NO KINGS! A Conversation with Indivisible’s Ezra Levin

Summary

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The PoliticsGirl Podcast

Episode: NO KINGS! A Conversation with Indivisible’s Ezra Levin
Date: October 21, 2025
Host: Leigh McGowan
Guest: Ezra Levin (Co-founder and Executive Director, Indivisible)

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Episode Overview

In this powerful episode, Leigh McGowan welcomes back Ezra Levin to discuss the explosive success and meaning of the “No Kings” rallies—the largest peaceful protest in American history. Together, they break down how the movement came to be, the joyful character of the events, the regime’s inability to comprehend popular opposition, and why mass protest and active participation are essential to preserving democracy. The conversation explores media erasure, right-wing propaganda, movement-building tactics, and what must happen next to ensure this moment results in lasting change.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Historic Context & Growth of the “No Kings” Movement

• The “No Kings” rallies represent unprecedented grassroots action, mobilizing millions across the United States and abroad.
• Indivisible, initially started in response to Trump’s first election, has grown into a coalition of nearly 300 organizations, uniting unions, civil rights groups, and local activists.

Ezra Levin [02:07]:
"The largest protest in the first Trump term was Families Belong Together... 750 events. This time with No Kings 2 in June, we had 2100 events and 5 million people. And on Saturday, we had 7 million people out at more than 2700 events... It is, without any caveats, the largest peaceful protest in American history."

2. Atmosphere and Significance at the Rallies

• Contrary to right-wing fearmongering, rallies were joyful, hopeful, and community-driven, with creative costumes, humor, and a strong sense of togetherness.
• The diversity and sheer size of the movement—rural, urban, small towns—show the cross-cutting nature of opposition to authoritarian overreach.

Leigh McGowan [04:49]:
"This is not the Trump era. This is the no Kings era. He's just living in it."

Ezra Levin [03:28]:
"The vibes were immaculate... It was joyful. There were people who were just so pleased to be in community with each other... It was this sense—gosh, it feels schmaltzy just talking about it—of hope…"

3. Debunking Right-Wing and Media Narratives

• The regime’s attempted smear—calling protesters “violent” or “Marxist terrorists”—was undercut by the peaceful, festive scenes.
• Media (mainstream and right-wing) either ignored or minimized coverage, attempting to erase the event’s impact. Right-wing circles even claimed protests “never happened.”
• The importance of actively mythologizing and sharing the real story is stressed as essential democratic defense.

Ezra Levin [06:51]:
"The main argument they had was that we were going to be violent. And we have done everything we could over the last eleven months... I believe, to my knowledge, there was one arrest... It was a woman dressed up in a large penis costume with a sign that said 'no dictators.' That was it."

Ezra Levin [08:21]:
"If you're scanning right-wing circles now...the line of attack is it never happened. They're trying to figure out how they can be the target of the largest peaceful protest in American history. Well, the answer is, 'We weren't. It never occurred.'"

4. Welcoming Disaffected Conservatives & Coalition-Building

• Focus on welcoming those who feel betrayed by broken regime promises, urging unity on anti-authoritarian principles, not uniformity on policy.
• Highlighting the contrast between pro-democracy signs of the rallies and the "leader cult" shouting of counter-protesters.

Ezra Levin [16:52]:
"We don't need to agree on everything. If we agree on everything, we need a bigger crowd that doesn't agree on everything. What we need to agree on is we don't do kings in America."

Leigh McGowan [15:28]: (paraphrasing an attendee’s son)
"'They're not really for anything...they are only there for the cult of the leader.' And I think that's a contrast we also have to make."

5. Movement Structure and Participatory Democracy

• Indivisible’s decentralized approach has empowered ordinary citizens, not “knights in shining armor,” to create change.
• The rallies were organized by everyday Americans across the nation; activism has to be participatory and local.

Ezra Levin [22:25]:
"Politics is too important to be left to the politicians...If we want this democracy to work, we can't let them divide us and isolate us and make us feel powerless. We have to take our power, which is ours, and organize it."

6. Protest as Tactic, Not Endgame

• Protests are necessary but not sufficient; they must be stepping stones to sustained, diversified action.
• Citing historian Heather Cox Richardson, they discuss how artful, music-filled activism fuels courage and community resilience under authoritarian threat.

Ezra Levin [25:57]:
"A protest is a tactic. A tactic ought to be one of many...If that's all we do, we will fail."

7. Response from the Regime: Ridicule and Threats

• Trump and surrogates respond with offensive, AI-generated video memes, mocking and demeaning protesters, further revealing regime priorities.
• Mainstream media fails to cover the regime’s disrespect and anti-democratic rhetoric, granting them impunity.

Ezra Levin [33:09]:
"They so clearly were upset at seeing a historic peaceful protest that all they could do was lash out with these ridiculous videos."

• Counter events, like the Camp Pendleton military demonstration, serve as propaganda and intimidation, reinforcing “bro culture” and disrespect for American democratic norms.

8. Next Steps for the Movement

• Emphasis on not allowing the narrative to be rewritten—keep the truth alive.
• Indivisible and coalition groups plan to escalate action: supporting threatened institutions, deploying economic pressure, and rapidly mobilizing to protect democracy.
• An upcoming national call (referenced in episode for October 21) to strategize the movement’s immediate future.

Ezra Levin [39:22]:
"Do not allow them to propagandize, do not allow them to act as if it didn't occur...We're going to have to respond to the overreach from this regime."

9. The Power of Community Solidarity

• Lasting change comes from continued, collective participation. Ezra rejects the “hero” model, instead embracing grassroots, leaderful action.
• Every new participant, first-time protester or committed organizer, makes the coalition stronger and gives democracy a fighting chance.

