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Dave Ramsey
Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey network in the Fairwinds credit union studio, this is the Ramsey show. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality number one best selling author, co host of the smart money happy hour. My daughter is my co host today. Open phones at Triple 882-55-5225. Phillip is in Los Angeles. Hi Philip, how are you?
Caller
Hello.
I'm okay.
How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Better than I deserve. What's up?
Caller
Well, I'm having difficulty staying away from new debt and I'm on baby step number two and I'm having difficulty with budgeting.
Dave Ramsey
Okay, Philip, those would go together. That makes sense.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah. Is it any, any type of like business that are all consumer debt in your household that you're trying to stay away from?
Caller
Consumer.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. Any specific type that you find yourself in a lot?
Caller
Credit cards and. Medical.
Rachel Cruze
Medical and credit cards. What's going on with the medical.
Caller
Oh my. Well, just having difficulty with the copays
and doctors and dentists and things like that.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. More just routine type medical things or is there an ongoing sickness or concern?
Caller
Routine.
Rachel Cruze
Routine. Okay. Okay.
Dave Ramsey
How old are you?
Caller
49.
Dave Ramsey
49. How many kids you got?
Caller
Zero.
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Are you single?
Caller
I'm married.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And what's your household income?
Caller
I would guess 40, $45,000 a year.
Dave Ramsey
What do y' all do for a living?
Caller
My wife is in clerical and I work as a.
In a grocery store as a courtesy clerk.
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
It doesn't sound like you guys are peeking out on your careers.
Caller
Correct?
Yeah, I'm not.
My wife is okay with hers.
Rachel Cruze
You mean?
Caller
Yes.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. But $45,000 in Southern California for two
Dave Ramsey
people working 40 hours. That's not. You're not working.
Caller
Yeah, I'm not working 40 hours a week.
That's right.
I'm a part timer.
Dave Ramsey
Why?
Caller
Just the way that the company does it.
Dave Ramsey
No, why are you working? Not working 40 hours doing something.
Caller
I'm looking for a 40 hour week job and it's hard right now for me.
Rachel Cruze
Have you ever had one? A different type of career?
Caller
I've done other things with cashiering and with driving.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Caller
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Is there something that's. That you are facing or that you're trying to work your way through that we're not understanding here that's keeping a 49 year old man from getting a job and holding it down?
Caller
Yeah.
A lot of emotional stuff. A lot of baggage.
Yeah.
I have a long History.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And so that's. That's also playing into the medical bills.
Caller
Right, Right.
Dave Ramsey
Okay.
Caller
All right.
Dave Ramsey
Now that makes more sense. Okay. Little more mercy then. All right. And so here's the thing. There's a connecting line here between these things. Let me kind of walk through it.
Caller
So.
Dave Ramsey
So the emotional healing produces a version of Philip that allows him to work more and earn more, which allows him to have more money to budget. And so the actual cause of some of the things you called about goes all the way back to you completing your healing journey. Is that logical to you?
Caller
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. And so in other words, the stronger version of Philip we have, that's got the scars of the past healed enough to function at full capacity. And then that version of Philip works 60 hours, two jobs, three jobs. And that version of Philip brings home a lot more money than $45,000 in Los Angeles.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And that, then that changes the whole budget transaction.
Rachel Cruze
It does. But I also have Dr. John Deloney in my head. Philip, where he is, he leans into. You have to have action as well. I'm all about you healing from, you know what it is. But there's. But there's been a pattern. It sounds like most of your adult life where you've haven't gone beyond what you're doing now. And I think I would. It's a both ands. Yes, I do think. But you have to action in the healing step.
Caller
Yes.
Rachel Cruze
And the action of getting up at 6am, going to a job, getting dressed, getting out the door, being somewhere with an accountability of being on time or working hard and exhausting yourself till 5pm, 6pm for dinner, and you leave and go home, there's a. There's a confidence and a rhythm that'll double your income. That is good for you, Philip, Paired with being able to, you know, unpack what you need to unpack and understand yourself and not have high levels of anxiety, all of that. But I think it's a both ands. And so if I were you, I think it's part of your healing journey to go and be productive, because I think that's going to give you some confidence. And when you get paychecks in that are double what it is now and you can sustain a fan and sustain you and your wife, and you're not behind and you're not so stressed and bogged down and feeling like, oh my gosh, I don't know how we're gonna make the next paycheck. Some of that confidence of, hey, look, we're literally bringing in tangible Money double what we were. And that. Not that money brings you confidence, but you know what I'm saying? Like, it will. It will give you a sense of pride and dignity that I think is
Dave Ramsey
really good for you, Philip. That swaggerty walk versus sleeping.
Rachel Cruze
I mean, versus being home till 11, working a half day or. You know what I mean? Like, I think there's a level of that busyness and productivity that's gonna be really good for you, Philip. And you have to stay current on your bills. There's a point that, yeah, there's not gonna be much of a choice, or you guys are gonna get behind and live off credit cards for the rest of your life, and that's gonna cause more stress and anxiety. So.
Dave Ramsey
So what I would do that'll help. That'll help push you into that. Is to go back all the way to the beginning of the call and answer your actual question was, okay, I'm struggling with budgeting, and I'm str.
Brian Buffini
Debt.
Dave Ramsey
Staying away from debt. And so the way you fix both of those things is the same way. We're talking about this other issue with great intentionality and action. So the intentionality is I'm going to ask you to pretend that someone is paying you $100,000 a year to manage this couple's budget in Los Angeles. And this couple's budget has a husband named Philip. And if you were paid to do that, you could do it, and you could sit down. I talk to you. You're an intelligent guy. You can sit down and do a budget, and we'll hook you up with EveryDollar, the budgeting app. And you and your wife sit down, and you say, all right, we're going to tell every dollar before it gets here what to do, and then we're going to stick to that. That's intentionality. Then when you're doing that and there's a problem, then you've gotta say, well, the reason we're doing all of this is to get out of debt and stay out of debt. So we're not gonna use debt to fix our problems anymore or our impulses or our whatever. But the reason debt is popping up is you don't have a good, solid, detailed plan. Because if you got a good, solid, detailed plan, it's gonna point out that you need more income, and you're gonna go get the income.
Rachel Cruze
Well, and I would assume your rent and Los Angeles has got to be most of your paycheck. I mean, if you're bringing home four. Four grand a month, not even. I Mean, yeah. I mean, two grand a month. I mean, I don't know. I just. I think that there's. When you start to look at the math and see you guys will probably be. I mean, you're probably already cutting back, but I would cut up the credit cards, not make it an option. And that will force the math to show you that the income really is the major problem here.
Dave Ramsey
Exactly. Exactly. There's two sides to the equation, folks. The income side and the outgo side. And you want to win, you got to beat both of them. You gotta be increasing your income constantly thinking about long term and short term. What can I do to get the income up? And what can I do long term and short term to get the outgo down? Sell a stupid car? Sell the boat? I don't know. What is it? What's in your way? What's keeping you from winning? When I'm done talking to you, you're still gonna be okay, and I'm still gonna be okay. But what's keeping you from winning?
Rachel Cruze
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Dave Ramsey
So just like we told the last guy, 100% of people who win at anything do it with intentionality. They do it on purpose. No one accidentally is married for 45 years. Sharon and I are getting ready to hit 44. It's not accidental. No one accidentally raises great kids. It's a lot of work and a lot of intentionality. No one accidentally stays in shape. Donuts Accidentally happen, not staying in shape.
Brian Buffini
Okay?
Dave Ramsey
And so you got to do everything intentionally. And when you're doing it intentionally with money, it means you're working some kind of a system, some kind of a plan to build wealth. Ours has been proven because we get you out of debt so that you don't have any payments. And now you got money to build wealth with and be generous with and have fun with. And the best way to do that is with the budgeting app, where you lay it all out. And our budgeting app, EveryDollar, leads you with personalized coaching and customized plans right through the Ramsey plan. So if you want to do this stuff, download this app for free every dollar in the app store or Google Play. Jack's in Tampa. Hi, Jack. How are you?
Caller
I'm all right. How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Better than I deserve. What's up?
Caller
So I've got a couple of questions. I am fresh out of school. I just graduated from the University of Tennessee last year.
Rachel Cruze
Well done.
Caller
Go Balls.
Dave Ramsey
What's your degree in?
Caller
I got a degree in supply chain management.
Dave Ramsey
Whoa. Good for you, killer. You landed the first big job.
Caller
I did. Well, it's actually construction job, so not exactly what I studied, but yeah.
Dave Ramsey
So what are you making?
Caller
I got a pretty, pretty solid job. I'm making 80 grand a year straight out of school.
Dave Ramsey
That's sweet. Good for you.
