Podcast Summary: The Political Scene | The New Yorker

Episode: For the People

Date: March 17, 2016
Host: Evan Osnos
Guests: Jelani Cobb, Benjamin Wallace-Wells

Episode Overview

This episode of The Political Scene explores the evolving dynamics of the 2016 presidential race following major primary contests, with Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump strengthening their bids for their respective party nominations. The conversation examines the contrasting campaigns and strategies of the frontrunners, the state of populism in American politics, and the implications for the Republican and Democratic parties. The episode also discusses President Obama’s nomination of Merrick Garland to the Supreme Court in the wake of Justice Antonin Scalia’s death.

Key Discussion Points

1. State of the Democratic Race

[02:25 – 03:56]

• Hillary Clinton’s Dominance:
  Clinton has almost double the delegates compared to Bernie Sanders and has accrued about two-thirds of what's needed for the nomination.
• Bernie Sanders’ Influence:
  While Sanders is unlikely to win, his campaign has succeeded in pushing the Democratic Party leftward and rallying support among minority communities.
• Long-term Impact:
  “What Sanders’ campaign was about at the outset was trying to shift the party a little bit to the left. And I think that that project has been pretty successful, and I think that it continues.”
  — Benjamin Wallace-Wells [03:18]

2. Republican Turmoil and Trump’s Rise

[03:56 – 05:26]

• Trump’s Clean Sweep & Rubio’s Defeat:
  Trump outperformed opponents in multiple states, including a significant win in Florida, leaving only John Kasich and Ted Cruz as significant challengers.
• Contested Convention Speculation:
  Despite party insiders’ opposition, the likelihood of stopping Trump via procedural maneuvers is slim due to the party’s disorganization.
• Trump’s Warning:
  “If we’re 20 votes short or if we’re, you know, 100 short, I don’t think you can say that we don’t get it automatically. I think it would be... I think you’d have riots.” — Donald Trump [02:07]

3. The “Populism of Identity” and Trumpism

[05:26 – 07:35]

• Identity Over Economics:
  Jelani Cobb discusses Trump’s primary appeal to identity-based populism—focusing on resentment, nostalgia, and defining who “deserves” America—rather than traditional economic populism.
• Dangerous Nostalgia:
  Trump frequently evokes a return to a time when “those who didn’t belong” were dealt with harshly and without consequence.
• Quote:
  “His success has been based upon stoking a particular kind of populist resentment... hard working, everyday Americans are being taken advantage of by immigrants, by the Muslim population...”
  — Jelani Cobb [05:43]

4. Historic Parallels and Chicago Protests

[07:35 – 09:01]

• Protests in Chicago:
  The cancelation of a Trump rally highlighted deep divisions and was reminiscent of protest eras in American history (especially 1968).
  Difference: In 1968, protesters were outsiders. Now, as Cobb says, those "outsiders" are inside the movement itself.
• Quote:
  “Those are the people who are inside this time around. And that is, I think, the movement that Donald Trump represents.”
  — Jelani Cobb [08:46]

5. Trump’s Place in the American Populist Tradition

[09:33 – 11:23]

• Modern and Historic:
  Trump is simultaneously a product of contemporary media (e.g., Twitter, reality TV sensibilities) and the heir to a long line of American demagogues (Huey Long, George Wallace).
• Dual Populisms:
  Cobb maps modern populism as split: one branch is economic (Sanders), the other appeals to identity and social resentment (Trump).
• Quote:
  “Populism has had very often a close association with the politics of racial and social resentment, kind of using bigotry as the lingua franca, I think, to express itself.”
  — Jelani Cobb [10:06]

6. Comparing Populist Bases: Sanders and Trump

[11:23 – 13:16]

• Overlap and Contrast:
  Both Sanders and Trump supporters are disproportionately white, less educated, and concerned with economic inequality, but differ sharply on social issues.
• Party Responses:
  Democrats have integrated economic populism to some degree; Republicans, by contrast, have neglected these grievances, allowing social and racial resentment to fuel their populist wing.
• Quote:
  “Both for reasons of sort of ignorance and reasons of decency, the Republican Party has just done much less to incorporate that economic alienation into its party than the Democrats.”
  — Benjamin Wallace-Wells [13:09]

7. The End of Cold War Politics and Its Legacy

[13:16 – 14:24]

• Ideological Shifts:
  The decades since the Cold War have made it possible for open discussions of socialism, both for Sanders’ success and for more explicit social populism.
• Quote:
  “The economic populism of Democrats throughout the entire Cold War—no one wanted to sound like, you know, a Soviet sympathizer or anything.”
  — Jelani Cobb [13:34]

8. Obama’s Supreme Court Nomination: Merrick Garland

[15:03 – 17:41]

• A Strategic Pick:
  Garland is a moderate, older white man with bipartisan praise, selected to challenge Republicans to justify their expected obstruction.
• Progressive Frustration:
  Some progressives hoped for more diversity; the nomination is calculated to highlight Republican obstruction rather than court diversity.
• Quote:
  “Let me give you the most amenable nominee that you're going to get from a Democrat in a generation.”
  — Benjamin Wallace-Wells [15:34]
• Potential for Decorum:
  Uncertainty whether the Supreme Court fight will restore some order or become just another partisan spectacle.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Trump and Populism:
  "He's representing something that transcends the typical economic basis of populism. I think he's really talking about something that's much more based upon a common identity."
  — Jelani Cobb [05:54]

• On 2016 vs. 1968 Protest Dynamics:
  “In 1968, the Yippies were this outside group... Those are the people who are inside this time around. And that is, I think, the movement that Donald Trump represents.”
  — Jelani Cobb [08:46]

• On Party Weakness:
  “The Republican Party looks so disorganized and incoherent right now that it’s just sort of impossible... to see them pulling some devious procedural maneuver...”
  — Benjamin Wallace-Wells [04:34]

• On the Garland Nomination:
  “If you are going to stand on principle and refuse to vote on anybody who I bring up, let me give you the most amenable nominee that you’re going to get from a Democrat in a generation.”
  — Benjamin Wallace-Wells [15:32]

Important Timestamps

• [02:25] – Democratic delegate math and Sanders’ lasting influence.
• [03:56] – Trump’s primary victories and the challenge of a contested convention.
• [05:40] – Jelani Cobb explains Trump’s “populism of identity.”
• [07:49] – Chicago protest compared to 1968 convention.
• [09:59] – Historical context for Trump’s populism.
• [11:41] – Analysis of the Sanders/Trump voter overlap.
• [15:03] – Obama's Supreme Court nomination and political calculations.
• [17:41] – Will the Supreme Court process restore order, or add to the chaos?

Conclusion

This episode encapsulates a pivotal moment in the 2016 election, dissecting the ideological and demographic divides shaping both major parties. With sharp analysis from Jelani Cobb and Benjamin Wallace-Wells, listeners gain a richer understanding of how populist energy and racial identity are remaking American politics, as well as the tactical decisions confronting party leaders at a time of institutional upheaval.