← The PoliticsGirl Podcast
The PoliticsGirl Podcast
Inoculate Yourself From Fear: A Conversation with Global Affairs Expert Andrea Chalupa
00:56:41
Loading summary
Transcript24 lines
- [00:00]
A
We are not nihilists. We believe in the power of the underdog. And so it's our time now to own that power, bring that power out into the world and link arms and fight like hell for what we love, which is our freedom, which is human rights, and our families. We're not going to let them take our country from us. This is our country. And so. And so we're going to fight back. We have no choice but to be brave now. Because you're only as free as you are brave.
- [00:40]
B
Hello and welcome to the Politics Girl podcast. I'm your host, Lee McGowan. Let's get into it today. I'm joined by Andrea Chalupa, a Brooklyn based journalist, author and filmmaker who is also the host and producer of the Webby Award honoree podcast, Gaslit Nation. A student of Soviet history at the University of California, Davis, and Ukrainian history at the Harvard Ukrainian Research Institute, Andraya was not surprised by the results of the 2024 election. The child of parents who were born in European displaced persons camps after World War II, Andrea played a key role in the organizing of the March for Truth, the movement demanding transparency in the Russia Trump investigation that had marches in over 130 cities in the spring of 2017. An author whose works include the graphic novel in the Shadow of Stalin and Dictatorship, It's Easier Than youn Think, Andrea is a frequent speaker on global affairs and US Politics and democracy. She has a very clear idea on what America is now experiencing and what it will experience in the future. And I'll warn you, it's a lot. But if knowledge is power, stick with it. And I think you'll find that this is not only an incredibly powerful episode, but a very inspiring one. So without further ado, please welcome my guest writer, producer, and passionate warrior against the threat of fascism, Andrea Chalupa. Welcome back, Andrea.
- [01:58]
A
Thank you, Leigh. I'm so excited to see you again.
- [02:01]
B
Oh, my gosh. Well, thanks for coming. I mean, you and I spoke right after the election personally, and I knew that people needed to hear from you, but honestly, I was concerned that the information you were going to give us was going to traumatize them. Right. And I felt like they were already traumatized, and I didn't want to do that to people already on the edge. But here we are, almost a month later, sitting down to talk about where America sits in history, you know, where it sits in the world order, how to get prepared for what comes next. So while I know we will both do our very best to not terrify people, I Do want to prepare them with your perspective?
- [02:34]
A
Well, I feel inoculated to this moment of horror because I am Ukrainian American, and as you know very well that Ukrainians were born ready. And so, you know, I grew up on my family's history, stories of survival, of the power of art and resistance, the importance of finding your joy even when people want to kill you. So we're going to get through this. And one of the other things I appreciate is that I've spent years studying history, European history and also American history. So Donald Trump is not surprising to anyone who has studied the long, authoritarian, violent history that built the United States of America. And so we've been here before. Unfortunately, we will likely be here again. But the next time we come back around to whatever the latest reincarnation of Trump will be, we'll have more freedoms, we'll have more liberties, we'll have more representation across society. We'll be a freer, fairer, stronger country. And we have to hold on to that dream, because that is the story of American progress. It is built by the grassroots engines. It is built by people who choose hope over despair. So I have a lot that I want to jump into. So I don't know how you want to start, because I'm so ready for this conversation. And I want to reassure everybody listening that, no, it's not over. It's not over. In fact, we have to stay grounded in how close we came to victory in all of these states and how close we came to controlling the House. We came close. So they don't have a mandate by any means. They have a very, very fragile majority. What we're unfortunately going to watch is the chaos imploding, because there's going to be a lot of turf wars of all these oligarchs who feel that they're entitled to now be the smartest person in the room of Donald Trump's regime. A lot of these dark forces that help bring Trump to power in an election that I will go on record to say that I don't believe is legit. For the simple fact, as we covered on Gaslit Nation, MAGA was openly trying to steal this election. We did two stories on what they were their Georgia operation where they had stolen voting data, software. And you can look at those episodes that go into that, like warnings of that. And if you want more details on what should happen, go to Free Speech for People, a great group that is amplifying the calls of election security experts who say, hey, we've been warning you for years now that our Election systems were vulnerable, that MAGA was openly trying to suppress the vote and steal it. And now to ensure the integrity of the vote, we must have recounts. That should be just a basic election hygiene that we do, so everyone's reassured. So I think let's just push for that in this short window of time that we have and just, just to raise it as an issue. And no, that doesn't make us blue maga, we or the equivalent of their big lie. The reality is that if it weren't for voter suppression laws that Republicans have been passing for years, if it wasn't for Citizens United, passed by a Republican PAC Supreme Court, if it wasn't for gutting the Voting Rights act by a Republican PAC Supreme Court, Kamala Harris would have won this election. If it wasn't for voter ID laws, Kamala Harris would have won this election. And on and on it goes. So, no, that does not make us conspiracy theorists. That makes us historians of this moment, just pointing out what we're up against, the systemic corruption. And so we have to be clear about this. This was an election we could have won if our system wasn't so broken. And we now need to appreciate the fact that Donald Trump, coming onto the scene, coming to power in 2016 with the Kremlin's help, he unleashed across America a political grassroots revolution. We now have so much incredible talent that is now working on the all important grassroots level in states across this union, including in Kansas, fighting for building political power in Kansas. So I'm pointing that out to all the Americans feeling despair right now, thinking our country's over, we've lost our country. No, you have not. In fact, so many more people are waking up to the fact that we can no longer afford to be complacent. We can no longer afford despair. We all have to find our place in rebuilding our country and being