S2-E50: When Does Your Side Hustle Become A Distraction with Mike Garvey of Side Hustle Squad Podcast

Summary

Episode Overview

Podcast: The Deep End with Eric Triplett
Episode: S2-E50: When Does Your Side Hustle Become A Distraction with Mike Garvey of Side Hustle Squad Podcast
Date: July 20, 2026
Main Theme:
Eric Triplett sits down with Mike Garvey to explore the blurred boundaries between side hustles and real businesses for entrepreneurs, contractors, and tradespeople. They discuss personal experiences, motivations behind side hustles, when a passion project crosses into a legitimate business, and the challenges of balancing multiple ventures without losing focus on bigger missions.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Personal Journeys with Side Hustles

• Eric’s Story:
  • From a young fish enthusiast with “a garage full of fish tanks” to building a thriving business around his passion for aquatics.
  • Current side activities include breeding tropical fish, which he describes as a "hobby that pays for itself."

    "Here I am 35 years later, and I have about 35 or 40 aquariums in my garage, and I'm still breeding those same fish from a long time ago... I sell the fry. I don't really make enough money to do anything with it." — Eric (06:15-06:55)

• Mike’s Story:
  • New Jersey State Trooper with a business on the side, designed to step into upon early retirement.
  • His approach always viewed the side hustle as a full-on business from the start — forming an LLC, getting insurance, and investing in branding even with minimal customers.

    "It was always like, okay, this is going to be real. This is real. This is LLC. This has insurance. This has branding behind it." — Mike (08:40-09:09)

---

2. What Turns a Side Hustle into a Real Business?

• Motivations Vary: Some want to escape a job they dislike, others just seek extra money or fulfillment.
• “Realness” is Subjective: Filing paperwork, serving customers, and formalizing operations can make a side hustle feel legitimate before it becomes financially viable.
• Safety Nets Cut Both Ways: Stability from a main job can reduce fear and pressure but also dilute the drive needed for entrepreneurship.

  "If you have a solid backup plan and if it's a side hustle, it's really maybe a backup plan." — Eric (10:13-10:18) "But it also takes a lot of the real, like, the grit out of... I have to succeed." — Eric (09:43-09:51)

---

3. The Dangers of Distraction

• Eric’s Own Struggle:
  • Faced with pausing his coaching venture (“Train with Triplet”) because it was detracting from his core mission in water features.

    "Sometimes the hardest entrepreneurial decision isn't starting something new, but it's about having the discipline to let go of something that's good so you can go... all in on something that's great." (31:42-32:02)

• Fear of Scaling a Passion:
  • Turning a hobby/side project into a business can potentially erode the joy and fulfillment it once brought.

    "I think there's a little bit of fear built up in the fact that, well, I love this so much that I don't want it to become a real big business, because then I won't love it anymore." — Eric (24:49-25:15)

---

4. The Retirement and Future-Proofing Angle

• Mike’s Long Game:
  • Started thinking of life after police work by year five, aspiring to have a business established for when he retires in his late 40s.

    "I've been in this since I was 18 years old in police work... I started thinking about this in year five." — Mike (10:46-11:08)

  • Critiques those who don’t plan ahead for their transition out of a long-term career.
• Risks for Tradespeople:
  • Many become “locked in” to pensions or union jobs, making it hard to leap into entrepreneurship, especially as physical labor takes its toll with age.

    "By that time he's going to be 55 and his body's broken. So like how much, how many, how big is the spawn business?" — Eric (17:34-17:42)

---

5. Examples & Anecdotes

• Softball and Baseball Card Side Hustles:
  • Employee with a deep love for sports, collects and sells baseball cards on the side, making “a couple grand a month.”

    “I'm like, how much you make a month? He's a couple grand. I'm like, are you bullshitting? He's like, no, I make a couple grand a month on baseball cards and work on my collection." — Eric (21:58-22:06)

• Pottery and Craft Hustles:
  • Local artists, ceramicists, and bakers use markets and events as outlets for their creative side hustles — sometimes selling out high-priced items ($450 vases mentioned) without ever formalizing their “business.”

    "This hot girl in the night. Nice. Making this glaze...$450. I was like, good for you, girl. Wow, this is amazing. And it's sold out. Sold out." — Eric (26:27-27:10)

---

6. Knowing When to Move On or Double Down

• Discipline Over Opportunity:

  • Know when to let go of a good opportunity for the sake of pursuing your highest-impact, most aligned mission or passion.

