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The Prestige TV Podcast
‘The Studio’ Episodes 3-8: Midseason Awards, A-List Cameos, and Best Fake Movie
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- [00:01]
Bill Simmons
This is Bill Simmons. I am thrilled to announce our newest YouTube channel. It's called Ringer Movies. If you're a fan of our movie coverage here at the Ringer, then you're in luck because every episode of the Rewatchables in the big Picture now on YouTube.
- [00:14]
Sean Fennessy
Like Bill said, Ringer Movies will feature full episodes of my show, the Big Picture, the rewatchables, as well as special live episodes, deep dives into movie history and a bunch of other fun stuff featuring other movie loving ringer personalities. Search ringer movies on YouTube and experience the joy of Chris Ryan impersonating Wayne Jenkins on camera.
- [00:34]
Bill Simmons
This episode is brought to you by Degree original Cool Rush deodorant. Remember last year people got really mad when Degree changed their Cool Rush formula. One dude even started a petition. What was up with that guy? Well, guess what? ° listened. They admitted they messed up. They're bringing back the original Cool Rush scent. And thank God. You've gotta love when a brand can own its mistakes. And it's in Walmart, Target and other stores right now for under $4. Grab some, find out why it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. By the way, you should put that on especially. We're about to hit the summer. It's getting sweaty in the summers. The original Degree Cool Rush is back and it smells like victory for all of us. This episode is brought to you by Viori. Look, I'm not a big let's hype up workout clothes guy, but Viori, I gotta say, total game changer. Been wearing a lot. If you see me power walking around Los Angeles, probably gonna see me wearing some Viori Sunday performance joggers that they have. It's made with four way performance stretch fabric, one of the most comfortable things you own. You will wear them everywhere, I promise. All you have to do is go to viori.com and you get 20% off your first purchase with Vuori V-U-O-R-I.com Simmons. Enjoy. Free shipping on all US orders over $75 plus free returns. Exclusions apply. Visit the website for full terms and conditions.
- [02:18]
Sean Fennessy
Welcome to the Prestige TV podcast. I'm Sean Fennessy here with Craig Horlbeck. Craig, this is our first time recording a pod together. How do you feel?
- [02:25]
Craig Horlbeck
Is that right?
- [02:25]
Sean Fennessy
Just me and you?
- [02:26]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, definitely just me and you. We've had you on the fantasy pod.
- [02:29]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah.
- [02:29]
Craig Horlbeck
Talking jets.
- [02:30]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. I'm sort of the Matt and you're the Sal in this equation, Right?
- [02:34]
Craig Horlbeck
I was actually wondering if you were gonna say I'm the Sal or the Quinn. Thank you for saying Sal.
- [02:38]
Sean Fennessy
You are the Sal. We're talking about the studio. This is a bit of a catch up episode. Me, Bill and Joanna did talk about the first two episodes and some of the third episode. And at the beginning of this season. This is a new Apple TV show that is produced and directed by Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg. And it is a massive parody, satire, loving homage to the absolute inanity of working in Hollywood. And the show, I would say, has broadly been a huge critical success. And I have absolutely no idea if people in the real world beyond our LA and New York denizens are engaging in it.
- [03:15]
Craig Horlbeck
Well, it's number two on Apple. I don't know what that means.
- [03:18]
Sean Fennessy
Me neither.
- [03:18]
Craig Horlbeck
But it's been consistently number one or number two, which is a good sign. It just got renewed for a second season. Also good sign, right?
- [03:27]
Sean Fennessy
Absolutely.
- [03:27]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah.
- [03:28]
Sean Fennessy
I think also you are the first person in my life who came to me and said, have you seen the studio when we first got screeners for this show? You, of course, are the producer of the Town and the host of the Town. Matt Bellany makes some cameo appearances on this series.
- [03:43]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, no spoilers.
- [03:44]
Sean Fennessy
No spoilers.
- [03:44]
Craig Horlbeck
The Town podcast has been in, I think the first episode or the second one. Yeah.
- [03:49]
Sean Fennessy
We could say you're in the pocket of the studio in some ways.
- [03:51]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, I'm angling to get in season two.
- [03:54]
Sean Fennessy
Oh, you were not invited to this season?
- [03:56]
Craig Horlbeck
Not yet.
- [03:56]
Sean Fennessy
That's too bad.
- [03:57]
Craig Horlbeck
Okay.
- [03:58]
Sean Fennessy
But this show is. It's fascinating. The conversation that me, Bill and Joanna had was, I think, defined by this, like, who's paying attention? Who's this for? What's this about? In the aftermath of stuff like Larry Sanders and the Player and this long history of Hollywood self satirizing, to me, this show is working really well as both a broad comedy and an insider's story. Do you feel the same way?
- [04:20]
Craig Horlbeck
Yes. Yeah. I'm probably too in the bag for this show to be objective because this is like everything I've ever wanted in a television show. So I really love it when you say that.
- [04:30]
Sean Fennessy
What do you mean?
- [04:31]
Craig Horlbeck
Not only do I have I wanted to work in media or Hollywood, I've always found it to be. The glamour, the sexiness of it has always been very attractive to me. And it's everything you want Hollywood to be in the best and worst ways, which is why I really like it. Yeah, it shows you, like the backstabbing and the self importance and the vanity of it all. But it's also very glamorous and sexy and cool. It really is, to me, kind of a. It's honestly just kind of a workplace comedy. That looks fucking awesome.
- [04:58]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [04:58]
Craig Horlbeck
And it is less, I think, going in. I thought there was going to be more arcs, more narrative build, and there kind of isn't.
- [05:07]
Sean Fennessy
I'd like to explore that with you a little bit. Matt Remick is the Seth Rogen character. He, at the beginning of the series, was named the head of the Continental Studios, which is clearly a large historical movie studio, but maybe not quite at the top of the heap in terms of Disney and Netflix. It feels like it's more in the vein of a Paramount and it feels very closely modeled on real world events.
- [05:30]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah.
- [05:31]
Sean Fennessy
But the energy of the show is complicated, and I think one of the reasons some people have had a hard time hooking into it, but I think feels very true to the experience of working in Hollywood is there are no heroes on the show. And in fact, Matt, the lead, is kind of a tragic dipshit and has not, through eight episodes, really turned that arc around in any meaningful way. In fact, he keeps kind of digging a deeper existential hole for himself, despite the fact that he is, in theory, in one of the five key jobs in movie making. You know, he is incredibly powerful. He has the ability to greenlight films. He can work with his favorite artists if he wants to, and yet he's kind of a miserable schmuck.
