S2-E51: 25 Years Later: The Pond That Never Gave Up on Its Owner with Shad Dixon

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Deep End with Eric Triplett

Episode: S2-E51 — "25 Years Later: The Pond That Never Gave Up on Its Owner with Shad Dixon"
Date: July 24, 2026
Host: Eric Triplett ("The Pond Digger")
Guest: Shad Dixon

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Overview

This episode departs from technical pond construction to explore the deep, personal significance a backyard pond can hold over decades. Eric Triplett welcomes his long-time friend and client Shad Dixon, for whom he built a pond 25 years prior. Together, they reflect on how the pond has stood as a steadfast backdrop through myriad life changes—children growing up, divorce, renters, and Shad now caring for his elderly mother. It’s a moving look at how, long after installation, a well-crafted pond becomes integral to the family’s evolving story—offering beauty, calm, and a touchstone for memories.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Origin: Friendship and the Decision to Build a Pond

• Background: Eric and Shad became friends as fellow contractors and fathers dropping kids at Montessori school. Their camaraderie led to exchanging services—kitchen remodel for backyard pond.

  • "We were just hanging out, good friends. And, you know, to me, it seemed like it'd be something nice to have in the backyard..." — Shad Dixon [06:27]
  • The pond was initially more Shad’s dream than his spouse’s; she wanted a pool.

• The Social Element: Pond tours, moonlight visits, and a growing appreciation for the pond community.

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Building the Pond: Reality vs. Expectation

• Initial Perceptions: Shad thought the pond would be easy-maintenance—then discovered the required effort, but embraced it as worthwhile.

  • "Like sometimes people think that you don't have to do shit... you have to put some effort in." — Shad Dixon [07:22]

• Phases of Care: For about 15 years, Shad let the pond grow wild. Despite neglect, it survived with minimal intervention, a testament to sturdy design and nature’s resilience.

  • “I didn't touch it for 15 years. Yeah. And the same fish you put in it 15 years before that...were still in it and they were alive.” — Shad [09:15]

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The Pond as Life’s Constant Through Change

• Life Milestones: The pond witnessed family growth, adult children, a divorce, a period with renters, and now Shad’s mother moving in. Through all, it remained—sometimes neglected, but always present.

  • "You know, your kids are all grown up. The kids have moved out now. Your mom’s... moved in. Life happens." — Eric [11:13]
  • “I can't imagine my backyard without it. I like it. I love it.” — Shad [11:29]

• Nature’s Cycles: Original koi and aquatic plants have persisted; grandchildren and pets play by the water. Multiple generations of flora (tiny Japanese maples now enormous) underline the passage of time.

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Stories, Memories, and Family

• Kids & Imagination: Shad’s children made “fairy pancakes” and had tea parties with algae by the water—turning the pond into a site for childhood creativity.

  • “They would make like soup with the algae... ‘try some soup.’” — Shad [19:19]

• Shad’s Mother: Now, at almost 80, she delights in quietly watching fish and hummingbirds drawn by pondside flowers.

  • "Every morning the sliders open, so she can listen to it and watch it. All the hummingbirds that come around...She loves that." — Shad [37:35]

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The Pond's Physical Journey

• Durability: The pond retains original liner, equipment, and most of the original fish—requiring only periodic lighting updates and major plant thinnings.

  • “It’s the original liner. Nothing’s had to been drained and replaced or repaired...You don’t have any leaks still to this day.” — Guest [12:57]

• Design Reflection: Eric and Shad reminisce about construction, from hand-digging the hole to installing dual skimmers and waterfalls.

  • The pond remains central even as decks and landscape structures are remodeled around it.

• Location & Impact: The placement is key—the pond is visible from the kitchen, always within view, amplifying its role in daily life:

  • “Let’s talk about the location, because it’s not back in the corner. It’s like, you’re in your kitchen. You’re right there. Right. You can see it.” — Eric [32:41]

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Challenges & Lessons

• Periods of Neglect: Years of minimal maintenance, a period when renters let it go, and major cleanouts by friends.

  • “I didn’t take care of it at all. And then it still was like nothing...That always amazed me.” — Shad [22:04]

• Nature’s Visitors: Raccoons, possums, skunks, squirrels, and even a “bear-sized” raccoon are regular pond visitors—adding the wild to the domestic.

  • “No, I know. I got one raccoon that looks like a bear.” — Shad [25:33]

• Maintenance Realities: Both the joys and headaches of upkeep, family debates about “pond vs. pool,” and the cycles of falling in and out of love with the pond.

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Future Vision

• Backyard plans: Shad is inspired to remodel again—pavers, new coping, fire pit, outdoor kitchen, pizza oven.

  • “That’s one thing I want to do...a big outdoor kitchen” — Shad [41:34]

• Continued Legacy: Eric notes clients who seek ponds because they remind them of their childhood, and openly reflects on the honor of building such lasting parts of people’s lives.

  • “We aren’t just building water features. We’re creating spaces. These special places in people’s lives where their lives unfold.” — Eric [50:55]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• The Emotional Takeaway:
  • “This water feature is emotionally measured by everything that’s happened around it. After we left the scene...25 years of family dinners and quiet mornings and kids growing up playing around the pond and...new beginnings, and through every chapter, that pond just keeps showing up.” — Eric [50:55]
• On Perseverance & Rebirth:
  • “It was a rebirth when that happened...you went through a divorce and…you find peace...it’s hard. And you come home and chill.” — Eric [24:03]
• The Pond as a Living Time Capsule:
  • “Like you can really grasp...the time that’s spent on how huge that tree is. I mean, this is pre-Internet. This is pre iPhones.” — Guest [13:48]

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Segment Timestamps

• 00:42 – Eric introduces the story’s central theme: a pond’s place in a family’s legacy
• 04:53 – Origins of Shad’s pond and the early days of their friendship
• 06:39 – Reflecting on why Shad chose a pond over a pool
• 09:09 – 15 years of neglect; pond’s resilience
• 11:13 – Life changes: divorce, grown kids, caring for elderly mom
• 13:23 – Changes to surrounding landscape; Japanese maples’ growth
• 18:44 – Memories of kids growing up, playing by the pond
• 22:04 – Amused reflection on neglect vs. effort
• 24:03 – The pond’s role in helping Shad through tough times
• 25:33 – Wildlife encounters: raccoons, skunks, etc.
• 32:41 – The importance of pond placement in the yard
• 37:35 – The pond’s newfound joy and serenity for Shad’s mother
• 41:34 – Shad’s future backyard renovation goals
• 50:55 – Eric’s concluding thoughts on building spaces that host life’s stories

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Tone & Language

The tone is warm, reflective, and candid—full of humor, frank admissions, and affection between friends. Both Eric and Shad speak with the easy camaraderie of long-time colleagues; technical details fade into the background as personal stories take center stage.

