Podcast Summary: The Political Scene | The New Yorker

Episode: DeRay Mckesson Talks to David Remnick About Protest and Politics
Host: David Remnick
Guest: DeRay Mckesson
Date: February 22, 2016

Overview

In this in-depth conversation, David Remnick speaks with DeRay Mckesson, a prominent Black Lives Matter activist who had just announced his run for mayor of Baltimore. The episode explores Mckesson’s journey from grassroots activism to electoral politics, delving into his personal background, his vision for Baltimore, and his approach to the critical issues facing American cities, especially around policing, education, and systemic change.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Moving from Protest to Politics

• Remnick opens by noting the major shift Mckesson is making from activism to political candidacy.
  • “You’re making a huge leap. … Most activists resist this leap. Why have you decided to run?” (02:00)
• Mckesson reframes the debate:
  • “Protest is actually one of the most political acts in this America. … Challenging the government to be the best it can be is fundamentally a political act." (02:39)
  • He sees his mayoral campaign as the next step when no other candidate offered a bold vision for Baltimore.

Personal Roots & Motivation

• Growing up in Baltimore, Mckesson’s parents battled addiction; his father raised him and his sister from age three.
  • “So much of what informs my own perspective of hope and possibility is because I’m the child of addicts. But also I grew up in a rich community of recovery.” (03:34)
• Early involvement in youth organizing, leadership roles, and philanthropy seeded his commitment to systemic change.
  • “As a teenager, I led Baltimore’s only youth-led grantmaking organization that gave out money to youth-led community projects across the city.” (03:50)
• Supportive environments and mentors helped him thrive:
  • “Adults cared about me who did not have to, and they pushed me to be the best self I didn’t know existed at the time.” (04:53)

The Influence of Education

• Attended Bowdoin College, a transformative experience.
  • “Bowdoin was a magical experience for me. I fell in love with my mind. It really pushed me to think and exposed me to a range of ideas I had no clue existed.” (05:35)
• Taught in East New York through Teach for America, reinforcing his dedication to educational equity. (06:18)

Baltimore’s Crisis & the Case for Change

• Remnick details the city’s issues: economic collapse, high vacancy, crime, and poverty. (06:37)
• Mckesson critiques traditional political pathways and offers a broader definition of safety:
  • “Most people think about safety as a matter of the police. … If I asked you to close your eyes and imagine where you feel the most safe, you would likely not say, ‘Oh, a room full of police.’ … Safety is much more expansive than policing.” (07:03)
  • Argues for preventative measures and considering underlying factors of crime.

Platform and Policy Innovations

• Proposes police reforms:
  • Require as much training in de-escalation and crisis intervention as in firearms use.
  • Mandatory anti-racism training and the use of smart guns. (08:04)
  • Redistribute police budgets towards education and employment initiatives.
    • “We can’t arrest our way out of crime. … We might actually be able to employ our way out of crime.” (08:21)
• Job creation ideas:
  • Invite businesses and develop vacant properties into “WeWork-like incubators,” especially for food and tech startups. (08:51)
  • Support for small business, especially where legal spending options are limited.

Gentrification and Urban Development

• Calls for development to be anchored by institutions beyond elite universities:
  • “Let us have the development plan actually focus on anchor institutions and build around those … not just Hopkins, but the Coppins and the Morgans.” (09:21)

Addressing Practical Concerns

• Remnick presses on nuts-and-bolts voter concerns—crime, city services, and youth opportunity.
• Mckesson responds with both vision and details:
  • “People are focused on … a city that's safe, their access to healthcare and healthy food, that those things are fundamental and real. … Officers shouldn’t be able to strike members of their hearing board … Police union conduct should be fair and just.” (10:10)
  • Advocates for coordinated preschool services, afterschool literacy, a citywide strategy on adult literacy, and GED programs.

Reflections on Political Resistance from Institutions

• Addressing potential pushback from police:
  • “I would not go into this role expecting insurrection. … I want to believe that the police also want to live in a city where there isn’t much crime.” (12:43)
  • Emphasizes partnership between police and other community agencies.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On protest as politics:
  “Protest is … one of the most political acts in this America.” — DeRay Mckesson (02:39)

• On safety and policing:
  “You would likely not say to me, ‘Deray, oh, a room full of police.’ You would say, a place where there’s family … that’s how we have to start thinking about safety.” — DeRay Mckesson (07:03)

• On his candidacy and vision for Baltimore:
  “I waited, I held out because of the belief that someone was gonna step forward with a plan and a platform that would really push the city ... and that didn’t happen. So I stepped up.” — DeRay Mckesson (02:39)

• On the impact of education:
  “Bowdoin was a magical experience for me. I fell in love with my mind.” — DeRay Mckesson (05:35)

• On policing and reform:
  "We can’t arrest our way out of crime. … We might actually be able to employ our way out of crime." — DeRay Mckesson (08:21)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:00] – Remnick asks about moving from activism to politics
• [02:39] – Mckesson discusses protest as political action and campaign motives
• [03:34] – On Baltimore roots and family background
• [05:35] – Bowdoin College experience
• [06:37] – Baltimore’s challenges and need for new approaches
• [07:03] – Redefining safety beyond policing
• [08:04] – Platform proposals on police reform
• [08:51] – Plans for job creation and economic development
• [09:21] – Gentrification and development strategy
• [10:10] – Practical city concerns and specific solutions
• [12:43] – Reflection on working with the police department
• [13:25] – Closing thanks

Tone and Style

The conversation blends candid personal storytelling with policy wonkery; Mckesson’s responses are thoughtful, sincere, sometimes vulnerable, but always focused on the practical and political realities of city life and leadership. Remnick maintains a probing, respectful, and slightly skeptical tone, pressing for specifics while acknowledging the complexity of the issues.

In summary, this episode offers a vivid picture of DeRay Mckesson’s journey and ideals, providing listeners with both the personal motivations and specific policy approaches he hopes to bring to Baltimore’s future.