part of the larger story of America's progress. And we have to be humble to the fact that every single one of us is needed now. Whatever your gifts are, whatever is your secret dream, whatever, whatever is inside of you that you've had since a child, that you've always wanted to bring out, whatever your voice is, your secret voice, maybe there's a hidden dream inside of you that you've been too afraid to communicate, even to the people closest to you. I am telling you, we need that now from you. We need you to have the courage to overcome whatever your inner blocks are, be honest with yourself and bring out who you are that is needed now more than ever. And the reason why is. Because it's that energy. It's releasing that creativity. It's allowing you to find your fullest self, your truest self, that is going to shine a light so bright that we are together, going to change the culture, impact the culture. And by doing that, you're going to inoculate yourself from despair, from curling up in a fetal position, because that is what they want. What fascists do, what they're going to do in the months when they're fighting, when Biden's gone. Right. We're in the sleepy time now where we're used to having adults in the White House, and it's a quiet period relative to what's coming. So when they get into power, when they have their big Russian prom night of inauguration balls, like all the Russian oligarchs are going to come, like they did in 2016, when that horror show fully unleashes, they're going to try to shock an Oz because they want to show brute force. Donald Trump does not have any ideology. He's not a Reagan Republican, he's not a Bush Republican. His one consistent theme has been brute force, just showing strength. So in those early weeks, months of his administration, they're going to try to terrorize us into submission. They will be leaning on immigration, dystopian plan of rounding up people. That's probably how they're going to start. They're pretty amped about that. That's what drove out their base, and that's what Nazis do. And so we have to refuse to accept, we have to refuse to normalize that. We cannot lull ourselves in the lie that they're just going to round up immigrants, they're just going to round up criminals that shouldn't be here. We cannot make just false justifications in our minds to say that's okay when it's not. Whatever the laws are in America, whatever lawfare they unleash, there is international law when it comes to human rights. And that is what they must abide by. And that is what we internally must abide by in those critical first weeks and months. Why? Because they are going to be testing us to see how much we let them get away with. So we need to react. We need to raise our voices. We need to raise hell. Yes, we need to march. I know people are feeling so demoralized they don't even want to march. But understand the marching we did in 2016 and all those years when Trump was in power, the phone calls we made, the postcards we sent, all the work we did during his first term. That created a sea change in American political life that historians are going to be writing about for generations. We changed this country. We helped bring so much new talent into the system, to improve the system, to reform the system. We made progress. And we haven't lost that progress. We're still building on it. So, yes, the marching works, yes, the running for office works. Yes, the postcards work. If you are in a red state that's already suffering from Project 2025, run for office. Even if you will lose, and you know you're going to lose just by standing up and shining your light, what you're doing is creating a platform and you're going to bring more lights to you and you're going to shine brighter. So please understand our larger war. It's not about Donald Trump. He's just a figurehead. He is just the shield that the corrupt elite hide behind in the darkness. They love him because our focus is purely on him. It's Trump, Trump, Trump all the time. So he's just a distraction. The larger evil that we're up against is corporate greed, corporate price gouging. All of the CEOs with their extreme pay while squeezing their workers, while union busting, while fighting against raising the minimum wage. Those are the people we have to bring out from the dark and into the light. We need to stop falling for the cat laser pointer of Donald Trump. And there is a wonderful app that everyone should download called Good Unites Us, where you can see how the corporations, the consumer products that you rely on, how their companies voted with their dollars, who did they donate to? And so if you see that you are handing over your hard earned money to a lot of corporations that are then propping up maga, this app will show you alternatives that are actually believing in democracy and putting their money behind democracy. So that's extremely important. So we have to now be in a boycott mindset because the civil rights movement, Martin Luther King Jr. He became a global superstar with the Montgomery Bus Boycott. It was a financial boycott. They hit the white people of the authoritarian Jim Crow south in their pocketbook. That is what led to voting rights and human rights and ultimately breaking up the Jim Crow South. So if you want a wonderful guide on how to get ready for what's coming, read Martin Luther King Jr. S memoir, Stride Toward Freedom, Stride Toward Freedom, which he wrote as a young reverend organizing the Montgomery Bus Boycott. That is what we need to do as well. So if you are in independent media, if you are a journalist, if you are an activist, as the atrocities Start coming under the Trump regime, make memes, make statements showing those atrocities and the corporate CEOs that sponsored them, the celebrity endorsements that sponsored them. We need to be a PR branding nightmare for the dark forces that financially prop up MAGA that think they can hide behind the Donald Trump clown. We're not going to let them hide anymore. We're going to make them front and center. So that's important. So I'm going to just recap everything our work that we've done at this point matters. We came extremely close and we changed this country. Number two, your innate gifts matter. That is what is going to help you shine your light and together make all of our lights brighter. And it's going to protect you from being demoralized. You're going to find your joy. Because one thing dictators hate, it's joy. Okay? So we need that from you more than ever. And the third thing is, it's time to name and shame the corporate elite, the villains who brought us to this moment of crisis. It's time to make them all famous. It's time to haunt their dreams, their nightmares, and make their PR flax, their communications department sweat. Okay? That is our work in these critical years ahead. And finally, I just want to sum up. None of this is normal, what's happening. Refuse to normalize it, refuse to accept it, push back against them, be defiant in every single step, because they're not just. They're