← The PoliticsGirl Podcast
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- [00:00]
Ken Martin
People want to see the Democratic Party fight. And I'll tell you, when the stakes are so high, higher than they've ever been, if they don't see our party fighting now and resisting at this moment, how in the hell are they going to believe us when they say, but, you know, put us in power and we'll fight for you then? No, we need to be in this fight right now. We need to stand up with our brothers and sisters in the movement in solidarity, pushing back as hard as we can against what we're seeing from Trump and Musk Foreign.
- [00:36]
Lee McGowan
Hello and welcome to the Politics Girl podcast. I'm your host Lee McGowan. Let's get into it. Well, the Democrats had a tough year. Not only did they lose the 2024 election or at least didn't question the loss, the people seem to have lost faith in them. And as we watch Donald Trump and his team systematically dismantle our government and listen to the Vice President and the speaker of the House talk about ignoring the constit to give the executive branch complete power to act without checks and balances, the Democratic Party seems unprepared or perhaps unwilling to be the opposition that we need now, saying that there are many aspects to the Democratic Party. It's not just the representatives in Congress, some who are not in leadership but are really stepping up and fighting back. But we also have these amazing Democratic governors who are standing firm for their states and the rule of law and the importance of federalism in the face of tyranny. We have local Democrats and state Democrats and all the various committees from the Detroit Triple C to the dscc. But when people think of the party, especially in the absence of a clear leader, it is the dnc, the Democratic National Committee, that they think of as leadership, whether that's true or not. So today I'm going to have a conversation with the newly elected leader of that organization, Ken Martin, to see what he has to say about the future of the opposition party and meeting this moment in American history. As far as his background, Ken Martin began his political career in 1990 as an intern for U.S. senator for Minnesota Paul Wellstone and later interned in Wellstone office organizing college campuses for the Clinton Gore campaign and working in Kansas politics before returning to Minnesota to serve as the Political and Field Director for the Minnesota Democratic Farm Labor Party. Ken went on to become the President of the association of State Democratic Committees and Vice Chair of the dnc. Before winning the election to become chair of the DNC this month, Ken ran on the idea that the Democratic Party needed a leader who could connect with the working class voters and restore people's faith in the party. So without further ado, please welcome my guest, lifelong Democrat, political organizer and newly elected chair of the dnc, Ken Martin. Welcome, Ken.
- [02:42]
Ken Martin
Thank you, Lee. I'm so glad to be here.
- [02:44]
Lee McGowan
Well, thanks for joining me. I mean, honestly, I wish it was under better circumstances and we could just have a conversation about how to get the party to help more people around the country. But you're joining me at a time of crisis, so I think that's what we need to address.
- [02:57]
Ken Martin
Yes, for sure. We do need to address the crisis. And there's a lot going on, of course, in Washington right now that we have to and fight back. But as I've said, we also can walk and chew gum at the same time, meaning we need to give people a sense in this country of who we are as Democrats, what we're fighting for and why at the same time. And so, you know, I think, you know, we've seen Trump and Musk in recent days, of course, really throw a lot of folks off kilter with all of the stuff that they're doing in Washington, D.C. it's hard to land the right punch, right? And that's part of what we're doing right now is really convening people and mobilizing folks, not just our elected officials, but others in advocacy spaces and in movement spaces to figure out how do we resist the right way. So we're landing the right punch. Right. And of course, the DNC plays a big role in that. And so, you know, we have one goal as a Democratic Party, right? Of course, we are part of a movement of folks fighting for economic and social justice, human rights and civil rights. But our one goal and role within the movement is of course, to win elections. And so while we're resisting Donald Trump, we also have to build the infrastructure to win. And that's what I'm almost exclusively focused on right now.
- [04:10]
Lee McGowan
Yeah, good to win. I mean, that's the thing, right? We can't just be, you know, perfect little soldiers who do everything exactly by the book and check off every box. We have to actually win as well. Right. Like, and despite what people might think, the DNC is not the leading arm of the Democratic Party. They are one part of Democratic leadership in combination with many other parts. Your predecessor once told me, the DNC is one piece in a 12 piece pie. But when people think of the Democrats, especially when we don't have a leader, the president or someone we can look to as Being our leader, people do look to the DNC as being in charge, whether that's true or not. Now, to me, the DNC has yet to rise to that offer of leadership. But maybe now, at this tipping point that we're living in, that could change. How do you see the DNC's role at this moment in time?
