The Political Scene | The New Yorker

Episode: Peter Schjeldahl on Good Cheer During Bad Times
Host: Dorothy Wickenden
Guest: Peter Schjeldahl
Date: December 19, 2019

Episode Overview

In this special year-end episode, Dorothy Wickenden forgoes the usual focus on politics to converse with Peter Schjeldahl, longtime art critic for The New Yorker. Recently diagnosed with terminal cancer, Schjeldahl reflects on his life, the joys of art, and why finding beauty and meaning matters even in times of personal and political crisis. The discussion weaves through Schjeldahl’s personal history, philosophy on art, recent health developments, and his enduring optimism.

Key Discussion Points

Reflections on Life and Illness

• Facing Mortality with Gratitude
  • Schjeldahl discusses his essay "The Art of Dying," exploring his cancer diagnosis, the improvisational nature of facing terminal illness, and his outlook:
    • “Dying. It's my turn to survey life from as far-now-near shore. The extra months are a luxury that I hope to put to good use, like a camera situated nowhere and taking in every last detail of the pulsating world.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 02:28)
  • Despite the severity of his diagnosis, Schjeldahl describes unexpected improvements due to immunotherapy:
    • “It's weird to have mixed feelings about the fact that the treatment I’ve been given, not chemo, but immunotherapy, against the odds, seems to be working very well. It's not a cure, but my prospects are much improved and I feel much better.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 03:33)

Finding Good Cheer During Bad Times

• Cultural and Historical Perspective

  • Schjeldahl downplays the current sense of political despair, suggesting that turmoil is a recurring feature of American life:
    • “Think back, you know, when has the world not been in crisis? You know, we got through the Civil War and Jim Crow and the Depression.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 03:01)
  • He encourages acceptance and perspective, rather than catastrophizing, about the present.

• Moments of Serenity and Beauty

  • Schjeldahl recounts learning of his diagnosis during a drive through the Catskills, accompanied by Patsy Cline on the radio—underscoring the power of art and nature:
    • “The beauty of the Catskills, the absolute perfection, the platonic quality of Patsy Cline, the model for any kind of art.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 04:25)

Origin Story: From Minnesota to New York and Paris

• Early Writing Life

  • Schjeldahl was drawn to words from an early age, but felt unheard—a trait he finds common in writers.
  • He dropped out of Carleton College for a journalism job in Jersey City, recounted with characteristic humor:
    • “You don't know? You don't have a place to stay, do you? Oh hell, take a desk.” (Peter Schjeldahl recalls a hiring editor, 06:58)

• Eye-Opening Experiences in Journalism

  • His first brush with corruption: refused a $50 bribe, much to the editor's consternation:
    • “But I'm a Midwestern country Lutheran kid. So I just, I said, oh, thank you, but I can't take this… I was innocent of the fact that, you know, if you don’t accept being bought by him, it might be dangerous.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 08:11)

• A Life-Changing Encounter with Art

  • A visit to Piero della Francesca’s fresco of the pregnant Madonna triggered an epiphany about the power of art:
    • “It was just like whatever I was going to do in my life was going to have something to do with that. And I didn't. I'm still working on what that is.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 09:14)

Becoming an Art Critic

• The Journey to Criticism

  • Schjeldahl confesses to beginning art criticism with "pristine ignorance," learning on the job and gradually accruing genuine expertise.
  • He notes that talk and writing about art are ways of ratifying one's unique, often solitary, aesthetic experiences:
    • “To have an aesthetic experience is inward and it’s very lonely and it can seem pretty wacky... the social function of criticism... is to ratify and perhaps in some cases to correct our subjective experience.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 16:12-17:23)

• On the Nuances of Taste

  • Schjeldahl feels the aesthetic can be found everywhere, not just constrained to galleries:
    • “Stalking the aesthetic everywhere... the aesthetic isn't bounded by art which merely concentrates it for efficient consumption. If you can’t put a mental frame around it... you'll respond to art only sluggishly.” (Peter Schjeldahl paraphrased by Dorothy Wickenden, 15:35)
  • He jokes about giving advice: “It's like, how do you learn to swim? Well, get in the water.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 16:12)

• The Value of Bad Art

  • “Bad art is much more instructive than good art. You learn more because when something falls apart, you can see what it's made of.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 17:30)

Art, Politics, and Social Change

• Art as a Political Act
  • Schjeldahl discusses Amy Sherald's portrait of Michelle Obama as an example of art changing context and refreshing tradition:
    • “Somebody like Sherald... applying [portraiture] to upper middle class black people... it refreshes the tradition. It makes it new. Art doesn’t change... but we change.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 15:05)
  • He remarks that race, as a subject, “applies as a condition and a cause for resetting the mainstream of Western art.”

Looking Ahead

• Next Project
  • Schjeldahl hints at an upcoming essay about visiting the Prado Museum in Madrid at Steve Martin’s invitation, embracing opportunities beyond the critical review format.
    • “Steve Martin decided that he needed me to talk to him about Velazquez, so we flew over on a private plane… encouraged to write an essay that’s not a review.” (Peter Schjeldahl, 18:06)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Facing Death and Remaining Present (02:28)

  • “Dying. It's my turn to survey life from as far-now-near shore… like a camera situated nowhere and taking in every last detail of the pulsating world.” — Peter Schjeldahl

• On Art’s Social and Personal Function (16:12)

  • “To have an aesthetic experience is inward and it’s very lonely... the social function of criticism... is to ratify and perhaps in some cases to correct our subjective experience.” — Peter Schjeldahl

• On Corruption and Naivete in Journalism (08:11)

  • “I was innocent of the fact that if you don't accept being bought by [a corrupt official], it might be dangerous.” — Peter Schjeldahl

• On Advice for Enjoying Art (16:12)

  • “How do you learn to swim? Well, get in the water. I mean, do you like art or not?” — Peter Schjeldahl

• On the Insightfulness of Bad Art (17:30)

  • “Bad art is much more instructive than good art. You learn more because when something falls apart, you can see what it's made of.” — Peter Schjeldahl

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:28 – Schjeldahl reads from "The Art of Dying" and discusses facing terminal illness
• 03:33 – Updates on his health and reflects on positive medical news
• 04:25 – The power of beauty and Patsy Cline, even amid crisis
• 06:13 – Early writing life and feeling unheard as a child
• 08:11 – First lessons in city journalism and naïveté confronting corruption
• 09:14 – Mystical experience with Italian art and life direction
• 15:05 – The political meaning of Amy Sherald’s portraiture
• 16:12–17:23 – How to develop taste and the value of sharing art experiences
• 18:06 – Sneak preview of a forthcoming essay on Velazquez

Summary

This warm, contemplative conversation moves well beyond politics into reflections on mortality, art, joy, and the meaning to be found amid uncertainty. Schjeldahl’s unique blend of humility, humor, and deep aesthetic sensitivity invites listeners to slow down, notice beauty everywhere, and accept the complexities of life—good, bad, and in-between. The episode offers a fitting close to a turbulent year, radiating hope and clarity for what lies ahead.

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