Wise Money Decisions Start With Clear Priorities

Summary

---

The Ramsey Show Episode Summary

Wise Money Decisions Start With Clear Priorities

Date: June 25, 2026
Hosts: Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruze
Special Guest: Brian Buffini

---

Main Theme:

This episode focuses on how clear priorities and intentional action are essential for making wise money decisions—whether building wealth, buying a home in a tough market, escaping debt, or managing finances within a family. Throughout, Ramsey and his team answer listener questions, provide real-life examples, and deliver practical advice, especially on navigating today’s real estate challenges.

---

Key Segments & Highlights

1. Staying Out of Debt and Building Emotional and Financial Health

[00:41 – 09:02]

• Philip from LA struggles to avoid new debt, is stalled on Baby Step 2, and feels stuck in part-time work.
• Dave and Rachel dig deeper and discover underlying emotional issues limiting Philip's earning potential and career advancement.
  • Dave Ramsey [03:39]: “The emotional healing produces a version of Philip that allows him to work more and earn more, which allows him to have more money to budget.”
  • Rachel Cruze [04:57]: “There's a confidence and a rhythm that'll double your income. That is good for you, Philip, paired with being able to unpack what you need to unpack… But it's a both-and… it’s part of your healing journey to go and be productive.”
• Action Steps:
  • Address the root emotional causes.
  • Take action alongside healing.
  • Adopt "intentionality" in budgeting and life decisions—pretend you’re paid $100k to manage your own budget.
  • Cut up credit cards and prioritize budgeting to force the math and reveal the need for higher income.

2. Young Couple Facing Student Debt Before Marriage

[11:36 – 17:19]

• Jack from Tampa is debt-free, saving for a ring, but concerned about his girlfriend's soon-to-be $70k student debt.
  • Post-graduation, she’ll be earning $80–90k/year.
  • Ramsey advises not to pay her debt until after marriage.
  • Together, with combined income near $200k, they can pay off her debt quickly.
  • Rachel Cruze [16:52]: “That will feel weighty for sure. But that's just emotional. It's not logical. When you look at the numbers, you'll be fine.”
  • Dave Ramsey [17:19]: “Don’t overanalyze getting married—just do it if she's the one.”

3. Debt “Transfers” Are Not Debt Elimination

[18:00 – 19:45]

• Jeff from Raleigh moved $80k in credit card debt to a HELOC—Ramsey sharply clarifies: you’re not out of debt, you’ve only shifted it, so next step is to attack and pay off the HELOC.

4. Managing Savings Account Interest in the Budget

[22:09 – 24:24]

• Should you count high-yield savings account interest as income in your budget?
  • If you’re sitting on a large savings, it should probably be thrown at the mortgage unless you’re saving for a specific, near-term purpose.

5. Cheap Car Conundrums for Broke Listeners

[24:25 – 30:56]

• Andrew from Little Rock weighs costly repairs on two “junk” cars.
  • Ramsey: Don’t spend as much repairing a car as the car is worth.
  • Fix only the essentials (e.g., AC/battery), and keep a junk car temporarily while you save to upgrade.
  • Dave Ramsey [27:31]: “Don’t spend $3,000 on a $3,000 car.”

6. Navigating Family Business Compensation and Succession

[32:59 – 42:21]

• Justin from Chicago wants clarity on getting a raise, ownership, and succession in a complex family business.
  • Dave Ramsey [35:59]: “Worker pay should match market value; profits/ownership are different discussions.”
  • Rachel Cruze [41:50]: “Not having a raise in 10 years… is deflating.”
  • The main issue: lack of plan and communication between current and next-gen family business leaders. A formal operating and succession agreement is urgently needed.

---

Special Real Estate Q&A Hour with Brian Buffini

[43:46 – 85:59]

Market Context & Key Trends

[45:12 – 70:17]

• Housing prices surged post-Covid due to low interest rates and inventory shortages.
• Median age of first-time home buyers now 40 (up from 30 a decade ago).
• Young men are less likely to be buyers; women outpace men 2.5:1 in first-time purchases.
  • Brian Buffini [50:41]: “All the single ladies, all the single ladies… Men are feeling the need to hit the home run.”
  • Young men are more likely to “swing for the fences” with gambling and crypto hoping for instant wealth, rather than steady saving.
• Dave Ramsey [51:40]: “When you have a lack of hope, you get stupid… Instead of swinging for the fence, hit singles and doubles with your actions.”

Macro Solutions for Inventory Shortages

[55:42 – 62:00]

• Proposals to:
  • Limit corporate and foreign bulk purchases of homes (for sale to individual buyers)
  • Raise capital gains exclusion on personal residences to $1M to encourage baby boomers to sell
  • Reduce regulatory barriers to building new homes
    • Brian Buffini [61:11]: "More homes were built in Dallas–Fort Worth last year than the entire state of California… because of regulations and fees."

Individual Solutions – What You Can Control

[62:00 – 71:11]

• Pay off debt, avoid car loans & credit cards.
• Adjust expectations for your first home (size, location, finishes).
  • Dave Ramsey [66:39]: “You can’t compare that [starter] house to your little McMansion you’re bitching about that you can’t afford.”
• Look further from city centers for better affordability.
• Brian Buffini [68:34]: “You make money in real estate when you solve someone’s problem—look for the beater house and put in sweat equity.”

Listener Real Estate Questions

[77:05 – 100:21]

1. Carter, 22 and 23, expecting first child, $60k income:
   • Don’t rush into buying; focus on debt elimination, saving, side hustles, and slow, patient accumulation of a home fund.
   • Many pastors (their career) have side hustles.
2. Danielle, mid-20s, Des Moines:
   • What to prioritize in a first house for a growing family? Floor plan and yard trump square footage. Buy for where you are now, not forever.
3. Alexis, Fort Wayne, IN:
   • Should they borrow against home equity to buy investment farmland? No—do not risk your home and don’t call speculative land an investment if you can’t safely afford it.
4. Julian, Baltimore:
   • Recent grad; $70k student loans, $3,800 credit card debt; wants to buy a ring and propose.
     • Ramsey: Pay off credit cards, save for a modest ring (max 1 month’s pay), then tackle the student loans together after marriage.

---

Notable Quotes & Takeaways

• Dave Ramsey [03:39]: “Emotional healing produces a version of you that can go work, earn, and budget—action and healing must happen together.”
• Rachel Cruze [04:57]: “You have to act during the healing step; productive work brings dignity and confidence as much as cash flow.”
• Rachel Cruze [16:52]: “Don't let emotion override logic—when you look at the numbers, you’ll be fine.”
• Brian Buffini [47:15]: “Everyone thinks it's harder only NOW, but everyone in every generation feels that way.”
• Brian Buffini [68:44]: “The truth is, everyone makes money in real estate with sweat equity and solving a problem—not buying the staged model.”
• Rachel & Dave, multiple times: Patience, intentionality, and contentment with humble beginnings lead to long-term success.

---

Memorable Moments

• Debt-Free Scream: [106:42 – 115:28]
  • Austin & MacKenzie, age 27, from Mount Pleasant, MI, paid off $117k (including a $135k mortgage!) in 19 months and doubled their income with focused determination and sacrifice.
  • Austin: “The ones that don’t do it are the ones who say it’s impossible… Instead, ask, ‘How?’”
  • Dave Ramsey: “You can’t compare yourselves to people 25 years ahead. Contentment plus ambition isn’t an oxymoron—you can be both.”

---

Episode Structure

I. Debt & Priorities—Personal Q&A

• Overcoming emotional and lifestyle obstacles to earning more (Philip)
• Navigating pre-marital debt and blended finances (Jack, Mary)
• Why moving debt isn’t paying it off (Jeff)
• Counting interest and budgeting issues (Lewis question)

II. Real Estate Focus—Brian Buffini Hour

• Market trends, generational shifts, and actionable advice for new buyers
• Deep dive on what’s realistic, what’s fixable, and what’s out of your control
• Individual Q&A on home buying strategies and pitfalls

III. Actionable Inspiration

• Listener stories emphasizing the power of patience, sacrifice, and intentional planning—culminating in a debt-free scream

---

Takeaways for Listeners Who Haven’t Heard the Episode

• Intentionality is key. Every lasting financial win—from budgeting to home-buying to changing careers—requires clear priorities and consistent, on-purpose action.
• Fix controllables first: Pay off debt, avoid lifestyle inflation, and adjust your expectations to match reality, not social media.
• Hope, not victimhood, is your superpower: Don’t spiral into despair because of headlines, but also acknowledge the real (though not impossible) challenges of today’s financial landscape.
• Sacrifice is temporary, but the results last: Whether driving a junk car, buying a small first house, or skipping luxury for a few years, the accumulation of good choices will set you up to win for decades to come.
• Real estate is harder now, but not impossible. Buy when ready, not when pressured by FOMO. Sweat equity and lower expectations provide enormous opportunity.
• Family and business finances demand honest communication, trust, and a willingness to create systems for success.
• Community and example drive change: Listener success stories remind everyone that change is possible—with the right mindset and steps.

---

For more resources or to connect with a Ramsey Trusted real estate agent, visit ramseysolutions.com/agent

---

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey network in the Fairwinds credit union studio, this is the Ramsey show. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality number one best selling author, co host of the smart money happy hour. My daughter is my co host today. Open phones at Triple 882-55-5225. Phillip is in Los Angeles. Hi Philip, how are you?

[Caller]

Hello.

I'm okay.

How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

Well, I'm having difficulty staying away from new debt and I'm on baby step number two and I'm having difficulty with budgeting.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, Philip, those would go together. That makes sense.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Is it any, any type of like business that are all consumer debt in your household that you're trying to stay away from?

[Caller]

Consumer.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Any specific type that you find yourself in a lot?

[Caller]

Credit cards and. Medical.

[Rachel Cruze]

Medical and credit cards. What's going on with the medical.

[Caller]

Oh my. Well, just having difficulty with the copays

and doctors and dentists and things like that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. More just routine type medical things or is there an ongoing sickness or concern?

[Caller]

Routine.

[Rachel Cruze]

Routine. Okay. Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are you?

[Caller]

49.

[Dave Ramsey]

49. How many kids you got?

[Caller]

Zero.

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you single?

[Caller]

I'm married.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And what's your household income?

[Caller]

I would guess 40, $45,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do y' all do for a living?

[Caller]

My wife is in clerical and I work as a.

In a grocery store as a courtesy clerk.

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

It doesn't sound like you guys are peeking out on your careers.

[Caller]

Correct?

Yeah, I'm not.

My wife is okay with hers.

[Rachel Cruze]

You mean?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. But $45,000 in Southern California for two

[Dave Ramsey]

people working 40 hours. That's not. You're not working.

[Caller]

Yeah, I'm not working 40 hours a week.

That's right.

I'm a part timer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why?

[Caller]

Just the way that the company does it.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, why are you working? Not working 40 hours doing something.

[Caller]

I'm looking for a 40 hour week job and it's hard right now for me.

[Rachel Cruze]

Have you ever had one? A different type of career?

[Caller]

I've done other things with cashiering and with driving.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is there something that's. That you are facing or that you're trying to work your way through that we're not understanding here that's keeping a 49 year old man from getting a job and holding it down?

[Caller]

Yeah.

A lot of emotional stuff. A lot of baggage.

Yeah.

I have a long History.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so that's. That's also playing into the medical bills.

[Caller]

Right, Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now that makes more sense. Okay. Little more mercy then. All right. And so here's the thing. There's a connecting line here between these things. Let me kind of walk through it.

[Caller]

So.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the emotional healing produces a version of Philip that allows him to work more and earn more, which allows him to have more money to budget. And so the actual cause of some of the things you called about goes all the way back to you completing your healing journey. Is that logical to you?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And so in other words, the stronger version of Philip we have, that's got the scars of the past healed enough to function at full capacity. And then that version of Philip works 60 hours, two jobs, three jobs. And that version of Philip brings home a lot more money than $45,000 in Los Angeles.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that, then that changes the whole budget transaction.

[Rachel Cruze]

It does. But I also have Dr. John Deloney in my head. Philip, where he is, he leans into. You have to have action as well. I'm all about you healing from, you know what it is. But there's. But there's been a pattern. It sounds like most of your adult life where you've haven't gone beyond what you're doing now. And I think I would. It's a both ands. Yes, I do think. But you have to action in the healing step.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruze]

And the action of getting up at 6am, going to a job, getting dressed, getting out the door, being somewhere with an accountability of being on time or working hard and exhausting yourself till 5pm, 6pm for dinner, and you leave and go home, there's a. There's a confidence and a rhythm that'll double your income. That is good for you, Philip, Paired with being able to, you know, unpack what you need to unpack and understand yourself and not have high levels of anxiety, all of that. But I think it's a both ands. And so if I were you, I think it's part of your healing journey to go and be productive, because I think that's going to give you some confidence. And when you get paychecks in that are double what it is now and you can sustain a fan and sustain you and your wife, and you're not behind and you're not so stressed and bogged down and feeling like, oh my gosh, I don't know how we're gonna make the next paycheck. Some of that confidence of, hey, look, we're literally bringing in tangible Money double what we were. And that. Not that money brings you confidence, but you know what I'm saying? Like, it will. It will give you a sense of pride and dignity that I think is

[Dave Ramsey]

really good for you, Philip. That swaggerty walk versus sleeping.

[Rachel Cruze]

I mean, versus being home till 11, working a half day or. You know what I mean? Like, I think there's a level of that busyness and productivity that's gonna be really good for you, Philip. And you have to stay current on your bills. There's a point that, yeah, there's not gonna be much of a choice, or you guys are gonna get behind and live off credit cards for the rest of your life, and that's gonna cause more stress and anxiety. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what I would do that'll help. That'll help push you into that. Is to go back all the way to the beginning of the call and answer your actual question was, okay, I'm struggling with budgeting, and I'm str.