- [04:58]
Ken Martin
Well, as I mentioned, I mean, it's really, we have to get the DNC out of dc. And what do I mean by that? Some folks think, well, what are you, what are you saying? You're trying to move the DC quarters out of dc? No, it's really a mind shift. Right. We can't be a party that's focused just on seven battleground states and a handful of congressional races. Right. We have to take a more holistic view on how we build power right around our agenda. The conservative movement understood this years ago. What they understood is that they are going to actually compete in every public policy arena throughout this country. Think about this, Lee. In 2022, the Democrats did not contest over half of the elections on the ballot.
- [05:40]
Lee McGowan
I know, Ken. It's ridiculous, honestly.
- [05:43]
Ken Martin
Right. And these were races for local elections. City council, school boards, county boards, township offices, you name it. And while we may think these are nonpartisan races, there's no such thing anymore. In this environment of a nonpartisan office, every office has been politicized. So when I talk about getting the DNC out of dc, it's making sure that we are competing in every of this country in all 3,244 counties that we're not leaving any behind. And more importantly, we are taking a holistic view on how we build power. We cannot keep being indifferent to school boards as an example. You know this better than anyone, Lee. I mean, for God's sake, some of the biggest school districts in this country have been taken over by these far right nuts who are banning books and changing curriculum, whitewashing history, attacking our children. Right. There are real consequences to our own indifference as a national party. So white. Of course, there are many advocacy groups and organizations that are involved in this work for sure. But the role of the Democratic National Party is to build long lasting and durable infrastructure so we win. That is the role. That is our goal. And frankly, that's what the DNC has to be doing. Right. I'll share one story with you. In 23, I was down in Mississippi with Brandon Pressley, our candidate for governor there. He was tied with Tate Reeves, the Republican, about two months before the election. And I asked him what more could the DNC be doing to be helpful to you in this moment. And he said, look, years of indifference and disinvestment in Southern states has led to this moment now where there's no infrastructure on the ground to help me, so I have to build it all myself. That's shameful. We should never be in a position where candidates don't have something on the ground that they can tap into so they don't have to spend money on everything. And that is, frankly, what we're focused on. The nuts and bolts organizing of making sure that we're competing up and down the ballot and we're building long lasting and durable infrastructure so we win again. And I hate to say this, but guess what? Coming in second or losing by less does nothing for people's lives. I used to work for a guy named Paul Wellstone. That's what was my first campaign, in 1990. And you know what? Paul used to say that you can strip everything away, but really what politics is about is the improvement of people's lives. If we don't win elections, we can't make a difference. And so that's what we have to get back to realizing here now. At the same time, we do have to resist and stand up and we have to throw a punch. You know, at this moment right now, Lee, when people in this country are so worried at what they're seeing with Trump and Musk in Washington, people want to see the Democratic Party fight. And I'll tell you, when the stakes are so high, higher than they've ever been, if they don't see our party fighting now and resisting at this moment, how in the hell are they gonna believe us when they say, but, you know, put us in power and we'll fight for you then? No, we need to be in this fight right now. We need to stand up with our brothers and sisters in the movement, in solidarity, pushing back as hard as we can against what we're seeing from Trump and Musk.
- [08:53]
Lee McGowan
Yeah, absolutely. And I think the thing is, is that you were saying in the campaign for GNC chair that one of your biggest concerns coming out of the 2024 election was America's perception of the two parties. Right? That they had switched somehow. The people somehow think the Republicans are the party of the working class and Democrats are the party of the elites, which, of course, based on policy, couldn't be further from the truth. So what do we do about that? Because the Republicans clearly have used their extraordinary messaging machine to paint the Democrats as the enemy. So how does the party then redefine itself under those constraints.
