunter Harris]

I read down the line, I think he says, you know, LinkedIn is, like, trying to apologize. And then Dr. Robbie says, I'm really happy that you got the help that you need, but I don't know that I want you working in my er. That was devastating.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

It was.

[Hunter Harris]

And then I think Langdon is, like, so shaken by that. Not only, like, does he lose this, you know, very clear sense of, like, brotherhood, friendship, whatever, but also that now Robbie, like, doesn't trust him as a doctor, like, professionally. I think he sees Robbie as such a mentor. Like, that's really disappointing. And, like, you see him almost, like, deflate in the moment, and then he freezes up later. Right. With a patient in front of Dr. Garcia.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Yeah. I don't think.

[Interviewer/Host]

And I don't think it was very

[Dr. Alok Patel]

fair for Dr. Robbie to say it number one in that moment, but also without, like, a longer conversation. Like, he followed, from what we know, according to the rules at PTMC. You know, Dr. Lane didn't follow the protocol. He, like, took time out. He went to rehab. And I don't know what happened to his privileges in the hospital, for example, but he's back in, and he's legit, and he's ready to practice. So the hospital is like, yes, you have done what you needed to do, and you're ready to go and finish your residency. But Dr. Robbie's like, I don't want you in this ER. So that's. It's. It's a personal issue that he has. It's nothing related or nothing that he can enforce professionally. So I feel like he needs to sit down with Lane and be like, yo, I have a problem. But you're allowed to practice here according to privileges. But there's a lot more to unpack than that one line.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah, I mean, I'm thinking it's, like, very, like, dark Dr. Robbie this season like, the way that he talks to Al Hashemi, the way that he's dealing with Langdon and even Langdon with the patient who had the leg issue, the waitress, you know, I mean, I like that nursena was like, okay, either, like, bring him in or, like, leave him out. Because you like Robbie taking him, sending off to triage. I'm like, what is, like, you confront him somehow?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Is it dragging on? Is it dragging on now? Are we at the point where, like, I just want to see resolution?

[Hunter Harris]

No, I kind of like this eye of doctor.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I like.

[Hunter Harris]

It's very dramatically rich to see him in the wrong in this scenario, because I. I feel like he is.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

That's fair. I'm almost ready for there to be, like, pick a direction. Like, either we're going to work together,

[Interviewer/Host]

or there's going to be, like, a

[Dr. Alok Patel]

catastrophic split between the two of them, and so we can just move on to different dramatic arcs. But then all of a sudden, maybe there's a little bit of a foreshadowing when they're treating that patient who got hit with the boat propeller. Because it's like, Dr. Robbie's like, Langdon, it's your show. Like, he's communicating with his eyes. And, like, Langdon is like, you just told me you don't want me in your ed, but now I'm going to be directing care. And, like, I can almost see it in the acting.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

In, like, Patrick's acting when he's, like, playing this resident who's like, wait, you don't trust me, but you do trust me. But now I'm being put on this. Like, there's a lot happening.

[Hunter Harris]

It really felt like bullying to me, honestly, to watch Robbie, like, kind of send him out without, like, okay, let's see what you can do. And I'm like, oh, my gosh. Like, this is not the Robbie that we know from season one.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly a guest or co-host)]

Dang.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Robbie the bully. Yeah, we've gone. We've gone there.

[Hunter Harris]

No, but I think it's good. I think. I think Noah Wylie plays it really well. Like, that real sharp coldness. I'm like, yeah, I would not want to be on your bad side.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

We've got the return of Abbott, but also, we have this, like, kind of, like, sexy moment.

[Hunter Harris]

What happened to you?

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Oh, well, it grazed my vest.

[Hunter Harris]

You were shot.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly Dr. Abbott or Trent Norris)]

Shot at. Geniuses. Thought today was the day to rob a goods warehouse. Didn't think about how long it would take to load the appliances. They panicked. All hell broke loose.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Jesus.

[Hunter Harris]

Kind of sexy.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

He's.

[Hunter Harris]

She walks in on him shirtless, and he's like, there's nothing sexier than, like, tending to your own wounds.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I was over.

[Hunter Harris]

I think so.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Especially if it's, like, a wound that you took, like, protecting something from bullets.