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Summary

This episode stands as a heartfelt testament to the enduring power of a pond—not as a construction project, but as a living, breathing part of a home and family legacy. Listeners are left with a sense of respect for the long-term role these water features can play and for the hands that craft them with care. Eric’s pride in his work and Shad’s evolving relationship with his pond become emblematic of the lasting value of craftsmanship, patience, and human connection to nature.

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Transcript

[A]

Welcome to the Deep End with Eric Triplett, the pond digger and inventor of Helix Life Support Pond filtration. For over three decades, Eric and his team have been in the field designing, building, and protecting breathtaking aquatic ecosystems that reconnect people with nature right in their own backyards. Ponds, koi, craftsmanship, culture, business. This is where we dive deep into building a wild, wildly successful brand rooted in nature. Let's dig in.

[B]

Welcome back to the Deep End. My name is Eric Triplett. I'm your host. I'm also the founder of the Pondigger Waterscape design and construction company. And today's guest is an old friend of mine, Shad Dixon. And the story about today is reflecting on how most people buy a water feature because they want to enhance their backyard. They want to, you know, have a place to unwind and relax, chill and find some peace at the end of their day in their very own backyard. And that's what I felt like I've specialized in all these years. But today's story kind of twists it a little bit, because while most people buy their pond thinking that that's what's they're doing it for and that's why it's happening, what's really happening behind the scenes is they're creating a place where life happens in their very own backyard. And the story is built around Shad's story because I built him this pond 25 years ago. The conversation we're going to have is not really about construction. You know, we have a lot of our shows are about construction, business, and so forth. But what the story about is today is what happens after the trucks leave. How does life happen around the pond? The pond that's part of the conversation today has seen toddlers become adults. It survived the birthday parties and the holidays. Teenagers. But family changes, a divorce, renters, a new chapter where Shad is now caring for his mom in that same home where he raised his. His babies.

[C]

Right?

[B]

Think about that. And through all of that, the pond is still there now. The original coir is still swimming in this pond. The water still brings peace. And today, Shad really appreciates that pond in a different way and more than he ever did when it was brand new. In fact, at the end of the conversation, I feel like Shadow was thinking about his backyard in a completely new fashion. Like, I want to bring this back to life. This has been so important to me. It's been, you know, shad's approaching 60, and the pond's 25. I mean, this pond has been with him half his Life. Nearly. If you've ever wondered whether a pond is worth the investment, this episode isn't about features or filtration. It's about building something that becomes part of your family's story. And one thing that I didn't bring up in the conversation with Chad, and I wish I would have thought about it when it was happening, was, you know, we've built ponds for grown adults that are building the pond because it was part of their history from their father who had the pond in the backyard, and they still have a water lily rhizome from, you know, their grandfather's pond or something like that. I mean, there's lots of really interesting, fun stories about how the pond has been an important part of this person's life, and now they're buying a new house or they've moved into our state, and they want us to put that in their backyard so they could have that piece of history. So, yeah, it was. It was a really cool story. And it just makes me think about what we've been specializing in for all these years and how it moves me because I know that touching people's lives with water in the most profound way has been what we've been doing and what we're going to continue to doing. So hope you enjoy the conversation. Welcome to the Deep End.

[D]

Little fireside chat here at the Pondiga Ranch tonight, and I think I have a fun, interesting journey for pond people. I have Slaters in the house. He's had his pond at least 10 or 12 years. Huh? How long?

[E]

I think 10 years.

[D]

10 years?

[E]

Yeah. This current pond, right?

[D]

No, just. I mean, how long have you had a pond?

[E]

Oh, no, I've had a pond since probably 2005.

[D]

No kidding?

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

Okay, that's great. And, Tyson, you've had a pond for about eight years?

[F]

Yep.

[D]

Okay, so my special guests, Shad Dixon. I built him a pond probably 2001. So I professionally built him a pond 25 years ago. And so the story goes, our kids went to the same school together. They were in Montessori and Redlands. And, you know, we got to know each other. We're dropping off the kids. You know, I'm an entrepreneur. He's an entrepreneur. I'm a contractor. He's a contractor. Like, we're dropping our kids off at private school. It's, you know, life was good. We got to talking, hanging out, and we would be at the, you know, the after school specials and all this stuff. We became buddies. And, you know, here we are 25 years later, still. Still buddies. And so he did some kitchen work for me. I'm doing pond work for him. And so I'm really proud to say, you know, the pond that I did for him 25 years ago, still standing, still kicking, still rolling, same equipment. I mean, we've talked about upgrading and we've talked about doing some other stuff, but I kind of want to walk through the journey of someone not as a professional, but as someone who's just been. Had a pond in their place for 25 years. Shad has the experience. I mean, I can give you some stuff as a. As someone who was just a hobbyist before it turned professional for me, but. So, Shad, kick it off. Let's talk about your pond. What was I just such a cool, magnetic guy? You just had to have a pond or, like, what. What prompted you to do it?

[C]

We were just hanging out, good friends. And, you know, to me, it seemed like it'd be something nice to have in the backyard and be.

[D]

We had pond tours back then.

[C]

Right.

[D]

You probably came, I probably invited you over to the pond tour. Sat around the pond, moonlight pond tours going on.

[C]

Right.

[D]

We're kicking back. People are walking, checking the pond. You're like, I could get into this.

[C]

Yeah, no, too. And. And then also when we were going to do it, it was, oh, this is like a. Like its own ecosystem. And it's really easy. And then I found out real quick that it's. It's not that easy. Like, it's not.

[D]

Come on.

[C]

It's not perfect, but how much have

[D]

you liked on that pond? But if you like.

[C]

I know. But if you like it, then it's worth, like, working on. It's worth doing the work. It's like putting the. You have. You have to put some effort in.