- [09:28]
Ken Martin
Well, I think it's really important to realize, and I don't know when this happened, Lee, but our party started to message to smaller and smaller parts of our coalition, right? And while I think that worked to a certain degree, what we lost is the thing that connects all parts of our coalition, all of these disparate groups of folks right. In Minnesota. I'll use an example. I mean, what connects a corn farmer in southern Minnesota with a steel worker on the Iron Range with a new refugee in the Twin Cities? It's economics, right? It's kitchen table issues. It's a belief in the American Dream, the belief that if you work hard, no matter where you're from, no matter where you live, no matter who you are or who you love, you should be able to actually achieve economic success and climb the economic ladder, build a better life for your family, right? Yet so many people right now, and this has been happening for some years, so many people who are part of our coalition feel that they can't achieve that American Dream, that there are obstacles in their way, that they're being forgotten and left behind, right? They're working their asses off. They're working harder than they ever have before. And they don't feel seen or heard by a government, whether it's state and local government or the federal government. They don't feel seen or heard by politicians. The low level of trust in institutions and politicians right now is a direct correlation to the fact that people's lives aren't getting better. Right? So at the end of the day, it's twofold in terms of how we do this. One is we have to be present in community much earlier than just four months before an election. Lee, when I came up in politics in the 90s, the conventional wisdom at that time was you show up, you know, in four to five months before an election because that's when people are paying attention, right? Well, and sure enough, you know, undecided voters broke in the last two weeks. So you'd flood the zone with organizing, you'd flood the zone with paid media and earned media. But it did not do what we needed to, which was to build long lasting and durable relationships with voters. So we cannot show up four months before an election, and the first conversation we have with someone is asking them to do something for us to vote for our candidates or our party. How in the hell. I mean, think about this. Why are we losing ground with Latino voters? Why are we losing ground with young voters? Why are we losing ground with every Single demographic group. There's a million reasons, but one is because they only see us during an election, usually the last few months. And when they hear from us, we're asking them for something in return, and then they don't see us again for two years. They feel like we're using them for their vote versus actually caring a shit about what's happening in their lives. So we've. We've got to get back to actually showing them that we give a damn. Being present, having a permanent campaign where we are year round, organizing like we do in Minnesota. Right. We have a permanent campaign where we're showing up on shows like this and information spaces all the time to get the message out, not just during an election year. Right. We have to realize, Lee, that we live in a perpetual campaign. Now, as crazy as it is, as much as I wish it wasn't so. Right, because we all need a break from the craziness of this, but the reality is we're in a perpetual campaign which requires us to have a permanent campaign mindset. The second part of that is not just campaigning all the time. The second part of it is actually delivering on the promises we make to people. And there's such a disillusionment amongst people in our party that they keep voting for Democrats, yet when Democrats are in power, they don't use the power to make a difference. That's why I'm so proud of what Governor Walz and our legislative leaders did in Minnesota. You know, we sat down right after the trifecta in 22 and we said, you know what? God damn it, Power is fleeting. We have power. Let's use it to make the biggest difference we can for as many people as we can. Not in a cavalier way. Right. But in a way that actually improves people's lives and makes a difference. When more and more Americans see Democrats willing to actually stand up, stiffen their spine and deliver on the promises, and even when we're not in majorities to stand up and fight for what you believe in, then they will start supporting us again.
- [13:49]
Lee McGowan
Yeah. And you look at a state like yours where you're all, you're giving children's school lunches. You've got Governor Wall surrounded by all those kids that are gonna get fed at lunch. And it's one of the best states in the nation to do business. So you don't have to, like, make a deal with the devil to do both things. You can help everybody at once if you use your power for good. I mean, I look at you and Ben Wickler who also ran for chair. You're both successful party leaders who had to start from scratch in states that have been all but taken over by Republican leadership using undemocratic practices like gerrymandering and voter suppression. And clearly your and Ben's successes in Wisconsin and Minnesota are what's possible for the whole nation. So having done that at the state level and now being in charge of a federal party, in charge of the entire country, how do you use those skills you learned to then take those unfair practices that are happening nationwide and start building it up from the ground again? This podcast is sponsored by MDHearing and in a world where people voted to lower the cost of eggs and gas, but we've now doubled the cost of eggs and gas is about to go through the roof. One thing that isn't going to be more expensive are hearing aids. If you buy them from mDhearing. MDhearing makes high quality, easy to use rechargeable hearing aids with exceptional sound quality that are personalized to your hearing profile and they have cut their prices in half. In fact, MDHearing just made their Neo rechargeable digital hearing aids only $297 a pair. That's over 90% less than in clinic hearing aids. 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- [19:40]
Ken Martin
Well, I think it's exactly what you just said. I mean, taking some of what we're doing both in Minnesota, Wisconsin, there's other state parties that have been doing great work as well and scaling that up to the national party, right? We can do this. We can run a permanent campaign, right, that really focuses in again, more holistically on competing and contesting races up and down the ballot in a way that allows us to build power again. For me, it's easier said than done, right? In the sense that I don't think the national party, they've been so focused as long as I've been part of the DNC, which is these last 14 years, the DNC has been really focused just on federal offices and we can't do that any longer. So we're leaving state legislative seats empty. We're leaving congressional seats and gubernatorial races without the support they need. We're leaving mayoral ships and school boards as I mentioned. So we have to do a lot more. And part of that is building the infrastructure the way that we've done in places like Minnesota and Wisconsin year round organizing, talking to voters all the time, being present in community running, communications all the time. And you know, these information spaces. You know, Ben's really good at this and in fact, I hope to bring him into this conversation about making sure in this new information environment we live in that we are actually competing in ways that the Republicans have frankly outwitted us on in these last several years. You know, I'll just say and one of the things they've done really well, in addition to building power at local levels and organizing all the time, is they are. About five or six years ago, they started to make the shift. We saw the entertainment industry do this years before, which is recognizing that 90% of Americans have smartphones. So they started moving all their content entertainment industries into streaming services and into these new information spaces. And of course, politics is always lagging behind where corporate America and the entertainment industry is. But I saw the Republicans make this shift about five years ago, and they, right after the 2020 election, they started beating the shit out of Joe Biden and the Democratic Party and all of these new information spaces. We weren't even present on the campaign, the Democratic Party surrogates, none of us were present in these spaces. And so for three years, they had unfettered access to essentially spread their lies, their misinformation, and beat the hell out of us. And then again, because we think the campaign starts in an election year, we show up in the election year feeling like we can actually then catch up. While they've already defined us before, we defined ourselves. That can never happen again. So again, part of it's a permanent campaign that I talked about. It's not just organizing. It's the communication side of this as well.