- [06:11]
Craig Horlbeck
I see. I. Yeah. And it's because I think this show is tapping more into curb than it is hacks, where there's conflict and this resolution and character growth, it kind of is just. Let's tune in this week to see the misadventures of a. Of a Hollywood executive crew at a studio. And that's the only criticism I've heard, is that people thought it was going to be more honestly, like, serious in terms of its growth and the character development. And it's kind of just like Seth and Evan wanting to tell people that the behind the scenes of Hollywood is just as chaotic and embarrassing as you think. But we also kind of love it, and it's really funny. And it's just as funny what's going on behind the scenes as sometimes what you're seeing on screen.
- [06:53]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, I think it's a fascinating show, too, about. Essentially, it's not just that the studio executives are buffoonish in some ways and that they think that they are creative and in fact, they are actually impeding the creative process of movie making, but that when you are a boss and in charge of a creative endeavor. It's basically hard to seem cool or good in any way. There's not really like Matt Remick, in theory aspires to not just making meaningful movies that make him feel great about the work that he does, but to do a good job at this job.
- [07:24]
Craig Horlbeck
And he wants people to like him.
- [07:25]
Sean Fennessy
And he wants people to like him.
- [07:27]
Craig Horlbeck
And a lot of the show is how quickly people abandon their integrity when it benefits them.
- [07:31]
Sean Fennessy
Yep.
- [07:32]
Craig Horlbeck
And that's like every character in the show. I mean, the Ron Howard episode, episode three is the perfect example of this. Everyone is like, I'm single handedly saving film and then one of them has to deliver a negative note to Ron Howard. And they're like, actually, I'm never going to do that.
- [07:44]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [07:45]
Craig Horlbeck
Because I want Ron Howard to like me.
- [07:47]
Sean Fennessy
The passing of the baton is really interesting. I had heard that Ron Howard was the very first celebrity who signed on to appear in the show, which is very interesting because it tells you a lot about how this show is constructed too, that they need these critical names to make the show make sense. And it does the same thing that a show like Curb does or show like the Larry Sanders show does, where they take famous people and they portray a kind of darkened version of themselves, or it takes a famous person and they play a character that exists within this world that is created around it. And it's a very clever delineation between who gets to be themselves, who. Who gets to be a character. This is a world where Seth and Evan don't really exist, which is kind of an amusing way to think about this. But it is also a world where Olivia Wilde, for example, is a successful but complicated and maybe deeply flawed filmmaker, which is something that most people who follow this stuff somewhat closely might know just from seeing the trail of press around. Don't worry, darling. And they managed to convince somebody who incurred all this negative press about the making of that movie to do something somewhat similar in the Missing Reel, the fourth episode of the show.
- [08:53]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, I always think it's a good look. A celebrity plays into a stereotype about them. I think it's. It's a, it's a humble move. I think it's a great play for your ego. And I also think a lot of the reason why this stuff works, and I, and I, it's probably why a lot of celebrities and people agreed to cameo is. And I'm curious what you think. The show doesn't really tap into any macro major issues in Hollywood, like it Kind of hints at them.
- [09:22]
Sean Fennessy
It points to them. Yeah.
- [09:23]
Craig Horlbeck
But they're not really getting into streaming. Like the word streaming might not even be uttered in the show maybe once or twice. AI is not a huge part of this show.
- [09:31]
Sean Fennessy
There was a point made about it in episode seven in casting, in the Kool Aid casting episode. It became a point of rejection and revulsion at the end of that episode. But it wasn't really explored. It was just the same thing you hear over and over again, which is AI Bad. Taking jobs away from people. Yeah. And that's basically it.
- [09:50]
Craig Horlbeck
But. But then it ends and then the next episode begins and that's no longer. You know, each episode is its own. You can kind of just jump into the show.
- [09:57]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [09:57]
Craig Horlbeck
And watch an episode and kind of have an idea of what's going on. But like the theatrical Decline franchise ification, that stuff is all kind of floating around it, but none of it is actually driving the story. Yeah. I guess the Kool Aid of it all is. Is a major plot point. But even that, again, it's. It's not like people are really like the Kool Aid thing. Matt's character is not really being hurt by that throughout the season.
- [10:21]
Sean Fennessy
No, I mean, in fact, it's interesting that they even brought that film back into the center of the story three or four episodes since they had last really discussed it because it felt like the show had become this self contained situational comedy where each episode was just a different problem that they had to deal with in that space. It isn't a serialized drama in any of the ways that we come to expect with a show that looks this good from a big fancy streamer and big stars.
- [10:45]
Craig Horlbeck
That's why it's so confusing, I think to some people is they're. This looks maybe better than almost. This looks better than some movies.
- [10:52]
Sean Fennessy
The filmmaking is amazing. My favorite episode of this show is still the second episode, which we talked about the oner and the filmmaking style and the location shooting and all that. It's just remarkable. Like, it's just really, really high level stuff.
- [11:04]
Craig Horlbeck
And they're just using one camera, one lens. It's like a 35 millimeter lens and they're shooting everything on it.
- [11:09]
Sean Fennessy
And it honestly sounds like it's incredibly laborious to execute on this show.
- [11:13]
Craig Horlbeck
Seth said, on average it's 16 takes per oner shot. And I would say each episode it can have, I don't know, 10 to 15 oners.
- [11:20]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, it's just a tremendous amount of work that they're putting into. What usually doesn't happen. I think part of the success of the show, too, is even though it's not a serialized show, it is a deep character study, and there's a lot of time spent not just with Matt, but with Sal Saperstein. Like Barinholtz's character, we're getting some time with Chase Tui Wonder's character and seeing what it's like for someone who's kind of on the younger side of the executive stage. Catherine o' Harris character, who is sort of the Amy Pascal stand in. So you are like, you're building a relationship with the characters in the series, even though their lives doesn't feel like they're being charted in a linear way, it feels like we're kind of like dots on a map that are moving all over the place.
- [11:57]
Craig Horlbeck
And it's not really emotional. It's more. It's more professional.
- [12:00]
Sean Fennessy
I would have said that all the way up until the end of the Golden Globes.
- [12:03]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. When he sat in the limo.
- [12:04]
Sean Fennessy
When he's sitting alone in the limo and Matt and I was like, oh, this is a tragedy. I didn't realize that this show was a tragedy. Now you've seen ahead. I haven't seen ahead. We won't spoil anything about episodes 9 and 10. Maybe I think you and I will come back at the end of episode 10 to do another pod about this.
- [12:15]
Craig Horlbeck
But again, like I said, with the end of the other episode where the next one begins and the conversation about AI has just ended, it's kind of the same thing. I don't want to spoil nine, but, like, the sadness that Matt feels at the end of eight doesn't really carry. Like, they are more contained.