Caller
Yes, sir. Thank you. So I guess the main, main question I have is my girlfriend is still in school and she is. She does not have an income right now. She's in school to get her dpt, so doctorate of physical therapy. And then at which point she will be in debt at around 70. She'll be around 70 grand in debt after getting out of school. I currently am saving for a ring. I don't have any debts at the moment.
Good.
I just don't have a ton in my savings. And I'm worried that once that 70 grand hits, I mean, assuming things go well with my girlfriend, which I fully do plan on, I plan on getting engaged and all that stuff, but I'm just kind of looking at that and it's a little nerve wracking to have that kind of over my head.
Dave Ramsey
You're a supply chain guy. You're looking down the field, down the line and seeing what's coming. Way to go, man.
Caller
Yes, sir.
Dave Ramsey
Like, actually like you were trained to do. Congratulations.
Rachel Cruze
So are you worried that you won't be able to make the payment or clear it up?
Caller
I'm just not. I'm worried that I won't be able to clear it up.
Dave Ramsey
When does she graduate?
Caller
She'll graduate in about a year, but she won't start having a job until I think she said October. Why not have next or. I think it just takes a little bit of time. They've got to pass a couple certifications outside of school through the summer.
Rachel Cruze
She'll do that.
Dave Ramsey
Okay, so she's got to pass her board.
Rachel Cruze
And then when she, when she gets a job in October of next year, what will she be making? What's starting salary for her?
Dave Ramsey
60 to 80.
Caller
It's look. Yeah, it's looking like around 80 to 90k.
Rachel Cruze
Okay, well, why don't you just live off your. Assuming you guys get married in that time period, why don't you guys. Yeah. Live off your income, which will probably be up a little bit more of 80, and then throw her income at her debt and you guys are out in a year.
Caller
Okay, but I'm looking, I'm just looking at my savings. I've currently got around 3 grand in a high yield savings account, like 202 grand.
Dave Ramsey
But you've been working a whole month.
Caller
Okay.
Rachel Cruze
And she's gonna have.
Caller
She's gonna have.
Rachel Cruze
She's gonna have an income, Jack. She'll have an income.
Caller
Right?
Dave Ramsey
So, you know, you. If you save like a crazy man between now and the time you get married, when would you think you get married? Before October of next year?
Caller
No, definitely not. Probably the next two to three years.
Dave Ramsey
Why?
Rachel Cruze
He's like, whoa, whoa. I'm saving for a reason.
Caller
Marriages rings a lot coming down the pike. And I'm sort of. She doesn't live with me, but we do hang out a lot. I live with my brother, but we kind of. I pay for most, pretty much everything, which I'm comfortable doing.
Dave Ramsey
And you don't need to be paying for anything of yours until you're married. And you need to be piling up cash, buy ring in cash, have an emergency fund in cash, and then pile up cash if you're engaged to where? I think by the time you get married, and you probably need to get married sooner than you're thinking, but by the time you get married, you'll probably have enough to pay it off or almost pay it off. And then the two of you will be making 200,000 between the two of you by then, my gosh, man, you'll be able to knock it out in no time.
Caller
Okay, well, that makes it a little bit better.
Rachel Cruze
And listen too. This is not your responsibility to pay on her debt until you are married.
Dave Ramsey
Exactly. Do not pay A dime of it.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah. So if you did your way and you guys got married in three years though, then you shouldn't be stressed about it. Because her problem. Yeah, that's her problem, not yours at that point.
Dave Ramsey
But if you're getting married, you know, she passes her boards, she gets a job in October. You get married in October, you might not have 70 by then stored up, but you might, you really might. That's 18 months from now. You're making 80, 90K and you don't have any expenses.
Rachel Cruze
So what the flip are you gonna
Dave Ramsey
do with all that money he's got?
Rachel Cruze
Well, it's 70,000.
Caller
I don't.
Rachel Cruze
He's making 18 months. Yeah. So I mean, he's gonna probably save for the wedding, save for a ring. Yeah, there's some stuff. But all that to say you guys together once you were mar. Yes, you'll be fine. I appreciate the caution and a little bit of that unease because if, because if I am Jack, and I'm like, okay, I'm debt free. I'm now going above my net worth and saving and then I'm going to have this massive debt entering my life once I get married, that will fe. That can feel weighty for sure. But that's just so emotional. It's not logical. When you look at both of the numbers of what you guys are making, you'll be fine.
Dave Ramsey
And you know, I'm bragging on you, Jack, about getting your degree in supply chain, your decision making paradigm that you're taught, your method of thinking that you're taught in order to get that degree can work against you as you're planning this marriage. And you'll get paralysis of the analysis and go, we'll get married in eight years. No, you need to just, old man to young man, get married if she's the one.
Rachel Cruze
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. If you're gonna get engaged, don't. We don't need 73 month engagements. Good lord. All because you overanalyze stuff. So don't analyze it. Get done. Get it done, man. And you know you're gonna be okay. Both of you got great careers, both of you. Neither one of you did stupid degrees in left handed puppetry or something. You both got the ability to step out of school into 80 grand. Nope. I mean, not many degrees do that. So pretty strong. Pretty strong. You guys are going to be fine. And don't, oh, don't use your training and overanalyze getting married. Just do it. Jeff is in Raleigh. Hey, Jeff, what's up?
Caller
Hey guys, thanks so much. For taking my call. Longtime listener.
Dave Ramsey
Thanks.
Caller
First time calling. So I have essentially completed baby steps one, two, and three. I got rid of the stupid truck. $60,000 truck. Twelve hundred dollars a month payment. That's gone and out the window.
Dave Ramsey
How painful.
Caller
Married.
Oh, it still hurts.
What kind of truck was it but a 3500 Silverado? I pulled a trailer all over the
Dave Ramsey
country, so that was hard to sell. That's a great truck. Good for you. You manned up, did the right thing. You're acting like a grown up. Way to go.
Caller
If I could have built one, I'd have built that one. So it sucked, but it was the right thing to do.
Dave Ramsey
Yep.
Caller
According to you. And it seems to be it is the right thing.
Dave Ramsey
But I hate. I'm. I'm with you. I hate it.
Rachel Cruze
How can we help? Je?
Caller
So I'm 29, I'm married, I have two kids. We have essentially eliminated our debt to this point outside of our home. And a HELOC that we took out on the home to help eliminate that debt. We had almost $80,000 in credit card debt that the HELOC paid off, which took the interest down to 6% with the HELOC over 20 years, versus, you know, $3,000 a month in credit card bills that we were paying.
Dave Ramsey
Well, you're not in baby step three then. You didn't eliminate the debt. You moved it.
Caller
So.
Yeah, so that was kind of. My question is, should my next step
Dave Ramsey
be pay off the heloc? Yes.
Caller
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Yes, you did.
Caller
You.
Dave Ramsey
You didn't get out of debt yet. You just moved your debt. And you can't hide from it. It's still there. So you need. You need to draw back and punch that thing in the nose and finish it up.
Caller
Sam.
Dave Ramsey
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Rachel Cruze
from Lewis in Connecticut. How should interest from High Yield Savings accounts be handled? I've so far ignored the accumulating interest because of baby step 6 and 7. Still feel very surreal. Should I be entering the interest as income on the EveryDollar app to include it into paying more on the house giving and investing or should I leave it in savings and let it continue to grow? I probably. It's funny, we actually have our interest as income on the Every Dollar app on our High Yield Savings. Just to like, hey, we're making this.
Dave Ramsey
You don't have a mortgage.
Rachel Cruze
It's available, do it? No, but I'm just saying in general, if you have a lot of money in savings that high yield, it's wild what it can produce year after year. So it is a real thing that
Dave Ramsey
if you're on Baby step six, you should not have a lot of money in savings.
Rachel Cruze
It should be gone.
Dave Ramsey
You should have your emergency fund.
Rachel Cruze
But I just felt that the amount
Dave Ramsey
of high yield savings that that is producing should be minimal. And so what that tells me is you got a whole big chunk of money sitting in High Yield Savings. You should have thrown at the mortgage. That's what I think's going on, Louis. Otherwise there wouldn't be enough money to save it.
Rachel Cruze
Save it for something else.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, I mean 3% on 30,000 bucks is $900 a year. That's not enough to ask this question over. Okay, you would throw that. You just pick that up and throw it at the mortgage. It's a no brainer. But you got a bunch of money in there. You've been saving money over. You've not, you've not applied your. You got all this high yield savings. Instead of putting on your mortgage, you need to take your dadgum mortgage and get rid of it.
Rachel Cruze
Unless they are saving for something specific that they're going to use that money for.
Dave Ramsey
Again, it shouldn't be $200,000 worth of something. I mean, it should be the amount you should have. I mean, you're saving for Christmas or saving for replacing a car or something like that. A vacation.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. Fair. Okay.