not going to stop at the criminal element of immigrants. That's what they're telling us. They're not going to stop there. They're going to mass arrest dissidents. They're going to mass arrest anybody that dares stand their way. So we have to block them off at the first sign of Gestapo tactics. Even if we have to mass protest in the streets, put our bodies between people who are being arrested, we have to have moral courage now and stand in our truth and know that our truth will protect us as long as you, in this moment, set an intention of collective good that gives us power, that gives us strength, that gives us something that they do not have. They do not have that. They are not interested in the collective good. They're suffering from a mental health crisis, a mass psychosis known as greed. And so, you know, so we're stronger than them. There's more of us than there are them. And there's a lot of opportunities ahead for us to make a huge impact. Run for office. Help good people. Run for office. And join forces with the National Vote Compact, which is just a few states away of passing having enough legislation in key states to ensure that we have the Electoral college votes, to ensure that the popular vote winner becomes the winner. So look up the National Vote Compact. It's state level legislation. It's a grassroots effort that's very close to victory of being the law of the land. And you'll see Gaslit Nation did an episode on it in May 2024 called Reform Electoral College. This movement is serious. This movement is bipartisan. And the fact that a Republican president just won the popular vote and Electoral College. Now is the time for us to convince more Republicans. You know what? Maybe we don't need Electoral college. We should just do one vote, one citizen. Wherever you live, your vote matters. We need to get rid of electoral college and make the popular vote the law of the land. That needs to happen. That's going to increase engagement in the process. More Californians, more New Yorkers, more Texans will vote because they'll understand that their vote matters. So we have this critical window of time in the next few years to push that through and get it in by 2028. And yes, we will have election in 2028. Yes, the Maga cult will try to steal it again, right, because that's what they do. But we will have elections. We will fight like hell for those elections. And everyone is needed now. You matter. Our democracy has survived this far because of you.
- [17:22]
B
Well, thank you for that.
- [17:26]
A
I had a lot to get out of my system.
- [17:28]
B
You had some things to say and I was happy to hear them. Let me ask you a couple questions. Questions about what you said. One, you're talking about we will have elections in 2026, 2028. You and I both agree that something is very sus about this last election, but it looks as if we are not going to be challenging it. And that is upsetting to a lot of people. It's upsetting to me. And like you said, it doesn't really make you an election denier to say, I'm recognizing these things that have happened in other countries. In Belarus and Ukraine, you know, in Georgia, you know, these are. These are tactics that have already been used. We're not being crazy when we say this seems circumspect and you should be looking. However, if we're not going to. And they're going to use the same tactics two years from now, four years from now, how can people not just give up hope and feel like it's all over? I mean, Ukraine dealt with this for years and then they ended up ousting their Russian puppet President so how do we look at it like that? With the holiday season upon us, let's talk about making gift giving more meaningful and supporting artisans and craftsmen by giving more personalized gifts, things that you wouldn't find at a big box store. Uncommon Goods makes holiday gift giving special by gathering unique hand picked items for everyone on your list. Uncommon Goods scours the globe for original, handmade and one of a kind items that make gift giving feel more personal. It's a fun way to shop on their site. You can put in people's specific interests, get personalized gifts that no one else will have, or find something incredibly memorable. One year we got a puzzle that was our entire neighborhood. It was so cool. It was a tough puzzle too. We did it all the way up to New Year's so it was a gift and it was a family project. When you shop at Uncommon Goods, you're supporting artists and small independent businesses. Many of their items made in small batches, so I would recommend shopping earlier rather than later just so they don't sell out. They also focus on quality, unique designs and many of their products are even handmade right here in the usa. So whether you're looking for some stocking stuffers or something for a scotch lover, this is not your typical holiday selection. And for every purchase you make, Uncommon Goods will donate $1 to a nonprofit of your choice with over $3 million donated to date. So get 15% off your next gift by going to UncommonGoods.com politicsgirl that's UncommonGoods.com politicsgirl for 15% off. Don't miss out on this limited time offer because, as they say, Uncommon Goods we are all out of the ordinary. Speaking of spending money, how many transactions do you make each month? Honestly, I couldn't even guess. But I was surprised to learn that the average US consumer makes about 70 payments a month. Trying to keep track of that can feel impossible, but that's exactly why Rocket Money is so helpful. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that empowers you to save more, spend less, and take control of your financial life. It pulls all your checking, savings, credit cards and investments into one convenient place so you get a clear view of your spending trends. It helps you see exactly where your money is going, and it's so much easier than combing through all your bank statements. One of my favorite features is Rocket Money's custom budget tool. It identifies your top spending categories, whether that's dinner or travel or groceries, and it helps you adjust where you might need to rein it in. Plus, it can help you save money for specific goals, whether you're looking to pay off debt, saving up for a big purchase, or just putting a little extra aside. And here's something I think everyone can appreciate. Rocket Money will even negotiate lower bills for you, sometimes by up to 20%. Imagine saving on your cell phone or cable bill without even having to deal with customer service. It's no wonder they have over 5 million happy members and have saved their users over $1 billion across all their features. Let Rocket Money help you reach your financial goals faster. Get Rocket Money today@RocketMoney.com PoliticsGirl that's RocketMoney.com PoliticsGirl RocketMoney.com PoliticsGirl how can people not just give up hope and feel like it's all over? I mean, Ukraine dealt with this for years and then they ended up ousting their Russian puppet president. So how do we look at it like that?