Ezra Levin [42:42]:
"There’s more of us, and we’re all leading it. I am not the leader of this movement. There are thousands upon thousands of people who put together these protests…That’s success, y’all. That’s the dream."

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Ezra Levin on Movement Building:
  "If we agree on everything, we need a bigger crowd that doesn’t agree on everything." [00:22]

• On Joy as Resistance:
  "This was joyful. There were people just so pleased to be in community...celebrating our First Amendment rights...It was this sense—gosh, it feels schmaltzy just talking about it—of hope." [03:28]

• On Right-Wing Denial:
  "Put your fingers in your ears, close your eyes and just say ‘la la la la la’ and hope that everybody forgets about it. We're not going to let them do it." [11:20]

• On the Regime’s Response:
  "They so clearly were upset at seeing a historic peaceful protest that all they could do was lash out with these ridiculous videos." [33:09]

• On Participatory Change:
  "Politics is what we do. It is a participatory sport." [22:25]

• On Leadership:
  "I'm not the leader of this movement. There are thousands upon thousands of people...That's success, y'all. That's the dream." [42:42]

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Important Segment Timestamps

• [02:07] – Ezra describes the scale of the No Kings rally and its place in protest history
• [03:28] – Vibes and atmosphere at the DC event, contrast with regime rhetoric
• [06:51] – On the movement’s commitment to nonviolence and humor (the “giant penis costume” anecdote)
• [08:21] – Right-wing attempts to erase or minimize the protest’s reality
• [15:28] – Protester contrasts between pro-democracy messages and cult-like counter-protesters
• [16:52] – Welcoming disaffected conservatives with a unifying message: “we don’t do kings in America”
• [21:32] – The coalition size and grassroots organization behind the movement
• [22:25] – The importance of participatory democracy and local engagement
• [25:57] – Protests as one element in a larger strategy for change (citing Heather Cox Richardson)
• [33:09] – Regime’s lashing out with insulting AI-generated videos, media’s lack of coverage
• [37:21] – The strategic importance of ridicule versus fear when confronting authoritarianism
• [39:22] – Next steps for the movement, upcoming organizing call at NoKings.org
• [42:42] – Ezra’s closing reflection on collective leadership and inclusivity

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Further Resources & Calls to Action

• Find/Get Involved:

  • nokings.org — Join organizing calls and connect with the movement
  • indivisible.org — Find or start a local Indivisible group

• Stay Informed:

  • Support alternative, independent media for accurate movement coverage
  • Follow and share stories from rallies to combat erasure and propaganda

• What Comes Next:

  • Continue growing the movement, diversify tactics beyond street protest (economic pressure, institutional campaigns, rapid mobilization)
  • Build community and solidarity, encourage participation beyond “hero” narratives

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Summary Conclusion

This episode is both a celebration and a sober reminder: winning back democracy is possible, but only through the joyful, persistent, and strategic action of millions—ordinary people, united by the conviction that America does not do kings. As propaganda and gaslighting ramp up, the fight must move from the streets to the institutions, from protest to coordinated, diverse resistance. The message is clear: the American people are not just showing up; they are leading, and their numbers—and courage—are only growing.

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Transcript

[Ezra Levin]

There are a lot of even Trump voters from the last election who are souring on him, who feel betrayed because he did not promise Project 2025. He didn't promise this agenda. They're seen. He promised lower prices of eggs and bread and to make their lives better. And instead, he's doing a golden ballroom instead. He's invading American cities. Where the hell is this coming from? And it's our job to welcome those people to these rallies, to welcome those peoples into these side. We don't have to agree on everything. And if we agree on everything, we need a bigger crowd that doesn't agree on everything.

[Lee McGowan]

We.

[Ezra Levin]

What we need to agree on is we don't do kinks in America. And we're moving beyond this period, that this era that we're living through is temporary, and we will be replaced by one of accountability and reform. And that's right around the corner.

[Lee McGowan]

Hello, and welcome to the Politics Girl podcast. I'm your host, Lee McGowan. Let's get into it. Well, last weekend was the second no Kings rally, and it was a complete success. To break down how it went, what comes next, and why we need to keep getting out there in the streets, even when our president wants to literally shit on us, I am joined by the organizer of the event, Ezra Levin, the co founder and executive director of Indivisible. Ezra started Indivisible with his wife, Leah Greenberg, with the vision of a real democracy, of, by and for the people. It was founded in response to Trump's first election, knowing that he was a symptom of a Sikh democracy and not the cause. Since then, it has become an incredible grassroots movement of thousands of local groups across the nation with the mission to elect progressive leaders, rebuild democracy, and defeat the Trump agenda. So, without further ado, please welcome my guest, one of GQ's 50 most powerful people in Trump's Washington, number two on POLITICO's list of top thinkers, doers and visionaries, and the co founder and executive director of Indivisible, Ezra Levin. Welcome back, Ezra.

[Ezra Levin]

Hey, great to see you.

[Lee McGowan]

Oh, my gosh. Thank you for coming. What a weekend we just had as one of the main visionaries of the no Kings rallies. Give me your thoughts on how you're feeling right now and how you think it all went.

[Ezra Levin]

I am exhilarated. I am exhausted. I am elated. What are other e words? I. It was incredible. It was incredible. I mean, some context. So the largest protest in the first Trump term was families belonging together. Incredible, powerful, meaningful events. 750 events. All over the country. It was great. And also we roughly doubled that with Hands off in April. We then almost doubled Hands off with no Kings 2 in June. That was 2100 events and 5 million people. And then on Saturday, we had 7 million people out at more than 2700 events. It is, without any caveats, the largest peaceful protest in American history. I feel great.