[Hunter Harris]

Her saying, someone shot you. No, I was shot at. Like, he's such a cowboy. I love him.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I know. She, like, there's like, this tension of her, like, let me treat your wound. And also, I need to ask Sean Hadassey about his, like, chest routine, because homie's kind of jacked.

[Hunter Harris]

I like how this builds upon, like, the, like, the subtle tension between them from last season where he is very, like, Dr. Abbott is very impressed by Dr. Mohan, and I like that now they get this little moment of, like. Yeah. Of real flirtation. And I also like that he immediately sort of helps her with Orlando De and kind of, like, breaks the rules a little bit.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

There's also this really quick moment when she's tending to his wound on his back, and Dr. Robbie walks by quickly and, like, looks in the room and just keeps walking.

[Hunter Harris]

It's one of, I think, like, iconic double takes that I've ever seen. Like, he's like, what? He's so, like, what's going on? And also, I'm not gonna get involved. Like, whatever they're doing that can be theirs, they can leave it privately.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I feel like when you and I watch the show, we have, like, really fun notes because they're just different. And sometimes these topics, I'm like, oh, they're not big enough to be, like, a full discussion, but, like, maybe a quick, like, bullet point of something that caught your eye. Okay, so I was trying to ask you, like, tell me a few moments of this episode, a few details where you were like, oh, like, that's fun.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Hmm.

[Hunter Harris]

I think three very quick things. The difference between Javadi's mom and her dad, like, they're.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

They.

[Hunter Harris]

You know, her mom is very strict, but, like, also wants her to go into surgery. Her dad is, like, a little bit more chill, like, do what you want. And I wonder if there's, like, something different about, like, their specialties that maybe speak to, like, those character differences. That was interesting to me. Also, Dr. Abbott kind of liking Dr. Alhashmi and Dr. Robbie being, like, I don't know, maybe, like, he's still very resistant, very dismissive. And the big CEOs grilling, Fourth of July outfit. That was funny to me.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I like those. I like those.

[Hunter Harris]

What were your three?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

So I got my three quick things that are obviously gonna be a nod to some small medical detail. Some Workflow detail.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Love it.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

This episode also has, like, this subtle nod to kind of burnout and physicians working in crazy scenarios. Because you've got this one little moment where you have a doctor sleeping on a patient bed.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Oh, yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Just because take a quick nap. And like, that actually does happen sometimes we're sleeping on floors and sopas, like, whatever. In empty conference rooms just to cut a quick nap in. Whitaker also throws a protein bar to the residents and he's like, you got to eat on the go because we don't have time to eat. So that was one little kind of theme in this episode.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Also like, hey, you know, at the ongoing conversation about gun violence in America, Dr. Abbott makes this comment about how even with a bulletproof vest and AR15 can still cause damage. Like, just to think how powerful those guns are. And last but not least, I am glad that there's a little PSA about the risks of heat related illness and anyone who's outside when it's hot, but especially our young athletes. Oh, and this football player was like, I'm fine, I'm fine.

[Hunter Harris]

I didn't drink water. He's like, water two days. Like, I gotta get back out there. I'm like, oh, my gosh, you're in high.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

You're in high school. You don't need to be pushing yourself. Heat related illness happens in high humidity. Even if people don't realize it because they're losing so much fluid, they're not sweating and cooling as efficiently. I also want to go back to the high school and question the coach. I mean, like, what are you doing in terms of breaks right now? Like, that entire scenario is we see it play out every single summer across the country.

[Hunter Harris]

Alok so much is going on in the pit with this code black, and I think we need to go straight to the source and hear from two people who are right in the thick of it. Let's hear from my favorite nurse duo in the pit. Kristen Villanueva, who plays nurse Princess and amulet Avalaire, who plays nurse Perla.

[Interviewer/Host]

Kristen, Amy Lynn, it is an honor to have you both here. Like, a little personal note.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I work in a hospital.