- [21:33]
A
Well, I think we should still push for a recount. I think it's, you know, Kamala Harris and Biden and Mark Elias like giving up and not doing recounts. Given what Mago is doing out in the open and given what Trump himself was saying, you won't have to vote anymore. We're going to take care of that. I think that was morally wrong. I don't think the Democrats can run on a campaign saying everyone's hair should be on fire over Project 2025 and that Trump wants to be a dictator and then just go away after he wins an extremely close election that he was openly trying to steal all year and the Russians were involved too, hacking election systems in Georgia all year and then all the dozens of bomb threats of key battleground states on election day alone. So I think that was criminally negligent of the Democrats to just back away. And I think it's in sharp, alarming contrast to the message of crisis they were pushing to Americans all year. It's just such a disconnect and it's wrong. And it basically is an urgent reminder that we need new leadership for the Democratic Party at the top. And that's not just me saying that. That's a lot of super talented and impactful organizers like Amanda Littman, who built Run for Something that has brought so many amazing young people helping them run for office and win on the all important state level where our quality of life issues are decided, where MAGA extremism has taken root. And that's where we need to really push back. So a lot of the people who are on the front lines of protecting our democracy are like, enough already with this current leadership of the Democratic Party. Like, you're absent. You're not meeting this moment. And so we should, you and I and the rest of the independent media, we should be demanding recounts. We should be saying, this is not normal. The Audit the vote movement in 2016, that was a movement driven by, yes. Activists were like, this isn't right. The Russians were here and there. And we didn't know at the time in 2016 that the Russians were in every single voting system. That news didn't come out until years later. But we suspected something was wrong because you had a longtime Kremlin operative, Paul Manafort, running Trump's campaign, and the horrible things that he did in Ukraine showed that, you know, did he do that here in America? And so we all had questions in 2016, and we demanded a vote audit. Reputable computer scientists at major universities were the ones to ultimately call for that vote audit and were involved in that. And even though Trump still won that audit the vote movement brought so many amazing activists like Jennifer Cohen, the election security expert. So every single failed movement fertilizes the ground for future successes and helps strengthen the movement. So we now have Jenny Cohn out there who's now ringing the alarm about this election and galvanizing people. So we shouldn't just give up on a recount just because Biden and Kamala have given up. Like, we have to refuse to give up. That's. That's morally incumbent on us. And the election in the midterms, the states matter. So on the state level, wherever you live in this country, have your reps on speed dial and demand that locally they push for laws that do what the John Lewis Voting Rights act was supposed to do, which was strengthen and restore all these protections, the Voting Rights act, and ensure election security, including from hacking. And so wherever you live, make your elections in your state stronger and more transparent. And yes, work with Republicans to make that happen. I think we should talk to Republicans who are concerned about the big lie. Hey, you guys want to have some peace of mind? Well, why don't we strengthen these voting systems, see if they're open to that. Some of them might be. Some of them, of course, will not. But so work very hard, organize, become leaders, become a safe place for democracy wherever you live. And pass the John Lewis Voting Rights act locally, where you live. And if it seems impossible because you're in A Gerrymandered Project 2025, so called Red State, a Republican hostage state, still push for it anyway. Look at Missouri with those referendums that were so populist and popular with voters in Missouri, despite that being a Republican hostage state. So have hope. Your job in these coming weeks and months is to plant seeds of hope, plant seeds of change. Take these small steps and refuse, refuse to pre surrender, refuse to give up. Because that nihilistic attitude that we're not going to have elections, everything's over. That's a very Russian attitude. That's why the Russian opposition has been absolutely useless in stopping Putin. Like, where are the Russians? Over a million have fled Russia in a massive brain drain since Putin's war began 10 years ago. They go abroad and then what? They don't join forces with Ukrainians and Poles and Georgians building human rights organizations. They disappear. They just live their lives and go on. It's like they're nihilists. They don't believe in anything. They don't believe anything will change. So the Russian opposition is completely useless. And Ukrainians have had to fend for themselves. There have been a select few of Russians that have been extremely brave, extremely strong, and extremely honorary Ukrainians like Boris Nemtsov and others. Obviously, many have suffered, including dear friends of mine. But the numbers are just not there. And so Americans cannot become like the Russian opposition, because if we surrender here at home, who's next? France is next. The UK is next. Canada is next. They have a big election next year. The Scandinavian countries are next. This MAGA virus is just going to steamroll with Russia's help across all these other democracies. So we have to make it so hard here and slow them down. Sabotage, be like nails in the road of their tires of fascism. We need to stand in our truth and be accountable to ourselves and each other. And one thing I want to caution people on, there's a lot of disinformation out there. And the whole New Age spirituality place, there's a whole funnel of MAGA in that space online. So people who fall into the rabbit hole of New age videos on YouTube and yoga and things that seem sort of fun, entertaining, innocuous at first, there's been reporting and books written about how MAGA has tapped into that to feed you information that there's some higher plan and there's like some good versus evil, and, you know, QANON is sort of a model of that. What I'm talking about. I want to caution everyone, as someone who has studied and made two films now on the interwar period, the 1930s, during the rise of fascism in America. First, I have to warn you that when times seemed hopeless during the rise of fascism in the 1930s. And that was all in the shadow of the trauma of the Great war, World War I, that saw just carnage, millions killed. Europe just littered with bodies and dead horses. It was just like. It was like the gates of hell just opened up across Europe. People lost their minds with trauma. That's why they call it the lost generation of the artists that came out of that. And one phenomenon that I studied from that time was that black magic came in vogue. Like people were turning to black magic to try to find some larger meaning behind all these things that were happening because they couldn't live with that reality. And I think that's happening today. I have some very smart people sending me videos of seemingly normal people making statements saying that there's a higher plan. This is the final battle of good versus evil, the matriarchy versus the patriarchy. And this was all meant to happen this way so we can all be radicalized. I want to tell you all that this is just a human condition grasping for meaning in a seemingly meaningless world. And people will fall victim to this thinking. And I want to tell you, as somebody who has studied history, there is no larger plan. There is no inevitable victory. There's no guarantee that there's some big reveal happening because of this madness that we're all living in that simply does not exist. If you are looking for any sort of comfort or grounding, look within. Look within. Just know you're made of tough stuff. Just know that you come from a very long line of ancestors. We're talking a very long line of ancestors of women who had to give birth without anesthesia. Okay? And going back many generations. So you are tough. You are made of tough stuff. Begin within. Trust your own inner strength. Trust your own intuition, your own inner knowing. Be centered. Be calm. Have a daily practice of being mindful, taking, you know, catching your breath. That is what you need to get through this. Not some external promise of trust the plan. When I'm here to tell you that charlatan act has existed throughout moments of terrifying chapters of history, just like it did then. It's coming back again today. Do not trust anything outside yourself promising you there's some greater plan. There's not. Trust yourself now. Trust your own inner strength. Trust the people that brought you this far that live inside you to this day. You are connected to something larger and beautiful and immortal. Yes, that's true. There is an inner light in you that has given birth to generations of wonderful humans. So trust that and have faith in that and know that we've had many dark chapters, and this is just the latest one. And we're ultimately going to get through it, and we're going to get through it together.