[Brian Buffini]

Debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Staying away from debt. And so the way you fix both of those things is the same way. We're talking about this other issue with great intentionality and action. So the intentionality is I'm going to ask you to pretend that someone is paying you $100,000 a year to manage this couple's budget in Los Angeles. And this couple's budget has a husband named Philip. And if you were paid to do that, you could do it, and you could sit down. I talk to you. You're an intelligent guy. You can sit down and do a budget, and we'll hook you up with EveryDollar, the budgeting app. And you and your wife sit down, and you say, all right, we're going to tell every dollar before it gets here what to do, and then we're going to stick to that. That's intentionality. Then when you're doing that and there's a problem, then you've gotta say, well, the reason we're doing all of this is to get out of debt and stay out of debt. So we're not gonna use debt to fix our problems anymore or our impulses or our whatever. But the reason debt is popping up is you don't have a good, solid, detailed plan. Because if you got a good, solid, detailed plan, it's gonna point out that you need more income, and you're gonna go get the income.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, and I would assume your rent and Los Angeles has got to be most of your paycheck. I mean, if you're bringing home four. Four grand a month, not even. I Mean, yeah. I mean, two grand a month. I mean, I don't know. I just. I think that there's. When you start to look at the math and see you guys will probably be. I mean, you're probably already cutting back, but I would cut up the credit cards, not make it an option. And that will force the math to show you that the income really is the major problem here.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly. Exactly. There's two sides to the equation, folks. The income side and the outgo side. And you want to win, you got to beat both of them. You gotta be increasing your income constantly thinking about long term and short term. What can I do to get the income up? And what can I do long term and short term to get the outgo down? Sell a stupid car? Sell the boat? I don't know. What is it? What's in your way? What's keeping you from winning? When I'm done talking to you, you're still gonna be okay, and I'm still gonna be okay. But what's keeping you from winning?

[Rachel Cruze]

Hey, guys, it's Rachel Cruz. When it comes to life insurance, most people fall into one of two camps. The ones who make a plan to protect their family and the ones who hope everything will just work out. But hope isn't a financial plan. When you get married or have kids, your money decisions aren't just about you and anymore. Your income helps keep the lights on, pay the mortgage and put food on the table. And if something happens to you, will your family have protection or uncertainty? Well, at Ramsey, we recommend term life insurance that 10 to 12 times your income with a 15 to 20 year term for the years that your kids are at home and your mortgage is still being paid off. That's why Winston and I have our term life coverage through Zander Insurance. They're an independent broker who works for you, shopping all the top companies to find the most competitive prices on coverage you need. Get instant quotes online in just [e-mail] or call 800-356-4282 to get your family protected with term Life Insurance. That's Zander.com or 800-356-4282.

[Dave Ramsey]

So just like we told the last guy, 100% of people who win at anything do it with intentionality. They do it on purpose. No one accidentally is married for 45 years. Sharon and I are getting ready to hit 44. It's not accidental. No one accidentally raises great kids. It's a lot of work and a lot of intentionality. No one accidentally stays in shape. Donuts Accidentally happen, not staying in shape.

[Brian Buffini]

Okay?

[Dave Ramsey]

And so you got to do everything intentionally. And when you're doing it intentionally with money, it means you're working some kind of a system, some kind of a plan to build wealth. Ours has been proven because we get you out of debt so that you don't have any payments. And now you got money to build wealth with and be generous with and have fun with. And the best way to do that is with the budgeting app, where you lay it all out. And our budgeting app, EveryDollar, leads you with personalized coaching and customized plans right through the Ramsey plan. So if you want to do this stuff, download this app for free every dollar in the app store or Google Play. Jack's in Tampa. Hi, Jack. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm all right. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So I've got a couple of questions. I am fresh out of school. I just graduated from the University of Tennessee last year.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well done.

[Caller]

Go Balls.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your degree in?

[Caller]

I got a degree in supply chain management.

[Dave Ramsey]

Whoa. Good for you, killer. You landed the first big job.

[Caller]

I did. Well, it's actually construction job, so not exactly what I studied, but yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what are you making?

[Caller]

I got a pretty, pretty solid job. I'm making 80 grand a year straight out of school.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's sweet. Good for you.

[Caller]

Yes, sir. Thank you. So I guess the main, main question I have is my girlfriend is still in school and she is. She does not have an income right now. She's in school to get her dpt, so doctorate of physical therapy. And then at which point she will be in debt at around 70. She'll be around 70 grand in debt after getting out of school. I currently am saving for a ring. I don't have any debts at the moment.

Good.

I just don't have a ton in my savings. And I'm worried that once that 70 grand hits, I mean, assuming things go well with my girlfriend, which I fully do plan on, I plan on getting engaged and all that stuff, but I'm just kind of looking at that and it's a little nerve wracking to have that kind of over my head.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're a supply chain guy. You're looking down the field, down the line and seeing what's coming. Way to go, man.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like, actually like you were trained to do. Congratulations.

[Rachel Cruze]

So are you worried that you won't be able to make the payment or clear it up?

[Caller]

I'm just not. I'm worried that I won't be able to clear it up.

[Dave Ramsey]

When does she graduate?

[Caller]

She'll graduate in about a year, but she won't start having a job until I think she said October. Why not have next or. I think it just takes a little bit of time. They've got to pass a couple certifications outside of school through the summer.

[Rachel Cruze]

She'll do that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so she's got to pass her board.

[Rachel Cruze]

And then when she, when she gets a job in October of next year, what will she be making? What's starting salary for her?

[Dave Ramsey]

60 to 80.

[Caller]

It's look. Yeah, it's looking like around 80 to 90k.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, well, why don't you just live off your. Assuming you guys get married in that time period, why don't you guys. Yeah. Live off your income, which will probably be up a little bit more of 80, and then throw her income at her debt and you guys are out in a year.

[Caller]

Okay, but I'm looking, I'm just looking at my savings. I've currently got around 3 grand in a high yield savings account, like 202 grand.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you've been working a whole month.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

And she's gonna have.

[Caller]

She's gonna have.

[Rachel Cruze]

She's gonna have an income, Jack. She'll have an income.

[Caller]

Right?

[Dave Ramsey]

So, you know, you. If you save like a crazy man between now and the time you get married, when would you think you get married? Before October of next year?

[Caller]

No, definitely not. Probably the next two to three years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why?

[Rachel Cruze]

He's like, whoa, whoa. I'm saving for a reason.

[Caller]

Marriages rings a lot coming down the pike. And I'm sort of. She doesn't live with me, but we do hang out a lot. I live with my brother, but we kind of. I pay for most, pretty much everything, which I'm comfortable doing.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you don't need to be paying for anything of yours until you're married. And you need to be piling up cash, buy ring in cash, have an emergency fund in cash, and then pile up cash if you're engaged to where? I think by the time you get married, and you probably need to get married sooner than you're thinking, but by the time you get married, you'll probably have enough to pay it off or almost pay it off. And then the two of you will be making 200,000 between the two of you by then, my gosh, man, you'll be able to knock it out in no time.

[Caller]

Okay, well, that makes it a little bit better.

[Rachel Cruze]

And listen too. This is not your responsibility to pay on her debt until you are married.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly. Do not pay A dime of it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. So if you did your way and you guys got married in three years though, then you shouldn't be stressed about it. Because her problem. Yeah, that's her problem, not yours at that point.

[Dave Ramsey]

But if you're getting married, you know, she passes her boards, she gets a job in October. You get married in October, you might not have 70 by then stored up, but you might, you really might. That's 18 months from now. You're making 80, 90K and you don't have any expenses.

[Rachel Cruze]

So what the flip are you gonna

[Dave Ramsey]

do with all that money he's got?

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, it's 70,000.

[Caller]

I don't.

[Rachel Cruze]

He's making 18 months. Yeah. So I mean, he's gonna probably save for the wedding, save for a ring. Yeah, there's some stuff. But all that to say you guys together once you were mar. Yes, you'll be fine. I appreciate the caution and a little bit of that unease because if, because if I am Jack, and I'm like, okay, I'm debt free. I'm now going above my net worth and saving and then I'm going to have this massive debt entering my life once I get married, that will fe. That can feel weighty for sure. But that's just so emotional. It's not logical. When you look at both of the numbers of what you guys are making, you'll be fine.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you know, I'm bragging on you, Jack, about getting your degree in supply chain, your decision making paradigm that you're taught, your method of thinking that you're taught in order to get that degree can work against you as you're planning this marriage. And you'll get paralysis of the analysis and go, we'll get married in eight years. No, you need to just, old man to young man, get married if she's the one.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. If you're gonna get engaged, don't. We don't need 73 month engagements. Good lord. All because you overanalyze stuff. So don't analyze it. Get done. Get it done, man. And you know you're gonna be okay. Both of you got great careers, both of you. Neither one of you did stupid degrees in left handed puppetry or something. You both got the ability to step out of school into 80 grand. Nope. I mean, not many degrees do that. So pretty strong. Pretty strong. You guys are going to be fine. And don't, oh, don't use your training and overanalyze getting married. Just do it. Jeff is in Raleigh. Hey, Jeff, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey guys, thanks so much. For taking my call. Longtime listener.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thanks.

[Caller]

First time calling. So I have essentially completed baby steps one, two, and three. I got rid of the stupid truck. $60,000 truck. Twelve hundred dollars a month payment. That's gone and out the window.

[Dave Ramsey]

How painful.

[Caller]

Married.

Oh, it still hurts.

What kind of truck was it but a 3500 Silverado? I pulled a trailer all over the

[Dave Ramsey]

country, so that was hard to sell. That's a great truck. Good for you. You manned up, did the right thing. You're acting like a grown up. Way to go.

[Caller]

If I could have built one, I'd have built that one. So it sucked, but it was the right thing to do.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yep.

[Caller]

According to you. And it seems to be it is the right thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

But I hate. I'm. I'm with you. I hate it.

[Rachel Cruze]

How can we help? Je?

[Caller]

So I'm 29, I'm married, I have two kids. We have essentially eliminated our debt to this point outside of our home. And a HELOC that we took out on the home to help eliminate that debt. We had almost $80,000 in credit card debt that the HELOC paid off, which took the interest down to 6% with the HELOC over 20 years, versus, you know, $3,000 a month in credit card bills that we were paying.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you're not in baby step three then. You didn't eliminate the debt. You moved it.

[Caller]

So.

Yeah, so that was kind of. My question is, should my next step

[Dave Ramsey]

be pay off the heloc? Yes.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, you did.

[Caller]

You.

[Dave Ramsey]

You didn't get out of debt yet. You just moved your debt. And you can't hide from it. It's still there. So you need. You need to draw back and punch that thing in the nose and finish it up.

[Caller]

Sam.

[Dave Ramsey]

When I started, I had great ideas and I knew how to serve people, but I didn't have systems in place yet. At that time, I sold books out of the trunk of my car. It was a lot harder to start a business back then. Shopify makes it easier. Shopify is the business platform powering millions of businesses and about 10% of all E commerce in the United States. If you've got a product or even just an idea, Shopify makes it simple to get moving. You can build a storefront, write product descriptions, and even improve your product photos all in one place. You don't need 10 different systems duct taped together. Shopify handles everything you need to make sales, from payments to marketing and analytics. Plus, that purple shop pay button is one of the best converting checkouts on the planet. For fewer abandoned carts. And if you get stuck, Shopify offers 24. 7 support. So if you've been sitting on the sidelines, it's time to turn those ideas into Sign up for your $1 per month trial at shopify.comramsey that's shopify.comramsey shopify.com Rams. Our question of the day is brought to you by why Refi? If missed private student loan payments are keeping you from making progress towards your goals, why Refi might be able to help explore refinancing with a lower fixed rate and a payment you can manage. Visit yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey might not be in all states today's question comes

[Rachel Cruze]

from Lewis in Connecticut. How should interest from High Yield Savings accounts be handled? I've so far ignored the accumulating interest because of baby step 6 and 7. Still feel very surreal. Should I be entering the interest as income on the EveryDollar app to include it into paying more on the house giving and investing or should I leave it in savings and let it continue to grow? I probably. It's funny, we actually have our interest as income on the Every Dollar app on our High Yield Savings. Just to like, hey, we're making this.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't have a mortgage.

[Rachel Cruze]

It's available, do it? No, but I'm just saying in general, if you have a lot of money in savings that high yield, it's wild what it can produce year after year. So it is a real thing that

[Dave Ramsey]

if you're on Baby step six, you should not have a lot of money in savings.

[Rachel Cruze]

It should be gone.

[Dave Ramsey]

You should have your emergency fund.

[Rachel Cruze]

But I just felt that the amount

[Dave Ramsey]

of high yield savings that that is producing should be minimal. And so what that tells me is you got a whole big chunk of money sitting in High Yield Savings. You should have thrown at the mortgage. That's what I think's going on, Louis. Otherwise there wouldn't be enough money to save it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Save it for something else.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I mean 3% on 30,000 bucks is $900 a year. That's not enough to ask this question over. Okay, you would throw that. You just pick that up and throw it at the mortgage. It's a no brainer. But you got a bunch of money in there. You've been saving money over. You've not, you've not applied your. You got all this high yield savings. Instead of putting on your mortgage, you need to take your dadgum mortgage and get rid of it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Unless they are saving for something specific that they're going to use that money for.