Caller
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
Shouldn't be that much money.
Rachel Cruze
I know, but when he said that, I was like, oh, my gosh.
Dave Ramsey
That's what you do. But you have a lot in high yield saving. All are doing other things with that.
Rachel Cruze
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
And you don't have a mortgage. Yeah. Yeah. So do I. But. Yeah, but in that case, you would just take that interest and do exactly what you said and add it to income.
Rachel Cruze
Sure.
Dave Ramsey
Andrew's in little Rock. Hi, Andrew. How are you?
Caller
I'm doing well. How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Better than I deserve. What's up?
Caller
Yes. Thank you so much for taking my call. I'm a longtime listener, and we are. We are very sick and tired of being sick and tired, and we are trying to figure out how to best go about, you know, getting out of debt. We currently have two junk cars that we are driving. Both have a lot of issues, however, and we're trying to figure out if we should fix them or if we should buy another one or in what would be a fair, safe amount to put towards them.
Rachel Cruze
How much are the repairs costing you guys?
Caller
Well, right now they are asking me about three grand to fix the suspension and ac problems we're having and. And batteries.
Dave Ramsey
What is the car. What's the car worth?
Caller
It's worth 3,000.
Dave Ramsey
Oh, no. You don't spend three grand on a $3,000 car. That's a net zero. So you don't fix the suspension, and the suspension is the big number there. All you want to do is fix the ac and you got to put a battery in it, right?
Caller
Yeah, yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Don't fix the suspension on a $3,000 car. It's gone.
Caller
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
I mean, if the suspension has completely gone out to where the car is sitting on this, sitting on its belly on the road, which didn't happen. This is just a mechanic that looked and said, oh, your suspension's loose. Yeah, well, so what? But guess what? It's a trashy car. Of course the suspension is loose. It's worn out. That as long as the car will drive. Will it drive?
Caller
It does drive.
Dave Ramsey
Good. It's just loosey goosey, right?
Caller
Yeah, Yeah. I mean, it runs. It runs fine for the most part. It does make a lot of squeaky sound.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Here's one.
Caller
We just don't talk about safety.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. I was driving a car that's probably worth 400 after I went broken. The main color of it was Bondo. Okay. And it had 418,000 actual miles on it. It was an absolute piece of crap. And I drove that car for what felt like 10 years, one three month period. And during that three months, all I thought about was how bad I hate this car. And I spent all my waking hours working to put money together to move up a little bit in car and pay cash and then move up a little bit of car and pay cash. And that's why today when someone gripes about Dave Ramsey bought a nice car, well, kiss my butt. I know what it feels like to have been there. And I'm not going to drive that anymore. I don't have to. I worked my way out of that hole. So what I want you to do is get really, really mad about being here and don't call me back in four years and say I listen to you all the time. I'm driving junk cars. You need to go get out of that junk car by getting this mess cleaned up in your finances and work your way butt off. Get mad about driving something that.
Rachel Cruze
And realistically, Andrew, it may only last you guys another four to five months.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
And then if it save on the side. Yes.
Dave Ramsey
Throw it away and buy another three thousand dollar car. But don't spend three thousand dollars on a three thousand dollar car.
Rachel Cruze
Yep.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Those are throwaway cars. And let me tell you guys, if you're at that level, okay, this car that I'm talking about was loaned to me. It wasn't even my car, which is even worse. And like the cops are following me around because they're like what are you doing driving this car on this end of town? You know, and it's like are you here to rob something? You know? And so I'm looking up what I was being profiled based on my car. You don't know what Bondo is?
Rachel Cruze
I don't think so.
Dave Ramsey
Bondo is the filler you put in when you have a car wreck. Used to, they don't do it anymore.
Rachel Cruze
Oh. Or it's okay, it's showing on hardwoods.
Dave Ramsey
Well, yeah, it's a filler. Okay. Like if you had a dent you
Brian Buffini
would fill the dent.
Rachel Cruze
I got the joke now.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Okay. So the predominant color was dent, was Bondo dent filler.
Rachel Cruze
Okay, that makes sense. I always pictured like a red door and a. Oh, thank you. Google image.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, there we go.
Rachel Cruze
Well done. All right.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. You sand that stuff in.
Rachel Cruze
Oh, I see.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Fill it in and then you paint over it. Okay? So lesson learned. All right, so here's the thing though, guys. Tell me if you are. If you are in that market for a short period of time. It should be for a short period of time because you're so pissed off that you're willing to do anything to never drive like that again. I'm gonna drive like no one else so that I never have to drive like no one else again. I'm gonna pay a price to get out of this mess. And part of it is I'm gonna drive a car that we have to give it a name. Cause it's pitiful old blue, Big Bessie, whatever it is, right? And you have to have a little yacht horn going, brrrr. So go. So if you want to buy one of those, here's where you get them. Garage sales. This is a thousand dollar two thousand car Facebook marketplace. And this Facebook marketplace too. This is a dog ugly car. No car dealer would even put this on their lot. It's ancient, but it has not many miles and has a lot of life left in it. But you couldn't tell it cosmetically. That's what you're looking for when you're buying a 2 or 3,000, $4,000 car. It's zero sex appeal and you will get no dates if you're single based on your car. This is what you're looking for for a short period of time. And you go bananas on that. Because a car is the thing that kills your finances. And I love cars. I've got nice cars now, but they kill your finances. And if this is going on year after year after year after year, I'm not saying drive that kind of car for three years. I'm saying do it for three months, five months, eight months, whatever. And we're just going absolutely crazy. Be sure you take pictures of it. And you can put them, you know, you can. Later on you can show them to your grandchildren when you have or your great grandchildren and say, back in 26, we drove this car. And that's why you ain't poor no more, kid. You can do the grandpa thing, right? You know, we changed our family tree back in 26, you know, and because that, that's the stuff you're doing right now, Andrew, I'm proud of you now, now. But you're gonna have to suck it up and knock it in the face. You got to get after it. You got to get pissed off. I'm not living like this I've never been poor. I've only been broke. Poor is a state of mind. Broke is. I'm passing through.
Caller
It's.
Dave Ramsey
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Caller
Hi, Dave. How are you guys?
Dave Ramsey
Better than we deserve. How can we help?
Caller
Okay, I think this is like a really good question for you and your daughter. How should you set up hate in a family business? That is my basic question.
Rachel Cruze
Like market value, you pay?
Caller
No, like, I can. I can, like, go into it. So I make $120,000 a year working for my dad and I'm asked for a raise and he just acts like. Acts like I'm capped out. And there's like, no other way to advance in a family business. And I'm wondering if you should be working towards shares or what you feel
Rachel Cruze
that way or that was told to you.
Caller
I feel that way. Like, I haven't had a raise in 10 years and my dad says I'm capped out. Like, that's as much as we can pay you for your job.
Dave Ramsey
Okay, so the answer to your question overall is what Rachel said, and that is that what you should be paid in a family business is what the job pays. And so if the job you're in is capped out, that's fine. But if you weren't there and your dad had to hire someone else to do that job, what would he have to pay in the market?
Caller
Probably now about 120,000.
Dave Ramsey
And what do you make?
Caller
About 120,000.
Dave Ramsey
Okay, then why would you make more than he would have to pay to replace you?
Caller
Well, that's kind of my question. That, like, it's a generational family Business. And that's not how my grandpa did it. He paid his kids way more so they could save and buy. Buy more locations. It's a very large business.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Well, so what I would do in that case is not to pay you more for your job, but I would give you some percentage of Prof. As a family member and treat you like an owner. Okay. Whether you got percentage actual of actual ownership or whether you got paid as an owner. So what you should do in this situation or in this thing is to say, all right, let me ask you this. If you went and got a job doing what you do somewhere else, what
Caller
could you get paid for? The industry, it's got a little bigger about after a couple years, probably about what I'm at right now, about 120. But I've been working for my dad. 20.
Dave Ramsey
Doesn't matter how long you've been working there. What matters is what the job is worth. And I think we clearly have assumed established in this conversation, this job's worth what you're being paid. You're not being underpaid.
Caller
Correct.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And you're not being overpaid now. So then we separate the being paid for the job with being an owner. So you've got employee and you've got owner, and you can wear both hats, but just not. You just don't confuse them and convolute them. And so if your dad wanted to be like your granddad and move some dollars your way out as an ownership position, even if it wasn't an actual stock, but instead I'm going to give you some percentage like grandpa used to say.
Rachel Cruze
You. What is the profit of the company each year? Net profit?
Caller
Net profit, about 8 to 10 million.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. Do you have other siblings in the business?
Caller
I do not. But I have cousins in the business, so that's where my dad has five business partners.
