Podcast Summary: The Radio Free Hillsdale Hour

Episode Title: The History of Western Civilization
Date: January 30, 2026
Host: Scott Bertram
Guests: Dr. Allen Guelzo (main segment), Michael P. Foley (second segment)

Overview

This episode centers around the importance, resilience, and narrative of Western civilization, featuring a deep discussion with Dr. Allen Guelzo, co-author (with James Hankins) of the new two-volume work, The Golden Thread: A History of the Western Tradition. The episode explores definitions, crises, and strengths of Western civilization, the methodology behind the book, and its critical value today. The latter part of the episode features Michael P. Foley discussing his book Abstaining with the Saints, which explores the sober-ish movement through historical, saintly stories and no/low-alcohol recipes.

Main Segment: Dr. Allen Guelzo on "The Golden Thread" – The History and Value of the Western Tradition

Background and Motivation

• Collaboration and Inspiration (02:04)
  • The two-volume book is a long-time collaboration between Guelzo and James Hankins, rooted in five decades of friendship and discussions about the Western tradition.
  • The "Golden Thread" title references the myth of Theseus and the Minotaur, symbolizing the way Western civilization is a guiding path through history back to the light.
    • Quote: “We have tried to do with these books is to offer the Western tradition as a golden thread which can be followed to the light of civilization.”
      — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 02:31

Defining the Western Tradition (03:45)

• Western civilization is seen as an accumulation of “civilizational moments”—from the Greeks to Rome, the Middle Ages, the Enlightenment, and into the present.
• The tradition is handed down and built upon, rather than replaced in isolation.
• Western civilization includes not just Europe, but also the places shaped by European cultural transplantation.
  • Quote: “It is west and every place that the west has informed civilizational development.”
    — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 05:35
• Guelzo challenges the idea that Russia stands apart civilizationally from the Western tradition.

Current Relevance and Civilizational Crisis (06:29)

• Guelzo and Hankins see the current moment as one of civilizational crisis and widespread questioning of the Western tradition, citing world wars, the Holocaust, totalitarianism, and imperialism as legitimate grounds for these doubts.
• They warn against both hostile ideologies (Marxist reductionism) and complacency.
  • Quote: “There are people who are frankly the devotees of an anti-civilizational outlook...all of those things are in fact subservient to this thing called civilization. So what we want to do is whether the questions about civilization arise from that kind of ideological hostility or whether they arise from a simple questioning that says: how can we still talk about a civilization?”
    — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 08:18

Western Civilization’s Resilience and Values (12:05)

• The tradition has survived previous collapses: fall of Rome, the plague, the Thirty Years’ War, etc.
• It consistently bounces back, with resilience seen as a unique aspect of the West.
• Key strengths of the tradition include:
  • The interdependence of government and law, specifically the subordination of government to law.
  • The monotheistic religious tradition and “argument for the sake of heaven,” fostering both disagreement and toleration.
  • Deep love for the arts—music, literature (not just oral but written and preserved), and painting.
  • The encouragement to approach heritage with “reasonable gratitude”—recognizing imperfection but valuing what’s been handed down.
    • Quote: “With the imperfections of parents, you experience a sense of gratitude for what has been given to you. So it is that reasonable gratitude that we seek to cultivate in the Golden Thread.”
      — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 14:58

Narrative Approach and Structure of "The Golden Thread" (16:20)

• The books offer multiple pathways for engagement:

  • Read as a continuous narrative.
  • Dip into "Threads"—short, easily digestible sections on individuals, events, or themes.
  • Engage with extensive primary sources and art reproductions, blending narrative with original voices and images.
    • Examples: Essays on Monteverdi and the Baal Shem Tov; a chapter on the Titanic.

• Art as a Civilizational Marker

  • Art reproductions are woven throughout to illustrate the evolution of artistic schools and their relationship to their times (e.g., Impressionism in France, Russia, the Netherlands, even Bengal).
    • Quote: “There are pages upon pages of great art…so you can see how a particular artistic school develops.”
      — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 18:54

On Historical Perspective and Recency (20:14)

• History is never definitively "solidified"; it is always subject to ongoing argument and interpretation.
  • Quote: "It never does. We'll start arguing about the consequences of the Battle of Marathon."
    — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 20:14
• The volumes end with the collapse of the Soviet Union, as events beyond that are too recent to contextualize with certainty.

Capturing Beauty and Destruction (22:18)

• The 20th century West is marked by both outstanding cultural achievement and terrifying violence.

• It’s a narrative challenge to bridge statistics of war with the experiences captured in art and literature (e.g., the poetry of Ezra Pound, novels like All Quiet on the Western Front).