[Dave Ramsey]

Again, it shouldn't be $200,000 worth of something. I mean, it should be the amount you should have. I mean, you're saving for Christmas or saving for replacing a car or something like that. A vacation.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Fair. Okay.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Shouldn't be that much money.

[Rachel Cruze]

I know, but when he said that, I was like, oh, my gosh.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what you do. But you have a lot in high yield saving. All are doing other things with that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you don't have a mortgage. Yeah. Yeah. So do I. But. Yeah, but in that case, you would just take that interest and do exactly what you said and add it to income.

[Rachel Cruze]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

Andrew's in little Rock. Hi, Andrew. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing well. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

Yes. Thank you so much for taking my call. I'm a longtime listener, and we are. We are very sick and tired of being sick and tired, and we are trying to figure out how to best go about, you know, getting out of debt. We currently have two junk cars that we are driving. Both have a lot of issues, however, and we're trying to figure out if we should fix them or if we should buy another one or in what would be a fair, safe amount to put towards them.

[Rachel Cruze]

How much are the repairs costing you guys?

[Caller]

Well, right now they are asking me about three grand to fix the suspension and ac problems we're having and. And batteries.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is the car. What's the car worth?

[Caller]

It's worth 3,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, no. You don't spend three grand on a $3,000 car. That's a net zero. So you don't fix the suspension, and the suspension is the big number there. All you want to do is fix the ac and you got to put a battery in it, right?

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Don't fix the suspension on a $3,000 car. It's gone.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, if the suspension has completely gone out to where the car is sitting on this, sitting on its belly on the road, which didn't happen. This is just a mechanic that looked and said, oh, your suspension's loose. Yeah, well, so what? But guess what? It's a trashy car. Of course the suspension is loose. It's worn out. That as long as the car will drive. Will it drive?

[Caller]

It does drive.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. It's just loosey goosey, right?

[Caller]

Yeah, Yeah. I mean, it runs. It runs fine for the most part. It does make a lot of squeaky sound.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Here's one.

[Caller]

We just don't talk about safety.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I was driving a car that's probably worth 400 after I went broken. The main color of it was Bondo. Okay. And it had 418,000 actual miles on it. It was an absolute piece of crap. And I drove that car for what felt like 10 years, one three month period. And during that three months, all I thought about was how bad I hate this car. And I spent all my waking hours working to put money together to move up a little bit in car and pay cash and then move up a little bit of car and pay cash. And that's why today when someone gripes about Dave Ramsey bought a nice car, well, kiss my butt. I know what it feels like to have been there. And I'm not going to drive that anymore. I don't have to. I worked my way out of that hole. So what I want you to do is get really, really mad about being here and don't call me back in four years and say I listen to you all the time. I'm driving junk cars. You need to go get out of that junk car by getting this mess cleaned up in your finances and work your way butt off. Get mad about driving something that.

[Rachel Cruze]

And realistically, Andrew, it may only last you guys another four to five months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

And then if it save on the side. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Throw it away and buy another three thousand dollar car. But don't spend three thousand dollars on a three thousand dollar car.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Those are throwaway cars. And let me tell you guys, if you're at that level, okay, this car that I'm talking about was loaned to me. It wasn't even my car, which is even worse. And like the cops are following me around because they're like what are you doing driving this car on this end of town? You know, and it's like are you here to rob something? You know? And so I'm looking up what I was being profiled based on my car. You don't know what Bondo is?

[Rachel Cruze]

I don't think so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Bondo is the filler you put in when you have a car wreck. Used to, they don't do it anymore.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh. Or it's okay, it's showing on hardwoods.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, yeah, it's a filler. Okay. Like if you had a dent you

[Brian Buffini]

would fill the dent.

[Rachel Cruze]

I got the joke now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay. So the predominant color was dent, was Bondo dent filler.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, that makes sense. I always pictured like a red door and a. Oh, thank you. Google image.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, there we go.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well done. All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You sand that stuff in.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, I see.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Fill it in and then you paint over it. Okay? So lesson learned. All right, so here's the thing though, guys. Tell me if you are. If you are in that market for a short period of time. It should be for a short period of time because you're so pissed off that you're willing to do anything to never drive like that again. I'm gonna drive like no one else so that I never have to drive like no one else again. I'm gonna pay a price to get out of this mess. And part of it is I'm gonna drive a car that we have to give it a name. Cause it's pitiful old blue, Big Bessie, whatever it is, right? And you have to have a little yacht horn going, brrrr. So go. So if you want to buy one of those, here's where you get them. Garage sales. This is a thousand dollar two thousand car Facebook marketplace. And this Facebook marketplace too. This is a dog ugly car. No car dealer would even put this on their lot. It's ancient, but it has not many miles and has a lot of life left in it. But you couldn't tell it cosmetically. That's what you're looking for when you're buying a 2 or 3,000, $4,000 car. It's zero sex appeal and you will get no dates if you're single based on your car. This is what you're looking for for a short period of time. And you go bananas on that. Because a car is the thing that kills your finances. And I love cars. I've got nice cars now, but they kill your finances. And if this is going on year after year after year after year, I'm not saying drive that kind of car for three years. I'm saying do it for three months, five months, eight months, whatever. And we're just going absolutely crazy. Be sure you take pictures of it. And you can put them, you know, you can. Later on you can show them to your grandchildren when you have or your great grandchildren and say, back in 26, we drove this car. And that's why you ain't poor no more, kid. You can do the grandpa thing, right? You know, we changed our family tree back in 26, you know, and because that, that's the stuff you're doing right now, Andrew, I'm proud of you now, now. But you're gonna have to suck it up and knock it in the face. You got to get after it. You got to get pissed off. I'm not living like this I've never been poor. I've only been broke. Poor is a state of mind. Broke is. I'm passing through.

[Caller]

It's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Health insurance is confusing on purpose. You call one company, get transferred three times, sit on hold for 45 minutes, and end up more confused than when you started. That's why I recommend Health Trust Financial, their health insurance advisors who actually get to know your situation and help you find the right coverage for your life and your budget. Healthcare needs change as your life changes. Maybe it's a job change, the birth of a child, a new diagnosis, or you're just trying to have more margin at the end of the month. No matter your situation, Health Trust Financial shops multiple top rated insurance carriers and helps you understand what you're actually buying. I've trusted Health Trust financial for over 20 years because they help Ramsey fans make smart health care decisions. Go to HealthTrustFinancial.com today and talk to a real person without pressure or confusion. That's HealthTrustFinancial.com. Justin's in Chicago. Hey, Justin, what's up in your world?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. How are you guys?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Okay, I think this is like a really good question for you and your daughter. How should you set up hate in a family business? That is my basic question.

[Rachel Cruze]

Like market value, you pay?

[Caller]

No, like, I can. I can, like, go into it. So I make $120,000 a year working for my dad and I'm asked for a raise and he just acts like. Acts like I'm capped out. And there's like, no other way to advance in a family business. And I'm wondering if you should be working towards shares or what you feel

[Rachel Cruze]

that way or that was told to you.

[Caller]

I feel that way. Like, I haven't had a raise in 10 years and my dad says I'm capped out. Like, that's as much as we can pay you for your job.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so the answer to your question overall is what Rachel said, and that is that what you should be paid in a family business is what the job pays. And so if the job you're in is capped out, that's fine. But if you weren't there and your dad had to hire someone else to do that job, what would he have to pay in the market?

[Caller]

Probably now about 120,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what do you make?

[Caller]

About 120,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, then why would you make more than he would have to pay to replace you?

[Caller]

Well, that's kind of my question. That, like, it's a generational family Business. And that's not how my grandpa did it. He paid his kids way more so they could save and buy. Buy more locations. It's a very large business.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Well, so what I would do in that case is not to pay you more for your job, but I would give you some percentage of Prof. As a family member and treat you like an owner. Okay. Whether you got percentage actual of actual ownership or whether you got paid as an owner. So what you should do in this situation or in this thing is to say, all right, let me ask you this. If you went and got a job doing what you do somewhere else, what

[Caller]

could you get paid for? The industry, it's got a little bigger about after a couple years, probably about what I'm at right now, about 120. But I've been working for my dad. 20.

[Dave Ramsey]

Doesn't matter how long you've been working there. What matters is what the job is worth. And I think we clearly have assumed established in this conversation, this job's worth what you're being paid. You're not being underpaid.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And you're not being overpaid now. So then we separate the being paid for the job with being an owner. So you've got employee and you've got owner, and you can wear both hats, but just not. You just don't confuse them and convolute them. And so if your dad wanted to be like your granddad and move some dollars your way out as an ownership position, even if it wasn't an actual stock, but instead I'm going to give you some percentage like grandpa used to say.

[Rachel Cruze]

You. What is the profit of the company each year? Net profit?

[Caller]

Net profit, about 8 to 10 million.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Do you have other siblings in the business?

[Caller]

I do not. But I have cousins in the business, so that's where my dad has five business partners.

[Rachel Cruze]

And are the cousins paid just for their jobs as well, or are they

[Caller]

paid just for their jobs, but they're paid just as much as me? Like, it doesn't make any sense how they set up the pay structure.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

That's kind of. So I guess my Dave's right. Like, I can separate the job. I know I'm not overpaid or underpaid. I know I'm getting what I get for my job. But my question more is like my dad had told me at one point, you know, give me $100,000 and I'll sell you my shares of this. And I had the money to do. Then he reneged on that, and then

[Dave Ramsey]

That's a different discussion.

[Caller]

Wait till I'm dead or. I just don't know how most families do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Most families do it, but they don't renege.

[Caller]

Yeah, but just. Should a dad be willing to sell the share? Should it be something gifted? I mean, for that ownership?

[Dave Ramsey]

Either one's okay. There's not an ethical construct on that. Lots of the small business owners we work with sell their shares to the next generation. That's not unusual at all. Some of them allow them to participate in profits, to buy out the percentages over time, quickly. Some of them gift them and just gift them and so it's not a thing. So, you know. But there's not a. You know, your dad's not. Now the only thing he's done that I've heard so far in this whole conversation that's wrong is reneging.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so when was that?

[Caller]

That was maybe about two years ago. And his reasoning was he wouldn't be able to be the president, the corporation because he'd have less shares than some of his brothers. And some attorney advice. I don't know. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

So would you be some of his shares or all of his shares when that was the.

[Caller]

No, just a small port, like a hundred thousand dollars, like maybe like a 1% stake of his shares just for me, you know, like, just to give your kid to have some. Like, he just doesn't want to give me something, which I understand, you know, he wants.

[Dave Ramsey]

So how many brothers are in the deal?

[Caller]

He has three brothers and two cousins in the deal. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

It's a lot.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you've got cousins in the deal also.

[Caller]

Yeah. And we're all kind of trying to figure out how to get away. It's like my grandpa set it up more simply because he was one person and, you know, put a cap on all the stores to get a rent check and then gave like a 10% profit sharing. So my dad was making way more than a job entailed, but. And then my great grandpa actually just sold the business to his sons and allowed them to pay him with the profits over the years from the business. So there's a bunch of different ways, and I don't.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, here's what I think should happen for the good of the business and all the people that we're talking about, brothers and cousins and everything else you guys do not. Your dad and his generation does not have a plan.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that is going to kill y'.

[Caller]

All.

That's a more serious issue.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's going to run off all the family Members that are talented because they're going to go do something else with their life. And it's also, you know, they're holding on so tightly. Oh, God, I won't be the president. And there's no succession planning. There's no generational agreement on what we're going to do. There may not even be good partnership agreements between him and his brothers. I don't know.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

If they want to save this business generationally, they need to sit down starting next week and put together a partnership agreement that they all agree to. And then B, it needs to include a succession plan of what to do with you and your generation and how to make the transition in ownership and how to make the transitions in profits. So an example would be, with what you've told me about this, that would be healthy from a mental health and a relational health standpoint. I don't know if your bunch can pull it off, but a good thing would be that you guys sit down and the brothers come up with an operating agreement that. That says your dad is the president until such time, regardless of his ownership position. And that allows him then to begin to transfer some of the ownership position without losing the presidency.

[Rachel Cruze]

Because eventually he won't have it.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Cause if he can't do good succession planning because he has to hold on to the moment because they're at such conflict, then you guys are gonna die. The business is not gonna make it. You guys are gonna fight with each other. And the enemy is within. The enemy is in the building. It's no longer competition. It's no longer trying to serve the marketplace. You guys are all just scrambling for all the crumbs inside the building. That is not healthy. It's going to blow up relationships and it's going to end the business. We see it all the time. We coach family businesses that do stupid butt stuff like this all the time. And so you guys have got to. Your dad has to sit down if he wants to save it. And if he wants to save the relationship with his kids and his brothers, they need to sit down and develop an operating agreement for today that includes him continuing to be president, in my opinion, based on what you told me, for X period of time, and begin to transfer shares into the other generation. And that generation also has an operating agreement as to how this thing's run after succession. It could be that you split the business up and each of you take your store and go on your way like your grandpa used to do, and that might be the healthiest thing of all. But you Guys not having a plan and, you know, and then reneging on stuff to stay president is a good way to screw up the whole thing.

[Rachel Cruze]

And staying so consistent for 10 years of your income and not moving one inch is deflating. Right. So he either was overpaid 10 years ago.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

And it is what it is. But there's no movement in that. There's no debt. I don't know. There's not. And not that you have to move up outside of market value. I'm not saying that. But to not have a raise for 10 years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, that something was wrong then.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

They either started too high or something's weird about this position or something. But again, that can be solved for sure by just saying we're going to leave that income there because it's market value, but we're going to add some percentages of ownership over here and let you share in the profits. And all of a sudden it gets a raise.

[Rachel Cruze]

Y.