Rachel Cruze
And are the cousins paid just for their jobs as well, or are they
Caller
paid just for their jobs, but they're paid just as much as me? Like, it doesn't make any sense how they set up the pay structure.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Caller
Okay.
That's kind of. So I guess my Dave's right. Like, I can separate the job. I know I'm not overpaid or underpaid. I know I'm getting what I get for my job. But my question more is like my dad had told me at one point, you know, give me $100,000 and I'll sell you my shares of this. And I had the money to do. Then he reneged on that, and then
Dave Ramsey
That's a different discussion.
Caller
Wait till I'm dead or. I just don't know how most families do it.
Dave Ramsey
Most families do it, but they don't renege.
Caller
Yeah, but just. Should a dad be willing to sell the share? Should it be something gifted? I mean, for that ownership?
Dave Ramsey
Either one's okay. There's not an ethical construct on that. Lots of the small business owners we work with sell their shares to the next generation. That's not unusual at all. Some of them allow them to participate in profits, to buy out the percentages over time, quickly. Some of them gift them and just gift them and so it's not a thing. So, you know. But there's not a. You know, your dad's not. Now the only thing he's done that I've heard so far in this whole conversation that's wrong is reneging.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And so when was that?
Caller
That was maybe about two years ago. And his reasoning was he wouldn't be able to be the president, the corporation because he'd have less shares than some of his brothers. And some attorney advice. I don't know. So.
Dave Ramsey
So would you be some of his shares or all of his shares when that was the.
Caller
No, just a small port, like a hundred thousand dollars, like maybe like a 1% stake of his shares just for me, you know, like, just to give your kid to have some. Like, he just doesn't want to give me something, which I understand, you know, he wants.
Dave Ramsey
So how many brothers are in the deal?
Caller
He has three brothers and two cousins in the deal. So.
Dave Ramsey
Okay.
Caller
It's a lot.
Dave Ramsey
And you've got cousins in the deal also.
Caller
Yeah. And we're all kind of trying to figure out how to get away. It's like my grandpa set it up more simply because he was one person and, you know, put a cap on all the stores to get a rent check and then gave like a 10% profit sharing. So my dad was making way more than a job entailed, but. And then my great grandpa actually just sold the business to his sons and allowed them to pay him with the profits over the years from the business. So there's a bunch of different ways, and I don't.
Dave Ramsey
Well, here's what I think should happen for the good of the business and all the people that we're talking about, brothers and cousins and everything else you guys do not. Your dad and his generation does not have a plan.
Caller
Correct.
Dave Ramsey
And that is going to kill y'.
Caller
All.
That's a more serious issue.
Dave Ramsey
It's going to run off all the family Members that are talented because they're going to go do something else with their life. And it's also, you know, they're holding on so tightly. Oh, God, I won't be the president. And there's no succession planning. There's no generational agreement on what we're going to do. There may not even be good partnership agreements between him and his brothers. I don't know.
Caller
Right.
Dave Ramsey
If they want to save this business generationally, they need to sit down starting next week and put together a partnership agreement that they all agree to. And then B, it needs to include a succession plan of what to do with you and your generation and how to make the transition in ownership and how to make the transitions in profits. So an example would be, with what you've told me about this, that would be healthy from a mental health and a relational health standpoint. I don't know if your bunch can pull it off, but a good thing would be that you guys sit down and the brothers come up with an operating agreement that. That says your dad is the president until such time, regardless of his ownership position. And that allows him then to begin to transfer some of the ownership position without losing the presidency.
Rachel Cruze
Because eventually he won't have it.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Cause if he can't do good succession planning because he has to hold on to the moment because they're at such conflict, then you guys are gonna die. The business is not gonna make it. You guys are gonna fight with each other. And the enemy is within. The enemy is in the building. It's no longer competition. It's no longer trying to serve the marketplace. You guys are all just scrambling for all the crumbs inside the building. That is not healthy. It's going to blow up relationships and it's going to end the business. We see it all the time. We coach family businesses that do stupid butt stuff like this all the time. And so you guys have got to. Your dad has to sit down if he wants to save it. And if he wants to save the relationship with his kids and his brothers, they need to sit down and develop an operating agreement for today that includes him continuing to be president, in my opinion, based on what you told me, for X period of time, and begin to transfer shares into the other generation. And that generation also has an operating agreement as to how this thing's run after succession. It could be that you split the business up and each of you take your store and go on your way like your grandpa used to do, and that might be the healthiest thing of all. But you Guys not having a plan and, you know, and then reneging on stuff to stay president is a good way to screw up the whole thing.
Rachel Cruze
And staying so consistent for 10 years of your income and not moving one inch is deflating. Right. So he either was overpaid 10 years ago.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
And it is what it is. But there's no movement in that. There's no debt. I don't know. There's not. And not that you have to move up outside of market value. I'm not saying that. But to not have a raise for 10 years.
Dave Ramsey
Well, that something was wrong then.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
They either started too high or something's weird about this position or something. But again, that can be solved for sure by just saying we're going to leave that income there because it's market value, but we're going to add some percentages of ownership over here and let you share in the profits. And all of a sudden it gets a raise.
Rachel Cruze
Y.
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Dave Ramsey
and no specific outcome is guaranteed. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. Rachel Cruz is my co host. Today we're going to take an hour and do something that we haven't done in a long time. We're going to do a theme hour and we're going to talk about real estate. And to do that, I brought in one of my good friends for many, many years, one of the top real estate minds and real estate coaches in America. Brian Buffini flew in from his home in California to hang out with us. We've been hanging out for a couple days, having all kinds of discussions. We get to do all kinds of fun stuff together. But we thought, hey, we better get him here on the air while he's here and we better mine this mind. He knows more about this real estate stuff than anybody moving around out there and have a really good discussion. Welcome, my friend.
Brian Buffini
It is always a pleasure and we've had a great week and I'm looking forward to it today.
Dave Ramsey
If you've been listening to the show for a while, you've heard Brian on here a couple of different times. We were promoting his book the Immigrant Advantage, which is a best seller years ago when that came out. Three years ago.
Brian Buffini
Maybe five.
Dave Ramsey
We're getting maybe five. Yeah. Time gets away fast.
Rachel Cruze
And it's not going to be southern accents this hour either. No, I love listening to southern Ireland. I just like the Irish accent.
Brian Buffini
You know, we're big into real estate in Ireland. You know what I mean? The potato famine and all that good stuff.
Dave Ramsey
All right, let's get to this. The real estate market is a problem. We've talked about it a lot here on the air. That the shortage of inventory and the weird blip on the radar called Covid drove prices up unbelievably and they've slowed down considerably. But still, we've seen a phenomenon that we've never seen before in that we're currently at the oldest median age for a first time home buyer, right?
Brian Buffini
Yep, yep. 40 years of age. So median half above and half below. How old were you when you bought Your first house?
Dave Ramsey
22.
Brian Buffini
Yeah, we drove by one of your original houses.
Dave Ramsey
That was a flipper I was doing last night. We're going to dinner. We drove by one of those rehabs.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah, that's good.
Brian Buffini
I was 23.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
So, Brian, this is the pain point. I feel like we hear so much. I mean, housing and buying a home is all. Is a financial goal for majority of people, as it should be. But it's just they're feeling this tension at this point and it starts to feel hopeless. Right.
Dave Ramsey
And we were talking about social media out of reach.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah, we were talking about social media earlier. But I get in that algorithm and you just see people and it's some complaining, which I'm like, listen, I get it, it is hard. But then also it starts to feel as people start throwing facts and figures, which is why I love that you're on. Because you can maybe combat some of that or affirm some of it, but it just feels like today, more than ever, than any time in the home buying process, it's harder with just the price of homes, income and all of that. What would you say to someone that just.
Brian Buffini
Well, yes, the answer's correct. But if you talk to people from the 60s and they bought a house for eight grand, they thought their arms and legs were gonna fall off, and they ate spaghetti for three years, you know, everybody feels that way. Yeah, everybody also does. Oh, you see that property over there? I could have bought that in 1979 for $8 and a packet of peanuts. And now it's worth 20 minutes. 20 million. But I didn't buy it. So, you know, that's never going to change in real estate. What we have is what I call an anaconda's meal.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Brian Buffini
You know the anaconda.
Caller
Yeah.
Brian Buffini
It eats like a sheep, only from
Rachel Cruze
the Jennifer Lopez meal.
