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- [00:01]
A
This episode is brought to you by Whole Foods Market. And New year means a whole new batch of wellness goals. And Whole Foods Market is the best place to start. From sales on supplements of vitamins, protein powders, probiotics, and much more, they've got everything you need to upgrade your routine with ingredients you can trust. You'll also find lean proteins like sustainable wild caught sockeye salmon, plus smart meal shortcuts from the 365 brand like they're ready to eat salads. Even dry. January is covered with a host of non alcoholic drinks. Shop all things wellness at Whole Foods market. Must be 21 plus in select states.
- [00:35]
B
This podcast is brought to you by Carvana. Car shopping shouldn't feel like preparing for a marathon of paperwork. That's why Carvana makes buying and financing your car easy from start to finish. Search thousands of vehicles with great prices, all online, all on your time. And when you're ready, your new car shows up right at your door. It doesn't get better than that. Buy your car the easy way on delivery fees may apply. Hello, welcome back to the Prestige TV podcast feed. I'm Joanna Robinson.
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C
I'm Rob Mahoney and we're here to.
- [01:28]
B
Talk about the pit. It's 10am it's episode four. Let's get into it.
- [01:33]
C
It is five hours to go until the deputies. Until Mel is due.
- [01:37]
B
Yeah, exactly.
- [01:37]
C
I'm excited that we're gonna get it this season.
- [01:39]
B
Does that feel like the 3 o'? Clock, five hours from what? Is it the 3 o'? Clock?
- [01:43]
C
It is the 3 o' clock or.
- [01:44]
B
The 4 o' clock episode?
- [01:44]
C
I think it's the 3 o' clock episode. Okay, so mark your calendars.
- [01:48]
B
Yeah. The deposition's coming in a month from now.
- [01:52]
C
The Marvel style countdown clock can begin.
- [01:54]
B
We're get to an interview that co creator John Wells gave to Leslie Goldberg at the Ankler related to a few things, AI et cetera, et cetera. But one of the things that he confirmed in that interview that I had sort of noticed in some of the red carpet interviews from the premiere is that they were still shooting this season up until last Friday or the 20th is when they wrapped shoot on episode 15. So I think some of the conversations we had about, well, they had already shot this. This isn't necessarily reactive to responses to season one. I'm not sure that that's exactly true because given that they just wrapped. So season one might have had a greater influence on the season than I had previously thought.
- [02:35]
C
Makes sense.
- [02:35]
B
Or the reactions to it at any rate.
- [02:37]
C
But not the full on old school TV model of it's episode three and we're reading commentary online. And by episode 10, it's actually influencing the show a little more lag than that.
- [02:47]
B
Right. But not given the model that they're attempting, which is we're gonna have a new season every year. It is closer to that old school model than it is the sort of. We shot eight episodes two years ago, and we're still working on the digital effects. So we have a few emails to sort of get into. How can folks reach us on this podcast? Rob Mahoney always.
- [03:09]
C
Prestigetvpotify.com but especially for the pit. Drsydbanksmail.com that's spelled out Dr. The full word. Sidebangsmail.com.
- [03:19]
B
How'D you feel about your girl Cass getting a date in this episode?
- [03:22]
C
She got a couple dates in this episode. She did a lot of action.
- [03:26]
B
Some better than others, I would argue.
- [03:28]
C
I have some objections to the dating methods. I mean, we talked about the legality of doctor patient interactions. I'm kind of putting that aside.
- [03:36]
B
Okay. I want to circle back to it.
- [03:38]
C
For me, it's more this guy just came in thinking his foot was broken, and you're like, nope, foot's not broken. But also, come to an art gallery with me.
- [03:46]
B
No, no, no. Calm down. Oh, you think he's, like, too injured to go on this date?
- [03:50]
C
I'm saying, of, like, I know he's game to go on a date, but, like, can we do something where this guy can sit down too much walking and stand about pondering still life?
- [03:59]
B
He's gonna need those crutches at least.
- [04:01]
C
Bare minimum.
- [04:02]
B
That's a great. That's a great point. We. We heard from some people about Boba guy.
- [04:06]
C
Yeah.
- [04:06]
B
Our. Our number three enemy on our list.
- [04:09]
C
Still on Mel's mind somehow.
- [04:10]
B
Yeah, still thinking about him. About the legality of Mel going out with a patient. Right. So did Cassie McKay, Dr. Banks herself, circumnavigate that issue by just being like, I will be at this art gallery at this specific time if you happen to be there. That would be interesting. Do you feel like she. You know, that will hold up in a court of law as I didn't ask a patient out on a date.
- [04:35]
C
A lot of plausible deniability.
- [04:37]
B
Okay.
- [04:37]
C
I didn't think it was the most artfully done in a legal sense.
- [04:40]
B
Right.
- [04:41]
C
But also, I'm not interested in prosecuting her. Like, let her get her rock sauce.
- [04:45]
B
We're not doctors and we're not lawyers. Just to be Clear. So. So not only can people email us, but I want to remind them that we have social media dedicated to this very pod. Now we do where our hottest takes get clipped for public consumption. Prestige TV pod. It's where you can find us on Instagram and TikTok. Why should folks subscribe to that?
- [05:05]
C
I mean, for one, the content is popping. Kai is absolutely cooking with it. Yay. You're getting great takes off. How do you feel about being a Dr. J of your own kind?
- [05:13]
B
Do not follow any medical advice that we might give on this. My. My lawyer says please don't follow any medical advice, but hopefully people will learn some things from those social media accounts. Please subscribe. We would like that very much. Some emails we got in previous weeks was pushback from the medical community on this idea of the July effect. Tell that to the writers of the Pit because they seem to be buying full in. How did you feel about it getting sort of full first week in July syndrome, as I think the technical term they used in this episode. How'd you feel about that getting a mention inside of this episode?
- [05:46]
C
I did love it. You know, just for the finger wag. To the finger wag. Not to say that the debunking has in turn been re bunked.
- [05:53]
B
Oh, we love to re bunk.
- [05:54]
C
We do love to re bunk. But honestly, this reflects what we were getting in our inbox, which is some people believe this on face or believe it based off slim reporting or like some initial evidence. And then some people are pushed very strongly the other way. It feels like exactly the sort of urban legendy, plausibly true bit about your industry that you might buy or might not.
- [06:14]
B
Right. So the evidence that we get in this episode is there's a new hottie in radiology, according to Princess.
- [06:21]
C
Can we do our own, like, betting pool on that? When do we see the hottie in radiology?
- [06:24]
B
I hope before the deposition.
- [06:26]
C
I would. I think within three episodes this hottie will be on screen.
- [06:30]
B
Hell yeah.
- [06:30]
C
What does hottie look like? What form? What is Princess's type? Many people are wondering.
- [06:35]
B
Princess has dropped many comments about her dating life. So I have. I. I think she's gonna have good taste. And I'm excited to meet this new member of the team. Not the best at reading X rays, as it turns out. This new guy in Radiology, a little slow, so hot, but missed a giant piece of glass. Ogilvy, also new, is the one who inadvisedly pulled it out. So it's a combo of two new folks sort of missing something not knowing what they're doing. And that's what prompted the July effect comment here. So we also get Joy in this episode, you know, cutting her finger on a piece of glass. Emma dropping the vial and it going under the cart. So these are all the new kids.
- [07:18]
C
Like, rookie mistakes left and right.
- [07:19]
B
Yeah. Just doing their job. Nothing terrible happened. The guy with the glass on his back seems like he's gonna be fine.
- [07:26]
C
I mean, that one was pretty bad. Yeah, it was tough escalating a stable patient to surgery based off not waiting for anyone to say something. Not ideal.
