B (2:56)

You know they can't quit you, Brett.

A (2:58)

There were some of you have remained even. We've got some new people. It's crazy. It's hard to believe, but yeah, we're here. This. As you listen to this, this is the last Tuesday in 2025, which is really difficult to believe. I mean, I guess the biggest of it for me this year is I did have another child, so that's a pretty big deal. That's a pretty big deal. And now she's so big, it's crazy.

B (3:25)

She's not just so big. So I just. So I just delivered a bunch of clothes from Britney for her, but they're like 18 month clothes. I know.

A (3:33)

She's huge.

B (3:34)

I'm like, you're so big. I mean, I'm not gonna lie. Brittany's kind of still in 18 month clothes, so they're kind of sharing clothes now.

A (3:40)

Maybe she'll be her athlete. She's their athlete.

B (3:43)

Well, I mean, she's a good. She's like standing and walking and everything, which is pretty impressive.

A (3:47)

Yeah. So that was a big deal for me. But yeah, a lot of life changes this year. But obviously the most important thing were the episodes we recorded and released. And we were always excited to do these episodes. I hope you guys enjoy them. I always like talking about the year. I like going through the stats. I think the stats are fun. So hopefully you guys enjoy that as well. Well, the way we always start these off and I. I think there's no reason not do it the same way is our three. Can we say three cases that we covered? Yeah, three cases that we covered that were our favorites. Now, as Alice pointed out earlier, we covered a lot fewer cases this year than normally because half the year was West Memphis Three. I mean, it's a good 24 episodes.

B (4:30)

Specific episodes. Because West Memphis Three kind of like took on a life of its own. So there were kind of standalone episodes within it.

A (4:37)

Well, that's true.

B (4:38)

Yeah. Like for example, with Julia Crowley and Justice Scott Morgan. Exactly. And then. So I think we can work with this.

A (4:46)

Yeah. So do you want me to start or do you want to start?

B (4:48)

Let's go back and forth.

A (4:49)

Okay, we'll go back and forth. Okay. So this is in no particular order of my. My three. I will say this. So obviously 2025 is the year of West Memphis three. It just is. I mean, we spent a lot of time on it. It was sort of a. My Everest, My Roman Empire. It was a case I always wanted to cover. One of the reasons I want to do a podcast to cover that case. We Suck the Marrow out of the West Memphis three case. Had a lot of great episodes, like Alice said. You know, I thought The. The interview with Terry Hobbs was really interesting. Like you said, Julia is always great to have body bags was great. Just walking through the timeline, theories, all the various things, lots of fun. But I'm not going to say West Memphis three. I'm. West Memphis three is sort of its own thing. So I'm going to put it aside for my top three cases that we covered. There's West Memphis three and everything else. But I will say this despite the fact that West Memphis 3 really dominated the year, as I was going back through the episodes, we covered some really cool cases. I mean, honestly, some of our best cases, I think, were this year. So it was kind of difficult. But I'm going to start with, you know, how much I love mountains and how much I love mysteries on mountains. And when Aconcagua, when we first sat down to do that, I was like, oh, I don't know, is this really, you know, some people went up a mountain, a couple of them died. I mean, this happens all the time. But then I think, as those of you who listen to this couple episodes, fascinating story. Just an incredibly fascinating story. If you didn't listen to it, I highly recommend it. I don't know if we'll ever get any more truth in that case than we did in the Dyatlov Pass case, but just a really fascinating mystery, a moment in time, sort of the historical perspective, everything that's going on, you know, it happens. Right. For a coup, which is part of the problem, and a case that honestly, were not for great reporting by the New York Times, probably most people never would have even heard of. So really glad we covered that case. Really enjoyed that one. That one's definitely in my top three.

B (6:51)

That was an awesome one. I kind of forgot about it until you said that. That took so many twists and turns. As we were researching, I was like, no, no, no. I was ping ponging back and forth. Okay. Also in no particular order, this was a little bit sentimental, too. I loved the Lake Ocone murders and here's why. We did it on our podcast, but we actually did it. We did one episode with. Not on our own podcast, but on Zone 7 with Mac Cheryl McCollum, who is one of the most incredible investigators and podcasters and TV hosts, all the things out there, mostly because she just has taken us under her wing. But I did that episode, I think the week I was about to have a baby, literally, because I was like, this is my last recordings. One of the last recordings. And we couldn't. Because scheduling, we couldn't fit it in until that week. And I don't think Mac knew that I was having a baby. So I was kind of like, I may or may not make this recording, but I think my brain was in, like, hyper mode on everything, right? Like, I was like, deep cleaning my house. I was, like, trying to make a bunch of freezer meals. And my brain was working in a way differently than when we did the episode, which was after Allison was born. And not that my thinking changed about it, but in listening to the way I analyzed the two cases, it was crazy for me because they were a couple. They were maybe a month apart. It wasn't that long. But the way my brain thought in those two different instances fascinated me because I got to see in real time the same case. And truthfully, I did not remember anything I said before I gave birth at all. I did not remember what I said. And it wasn't that. It's so different, and you guys may not even be able to tell, but I could tell how my brain works differently. And as a, like, I don't know, a human interest study matter, I found it really fascinating how my brain works in different circumstances. And also shows you that depending on where the investigators are, what the environment is, like, what other cases they're working on or what kind of situation, how much pressure they're getting from the media, how much pressure they're getting from life, things can actually change how an investigation is run. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. It's just a reality, because this is not a science, it's an art. And it's done by humans. And we want it to be done by humans. Like, if AI could solve crimes, we'd already been be doing that. But obviously they can't always solve crimes. We can use DNA and whatnot, but the human element matters because we're dealing with humans. And so I say that because it kind of broadened my own view, how my own thinking can change so drastically when I was, like, straddling two major life events or one major life event, but being, you know, before it and then being right after it. And it gave me new perspective into situations I may not fully understand when I'm studying a case and like, why the heck did that prosecutor do that? Or why did the defense attorney do that? Or why did the investigator do that? So that was a much longer answer than you bargained for, but it was interesting to me.