[Lee McGowan]

I think that is so awesome. I mean, listen, I went to the official Hollywood event that started at noon in la, and then my husband and I moved downtown to the event that started there at 2. And there were so many other events happening in the city that weren't even part of the official count. So I wouldn't be surprised as you guys go along that those numbers keep going up. You know, like, it really feels amazing because I know that if you look at this, this is the largest coordinated protest of the Trump era. You spoke at that event, which was kind of the key event in Washington with Senator Bernie Sanders, Senator Chris Murphy, so many civilian rights groups. Can you tell me about what it felt like there in dc?

[Ezra Levin]

I mean, overwhelming in the best of ways. So we had 200,000 people out in D.C. which was double what we saw for Hands off back when we had a DC rally. The vibes were immaculately, is what I say. This was anything but what Mike Johnson was describing as, you know, he spent the 10 days leading up to this talking about, oh, they are violent communists, blood in the streets. Oh my gosh, it's going to be messy and gnarly. And it was joyful, right? It was joyful. There were people who were just so pleased to be in community with each other and celebrating our First Amendment rights and doing it in hilarious ways and inflated costumes and funny signs and wiener dogs and, and children and grandparents. And like, it was just, it was this sense. Gosh, it feels schmaltzy just talking about it's sense of hope that. Wait a minute. This image of America that the regime is painting of this division and this hatred and this darkness, where was that? I didn't see it on Saturday. What I saw were Americans in, in rural areas and suburban areas and city centers, all under one big banner, proudly coming out together. So it lifted my spirits and I think it lifted the spirits a lot of people out there and gave us a vision for what's to come.

[Lee McGowan]

What.

[Ezra Levin]

Which is, this is not the Trump era. This is the no Kings era. He's just living in it.

[Lee McGowan]

I love that. I love that. And that's the thing. I mean, like, people kept saying to me well, like, what's the point of protesting if. If he. If the government doesn't listen? I mean, in the. In the past, like, if you protested, it was your government would listen to you and maybe change would be made. But when you know that your government is absolutely not listening to you, and on top of that, they're going to lie about why you're there, they're going to lie about who you are, they're going to try. And like you said, Mike Johnson and crew, by the way, all spent 10 full days with a coordinated effort to say we were Marxist terrorists, leftist antifa murderers who were gonna be out there. And then, like you said, we're seeing a bunch of twerking, you know, unicorns and frogs, you know, and then, like children. And it was just. It was such an amazing contrast to what we had been painted as. And I think it's also very important for how the world looks at us, because I'm sure the world looks at us right now like they've gone insane. They're everything we said they were gonna be. You know, they're everything that we've always said, America is the infidel. America is greedy, America is gross, America is loud. And then you see all these people enjoy, you go, okay, well, maybe not all of America. And when there's that many people coming out, it's really quite amazing. I. I'm thinking of that standout visual of the human formed no Kings banner in San Francisco on the beach. You know, it was just so many people coming together, not just to. To protest, not just to rally, not just to be in community, but to build something with their bodies that said, like, this is what we're doing. It was the opposite of the Terrorism Hate America rally that we were told it was going to be. And in fact, I thought it was very interesting because there was like major cope in real time as it was happening. And I'm sure you saw that too. Like, you know, they went from you guys are terrorists and you're pro Hamas to like, well, this is just a bunch of old white people, like, who really cares about these people? And I thought, that's a hell of a cope trying to switch the narrative halfway through.

[Ezra Levin]

The main argument they had was that we were going to be violent. And we did everything that we could and have done everything we could over the course of the last 11 months of building up an insistent but nonviolent resistance force to this regime. And it showed on Saturday, I believe, to my knowledge, there was one arrest of a protester in. In 2700 events on Saturday. It was a woman dressed up in a large penis costume with a sign that said no dictators. That was it. That was it.

[Lee McGowan]

Can we talk about that? Because like six, six police officers took her down. They like jumped her. So then it was a bunch of cops like attacking a giant dick. It was really the funniest thing. Like, even, even if she got arrested and she's like, oh, this is a total drag, like, those images will last forever. And I just feel like that is kind of sort of the important point here. Like, Americans still have a sense of humor. We still have joy, we still have hope. You know, like, we're not as bad as isis, right? And we're either as bad as ISIS or we're near death. Senior citizens, right? And like, then I thought, well, what's your problem with old people anyway? Like, that is these are the people that originally, you know, marched for civil rights, for women's rights. They're back out here in the streets again because you blew it again and you should be supporting those people. And yet they're mocking them for being out there with their walkers there.

[Ezra Levin]

They, I think the cope is real, as you pointed out. And the, if you're scanning right wing circles now, which unfortunately I've done, some of what you see them circling around is a line of attack against this, which is it never happened. They want to erase that it even happened, that it was made up, that the image you see are from a different time or that not very many people came out because they spent so much time saying this was going to be a violent and a disaster and nobody was going to show then to actually see what it looked like. They're trying to figure out how can we be the target of the largest peaceful protest in American history. Well, the answer is we weren't. It never occurred. What you saw was imaginary or made up. Which means we have to do a really good job celebrating this win. That's not just to make ourselves feel good. That's, that's for democracy. We need to make sure everybody understands what we just successfully pulled off on Saturday. We need to mythologize it, we need to storytell about it, we need to celebrate it. So one of the key things that folks can do in the coming days is make sure everybody knows what just happened. Do not let them propagandize you into forgetting what we've done. We are going to build to be even bigger in the future. But, but we've got to celebrate this win right now.

