← The Portrait System Podcast
The Portrait System Podcast
How Aaron Jay Young Went From $150 To $2500 Per Shoot (Re-Release)
01:03:24
Loading summary
Transcript188 lines
- [00:01]
Nikki Klosser
When water from the pipes was pouring down, filed a claim with his Cox.
- [00:06]
Aaron J.
We turned it around. Across America, over 600,000 small businesses look to Hiscox Insurance for protection. Find flexible coverage that adapts to the needs of your small business with a fast, easy online quote@hiscox.com Cause there's no business like small business like no business we know. Get a quote today with Hiscox Small Business Insurance.
- [00:30]
Nikki Klosser
Hey there, it's Nikki Klosser and I want to to let you know about an awesome free giveaway for people on our email list. If you haven't already, click the link in our podcast description or go to theportraitsystem.com signup to get on the list. If you sign up, you'll get a free posing 101 PDF to jumpstart things. It's an epic PDF so you'll definitely.
- [00:49]
Want to get this.
- [00:50]
Also, just by being in our email community, you'll get deals, sales and information about any of our upcoming events and activities. So head over to theportraitsystem.com sign up and sign up today.
- [01:02]
You're listening to the Portrait System Podcast.
- [01:05]
Aaron J.
If you're waiting until you feel ready to up your prices or ready to make a move like you might be essentially wasting a whole lot more time than you need to, than if you would just open yourself up and be willing to walking in that direction and being okay that you might fail a little bit or, you know, you might not make a sale or whatever.
- [01:31]
Nikki Klosser
Welcome to the Portrait System Podcast.
- [01:33]
I'm your host Nikki Klosser and this show is here to help you succeed in the world of photography and business, to help you learn to become financially free, doing what you love and so much more. With over 1 million downloads, countless photographers have taken what they've learned from both our episodes and from theportraitsystem.com and they.
- [01:50]
Have grown their businesses, quit their day.
- [01:52]
Jobs and are designing a life of their dreams.
- [01:55]
We keep it real and share stories.
- [01:57]
About the ups and downs that come with running a photography business.
- [02:00]
You'll hear real life stories of how.
- [02:02]
Other photographers run their business and you'll learn actionable steps that you can take.
- [02:06]
To reach your own goals.
- [02:08]
Thank you so much for being here.
- [02:09]
And let's get started this week. My guest on the Portrait System is Aaron J. And his business is located in Los Angeles. Aaron decided it was time to make changes in his business or he was not going to survive. And with these changes, he went from making $150 per shoot to a $2,500 average. Now, by part of this was obviously raising his prices. And Aaron is very open about how it was extremely uncomfortable for him to charge more, but he talks through how and why he was able to do this. Aaron does both commercial work and regular portraits. And something that helps him get more clients is by using a marketing team, which he tells us all about. Okay, it's time to get started with Aaron J. Hi, Erin. Welcome to the portrait system.
- [02:54]
Aaron J.
Hey, Nikki. Thanks so much for having me.
- [02:56]
Nikki Klosser
Well, this is actually your second time, right? Cause you were on the episode with Kevin and Ashley a while back.
- [03:02]
Aaron J.
Yeah, I did the clubhouse thing a little while back.
- [03:05]
Nikki Klosser
Right? Yeah, that's right. Well, I'm excited this time. We get to go in more depth and detail of your whole photographic journey. And I'm looking forward to it. It's like, I feel like I know a little bit about you, but I don't know a whole lot about your story. I'm excited.
- [03:22]
Aaron J.
Cool. Awesome. I'm excited, too.
- [03:24]
Nikki Klosser
Cool. All right, so, Erin, let's start with what you do, where you're located, and we'll go from there.
- [03:32]
Aaron J.
Okay. So I'm a portrait photographer. My studio is based in Los Angeles. I currently also have a place in Palm Springs where I'm spending, like, the majority of my time when I either have work in Palm Springs or if I'm just not, you know, actively shooting on any given day in la.
- [03:50]
Nikki Klosser
Oh, hell, yes. That's awesome.
- [03:52]
Aaron J.
Yeah, it's great. So I'm, you know, I'm just traveling back and forth, but currently I've been in LA for, God, I lost count of how many years. I think, like, 13 years. And in the last year and a half is when I started spending more time in Palm Springs. And this feels a little bit more like home at this point to me. So that's why I just, you know, I'm out here whenever I, you know, not in the studio in la.
- [04:15]
Nikki Klosser
Now, did you say that most of the work that you do is in LA and Palm Springs is more of your downtime, or do you also work when you're out there?
- [04:23]
Aaron J.
I work in both places. I would say most of my work is still in Los Angeles, so there's just a lot of going back and forth. You know, if. If I can, I will schedule consecutive days of shoots in la, so I can just be there for, like, three days or four days and then come back sometimes, like this week. You know, I'm doing a couple of shoots in Palm Springs today and tomorrow, and then I Have Friday, just like one shoot in Los Angeles. So I'll just be driving out for the day and come back.
- [04:51]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, Erin, I used to do the same thing when I lived in Seattle and I had a studio in Michigan. It's like I wanted to be in Michigan, but our life was still in Seattle. So I started a studio in Michigan and it allowed me to be able to travel there pretty much as much as I wanted, as long as I had clients there. And this might be too personal of a question, but I'm going to ask anyway. Do you see yourself moving all of your shoots and just your studio life out to Palm Springs? Eventually.
- [05:22]
Aaron J.
Maybe one day. I mean, I think for my career and sort of the goals that I have for my career, I think it's important at least right now that I have a base in Los Angeles and then, you know, we'll see. I mean, it could go that way, which would be, you know, really awesome, but it just will depend on kind of my career trajectory.
- [05:47]
Nikki Klosser
Right, right. Okay, this is a little bit backwards of how I usually interview, but what are your career goals that would make you kind of need to stay home base in LA for that?
- [05:57]
Aaron J.
You know, I'm always working to do more commercial and editorial kind of work.
- [06:01]
Nikki Klosser
Okay.
- [06:02]
Aaron J.
You know, and it's just a lot of times that's taking place in either Los Angeles or, you know, it could be somewhere else in the country. But yeah, so that I would say that's the, the biggest reason why. So anything industry related, if it was somebody who was like a recognizable person that I was photographing or whatever, it would be most likely happening there versus, you know, somebody coming out to Palm Springs or, you know, just happening to be in town.
- [06:30]
Nikki Klosser
Got it. Okay, that makes sense. Okay, so let's back up a little bit. And I know you said you're a portrait photographer and obviously like you just said you're interested in commercial work and that sort of thing, but at this point, what would you say the split is between just typical portrait clients versus commercial in your business?
- [06:50]
Aaron J.
Let's see. I would say about 60, 40 maybe is the split.
- [06:56]
Nikki Klosser
Yep.
- [06:56]
Aaron J.