A (9:48)

No, and I. But I think that's a great point, and I think it speaks to something we talk about a lot. I Mean, you know, people get so worked up over these cases, as we know. You know, you come out the wrong way, quote, unquote, wrong way, and you have people who wish you were dead. Right? But the reality of the situation is they're all mysteries for a reason. Or the ones that are mysteries are mysteries for a reason, because you have limited data that's available to look at. And if it added up to an easy answer, number one, AI could do it. But also could just anybody, we would all know, right? I mean, and I feel like. Well, I mean, there are cases where obviously we all. We do know, like, there may be little mysteries, but we. We all agree on what happened, generally speaking. And I think those are boring. Some of you guys love those. But I mean, like the Robert Pickton case, there's no. There's no real debate, right? But with these other ones, so much of it is the lens that you're looking through and maybe the mood you're in that day. I mean, even for us, right? And I really experienced this a lot in the West Memphis three thing. I mean, I would go back and forth on what I thought. I think you did too. Think right up until the end, just because there wasn't enough there. Usually I would say nine times out of 10, 99 times out of 100, I feel like there's enough evidence to come to a pretty good idea might end up being wrong, but a pretty good idea. That one was just different. But I think that's important to remember. It is a sort of lesson for all of us. When you're listening to these cases, don't get so invested in a theory or a solution or a suspect, because you don't even know what sort of unconscious things could be affecting the way you look at it. So that is an interesting case study, looking at the case before you had the child and then after they had.

B (11:33)

The child with, like, the stressors. Right? There were the stressors pre and post and then, like sleep deprivation and like, you know, all the things that come with it, which really, I think, mirror real life, too, when you have other things. It may not be a baby, but it could be, you know, the media is all over you, hounding you, that sort of thing.

A (11:52)

Yeah. So that's fascinating. Okay, That's a great case, too. That's the thing I'm telling you.

B (11:57)

We covered so many really fascinating case. Another case that, like, could be solved, you know.

A (12:03)

So I'll say my second one that I really enjoyed covering. It's funny, I think all of my top three Cases are cases that I was like, yeah, we'll do that one. Not thinking that I would both enjoy it as much as I did, but also feel like maybe we reached some sort of conclusion. And that's the Karen Silkwood case. I mean, I felt like on the Karen Selkwood case, by the time we finished, we knew what had happened, you know, and. And I can't prove it. No one ever will be able to prove it. But I just felt like sitting down and really looking at the FBI files and reading a lot of the information and listening to some of the podcasts on it. It just, it became so obvious to me what was going on there. And so I enjoyed covering that. A lot of different reasons. I mean, the historical aspect, the mystery of it, telling her story, trying to get some sort of truth. So that, honestly is one of the top cases we've done on the podcast, as far as I'm concerned. Another one that was Pre west when iii. So I don't know if it got kind of lost in the shuffle, but I really, I really enjoyed that one.

B (13:16)

That was an awesome case because obviously I didn't follow that case as closely as you in the sense that I didn't know how much was already spoken about it out in the true crime world, I suppose. So I came in completely neutral in the sense that I didn't know that everyone was like, oh, it's this big conspiracy. So the first time I read through everything, I was like, huh, she was having a really rough time. She just got divorced, was no longer with her children. She had been a stay at home mom. Like a lot of this is seeming like, not as mysterious as it seems to be. And then when you said it, I was like, oh, thank goodness I'm not missing something big. But not realizing that that wasn't really the obvious theory circulating out there.

A (14:02)

But in another instance where we're terrible co hosts, you know, if this were a professional operation, we would have like a pre show and we'd sit down and we'd talk about the case and what we're each gonna say and what our outcome's gonna be.

B (14:16)

We do none of that.

A (14:17)

So it was all buttoned up and consistent. It's just a good thing. We think the same way.

B (14:22)

Exactly. Speaking of not buttoned up, okay, I'm gonna cheat a little bit. Cause it's gonna be. It falls into one of my favorite episodes, but it might not be a favorite case. I. And now I'm gonna get all sentimental on you. You described me as grateful, and I Am grateful. Okay. One of my favorite episodes of this year was A Little Less Conversation, West Memphis three. Those of you who do not know what I'm talking about, go listen to it or don't. You'll get really mad at us because talk about not having any sort of notes, not going off an outline, not talking ahead of time, what we are going to talk about. And it was like at its core, even five years later, you know how you like read the tabloids and they pretend to be friends and all these things people have asked, are you really friends with Brett? I think all you have to do is listen to that episode and you'll know that everything you hear here is incredibly genuine and that I truly am so glad I get to do this with my best friend. And we have fun doing it. The reason we're able to do this for five years is because of that episode. That was no notes, that was no pre show yet we talked forever and had a great time. And the sentimental part, if that wasn't already sentimental enough, that gave birth to After Dark.

A (15:35)

That's true.

B (15:36)

Which actually is so fun to do because all we do all day is like clean diaper, argue motions to suppress, get yelled by judges, have filing deadlines, and get yelled some more by judges. And that one, we get to just kind of have fun. And although we have a lot of fun doing this podcast there, you know, you're like, it's really important stuff. You want to get it right. And kind of letting down our hair and just being able to talk about what is on our mind is really fun. And you guys listen, which is even crazier.

A (16:08)

So that episode was awesome and it was so fun and it was so easy is the thing. I mean, there's a reason we did After Dark afterwards because like, wow, this is easy because we did. We just went in and just started talking. Once again, we knew what we're going to do, but we no pre planning whatsoever.

B (16:24)

Not even a little.

A (16:24)

And we got to like 40 something minutes.

B (16:26)

It was so many. And we only cut it off because I think we did it after another episode. So it was really late.

A (16:32)

That's right, we did do that because we recorded a real episode and then immediately.

B (16:36)

And then went off live and then started recording. And I think both of our spouses were like, where are you?

A (16:42)

Yeah, so that one was cool. And so Spotify. One of the cool things about Spotify. I've actually started listening to everything on Spotify now. Cause I want my wrapped to be more accurate now. After it called me a 75 year old person. So.

B (16:54)

And by the way, I think. Sorry if we haven't done this. Is our Patreon linked with Spotify? Because I think we're supposed to do that. Okay, it is.

A (17:02)

If you listen. You can listen to our Patreon on Spotify.

B (17:05)

Good. Someone was asking me, I was like, I think it is.

A (17:07)

But so, yeah, so yeah, you can do that. So you can comment on episodes on Spotify which you can't do on most other things.

B (17:14)

Platforms.

A (17:15)

Right. And then it tells you at the end of the year what your most commented on episode was. And it was a little less conversation.

B (17:24)

Ironically. Ironically. It really spurred some conversation.

A (17:28)

Conversation. A lot of those comments I think were angry comments.