[B]

Like.

[C]

Like sometimes people think that you don't

[A]

have to do shit.

[C]

Like, you could just, like, you just put some water in there, put some fish in there, and you don't have to do anything.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

There's no work involved.

[D]

Hey, Ty said there's no work. Hold on. Just so you know, your mic's on when you're digging. Ice chest over there.

[C]

Sorry, everybody.

[D]

Red spots. Spikes going on over here everywhere.

[E]

I think you're able to isolate him.

[C]

It does require work. Like, there's not. And it's okay.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

If you want a pawn, then you need to understand that there is work.

[D]

But let's put this in perspective. So at the time, you were kind of. You were remodeling the backyard. You were putting deck in all around the back Porch, like you were making some backyard improvements to just enhance your lifestyle. You know, you got three babies and, and not at the time you didn't, but you had kids and wife and all this stuff. You know, retaining walls to like make your little compound and I mean, come on, when you do a garden, like, what do you plant, like a hundred tomatoes at a time and.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, so, so I mean that has to put some perspective in like you're in the backyard all the time, right?

[C]

No, I do, I like it.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

No, it was, it was, it was something, it was something that I wanted more than my spouse wanted. She wanted a pool. I was like, nah, I'm, I'm cool with the pond. I really would rather have a pond.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And so a pond is what it was. And it, you know, I still like it now. Like, and for like probably 15 years, I didn't do anything to it. I just let it over grow.

[D]

So see, see, so this is an oxymoron. Cuz you got to do a lot of work to it. But then I didn't touch it for 15.

[C]

I didn't touch it for 15 years. Yeah. And the same fish you put in it 15 years ago or like 15 years before that.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Were still in it and they were alive. And then I had to have, you know, then we came over and we took out like two full size bed loads full of like lily pads and just all the plants and all the stuff because it was so overgrown, you could literally walk across it. Like you were walking on water. Like you just walk across the pond. There was, there was nothing. There's roots and plants everywhere.

[E]

And did you, did you build your pond day one, like the size that like today you're still like.

[D]

Yeah, same pond.

[C]

Yeah, same pond.

[E]

I mean, you're still happy with how big it is?

[C]

Oh yeah, it's nice. It's a big pond. Yeah, it's not small. I mean it's not huge, but I

[D]

mean it's probably 15 by 20.

[C]

Yeah, it's at least waterfalls. It's at least four foot deep.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah, four foot deep. And I probably have 30 some fish in there.

[E]

Nice.

[C]

You know, so. Yeah, no, it's, it's nice. It's just, it's crazy how I didn't give a crap about it because I was so mad about other things for like 15 years and then cleaned the whole thing up, put it back together and it looks brand new again.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, you sent me, you sent me a photograph. I want to put a little context here. So I want people to hear this podcast that have a pond now, or they've had a pond for many years, and they can reflect on their life. But you went through a divorce. You know, your kids are all grown up. The kids have moved out now. Your mom's, you know, not doing so well. Mom's moved in. Like, life happens.

[C]

Oh, my mom loves it.

[D]

Yeah. But I mean, I'm just saying life happens.

[G]

Like when you build the pond.

[D]

I mean, if someone's listening to this and they've only had a pond for two or three years and they're into it, it's like, you know, fast forward into the future 25 years, and, like, you know, things can happen. Like, like I said, well, I can't

[C]

imagine my backyard without it. I like. I like it. I love it.

[D]

It's cool. I want to put some more context to here, too, because

[G]

two of my

[D]

team members rent a house for me, which I think is so cool. Right, right.

[E]

So.

[D]

And, you know, as part of the rent agreement, they take, you know, they come and kiss that pond. So it's perfect at all times, right?

[A]

Yep.

[D]

So they're. They're over there, like, tweaking on the pond and everything. But I remember one time, it must have been last fall, you know, just like maybe eight or nine months ago, you sent me this photo of the pond. They had just redone all the lights. You know, the lights had to be replaced because they were. They were old. Right, right. So we updated the lighting system, and you sent me a photo of the pond at night, and I was like, damn, this pond's super sick. I mean, I did this thing 25 years ago because, you know, when you. When you think back, like, I'm really proud of your pond because, you know, like, we went a lot deeper. We had this cool jet in there. Dual skimmers, dual waterfalls, and, like, we really went all out on it. And here it is 25 years later, and it's. I'm so, so proud of it still. It's really dope, pond. It's nice when you sent me that, because when you sent me that photo of the. Of the night, of the nightscaping with all the lights on around it, I was like, this pond looks literally brand new.

[C]

Yeah, it looks brand new.

[D]

It looks literally like someone just installed it yesterday. It was so, so nice looking.

[F]

What's even cooler is it's the original liner. Nothing's had to been drained and replaced or repaired. Yeah, right there. Nothing's ever penetrated it. You don't have any Leaks still to this day.

[D]

Same skimmers.

[F]

Same skimmer.

[D]

Here's what's cool. When we planted that pond, like I think I, I have this vague memory there's maybe some oleanders behind the pond. We ripped them out. Is that right?

[F]

We ripped them out.

[D]

Yeah, we ripped out these old oleanders. Like get these things out here. They're bad for kids, bad for dogs, bad for spawns.

[A]

Right.

[D]

They're gone. And then we planted some like Japanese maples and they were tiny.

[C]

They're huge.

[D]

Yeah, they were tiny. When we planted them. They were like little, little 3 gallon or 5 gallon plants. They were skinny. Now they're like as tall as the house. They're hanging over the waterfalls. They just look. They look.

[A]

Yeah.

[E]

That's awesome.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah, that's definitely like a time capsule. Whatever. You know what I mean?

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Like you can really grasp, grasp the time that's spent on how huge that tree is.

[D]

I mean this is pre Internet. This is pre iPhones. Like I can't take like, hey, there's, here's the before and after. Here's original from that time era, you know.

[A]

Right.

[D]

I just can't capture that. And so, you know, here's the, here's the topic with Shad. Like let's, let's try and document it like the story right there.

