Podcast Summary: "The Coronavirus Election"
Podcast: The Political Scene | The New Yorker
Host: David Remnick
Guest: Susan Glasser (Washington Correspondent, The New Yorker)
Date: March 30, 2020
Overview
In this episode, David Remnick speaks with Susan Glasser about how the COVID-19 pandemic is upending American politics, the presidency, and the lead-up to the 2020 election. The conversation explores President Donald Trump’s handling of the crisis, the interplay between public health and political messaging, the response from other political figures, and the ramifications for the upcoming presidential election. Throughout, they examine the contrasting leadership styles emerging in this moment of national uncertainty, and how partisanship and character are shaping the response at every level.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Trump’s Personalization of the Crisis
[02:19–05:33]
- Susan Glasser describes the crisis as “the most clarifying of Donald Trump's presidency,” arguing that crises reveal a leader’s core qualities—both strengths and weaknesses.
- “By sort of waging war on the institutions of government... and constructing a White House that runs (or doesn’t run) unlike any other... those are the tools he brings to this most unusual battle.” (Susan Glasser, 02:25)
- Trump’s tendency to personalize issues is especially evident in the pandemic context.
- “You hear the word ‘I’ an awful lot… dramatizing this as if it’s something that is affecting him and him alone.” (Susan Glasser, 03:17)
- The hosts discuss how Trump publicly minimized the seriousness of COVID-19, despite internal warnings from his administration.
- “He didn’t want anything to interrupt his re-election campaign plan, which entirely hinged on the strength of the US economy and also the strength of the US stock market.” (Susan Glasser, 04:13)
- Glasser notes a future “9/11 style commission” may investigate the delay in federal response.
2. The Collision of Trump’s Style with Reality
[05:33–07:41]
- Remnick and Glasser discuss the dangers of Trump’s approach, contrasting it with the empirical reality presented by the pandemic.
- “Where his flimflammery and narcissism and insistence upon projecting alternate realities would collide with empirical reality in such a stark way. The math is the math.” (Susan Glasser, 06:15)
- “It’s not about ideology. It’s about the unique flaws in his character... that’s what makes him so potentially dangerous in this kind of crisis.” (Susan Glasser, 06:15)
- Trump’s calls to “reopen the country by Easter” are seen as minimizing the public health threat.
3. The Role of Truth-Tellers: Fauci, Cuomo, and Others
[07:41–09:54]
- Remnick raises the importance of figures like Anthony Fauci and Andrew Cuomo, who are perceived as “truth-tellers.”
- Glasser explains that their relationship with Trump is “erratic in the extreme”—sometimes he listens, sometimes he attacks.
- Both Fauci and Cuomo must “tread a delicate line” to avoid losing influence while speaking the truth.
- Trump has publicly attacked several Democratic governors, potentially harming the on-the-ground response.
4. Public Opinion and the Politics of the Crisis
[09:54–12:14]
- Glasser notes a rise in Trump’s approval ratings during the crisis, with Gallup showing 49% approval overall and 60% for his crisis handling.
- “Views about Donald Trump are remarkably fixed and immune to almost any kind of external change or shock.” (Susan Glasser, 10:13)
- The partisan divide is evident, with blue states hit first and hardest, and Trump accentuating those differences.
- “He seems to be exacerbating those divisions that already exist in the country with how he’s talking about this... almost overtly [playing] to small, less populated states in the middle of the country that so far have not been hard hit.” (Susan Glasser, 11:22)
- Trump is seen more as an agent of division than unity in this moment.
5. GOP Responses and Notable Contradictions
[12:14–15:36]
- Few Republican senators publicly break with Trump; notable criticism comes more from Republican governors like Mike DeWine (Ohio) and Larry Hogan (Maryland), who are more “clear eyed” in their public health response.
- “Implicitly, their behavior and their public statements have been a rebuke to Trump almost every day.” (Susan Glasser, 12:55)
- Contrast with voices like Texas Lieutenant Governor Dan Patrick, who suggested that senior citizens should risk their health for the economy:
- “There’s something that would be worse than dying.” (David Remnick quoting Patrick, 14:13)
- “I personally am not ready to sacrifice my parents for the views of some Wall Street financiers... It’s just shocking that people say things like that out loud.” (Susan Glasser, 14:18)
- Senator Rand Paul’s actions—potentially exposing colleagues after testing positive—highlight the lack of seriousness by some GOP figures.
6. The Frozen 2020 Election and Biden’s Dilemma
[15:36–16:59]
- Political campaigning and the Democratic primary are mostly “on hold,” casting a shadow on Joe Biden’s campaign.
- “It’s an aspect of our national life that’s been put almost on hold... [Biden’s campaign is] worried they’re too far out of the news cycle.” (Susan Glasser, 15:49)
- A strategic debate: Should Biden attack, or step back and let Trump damage himself?
7. The Role of Government in a Pandemic
[16:59–18:27]
- Remnick references Reagan’s famous anti-government quip: "The most terrifying words in the English language were, ‘I'm from the government and I'm here to help.’"
- Glasser says the pandemic has forced even Republican lawmakers to support massive federal intervention:
- “Politicians, regardless of their ideology... are willing to throw money at a problem when it's a problem like this one.” (Susan Glasser, 17:11)
- “The sustained Republican attack on the institutions of our government... has contributed to what appears to be the incompetence and disorganization of the Trump administration's response.” (Susan Glasser, 17:23)
- Glasser says the pandemic has forced even Republican lawmakers to support massive federal intervention:
- The episode closes with Glasser predicting a thorough post-pandemic reckoning over government failures.
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- On Trump’s crisis style:
- “You couldn’t imagine a president personalizing a crisis with a virus, but somehow that’s where we are. The Trump show applies even to the pandemic.” (Susan Glasser, 02:40)
- On the consequences of wishful thinking:
- “The math is the math. Look at those charts. Look at those numbers. X number of people are sick... And so I think that really hit home... when the President... was simply declaring willfully, ‘Well, I would like to reopen the country by Easter.’” (Susan Glasser, 06:21)
- On political division during the pandemic:
- “You have essentially Blue America and Red America... experiencing the pandemic in a very different blue state, red state way.” (Susan Glasser, 10:58)
- On the GOP's response:
- “Implicitly, [Republican governors’] behavior and their public statements have been a rebuke to Trump almost every day.” (Susan Glasser, 12:55)
- On sacrificing lives for the economy:
- “It’s just shocking that people say things like that out loud... Well, you often have some of his followers now doing that.” (Susan Glasser, 14:18)
- On the role of government:
- “The sustained Republican attack on the institutions of our government... has contributed to what appears to be the incompetence and disorganization of the Trump administration’s response to this.” (Susan Glasser, 17:23)
Timestamps for Key Segments
- Trump’s Personalization of Crisis: 02:19–05:33
- Empirical Reality vs. Political Spin: 05:33–07:41
- Truth-tellers and Internal Debate: 07:41–09:54
- Public Opinion & Political Divide: 09:54–12:14
- GOP Response (Governors vs. Senators): 12:14–15:36
- Freeze in Presidential Campaign: 15:36–16:59
- Government’s Role in Crisis: 16:59–18:27
Conclusion
Susan Glasser’s analysis frames the emerging coronavirus crisis as both a public health emergency and the ultimate test of the Trump presidency. The conversation is rich with insights into the ways political character, partisanship, and the unique nature of this crisis are shaping the official response—and how this moment may permanently alter the landscape leading into the 2020 presidential election. Glasser and Remnick emphasize the unprecedented blending of public health, politics, and personal leadership styles, while leaving open the question of America’s potential for unity and a true sense of the common good in a time of historic uncertainty.