B (17:31)

They were. But you know what? You know, dogs don't bark at parked cars. That's all I gotta say. We're just, we're a couple of Ferraris over here.

A (17:39)

It's not telling how many listeners we lost who like, oh, they're Westminster. I'm into that. I'll listen to these guys. What? This is the most ridiculous podcast ever. I hate this podcast. People are terrible. But it's fine. You know, we don't do this to be successful.

B (17:52)

We really don't.

A (17:53)

It's a random, like it's just completely random. Okay, so she were all. You're all sensitive or sentimental. My, my last one is not sentimental, but I'm going to say it anyway. I mean, I wish I could tie this in. Maybe it's like sometimes Alice, you know, being on this journey with you, trusting each other as we combat the rapids of criticism and the unknown dangers that lie ahead. It reminds me of Glenn and Bessie Hyde, which was another one of my absolute favorite cases. We did in another case that I was like, oh yeah, this could be interesting. And then did it and just thought, wow, just so. I mean, honestly, you guys all know this by now. I just. Any case that has some sort of historical hook to it, I just love, I just love doing that stuff, like talking about these people in the 20s, like putting them in that world and describing what they're going through and how that affects the mystery itself and how the mystery develops because of the time period, the time frame. I just love that. And so that was a, you know, a lot of fun to do and just another great episode. There were no losers this year. I think there were a lot of winners. I'm going to go ahead. I, I got to have, I got. I got to say, I didn't put this in the top three, but I really enjoyed Polybius So that was going.

B (19:23)

To be my number three. But you still. I knew you were going to as well. Yeah. I loved it because I'd never heard of it before. I'd never heard of it before. And it blew my mind until I thought about the corollary to where we are in today's times. This is kind of like Slender man, except that was a horrific murder that came from it. But the idea of Slender man, how it came about, that it was a purely fictional creation and it was meant to be a fictional creation, was. I see a lot of similarities.

A (19:52)

Another awesome case.

B (19:52)

We covered another awesome case. But that one was really sad because obviously, you know the circumstances. But the Slender man, like, character is very much like Polybius. And I thought that was fascinating because it shows so much about human nature and the suspension of belief and what we want to believe. And, like, it kind of goes to the core of what is reality. And who says, is reality always what you can see, touch and smell in here? Not necessarily. And does that make it less real? I think yes. But then having to describe why that is the case when there are effects of it. So Slenderman, not a real person, but created a real situation. So does that make Slender man less or more real? I think it has these, like, really metaphysical questions that are interesting to think about because you can carry it over to lots of different instances that we see not just in true crime, but, like, in the world before us.

A (20:45)

We timed Slender man, right? Didn't we? I've been wanting to do that case for years, but definitely picked the right year to do it.

B (20:52)

Yeah. It was like the week we did it that she went on her little escapade. But same with Asia Degree. That was a Brett. What was that?

A (21:02)

So I got to do Slender Brett last year.

B (21:05)

That was horrible. That was terrifying. Also, you probably won an award for wearing the costume the entire time. Is disgusting. You really have to get rid of that. That's just, like. That's really gross. That's. It's just.

A (21:18)

Yeah, no, I mean, that was a lot of fun. And the Wendigo story was great.

B (21:24)

That was terrifying. I did not enjoy it because it was scary, but I know what you mean. And Wendy goes kind of like Slender man and Polybius as well. Like, when the effects are real.

A (21:33)

That's a good point.

B (21:34)

Is reality anymore, right? Yeah, I. I thought those were fascinating cases. I did not love our super murdery ones. We had, like, Robert Pickton super murdery.

A (21:48)

Our super murdery ones? Yeah. Like Westminster three.

B (21:51)

Super murdery.

A (21:53)

Robert Pickton that was a lot.

B (21:55)

That was a lot.

A (21:56)

I mean, we did some very disturbing cases because we did Robert Pickton, which was incredibly disturbing.

B (22:05)

So disturbing.

A (22:06)

And then our first. I can't remember the name of the guy right now, but our first Halloween case. Oh, Lord. Oh, how's the first case? That is the first case we've ever self censored.

B (22:18)

That's true. Because I read it and I was.

A (22:20)

Like, we can't lie to that loud, extreme degree. I mean, there. There are occasions where we'll say something like we're not gonna say exactly what happened when we know, but that, like half episodes.

B (22:29)

About like 30%. 30% of what was really. Because we couldn't describe it. Not because we thought we would be censored, because we would scar you forever.

A (22:38)

Oh, yeah. Just terrible.

B (22:39)

You don't want to put that. That.

A (22:41)

Just a window into human depravity.

B (22:44)

Yeah.

A (22:46)

But, yeah, I don't know. I mean, you know, one of the, I guess, sadder cases we did in. In some ways is Pablo Velez. You know, innocence case with someone who's actually innocent. Had an opportunity in parole. Parole was denied, which sucks, because people get parole all the time. They don't deserve it. You know, I was just. I was looking at a. Well, you. You may. You probably looked at the outline, too. We're doing an interview, talking about a case tomorrow. And there was. The suspect who did it was someone who had committed a horrific crime and got parole after four years and immediately went back to doing all these. And it's like that guy got out on parole. But Pablo has been in prison now for 25 years. I mean, how long he's been in and can't get parole even though he didn't do it. It's just frustrating. But I'm glad we did that case. I mean, that was another sort of example of a case we did that I thought was great. And I don't know, I mean, we got a lot to live up to in 2026. I think we kind of.

B (23:54)

And it was funny because we felt like, I think maybe, you know, like, Little Engine who could. West Memphis 3 was taking so long. We were like. Every other episode we do has to be, like, out of the park.

A (24:06)

Yeah.

B (24:07)

We worked really hard this year, and we added two babies to our families. I know. Why do we always do this episode? I don't know. Because I'm a little bit tired. You know, I told. I mean, I told this on a previous episode, but it's worth telling again because it just shows how exhausted we were this year we shot two documentaries. Both were this year, right?

A (24:23)

That's true.

B (24:24)

Because 2020 was last year. And so we shot two which both involved travel and so being away. That's right.

A (24:32)

Because we both have second documentary should.