[G]

Hey, it's Triplett here. Listen. In a world where quality is often overlooked, Helix Life Support stands proud, bringing you American made excellence for your koi ponds and water gardens. And I want you to know I worked in the field for over 15 years and had professionally built nearly a thousand ponds before I designed my own proprietary filtration equipment. So trust and believe when I say that Helix Life Support is a product line that was crafted for those who demand durability, advanced technology and a deep commitment to fish friendly designs. Now at the heart of the product line is our patented award winning Helix pond skimmer. Built with the safety for your koi and other fish as our top priority. No sharp edges, no unnecessary risks. Just an innovative fish friendly skimmer you can trust. And every piece of Helix equipment that's made made is with high quality materials so you can get a filtration system that's as tough and reliable as it is efficient. Whether you're a first time pond builder or a professional contractor looking to elevate your game, my team and I are ready to help you realize that vision. For personalized pond design assistance or to get your hands on Helix Life support filtration equipment. Give us a call today. At 800-522-5043. That's 800-522-5043. Support American craftsmanship and choose Helix life

[D]

support for your pond.

[G]

Built for koi. Built for life. Built for you.

[F]

I don't have anything that's lasted me 25 years. You know what I mean? I don't have anything in my house that's 25 years old. So the fact that that's still there, still operating, still flowing, still tits, I mean, that's. It's pretty.

[D]

Well, let's talk about it. The deck started to get dilapidated, right?

[C]

Yep.

[D]

You had to rip the deck out and there was another big tree that was there. That. That tree's.

[C]

That tree died.

[D]

That tree died? Yeah. Like it was a giant mulberry or walnut or something.

[C]

No, it's a big maple tree.

[D]

Big old. It's huge. Like a huge maple.

[C]

Like a silver maple.

[F]

Yeah.

[D]

30 footer or something, right?

[C]

No, it was bigger than 40.

[D]

Yeah, it was just huge tree.

[C]

I mean, it's had died.

[D]

Yeah.

[G]

Like two people.

[D]

Like you couldn't hug and, and touch the other side. Like Tyson, if you're on the side. It's that big, right.

[F]

Wow.

[D]

And that was coming up through the deck and it was just like this really cool spot. And now it's like the deck's gone. That tree's gone. But bam.

[C]

And now it's dirt.

[D]

That's all dirt. And now he's like, I gotta remodel the backyard.

[C]

Right.

[D]

But the pond is still.

[C]

No, the pond's still the focus.

[D]

It's still cherry enough that it doesn't

[F]

have to be remodeled.

[C]

No, I want to do like pavers and I want you to put in some big like coping around the one part. Put in the. Put in the gas, you know, fire pit. Fire pit.

[D]

Well, there was one set section where there was like the deck came up and there was like a little brick. Brick planter or something. But like the deck came up next to the pond. So it was like the pond's really low profile there. So what he's saying now is like, let's put some giant, you know, four foot slabs of stone.

[C]

Yeah. Because the deck used to go across

[D]

the pond to kind of like cantilever over that spot.

[C]

The deck used to go across the pond like Atlantis does.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Where you could. Like you were standing out over there and you'd be over top of the pond.

[E]

I think I've only been over to your place once.

[F]

Yeah.

[E]

And I barely kind of remember after I.

[C]

Probably after I tore out the deck.

[F]

The deck was gone.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, because the deck's over there now, so.

[D]

Well, that's cool because. So some of the material, the undercarriage of his original deck was falling apart, so he stripped it and he had that, you know, synthetic wood as the top piece.

[A]

Piece.

[D]

And that's, that's around Atlantis right now. That's, that's the top part of the deck right there. It's not perfect, but it's like it was, it was a fun reusable resource that we were able to put on the pond and, and tie it together.

[E]

That's what the ranch is all about.

[D]

Yeah, the ranch is all repurposed. Cool stuff. So that, that makes it even more special. So like a piece of that original pond is in my, my yard right now.

[F]

Yeah.

[D]

So talk about, do you remember your kids around the pond? I mean, because you. Oh yeah. You only had one baby when we built that pond and now you have three grown up adults, right?

[C]

But when they were little, it was all about making fairy pancakes.

[D]

What do you mean?

[E]

Making what?

[C]

They would take all the like algae and the moss, like the green. And they would take and make like, they'd make like these pancakes out of it for their fairy friends and stuff around the boat.

[D]

So you were slave, you were slaving your kids, like, pick the algae.

[E]

Here's a fun game.

[D]

Let's make it a fun story. This is hilarious.

[C]

No, it's just they did some weird stuff around it. Like they would make like soup with the algae. Like, you know, add like all this stuff and like, oh, look, try some soup.

[E]

Eric makes some wafer.

[C]

Yeah. And I'm like, yeah, okay, that looks awesome. But no, I remember, like me, I didn't have a problem with like, I loved the pond. And it was this constant like barrage from the other one who would just talk about how terrible it was we didn't put in a pool and you know, whatever, I, I liked it. I loved it and kept it all this time. And so what, at times I abused it and then it still came back.

[E]

What, what equipment's in your pond right now?

[C]

Aquascape.

[E]

Oh, you have aquascape?

[C]

Yeah, the original stuff that they used.

[D]

He's got one of the grande waterfall filters. It's like a coffin. It's huge.

[E]

Yeah. Okay.

[C]

Which like I was telling you earlier, all the, like that big circular thing. No, no, it's like a big bathtub.

[D]

It's like more rectangular. It's huge.

[C]

It's huge. Like I was telling you earlier, how, how when the fish when the fish have babies, somehow they wind up going through the skimmer and wind up in that top waterfall body. Yeah.

[E]

I'm trying to remember.

[C]

And then I'll have, like, 50 or 100 fish in there.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Little baby ones.

[D]

Well, because the eggs, you know, we have a solid tantaline pump in there. Let's talk about. This is cool.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

So the tub is literally like. It's like a, you know, Rubbermaid tote. That's like 150 gallons or something. It's big. Right. And so there's a lot of open space. There's a lot of open water in those particular filters. And when the fish spawn, there's eggs everywhere. And then the eggs would get picked up by the solids handling motor. And. And the impeller would not chop the eggs up because they're so small and fine. It would push it up to that filter, and so the eggs would incubate up in the grande waterfall filter. And then all of a sudden, you know, you go to clean that waterfall a couple, three months later. Because at the time, he probably only cleaned it every six months.

[C]

Right.

[D]

Or once a year.