You know, I have a steady flow of everyday people coming in that a lot of it has to do with branding kind of stuff. You know, like lots of authors, architects, even like real estate people. But, you know, so people that kind of want to represent their business in the. In a way that's not stereotypical, that's a little bit more stylized and actually feels more editorial. And then there's just like all the other stuff which is like, you know, like I did a book cover last week. Jobs that are like, they're still. I mean, I consider everything I do to be portraiture to some capacity. But, you know, like, I'm photographing the head of an all girls school in Los Angeles in a couple of weeks. So it's like that, that specific job is, you know, it's still portraiture, but it's kind of structured, different than like an everyday portrait client. Because I'm dealing with like an entity, you know, which is the school versus like an individual person.
- [07:51]
Nikki Klosser
Right, Gotcha. Yep.
- [07:53]
Aaron J.
Yeah.
- [07:54]
Nikki Klosser
And when you said stylized, that totally makes me think of your work. There is this sort of, I don't know, there's just a different element of your work that isn't just typical, like. And it's not like you go, I don't think it's like overboard on like crazy styling or whatever, but there is like maybe editorial. Like you said stylized, editorial. But yeah, I totally feel that when I look at your work, it's really great.
- [08:18]
Aaron J.
Thank you so much. I was thinking about this the other day of like, what I do as a portrait photographer and, and what sort of came to me and I started, you know, just kind of writing it all out was the thing that I think I'm the most passionate about is actually capturing energy. And so I would say what I do is I actually capture energy and emotion, which is a thing that you actually feel that you can't necessarily see. But I do it through a visual medium, which is an interesting juxtaposition. And you know, I would. And then I was thinking about, you know, how like the, you know, like your energy, my energy, if you think of it as sort of like inside of us, and it kind of, you know, starts inside of us and then kind of emanates out the way that we sort of express that is through our body language and through expressions, facial expressions, through our eyes. So it's like that those elements are sort of the vehicle, visually that I use to then capture an energy that I would say is sort of an authenticity or an essence of who somebody truly is.
- [09:29]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, that's really beautiful to think about it that way. I like that. Have you always been a photographer or did you. I feel it seems to me like you probably are always been an artist in some sort of way.
- [09:41]
Aaron J.
Well, I've always been creative in some sort of way. You know, like when I, when I was really young, like five, six years old, I remember I loved to draw a lot. And from there, in my teenage years, I was obsessed with music. I taught myself how to play guitar and, you know, piano. And. And then in my. Towards my adult life is when I first picked up a camera and sort of discovered that as like a new avenue of expressing myself artistically.
- [10:09]
Nikki Klosser
Okay, and how did you end up picking up a camera?
- [10:13]
Aaron J.
So the first time I ever picked up a camera, I was visiting a friend out west, actually, here in Palm Springs before I had moved to the West Coast. And he was doing a couple of photo shoots while I was visiting. And during one of the shoots, he handed me one of his old cameras and he was like, can you just take some, you know, like, behind the scenes stuff? And so I just tried to mimic sort of what I saw him doing. And that was like the beginning. And then, you know, it was a little bit of a journey to, like, get to figuring out that I wanted to just photograph people and all of that. But sure, yeah, but that was the beginning of it all.
- [10:51]
Nikki Klosser
Isn't that funny? My husband, the reason I picked up a camera, when we got married, he had a DSLR. It was a Nikon D80. And I remember staring at it thinking, that's a lot of buttons. Like, that's a lot of wheels. That's just a lot happening. And I was like, super intimidated. And he rides BMX and he was sponsored by this clothing company or whatever. And he's like, you have to take a couple pictures of me in this T shirt. I just have to send it to him, blah, blah, blah. And so he's like, you have to use my Nikon. And I was like, okay. And I took a couple shots and I was like, oh, damn, it kind of looks good. Like, I like this. And then slowly, you know, it's just funny how just that one time of. Of taking someone's portrait, I was like, okay, I like this. It's funny how that works.
- [11:32]
Aaron J.
Yep. It was kind of the same for me. It was like, you know, we were like, in an ideal. We were outside, like, beautiful shaded area, and camera was fully automatic setting, so I didn't have to think too much about the technical side of it. But that was like a great introduction because, you know, it kind of helped me to not be completely overwhelmed. Yeah, you know, the overwhelming came later on, so.
- [11:56]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, right.
- [11:58]
Aaron J.
Yeah.
- [11:59]
Nikki Klosser
Isn't that the truth? So how did you do the transition from what you were doing for work, you know, before photography into. I'm doing this as a full time gig.
- [12:10]
Aaron J.
Okay. So I. Before I move to Los Angeles, I was a personal trainer for like a brief Period of time. And that was my first, like, job outside. Like before that I worked retail and, you know, other, other jobs. And so that was like the first sort of thing that I did to move into, like having a career of some sort and doing something that I loved at the time. And when I moved to Los Angeles, it was the first time where I had to truly be freelance because when I was in Pennsylvania, I just worked at a gym and had like desk hours and that's how I'd pick up clients. And when I moved to la, it was like all on me to, to build my business from scratch, basically. And I had no experience with that. So I had a little bit of that going on. And then, and then I decided I wanted to get certified as a massage therapist. So I did that. And then it was really while I was working as a massage therapist that I just kept moving in the direction of the end goal, which was to transition from full time massage therapy to full time photographer.
- [13:18]
Nikki Klosser
All right, and when you made that whole transition or whatever, was it something that you started out straight as a shoot and burn?
- [13:24]
Were you in the studio right away doing packages?
- [13:26]
Like, how did that look for you?
- [13:28]
Aaron J.
When I first started, I had no idea what I was doing on every level. So I did the thing that I've heard other photographers talk about, which is you go researching on Google to see who has their price prices online and sort of think that you have to match your pricing to match their pricing. So I did that. I found like headshot photographers in Los Angeles and the people that I found were more shoot and burn photographers. I didn't have a reference point for what that even was. So to me at the time I was like, oh, well, this is what successful photographers charge. This is what I should be charging. I shouldn't charge anything more than that. And it was, it was barely anything. I mean, I think I remember at one point charging $150 for like a shoot and a. Whatever, however many images. And the actual, you know, the moments in between, like one client to another client were so vast that I would, I would change my pricing like 10 times in between.
- [14:31]
Nikki Klosser
I remember doing that too. That's funny, because it just.
- [14:34]
Aaron J.
I never felt like I was landing on anything that I just felt like I didn't really know what I was doing or why I was doing it. So I would see one thing, you know, somebody share their pricing and I would be like, oh, that makes sense. But then I would see something else like, oh, that makes it. Yeah, yeah. So I was just I was all over the place. And it was also. I was on, like, the lower end pricing wise then, too. Like, I remember at one point charging $250 and feeling like that's a little bit. You know, that's a little bit much. And so, yeah, I mean, it just. That's kind of where it started. And it was a few years of that of just kind of feeling like I was just kind of flailing around and very not sure about how I was gonna do it and make it happen and if I was doing it the correct way.
- [15:26]
Nikki Klosser
Do you know what your, like, portrait sales average is now?
- [15:31]
Aaron J.