- [07:35]
B
Listen, Ogilvy has been on my villain rankings and he' he's only climbing, so that's. I'll be curious to hear from the medical community if they are frustrated that the show seems to be confirming this idea of the July effect or not. We also got a bunch of emails from people. When I did my sort of, like, ode to Nurse Jessie in last week's episode, I did not know that Ned Brower, who plays Nurse Jessie, was a. A former drummer in the band Rooney.
- [08:03]
C
Yes.
- [08:03]
B
Cool.
- [08:03]
C
Huge revelation.
- [08:05]
B
Really cool. And then also became. For 13 years, he was first an EMT and then an ER nurse himself. So he's been hired as he's done some acting in his life. He was, like, on Dawson's Creek or like some other things, was a drummer for Rooney Wild. And then is, like, one of the people that they hired who is not just an actor, but also there to sort of keep an eye on the medical accuracy of what's going on. And I loved this quote from an interview he gave People magazine about this quote. If you see anything, he was told, if you see anything that looks strange or out of place, let this person know. Don't go blabbing all over set, undercutting directors and things. So Ned Brower, Nurse Jesse himself, is supposed to sort of. Well, actually a few things, but not on a constant annoying basis. So he said that there's a few people around. And something that the actors have said is that when they're in the midst of sort of the more fraught, intensive medical procedure moments, those are usually not directed by the, you know, director of the episode, but they have medical professionals who are directing those specific moments of the episode. So I thought that was really interesting as well.
- [09:14]
C
It's almost like they have an action unit, you know, just kind of tag one in. But look, this does explain with Ned Brower why he feels so natural floating.
- [09:22]
B
In the background, calling out stats and all sorts of stuff.
- [09:25]
C
So the expertise bears out on screen.
- [09:27]
B
Clearly, I love Nurse Jessie. I'm a big fan. All right. And then we got. We didn't get an email about this, but I sent you a clip from the Pit Crew podcast. We did get some emails from people for whom the Tree of Life sequence in last week's episode really worked for them. Absolutely felt really important for them. And I think you and I agreed at the time that, you know, we didn't at all object to this being a plot line. We just had some questions about how exactly it was deployed. But a piece of information that we didn't have that this Pit Crew podcast segment that I saw got into was the fact that Dr. Rabi himself is likely, though it's not confirmed, named for Dr. Jerry Rabinowitz, who was one of the victims in the Tree of Life shooting. And this is. This is a quote from a CNN article about that. When gunfire erupted, Rabinowitz was not in the basement where the congregation was gathered, but outside the room. His nephew said, quote, why? Because when he heard shots, he ran outside to try and see if anyone was hurt and needed a doctor. That was Uncle Jerry. That. That's just what he did. If there was a message his uncle would want everyone to take from the tragedy, Ostrin said it would be a message of love, unity, and of the strength and resilience of the Jewish people. So this idea that Dr. Rabi in the first place is an homage to this beloved member of the medical community who was part of this horrific event that happened in Pittsburgh doesn't necessarily change any of the reactions that I had to it last week, but does sort of deepen my understanding of why they would really specifically want to delve into this particular.
- [11:04]
C
Of course. And if that namesake really is a tribute, I mean, it's a beautiful gesture toward a doctor who seemed absolutely beloved and touched so many people's lives. And I've been thinking a lot this week, Joe, about, I mean, look, we live in a world now where an innocent man can be executed in the street by a law enforcement officer. Been thinking a lot about the idea of first responders and, like, who are our first responders?
- [11:31]
B
Right?
- [11:32]
C
And look, there are a lot of good, well meaning people in those jobs across the board. The Pit is clearly a show that is invested in and has great admiration for medical professionals specifically who are called to service. I'm not even really thinking about people doing a job, but people like Jerry Benowitz. So it's like you hear your community in danger and you run toward that danger to help people like Alex Preddy, who. You see a woman being assaulted by ICE officers, and you're running toward that, and that is community to me. That's what we can do for each other. I think there's a lot of aspects of modern life that make us feel isolated and make us feel alone, and we're not. And I hope whenever our moments come and they take different shapes, they look different for everybody. They're at different times. They're not always running into gunfire or trying to separate a skirmish. But I hope when those moments come, there's a Jerry Rabinowitz in us, that there's an Alex Preddy in us. Like, I can only hope for that.
- [12:37]
B
It's really beautifully said, the reports that we're getting, that Alex Preddy's. You know, Alex Preddy, who was an ICU nurse who worked with veterans, that his last words were, are you okay? Is just extremely devastating, as we think no one should have lost their life that way. I think as we've been thinking a lot about the pit and what the pit has to say about the medical community and how they care about the most vulnerable around them. You know, I've been thinking a lot as I've been watching the medical community, the nursing community, specifically in Minnesota or just around the world, talking about Alex Preddy as we've seen footage of the work that he did inside of hospitals, you know, circulate and stuff like that. It's just like, it's really. Enhancing. That's the wrong word, but it's deepening my relationship to this show and what it has to say about these people.
- [13:31]
C
Well, those clips, especially of him at work, you know, sending off fallen soldiers at the va, for example, I mean, it feels of this world. And I mean that in a complimentary, maybe sentimental way, but very sincere. Like, the sincerity of the Pit, I think, is one of its strongest suits. And it can be a little much at times. It might, like, make you cringe at others, but it's like, these are the occasions in real life that call for it. And we had an emailer, Raph, who wrote in as we were talking last week about the way the pit sometimes says the thing out loud, right? Like, says the very overt feeling out loud. And this is a show that does that. But it's also, like, dealing with occasions, as Raf said, that it's like, if there's gonna be a place to do that, it's there. It's in a hospital. To the people saving your life. To the people who mean the most to you.
- [14:19]
B
Right.
- [14:19]
C
And it's like, the way all of that sentimentality is channeled here. But also, like, again, in those clips of Alex Peretti just doing his job, it's incredibly resonant since we.
- [14:29]
B
And I watched the first scene of the Pit cover the pit. I had a very serious medical issue last year, so my relationship and I had never had, like, surgery in my life or anything like that. So my relationship with medical community has. You know, I grew up as a daughter of a doctor and a nurse, so, like, I was sort of in that world, but I wasn't ever, like, really a patient in that world. So to go through that system to. It was in this episode when, you know, Emma has to take some blood from Joy, and Joy's like, I'm a tough stick. Like, I am a tough stick. And so, like, all the nurses who sort of, like, were just trying to find veins on me, taking time to, like, comfort me, make me feel okay about what I was going through. Like, I have a very different appreciation for that. I like to think I already appreciated them, but having experienced it firsthand, going through multiple surgical procedures last year, like, it. It really changed the way that I watch this show and the way that I think about it. And to your point about sort of how earnest the show can be, this is a quote that John Wells gave to Leslie Goldberg in the Ankler. He said, quote, we wanted to show how heroic these people were through a simple way in which they deal with other human beings. The North Star, for us, was trying to be humanistic and to show that these jobs are difficult, and yet you can take the time to care. It's a fine line. You don't want it to be earnest. You want it to be honest and straightforward, but you also need to feel that someone is taking the time to see you and listen to you. So, you know, that's something, you know, inside of this episode. Langdon coming in to talk to Louis, you know, who's not even his patient anymore, or Mel and Santos, you know, Mel a bit more in a focused way than Santos taking the time to slowly draw out of a reluctant patient, like, the reason why she's there. This woman with an eating disorder, you know, um, that one, too.
- [16:19]
C
Especially because, you know, members of the staff kind of have wins in different ways in this episode. Like, Whitaker has a win because he, like, identifies something. A heart attack, basically in process.
- [16:29]
B
Right?
- [16:29]
C
Mel has a win because she identifies it, but it's like, that's not the win. Like, recognizing it is the start, and the caregiving is the payoff.