[C]

Right. I wasn't. I wasn't doing anything.

[D]

Or. Or once every 15 years. Right.

[C]

I wasn't doing.

[D]

I wasn't taking care of it at all.

[C]

And that's what always amazed me, is that. That I didn't take care of it at all. And then it still was like nothing. Like, nobody ever had stopped taking care of.

[D]

Yeah. Can we just go back to the beginning of the podcast when you're like, yeah, he told me you didn't have to do nothing, and it was a lot of work.

[C]

Right.

[D]

And now you don't. But then I don't touch it for 15 years. I just want to make sure everyone heard that the second time.

[C]

Yeah. But I didn't have to do a lot of work, and it's still there,

[D]

so.

[C]

But you go through phases where you like.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Like, sometimes you're like. Like, sometimes they'd be like, I'm gonna bury this thing in dirt. You know, that's because you were trying to.

[D]

You were thinking about.

[B]

Right.

[C]

I'm just like, ah, I'm sick of this crap. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of it. But I was mad about other things.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, and then. And then got it all cleaned up. And then, you know, a friend of ours came and cleaned it out because I traded him his bathroom showers.

[D]

Yep.

[C]

And he.

[D]

Cameyer, my buddy.

[C]

Yeah. Stay Meyer.

[D]

He started building Pots with me at the same time. We met probably in 96 or 97. Yeah, 98, whatever. Like in that range right there. We met at a convention.

[C]

You know, he's on a walk, right?

[D]

Yeah. Forever. The Pacific Crest. It's amazing.

[C]

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So he came and cleaned out my pond. And I've known him for a long time, too. He's bought a lot of, like a lot of countertops from us over the years because, you know, they. He. He's got a lot of. His brother is a cat, a cabinet guy. So we've done a lot of stuff for him over the years, and he came and cleaned it out and, you know. Yeah. Now I love it again, you know, like. I don't know. It's like a love hate thing with me.

[D]

Well, it was a rebirth when that happened, and I think I kind of want to pick that up because,

[E]

you

[D]

know, not to bring up any dirt or. But like, you know, you went through a divorce and like, you know, you're going through dark times and, you know, you're mad at everything and didn't care about it. Yeah. And then, you know, things evolve and suddenly you find this newfound love for things, and so you find peace. Yeah. And let's face it, you're a contractor. You go, you. You bust your ass at work. You're getting hand grenades throwing at you all day long. You know, you're dodging bullets like it's. It's hard. Yeah. And you come home and chill.

[C]

No, I like it. Except for the animals that decide that the skunks, that they must live around my pond. Possums and raccoons and ferrets and skunks and squirrels. And squirrels, not so bad. They don't try to eat the fish. But the rest of them I could really care less for. I got a ferret right now, so.

[F]

But let.

[D]

Let's. Let's be. Let's be real. So it's nature. It's in your backyard, right?

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

And you're in Beaumont. You have a couple big open fields really close by you, and they're all interconnected all sudden. You know, you could probably get to Bogart park from your place with barely crossing one or two streets.

[C]

Right.

[D]

You know, just weaving through the ditches and the. You know, so, I mean, you're in the wilderness, man.

[C]

No, I know. I got one raccoon that looks like a bear.

[D]

Someone else has said that before. They thought there was a bear in their back backyard was a giant raccoon.

[C]

Yeah. It was like this Big raccoon, and he gets in that big waterfall body and takes a big bath and then takes off.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

That's hilarious.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

So mistaking a raccoon for a bear.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Tell us. Tell us, like, a real memorable story about the pond.

[F]

Oh,

[E]

What about. Is there any construction stories? There wasn't any. Was it flawless? Did it just. We didn't have any issues with space or.

[C]

Eric did shut off all the water to my house, and then I. I had to yell at him and call him up and go, hey, like, there's no water. Like, half of my house. I don't know what happened. So then he come over, and we, like, had to rerun some water lines and then. And then hook up water to the other side of the house.

[E]

Like, how many ponds have. Have you done to this point? Is it hundreds or thousands?

[D]

No, no, no, no, no. So 2000,

[E]

I would think it's. It's like.

[D]

I'd say 2000. I'm trying to remember if it's 2002. We did, like, 97 ponds or 98 ponds, and then we did three years consecutive of like 100 ponds a year. But up to that point, I probably was. I probably had 100 ponds under my belt.

[E]

Okay.

[D]

You know, and, you know, before his pond, there was probably ponds that I wouldn't be really excited to, you know, shoot, show off. I was either dealing with a budget or, you know, I was still trying to figure out how to, you know, be a good pond builder and Be a good pond builder and a contractor and a boss and plus my kids. So, like. Yeah, I mean, I was still really green, but as, you know, as much as I love. Love the art and the craft and the. In the whole ecosystem, a part of it. I mean, 100's not out of line to be saying.

[E]

Yeah. So I'm sure you've learned a lot since then.

[D]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[E]

So it wouldn't be surprising if there were some hiccups during that build.

[D]

His backyard was pretty open. He was doing a lot of remodels. I mean, we dug the whole thing by hand, which was brutal. Like, I. In the beginning. My. My beginning. Start of my career, probably. Yeah.

[C]

But then we tore down that one wall so you could get. Because you did bring in some huge rocks.

[E]

Yeah, you probably.

[D]

But I didn't use a machine. I just had these.

[C]

No, you used a bobcat.

[G]

It might have been 80s.

[C]

It could have been.

[D]

Maybe. Might have brought in some rock for me.

[C]

Yeah. Because his dad didn't know how to build a Fence.

[D]

I remember that well. I just, I wasn't using machines, you know.

[E]

Did you own any then?

[D]

No.

[E]

So if, if you had one, you'd rent it, right?

[G]

Remember?

[C]

Because we had that one section where you guys had brought in a piece of equipment through the backyard.

[D]

Yeah, that. That's kind of gray to me. I don't really remember.

[C]

It probably was abs or maybe something like that.

[D]

Yeah, I mean, I probably relied on another contractor. I was like, hey, I'll bring some big rocks so you get them back there to us.

