‘The White Lotus’ Season 3, Episode 3: The Unraveling of Tim Ratliff

Summary

The Prestige TV Podcast Summary Episode: 'The White Lotus' Season 3, Episode 3: The Unraveling of Tim Ratliff
Release Date: March 3, 2025
Host: The Ringer
Platform: The Prestige TV Podcast

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Introduction

In this episode of The Prestige TV Podcast, hosted by a rotating cast of Ringer personalities including Andy Greenwald, Mallory Rubin, and Chris Ryan, the discussion centers around the third episode of the third season of HBO's The White Lotus. Titled "The Unraveling of Tim Ratliff," this episode delves deep into the complexities of the characters and the escalating tensions within the storyline.

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Recap of Episode 3: Key Events

"The Unraveling of Tim Ratliff" showcases a series of escalating crises that push the characters to their limits. Central to the discussion is Tim Ratliff's deteriorating mental state, exacerbated by his heavy use of Lorazepam, a sedative that plays a pivotal role in his unravelling.

Key Plot Points:

• Tim Ratliff’s Decline: Tim is increasingly reliant on Lorazepam, symbolizing his struggle to maintain control over his life and actions.
• Chelsea’s Near-Death Experiences: Chelsea faces near-death twice within consecutive episodes, intensifying the concern for her well-being.
• Snake Show Incident: A tense sequence involving venomous snakes heightens the sense of impending disaster.
• Family Dynamics: Tim’s strained relationship with his family, particularly his son, adds emotional depth to the unfolding chaos.
• Boat Trip Tease: The impending boat trip introduces anticipation for significant character developments and potential confrontations.

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Character Analysis

Tim Ratliff

Tim Ratliff’s character arc is a focal point of the episode. His increasing reliance on Lorazepam indicates a deeper internal conflict and foreshadows potential downfall.

• Quote:
  Andy Greenwald [02:18]: "I've never been concerned for this many people in a White Lotus cast at the same time."

Rick

Rick is portrayed as a man teetering between justice and revenge. His actions suggest a man on the brink, struggling with his moral compass.

• Quote:
  Chris Ryan [12:04]: "White Lotus tends to zig and zag."

Chelsea

Chelsea’s survival through near-death experiences makes her a sympathetic character. Her relationship with Rick becomes increasingly complex as tensions rise.

• Quote:
  Chris Ryan [43:30]: "Chelsea, who's still having dinner with you despite you getting her snake bit, totally forgave him immediately."

Belinda

Belinda’s interactions with other characters hint at underlying motives and potential future conflicts.

• Quote:
  Andy Greenwald [54:10]: "Belinda's response to Greg."

Saxon (Locky)

Saxon’s character is both charming and troubled, with hints of a darker side that could lead to significant plot twists.

• Quote:
  Mallory Rubin [10:32]: "She (Chelsea) thinks that's going to make me (Tim) ..."

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Themes and Symbolism

Disaster and Chaos

The recurring motifs of tsunamis, snakes, and fire symbolize the chaotic forces at play within the characters’ lives.

• Quote:
  Andy Greenwald [02:18]: "I'm more worried for ... Tim Ratliff, who is hitting the Lorazepam hard."

Drug Use and Dependency

Tim's dependency on Lorazepam serves as a metaphor for his inability to cope with the pressures of his life, highlighting the destructive nature of addiction.

• Quote:
  Mallory Rubin [08:17]: "Tim Ratliff is something that I'm very excited for."

Spiritual Awakening and Therapy

The introduction of therapy sessions and spiritual discussions points to characters seeking redemption or inner peace amidst turmoil.

• Quote:
  Andy Greenwald [21:18]: "What do you think the lesson is? What is the show's message to us?"

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Theories and Predictions

The hosts engage in lively speculation about future plot developments, particularly focusing on the upcoming boat trip.

Predicted Events:

• Yacht Confrontation: A major confrontation is expected on the yacht, potentially involving Rick and other key characters.

• Character Fates: The possibility of significant character exits, including Tim Ratliff’s potential downfall.

• Belinda’s Role: Belinda may play a crucial role in confronting or uncovering hidden truths about other characters.

• Quote:
  Andy Greenwald [65:00]: "Is White Lotus just a show about kill off your favorite character, Greg Garry going around the world killing women?"

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Notable Scenes and Quotes

The discussion highlights several pivotal scenes that stood out in the episode:

1. Snake Show Sequence:

   • Description: A tense moment where venomous snakes are introduced, heightening the sense of impending doom.
   • Quote:
     Chris Ryan [51:07]: "Chelsea got bit. That was a very well done tense scene."

2. Therapy Sessions:

   • Description: Tim’s interactions in therapy reveal his internal struggles and set the stage for his unraveling.
   • Quote:
     Andy Greenwald [47:53]: "He was not ready for it though. Obviously all of these characters have quite a bit to work through."

3. Belinda’s Villa Confrontation:

   • Description: Belinda confronts Greg Gary, hinting at deeper tensions and possible future conflicts.
   • Quote:
     Mallory Rubin [62:37]: "Belinda's response to Greg."

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Conclusion

Episode 3 of The White Lotus Season 3 intensifies the drama and deepens character arcs, particularly focusing on Tim Ratliff’s descent into chaos. The hosts of The Prestige TV Podcast provide insightful analysis and engaging theories, building anticipation for the upcoming episodes. With themes of disaster, addiction, and spiritual conflict, the season continues to offer rich storytelling that captivates its audience.

• Final Quote:
  Andy Greenwald [67:17]: "He has to free himself from that."

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

1. Concern for the Cast:

   • Andy Greenwald [02:18]: "I've never been concerned for this many people in a White Lotus cast at the same time."

2. Classic Dysfunction:

   • Mallory Rubin [03:20]: "The character mentioning it."

3. Belinda’s Suspicion:

   • Andy Greenwald [09:37]: "But let's talk about this Belinda episode."

4. Therapy Insights:

   • Andy Greenwald [47:53]: "You're a people pleaser. You're a people pleaser."

5. Yacht Speculation:

   • Andy Greenwald [69:55]: "Is Rick going on the yacht or is he going to Bangkok?"

6. Final Reflection:

   • Andy Greenwald [67:17]: "He has to free himself from that."

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This comprehensive summary captures the essence of the podcast episode, providing listeners with a clear understanding of the discussions, insights, and key takeaways from 'The White Lotus' Season 3, Episode 3: The Unraveling of Tim Ratliff. Whether you're a dedicated fan or a newcomer to the series, this summary offers valuable perspectives on the evolving narrative and character dynamics.

Transcript

[Chris Ryan]

This episode of the Prestige TV podcast is brought to you by Coffee Mate.

[Andy Greenwald]

Coffee Mate has been searching the globe for flavors that pair perfectly with coffee.

[Chris Ryan]

So when they heard that the new season of HBO's the White Lotus was set in Thailand, they were inspired to brew up two new flavors, Thai iced coffee and Pina Colada flavored creamers.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're available for a short time only, so for the love of coffee, go try them now.

[Mallory Rubin]

The Prestige TV podcast is brought to you by the Ringer Podcast Network where you can find House of R. Yeah, true.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Guys still doing that one, right?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, we're cranking it.

[Chris Ryan]

That show we do twice a week. Yeah, yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Wow.

[Andy Greenwald]

You've officially put us in the crack, Ryan. The watch, though.

[Mallory Rubin]

I miss him. I haven't done a Potter with cigar in a couple weeks. He's still doing the watch though, right?

[Andy Greenwald]

Still cranking it out.

[Chris Ryan]

I've heard that that's. Still cranking it out.

[Andy Greenwald]

Still doing that.

[Mallory Rubin]

You can watch this on video on Spotify. You can watch it Ron Ringer Dash TV, our wonderful YouTube channel that breaks down. Right now we're doing White Lotus and Severance.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Eventually we'll get the zombies back. Yeah, right.

[Chris Ryan]

The mushroom zombies.

[Mallory Rubin]

What happens in Last of Us? Is it zombies?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, mushroom zombies.

[Mallory Rubin]

Great. We're going to talk about White Lotus now. It's coming up next. Tsunami, Snakes and Fire. Episode three is Going for it. Let's do this. This episode is brought to you by Marvel Television's Daredevil. Born Again. Charlie Cox returns as vigilante lawyer Matt Murdock and Vincent D'Onofrio as former mob boss Wilson Fisk. The darker side of Matt Murdock is revealed when he gains a new perspective on his role as the Daredevil and faces an internal struggle between justice and revenge. The devil's work is never done. Don't miss the two episode premiere of Born Again on March 4th, only on Disney. Well, shit's hit going down. Episode three. We knew we we're heading toward something. What are we heading to?

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, I don't know. Disaster, Chaos. Who are you more worried for? Chelsea, who's already been to the hospital, or our guy, Tim Ratliff, who is hitting the Larrazepam hard?

[Andy Greenwald]

I've never been concerned for this many people in a White Lotus cast at the same time. I am.

[Mallory Rubin]

Is the show now self aware that we're going to become attached and concerned for the characters and now that's why six are in play?

[Andy Greenwald]

You know, I think that it is engaging with the Theorizing around the opening mystery very actively this season like that. And I think, you know, I was wondering if it felt like more pronounced this season. But then if you. If you think back like last year or last season, everything with Tanya and the Madame Butterfly foreshadowing. It's not like the prior seasons weren't doing that. But it does feel like the let's make sure. You know the classic great storytelling technique of making sure every outcome is viable and the one that ultimately ends up happening will be supported in full by the story to that point. But you could believe any number of outcomes. Like I feel like they're doing a great job with that so far. Chelsea nearly dying twice in two consecutive episodes makes me actually less worried.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I was going to say does that make you less.

[Mallory Rubin]

And the character mentioning it.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Another character mentioning. Well, you've had two light near death experiences.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you feel like Chelsea's safe or are you going to double fake yourself out and be like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Or is he counting on us thinking that is Mike White on the side. What Chelsea said to Rick at the end. You're not going to get rid of me that easy. If you kill me, I'll follow you into the next life and the next.

[Mallory Rubin]

So the Stevie Nick Silver Springs.

[Andy Greenwald]

Man.

[Mallory Rubin]

I'm probably if do you want to do our I was going to start the pod this way but as well our most worried about character power rankings.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sure.

[Mallory Rubin]

Gay talks number one for me. I just feel like he's. He's going to be dead unless. Not a spoiler alert because everyone's seen episode three. Unless he's involved in the robbery. They're doing a nice little end around.

[Andy Greenwald]

With I don't think he's involved in the robbery. I feel and we've been talking about this since week one. No. But I do think he is going to play a crucial tragic and crucial role in the shootout. And what feels most likely to me now after the third episode where I still adore him. But he got one taste. One crumb. A crumb of hope. Shout out the Landman finale title. A crumb of have you watched the Landman finale yet?

[Mallory Rubin]

No. No.

[Andy Greenwald]

You got a little. A little taste of praise. Right.

[Chris Ryan]

For.

[Andy Greenwald]

And I say this was love for.

[Chris Ryan]

For.

[Andy Greenwald]

For guy talk up his job. Like they got in, they committed the robbery and he got hit in the head and then they escaped and he was told he was brave. He was doted on and checked on by the person he loves and now he's like I'm tough. I can do this. I know that the bodyguards, the Hollinger bodyguards, have this appeal. Like, let me go offer to be a bodyguard. And I think there's a pairing of guy talk theory corner and monkey theory corner. You have won me over in full.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, wow.