Brian Buffini
Eight months to digest it. And that's kind of where we are with real estate right now. Say that, Covid. Free money, you know, 2% loans, everything jumped up. Covid. People were living in small houses. Remember there was the tiny house movement. Remember that, Dave? Well, when we were all living together for 10 months, locked up, nobody wanted a tiny house. I don't want to see you. I want an office. I want a school. I want a gym. So now people got bigger houses, lower interest rates. And you had this massive jump in the market when the Fed adjusted the rates because they overcooked it. It was the fastest rise in rates in 120 years since the Federal Reserve existed. They intentionally stalled the market, like stalling an airplane. So they intentionally put the brakes on. And the brakes have kind of been on ever since.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. So to backtrack a little bit. Ten years ago, the median age of a first time home buyer was what, 30 years old. And so in 10 years it went from 30 to 40.
Brian Buffini
Yeah, yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And this is the highest median age since we've kept records.
Brian Buffini
Since we kept records go back to 1908. The most in a decade was two years. It changed. That was the Great Depression. And then the next great change was during the war. And then we had the baby boomers. And, you know, America exploded in the housing after that.
Rachel Cruze
Yes.
Brian Buffini
And so this is. So that's. It is a shock. It is a shock to the system and what I do here so people don't feel crazy.
Rachel Cruze
If people are feeling this, they're not crazy.
Brian Buffini
No, it is.
Rachel Cruze
There's a reality to It.
Brian Buffini
But they're losing hope. And that's the dangerous thing. You can't lose hope.
Rachel Cruze
That's right.
Brian Buffini
You gotta dig in.
Dave Ramsey
We're not gonna get in the loss of hope business or the sanctioning of a victim. But there's also the reality of the numbers. And so based on that reality, then you've got a solution. We have to come up with a solution. We'll work on that throughout this time we've got together. I want to do that. And so rates are just. Pretty much just stayed the same for what, three years?
Brian Buffini
Yeah, I mean, look, we were heading on a nice path and I thought we'd be at between 5.8 to 6.2 this year. And then we got Iran, you got oil, you got all that stuff, which is another blip in the screen. But I think what's going to happen is we might even have a slight rate hike before the end of the year. Eventually rates are going to settle around 6.6%'s a healthy.
Dave Ramsey
It's just not a bad thing.
Brian Buffini
You know, we remember business.
Dave Ramsey
It was high, I was gonna say.
Rachel Cruze
Well then that's perspective too. Right. Cause you have, you know, my age group that we don't remember the Carter years. Right. Or the. You know what I mean? Like when they all were selling houses.
Brian Buffini
1989, I was in a real estate office and we had a 10% party. We were stirring the porridge, we were dancing it up. Pizza was in, the music was playing. Cause the rates had come down to 10%. So, yeah, historically the rates were ridiculously low. I mean, 2% and 3% mortgages are artificially governmentally created. So for a government to loan a bank money at 0% is not sustainable. Especially when the government's paying 5% to the people who loaned it the money.
Rachel Cruze
Yes.
Brian Buffini
So it's artificial.
Rachel Cruze
And I saw this on one of these slides that you gave us, which I thought was fascinating, is that, yeah, the median age for the first time home buyer is 40. But 25% of single women make up that demographic of first time home buyers and only 10% of single men. So women are outpacing men two and a half to one and buying homes.
Brian Buffini
All the single ladies. All the single ladies, right. Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
Yes.
Brian Buffini
So men are feeling the need to hit the home run is what I could see.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Brian Buffini
And so they're like, I don't feel.
Dave Ramsey
So this is a 25 to 35 year old man.
Brian Buffini
Yep, 25, 30. Well, we know that exact demographic because online gambling has gone from 5 billion a year to 150 billion a year in three years.
Dave Ramsey
Thank you, DraftKings.
Brian Buffini
Thank you, DraftKings.
Dave Ramsey
You wanna know why men aren't buying houses? DraftKings.
Brian Buffini
Yeah. And remember, you couldn't have a sports team in Vegas and you couldn't have an advertiser. And now, because they all own a piece of the action, young men are buying the Lakers and the Celtics and the Sooners because they don't think. You know, saving 300 bucks a month's not gonna do me anything. Let me put it all on the Lakers. And so they're hoping for the big win. And with the big win, they're hoping. The number one question of the online gambling bros is what would you do with the monies if you had a huge thing? They said I'd buy a house. So it's that lack of hope.
Dave Ramsey
And you look what happens is when you have a lack of hope, as soon as I get desperate, I get stupid. And you're not swinging. You're not swinging to hit singles and doubles. You're swinging for the fence. And every time you swing for the fence, you strike out. And that's what brought the crypto bros up, too. They're looking for a dadgum easy money.
Rachel Cruze
Well, the ladies. And making wise decisions.
Dave Ramsey
Well, the women are just. They're just going, we're just gonna put some money away. Yeah.
Caller
Yeah.
Brian Buffini
The house is a bigger deal.
Caller
Wow.
Rachel Cruze
Well, I can't wait to keep talking about this. Cause there is a plan and a great way for people to be homeowners. And so. Yeah, and you're part of that.
Brian Buffini
I wouldn't be here without us.
Dave Ramsey
Ryan Buffini is with us. We're talking real estate this hour. What you guys are all want to talk about. And we're going to help you with it. We're also going to talk about the realities of what you're doing out there.
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Dave Ramsey
We're talking real estate with Brian Buffini, one of the leading experts in real estate, one of America's greatest real estate coaches. He coaches more real estate agents, high performing real estate agents than anyone else in America. So he's really got his finger on the pulse of what's going on in the real estate world. He and I have about been talking, talking offline about this cause we've been friends for years. And one of the conclusions I've come to Brian is that there's not a. That the people who are feeling hopeless and are just screaming and throwing a fit on social media and yelling at boomers, you bought your house for a basket of strawberries thing are really too simplistic at how they're looking at this because instead of looking for a solution, they're just laying on the floor foaming at the mouth and having a fit because there's a lot of different problems. Let's go back to one thing and then I want to take this down a couple of ways. One thing you were talking about was the number of houses sold this year.
Brian Buffini
Yeah, 4 million. It'll be this year. It was like 4.1 last year.
Dave Ramsey
Right.
Brian Buffini
And the last time we got about
Dave Ramsey
a million houses on the market.
Brian Buffini
Listed on the market. Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And that's been that way for about four years.
Brian Buffini
Yeah, almost four. And the last time we had that few homes sold was in 1995 when there were 80 million less people living in the country. So you have big population increase all economic supply and demand. So you have 80 million more people which is why prices are continuing to go up and will continue to go up. If you are watching YouTube, if you're watching the doom scrollers market crash, this has fallen into the thing. It is not true. It is clickbait. It's unfortunate that they're going to make a living.
Dave Ramsey
The prices are going up because there's an inventory shortage. Supply and demand, supply and demand. You've got 100 million more people chasing the same number of sales. And so we've got a supply problem. We continue to have a supply problem and that is due to several things. So there's a bill sitting on the president's desk for him to sign. He just pushed it aside a few minutes ago as were recording this or broadcasting this. So I don't know when you folks are going to be listening to this, but something else may have happened by then. But for right now he pushed it to the side. So he's not signing it until he gets some other political favors on some other stuff he's working on. But that bill is called the Road act and it was had good intention. You and I agree it's full of a bunch of pork and crap, but Congress can screw up Christmas. But the idea is, the idea was that they're going to limit corporate hedge fund buyers and Chinese foreign nationals and so forth from buying thousands of single family homes and starving that supply we're talking about. Yeah. Allegedly they're gonna limit. The idea of limiting. It is a good idea. It was your idea.
Brian Buffini
It was. I proposed it to the senator and
Dave Ramsey
then I said it on the air and I said President Trump, if you're listening. And apparently he was or somebody was because they put the bill out like 60 days later in January, they got the bill pass but by the time they got it through Congress they screwed it up putting all this crap in it.
Brian Buffini
Yeah. And they, you know what was initially proposed was a great Bill Limited to
Dave Ramsey
350 homes, single family homes that a corporation can own because they're stealing them from first time home buyers.
Brian Buffini
100%. So first time buyers and by the way they get tax advantages. So a giant, you know, multi billion dollar company gets all of these tax advantages that a single family that's, you know, eating spaghetti saving their money can't. And so that was the intent. Now it's gotten politicized and all of a sudden it's like, well, we're concerned about access to capital and things like that.
Dave Ramsey
And said BlackRock.
Brian Buffini
Yeah. Yes. Because I also got a giant contribution to my campaign. Right, right. So they gave 10 million and Mary can give 10 bucks. So look, it is the deal. It's brutal.
Dave Ramsey
One thing, one thing we could do is if you really did do it and this bill really doesn't.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
If you really did do limit, limit the number of the Chinese buying 5,000 houses in Memphis, Tennessee or our Blackrock doing the same thing and taking them off the market. That's thing one thing two you've suggested, and I like this even more is to get the market moving, just do away with capital gains Tax completely on single family personal residences.