    "Not every opportunity deserves a lifetime commitment...putting Train with Triplet on pause and doubling down...on the mission that's been in my heart all along." — Eric (31:42-32:20)

• Passion as the Differentiator:

  • Eric sees his deep, abiding love for fish as his unique edge:

    “I'm not just a pond guy that I'm pretty good at landscaping, so I build ponds, too...I'm a total fish freak. Fish head. Number one.” (30:53-31:20)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Decision to Pause a Side Hustle:

  “My real mission isn't coaching contractors, even though I love doing that. But my mission is reconnecting people with nature through water features...” — Eric (03:40-04:20)

• On Motivation and Burnout:

  “I think they're waiting for, like, this big, special moment where they show up, and all of a sudden they're overwhelmed with work...I think there's a little bit of fear built up...then I won't love it anymore.” — Eric (24:00-25:15)

• On Money versus Fulfillment:

  “It was always like, okay, this is going to be real...Even though it couldn't sustain your lifestyle and everything.”
  “It could be easy to quit.” — Mike (08:40-09:52)

---

Key Segment Timestamps

• Personal Backgrounds & Side Hustle Definitions: 00:42–08:00
• When Does the Side Hustle Become Real: 08:00–11:30
• Planning for Retirement, Building for the Future: 10:18–12:05
• Case Studies: DMV, Softball, Baseball Cards: 15:17–24:00
• Creative Hustles: Pottery and Sourdough: 23:24–27:20
• The Fear of Scaling a Passion: 24:00–25:44
• Full Circle: Making the Passion the Business: 30:32–31:24
• Discipline vs. Opportunity, Closing Reflections: 31:42–32:20

---

Takeaways for Listeners

• Intention matters: Whether a side hustle is a hobby or the seed of a business depends on your goals, planning, and what gives you energy.
• Don’t be afraid to let go: Sacrificing a “good” thing for a “great” pursuit takes discipline and clarity of vision.
• Fulfillment trumps money: Many start side hustles for extra cash, but those that endure are usually rooted in genuine passion and identity.

As Eric put it:

“Not every opportunity deserves a lifetime commitment. Sometimes the hardest entrepreneurial decision isn't starting something new, but it's about having the discipline to let go of something that's good so you can go...all in on something that's great.” (31:42–32:02)

---

For entrepreneurs, tradespeople, and anyone grappling with side hustles, this episode delivers practical insights, honest stories, and key questions to help frame your next move—without losing sight of what truly makes you come alive.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to the Deep End with Eric Triplett, the pond digger and inventor of Helix Life Support Pond filtration. For over three decades, Eric and his team have been in the field designing, building, and protecting breathtaking aquatic ecosystems that reconnect people with nature right in their own backyards. Ponds, koi, craftsmanship, culture, business. This is where we dive deep into building a wild, successful brand rooted in nature. Let's dig in.

[B]

