Episode Overview

Title: Is Donald Trump Creating the Conditions for Another World War?
Podcast: The Political Scene | The New Yorker
Date: January 9, 2026
Host: Evan Osnos
Guests: Jane Mayer, Susan B. Glasser

This episode delves into President Donald Trump’s aggressive and unpredictable foreign and domestic policy actions during his second term, focusing in particular on the recent U.S. assault in Venezuela, threats towards Greenland (Denmark), and the use of lethal force by ICE domestically. The hosts analyze the risks of an unprecedented concentration of power in one leader, drawing historical parallels to past world conflicts, and contemplate whether Trump is indeed forging the conditions that could lead to another world war. The conversation explores the psychological makeup of Trump, the breakdown of international alliances, the domestic political response, and the unraveling of the post-WWII global order.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. A New Era of Power: Trump’s Unprecedented Actions

• (00:55) Within the first week of 2026, Trump’s administration initiated lethal military actions abroad (notably in Venezuela) and a highly publicized use of deadly force domestically resulting in public outrage.
• Trump’s quoted as saying the only limit to his global power is “my own morality, my own mind.” (01:40)

2. Optional Conflicts and Unilateralism

• Jane Mayer: “These are completely optional conflicts created by the character of the president. The die is cast by who he is, and he sees himself as without any kind of restraints on his power.” (03:13)
• The group agrees that Trump’s foreign actions aren’t isolationist but rather assertive, narcissistic unilateralism.

3. America as ‘Gangster’: Inverting FDR’s Warning

• Susan Glasser: “If the fear is gangsterism, what does it say that we’re talking about America as the gangster?…Trump is the gangster in chief.” (04:00)
• The group highlights the irony that the U.S., which once helped build the rules-based order out of fear of gangster leaders elsewhere, is now perceived as a destabilizing force.

4. NATO’s Credibility and Global Order at Risk

• Discussion about the erosion of trust within NATO, especially as Trump threatens a fellow member (Denmark/Greenland).
• The threat to “mutual defense” principles and the possible impact on allies in the Baltics. (06:27-07:20)

5. Greenland Obsession and Psychological Drivers

• Trump’s preoccupation with Greenland is not just strategic but deeply personal—framed as a real estate conquest: “It's not different from a real estate deal. It’s just a little bit larger.” (Susan Glasser, quoting Trump, 15:00)
• Comparison to Vladimir Putin’s narrative of restoring the Russian homeland; Trump seeks similar personal historic relevance.

6. The World Reacts: China and Russia’s Perspective

• Trump’s actions align with a worldview “governed by strength, by force, by power”—mirroring Chinese and Russian ambitions.
• Noted by Osnos: “Everybody in my world this week was remembering a comment…2010…the Chinese foreign minister … said, ‘China is a big country and there are small countries. That’s a fact.’ That’s the Donald Trump worldview.” (10:25)

7. Stephen Miller’s Worldview and Domestic Parallels

• (12:51-13:31) Clip of Stephen Miller: “We live in a world that is governed by strength…governed by power…These are the iron laws of the world.”
• The hosts describe this as “a world of might makes right,” with Trump’s administration discarding any pretense of spreading ideals or democracy. (13:30-14:40)

8. Energy, Resources, and ‘Pirate’ Mentality

• U.S. actions in Venezuela focused on seizing oil and propping up the regime for U.S. benefit, not “regime change” for democracy.
• Osnos: “We're pirates now. Basically, we're seizing the oil, we're selling the oil.” (14:25)

9. Domestic Political Fallout

• Splits are emerging in both parties: some MAGA figures (e.g. Marjorie Taylor Greene) are questioning foreign wars, as are Libertarian and establishment Republicans; Democrats are fragmented and lack a unifying response. (18:33-20:16)
• Democratic and Republican critics are disorganized and unable to mount meaningful resistance. (26:33)

10. Unchecked Power and the Breakdown of Democratic Norms

• Trump’s leveraging of emergency law and executive wartime powers domestically (e.g., via the Alien Enemies Act, deploying troops at home) is part and parcel of his worldview. (20:34-21:00)
• Glasser: “It’s a personalist cult…where one man essentially makes these decisions.” (32:10)