Brian Buffini
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Or on personal residence. Period.
Brian Buffini
Sure. And they can do this in a periodic way. They can do it for in a structured way. Right now it's 500 grand.
Dave Ramsey
But that's a 25 year old law, isn't it?
Brian Buffini
Yeah. And it's 500 grand. And 500 grand was different 25 years ago than it is today. It was different five years ago. So if you move that to a million. So if you went from 500 grand to a million, so that first million,
Dave Ramsey
you would stimulate sales like crazy.
Brian Buffini
Here's what would happen. The baby boomers who are sitting on $89 trillion worth of assets, the baby boomers are willing to go, okay, you know what I might do? You'd actually have a temporary dip in prices because they go, guess what, I'm gonna make a mill on this. Maybe I'll take 50 grand off the house to sell it quick because I want to do it while the capital gains law has changed. They might take 50. They might take 70 off the price. They might take 100 off the price. You might have, oh, this guy took 50. Now they have. So prices might take a little softer
Dave Ramsey
and you put some supply in the market.
Brian Buffini
A lot of supply in the market.
Dave Ramsey
Because your median seller right now is in their 60s. Right.
Brian Buffini
Median seller is 64 years of age.
Rachel Cruze
Is it capital gains or is it right to buy the next home that's stopping people? Or both. I just wonder what the motivation is.
Brian Buffini
Baby boomers are sitting on.
Dave Ramsey
Their houses are paid for.
Brian Buffini
They're paid for. They got a bunch fair they weren't buying then. Some people say the greatest generation, they're borderline. I'm going to create some tension here for you, but they're borderline being called the greediest generation.
Dave Ramsey
Well, we were with the 80s.
Brian Buffini
Yeah. Go. Go, baby, get it. Greed is good.
Dave Ramsey
Gordon Gecko.
Brian Buffini
Grease the hair back.
Dave Ramsey
Exactly.
Brian Buffini
The baby boom generation was the first historical generation to buy real estate not just for a primary residence. Baby boomers bought rental properties. Baby boomers bought vacation properties. Baby boomers bought and built eight unit apartment buildings. So brilliant. They sacrificed, they made their money and they've done well. They've been slow to hand it over.
Dave Ramsey
So the two things we could do from a macro perspective, and usually you and I don't reach for Washington to do anything because they screw it up. And they have in this case too, but would be to limit corporate buying and just do away with or raise the capital gains to a million. You sell your home for up your personal residence for up to a million dollars profit with no taxes at all. If you just did away with it, you could increase your inventory substantially, which would increase the flow of houses. And we get back up above a 4 million transaction rate and you'd get the inventory going. And the third thing is we gotta have some federal help probably pouncing on people like these idiots in California that have still not issued building permits two and a half years later on Palisades.
Brian Buffini
My people, my people. I'm from the People's Republic of California. Look, it's. More homes were built in Dallas Fort Worth last year than in the state of California.
Rachel Cruze
The entire state.
Brian Buffini
Than the entire state, which is 40
Dave Ramsey
million because of regulations and building permit costs and all the fees, fees, fees and more. They got more fees than a French poodle.
Brian Buffini
Fee, Fee, fee, fee, fee.
Dave Ramsey
Very good.
Brian Buffini
167 grand. The average fees for housing just to break ground. So the fact of the matter is there are governmental things that can happen. There are some things they're trying to do. They're trying to. They're actually the one thing this current legislation does, does a lot of reducing requirements and restrictions and regulations on housing. They're reducing the federal regulations on housing. So that will help some things. They're gonna expand, you know, the developed property. So like, you know, the delivered mobile home. Right. So that's like you can build it to suit, which is a little more manufactured. Manufactured, and they're a little more structured than they used. So there are some things that they're doing that will help some things.
Dave Ramsey
Okay, so let's switch gears then. That's stuff that we can't control if we're 35, but we can control if we're giving all of our money to crypto or draftkings. We can control if we go into debt to Ford Motor Company for a $90,000 pickup. And so we don't have any money to save for a house. We can control if we don't let Citibank. What's in your wallet? Screw me over with Samuel L. Jackson telling me to do it. We can control if we get deeply in debt with student loans. These are controllables that the individual can do to put themselves in a position where they have disposable income to start moving towards buying.
Brian Buffini
Dave Ramsey has a lot of answers for the real estate business. You know, if I want to, somebody said if I really hated a real estate agent and I wanted to just really screw him up, I'd refer him a couple of kids who wanted to buy a house and tell them to buy a truck first. If I really hated that realtor, here they go. And what happens is psychologically their first major purchase is a car and then they got a loan and now they feel they can buy a house. It's, it's insanity. And you've just, you just added screwed
Dave Ramsey
up the whole thing.
Brian Buffini
You screwed up the deal by the way.
Dave Ramsey
Get married.
Brian Buffini
Yeah, there's a good one.
Dave Ramsey
Cohabitating doesn't get you towards buying a house.
Brian Buffini
You talk about is one on one. That's why I was a Dave Ramsey fan my whole real estate career because I'd have my clients listen to your stuff so I could help them get a down payment to buy.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah, opens up margin when you don't have debt. And then, and then patience all.
Dave Ramsey
Also I got one more to add to this when we come back and then we're going to take some calls.
Brian Buffini
Great.
Dave Ramsey
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Caller
Right.
Dave Ramsey
And so wages have not kept up. That is real. However, the other thing we've never adjusted for in our psyche out there in the land of TikTok, where you're 27 years old, living in your mother's basement bitching about this is you've never adjusted your entitled viewpoint. Because let me tell you what was in that $67,000 house. No stove, no refrigerator. Had to go buy them used. No washer and dryer, no dishwasher, no microwave, no disposal. Rollout. Vinyl floor on the kitchen.
Brian Buffini
Come on.
Dave Ramsey
And a Formica top, a chipped up sink that has had little chips in the ceramic. Yeah. The carpet, you had to mow it because it was seven inches tall. It was. Remember shag in the 1970s?
Brian Buffini
Shagadelli.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, Shagadelli.
Rachel Cruze
One bathroom.
Dave Ramsey
And it had one and a half baths. And it was 1200 square feet with one car garage. So you can't compare that house to your little McMansion that you're bitching about that you can't afford. So you don't compare that. I grew up in a 1,000 square foot house with an unfinished basement. We had no living room furniture until I was 13. And the living room wasn't enough. Wasn't as big as this desk.
Brian Buffini
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And so you know you adjust all of that before you say, well, you're a boomer, you had it be good. It was easy for you. No, we didn't. I mean, I had one and a half cars. You guys got three.
Brian Buffini
Sure.
Dave Ramsey
You know, and so you really got to adjust for that and your expectations. And then lastly, you need to think about where you're buying. And in most markets, and you know this better than anybody, probably the urban basic urban growth is if you go out of town a ways, as we say in Tennessee, out in the country, it gets cheaper the further from downtown you move. Yep.
Brian Buffini
Yeah. And look, I mean, the average home used to be 1210 square feet, and now the average home is 2900 square feet. And so it's much bigger.
Dave Ramsey
And the difference in those is not necessity, it's luxury.
Brian Buffini
You know, that's what people were buying and the prices and the market and the way it went and all that kind of stuff. Here's the bottom line. You know, the first house I bought, it looked like it had been in a drive by shooting. Okay. And I was a house painter's son, you know, and I fix it up. And there's a thing called sweat equity. And everybody watches the homes and garden shows. The truth of the matter is, you know, I was out here in Tennessee the other day just looking at stuff and I was looking at the model homes and they have them all tricked out and they're lined up out the door and everybody's buying the model homes. The money is not in the model home and the new construction. The money's in the old beater down the street without the, you know, with the. Looks like it needs a coat of paint.
Dave Ramsey
Cause it does.
Brian Buffini
Cause it does. You know, you make money in real estate when you solve somebody's problem.
Dave Ramsey
That's how you buy though, people. Yeah, you stay out of the traps and you set yourself up and you adjust your expectations and act like a first time home buyer. Quit acting like you've been saving money for 25 or 30 years. You haven't. You're 27 years old.
Brian Buffini
Look, how bad do you want us?
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Brian Buffini
And you know, I hear a lot of the younger folks, you know, the math isn't mathing. And I'm a lifestyle person. All of a sudden, the average homeowner has 44 times the net worth of the average renter. And if you want to get on the right side of the net worth equation, the number one way people make money in America and all over the world is housing. And so I've trained in 47 countries. And housing is the same all over the world. Food, shelter, clothing, the three necessities. And so you gotta fight and grind to do it. And again, I know. I think you're right. People are losing hope. But people are also listening to all this garbage out there.
Rachel Cruze
100%.