[Andy Greenwald]

Here's what I'm worried about now. The guest. Because we have that Belinda. Spooky sounds in the villa scene. Somebody hears something. It sets off a reaction from a panicked guest.

[Chris Ryan]

You're saying.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then our guy. Guy talks. Trained at a point to defend the hotel because they're all called out by.

[Mallory Rubin]

The other bodyguards as a wuss. He's got to prove his manhood a little bit.

[Andy Greenwald]

Torky trying to be a rooster, right?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Starts firing. And then just a sequence of events unfolds. Like, where are all the other accidental chaos?

[Chris Ryan]

So, like, that's. Where are all the guns coming from, though? That's the question.

[Andy Greenwald]

So are we. Are you comfortable with us talking about. None of us have watched ahead. We'll issue our caveat every time. Trailers, though.

[Mallory Rubin]

You know what's funny? People don't believe that.

[Chris Ryan]

We're not watching.

[Mallory Rubin]

People in my life who know me and allegedly either like me or love me are like, no, you're watching ahead. Come on.

[Andy Greenwald]

Because they think you're undisciplined.

[Chris Ryan]

You're not watching ahead because you're like, as soon as we're done, I'm going to watch episode four.

[Mallory Rubin]

Episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, but in the. So you're comfortable with us talking about trailers? Trailers are better.

[Mallory Rubin]

You guys. You guys study the trailer.

[Chris Ryan]

I did not study the trailer at all.

[Mallory Rubin]

I feel like that's cheating.

[Andy Greenwald]

I didn't study it frame by frame. I just. Every trailer that they've released, the preseason trailers and the rest of the season on Guy Talk is training with a gun in all of the trailers. So he's getting a gun at some point, though there are lots of other guns in the trailers as well.

[Chris Ryan]

He gets spooked.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's like, someone else gets spooked. And then he's like, I defend you.

[Chris Ryan]

Is trigger happy. Has something to prove. And you think the inciting incident is.

[Andy Greenwald]

A monkey or a snake. They're everywhere.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

Snakes, fire monkeys, tsunamis, tsunami videos, a toilet snake. Watch this guy just stand here on the beach as the tsunami overtakes him.

[Chris Ryan]

And don't you think that Tim was like, that looks pretty nice right about.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah, I would sign up for that right now.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was a gorgeous opening to the episode.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, the dream. A very dream.

[Andy Greenwald]

Trippy, druggie, delusional, dreamy episode. I Loved it.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think that's the season.

[Chris Ryan]

I agree. Yeah, I agree. Because. And I know you do you want to talk about the interview you had on the pod?

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah. By the time people hear this, I think that will have already run. But Dave Bernad, with the EP of it, he said this whole season came out of, like, this fever dream Mike.

[Chris Ryan]

White had in the hospital. In the hospital when they were location scouting.

[Mallory Rubin]

Location scouting. And gets so fucked up. He's like, in this. They gave him some steroid that was too strong, and he went into some haze for two days.

[Chris Ryan]

So this is a drug scare.

[Mallory Rubin]

Came out of the haze and was like, I have season three.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

When I get sick, literally season three.

[Andy Greenwald]

I can barely lean over to get a tissue. And Mike White comes up with season three of White lips.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay, so, like, when you say when.

[Mallory Rubin]

You get sick, you mean once a month? When I get sick.

[Andy Greenwald]

I try to avoid that by not being around my colleagues when they're ill.

[Mallory Rubin]

You do get sick a lot.

[Chris Ryan]

The rat lifts.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm susceptible to germs.

[Chris Ryan]

2 out of 5. The rat lifts are on lorazepam right now.

[Andy Greenwald]

Uh, yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Right.

[Andy Greenwald]

I. I love the little, like, pill holster. The little piece of luggage just for the pills.

[Chris Ryan]

Rick claims that he. His. His drugs were laced. The. The. The weed that he got from, like, Weed Land or whatever. It's Cannabis Land, whatever it's called.

[Mallory Rubin]

I don't believe that.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you think the. The. The blondes, the ladies, are they going to have a drug experience?

[Andy Greenwald]

Sure.

[Mallory Rubin]

The fancies.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I love fancies. I sure makes me think of Reba. Um, they're drinking. They're. They're drinking a lot. Are they gonna have a drink at some point?

[Mallory Rubin]

Everybody's gonna have a lace. Something.

[Chris Ryan]

I don't know, laced or otherwise, are chosen.

[Mallory Rubin]

We. Here's what we know for episode four. We're going on a boat. And I can't wait.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm thrilled.

[Mallory Rubin]

We're going on a boat. Greg. Gary's hosting.

[Chris Ryan]

Saxon's gonna be there.

[Mallory Rubin]

Saxon's gonna be there with no shirt on. Just doing some.

[Chris Ryan]

Chelsea's gonna be there. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Chloe.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Mallory Rubin]

Saw some glances.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, man. A lot of eye opening.

[Mallory Rubin]

We've gone backwards. Big takeaways from episode three before we. We gotta rip through it. Tsunami, snakes and fire.

[Chris Ryan]

Yep.

[Mallory Rubin]

Ratliff's about to be disaster. He's basically like, I'm gonna enjoy these next five days. My drugged. Whatever. Stupor.

[Andy Greenwald]

Enjoy.

[Mallory Rubin]

The end of the vacation will happen. They'll hand me my phone back, and I'm going To jail?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Then I don't want to know anymore. I'm gonna drop my phone in the.

[Andy Greenwald]

Bag in one piece. That is not a man who is prepared to face the. Forget, like, chipping away the shattering of his legacy and his standing. And when he was telling Saxon we gotta. You know, just kind of trying to distract his family. Right. With the whole phone gambit. Like, we gotta, like, nurture these things in ourselves so that we have something else to give. He is confronting the fact that that is not. He doesn't feel that that is the case about his life. He is not prepared to go to jail. We got no.

[Chris Ryan]

Rob and I got an email. Someone was pointing out to us that the. The. The poisonous tree that's in their villa.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

That pong Pong tree is known as the suicide tree.

[Andy Greenwald]

I feel like the pills in this episode were a gateway to that for Tim. The fact. And he.

[Mallory Rubin]

So they plant the toxic fruit in episode one.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Mallory Rubin]

The pills are now heading toward the To. Yeah. Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

Because the second pill he took, he didn't. He didn't tell Victoria he took it. She's like, do you want another one? He's like, no, I don't.

[Chris Ryan]

I don't do drugs.

[Andy Greenwald]

But he had just gone and taken.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

So he's already secretly consuming. He's trying to avoid having to confront the.

[Mallory Rubin]

Could you eat the toxic fruit but not die?

[Andy Greenwald]

I think so.

[Chris Ryan]

She said, very, very poisonous. You could die, but she didn't say, you will die.

[Mallory Rubin]

So it could be, like, the suicide where he doesn't actually die. He eats the fruit, thinking it's gonna kill him.

[Chris Ryan]

The hospital's only 15 minutes away.

[Andy Greenwald]

We know this thanks to Chelsea, hero that she is.

[Mallory Rubin]

The other one I was thinking was he makes a toxic fruit smoothie, but then gets distracted, and then Lachy drinks it. Cause he thinks it's a power shield.

[Chris Ryan]

Ew. Chug it down, Lachie. Don't you want to be one of the big dogs?

[Andy Greenwald]

It sounds like it could.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Hearing you say that, that feels something.

[Chris Ryan]

With Lachlan in this movie. Seems like that feels right, being forced on him.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yes. I had Lachie number two in my power rankings. That's another man.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, that's another one that people have been pointing out. You know, like in the opening credits, there are all these, like, postures with the. With the various animals. My favorite one is Parker Posey's, where it's just like, two monkeys getting high. Getting high.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

But Lakis is. Sam Navola's is just like a Guy floating in the water. Now, that could be Lachie in the deprivation tank or could be chill water.

[Andy Greenwald]

Hammock where he asked his sister who.

[Chris Ryan]

Shot recently his dead body.

[Andy Greenwald]

Boy, that would be.

[Chris Ryan]

That would be.

[Andy Greenwald]

That would be really sad.

[Mallory Rubin]

So those two, I would have as top two. I mean, Rick has to be on there. Just because we know Rick's going to commit some violence and we might come back to haunt him.

[Chris Ryan]

I feel like it's. Well, I don't know. White Lotus is not operate on normal moral behaviors, but it feels like the kind of story where Rick has a choice to make. Give up vengeance, embrace Chelsea's affection, choose a path of, like, life, or choose vengeance, and that will lead in death and destruction. That's the usual setup, but White Lotus tends to zig and zag.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm glad you're hitting the vengeance note because he's a couple gravely voice register shifts away from just being Robert Pattinson's Batman in this episode. Like, talking about his pursuit of vengeance.

[Mallory Rubin]

Absolutely not.

[Chris Ryan]

No. Because Robert Pattinson, Batman was never as charming as. As Rick is when he sits down.

[Andy Greenwald]

Who is he actually doing? He's Sawyer. I mean, they're just doing. I knew we were gonna do this down to the dear Mr. Sawyer.

[Mallory Rubin]

You guys were letter Goggins after the first episode, and now he's full Goggins in it.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm thrilled.

[Chris Ryan]

It was great.

[Mallory Rubin]

I'm proud of all the great, great Goggins.

[Chris Ryan]

Grifter Goggins was wonderful.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think he's moved into the Emmy leaderboard rankings. I think he's number one right now.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's crowded field. Everyone's amazing.

[Chris Ryan]

I don't know. Jason Isaacs.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's been really good.

[Chris Ryan]

He's been really good.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's been really good.

[Chris Ryan]

Really, really good.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're all great.

[Chris Ryan]

Tim is the one who's, like, the most being squeezed going through it. You know what I mean?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

So we have Belinda's now in danger. That's a big takeaway. We're gonna go through all these when we break down the episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

But let's talk about this Belinda episode.

[Chris Ryan]

About Greg Garry or Pornche?

[Mallory Rubin]

Greg Garry Pornche.

[Chris Ryan]

Your guy Pornche. I can't wait. He's gonna have good dreams of her.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is that a tie? Saying fantastic.

[Mallory Rubin]

It felt like something was gonna happen there.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

I was nervous.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh. Oh.

[Andy Greenwald]

I was thrilled. And I just eager.

[Mallory Rubin]

I was like, are we.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, I'm shipping it.

[Mallory Rubin]

This is gonna be our first sex scene. Belinda and this guy.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, we got. We got Chelsea and Rick at the end of last episode. That did not leave the impression on you that I left.

[Mallory Rubin]

It was sexy.

[Andy Greenwald]

A suckle. It was more than a lick. It was a full suckle.

[Mallory Rubin]

It was a PG. It's a PG 13. Maybe. PG 13. That's not what we do on White Lotus. We go hard on White Shy.

[Chris Ryan]

Mumbling to himself. T. Tipsy, tipsy, tipsy. As he walks away. The.

[Andy Greenwald]

Not just the like moment at the doorstep with the two of them, but it was very brief. In one of the montages, the. I don't know what the treatment is called.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, cradle the baby.

[Andy Greenwald]

Cradling her in the water.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

I have never felt you're signing up for that.

[Mallory Rubin]

Is that your number one spa treatment now? Well, I still want the fee one.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, yeah. That's looking very little about the wellness life about. But that seemed great.