[Guest Host]

Here's what nobody warns you about. You're behind on payments. You signed up with some debt settlement company. You're making your monthly payments to them, and then one morning a process server knocks on your door. Surprise. You just got sued by a creditor. And that company you trusted, not a law firm. They're not built to represent you if things escalate. And now you're scrambling to figure out what to do next. And that's why I tell people about Guardian Litigation Group. Guardian Litigation is not a call center. They're actual attorneys at a law firm. And from day one, you're assigned a real attorney who can represent you if a creditor takes you to court. No scrambling when things go sideways. Just real legal protection built in from the start. And look, the best way out of debt is still the budget, the plan, the baby steps. But if you're already in default and legal threats are coming your way, Guardian has your back. Their attorneys have helped over 55,000 people settle more than $600 million in debt. So get real legal [e-mail] Ramsey that's guardianlit.com Ramsey Attorney advertising results may vary

[Dave Ramsey]

and no specific outcome is guaranteed. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. Rachel Cruz is my co host. Today we're going to take an hour and do something that we haven't done in a long time. We're going to do a theme hour and we're going to talk about real estate. And to do that, I brought in one of my good friends for many, many years, one of the top real estate minds and real estate coaches in America. Brian Buffini flew in from his home in California to hang out with us. We've been hanging out for a couple days, having all kinds of discussions. We get to do all kinds of fun stuff together. But we thought, hey, we better get him here on the air while he's here and we better mine this mind. He knows more about this real estate stuff than anybody moving around out there and have a really good discussion. Welcome, my friend.

[Brian Buffini]

It is always a pleasure and we've had a great week and I'm looking forward to it today.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you've been listening to the show for a while, you've heard Brian on here a couple of different times. We were promoting his book the Immigrant Advantage, which is a best seller years ago when that came out. Three years ago.

[Brian Buffini]

Maybe five.

[Dave Ramsey]

We're getting maybe five. Yeah. Time gets away fast.

[Rachel Cruze]

And it's not going to be southern accents this hour either. No, I love listening to southern Ireland. I just like the Irish accent.

[Brian Buffini]

You know, we're big into real estate in Ireland. You know what I mean? The potato famine and all that good stuff.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, let's get to this. The real estate market is a problem. We've talked about it a lot here on the air. That the shortage of inventory and the weird blip on the radar called Covid drove prices up unbelievably and they've slowed down considerably. But still, we've seen a phenomenon that we've never seen before in that we're currently at the oldest median age for a first time home buyer, right?

[Brian Buffini]

Yep, yep. 40 years of age. So median half above and half below. How old were you when you bought Your first house?

[Dave Ramsey]

22.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah, we drove by one of your original houses.

[Dave Ramsey]

That was a flipper I was doing last night. We're going to dinner. We drove by one of those rehabs.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, that's good.

[Brian Buffini]

I was 23.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

So, Brian, this is the pain point. I feel like we hear so much. I mean, housing and buying a home is all. Is a financial goal for majority of people, as it should be. But it's just they're feeling this tension at this point and it starts to feel hopeless. Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And we were talking about social media out of reach.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, we were talking about social media earlier. But I get in that algorithm and you just see people and it's some complaining, which I'm like, listen, I get it, it is hard. But then also it starts to feel as people start throwing facts and figures, which is why I love that you're on. Because you can maybe combat some of that or affirm some of it, but it just feels like today, more than ever, than any time in the home buying process, it's harder with just the price of homes, income and all of that. What would you say to someone that just.

[Brian Buffini]

Well, yes, the answer's correct. But if you talk to people from the 60s and they bought a house for eight grand, they thought their arms and legs were gonna fall off, and they ate spaghetti for three years, you know, everybody feels that way. Yeah, everybody also does. Oh, you see that property over there? I could have bought that in 1979 for $8 and a packet of peanuts. And now it's worth 20 minutes. 20 million. But I didn't buy it. So, you know, that's never going to change in real estate. What we have is what I call an anaconda's meal.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Brian Buffini]

You know the anaconda.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Brian Buffini]

It eats like a sheep, only from

[Rachel Cruze]

the Jennifer Lopez meal.

[Brian Buffini]

Eight months to digest it. And that's kind of where we are with real estate right now. Say that, Covid. Free money, you know, 2% loans, everything jumped up. Covid. People were living in small houses. Remember there was the tiny house movement. Remember that, Dave? Well, when we were all living together for 10 months, locked up, nobody wanted a tiny house. I don't want to see you. I want an office. I want a school. I want a gym. So now people got bigger houses, lower interest rates. And you had this massive jump in the market when the Fed adjusted the rates because they overcooked it. It was the fastest rise in rates in 120 years since the Federal Reserve existed. They intentionally stalled the market, like stalling an airplane. So they intentionally put the brakes on. And the brakes have kind of been on ever since.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So to backtrack a little bit. Ten years ago, the median age of a first time home buyer was what, 30 years old. And so in 10 years it went from 30 to 40.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And this is the highest median age since we've kept records.

[Brian Buffini]

Since we kept records go back to 1908. The most in a decade was two years. It changed. That was the Great Depression. And then the next great change was during the war. And then we had the baby boomers. And, you know, America exploded in the housing after that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Brian Buffini]

And so this is. So that's. It is a shock. It is a shock to the system and what I do here so people don't feel crazy.

[Rachel Cruze]

If people are feeling this, they're not crazy.

[Brian Buffini]

No, it is.

[Rachel Cruze]

There's a reality to It.

[Brian Buffini]

But they're losing hope. And that's the dangerous thing. You can't lose hope.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's right.

[Brian Buffini]

You gotta dig in.

[Dave Ramsey]

We're not gonna get in the loss of hope business or the sanctioning of a victim. But there's also the reality of the numbers. And so based on that reality, then you've got a solution. We have to come up with a solution. We'll work on that throughout this time we've got together. I want to do that. And so rates are just. Pretty much just stayed the same for what, three years?

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah, I mean, look, we were heading on a nice path and I thought we'd be at between 5.8 to 6.2 this year. And then we got Iran, you got oil, you got all that stuff, which is another blip in the screen. But I think what's going to happen is we might even have a slight rate hike before the end of the year. Eventually rates are going to settle around 6.6%'s a healthy.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's just not a bad thing.

[Brian Buffini]

You know, we remember business.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was high, I was gonna say.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well then that's perspective too. Right. Cause you have, you know, my age group that we don't remember the Carter years. Right. Or the. You know what I mean? Like when they all were selling houses.

[Brian Buffini]

1989, I was in a real estate office and we had a 10% party. We were stirring the porridge, we were dancing it up. Pizza was in, the music was playing. Cause the rates had come down to 10%. So, yeah, historically the rates were ridiculously low. I mean, 2% and 3% mortgages are artificially governmentally created. So for a government to loan a bank money at 0% is not sustainable. Especially when the government's paying 5% to the people who loaned it the money.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Brian Buffini]

So it's artificial.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I saw this on one of these slides that you gave us, which I thought was fascinating, is that, yeah, the median age for the first time home buyer is 40. But 25% of single women make up that demographic of first time home buyers and only 10% of single men. So women are outpacing men two and a half to one and buying homes.

[Brian Buffini]

All the single ladies. All the single ladies, right. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Brian Buffini]

So men are feeling the need to hit the home run is what I could see.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Brian Buffini]

And so they're like, I don't feel.

[Dave Ramsey]

So this is a 25 to 35 year old man.

[Brian Buffini]

Yep, 25, 30. Well, we know that exact demographic because online gambling has gone from 5 billion a year to 150 billion a year in three years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thank you, DraftKings.

[Brian Buffini]

Thank you, DraftKings.

[Dave Ramsey]

You wanna know why men aren't buying houses? DraftKings.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. And remember, you couldn't have a sports team in Vegas and you couldn't have an advertiser. And now, because they all own a piece of the action, young men are buying the Lakers and the Celtics and the Sooners because they don't think. You know, saving 300 bucks a month's not gonna do me anything. Let me put it all on the Lakers. And so they're hoping for the big win. And with the big win, they're hoping. The number one question of the online gambling bros is what would you do with the monies if you had a huge thing? They said I'd buy a house. So it's that lack of hope.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you look what happens is when you have a lack of hope, as soon as I get desperate, I get stupid. And you're not swinging. You're not swinging to hit singles and doubles. You're swinging for the fence. And every time you swing for the fence, you strike out. And that's what brought the crypto bros up, too. They're looking for a dadgum easy money.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, the ladies. And making wise decisions.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, the women are just. They're just going, we're just gonna put some money away. Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Brian Buffini]

The house is a bigger deal.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, I can't wait to keep talking about this. Cause there is a plan and a great way for people to be homeowners. And so. Yeah, and you're part of that.

[Brian Buffini]

I wouldn't be here without us.

[Dave Ramsey]

Ryan Buffini is with us. We're talking real estate this hour. What you guys are all want to talk about. And we're going to help you with it. We're also going to talk about the realities of what you're doing out there.

[Guest Host]

Hey, guys. George Camel here. Two things you should know about me. I love a good movie and I hate overpaying for things. An angel just checked both boxes. They've got a new movie called Young Washington. The story of George Washington's early life as a soldier before he became a founding father. And whether you're a history buff or not, this was a gripping, entertaining thrill ride of a prequel to the guy on the dollar bill. I was on the edge of my seat the whole time. Now, here's where the math gets fun. A premium Angel Guild membership is normally 20 bucks a month, but as a Ramsey fan, you get 25% off. So it's just 15 bucks a month. And that membership gets you two tickets to Young Washington in theaters along with tickets to future angel theatrical releases and access to their family friendly streaming library. Two free movie tickets every month. I ran the numbers. The membership basically pays for itself before you even touch the popcorn. So get the deal and go see Young Washington in theaters this Fourth of July to celebrate America's 250th birthday. Sign [e-mail] Ramsey that's angel.com Ramsey.

[Dave Ramsey]

We're talking real estate with Brian Buffini, one of the leading experts in real estate, one of America's greatest real estate coaches. He coaches more real estate agents, high performing real estate agents than anyone else in America. So he's really got his finger on the pulse of what's going on in the real estate world. He and I have about been talking, talking offline about this cause we've been friends for years. And one of the conclusions I've come to Brian is that there's not a. That the people who are feeling hopeless and are just screaming and throwing a fit on social media and yelling at boomers, you bought your house for a basket of strawberries thing are really too simplistic at how they're looking at this because instead of looking for a solution, they're just laying on the floor foaming at the mouth and having a fit because there's a lot of different problems. Let's go back to one thing and then I want to take this down a couple of ways. One thing you were talking about was the number of houses sold this year.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah, 4 million. It'll be this year. It was like 4.1 last year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Brian Buffini]

And the last time we got about

[Dave Ramsey]

a million houses on the market.

[Brian Buffini]

Listed on the market. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that's been that way for about four years.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah, almost four. And the last time we had that few homes sold was in 1995 when there were 80 million less people living in the country. So you have big population increase all economic supply and demand. So you have 80 million more people which is why prices are continuing to go up and will continue to go up. If you are watching YouTube, if you're watching the doom scrollers market crash, this has fallen into the thing. It is not true. It is clickbait. It's unfortunate that they're going to make a living.

[Dave Ramsey]

The prices are going up because there's an inventory shortage. Supply and demand, supply and demand. You've got 100 million more people chasing the same number of sales. And so we've got a supply problem. We continue to have a supply problem and that is due to several things. So there's a bill sitting on the president's desk for him to sign. He just pushed it aside a few minutes ago as were recording this or broadcasting this. So I don't know when you folks are going to be listening to this, but something else may have happened by then. But for right now he pushed it to the side. So he's not signing it until he gets some other political favors on some other stuff he's working on. But that bill is called the Road act and it was had good intention. You and I agree it's full of a bunch of pork and crap, but Congress can screw up Christmas. But the idea is, the idea was that they're going to limit corporate hedge fund buyers and Chinese foreign nationals and so forth from buying thousands of single family homes and starving that supply we're talking about. Yeah. Allegedly they're gonna limit. The idea of limiting. It is a good idea. It was your idea.

[Brian Buffini]

It was. I proposed it to the senator and

[Dave Ramsey]

then I said it on the air and I said President Trump, if you're listening. And apparently he was or somebody was because they put the bill out like 60 days later in January, they got the bill pass but by the time they got it through Congress they screwed it up putting all this crap in it.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. And they, you know what was initially proposed was a great Bill Limited to

[Dave Ramsey]

350 homes, single family homes that a corporation can own because they're stealing them from first time home buyers.

[Brian Buffini]

100%. So first time buyers and by the way they get tax advantages. So a giant, you know, multi billion dollar company gets all of these tax advantages that a single family that's, you know, eating spaghetti saving their money can't. And so that was the intent. Now it's gotten politicized and all of a sudden it's like, well, we're concerned about access to capital and things like that.

[Dave Ramsey]

And said BlackRock.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. Yes. Because I also got a giant contribution to my campaign. Right, right. So they gave 10 million and Mary can give 10 bucks. So look, it is the deal. It's brutal.

[Dave Ramsey]

One thing, one thing we could do is if you really did do it and this bill really doesn't.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you really did do limit, limit the number of the Chinese buying 5,000 houses in Memphis, Tennessee or our Blackrock doing the same thing and taking them off the market. That's thing one thing two you've suggested, and I like this even more is to get the market moving, just do away with capital gains Tax completely on single family personal residences.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Or on personal residence. Period.

[Brian Buffini]

Sure. And they can do this in a periodic way. They can do it for in a structured way. Right now it's 500 grand.

[Dave Ramsey]

But that's a 25 year old law, isn't it?