Brian Buffini
You can do it. You can bite, fight, scratch your cloth. Look, I'm an immigrant, came to America, got run out by a car. I have 250 grand in medical bills in 1986. I don't know what 250 grand is worth today. It'd be a fortune. And I bought my first house, and I fought like the dickens for it. And I literally didn't eat a meal that I didn't prepare for three years. But that house I bought for 107 grand. I sold it for 164. The next one I bought was 220. And I fixed it up and I sold it for 394. And then I bought the next one, and I bought it for 900. And then I bought the next one. It was 1 8. And I bought the next one. And that 18 now turned into four. And the next one four turned into seven and a half million. And so here's a house painter son with not a dime goes from in 22 years, from zero to seven and a half million. That doesn't happen by rent, and that doesn't happen with crypto, and it doesn't happen with DraftKings.
Rachel Cruze
Yep.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Very good. Chuck is in Milwaukee. Let me get that line going. Chuck, how are you?
Caller
Good. How you doing?
Dave Ramsey
Great, man. Enter. Enter the conversation. How can we help?
Caller
Hey, so I'm a longtime listener. I'm a baby step worker. And so my question is.
So my wife and I have worked
through most of the baby steps, except
for the latter ones.
And we are at the point now where we want.
We're thinking about selling our house in order to be mortgage free.
And I'm just wondering, is that possible?
Dave Ramsey
That makes you move down then, right?
Caller
What's that?
Dave Ramsey
You would move down in house?
Caller
We downsize.
Yep. Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Other than to be mortgage free? Why would you do that?
Caller
That's the only reason I would.
Dave Ramsey
What's your. What's your house worth?
Caller
447,000.
Dave Ramsey
And what do you owe on it?
Caller
192,000.
Rachel Cruze
What do you guys make a year?
Dave Ramsey
You're gonna buy $150,000 house from a $500,000 house?
Caller
Yeah.
I.
Doesn't make sense.
Dave Ramsey
Are you married?
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Don't do this.
Brian Buffini
He just saved you 250 grand in marriage counseling right there, buddy. Chuck, do you want the real estate?
Rachel Cruze
Do you want to do this? What, what is your wife saying? I am curious.
Brian Buffini
I, I,
Caller
our goal is to, yeah, our goal was to work that baby step and be mortgage free. But personally, personally, no, I like where we live. I'd rather just, you know, buckle down, pay it off. You know, we got eight or nine years till we get paid off.
Dave Ramsey
That's what you should do. Yeah, yeah.
Rachel Cruze
How much do you guys make a year, Chuck?
Caller
So I can tell you, I'm self, I've been self employed for 25 years. I'm a Harvard foreign contractor and I work alone. And do you want like the business gross income?
Dave Ramsey
I'm asking what your household income that you pay taxes on is.
Caller
Okay, I made 151,000.
She made 64,000.
Brian Buffini
Great.
Dave Ramsey
So two and a quarter and you got to pay off. You need to pay off 192 and you're going to do that in four or five years. And then if you want to save up and move up, I would, but I don't know, I would not sell this and move down to be debt free. I think you're gonna be debt free soon enough. You got a good plan? Would you, Brian?
Brian Buffini
Well, I'm a house painter, son Chuck. So here's what we would do. We do call it Saturday money. So we take what was called a side job, do a little work on the side and every dollar I made on the Saturday job, you used to pay down the debt. And so you do that. Here's what you can be. You could be debt free in five years, not eight. And you get to live in the same house. And you know what? Your wife thinks you're even cuter than you are right now
Rachel Cruze
with no mortgage. It's amazing how people's looks change suddenly beautiful thing.
Brian Buffini
My wife thinks I'm gorgeous.
Dave Ramsey
Oh my goodness. Brian Buffini is with us, real estate coach and expert. We're going to come back in the last segment this hour and take your
Rachel Cruze
calls and I'll throw out too. You know, there was some hope interjected there at the beginning about hey, get in like this, like your housing is amazing. And so if you want to check out and find a great agent, go to Ramsey's Solutions.com agent. We'll put a link in the show notes.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, we'll hook you up with a Ramsey trusted agent that knows what they're doing and they can help you really do this. It's possible, folks. RamseySolutions.com agent.
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Dave Ramsey
Our guest is real estate expert and world renowned coach. Brian Buffini coaches more real estate agents than anyone else in America today. Especially the high performing ones. We're talking real estate. We're talking about it is possible, it is definitely harder, it's definitely different than it was 10 years ago and it's definitely way different than it was 30 years ago. No question. That is not in question. But the question is you can control only the things you can control and that's what you should control. If you control the controllables, you can put yourself in a position to buy. Carter is with us in Columbus, Ohio. Hey Carter, your question for Brian and the panel here.
Caller
Hey guys, how's it going?
Dave Ramsey
Great. How can we help?
Caller
I just wanted to call in and just say my wife and I are expecting with our first child and we're currently thinking that home buying is our next thing that God wants us to do. Cool. We are both in full time ministry. So with that obviously it's not like an extravagant paychecks that we get but we're not in it for the money. I'm just wanting to know like how we can go from the jump we're renting right now. How we go from the jump of we have everything budgeted with our rent to our mortgage payment, everything with bills
Dave Ramsey
and like that with congratulations on the baby, how old Are you guys.
Caller
Thank you. 22 and 23.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And how old is. I mean, I'm sorry, what is your household income today?
Caller
Yearly, we Both combined to 60,000.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. You have a bunch of debt.
Caller
Nope. My wife has no debt whatsoever. The only debt I have is student loans, but I'm working through a public student loan forgiveness with. Because I work for a church.
Dave Ramsey
So 10 years is not a plan to get out of debt, honey.
Caller
Yeah.
Brian Buffini
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Brian, what do you think? Yeah.
Brian Buffini
How much is on the student loan, by the way?
Caller
21,000.
Brian Buffini
Okay. And after your bills come in and your money comes in, how much left over? You have anything left at the end of the month?
Caller
So with all bills aside and ties offering aside and everything like that, we have about 1600 left to spend, not including food or anything like that.
Brian Buffini
Okay. You got any money saved?
Caller
We have 13,000, including $1,000 emergency fund.
Brian Buffini
Great. Fantastic.
Caller
Wow.
Dave Ramsey
You're way ahead of what I thought.
Brian Buffini
Yeah. 22 and 23. We got a winner here. Hope for America. Okay.
Caller
Okay.
Brian Buffini
What's the average sales price in Columbus, Ohio?
Caller
We're looking. We got Pre approved for 228, but I was doing the math and just looking what our mortgage would be. I just don't know how that would be possible to. We just kind of be making pre approved.
Dave Ramsey
Pre approved only means that the mortgage company has brain damage. Okay. Because there's no possible way you should do that.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
You know that when you looked at the payment, you bought choked, didn't you?
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Good for you.
Caller
It's about 220, though. 220, 000.
Brian Buffini
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
All right.
Brian Buffini
Just curious. What would 220 get you in Columbus, Ohio?
Caller
Like bedrooms and, and stuff like that?
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Caller
About three beds, two baths.
Dave Ramsey
Nice. Wow.
Brian Buffini
Nice. I know. We're not living in San Diego, baby.
Dave Ramsey
So like 2, 000 square feet, huh?
Caller
Like 1500. Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. Wow.
Rachel Cruze
Okay, well, Carter, I would take that 13,000 that you have, throw it at the student loans. You guys, you may want to work a part time job for just a season. Well, when's your wife due? When's the baby coming?
Caller
End of September, early October.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. Between now and then, Carter, if I were you, I would be stacking cash and I would go work extra weekends and nights and you guys. Yeah. Pile up some cash, get the student loan knocked out, save some more back to that emergency fund and then make it a big goal. Yeah. Of. And knowing that you're on a $60,000 income. Okay. So it's gonna take you guys a couple of years to save for that down payment, but it is totally possible.
Dave Ramsey
So let me tell you this. I completely affirm God's call on your life to be in ministry. And I want you to keep doing that. And here's the reality that goes with that. You're not going to only get to do that for the first decade. Go talk to some 65 year old pastors and ask them how many of them when they were 22 worked a side hustle. We work with 50,000 churches in America and what we found is that 88% of pastors are bi vocational. They have a side gig. 88%. And they call that full time minister. My pastor that led me to the Lord and baptized me is with the Lord today. And back in the day, he delivered bread, had a bread truck, and he was a full time pastor. And he told that story from the pulpit a thousand times to where we all could visualize the bread truck. We heard it so much, but it was perfect. So you know, you're 22 and 23. You're just beginning. You've got time. You don't need to buy a house today to be rich. You don't need to buy a house today and money's not your motivator anyway. But you do need to buy a home. It's going to be good for your family. But it may be five years. So what? Clear the student loans, you pile up some cash, you work some side hustles and your ministry continues to grow. And maybe you move into a senior pastor role at some point where you actually can just do that and make enough money to afford a home. So if you buy a house at 27 or 28 years old and you put down a good solid down payment and you stay out of debt and you're a good dad and a good pastor, I would call you a phenomenal success in America.