- [16:37]
B
Right? Making the person feel safe completely, to be honest. And we talked about this last week about the barriers between the barriers in the way of people getting the medical care they need. We have a family inside of this episode as it pertains to insurance, which is something very specifically that Pitt wanted to confront. How insurance companies have made it increasingly difficult for people to get the care they need. We've got Dr. Robbie inside this episode having a conversation with a therapist friend about like how resistant he is to have therapy. You know, these takes all different kinds of shapes. But if a person is carrying shame around something, which is something we talked about last week and we have this woman with an eating disorder who is clearly ashamed to talk about it. And Mel being someone who both does and doesn't have the personal skills to get it done, like she's got a great bedside manner and then you see her try to relate to Santos and that's a much more challenging job for anyone. I mean, Santos is a prickly customer, but like, I don't know, I just. I love watching these people try to help. That's what this show is about. I have a couple more sort of John Welles quotes that I want. Well, I don't want to like read. You can read the whole article yourself. Leslie did a great job with the interview, but one thing he talked about is the reason they did the format that they did this sort of every hour of a day, is that they wanted to avoid. I think this is interesting in light of Dr. McKay and Robbie and Nurse Hastings, et cetera, is that they wanted to avoid sort of the soapier romantic that wasn't like shots fired at Grey's Anatomy. He was just like, we did that on er, right? We did it for over a decade on er. This is the quote we wanted to talk about what these physicians life is. You show up with them for a shift and you're leaning over their shoulder and see what they go through. On our behalf to emphasize that when you're waiting for eight or nine hours because you cut yourself trying to slice a bagel, there's a reason you waited eight or nine hours. It's not that people are ignoring. They're dealing with so much of humanity in so many major cases. So I love that as just sort of like a yes, we will see some personal life stuff in here, but that. And I'm sure we talked about this in season one, but that just sort of hour in, hour out, it probably hits a bit more when you watch it in a binge. But like, you know, thinking about Whitaker or anyone else and knowing what they dealt with three hours ago and how is that informing? How have they had a chance to eat? How much is Santos thinking about her, you know, her charts that she has to get done? And this thing that Dr. Al Hashemi says to her, like all of that is in the hour by hour, minute by minute experience of their day in this hospital. And I think that's, you know, that's one of the strongest things that Pitt.
- [19:20]
C
Has to do completely. And look, in some ways it's complicated and imperfect. Like we did have an emailer write in to be like, why do Mel and Langdon have the relationship they do when they spent one day together and then he disappeared for a year?
- [19:31]
B
I think that's, that's a great question to ask.
- [19:33]
C
That's entirely fair. But experientially, obviously those characters have been a lot, they've been through a lot together to us and with us. And so part of the magic of that escalation of one shift is you're right, you have all the payoffs within it, but also the intensification of these moments. And that's where I'm a little more open minded about those sorts of things. Like, yes, in the grand scheme of things, Langdon and Mel spend a day together and maybe wouldn't have this kind of relationship in many other contexts, but if it was in a hospital on the day of a mass shooting event.
- [20:02]
B
Her first day on her first day.
- [20:04]
C
In this hospital, it kind of tracks in some ways.
- [20:06]
B
I agree. The last quote I'm going to pull from this John Wells interview has to do with AI because we have been questioning whether or not when Dr. Al Hashimi shows up. Is this a sort of cautionary tale about AI or is the, the show on the side of AI? And I will say a lot of the pro AI emails that we got from the medical community, we were about specifically charting and how it can help with charting. So the fact that Santos. I'm trying to be on Dr. Al Hashimi's side, but I thought that was very, a very tough. You don't want to repeat this year on like the first day they've worked together, like establish that relationship and then have a conversation. Don't say that in the first couple hours of meeting someone sort of walking down the hall away from them. You don't want to have to repeat your year, do you? Very tough, yes. But Santos then is just off her game for the rest of the episode because she's worried about this. And this is what John Wells had to Say about AI, John Wells, who used to be, I think, like head of the wga, so has. Has been in the mix with the Writers Guild trying to negotiate around AI. He says, I'm not as concerned about AI as others are. First, specifically what writers do. A lot of the people I work with, their jobs are really threatened by it, particularly in post and what we do in editorial and visual effects. So he's basically like, tough shit for them. You can't replicate what I do with AI, which is, I think, a kind of a very. Not. I think a very privileged position for someone to take towards the latter years of their career who is very established. And a John Wells show means something different from the newcomer who's trying to get their start. And people might think their work is exchangeable, you know, Exchangeable with AI, you know. Yeah.
- [21:48]
C
And look, there's hugely different conversations happening between the way AI is using creative spaces versus medical ones. Like, I. Completely different things to acknowledge and to lump them together, I think would be misleading in the creative spaces. I just frankly don't really want to participate in things that weren't touched by human hands and made by actual people in the medical field. Like, I am open to the idea that it could be effective for charting, that it can be effective for diagnosis. It just has to meet certain thresholds. And I think this is one of those things that's a little different person to person about what failures are you willing to accept if they come by algorithmic determination or they come by generative AI. Right. Like if a waymo veers off the road and runs over a bunch of kids outside of school, is that different than a human driver doing the same thing? And if so, which one feels like more? Neither is okay, but, like, beyond the pale to you. Everyone's gonna feel differently about that stuff. I feel like if you're going to welcome in this level of risk, you have to be willing to deal with that level of consequence. And a huge part of the problem, like we discussed last week, is like, who bears the liability for an error in AI transcription.
- [22:54]
B
Right.
- [22:54]
C
And usually that answer, even at most reputable hospitals, is like, as far as the buck will pass.
- [22:59]
B
Right. I wanted to bring up something that Chris Ryan was texting me about. And so I don't want to say, like, I'm sure he and Andy had a really good conversation about this on the watch, which I haven't. We haven't had a chance to listen to, but because of when we're recording. But if you go listen to them, I don't want to step on their conversation, but I want to sort of bring it to you. He. He was texting me about conflict around Dr. Robbie inside of the season. And basically it was a good. It was a good episode for him to text me, do I miss Dr. Collins? Because Dr. Collins is present in this episode in a couple of ways. We hear from Whitaker an update on where she is. We hear Louis say, she always helped me out. And we also hear from the woman with an eating disorder about how, like, black women go undiagnosed and, like, would it be helpful inside of this ER to have more Black doctors around, bring Dr. Ellis onto the day shift or something like that?
- [23:50]
C
Well, even in her preference, too, when she finally does come to the realization that it'd be good to speak to somebody, I would love to speak to a black woman. And it makes you kind of rerun the whole scenario in your head where it's like, if Dr. Collins had been her doctor from the jump, and not that you would profile people accordingly, but would she have been more open or felt more comfortable? Would the whole patient doctor dynamic have shifted?
- [24:09]
B
And this is something we saw a lot in season one with Dr. Collins. Before she was sort of like, you know, exited the show before the. The mass shooting event, there were a number of cases, one very specific, I remember where there was, you know, a black woman and her son. And she was just so excited to have a black female doctor on the case. And she was just like, she's like, you're amazing. Can you be our doctor for everything? And. And, like, saying to her son, you're so lucky to have this amazing woman helping you, you know, so, like, Dr. Robbie's reaction to overhearing Whitaker talking about Dr. Rob, I think is interesting to think about on a personal basis in terms of how much is Dr. Robbie Sabbatical connected to Heather, who he had a very tough conversation with at the end of her run on the show last season about, you know, getting pregnant and their relationship and his potentiality of being a father at one point in his life. So hearing that she's, like, left to do this on her own, how much is that influencing his desire for a sabbatical? Among other various things that are running around his head.
- [25:12]
C
Who's to say with Dr. Robbie?