- [31:31]
B
Andrea, I swear, when I spoke to you after the election, you were like, yeah, this is how the world works. Like, you just haven't experienced it yet. And I was like, I'm having a heart attack. And you, you were like, no, this is totally normal. And we started talking about. I was like, well, what are we supposed to do? You're like, we need to shore up ourselves. We need to shore up other democracies around the world. They need to stay as a beacon for us. We have to make sure that Canada doesn't go the way that Putin and Elon want it to go next October or next year. We have to shore up their democracy so we still have something to look towards. One of the reasons I think, that Putin wanted to get rid of and everyone, all the leaders before him, really get rid of America as a beacon of democracy is because then you can no longer look to it and say, see, there is a place where you can replace your leaders. See, there is a place where your vote matters. See, there is a place where people can be happy and joyful. You go, well, there's no other place. It's all like this. It's all the same. And you lose. You get demoralized. And I think that is part of what you're telling us not to do. I mean, I want people to remember that our founders, who, by the way, were children, they were so young, a lot of them, they actually put a fair amount of guardrails in to protect us. You know, like federalism itself is here. You know, our system is quite complicated. They actually created the electoral college to protect us from the rise of a charismatic strongman. It's just. It failed. Right? But we also built this nation on racism and sexism and on certain people taking what they wanted and certain groups always being at the top. So it's not really surprising that we're sort of back here again, because it's sort of where we started. And the people that didn't love sharing their spot at the top have kind of gotten back there and are trying to lock everyone else out. And we have to say, well, we're not going to do that. There's more of us, and we're not into this. Right? And I think we have to remember that we need a really strong civil society moving forward. And so people understand a civil society society is like anything that's not a Business or the government, Right? So it's all the organizations, the membership groups, the advocacy groups, the professional associations, every voluntary group, you know, anything that organizes American life and culture. Authoritarians often feel the need to crush civil society. Right. Strongman leaders have a tendency to become not just dictators, but totalitarians. Right. Where everything they don't like in the country or it isn't about them or isn't for them, they will try and destroy. And so we have to make sure that those institutions, those groups, those communities are upheld, because that's where we have room to think for ourselves, to organize, to speak with the power of many instead of just being one. It's why they hate unions so much, this kind of group challenge to the power structure. Right? It's why this bill that's been going through the House about unilaterally declaring not for profits terrorist organizations is, like, so horrifying, because that's exactly what they want to do. They want to be able to close down the ACLU and close down Emily's List and close down all these organizations. They currently have an oil and gas company suing Greenpeace for $300 million just to be able to shut it down. Shut down when they are getting rid of these things. And we have to be, as you're saying, like sand in their gears, right? They're trying to get this machine, this authoritarian machine, up and running. Like you're saying, there's all of these oligarchs are going to be jockeying for position behind the scenes, and we can't let them be behind the scenes. We have to shine a light on them, too. We have to start saying, we don't want to just see Trump. We want to see all you people pulling the mechanisms, all you people fighting for positions, and we have to get in their way. So we're a hindrance to this machine really getting up and running. And in the meantime, we have to support the organizations and the groups and the politicians who really are trying to uphold the system. Right? Because that is possible. And it's only not possible if we sit around thinking someone's going to save us or we do nothing because we're horrified. Which is why you're talking about this shock and awe situation. We have to throw a wrench in their plans, and we do that collectively. Is that correct? This season, it's a great time to think about what we're thankful for. Family, friends, good health. And part of that health is our skin health. As I've said before, I'm a super white Girl. So skin cancer is something I like to keep on top of. It's nice to look nice, but it's more important to be healthy. Which is why I've been so pleased with Oneskin. I live in Los Angeles, so I use Oneskin sunscreen every day. I even keep it in my car for my hands. But Wenskin has an entire line of skin care that doesn't just treat surface level issues, but works at the cellular level to keep your skin healthy and resilient as you age. The Secret is their OS1 peptide which targets the sentient cells, the ones that stop our skin from producing collagen and hyaluronic acid. This peptide allows you to turn those cells off so your skin stays hydrated and smooth and vibrant. And coming up this holiday season