The Promised Podcast: "Bibi’s Big Adventure" Edition

Date: June 19, 2025
Host: TLV1 Studios – Noah Efron & Alison Kaplan Sommer

Main Theme:

An Inside Look at Israeli Resilience and Debate Amid Wars With Iran and Gaza

The episode delves into two major narratives:

1. How the recent war with Iran reframes Israel’s protracted conflict in Gaza, interrogating whether these are isolated wars or one grand design orchestrated by Prime Minister Netanyahu ("Bibi’s Big Adventure").
2. The evolving relationship of Diaspora Jews—especially American Jews—with Zionism, through the lens of a powerful essay questioning their continued identification with the ideology.

Personal reflections and cultural touchstones punctuate these political explorations, especially regarding Israeli society’s ability to find warmth, humor, and debate—even in times of acute crisis.

Key Segments and Discussion Points

I. Life in Tel Aviv Under Fire

Timestamps: 00:00 – 06:50

• Setting the Scene:
  • Day 622 of 53 Israeli hostages in Gaza.
  • Tel Aviv residents face Iranian missile threats with characteristic humor and resilience.
  • An IRGC warning for civilians to evacuate Tel Aviv is met (for Noah) with a They Might Be Giants song stuck in his head—symbolizing both the absurdity and grit of local mentality.

“If the official slogan of the place is the City That Never Sleeps, surely our unofficial slogan, evidenced a million times a day… is Brother, you are not the boss of me.”
— Noah Efron [01:50]

• Personal Accounts:
  • Alison, once hunkered in the suburbs, moves into central Tel Aviv—just blocks from the IDF headquarters and near a building hit by a rocket.
  • Alison recounts dodging disaster thanks to her husband’s “prescience” in avoiding the 29th floor apartment that was later struck.
  • Noah recounts being offered a chair in the bomb shelter by a young neighbor, a humorous but sobering acknowledgment of aging and community care.
  • The hosts prepare to tackle two topics “so grand you may find yourself fighting an impulse to salute or to curtsy.”

II. The Place of Persian Jews and Iranian-Israeli Ties

Timestamps: 06:50 – 37:24

• Maureen Nehedar’s Musical and Cultural Journey:

  • Noah recounts attending a transcendent concert by Persian-Israeli singer Maureen Nehedar.
  • Nehedar’s life story: born in Iran, emigrated twice (as a child and again as an adult), navigates longing and cultural synthesis between Iran and Israel.
  • Her music embodies this complexity—combining Persian folk, Jewish liturgy, and personal nostalgia.
  • The emotional resonance at her concerts is palpable: older audience members sing along and dance, demonstrating the unforgotten cultural ties of Iranian Jews.
  • Quote:

    “These people, they never really left these songs behind. But at the same time, for more than 40 years, it hasn’t really been possible… to visit the place where they were born.”
    — Noah Efron [15:00]

• Historical Complexity – Jews in Iran:

  • The narrative disrupts the “lachrymose view” of Jewish history (ie, unbroken suffering)—the experience of Iranian Jews included thriving periods and unique political engagement.
  • Mini-biographies show a deep, living connection to Iran—far from simple exile:
    • Pinchas, the Jewish Iranian communist and committed ping-pong player, symbolizes vibrant Jewish participation in Iranian radical politics in the mid-20th century.
    • Abie Nathan’s transformation from pilot in Israel’s founding war to tireless peace activist, culminating in his famed “Voice of Peace” radio ship.
    • Contemporary activist Orly Noy: stories of religious coexistence in Iran, and her life's work, translating Iranian literature into Hebrew to humanize “the enemy.”
  • Notable Moment/Quote:

    “What all these people know that I could not know without them is that this moment… is not some inevitable result of some inevitable currents of history… but rather this moment… is a break. It is an anomaly.”
    — Noah Efron [32:48]

  • Final Poignant Note:
    • Orly Noy’s translation of a poem by Ahmad Shamlou, “Bright Horizon,” offers a vision of eventual peace and human connection transcending locked doors, bombs, and exile.