  • Quote: “If you want to know what the impact of the war was, there it is... If you want to know what the impact of the war on the lives of the people who fought it, read Eric Maria Remarque’s All Quiet on the Western Front.”
    — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 23:10

The Fragility and Continuity of the “Golden Thread” (25:58)

• The greatest danger? Complacency—taking Western civilization for granted, not overt hostility.

• Vital to take cultural creation seriously, as politics and society are inseparable from their music and art.

  • Notable Quote: “If their art turns sour, sooner or later—and usually sooner—their lives, their society, their politics will turn sour.”
    — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 26:28

• The book targets advanced high schoolers, university students, and general curious readers alike, encouraging rediscovery and critical engagement.

  • Quote: “It’ll be like making again the acquaintance of old friends. For many others, it will be a surprise. It will be, I never knew these things were connected like this...that kind of realization, kind of awakening—that is another thing we hope that these books will invite people to.”
    — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 29:00

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Purpose of the Books:
  “We’re trying to give a picture of this thing we call the Western tradition...which can be followed to the light of civilization.”
  — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 02:23

• On the Western Tradition as ‘Layer Cake’:
  “The Greek civilization...is then succeeded by the civilization of the Romans...followed by the civilization of the Middle Ages...”
  — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 03:52

• On Historical Complacency:
  “The real danger comes when we simply assume that these things have always been there, that they always will be there.”
  — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 25:58

• On Art and the Soul of Civilization:
  “What do we do in our music in the West? Plato once said...if you wanted to understand the politics of a society, listen to its music.”
  — Dr. Allen Guelzo, 26:32

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Topic | |-----------|-------| | 02:04 | Guelzo introduces the collaboration and title metaphor. | | 03:45 | Defining 'Western tradition' and 'civilization.' | | 06:29 | The crisis of the Western tradition—historical and ideological challenges. | | 12:05 | The enduring values and resilience of the West. | | 16:20 | Book structure: narrative, "threads," and primary sources. | | 18:54 | The role of art and visual storytelling in the books. | | 20:14 | Challenges in periodization and history “solidifying.” | | 22:18 | Addressing the tension between Western creativity and destruction—20th century wars. | | 25:58 | The "golden thread": what keeps it intact and its greatest threat. | | 29:00 | The intended audience and ambitions for the books. |

Second Segment: Michael P. Foley on "Abstaining with the Saints"

Theme

Explores the sober-ish movement in contemporary culture, using saintly stories to enliven non-alcoholic and low-alcoholic drink recipes.

Key Discussion Points

• Foley’s book follows a trilogy on cocktails and feasts, now pivoting to meet a quiet demand for moderation—driven by social trends post-COVID, health consciousness, and the preferences of Gen Z (34:03–36:53).
• On the "soberish" movement:
  “It is kind of responding to what is called the soberish movement, which is different than going completely sober...there is a renewed interest in moderation, and Abstaining with the Saints is meant to help with that.”
  — Michael P. Foley, 34:49
• Book weaves historical and saintly stories with hundreds of no/low-alcohol recipes; highlights include unique stories like St. Paula the Bearded (37:30–38:51).
• Recipes are paired to saints through locale or symbolism (e.g., strawberries with the Virgin Mary), drawing on both historical context and modern drink options (39:08).
• Taste testing and accessibility: Foley sampled most, acknowledges some non-alcoholic drinks are as expensive (or more) as their alcoholic counterparts due to production complexities (41:10–44:18).
• Modern “zebra striping”—alternating between alcoholic and non-alcoholic drinks—offers strategies for moderation (41:58).

Conclusion

Dr. Allen Guelzo’s conversation provides an expansive, accessible view of Western civilization: its complex, multi-layered legacy, how it has confronted and recovered from crisis, and why telling its story matters. The “golden thread” is not only a metaphor but a directive—urging a renewed appreciation for the West’s achievements in law, government, art, faith, and resilience, and warning against complacency.
The episode is thoughtful, engaging, and challenges listeners and readers alike to revisit, re-evaluate, and revitalize the fabric of their own culture.

For Additional Detail:

• [02:04–06:23]: Roots and definition of the Western Tradition
• [06:23–12:05]: Civilizational crisis—why the tradition’s survival is not guaranteed
• [12:05–15:54]: Strengths of the Western tradition—government under law, religious argument, love of the arts
• [16:20–22:18]: Book structure and importance of primary texts and art
• [25:58–31:02]: Fragility of the western tradition—art as a cultural bellwether, the consequences of complacency

Notable Takeaway:
Western civilization is a living inheritance—often imperfect, always complex, yet uniquely resilient. Its preservation depends not just on defending it from hostility, but from indifference. The “golden thread” is kept intact through continual rediscovery, gratitude, and serious engagement with the best that has been thought and created.