- [12:30]
Sean Fennessy
That's interesting. Do you feel that that is, like, reflective of the life of people that you are close to in the business? There is an epic sadness inside of Matt.
- [12:38]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. It's funny, though, because there's a. There's a perpetual anxiety and sadness and stress in everybody. And then the next day you wake up and you just kind of start all over again, and you try to win again the next day. And that's kind of what this show is.
- [12:50]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah.
- [12:51]
Craig Horlbeck
You know.
- [12:51]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. It's an interesting exploration of people who get into a job that is literally in the city of dreams, and they think that they're pursuing their dream, and their dream is just a mechanical bureaucratic shame factory.
- [13:05]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. And it looks gorgeous on purpose. I mean, the Continental Studios is, like, the coolest building I've ever seen in my life. Seth him. Matt Remick's Character is the best dressed character I've ever seen in a show. It's immaculate. And all the other characters look great too.
- [13:19]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, It's a fantasy inside of a nightmare. It's fascinating. It's a surrealist show in a lot of ways. Even though it feels very real.
- [13:25]
Craig Horlbeck
This is also on purpose. They don't get into the personal lives of really anybody.
- [13:29]
Sean Fennessy
We do see a couple of moments. We see Chase, Tui Wonder's boyfriend, and there's like kind of a sex scene. You know, we see that Matt dates.
- [13:37]
Craig Horlbeck
That scene jumped that. Did that kind of the sex scene kind of like stick out to you?
- [13:41]
Sean Fennessy
It did, but it also felt.
- [13:43]
Craig Horlbeck
That felt real to me, like.
- [13:45]
Sean Fennessy
Like this is what happens with 30 year olds in these jobs living in dingy apartments in Silver Lake. You know, I was like, there's something real about what's happening here. I used to be one of those 30 year olds, you know.
- [13:54]
Craig Horlbeck
Did this happen to you?
- [13:55]
Sean Fennessy
Not that sex scene specifically, but, you know, this lifestyle, it's. It. I think that there's like a lot of wisdom in the real experiences of the people, but it's pitched at a level that is like anxiety inducing. I would say a lot of the show is very dependent on Matt's anxiety and the anxiety that filters down from him to all the people that work with him. And we haven't even mentioned Kathryn Hahn's character. She too is like a speedball of rage and exaltation in every episode that she appears in. It's a really odd show. I can't. It's not. Larry Sanders and the Player are not the comparisons for this show.
- [14:32]
Craig Horlbeck
I think it's more Veep.
- [14:33]
Sean Fennessy
It's more Veep. That's exactly what I was gonna say.
- [14:34]
Craig Horlbeck
And then one of the creators, Alex Gregory, worked on Veep.
- [14:37]
Sean Fennessy
Worked on Veep. And that same sense of desperation and panic. And we all fucked up today, but tomorrow's a new day.
- [14:43]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. And like, this is what it's like at the top. It's stupid people having stupid conversations in beautiful places.
- [14:48]
Sean Fennessy
Yes. Yeah. Well, LA is more beautiful than dc, but yeah, your point is taken. Any other thoughts on the show? I mean, the most recent episode is the Golden Globes episode, which I thought was kind of masterful and seemed like it was incredibly hard to pull off because there's so many famous people in episode. That sounds like it's easy to do when you're making a TV show, but it's not to get somebody to come in and work for two days.
- [15:09]
Craig Horlbeck
Especially when every shot is Every take is five minutes long. You got to get Adam Scott to hit his mark and Dave Krumholz to then hit his mark. And then it cuts to the hacks creators on stage and Ramy Yousef then comes out after. It's extremely impressive. I spoke to somebody who worked on the show and they were like, yeah, Apple basically just recreated the Globes. It felt like you were at the Golden Globes.
- [15:27]
Sean Fennessy
It's an amazing achievement.
- [15:28]
Craig Horlbeck
They're at the Beverly Hilton.
- [15:29]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. And the show is. Every episode is incredibly propulsive because of that filmmaking style. And I thought this episode was quite funny because it was a real exploration of why Matt will never be happy and that the thing that he thinks he wants that will help him, he's pursuing it in a way that is more desperate than any normal person would. What happens in that episode, I would not say specifically would happen literally, but a version of someone working overtime to get thanked publicly literally does happen.
- [16:00]
Craig Horlbeck
Yes.
- [16:00]
Sean Fennessy
The fight for credit, for example, is so important to people in Hollywood. They are defined by their. The, like, credit creep that comes with every project. So I don't know, I just felt something very true about this episode, too, and very curb.
- [16:14]
Craig Horlbeck
Also, I don't know if. I don't know if there are teleprompters for award speeches.
- [16:18]
Sean Fennessy
That was news to me. If that's something that happens. If you get to contribute your potential speech if you're going to win. Maybe it's a Globes thing.
- [16:24]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, maybe.
- [16:26]
Sean Fennessy
We've cooked up some awards, so we're trying to cover six episodes here. So this is a pretty broad swath that we can talk through. First award, best episode from three through eight. What's your pick?
- [16:37]
Craig Horlbeck
Casting episode seven.
- [16:39]
Sean Fennessy
Okay.
- [16:39]
Craig Horlbeck
When they struggle to cast the Kool Aid movie in the attempt to not be racist. And it's. They don't actually care if they are racist. They just don't want to appear racist.
- [16:48]
Sean Fennessy
The perception of racism is.
- [16:50]
Craig Horlbeck
The issue of being racist is driving the entire episode. The funniest bit to me is every, like five minutes, they come up with a new cast that they think is the answer. And then it cuts back to one of them staring at the bulletin board with everyone's headshots on it. And the best one is at the end when they decide that actually every character in the movie is going to be black. And then it cuts to Chase three Wonders character and she goes, okay, now this is racist. So good.
- [17:14]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, it's a great episode. I really like that one too. I especially like the conversation with Lil Rel. When he's sort of examining whether or not he's, like, the decider for them, him and Zwez.
- [17:25]
Craig Horlbeck
Are you saying that a black woman could not be with a man like Kool Aid?
- [17:32]
Sean Fennessy
My favorite episode, I'm inclined to say the Golden Globes, because I just watched it yesterday, and I thought it was a pretty amazing feat. But I thought the funniest episode was the War, which is an episode that kind of sidelines Matt in favor of Sal and Chase, Louie Wonder's character. And they're kind of like, in this battle for deputy supremacy, this idea of them having the ability to choose a filmmaker on a project to get Matt's attention on a sort of, like, death battle that you tend to see in the second tier of leadership in a lot of places like this.