III. Discussion 1 — Bibi’s Big Adventure:

Timestamps: 37:24 – 61:35

Thesis:

Did Netanyahu delay the end of the Gaza war—as many suspected for domestic political survival—or to create diplomatic conditions for a historic attack on Iran’s nuclear program? Are all these conflicts one grand design?

• Context and Background:

  • Israel bombed parts of Iran’s nuclear infrastructure.
  • This possibly reframes 622 days of the Gaza war; perhaps Netanyahu’s longstanding strategic vision was always Iran-centric, with Gaza and Lebanon “steps” along the way.
  • Historical parallel: Israel’s leaders (Sharon, Olmert, Netanyahu) have all considered attacking Iran, but Netanyahu was most persistent.

• Alison’s Position:

  • Netanyahu’s decision not to end the Gaza war was, above all, about domestic political survival (coalition politics), not long-term strategic gain.
  • Attacking Iran required aligning with the US. Trump’s newfound indifference or support enabled the recent action.
  • The crucial “green light” was the defeat of Hezbollah (removing the threat of massive missile retaliation on Israel) more than any plan hatched since October 7.
  • Quote:

    “I don’t think that… there was (a) grand plan, let’s keep this war going in order so we can attack Iran. I think that things fell into place.”
    — Alison Kaplan Sommer [53:17]

• Noah’s Analysis:

  • Suggests a perverse strategic logic: perhaps Netanyahu was right that “the world’s full-throated opposition,” ironically, gave Israel new diplomatic space to attack Iran.
  • Netanyahu’s “brilliant reactivity” (not pure Machiavellian design) may have led him to seize the moment as it unfolded.
  • Memorable Quote:

    “[Netanyahu is] one of the great opportunists that I’ve ever seen on this stage of history… as soon as situations develop… he finds a way quickly to take advantage of them.”
    — Noah Efron [55:25]

• Debate over Legacy and Morality:

  • Alison: Netanyahu’s lasting image may be as “the guy who saved Israel” from existential nuclear threat—even if his personal popularity and record are otherwise tarnished.
  • Both hosts worry about the profound human cost (Palestinian and Israeli lives), and Netanyahu’s striking inability to express empathy:

    “[Netanyahu] comes out triumphantly about our achievements in Iran and doesn’t mention the 23 of his citizens who have died… any acknowledgment of the tragedy and human loss of his achievements can’t even be acknowledged or admitted, and he can’t even comfort people.”
    — Alison Kaplan Sommer [59:38]

IV. Discussion 2 — Goodbye to All That: Zionism in Crisis

Timestamps: 62:46 – 82:42

Prompt:

Journalist Isaac Saul’s viral essay, "I Think I’m Leaving Zionism—or Zionism Is Leaving Me," articulates the growing estrangement of young Diaspora Jews from identification with Israel and Zionism.

• Summary of Saul’s Argument:

  • Once a loving, reform Jew and committed Zionist (via birthright, yeshiva, Israel travels), he is now shattered by Gaza’s devastation:
    • 100,000 Gazans dead, Israel accused of genocide, hostages still captive, right-wing “ethnostate” values over universalist humanism.
    • “My desires for what I want Zionism to be are distinct from what Zionism is… I may just not be a Zionist at all.”

• Alison’s Response:

  • Entirely understandable for American Jews steeped in universalist values to now reject Zionist particularism/ethnonationalism.
  • For Israelis, “Zionism” is less a live ideology than a descriptive fact—living in the real Israel differs fundamentally from Diaspora debates.
  • “Israel as shelter” carries little resonance for those who have never “needed” it.