- [22:29]
Lee McGowan
Yeah, it's the communication side because I think when you talk about a permanent campaign, I think you're right. I think a lot of people are like, my God, like, like, make politics be over. Like, do I have to get texts 365 days a year asking me for money? Like, this is insane. And I think it comes back down to this idea about money in politics. It's difficult, let's say, to look at where America is in this moment with a billionaire criminal president who the Supreme Court, many of whom are in bed with billionaire donors themselves, have deemed him above the law. He has a cabinet with a collective self worth of $480 billion. The richest man in the world is acting as this unelected bureaucrat seemingly in charge of every aspect of our federal government. You go, okay, like, money in politics has clearly gotten way out of hand. You have personally said that there's too much money in politics, that it's playing this corrosive role in our democracy and that it should be a priority for our party to try and end Citizens United, which, if people don't know, is the controversial 2010 Supreme Court ruling that basically allowed corporations and outside groups to spend unlimited money on elections. So how do you propose we do that? Because I do want us to have a permanent presence in all 50 states and to go out to the territories. Right. I want us to be there talking about issues, making sure people know that we care about the things that they want. Cuz I often say the reason the Democrats didn't win in this last election isn't because they didn't have the better candidates, the better ideas or the majority sense of the nation. It's because people didn't for some reason know. And in many ways that's because the Republicans are, as you said, allowed to define us before we can define ourselves. So if you didn't know that we were the party of union and a higher minimum wage and paid family leave and taking care of your family and affordable health care, then that's on us. Right? We, we blew it. Not because we don't stand for those things, but because people didn't know those things. So with this much money in politics, how do you propose that we get out of that? Because right now maybe campaign finance reform, maybe trying to get rid of Citizens United, but with the conservative corporate aligned Democrats themselves, we do have that group. Right. It often feels like we can't properly this rising oligarchy because we're too worried about upsetting our own oligarchs. Right. So like how do you balance that?
- [24:44]
Ken Martin
Well, I mean I think one, we have to live our values. And so first you mentioned what we need to fight for. Obviously we need to end Citizens United. We need significant campaign finance overhaul in this country because the finance system is broken. And Bicra, McCain, Feingold act in 2002 certainly tried to do that, but it's not working right now. And we have seen so much of this has been pushed out to these unaccountable dark money groups in ways again that is having a corrosive impact. I believe actually you should be increasing the amount of money that candidates and parties can take because they're closest to the voter and they're the most regulated, right? Meaning they have to report everything that they raise and spend. Sunlight is the greatest disinfectant. And again candidate campaigns and parties can't hide what they're doing. All of these dark money groups can. And that's part of the problem we have here. So one, there's no accountability. You need to get rid of dark money groups and you actually need to reverse the limits because as crazy as it is, I'm not for more money in politics at all. I'd like to see us get to full public financing of our campaign system. But we should recognize that there's greater accountability, like I said, with those closest to the voters. And those are regulated. And so you should actually, instead of being punitive to parties and to candidates, you should actually increase their limits. You see, the. These dark money groups have no limits. They're not regulated in any way. They can take as much as they want, spend it on whatever the hell they want with no accountability back to the voters or to any regulatory agencies. So to level the playing field, you actually have to increase the amount that parties and candidates can take so they can have a little bit more of a voice in this process. And I know that sounds crazy. The second piece we need to do in addition to a campaign finance overhaul and in Citizens United is we should only take money from people who share our values. Right? Meaning that there's been a lot of candidates on the Democratic side who take money from people who don't share our values. And I was very clear. The DNC will not take money from companies that are union busters. Right. Or people who own companies that are union busters. We won't take money from companies or people that are polluting our environment and killing our planet. As an example. Right. And so for me, it's really important that we live our values through the contributions we're raising. And the last thing we need to do is really increase the amount of money we raise through small donor contributions, through grassroots fundraising. Right. And that's really important because we want more people to feel like they have a voice in politics and if they give their 10, 15, $20 a month, that it's making a difference. Look, the issue last election was not money for the Democratic party. We spent two and a half billion dollars on a presidential race race. Two and a half billion dollars. In 2024 alone, Lee, there was over $10 billion spent on just Democratic races up and down the ballot. 10 billion. I mean, that's freaking crazy.