- [18:06]
Craig Horlbeck
And it's a lot of generational philosophies at war.
- [18:11]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. The sort of, like, white guy in his 40s with kids who hate him and he feels like he's lost. And this young woman who's trying to be taken seriously. Woman of color who's trying to be taken seriously and sort of, like, presenting herself as the future of the business, but doesn't quite know how to do her job yet.
- [18:26]
Craig Horlbeck
It's the only episode, in my opinion, that really shows strong character growth. And it's funny that it's the one without Matt or that sidelines Matt. You actually. That's where you get to see Quinn's home life. You get to see Sal's home life with his daughters, which is a hilarious thing we could talk about.
- [18:39]
Sean Fennessy
It's something I'd like to see a little more of in season two, and I'm kind of hoping that they'll let us go outside of the Matt pain cave more.
- [18:45]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, I don't know if it's. You know, you only have 10 episodes, and these are short episodes, and you don't really have time. And I. You know, if you want to just cut to those scenes, the. The oner style, I feel like when you're at home with your family, maybe it doesn't translate as well.
- [18:57]
Sean Fennessy
It's not as dynamic. You're right. I thought it worked pretty well, though, when Sal takes his kids out to the restaurant and the camera's kind of whipping around the table. And their utter disinterest relative to his anxiety felt like very in sync with the show. But the reason that I picked it is because I think it has the best visual, physical comedy of the series, particularly the burrito throw, which is just an amazing. That's my visual gag for this award show too, because that's like epic orchestration at the end of a oner that is like magical kind of Buster Keaton style movie making to me that I absolutely loved.
- [19:30]
Bill Simmons
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- [21:05]
Craig Horlbeck
The first four I think kind of it's just Matt wanting to save Hollywood and he loves movies and he has the great line in the first episode. I've always loved movies and now I think my job is to ruin them. And then episode three with Olivia Wilde, he's championing the use of real film and paying for that and all that stuff. And then in episode five, I feel like you kind of get to see Matt settling into his job a little bit and Owen Klein and Parker Finn show up and he's kind of being a dick to them and he is kind of siding with Sal about, well, this needs to make money.
- [21:37]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [21:38]
Craig Horlbeck
And you can kind of see that Matt character. You know, he doesn't really grow, but he morphs.
- [21:42]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, he's becoming the Catherine o' Hara character He's becoming cynical in real time. And all of his aspirations for working with Martin Scorsese and making real movies have dissipated. They're not really indicating to us how much time is passing. Although it's an interesting thing to think about because did this happen in a month? Did it happen in six months?
- [21:58]
Craig Horlbeck
In a couple months is my guess.
- [22:00]
Sean Fennessy
I agree. We also have not really heard from Bryan Cranston very much. His character, who may or may not be Griffin Mill from the film the Player. His character's name Griffin Mill and his. He was very present in the first couple of episodes because of his desire to get big projects going and to not make films, but to make movies. Movies.
- [22:19]
Craig Horlbeck
Does that bother you? That phrase, how do you feel about that as the host of the Big Picture?
- [22:23]
Sean Fennessy
Why not both? You know, like, I don't have to choose. We don't. There's not a popcorn movie can be a film and a great work of art can be a movie.
- [22:31]
Craig Horlbeck
Do you use the words interchangeably?
- [22:33]
Sean Fennessy
More or less. But just because I have to say a version of them, like nonstop, every day in my life.
- [22:36]
Craig Horlbeck
College paper.
- [22:37]
Sean Fennessy
You need a little baby needs to have some synonyms. Exactly. I don't. I don't delineate between the two, but I'm curious. I assume Griffin Mill will make a return near the end of the season.
- [22:48]
Craig Horlbeck
Safe to say a triumphant return. Yeah.
- [22:50]
Sean Fennessy
Interesting. Okay. I look forward to that.
- [22:52]
Craig Horlbeck
My other favorite episode, I have to say, is the pediatric oncologist episode.
- [22:56]
Sean Fennessy
The only one that hasn't come up yet in our conversation.
- [22:58]
Craig Horlbeck
Because it's. I mean, this is more of a bottle episode that you could pluck right out of the season and it wouldn't matter.
- [23:02]
Sean Fennessy
This one was very curb to me. One of perhaps the most curb. Yeah.
- [23:06]
Craig Horlbeck
Yes. My sister in law is a pediatric oncologist in L. A.
- [23:10]
Sean Fennessy
Does she look like Rebecca Hall?
- [23:12]
Craig Horlbeck
Blonde versus brunette.
- [23:13]
Sean Fennessy
Okay.
- [23:14]
Craig Horlbeck
But I could see her at one of those gallas. Her one note was like, where are these pediatric oncologists getting $100,000 to bid on golf?
- [23:21]
Sean Fennessy
Good question.
- [23:23]
Craig Horlbeck
I don't know where they're working.
- [23:25]
Sean Fennessy
It did have me wondering what Matt's salary is given that he lays out. Was he lay out 200k for that 200k?
- [23:33]
Craig Horlbeck
I actually I texted Matt Bellamy about this and he texted a studio executive and he guessed that Matt is making about 5 million.
- [23:40]
Sean Fennessy
Interesting. That would be a lot to pay for golf, a sport he does not play.
- [23:44]
Craig Horlbeck
$200,000. Well, this is the curb of it all. Larry David would do that in a Heartbeat.
- [23:47]
Sean Fennessy
That's a good point. He is a buffoon.
- [23:50]
Craig Horlbeck
But, yeah, this episode is nuts. And what's great about it is it's like Seth and Evan know how ridiculous their jobs are and what they do. And Seth and Evan, Seth's wife, I believe, does a lot of philanthropy in the medical world. So he goes to a lot of events like this. And I think he literally has these conversations where they're like, oh, didn't you make Pineapple Express? That's all about smoking weed. And he's like, well, yes, but that is art. And what I loved about this episode is you kind of seesaw back and forth between who you're hating. The Doctors versus Seth versus Matt Remick. And they could have made it much more like, Matt is the idiot. The Doctors are correct. But it shows that Hollywood still has this, like, self importance to them where they're like, well, sure, but we still do matter. You may be working with children who have cancer, but we still do matter a little bit.
- [24:40]
Sean Fennessy
You could argue that in this episode, Matt Remick gives his most unlikable and boneheaded social performance of the series. And yet when you get to the end of the episode and they're outside the fountain and he's saying to them, I'll give you the trip if you just tell me what I do is important. It's as important as what you do.
- [24:59]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. Him saying as important as what you do.
- [25:01]
Sean Fennessy
There was a part of me that was like, he's not wrong. Like, the arts do matter. I'm not saying that it is more important than curing pediatric cancer.