[Interviewer/Host]

I work with a lot of incredible Filipino nurses. They are all my kuyas, my ates, my titas. So I'm very stoked to talk to both of you because I think nurse Perla, Nurse Princess just hits a relatable note for a lot of people. I want to start with a moment that was pretty important to me and I think it just really speaks to the dedication when Louie, when our favorite patient, Louie, is coding, Nurse Perla is, like, right there. It's like a sixth sense when nurses know what is happening, what physician needs are, what patient needs are. And I think that's true of a lot of nurses. I think you both, throughout the series have moments like that. I was curious if you could comment on how you kind of identified into that role and you transformed into these ER nurses.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Well, speaking of Louie, I think that is Perla's favorite patient, but I think that is such a beautiful thing about being a nurse, is that they are sort of three or four or five steps ahead all the time and have a way of anticipating what's about to happen, mostly because they're so experienced. And, you know, I think Nurse Perla has been working at PTMC for over five to six years now, all through Covid, working, you know, side by side with Dr. Ravi. And so I think she has learned through, you know, osmotic experience on how to be five steps ahead of the doctors, but also still patient and waiting and also ready to support whatever order they're about to make, whatever they're. What road they're going to take.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I think in addition to that, too, they're not just amazing at what they do in their profession, but they're amazing humans in the sense that they're very empathetic, so they're very sensitive to energy. And so I can just look at Amylyn, Nurse Perlite. I know that something's up. You know, we work alongside together. It also helps that we're friends, both on camera and off camera, so I can feel her energy and no words are needed.

[Interviewer/Host]

Raise a glass of that.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

True.

[Hunter Harris]

I want to talk about the Code Black, because in this episode, we learned that it's a cyber attack. How does this change the day for Perla and Princess?

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I know for me, I asked our med techs, our real ER nurses on set, like, if this happens to you right now, what is your reaction? And I don't know if I could use curse words, but they used curse words, like, right away. Oh, they're like, fuck me.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Oh, my God, no.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

And, yeah, and one of them even told me, like, I think they have rules and regulations around that and what they would do, but they haven't drilled it yet. So they're afraid of whenever that first drill will come or if, God forbid, the actual thing happening. But, yeah, it's. It's no bueno.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Yeah. On a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being a pain in the ass, the nurse techs were saying this is the worst. This is the worst thing that could happen in terms of how do we keep all these balls up in the air and, you know, stay accurate, know how to. How to chart our patients, know who's in which room, how to keep track of everything. And it's just. It would just be the worst thing that could happen in terms of trying to stay on top of what we're trying to do in each hour.

[Interviewer/Host]

You know, when we're looking at situations like the Code Black or patients really ill. Princess and Perla, all the nurses are almost like the Greek chorus.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Just, like, looking at their expressions and

[Interviewer/Host]

their tone sets the stage for how

[Dr. Alok Patel]

people should be feeling. Like, is it.

[Interviewer/Host]

Things can be tense, Is it not a big deal like that happens in the real world?

[Dr. Alok Patel]

And you two have this amazing dynamic

[Interviewer/Host]

where you also kind of banter and talk smack. And Tagalog, which is this great kind of escape, we get to see what Perla and Princess are really thinking about. So I was curious about how you thought of weaving in that cultural context and how it found its way into the story.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

It's all the writers.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

Thank God to the writers. Yeah. They would write it in English and then they would say, this will be spoken in Tagalog. So kudos to them. They know exactly what happens in real hospitals.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Yeah, I was about to say, it's so accurate.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Yeah, it must be. I think so. And it's, you know, call it gossip, call it talking smack, but, you know, I think that Princess and Perla are just partaking in, you know, Shakespearean asides with each other, you know, and just sharing information with themselves and with the audience, you know, in a meta style, like, away from the people that they're observing. And I think you go into any hospital and any workplace, and I think that is almost the joy and in observing humanity in all its foibles and commenting on it and having secrets about it, with observing your co workers in their flaws, in their mistakes and their accidents, in their relationships, in their connections and misconnections. And I think that Perla and Princess have been in this hospital for a long time together, and they've seen people come in and out. They know who's senior, they know who's not. And I think it's fun for them, and it allows them to, you know, take a little bit of a break. Connecting. And, you know, for that to cross with a cultural dimension of Tagalog is, I think, just this wonderful thing to portray in what the reality of a hospital is.