Welcome back to the Deep End. I'm Eric Triplett, founder of the Pondagger Waterscape design and construction company. And today's episode's a fun one because it's one of those conversations that's happened at exactly the right time in my life. I sat down with a buddy of mine, Mike Garvey, from the side Hustle Squad podcast. So we were at Profit Accelerator Live, and the topic is about side hustle versus real business and. Or a distraction. You know, that's the struggle that I run into. And Mike's the perfect guy to have this conversation with because he's a state trooper in New Jersey, he's a business owner, and he's someone who understands what it's like to build multiple streams of income. And behind Mike, you know, he's been approaching retirement, and for many years, he's been working on building a business. So when he retires, he'll still be young man. He'll be in his late 40s, I believe, and so he'll retire from the. As a state trooper and still have, you know, a. A lot of lot to do in life, and he'll already have a thriving business that's already a monster that he get to step right into, which is amazing. Right? It's a little different for me because, you know, my. My passion and my dream has just been fish. My whole life built a business around fish, and. And fish started as a side hustle potentially and quickly became my business. And then there's some fun stories behind how fish breeding is a side hustle for me inside this big umbrella of following my passion, building ponds and so forth. But we started talking about side hustles and when they make sense, when they become real businesses, and when they actually start pulling you away from a mission you've meant to be to build, you know, and that's exactly what I ran into. What's interesting is this conversation happened while I was, you know, in the throes, in the middle of making a huge decision in my own life and business and side hustle, if you will. So at that point, I had already decided to put train with triplet on a shelf. It's my coaching business that I've been working on for four years. And not because I didn't love it, because I absolutely did. And how fulfilling and rewarding it is to help contractors understand their business better and spend more time with their family and still make enough money to be profitable and all that, and spend more time in their hobbies and still run their business without too much trouble. Right. But I mean, it's. That's really fulfilling as I've had to go through that myself in business and life. And for me to be able to help contractors, you know, navigate that, it's. It's a big deal for me. It's really fulfilling. But it was pulling time, energy, and focus away from the bigger vision, the bigger mission. I've been building for nearly three decades. And I'm on, like, the precipice of pushing this, you know, pushing it right to the top of the hill, and then I'm distracted by a coaching business. Right. So my real mission isn't coaching contractors, even though I love doing that. But my mission is reconnecting people with nature through water features, helping them understand the stewardship of wildlife, and helping millions of people experience what happens when you bring water back into their lives right in their own backyard. So this episode is in a real time snapshot of what decision, like, looked like, what that decision looked like, like, as it was unfolding, like in real time. Right. So whether you have a side hustle, multiple businesses, or if you're wondering where to put your energy next, I think you're to get something out of this conversation that was real and raw with me and my dear friend Mike Garvey. When I first started, a business was all built around fish. And it built, it was built around my passion for aquariums in my. In my apartment. Went from one aquarium to two to five to seven. And I was just infatuated. Like, dude, I just couldn't get enough. And then I had this wild hair. I was still young, dude. I was early 20s. So I didn't have a mortgage, a car payment, a wife, kids.

[A]

Like, no worries, no responsibility.

[B]

Yeah, it could be totally irresponsible. And it was interesting because it didn't even go from a side hustle to. I just went from like, I'm a framer, I quit framing, and now I'm gonna figure out how to make money with fish. So it was just really. I turned it off like that. I probably, if I remember well, I probably did some side jobs on the weekends, patio cover here and There. And so still could supplement.

[A]

Sustain.

[B]

Yeah, supplement this new business venture. But cool thing. Now the full circle. Here I am about 35 years later, and I still have. I have a garage full of fish tanks. Because after I left that, I was doing the aquarium service, and then I started breeding fish. And I went to a full garage full of fish, to 2 car garage, to 3 car garage full of fish. And then my poor landlord at the time, we converted one of the rooms inside the house to fish. You know, the carpet was just terrible. It was terrible. It was bad. But, you know, I had all these different fish tanks and I was breeding all these fish. And so that was part. That was my business that just kind of kept expanding. But here I am 35 years later, and I have about 35 or 40 aquariums in my garage, and I'm still breeding those same fish from a long time ago. Different. Different styles, different breeds. And it's totally side hustle. I don't even know if I call it side hustle. It's like a hobby. But I sell them, I sell the fry. I don't really make enough money to do anything with it. It's just. It's like supporting my home hobby, you know what I mean?

[A]

Which is also support. Like. Like you need fish for the pond, right?

[B]

Like, no, this is. They don't go in ponds.

[A]

They don't go. This is just straight hobby.

[B]

Straight hobby tropical fish. And it's a side hustle because really cool when the fry grow up. And I'm paying someone right now to feed my fish while I'm gone because my wife's too busy with the wild animals, you know, Right. Wildlife rehabilitation. And her sister's there. I'm like, you have to take care of my fish. She feeds the fish room three times a day. She hatches baby brine shrimp, like, and so I make enough money to pay her for that. But it's just like a little side thing. I'll call up one of my homies at a. At a pet store. And I'm like, hey, what's up? I got Neil Leo Lamprologus tricephalus coming out my eyeballs, bro. How many you need? A hundred. And he's like, oh, maybe 20. You know, I gotta figure out how to hustle the other 80.

[A]

Somewhere around California.

[B]

Yeah. So I gotta call these jobbers and they come and buy from them. And then I, you know, a little side hustle. I'm like, hey, I want to upgrade all my little filters in the garage. So I talked to my Buddy at a pet store. And I'm like, hey, order me 40, you know, these specialty filters. He's like, I got it, dude. So it's like a little hustle thing on the side. It's fun. It's purely for, like, my heart and, like, my. I continued desire to, like, see nuances in fish up close in my face. Right.