- [25:09]
Craig Horlbeck
It's not.
- [25:10]
Sean Fennessy
It's not. But when they were like, we cure cancer, and he's like, did you cure cancer?
- [25:14]
Craig Horlbeck
He's like, I missed the headline.
- [25:16]
Sean Fennessy
You know, he's not wrong. So I think the show is, like, weirdly, is so clearly aware of the absurdity and the silliness of. Of Hollywood and show business, but there is this, like, little subterranean part of Seth and Evan that are like, we do make people happy and that matters a lot. And honestly, they're right. So as much as they want to curb themselves, curb stomp themselves, in some ways, Matt is just getting absolutely annihilated at the end of every episode of the show. Now, I still think that they sort of believe in the magic of entertainment.
- [25:49]
Craig Horlbeck
Absolutely.
- [25:50]
Sean Fennessy
And the whole movie, I mean, the.
- [25:51]
Craig Horlbeck
Whole show is so romantic looking.
- [25:53]
Sean Fennessy
It is. It also crests so beautifully in the Golden Globes episode, in that kind of confrontation between Ted Sarandos and Matt Remick. Where Sarandos, you know, this is just a fascinating cameo that the head of the studio of a rival streamer appears on an Apple TV show at a moment in which Netflix is so far out in front of everybody else.
- [26:15]
Craig Horlbeck
And it's a show about making movies and putting movies in theaters.
- [26:18]
Sean Fennessy
Yes. And he, of course, is frankly the enemy of that. And Ted Sarandos gets to look like the smartest guy in the room, the most grounded and intelligent person in business. That's crowd.
- [26:28]
Craig Horlbeck
That's a good way to put it.
- [26:29]
Sean Fennessy
Because he knows he identifies to Matt, that he's not an artist, that he's the bean counter. And so he gets to have this sense of grace. And Matt has none of that grace now. Who knows if Sarandos is like that in real life.
- [26:39]
Craig Horlbeck
He's a huge movie lover himself.
- [26:40]
Sean Fennessy
He does love movies, which is why it's so painful what has happened with Netflix to me and why they operate the way that they do. Because he knows everything about. He used to work in video stores. Anyway. I loved that scene. And I thought that that was fascinating and just amazing that it happened that Sarandos was. That Apple allowed him to appear in the show, that he agreed to appear in an Apple show, that these are two streaming services that have an unhealthy relationship to theatrical. I would say.
- [27:05]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah.
- [27:05]
Sean Fennessy
Apple about to release Fountain of Youth straight to streaming a film starring John Krasinski and Natalie Portman. And yet this is Hollywood right now. Like, these are the most powerful people, the people who are making streaming TV shows. It's fascinating.
- [27:19]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. There's a self awareness to it all where you get the sense that it's like even Ted Sarandos knows and probably does love going to the movie theater to watch a movie, but he knows the reality of the world he's in. And there's kind of the cognitive dissonance of like he's doing the thing at Netflix, but he also understands the other side. And him being in the show, I think kind of proves that. I also thought he was pretty believable as an actor.
- [27:39]
Sean Fennessy
He was good.
- [27:39]
Craig Horlbeck
He was really good.
- [27:40]
Sean Fennessy
He gets a quiet moment to himself after Matt walks away. And he pulled it off.
- [27:44]
Craig Horlbeck
He did.
- [27:45]
Sean Fennessy
Also, he's in a oner shot, peeing.
- [27:47]
Craig Horlbeck
All the way back out to the bar.
- [27:48]
Sean Fennessy
Yes. That's not easy.
- [27:49]
Craig Horlbeck
No.
- [27:50]
Sean Fennessy
Okay. What's your most believable Hollywood storyline so far?
- [27:52]
Craig Horlbeck
It's the Quinn character in the war. A young executive thinking it's their time to shine two weeks after getting promoted. That just feels Spot on right now.
- [28:00]
Sean Fennessy
What are you saying about your generation?
- [28:03]
Craig Horlbeck
You know, we want things expedited.
- [28:05]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. A little over your skis.
- [28:06]
Craig Horlbeck
All of our bosses are old. Not. Not here.
- [28:09]
Sean Fennessy
But, you know, what are you trying to say?
- [28:12]
Craig Horlbeck
You're young.
- [28:13]
Sean Fennessy
Okay, thank you. Appreciate that. No, no sarcasm in your tone. Thank you. Yeah. Blossoming. More gray hair by the day.
- [28:19]
Craig Horlbeck
And then, I mean, somebody working in media or the arts or whatever, conflating the importance of their job with a doctor also feels pretty accurate.
- [28:27]
Sean Fennessy
That seemed realistic. Yeah. I just did it right here on this podcast. For me. Most believable storyline. I really enjoyed the Parker Finn, director of smile and smile 2, being brought in to remake his horror movie for the third consecutive time. But just retitling it, Wink, which is a very soft reboot of Smile, mere years after making it a smash sensation. I really like that sequence where Owen Klein in particular comes in to pitch against Parker Finn's basically his own movie. And he's presented by Quinn as the sort of a 24 cool guy who's up and coming, which is something that we do see quite often. One guy makes one feature film and then all of a sudden he's springboarded into a big Hollywood production. That's just. That is what happens.
- [29:10]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, I thought both of them were quite good as well. Parker and because those are guys who are a little bit lesser known.
- [29:16]
Sean Fennessy
Owen Klein, though, Kevin Klein's son and was an actor in his own right.
- [29:19]
Craig Horlbeck
Kevin Klein's son didn't know that.
- [29:21]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, he's Kevin Klein and Phoebe Cates son. And he was one of the sons in the Squid and the Whale. And he has not acted in many years.
- [29:27]
Craig Horlbeck
He was really good.
- [29:28]
Sean Fennessy
He's very good.
- [29:29]
Craig Horlbeck
They did a great job with the cameos. They clearly have an eye for. For who would work. I mean, even the big names like Scorsese in episode one really kills it.
- [29:35]
Sean Fennessy
Okay, next category. Least believable Hollywood storyline.
- [29:40]
Craig Horlbeck
I had Zack Snyder presenting Best Picture at any awards show. That doesn't feel even at the Golden Globes. I'm not sure Zack Snyder's given out Best pick.
- [29:47]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, bit of a reach. Marty was not available on this day.
- [29:52]
Craig Horlbeck
Everything else felt believable. Ramy, Youssef, all the people on stage. It all worked. And then Zack Snyder comes out. He had a funny joke, I will say, talking about how he's going to release his own Snyder cut of the Golden Globes.