[Chris Ryan]

Hover hands. Hover hands is not for me. Energy moving is not for me. Valentine. Valentine.

[Andy Greenwald]

One of the many things that you and Kate have in common.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. It's just healing well. One of the many things.

[Andy Greenwald]

One of the many things.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's back off. Putting me in the same bucket.

[Mallory Rubin]

I know what to do during the energy massage.

[Chris Ryan]

You can't even open your eyes. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Close your eyes.

[Mallory Rubin]

What if you didn't. What if you didn't feel it right away? Is it just. You just get your money back.

[Chris Ryan]

No.

[Mallory Rubin]

Like, you have to, like, buy in if you're the.

[Chris Ryan]

It's like an. Like, it's an emperor's clothes situation where you just sort of like.

[Mallory Rubin]

You said to go with it.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, we got to see what it was like when you're not vibing with the session. Locky sitting there.

[Mallory Rubin]

Right.

[Andy Greenwald]

That. People pleaser. People pleaser.

[Chris Ryan]

Lockie's, like, hunched position is like, Was tough. Very identifiable to me.

[Mallory Rubin]

Chloe and Saxon. It's on. That was another big takeaway.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

We're okay.

[Chris Ryan]

They have.

[Mallory Rubin]

With some.

[Chris Ryan]

They're having.

[Mallory Rubin]

There's going. There's. He's definitely banging her.

[Chris Ryan]

Or is he. Or is she going to, like, fleece him for some money? So she eyeing him as a mark or as someone to have sex with or both.

[Andy Greenwald]

I had that thought and that's my question, too. But I do wonder if that's too similar to the Lucia Alby.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think it's my last year with Greg. Gary has sucked.

[Chris Ryan]

And time to find.

[Mallory Rubin]

This guy's gonna be here for a week.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm gonna step in a new. New meal ticket.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah. This guy's in shape. I hear you're Gonna be a fun two days.

[Andy Greenwald]

I could see her, like, charging Saxon. For Saxon, it being such an ego wound for him. The idea that everybody would.

[Mallory Rubin]

Straight season.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. It would be a little.

[Mallory Rubin]

We'll get into that and then we'll get into.

[Chris Ryan]

Wait, are you hoping for then, like, is it boat sex? Is it.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, I think it's a sneak away in the cabin.

[Chris Ryan]

Sneak away in the boat?

[Mallory Rubin]

Like the little guest cabin in the bathroom. I think because Greg. Gary knew right away.

[Andy Greenwald]

That makes me nervous for Saxon.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, you throwing Saxon in the power rankings.

[Andy Greenwald]

The fact that Greg slash Gary a known.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you think he's gonna kill Belinda and Saxon? I hope it's okay. I just think everybody feels like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Everybody feels like they're in peril right now.

[Mallory Rubin]

Who's not in peril? Basically just a daughter. She's the only one I feel good about.

[Chris Ryan]

I think Jacqueline Lemon's gonna be fine. Yeah, I think Laurie's gonna be fine.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, Lorry. I love her.

[Chris Ryan]

I think Kate is gonna be fine.

[Andy Greenwald]

Kate.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, we have Rick killing somebody in Bangkok is happening.

[Chris Ryan]

Or on his way to Bangkok to do something.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's just running.

[Mallory Rubin]

Those are big. Those are big sequences.

[Chris Ryan]

But he's got. Okay, so we know that. Did you guys talk about this on the pod? That there's like an actor that hasn't been announced yet?

[Mallory Rubin]

We did not talk about that on the pod.

[Chris Ryan]

That's just down the water. There's an actor that hasn't been announced on White Lotus. And we know that Rick called his friend.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Mallory Rubin]

Not surprising, because they've done this. They did season two. Didn't you in season one?

[Chris Ryan]

I don't remember them.

[Andy Greenwald]

He calls his friend Frank.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, he calls his friend Frank.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, Frank. Frank.

[Chris Ryan]

Or any of the number of people that Tim Ratliff has talked to on the phone.

[Andy Greenwald]

Chuck Terry, the.

[Chris Ryan]

The woman on the phone with him. I. I'm unwilling to identify this with any certainty. It sounded a little like Merit Weaver to me. But that might be just because I've been watching too much Severance.

[Mallory Rubin]

Joanna's voice recognition technology.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's incredible. I.

[Chris Ryan]

That one I'm not the best. That one I'm not very certain on. And we don't. We don't have any, like, closing credits one way or another, so. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

So you're convinced every time there's somebody on a phone it's a famous actor or actress?

[Chris Ryan]

Not every time, but I think sometimes it is.

[Andy Greenwald]

Seems at least worth considering. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

We'll take a break and then we're going to rip through the Episode this message is a paid partnership with Apple Card. One of the most useful things in my life lately has been my Apple card. I really do love it. It's great for game nights, vacations, just life in general and applying. So easy so, so quick. You can apply, see your credit limit offer, then start using your card in minutes. Do it while you're watching a basketball game. You can start making purchases before halftime even rolls around. I also love how I can get back up to 3% daily cash back on every purchase. That's more money for game tickets. I feel like I scored big time when I started using Apple Card. Applying the wallet app on your iPhone. Start using it right away with Apple Pay. It's that easy. Subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City Branch terms and [e-mail] this episode is brought to you by Cars.com whether you're buying your first set of wheels, upgrading to fit your growing family, or looking for something to have a little fun with on the weekends, visit cars.com and explore the possibilities. Up to 50,000 cars are added daily. So wherever life takes you, there's a car for it on cars.com find your next possibility on cars.com where to next? We open with the Parker Posey dream sequence.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sensational.

[Mallory Rubin]

This is what it looks like before a tsunami.

[Chris Ryan]

You're missing the like duvet wrapped around you as you, as you sit on the beach. And then Lachi's there with like two, you know, like members of the hotel staff. Yeah, two staff people.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Then she wakes up.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

And here's husband's on the balcony having urgent. I just don't think she's curious enough as a spouse. I don't care how many secrets you're you're burying in a marriage, you're gonna notice when it hits this kind of tipping point where there's something clearly horrible happening.

[Andy Greenwald]

She does notice. Like the fact that she has afraid to nudge on dream is clearly triggered not only by Locky showing her these videos, but also by this budding anxiety that something is wrong. And then at the end she does say to him like Tim, is something going on? And then immediately gives up and turns the lights on.

[Mallory Rubin]

But it's not even a question. Something's clearly going on.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm just gonna say as a blanket policy, no tsunami videos before bed. Just like blanket.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think that's a great.

[Chris Ryan]

You don't even have to be in Thailand. No tsunami videos before bed rule. We've had a lot of pushback on our accent critique of Jason Isaac, specifically.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm loving it, as you know.

[Chris Ryan]

And Mike White said that he based the ratliffs on Bravo, Southern Charm. And we got a bunch of emails of people sending specifically Tom Ravenel from Southern Charm.

[Andy Greenwald]

Never seen a second of Southern Charm.

[Chris Ryan]

Me neither. But it is pretty on the nose. And this guy was a disgraced politician and Charleston playboy, Tom Ravenel.

[Mallory Rubin]

So apparently it's a certain. Dave was telling me about it today when I did the thing with him. It's a certain Southern drawl, but there's, like a weird British piece to it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

And that's what Isaac said, too, that there were, like, some vowels that sound British. I will say I still stand by immediately being a bit British last week, but I. I think either my ear is getting used to it, or I'm convinced by all of the millions of emails we got about it.

[Mallory Rubin]

But it's a big passion point for the cast. I think that they actually spent an incredible amount of time figuring this out.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

So I don't think it's as simple as, like, if it was a Boston or a Rhode island accent, where I would just be like, that's not right. You did it incorrectly.

[Andy Greenwald]

I find it very compelling to listen to him talk. Very compelling indeed. So on Tsunami Corner.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah. Well, there's certainly. They played the card this episode, that's for sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

But it. So, okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

And by the way, they said it was at the next resort over.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's right. Yeah. The fact that the structure of the season opens in the future and then we go back one week to watch the season, I think eliminates the prospect.

[Chris Ryan]

Of an actual however, because everyone's just living life however.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's but an emotional Susan.

[Chris Ryan]

No, no, no, no however. It's eight episodes.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

And we think we're only doing a week.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

So is that last episode?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

After whatever happens or just ends with.

[Mallory Rubin]

A tsunami, everyone just gets wiped out.

[Chris Ryan]

And then everyone dies.

[Mallory Rubin]

Who manages to hold on? Opc. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, man.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, at the family breakfast, we get.

[Andy Greenwald]

Stuff like, these breakfasts look great. The fruit, I have never seen a lot of colors. I love a melon, though.

[Mallory Rubin]

This is why Mallory and I can't be on White Lotus, because at the. In this breakfast, we're getting stuff like, dreams might not predict the future, but they're a window into something.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

We all dream about firesticks. Mallory and I would just be like, where's the half and a half I really need? We just wouldn't be coherent for like a half hour. Until the coffee kicks in. These people are just having full. Rick is ready sophical conversations.

[Andy Greenwald]

Rick is ready to run a con.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Before his first date.

[Chris Ryan]

What do you think of Rick? Rick sniffing a muffin. Phrasing right before he went over to talk to them. My favorite thing that happens at breakfast, actually, is Kate is talking to Lori's like, kind of background. Kate's like, do you think I could do something like this at home? And there's nothing but time. You got nothing but time.

[Andy Greenwald]

Nothing but time.

[Chris Ryan]

You don't have a job.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, my God.

[Chris Ryan]

What do you have to do?

[Mallory Rubin]

You got nothing but time. Probably the best backhanded compliment of the series so far.

[Chris Ryan]

I think so.

[Andy Greenwald]

Wild stuff.

[Mallory Rubin]

It's a really cool.

[Chris Ryan]

Lori's a sniper.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, we have the. Dad's unraveling. Can't stop looking at his phone. We find out the FBI is in his office with a warrant.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Time to shred.

[Mallory Rubin]

I wrote down this is a pretty great. My life is falling apart in slow motion. It's fantastic sequence for a TV show that I can't remember who else did anything like this.

[Chris Ryan]

I think. I mean, I think we've seen similar things on some of the big prestige antihero shows, but it's never. What is delicious about this is he's overseas and there's nothing he can do about it. He's helped. He's in a different time zone overseas. So it's not like he can go into the office or have like a cokey car chase. The helicopters are coming like Goodfellas moment.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

He has to. Like, he's trying to pretend to his family that everything's fine. And if he goes back to handle it, then he has to fess up that it's happening.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's the blessing and the curse. He's complaining about the time zone, how hard it is to get in touch with people, but it does allow him to delay the inevitable now for just a few more days and pretend that his life is not over. Which it is in terms of the nature of the life that he is used to living. The kind of life that they are accustomed to.

[Chris Ryan]

That's.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's done. Right. He is a financial criminal.

[Mallory Rubin]

Think about him in the first episode where he's like this aggro. Like, just. I've seen this guy in a TV show. And then by the end of the third episode, he's a sleeping pill chugging mania.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I was gonna say, has anyone. Has anyone ever come back from that?

[Andy Greenwald]

You don't come back from that shower.

[Chris Ryan]

Cam shot of shower. You're. That's a thing.

[Mallory Rubin]

Who's. Who survived the shower camp? I don't think nobody.

[Chris Ryan]

That's why Isaac is, like, front, like, leaderboard for Emmys for me, because it's the difference.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, now that you've apologized about your feelings on his accent, I don't know that I apologize.