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. And it's 500 grand. And 500 grand was different 25 years ago than it is today. It was different five years ago. So if you move that to a million. So if you went from 500 grand to a million, so that first million,

[Dave Ramsey]

you would stimulate sales like crazy.

[Brian Buffini]

Here's what would happen. The baby boomers who are sitting on $89 trillion worth of assets, the baby boomers are willing to go, okay, you know what I might do? You'd actually have a temporary dip in prices because they go, guess what, I'm gonna make a mill on this. Maybe I'll take 50 grand off the house to sell it quick because I want to do it while the capital gains law has changed. They might take 50. They might take 70 off the price. They might take 100 off the price. You might have, oh, this guy took 50. Now they have. So prices might take a little softer

[Dave Ramsey]

and you put some supply in the market.

[Brian Buffini]

A lot of supply in the market.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because your median seller right now is in their 60s. Right.

[Brian Buffini]

Median seller is 64 years of age.

[Rachel Cruze]

Is it capital gains or is it right to buy the next home that's stopping people? Or both. I just wonder what the motivation is.

[Brian Buffini]

Baby boomers are sitting on.

[Dave Ramsey]

Their houses are paid for.

[Brian Buffini]

They're paid for. They got a bunch fair they weren't buying then. Some people say the greatest generation, they're borderline. I'm going to create some tension here for you, but they're borderline being called the greediest generation.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, we were with the 80s.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. Go. Go, baby, get it. Greed is good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Gordon Gecko.

[Brian Buffini]

Grease the hair back.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly.

[Brian Buffini]

The baby boom generation was the first historical generation to buy real estate not just for a primary residence. Baby boomers bought rental properties. Baby boomers bought vacation properties. Baby boomers bought and built eight unit apartment buildings. So brilliant. They sacrificed, they made their money and they've done well. They've been slow to hand it over.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the two things we could do from a macro perspective, and usually you and I don't reach for Washington to do anything because they screw it up. And they have in this case too, but would be to limit corporate buying and just do away with or raise the capital gains to a million. You sell your home for up your personal residence for up to a million dollars profit with no taxes at all. If you just did away with it, you could increase your inventory substantially, which would increase the flow of houses. And we get back up above a 4 million transaction rate and you'd get the inventory going. And the third thing is we gotta have some federal help probably pouncing on people like these idiots in California that have still not issued building permits two and a half years later on Palisades.

[Brian Buffini]

My people, my people. I'm from the People's Republic of California. Look, it's. More homes were built in Dallas Fort Worth last year than in the state of California.

[Rachel Cruze]

The entire state.

[Brian Buffini]

Than the entire state, which is 40

[Dave Ramsey]

million because of regulations and building permit costs and all the fees, fees, fees and more. They got more fees than a French poodle.

[Brian Buffini]

Fee, Fee, fee, fee, fee.

[Dave Ramsey]

Very good.

[Brian Buffini]

167 grand. The average fees for housing just to break ground. So the fact of the matter is there are governmental things that can happen. There are some things they're trying to do. They're trying to. They're actually the one thing this current legislation does, does a lot of reducing requirements and restrictions and regulations on housing. They're reducing the federal regulations on housing. So that will help some things. They're gonna expand, you know, the developed property. So like, you know, the delivered mobile home. Right. So that's like you can build it to suit, which is a little more manufactured. Manufactured, and they're a little more structured than they used. So there are some things that they're doing that will help some things.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so let's switch gears then. That's stuff that we can't control if we're 35, but we can control if we're giving all of our money to crypto or draftkings. We can control if we go into debt to Ford Motor Company for a $90,000 pickup. And so we don't have any money to save for a house. We can control if we don't let Citibank. What's in your wallet? Screw me over with Samuel L. Jackson telling me to do it. We can control if we get deeply in debt with student loans. These are controllables that the individual can do to put themselves in a position where they have disposable income to start moving towards buying.

[Brian Buffini]

Dave Ramsey has a lot of answers for the real estate business. You know, if I want to, somebody said if I really hated a real estate agent and I wanted to just really screw him up, I'd refer him a couple of kids who wanted to buy a house and tell them to buy a truck first. If I really hated that realtor, here they go. And what happens is psychologically their first major purchase is a car and then they got a loan and now they feel they can buy a house. It's, it's insanity. And you've just, you just added screwed

[Dave Ramsey]

up the whole thing.

[Brian Buffini]

You screwed up the deal by the way.

[Dave Ramsey]

Get married.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah, there's a good one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cohabitating doesn't get you towards buying a house.

[Brian Buffini]

You talk about is one on one. That's why I was a Dave Ramsey fan my whole real estate career because I'd have my clients listen to your stuff so I could help them get a down payment to buy.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, opens up margin when you don't have debt. And then, and then patience all.

[Dave Ramsey]

Also I got one more to add to this when we come back and then we're going to take some calls.

[Brian Buffini]

Great.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you've had your phone two or three years, there's a chance it's unlocked. So bringing your own phone is a great way to unlock savings on your wireless bill. You can switch to Boost Mobile to get unlocked, bring your own device and save big. See, the big wireless companies count on you staying right where you are, paying more than you should every single month. They make it sound complicated to switch. It's not by the way. And meanwhile your bill keeps going up. That's not inflation, that's them taking advantage of you. But Boost Mobile is different. They make it simple. You bring your phone, keep your number and get unlimited wireless for just $25 a month. And that price is locked in forever. No contracts, no hidden fees, no surprises. So if you're tired of wasting money on your phone bill, this is your chance to do something about it. Go to boostmobile.com Ramsey get unlocked and keep more of your hard earned money. That's boostmobile.com Ramsey $25 forever requires customers to remain active on Boost Mobile Unlimited plan. Talking with Brian Buffini we're talking about real estate. The median age of the first time home buyer has gone up from 30 years old to 40 years old in the last 10 years. We have a shortage of inventory. We talked about. There's three things that the government can do. One is to lower regulations to get home building going again. Two is do away with capital gains and three is limit corporate buying thousands of single family homes and starving that inventory. As an individual, what can you do? Well, quit being desperate and swinging for the fence and so stay off of DraftKings and crypto. Quit buying crap you can't afford and letting these companies screw you like Lexus and you've got a car you can't afford for twelve hundred and fifty dollars. And then you whine because you can't buy a house. It's your fault. You did that. Okay? So you gotta stay out of the stupid. You gotta get the stupid student loan paid off like it's some kind of pet in your house. You gotta get that credit cards cut up and get Samuel L. Jackson out of your life. What's in your wallet? All of your money, apparently. But yeah, so we got to fix all of that. And then the one last thing I wanted to bring up, and I want your input on this because you and I are about the same age and I've been hammered negatively on this subject because. And I was on Fox yesterday talking about it, as a matter of fact. And the anchor John on there is about our age. And he said, what'd you pay for your first house, Dave? And I went 67,500. What'd you pay for yours? 88,000. What'd you do that on? $18,000 a year. Okay, well, wages have not kept up with house prices. Cause house prices shot up in the last 10 years due to inventory shortage and Covid garbage.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so wages have not kept up. That is real. However, the other thing we've never adjusted for in our psyche out there in the land of TikTok, where you're 27 years old, living in your mother's basement bitching about this is you've never adjusted your entitled viewpoint. Because let me tell you what was in that $67,000 house. No stove, no refrigerator. Had to go buy them used. No washer and dryer, no dishwasher, no microwave, no disposal. Rollout. Vinyl floor on the kitchen.

[Brian Buffini]

Come on.

[Dave Ramsey]

And a Formica top, a chipped up sink that has had little chips in the ceramic. Yeah. The carpet, you had to mow it because it was seven inches tall. It was. Remember shag in the 1970s?

[Brian Buffini]

Shagadelli.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, Shagadelli.

[Rachel Cruze]

One bathroom.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it had one and a half baths. And it was 1200 square feet with one car garage. So you can't compare that house to your little McMansion that you're bitching about that you can't afford. So you don't compare that. I grew up in a 1,000 square foot house with an unfinished basement. We had no living room furniture until I was 13. And the living room wasn't enough. Wasn't as big as this desk.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so you know you adjust all of that before you say, well, you're a boomer, you had it be good. It was easy for you. No, we didn't. I mean, I had one and a half cars. You guys got three.

[Brian Buffini]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, and so you really got to adjust for that and your expectations. And then lastly, you need to think about where you're buying. And in most markets, and you know this better than anybody, probably the urban basic urban growth is if you go out of town a ways, as we say in Tennessee, out in the country, it gets cheaper the further from downtown you move. Yep.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. And look, I mean, the average home used to be 1210 square feet, and now the average home is 2900 square feet. And so it's much bigger.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the difference in those is not necessity, it's luxury.

[Brian Buffini]

You know, that's what people were buying and the prices and the market and the way it went and all that kind of stuff. Here's the bottom line. You know, the first house I bought, it looked like it had been in a drive by shooting. Okay. And I was a house painter's son, you know, and I fix it up. And there's a thing called sweat equity. And everybody watches the homes and garden shows. The truth of the matter is, you know, I was out here in Tennessee the other day just looking at stuff and I was looking at the model homes and they have them all tricked out and they're lined up out the door and everybody's buying the model homes. The money is not in the model home and the new construction. The money's in the old beater down the street without the, you know, with the. Looks like it needs a coat of paint.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cause it does.

[Brian Buffini]

Cause it does. You know, you make money in real estate when you solve somebody's problem.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's how you buy though, people. Yeah, you stay out of the traps and you set yourself up and you adjust your expectations and act like a first time home buyer. Quit acting like you've been saving money for 25 or 30 years. You haven't. You're 27 years old.

[Brian Buffini]

Look, how bad do you want us?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Brian Buffini]

And you know, I hear a lot of the younger folks, you know, the math isn't mathing. And I'm a lifestyle person. All of a sudden, the average homeowner has 44 times the net worth of the average renter. And if you want to get on the right side of the net worth equation, the number one way people make money in America and all over the world is housing. And so I've trained in 47 countries. And housing is the same all over the world. Food, shelter, clothing, the three necessities. And so you gotta fight and grind to do it. And again, I know. I think you're right. People are losing hope. But people are also listening to all this garbage out there.

[Rachel Cruze]

100%.

[Brian Buffini]

You can do it. You can bite, fight, scratch your cloth. Look, I'm an immigrant, came to America, got run out by a car. I have 250 grand in medical bills in 1986. I don't know what 250 grand is worth today. It'd be a fortune. And I bought my first house, and I fought like the dickens for it. And I literally didn't eat a meal that I didn't prepare for three years. But that house I bought for 107 grand. I sold it for 164. The next one I bought was 220. And I fixed it up and I sold it for 394. And then I bought the next one, and I bought it for 900. And then I bought the next one. It was 1 8. And I bought the next one. And that 18 now turned into four. And the next one four turned into seven and a half million. And so here's a house painter son with not a dime goes from in 22 years, from zero to seven and a half million. That doesn't happen by rent, and that doesn't happen with crypto, and it doesn't happen with DraftKings.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Very good. Chuck is in Milwaukee. Let me get that line going. Chuck, how are you?

[Caller]

Good. How you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Great, man. Enter. Enter the conversation. How can we help?

[Caller]

Hey, so I'm a longtime listener. I'm a baby step worker. And so my question is.

So my wife and I have worked

through most of the baby steps, except

for the latter ones.

And we are at the point now where we want.

We're thinking about selling our house in order to be mortgage free.

And I'm just wondering, is that possible?

[Dave Ramsey]

That makes you move down then, right?

[Caller]

What's that?

[Dave Ramsey]

You would move down in house?

[Caller]

We downsize.

Yep. Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Other than to be mortgage free? Why would you do that?

[Caller]

That's the only reason I would.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your. What's your house worth?

[Caller]

447,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what do you owe on it?

[Caller]

192,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

What do you guys make a year?

[Dave Ramsey]

You're gonna buy $150,000 house from a $500,000 house?

[Caller]

Yeah.

I.

Doesn't make sense.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you married?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Don't do this.

[Brian Buffini]

He just saved you 250 grand in marriage counseling right there, buddy. Chuck, do you want the real estate?

[Rachel Cruze]

Do you want to do this? What, what is your wife saying? I am curious.

[Brian Buffini]

I, I,

[Caller]

our goal is to, yeah, our goal was to work that baby step and be mortgage free. But personally, personally, no, I like where we live. I'd rather just, you know, buckle down, pay it off. You know, we got eight or nine years till we get paid off.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what you should do. Yeah, yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

How much do you guys make a year, Chuck?

[Caller]

So I can tell you, I'm self, I've been self employed for 25 years. I'm a Harvard foreign contractor and I work alone. And do you want like the business gross income?

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm asking what your household income that you pay taxes on is.

[Caller]

Okay, I made 151,000.

She made 64,000.

[Brian Buffini]

Great.

[Dave Ramsey]

So two and a quarter and you got to pay off. You need to pay off 192 and you're going to do that in four or five years. And then if you want to save up and move up, I would, but I don't know, I would not sell this and move down to be debt free. I think you're gonna be debt free soon enough. You got a good plan? Would you, Brian?

[Brian Buffini]

Well, I'm a house painter, son Chuck. So here's what we would do. We do call it Saturday money. So we take what was called a side job, do a little work on the side and every dollar I made on the Saturday job, you used to pay down the debt. And so you do that. Here's what you can be. You could be debt free in five years, not eight. And you get to live in the same house. And you know what? Your wife thinks you're even cuter than you are right now

[Rachel Cruze]

with no mortgage. It's amazing how people's looks change suddenly beautiful thing.