[Lee McGowan]

Yeah. And I think we should point out that a lot of mainstream news organizations, abc, NBC, cbs, New York Times, they all downplayed it or didn't even put stuff up. It was really shocking how we could spend two weeks talking about, you know, the violent death of a podcaster who was. It took over the news for two full weeks. And then you have this event and it's like, oh, right under the radar. No one's going to talk about it because like you said, this is the only way that they can kind of handle what happened. Because it wasn't just in blue cities, it was in deep red areas. It was in Birmingham, Alabama, and like Billings, Montana. I saw this incredibly moving video of a small. A march in like a really small Wyoming town. And they had actually marched all the way down their main street together behind a banner. And there was one folk singers standing on the stage where they were all going to end up. And she was singing this land is your land, like really sweetly and quietly as the entire march came up. And she said, I've never been so moved because my town is small, my town is red. And here were 10,000 people coming towards me as I sang about the love of my country. And I think, like, yeah, man, that's what we need to be celebrating. That's what we need to be putting out. Because there were international events on this. There were. There were events in other countries of the world. So don't tell us it didn't happen, because it certainly didn't. It might not be being presented by American media, but it certainly was in the uk. It was in Spain, it was all over the place. And I think it's really, really important. And I should point out that in the UK they just tweaked it to say no tyrants, because they quite like their royalty over there. But they were like, we know what the Americans are saying and let's help them out.

[Ezra Levin]

Yeah, we see that in other places with actual monarchies who wanted to participate against tyrants. I love the local leadership here and the local branding. I think that they are going to try to act like this didn't happen, but they're not going to succeed. It was too meaningful to too many people and it is part of a trend. 3 million, 5 million, 7 million. It will be bigger next. And I think they are scrambling. They're between a rock and a hard place. Their approval ratings are in the toilet. This shutdown they have no way out of. The American people don't support what they are doing to the country. They don't like that. Their insurance premiums are going to go up. They don't like their cities are being invaded and occupied. They they don't like the secret police force that they are currently recruiting for through Spotify ads and Hulu ads. They don't like what is happening now. And so Republicans are trying to figure out how they message about it. And the best thing the brilliant minds in the Republican messaging strategy space have figured it out. Put your fingers in your ears, close your eyes and just say la la la la la and hope that everybody forgets about it. We're not going to let them do it. We're not going to let them do it because there are more of us than there are of them. We're going to win.

[Lee McGowan]

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[Ezra Levin]

We're not going to let them do it. We're not going to let them do it because there are more of us than there are of them. We're going to win.

[Lee McGowan]

Yeah, nothing to see here. Like it's a bit ridiculous that they went from violent terrorist meetings to it never even happened. I saw someone looking at the pictures of all of the people that came out in Boston, which is really quite a shot because they were in the commons and someone said this is an old picture from 2017 from the Boston Marathon. And like just so many people from Massachusetts and Boston got on the Internet and they were like, no, it's not. No one gathers in the commons after the marathon. We all go to drink in bars. Like, this is today. I was there, you know, and I find it really fascinating. And I was listening to one man talk about how something his son noticed when they were out at a rally in Chicago and his son was looking around because there were some Trump supporters yelling at them. There were these counter protesters and he said, I don't understand. Like our signs say why we're here, right? Like our signs say protect our neighbors or anti ice or pro democracy or pro trans or whatever somebody was marching for that day, Whatever. Someone was there with their, like, main idea. And he said, these hecklers are just screaming, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump. And the son was like, they're not really for anything. Right. They're not, they're not saying, oh, pro tariffs or you know, let's kill the farms or build that ballroom. Right. Like, they're not there for that. They are only there for the cult of the leader and everything they stand for is just him. And I think that's a contrast we also have to make.

[Ezra Levin]

Absolutely. And this is also a regime leader who has not been more unpopular than he is now. He is a lame duck unpopular president on leading a deeply unpopular agenda that the American public is rejecting. So I, I, I don't think we're going to win over all maggots to our side. I don't think that's in the cards. They're going to be a relatively small but meaningful contingent of the public that will never distance themselves from Donald Trump, but we don't need them in order to win. There are a lot of even Trump voters who, from the last election who are souring on him, who feel betrayed because he did not promise Project 2025. He didn't promise this agenda they're seeing. He promised lower prices of eggs and bread and to make their lives better. And instead he's doing a golden ballroom instead. He's invading American cities. Where the hell is this coming from? And it's our job to welcome those people to these rallies, to welcome those people into these side. We don't have to agree on everything. And if we agree on everything, we need a bigger crowd that doesn't agree on everything. What we need to agree on is we, we don't do kings in America and we're moving beyond this period, that this era that we're living through is temporary and we will be replaced by one of accountability and reform. And that's right around the corner. And that's not even a message to Donald Trump. That's not a message to Mike Johnson. That's not a message to the Magas. That's a message to everybody outside this regime trying to understand where is this country going and which side of history should I be on. We get to send that message and we send it to in the clearest, biggest, loudest, most boisterous possible way on Saturday.