[Andy Greenwald]

She acknowledged that there's a different opinion out there, but she did not apologize.

[Chris Ryan]

I have learned something.

[Mallory Rubin]

So you go, Isaac Emmy corner number one right now. OB Goggins.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes, right now.

[Andy Greenwald]

So far, I feel like Goggins will win the season at the end.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think Goggins is.

[Andy Greenwald]

But I. I think James Goggins has.

[Mallory Rubin]

Shown more stuff already. In three episodes he's done. I don't know.

[Chris Ryan]

I think between the shout, like, like, surveying his domain in episode one and Showershot in episode three, Isaac's has, like, gone really far. Goggins also, like, Grifter Goggins showing up here versus.

[Mallory Rubin]

What about Snake Goggins?

[Andy Greenwald]

Snake Goggins, Snake release Goggins Stone Snake Goggins. I thought the single best acting moment to your point that we have seen through three episodes so far was the look on Jason Isaac's face when he pulled Saxon out to have the Khmer son talk. I want to circle back at some point to the actual genuine and I thought really sincerely alarming rage we saw from Saxon when he was yelling about how Piper. Maybe we don't need to circle back to it. That's just like, let's note that that was actually scary.

[Chris Ryan]

Like, Piper always gets her way.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Level of, like, real anger that he was capable of generating very quickly there. But that look on Jason Isaac's face, on Tim's face when Saxon said, like, I love working with you. I get to learn so much from you. That fleeting, shattered expression that he had failed his family so deeply and the like, they put him on a pedestal, perhaps wrongly. But to have to confront the fact that that's over, that that is about to be over, that the way his family sees him is going to change.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you think there's the potential for any kind of, like, actual growth from Tim? Because what he says to Saxon in that moment, right, is he says, we both know how gratifying work is, but there's gotta be more to life than just success. If we leave room for them to develop, then we'll have more to offer. Which is not something Tim Ratliff of episode one would ever have said when they were talking to Pam about, like, him, the. The father son working Together, he's like, yeah, we love working together. It's great. And so like him saying it can't all be work, knowing that everything's going to fall apart for them back home. That's like a forced.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Spiritual development. Inside of Tim Ratliff, my fear is.

[Andy Greenwald]

That even if he goes on that emotional journey, his family will not meet him there. That Victoria will say, that is not what I like, signed up for from you. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

So I interpreted it completely different than you. The Tim Ratliff in the Sun. I think the whole thing, it's like this is the classic, yeah, you're going to take over the business, but the son really has nothing to do. He's. He said multiple times, yeah, I don't.

[Andy Greenwald]

Have a lot going on.

[Mallory Rubin]

Like, I don't. Like the office needs me. And it made him feel important.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, yeah. I think I'm so impressed by you. You're going to have a phenomenal career. Is not that also, he says, you're.

[Mallory Rubin]

Going to have a phenomenal career. I can see it. It's like there's literally no evidence other than that your son's a jackass. But if all this father son stuff feels really fake and like, I had this company, my son, whatever, I'm gonna shoehorn him in and Nep. And it's funny. Cause he's Nepo baby.

[Andy Greenwald]

The meta commentary is delicious, but Patrick.

[Mallory Rubin]

Schwarzenegger, who we talked about, and that kind of became a little bit of a story this week with the Nepo baby thing, I just think he's really good.

[Andy Greenwald]

Honestly, he's great.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, he and Simna Vola, who are both nipple babies, are really, really good at him.

[Mallory Rubin]

And as we talked about in a previous episode, like, he's half Arnold, who's like a performer and a charismatic guy. It makes sense to me he would be a good actor.

[Chris Ryan]

He's also partially a Kennedy, so that's something to remain true, I think, on that front.

[Andy Greenwald]

And that, like, what I see for you in your future, obviously part of it is he's trying to distract everybody. Right?

[Mallory Rubin]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

There's a tactic at play there. But like everything that's great in any White Lotus season, there's more than one thing happening in tandem. And like, it felt. It felt to me very keenly there that he was confronting the fact that he had failed his family, not just in terms of what he had done, but in preparing them for a different kind of life.

[Mallory Rubin]

But the fact he's like, I actually.

[Andy Greenwald]

Did allow you to think that it was okay to be Entitled and just sit there and like, not be prepared to build your own for her own reality.

[Mallory Rubin]

The son has no insight in the business was the thing that became clear.

[Chris Ryan]

But he loves to work.

[Mallory Rubin]

But he loves to work. Like, if we were all hanging out doing like a ring or retreat, and the whole day I was just on my phone freaking out and you were like, can I help? Can I help? And I was just like, yeah, like there's some sort of power move with that. That it's like you. I don't even want to discuss what's going on here with the. But that's. That's why the son. He's got some fake office on the side and he's not doing anything.

[Chris Ryan]

I really agree. Can I ask you a question about the naming? Do you think so Lachlan, like, is such a rare name that I immediately thought of Lachlan Murdoch. Right. Saxon is the name of one of Elon Musk's kids.

[Mallory Rubin]

And see, I think all this shit's intentional.

[Chris Ryan]

And I was trying to find a famous Piper. Piper Palin is the best I could do, but I couldn't.

[Mallory Rubin]

I just think Piper Ratliff sounds like the perfect rich kid name.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, the whole family is impeccably named. All the kids.

[Mallory Rubin]

Although we did call him Saxton with a T for half one episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

Did we? We.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think Joanna started it and then.

[Chris Ryan]

I took it and ran with it.

[Mallory Rubin]

We accept flame. Well, we also have Locky shows the data Tsunami video and Saxton got a blender. That was our big things with the rat lifts.

[Andy Greenwald]

Incredible pan.

[Mallory Rubin]

Nobody's been more excited to get a blender. He's fucking jacked.

[Chris Ryan]

Incredible.

[Andy Greenwald]

Pam is ready to help him blend.

[Chris Ryan]

She was gonna make the. She wasn't just delivering the blender. She's like, what milk do we want?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

How much of this they have? All there. Okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think Pam is in the running for most underrated performance of the season.

[Chris Ryan]

I love.

[Andy Greenwald]

Incredible.

[Mallory Rubin]

She's perfect at that. Okay. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Since the beginning. How wonderful for you. How wonderful for you. When she looks in the bag.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

This isn't even that much.

[Mallory Rubin]

Right. She's a carrot, Zach.

[Chris Ryan]

When she has a stir down of him. Like, are you going to put your phone in there?

[Andy Greenwald]

That was great.

[Mallory Rubin]

You know, so I had some nitpicks with that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay, what do you got?

[Mallory Rubin]

People didn't turn off their phones. First thing you're doing is turning off the phone.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think not just so it's turned off, but also like for the battery.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Tim powered Saxons Down. Right.

[Mallory Rubin]

This wasn't like a 2012 Samsung.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's.

[Mallory Rubin]

I don't know what phone that was, but it not only was not an iPhone, but it wasn't. I don't know what that was.

[Chris Ryan]

Should we be worried about the iPhone rule then?

[Andy Greenwald]

I was. I was. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

What's the iPhone rule?

[Chris Ryan]

According to Rian Johnson, Apple told him.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can'T let a bad guy.

[Chris Ryan]

That you can't let a bad guy use an iPhone. So. And that has. That has crept up in shows before where, like, he.

[Andy Greenwald]

The gunman.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Does he get his hand on a gun somehow? Does he try to do something desperate?

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, the feds come, Shootout with the dad.

[Chris Ryan]

Or he just can't stand, like, any of them having to face the reality of what has happened here. Dark comes.

[Andy Greenwald]

Very dark. Exceedingly grim.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

I just want to say there's no scenario where I give up my phone for five days. No, I mean, of course, literally none.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

But there's no vacation scenario that exists where I would be like, yep, no phone, five days.

[Andy Greenwald]

But do you think he. I don't believe he has given up his phone for five days. So then my question is, when he goes to find it, what else does he stumble upon? Like, I feel like he's going to break into some office and try to get that phone back.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, Cam, I know.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then what else is he gonna stumble upon?

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, now I like this. So he breaks in, but then there's something else in there.

[Andy Greenwald]

Maybe guy talk shoots him because he thinks it's another hotel robbery.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, my gosh.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm just really worried about guy talk.

[Mallory Rubin]

Guy talk or gay talk? Was I saying that wrong?

[Chris Ryan]

I think it's guy talk.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it's. We were all saying it. All of us were saying it wrong.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, guy talk.

[Mallory Rubin]

The matron. Well, we had Goggins. The matron.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, my God, this was remarkable.

[Chris Ryan]

And my guy, Fabian, who is maybe my new favorite, actually heartbreaking.

[Mallory Rubin]

I have a guy in Bangkok. You're going to be in Bangkok. Would you love a meeting?

[Andy Greenwald]

I didn't even think that this was a particularly good con from Rick. He's, like, making faces of dismay as he is luring her into his trap. But the fact that Fabian is at the table, first of all, we get that very emotional, quick little moment where he's, like, opening up right before Rick interrupts. And he's like, this was not.

[Chris Ryan]

The arts were not encouraged in my home.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then he's interrupted and thwarted. But he does not like Rick.

[Chris Ryan]

No. When. When they came to the boat in the first episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

Rick was like, fuck all of you. I'm not gonna engage in your little welcome ritual. So the fact that he's there witnessing that felt very purposeful in his.

[Chris Ryan]

Very protective of Sitala and, like, Dufferin. But, like, the finding out that he has been mispronouncing her name, as I'm sure I am in my own way. But he was just like, I'm sorry. It's what.

[Andy Greenwald]

I know.

[Mallory Rubin]

I'm gonna keep calling her the matron.

[Chris Ryan]

That's fine. But, like, Fabi, our guy Fabi.

[Mallory Rubin]

I feel like I'm in the right group for this question. So Aries and a Scorpio. Did either of you have thoughts on this?

[Andy Greenwald]

I obviously loved the conversation between Chelsea and Rick there, which was iconic.

[Mallory Rubin]

How big of a horoscope person are you?

[Andy Greenwald]

When I tell you I've never.

[Mallory Rubin]

You don't care at all.

[Andy Greenwald]

Consumed one or two of my life.

[Mallory Rubin]

But I know Stealth in a tiny.

[Chris Ryan]

Bit, I would not be able to weigh in on this.

[Mallory Rubin]

I'm always jealous of the horoscope people. I feel like they do have this extra.

[Chris Ryan]

I know my sign and what that means about me. What's your sign?

[Mallory Rubin]

I'm Libra, which. I'm like a classic Libra. Apparently, I'm a Virgo. What does that do?

[Andy Greenwald]

Couldn't tell you.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

I literally have no idea.

[Mallory Rubin]

No Virgo.

[Andy Greenwald]

Absolutely no idea.

[Mallory Rubin]

Very susceptible to germs.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, probably. I'll ask children. See what she does.

[Mallory Rubin]

A lot of postmates orders.

[Chris Ryan]

What's a classic Libra, according to you?

[Mallory Rubin]

Creative and passionate.

[Chris Ryan]

That's us.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Wow.

[Chris Ryan]

That's. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

How wonderful for you. How wonderful for you.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

But the thing about the thing about these horror. Like, I miss being whatever the next one was by, like, a day.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, it was like one of those. Or maybe like, I was a day into it. Could have been, like, one day earlier. All of a sudden, I'm like a different sign.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's where these are a week apart. We're different signs.