[Hunter Harris]

How hard is it to keep Track of everything. When you have so many scenes, so many patients, and so many people on set.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I have a. I have a Princess Tracker on my Google Doc.

[Hunter Harris]

Oh, I love it.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Host]

Yeah.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

Like, and I didn't. I don't know why I didn't do it last season, but I did it this season of just tracking where I was last at, who was the last patient I saw. Where are they now? Where are the other patients? Are they getting their CT scan? Did we discharge this patient? Yeah. No. It's very hard. So every time a new episode drops, I'm the same as everyone else.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I don't know what happens to that episode.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

True.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

It does, of course, help that we are shooting it in real time. Princess and Perla are in different traumas at different times. And then we leave to go check on our other patient. And Amy Lynn, as the actor, always has to ask scripty, how much time has passed when. Where was I before this? Because two minutes can pass. But that was maybe, you know, I filmed that on Monday, and now we're filming that on the next two minutes on Thursday. So it is sort of an actor problem that I love figuring out. And also, you know, a Perla problem of, you know, which patients do I need to check up on and who was I there last? But that's, you know, we've been having fun with that.

[Interviewer/Host]

Speaking of Amy Lynn, the actor and Perla, Amy Lynn, you come from a family of healthcare professionals, right? Like, dad's a doctor and your mother's was a nurse.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

How much did your personal experience kind

[Interviewer/Host]

of play into you developing the character Perla?

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

So much. So much, yes. My dad is a retired family practitioner. He had his own little private practice in Stockton, California. And my mom started out as an RN in the CCU at the critical care unit and then upgraded in her 40s to a nurse practitioner. And so she. I was very familiar with hospital settings, following my dad at rounds and things like that, and also with my mom in the clinic as well. And I think it allowed a familiarity of all the. Just being comfortable in these spaces, being comfortable in a hospital, being comfortable with the language, even though it's still. I still have to rehearse it quite a bit. But there was definitely a sense of a little bit more comfort in knowing what these tools are in a hospital and what a blood pressure is and what an IV is. And also just being. And seeing a doctor's dynamic with the patient when observing my father. And then also how it's a little bit different with the nurse's dynamic with my mother, and they work together in the same clinic too. So I really am grateful for being in that space with them. And they've been enjoying watching me sort of bring it to life.

[Hunter Harris]

We know that Princess speaks, like, maybe four or five languages. How does that add to, like, the dimensions of her character? And is that fun for you?

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

They said six, actually.

[Hunter Harris]

Oh, excuse me, six.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I don't know what the six are. Oh, it's very fun. I've always been enamored by people who are. Is it polyglot? Is that the polyglot term for folks who can speak more than three languages? I've always been enamored by them and in awe. And I've always loved putting on accents, although I'm not one of those who can just like, you know, I need to study it. Give me a week. But yes, no, it's been fun. It's been great.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Great.

[Hunter Harris]

Do you speak multiple languages, too?

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

If I'm lost in the jungles of Costa Rica, I could find where the gasoline station is. So. In Spanish. So I could. I have emergency Spanish in my back pocket. Tagalog. That's my first language.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Okay.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

Yeah. The rest.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I'm curious who you'd be asking the

[Interviewer/Host]

directions from in the Costa Rican jungle,

[Dr. Alok Patel]

but I like it. I like. I like the scenario.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

I mean, luckily they speak Spanish, so in my. In the back of my head, I'm like, when in doubt, stayed in Tadalog. It's probably the same in Spanish.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Very similar.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Okay.

[Kristen Villanueva (Nurse Princess)]

Very similar.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Fun, fun. Serious question.

[Interviewer/Host]

Is there anything that either one of you learned from the nursing consultants, the medical writers that. That really surprised you about being a

[Dr. Alok Patel]

nurse in the er. Was there, like, an aha moment?

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I'm. I'm still trying to get over the fact that these are real cases that we're presenting as the reality of an ER department. And the nurses say, yes, this does happen all the time. This is actually what our day is like. And also the trauma of nurses being assaulted and that fear every day is real, is very real. And that, to me, is so discouraging and so confusing to how these people who are dedicated to helping and caring and to save their lives are being, you know, acted out against. So that's hard for me. And the nurse sex, really, that's just not water off their back, but they're just like, shrug. Yeah, that's the truth. And that's hard for me to swallow.