- [25:13]
B
But also, we haven't seen Gloria this season. I don't know if we will, actually. But, like, what Chris's point was in texting me, he was like, do I miss someone pushing back harder on Dr. Robbie, we have Dr. Al Hashimi, who's Like not as a successful case here. Heather felt pretty free to push back on Robbie last season. Gloria, of course, is always coming in and hammering him in a way that we were like, oh brother, get Gloria out of here. But like there was pushback there. Dana is usually Robbie's co captain. She's not really pushing back on him.
- [25:46]
C
She'll undercut him with a joke.
- [25:48]
B
Right.
- [25:48]
C
But not necessarily question where he's going, medically speaking.
- [25:52]
B
Right. And then there's. And then like Dr. Langdon certainly is not a position to do that this season. Samira is not doing that at all in her role in that way. And so when is Dr. Jack Abbott getting here? Like a really. I really need that because a counterbalance. We've been talking about the wins that Robbie has been having and like, I don't want him to lose, I want him to do well. I care about him.
- [26:19]
C
But the losing is important sometimes.
- [26:20]
B
But I need there to be a bit more sort of like back and forth there. So Dr. Al Hashimi Santo's trying to bond with Robbie about how she sucks in the ambulance bay.
- [26:31]
C
Do we like her?
- [26:32]
B
Really tough, honestly. But also watching Victoria, Dr. Javati or medical student Dr. J herself kind of flourish under Dr. Al Hashimi's attention. You know, there's like a. She's like, good job on the tap.
- [26:48]
C
Yes.
- [26:49]
B
She's like, Victoria, would you like to present? You know, so there's ways in which there are people sort of like flourishing under her attention.
- [26:56]
C
I think it's also not an accident that the people who are flourishing are like a little more methodical and the people who are struggling are like a little more hot blooded.
- [27:03]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [27:04]
C
A little more reactive. And that's clearly not Dr. Alashemi's speed.
- [27:08]
B
But what do you think about this idea of Dr. Robbie needing someone to sort of push back on him inside of the makeup of this show?
- [27:16]
C
I think it's really important. And we talked earlier this season about how Dr. Alashemi is kind of a consolidation character in that way. Right. She's appointed by Gloria. She's in theory fulfilling a similar role as Dr. Collins. The difference is from the jump when Dr. Collins opposed Robbie or was on a different side of an issue, like you could understand where she was coming from really quickly and feel like, oh, she's right. And she's checking this impulse in Robbie that is jumping to a conclusion or self destructive or whatever it is in that moment. And they don't have that with Dr. Alashimi yet. And so until they do, it's hard to feel like in their conflicts. Is this supposed to be the kind of thing where I'm even at a question as to which side I'm supposed to fall? Like, one of these characters we've been through a lot with, and one of them has just kind of parachuted in with a lot of dramatic ideas about changing the world vis a vis the pit. I think little by little, they're doing a good job of making her a little bit more of an actual human person over the course of these last couple episodes. But it's a long way to go. And you can only hope that that long road will lead to the kind of validation in that sort of moment when Robbie does inevitably fuck up in a big way. That something Dr. Alashimi has taught or implemented or brought along over the course of the season will help us understand her perspective a little better.
- [28:31]
B
On that note, what did you make of their interaction around the betting board? This sort of, like, almost flirtatious. I don't know. How did you read that?
- [28:38]
C
I mean, he certainly seemed to read it that way. That, like, I'll buy you a drink with my winnings.
- [28:42]
B
Yeah.
- [28:43]
C
For one, I love, you know, Dr. Alashimi flaunting a little bit, Flexing a little bit. This is what I'm talking about. Like, I just want more of these moments. And it can be whatever personality type they want to write this woman to be is fine. It's just like, you got to let her be a personality.
- [28:57]
B
Yeah.
- [28:57]
C
And having those moments goes a long way and maybe a long way in smoothing over relationships with her relationship with Robbie, too. Right. They just need to connect on something, even if it is some weird little ancillary thing around the betting pool.
- [29:09]
B
Exactly. On the LinkedIn front, we did get a bunch of emails from people in. In response to our response last week about what it means to be a person in recovery and how we might expect. Like, and. And I. And I don't disagree. There are moments of, like, very earnest Langdon. That makes a lot of sense to me.
- [29:28]
C
Cool.
- [29:28]
B
That he's on this journey a hundred percent. It was mostly the qu. Lengthy passages that we sort of had some issue with.
- [29:34]
C
And then reciting them aloud in a workplace context when everyone's like, did we ask him to do this?
- [29:41]
B
But inside of this episode, we'll get to the Mercer moment a little later on. But we're mostly dealing with. We've got the eyelash patient, once again, played by Patrick Wells real life partner, back in the mix here. Great stuff. And then we have this Louis moment. You Know that he comes in to see Louis. Showing us Langdon's desire to connect, to continue to make amends with Louis. Someone that he feels like he definitely owes an apology to. To show us that not only do. Does everyone in this ER know Louis because he's a repeat customer, he knows things about them. He's asking about Langdon's kids. How are your kids? You know, And Langdon's been out for almost a year. And Louis like remembers that he has kids and so on. Like, is Louis gonna be okay? Watch. I'm certainly quite worried that, you know, this is an oppor. Louis is the kind of on like a story basis in the cr. So many people are rotating through so quickly and we don't see people again. But there are some repeat customers.
- [30:46]
C
Yes.
- [30:47]
B
And Louis represents someone who the loss of whom would deeply impact, of course, all of the characters. Not Ogilvy, perhaps. Cause he seems like a sociopath. But like almost anyone else here in the er, he's such a likable guy.
- [31:02]
C
He's such a likable character and person that it's like you have both the repeat customer element where everyone does have some kind of relationship with him. You have just a lot of genuinely fun or jovial or warm hearted scenes with him.
- [31:15]
B
Yeah, it's just like.
- [31:17]
C
It brings me no joy to say that it's probably the kiss of death on the pit to have that much screen time be that positive. Plus all of these potential complications around his tooth and wounds, what it could mean. And all the fluid, like he's just in a bad way.
- [31:29]
B
It's tough. I'm not optimistic and I am sort of pre devastated about it.
- [31:37]
C
Well, plus I think we should say too, we get with the MRSA kind of reveal at the end from someone who has returned back to the hospital. Right. I think all of those.
- [31:46]
B
A bounce back. Donnie Culner.
- [31:48]
C
Exactly. Like all of those cases are structurally interesting for a show like this because they force the doctors to reconsider their examination, to reconsider their initial diagnosis. And so having someone who's constantly coming back to the hospital is a great device. But then with Louis, you have just like all the added emotional baggage of people really wanting this guy to change his life. And he's refusing to do it to the point that he's asking for his like midday drink at the hospital. I wish I could say that I could like see a vision of this show where he makes it through the scene.
- [32:19]
A
This episode is brought to you by 20th Century Studios. Send help from the twisted mind of Sam Raimi, director of the Evil Dead and Drag Me to hell starring Rachel McAdams and Dylan O'. Brien. I like both of them. Comes a new film that begs the question, what would you do if you were stuck on an island with your terrible boss in paradise? HR can't hear you scream. Now playing only in theaters and 3D this message is a paid partnership with Apple Card One of the most useful things in my life lately has been my Apple Card. Great for game nights, vacations, just life in general. And applying was so easy and quick. You can apply, see your credit limit offer and if approved you can start using your card in minutes. Do it while watching a basketball game. You could start making purchases with Apple Pay before halftime even rolls around. I also love how I can get up to 3% daily cash back on every purchase. That's more daily cash to use for game tickets. I feel like I scored big time when I started using Apple Card. Apply in the Wallet app on your iPhone. Start using it right away with Apple Pay. Subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch terms and more@applecard.com this episode is brought to you by TaxAct. Like an expert coach, TaxAct offers step by step guidance and guaranteed accuracy when filing taxes. Get tips along the way. Add expert assist to talk to tax experts and let our experts do your taxes for you with expert full service. TaxAct helps you find the deductions and credits you deserve so you can get them over with. Visit taxact.com to learn more. Conditions apply. See taxact.com for details.