[Chris Ryan]

Look at that.

[Mallory Rubin]

I was also Year of the Cock in the Chinese food menu.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm Year of the Cock on the Chinese menu.

[Mallory Rubin]

There you go.

[Chris Ryan]

That's Bill.

[Mallory Rubin]

You're the cock. Libra.

[Chris Ryan]

I was cosmically meant to podcast with.

[Andy Greenwald]

You, so unlike Chelsea and Rick, you two are podcasts because your signs are compatible.

[Mallory Rubin]

The fancies get offered time with the energy healer, which they steer toward our girl, Carrie Coon.

[Chris Ryan]

Jacqueline is pushing Laurie. Yes.

[Mallory Rubin]

So what's her game plan? She just wants Laurie to get laid or what? Like, I don't understand why is she pushing this so hard?

[Andy Greenwald]

I thought this was a fascinating, obviously, in general, fascinating episode for the Cougars, but a particularly fascinating Jacqueline Laurie episode where I felt more what struck me as authentic affection between the two of them in this episode than between any other pairing in the triangle at any point. But loaded and charged, as always, with all of the undercurrents of something less savory. And the fact that.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you think that connection is because in terms of this trust triangle, when it gets to, like, what unites us, what divides us. Kate dropping the, like, I voted for Trump.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're genuinely united in something that feels, like, rooted in identity and, like, Kate is on the outside of that. But even, like, when they looked at each other when they were doing yoga, there was, like, the giggle. That just felt like friendship to me in a real, true way. But I agree, Jack egging Laurie on here couldn't help the like. But you're the single one. It's not like, just go for it and get married and have an orgasm and have a great weekend. It's like, I have to remind you that you're the only one who's, like, not in a relationship right now.

[Chris Ryan]

I can get him for you.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

Like, I'm doing the flirting.

[Andy Greenwald]

I will facilitate this to make.

[Chris Ryan]

I am in a committed relationship, but I. It's still my allure that's getting you.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

Closer to this guy.

[Andy Greenwald]

Speaking of allure, I would like to just spend a couple moments on Valentin's thigh tattoo.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which I thought was extraordinary.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

And I.

[Chris Ryan]

Are you going to get a thigh tattoo?

[Andy Greenwald]

Deeply compelled. Not since recent. In the court of thorns and roses.

[Chris Ryan]

Were going to bring that up on.

[Andy Greenwald]

A white above me tattoo has been quite so compelling, really. Some.

[Mallory Rubin]

Wow.

[Chris Ryan]

Which I was struck by that tattoo.

[Andy Greenwald]

I would not personally, but I did. I loved the way they all looked at it and looked at each other, and you could just, like, feel the. You didn't need an energy healer to feel the energy in that moment. My goodness.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you know that there's, like, a huge Russian population in Thailand? No. Yeah. They've, like, so they.

[Mallory Rubin]

I'm gonna add that to my con list.

[Chris Ryan]

When they're talking. When they're talking to Valentine, they're like, oh, you came here before the war? And he was like, yeah, but, like, when the Russia Ukraine war broke out, Russia was a Persona non grata. Like, the Russian citizens could not fly to so many countries, and Thailand was like, come here. And so it was a Massive influx of Russians in Thailand.

[Mallory Rubin]

More pots.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, yeah. And schemes.

[Mallory Rubin]

So we're calling it Guy Talk now. Okay. And Mooc fanduel parlay where, like, they'll do this on with sports bets where they'll be like, you can have Saquon Barkley and somebody else to score a touchdown and if one of them scores, you win the bet. I would do that with guy talking Mook. Like, I bet I'm at least one guy's star.

[Chris Ryan]

Cross lovers.

[Mallory Rubin]

This is not the Mike White universe. That.

[Chris Ryan]

Here's. Here's a follow up question. This is Rob Mahoney's take on Guy Talk. He thinks he's like. Like a creep. I don't get that vibe off of him. But, like, Rob's not a little.

[Mallory Rubin]

Rob's got good radar for this stuff. I don't know. That might be a good thing.

[Chris Ryan]

Rob has good creep radar.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Tough.

[Andy Greenwald]

Tough one there for Rob.

[Chris Ryan]

He's got nothing but time.

[Mallory Rubin]

No, that's a compliment.

[Andy Greenwald]

I was compelled to step out.

[Mallory Rubin]

The creeps.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Like, that was not how it struck me. I have found them through three episodes, like, incredibly sweet and winning as a potential couple, and I am filled with trepidation and fear, but hope they will be okay and live a long, happy life together seems unlikely, but hopefully. But when Rob said that, it was in my mind watching in this episode, like, she shows up and he runs out and he wants to tell her that someone called him brave and like, look how big and strong I am. Would you go? Would you leave the island if you came with me?

[Chris Ryan]

It was.

[Andy Greenwald]

I didn't change my read on it, but I see why Rob is clocking.

[Chris Ryan]

He's not pinging my creep radar. But like, you've been saying this from the front that you driven first, that you were worried that he was going to try to show off.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

I just want to say Creep Radar would be an incredible podcast.

[Chris Ryan]

Creep Radar with Rob Mahoney.

[Mallory Rubin]

Just creep radar once a week. It's like creep radar.

[Andy Greenwald]

Let's get that going.

[Mallory Rubin]

Here we go.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Yeah, let's.

[Mallory Rubin]

Let's dive into Patrick Schwarzenegger. I'm voting no.

[Chris Ryan]

Can I just say, not a creep. It's an incredible time for creep radar.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, my God. Creeps everywhere.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah. Fodder. Appointing post Covid. Creep. Apex. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Well, now you have to explain what Apex Mountain is again. Nobody knows.

[Mallory Rubin]

Nobody knows. Lockheed Saxon by the pool.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, man.

[Mallory Rubin]

Makes him drink the energy drink. Says, don't you want the big dogs to respect you? You want to be Neurotic your whole life and end up a virgin.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, is this where I get to talk?

[Andy Greenwald]

Go ahead.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

Where are you, Nora? Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Prince Yadi, the best legend, texted me and said she was in on my Saxon is a virgin thing.

[Mallory Rubin]

Nailed it.

[Chris Ryan]

I. I mean, we don't know. I don't know what her virgin radar is, but she says she introduced me to a term that is gym cell, which I had never heard before.

[Mallory Rubin]

Gym cell.

[Chris Ryan]

An incel who likes to hit the gym. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Jim cell.

[Chris Ryan]

Incredible.

[Mallory Rubin]

That's great. So that sounds like another ringer podcast.

[Chris Ryan]

Shout out to Nora Corner. Nora should host Jim Cell. Corner Jim.

[Andy Greenwald]

So it was really good.

[Mallory Rubin]

Talk to her about it.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

Jim Cell.

[Andy Greenwald]

Saxon saying out loud to Locky die a virgin is the first time I considered that you might be right about.

[Chris Ryan]

I have seduced you to monkey shootout.

[Andy Greenwald]

You have me with monkey shoot at. I still say. I just think. I think this guy has fucked a lot of people.

[Chris Ryan]

Tell and is not a version. Do you want to say on camera what you told you texted me?

[Andy Greenwald]

I just think you and Nora have more faith in the undergraduate populace than I do. I think Saxon has had a lot of sex, but again, I don't think he's very good at it or particularly adept at it or has a feel for what other people enjoy and probably.

[Chris Ryan]

Has not had a second time than any of his partners.

[Mallory Rubin]

A lot of one and done.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, yeah, certainly. I do think though, something is poised to happen there with him pursuing Chloe and like, oh, for sure. Is he gonna try to enlist Chloe for Locky? Are he and Chloe gonna hook up? And I. I agree. Greg Gary is gonna try to harm him.

[Mallory Rubin]

I like that you use Greg Gary. Thank you. It's been trying to get that going all podcasts again.

[Andy Greenwald]

He still could have just gone with Michael.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you think. Do you think that Mitchell, that Saxon is going to use his like peculiar flex trick to.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was great deal with the. What he was doing. That was so funny to me.

[Mallory Rubin]

He had a great laugh in this scene when I. I just. I really enjoy Patrick Schwartz saying when.

[Andy Greenwald]

She called him a douche. I hear you're a douche.

[Mallory Rubin]

Like, but it was like genuine. I don't know. I think he's doing a good job. Little stare down with the. With the. With Chloe.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, yeah. I mean, they're. They're clocking each other.

[Mallory Rubin]

Goggins therapy session really quick. I've done a lot of bad things. I've made a lot of mistakes. Says his father was murdered. I can't get my Life back. Maybe I can still get some satisfaction. How did you interpret this, Joe?

[Chris Ryan]

Again, I feel like this is a. This is a make or break moment for Rick. Like he is locked into this vengeance plan. It seems like he doesn't see a future for himself. He feels like he has no future. But if he can get Venice, which.

[Mallory Rubin]

Is sad because we all like Chloe.

[Chris Ryan]

Chelsea.

[Andy Greenwald]

Chelsea.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, Chelsea.

[Chris Ryan]

I know. Well, that's. The whole thing is, like, can you see what's right in front of you? Which is Chelsea, who rules.

[Mallory Rubin]

You guys are. You guys are fighting.

[Chris Ryan]

Chelsea, who's still having dinner with you despite you getting her snake bit, totally forgave him immediately.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're at dinner that night. Wild stuff. Yeah. Like the fact that he says, I can't get my life back. I mean, I'm sure that that feels really true to him.

[Chris Ryan]

Sawyer also can't go back to Australia.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's giving Sawyer. It's giving Sawyer.

[Chris Ryan]

You know what the snake show made me think of? Justified season four.

[Andy Greenwald]

I was thinking about that, too. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Goggins with the snakes and Justified season.

[Mallory Rubin]

Four, there's some deep shit going on with him.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's not allowing himself to. To get his life back. Right.

[Chris Ryan]

He feels like he's stuck in a cage.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

People can just feel like they're broken and that's it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

And they're just like, I. I've now latched on to my brokenness, and that's just who I am.

[Andy Greenwald]

And he keeps saying he doesn't want to go to these sessions, but he immediately opens up and shares when he's there with Amrita. The best moment of the episode was Chelsea's like, please help him.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, yeah, please help.

[Andy Greenwald]

Help him, please.

[Chris Ryan]

And almaries are really all. Marisa thinks she can help him. Is there an okay. This is gonna be a. My running bit if I remember to do this.

[Mallory Rubin]

Did you just use the character's name?

[Chris Ryan]

Sometimes I do.

[Mallory Rubin]

No, that was really impressive. The therapist.

[Chris Ryan]

Would you call it Conferencing Amarito? Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Both of you had them?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

I don't know any character's names. It takes me, like, four episodes.

[Chris Ryan]

No, but that's great because I feel like sometimes I just use character's name and people have no idea what I'm talking about. And when I'm.

[Mallory Rubin]

For the common people, when I podcast.

[Chris Ryan]

With you, you're like, you know the.

[Mallory Rubin]

Blonde I'm calling Cary Coon.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I mean, it was.

[Mallory Rubin]

All right, I interrupted you. What were you going to say?

[Andy Greenwald]

Game of Thrones. You were still texting us like the blonde one.

[Mallory Rubin]

So tall lady.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, do you think if this whole theme of the season is not just drugs, but also, like, spiritual awakening, like, who is that available to? Who's gonna have the, like, nirvana moment here? Or is it available to anyone? Is it available to Rick? Chelsea already seems pretty enlightened to me.