[Interviewer/Host]

I think Perla has that line after Charger's dandy gets punched and she says, we've all been assaulted.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

We've all been assaulted. That's just daily life.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Damn.

[Interviewer/Host]

Well, I'm glad that the Pit at least shed awareness and put a light on it, because it's almost like workplace violence against nurses, against doctors, is almost normalized. If that happened in any other business, it would not be tolerated for more than a day.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Yeah.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Correct.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Correct.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

This was awesome.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I think so.

[Interviewer/Host]

Thank you for all you do.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I got some tricks. I got some tricks.

[Interviewer/Host]

Appreciate you both. Thank you.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Thank you.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

Thank you. Awesome.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

I was so excited to talk to them.

[Interviewer/Host]

Like, they're such a relatable part of

[Dr. Alok Patel]

the show because there's so many incredible Filipino nurses. I was actually sold on the accuracy

[Interviewer/Host]

of the Pit because in season one, when you first hear Nurse Princess, I

[Dr. Alok Patel]

was like, oh, yeah, they did their homework.

[Hunter Harris]

I think that they have such good. They have such good chemistry together. Like, such a good relationship. I, like, want to be gossiping with them. I want to be whispering with them. I want to know what they have to say. And I do like how they are kind of an audience proxy for, like, based on what. I don't know what expression they have on their face. I'm like, okay, so that's how I should be reacting. Like, that's. This is good news or bad news. I can tell immediately from them.

[Interviewer/Host]

It's totally true. And it's a testament to the preparation

[Dr. Alok Patel]

they both did and their acting skills.

[Interviewer/Host]

Because if you think about an actual er, those nurses have seen everything. Depending on how long they've worked, they've kind of been conditioned to it. So if they're freaking out, I'm freaking out.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

If they're calm, that gives me a

[Interviewer/Host]

little bit of, you know, like, a little bit of calmness, too. And patients and families look to nurses

[Dr. Alok Patel]

also, like, they really do set the tone of a busy hospital.

[Interviewer/Host]

I have to nod my hat to Catherine Lanasa, charge nurse Dana, and how she handles the entire situation with the survivor of sexual assault.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

And we know that this interaction is inspired by the actual work that sexual

[Interviewer/Host]

assault nurse examiners do every single day. These sayings, as we call them. And we are fortunate enough to talk to an actual Saint from Pittsburgh, Dr. Kathleen Sakula. I'm so honored that she's going to take the time to speak to us about her work because it is extremely

[Hunter Harris]

important and necessary and definitely very inspiring.

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[Hunter Harris]

to start off, Dr. Sekula, can you tell us what Sein is and how it fits into the healthcare system?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Okay. SANEs are sexual assault nurse examiners, and they're specially trained to assess and treat patients who have been victims of really any types of assault, but sexual assault in particular. And they just. Sexual assault nurse examiners just really came into being in the 80s, late 80s, early 90s, and forensic nursing then started to be recognized.

[Hunter Harris]

When you were advising on the show, was there something very important to the same process that felt like, urgent to get right?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

Yeah, I think there were a few things. One of the biggest misconceptions in caring for a patient who's been assaulted is that they all present in the same way. And they should present as being very sad and being upset, when in fact, they can present to the unit in many different ways. Some of them can be totally silent, some may be very anxious. You know, that's expected. And we've had, you know, some of them might be giggling, and that's their reaction to anxiety. And so for a long time, nurses and physicians, you know, saw these patients when they came into the unit as being maybe faking or, you know, being not credible in some way. And now we know that they present in many different ways when they come in. So it's very important. And most hospitals, most emergency departments now are working very hard to get SANEs on board so that they're 24 hours, or at least that you have a saying that you can call in who's on call if a case comes in, because they take a long time. And that was the other thing that I think people aren't aware of. A case usually takes somewhere between three and four hours to complete.