- [27:55]
Lee McGowan
It's obscene. It's obscene.
- [27:57]
Ken Martin
We got a reverse course. So, you know, I don't know how to do that until we win elections.
- [28:02]
Lee McGowan
Yeah, exactly. If you win elections, then you put in things like the John Lewis Voting Rights act or the for the People act and you start taking dark money out of politics and making gerrymandering illegal and making Election Day a national holiday and, you know, cutting off these dark money groups at the knees and saying, if you want to donate to a campaign, here is the candidate you can donate to. I am on your side. I would love to see public funded elections where everyone has the same amount of Money. And you can only advertise for a certain period of time. You look at somewhere like London or if you're having an election in the uk, it's like you got six weeks, weeks. And you know, at the last week you can't even be on social media or in the advertising at all. Like people have to know what your positions are. And then we're not completely inundated all the time. I'm sure everyone in America would be like, oh my God, please make it, you know, six months max. Like, let me, let me have my back to my life. Right? But I also think that it's spending money on things to build relationships and not just build a coffer where a bunch of consultants make a bunch of money and buy a beach house. Right? Like more face to face door knocking, more neighborhoods neighbor to neighbor. Not flying in operatives to talk to a stranger, but people that have relationships with people. I like the idea that it seems that all of the candidates that were on the DNC chair race were talking about more organization with the state parties, more organizations with people that are on the ground in each one of the states. So that you say instead of the DNC dictating to the states, what we need from you, the states can say to the dnc, here's what we need, need from the dnc. We can see that we need people in these rural areas of Kentucky or we can see that this Mississippi governor actually has a chance, send us money to deal with that, get more voting out, get more people registered, get more people here, there, the other place, and that's from the people on the ground. And are you willing? Because it seemed like everyone that was running really got that, that it wasn't going to have to be. It wasn't going to be top down. It had to be states up.
- [29:51]
Ken Martin
That's right. And I think that's the other way to get at the corrosive impact of money is when you build from the grassroots. Right. It's much harder for money to work in the very negative ways that it does when you've built a relationship with voters around shared values and trust. Right. It's harder for them to demonize the Democratic Party when they know their neighbor, who's a big Democrat, has invested enough in the conversation and the relationship over years to talk to them about their hopes and dreams and their concerns. Right. And so for me, as an organizer, that's the, the title that I cherish the most, right. Is an organizer, a grassroots organizer, understanding that that's the way we have to Build a party from the ground up, not the top down. And as you mentioned, the state parties. I led the state parties for the last year, eight years as the president of the asdc, the association of State Democratic Committees. I believe in all of our state parties and I believe they're a critical nexus to the work that all of our organizations in D.C. and our committees in D.C. should be working with more. That means for me, in 2017, when I came in, think about this. In 2017, the DNC after that election in 16 was $70 million in debt. The data infrastructure was way behind the Republicans, and the state parties had been hollowed out by OFA and Organizing for America those eight years prior. And so the infrastructure was really terrible. What I immediately went and did is I wrote a 57 state party strategy. Our 50 states, plus our territories and Democrats abroad. And those investments are the deepest investments ever in the history of our party. And they've made a tremendous difference in already building up strong state parties and the infrastructure there. We now need to dig deeper, right? We need to build up our county parties, right? And eventually, you know, we need to start getting even more local and granular in the sense that we used to have a very well developed precinct system throughout this country that had precinct chairs and captains all throughout this country. It's probably not realistic to do that. But we should be supporting our state parties and our county parties throughout this nation in more ways than we've done even these last eight years, which was historic. And so I plan to do that as the next. Not the next DNC chair. I am the DNC chair.
- [32:17]
Lee McGowan
As the DNC chair.
- [32:18]
Ken Martin
Yes, yes.