I don't know exactly, but I'm gonna guess it is. Okay, so if we're just talking, like, everyday people. Yeah, I would say probably somewhere around $2,500.
- [15:44]
Nikki Klosser
Awesome.
- [15:45]
Aaron J.
Yeah.
- [15:45]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, that's great.
- [15:47]
Aaron J.
And, yeah, and I also, you know, with the SBE kind of model or the portrait system model, I've sort of taken elements of that and applied them to my business. And then there's things that I do that are a little bit different. Like, one thing is I don't actually sell very many prints to those kind of clients. And so early on, I was just like, okay, so if I'm not selling a lot of prints, I just need to price myself at a place that I still feel good about my business and how much money I can make, you know, selling the digitals. And I did go with the idea of, like, okay, I'm going to price, like, my digitals. That's sort of like what the first print price would be so that people.
- [16:27]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah.
- [16:28]
Aaron J.
If they are thinking about buying prints, it would make sense to just do it.
- [16:32]
Nikki Klosser
You know, I like that I'm not a big print seller either. I don't know. Some people absolutely love it and make a killing at it, and it is. Feels really good to them. For me, it just. I don't know, it just stressed me out, so I just didn't. I don't.
- [16:47]
Aaron J.
I feel the same way. It does kind of stress me out sometimes. And, yeah, I've gone through periods in my business where it's something that I've tried to really push and have had varying levels of success, but I also just attract a lot of clients who. The purpose of why they're coming to me is different from that. And it's just like the kind of photos I'm taking of them. It's like, I don't know, it just like, doesn't seem to always align with that. So I just figured I'm just Gonna go with it, and I'm not gonna create more tension than is needed.
- [17:15]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, yeah, definitely. I think if I had my shit together more, and I had like a. An office manager or something, I would have been more successful with it. Cause then that person could have taken on that role of the ordering and shipping and all of that. But I just. I just couldn't get my shit together enough to do it and that, you know, like, well, oh, well, you just won't do it then.
- [17:35]
Aaron J.
Yep. I know that feeling.
- [17:37]
Nikki Klosser
Do you feel like there was a specific turning point? Because to go from thinking $250 is a lot to all of a sudden. Well, I don't. I know it's not all of a sudden, but to now having this $2,500 sales average, was there a specific turning point?
- [17:51]
Aaron J.
Yeah, I mean, I would say there's been multiple points in my career that have been, like, big moments or big turning points. One of them was so, you know, Subaris, I remember. I remember years before this, probably like four years before this, randomly coming across this woman who would make everyday women look beautiful. And she was from New Zealand at the time, I think. Or I think that's where she was living when I first saw. And I was like, wow, this is incredible. And this was back when I was, like, not even sure how to take a proper photo. And I thought it was really cool. And then, like, that was. You know, I didn't think about it for a number of years. And then somehow it came back around and I saw her again. And then I just happened to be on. I think there was a blog that she had at the time, and she posted that she was doing a talk, a free talk that she was only publicizing on this blog at somewhere in downtown la. And I was like, okay, I need to just go to this thing. And I'd never been a part of anything that she was doing at the time before then. And so I went to that talk, which, you know, of course blew my mind. And I think that was technically the first time I met you, but we didn't really, like, officially meet. It was the, you know, being in the line of, like, take a picture with sue at the very end.
- [19:11]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, yeah. It's always so hard because it's like you want to talk more to people, but you can't because it's like, there's other people waiting. It's like, oh, man.
- [19:18]
Aaron J.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like, yeah, it's, like, sort of awkward. And I was imagining how awkward it probably is for you guys and everything. So it was. Yeah, it was just that quick moment. And from there I started. I think I joined sbe and then I started actually learning a little bit more about pricing. And, you know, it was a pretty wild concept to me at the time to, to charge so much more than what I was charging. But there was also a part of me that I knew I wanted to. And so I would say that was one big turning point. And from there I was like, you know, I gotta start doing this at some point because, like, it's up to me to just raise my prices. So I, I did. And I. I think it was like $450. I think it was the first time the idea of charging like a session fee came into play, which was maybe like $150 and then $450 for however many photos. And so I just slowly started down that road, you know, being incredibly uncomfortable and so many phone calls and emails and just feeling so uncomfortable to say the pricing out loud. And. And it's also interesting because I recognize now, looking back that every single time I've increased my pricing, it seems like the universe throws my way. Like the very first people will be like, they'll challenge it. It's almost like the universe is asking like, okay, do you really believe in this? And so I'm kind of used to it now. I'm kind of used to, like, initially there's like a little bit of a pushback, and then I just stick with it. And then, and then there's like a breakthrough and then it's not a big deal. And so that was a big, I would say the first moment when I started to realize, okay, I need to really expand this whole concept that I have if it's going to be successful. And then another huge turning point for my business was on the other side of lockdown. During COVID I decided to hire a marketing team and that completely changed my business just because they were in charge of doing, you know, Facebook, Google, Instagram ads. And so now I was just getting in front of a lot more people on a regular basis. And that was when there was like a huge level up in terms of just my busyness and like how the consistency of the amount of people that were coming in and the amount of inquiries and, you know, it was a little overwhelming at first because it was such a shift from where I was at. Because before that, I mean, I was busy and I was, I was a full time photographer before that. For a little while there was just like more of an Ebb and flow of like, you know, being really busy and then not so busy and then really busy. And when I did the marketing company thing, it was like, consistently being busy and just, you know, in a way that I hadn't experienced before.
- [22:17]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, well, it seemed like it was almost twofold. One, it seems like the mindset had to come first. Like, even though it was scary and, you know, uncomfortable to raise your prices or whatever, it feels like maybe you had to get there first. And then it's. The shift started with your marketing team. Like, do you think that's right, that if you hadn't done the mindset stuff first?
- [22:40]
Aaron J.
Yes, I think that mindset is everything.
- [22:42]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah.
- [22:43]
Aaron J.
You know, I was thinking right before this podcast, I was sort of reflecting on just that, like, where I'm at now with my mindset around money, around business, around just my life in general and how different it is from when I first started or from even a few years ago and how it continues to. To evolve on this journey. And. Yeah, I mean, mindset is everything there was. You know, back then, my mindset was. Was much more centered around a scarcity belief system and more shame, more guilt, more just doubting my. My ability to be able to be a good photographer, to be able to be successful, to be able to make a lot of money. You know, I would say that the core. A core belief that I've worked a lot on, it was just, I am not capable, you know, so that's where I started.
- [23:40]
Nikki Klosser
So you had to work through that belief to challenge that belief?
- [23:44]
Aaron J.
Yes. And I mean, I think it's like a. I don't think it's completely black and white in terms of, like, okay, your mindset has to shift, and then this shifts. Because I think it can kind of coexist together. Because, you know, like, when I was really scared to price myself higher, I still had that scarcity belief system, but I also chose to take steps in that direction, even though I wasn't comfortable, which is something that I. That's a conversation I'll have a lot with photographers today, which is, you know, if you're waiting until you feel ready to up your prices or ready to make a move, like, you might be essentially wasting a whole lot more time than you need to, than if you would just open yourself up and be willing to walking in that direction and being, okay, that you might fail a little bit or, you know, you might not make a sale or whatever, like, if you just start to move in that direction before you feel like you're ready That's, I believe, like, how you kind of have to do it, because that's how you become confident.