B (24:34)

Be coming out very soon, I think January or something. But it was the. The Delphi, the Hulu three part series, I guess. I was like, baby was six months old. So I was driving to recording and I was like, let me listen to our update. And I was listening to. I was like, I don't remember saying any of these things. And I was like, this must be years ago because we did the Delphi case so long ago. So I was like, must have been a long time ago. And then at the end of it I was like, yeah, so thanks for all your well wish for the baby. And I was like, Brittany. And then I realized we had recorded it three months ago and I couldn't remember a single thing. Homes.com knows when it comes to home shopping, it's never just about the house or condo. It's about the home. And what makes a home is more than just the house or property. It's the location and neighborhood. If you have kids, it's also schools, nearby, parks and transportation options. That's why homes.com goes above and beyond to bring home shoppers the in depth information they need to find the right home.

A (25:34)

And when I say in depth, I'm talking deep. Each listing features comprehensive information about the neighborhood, complete with a video guide. They also have details about local schools with test scores, state rankings and student to teacher ratio. They even have an agent directory with the sales history of each agent. So when it comes to finding a home, not just a house, this is everything you need to know all in one place. Homes.com We've done your homework. The McDonald's snack wrap is back. You brought it back. Ranch snack wrap, Spicy snack wrap. You broke the Internet for a snack snack wrap is back? Time no longer really means anything.

B (26:24)

Really doesn't to me.

A (26:26)

It's like it just, it moves in these, these sort of weird, I don't know, ebbs and flow, concentric circles.

B (26:33)

We just keep going back and forth.

A (26:35)

I can't remember when things happen, they just all run together, you know, it could have happened this year, could happen last year. It's like looking back at the episodes, we covered some of them. I was like, we did that this year. Yeah, like the Lake of Coney Murders. When I saw that, I was like, wow. Yeah, I forgot we did that.

B (26:51)

And the only reason I remember it is. I remember recording with Mac the week before I went to have a baby, and then we recorded that soon after, because you're like, you already know this case. And I was like, I'll remember anything, right?

A (27:03)

So we were probably entirely inconsistent when we did that.

B (27:06)

I was.

A (27:08)

So one part people always enjoy, which we definitely want to do, is. Well, before any of this, I do want to say we. We did one other thing this year, basically, this year that I want to highlight in case you guys have missed it, which is our substack, the True Crime Times. If you're not following that, you should definitely check it out. Most of these stuff is free, and in fact, so I say we do it in reality. Jason Blair is the editor of the True Crime Times, so we just sort of, like, help out. And he's gotten people from across True Crime, all sorts of really interesting people who've done articles for it, Victims, victims advocates, true crime people. I mean, all sorts of amazing stuff. We actually started it because we wrote a Karen Reed op ed that was too hot. Nobody would publish it. They were all afraid. They're all scared. Like, we. We fear. No. We fear. No, man. You know, you can't. You want to sue us, Bring it, right? But I'll just go ahead and tell you. Mainstream media, terrified of the lawsuit, right? So, like, they were like, can we really say she's guilty?

B (28:11)

And it's like, yes, yes, you can.

A (28:13)

You can. But they didn't want to do it, and so we had to, like, we basically, like, fine, we'll just start our own substack. So we started substack, where we could publish anything we want and have a lot of other people. We just published something about which I thought was interesting. I think you guys would enjoy as well. My experiment, my Twitter experiment, to see just how many. If I could get to 5 million interactions, which is what you need to be monetized just by mentioning Karen Reed's name. Like, that was it. She doesn't want to mention her name. You know, every tweet's gonna have her name in it. And it was crazy. And if you read it, this charts and everything insane. And I think a real insight into what drives a lot of the coverage in these cases. Some of the problems with true crime, but also some possibility as well. So had a lot of fun doing that. And I'll say this. If you're out there in the world and you have an interest in true crime or you have something you want to write about, or you're somebody who has interesting story to tell. Reach out, because we're always looking to highlight that stuff at the substack. I mean, it's a lot of fun, so you guys should get involved.

B (29:18)

Also shows how, like, this podcast has taken us places we never imagined when we started. Not only all these podcasts, all these, like, guests on other people's shows, shooting documentaries, getting to meet you guys, you know, year after year, and getting to know you year after year at CrimeCon. But now, like, a substack. And who knows what next year will bring?

A (29:38)

Who knows?

B (29:38)

Who knows?

A (29:39)

The detectives are in the chat. We met them. They have a great podcast if you haven't listened to it. We did an episode on Legal Briefs you should check out. But, you know, they stole our name. But that's fine. They are detectives. We are prosecutors, so it makes sense.

B (29:53)

It is descriptive.

A (29:54)

They're prosecuted.

B (29:55)

Truth is a defense, Brett. Truth is a defense.

A (29:57)

Yeah, so they're awesome. You should check them out. But anyways, demographics do demographics.

B (30:04)

Because it shifts a little bit each time it does.

A (30:07)

So, you know, people always ask. They always ask me, is it true that most of people who listen to True crime are women? And I'll say this about our podcast. I think we have a more diverse listening base than most, but we still are very much where you would expect us to be. So 79.7% of our listeners are women.

B (30:32)

Woo go, women.

A (30:33)

Woo go, women. And then 16.6% are male. And the rest of you don't want to identify what you are.

B (30:40)

So that actually probably is a more diverse breakdown. If you've been watching this season of Only Murders in the Building, which I love every season. The season was no exception. I loved it. They have this, like, one bit where there's, like, a network that they sign on to and they're walking down the halls, and there's all these different podcasts, and it's like these. So there's just, like, people, you know, recording in these, like, glass offices, basically, and they're all having a lot of fun. And they walk by. Those are two drunk. It's just, like, two girls, and they're, like, passed out with wine glasses, and they're, like, on the table. They're like, will you be more like the two drunk bitches?

A (31:17)

Yes. Yes. We should be more like the two drunk bitches.

B (31:21)

That's what I'm saying is if we were, I think that percentage would shift a little. So we're just not doing enough.

A (31:26)

So do you want to guess? So 35% of our listeners come from A certain age bracket.

B (31:35)

Okay, Yes. I don't know what it is, but I think I fall within the bracket. Okay, well, I'm going to guess 25 to 40.

A (31:43)

I mean, it's not that wide.

B (31:45)

Okay.

A (31:45)

They're narrow.

B (31:46)

Okay, 35 to 40.

A (31:48)

35 to 44. You nailed it.

B (31:51)

I really, I thought it would be like, because a lot of the people who interact with us because we talk about like Umbop, Hanson and like all these things and, you know, quicksand and the 90s, I feel like we are the same age as a lot of our listeners because they get all of our references. Whereas when I talk to friends who are like a little younger than me, they don't get my references at all.