- [32:19]
Lee McGowan
Well, listen, I mean, that's the thing. I think we do need a new way of, of looking at things. I think the Democrats, but particularly the DNC has often come off as too old school. Like this is how we've always done it. You know, we know what's best. Don't rock the boat. But after this last election, it's very clearly not true, Right? You didn't know what was best. Not you personally. You were not in charge. But it's well past time for change, right? So we're at this part. There was one candidate who made me laugh, James Scoffis, who was in the. Who is in the race with you. Because he reminded me of when you go on a reaction reality show and you're like, I'm not here to make friends. You know, like, he made me laugh because he was just saying everything that was on people's minds, right? And one of the things he said was we have to throw out this old stale DC playbook and we have to listen to the voters and less to DC consultants. And I really kind of appreciated that because I feel like sometimes people are like, well, in the beltway and I'm like, most people don't know what the frickin beltway is. Stop saying that. Right? Like it feels like we are living in, in the 1990s and the Democrats are trying to run some manual that was written 30 years ago and it doesn't work. Right. We just lost the biggest election of our lifetime. A bunch of consultants made bank and now we have all of these old school, you know, vendors who think that they're still going to carry on with the Democrats. And I kind of liked the idea of being like, no, none of you get guaranteed contracts. We're starting fresh. We're doing something new. We're going to spend our money differently because. Because we clearly missed the people in this machine. And we gotta get back to that. This episode of the Politics Girl podcast is brought to you by Wildgrain. 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- [37:02]
Ken Martin
Well, listen, and James is a great friend and I will say this. He's not wrong and we all. No.
- [37:08]
Lee McGowan
And he's fiery and ballsy. I liked it. It was great.
- [37:11]
Ken Martin
Me too. And here's what I would say, Lee. I mean the reality is most of those D.C. consultants, they've never spoken to a voter. They've never set foot in any of these states. I mean, they couldn't tell me how to do my job here in Minnesota, that's for sure. But the reality is they're also trading on very old practices and tactics because there's a perverse Profit incentive in politics, right? And we see this. Look, I'm 51 years old. I still read a hard copy of a newspaper, right? So my kids think I'm a little bit of a dinosaur that way. But I will tell you what I don't do. I don't watch broadcast TV anymore. I don't watch broadcast TV in years. Yet guess what? You know where Most of those D.C. consultants continue to spend our money? On broadcast TV. Now, I'm a hunter and I say this to folks. People ask me, well, where do you go to hunt? And they think I'm going to tell my favorite deer stand or my favorite hunting spot. No, you know, where you go to hunt where the deer are. Where do you go to get to people where they're at? Guess what? They're not on broadcast tv. All of these consultants, in fact, this is what we're doing here. These first two weeks that I've been on is going through every consultant contract, line by line, and most of them are going to be gone because they provide absolutely no value or service. And the only thing they care about is lining their own pockets versus winning. If, and I've said this to the staff and I said this to consultants, if you're not bringing me a plan to win, go pound sand. Because at the end of the day, I'm not spending money. There are people literally giving us 10, 15, $20 a month because they believe in this Democratic Party, right, And our values and they want us to win. So if we're not winning, then we shouldn't be doing it. I say to every organization I've ever run, whether it's campaigns I've run up and down the ballot here, the DFL the last 14 years and now the DNC, if we're doing things that aren't about winning elections, we should stop doing them. And that's true of consultants, by the way, as well. You know, I'd rather put more money into shows like yours and to influencers and to content creat and people who are actually reaching folks. Then the same stale old practices that I don't even know how you measure anymore. The metrics are so flawed. I mean, there's a lot to say on this other than to say that the bottom line for me is this. They're more interested in making money than anything else. And that's a damn shame.
- [39:37]
Lee McGowan
It is a damn shame. I completely agree with you and I love to hear that you say that because it pleased me when James said it on the campaign, Terrell. It pleased me when all the people who were running for DNC chair agreed with that, I was thrilled to hear that all the candidates, when I listened to your forum on January 11th and all of you talked for a couple of hours, and it seemed like every single one of the people looking to run the DNC were like, let's stop doing this swing state thing. Let's stop doing this red and blue state thing. Why do we keep ceding what we call red states to these Republicans without a fight? This idea of us being in every state and talking to every voter all year long and building relationships with communities, rather than, as you were saying, pulling in right before an election and asking for a vote that we haven't earned. Marianne Williamson, who is one of the other candidates that you worked with, she has said something that really resonated with people during that campaign, and she said that Democrats need a cohesive worldview, that Republicans have a cohesive worldview. It's an abhorrent worldview, but it's cohesive. Right. And the people need to be clear about what the Democrats stand for. And I really can't argue with her when she says that because, you know, all of you that were in the chairs race agreed that, that we can't keep looking at the voters like, these are low propensity voters and these are swing voters and these are Democrats and these are Republicans. We have to look at the voters as people and speak to the people's needs. Right. And we kind of stop doing that because as you said, people are in many ways in it for like, oh, I can make some money here or I can do this, this and this idea that, you know, of course there's going to be certain groups with certain needs and we're going to need to speak to them. But we shouldn't decide that this group or that group doesn't matter because they don't fit into our electoral calculation. And it's all just math. And, you know, like, we just really need this little group of voters because people can tell when you show up because they need, you know, you need this vote that they're just numbers on a spreadsheet and it comes off as inauthentic. And I think that inauthenticity is something that Democrats struggle with. You know, the Republicans suck, but you believe they are who they are. Right. And that's something that I think at this point we need to really embrace. Like, if you didn't know that we're here for you, let us tell you now, that kind of a feel.