- [33:56]
C
He's in a live, but it just really doesn't feel like it.
- [33:58]
B
Let's talk about Dr. J herself finally revealed. This is the first thing I said was I was like Giovanni's the only one I can think of, but I don't think it's her. And then we sort of went down the Joy we certainly did. That we were like convinced by our listeners was true. We were like how dumb we were to not think it was Joy. But I guess it's Victoria this whole time.
- [34:17]
C
Yeah, it turns out Joy is just disaffected and bored at work and on her phone like the rest of us.
- [34:21]
B
I love Joy. Joy V. Ogilvy is honestly one of my favorite things that's happening this season. But so Shabana Aziz plays Victoria devotee. And something I think that's really interesting about Javati this season is, you know we met her on her first day last year. Her first day overwhelm, sort of spiky and defensive about how young she is, dealing with her mom sort of hovering and her reputation dealing with having to work with Mateo. One of the handsome guy is alive. Like all this sort of stuff like that.
- [34:49]
C
Well, until the radiology department phones in.
- [34:51]
B
Oh, wow.
- [34:52]
C
I'm just saying he's got competition now.
- [34:53]
B
Great call. Okay. But what's been really interesting to me, sort of interacting with the press tour that the actors have done, is that Shabana, who plays Javati, is like, much more of a tuned into social media sort of pop girly, I guess, than I interpreted Victoria being in season one. And so I'm wondering if this sort of. She talks about. Oh, I didn't peg you for an astrology girly. To Whitaker.
- [35:25]
C
I didn't peg her for a cancer. If we're just gonna flip the script on that.
- [35:28]
B
Okay, let's pause. I didn't pick you for an astrology girly. Rob Mahoney, tell me what you think about people being cancers versus otherwise, what are you?
- [35:36]
C
I'm not, but I am a cancer. Oh. And so this is where I'm like, do I see the through line between me and Javati?
- [35:42]
B
What are the characteristics of a cancer?
- [35:44]
C
I mean, water sign, as I understand it, typically quite emotional.
- [35:47]
B
Okay.
- [35:48]
C
And I mean, she clearly can be, but I feel like she's a little more process driven.
- [35:52]
B
Okay.
- [35:53]
C
But maybe this is just something I'm not identifying in myself enough.
- [35:56]
B
Okay.
- [35:57]
C
Maybe I am a Javati.
- [35:58]
B
Do you have any other takes on any other zodiac signs that you would care to share?
- [36:02]
C
I'm out of my depth, but I was just a little surprised to hear that she was a cancer based on the slim amount that I know about cancers.
- [36:08]
B
Okay, so it's pressttvotify.com.
- [36:11]
C
Yeah.
- [36:11]
B
If anyone listening has some thoughts on Rob Honey, being a canc.
- [36:16]
C
What?
- [36:16]
B
That means I'm a Libra. If anyone has any thoughts about that.
- [36:19]
C
Maybe it's like a rising issue. Maybe, like, Victoria and I have different rising signs.
- [36:23]
B
What's your rising sign?
- [36:24]
C
I don't know.
- [36:25]
B
You don't know?
- [36:26]
C
This is a problem. Maybe I need to find out.
- [36:27]
B
Okay. And if anyone has any thoughts. Kai Grady, what's your zodiac sign?
- [36:33]
C
I was worried that this was gonna come to me. Capricorn question mark.
- [36:36]
B
Capricorn question mark.
- [36:37]
C
Yeah. Not an astrology girly myself.
- [36:40]
B
What do the astrology girlies, no gender required. Think of a Libra and a Capricorn and a cancer. Making a podcast together.
- [36:48]
C
Yeah, I would love to see the synergy chart.
- [36:50]
B
What is that combination?
- [36:51]
C
I don't Know if you know, Judd, this has been a big thing in the NBA world, where certain team compositions, they will chart out and be like, oh, these players are compatible because of their sign alignment.
- [37:00]
B
Okay.
- [37:01]
C
Sometimes it can tell the future. Sometimes, in the spirit of astrology, it does not.
- [37:05]
B
It's not. Okay. Interesting to go back to Victoria Giovanni. I feel like they're kind of oozing her character into the person that the actor is a little bit. That's bleeding over. Really poorly stated, but I don't want to say oozing in an ER context, but I feel like, yeah, they're melding sort of the character. They're mapping the character a bit more onto who the actor is. And in a way that doesn't feel like. It just feels like this Victoria feels a bit. I would never have guessed that the Victoria we meet in season one would be a social media influencer. And not only a social media influencer, but when Langdon questions her about it, she's like, more than you think, Dr. Langdon. Like, really sassy. And that seems to be what. What Shabana's like, actual personality is a bit more like. And so I don't see it as a contradiction because that was Victoria's first day. Totally, you know, overwhelming, overwhelming circumstances. But I kind of like this idea that, like, this other side of her is emerging, and it is connected to who this actress actually is in her day to day, which she seems very, very delightful. And like, all of her castmates, when they're asked sort of who's the best at memes or who's the best at, they're all like, oh, Shyvana. Shyvana, Shabana. Every single time. So I just thought that was a really interesting development. How do you feel about the Dr. J reveal?
- [38:20]
C
I was delighted by it. And in particular, yeah, like, I love Giovanni as is, so I love getting these new wrinkles to her. I also really enjoyed that Langdon didn't undercut it at all. He kind of played with it a little bit and made some jokes. But he also wasn't gonna be the first to say Dr. J is not an actual doctor, Right?
- [38:36]
B
No, he just sort of like, Dr. J, great to meet you.
- [38:39]
C
Hand it off.
- [38:41]
B
Sure.
- [38:42]
C
And apparently can be asked for by request in the ed. Huge, huge news for everyone involved.
- [38:48]
B
And for him to be like, oh, I'd love to watch that video. On getting along with problematic work coworkers.
- [38:54]
C
We need that supplementary content.
- [38:56]
B
I really need to see it as well. Okay. Grace, I thought this was a great reveal and a great handling of it.
- [39:01]
C
Fantastic.
- [39:02]
B
Let's talk about. Let's go back to the astrology. Girly himself. Huckleberry, Whitaker, Huckleberry and Amy. And farm benefits. The way that Jabani said, what are farm benefits? It's really funny to me.
- [39:14]
C
We have seen a milking machine. For the record.
- [39:16]
B
You know, this brings me to my next point. And for this I have a visual aid. Oh, I'm so sorry to do this to you. I couldn't help myself. Have you heard of the book Morning Glory Milking Farm?
- [39:28]
C
No.
- [39:29]
B
Okay, should I have? This is a USA Today bestseller, whatever that means. I actually don't know how USA Today manages their numbers.
- [39:37]
C
Was that you? New York Times bestseller Joanna Robinson turning your nose up at usa.
- [39:42]
B
I genuinely don't know what makes the USA Today bestseller versus a New York Times bestseller, but apparently they're different lists.
- [39:47]
C
Makes sense.
- [39:48]
B
Okay. Written by Sam Nacosta, part of a series. Would you like to guess what Morning Glory Milking Farm is about?
- [39:59]
C
Morning Glory Milking Farm. I mean, I'm guessing this is a romance novel of some kind.
- [40:03]
B
It is, yeah.
- [40:04]
C
Who is involved? I mean, look, the formula says a big city girl who's disillusioned with her job, going for a simpler life, meets an unusually attractive man at like outside the feed store or something when she goes back to deal with her like parents funeral in the small town that they grew up in.