season, Oneskin is introducing a limited edition holiday bundle. This exclusive bundle comes with Travel sizes of OS1 face, OS1 eye and OS1 body in a sleek bag. I just got one and it would be a great gift. In fact, it might be a perfect gift for anyone wanting to invest in long term skin health. Oneskin is the world's first skin longevity company addressing skin health at the molecular level, targeting the root cause of aging so skin can behave, feel and appear younger. Why not get started with your new face, eye and body routine at a discounted rate today? Get 15% off with the Code Politics Girl at oneskin co. That's 15% off at oneskin Co with the code Politicsgirl. After your purchase they'll ask where you heard about them so please let them know we sent you. We only get one body, one skin so why not make it the best it can be? Age healthy Healthy with one skin as you may or may not know, I have a dog, a wonderful goldendoodle who just got his hair down and he's a big poofy poof ball and I love him and his name is Chips. I think it would be fair to say that I am borderline obsessed with this dog and the feeling is mutual. He is my shadow. He goes everywhere with me and I'm not kidding when I tell you he loves Sundays for dogs. I had heard great things about Sundays for dogs but my boy is a picky eater so I went wasn't sure that he would take to it. But often when he refuses to eat anything else, he will eat sundaes. I even keep a bag of it in my office. Sundaes for Dogs is a fresh dog food made from a short list of human grade ingredients. Co founded by practicing veterinarian who tests and formulates every version of each recipe. Sundaes contains 90% meat, 10% superfoods, and 0% synthetic nutrients or artificial ingredients. And unlike other fresh dogs, Dog Foods Sundays doesn't require refrigeration or preparation because of their air drying process, so you can just pour and serve. I go back and forth between the beef and the chicken because like us, Chips gets bored if you offer him the same thing every day. So if you and your dog want to try sundaes for dogs, go to Sundays for dogs.com politicsgirl to get 40% off your first order. That's sundaysfordogs.com politicsgirl girl and use the code Politics Girl at checkout for 40% off because I'm sure your dog is just as special to you as my dog is to me and I would never steer you wrong when it comes to our doggos. Sundays for dogs.com politicsgirl so coming back from our Thanksgiving trip, you know what? We had a lot of laundry and it doesn't matter how busy you get, there's always more laundry to do. As I've said before, I have a teenage son who will wear things once and throw it in the hamper or leave it all on the floor so you don't know what's clean and what's dirty so you just have to wash it all. Which is why I am so pleased that Laundry Sauce has decided to sponsor the show. I was already pretty picky with my detergent because I like to be good to the environment and I'm not into chemical smells. But Laundry Sauce has partnered with one of the top fragrance houses in the world to bring beautiful, complex aromas made from high quality ingredients and put them into a powerful stain fighting laundry pod that's not only good for the environment but smells amazing. From Australian sandalwood to Egyptian rose to Siberian pine, people are loving it. And I'm not the only one who's into them. Laundry Sauce has some of the funniest and most authentic reviews you'll ever read. For example, Chuck said my clothes in bed smell good AF and he's not wrong. Plus, Laundry Sauce doesn't just stop at pods. They've got scent boosters and dryer sheets and dryer balls and fabric softener and even and candles to really round out the experience. The scent is that good, but it's not overpowering, which is lovely. Ready to elevate your laundry ritual? Now is the time. Head to laundry sauce.com politicsgirl and use the promo code politicsgirl at checkout for 15% off. That's laundry sauce.com politicsgirl promo code politicsgirl for 15% off your order one last time. Laundrysauce.com politicsgirl with the code politicsgirl for 15% off. We have to throw a wrench in their plans, and we do that collectively. Is that correct?
- [40:08]
A
A trillion %. A trillion percent. Because the real enemy is normalization. They want to shift things where we. They're going to test us, like, how much will we take? And we have to push back every time.
- [40:22]
B
I don't love that. I'm not gonna lie to you, Andrea. That sounds horrifying. As does marching in the streets and having them open fire on me. I couldn't even watch the Handmaid's Tale because that scene happened in maybe the second episode where, you know, the women lost their bank accounts, and then they lost their ability to go to work. And then, of course, they protested because they were in America and they opened fired on the protesters. And then, of course, people stopped protesting because they were like, no, thanks. And then it got even worse. And I feel like a lot of people are terrified of putting themselves in that position. And I understand the fear. I feel it myself as someone who has seen a lot more horror than, say, us softies that grew up here without parents, that were born in, you know, displaced persons camps who have, like, a real. Like, you're talking about a real strength within them that they can grasp onto right away. What do you say to us when we say we're afraid and we don't know how to fight back?