- [41:43]
Ken Martin
No, that's Exactly. Right. And I think authenticity is something that people thirst for in politics. Right. In fact, they're willing to give you the benefit of the doubt, even if they disagree with you on issues, because they know it's something you believe in. Right. And it's not being disingenuous or, you know, doing one of the these where you stick your finger in the wind to see which way it's blowing. Right. You know, Wellstone was that way. And, you know, people voted for him here in Minnesota. They didn't agree with him on every issue, but they just loved that he was willing to stand up and fight for what he believed in. I think that's true of my governor, Governor Walls. The same thing. Right. People view him, you know, as very authentic, you know, and they disagree with him on things, for sure, but authenticity matters. Also, being a strong leader with a spine who's willing to say what is on their mind and is not trying to couch their words, I do actually think in a weird, perverse way, that's why Donald Trump has some of the following. He does, because people view him as authentic, strong, and someone who doesn't give a damn about what other people think, about what he thinks he's gonna say, what's on his mind. And Democrats, we try to, oh, you know, I don't know how these people are going to think if I say it this way. You know, look, I think we just have to stand up and actually, you know what? One of my old mentors said this. Never separate the life you lead from the words you speak. That is something that I've really tried to abide in my life, which is, you know, what, Stand up and speak your truth and your values and what you believe and then live them as well. And I think that's an important lesson for Democrats right now.
- [43:23]
Lee McGowan
I agree with you, Ken. And honestly, I always say, I think we can be humble about a lot loss without being apologetic. Right. Like, I'm watching consultants now talking about, like, throwing people under the bus. You know, maybe we got too woke. Maybe we don't talk so much about trans people or gay people. Maybe we. We don't talk about, you know, women's rights. And I'm like, are you kidding me? Like, you can say we are the party for everyone without, you know, getting into the weeds of it all the time, being like, we want you to be who you are and love who you love and make money and have a good. Have. Have a good life. That's what we're here for. Like, ultimately, we want Your schools to be good, your opportunities to be open. We want your kids to be happy and healthy and have a roof over their heads. We want you to be well fed and cared for. That's what your government should be doing so that you are free to pursue this happiness that you were promised. And we don't think this is just a nation for this top few people at the top. We think this is a nation for all of us. And if you didn't know that from us, then let us tell you now. And I think that that is where we need to be right now. And not throwing anyone under the bus. Like, ultimately people don't like weakness, but they do like humility and self deprecation. I think, you know, Democrats should be out here telling people that they're the party where everyone is accepted and that acceptance isn't veered off into weird virtual virtue signaling where we come off like some scolding hall monitors. Right? We don't want to do that anymore. Like, we don't want to be like, listen, this isn't how we, you know, like, everyone hates that. Like just, we don't need to do that anymore. It's a lot. It's too much chirp, chirp, chirp. I think, think when people think about Democrats as being the elitist party, it's not because of money, because clearly that's the Republicans. They have all the money. They have the billionaires. They're serving the billionaire class. I think we come off as intellectually elite, like snobby smarty pants. And people hate that. And so I think if we are going down to the grassroots level again and talking to people and saying like, what is it that you need and how is it that we can help you? And you know what's interesting, because that is what we really want to do for you. That is where people are going to go. Maybe I don't hate the Democrats. Have I been taught to hate the Democrats? And we could say, yes, you have been taught to hate the Democrats. Right. I think at the end, like, I'm just, I so appreciate it. You said on the campaign trail that Democrats need a workhorse, not a show pony to run the dnc. We need someone who's willing to do the work on the ground, who's not just aching to be in front of the camera and get their face out there all the time. And I'm very pleased you got the job, Ken, because I think you get it. And I'm really, we really need someone to get it right now because Democrats are feeling defeated, and they're feeling a bit rudderless and leaderless. And it's nice to know that you're out here and you get it. So please tell people how we can help you get our country back on track. You know, how we can help push your mission forward, to really, really start from scratch and build something that people can be proud of.