[G]

Hey, it's tripola here. Let's be be real. In a world of reels, swipes and virtual trends, it's easy to forget what really moves the needle. Pond Trade magazine isn't chasing clicks. It's preserving the craft of water features, arguably the last stronghold of long form education in our industry, where real pond builders, koi pros and innovators share their knowledge unfiltered and unrushed. You won't find gimmicks or clickbait weight in pond trade. You'll find depth, detail, strategy story. From advanced filtration systems and aquatic plant care to retail strategies and contractor spotlights, pond trade is where the best in the business speak freely and where the next generation of pond builders learn what it really takes. If you build ponds for a living, maintain them, design them, or dream about doing it all better, this is your magazine. Delivered free, written by professionals respected by the entire industry. This isn't just content for the algorithm, it's content for legacy. Subscribe now@pond trademag.com stay connected to the heart of the pond world. Now back to the show.

[C]

What Eric did was kind of. I mean, what he did was pretty much went smooth, but then all the other people that we found, like, people he knew and people I knew to try and do all this other stuff we wanted to do. I don't know, they kind of like sucked. I mean, back then. I mean, like.

[D]

So you're saying back when I wasn't even that good, I was fucking badass?

[C]

No, you were great. It's just like, like the guy who did the fence, like he bought those eight foot cells, sections of fence, but then put the poles in the ground 10ft apart.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

And I'm like, what are you doing here? You know, and then it's all running, like, not level. It's all screwed up. And then we had done these big giant brick retaining walls and stuff to hold back like a whole lot of dirt. Like, the walls on the outside were like 11ft. And we had to put in keystone footings and, like, do all this special stuff and use, like, the same rebarb they use on the freeway in order to make sure the wall didn't crack or move. And they did a great job, you know, building the wall and filling all the cells and putting all the rebarb in. And then I ran all the electrical pipe and put it all on the ground and stuff and taped everything off. But then they buried it all, and they knew it was there. And then I had to go buy a jackhammer so I could jackhammer up all the concrete and pour water through the top of it to see where the water came out at the bottom. So I knew where to jackhammer it up so I could run wire.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

I was like, come on. You guys are making my life.

[D]

Let's not.

[C]

You guys make my life rough.

[D]

I delivered what I said. I was gonna.

[C]

He did a great job.

[D]

I was gonna do it.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

But, you know, but the pond was really a centerpiece behind, like, building the whole backyard.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

It was like, you know, it was like, I'm gonna do a pond, and then I'll do a deck, and then I'm gonna build the garden. I'm gonna plant the maples, and I'm gonna do the walls and all that stuff. So it was.

[C]

Right.

[D]

And that still is the case to this day, where, you know, that's kind of the foundation of how a lot of our work is where we go in and we create that centerpiece, and that's usually the best, because I can put the pond in a spot. Let's talk about the location, because it's not back in the corner. It's like, you're in your kitchen. You're right there. Right.

[C]

You can see it.

[D]

You see everything.

[C]

Right. No, the. The way we kind of like, the way we discussed it and what happened. Like, I have pictures of the house before you did it. Like, I do have all those pictures. I have pictures before you. Before it happened. And I even have, like, where you had taken, like, the.

[D]

The hose or something, the paint.

[C]

The paint thing or whatever else and drew the shape of it.

[D]

You have those pictures?

[C]

Yeah, I do. I have those pictures. And.

[E]

And then we'll throw those in the video.

[C]

Yeah, And. And so I have those. And then we did all that stuff, and we. You know, we dug the whole thing up and did everything, and it was. I don't know. I. I mean, I had this idea on top of yours of kind of, like, what I grew up with, and my dad's House, two neighbors down. The guy used to have this amazing, like, koi pond, but he had bamboo everywhere, and he had, like, this nature trail that went all along his backyard. And he would go through there and walk along the, you know, the pea gravel going through there, and they had, like, you know, you know, water features, like. Like bird feeders and stuff like that. In a pond. Koi pond. It wasn't a big koi pond, but it was still a koi pond and all this stuff and everything else. And I was like, that's why at my place, how. You know, the pea gravel goes back behind the back of it, and, like, you can walk all around the Naples.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah, that's. That's kind of like the same idea.

[D]

Yeah, I love that part of it.

[C]

And then I was like, well, let's plant some bamboo. And you're like, no, we're not planning bamboo. And then I found those. Those trees, like they use at. At Disneyland, that grow up super tall and get really bushy, that block out everything. And I planted those all over back behind there. And you can't, like, you can't see a neighbor's house from my backyard. Yeah, like, it's covered. Like, you could just. All you see is the pond and the trees.

[D]

So you think your wife has a pool at her new place? No, she doesn't.

[C]

Doesn't have anything. Like, she bought that new place up in Redlands, and they don't have. They don't, you know, they have a nice backyard. It's a big backyard right on the back side of the canyon, and it's big backyard.

[D]

But

[C]

I don't know if. Not being mean, but maybe you're broke.

[D]

Oh, here we go.

[C]

You spent $1.2 million on a house that's worth 5. Maybe you don't have money to put in a pool. I don't know.

[F]

Not your concern anymore.

[C]

No, it's not.

[E]

That's somebody else's problem.

[F]

Good luck.

[D]

That's.

[C]

That's somebody else's problem for sure.

[D]

Tell me about. Tell me about your mom's experience, because she probably came over and saw the kids at Christmas and things of that and saw the pond out there. And now here she is, you know.

[C]

You know, she. She came out. She came out like. So the thing is, is, like, that was the other thing that happened that kind of. Kind of was a little bit, you know, crazy is that we moved from that house to another house on the other side of Beaumont because we had to have a pool and fancy new closets and bedrooms and Stuff. Stuff and everything else. And. And so when we moved, we rented the house out to my ex's secretary. Well, they didn't really take care of the place and that's why it got really bad. So the, the, like they didn't take care of the pond at all. Like, I'm surprised it managed to make it through them being there for the, you know, three or four years that they were there. And I didn't go there and take care of it because I was too busy with work. No one else took care of it. So I'm surprised that the pumps worked. I'm surprised that anything managed to make it. Like, I figured I'd go over there after I moved back into the house and I figured it'd just be destroyed and it wasn't. Everything was still semi working. And then I came up and saw you right away and got a pumpkin because the pump wasn't working that well. So I got some pumps from you. I took care of some other stuff. And then, you know, and then Russell came or Russ came over and did the pond clean out and did all other stuff and we cleaned it all up. And then of course, then your guys moved into my rental house and then. And now they take care of it. And so now it's like it looks brand new again. So it took some work. But.