A (32:13)

So that's true.

B (32:14)

We found each other. Us.

A (32:16)

Yeah.

B (32:16)

I wouldn't call us middle age. We're advanced youth.

A (32:20)

There you go. Advanced youth. I like that. 35% of you are 35 to 44. 22% of you are 28 to 34. Let's see, I'm. I'm going. I'm going down in age.

B (32:32)

And then I kind of. I kind of got it right, like with that 25 to 40.

A (32:36)

Let's see. 8% of you are 23 to 27. And that's actually. Yeah, the only bracket, 23 to 27 were more male listeners than female.

B (32:49)

I wonder if they're law students too, because that is like kind of the law student. And there are actually even numbers of men and women who are in law school. But I just wonder if maybe we're capturing that crowd.

A (33:01)

1.5% of your 18 to 22 and point 3% of you are under 18.

B (33:07)

Should you be listening, guys? Is this a little too murdery, you 12 year olds?

A (33:13)

We love going the other way. 45 to 59 is 26%. So that's actually the second biggest. Okay, 45 to 59. 60. 60 to 150, I guess that's big, big span. That's as old as you're allowed to live. According to the podcast demographics, 6.7%. And we have no listeners who are older than 150.

B (33:41)

So that's a. It's a weird, weird cut off.

A (33:44)

They picked, I guess, geographic location. Okay, you ready for this one?

B (33:49)

Okay, so we always been Texas heavy. We've always.

A (33:53)

Well, we're going to start with the countries and start with the countries. Okay, so first is easy.

B (33:58)

United States.

A (33:59)

Okay. What do you think the second largest one is?

B (34:03)

I'm gonna go with Australia.

A (34:05)

No, that is wrong. Australia is number four.

B (34:08)

Okay. Canada.

A (34:10)

No, usually Canada is number two. But I think the fact that Canada doesn't have automobiles yet and they're still riding around on horses is one of the reasons that the United Kingdom has overtaken Canada. And the United Kingdom is now the number two country ahead of Canada.

B (34:28)

So our Canadian friends haven't gone across the pond, and I really want to go across the pond. I love the United Kingdom.

A (34:34)

Canadian friends, you need to get on your horse. You need to ride into town and post something. Okay, guys, the local billboard about the prosecutor's radio show via Internet so that the people there can listen.

B (34:51)

So the reason. Brett, no one. No, not everyone understands your inside jokes. We have done a couple Canadian cases, and in one of the cases, we talked about the Mounties who ride horses, and we didn't say they exclusively rode horses in Canada, but I did make.

A (35:07)

A joke about how that's one of.

B (35:09)

The reasons.

A (35:11)

Because they have to ride horses everywhere.

B (35:13)

Brett makes jokes about everything all the time. That is who he is. He doesn't know how to live otherwise. But anyways, someone got very mad because they thought that we really thought Canadians, not just one.

A (35:22)

And look, this is not just a lot of.

B (35:24)

This is a test.

A (35:24)

This is why I love the Canadian people. I mean, you know, they really, together are like salt of the earth, just honest, straightforward, earnest people. And they're. If they hear somebody say that the Mounties all ride horses, they just assume they must really believe that. And so we got multiple people who were angry, and.

B (35:46)

But they were, like, Canadian angry. So they weren't very angry, because when, like, Americans or Australians get angry, you know, they get angry. They were, like, super angry, but really polite about.

A (35:57)

Confused. They were confused.

B (35:58)

They were confused, but they were very polite about it.

A (36:01)

So I just want everybody to know, I know that the Royal Canadian man in Police, despite their acronistic name, do not ride horses. I know that's just a parade thing. And they have cars and SUVs and helicopters and motorcycles and everything else. They're a modern police force. It was a joke.

B (36:21)

But sometimes.

A (36:23)

And they still ride horses sometimes. In fact, maybe they'd solve more cases if they rode horses. I mean, I've seen. I've seen Canada.

B (36:29)

A lot of wilderness where no automobile can go, but horses can get there.

A (36:34)

Horses. Anyways, the best.

B (36:35)

I had to explain your joke because not everyone understands your jokes. I'm sorry.

A (36:39)

You know, the thing is, like, if you've ever seen riot control, police will tell you this. Like, you'll see crowds, like, rocking police cars back and forth you know what? You don't see? People rocking horses. Horses are, like, terrifying. And the New Orleans cops talk about this a lot because when it's time for Mardi Gras to end, the mounted police, they start at the end of Bourbon street and they just start slowly moving down Bourbon street. And you don't. That horse gets up to you. Keep going. Horses are terrifying. There's a reason we still use horses in law enforcement.

B (37:13)

But okay, maybe Canada is just ahead of all of us. Canada.

A (37:17)

Exactly. Exactly.

B (37:17)

I love you, Canada.

A (37:19)

Oh, Canada.

B (37:20)

Oh, Canada. Okay, wait, so we have us, uk, Canada. We have Australia. And now one more.

A (37:26)

One more.

B (37:27)

Okay, let me think about this. A lot of pressure over here. Germany.

A (37:31)

Germany is number eight.

B (37:33)

Okay? So I'm like, wildly off. You know, we haven't gotten any of the Asian countries, which is too bad, because I would love for someone to invite us over so we can have, like, real Asian noodle soup. Because all I'm. All I have is what I make here. Not Germany. A European country.

A (37:48)

It is European.

B (37:49)

Okay. France.

A (37:51)

No, France is number 17. Spain is number 15. They speak English.

B (37:57)

Oh, who speaks English?

A (38:01)

There's a lot of people getting insulted all of a sudden.

B (38:03)

I'm sorry.

A (38:06)

A lot of people getting insulted.

B (38:07)

Now I'm. Now I can't.

A (38:09)

Independent nation, not part of the English speaking country you're thinking of.

B (38:14)

Now I'm drawing a blank because I put on the spot.

A (38:17)

Do you want me just to tell you.

B (38:18)

Ireland.

A (38:19)

Ireland.

B (38:20)

Okay. The itis.

A (38:21)

Emerald Isle. The Republic of Ireland up. The Republic.

B (38:26)

That's right. I knew this because we talked about. What's that show called?

A (38:30)

Dairy Girls.

B (38:31)

Dairy Girls.

A (38:32)

Great show.

B (38:33)

One of my favorite shows of the last year. I mean, it came out before last year, but I only watched it this year.