- [41:16]
A
Fear is contagious. So if you're afraid and you let that stop you from doing something needed in that moment, then you're basically shutting down not just yourself but others. Because when you shine, when you stand out, when you show up to a protest, when you show up to support a candidate, when you show up, right? There's power in showing up, and you give permission for others to be brave. But if you don't show up, others may not show up either. So we all need to show up. Ukraine, I know Ukraine is. People are heartbroken over what Russia is doing to Ukraine. Actually, Ukraine's economy right now is stronger than Russia's, and Ukraine is the place to be. Russia is collapsing. US$20 is 2,000 Russian rubles. There is such a labor shortage in Russia because people have fled the country, and so many have ended up in the meat grinder in Ukraine that Russia's on the brink of collapse. They're on the brink of hyperinflation, which brought down the Soviet Union. In the first go around. So Vlad wanted to, Putin wanted to bring back the Soviet Union. Well, here you go. This is what it is. And so Russia is one of those shithole countries, if I can say that on your show, sorry, what Trump calls, you know, so it's in that category. And Ukraine is actually flourishing in so many ways, and it's building up this whole innovative military industry to create a defensive industry that it didn't have before. This total, this, this all out genocide. And that's because of Ukrainian ingenuity and independent spirit and creativity. And Ukrainians are doing remarkably well considering. But the reality is that Ukraine exists to this part, to this point in history, because it's been under Russian occupation, Russian threats for many centuries. So Putin's just the latest czar. But Ukraine has survived for so long because they refuse to accept fear. They live their lives out loud. I hope to go there with you someday because it has such a flourishing art scene. The creativity, it's just brilliant and it's just such a fun place. And especially in the summertime, like all the DJs and the bands on the sandy banks of the Dnipro river that runs through Kyiv and all the art shows. And I remember going to a party once and I had a stand on a stool and recite a poem because that's what everyone had to do when they came to the party. And I had a friend who was on the Ukrainian version of the Voice and her clips went viral. She was just so passionate when she sang. So it's just a beautiful, beautiful culture. And so they were never afraid of the Russians. That's why they've won so far. That's why they've pushed them back, because they refused to submit to fear. And so that's what we have to do now. So when a Ukrainian investigative journalist, a woman was ran off the side of the road and brutalized, her face beaten so badly you could hardly recognize her. Like everything puffed up. You would think that people would be intimidated and they would stay home. Instead, they flooded the streets demanding justice for her. So that's what we need to do. We need to remember what Americans did during the George Floyd protests, when we all witnessed a man being executed on the street, begging for his mother. And so we need to remember that we have that in us too. We're more like Americans are more like the Ukrainians than they are the Russians. We are not nihilists. We believe in the power of the underdog. And so it's our time now to own that power, bring that power out into the world and link arms and fight like hell for what we love, which is our freedom, which is human rights and our families. We're not going to let them take our country from us. This is our country. And so, and so we're going to fight back. Or we have no choice but to be brave now because you're only as free as you are brave.
- [45:28]
B
I mean, I don't even need to speak. You're so incredible. I mean, the point is, I think here is that as much fear as we might feel, we can't let it define us. We can't just lie down and give this horrible man the power over this beautiful country just because he says he wants it. We can't just lie down because a handful of super rich assholes decided they wanted to take everything. We can't just lie down and do that. And we can't lose who we are. We can't lose the American spirit and the American can do attitude and the, you know, stand up and fight patriotism just because the people who are fighting also happen to be Americans. There is a reason, I think, that the Constitution said, you are going to fight enemies abroad and domestic. They had some sense that, you know, our biggest threat would always come from the inside. You know, I think that when they said we have a republic, if you can keep it, I think if when Lincoln talked about we would be able to be a free nation as long as we didn't destroy ourselves, I think the men, these men of the past, they had some sense of who the men of the future would be. And that is where we are now. So I think this wannabe authoritarian is gonna see how far he can push us, push our systems, and we have to say not very far over and over and over again. I think I said to you when we first spoke that we have to be the most annoying ever. And your attitude was so, I don't know, calm and peaceful when I was having a complete panic attack. And I think it's because you've seen it before and it might be new to anyone here experiencing it. I mean, I grew up in Canada. I talk about, you know, it all going smoothly for me. I even had, you know, healthcare. But here, you know, there is a struggle built into our bones. There is a struggle and we have to kind of latch onto that now because I think that this is a horrifying time. But if we catastrophize it, we are lost.
- [47:33]
A
If they declare martial law and they just shut down elections flat out, and no one's voting. I'm gonna actually fight like hell politically for the National Vote Compact and the John Lewis Voting Rights act in my state. But you know what I mean? Like, so. And have a lot of fun and look fabulous while doing it like that. Those are my goals in life.
- [47:50]
B
Yeah. Well, you said we should do an episode to try and save Canadian democracy, which, by the way, Canada, you are in trouble, girl. And I said, how are we supposed to. You're like, we'll make it a festive Christmas party. We'll draw attention to the Canadian elections, and it can be this fun, festive event. And I was like, how can this terrifying. Watch out, it's coming for you, too. Event. Be fun and festive. And you were like, because it has to be. Because we're human beings that deserve to be living in joy. Just because something terrible is happening to us doesn't mean it has to happen within us. And we must, as you keep saying, share that light, because light, just like fear, is contagious. And it is exactly what these type of leaders cannot deal with because they want to demoralize us and break our spirit. And it's just so incredibly awful for them. Exactly.