- [40:23]
B
Okay, wow. You know your way around. Apply. That's not right.
- [40:27]
C
Okay.
- [40:27]
B
But it was really admirable. Thank you. I would now like to show you the COVID art of Morning Glory Milking Farm. And I do. I mean, it's nothing we can. We'll be able to show this on the podcast. It's nothing like. I hope it's on the COVID And I would like to introduce you to a new corner, hopefully of romance.
- [40:45]
C
Oh boy. Okay. Yeah, so I wasn't expecting this.
- [40:49]
B
Can you describe for the listeners what you're seeing here?
- [40:52]
C
I would say it's a woman canoodling in very traditional romance novel fashion as if she would be curling up with like a Fabio type.
- [40:59]
B
A pirate.
- [41:00]
C
Absolutely. Except instead of the pirate, it is a bull man.
- [41:05]
B
A minotaur is, I think the. The technical term.
- [41:08]
C
I mean, he does look like a minotaur. That seems fair. I got questions about the milking part, I guess.
- [41:13]
B
Great, I'm happy to read the plot description to you. Violet is a typical down on her luck millennial, mid twenties, over educated and drowning in debt.
- [41:20]
C
I gotta say, so far I got it.
- [41:22]
B
On the verge of moving into her parents basement okay. When a lifeline appears in the form of a very unconventional job in the neighboring Cambric Creek, she has no choice but to grab at it with both hands. Morning Glory Milking Farm offers full time hours, full benefits and generous pay with no experience needed. There's only one catch. The clientele is grade A certified prime beef with all the manly, meaty endowments to match. Milking Minotaurs isn't something Violet ever considered as a career option, but she's determined to turn the opportunity into a reversal of fortune. How are you feeling? Have you. So would you. I would just like to go back to the line. You ever seen a milking machine.
- [42:05]
C
In.
- [42:05]
B
The context of Morning Glory milking bars?
- [42:07]
C
This wasn't the kind I anticipated, I have to say. So that is.
- [42:12]
B
This literally came up in organic conversation over dinner last night that someone else brought up. I have not read this book.
- [42:17]
C
Okay.
- [42:18]
B
I did check it out from the library, the audiobook. Because I was.
- [42:21]
C
You must.
- [42:21]
B
I was very curious about it a couple months ago and I started and I said, no, thank you. I said, not for me. I said, some bridges are a bridge too far and this is one for me. But I'm not trying to yuck anyone's yum. And like monster romances are a big thing right now, so. But it's not my thing. But it exists.
- [42:37]
C
Frankly, if there's like a supporting part in one of the audiobooks in this series, like I would love to be a random townsperson or something. I don't think I have the gruff to be the Minotaur himself. So I don't know that I could play that. But I would love to participate in some way.
- [42:50]
B
Okay.
- [42:51]
C
I still have questions about Minotaur milking other like, does he have is it strictly not safe for work milking or does he have udders?
- [42:59]
B
No, it's not safe for.
- [43:00]
C
What's the profit in that? Like, what's the business model?
- [43:03]
B
Well, you know what? You can read the book to find out. I'm sure they get into it. Kai Grady, Capricorn that you are. Any thoughts on Morning Glory Milking Farm that you'd like to share?
- [43:12]
C
I think this is what will break Rob into fiction. Sounds like this is the one. I'll hold it back. All I needed was minotaur sex, so I.
- [43:22]
B
That was one avenue that I went down this morning when I was doing research for this particular episode. There's also.
- [43:28]
C
Joe, you're having a very normal one.
- [43:30]
B
There's also parkour.
- [43:33]
C
Yeah.
- [43:33]
B
As almost an Olympic sport. I was trying to figure out what was the height of Parkour's fame. What do you think? The height of Parkour's fame? We get a guy who fell through a glass ceiling onto some ferns. I guess because he was busy making content. Vince Cole, 23, busy making content with a pal of his.
- [43:51]
C
Well, as Kai Grady knows, those social feeds aren't going to populate themselves. It's hard work.
- [43:55]
B
It's true. What do you think the height of Parkour's fame was?
- [43:57]
C
I would say 2006, the date that.
- [44:04]
B
Casino Royale came out.
- [44:06]
C
I mean, honestly.
- [44:07]
A
True.
- [44:07]
B
That's what I put in my notes. Casino Royale, 2006. It's about that. It's like 2008, 2006.
- [44:12]
C
How does that scene play to people who weren't there?
- [44:15]
B
Well, Vince Cole, who's 23, was three years old when Casino Royale came out. So like this is like a very like older sort of sport for the Vince Cole's of the world. I thought was really, really interesting when his. When his partner in Parkour said that it was almost an Olympic sport. I was very curious about this. And this is, this is in fact true that the gymnastics umbrella of the Olympics tried to claim Parkour and get it into the, I think the Tokyo Games.
- [44:47]
C
Okay.
- [44:49]
B
And it did not work out for them. But this is apparently like a controversial thing around the Olympics that I didn't know and sorry, we will get back to medical stuff in a second. But a various sort of like sport umbrella institutions trying to claim certain things. Like there was controversy when the canoeing federation and the surfing federation tried to claim like stand up paddleboarding. Wow. In the 2017 Olympics. So, you know, I mean, look, stand.
- [45:17]
C
Up paddle boarding is not surfing. That's just not parkour.
- [45:22]
B
Did not make it Baseball, softball, karate, sports, climbing, surfing and skateboarding did Paris break dancing, of course. And then this year in Milan we're getting a bunch of new winter sports. But they're all like basically skiing. There's ski mo. Do you know what that is? Ski mountain. Ski mountaineering. So basically like you have to climb up the mountain and then ski down it.
- [45:41]
C
So it's like cross country skiing with incline.
- [45:44]
B
I guess so. And then the one that I'm really excited about for. I love the Olympics, by the way. I know that you think I don't know anything about sports and that's true.
- [45:52]
C
I don't believe that. I know that you're a secret sportsman just waiting in the wings to jump on your chance.
- [45:57]
B
I like high stakes sort of sports, you know, that's why, Like a playoff game or something like that? Or the Olympics. What could be higher stakes than that? And also, like, the whole globe is involved in watching. It's double. We're doing double moguls this year. So, like, you're pitting two people doing moguls, downhills, mogul skiing against each other, which I think is really exciting.
- [46:19]
C
That is exciting. Feels like a lot of moguls. I'm not gonna lie.
- [46:22]
B
Too many to you.
- [46:23]
C
Too many moguls. I'm in favor of direct competition.
- [46:26]
B
Do you have a favorite Olympic sport?
- [46:27]
C
I mean, basketball, obviously.
- [46:29]
B
Sorry. Other than the one you cover for a living.
- [46:32]
C
I love team handball. Love full volleyball. Not sand volleyball, which is a travesty. Trying to think what else? Table tennis is thrilling.
- [46:40]
B
Okay. In your Marty supreme era.
- [46:43]
C
I mean, I'm perpetually in my Marty supreme era, unfortunately for all of us.
- [46:46]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you love the Olympics, or do you. Are you medium on the Olympics?
- [46:51]
C
I'm medium. I mean, look, the IOC is hideously corrupt. It's a weird institution. There's a lot of stuff happening around it. Like, do I feel myself swell with the glory of biathlon? I can't say that I do, but I do respect it.
- [47:07]
B
Do you feel like maybe swell with the glory of the biathlon should be the logline on a new romance novel that you do a voice for a town person.
- [47:16]
C
For perhaps that one, I'm willing to play the lead.
- [47:18]
B
Okay, great. Great. Anything you want to say about Ogilvy and the Glass shard?
- [47:24]
C
I mean, the great humbling of Ogilvy, I would think.
- [47:26]
B
One would hope.