[Brian Buffini]

My wife thinks I'm gorgeous.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh my goodness. Brian Buffini is with us, real estate coach and expert. We're going to come back in the last segment this hour and take your

[Rachel Cruze]

calls and I'll throw out too. You know, there was some hope interjected there at the beginning about hey, get in like this, like your housing is amazing. And so if you want to check out and find a great agent, go to Ramsey's Solutions.com agent. We'll put a link in the show notes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, we'll hook you up with a Ramsey trusted agent that knows what they're doing and they can help you really do this. It's possible, folks. RamseySolutions.com agent.

[Caller]

If you've worked hard to keep your car running, the last thing you want is stress when you're running the kids all over to summer activities or loading up the family for a well earned vacation. That's why I trust Christian Brothers Automotive. Listen, most people don't worry about their car just because it's older. They worry because they don't feel confident about what's happening under the hood or, or who's working on it. And that kind of uncertainty can turn a simple trip into a stressful one real fast. But Christian Brothers is different. They use digital vehicle inspections so you can see what your technician sees, know what needs attention now and what can wait and make decisions without the pressure. That's how you protect your time, your money and your travel plans. And Christian Brothers stands behind their work with the nice difference warranty. Three years or 36,000 miles, whichever benefits you more. So before your next trip, take care of the car that's taking care of you. Go to cbac.comramsey to schedule your service and get 10% off your visit. That's cbac.comramsey 10% off, up to a $250 value. See stores for details.

[Dave Ramsey]

Our guest is real estate expert and world renowned coach. Brian Buffini coaches more real estate agents than anyone else in America today. Especially the high performing ones. We're talking real estate. We're talking about it is possible, it is definitely harder, it's definitely different than it was 10 years ago and it's definitely way different than it was 30 years ago. No question. That is not in question. But the question is you can control only the things you can control and that's what you should control. If you control the controllables, you can put yourself in a position to buy. Carter is with us in Columbus, Ohio. Hey Carter, your question for Brian and the panel here.

[Caller]

Hey guys, how's it going?

[Dave Ramsey]

Great. How can we help?

[Caller]

I just wanted to call in and just say my wife and I are expecting with our first child and we're currently thinking that home buying is our next thing that God wants us to do. Cool. We are both in full time ministry. So with that obviously it's not like an extravagant paychecks that we get but we're not in it for the money. I'm just wanting to know like how we can go from the jump we're renting right now. How we go from the jump of we have everything budgeted with our rent to our mortgage payment, everything with bills

[Dave Ramsey]

and like that with congratulations on the baby, how old Are you guys.

[Caller]

Thank you. 22 and 23.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And how old is. I mean, I'm sorry, what is your household income today?

[Caller]

Yearly, we Both combined to 60,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. You have a bunch of debt.

[Caller]

Nope. My wife has no debt whatsoever. The only debt I have is student loans, but I'm working through a public student loan forgiveness with. Because I work for a church.

[Dave Ramsey]

So 10 years is not a plan to get out of debt, honey.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Brian Buffini]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Brian, what do you think? Yeah.

[Brian Buffini]

How much is on the student loan, by the way?

[Caller]

21,000.

[Brian Buffini]

Okay. And after your bills come in and your money comes in, how much left over? You have anything left at the end of the month?

[Caller]

So with all bills aside and ties offering aside and everything like that, we have about 1600 left to spend, not including food or anything like that.

[Brian Buffini]

Okay. You got any money saved?

[Caller]

We have 13,000, including $1,000 emergency fund.

[Brian Buffini]

Great. Fantastic.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're way ahead of what I thought.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah. 22 and 23. We got a winner here. Hope for America. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Brian Buffini]

What's the average sales price in Columbus, Ohio?

[Caller]

We're looking. We got Pre approved for 228, but I was doing the math and just looking what our mortgage would be. I just don't know how that would be possible to. We just kind of be making pre approved.

[Dave Ramsey]

Pre approved only means that the mortgage company has brain damage. Okay. Because there's no possible way you should do that.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know that when you looked at the payment, you bought choked, didn't you?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Good for you.

[Caller]

It's about 220, though. 220, 000.

[Brian Buffini]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[Brian Buffini]

Just curious. What would 220 get you in Columbus, Ohio?

[Caller]

Like bedrooms and, and stuff like that?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

About three beds, two baths.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nice. Wow.

[Brian Buffini]

Nice. I know. We're not living in San Diego, baby.

[Dave Ramsey]

So like 2, 000 square feet, huh?

[Caller]

Like 1500. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, well, Carter, I would take that 13,000 that you have, throw it at the student loans. You guys, you may want to work a part time job for just a season. Well, when's your wife due? When's the baby coming?

[Caller]

End of September, early October.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Between now and then, Carter, if I were you, I would be stacking cash and I would go work extra weekends and nights and you guys. Yeah. Pile up some cash, get the student loan knocked out, save some more back to that emergency fund and then make it a big goal. Yeah. Of. And knowing that you're on a $60,000 income. Okay. So it's gonna take you guys a couple of years to save for that down payment, but it is totally possible.

[Dave Ramsey]

So let me tell you this. I completely affirm God's call on your life to be in ministry. And I want you to keep doing that. And here's the reality that goes with that. You're not going to only get to do that for the first decade. Go talk to some 65 year old pastors and ask them how many of them when they were 22 worked a side hustle. We work with 50,000 churches in America and what we found is that 88% of pastors are bi vocational. They have a side gig. 88%. And they call that full time minister. My pastor that led me to the Lord and baptized me is with the Lord today. And back in the day, he delivered bread, had a bread truck, and he was a full time pastor. And he told that story from the pulpit a thousand times to where we all could visualize the bread truck. We heard it so much, but it was perfect. So you know, you're 22 and 23. You're just beginning. You've got time. You don't need to buy a house today to be rich. You don't need to buy a house today and money's not your motivator anyway. But you do need to buy a home. It's going to be good for your family. But it may be five years. So what? Clear the student loans, you pile up some cash, you work some side hustles and your ministry continues to grow. And maybe you move into a senior pastor role at some point where you actually can just do that and make enough money to afford a home. So if you buy a house at 27 or 28 years old and you put down a good solid down payment and you stay out of debt and you're a good dad and a good pastor, I would call you a phenomenal success in America.

[Brian Buffini]

Yes, sir, Sir. Yes, sir. And by the way, being a pastor can also be your side hustle. I had a buddy of mine and he was in the same spot. And again, sometimes you can be so heavenly minded, you know, earthly good. I'm here to be a minister and I'm trying to help. And so his side hustle was marry, bury and baptize. And so he said, I'll marry, bury and baptize. And he put a little service out there and he made enough money to go buy himself a house. So your ministry could be your side hustle too. I love it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Danielle is in Des Moines. Hi, Danielle. Your question for the panel.

[Caller]

How's it going?

Good.

[Dave Ramsey]

How can we help?

[Caller]

So my husband and I, we're in our mid-20s and thinking about starting a family soon. So we're looking at buying a house maybe in the next year or two. And we're just wondering what we should be prioritizing in our first house for our family. Like should it be location, size, the cheapest thing possible. And we're trying to put it down 20%.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow, that's great. That's unusual for a first time homebuyer. That's good though, if you could do it. So what do you think? The leading indicator of a home you want to get in but you're not going to live there forever.

[Brian Buffini]

So how many kids you have again, Danielle?

[Caller]

Well, we don't have any right now,

but we're hoping within the next year.

[Brian Buffini]

Well, so you plan for that. Here's the big tip I give people all the time. You'd live in the floor plan, not the square footage. People get caught up in square footage. So sometimes older houses have smaller square footage and better floor plans. You'll see this like you can see a townhome or a condo has lots of square footage, but it's all cut up and chased up or it's a two story. So you live in the floor plan, not the square footage. So start thinking about, okay, Lord willing, if we had a couple of kids, what would that look like? So to me, you want to make sure that you got the best floor plan that's open as possible. And then, you know, I have six kids, me and my bride, which seemed like a great idea at the time. And we prioritize having a yard over everything else. You know, we were going to have those crumb snatchers out there catching balls and running around. And we live where it was a little bit sunny. So to me, again, it's your priorities. So floor plan is key over square footage. And typically the older houses have the better floor plans and then a little bitty yard if you're going to have kids. Those would be the first two for me.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Very good. Very cool. All right, well done, sir. So Brian Buffini has been our guest this hour. Brian, if people want to learn about Buffini and Company, the leading real estate coaching company in the world, how do they do that?

[Brian Buffini]

Well, like I say, we have buffiniancompany.com just check us out if they're interested in, if they're in real estate. That's our specialty. We do real well. We have thousands of clients. We really teach people to take care of their customers. That's what we're all about. And so we help real estate agents do well. And a lot of our agents that we coach are in your program helping folks out there.

[Dave Ramsey]

A lot of our Ramsey trusted agents are coached by Buffini and Company. So that's absolutely perfect. Well, folks, we want to give you hope and we don't want. There's a whole industry that makes a living telling you that there's a bubble and there's a crash coming and the world is coming to an end. And Chicken Little, we sell homes and

[Rachel Cruze]

you could never be a homeowner.

[Dave Ramsey]

You'll never make it. America is dead. People make a living off of that. And that's a lot. Is it different? Yes. Is it hard? Yes. Has it always been some form of hard? Yes. Yes. But can you do it? You control the controllables. You know, stay out of crypto and draftkings and get out. Get yourself out of debt and then adjust your expectations on your first home and you can get yourself into the market and we'll help you do it. We love you. We want you to win.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's right. Brian, thanks for being here.

[Brian Buffini]

It's really love you guys, love your family, love helping people. Today it was a treasure.

[Rachel Cruze]

Thank you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Check out our [e-mail] agent if you want a Ramsey trusted agent to help you do it the way we teach you. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality. My daughter is my co host today. Mary's in Dallas. Hey, Mary, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave.

How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Well, my husband and I have been married 19 years. We're approaching retirement and we've always managed our finances separately. We're a blended family. We don't have a will. And we're struggling to move from talking about major financial decisions to actually making them. We cannot get on the same page. I just don't know how to get there.

[Rachel Cruze]

What's the biggest difference? Mary, if you could explain, like what, what is kind of his mindset with things? What's yours? Where does that conflict come in?

[Caller]

So he has a lack of trust about. He kind of holds most of the liquid assets. I have retirement assets, but he has more liquid assets. We kind of have always split bills and I tend to carry debt and then pay it off. Carry it. I've kind of borrowed money against savings and paid him back. And so his concern is that if we combine finances, then he's not going

to be able to protect our future from you.

From me? Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, that's valid. You keep borrowing money and paying it off with his money and then paying him back. And that scares him. Well, of course it does. It should.

[Caller]

Well, we both work, and I have an outcome.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's observing a pattern that scares him. That is a valid thing. So you have to remove that, you know, that pattern in order for him to be comfortable combining finances, because he's conservative.

[Caller]

Could he.

[Rachel Cruze]

If you guys agreed on the value system of. If we combine finances, debt is no longer part of our family. We are not going to use debt. Would you be okay with that?

[Caller]

That.

Absolutely. I've suggested that we sit down. We sit down and go over our debts, go over our assets, look at everything together, pay off what needs to be paid off, create a household account and help hold me accountable. Hold him accountable.

[Brian Buffini]

That.

[Dave Ramsey]

That. That's healthy. I'm with you on that. But, you know, but if someone observes a behavior pattern and that behavior pattern breaks trust, that's valid. So we've got to solve for that emotionally. He's got to have a reason to believe that you're not going to do this again. And you're saying, as a friend of mine said the other day, he said I had to submit myself to the system. I have to say the system says we don't borrow money. The system says we have a budget that we both agree on. And I had to submit myself to that. In other words, my little wants or little impulses were subject to my agreement with my spouse. And if he believes that, and okay, I will never spend another dime again. That we have not both agreed on. Oh, and by the way, neither will you. If he really believes that that's going to happen, then there's no possible way you could go in debt, Right?

[Caller]

Correct. And I think that. I think that where we haven't gotten on the same page that way is that I think he's too frugal. He thinks I'm too liberal. And so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you do need each other in that regard. In general, if one of you is not over the top. But here's what I would suggest y' all do. Let's try combining the budget, the monthly income budget, and work out of one first. And if we do that, then that addresses now, and then both of you need to hear this part. Okay? The saver needs a spender in his life, so he has a life. Okay?

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because the people that are like him will live in a cave, collect lint, and only come out on triple coupon. Thursday. Right. And that's not. You know. And the saver. Him. The spender. You. Needs a saver in his life. In your life. So you don't have to retire and eat dog food.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because you spend everything, so you can't, you know, so we've got to balance that out. And so there has to be a portion of. Mary, in the budget where there's some fun. In our case, that'd be Rachel. And there's a portion of the. Your husband, which is Rachel's husband. Winston is more like. Your husband is conservative, but he allows for fun and she allows for savings. Because we agree that both of those things are necessary to have a quality life.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, absolutely. Mary, I want to follow back when you mentioned the trust aspect at the beginning of the call, because you said he has a lot of liquid assets. Did you mean trust with the market or you.

[Caller]

I think with me.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so it's a relational trust. Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

Yeah. He has two big things. So one thing we. We have a franchise, and we invested a lot of money into that, and we're not going to come out whole on the other end of that. So he feels very protective of the liquid assets and retirement that he has, which is fine. And then I, at one point, because I handled separate finances, made a decision to do some cosmetic dentistry for one of our children that was substantial, and he felt that was a major financial decision. I didn't discuss with him, which it was. But we handled our finances separately. I have substantial retirement assets, but I really don't have very much liquid at all. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what is your retirement asset base?

[Caller]

A little over a million.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And what's the. Is the franchises a business one of you are running?