- [48:34]
A
If they can't. Exactly. And there's so much on our side. When I was coming up as a girl in America, Christopher Hitchens wrote an essay for Vanity Fair titled something like, women are just not funny now. Today, TikTok in Instagram, Twitter, all those spaces are flooded with crazy viral videos of women of all ages just being ridiculous and hilarious. And it's being. Those clips are being shared by everybody. Men, too. You know what I mean? But so what I'm telling you is there's so much progress in our lives, in our lifetimes, that we take for granted. It's like we've come so far just in our own lifetimes, and we're going to go farther. We're not. Like, Ukraine's national anthem has a line that says, we're not dead yet, and that's us now. Like, we're not. You know, we've got so, so much going for us, even in this moment, and people need to stop psyching themselves out that it's going to be just this abysmal Handmaid. They want it to be Handmaid's Tale, but we're pushing back against that, and we need to just link arms and be creative and be smarter in how we leverage our resources. I was just in London for a big trip to work on some film projects, and I was meeting with independent journalists while there, and all the talk is that London's now the new hub of media resistance because they had their time under Brexit chaos, and now they have a new government in place that's going to buy them a quiet period, just like Biden bought us a quiet period. And so they're like, okay, we're here to help. What do you need help with? And so we're talking to journalists in London about creating a transnational newsroom to help each other, to make our jobs, our lives, easier, to stay connected, to feel our strength and leverage our powers. So we're going to become smarter and more innovative, more clever in these years ahead, just like the Ukrainians were forced to be for their survival. So that's what's going to happen. A lot of powerful seeds are going to be planted in the time ahead. And they hate that. They fear us. Never forget they fear us. They wouldn't work so hard to steal elections and suppress the vote if they did not fear us. They go straight to the cheapest tricks in the book to try to demoralize us. They threaten us, our very lives. They gloat about it, right, because they're not creative people. They're not coming from a good place. So they're just desperate for attention. They're insecure men desperate to be taken seriously because they don't have the goods to make it in a true meritocracy. So all they want to do is smash things out of their own frustrations over their limitations. Right? And so we intimidate them, we scare them. Never forget that.
- [51:26]
B
Well, I'm going to leave it at that. Thank you so much for coming today, Andrea. Thank you for sharing all your thoughts with us. I am so, so grateful for your insight. And please tell people how they can follow your work moving forward and obviously perhaps your international news work moving forward as well. But right Now, Gaslit Nation, etc. Tell us.
- [51:45]
A
Well, come find me on Blue sky and Mastodon and Spoutable. I'm hedging. I'm on all of them threads. So wherever you are, I am there. Just look up Andrea Chalupa and you'll find me.
- [51:58]
B
Perfect. And then they should listen to Gaslit Nation for now.
- [52:02]
A
Thank you. Yes, absolutely. So we're going to be covering all. So Gaslit Nation is not like the Martha Stewart of fighting authoritarianism. We make it a lifestyle. And so we're going to get through this. It's going to. We're going to have some dark moments and even darker ones, but ultimately we're going to prevail because we have no choice. And it's our turn now to show up for ourselves and show up for each other.
- [52:24]
B
Yeah. I always say, you know, you and I both have children. And I was like, your kids are so young. If you knew this was sort of coming, why would you have kids? You're like, because the future goes on. You know, like, that's the way you look at it. And I think we have to look at it like that. Like, okay, you and I are going to work really hard, but we're going to a far better word for the children that we brought into it. And that's not an impossibility. And if we. If we can go forward with that kind of positivity and hope, it will be contagious to other people and absolutely deadly irritating to the people who think they can just take it all.
- [52:55]
A
That is the goal, to be as irritating as possible. So I wanted to close by saying my mom and dad were born in World War II refugee camp. They spent their first five years or so in refugee camps. They had an amazing childhood. From their viewpoint. They had so much fun, like running through the forest, hunting for mushrooms. I'm sure their parents were stressed out and overwhelmed, and the future was so uncertain, and they had to take these big, smelly, dank ships all across the Atlantic Ocean. My God, to go to Boston Harbor, New York Harbor. What a nightmare that would have been as a parent. I couldn't have gone through that. But that's what my grandparents did. And so the world was a broken place and the Cold War was starting. It wasn't a time of peace. It was a time of growing tensions in the nuclear space race and nuclear war. And my dad remembered doing nuclear bomb drills in his classroom in New York City. And so humanity has been here before. Imagine when Kennedy was assassinated, when his brother was assassinated, when Martin Luther King was assassinated, when Malcolm X was assassinated. Like, this is America. And so we are, you know, especially as. As white women. Like, so it's up to us as white women, to help the groups that are in their crosshairs first, because we're up against actual Nazis, so we don't. So when we're old ladies and the history books are going to be written on this moment, they're going to look to white people like us and say, what did you do to protect others that were under attack? So that we have to, right now, in this moment, learn to live with ourselves, learn to be on the right side of history no matter what, because lives depend on it. Children depend on it. So that is our mission now.
- [54:36]
B
It's a good mission and like you said, it's not over. So that was the amazing Andrea Chalupa reminding us to inoculate ourselves from despair and fear. That fear is contagious, but so is courage. This isn't over, it's just the next phase. Trump is just a distraction of what a collection of behind the scenes, money grubbing, power seeking assholes have wanted for years. And we have to pull back the curtain and reveal them. Refuse to submit to the tactics of this administration, make them famous for their bad behavior, mock them, deride them, get in their way and have fun doing it. We have to fight back every single time these people attack our institutions, our laws, our people. And while they may be our enemy, the real enemy is normalization. None of this is normal and we can never give them the victory of our thinking that it is. I want to thank Andrea for joining us and you for caring enough about this country to be here. Now go out and find your light because we are going to need it. Until next week. PG Out. If you are a premium member of this podcast then I want to thank you because it's going to be more important than ever to support independent media moving forward. One of the reasons this election went the way it was was because the right wing media ecosystem was so powerful and so well funded that they were able to shape the mindset of a fair amount of this nation. Our side just didn't invest in independent voices and if you are not a member of our premium channel, please consider doing so now by going to politicsgirl.com and signing up. I cannot do this work without your help. I can't tell the truth if I'm nowhere out there to do it. And the beauty of signing up for this podcast is that you get the whole thing ad free, but also you get the information as it comes directly to your inbox. So even if my work is silenced on social media channels, you will still get it. We need people to support us now more than ever and I really hope that you will join us. Politicsgirl.com.