- [24:50]
Nikki Klosser
I think that's such good advice. Such good advice. I don't know anyone who didn't break out into a cold sweat the first time they said their packages start at $1,200. I mean, shit's scary. Like, it's not. You know, it's. I remember there was something that sue said that was really important that I think stuck with a lot of people was especially. Definitely stuck with me was with change comes pain. And it doesn't have to be like that. I'm curled up in a ball, like, writhing in pain sort of thing. But uncomfortableness and fear and all of that. If you're gonna make big changes, which raising your prices to industry standards like that, it's a big change. It's gonna change your whole life. It's gonna give you a stable income. Like, there's big changes there, and you have to go through that uncomfortableness and quote, unquote, pain to get there. I mean, I guess you don't have to, but I think most people do.
- [25:40]
Aaron J.
Yeah, I think. Didn't she do. She did a talk that was basically like, choose your pain.
- [25:46]
Nikki Klosser
Yes, yes, yes, exactly.
- [25:48]
Aaron J.
That's exactly what you're talking about.
- [25:49]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, but that's good advice. Like, you have to be open to feeling uncomfortable. You just have to. And then. Erin, tell us about your marketing team. I'm really interested in this.
- [26:02]
Aaron J.
Yeah. So I actually, I found them through somebody else who's a part of this community who. Who told me about them. And, you know, I just decided to try them out. And they. So they basically handle all online advertising. They sort of set up a sales funnel kind of thing. I don't know if you'd call it a sales funnel or like a. Just a funnel from, like, you know, people can now set up a call if they want to set up a time to have a consultation, which didn't exist before. I also think, through them, created a completely. A second website because I had, you know, like the stereotypical photographers websites where it's like, you go on and it's just a portfolio of their work and you have to go hunting for, like, how you're going to hire this person.
- [26:50]
Nikki Klosser
Yep.
- [26:51]
Aaron J.
So that was me. And I still. I still have that website because I've. For the other stuff that I do, I think that's totally fine to have just like a portfolio of more sort of editorial kind of work. And then just to make it very clear to somebody Finding me or finding the studio that they can absolutely, you know, hire us to photograph them. I created a studio website that was geared more towards, towards that client specifically. And so there's just lots of calls to action. There's client feedback, there's, you know, you can book your own consultation. You know, all of that stuff that just didn't exist on the, it doesn't exist on the other website. But it was through them that I kind of learned that, and I kind of followed their direction initially to kind of create the bones of it myself. And then they went in and adjusted things and changed some stuff up. And, you know, I just, like, this is stuff that I hate doing. Like, I hate. I mean, I've tried to do, like, Facebook ads, and I've never had a great return myself, and it's super confusing. And, and so, you know, I thought if I just delegate this to somebody who knows what they're doing, I could probably benefit greatly from that.
- [28:04]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah. So smart.
- [28:06]
Aaron J.
You know, I mean, I, I, I'm excited for the day when I get to delegate everything except for picking up my camera, because most aspects of business, like, I don't enjoy necessarily, but I, you know, it's like, again, it's like you gotta just be uncomfortable and do the shit that you're, you know, that you don't like sometimes if you really truly want to be successful and reach your goals.
- [28:28]
Nikki Klosser
Totally. So the team, they do your Facebook ads, they do the funnel, like the inquiry funnel.
- [28:37]
Aaron J.
Yeah, they basically just, they just set it up because I didn't have anything before this.
- [28:41]
Nikki Klosser
Okay. So they set it up, but it still comes through you and you respond to the inquiries.
- [28:45]
Aaron J.
Yeah, like, it's up to me to respond to inquiries, to do the phone consultations, to, to take care of, like, when somebody shows up in this, this kind of, like, funnel, I have to, you know, keep track of where they're at in the whole system. But they'll do things like if I wanted to run a promotion or if I wanted to do a newsletter or whatever, like, they would be in charge of getting that together and then making sure it's going out. And to be honest, there's, I mean, as I'm saying that, it's like that's something that's been on my list for a long time. It's like, newsletter, still haven't done it. So things like that that I, you know, could be taking even greater advantage of the service. And they'll even do Google Ads. And another thing that I did with a separate company that actually reached out to me that I'd never heard of was they pitched that. What they do is they will make sure that your business listing is on, like, the first page of searches on Google if you're searching for certain keywords. So I paid a company, you know, like, 300 bucks a month for maybe three months to make that happen, and they actually delivered on what they said. So that was a big deal because I do now get more like cold inquiries from people that say they just found me searching on Google.
- [30:01]
Nikki Klosser
Nice.
- [30:02]
Aaron J.
And that even sometimes the book cover that I just shot with Penguin Random House came through that the creative director said he was literally just searching for photographers and came across my website.
- [30:18]
Nikki Klosser
Awesome.
- [30:19]
Aaron J.
Yeah. So, I mean, that. That's a huge. A hugely beneficial thing that I invested in for sure.
- [30:24]
Nikki Klosser
Very cool.
- [30:26]
Hey, just a quick break to tell you that since you're here listening, you have access to a really great offer for our listener listeners only. We have a special promo code you can use to get 50% off the cost of membership. Just go to theportraitsystem.com or click the link in the description and use the promo code PODCAST50 to get 50% off of a membership. We rarely discount membership, so this is a big deal. As I hope you already know, the membership is how I and so many guests on this podcast reached our success. And it gives you access to countless amazing videos and awesome, awesome community and all the tools you need to build a massively successful business. So use the code podcast50Now to join the community and to start building the business of your dreams. I'll see you there.
- [31:11]
What does something like this cost? So if, you know, someone's out there listening and wants to hire a team like this, you know, what would they expect to spend?
- [31:20]
Aaron J.
Okay, so I am currently spending a lot on this. I. I haven't done a ton of research to see, like, what else exists out there. The company that I'm working with only works with photographers, and I know there's marketing companies that, you know, work with all in different kinds of industries and whatever. So I am currently paying them $2,000 a month, and then I'm investing about a thousand dollars a month on the actual ads themselves, you know, so it's like, it's something where, you know, if you're just starting out, like, spending $3,000 a month on basically advertising, that's a lot too. I would never have been able to do it for a long time.
- [32:01]
Nikki Klosser
But I mean, if you get your average up, it's like one, one and a half Ish. Not even shoots well.
- [32:06]
Aaron J.
Yeah. And if, like, yeah, if 90% of your work is actually coming through this, then it's, it's worth it because it's like, okay, well, if I was not going to have 90% of this work without it, then, you know, Yeah, I think it's, I mean, it's paid off, like beyond. So, yeah, I mean, I would say overall, it's been worth it. And, you know, at some point I may look into just seeing what else exists and if there is possibly a way to pay a little bit less to get kind of a similar service. But for now, this is just how it's all working.