[D]

But back to your mom. So your mom. But. But when you had babies, she'd probably.

[E]

My mom.

[C]

My mom had been there like once or twice. She hadn't been there very much.

[D]

Okay. Okay.

[C]

But my mom, My mom. My mom had been at the new house that we had more often.

[D]

Okay.

[C]

But now that my mom lives with me and she's there all the time, she loves it. Like she. Every morning the sliders open, you know, so she can listen to it and watch it. All the hummingbirds that come around, like we probably have. There's hummingbirds all day long that are eaten. Like there. There's all those red. I don't know what those red flowers are. They're like a lily or like some kind of red flower you planted that comes up in the pond. Yeah, they're in the pond, like around the pond. And then those big leaf things, I don't know what they're called. And then there's like some other flowers and stuff around the pond and then a couple hummingbird feeders. But there must be, you know, because there still has all those. The night blooming jasmine and like the honeysuckle, like, like entry things for going in. And so there must be. I Don't know. There must be 50, 60, like hummingbirds that come through there all day. Yeah, my mom just sits there and watch those. She likes the sound of the pond and she goes out there all the time and like feeds the fish and feeds the turtle or the turtles and you know, I mean, it's, you know, for her. She loves doing that. And so how old is she? She's almost 80. She likes, she loves that. So.

[D]

One day you're gonna be 80, just out there enjoying your pond.

[C]

Yeah, I'll be in it.

[D]

Yeah, I like laying down next to the creek.

[C]

Look at my new bathtub.

[A]

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[D]

No, I remember that was another thing

[C]

we used to say all the time because you're like, when we built, we built that one little section that was like a plateau that was in the pond so the kids could sit there and put their feet in the pond. And of course they, they used to, but then, you know, the ex would get all upset because she thought it was too, too dirty.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Cuz there's algae and all this stuff and grouse. Grouse, you know, and like I just.

[D]

Turtle poop?

[C]

Yeah, turtle poop.

[D]

Gonna get salmonella.

[C]

I mean like whatever. And then they're out there like making, you know, like I said, they're making like fairy pancakes and fairy tea and stuff out of the algae and everything else and cups and stuff and Having tea parties out in the patio with the algae from the pond. So I don't think they cared.

[D]

Tell us about your new vision for the backyard around the pond. Because you said pavers and a fire pit, and I want to do.

[C]

I want to do the favors in the fire pit, and I want to put it out like a. Like, you know, because, you know, I do, you know, I do kitchens and I do lots of construction work, so I want to do like a big outdoor kitchen, like put in one of those, like, pizza ovens, barbecue.

[D]

And you're not bad.

[C]

Yeah, I want to do like one of those pizza ovens, you know, and like a whole outdoor barbecue area. I already have all the plumbing and everything there for it.

[D]

I just have a pizza oven. Yourself, or will you, like, add a brick or will you buy something?

[E]

I'm old.

[C]

I'm gonna buy one.

[F]

Okay.

[D]

Slayer's devastated.

[E]

I was like, please say you're gonna build it.

[C]

I would. You know, I probably could, but I just don't have time. I know.

[E]

Yeah, I get it.

[C]

Time's a problem for me. You know, all I do is work,

[E]

so I'm the same.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

So if I want a pizza oven, I'd love to build one, but I'd probably end up buying one.

[C]

Right. So I just. I don't have. I don't have time for it. So I just put one in and then just. I don't know. There's a couple things I'd like to do, so. I mean, that. That's one thing I want to do. Like, I. I was doing a garden in the backyard for a long time, you know, and growing, you know, tomatoes.

[D]

Out on that a little bit, huh? You kind of petered out on that a little bit.

[C]

It's a lot of work. Like, people don't understand how much gardening is. I mean, it's a lot of work.

[D]

Well, you could scale it down a bit. You don't have to plant at 100 tomatoes, bro.

[C]

Well, no, I put in like, you know, 15 tomato plants and get like 300 tomatoes every couple weeks, you know?

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And then, you know, cucumbers and all this stuff and everything else. But that's not the problem. The problem is weeding. That's the problem. It's like it's constantly work. So I'd rather just tear it all out.

[D]

80 year old mom out there. Mom pull the weeds.

[C]

Yeah, right.

[D]

I keep around.

[C]

I could put in a pool over there.

[F]

You just pulled landscaping duty?

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah.

[F]

Use my fingers.

[C]

Well, that's what I do with the kids all the time. Like, if we have, like, I'll schedule a job in the desert, and then I'll have all the employees show up at my house in the morning at like, 7. Then we'll work at my house for two hours and weed and landscape the whole place in like, two, three hours. Jump in the truck and then go do a job.

[F]

Now your back's coming to hurt too,

[C]

But it gets done. Yeah, you got paid for it. Get out of here. Let's go. Time to go put in this kitchen.

[D]

Wait, that wasn't. Was that dodgeball? What was. It wasn't Something About Mary.

[A]

What movie was.

[F]

It's. It's Adam Sandler.

[D]

I know it's Adam Sandler, but which one?

[F]

When he. He plays hockey. No. Oh, plays golf.

[C]

The dad one.

[E]

Oh, Happy Gilmore.

[F]

Gilmore.

[D]

Is it Happy.

[F]

Happy Gilmore. That's what it's called. And he puts his mother. His mom, his grandma's in a home. And the. The carekeeper of the. Of the old people. He's like. He's having him.

[C]

Ben, huh? Yeah, Ben Stiller.

[F]

He's having them, like, well, make quilts.

[C]

Yeah.

[F]

And he's on this. He's like, one on the. One of those old cell phones that's, like, as big as a brick. He's like, this is high quality shit, man. Are you gonna be able to pick up this order? He's like, I got 100 quilts getting ready here. Cause he's like, selling them on the black market. And one of the little ladies in the group's like, excuse me, sir. My fingers are hurting. And he's like, I gotta go. I'll call you back. And he's like, oh, your fingers hurt? He's like, yeah, I've been quilting all day. And he's like, well, now your back's gonna hurt. Cause you just pulled landscaping duty. He, like, escorts around the room to

[D]

come up with an old.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

An old movie parallel.

[F]

Is this funny?