[A]

That's really cool.

[B]

So it's full circle like that. But when does side hustle become, like, a real business? Like, what. What's the lever? It's different for everyone, right?

[A]

I think it's different for everyone because what's everybody's goal? Is it that they hate their job and they want to work for themselves, or is it they want more money and they want to do something on their days off? Like, everyone's motivation's different, I think. And I think it's always a. For me, I was like, I'm serving customers. It's a real business. Like, Like, I. I was. I never felt like, oh, this is like a hobby. I filed the paperwork before I even had, like, one customer. Like, it wasn't like, oh, I'm gonna do this off the side. Take cash, you know? Like, it was never like that for me. It was always like, okay, this is going to be real. This is real. This is llc. This has insurance. This has branding behind it. It was. Oh, no. Even with 10 customers, it was like, I still felt it real even though it wasn't full time. It was a real business, though.

[B]

So your side hustle started out like it's full business.

[A]

Oh, full, Full on. Yeah.

[B]

Even though it couldn't sustain your, you know, your lifestyle and everything.

[A]

Couldn't. It's didn't. Couldn't sustain my lifestyle. If I quit my state police job, it couldn't sustain my life. Like, yeah, not even close. But it's like that also, too. Takes a lot of fear out of starting a business.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. I have a huge safety net that I'm like.

[B]

But it also takes a lot of the. The real, like, the grit out of. I have to succeed. It takes the.

[A]

Totally.

[B]

It takes that will.

[A]

It could be easy to quit.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

And you see people do it at a time. They're like, I wanted to do inflatable freaking things on the part over the weekend. So I, like, started an llc, but then I realized I had to work on the weekends.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. Like, because I had my other job

[B]

that I'm just like, yeah, I. I started this embroidery shop and I started making hats, and then I had to call customers and talk.

[A]

And I got.

[B]

Just. If you have a, if you have a solid backup plan and if it's a side hustle, it's really maybe a backup plan. Am I wrong by saying, like, because you've been a state trooper for over a decade, like 15, 18 years, right?

[A]

Yeah, I just passed 17. Yeah.

[B]

So your, your side hustle now is like your, it's like your future. After I retire after 20 or 25 years.

[A]

Yeah. I'm going to be retired at 47.

[B]

I'll have a kick ass, like little couple of side things.

[A]

But that was the, that was the thing. I. If I saw guys very early on, like when I've been in this since I was 18 years old and police work in some capacity or other, I would see guys retiring. I'm like, what are you gonna go do? And they're like, I don't know, I'm just gonna, I'm gonna figure, you know, I'm like, what, you're thinking about this now? I'm like, I started thinking about this in year five.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

It's like, I'm like, I want something. Well, I always wanted something established that while I was at my full time job, it was make some not. I have people in place that are running it and doing it while I'm at, like, it's. Yeah, I wanted to make money while I was making money.

[B]

Yeah, you're. That's. If that makes. You're built different, bro. Not only in your behind, but in your mind.

[A]

Right.

[B]

For those of you, Mike has a giant, giant butt.

[A]

The one guy here he needs so he's got done.

[B]

You got it all when you were born.

[A]

You got all the. But thanks, mom. But, but like, yeah, like, I don't want to think about that. Oh, I'm gonna start a. I don't want to. You're not gonna. I don't want to start a business when I'm 48.

[B]

Yeah. Like, from Colonel Sanders started when he was like, true 65 or 70.

[A]

And there's nothing to say that I, I say it wrong. I want to. I don't want to like, figure out what I want to do. Like, then I don't want to be like in the last, like month to be like, I don't know, do I want to like, teach? Do I want to do like. I don't know.

[B]

What do they say, those who can't do, teach?

[A]

Is that what they say?