- [30:02]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, every Golden Globes feels like the Snyder cut to me, but that's neither here nor there. Speaking of the podcast award that the Golden Globes be giving out. How are you feeling about that? Is ringer fantasy football angling for?
- [30:13]
Craig Horlbeck
Well, it's why I'm doing the show right now. I'm campaigning.
- [30:16]
Sean Fennessy
FYC has started.
- [30:17]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah.
- [30:17]
Sean Fennessy
Well, you're putting in the hours for me. Least political storyline. I mentioned Matt desperately trying to get thanked by like, trying to take over the teleprompter was a little far. Trying to get inside the teleprompter during the award show.
- [30:31]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah.
- [30:32]
Sean Fennessy
Strained some credulity when Ted Sarando said.
- [30:35]
Craig Horlbeck
That he requires everyone who wins an award at Netflix to thank him. I love that. Yep. How. How often do, in your opinion, do executives get thanked? Because, you know, the Patty Lee character was basically saying it never happens. That's the job is you're in the background and your name is not anywhere.
- [30:55]
Sean Fennessy
I think what often you. Well, for starters, often the executive is the person who is most typically at war with the filmmakers, asking them to make changes, negotiating salary. They're seen as the person who is most responsible for blocking the things that the creatives want. So it's not common. I will say though, that the Amy Pascal types, the sort of like ex executive producer is a name you hear all the time getting thanked. That kind of a person who understands the sensitivities of artists and is unshackled from the necessity of being a corporate steward. So that part makes a lot of sense. But Matt Remick getting thanked. I don't know, like, what's going to win? What won best picture of this year?
- [31:31]
Craig Horlbeck
An aura.
- [31:33]
Sean Fennessy
Tom Quinn probably did get thanked.
- [31:34]
Craig Horlbeck
Well, a 24 is. It's a smaller independent studio.
- [31:37]
Sean Fennessy
Neon, Neon, Neon. Right.
- [31:38]
Craig Horlbeck
Smaller independent studio that feels, you know, you're taking more of a risk. You're.
- [31:44]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, yeah. When's the last time a big studio.
- [31:46]
Craig Horlbeck
Oppenheimer. I doubt Donna Langley was.
- [31:49]
Sean Fennessy
I. She probably was. But you know what? Donna Langley is an interesting figure. Her name was uttered in the Golden Globes episode of this show is widely considered not just very powerful, but very well liked and respected as an executive. So, you know, it could happen.
- [32:04]
Craig Horlbeck
Will you thank Bill Simmons when you win?
- [32:06]
Sean Fennessy
Win what?
- [32:07]
Craig Horlbeck
Best podcast at the Golden Globe.
- [32:09]
Sean Fennessy
I 100% winning. Daniel Ek. Yes. I look forward to winning for my work on the Watch as executive producer.
- [32:14]
Craig Horlbeck
Best guest cameo.
- [32:16]
Sean Fennessy
Okay. Most accurate character. I like this category.
- [32:20]
Craig Horlbeck
This is obviously a little hard. I'm not inside these studios, but it feels like although they are the most ridiculous and outsized, that the marketing team of Kathryn Hahn and Tyler. Maya is her name. Maya And Tyler.
- [32:31]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah.
- [32:33]
Craig Horlbeck
Her trying to cling on to whatever Gen Z language she can and him trying to turn everything into a TikTok video or a dune popcorn bucket, I find is spot on.
- [32:44]
Sean Fennessy
It is tremendously accurate. You know, Joe and Bill, push back a little bit on me in terms of the way that that Kathryn Hunt character is written and styled. But it is clearly based on at least one real person who I won't name, but who is in the business for sure.
- [32:59]
Craig Horlbeck
I think Kathryn Hunt is crushing it.
- [33:00]
Sean Fennessy
I love her. I think she's so funny. I know that some people think it's too big. I don't think it's too big at all.
- [33:04]
Craig Horlbeck
I completely agree. I think it totally works.
- [33:06]
Sean Fennessy
To me, the most accurate character is David Krumhole's agent character, Mitch. That's just. That guy's an agent. That is just a guy. And David Krumholtz has an agent and he's been in Hollywood for a long time. And that is just a very recognizable, shit talking, fast talking, deal wheeling guy who exists.
- [33:24]
Craig Horlbeck
We got to take a second to shout out Krumholz Krum.
- [33:27]
Sean Fennessy
He is the man.
- [33:27]
Craig Horlbeck
He's been doing it. He's my beloved Bernard in the Santa Claus. The man was an Oppenheimer. He's super bad. Who's doing it like him?
- [33:35]
Sean Fennessy
I mean, he's OG Rogan too. He's been in that crew forever and I love him. And he's kind of like. I feel like he's like a father figure to those guys because he was the older guy when they were coming up. Crummy is great. Okay, best cameo. You want to do top three?
- [33:48]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, I'll start. Sarandos is definitely in the top three.
- [33:52]
Sean Fennessy
Yep.
- [33:53]
Craig Horlbeck
I'm going to give Adam Scott the third spot.
- [33:55]
Sean Fennessy
He was good.
- [33:56]
Craig Horlbeck
I'm always impressed with Adam. I always forget how easy it is for Adam Scott to just turn right back into kind of a bro.
- [34:01]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah.
- [34:02]
Craig Horlbeck
Kind of a dick.
- [34:02]
Sean Fennessy
Like the Step Brothers down guy.
- [34:04]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. Eastbound Derek from Stepbrothers. He's so good at that that when you see him in Severance, you forget that that's. And Parks and Rec. He's not really like that at all.
- [34:13]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [34:14]
Craig Horlbeck
So I love Adam Scott and I think he was great in this with Sal. And then number one, I think I'm gonna give it to Anthony Mackie, who's an actor that I have like. No, I like Anthony Mackie. She's fine. I have no real relationship with him, but I thought he was great. And I think this was like, honestly my favorite performance I've ever seen from him.
- [34:35]
Sean Fennessy
He was weirdly committed in this part as Anthony Mackie, the producer of a Ron Howard crime drama.
- [34:40]
Craig Horlbeck
I think the fun thing about the cameo performances in the show is that you can't really half ass them because of the one or nature of it.
- [34:46]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [34:48]
Craig Horlbeck
In Entourage or these other shows where there's cameos, it feels like a Bob Saget can come in, be there for 30 minutes and bail. And this is like Anthony Mackie is staging out and plotting out long, complicated oners that require a ton of emotional range in one shot. So much directing and camera movements. And I thought his turn to like, hey, man, the last 45 minutes is dog shit. And I've been lying, obviously was really good and believable.