[Mallory Rubin]

Rick's probably our best hope.

[Chris Ryan]

I hope so.

[Mallory Rubin]

The daughter.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, Piper.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, Piper.

[Mallory Rubin]

I just did it again. I didn't call her Piper.

[Chris Ryan]

Now people knew what I was saying instinctively.

[Andy Greenwald]

Piper feels like.

[Mallory Rubin]

But we know she has a big appointment on Friday.

[Andy Greenwald]

She sure does. Boy, that was a tense moment. Was she going to be able to get that scheduled before they had to depart?

[Mallory Rubin]

She only had six months of the tripping plan.

[Chris Ryan]

This is a big reveal from Piper because she wants to do a program which is not for a year.

[Andy Greenwald]

Her family knows nothing about her life.

[Chris Ryan]

They think she's there for a thesis interview, and she's there.

[Mallory Rubin]

Smart move by her to get away from the rat lips.

[Chris Ryan]

Right now especially, it's like, oh, my.

[Mallory Rubin]

Close relationships with my brother who asked me about my sex life, my date rapey older brother, my crazy mother, and my dad, who's just completely unraveling. I'm gonna stay here.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm gonna go to Tyler for a year.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, great. Great strategy, Great life strategy for Piper. But Piper feels like we're, like, meeting her where we left other characters at the end of a Lotus season. Like Quinn at the end of season one.

[Mallory Rubin]

IPad. Quinn.

[Andy Greenwald]

IPad. Quinn just wanted to crank it on the beach and then, like, let's look at this whale instead. Wanna talk about a character in an arc?

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

My God. And so now he's in Gladiator.

[Mallory Rubin]

Cr on the beach.

[Chris Ryan]

Exactly.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like CR on the beach. But, you know, he had to work toward a desire to commune with nature and run away from the drama and his family. And, like, Piper's there already.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

So her committing to that in full feels, like, very imbalanced. But I think Rick feels like a good candidate for the journey of some sort of awakening. Like, I don't actually want to live my life the way I've been living it. When he had that line about the snakes and how, like, treating evil things that way only makes them more evil. That applies to everybody in the show so far, but certainly applies to him. He's got to, like, free himself from that.

[Chris Ryan]

The thing about White Lotus is that sometimes people leave White Lotus enlightened, and sometimes people leave White Lotus trapped in the same toxic relationship as when they got there.

[Mallory Rubin]

And sometimes they Leave or state of mind.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

And sometimes they leave because they fell off the boat, landed on their head and drowned.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, dude.

[Mallory Rubin]

It's another way to go energy session with Lori and then we also had the corrective posture session with Lachi. So I really spent a lot of time thinking about this about. And I, I, it was going to be a Google deep dive. Maybe I'll do it this week. The defensive position. Left foot on your knee. You're protecting yourself with your female side. I don't know if this is true. Sometimes, like I have a bad back. Sometimes it's easier for me to throw a foot on one leg or the other. Like we do the live podcast. I gotta keep my iPad up, so I don't know. I immediately got defensive. I got in a defensive sitting posture listening to him talk about posture. Okay, so now I don't want to do that rabbit hole, but do you guys believe in defensive postures? I know this is defensive. If you do this, that's defensive.

[Chris Ryan]

I do that sometimes. And if I ever register that I'm doing it, I put my arms down because I know what it gives off.

[Andy Greenwald]

I would also sit in a defensive posture if that were my family fair, which is basically what he says.

[Mallory Rubin]

Are there defensive standing postures?

[Chris Ryan]

Probably, I think like a hard punch of any kind. Like hands in your pockets, protecting your belly. Sort of, you know, sort of like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right, yeah, you're vulnerable.

[Chris Ryan]

You're vulnerable. Your soft bits.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, the guy basically said Lockheed sat like a loser. That was his therapy session. It's like everything you're doing isn't working, buddy.

[Andy Greenwald]

I really like that it connects to the question you're asking. People pleaser. You're a people pleaser. I like this with a feminine side.

[Mallory Rubin]

Just what an 18 year old wants to hear who's struggling with sexuality but.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like he was not ready for because. Exactly. It wasn't just about. Okay, we're gonna teach you to sit up straight. Like this isn't a therapy session. And he was not prepared for it though. Obviously all of these characters have quite a bit to work through. So can, can we go back to.

[Chris Ryan]

Chloe for a second?

[Mallory Rubin]

I was just about to dive into.

[Chris Ryan]

Her talking about Tanya.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah, she thinks.

[Andy Greenwald]

Shocking.

[Mallory Rubin]

She thinks Greg's wife killed herself by walking in the ocean. Which by the way, if somebody said that would happen to your ex wife committed suicide by walking to an ocean.

[Chris Ryan]

And all they found was part of her leg. Which is untrue.

[Andy Greenwald]

Correct.

[Chris Ryan]

I went back and rewatched. I mean, you rewatched it more Recently. But I was like, I feel like we saw her whole body. Which we do. We see her whole body, but also.

[Mallory Rubin]

Why would he tell her anything?

[Andy Greenwald]

This is exactly. This is the thing. This is like such sloppy shit from Greg. Greg, Gary can't bother to really change her name. Greg and Gary. Are we fucking for real? Come on. Bill has been suggesting Mitchell. It was right there. You're still dining at a white lotus. Belinda identifies you and goes up to everybody. I know. Now I'm moving from the Chloe Chelsea conversation about what Chloe has learned to the dinner confrontation, the beach barbecue confrontation with Belinda. But it's all in the brew, right? Like the fact that everybody at that table heard Tanya's name. Like now they just have to Google that and they know who Greg is.

[Chris Ryan]

Like first and last name.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[Chris Ryan]

And Rick's been like, fucking him.

[Andy Greenwald]

Absolutely. This and that. Like, it's a fellow con man who's not very good at being a con man. I mean, good enough to get the.

[Mallory Rubin]

Money in that club. Yeah, well, it's his fault because he's staying at Away Lotus. We covered that last episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

But like, who's going to use what they learn as leverage in that scenario, right?

[Chris Ryan]

Or what is is Belinda. Belinda does not seem convinced by this.

[Andy Greenwald]

No.

[Chris Ryan]

So.

[Mallory Rubin]

So I thought that was the best acting of the show.

[Andy Greenwald]

Belinda's response to Greg.

[Mallory Rubin]

No, Greg Garrett's kind of very hidden double take where he's like, you could just see for like a split second his eyes bulging out really good in this season.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Then he got his shit together.

[Chris Ryan]

But his like predatory, like sort of scoping out the restaurant, looking at Saxon. To your point. But I think something that's really important about Chloe talking about Tanya and Belinda talking about Tanya and all of this other stuff is there's this batshit theory floating around with love and respect to everyone who believed in this theory that this was some, like a prequel. Because. Yeah, because they were like, maybe this is before he met Tanya. Maybe this is before Belinda met Tanya. There were a bunch of people who thought this was like a. I think people have been watching Too Much Severance and. Or Westworld. Like they thought it was a prequel season, but there's no way. No, it's clearly not.

[Mallory Rubin]

I have a Greg Gary present for you guys.

[Andy Greenwald]

Let's see.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, just me and a few simple laws of geometry. Yeah. And a growing pile of 20s.

[Chris Ryan]

Icing on the cake.

[Mallory Rubin]

It's best high in the world. Don't believe me. It's not the best high in the world. That's like 30 plus years ago. Just don't trust Greg Gary. When you see him in anything. John Gree Lost.

[Chris Ryan]

Don't trust him on loss.

[Mallory Rubin]

Has he ever been trustworthy ever?

[Chris Ryan]

Napoleon Dynamite. Uncle Rico.

[Andy Greenwald]

Good call. Good call.

[Chris Ryan]

That's the one.

[Mallory Rubin]

Chelsea and Rick get high and go to a snake show. How'd you feel about this? This is the weirdest, weirdest sequence in the show.

[Chris Ryan]

I was very distressed through this whole sequence. It couldn't have possibly ended well. Right?

[Mallory Rubin]

I mean, does I think the answer to this for pretty much everybody is no? But do you guys like snakes? Because I don't like snakes.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm not opposed to like a little corn snake. Like, there's some, like, cute little snakes that exist. Yeah. But if they've got. If it's like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

If it's got like poisonous fangs or a rattle.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

And I'm in Thailand.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

It's a no. Oh, so snake show. I'm not going.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, no. I would not be going to the snake show.

[Mallory Rubin]

Is immediate. No, thank you.

[Chris Ryan]

No.

[Andy Greenwald]

So Rick is doing a little bit of the Arbats, a little bit of the story from Lost, and a little bit of the Harry freeing the snake before he knows he could speak.

[Chris Ryan]

He speaks parcel tones.

[Andy Greenwald]

This was. Okay, here's my question for you guys about the snake freeing and great. Obviously that Chelsea just confronts him at the end and is like, rick, you freed a bunch of venomous snakes today. Like, this is not a normal thing.

[Chris Ryan]

I love her.

[Andy Greenwald]

She's the best. What do you think the lesson is? What. What is the show's message to us?

[Mallory Rubin]

I think this is Rick does this.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then something bad happens.

[Mallory Rubin]

This is the calm before the storm episode. Literally, because they're going on a boat. And I think this was just establishing snake fire and tsunami. I think they're trying to tell us.

[Chris Ryan]

But also, Chelsea thinks nearly dying twice is important.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

One way or another.

[Andy Greenwald]

Because, like, there's something about what Rick is doing here that feels noble and good.

[Chris Ryan]

He's like, they're trapped.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're not free.

[Chris Ryan]

I see myself in that.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's like a good moment of introspection. And also, he is trying to do something, like, helpful. And in theory, good. And Chelsea almost dies is her husband.

[Mallory Rubin]

But these are two pretty dramatic vacation events. Like, if you went on a vacation, you'd be like, hear about what happened to Mao in Thailand. She was in a store and there was a huge robbery and she almost got shot. Like, oh, my God.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

And it's like, snake show.

[Chris Ryan]

She got palace and I'll be like, absolutely not, Mal. I did not go to a snake show.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, man. Great.

[Mallory Rubin]

But, like, those are two crazy things to happen.

[Chris Ryan]

Unless it's a different kind of snake show. Right?

[Andy Greenwald]

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Great stuff. When Gwen, Chloe's like, maybe you just shouldn't come on the boat.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay, wait, did you. Did you hear when the fancies, as Bill is calling them, were checking on Valentin, there was, like, hardcore moaning on the soundtrack. And same with Chloe and Saxon. Like, they're putting, like, pornographic moaning on the soundtrack of this show.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes, I did notice.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay. Just making sure.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, Chelsea got bit. That was a very well done tense scene.

[Chris Ryan]

When you see the snakes, just all.

[Mallory Rubin]

The stinks, I was like, oh, God, I'm not enjoying this. But, you know, it's. It was definitely weird. Rick got one of the sleeping pills.

[Chris Ryan]

Rick seemed.

[Mallory Rubin]

Not Rick.

[Chris Ryan]

Rick seemed genuinely upset.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sure.

[Chris Ryan]

We were constantly questioning, like, does Rick actually care about Chelsea at all? Right. And when she's going to the hospital, he seems, like, desperate to follow her.