- [45:57]
Ken Martin
Well, let me give you five key things that people can do right now, in this moment, in this moment right now. Okay? And there's a lot of other ways you can help me and the dnc, but the first thing is, is fill state and local party committee seats. We have thousands of vacancies in our local parties and our state parties right now. Help us build the army that we need to win up and down the ballot in 25 and 26. So, first thing is contact your state party and ask if there are any vacancies that you can help fill. Be a part of the solution. Right. And the best way to do that is join your local party. Two shows up to town halls that Democratic elected officials are having right now to show your support for the work that they're doing to push back on Musk and Trump and their illegal and unconstitutional actions. This is really important because our Democratic elected officials are standing up right now. They don't have power in Congress, but they're standing up and using the platforms and the power they have to push back and do everything they can to fight back against these illegal actions. We need to show them that we support them. Right. Oftentimes Democrats turn on each other first. Right. Right now it's important that we show them that we support their actions so that they continue to push as hard as they can. Three, show up and protest at local Musk and Trump businesses. That is Tesla dealerships, Trump hotels, golf courses, and other properties. Right. Let's take the fight to the Republicans. I'm sick and tired of Democrats being good government types just sitting back and waiting for things to come to them. Let's take the fight to the Republicans and make them have a little bit of economic pain. Both Trump and Musk. Show up at their properties, show up at their businesses, make sure they know that you don't like what they're doing. Fourth is show up and engage in online communities and other information spaces. Be part of the conversation, push back, be loud and combat the misinformation and disinformation that the Republicans continue to spew. This is one of our biggest weaknesses. We don't do this well, and we need to get into all of our online communities and spaces and push back on the bullshit. The last thing is, we have elections coming up right now in Florida 1 and Florida 6. Call the Florida Democratic Party or visit them at FloridaDems.org and sign up for a volunteer shift. The public mood and sentiment has shifted significantly in the last three weeks. And as crazy as it is, yes, these are Republican leaning districts, but we can win. And if we win one or two of those right now, we're in a better position to take the U.S. house back. And that is the first line of defense of stopping Trump. And Musk is winning back the U.S. house. Of course, all those other races. There's over 100,000 local races on the ballot this year. And so my point is this. Those are five things you can do today. If you're looking to get involved and do something, do one of those things. Do all five of them. If you're looking for more, give me a call or send me an email because I have a much larger list. But those are five actionable things you can do right now.
- [49:04]
Lee McGowan
Thank you so much, Ken. I appreciate that. And people can probably go to. Is it DNC? Where should they go?
- [49:10]
Ken Martin
DNC.org Yep. And sign up to volunteer so people.
- [49:14]
Lee McGowan
Can go to dnc.org and sign up to volunteer and see what else Ken has past his five things. But thank you for giving us action items. Because it's action. We always say that is the antithesis to apathy. People want to shut down, but you give them things to do and they're willing to do them because they know this isn't right. So thank you so much for joining us and thank you for taking on this role at this hellacious moment in political history. History. But we really appreciate you standing up and standing up for all of us.
- [49:38]
Ken Martin
Thank you, Lee. It's just a delight to be on and I hope you'll have me back.
- [49:43]
Lee McGowan
Absolutely. We can't wait. We'll start talking about the wins.
- [49:45]
Ken Martin
There you go. Awesome. Thank you.
- [49:48]
Lee McGowan
So that was Ken Martin, the new chair of the DNC and a man with a plan. I love these grassroots organizer leaders who aren't in it for the FaceTime on the cameras or the big donor dinner parties. But are the people willing to reach reimagine how something has always been to how something could be? As Ken said, ultimately the number one goal for the DNC is to win, to beat back this horrible far right extremist Republican Party so we can start making real change from a place of power. To do that, Ken's plan is to get the DNC out of D.C. and back to the states, all the states, back to the people. We have to be present in communities at all levels and working with state parties to help build the infrastructure for Democrats to actually win. I want to thank Ken for joining us today and you for caring enough about democracy to be here. Now. Take one or all of Ken's five suggestions and take action to wake us up from this national nightmare. Until next week, pgf. Before you go, I just want to say if you're a premium member of this podcast, thank you. And if you're not a member, please consider supporting my work. As Ken said, we need the new independent voices out here telling you the truth. We are almost completely overwhelmed by state supporting legacy media and propaganda at this point, so it's essential those of us out here still bringing you the facts are supported. So if you aren't a member of Politics Girl Premium, please consider going to politicsgirl.com and signing up. You will get this podcast ad free, along with my rants and bonus content sent directly to your inbox. So even if my work is silenced on social media media, you will still get access to the truth. There is a link to sign up in the bio of this episode, but also@politicsgirl.com and as always, please like and share this podcast so we can grow our audience. Because the more people who have access to this kind of information, the better. Thank you as always for your time and support. The Politics Girl Podcast is written and performed by me, Lee McGowan in partnership with the Midas Media Network and produced and edited by Happy Warrior Entertainment. All rights reserved.