[Lee McGowan]

Oh, Ezra, that's such a nice way to put it. Honestly, like, by the time Sean and I got downtown and I should probably Point out that Sean was wearing a giant bald eagle mask that took up his whole head and then was wearing like a USA T shirt and like, basically looked like a cowboy but an eagle. And like everyone was taking pictures with him because they were like, eagle, let's go. You know, like, there was a lot of like this kind of passionate patriotism that people want to feel again, like, we still love America. We know that America is being taken over, but we still love it. And it doesn't matter what they try and pitch to us, because I should point out today, you and I are talking Monday morning, the headlines are right now, we're saying that Carolyn Levitt is officially announcing the launch of a large scale investigation to find out the person behind no Kings. And first of all, I'll say, here he is. You don't have to have a large scale investigation. But also, I thought it was Soros, I thought it was antifa. I thought it was, you know, the pro Hamas wing of the violent Democratic Party. Like, now they're going to launch an investigation. The whole thing seems ridiculous to me. And I just, I think that we need to play into that ridiculousness because I think people are very, very unimpressed with not only how he's running the country, but the choices he's making. Because it's not just the ballroom. There is now this ridiculously gigantic arch that's bigger than the Lincoln Memorial that he wants to build to himself. That has never been done. So saying we did a no Kings rally and then having this man, you know, maybe he's like, well, actually I want to be an emperor because this is what Napoleon built for himself. You know, like, we can't ignore that. And neither can Republican voters, and neither can some mega voters who are losing their farms or who are losing their health care or who are losing their rights in this country. And we have to keep reminding them that there is a place on the opposite side. And it doesn't mean we have to agree on every issue. It means that we have to agree that this is not America and we are not for what's happening.

[Ezra Levin]

And the good news for us and the scary news for the regime is they can come after me, they can come after Soros, they can come after some Democratic politician. This was led by thousands of normal, everyday Americans who are pissed off and not putting up with this authoritarian overreach. That's who's leading this. Who orchestrated. Go look in general, California. Go look in rural North Dakota. Go look in Hays County, Texas, where I'm from. There were Three events. It's normal people who are rising up peacefully but forcefully to say we're not putting up with this any longer. And that's, that's an enemy they can't actually attack because they can't come after all of us. There are just too many.

[Lee McGowan]

Yeah, I mean one thing that somebody pointed out, and I'll read it from Heather Cox Richardson later because I thought she made a really clear point. But I should point out as you're saying this, that Indivisible doesn't work alone. You know what I mean? The no Kings idea comes from your organization, but there's a whole coalition, a network of, I mean, what is it, at least 200 progressive organizations?

[Ezra Levin]

It's nearly 300, nearly 300 organizations. The unions like AFT, other grassroots groups like 5051 and move on good government groups, Public Citizen, ACLU. This is a huge coalition of folks who is part of this and then an even huger coalition of grassroots organizers. Normal everyday Americans putting it together.

[Lee McGowan]

Yeah, and I also know that there's a number of democratic groups who had marches and events but can't even be counted in the official numbers because Indivisible doesn't work with political parties. Right, but you've created this movement of thousands of group leaders, you know, just working together in regular action in their communities against this kind of very destructive regime. And I think people need to know that, that it's not just one group, one donor, one person. This is Americans coming together to work together for a better America.

[Ezra Levin]

I mean that, that's the whole theory, right? We, we believe that politics is too important to be left to the politicians and that if we're going to have a democracy, we do, if we're going to have a democracy, we can't just consume, consume, consume. Look, it's important to be informed. It's important to know who's out there doing work and what bills are up and what the immediate threat is in Congress or in your state legislature. I mean that is all useful, but politics is what we do. It is a participatory sport. And if we want this democracy to work, we can't let them divide us and isolate us and make us feel powerless. We have to take our power, which is ours, and and organize it. And so I don't think this thing succeeds in any form of top down structure. The only way it succeeds is if all of us figure out a way to participate meaningfully. Maybe that means joining your local indivisible group or a local working families party or local sunrise or Other local organizing home. I actually look, I'm with indivisible, so I like indivisible, but I don't particularly care. I want you organizing wherever you, you feel that you are home. And I have a faith that good things will flow from that. We are going to have a better democracy if you get engaged. But that means at some point turning off the tv, closing the computer and meeting face to face with fellow Americans in your community to figure out what the hell we do.

[Lee McGowan]

Which is one of the beauties of these rallies, you know, because you're out in the street with tons of other Americans that aren't like you. People taking photos together, people cheering together, people singing together. And that wouldn't necessarily be the people that you would hang out with on a daily basis. And I think it's great reminder of the country as a whole and who we are and what we actually look like. I think it's fascinating. I'm now I'm going to read you what I think Heather Cox Richardson put so brilliantly because she wrote it this morning and I was like, oh, I have to read this to Ezra. And she said there are people saying, what's the point? The government doesn't care what they're going to do and they're going to lie about it anyway. So she comes in and she says in her most recent letters to an American, which I think people should go and read and subscribe to, she said, how much difference will the no Kings Day protests, even as big as they were, make in the face of the administration's attempt to get rid of our democratic political system and replace it with authoritarianism? What good is an inflatable frog against federal agents? Scholars of social movements note that large fun marches full of art and music expand connections and make people more willing to take risks against growing state power. They build larger communities by creating new images that bring together recognizable images from the past, but in new ways, helping more people see themselves in such an opposition. The community and good feelings those gatherings develop help carry opposition through hard moments. And then she notes that yesterday when on Saturday every single rally, including the ones in small towns, were bigger than the surrounding police force available. That that kind of image is very important because if you are demonstrating social coherence against a fascist government and it's makeshift Gestapo, it is those numbers that are important to remember that concept of there are more of us than them. And if we really, truly want a peaceful, law abiding democracy, we're actually on the side of the scale that should be much More weighted.