- [47:27]
C
One would hope. If there is a path to us liking this character or not hating this character at any juncture, this kind of thing had to happen, right? I still don't know if it's gonna be enough. Still feels like a long road to get there. Everybody hates this guy. Not only including us, but the look that Dr. Bangs and Robbie give each other as joy cuts him down. I mean, just brought me the greatest delight.
- [47:50]
B
Possibly my favorite part of the episode is when Robbie gives Whitaker the double fist bump and then just leaves Ogilvy. Hay.
- [47:58]
C
She wanted it so bad.
- [47:59]
B
Really, really good stuff.
- [48:01]
C
Couldn't even get a. Couldn't even scrounge up a single fist bump after all that.
- [48:04]
B
No. Okay, Mr. Samba. Jean. Jean Samba, 54, with the heart condition. This was a really good season one callback because, as you might remember, Whitaker lost a patient, Mr. Bennet, due to a cardiac incident in season one. A patient that he was attending to who he was bonding with, who they basically, like, put in a gurney in the hallway. And, like, while he was there, he, like, died. And later in the season, there was another patient, Harvey Chang. That's when they got the ECMO machine out. That, like, really insane, very cool machine that they use to sort of try to keep someone's, like, lungs and heart going when their body can't. And when that happened, Whitaker was asking, like, why couldn't we do that for Mr. Bennett? And Langdon said that Mr. Bennett needed to have CPR within five minutes. An initial rhythm of V fib or vtach or the ECMO wouldn't have worked. So the fact that. Please forgive all of my bungling of jargon, but the fact that Whitaker was not only a little bit more on it than Santos was about sort of thinking about the possibilities of, you know, a heart condition inside of this. This. This particular patient. But when Jesse comes in, he's like, oh, you. You already put the pads on for. For the. For the defib paddles. And he's like, yeah, just in case. And to me, that's him saying, like, if we need to do defib, like, we need to not have anything standing in our way. I need to not have another Mr. Bennett incident happen completely. And so this was just like a. This is why he gets the double fist bump from Robbie. But this is, like, a great win and save for Whitaker. And also just, like, some season one trauma hanging over him as he handles his patient. What'd you think about that?
- [49:56]
C
I mean, tracks. Absolutely. In terms of doctors being unusually attuned to the very specific things that haunt them.
- [50:02]
B
Yeah.
- [50:02]
C
Yeah. And the ways you're willing to go the extra mile to attach the defib pads to, like, be ready for the thing that's, like, probably statistically not gonna happen, but if it does happen, you don't wanna be in that position again.
- [50:13]
B
Again.
- [50:14]
C
Yeah. And I thought that's why this episode overall last week, to me, was so much about the patient cases, and it was so much about, like, identifying with these people we don't really know and finding, like, these quick emotional connections with them in ways that I thought were really effective in some, a little clumsier in others, you know, a mixed bag. This one was all about the doctors. It was all about past cases, past wins, current expectations, current pressures, how you're paying off, like, the costs of precociousness, the cost of ambition. Like, it's. It was so much more of, like, a workplace drama this week in ways that I thought worked, but also just, like, I I constantly was, like, trying to find my footing overall in this episode because of it.
- [50:50]
B
Interesting. I thought this episode was, for me, much more successful than last week. I didn't have any moments that I really bumped on the way that I did same last week. It all felt just a bit smoother to me. But I hear what you're saying. I guess the only way, the place that I would push back on that is the Diaz family, right? Orlando Diaz, his wife Lori and their daughter. And the insurance case here that we have, we have Laurie Diaz who comes in. You know, this case has been percolating for a couple episodes now. We've got the full family here. Now Lori comes in having not been able to, you know, get the bus that she needs to get there. She's wearing her work shirt. And we get this conversation between Noel Hastings and. And Samira. Samira already knows this, but it's for the benefit of us at home. Why can these people who have multiple jobs not afford healthcare? Here's the very specific crack that they fall into inside of this very flawed system of why they can't have the coverage they for this. And how can we figure out a way through the system? This is something I'm going to be really interested to track. What can Nurse Hastings do? What can Samira do? What is the solution here for this family? Orlando's, you know, Orlando talks about he's not taking his medication that he needs in the dosage that he needs because they can't afford it. Yes. The. You know, we talked already in this episode, in previous episodes about shame. The shame in Lori's voice when she's like, we can't afford. Afford this ER stay. Like, what are we gonna do? Should we just leave sort of thing, you know, And Samira's like, we'll figure it out. This was just like very at the core of what the pit wants to tell us.
- [52:28]
C
Definitely. And you could see it all over their faces when she walks into the room and sees her husband, like, we can't do this. Like, I know, like in the moment, it's inarguable. You're in a hospital bed. You're in a hospital room. It's like, how. How is this all going to make sense financially and realistically for our family? And I thought they do a great job of carrying that dread, that tension, that anxiety throughout the whole case. Also another case where, as you mentioned, Samira Mohan's like a little bit over promising. And it's one of these things that we see with doctors across the board in the show that, like some cases, they're very hesitant to do it. We see it with Javati in this episode where she's hesitant to almost, like, say too much about what Jackson's potential diagnosis would be. The law student who's had this, like, episode and his sister's there. Exactly. And it's like, let's wait and see the test. Whereas Samir is saying, we will find a way when she has to know on some level, they might not find a way. And to the family's credit, to this point, the clearest sense of any kind of way forward is the closest thing we have in this country to a working insurance system. And that's GoFundMe, unfortunately.
- [53:29]
B
Yeah. This is the final quote that I'll read from this John Wells interview. Right. When he was talking about the response to season one, was he surprised that season one was such a hit? And he says, it turns out that people are really concerned about this. Things have gotten very dramatic within the healthcare system and all the changes that people have been trying to do to the Affordable Care act for years. I was surprised that the serious subject would immediately resonate. And every week, as the show dropped, there were more people who were tuning in and talking about it. Healthcare professionals started to talk about it. So this is part of their mission statement they want to talk about. He mentions violence in hospitals towards healthcare workers. We got that, of course, with, like the nurse Dana plotline, how difficult urban hospitals were getting changes in health, healthcare after effects for healthcare workers after Covid and the massive flaws inside of the incredibly corrupt insurance system in the US and so this family and their journey through the ER and what can we do to help? You almost game the system. How can we figure out a solution? Is something that I presume we'll be tracking as we go forward.
- [54:34]
C
I would hope so. I mean, this certainly has the legs of one of the cases that could go three or four episodes, if not more. And we're in need of those at this point in the season. Like, we've closed a lot of cases, They've turned over a lot of beds. A lot of the patients that we know already have been discharged have been moved on or have moved on to another part of the hospital.
- [54:51]
B
Right, Right.
- [54:52]
C
I think in terms of things that are looming, there's this case clearly going forward. There's a side mention of the abandoned baby.
- [54:59]
B
I know one of the patients is like, what about that baby?
- [55:02]
C
Many people are asking, what about the baby?
- [55:04]
B
You guys remember that baby? Yeah.
- [55:06]
C
Other than that, I'm trying to Think.
- [55:07]
B
Like Harlow with the ASL interpreter.
- [55:10]
C
And we see that one intruder. Yeah, I guess technically Boba guy is still at large and could be hiding in a supply closet somewhere. Most other things have been closed up to this point. And that's why you have to. You know the waitress with the foot pain that may or may not be MRSA coming back. Like, we're starting to kind of refresh what is happening in the ed and.
- [55:29]
B
We'Ve got the betting. The betting board that we're watching sort of like what's happening there. That's not a patient, but like that's an ongoing.
- [55:34]
C
Well, that's how you refill the er. Is the other hospital shut down? We gotta funnel all the ambulances here. I will say one thing that's kind of noticed and I don't think followed up in this episode. Pamela Perry comes in on one of those ambulances with abdominal pain after eating chilaquiles.