- [32:42]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, very cool. And then let's talk a little bit about your pricing. I know you said you don't promote the whole print side of your business. So for digitals, how does that work? Is it all a la carte or do you have packages? Tell us about that.
- [32:59]
Aaron J.
So I have a la carte, meaning just a single digital image price. And then I have packages start at four images. So like four images, eight images, 15 images. If it goes beyond that, I have it written down somewhere. Like, I don't know it off the top of my head. I would have to pull it out, you know, but yeah, so that's basically. And then I have a session fee. I don't include hair and makeup in my session fee. So the session fee goes. Just goes. All of it goes directly to me. And then if somebody is doing hair and makeup, they pay one of my hair makeup people directly. And, you know, it's just, it's very straightforward. Even as I say that, though, it's really interesting how, you know, when I'm telling people my prices, I will say, okay, so I have my, My session fee is 490. That covers the photo shoot and the photo ordering appointment that's due at the time of booking the session, meaning on the call right now, if you're going to book it. And then the images are 290 a piece, and the packages start at $1,000 for four. So, you know, if you go with, you know, more images, they're. They, they're a little cheaper per image, the more that you buy. And it's interesting how some people have been so taught to think of photography in like a shoot and burn way that it just won't register in their brains. And they'll be like, wait, so there's a. So I have to pay for the shoot and then I have to. And sometimes it takes me like five minutes to explain this very simple, you know, breakdown. And I find that interesting because I just think, you know, that, that that's kind of what so many people in our industry have, have done. You know, it's just kind of like train people to think about this in such a different way. And now we're kind of changing all of that and, and, and helping people to understand that, you know, we don't do it that way anymore.
- [34:50]
Nikki Klosser
Right, right. It is a little bit of a shift, I think, to the general public. I feel like we're getting there. The more people that actually take this model on, the easier it becomes for all of us because we don't have to explain that you don't get 100 digitals for $500 anymore. It's just becoming more and more common.
- [35:10]
Aaron J.
Well, yeah, and if you think about it like if everybody charged a baseline of something and nobody could get the service for less than that.
- [35:18]
Nikki Klosser
Right.
- [35:19]
Aaron J.
That would change everything.
- [35:20]
Nikki Klosser
It becomes the norm.
- [35:22]
Aaron J.
Yeah.
- [35:22]
Nikki Klosser
I mean, I was just talking about this with my neighbor and oh my gosh, this is a weird topic to switch to, but like with my hearing aids, for example, I was just camping and I lost one of them and I was flipping out, like, God damn it, that's gonna be a thousand dollars. Like, couldn't find it. Couldn't find it. Cause they were $1,000 each for each one. And my cousin, like five minutes before we were going home, my cousin found it like in the dirt under a picnic table. And I was like, oh my gosh, thank you. Like, I was so happy. Anyway, so I was Talking with my 80 year old neighbor about it who also wears Hear Hear aids. And he's like, man, I paid like 3,000 for mine and blah, blah, blah. And we were just talking about it and I'm like, how cool would it be if there was this company that just charged less and then we could spend less. But I'm like, but there isn't because everyone charges, you know, at least two grand for hearing aids. And anyways, I was thinking about it and I'm like, well, it's a business model, right? Like they all start at X amount. It is just known if you're gonna buy hearing aids, you're gonna spend at least two grand. And I get mine at Costco, which is like the cheapest, you know, so it's like same with photographs. Like if we just know going into it that this is what you're going to spend. That's just what it is, you know, just like people expect to spend that much on hearing aids. Okay. Now, hearing aids, photos, you know, whatever, if they're both important. But one makes. Obviously makes me hear. But it's still. Anyone who gets hearing aids knows they're going to spend that much.
- [36:43]
Aaron J.
Yes.
- [36:44]
Nikki Klosser
And how great would it be if anyone who's getting a photo shoot knows it's going to be this much, you know?
- [36:49]
Aaron J.
Yeah, that would be awesome. I mean, I'll tell people flat out if they sort of question the pricing a little bit. I. I've said before to people, you know, all of my personal peers in the industry, like, they. They charge either. Either what I'm charging or more. So this is just. This is just what it is. Like, this is what I. This is. This is all I know at this point. There just isn't. There isn't anything less.
- [37:13]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, totally. It was one more quick story. I was at a. I started playing golf this year. I had no idea what I was doing, but I was like, I'm joining a golf league. And afterwards, we were all sitting, having drinks, and one of the ladies was like, oh, my God, my daughter's senior photographer is charging two grand. And I, like, looked at her, I'm like, that's actually really normal. I'm surprised it's not more, to be honest. She was like, really? And everyone's like, really? And I was like, yeah, I mean, that's really typical and common. And they were like, oh, okay. So I think it's just keeping that conversation going, you know, and helping people understand that if we don't charge as much, we can't stay in business.
- [37:55]
Aaron J.
Right. I also, I just like to remind myself too, like, if I. If I have a consultation that goes awry and, you know, it's clear that the reason they're not going to hire me is because of my pricing. I just, like, remind myself, like, I'm like, Dude, there's 7 billion people on the planet. There's 17 million people in Los Angeles. Like, and it's like, it's just business. Like, some people are not going to hire me. A lot of people are. And there's more than enough people on this planet to, you know, for every photographer in existence to make really good money.
- [38:29]
Nikki Klosser
So, yeah, totally. Love averages. Some people are gonna say yes, and people are gonna say no. And that's okay. Totally. Now, as far as I know, you, you said you have this kind of marketing team that implements different strategies, but do you find that one strategy works over others? Like Facebook ads versus Google versus in person networking, that sort of thing?
- [38:50]
Aaron J.
I mean, the Facebook ads have done really well, for. For whatever reason, what I've found to be the most successful consistently are like, ads that are what I would call more generalized, that just sort of speak about capturing the essence of who you are, capturing yourself authentically. They're not about like Black Friday or holiday or whatever. They're just these generalized ads, and those always bring the highest return. Anytime that we've tried to do promotions of some kind or around different, you know, different times of the year or whatever, it honestly for me has not been that great. And it's interesting because I see so many other people that it works really well for them. And I don't know, it could be, again, going back to mindset. You know, I, I always feel a little bit like I'm being sort of gimmicky when it's like, I don't know, like, get your pictures for Valentine's Day with your loved one or whatever. Even though it's like totally legit thing, it's just. I always just feel a little weird, like, why can't I just be a photographer that people are going to hire all year round? Because this is what I do and.
- [40:02]
Nikki Klosser
Right.
- [40:03]
Aaron J.