A (38:38)

I'll round out the rest of the countries that love us. New Zealand is number six. Sweden is number seven.

B (38:47)

Thank you, Sweden.

A (38:49)

There you go. Then Germany. Then Poland. Yeah, Norway. We're popular with the Vikings. Sweden and Norway. Then South Africa is number 11. The Netherlands. Finland, Brazil, Spain, Austria, France, Denmark, Italy, Belgium, India, Israel, Iceland, Argentina, Mexico. Which frankly, we're on the same continent. Mexico. Come on.

B (39:18)

I know, because Canada is number three.

A (39:20)

You know, exactly. Portugal, Switzerland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania. That's the top 30. And I just want to say, shout out to our one listener in Antigua and. And Barbuda. You rock. You invite us to do a live. We'll come to Antigua.

B (39:39)

How did they even hear about us?

A (39:41)

I don't know.

B (39:41)

Was it someone who was from the UK on vacation Antigua and Barbuda.

A (39:46)

No. 105 on the countries that listen to us. Literally the only country with only one listener. We have three listeners in Azerbaijan and only one listener in Antigua.

B (39:58)

That's pretty awesome. Also makes me feel lonely for them.

A (40:02)

I know they don't have anybody to talk to about our episodes.

B (40:05)

We. We need to step it up for them.

A (40:08)

You mentioned Asia. Let me see if I can find our first. Did I say an Asian country?

B (40:11)

I don't think so.

A (40:13)

Let's see if I can find an Asian.

B (40:15)

The language barrier may be a bit much.

A (40:16)

Japan is number 42.

B (40:19)

Okay, Japan. Get it on up there. Because I'd love to go to Japan.

A (40:22)

And I think China, like, censors us, so I'm sure we're not in China.

B (40:26)

Thailand. I'm sure they censored.

A (40:28)

Thailand is 64. Cambodia is 75. Shout out to the 24 people in Cambodia.

B (40:34)

24.

A (40:35)

Nepal, Vietnam, South Korea.

B (40:38)

You know what? Maybe more of our military friends who go abroad should bring us to the.

A (40:42)

Yeah, what's going on? South Korea. We should be Japan.

B (40:44)

Come on. Okinawa. That's a military base. Yeah.

A (40:48)

Okay, so that's countries. Now let's do some cities.

B (40:53)

All right. Last year was a lot of Texas.

A (40:55)

A lot of Texas. Okay, let's.

B (40:57)

I think, like, all the five big cities in Texas were in the top 10.

A (41:01)

Okay, here we go. Oh, okay.

B (41:04)

I'm a little nervous.

A (41:05)

It's loading up. It's loading up.

B (41:07)

A little nervous.

A (41:08)

Loading up. I mean, while it's loading, do you want to guess what the top city is?

B (41:12)

Okay, I'm gonna go with Houston or Dallas.

A (41:16)

Okay. It isn't either of those. Oh, this. This city has always been strong for us. I'm not entirely sure why, but it has always been right up there in the top cities.

B (41:29)

Okay. I think it's somewhere in the South East. Is that right? No. Oh, I said Portland because then we have a lot of listeners in Portland, and I didn't.

A (41:38)

Portland. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11. Portland is number 11.

B (41:44)

Not bad, not bad, not bad. Okay.

A (41:46)

Chicago, Chicago, Chicago.

B (41:48)

Chicago has always been so good to us.

A (41:51)

Always been good to us.

B (41:52)

And I don't know why, because we don't have particular ties. Like, we haven't been to Chicago.

A (41:56)

We've never even done an Illinois case.

B (41:58)

As far as we haven't done an Illinois case. I like Chicago.

A (42:01)

We did one out of Chicago, I think. Oh, we did the. The one about Ruthie.

B (42:06)

Oh, who lived in the high rise.

A (42:09)

Yeah, that one was out of Chicago through the mirror. Yeah, that was Candyman case.

B (42:14)

Yeah, that was.

A (42:15)

Maybe that's one of those ones too.

B (42:16)

I know.

A (42:16)

Okay, so Chicago's number one. Dallas is number two.

B (42:19)

Okay. Dallas.

A (42:20)

Dallas is right there. Okay.

B (42:23)

That may be my college friends.

A (42:25)

So then there are two southern cities.

B (42:29)

Okay. Atlanta.

A (42:30)

Atlanta is number four.

B (42:32)

All right, so you said Southern, not necessarily Texas. New. Orleans.

A (42:37)

No.

B (42:37)

Oh, New Orleans. Ouch. Mississippi has always been good to us too. Is Jackson on there? This is so interesting because it's not based on. It's based on pure numbers, right?

A (42:47)

This is pure numbers. Yeah.

B (42:49)

Rather than percentage.

A (42:51)

Right, yeah.

B (42:52)

So, like, bigger cities are gonna do it. Okay. Birmingham.

A (42:56)

You know, Birmingham's further down the list than I would have thought. It's like way down.

B (43:00)

Not Montgomery.

A (43:01)

No, not Montgomery.

B (43:03)

No. Nobody loves us. Nashville.

A (43:06)

Nashville is Charleston, surprisingly. Charlotte. Charlotte is number three.

B (43:13)

Charlotte has always been good to us too.

A (43:16)

Yep. Charlotte, North Carolina loves them. Some prosecutors. And then Charlotte is basically tied with number four, which is another southern city.

B (43:25)

Atlanta.

A (43:25)

Atlanta.

B (43:26)

Okay. And they are like, you can drive between the two. The carriage of this podcast from one city to the next.

A (43:33)

Any guesses for number five?

B (43:36)

I'm gonna go back to Texas. Houston.

A (43:38)

Yes. Houston is number five. And Houston. Houston is always sort of like ranged up and down, you know, in the top five. It's always been the top five, sort of.

B (43:47)

It's a huge city, so it's not really fair. You know, I feel like if only one, like 0.01% of that city listened, it'd still be really high.

A (43:54)

To round out the top 10. Denver, Colorado is next. Minneapolis, Minnesota, soon. That's all Sophie's doing. Minnesota, Indianapolis, Indiana, which could be Delphi related that, you know. Yeah. New York City. If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere.

B (44:17)

Wow. I mean, we haven't really made it there. They're not number one. But I see what you're saying.