[Interviewer/Host]

What does it actually take in terms of training to become certified and to become a sane?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

It takes learning how to collect evidence. So that's, you know, that's a big part of it. But the other thing is, is to learn how to assess the patient. Because they're different. They're different type of patients, even though most patients coming into the ED are anxious, but the assault patient is different. The sexual assault victim especially presents in a different way. We teach nurses who are training to become SANEs that you really respect their personal space very, very clearly. You ask them, you let them know if you're going to touch them because they have just been violated. So we talk about it as trauma informed care. So we give back to the patient control over what's going on.

[Interviewer/Host]

Kathleen, what is the path to becoming sane certified in terms of like a protocol? Like, is it something that, you know, you go to a specific program to do? Can you do it within your own hospital under a mentor? And do you see a trend, more nurses wanting to become SANE certified, or is there a gap?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

We have many more nurses becoming SANE certified. So first they take a didactic course, and that's like 40 to 60 hours of being online with expert nurses who are teaching them all about the process, what it's like to interface with the emergency department and throughout the hospital. And then after they've completed the didactic course, we provide them with hands on a three day, eight to five every day, hands on course, where they learn and they actually do the exams. And then after that they go back to their home clinical setting. And if they're very, very lucky, there's another sane who's been practicing who can then take over preceptorship with them and help them until they feel that the nurse is ready to do it on their own. And then once certified, they have to renew that certification every three years. I believe it is.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly a guest or co-host)]

We could take a break. Nepal.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I don't want to break. I want to stop.

[Unidentified Male Character (possibly a guest or co-host)]

Is this about reporting? Because you can do this collection without a police report for now, and none of it goes in your permanent medical record.

[Amylyn Avalara (Nurse Perla)]

I don't want to do this anymore.

[Hunter Harris]

So in the SANE examination, you're collecting evidence, but what does support look like from law enforcement or how does that relationship work as you're, as you're doing this work?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

One of the things that we have been able to make a tremendous change in is our relationship with legal and with, you know, the especially police departments here in the Pittsburgh area. We met with the chiefs of police and we talked to them about why it's important for the police to understand where they would take a victim to that particular setting. We want them to know where there are SANEs practicing. Now we have a lot more SANEs here in the Pittsburgh and surrounding area. But at a time there were only a couple hospitals that had seines that they could either call in or that were on on board all the time. Our relationship with lawyers, saints can testify as both a fact witness, which would be they collected the case, they talked to the patient, they documented everything, or they can testify as an expert witness or as both if they've been practicing for a long time, so we have good relationships with law enforcement throughout.

[Hunter Harris]

How else do you think that the culture around sane and this kind of trauma informed care has evolved over time?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

I think through education and then feedback from some of my research is my background is in psych mental health before I became a forensic nurse, and I still am an advanced practice psychiatric nurse. However, I see the patients, the victims. We use both the word survivors and victims. It's just interesting that over the years, people have come to realize that we were not doing things right with victims of sexual assault, first and foremost. And when I first started practicing, those patients would sit in the waiting room for hours, for hours, and many of them would just get up and leave. Now, hospitals know that that's not good care. That when a patient comes in and they say they have been sexually assaulted, if the saint is working that day, or we call in with the advocate and we get them in as soon as we possibly can. So we've learned a lot. And, you know, I think we've educated our fellow nurses and physicians this trauma informed care and understanding. Even police officers, this is a wonderful thing that's happened over the past, I would say five years is even policemen now believe that they should wait to really intensely interview the patient or the victim. Sometimes they'll wait a day or two, they'll come in and they'll get just an initial story, and then they'll set up a time with the patient to meet with them in a day or two. It used to be everybody was having them tell their story, you know, the nurse was having them, the advocate, the police officer, for sure. And so then when they'd go to court, the police officer would testify sometimes. Well, that's what she told the nurse when she went in, but that's not what she told me. So now we've gotten that down so that we only have the patient tell their story once, if we possibly can. And then we give the patient time to settle, you know, for their anxiety level to decrease. We know from research that many memories of what happened come back to them within the first 24 to 48 hours. And so they're just a better narrator of what happened if you give them time to decrease their anxiety. Wow.

[Hunter Harris]

I cannot imagine the pressure of having to, you know, recount everything again and again and again, Especially in a moment of trauma. If someone has been sexually assaulted or if they love someone who's been sexually assaulted, what would you say should be like their first course of action immediately following the attack?