- [55:49]
B
This is the biggest tragedy of the whole episode.
- [55:50]
C
Well, it's not a tragedy. This is a fact checking moment. Chilaquiles wouldn't hurt a fly.
- [55:55]
B
I really agree.
- [55:56]
C
Has never harmed anybody.
- [55:57]
B
I really agree. I know that this is like your. Your Tex Mex, like, but I love chilaquiles.
- [56:03]
C
As you should.
- [56:03]
B
It's like one of the best breakfast options. Mel King would not eat it because it involves eggs.
- [56:07]
C
No, but that's okay.
- [56:09]
B
I really agree with you. Do not vilify chilaquiles.
- [56:12]
C
I resent the implications.
- [56:14]
B
We will not stand.
- [56:15]
C
This is my July effect moment. It's like, how dare you invoke chilaquiles in this fashion.
- [56:20]
B
I make chiliquil. Well, often, but every new. It's my New Year's Day. Like, we have people over. I make chilaquiles.
- [56:27]
C
Fuck yeah. Joke.
- [56:28]
B
It's really good for like volume serving people.
- [56:30]
C
That's beautiful.
- [56:31]
B
Mersa. Let's talk about it. This is the last thing we're going to talk about. I learned about Olympic sports, milking farms and MRSA for this podcast. Yes. Methicillin. You really can't do it all Methicillin resistant staphylococcus aureus. I really nailed that pronunciation for sure. MRSA. I believe it's 1 in 30 people have MRSA like on their body at any given moment. And it is not a problem to have this bacteria on the surface of your body.
- [56:59]
C
Okay.
- [56:59]
B
The problem is when it gets into the. The deeper layers of you. And that is why it often shows up in a hospital setting when you're getting sort of like various, various things. Penetrating your body. Phrasing. So like, if. If it can get.
- [57:12]
C
Save it for the milking problem.
- [57:13]
B
This is a resistant. Is a resistant bacterial infection. If it turns into sepsis, it can be fatal.
- [57:20]
C
Okay.
- [57:20]
B
And it's highly contagious as well, which is why Langdon and Donnie are like, oh, it could be mrsa, right? The. The pain and the like the warmth coming off of her skin and all that stuff. Like these are sort of classic MRSA indicators. They mention cellulitis. That's the la tissue below the skin. So when MRSA gets there, or I believe it's like in the lungs and the esophagus of like that. Like that's when you encounter true problems. So it shows up in like nursing homes and hospitals a lot and increasingly, you know, in other places because we are doing a bad job of taking care of ourselves. And it has to do. My understanding is this idea of like, you know, methicillin resistant staphylocation is, I believe, connected to prestigiouspotify.com I am not a doctor. I merely watched some YouTube videos this morning about MRSA. Fun fact, but has to do with our over treating things with antibiotics. And so we are, you know, for one thing, hand sanitizer, like which we see them use constantly in the hospital. But the way in which we're sort of like irresponsibly over using antibacterial substances is causing more and more resistant strains of bacteria in the world. I believe that to be true. If that is a. If that is a myth. PressU tv@Spotify.com and I'm certainly happy to correct the record.
- [58:47]
C
I hope it's a myth. As someone who is hand sanitizing a apparently distressing amount, I really hope that's not true.
- [58:54]
B
Are you a big. I've never seen you.
- [58:56]
C
Oh, I. Mallory Rubin's a huge one.
- [58:57]
B
I've never seen you do it though.
- [58:58]
C
Carry it with me almost at all times these days. Look, all right. We all responded to Covid differently. This has been a real before and after transition for me.
- [59:06]
B
It's true. It's true. All right. Anything else you want to talk about? Did we get it all?
- [59:09]
C
One last thing, Joe. And we've mentioned this in earlier pods, but it felt especially prominent here. Dana has been missing stuff all day. Just weird little mistakes where in this episode it's like said there were two patients going to be rolling in from the ambulances when three were called. In an earlier episode, she tries to debrief McKay on her patients that are not her patients. It's like, there's little things happening that feel flagged at this point, an accumulation of something happening.
- [59:34]
B
With Dana, what's your. Do you feel like it's related to that sort of, like, PTSD email that we got? That's what you guys.
- [59:40]
C
That, to me, it feels, like, very in line with. Exactly. And maybe I'm just, like, primed to see it now since we got that email, but it does feel like we're seeding that idea.
- [59:49]
B
Interesting. How do you see that playing out? Or do you?
- [59:51]
C
I'm not sure.
- [59:51]
B
You don't care?
- [59:52]
C
I mean, frankly, this is one of those things where, like, this ER does not work without Dana. Like, she's such a binding element for all of the disparate parts of it that if she does have, like, her own Dr. Robbie, I need to huddle in a ball in peeds moment. I don't know how anyone gets by without her. So it could be another tough thing that they have to confront of, like, not only whatever's gonna happen that's gonna force Robbie and Dr. Elashimi to come to a head or come together, but in addition to that, if Dana's at all indisposed, that's brutal for everyone else.
- [60:24]
B
Speaking of brutal. And unless there's one thing we did not, like, linger on that, I think we should, which is, let's go back to, like, patron saint of this pod, Dr. Bangs and the broken coccyx and how she had to fix that. Should we just, like, we should touch on that, I think.
- [60:43]
C
I don't want to touch on that.
- [60:45]
B
Not even with gloves.
- [60:46]
C
That's not my job. She didn't want to touch on that.
- [60:48]
B
Not even with gloves. And, like, medical grade lubricant. You're like, no, thank you.
- [60:53]
C
I mean, I will give him credit. Like, the idea of undergoing that for the sake of keeping your social calendar.
- [60:58]
B
Intact, for the sake of love or.
- [61:01]
C
I mean, at least a certain entertainment. He has his priorities straight, in a sense.
- [61:07]
B
I just want to shout out this actor who, once again, I mentioned was a heartthrob of the 80s, was on the OC has done a lot of.
- [61:16]
C
Things, is a heartthrob of today. I don't know if you heard how many dates he has.
- [61:22]
B
I think the bravery of showing us his butt was. I just like to applaud. It's very hirsu. And, you know, it was a thing we saw on this show.
- [61:34]
C
Not everyone will recognize it, but we applaud butt bravery here.
- [61:38]
B
We do. All right. That has allegedly been another episode of the prestige TV podcast Morning Glory Milking Farm by CM DaCosta is the first in a series. There are more coming, so phrasing. Did not mean to say that.
- [61:51]
C
Also, what's the series called?
- [61:53]
B
Does it have a Cambric Creek series?
- [61:56]
C
I believe that's disappointing. Real missed opportunity.
- [61:58]
B
Okay, well, prestigev is Spotify.com, or drsydbangsmail.com, if you have a better title. For this book series, we also solicited nicknames for Dr. Santos. And Rob, you determined that we have not yet found the winner?
- [62:11]
C
Yeah, some very, I think some very promising, well intentioned leads, but nothing that's really making me feel like the search is over.
- [62:17]
B
Okay, so we would like to continue to receive those emails.
- [62:19]
C
I would love to.
- [62:20]
B
Any corrections of medical mishaps we might have made, wag those fingers. We love to learn. Thank you to you, Rob Vahoney.
- [62:26]
C
Thanks, Joe.
- [62:27]
B
Thanks to you, Kai Grady, for getting on the mic multiple times this episode. And thank you to Justin Sale as always for his work on this feed. And we'll see you back for industry. Jodie Walker will be back with us. Industry is very good this season if you guys aren't watching it, so tune in for that.
- [62:44]
C
And I would say there's like a similar amount of stuff going into orifices on both shows somehow right now.
- [62:49]
B
What a promise to make. We'll see you soon. Bye. Sa.