[Ezra Levin]

I couldn't say it better than Heather, obviously, because she's brilliant and ridiculously knowledgeable about American history and social movements. I would say I. I have noted that some of the conversation in, in the left, in the democratic ecosystem, and I think some people play up protests too much and some people underplay protests too much. A protest is a tactic. A tactic ought to be one of many tactics that fit into an overarching strategy. And that strategy ought to help you achieve your goal. I think this was a brilliantly successful tactic. And if that's all we do, we will fail. We have to build from this in the way that Heather is talking, that how do you build the kind of communities that aren't just providing support to each other, but are looking for opportunities to take action beyond this? And so I think it begs the question, where do we go next from this? What is next for no Kings? It's yes, there will be A no Kings 3, yes, we will march in big numbers again. But how are we confronting the regime? How are we pushing leaders who might otherwise capitulate in the near term? Disney is really instructive. I think that was an example of how a mass movement in response to Kimmel being fired, in response to the regime putting pressure on an institution came together immediately, provided countervailing pressure, and, and suddenly we won. You can look across the ecosystem right now at universities, at businesses, at media institutions, they are all being threatened. We need to be a force that shows up for democracy and makes clear to them, you got to stand with us. This is a time to choose sides. You should be choosing our side now, but we got to do that in a rapid response way. I think successful movements don't just get bigger. We are getting bigger. They don't just get more unified, we are getting more unified. They don't just reduce the, the popularity of the regime. It is less popular than it was before. They also diversify their tactics. They mature and they grow and they experiment. We got to do that. We got to move forward beyond no Kings too. As incredible and exciting, as historic as it was, we got to build more and we got to ask more of people, not less of them. They are now comfortable showing up at a protest. Great. What are you comfortable boycotting? What kind of community group are you comfortable getting together? Are you going to show up in mass the next time a specific institution gets pushed by the regime and they need to find their courage? We've got to do that. And I think what we show is we've got the numbers, we Just got to organize it now.

[Lee McGowan]

Absolutely. And listen, before we talk about what comes next for you guys at Indivisible, I would like to talk a little bit about the White House's response to these rallies because it was so kind of shocking to me, honestly, and I don't know why I can still be shocked. I really don't. You've probably heard about our next sponsor, irestore on TV. It's an @ home hair regrowth system, clinically proven to help regrow hair using 300 lasers and 200 LEDs that send light therapy directly into your scalp from the comfort of your own home. So if you have thinning hair and you would rather have healthier, fuller hair, Irestore Elite is for you. I got one for my husband. Sean's in his late 40s and he's in great, great shape, but he is conscious that his hairline is creeping back and he does not like it. So he's now just popping on the Iristore while we're watching a movie or while he's working from home and allowing science to do its thing. And this is science. The Irestore is the most advanced hair regrowth technology because it's equipped with trademarked Vixo lasers that feature wider beams of red light so they cover more scalp and surface area which increases follicle stimulation for better and more consistent results. In a four month double blind clinical study performed by a board certified dermatologist and laser surgeon, nearly every participant saw an increase in hair growth with the Irestore laser and LED technology. And they stand by what they can do, which is why irestore offers a 12 month money back guarantee so you can try it completely risk free. If your hair doesn't make a glorious return, they will give you a full refund. No awkward questions, just fuller, healthier hair or your money back. So get yourself the gift of hair confidence For a limited time only. Our listeners are getting a huge discount on their Irestore Elite. When you use the code [e-mail] head over to irestore and use the Code Politics Girl for our show's exclusive discount on the Irestore Elite. And as always, if they ask, please support, support the show and tell them that we sent you. I'm telling you that I understand that hair loss is incredibly frustrating, but now there is something you can do with Irestore. The Politics Girl podcast is now sponsored by Parallel. Parallel are doctor Made vitamins for women at every stage of their lives. Instead of just having women continue to take this one size fits all Vitamin Parallel is reinventing vitamins from the ground up. The first obgyn founded vitamin C company Parallel is defining a new era of women's health, one where supplements understand your hormones and your stage of life. Parallel creates targeted nutrition for every phase. Menstrual health, fertility, pregnancy, postpartum perimenopausal. It's products made by people who understand the people they're making it for. A vitamin company for women founded by actual doctors who specialize in women's health. So go to their website and check out if Parallel is right for you. There's a reason Glossy called it the wellness brand of the year because why shouldn't your supplements change as your life changes? Why shouldn't you have targeted support for every stage you find yourself in? Made with bioavailable ingredients your body can actually absorb, all powders are safe for pregnancy and breastfeeding, but designed for all stages of life. They even have daily powders that include protein, electrolytes and help with sleep support exclusive to our listeners Right now, new customers can enjoy 20% off their first order with the Code Politics Girl when they visit parallel health.com that's p e r e l e l health.com code politics girl I I would like to talk a little bit about the White House's response to these rallies because it was so kind of shocking to me, honestly, and I don't know why I can still be shocked. I really don't. I was speaking earlier about the right wing cope with the well, everyone is old and decrepit anyway so why do we have to care that attempted a narrat But J.D. vance posted an AI video of Trump being crowned the King juxtaposed with the Democrats kneeling during the BLM protests as if they were all bowing to King Trump. And then Trump himself posted this AI generated video on True Social which showed him in a crown flying a jet labeled King Trump, literally dumping a payload of shit on all of the protesters. And the whole thing was obviously disgusting, but beyond unpresidential, so disrespectful to the First Amendment, to the American people. And I found that both videos, both responses from the President and the Vice President were not only humiliating for the country, but that this is our leaders and this is how they behave. But it was just so indicative of what this type of leadership is really offering us, which is kind of this weird bro looking out for ourselves like there are perpetual trolls rather than leaders.