[B]

Yeah, hey, it's Triplett here. Listen. In a world where quality is often overlooked, Helix Life Support stands proud, bringing you American made excellence for your koi ponds and water gardens. And I want you to know I worked in the field for over 15 years and had professionally built nearly a thousand ponds before I designed my own proprietary filtration equipment. So trust and believe when I say that Helix Life support is a product line that was crafted for those who demand durability, advanced technology and a deep commitment to fish friendly designs. Now at the heart of the product line is our patented, award winning Helix pond skimmer. Built with the safety for your koi and other fish as our top priority. No sharp edges, no unnecessary risks. Just an innovative fish friendly skimmer you can trust. And every piece of Helix equipment that's made is with high quality materials so you can get a filtration system that's as tough and reliable as it is efficient. Whether you're a first time pond builder or a professional contractor looking to elevate your game, my team and I are ready to help you realize that vision for personalized pond design assistance or to get your hands on Helix Life support filtration equipment. Give us a call today at 800-522-5043. That's 800-522-5043. Support American craftsmanship and choose Helix Life support for your pond. Built for koi, built for life, built for you. What's up with the side hustle? Just being something. Okay, so you have a job. It's not necessarily your passion in your life, but you're good at it. And so you can make your living and raise a family and buy a home and all that stuff, but maybe you just don't love it. Right? And that could be all kinds of things. Could be something. A retail manager, you know, McDonald's manager makes like 200 grand or something like that, right?

[A]

High level McDonald's executive chick fil A makes 200 grand. I would say that's a lot of money, no? Yeah.

[B]

Oh yeah, That's a lot of money. Yeah.

[A]

I would say McDonald's manager makes a hundred.

[B]

Yeah. So I mean, but I mean that's. I don't know how fulfilling that could be. I mean like, hey, I run the staff and it revolves all the time. I got these new teenagers coming in to make burgers and pretty soon it's gonna be robots. But then, right, you know, like, yeah, so maybe that's not fulfilling at a,

[A]

at a level you're not getting your fulfillment from your. Or you thought you would be fulfilled from something or you're just. I see people in like, especially in like government and state government There you go. And I'm like, are you really. Are you pension into working at the division of taxation or.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Labor and like. Or pensions and, like, are you really, like, passionate about, like, what about the people? Office work.

[B]

Look. Look at the people at the dmv. You know, it's like this.

[A]

Oh, my God, I was just there.

[B]

But they probably make decent money and they have retirement and pension.

[A]

Pension.

[B]

I mean, how fulfilling can it be just yelling at people all day long.

[A]

No. And they have to be all the same. Like, the California DMV has to be exact same as New Jersey. None of them are any better than.

[B]

Is it because everyone in the world that. That has to go to the dmv, they're all idiots. And so we get treated like idiots. Or are they just so, like, whatever the case.

[A]

I had a guy help me the other day, and he was really pleasant because it was good dude. Like, young. Like, my age. Younger than a lot of them. And I'm like, how did he. I want to ask him, like, how did this happen?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Were you. Are you really into, like, titles? Registration.

[B]

Yeah. Registration, though.

[A]

Yeah. Like you really want to know every little single thing about, like. I don't.

[B]

What lights him up about that? Right?

[A]

Cars, baby, cars. You get to see the VINs. They're like, like, yeah. What? What? Yeah. But then again, maybe it's the pension.

[B]

Yeah. What. What lights you up about? Lines full of people that do not want to be there that don't have

[A]

the right documentation and you have to send them away.

[B]

Can't read English. I mean, what.

[A]

Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

[B]

Okay. So I can see someone exactly like that having some kind of side hustle where they make a little bit of coin to support their hobby. Right. Like me in my garage. I make enough. And then to support their hobby. But it's something that lights them up, gets them excited to wake up in the morning. I'm gonna go do my job and build my pension and take care of my family and have, you know, a nice safety. Yeah. Safety net. And then I'm gonna do this stuff on the side, so.

[A]

And sometimes it evolves and then it evolves, and it's like, okay, I can make a clean break or. I don't know, though. Some people are so invested. You get the year 20. It's like, you're not walking away, dude.

[B]

I've seen a lot of guys. I knew a. I had a buddy that was in the railroad. Yeah, he's in the railroad for, like, 13 years. And he wanted to be a pond guy and like just side hustle, kind of just like dabbling in it, just enough to stick around. But he's not going to leave his job for seven or eight years. But by that time he's going to be 55 and his body's broken. So like how much, how many, how big is the spawn business?

[A]

It's a double edged sword.

[B]

Yeah, it's like, you know, I mean, you can't leave that kind of pension and, and all that stuff for the union or whatever, right. At that level. After 13.

[A]

No.

[B]

Years.

[A]

No, no.

[B]

You're just locked in.

[A]

You're locked in for at least another seven years.