It's what I'm known for, kind of. And so maybe it's mindset that kind of keeps the, keeps these promotional kind of things from, from taking off possibly, you know, but. But again, it's like the, the generalized. There's always generalized ads running sort of all the time, all year round. And those are the ones that continue to, to bring in, you know, the highest return. And like the word of mouth thing, you know, I feel like that's something that just builds over time. You know, you just have to photograph more people or talk to more people, and then those people talk about you. And I feel like a big part of business is about building momentum, like, energetically and physically. And, you know, so there's many times in my career when, if I wasn't. If I wasn't that busy with paid shoots, I would just set up free shoots just to stay creative. Because the thing too is like, okay, it's like, I do see people get what I would say a little too caught up in like, the pricing stuff and be like, I'm never gonna work for free or I'm never gonna blah, blah. And it's like, okay, I understand that idea. And again, I think it's really important to not approach life from a black and white standpoint. I think that that's detrimental in a lot of ways. And I. So I try to look at things from sort of A gray area of like, yes, it's obviously super important to get paid really well for what we do. And there's huge benefits to just creating for the sake of creating, because it's what we love to do. And there's a lot of good that can come out of doing just creating for the sake of creating. You know, you can create stuff that you can share that will lead to more work. You can create something that just feels really mean, meaningful to you. You just get better every time at your craft, you know, which is super important, or at least it is to me. The pressure's off, you know, Like, I love doing a free shoot because the pressure's off. Just like, no, like, I can. It's like, okay, if the shoot goes to shit, like, it's fine. Like, yeah, you know, I'm just doing it for. I'm doing it for me. I'm doing for the person maybe that I'm photographing or whatever. There's just no pressure. But when I'm doing something and it's like, if it's a book cover and I'm getting paid $19,000, it's like, okay.
- [42:15]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, time to really step this one up.
- [42:17]
Aaron J.
Yeah. Like, this one image has to be everything. And, you know, I mean, I'm getting better at that of, you know, just not putting that pressure on myself, even when it is a big pain job. But, you know. Yeah, I like that experience of consistently having just low pressure kind of stuff to work on.
- [42:39]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, it is nice, and it allows us, I think, to be a little bit more creative and, you know, try new things as well. I love doing fun shoots, you know, just for fun, something different.
- [42:51]
Aaron J.
Yeah, absolutely. And, like, you know, I work really good under pressure. I work really good when I have just like, a little bit of time, because I've just had so many projects and things where it's like you just don't have much time. Or if you're photographing somebody who's like a famous or whatever, a lot of times you just don't have much time with them. And so I've gotten really good in that type of a setting. So if I like some of my favorite shoots, I would just randomly come across somebody on Facebook that I'm friends with that I've never met, who I was like, oh, I want to photograph them. I'd reach out to them, set up the shoot, go there the next day on location, just take, you know, like, just the gear that I know I'm going to use, and it's just me and we shoot for an hour, and then I have these great images that I share in my portfolio that I share on my social media that. That they share and tag me. And then that always leads to more work.
- [43:44]
Nikki Klosser
Totally. Totally. I've had the exact same experience, and.
- [43:48]
Aaron J.
At some of the. Just the funnest creative times, I've done it too.
- [43:52]
Nikki Klosser
When I was trying to add in a new genre, like, I remember I really wanted to amp up my maternity portfolio, so I put a call out in a Facebook group. I was like, hey, you know who's pregnant? It was like a West Seattle Facebook group or something. I was like, who's pregnant? Who needs, you know, who's between, like, seven and nine months pregn and would be my model? And I kind of remember, I think I might have had them pay for hair and makeup, which at the time, I think I bargained with my stylist. It was like 150 bucks or something, but they got these gorgeous portraits out of it. And I got a new portfolio, and it was great. I had no problem.
- [44:27]
Aaron J.
Yeah, I love that I did that not that long ago. Cause I was getting the thing that I was hearing over and over were people thinking that I just did, like, in studio work. And I thought, okay, I must be. That must be what I'm primarily sharing. And even though it's like I. I don't have that perception of myself, but I thought if that's what the general perception of me is, you know, out there, then I need to change that. So I wanted to change that. And so I just. Yeah, I just started setting up on location shoots just for fun. And, you know, it really, like, if you get all the mental bullshit out of the way, it really doesn't take that long to. To. To, like, build a portfolio or to, you know, if I had. If you gave me, like, four days and as long as, like, there were a few people that were available, like, I could just create, like, a whole body of work, like, right there, you know, that would make me, I'm sure, massive amounts of money and would give me content for days, you know?
- [45:27]
Nikki Klosser
Totally. Well, you just did it at the portrait Masters conference. You photographed a couple different people and, like, just a matter of minutes.
- [45:34]
Aaron J.
That's. It's amazing. That's what I was just thinking of because it was like, yeah, we had the. You know, Kat and I had, you know, our shooting bay. And, yeah, I mean, I would say I probably spent a grand total of 30 minutes over the course of those three days photographing, like, five or six people. And they would just be like, I just like stop by, like come to the booth for three seconds. I just need you for like three minutes and we'll create something amazing. And you know, and that's, that's all I needed. And yeah, announced this kind of like cool, cohesive body of work that's has some sort of similarities and whatever to it. So yeah, totally doable.
- [46:14]
Nikki Klosser
But I think Erin, most, most people starting out or even some people have been doing this forever. They, you know, doing shoots like that in a couple minutes can be tricky unless you keep practicing. Like, I feel like doing these kind of free shoots or portfolio building work is not necessarily just for our portfolio. It keeps our skills, like, it hones in our skills, it keeps us fresh, it keeps us fast. Like, I mean I can do, I can do shoot like with my eyes closed in a personal branding studio. Like it's nothing in, you know, six outfits, 60 Minutes, done and done. Like, but it didn't start like that. Like I had to really practice and keep doing it, you know?
- [46:52]
Aaron J.
Mm. Yeah. I mean, I think that that is a very valuable aspect of it. You just get better at what you do and more confident. I remember recognizing years ago that when I was more in that, that state of my business where I would be busy for a while and then I would have, you know, a couple of weeks where I would have nothing in those couple of weeks if I didn't pick up my camera at all and I was just waiting for the next paid gig to show up, I would start to like, doubt myself. I would just be less confident in my abilities in that amount of time. And so that's when I started to really recognize the value of just continually picking up my camera so that I don't even give myself the time in between for that self doubt to kind of creep in.
- [47:37]
Nikki Klosser
Yep, totally.
- [47:39]
Aaron J.
Yeah. And again, like that changes over time because now I would say if I didn't pick up my camera for two weeks, I don't know that I would have those insecurities showing up. And that's something that has developed over years, you know, so, you know, again it's just like part of the journey and everything continuously is changing and evolving over time.
- [48:01]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah. Pretty awesome. I'm excited for you. I feel like you are like just, you've only just begun.
- [48:10]
Aaron J.
I know. It's funny because I've been, you know, I've been a photographer for like 12 years and I really do feel like right now I'm kind of beginning in a way that feels really exciting and Also, I mean, there were years, years in the past where I, I think it's really valuable to, you know, like, write down your goals. And there's been different periods of my life where that was part of like my morning routine where I would, every morning I would read my goals out loud. There was one point where I would put on this like gladiator music in the background and I would just walk around my place and just read my goals out loud as powerful as I could. And you know, now, you know, it took a couple of years and then all of a sudden some of those big goals started to actually happen. And it's pretty wild, it's pretty awesome.