• Noah’s Reflection:

  • Moved by Saul’s sincerity, but sees a “superficial” vision of Zionism in the critique—it neglects the ongoing, living Jewish culture (Shabbat, Hebrew, poetry, music) thriving in Israel.
  • American Jews are seeing Israel through the lens of state and army, but miss the powerful cultural revolution—Zionism as more than national self-defense.
  • Laments: “If we lose this guy, then it’s a sign that something is terribly, terribly wrong and we have a lot to worry about, about our future.” [76:58]

• Both Recognize:

  • The experience of Israel “from afar” is deeply flattening—Americans see images of destruction, not the lived nuances, solidarity, and “messy humanity” of the place.
  • Alison: For Diaspora Jews, Zionism as ideology becomes abstract if you've already chosen life outside Israel.

V. Israeli Resilience, Daily Life, and the Shelters

Timestamps: 84:22–109:58

• Daily Routines Under Threat:

  • Descriptions of bomb shelter culture—neighbors of all ages, backgrounds, and pets sharing snacks and books; quiet humor and make-shift “camp.”
  • “In my go bag…there are Snyder’s Sourdough, popcorn, chocolate bars, toilet paper, and a book light. And I went back and forth about what books to bring.”
    — Noah [93:54]

• Moments of Community and Solidarity:

  • Alison: Kids play in playgrounds in the morning, window-washers—all life, even a kind of neighborly luxury, continues amid chaos.
  • Israel excels in informal, mutual aid: after rocket attacks, crowds of volunteers rush to help.
  • “The project of washing the windows in the building continues… we’ve got these guys, like, hanging from the sides of the windows by cables. I don’t know what’s going to happen if there’s an alert…”
    — Alison Kaplan Sommer [87:21]

• Reflections on “Resilience” and Numbness:

  • Israelis habituate quickly—are they resilient or numb? Is the normalization of war dangerous to the soul?
  • How to stay sensitive to “the other,” especially suffering Gazans and vulnerable Israelis who can’t reach shelters?
  • “Are we numbing ourselves out? Is it a good thing that we’re managing so well… or are we just becoming, I don’t know, robotic, inhuman?”
    — Alison Kaplan Sommer [107:01]

Notable Quotes

• Alison (on Israeli spirit):
  “I have to say, it’s extremely moving and encouraging to see. Israelis, when the chips are down, when the situation is really bad – wow, they are really out there and they’re really there for each other.” [87:31]

• Noah (on the lived complexity):
  “It seems to me possible that… we will someday… look at the miserable war in Gaza the way people now look at the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand—as the thing that brought about the real thing that matters.” [57:02]

• Alison (on Netanyahu’s grand calculus):
  “What puts me off is…when it’s his advantage versus the country’s advantage, in my opinion, he always defaults to his own advantage.” [56:00]

• Noah (on loss and empathy):
  “Maybe one of the things that we agree about that’s so grating and ultimately just insufferable about our Prime Minister is that it seems to come so easily to him to ignore the suffering of people here now.” [60:02]

Timestamps for Major Segments

| Segment | Start | End | |--------------------------------------------|----------|----------| | Introduction, Current War Setting | 00:00 | 06:50 | | Persian Jews, Maureen Nehedar Concert | 06:50 | 37:24 | | Bibi’s Big Adventure & Iran-Gaza War Link | 37:24 | 61:35 | | Goodbye to All That / Crisis of Zionism | 62:46 | 82:42 | | Tel Aviv/Shelter Life, Community/Resilience| 84:22 | 109:58 |

Tone and Language

• Voice is warm, reflective, nuanced, personal, and honest.
• Mixing humor and philosophy, Noah and Alison challenge each other's views candidly, maintaining respect and camaraderie.
• The episode retains TLV1’s characteristic blend of “heart and blood boil”—affection for Israel’s messiness, alongside keen critique.

Conclusion

This episode demonstrates the “inside view” at its best: Israeli life is shown as full of contradiction—hope and horror, resilience and numbness, universalism and tribalism. As Israel faces existential threats, its own self-understanding (and the bonds with world Jewry) are under profound strain. Yet, even in the bomb shelters—literal and figurative—the conversation is alive, questioning, and, against all odds, occasionally joyful.