The Political Scene | The New Yorker
Episode Title: The Trump Administration’s Self-Sabotaging Approach to Border Politics
Date: April 4, 2019
Host: Dorothy Wickenden (Executive Editor, The New Yorker)
Guest: Jonathan Blitzer (Staff Writer, The New Yorker)
Episode Overview
This episode centers on the Trump administration’s approach to border politics, specifically the decisions to cut foreign aid to Central American countries and threaten to close the U.S.-Mexico border. Dorothy Wickenden and Jonathan Blitzer examine the humanitarian and political impacts of these policies, the realities driving migration from Central America, the evolving tactics of asylum seekers, and how climate change is intensifying migration trends.
Key Discussion Points and Insights
1. Trump Administration’s Sudden Policy Changes
- Cutting Aid: President Trump abruptly announced the end of U.S. financial support to Guatemala, El Salvador, and Honduras, surprising even officials in the State Department and Homeland Security (01:16).
- Threats to Close Border: Trump repeatedly threatened to close all ports of entry with Mexico, despite warnings from Republicans about disastrous economic consequences.
Quote:
“He’s now seems to be backing off that a little bit and now tweeting about closing large sections of the border. Why though is he on this again?”
—Dorothy Wickenden (02:44)
2. The Reality Behind ‘Caravans’ and Migration Numbers
- Data Trends: Migration is, indeed, on the rise—76,000 apprehensions at the southern border in February 2019—but still about half of the numbers from 20 years ago (03:10).
- Security Framing: Trump frames the issue as a security threat, but Blitzer argues it’s a mischaracterization. The real crisis is one of overwhelmed asylum processing capacity, not border security (04:15).
Quote:
“The security issue stuff is absolute nonsense. But there is a legitimate crisis at the border. It’s a crisis related to asylum seekers and specifically to families.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (04:15)
3. Asylum Law, ‘Zero Tolerance,’ and Humanitarian Impact
- Aftermath of Family Separation: The abandonment of family separation led to new attempts to deter asylum-seekers, including restrictive bans and ‘metering’ at ports of entry (05:33).
- Asylum Claims: Many migrants cite life-threatening conditions at home, but most claims are complicated by narrow U.S. definitions of political asylum (06:28).
Quote:
“Technically, by the very strict dictates of U.S. asylum law, someone seeking refuge in the U.S. because of extreme poverty, hunger ... don’t rise to the definition of political asylum.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (06:28)
4. Evolution of Migrant Tactics: Caravans and ‘Metering’
- Caravans Continue: Large, organized groups (caravans) offer some safety from crime for families and children crossing Mexico. These continue, but many migrants are stranded in northern Mexican cities (07:34).
- Metering and ‘Remain in Mexico’: The administration limits asylum seekers processed at ports of entry, requiring many to wait for months or years in Mexico under the ‘Remain in Mexico’ policy (08:51).
Quote:
“Anyone seeking asylum in the US ... it might take three years before your claim is fully heard. In the meantime, you have to wait in Mexico and we’ll let you know when we’re ready for you.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (09:35)
5. Mexico’s Response
- Reluctant Accommodation: Mexico’s government has not strongly resisted ‘Remain in Mexico’. Some speculate Mexico expects the policy will be struck down by U.S. courts, reducing incentive to oppose it now (10:10).
6. Importance of Foreign Aid and Its Effects
- Preventative Focus: The Obama administration’s ‘Alliance for Prosperity’ aimed to address roots of migration (poverty, violence, corruption) with targeted funding. Cutting this aid is expected to worsen the border situation (11:59).
Quote:
“By every measure, that’s going to make the situation at the US Border much, much worse.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (12:43)
7. Blitzer’s Reporting from Guatemala: Climate Change and Migration
- On-the-Ground Reporting: Blitzer explains the astonishing rate of migration from Guatemala (300 people leave daily, ~200 are deported), with climate change as a rapidly growing factor (13:43).
- Climate Impacts: Shifts in weather patterns have devastated subsistence farming; whole communities are being depopulated as youth leave for the U.S. (14:32, 15:21).
Quote:
“The weather has been changing so radically that the crops that many of these families depend on entirely are no longer, allowing them to live in these places.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (14:32)
Memorable Story:
Blitzer recounts a young Guatemalan man whose father had been encouraging him to leave since he was a child (15:21).
Quote:
“My father’s been telling me I should leave since I was six or seven years old. He was annoyed that I even finished high school.”
—Unnamed Guatemalan migrant, relayed by Jonathan Blitzer (15:33)
- Asylum Gaps: U.S. asylum law does not recognize climate change or poverty as grounds for protection, making many migrants ineligible (16:51).
8. The Impact of Aid Cuts on Local Programs
- Community Initiatives: Blitzer observed a small town’s successful farming diversification initiative, funded in part by U.S. aid. Loss of such funds could cause more migration (17:48).
- Future Outlook: Local and international groups rely on U.S. aid; without it, migration pressures could worsen, and NGOs may struggle to operate (18:36).
Quote:
“I think it’s going to be pretty dire what happens, and it’s impossible to predict exactly how dire. ... Without those funding streams, it’s not clear to me how they’ll continue to do the deep work they need to do.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (18:36)
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)
-
On Trump’s Security Framing:
“The security issue stuff is absolute nonsense. But there is a legitimate crisis at the border. It’s a crisis related to asylum seekers and specifically to families ...”
—Jonathan Blitzer (04:15) -
On Caravans and Migration Shifts:
“Traveling through Mexico is extremely dangerous … and so, increasingly, what you’re seeing is more and more families … are gonna do it in these groups because it affords them more protection.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (07:34) -
On Remain in Mexico:
“Anyone seeking asylum in the US ... it might take three years before your claim is fully heard. In the meantime, you have to wait in Mexico.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (09:35) -
On Aid Policy:
“By every measure, that’s going to make the situation at the US Border much, much worse.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (12:43) -
On Climate Change and Desperation:
“My father’s been telling me I should leave since I was six or seven years old. He was annoyed that I even finished high school.”
—Anonymous Guatemalan migrant, relayed by Jonathan Blitzer (15:33) -
On Outlook Without Aid:
“It’s going to be pretty dire ... Without those funding streams, it’s not clear to me how they’ll continue to do the deep work they need to do.”
—Jonathan Blitzer (18:36)
Timestamps for Important Segments
- [01:16] — Introduction: Trump cuts aid and border threats
- [03:10] — Migration data, myth vs. reality
- [05:33] — Zero tolerance fallout, humanitarian crisis
- [07:34] — Evolution of caravans, metering, and Remain in Mexico
- [11:59] — The role and history of foreign aid
- [13:43] — Reporting from Guatemala: climate change as a driver
- [15:21] — The youth exodus and desperation stories
- [16:51] — Limits of asylum law, the climate migration dilemma
- [17:48] — Impact of aid loss on community programs
- [18:36] — Concluding thoughts on migration’s future without U.S. aid
Tone and Style
The conversation is analytical, measured, and grounded in rigorous reporting, with personal stories from field research adding human context to policy discussion. Both speakers maintain a factual, yet empathetic approach, pushing past political rhetoric to illuminate the real forces driving migration.
Summary Takeaway
The Trump administration’s border policies—cutting foreign aid and restricting asylum—are likely to worsen, rather than resolve, the migrant crisis at the southern border. The administration’s strategy overlooks root causes like poverty, violence, and especially climate change, and disregards the effectiveness of preventative aid. Without a realistic, compassionate, and multi-faceted approach, U.S. border crises are set to intensify.