A (44:21)

Let's see. Then Portland. So then New York's number 10, Portland. Then Washington. District of Columbia. Number 11. Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Los Angeles, California. Seattle, Washington. Phoenix, Arizona. San Antonio, Texas. Detroit, Michigan. That's Joe stewing. Brooklyn, New York, which I didn't realize that New York, New York and Brooklyn, New York were separated.

B (44:48)

I didn't know separate either.

A (44:50)

But if you put them together, then.

B (44:52)

They'Ll probably shoot up.

A (44:53)

They're number one.

B (44:54)

Oh, okay.

A (44:55)

If you put Brooklyn and New York together, it's number one.

B (44:58)

Then can we just say that we are number one?

A (45:00)

There you go. Number one. New York. St. Louis. Austin.

B (45:04)

Austin. There you go.

A (45:05)

Kansas City, Missouri. Because of Taylor Swift, probably Orlando, Florida. Salt Lake City, Utah, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and Boston, Massachusetts.

B (45:17)

Can I just say how varied that list is? How awesome is that? Like, that is just the country. Yeah. You know, like, I've never been to Detroit.

A (45:26)

I want to see where our first foreign city is. If it lists.

B (45:31)

That's a little hard because of the concentration. Yeah.

A (45:34)

I don't know if it actually. It may only list American cities on this. Yeah, I think it only lists American cities because I think.

B (45:42)

I don't.

A (45:42)

I don't think Tacoma, Washington, has more people listening to us than, like, London, for instance. So anyways. All right, so that. Oh, there's Montgomery. Montgomery's weight on the list. It's on, like, number 105 or so.

B (45:59)

That's embarrassing.

A (46:00)

That is embarrassing.

B (46:00)

People get tired of us. What can I say? Why listen to it when you get the real thing?

A (46:04)

That's true. So I do want to say, you know, it's not all been roses and sunshine. We've had some losses. I'd be remiss if I did not mention a couple of them. One, Rob Chadwick, who you guys probably didn't know as well. I mean, Rob is someone who was huge in sort of the. I'm not say, the innocence community, sort of the. Maybe the innocence fraud community. He was someone. He was a former reporter, retired reporter, lived in Nashville, was really into true crime and was an endless font of information. When we did Adnan Syed, I mean, he was somebody that I could ask any question to, and if he didn't know the answer, he would get the answer. Just a brilliant guy, really intelligent guy, and a huge loss. I mean, both people we're going to talk about are just huge losses. And had a professor in college once, and he talked about how when his mentor passed away, that all he could think about is like, what a. You know, this person who just knew so much and was so, so intelligent and was just a master of all these different fields. And to lose that, just what a blow that is. And definitely saw that this year.

B (47:28)

And the thing with Rob was, you'll meet lots of people in this world who are brilliant or think they're brilliant, but the ones who truly make a difference with their brilliance are those who are generous with their knowledge. And the way he interacted with people online, obviously we've seen lots of examples of people behaving badly online, but he had more information than just about everyone who tried to interact with him on any case. And he dealt with it with incredible grace, but not bending to the crazed Masses and, and he was specific and he point like he never. We were never on a wild goose chase. If you asked him a question, he would like give you, you know, exactly where everything was because he wanted everyone to know the information so we can go from there to have the conversation. And because of that, you know, such an incredible loss. But I don't think that all of that left with him. He was constantly pouring out his knowledge and it will reverberate forever. And that is the kind of one solace here is that he is not gone because of how generous he was with the way he spoke and engaged people with us, but also with so many of you online.

A (48:42)

Yeah, I mean, it would have been hard to do. Edna said we would not have done it as well without Rob. I mean, Rob was a massive source of information and talking about, you know, how he was always generous with information. I remember you people out there probably, probably remember timeline lady. And so timeline lady has a Adnan Sayad timeline. But after, you know, she got mad at us for citing her Delphi timeline, including a link on our website, she like took all the timelines down. So I'd done the whole. The whole Adnan Syed outline and, and I. It was done and I sent it to Rob. I was like, hey man, I got this whole outline done. Just check this and if you see anything that you think's inaccurate, let me know. Like, because. Because I want it to be as accurate as possible. When he sent it back to me, he's like, hey, by the way, do you want timeline, ladies, Timeline? Because before she took it down, I copied the whole thing and I was like, sure, send it to me. And so then I included like just little pieces of that timeline in that this is. This is how petty I am in like our discussion. Just so timeline lady would know. And I got the. I got the response I wanted on that. So. So I love Rob for that. That was like, it was so it. We laughed about that. I got to meet him in Nashville before he passed away and we had some drinks and just. Just the little joys you can take out of life. I mean, that was one of them. And he was a great guy and I am forever indebted to him. And I'm going to miss Rob. And then obviously we talked about Jessica. I mean, Jessica was just awesome. Incredible. Similar thing on West Memphis three. I mean, West Memphis three. We have been researching West Memphis three for years. But it was always great to be able to bounce things off Jessica and say, hey, like, nobody knew the case better than Jessica. And Jessica absolutely believed the West Memphis three were guilty. And Jessica absolutely knew that we might not come out that way. And I. I was like, yeah, I just don't know. The whole time I was like, I don't know. You know, I'm going back and forth. And the thing about Jessica is, is as committed as she was to that and as important as that case was, she was willing to accept criticism, to think about new information, new evidence, and just a rare trait. But another person I could be like, hey, I'm trying to run down, like, who lived in apartment 302. And just, oh, yeah, that was this guy. Like, how do you know that? And another person who just had so much knowledge about so many different true crime cases, and it was so fun to bounce ideas off of her. Huge blows. I mean, people who. It's funny because the true crime community is so big and it's so diverse, and people from all over the world and you. Lots of you don't even know who I'm talking about. But what you don't know is that the loss of those two people is actually a huge blow to true crime. Because our episodes won't be as good because we can't bounce things off Rob, can't bounce things off Jessica. And I miss them for that, but I also miss them just because they were good friends. And this has been a great year, a fantastic year. Another wonderful year. The podcast, but it's just another reminder that life is too short. Hug your friends, love your friends, take care of your friends. That's the best I can offer you.

B (52:05)

Yeah. With Jessica, what was so amazing. We've said this so many times before that we have the podcast, which is a small slice of what the prosecutor's community is.

A (52:17)

Committee of many.