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

The first thing that we would want them to do, we want them to report it. To either call a police, the police department, or just present at the hospital and say, I've been sexually assaulted. And if we can get them to do that, it's much better than if they wait for 48 hours or 72 hours and then report. Not that we can't get evidence even then we can, but it's not as easy. And on college campuses, and we had some grant funding, some large funding from the Department of Justice, where we did training with health departments in the universities and colleges. We even have new guidelines for colleges and universities to train their student body to talk about. If this happens to a friend of yours, this is something you can do. You can't force them. You should never force them. But you can try to talk with them and say, I'll go with you to the hospital or I'll call the police for you. But it's ideal when they come right after it's happened.

[Hunter Harris]

This has been such an inspiring conversation. Thank you so much, Kathleen.

[Interviewer/Host]

Thank you for sharing your insight and thank you for doing what you do.

[Unidentified Listener/Interjector]

You're welcome. Thank you for having me. I've enjoyed your podcast.

[Interviewer/Host]

Oh, we appreciate that.

[Hunter Harris]

I was so moved by Dr. Sekula and, like, the important work that she's doing. And I guess I never really thought about how specific and how highly skilled you have to be to be a sane and to collect evidence, but also to be, like, an empathetic listening ear to someone maybe on, like, one of the worst days of their entire life.

[Interviewer/Host]

It's like they have three jobs at once and they're taking their time. And I appreciate that in the show, when charge nurse Dana took on this role, it basically spanned the entire episode. She was focused on that patient. They didn't shortcut anything, and they actually gave it the attention it deserved. And a lot of that is thanks to the medical consultants in this case, Dr. Sekula, who made sure that the process was accurate, it was thorough, just like it is in real life.

[Hunter Harris]

Yeah. And also, I think it's a good, you know, reflection, opportunity to, like, check our biases, that we don't know how someone is going to react, and that someone might not always, like, come in crying or come in super emotional. And with Alana, she definitely seemed very vulnerable. And I liked that Dana did not really, like, try to smother her, like, try to be too affectionate or too understanding, because I don't know that that would have worked.

[Interviewer/Host]

You have to build trust, which charge and stain.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

It does.

[Interviewer/Host]

But what also really infuriates me in many situations, and I've been in this situation in talking to patients, survivors sometimes feel like, what's the point? Like they feel powerless or feel like the institutions or powerful individuals or people with money are going to get away with it. So they don't want to relive the trauma. So sanes also have this job of providing that reassurance in a protected space

[Dr. Alok Patel]

as well as ensuring someone we're going

[Interviewer/Host]

to do everything we can to make sure that law enforcement catches who did this and saves other people. It's an incredibly daunting process to think about, and I'm just so glad that there are people who are trained and who do this efficiently.

[Hunter Harris]

And I think speaking to Dr. Sekula's area of expertise, the idea that the way that we treat victims and survivors and the level of empathy and the level of understanding, the fact that now, like you're not immediately interrogated about what happened, that they take statements like days later, really speaks to how like the culture around sexual violence, I think is turning in our favor, that there is a lot more understanding and empathy.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

Well said. Thank you for watching today's episode of the Pit Podcast. You know where to find us every Thursday right here after the new episode drops. And share your comments, your questions. Also, shout out to all the nurses out there.

[Hunter Harris]

You can watch us on HBO Max or listen wherever you get your podcasts. The Pitt Podcast is a production of HBO Max in collaboration with prx. The executive producer of PRX is Jocelyn Gonzalez. Our managing producer is Courtney Florentine. Our editor is Lucy Perkins. Our production managers are Ebon Ochoa and Tony Carlson. Our video producer and editor is Anthony Q. Artis with assistant editor Damon Durrell Hinson. This show is engineered by Tommy Bazerian. Special thanks to Joe Joe Carlino.

[Dr. Alok Patel]

The executive producer of HBO Podcasts is Michael Gluckstadt. The senior producer is Alison Cohen, sirocac and the associate producer is Aaron Kelly. Technical director is Insang Kwong. I'm Alok Patel.

[Hunter Harris]

And I'm Hunter Harris. We'll see you next week in the Pit.

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