[B]

So something really super interesting new guy I hired, interesting guy. He plays softball like a lot. Four nights a week. Play softball on the weekends. It's just like softball all weekend. Right. And it's interesting. I was talking to the other day, he's just, he's not even at 60 days. He's probably at like 45 days with me. I just gave his 30 day review. We're just chatting and talking and somehow, you know, softball came up. We were talking about it and. And somehow baseball comes up and then somehow baseball cards comes up and I see him kind of light up a little bit. I'm like, oh, you got some baseball cards? He's like, yeah, I got, I got quite a lot. I've been, I said, how long you've been collecting 6? Since 73.

[A]

I'm like, oh my God.

[B]

He's like, yeah. He's like, I have all this sets and this sets and the sets. I'm like, no kidding? He's like, yeah. I'm like, where are you keeping that? What are you keeping those mantles? He's like, in, in the bank, in the safe deposit box. I'm like, no kidding. You know, so like we're developing this conversation. We're just talking about baseball cards, which I, believe it or not, love baseball cards. I've had them. Got rid of them, bought new ones, got rid of them, now I have some. And like, I'm always regretting. Yeah.

[A]

Getting rid of what you got rid of.

[B]

Like, oh man, if I just had them, I'd be a millionaire, you know, like. And then I hate telling that story. Like, well, when I was a kid I had all these, you know, like. So I hate that kind of stuff. But it's funny because we had this really fun talk about it and then that was it. Okay. It's more interesting here. Right. About a year ago, you know, I'm Scrolling through Instagram. I think I went to, like, a. I went to this baseball card show about a year ago in Pasadena, right? And I was just like, blown away. I bought some, like, 1968, the year I was born, 1968 commons to, like, build with my little collection. I was like, just checking the thing out. There's Pokemon cards and, you know, signings and all stuff. It was really fun to see. And then somehow I'm scrolling through Instagram and they're like, I'm paraphrasing this, but it's like, hey, you want a side hustle? You want to side hustle your baseball card business and make a few grand a month on baseball cards? And I'm like, yeah, sign me up. Sign me up. Like, I pay the $50 and like, and then I go to this. I go. Went to a webinar and they're like, teaching me how to do. I swear to God, bro. And I was like, I'm gonna be a side hustle squad baseball card collector, you know, and then what I can do, I can start to sell cards. I can make enough money to, like, recapture my childhood memories and get those cards that I sold that I shouldn't have sold. And I'll build my collection and I'll be doing. It's just a few hours a week, and I'll be able to have time for this. Yeah, I'll make enough money to where I could buy the cards that I want and I could flip them and sell them and, like, it could be fun because I think they're that cool to me. They're that.

[A]

Yeah, that's awesome.

[B]

That interesting to me. And. And so here's where it gets funny. It didn't take long for me to go like, shut the up, Eric. You outside of this. Shut the up. So, like, I deleted the thing or whatever, dude. Totally random. I'm sitting in the office of production manager, where I'm, like, still training him on stuff. And then I get a text, and I don't remember what it said, but it said, are you still interested in side hustle money? Or something like that? Like that. And I was like, who do I have the pleasure of talking to? Like, because I didn't know it was. I'm. Maybe it's a customer. They want a pond. I don't know what they want to do. And they're like, oh, it's the sports card. So. And so do you still want. You still want to. You still want to flip cars on the side for a side hustle? And I was like, looking at it, I'm like, what? I haven't heard from this guy in a year almost. And he's just hitting me up now. And I'm looking at it and I'm like, yo, Brian, look across him. He's like, yeah. I'm like, you want a side hustle? Make some money on some baseball cars. Baseball cars? He's like, oh, I already do. I'm like, you do? He said, yeah. I'm like, how much you make a month? He's a couple grand. I'm like, are you bullshitting? He's like, no, I make a couple grand a month on baseball cards and work on my collection. I'm like, wow, that is so.

[A]

That's awesome.

[B]

And so. But he's jazzed to be part of our team. He's psyched. You know, he was driving over an hour and a half, almost two hours a day to work somewhere else, and now he's. He looks like he lives like seven minutes from the ranch. He comes to work every day.

[A]

He's pumped, life changing.

[B]

He brings donuts and he brings snacks for everyone.

[A]

And he's awesome.