[D]

All right, cool. Well, let's button it up. I think it was just cool to kind of reflect on that. You want to throw some stuff in on this because you've already done some remodels. The special thing about shads is it's never had that massive remodel. You've probably had two or three ponds since.

[E]

Well, yeah, that's the whole thing. Like when I was saying earlier that, like, I had a pond, like 2005, but that was the Costco box thing where I just dug with the shovel real quick. And then. And then when I bought this house that I'm in, I. I dug my own pond. I went, you know, I went, I went super big. And it was only what, like 10 by 4, 6, something like that. And then. But now I got the expert in there. Got the great pond.

[D]

So it's as big as a swimming pool.

[E]

Yeah, it's.

[D]

It's a great pond.

[E]

I love it. So. But I was, I was wondering if we could talk about somehow. About like, like my yard. His yard. His yard. Like, the difference in the ponds. How, like, I know yours is like pretty well done, right? Like, as far like you're are, I don't think your whole yard's like completely done. You're still working on yours.

[G]

Used to be.

[C]

And it's just. Right now it's in the middle of me just pulling the trigger on redoing parts of it.

[E]

But you have like mine where like

[C]

I, I like 90, like I would say 80% of it's done. There's just this area where I tore out the, where I tore out the deck where it's just like.

[E]

Well, I have like a big ass yard and the only thing that's nice is my pond.

[C]

Right?

[E]

And then you have Tyson, whose, like entire backyard looks like immaculate. Yeah, it looks like a magazine.

[F]

I pull all the rock out between my stepping stones and vacuum.

[C]

Yeah, the. Yeah, I just, I, I don't have time. It's not that I don't want to. Like, like I, I literally, because of my business, the way I structured it over the years, and because I, and, and other reasons too. And we don't have to get into that because that's, that's a, that's a whole nother story. But I, you know, I mean, I don't have time to do anything. I don't have it. I don't have time. I don't have any help. Like, I do everything with my business. All the bidding, all the drawings, all the, all the paperwork, all the invoicing, everything. No one else helps me with it. So I like, when I get home, I'm like, all right, I'm going to bed. Like, I eat, I eat, work, sleep. That's what I do.

[E]

Now it sounds like you're complaining.

[C]

I'm not. But that's all I do. That's what I do. I work, eat, sleep.

[D]

Can we get back back to Tyson's yard, cuz. Yeah, yeah, he has these, these raceways of Mexican beach pebble, like inch and a half, Mexican peach pebble. Between these steel, custom steel, like mo strips and these like stepping Stones of concrete. So there's these four inch strips of this beautiful gravel and once or twice a year he literally pulls all the gravel out.

[E]

It's so insane.

[D]

Gets it into a wheelbarrow, vacuums it, washes every single piece of gravel and puts it back into space.

[E]

He's all like, hell yeah, I do.

[F]

Yeah, I. It's a lot, it's a lot of hard work.

[C]

You have ocd.

[F]

It's.

[C]

And nobody, nobody enjoys it as much as you.

[F]

It's an all, it's an all day affair too. You know, just do that one, one part of it. Yeah, it's a lot.

[D]

You're just a freak.

[F]

Y. I think my grass, my, my grass is like struggling right now because it's like got a couple brown spots in it from the heat.

[E]

How many outside people see me, my

[F]

wife, me all the time. I go back there every day after work. When I get home, I go spend at least an hour in the backyard, you know.

[E]

Yeah, it's for you. So.

[F]

Yeah.

[C]

Well, how long do koi fish usually live?

[E]

Oh, here we go.

[D]

Here we go. You know, there's all the myths.

[E]

A thousand years.

[D]

No, there's the myths about, you know, Hanako, that we're in 20 year old fish. But a 30 year old or 40 year old fish, koi fish is not, you know, out of line.

[C]

Right. So the fact that all the fish, most of the fish in my pond are the original fish you put in my pond.

[D]

Yeah. Is not, it's not extraordinary. It's very cool. It's not, not common that people have 25 year old fish. It's not common, but it's not like this crazy anomaly. But it's, it's very, very cool.

[C]

I mean, cuz I've only bought like over the last few years, I've only bought like maybe three or four more fish from.

[D]

Remember I still got that Japanese koi in there you want so bad.

[C]

Yeah, I know.

[D]

We're going to have to get that done.

[C]

I know it's still there.

[E]

And I, I wonder how many stories are, you know that koi don't live 25, 30, 40, 50 years is because of human error.

[D]

Of course.

[E]

You know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Well, now we just have to figure out when we're gonna fix my backyard.

[D]

Why do you think I'm doing this podcast? Just getting stimulated, bro.

[E]

Let's go.

[D]

All right, let's button up. You got any final words, Chad?

[E]

No.

[D]

Slayer.

[E]

I'm good.

[D]

Tyson?

[F]

I'm good.

[D]

All right, we're closing it out.

[B]

Thank you so much for your ears and attention hanging out with us in the deep end today. One of my favorite takeaways from the conversation today is how this water feature is emotionally measured by everything that's happened around it. After we left the scene, after we finished completion, and 25 years of family dinners and quiet mornings and kids growing up playing around the pond and the giggling, the hard seasons, the new beginnings, and through every chapter, that pond just keeps showing up. And when he went home last night after the fireside chat, he texted me a really wonderful photo of the pond all lit up, fish swimming around. Made me smile. And as my head hit the pillow, like, I was just so proud about what we've done over the years of. 25 years of building ponds locally here in our. In our area. It really hit home with me today that we aren't just building water features. We're creating spaces. These special places in people's lives where their lives unfold. And if this episode didn't hit you that way, I don't. I don't even know what to say. You'd have to see it in Shad's eyes when he was sitting by the fire, like, reflecting, like, you know, like when your life flashes before your eyes on your deathbed. You hear that story all the time. Like, I literally watched this man's life, you know, roll. Roll in his head, like, flash before his eyes, right before me, with the fire pit just crackling in the side. Please share the episode with someone that's into ponds and help them burn those memories a little bit deeper into their minds when they're hanging out by the pond and life's happening. That's what I'm talking about, people. Deep conversations in the deep end. That's it for today. I hope it moved you. Hope you share it until next time. I hope you dig ponds. I really, really do. I hope you dig them as much as I do.