- [35:14]
Sean Fennessy
It was very, very funny. I agree. He's wonder. We already mentioned Zweigh and Lil Rell. I love that. And Owen Klein and Parker, Finn and Sarandos. But I thought Zoe Kravitz was phenomenal in the Golden Globes episode. Very, very funny. And just coming off of directing her own real first feature, Blink Twice, which was not nominated for any awards.
- [35:31]
Craig Horlbeck
Didn't see that.
- [35:33]
Sean Fennessy
Not my favorite movie of 2024, but.
- [35:35]
Craig Horlbeck
What was the original name of that film? It was like Fuck island or something.
- [35:39]
Sean Fennessy
Pussy Island. Hard to believe it wasn't released under that title, though. It would have been a better title.
- [35:44]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. She was great though.
- [35:45]
Sean Fennessy
Best fake movie slash, which would actually work in real life.
- [35:49]
Craig Horlbeck
I liked Blackwing.
- [35:50]
Sean Fennessy
This is the Zoe Kravitz, soon to.
- [35:52]
Craig Horlbeck
Be that Mitch, her agent, is trying to sell to Continental Studios. I'm going to quote the Mitch character, Zoe Kravitz, as a vampire assassin in a black bodysuit holding a red Glock dipped in holy water.
- [36:05]
Sean Fennessy
Come on, what's your favorite part of that pitch?
- [36:08]
Craig Horlbeck
The bodysuit is enticing. The holy water is a nice wrinkle. I didn't see that coming. Vampires are hot right now. They're checking everything.
- [36:14]
Sean Fennessy
Incredible. Yeah, sinners too. Uh, Da Apocalypse seems gross and weird at the outset, which is a shit oriented zombie apocalypse movie starring Johnny Knoxville. And yet the Last of Us is very hot right now. And that's basically a mushroom zombie comedy or zombie drama, I should say. So I feel like this is gonna happen.
- [36:36]
Craig Horlbeck
This movie would absolutely work. I mean, a Kool Aid movie that would probably, could probably be made.
- [36:40]
Sean Fennessy
It's just not so far from reality. No.
- [36:43]
Craig Horlbeck
Do you like the name Da Apocalypse? I actually don't know if I get the joke. And then the pun in the name.
- [36:51]
Sean Fennessy
I'm not sure I do.
- [36:52]
Craig Horlbeck
Diarrhea and apocalypse combined. Is that all it is? Or is there something deeper on this?
- [36:56]
Sean Fennessy
Or is it duh? Like, duh, you're dumb?
- [36:59]
Craig Horlbeck
Like, duh, Maybe it's both A poop calypse. I don't know. I didn't. I was like, oh, I think I'm missing something with this title, but certainly could be made. Johnny Knoxville is the perfect choice. Also, him insisting that it's a satire of medical disinformation. Wonderful.
- [37:16]
Sean Fennessy
Probably unanswerable question. This is borrowed from the Rewatchables podcast.
- [37:19]
Craig Horlbeck
How much would you pay for a private weekend with Scottie Scheffler in Ireland? What is the right amount to pay for that?
- [37:24]
Sean Fennessy
Well, I'm a huge golf fan, but I find Scotty Scheffler boring as shit.
- [37:27]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah, but you're getting lessons from him.
- [37:29]
Sean Fennessy
Is that something I want? Yeah. Like, do you want lessons from somebody who's the best ever? Like, would getting basketball lessons from Michael Jordan be good? Or wouldn't you just feel horrible?
- [37:37]
Craig Horlbeck
No. If Steph Curry was like, let me teach you how to shoot threes, I would welcome that.
- [37:41]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, but you're a Bay Area baby. You love the Warriors. That's not the same.
- [37:45]
Craig Horlbeck
Regardless, if LeBron's like, let me show you some post moves, I would. I would take him up on that. Golf is so. It's so lesson based. Like, Scottie Scheffler could give you three things that could change your life.
- [37:56]
Sean Fennessy
I don't know. To me, there's like, some Good Will Hunting. Like, you know, easy. This is for me, like. Like, what's Scotty going to tell me? I can't. I don't have his build. I don't have his mind.
- [38:04]
Craig Horlbeck
Were the wives going on this trip? The two male doctors were obsessed with golf and they were bidding on it, and the wives were very supportive. Were they attending?
- [38:11]
Sean Fennessy
I gotta tell you, my wife would not be that supportive of a trip to Ireland where I played golf the whole time.
- [38:15]
Craig Horlbeck
You spent $100,000?
- [38:17]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. She would not appreciate that. I guess they would go and they would get to explore the Guinness Warehouse factory. I don't know.
- [38:24]
Craig Horlbeck
Rogan and Evan Goldberg really instill their silly humor into the show. There's a lot of pratfalls. There's a lot of swearing. Seth eats shit in almost every episode.
- [38:37]
Sean Fennessy
Yes.
- [38:37]
Craig Horlbeck
And the one in the. The pediatric oncologist one is. Is fantastic. Oh, cleverly mix in a stunt double.
- [38:44]
Sean Fennessy
Yes, I saw that.
- [38:45]
Craig Horlbeck
And have him eat on the table and break his finger. But, yeah, he's the Ron Howard one. He, like, trips over a glass table. He's always eating shit, which is just like a kind of a really lovely, funny wrinkle that you like, want to include.
- [38:55]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, the show is very silent comedy. Like I said, very. Like Buster Keaton, Charlie Chaplin, Harold Boyd. Unanswerable question. Has Matt had a hit yet?
- [39:07]
Craig Horlbeck
Well, he theoretically greenlit Open Zoe, Kyle.
- [39:11]
Sean Fennessy
Was it a hit, though? It was an awards movie.
- [39:14]
Craig Horlbeck
You mean financially.
- [39:15]
Sean Fennessy
But has he had the success that Griffin Mill wants him to have, you're.
- [39:18]
Craig Horlbeck
Saying, after he took over this head role? Because he obviously had the MK Ultra franchise 4. But I don't know if there's been enough time for a movie to develop and come out.
- [39:26]
Sean Fennessy
Good point. Yeah. We just don't know. That's the one tricky thing with the timeline of the show.
- [39:30]
Craig Horlbeck
Do you think Hollywood executives enjoy the show?
- [39:37]
Sean Fennessy
It's a really good question. I'm trying to think of what the comp is for us for if we saw something that was lightly satirizing our experience as professionals.
- [39:46]
Craig Horlbeck
Because don't you think executives watching something like Entourage, that's mainly making fun of actors and agents and how ridiculous they are, and that's easier to kind of get behind and pile on.