[B]

He's pumped to be at our work. But he loves baseball cards so much, and it's part of his sports health.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Fitness journey. And I was like, I was blown away. And I'm just like, maybe I can

[A]

get back into this.

[B]

Maybe he'll be my partner.

[A]

I almost got out. They got me back in.

[B]

Yeah. So I signed up for this next webinar,

[A]

but that's all. I think everybody has, like, different interests, different levels, different ideas of what success looks like for them. I think some people to just, you know, supplement their income a little bit. Some people just to have fun and like, do, you know, some people to leave their job, Some people to, you know, are more ambitious than others. I think there's just so many different levels of it. But, like, because to say, oh, when does it become a real. A real thing? I think that's ultimately you decide.

[B]

You know, I think I. We do a little event called Art in the arena at our facility. And we have all these local artists.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

They rent a spot.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That money goes to the Wildlife Foundation. We do it in the center right there. And it's like a. It's pretty fun. And we don't have all this stuff from Teemu and like these earrings and hanging on.

[A]

No, you have like,

[B]

person.

[A]

I saw a lot of your content from. From.

[B]

It's cool stuff. So where was I going with this? Oh, so when I. When I look at things like that, I think a lot of people start like, hey, I'm gonna start making sourdough bread. Like, my wife loves this girl in town. She makes sourdough bread. It's the best sourdough bread she's ever had. And it's $20 a loaf. I mean, Jesus. You know what I mean? And so this is a girl's side hustle.

[A]

Right?

[B]

You know what I mean? When I went to my son's event, we did art and clay. It's an event similar to the art in the arena. And you have all these potters. It's all, like, all of them. It's their side hustle. It's either a ceramics teacher at a high school, and he makes so much, and then he loves it. So he's like, what? I can't. My house is already stacked.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I'm just gonna go to the event and I'll sell whatever I have, and it'll help pay for whatever. And so I think that sometimes someone will go, like, I'm gonna start a sourdough business, or I'm gonna do his pottery, and I'll fire and I'll do all the events. And I think they're waiting for, like, this big, special moment where they show up, and all of a sudden they're overwhelmed with work and, like, money's just being thrown at you like crazy, and you're like, wow, I better make this a real business. I think they're just stalled, waiting for something like that to happen. I think there's a little bit of fear built up in the fact that, well, I love this so much that I don't want it to become a real big business, because then I won't love it anymore.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I want to keep it. I'm going to keep it dialed back just enough to where, you know, it's not bad. Like, you know. So I think there's a real tug of war in some of that, for sure.

[A]

Oh, totally. That. Oh, I love that. Yeah, I love it. I love. This is my hobby. I do it for fun. I don't want it to make it into, like, a business, or I do it a little bit, but I don't want to, like, really have to make it into a.

[B]

So a scrolling Instagram probably within the past two days. And I was. You know, I do. I see a lot of pottery stuff because my son's studio and Kathy Jo, she runs my office, she does a lot of pottery. So I see a lot of pottery stuff. So I'm scrolling through and this thing feeds up and it's this really interesting piece being glazed and like, it was shot really well. And the girl was kind of hot too. So she. This hot girl in the night. Nice. Making this glaze. And then she starts carving in the glaze with like a tool after it dried. And it's this gorgeous mermaid breasts out on the mermaid, not the girl doing it. Right on the mermaid.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