- [48:57]
Nikki Klosser
Heck yeah, how that works.
- [48:59]
Aaron J.
But yeah, I mean, as those things starting to happen, it's in a way it feels like the beginning of something much bigger. Much bigger. And I love again, like when people say things about how much I charge now a part of me, I'll just chuckle to myself because I think like, you know, this is, this moment right now is the cheapest you're ever going to be able to hire me, right? So like, you know, it's only up from here, you know, like I'm a year from now most likely going to be charging more than I do now, you know, and five, ten years from now it's going to be a whole different ballpark, you know, so. Yeah, I mean, but that, that's sort of the mindset shift from sort of like scarcity to I would say, expansion.
- [49:48]
Nikki Klosser
Very cool. Awesome. Well, I appreciate you sharing all of this. Very interesting. And I'm just picturing you in Palm Springs with like. I freaking love Palm Springs.
- [49:59]
Aaron J.
Have you spent a lot of time here?
- [50:01]
Nikki Klosser
No, I've only been there. Let's see, one, two, three, maybe four. No, wait. One, two, three, four. Maybe five times. Four or five times, yeah. It's one of my favorite places. I love the desert. There's something about the desert to me that is just mind blowing. It almost looks like cartoonish or something. Like, how can that be real?
- [50:20]
Aaron J.
You know, especially here in 360 degrees, we're surrounded by mountains.
- [50:25]
Nikki Klosser
Mountains, yes. And the pops of color with the flowers or like. So cool.
- [50:33]
Aaron J.
Sunrises, sunsets are gorgeous. The weather is beautiful. I mean, yeah, it feels like living in paradise slash on vacation half the time.
- [50:43]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, I believe it. I believe it. Very cool. If my husband would move to the desert, I totally would. I would have been there instead of Seattle. He doesn't like the heat though, so we compromise.
- [50:55]
Aaron J.
It gets really hot here sometimes.
- [50:57]
Nikki Klosser
Oh yeah.
- [50:58]
Aaron J.
Like 120 degrees?
- [50:59]
Nikki Klosser
Oh, yeah, yeah. That part's not quite as fun, but I'd take it over negative 10 in Michigan.
- [51:07]
Aaron J.
Well, yeah, I mean, that's why you just get a place with a pool, and then as long as you got some shade, you can be in the pool all day.
- [51:13]
Nikki Klosser
Yep. There you go. I'm just planning as. I'm, like, looking at the calendar, and I'm planning. I already planned us a trip to Jamaica. Now I'm looking at a month in Costa Rica in March.
- [51:21]
Aaron J.
That sounds amazing.
- [51:23]
Nikki Klosser
We'll see if we can pull it off. Anyway, I do have a couple more questions for you that I always ask at the end of each episode. And the first one is, what is something you can't live without when you're doing a photo shoot?
- [51:34]
Aaron J.
It's funny. I knew you were going to ask this, and I was like, I still didn't come up with anything because I was like, there's so many things that. I mean. Okay, I'll just say this because this is what I always have on my photo shoot. So I primarily shoot with. So I have a Canon R5 now, and I primarily shoot with a 24 to 105 lens, which I don't think is thought of as your stereotypical portrait lens.
- [52:06]
Nikki Klosser
I think it's their kit lens, isn't it?
- [52:09]
Aaron J.
No, you can. I mean, there might be a kit version, but there's. There's also the. The. I forget what it's called. Like, the.
- [52:17]
Nikki Klosser
Like an elevated version or something.
- [52:20]
Aaron J.
Yeah, you know. Yeah. Well, they have the L series, but now they have the R series for the. Yeah, yeah, for the R5 or whatever. And I honestly started using it just because that's what I had at the time, years ago. And then I've gotten so used to it that. I mean, the thing that's interesting about it is, you know, if you. It can distort things quite a bit. So, you know, photographing a person, not always the best, or oftentimes not the best at all. But if. But I got so used to just, like, the. The wide aspect of it because, you know, when you zoom out or whatever, it's like you just. You can get a much wider image. So I just started to really love it. And I would say, I mean, out of everything that I do, I mean, I'm usually most of the time shooting with that lens. So that's probably the best answer I could give.
- [53:07]
Nikki Klosser
Sweet. Awesome. I like that. No one's ever said that. All right, number two, how do you spend your time when you're not working?
- [53:16]
Aaron J.
When I'm not working. Like, is there a time when I'm not working? I'm totally kidding because I. I make a point of actually not working all the time.
- [53:28]
Nikki Klosser
A lot of people say that though. They're like, am I ever not working?
- [53:31]
Aaron J.
Right? It's easy to, it's easy to do that and then to burn out. And that was actually a conversation that came up quite a bit during the last conference a couple weeks ago with some very high level people just talking about burnout, basically, like becoming successful and then thinking that, like, okay, I need to keep this, this massive thing going and then burning ourselves out, because. Which I realized in having those conversations, that's an interesting mindset to have because in a way, I believe for myself, when I have that mindset, I'm actually saying to the universe, like, okay, this is all great, this big thing that we've created, but I don't necessarily believe that it can last. So I need to compromise myself and run myself into the ground and do all of these things just to be worthy of this thing that we created, like, continuing. Which, you know, what I really believe now is that I'm always attracting more work, more clients. My goals to me, whether I'm sitting down, actively working, or I'm playing with my dog, I believe that it's all coinciding, it's all working together. The universe is conspiring to. Actually, the universe and I are on the same team. We're all doing this thing together. And the universe is way bigger than, you know, than the four hours that I spend sitting at my computer.
- [55:00]
Nikki Klosser
Yes. Oh my gosh. Totally. Totally. It's like restructuring in my brain that it's okay to like, sit and read or like, stare off into space if I want for an hour, you know, and like, it's okay if I want to sit here and do nothing.
- [55:17]
Aaron J.
Yeah. Like, I think creativity oftentimes comes out of boredom. So you need downtime. You need time where you're not actively doing anything, where you can just chill and let your mind wander and, you know. So to answer your question, like, I'll spend time with my dog, spend time in my pool in Palm Springs, just spending time with friends. Lately, I've been going out to eat constantly almost every night of the week.
- [55:43]
Nikki Klosser
I love going out to eat. That's something that, after I had kids, I don't do as much anymore. So, like, on nights that, you know, my, my husband and I are always trying to make sure we each get some downtime without the kids. I mean, I love my children, of course, but, you know, you need some alone time. And I'll go out to eat by myself. And everyone's like, you got to eat by yourself. And I'm like, yes. And I love it. Like, I mean, I like going out to eat with friends and my husband too, but I don't know, there's something about just. I love going out to eat. So. I love that you said that.
- [56:11]
Aaron J.