[Ezra Levin]

I agree with everything you've just said and I think Donald Trump. J.D. vance. This regime has showed us who they are repeatedly. My 2 Responses to this were Less, less absolute shock that look at them do the most disgusting thing they possibly could do and more. One, this seemed like a real life version of that meme. And another thing, don't say I was mad. I wasn't mad. Don't put in the paper I was mad. They so clearly were upset at seeing a historic peaceful protest that all they could do was lash out with these ridiculous videos. But then the second thing is just how much of a failure establishment media has been covering this regime and covering how they operate in the world. Because I, I'm glad that we're talking about these videos and I think we should note exactly how disgusting and unprecedential and embarrassing they are at a global scale. But where, where's the New York Times talking about this? How, how many think pieces were written when Hillary Clinton said deplorables about the Macca and that was a word she said, a defensible, accurate word that she said. And Donald Trump can tweet a video of himself as king attacking peaceful protesters and dumping shit on them and the New York Times doesn't cover it. What world are we living in? Why is that acceptable? Why do we treat. It's not even just a both sides thing. He gets a pass, the regime gets a pass. And it just demonstrates to me how important it is for us to support, give our eyeballs, give our subscriptions, give our money to alternate sources of media in this country. Because the establishment media is not going to cover in the full breadth and depth what is actually happening.

[Lee McGowan]

Yeah, it's quite shocking, honestly. Like I really couldn't believe that no one was talking about it. And like you said, Trump gets a pass. But it's also like, but we've come to this point where it doesn't matter what he does because people say, oh, it's just Trump being Trump. You're like, he's the President of the United States. Like we had a month long heart attack when Barack Obama wore a tan suit. You know what I mean? Like, this is insane that we have come to a level now that everything he does is excused because it's him. And I think we have to be really clear that it's not just these silly memes. It's not just him being a disgusting pig saying things like grab women by the pussy, which we also just zoomed by. It is things like JD Vance and Pete Hegseth doing a counter event on the same day as no Kings. This High profile military demonstration at Camp Pendleton, ostensibly for the Marine Corps 250th anniversary. But I mean, it was really a counter protest, really. And California had to close the i5. And if you don't live in California, that is a huge 8 to 10 sometimes lane freeway for the safety of the people, because they were going to fire live rounds over the freeway. And to be clear, it was Governor Newsom who closed the freeway for the safety of the American people. And one of those rounds detonated too soon and ended up damaging one of the VP's own security cars. And I was like, unbelievable. Because the only thing I heard from that event was this big show of JD And Hegseth pointing out that they're going to give the military their outstanding paychecks because the Democrats closed the government, which we all know isn't true. They're using our military for propaganda. They're using their lies about the shutdown for propaganda. But they also then said that they were going to give them their paychecks because otherwise every bar in San Diego was going to go bankrupt. And I was like, did they just call our entire military a bunch of drunks? Like, everything is disrespectful. Everything is a joke. Everything is this weird bro culture where we don't take ourselves seriously anymore. And I think one of the beauties of the no Kings rally was that here are people not taking themselves too seriously in their inflatable costumes, but who take America and what it's supposed to stand for seriously. Do you see the juxtaposition of that?

[Ezra Levin]

Well, absolutely. Look, the regime can afford to be feared. It wants to be feared. It wants.

[Lee McGowan]

It needs to be feared. It needs to be feared.

[Ezra Levin]

It does not want to be ridiculed. That is a threat to it. If a lot of people feel comfortable enough in their own power to make fun of the regime to show up in a ridiculous costume in opposition to National Guard or ICE troops out there terrorizing their communities, that bursts the bubble. It jumbles the whole thing. Because the image they want is we are at war with each other. That's what they want us to believe, that Portland is exploding in violence, that Chicago cannot be saved unless MAGA comes in with troops from Texas to save it. And it's going to be a bloody battle, a confrontation. So to show up taking seriously our First Amendment rights and doing it in a way that doesn't give them what they want, I think is strategically brilliant. It is brilliant. I think that is the way to confront this regime. It is peaceful. It is with ridicule and it is with mass numbers that as much as they might try cannot be ignored.

[Lee McGowan]

Yeah, it's very hard to make your gaslighting stick when all of the images do not coincide with what you're trying to tell people. So listen, no matter how successful these events were, the right clearly has no designs to stop doubling down on their propaganda. I know that Mike Johnson is still saying that these protests indicate the rise of Marxism in the Democratic Party. And he said the protests were not about people, but about a dangerous ideology, this anti American ideology that goes against everything we stand for. I don't know who the we is and everything we stand for is there because I don't know who he thinks the First Amendment is for, but it's for we the people. But I think we need to know what comes next. So you were talking about lots of different things that comes next, that we have to diversify our tactics. So tell us, for you, for indivisible, what comes next? Because I know you're hosting a call on Tuesday, October 21st. What's the plan for that? How can people join? What's the next steps?

[Ezra Levin]

So check out no kings.org to join that call. We have more than a hundred thousand people coming in for it. We're going to be talking about what we do now as a movement in the immediate aftermath of this. And part of this is going to be to submit this win. Do not allow them to propagandize, do not allow them to act as if it didn't occur. And don't allow Mike Johnson to define what this was about. The banner said no Kings. It's not that hard to figure out what this was about. He opposes that. I understand he is supportive of monarchical rule. The that's his right as an American. He is allowed to support kingly rule. I think it's stupid and I think it's unpopular and I think he'll lose. But we're pretty clear about what we're about and we're pretty clear how many Americans showed up. Because it's the most Americans that have ever showed up for any day of protest in the history of the country. So coming out on Tuesday and being in community with all of us to talk about what the next steps are, I think is key. And yes, I do think there will be a no Kings the Third. But before that, we're going to have to respond to the overreach from this regime. And I think that's very clearly economic pressure and organized targeted campaigns against institutions that are being threatened we see some fight out there. We see some fight. We see universities starting to push back. We see even Disney responding to the pressure that we bring. We see individual businesses at the local level deciding not to support ICE and to support immigrants very, very clearly and publicly. These are steps in the right direction. When we build a mass movement, this doesn't just change overnight. This is a campaign where first we have 3 million, then we have 5 million, then we have 7 million. First we have Harvard University, then we have Princeton, then we have University of Texas, then we have others. First we have ABC News. We're going to get more, but we've got to do that work. And I think effective people powered movements do not just do the same thing again and again. That kind of tactical freeze, that kind of strategic thinking doesn't lead us to where we need to go. So we've got to grow and mature and try new things together. And that's going to happen in between the mass mobilizations that are in our future.

