The Political Scene | The New Yorker

Episode: The Press and the President

Date: March 17, 2017
Host: Evan Osnos
Guest: Andrew Marantz (Staff Writer, The New Yorker)

Episode Overview

This episode of "The Political Scene" delves into the intensifying and often adversarial relationship between the Trump administration and the American press. Evan Osnos interviews Andrew Marantz about the administration's tactics in redefining White House media access, the rise of new, ideologically-driven journalists, and the broader implications for democracy. Marantz, who recently published a piece titled "Trolling the President Press Corps," provides first-hand observations and analysis of the shifting journalistic landscape and the strategies at play from both sides.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Trump Administration’s Disruption of Press Traditions

• Rex Tillerson’s Foreign Trip Controversy

  • Secretary of State Tillerson excluded the regular diplomatic press pool, inviting only a single reporter from the Independent Journal Review, a conservative millennial-focused outlet.
  • State Department spokesman Mark Toner defended the choice as "outside the box," emphasizing the intent to include non-traditional media (02:01).

• Andrew Marantz on Motivations

  • The administration claims to be “opening up to new media outlets” and "democratizing the press corps," but Marantz suggests there are dual motives: part genuine outreach, part deliberate provocation.
  • He defines "trolling" as doing something with the intent to provoke a specific reaction, a tactic he believes is actively being used against the traditional press to make them appear self-important and out of touch (03:04).

2. Changes to the White House Press Corps

• Introduction of Skype Seats and Alternative Outlets

  • Sean Spicer has brought in “Skype seats” for regional reporters and called on little-known blogs, disrupting established press dynamics.
  • Some in the press worry new voices could lead to a "diversity of journalistic practice,” potentially undermining the standard of asking rigorous, meaningful questions (05:10).

• Debate Over ‘Softball’ Questions

  • Example: At a press conference with President Trump and Canadian PM Justin Trudeau, a Daily Caller reporter asked a broad national security question rather than addressing the scandal of the day (Michael Flynn)—infuriating other journalists (07:11).
  • Marantz points out there's no rule against such questions, but it's sparking internal debates about journalistic purpose and standards.

3. Strategic Undermining of Media Legitimacy

• The Breitbart/Bannon Legacy

  • The episode references a 2011 quote from Andrew Breitbart: "The left wins because it controls the narrative. The narrative is controlled by the media. I am at war to gain back control of the American narrative." Marantz argues Breitbart's heirs (including Steve Bannon and Trump) are well on their way to achieving this by flipping trust: “If the suits on the mainstream media are saying it, that’s how you know it’s not true.” (10:04).

• Trump and the Media: A Co-dependent Relationship

  • Trump both courts media attention and vilifies criticism, spinning press skepticism into an asset with his base: "Trump says something, the media says he’s lying, and then Trump can turn to his base and say, ‘Who do you choose to believe?’” (12:00 approx).

4. Rise of Ideologically-Driven Newcomers

• Profile: Lucian Wintrich (Gateway Pundit)
  • Marantz describes following Wintrich, a young, provocative right-wing blogger granted White House access, whose main currency is provoking both the left and the traditional right (13:34).
  • Wintrich’s goal: Not classic policy arguments, but cultural disruption and attention. He represents the blending of activism and journalism in the Trump era.

5. The Press Reassesses Its Role

• Media Soul-Searching

  • Reflecting on coverage choices during the 2016 election, Osnos asks if reporters are evaluating their “morally neutral” reporting style—the focus on “who’s up, who’s down”—and whether this inadvertently elevated Trump (16:58).

• Limits of Objectivity and Emergence of New Lines

  • Marantz challenges the myth of absolute objectivity: “Once you get beyond this simplistic and, I think, false notion that it’s possible to get the unfiltered, unvarnished, unbiased truth, I don’t think that’s possible.” (17:38)
  • Now, with overt falsehoods from the podium, journalists are forced to re-draw moral and practical boundaries, with more explicit fact-checking and calling out of official lies.

6. The State and Future of Journalism

• Resurgence of Robust Reporting
  • Osnos and Marantz agree that, despite the challenges, investigative journalism is experiencing a renaissance, with both liberal and conservative outlets producing strong reporting (19:16).
  • Marantz: “Now more than ever, this is a time when journalism is self-evidently important… This is an opportunity for institutions like CNN to frankly get some of their legitimacy back.” (19:52)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Administration's Tactics:

  “I use the word trolling… doing something or saying something in order to get a specific reaction from people. And that is certainly an aspect of what’s going on… It’s a distraction from whatever policy issues you don’t want the press to be discussing.”
  — Andrew Marantz (03:04)

• On Journalism Standards:

  “I love geographic diversity, I love even ideological diversity. What I don’t love is diversity of journalistic practice.”
  — Paraphrased from seasoned correspondent via Marantz (05:10)

• On the Battle for Narrative:

  “If the suits on the mainstream media are saying it, that’s how you know it’s not true. And I think… Steve Bannon being most visible among them, have made an enormous amount of progress.”
  — Andrew Marantz (10:04)

• On the Role of Provocation in New Media:

  "The highest goal in some cases is to take a liberal snowflake and make them really upset and trigger them or whatever the terminology is... He [Wintrich] would rather shock you into paying attention to him..."
  — Andrew Marantz (13:34–15:47)

• On Limits of Press Objectivity:

  “Once you get beyond this simplistic and, I think, false notion that it’s possible to get the unfiltered, unvarnished, unbiased truth, I don’t think that’s possible.”
  — Andrew Marantz (17:38)

• On the Importance of Journalism Now:

  "Now more than ever, this is a time when journalism is self-evidently important. And I think journalists are for the most part doing a good job taking advantage of that momentum.”
  — Andrew Marantz (19:52)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Tillerson Excludes Press Pool & Administration Motives – 01:16–04:31
• How the Press Corps Is Changing – 04:31–07:05
• The ‘Softball Question’ Debate – 07:05–09:11
• Controlling the Narrative: Breitbart/Bannon – 09:11–12:27
• Profile: Lucian Wintrich (Gateway Pundit) – 13:11–15:47
• Media Soul-Searching Post-2016 – 15:47–19:16
• Journalism’s New Path Forward – 19:16–21:18

Conclusion

This episode provides a nuanced exploration of the Trump administration’s approach to the press, the intentional mixing of genuine innovation with political gamesmanship, and the resulting introspection among journalists. With the introduction of new faces and practices into the White House briefing room, longstanding assumptions about the press’s function and authority in American democracy are undergoing stress and transformation. Yet, as Marantz and Osnos reflect, the adversity has catalyzed a resurgence of purpose and quality in American journalism.