Yeah. And like in Palm Springs, things like that are so easy. Like la. If you. Well, now la. To me, there's an aspect of it that just feels like a struggle in terms of like, the traffic's always really intense. You always have to allot for like a big chunk of time to get somewhere and to get home and all this stuff. And when I'm in Palm Springs, everything's just easier and faster. So you can be way more spontaneous with like, let's go out to eat and all that stuff. So, yeah, I mean, I love. I love that I would say I pretty. I kind of live very spontaneously. And so, you know, at least when I'm single, it's at times caused issues in relationship because, you know, you're with somebody who's a little bit more of a planner and you're like, I don't know what I want to do this weekend. Let's just see what happens.
- [56:58]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, totally.
- [57:00]
Aaron J.
But when I'm. When I'm single, when I'm by myself, like, I. It's kind of. I live like that a lot and so I. I sometimes don't have plans when the weekend shows up and I just kind of see what happens or, you know, just figure something out. But.
- [57:12]
Nikki Klosser
That sounds amazing.
- [57:15]
Aaron J.
Yeah, it's nice. I mean, I started recently I hosted my first adult party ever, like a pool party. Because I've always only ever done parties when I've been in a relationship. And yeah, it was amazing. I mean, it's like so much fun. I was like, wow, I'm actually good at throwing a party. Who knew?
- [57:35]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah.
- [57:38]
Aaron J.
It's such a great thing to do on your downtime, you know, to just surround yourself with all the people you love and just create a great atmosphere where, you know, good people get to meet each other and hang out and I'll get to connect and chill and just, you know, it's great.
- [57:53]
Nikki Klosser
Totally love it. All right, number three is. What is your favorite inspirational quote?
- [58:00]
Aaron J.
Okay. My favorite inspirational quote is by Pema Chodron. And it is, compassion is not a relationship between the healer and the wounded. It's a relationship between equals. Only when we know our own darkness well, can we be present with the darkness of others. Compassion becomes real when we recognize our shared humanity.
- [58:25]
Nikki Klosser
Oh, I like that.
- [58:27]
Aaron J.
Yeah. And I mean, I've always loved that quote, but I think it is a perfect quote even for portrait photography, because, you know, something that people will ask me often is like, how do you get that energy in the photograph, that. That strong connection with your subject? And I'm like, well, okay, you go to therapy, you learn how to grieve. Like your lost childhood. You do inner child work, you know, like, just basically like work on yourself. Like, like get in touch with yourself first and process that, you know, which is obviously, it's never. I don't think it's ever ending. I think it's an ongoing journey. And, you know, that is the journey that allows us to connect more deeply to ourselves. And then connecting more deeply to ourselves, we develop that stronger sense of compassion. And if you're somebody who has gone through some, you know, really intense shit in your childhood or in your life, I believe that. That we're the type of people that are given the opportunity, through that difficulty to actually develop a stronger level of compassion and empathy. And then we use that to connect and create a safe space for our subjects, even if it's two minutes that we have with them, really create that safe space where they feel connected and they feel like it's safe to be present in that moment with you. And that's whenever the magic happens, you know, So I think that that, I mean, that, that's why. That's why this. This quote is so important to me.
- [60:02]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah. Yeah, I love that. I love the self reflection piece of it. You know, it's. Yeah, it's amazing. All right, Number four is what would you tell people who are just starting out?
- [60:14]
Aaron J.
I would tell people that are just starting out to just continue to move forward towards your goals. And that again, it's not a black and white thing. So it doesn't look like every single day you're just like full steam ahead, like, you know, slaying the. You know, slaying your day. It's like there are days when it feels. I mean, for me, where it felt like I was doing nothing to move towards my goals, but what I would always return to was, okay, this is my purpose. This is what I believe I was put on the planet to do. And so, you know, if I had a day or two or a week where I felt completely disconnected, I would eventually return to that and then continue to to move forward. And I think that, I don't know, I heard a quote or I don't know if this is something people, somebody said, but I think it's really true that like, I think that, that, that actually determines success much more than just skill or raw talent. You know, I think that raw talent by itself is not going to make you successful.
- [61:22]
Nikki Klosser
Agreed.
- [61:23]
Aaron J.
Raw talent that's not developed is also not going to make you successful. I think if you have raw talent or something like I like to look at the people who are the best in their field, you know, across the board in all different kinds of industries and whatever. It's like people may start with raw talent but then they work their asses off to refine it, to continue to grow, to continue to become better. And, and then it's through that process and through, I mean also like the common denominator too is never giving up, just like continuing to move forward no matter what is going on. Like just holding that vision. And I guess I see, I see so many people that it seems like, you know, they're they feeling like giving up. They feel like, okay, I'm just, this is, this just isn't happening for me. And I totally relate to that. You know, I've had so many moments over the last 10 years where I've felt that way. And the other thing I would say is just start to develop a relationship with the idea of failure and start to reframe that to. As long as you're not giving up, ultimately meaning in the big picture, you're not really technically failing. In my mind, you're, you're just learning. And if you have that willingness to show up for the process and to make mistakes, that's really the only way that you're going to learn. That's the only way you're going to learn the technical aspects of photography or how to interact with people. How to do a phone consultation is going to be through taking the action and messing it up sometimes and learning through the mess up and then getting better at it if you're waiting until you feel ready or. I think that's a reason why so many, so many people will ask all these like technical questions like if they see a photograph they love, they'll be like, what kind of camera did you use? Like what were your settings? And I think that all, I mean intuitively a lot of times to me that feels like it's coming from a place of fear and a place of feeling like, okay, if I can just do it exactly like this person did then I'm not going to mess it up when you know it's not what it's about. You know, you can create something beautiful with just about any camera, any lens, any lighting situation if you have the courage to just kind of like show up to the process and figure it out.
- [63:44]
Nikki Klosser
Yeah, absolutely. Very cool. Well, thank you again, Erin. Where can people find you online if they're looking for you?
- [63:52]
Aaron J.
So online like Instagram, Facebook, everything is aaronjyoung. So it's spelled out A, A R o n J A Y O U n G. The studio website that I was talking about earlier is aaronjyoungstudio.com and then my other website that's more of that sort of just editorial portfolio is just aaronjayoung.com.
- [64:12]
Nikki Klosser
Awesome. Cool. Well, I look forward to the next time I get to see you in person. And yeah, thanks again. Have a great week.
- [64:19]
Aaron J.
Thank you so much. Just lovely to chat.
- [64:22]
Nikki Klosser
Thank you so much for listening to the Portrait System podcast. Your 5 star reviews really help us to continue what we do. So if you like listening, would you mind giving us a review wherever you listen? I also encourage you to head over to sue briceducation.com where you can find all of the education you need to be a successful photographer. There are over 1000 on demand educational videos on things like posing, lighting, styling, styling, retouching, shooting, marketing, sales, business and self value. There's also the 90 day startup challenge plus so many downloads showing hundreds of different poses. We have to do checklists for your business, lighting, PDFs. I mean truly everything to help make you a better photographer and to make you more money. Once Again, that's Sue briceducation.com.