[Lee McGowan]

We have to do the thing that the country stopped doing in 73, which is evolve. We must change, we must grow, we must do more things. I think it's essential because, you know, you can't just stay doing one thing and like we've said, you know, a protest on itself, it becomes just a march if you're not asking for change, if you're not doing something. So I really just so appreciate you being here today, Ezra, and I so appreciate the work you do and not allowing us to be gaslit. And I so appreciate everyone. I want to tell people, and I'm sure you agree with me on this, everyone that came out on the weekend, everyone that supported in their own way, if they couldn't come out, who drove their car around and honked or who spoke to their friends or who highlighted what we were doing on social media. And like you're saying, we must just continue to do it as they try to mass gaslight us into saying it didn't happen. We have to keep doing that together as a team. Because yes, it will grow. But also we need to show these academic institutions and these law firms and these media companies that there are more of us than them and they should be more afraid of us than they are of this regime. Because ultimately, if they believe in their capitalism or they believe in their, you know, admissions or they believe in their clients, they're going to have to pick one or the other. And we want to say there's more of us here. Choose us. Choose America.

[Ezra Levin]

That's right. And just to Be clear. There's more of us, and we're all leading it. I am not the leader of this movement. There are thousands upon thousands of people who put together these protests on Saturday. And there are millions upon millions of people, many of whom never went to a protest before in their life, who decided this was the moment. That's success, y'. All. That's the dream that we are all figuring a way to participate ourselves. So by creating welcoming communities for people to be part of, and not just to donate or not just to sign a box, but actually to do the work of defending democracy. That's how we win, and that is exactly what we're building. So I do hope people come out on Tuesday to figure out how they can get plugged into the next steps.

[Lee McGowan]

And they do that by going to nokings.org and it'll give them all the information.

[Ezra Levin]

That's right, nokings.org how else can they.

[Lee McGowan]

Follow your work, Ezra, in the future, to support what no Kings is doing and to support what Indivisible is doing.

[Ezra Levin]

Go to Indivisible.org, you can sign up for our list. And more importantly, you can find your local indivisible group. There are 2,400 of them all around the country. There's probably one near you. If there's not, start an indivisible group. Get a couple of friends together. Be that local, organized community. You can do it. That's how all of the indivisible groups have been formed. This is a big way of how we've put on the largest protest in American history with massive coalition partners. These are normal, everyday Americans who are deciding to show up. It's not somebody, Ryan on a knight in shining armor to save us. That's not how this works. We're saving us. All of us, together. And you're welcome to be part of it. So, yeah, check out Indivisible or find me on Blue Sky. Hit me up. We're always organizing together. We're always having a conversation together. Nobody has all the answers, but collectively, we've got the solution.

[Lee McGowan]

Oh, Ezra, thank you so much for joining us today. I mean, last time you were here talking to me, you reminded us that people who seek to destroy democracy want to do it in the dark. They want us to feel alone. And so it's so essential that we gather together and we keep shining a light on these people and their behavior. Because this is a way to not only show our unity in opposing this regime, but to prove to ourselves that we have Friends everywhere, fellow countrymen who really want the same things we do, which is freedom and fairness and justice and stability and of course, democracy. And I think at the very end, I will add to that accountability, because that's what I want to see as well.

[Ezra Levin]

Lee, thanks for being such a bright light in the darkness.

[Lee McGowan]

Love you guys. Keep up the great work. So that was Ezra Levin reminding us that politics is too important to be left to the politicians. The politics is what we do, that we have to take back our power, that the no Kings rallies on the weekend were incredibly successful. But if that's all we do, it won't be enough. We have to keep growing and diversifying our tactics to respond to the constant unchecked overreach of this regime. That it is not just about one day of protests. A protest is a tactic, but it's only one of many. And if you are interested in next steps, I encourage you to join the no Kings call today, Tuesday, October 21st at nokings.org or if you're listening to this later, go to indivisible.org to listen to what they said or get direction to find or start a group. For now, keep talking about the rallies, keep telling the stories, celebrate what we did, and do not let our country be gaslit in real time. We are here. We are unhappy with the direction our country is taking and we aren't going to take it lying down. I want to thank Ezra for joining us today and you for caring enough about democracy to be here until next week. PG out before you go, if you're already a premium member of this podcast, thank you. And if you're not, I want to ask you to support my work. We are living through an absolute propaganda nightmare right now, and if the mainstream media's response to these protests tells us anything, as Ezra said, we require alternative sources of media. So if you see worth in what we're doing here, please consider becoming a member of Politics Girl Premium by going to politicsgirl.com and signing up. You will get this podcast ad free along with my rant sent directly to your inbox. So even if my work is silenced on social media, you will still get access to the truth. There is a link to sign up in the bio of this episode but [e-mail] and as always, please like follow and share this podcast so we can grow the audience. Because the more people who have access to real information, the better chance we have to unite in truth and fight back in solidarity. As always, thank you for your time and support the Politics Girl Podcast is written and performed by me, Leigh McGowan, and produced and edited by Happy Warrior Entertainment. All rights reserved.