[Mallory Rubin]

So he was also upset after the robbery.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yep.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Tim ate a sleeping pill. There's a double date with Greg. Gary barbecue on the beach. He's inviting everyone on the boat tomorrow. And then the fancy cougar dinner. Let's dive into it after this break. This episode is brought to you by. Eight Sleep. We all know how important sleep is. When I sleep well, I feel so much better. It never happens. So I'm excited to talk about a game changer in the world of sleep technology. Eight Sleep, and their revolutionary Pod 4 Ultra. It's a high tech mattress cover that you can easily and quickly add to your existing bed. It's packed with advanced technology that allows it to automatically cool, heat, and even elevate. The Pod has been clinically proven to increase quality sleep by up to one hour each night. That's a massive boost to your recovery time, which can translate to better physical performance, improved cognitive function, and enhanced overall health. Having a pod is like having a sleep coach, personal thermostat, and advanced fitness tracker all rolled into one. It also uses precision temperature control to regulate your body's sleep cycles. It can cool down to a chilly 55 or warm up to 110. And it does this separately for each side of the bed. This means you and your partner can each have your ideal sleep temperature. And the really cool part, the pod learns your sleep patterns over time and automatically adjusts the temperature throughout the night to optimize each phase of your sleep. Ready to take your sleep and recover to the next Level. Head over to eightsleep.com ringer that's 8, which is E I G H T sleep.com ringer Use the code Ringer to get $350 off your very own Pod 4 Ultra. Trust me, your body will thank you for this investment in better sleep shipping to many countries worldwide. See [e-mail] Ringer all right, the fancies are out to dinner. Terry Coon hasn't been touched by a man like that and sometimes hasn't been not touched. Hasn't been not touched by a man like that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sometimes. Great stuff.

[Mallory Rubin]

But here's what we learned about Leslie Bibbs character. What's her name on the show?

[Andy Greenwald]

Kate.

[Mallory Rubin]

Kate. Not a new age person.

[Chris Ryan]

No, no.

[Mallory Rubin]

She's a church going Texas lady.

[Chris Ryan]

Yep.

[Andy Greenwald]

She voted for.

[Chris Ryan]

She voted for Trump.

[Mallory Rubin]

There's. You're no. Did you vote for Trump?

[Chris Ryan]

Well, she's like, do you really want to talk control? Really going to talk about Trump again. This like silent smile thing she does I think is like killer, silent, smiling.

[Mallory Rubin]

Maga conservative Texas lady.

[Chris Ryan]

What I think was so smart about what they did is they, they did a little bait and swish with us. When they put her in Austin. You're like, oh, right, exactly. Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And then she's like little. Yeah. Blue bubble in Texas. And then she's like, oh, no.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. The contrast in her facial expression at that table where she's like evasive and also challenging. A little bit of the contention that they're bringing.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then the face when she's alone, when there's no one sitting at the table, when she's watching them. Each of them now has, in every episode near the end has observed the other two talking about it.

[Mallory Rubin]

It's the no trust triangle.

[Andy Greenwald]

Totally.

[Chris Ryan]

To Kobe.

[Andy Greenwald]

And she looked completely crestfallen, not only to know that they thought this about her, but to see herself through their eyes.

[Mallory Rubin]

I actually thought this was my favorite scene in the episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

I love their reactions.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, my God.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

They're like. Because that now we're going back to. We all grew up together. I thought we would all think the same about everything. It's like, clearly this lady's a lot different than you two.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. And they haven't seen each other in a long time. And their accusation is that she has molded her personality to fit her husband. And also.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which seems true.

[Chris Ryan]

My. My favorite mom husband.

[Mallory Rubin]

Sounds great. Sounds like a fun hang. I'd love to go to a Cowboys game with him.

[Chris Ryan]

I think King of Austin did.

[Mallory Rubin]

Sounds like a connected dude.

[Chris Ryan]

My favorite. My favorite moment.

[Mallory Rubin]

Seen him last week in Texas, taking us out.

[Chris Ryan]

My favorite moment is when Kate is like, you would know that if you came to visit me. And they're like, can't wait to get down there. I really want to come.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah. There is no chance.

[Andy Greenwald]

So funny.

[Mallory Rubin]

Let's start planning that Austin trip.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, this is a big thing to not know about somebody that you repeatedly say out loud as your closest lifelong friend.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well.

[Chris Ryan]

Right.

[Mallory Rubin]

All right, so what are the lessons? They don't really talk that much.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're not in touch with me.

[Mallory Rubin]

It's probably, like, some tech stuff. How you doing, honey? So good. Saw that Instagram photo. You look so great. It's like, all surface fake shit. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Your kids look great. I get the Christmas card every year or something like that. I thought it was weird that you were all wearing red hats, but whatever, it's fine.

[Andy Greenwald]

Baseball caps instead of Santa hats.

[Chris Ryan]

Odd choice inside the trust triangle. I think what's really interesting inside the patented Jacoby trust triangle is, like, what. What. What are the strongest bonds of identity that you can have? Right? And it's like Lori and Kate are. Are moms who have been married and divorced for a long time. And Jacqueline doesn't get that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Or, you know, Jacqueline and Kate have wealth and status.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Have good plastic surgeons. You know what I mean? And then, like. But then there's this, like, Trump voter thing. And the Trump voter thing I thought was really interesting because first of all, this was made before they knew what the outcome of the election was. So, like, how does this. How does this scene play?

[Mallory Rubin]

They were editing it during the election.

[Chris Ryan]

But, like, this scene existed. So how is it gonna play if there was a different outcome? You know, all of that? And then also, I thought it was interesting to make the Trump part explicit here versus in White Lotus Season two, when they were talking about voting, they were like, you know, the couple, Theo James and stuff like that. Like, do you even vote? Was this sort of conversation they were having. We don't watch the news, but that's different. That's like a more nebulous version of this. Like, wait, you didn't vote for Trump, did you?

[Mallory Rubin]

I loved how they did it because it wasn't necessarily political, but it was about how something like this is such a great little window into the fact that the three of them don't really know each other that well. It was.

[Chris Ryan]

I thought.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, it did feel political, but it felt social. It felt like it touched all aspects of life. Like, yeah, they're coasting on Nostalgia right now. I think in some ways, there's something true and kind of nice about that. Like, the. The deepest or longest lasting friendships in your life. Sometimes you do go a really long time without seeing or talking to somebody, and the sign that it's a friendship you can count on forever is that that's okay. You can always just pick right back up. And maybe there are things you don't know about each other, but, like, oh, you don't know that I became like. Or that I have a gluten intolerance is like that bucket. You don't know that I have a deeply, like, gluten distinct political and that.

[Chris Ryan]

Regularly go to church. Yeah, yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

She could have pulled out, like, a giant thing of cocaine and just started, like, banging it out. And they would be like, whoa, you're doing that now. Like, it's on that level of, like, I didn't realize you're this now.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, and that's how it's like, cocaine.

[Chris Ryan]

Is like a habit.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right?

[Chris Ryan]

This is how you treat like a belief, sort of.

[Andy Greenwald]

And I think.

[Chris Ryan]

You know what I mean?

[Mallory Rubin]

Or it's a habit. The same way cocaine is where it's like, I'm in Texas.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

All right, cool.

[Chris Ryan]

Bumping church. Yeah, bumping church.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, I'm curious if you guys. If it struck you guys this way, too. Like, it almost felt like the judgment. I think, yes. If she's like, I. Yes, I voted for Trump. Why are you saying that? And why do you think that's bad? And here's all. Here is my defense of it.

[Mallory Rubin]

I like Theo Von.

[Andy Greenwald]

They would have said, we're horrified. How could you do that as a woman? All of the things that they say. But it felt like the more active judgment was like, is this what she believes? It's the chameleonic.

[Chris Ryan]

That's certainly what. What Laurie, Jacqueline were talking about.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's what the whispers later.

[Chris Ryan]

She always just does whatever Dave does.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

It's a classic Julia Roberts runaway.

[Mallory Rubin]

Dave sounds amazing. Could Dave be showing up to Thailand?

[Chris Ryan]

Who would you want to play have so many.

[Mallory Rubin]

I mean, it's Jon Hamm sitting right there. I don't know how many shows he can pop into at the same time.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, my God. Little Hammy can just roll over from the hospital bed.

[Mallory Rubin]

Right? Just right out. Pull the plugs out right up to.

[Andy Greenwald]

Listen for a FaceTime.

[Chris Ryan]

I want, like, Buddy Garrity.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, you know, that would be McConaughey. Oh. Oh, man. That would also be great.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, that would be wonderful.

[Andy Greenwald]

Again, that would be great.

[Mallory Rubin]

Anyway, I love this scene. And then Belinda, who for the most part was a snore fest with her scenes until she decided, I'm going to go see if that's actually Greg. And she's probably going to get. I think she's in the murder rankings.

[Chris Ryan]

I think that it doesn't feel safe to confront Greg Garry at dinner this way. But she doesn't know. But he doesn't know what she doesn't know. If that makes any sense.

[Andy Greenwald]

This almost feels like it would be too cruel of a thing for White Lotus.

[Chris Ryan]

Is White Lotus just a show about kill off your favorite character, Greg Garry going around the world killing women? Is that what this show?

[Mallory Rubin]

That's where they landed on doing the interview today. I forgot how haphazardly they put together season one. Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

Make us a show on Covid.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah, make a show Covid. They're still figuring out the show as they're doing it. They have to go back and refilm some of the ending and they assume it's a one and done.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Mallory Rubin]

And then by episode, by season three. Now this is like this show might be on eight seasons. Like, so Greg Gary becoming like the serial killer of White Lotus. Like, I'm not against this.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, sign me up. Where do I get to go?

[Chris Ryan]

That's the three. Pete Star of White Lotus.

[Mallory Rubin]

That's true. He's the only one.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, he is the only one. Yeah. I think he's clearly alarmed to have been clocked, right? Alarmed to have been made and going to try to ensure that Belinda does not out him. So then my question becomes, what is the counterweight to that?

[Mallory Rubin]

Does he let her on the boat?

[Andy Greenwald]

No, certainly not.

[Mallory Rubin]

But what if she. What if she finds out day of it's like, we're all going on the boat. You should come.

[Andy Greenwald]

I don't think she's a freaked out feeling. This is part of what the. What's the spooky sound in my room is evoking? It's just a sense of unease, right?

[Chris Ryan]

She's like, what is that spooky sound in her room?

[Andy Greenwald]

I what? I don't know. A snake, A monkey?

[Mallory Rubin]

Might have been Greg Gary in the closet.

[Chris Ryan]

It could be Greg Gary.

[Andy Greenwald]

It definitely could be God talk.

[Mallory Rubin]

Is he getting fired? No, we have that part. No, that plot's looming.

[Andy Greenwald]

But they are going to say, you can't let something like this happen again. And then he's going to get like.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah, I have Saxon going on the yacht, hopefully having sex with Chloe, which I'll enjoy. That whole subplot and done sex on.

[Andy Greenwald]

A yacht on White Lotus before Portia and Jack last season.

[Chris Ryan]

So what you're saying is you cannot wait for Saxon to have sex with Chloe on the yacht. That is your number.

[Mallory Rubin]

And Greg Gary to find out and be pissed off.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm also excited for this. Yachts are always boats of any sort. Big settings on White Lotus. This is where Tanya could not finish pouring the ashes or mother's ashes into the ocean in season one.

[Mallory Rubin]

I would say yachts are the single most important property in any HBO show.

[Andy Greenwald]

Certainly Succession.