B (52:18)

It's a committee of many. That's. That's the point. We started the podcast, and it's like this tiny slice, but it has expanded to this incredible community that is literally worldwide. And it's not just online only. You guys have been there for us in times of just some of the biggest parts of life. And we are not just online friends. And it's because of people like Rob and Jessica who helped build that community over time. They would check in on us, not just on, like, gallery posts, but one on one. They would, you know, reach out to make sure we were okay with this. Happened to me when I would be, like, particularly emotional during one of our recordings because a lot of these cases are really heavy. We. West Memphis 3. I did not like doing that. That was a really heavy case for me. I had just had a baby. I have an eight year old boy. I mean, talking about that case for basically half the year was really tough because you're forced to face all the evil and darkness in the world head on when you're already at your most vulnerable. And I remember a couple of times when I would get really, like, clearly emotional talking about some aspect of the, the case during one of our recording sessions. And Jessica would reach out and just say, hey, that was a tough episode, you doing okay? And it was outreaches like that, because we don't do this just for fun. Like, we are affected by these cases. And I think that's why the cases are good, because we are human beings who are affected by this. We say this all the time as well. We can't let these cases affect us when we prosecute them. And so in doing this podcast, we're actually able to do something that is a rarity in our profession and is something that is actually a huge balm for my soul to be able to feel the emotional side of these cases that I usually have to put up a wall against. But it comes with costs. And when your community recognizes what you give to these cases and recognizes us, people who are not just, you know, trolling for one star reviews, that we're actually human beings behind the camera. And it creates something so much bigger than what you may just see on the screen or what you may be hearing through your, you know, earbuds. And so Jessica was one of those and I think helped bring out that type of community in a lot of people as well. So huge losses. They are loved, they will be missed. But also all of you out there know that you're loved and you matter. Because these two people, you may not know them as we're talking about them by first name, but you can see how much they've meant to us. And you are, you are that important as well. Every single person is. And oftentimes we only talk about people in this way after they've passed. And that doesn't mean that you shouldn't start talking about it and telling people that they matter to their faces while they're still here with you. But it also means that others think about that, about you as well.

A (55:24)

And we're going to carry their memories forward. We're not going to forget them as we move forward in this. I mean, there are already cases that we're looking at doing. And I was like, man, I wish Jessica was here. But I'll say this, I Got a couple cases that Jessica did some research for us on. So our legacy is going to live on through that as well. Well, guys, look, we started off talking about how grateful we are, and we are grateful to all of you. This is crazy for us. It really is. I mean, you know, whenever we meet people in public who listen to podcast, I had this happen yesterday. It was at a birthday party, kid's birthday party. And it was the telltale thing. I'm standing on one side of the room, and I can tell these people on the other side of the room are talking about me. And sure enough, it was people who listen to the podcast. Right? And I'm always afraid, are they gonna meet us and be like, wow, those people are losers. I'm not gonna listen to those people anymore. Like, why don't I listen to that podcast? Goodness gracious, this lady spends a lot.

B (56:28)

Of time at Costco.

A (56:29)

Yeah, exactly. Like, I am totally convinced that eventually everybody's gonna be like, it's got these people ain't not listen to these people anymore. So the fact that we're five years into this and you guys are still supporting us is amazing. As I said earlier, we just signed on for two more years with our network, so we plan on doing this for as long as you guys will listen. We said it for it is. It is just true. As long as there are people who are willing to listen, we are willing to continue to do this. So I hope you guys will stay engaged, stay connected, keep sending us cases that you want us to do, that you want us to cover. There's a lot going on in true crime. Next few years are going to be interesting for a lot of different reasons, but we will continue talking about these cases, and we can't wait to have you join us as well. Alice, is there anything you want to say before we sign off?

B (57:18)

As always, thank you. We get to do this because of you all. I'm excited to see what 2026 brings. We are not ending. I hope you keep listening, but if you don't, we'll still play music too loud, too long, and talk too much. That's who we are, and I'm grateful for that.

A (57:37)

Awesome. Well, once again, guys, if you're listening to this live, you got a new year coming. It's a new year of opportunities and possibilities. Leave all the bad stuff behind. Let's leave it behind. Let's move forward to 2026. Have a great year, and we can't wait to bring more episodes to you. Next week will be bloopers. And then we'll be right back at it. So thank you so much for joining us tonight. And we'll be back in the new year in 2026 with more true crime. But until then, I'm Brett.

B (58:12)

And I'm Alice.

A (58:13)

And we are the prosecutors. All right, that time, it did.

B (58:37)

I counted too fast. I know.

A (58:39)

No, it was just when I clicked it, it didn't. It didn't do anything. So I don't know what's going on there. All right, I'm gonna go ahead and go live, if that's okay with you.

B (58:48)

Yes, of course. Course. How?

A (58:50)

My clicker's not working today.

B (58:51)

It's not. You can't hear it.

A (58:54)

I can hear it. I just. When I'm clicking the first time, it's not clicking, man. We got double click.

B (58:58)

That's.

A (58:59)

I know.

B (59:00)

That's really crazy. I'm just.

A (59:01)

Hello, everyone. Hello. Hello.

B (59:03)

Hello. I'm just looking at how much of this year was worth seeing this.

A (59:07)

It was a lot.

B (59:07)

I'm like. I'm, like, scrolling through.

A (60:10)

Sorry, that was my fault. That was my indulgence. Podcast didn't go away, so we survived it.

B (60:16)

It's just so funny that it's so many. Yeah, I'm good. I just. All right.

A (60:21)

Okay. Let's see.

B (60:24)

It's been a day.

A (60:25)

It's been a day.

B (60:26)

How are you?

A (60:26)

You ready? I'm fine.

B (60:27)

I'm so ready. It could not be more ready. Sam.

A (61:26)

Stream pluto tv stream pluto tv streaming.

B (61:31)

Pluto tv for free.

A (61:34)

Stream blockbuster hits like 21 jump street ted, the expendables, and so much more on pluto tv. Stream now pay.

B (61:42)

Never. My name is special agent Rebecca Henderson. Thursday, January 8th on NBC. There was an explosion at a top secret prison. Some of the most infamous killers broke free.

A (61:55)

The hunting party is back. We're going in loud.

B (61:58)

FBI.

A (61:59)

The stakes have never been higher.

B (62:01)

The longer they're out there, the more dangerous they're going to become. And the killers.

A (62:05)

Never seen anything like this before.

B (62:06)

Not even close.

A (62:08)

Have never been more twisted. This is next level. The hunting party. The thrilling season premiere. Thursday, January 8th on NBC.