- [39:57]
Sean Fennessy
Well, I'll draw you back to. I don't know if you were watching this show at the time, but when the fifth season of the Wire came out. The Wire was the most critically acclaimed show of its era. It had a small audience, but people loved it all the way through the fourth season, which kind of culminated the drug trade storyline that started in season one. Then season five turned its side of journalism, and all of a sudden critics got a little uncomfortable.
- [40:19]
Craig Horlbeck
This is about me now.
- [40:20]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah. A little uncomfortable with the way that there was a spotlight on some of the unethical practices that the writers portrayed in the show. Obviously, David Simon was a journalist for the Baltimore sun for many years, and so he was kind of drawing on his experiences. But the reception of that season was much more muted, I would say, than the previous four because it was people who knew about the world that was being portrayed and feeling like its lack of fealty to the truth annoyed them or what they perceived to be a lack of fealty in this case. I would imagine a lot of executives are like, that's cute, Seth and Evan, but you guys have it so easy, and you have no real empathy for what my life is actually like. I would guess. I would guess, yeah.
- [40:57]
Craig Horlbeck
I mean, you have to imagine, though, now. I mean, Seth and Evan they are executives now. They have Point Gray. They are running a company and are kind of. This is a show they couldn't have made 10 years ago.
- [41:07]
Sean Fennessy
100%. And I'm sure that's a huge reason why they made the show, is that they have now had the accrued experience of having a little bit of an understanding of what it's like to be Brian Robbins or Tom Rothman or Donna Langley on a lower scale with Point Gray. But still, they've had a lot of success over that time. Okay, last category, Best use of la.
- [41:26]
Craig Horlbeck
I think the architecture is quite stunning. I'm sure you're gonna mention Catherine Oharas house, Patty Lee's house.
- [41:32]
Sean Fennessy
You know, I was thinking actually of the house in the Oner is the one that was the most breathtaking to me. The Reiner Birch house residence, which is in Silver Lake, where they shot that Greta Lee movie, which is sick. And I could tell actually where they were at the beginning of that episode when they're racing in the car, in the sports car.
- [41:50]
Craig Horlbeck
Driving up the hill.
- [41:51]
Sean Fennessy
Driving up the hill in Silver Lake, I was like, I've been here. I know where. This.
- [41:54]
Craig Horlbeck
Seth's house is also so perfect for his character. No idea where. I'm assuming that's in the hills. It's like, simultaneously indoor and outdoor. I never know if he's inside or outside. He's always wearing, like, a silk robe.
- [42:05]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah, it's a bungalow. Yeah, bungalow.
- [42:08]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. It's like his dojo. I feel like that's Seth's real house.
- [42:11]
Sean Fennessy
I imagine his estate is a little bigger these days, given the success that he's had. He also sells weed for a living. House plant. Yeah. What else? Any other stray thoughts about the show?
- [42:20]
Craig Horlbeck
I want everybody to watch it. I want more seasons of it. I'm happy season two is here. I think the more you watch it and once you understand what they're trying to do, it's easier to just sit back and enjoy it. Like we said. Some of the criticisms was like, oh, where is this going? I think it's a little more stressful than people thought. These are pretty stressful episodes. I mean, there's a lot of. I was sitting next to my wife, Liz, and during, I mean, the pediatric oncology episode, she's like, can't look half the time. The secondhand embarrassment. The Michael Scott, the Larry David. There's a lot of that there. And that might be kind of only for a certain type of person, but I think once you kind of know that that's what the show is. And that's what it's trying to do. It's easier to enjoy.
- [42:59]
Sean Fennessy
Do you think that the show needs to evolve that in any way to continue to hold interest? Cause what Larry David accomplished and what Garry Shandling accomplished and I guess the Office in some way, I mean, the Office had that kind of counterweight of Pam and Jim where you felt like you were getting invested in another kind of emotional strain of the Office. Yeah.
- [43:19]
Craig Horlbeck
There's a lot of emotion there.
- [43:20]
Sean Fennessy
Curb isn't like that. Curb is just a pur. Soft toxicity for 30 minutes every week.
- [43:24]
Craig Horlbeck
Well, I think it's hard to do that in 10 episodes. I think the Office getting. I think it's easier to build those relationships over 24 episodes compared to 8 to 10.
- [43:32]
Sean Fennessy
This is one thing I have heard from people who work in the industry is what is redeeming about Matt? What is the thing? Even if it's not. Even if he's not a hero, what is the thing that you ultimately can invest in that you want to see something from him that is just not utter embarrassment and failure?
- [43:50]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. What's funny about that is I don't know if this is redeeming, but I think it's relatable. I think he is a human being and I think a lot of people are like, you can understand why he's doing the things he's doing. This is a workplace comedy. And a lot of these things, although they take place in Hollywood and our surrounding movies, these are just like a lot of issues that people have at their jobs.
- [44:08]
Sean Fennessy
Yeah.
- [44:09]
Craig Horlbeck
And so even if he's not redeeming or there's necessarily something you can root for or rest on. I do think what he's doing day to day as somebody at a job is really, really relatable. And that's something that you can climb onto a little bit.
- [44:24]
Sean Fennessy
It's so interesting because I don't that you don't strike me as like that at all. I do not sense the stress or anxiety of day to day work life in working with you.
- [44:34]
Craig Horlbeck
No, but you can. You know, the idea of like, basically this whole show is people avoiding delivering bad news to other people. And it's things like that that you can understand, you know, wanting to keep your reputation and wanting people to like you. That is a lot of our jobs. I think, at least on microphone.
- [44:52]
Sean Fennessy
It's a perilous balance for me. I'll leave it at that. Thanks so much, Craig. This was fun.
- [44:57]
Craig Horlbeck
Yeah. Episode 9 and 10 are a real rollick.
- [45:00]
Sean Fennessy
I can't wait. We'll be back after the season finale of this show. Thanks to Kai Grady for producing. Kai, keep it locked on the Prestige TV podcast where the rehearsal, your Friends and neighbors and the last of us are being covered on a week to week basis. Are you taking any of those shows?
- [45:14]
Craig Horlbeck
I'm bad at my job. No, I'm not watching any of those shows.
- [45:16]
Sean Fennessy
Oh my God. The rehearsal is absolutely fantastic.
- [45:18]
Craig Horlbeck
Talk about uncomfortable. If you think the studio is stressful, I watched a couple episodes of that show. It's.
- [45:24]
Sean Fennessy
It is. It is in a league of its own.
- [45:26]
Craig Horlbeck
I couldn't support what he's doing anymore, but I need to. I'd rather somebody tell me about it than watch.
- [45:31]
Sean Fennessy
If you want to hear Charles and Jody talk about it, tune into this show. We'll see you guys soon to talk about something. Studio.