11. Historical Echoes: Fragility of the World Order

• The U.S. has withdrawn from over 60 international organizations this week, unraveling the post-WWII framework designed to prevent another world war. (21:36)
• Macron’s warning: The U.S. is “breaking free from the international rules that it used to promote.” (36:28)

12. Are We Sleepwalking into World War?

• Jane Mayer: “This is how world wars start.” (37:05)
• Hosts cite The Sleepwalkers by Christopher Clark, underlining how WWI wasn’t caused by grand designs but by a series of psychological failures and drift. (37:39)

13. Psychology of Trump and Lessons from History

• Trump’s lack of military, historical, or tragic sensibility is central, per authors like Hal Brands and Charlie Edel: “Those in power are totally divorced from those at peril.” (Mark Shields, 31:14)
• Trump’s own fascination with power and pyrotechnics over governance is described: “He’s bored with the governing. He’s not interested in the rest of the plot. He loves the pyrotechnics.” (Jane Mayer, 33:44)

14. Failures of Constraint and Echoes of Autocracy

• Former constraints on Trump (first-term generals and security officials) are now absent.
• Trump’s wish for “generals like Hitler’s generals” (41:47) and historical comparisons to Kaiser Wilhelm II’s psychological insecurities underline the danger of unchecked, personalist leadership.

15. Closing Reflections: The Burden Returns to the People

• Jane Mayer closes with a paraphrase of FDR: “What is the answer to gangsterism? The answer is the people. People gotta stand up.” (44:41)

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• Donald Trump in NYT interview: “The only limit on his global power is, as he put it, my own morality, my own mind.” (01:40)
• Susan Glasser: “Trump is the gangster in chief.” (04:00)
• Evan Osnos on Venezuela: “We’re pirates now. Basically, we’re seizing the oil, we’re selling the oil.” (14:25)
• Jane Mayer on Trump’s psychology: “Beneath the surface, this is someone who's constantly trying to impose himself as a winner on the world…Yet he feels like people are treating him like a loser. That’s underlying a lot of this, I think.” (09:00)
• Stephen Miller (audio clip): “We live in a world…governed by strength…by force…by power. These are the iron laws of the world.” (12:51)
• Jane Mayer quoting FDR: “The answer’s the people.” (44:41)
• Mark Shields, via Osnos: “Those in power are totally divorced from those at peril.” (31:14)
• Susan Glasser: “It’s narcissistic unilateralism…a personalist regime in the United States, right, where there's one man essentially making these decisions.” (32:10)
• Jane Mayer: “This is how world wars start.” (37:05)

Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:55 - 03:10: Setting the stakes—Trump’s recent use of force abroad (Venezuela) and at home raises fears of unchecked power.
• 03:10 - 04:00: “Optional conflicts” and the personal nature of Trump’s foreign policy.
• 04:00 - 06:27: America as ‘gangster,’ NATO’s credibility threatened, and Trump’s psyche.
• 10:25: China’s reaction and parallels in worldviews.
• 12:51 - 14:40: Stephen Miller’s worldview and explicit embrace of power politics.
• 18:33 - 20:16: Fractures within the Republican and Democratic parties over new military interventions.
• 21:36 - 24:10: Discussion of the unraveling of the post-WWII order and U.S. withdrawal from international organizations.
• 26:33: Weakness of Congressional opposition and democratic institutional limits.
• 33:44: Trump as a consumer of spectacles, not substance—loves the “pyrotechnics.”
• 37:05: “This is how world wars start”—parallels with the prelude to WWI in The Sleepwalkers.
• 41:47: Trump’s admiration for Hitler’s generals as a symptom of authoritarian impulse.
• 44:41: The answer lies with the people—FDR’s lesson and Mayer’s closing message.

Tone & Language Notes

The conversation is urgent, historically literate, and at times deeply unsettled—richly analytical but with flashes of dark wit, especially when the hosts reflect on the absurdities and dangers of the moment. The language is candid and deeply informed by both history and current events, weaving large-scale observations with on-the-ground specifics.

Conclusion

The hosts warn that the Trump administration’s actions—in both foreign and domestic arenas—have put the postwar international order at risk, with historical parallels pointing to the way world wars have started in the past. They stress that these dangers do not result from a grand ideological drive but from the unique, unpredictable, and unchecked psychology of a single individual in power. In the absence of effective political opposition or institutional constraint, the ultimate responsibility, as FDR declared, falls on the public itself: “The answer’s the people.”