The art on the, on the pottery, you know, it's got like woman's breasts and this long, flowing hair and then it turns into the mermaid body and the scales are drawing on. Yeah. It's fascinating to watch because she's literally carving into it by hand. And you're just like watching it going, wow, this is amazing. And I was like, my wife would love this. Like, this is something I could surprise my wife with. So I go to her, I go to her. Her wall, you know, it was just. It was just fed to me on my wall. But I'm like, this is. I go there and it's all about pottery. I'm like, okay, cool. This is a pottery page. And this is probably her side hustle.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And she's probably got. She's probably given everyone in her family three or four gifts out of pottery, and she's got to start selling it now. And it was done so well. It was so beautiful. Then I hit the link tree and then it takes me to like this Etsy thing where she's got them and dude, that one little vase, it's not much bigger than this 16 ounce glass of water, you know, but it's got some cool shape. $450. I was like, good for you, girl. Wow, this is amazing. And it's sold out. Sold out. Hey, it's triplet here. Let's be real. In a world of reels, swipes, and virtual trends, it's easy to forget what really moves the needle. Pond Trade magazine isn't chasing clicks. It's preserving the craft of water features, arguably the last stronghold of long form education in our industry. Where real pond builders, koi pros and innovators share their knowledge unfiltered and unrushed, you won't find gimmicks or clickbait in pawn trade. You'll find depth, detail, strategy story. From advanced filtration systems and aquatic plant care to retail strategies and contractor spotlights, pond trade is where the best in the business speak freely and where the next generation of pond builders learn what it really takes. If you build ponds for a living, maintain them, design them, or dream about Doing it all better. This is your magazine. Delivered free. Written by professionals, received, respected by the entire industry. This isn't just content for the algorithm, it's content for legacy. Subscribe now@pond trademag.com stay connected to the heart of the pond world. Now back to the show. I mean, so they're each one of a kind, but she could maybe make 10 of them, let's say, and then hand carve it because she's got the vision in her head and you know, the. Maybe the vase is a little different color or a smaller, a different shape, but she's at the flow. And I was like, good for you. That is, that's awesome. So, yeah, I follow her now and I'm just like, I'm waiting for the right moment to like catch it and be around Leslie's birthday or mother's like something and just like something that's, boom, I'm getting it. It's not going to be sold out. So it's interesting when it's a piece of art like that and you can create whatever price makes the most sense. What are people willing to pay different than a baseball card?

[A]

That's like the price is dictated based off of, right?

[B]

Yeah. Market value.

[A]

Market value, yeah.

[B]

So you have it. But I, I've always been like, I'm all in. And I've never stopped loving aquatics. And I've been through a lot of.

[A]

You could have been like, I'm off. I'm done with all this.

[B]

Lots of employee problems and business problems and like everything gets in the way and trouble and mad clients and happy clients. Like, it's just, it's a lot, it's a burden to run a business for sure. And man, deep down inside, I just still, I love aquatics. Like, I would literally go to a foundation, I'd go to a pet store right now just to watch, see what fish they have in stock right now. Dude, literally.

[A]

That's awesome.

[B]

While I was upstairs on the.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I got a text from one of my buddies that sent me pictures of his new fish. They just landed. Never seen him before in my life. And I was like, oh, my God, this is the sickest fish I've ever seen.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And I sent him a text. I'm like, I need these. What are we doing? How do I get some?

[A]

That's awesome.

[B]

So I still, I still have this like deep seated love and fascination and for my side hustle that turned into a business.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Wait a minute, wait a minute. Something that I thought was gonna be a side hustle. Turned it into a business, and now it's potentially my side hustle today.

[A]

And complements your.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Otherworld.

[B]

I actually think that's one of my unique positioning pieces as a pawn builder, as a landscape contractor, because I'm not just a pond guy that I'm pretty good at landscaping, so I build ponds, too, because I can make money at it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And I'm really good at rock or something like that. I'm like, I'm a total fish freak. Fish head.

[A]

Number one.

[B]

Number one, Uno. I am only a landscape contractor today because of my love and fascination for fish.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So it's really. It's one of my unique buying positions or selling positions.

[A]

Yeah. That separates you.

[B]

Yeah. I don't think anyone. There's very few guys out there that can set something up ecologically that. That I don't have a pulse on.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, they have to. We have to battle it.

[A]

That's awesome.

[B]

Yeah. I hope you enjoyed that real and honest conversation with M. One of my biggest takeaways on this is not every opportunity deserves a lifetime commitment. Sometimes the hardest entrepreneurial decision isn't starting something new, but it's about having the discipline to let go of something that's good. So you can go, you know, all in or 10x on something. That's great. And for me, putting Train with Triplet on pause and doubling down, tripling down 10xing down on the mission that's been in my heart all along. Building incredible water features and creating thriving ecosystems is just my love, my passion. I'm so excited to get up every day and do that, and part of that is educating people and my team members to help have a larger impact on that, to reconnect families with nature. What you're going to notice here is a small shift in the Deep End podcast from what happened in January. You're still going to hear conversations about leadership and business entrepreneurship and the culture behind all that, building great teams. But they're all going to connect back to that mission of touching people's lives with water. Thanks again for your ears and attention to the Deep End podcast. We'll catch you on the next one. Until next time, I hope you dig ponds as much as I do, Sam.