[Caller]

It's. It is a business, and I mean, we both own it, but I'm running it. And there's two years left on the franchise.

[Rachel Cruze]

What do you mean?

[Dave Ramsey]

And it's gonna. You're just gonna close it?

[Caller]

I believe so, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so you've been responsible for that. Let me say this carefully. It. Does he say. Does in his mind, does he feel like you're responsible for that failure?

[Caller]

I don't think so. I don't think so. What we've talked about. He said we own that together.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And we made the. And it failed. And we did that together.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. So I would probably sit down, Mary, and you guys need to have a discussion for. To your point, today's point earlier, that maybe some valid. Maybe some valid concerns that he may have. And what does he need to see within you to get any level of that trust back on your side. Because you guys as a couple are going to function better when you see yourselves as a unit. You guys have been married 19 years and you've never combined this part of your life. And so that is a desire of yours. And so there that question I would want to know from him, hey, what are the things that you need to see? And I am willing to make some changes when it comes to the way I handle money or communicate about money. But I do desire that we are seen as one in all of this. Right. And what are those steps to get there? Cause I would be curious what he'd want to see from you. And if it's ridiculous and it's crazy and it's controlling and it is super, you know, all of this, if I don't want you to ever spend money on avocados or something just crazy, then there's gonna be some of his issues that are, that are in this as well. And not just you. And so.

[Dave Ramsey]

But if you have a reasonable acceptance of his need to save, he has a reasonable acceptance of yours to enjoy money. Yes, that's a good, healthy balance inside your budget budget. And that should be there. That's, that's accurate. Rebuilding trust. Henry, Henry Cloud's book, Trust. It gives you a great way to do that. And I think a good entry point here is just first, start budgeting together. If you budget together for 90 days, the amount of discussions you're going to have to get on the same page is going to be amazing.

[Caller]

Foreign.

[Dave Ramsey]

But your money's never going to return the favor if all you do is hope for the best. If you're ready to learn how to make your money work for you, check out the SmartVestor program. SmartVestor can help you find advisors who specialize in retirement planning, charitable giving, advanced investing strategies, and more. Whatever your goals, your pro will take the time to explain your options so you never have to invest in anything you don't understand. Head to ramseysolutions.com smartvestor to get connected. Ramsey Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros. Learn [e-mail] SmartVestor. Alex Alexis. I'm sorry. Is in Fort Wayne, Indiana. Hi, Alexis. How are you doing?

[Caller]

Great.

How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

All right, so me and my husband,

we just, we've owned our home for

a little over a year now and we renovated our entire home and now

we have, we suspect, like 70,000 or more in equity and then we're expecting

our first baby here in July. So we've been working really, really hard to make, like, smart financial decisions.

Our question for you is, would it

be wise to ref our home and

use the equity to put it towards an investment property?

Most likely it would be farmland that

we could later build on. Or should we wait at least one more year and then sell the house after? Like, we don't have to pay capital gains.

[Dave Ramsey]

You should wait and sell the house and not buy something unless you're going to move into it.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because you can't afford investment property. You don't have any money.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you go into debt to buy a piece of land that's just sitting there and you're paying payments on it, that destabilizes your home, where your new baby is. No, we don't do that.

[Caller]

Okay.

Yeah, I think the goal would be to continue to farm that land.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, well, so what?

[Caller]

And make some money off of that farm.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're not farming it now.

[Rachel Cruze]

What do you guys do for a living, Alexis?

[Caller]

My husband is.

He works at a steel mill. And then I am a stay at home mom.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. How much do you guys make a year?

[Caller]

We make anywhere from 5,500 to 7,000amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the land is how much land?

[Caller]

It would be eight acres.

[Dave Ramsey]

Eight acres.

[Rachel Cruze]

What would you farm on it?

[Caller]

Corn, Beans, slightly.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can't make the payments on that, that amount of money with farm and beans on eight acres.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

The numbers don't work. And so it's like he's got a dream of owning some dirt.

[Rachel Cruze]

I was gonna ask, is that like a. Like a passion kind of thing for you guys or what causes you to do that?

[Caller]

Yeah, I think the goal would be,

right now we have a small house that we own, and so the goal would be to eventually build on that property, and then we would like to own some property.

[Dave Ramsey]

There we go. Okay, so now here's what I would do that makes more sense than I'm gonna farm this and call it an investment on eight acres. Okay. That just doesn't. That's not enough to spit on. So, no, what I would do is have your baby, you guys, live your life, stack some cash and say, all right, the goal, to use your phrase, the dream is to buy a piece of property and build a home on it and sell ours and move into the new home on the piece of property. And that piece of property and home after construction are still a reasonable part of our budget. No more than 25% of your take home. Pay on a 15 year fixed. And then if he wants to have a gentleman farm on it and have a little bit of a side hustle, that doesn't kill me. Okay. And that's kind of fun for him, apparently. And so on. Right. But that's truly gentleman farming.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

And your life is about to be so different now, being parents. And so. And I think you did say you're a stay at home mom, so you guys have other kids. But I would take this slow. I would not be in a rush to make these big decisions. I mean, honestly, I think a few years of saving is going to be just fine. And then you guys may sell that house, go rent somewhere to be able to put down a good down payment. Construction, loan, all of that. You know, there may be a process.

[Dave Ramsey]

The reason you are framing this poorly as an investment idea is because you're in a hurry and you have to

[Rachel Cruze]

borrow on your primary residence.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly. If you slow down and make this deal your primary residence later, after the baby's here and you've got some money saved and you make a good solid purchase and you think about building a home on there and selling this home and putting all of the equity into the new purchase and again then it becomes a wise thing. But all of that slows down your excitement level that caused you to move too fast and move into a bad idea. Julian is in Baltimore. Hi, Julian. How are you?

[Caller]

Good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Caller]

Yeah, so I'm in baby step number two and I'm working on paying off my student loans and I have a

little bit of credit card debt left.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much debt?

[Caller]

I.

There's $3,800 on it, which I.

[Dave Ramsey]

On the credit card. How much on the student loan?

[Caller]

Oh, yeah, 70,000 on the student loans.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what do you make?

[Caller]

The big one right now, I just

graduated college in May, So I'm doing 35 hours a week at $17 an hour. So my take home is right around 500.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why did you go to college? What do you make? I mean, what do you do? That's. That's awful.

[Caller]

Yeah, well, that was just my job. I was in college. I'm currently looking for a career, but I. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your degree in?

[Caller]

Science and policy.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, he just graduated.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know. What's your degree in?

[Caller]

Environmental science and policy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So how's the new. How's the big boy job hunt going?

[Caller]

Well, I have my resume. Started tailoring my resume.

I have also applied for to be a game warden with the department of natural resources, which is my second choice, and that would be doing 80,000 a year for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And your degree does somewhat prepare you for that. Okay. Yes, that makes sense. All right, so, yeah, now I'm caught up. Okay. But you need to be in the big boy job quick.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. The way you presented this is like 17 hours.

[Rachel Cruze]

It's been three weeks.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know, but $17 an hour was, like, success or something. It's not success. It's. No, we're not doing that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Anyway, how can I help? How can we help? What's your question?

[Caller]

Yeah, so once I get that big

boy job, and like I said, I'm

on baby step two, but once I get that big boy job, I want

to pay off my loans, but I

also want to save up to buy a ring to propose to my girlfriend.

Yay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I love it.

[Caller]

Thank you. We've been dating for three years, and

I really want to take the next step with her. And I've talked to her family, and

I just was curious how you would do that because I have such a big payment in my student loans. Should I hold off on that for me?

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I think you get rid of the credit card debt, and then you save up some money for a rent, and then you get back on the student loans.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So have you got a. Have you got a budget in mind on the ring?

[Caller]

Yeah, somewhere around 2000.

Two to three thousand.

[Dave Ramsey]

That fits. Good. Good.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. And you may just be working three jobs to get there faster, too, you know?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Hopefully you get the 80,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you get the 80,000, that's it. So a good rule of thumb for those listening, not for you, because I like your 2000. Okay. Okay. But a good rule of thumb is a maximum of one month's pay for your ring. Jewelry store in the mall will tell you three months, but they sell rings. It's like asking a dog if it's hungry. Okay. So of course they're going to do that. But the. So one month. And so in your situation, that 2000 is very reasonable, given that you're going to have to stop paying on your

[Rachel Cruze]

debt to do this.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, but. And I think you're very wise. And, yes, I would do all of that as soon as you possibly can.

[Caller]

Okay. Yeah, the. The credit card should be paid off by the end of July. I also am a lacrosse coach, so I run multiple camps and do individual lessons. So I'm kind of already doing a side hustle on top of that. And that will stay good once I get that Career path.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good.

[Caller]

But. Yeah, so I was. That was.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you'll be able to attack the 70, but. And is she out of school, too?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's her career?

[Caller]

She's a.

[Dave Ramsey]

She's a nurse and she got the passer bars and got the job.

[Caller]

She's finishing up nursing school. So this. This semester, it will be here last semester in December.

[Rachel Cruze]

Will she have debt

[Caller]

a little bit as well?

Yes.

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So when you combine incomes and combine those two student loan debts, and you guys have a wonderful life starting off, and you attack those student loans to get rid of them, and then you go be millionaires, we're going to be so proud of you.

[Caller]

All right. Thank you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Go do it, man. Go do it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well done.

[Dave Ramsey]

Very well done. Good stuff. Good stuff. That's cool.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, fresh off the grad stage. Dave's like, what? What are you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I'm working 35 hours. I heard 35 hours a week at $17. What'd you hear?

[Rachel Cruze]

I heard that, too.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that's the definition of sucks right there.

[Rachel Cruze]

But he also was a lacrosse coach. He's killing it.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, he didn't. That buried that lead.

[Caller]

Hey, what's up, guys? It's Jade Warshaw. Listen, summer spending adds up so fast. Between vacations and road trips and fees and events and all the extra gas and grocery runs, money can get tight before you know it. To really get your money under control and keep it that way, you're gonna need a plan. And that's what you'll get with the EveryDollar budget app. It helps you track your spending, free up cash to put toward debt and savings. And it's the simplest way to make a plan for your money before the month begins. So no more wondering where your money's going. You're telling it where to go. Download EveryDollar in the app store or Google Play and start for free. Free. Today.

[Dave Ramsey]

In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt free stage. Austin and MacKenzie are with us. Hi, guys. How are you doing?

[Caller]

Pretty good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Welcome, welcome. Where do y' all live?

[Caller]

Mount Pleasant, Michigan.

[Dave Ramsey]

Ah, okay. Where's that? Near.

[Caller]

Like in the middle.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Right in the middle.

[Rachel Cruze]

I love Michigan. People always put up the.

[Dave Ramsey]

Always put the hand up. Talk to the hand. Yeah. Good. Very cool. Well, welcome to Nashville. And you're here to do a debt free scream. How much debt have you paid off?

[Caller]

We paid off $117,417.

[Brian Buffini]

Love it.

[Dave Ramsey]

And how long did that take?

[Caller]

19 months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good for you and your range of income during that two years, years.

[Caller]

We started at 100,000 and then we ended at 203,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, that's a little jump. Nice. What do y' all do for a living?

[Caller]

I am a health insurance agent, I'm

a broker and I'm a stay at home mom.

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So how'd you double your income in 18 months, dude?

[Caller]

Well, we actually, once we had our first child, I realized we weren't sure if she was going to stay home or continue to work. And when I was holding her, I realized, realized we have to keep her home with her mom. And that just really set a fire to pick things up for me.

Yeah, so he just worked really hard to up the sales.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

Golly. Baby, will motivate you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You're holding that child. You're like. This just got real.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, my gosh. So.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what was the 117,000 in debt? What kind of debt?

[Caller]

Credit cards, two cards, student loans, personal loan, medical, and our house.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow, you paid off your house?

[Caller]

We sure did.

Yes, we did.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what's the house worth?

[Caller]

It is worth 135,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Very cool. Good for you guys in Mount Pleasant, Michigan. What does that buy? How many square feet is that? How many bedrooms?

[Caller]

It's about a little over a thousand square feet and it's a three bed, one bed bath.

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Very cool. And how old are you too?

[Caller]

27.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you have a paid for house in Michigan?

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's pretty amazing, y'.

[Caller]

All.

It feels good.

Feels great.

[Dave Ramsey]

I bet.

[Rachel Cruze]

Pretty incredible. What year did you guys buy the house?

[Caller]

Two years ago.

Yeah, two years ago. So 22 years ago. Yeah. Yep.

[Rachel Cruze]

Amazing. See, we were just talking last hour about people getting in the market and doing all of this and getting out of debt and all of it. And you guys did all that of it in 18 months? Two years. Basically got in.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not only did they buy a home in their twenties.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

They paid it off in their twenties. Guess what? They bought a 1000. What'd you say? How many square feet?

[Caller]

1000. About a thousand.

[Dave Ramsey]

About a thousand square feet.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well done, you guys. That's amazing.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is not, this is not going to be on the, you know, the land of the rich and famous. But it is a great starter house

[Rachel Cruze]

for kids because you guys are going

[Dave Ramsey]

to start, you're going to be millionaires.

[Brian Buffini]

Yeah.

[Caller]

I mean, hey, hey. It's a roof over our head.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

I love it.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm so proud of you. Way to go. So did you sell anything, like the cars or anything?

[Caller]

No, actually we kept the cars that we currently have. And during the process, I actually called into the show to ask if I should buy a 1976 Corvette. And, yeah, it was interesting. He had told me, not necessarily something that you would have done at that time, but. But to keep it based off the income and where I was at during the baby steps. So probably would have maybe been a little bit sooner if I hadn't done that.