[Mallory Rubin]

Succession Sopranos, which. You didn't watch the Game of Thrones. Did they have yachts in the 1300s or no?

[Chris Ryan]

They did. There are plenty of boats. Plenty of thrones.

[Andy Greenwald]

Very famous.

[Chris Ryan]

Very famous boats.

[Mallory Rubin]

Some incest, then White Lotus. We've had multiple yacht stuff. We had the cliffhanger and Season or not Cliffhanger. The end of the season two.

[Andy Greenwald]

That makes me think it can't be the setting of some murder. Terrible act of vengeance.

[Chris Ryan]

Murder here. So is sex o'clock.

[Mallory Rubin]

I was thinking, I really miss succession.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, Great show, great program.

[Mallory Rubin]

I just miss it. I hope another show pops on that I enjoy it as much as that one.

[Chris Ryan]

What a weird thing to say right in the middle of talking about White Lotus. No, I love White Lotus Sunday night.

[Mallory Rubin]

But White Lotus, the characters change every year. The succession. Because I was thinking with the yacht, I was thinking of some of those. Some of those yacht scenes they had in succession.

[Andy Greenwald]

Let's get. Let's get some Tom and Greg back in our lives.

[Chris Ryan]

You want to tell me Grace went off.

[Mallory Rubin]

I feel like after five years, everyone's just gonna look at each other and go, it.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's bring this thing back to say that to Chris and Andy's face. Saxon mentions us. There's a big full moon holiday and this is like a thing in a thing.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

Right next. The island. Next door to the island they're shooting on. They have like a rave on the beach every single month for the full moon. It's just this, like, huge beach party in Thailand.

[Mallory Rubin]

Sounds like a great scene.

[Andy Greenwald]

I feel like some of our core characters are about to do some more drugs. That's what I'm hearing.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, we know that's going to be a theme. Last thing we didn't talk about Rick and Chelsea when she said you released a bunch of venomous snakes today. You're deranged. Snakes are evil. Read the Bible. Evil things shouldn't be treated like it only makes them more evil. So we're just.

[Chris Ryan]

Snakes are evil. Read The Bible is like a pretty great Chelsea quote.

[Andy Greenwald]

Incredible stuff.

[Mallory Rubin]

Not wrong.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, neither is Rick, though, so.

[Chris Ryan]

Not all snakes bite, man.

[Mallory Rubin]

Snakes are evil and cats are kind of deep down evil. Well, deep down.

[Andy Greenwald]

Stop it.

[Mallory Rubin]

Deep down.

[Chris Ryan]

No. That was not a Libra move of you at all.

[Mallory Rubin]

Deep down.

[Andy Greenwald]

No. There it is. The purest love you will ever know. If you, like Rick, opened your heart and opened yourself to the possibility.

[Mallory Rubin]

Some of my favorite Instagram videos are cats just fucking with dogs and little kids, which backs my point that they're.

[Andy Greenwald]

Discerning and strategic and smart.

[Mallory Rubin]

Cats have a dark side.

[Chris Ryan]

I can't believe this is a fight you want to pick.

[Mallory Rubin]

Cats have a dark side. We all know. And then things are closing on. Tim Ratliff is where we leave the episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

Boy, are they.

[Chris Ryan]

He doesn't do drugs.

[Mallory Rubin]

Major way.

[Chris Ryan]

He doesn't do drugs.

[Andy Greenwald]

Very, very worrying. MVP the episode Jason Isaacs Goggins, I think.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think it's Goggins. I have Goggins.

[Chris Ryan]

It's a great Goggins episode. I just want to say that I think it was last week that I was like, if Tim Ratliff gets into the lorazepam, we're going to have a good time. And I feel like we're about to have a good time, but it almost.

[Andy Greenwald]

Deprived us of Tim.

[Chris Ryan]

Larazepam. Tim is something that I'm very excited for.

[Mallory Rubin]

So Larazzapam. Like, can you walk me through how powerful this is? Is this, like, basically.

[Chris Ryan]

Why are you both looking at me?

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, because, you know the name of.

[Chris Ryan]

The pillow I don't take. Lorazepam. Yeah, it's a sedative.

[Mallory Rubin]

Is it like an elephant tranquilizer type of sleeping pill? Like how?

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, Vicky is happy to say that it's not sedative.

[Chris Ryan]

It depends on your milligrams, is what.

[Mallory Rubin]

I would say, because obviously Parker Posey's been chugging them down every night and is, like, half immune to him at this point.

[Chris Ryan]

She doesn't just take them at night, though. She, like, just takes them.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, that's what else is in her cocktail.

[Mallory Rubin]

But people like the mushroom scene, which I stay out of because I'm terrible at drugs, as Mallory knows.

[Chris Ryan]

And now I know.

[Mallory Rubin]

Well, now you know, too. I'm just bad at drugs. It's fine. I. I have a lot of strengths and I have some weaknesses, but I.

[Chris Ryan]

Like that you turned to me for drug info and horoscope info. I love this Northern California horoscope info. Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

But the mushroom, where some people can be like, oh, I'll do a 10 milligram, or I'll do a double. And then other people can do, like a single and they're completely demolished for the rest of the night. I would imagine sleeping pills works like that, too.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

What about, like, a weird.

[Chris Ryan]

And also, like, if you're. If you're talking about, like, body mass, you know, like. Like, Tim is much bigger than his wife, so, like, whatever her dosage is, he's probably gonna need more.

[Mallory Rubin]

That was the Jalen Rose corollary. Jalen Rose, my friend, who's like six, eight and a half, and he's drinking wine and it's just like, he's just. It's just gonna take more wine to. To knock him sideways. So if you, like, get a bottle with him and you have two glasses and he has two glasses, it's like he said, half a glass.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Because he's just got, you know, he's got more height to play with. Mvp. So we split on Goggins.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Predictions. I don't want to step on you and Rob, but predictions for episode four. We know we're going on a yacht.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, here's my question about the yacht.

[Mallory Rubin]

Like a transition episode to me, and I feel like episode four is going to be a massive episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is Rick going on the yacht or is he going to Bangkok?

[Chris Ryan]

He says he's going to Bangkok, but.

[Andy Greenwald]

He said that last episode, too.

[Mallory Rubin]

I think Rick goes to Bangkok, which means we get Chelsea.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Probably. Either she sees something she shouldn't see or she flirts with somebody she flirted with.

[Chris Ryan]

She wasn't bringing anyone else. There's a whole family going.

[Andy Greenwald]

He invited the family. Incredible. We didn't.

[Chris Ryan]

We didn't talk about not everyone who has a boat.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Like, Victoria's worried that they're trashy because they have a boat. Are there decent people?

[Chris Ryan]

Like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, they have a yacht. They're rich. Great stuff.

[Mallory Rubin]

Yeah, well, rich people can be trashy.

[Andy Greenwald]

But Rick, almost, like, I think he. Yes, he has to go to Bangkok and start running the comm, but if he delayed and went on the boat and the Ratliff family comes the idea of Tim and Rick being in a space together when they hate each other so much.

[Mallory Rubin]

So who's on the boat? Let's figure this out. The Double Day cruise. On the boat. Greg Saxon's on the boat. That's fine.

[Andy Greenwald]

Chloe, Chelsea. Probably not. Rick. Saxon, Locky.

[Mallory Rubin]

Oh, yeah. So three plus Saxon.

[Chris Ryan]

Expat. Like a bunch of expats. So I think there's just gonna be other people, but it's possible.

[Mallory Rubin]

It's just the four of them. With Saxon in the Rick spot.

[Chris Ryan]

I bet it's gonna be a bunch of LBHs.

[Andy Greenwald]

Losers back home, man. They gotta do something with their time.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, they got another butt time.

[Mallory Rubin]

I can't wait to go on the boat with this. True.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's gonna be fantastic.

[Mallory Rubin]

Something bad's gonna happen. All right, that's it for episode three, Right. Anything else?

[Chris Ryan]

We learned a lot about accents, about horoscopes, snakes. Snakes.

[Mallory Rubin]

The fact that cats have a dark side. You have to admit, cats have a dark side.

[Andy Greenwald]

A halo is a ray of light in my life, but halo.

[Mallory Rubin]

Would halo kill a mouse if it was in your house?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, sure. And he'd bring it to me, he'd present it to me and I would say, good job, Ba Ba.

[Mallory Rubin]

Cats are predators.

[Chris Ryan]

Would you kill a mouse if it was in your house?

[Mallory Rubin]

I don't really like mice, but we did have a.

[Chris Ryan]

Would you kill a mouse if it was in your house, Bill?

[Mallory Rubin]

The most interesting thing. Would I kill it? No. I would try to scoop it outside.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Mallory Rubin]

Just for karma points.

[Andy Greenwald]

With like a shoebox.

[Mallory Rubin]

I was dating. I was dating a girl once. We were staying at her parents house and I went down to get water and I heard this like weird sound. And it was. Their cat was in the foyer, had a mouse cornered and was just like slowing in. It wasn't just like, I'm killing the mouse. It was like, I'm really gonna enjoy this next five minutes before I kill them.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Mallory Rubin]

And it was like watching Wild Kingdom. I've never seen anything like it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you think that's what was happening in Belinda's villa? The mysterious sounds? You think it's a cat? It would be great to have a cat in the cell.

[Mallory Rubin]

Could it be a monkey?

[Andy Greenwald]

I think probably.

[Chris Ryan]

It's probably a monkey, Bill.

[Andy Greenwald]

Underneath anger, there's always a sadness, you know? So when you. That's what we learned from this episode and also what I know to be true. When you talk about cats.

[Mallory Rubin]

Cats?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

You just want me to. Do I have to get one just for our relationship, for the. For the stories?

[Andy Greenwald]

It seemed like you were gonna get one last year.

[Mallory Rubin]

My wife really wants one. Yeah, I don't. I just don't like kitty litter. Are you in on this?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

She has a cat.

[Mallory Rubin]

Would you. Would it be a male cat or a female cat? Female cats are less marky. Right?

[Chris Ryan]

I think you would love to have a little female cat. I think that would be really.

[Mallory Rubin]

Cats, Mark. Don't they.

[Andy Greenwald]

They can.

[Chris Ryan]

Don't you want the big cats to respect you?

[Mallory Rubin]

What?

[Andy Greenwald]

You don't just be, like, neurotic all your life and die a fucking virgin. Fucking cat virgin.

[Mallory Rubin]

Do you? We are back next week on the Prestige TV pod. But Joe's gonna be on with Rob Mahoney doing deep dives. When does severance end?

[Chris Ryan]

A couple weeks.

[Mallory Rubin]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

I don't want it to be over.

[Chris Ryan]

I know.

[Mallory Rubin]

A plus season. A, A, A, A plus.

[Andy Greenwald]

Really good.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Mallory Rubin]

Do you believe that it's Apple's biggest show ever?

[Chris Ryan]

Yes, absolutely.

[Mallory Rubin]

I don't know. How is it bigger than Ted Lasso? That show was, like, a phenomenon.

[Chris Ryan]

Everyone I know is watching. Except for you, the only person on the planet that I know who's not watching.

[Mallory Rubin]

How about this? I'll watch it when you watch the Sopranos.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay? Three mentions this episode.

[Chris Ryan]

Deal. I told you I'll watch the Sopranos as soon as you let me do a show about it.

[Mallory Rubin]

All right. Good to see you both.

[Chris Ryan]

Good to see you.