[Rachel Cruze]

But you kept the car.

[Caller]

Yeah, we kept everything.

[Rachel Cruze]

Because we told you to. That. We told you you could.

[Caller]

Yes. Rachel, you gave me a little more trouble than Dave did. Surprisingly.

[Rachel Cruze]

So funny.

[Dave Ramsey]

Surprisingly. We were all together.

[Caller]

Look at that.

Yes, it's funny.

[Rachel Cruze]

I probably was like, sell it. Oh, I think I do remember that. So I was like, I don't get it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but it wasn't. It wasn't. But how much money was.

[Brian Buffini]

Was it.

[Caller]

It was 7700. It was.

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, okay, okay. Oh, so. So what happened 19 months ago that you said, okay, we're going to start this journey to pay off all. I mean, that's a long list of debt.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

I mean, in the house.

[Caller]

Yeah.

I don't think it was anything. One big thing in particular. I think it was just a bunch of little small things. But I think definitely our first daughter being born, we were like, yeah, we gotta. You know, leading up to that, we were like, we gotta get serious about this.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you tell people? The key to doing this is, I

[Caller]

would say, at least for me and the people that I talk to, the ones that don't really make it or get anywhere are the ones that say that it's impossible to do or they just can't do it. And like, for us, we asked, how can we do this? What do we need to do? Exactly. So that's. That was my advice. If you're in that situation where it feels impossible, I definitely ask yourself how? And start from there.

Also, just, like, being honest with yourself and, like, putting the numbers in your face. Cause it took him. I won't say nagging, but persistently being like, hey, let's add up what you spent on this month, you know, and all this stuff. And it took me sitting down and looking at the number that I was spending on fast food to be like, actually, you know what? I can afford to put more money towards my debts. Like, there's no reason I. That I should only be making minimum payments on everything.

[Rachel Cruze]

Wow. So the. I mean, the budget and the revealing of, hey, this is what's going on, and here's what we have to change from a lifestyle perspective. Even.

[Caller]

Absolutely. Just be honest with yourself. Yes. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

So good. Yeah. People live in a little bit of that denial, I think, at times, right, where you're like, it's not a big deal. It's not a big deal. And then, yeah, you add it up,

[Dave Ramsey]

you're like, oh, man, it is a big deal.

[Rachel Cruze]

This could be going towards something great.

[Caller]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well done, you guys.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you guys are content today with an inexpensive home and some inexpensive cars so that you're 100% debt free? And I've often taught, and Rachel has too, that contentment is not on the same spectrum with ambition. Because you're very ambitious at the same time in that you leaned into this. You worked your tail off, double dirt, you cleaned up the mess, you paid it all off in 18 months, house and everything. Oh, my gosh. Where does that contentment come from?

[Caller]

I would say we. We just have a lot of peace knowing that, you know, if something were to happen to me tomorrow, that the girls will be okay, that they're not going to drown in debt. We put a lot of things in place that you guys have recommended to give us that peace. And I'll say I. I know people that have much nicer cars and much nicer homes, but have a lot more stress on their shoulders. And that's just not something that I wish for myself or my family.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah. And I think I. I mean, I'm content with food in the fridge, a roof over our head, and happy daughters, you know, and, you know, just giving it up to God and he's provided what we need, and we don't need anything else. That's. I guess that's where the contentment comes from.

[Brian Buffini]

Yes.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

We complicate our lives so much. Right. I mean, and we. And we do it to ourselves.

[Caller]

Yeah. Chasing after the next big thing.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's right. Absolutely. And that keeps you in a broke cycle for so many people, and they don't even realize it.

[Caller]

Right.

[Rachel Cruze]

And you guys are just a beautiful example of what that looks like, because you're exactly right. I think trading the peace over the stress any day.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruze]

And people crave it. They don't know what to do, so.

[Caller]

Absolutely.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

We'll be saving up. We're currently saving up for our next house.

[Guest Host]

So we can cash.

[Caller]

Yeah, absolutely. So it'll take some time, but. But that's the next goal for us.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. You guys are awesome.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're gonna be able to do. I mean, if you're making a couple of hundred, you're gonna be able to do Whatever you want to do in very short order because you got the stuff in the right order. You didn't go acting like you were richer than you are. And that's gonna set you up to build incredible wealth and generosity. In the meantime, you've got the piece of going, hey, this house, we got no payments. And I'll tell you something else. How long has the house been. How long has the debt been paid off? How many months ago was that?

[Caller]

February is when we paid it off.

[Dave Ramsey]

Have you noticed yet a difference in your sales?

[Caller]

Well, I noticed there's definitely a difference in everything that I do. Knowing that it's paid off. I mean, we've cash flowed three vacations since then as a little celebration, including this one. This will be our last one for a while. But there's definitely a different. There's a calm in the air that we've never felt before.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I've always coached small business owners and sales teams as well. That when you don't have a single debt in the world, you don't have to make a sale. And people can smell it.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you end up increasing your income.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because they don't think. You don't smell needy. A needy salesperson. You can smell it.

[Caller]

The commission breath is awful.

Exactly.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's exactly what it is.

[Rachel Cruze]

And how old are the kids?

[Caller]

She just turned 19 months old. And she just turned five months old.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Did you bring them or are they at home?

[Caller]

Yeah, they're here.

[Dave Ramsey]

You want to put them in the debt free scream?

[Guest Host]

Absolutely.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, let's bring them up then. That's perfect. And what are their names?

[Caller]

This one's Harlan.

[Rachel Cruze]

So great.

[Dave Ramsey]

Little Harlan. Oh, cute.

[Caller]

And the little baby is Maggie.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Rachel Cruze]

So sweet. All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Mom and dad changed their family tree. All right, Count it down. 117,000 paid off in 19 months. Debt free house and everything at 26. Let's see. Hear a debt free scream.

[Caller]

One, two, three. We're debt free.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you got to do the debt free scream early.

[Caller]

So good.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's awesome.

[Caller]

So good.

Oh.

[Dave Ramsey]

You should not feel uncertain about investing. And you don't have to. That's why we created Investing Essentials, a two night virtual event where George Camel and I walk you through my playbook for investing and wealth planning. We'll simplify everything from 401ks and mutual funds to passing on wealth so you can invest with confidence. Tickets start at $199. Get yours today at ramseysolutions.com events or click the link in the show notes. Our scripture of the day. Hebrews 11:6. It is impossible to please God without faith. Anyone who wants to come to him must believe that God exists and that he rewards those who Sincerely seek Him. St. Francis of Assisi said, start by doing what's necessary, then do what's possible, and suddenly you are doing the impossible. People always want to know how I handle my investments. And a couple of years ago, we decided to open Dave's Investing Playbook on real estate and on other things. And that includes what I don't invest in and why. And we called it Investing Essentials. And George Camel and I did a virtual event for two nights. We've only done that two times. We're gonna do it again one more time, and we're gonna change up a little bit of the content and get a little bit into building a lasting legacy and dealing with the issues of wealth inside your family and looking at wills and estate planning just a little bit as well. So we're gonna get into all of that. It's two nights. It's a virtual event. September 1st and 2nd. Me and George Camel tickets start at 1 99. You can get [e-mail] Jasmine is with us in Baltimore. Hi, Jasmine. How are you?

[Caller]

Hey.

I'm really curious how this is gonna go. Thanks for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller]

So I went into some debt. At the time, I wasn't super familiar with your baby steps, but I'm in baby step number two now building a homeschool app. And I'm thinking about taking some certificates, paying to take some AI product management certificates to put me in a different tax bracket. Entry level is like 100k. Can be, like, anywhere between 100k and 200k starting pay. And I'm wondering, is it like, it's such a competitive field, Is it worth me paying in to take those certificates and putting that time in to come out the other side, hoping to put that money back into my business.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you already in the technological field?

[Caller]

Well, I'm the product manager for the app that I built. Like, I built this app from scratch for homeschoolers.

[Dave Ramsey]

That means you did it by yourself at your kitchen table.

[Caller]

No, no, I. I hired a web development company. But, like, I chose, like, how everything's supposed to function. Like, where the buttons are supposed to be, what needs to connect to what. Like, I designed it completely from that. And that's what a product manager does.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know what a product manager does. I have a bunch of them. Works for me. Okay,

[Caller]

I'm sorry.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's okay. The so I but I just didn't visualize how you're doing so but you've got no software engineering experience at all?

[Caller]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right.

[Rachel Cruze]

And what would the courses is it the what you're going to to get and learn in those for the app or you said it's going to put you in a different tax bracket like

[Dave Ramsey]

what she just means she's going to

[Rachel Cruze]

make more money how though make more

[Caller]

money so I can move the business

[Rachel Cruze]

faster with with the day job make more money in what you're currently doing

[Caller]

or with the app make more money with getting the project management AI Project management certificates to get a different job.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. So right now I'm about 60. I gotcha.

[Caller]

I gotcha.

[Rachel Cruze]

Gotcha. And the field at which you're looking to get in is AI Project. Yes, I know. Thank you. I I yes. But I'm asking is that is the type of online course that you're taking do they see that as because it's kind of it's all pretty new. Do they need that as a standard or are they looking for something else? I just want to make sure you don't get in this and get something that people are like I don't even know what this is. And then does it really doesn't do

[Caller]

much for you know the Coursera certificates that you can get are specialized for project management training and then there's some for AI project management training. And if you pay like $300 you get access to like 10,000 different courses. I only need maybe four different certificates and I'm really burnt out at my job that I'm at and it's, it's not moving the needle fast enough for me.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So yes, I would spend $300 on continuing education. Yes, I would pursue your dream. Where I've got a disconnect is that someone told you this guarantees and opens these doors and I'm not sure it does.

[Caller]

Right. That's why I'm like should I okay, so yes, do it. But I don't know that I'll get a job doing it. But I know that I, I, I have it in me to do that job if I were to get that job.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes. Have you talked to people though that are that the job is out there and you could apply for it and they're saying hey, you do need these courses and then you could be in the running.

[Dave Ramsey]

Have you already got any certs in project management not counting AI?

[Caller]

No, I don't I just have proof that I can like that I can do the job because of that. What I've already done built the app

[Rachel Cruze]

that you did as proof too. Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So I'll be. Here's what's running through my mind. All right? We have 400 people of our thousand people that are in the technology side of things. Obviously we're leaning heavily into AI and obviously we have several project managers and lots of product squads working on things that are being led by different people.

[Caller]

People.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm trying to think through if this would cause us to consider hiring you. The fact that you built an app for your homeschool thing, I don't know if that qualifies you to be a project manager, even though you actually did manage a project. I'm not arguing that. I'm not sure we would hire you. And I'm not sure we would hire you because you had a certificate that says you're an AI project manager that costs you $300 to go through course there. I, I, I think we would talk to you.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's why I'm asking the companies that you're wanting to work for, Jasmine, what are they saying?

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not a golden key that opens the door.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, but it's not Ramsey. She's asking.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, but it is. She's wanting to get a job making $100,000 a year.

[Rachel Cruze]

I know, but in technology companies, trust me, I got some friends working in those. Plenty of money there. It's crazy. So I was wondering, like, has she talked, like, when she's looking at these jobs, are they saying this is a hole that has to be filled and this is a way to fill that hole, or is it work experience? Like, I'm trying to figure out what it is for that next step. And is it courses or is it not?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, There is plenty of money in technology companies, and we pay a lot of money to the technology team here. That's true. All of those are true. The only question I've got is whether this actually is the golden key that opens the door. And I'm not sure it is. And so what would be the next

[Rachel Cruze]

step for her to get on that path is my question.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think I would talk to someone who's actually doing the job that she wants to do, talk to the company.

[Rachel Cruze]

Company she's applying for.

[Caller]

I agree.

[Dave Ramsey]

Find someone that is doing AI project management and say, okay, what would qualify? What would make me get an interview and possibly get hired? Would this certificate help? Or is it a slam dunk if I've got the certificate? Or nobody gives a Crap. If I've got their certificate and talk to somebody who's actually doing that, and I think you're going to find that they're going to want some. If you want to be a project manager and you want to be an AI, both are cutting edge situations, you probably are going to have to have something more than what I'm hearing here. But I might be wrong. So I do want you to discover all of that. I don't want you to spend $300 and then be vastly disappointed that you didn't walk into the first place. And they went, oh, we have to have you. You got a Corsair certificate, which I'm pretty sure is not going to happen. Okay, so. And you Suddenly go make $100,000 a year. I just, it's. No, I don't believe that's gonna happen. But I do believe that you're on the right track and I want you to continue pursuing.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, I would use Ken Coleman's principle, the proximity principle. Go talk to people in that field, Jasmine. And again to those companies that you're looking at to apply for and go out to coffee with some of them, like, hey, what are the first four things I need to be doing to get myself in the running for this? Cause this is a passion of yours. You're obviously somewhat educated in it because you built an app and you're like, you're actually in that world doing it. You're pressing the buttons, you're talking to the people. Develop like you are in this world. And so what's the next formality to actually make you in the running for it? And it may be this certificate, it may not. We don't know. But I would go talk to people in that field.

[Dave Ramsey]

Folks, the danger I want everybody out there to look for is this. Don't. When someone tells you in a trade school or a certificate program or a four year old, your education, that this is going to be the magic pill that makes your life all good. It's not. You're the secret sauce, not the education piece. You're the secret sauce that gets the job, keeps the job. And so when someone says, oh, we'll put you in a higher tax bracket, that sounds like a sales pitch from a trade school to me. And so I don't want you to fall for that. I want you to have good, solid information about make these decisions that puts us hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace. And that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace, Christ Jesus.