Brian Buffini
Yes, sir, Sir. Yes, sir. And by the way, being a pastor can also be your side hustle. I had a buddy of mine and he was in the same spot. And again, sometimes you can be so heavenly minded, you know, earthly good. I'm here to be a minister and I'm trying to help. And so his side hustle was marry, bury and baptize. And so he said, I'll marry, bury and baptize. And he put a little service out there and he made enough money to go buy himself a house. So your ministry could be your side hustle too. I love it.
Dave Ramsey
Danielle is in Des Moines. Hi, Danielle. Your question for the panel.
Caller
How's it going?
Good.
Dave Ramsey
How can we help?
Caller
So my husband and I, we're in our mid-20s and thinking about starting a family soon. So we're looking at buying a house maybe in the next year or two. And we're just wondering what we should be prioritizing in our first house for our family. Like should it be location, size, the cheapest thing possible. And we're trying to put it down 20%.
Dave Ramsey
Wow, that's great. That's unusual for a first time homebuyer. That's good though, if you could do it. So what do you think? The leading indicator of a home you want to get in but you're not going to live there forever.
Brian Buffini
So how many kids you have again, Danielle?
Caller
Well, we don't have any right now,
but we're hoping within the next year.
Brian Buffini
Well, so you plan for that. Here's the big tip I give people all the time. You'd live in the floor plan, not the square footage. People get caught up in square footage. So sometimes older houses have smaller square footage and better floor plans. You'll see this like you can see a townhome or a condo has lots of square footage, but it's all cut up and chased up or it's a two story. So you live in the floor plan, not the square footage. So start thinking about, okay, Lord willing, if we had a couple of kids, what would that look like? So to me, you want to make sure that you got the best floor plan that's open as possible. And then, you know, I have six kids, me and my bride, which seemed like a great idea at the time. And we prioritize having a yard over everything else. You know, we were going to have those crumb snatchers out there catching balls and running around. And we live where it was a little bit sunny. So to me, again, it's your priorities. So floor plan is key over square footage. And typically the older houses have the better floor plans and then a little bitty yard if you're going to have kids. Those would be the first two for me.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Very good. Very cool. All right, well done, sir. So Brian Buffini has been our guest this hour. Brian, if people want to learn about Buffini and Company, the leading real estate coaching company in the world, how do they do that?
Brian Buffini
Well, like I say, we have buffiniancompany.com just check us out if they're interested in, if they're in real estate. That's our specialty. We do real well. We have thousands of clients. We really teach people to take care of their customers. That's what we're all about. And so we help real estate agents do well. And a lot of our agents that we coach are in your program helping folks out there.
Dave Ramsey
A lot of our Ramsey trusted agents are coached by Buffini and Company. So that's absolutely perfect. Well, folks, we want to give you hope and we don't want. There's a whole industry that makes a living telling you that there's a bubble and there's a crash coming and the world is coming to an end. And Chicken Little, we sell homes and
Rachel Cruze
you could never be a homeowner.
Dave Ramsey
You'll never make it. America is dead. People make a living off of that. And that's a lot. Is it different? Yes. Is it hard? Yes. Has it always been some form of hard? Yes. Yes. But can you do it? You control the controllables. You know, stay out of crypto and draftkings and get out. Get yourself out of debt and then adjust your expectations on your first home and you can get yourself into the market and we'll help you do it. We love you. We want you to win.
Rachel Cruze
That's right. Brian, thanks for being here.
Brian Buffini
It's really love you guys, love your family, love helping people. Today it was a treasure.
Rachel Cruze
Thank you.
Dave Ramsey
Check out our agents@ramseysolutions.com agent if you want a Ramsey trusted agent to help you do it the way we teach you. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality. My daughter is my co host today. Mary's in Dallas. Hey, Mary, how can we help?
Caller
Hi, Dave.
How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Better than I deserve. How can we help?
Caller
Well, my husband and I have been married 19 years. We're approaching retirement and we've always managed our finances separately. We're a blended family. We don't have a will. And we're struggling to move from talking about major financial decisions to actually making them. We cannot get on the same page. I just don't know how to get there.
Rachel Cruze
What's the biggest difference? Mary, if you could explain, like what, what is kind of his mindset with things? What's yours? Where does that conflict come in?
Caller
So he has a lack of trust about. He kind of holds most of the liquid assets. I have retirement assets, but he has more liquid assets. We kind of have always split bills and I tend to carry debt and then pay it off. Carry it. I've kind of borrowed money against savings and paid him back. And so his concern is that if we combine finances, then he's not going
to be able to protect our future from you.
From me? Yes.
Dave Ramsey
Okay, that's valid. You keep borrowing money and paying it off with his money and then paying him back. And that scares him. Well, of course it does. It should.
Caller
Well, we both work, and I have an outcome.
Dave Ramsey
He's observing a pattern that scares him. That is a valid thing. So you have to remove that, you know, that pattern in order for him to be comfortable combining finances, because he's conservative.
Caller
Could he.
Rachel Cruze
If you guys agreed on the value system of. If we combine finances, debt is no longer part of our family. We are not going to use debt. Would you be okay with that?
Caller
That.
Absolutely. I've suggested that we sit down. We sit down and go over our debts, go over our assets, look at everything together, pay off what needs to be paid off, create a household account and help hold me accountable. Hold him accountable.
Brian Buffini
That.
Dave Ramsey
That. That's healthy. I'm with you on that. But, you know, but if someone observes a behavior pattern and that behavior pattern breaks trust, that's valid. So we've got to solve for that emotionally. He's got to have a reason to believe that you're not going to do this again. And you're saying, as a friend of mine said the other day, he said I had to submit myself to the system. I have to say the system says we don't borrow money. The system says we have a budget that we both agree on. And I had to submit myself to that. In other words, my little wants or little impulses were subject to my agreement with my spouse. And if he believes that, and okay, I will never spend another dime again. That we have not both agreed on. Oh, and by the way, neither will you. If he really believes that that's going to happen, then there's no possible way you could go in debt, Right?
Caller
Correct. And I think that. I think that where we haven't gotten on the same page that way is that I think he's too frugal. He thinks I'm too liberal. And so.
Dave Ramsey
Well, you do need each other in that regard. In general, if one of you is not over the top. But here's what I would suggest y' all do. Let's try combining the budget, the monthly income budget, and work out of one first. And if we do that, then that addresses now, and then both of you need to hear this part. Okay? The saver needs a spender in his life, so he has a life. Okay?
Caller
Correct.
Dave Ramsey
Because the people that are like him will live in a cave, collect lint, and only come out on triple coupon. Thursday. Right. And that's not. You know. And the saver. Him. The spender. You. Needs a saver in his life. In your life. So you don't have to retire and eat dog food.
Caller
Correct.
Dave Ramsey
Because you spend everything, so you can't, you know, so we've got to balance that out. And so there has to be a portion of. Mary, in the budget where there's some fun. In our case, that'd be Rachel. And there's a portion of the. Your husband, which is Rachel's husband. Winston is more like. Your husband is conservative, but he allows for fun and she allows for savings. Because we agree that both of those things are necessary to have a quality life.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah, absolutely. Mary, I want to follow back when you mentioned the trust aspect at the beginning of the call, because you said he has a lot of liquid assets. Did you mean trust with the market or you.
Caller
I think with me.
Rachel Cruze
Okay, so it's a relational trust. Okay.
Caller
Yeah.
Yeah. He has two big things. So one thing we. We have a franchise, and we invested a lot of money into that, and we're not going to come out whole on the other end of that. So he feels very protective of the liquid assets and retirement that he has, which is fine. And then I, at one point, because I handled separate finances, made a decision to do some cosmetic dentistry for one of our children that was substantial, and he felt that was a major financial decision. I didn't discuss with him, which it was. But we handled our finances separately. I have substantial retirement assets, but I really don't have very much liquid at all. So.
Dave Ramsey
So what is your retirement asset base?
Caller
A little over a million.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And what's the. Is the franchises a business one of you are running?
Caller
It's. It is a business, and I mean, we both own it, but I'm running it. And there's two years left on the franchise.
Rachel Cruze
What do you mean?
Dave Ramsey
And it's gonna. You're just gonna close it?
Caller
I believe so, yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And so you've been responsible for that. Let me say this carefully. It. Does he say. Does in his mind, does he feel like you're responsible for that failure?
Caller
I don't think so. I don't think so. What we've talked about. He said we own that together.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And we made the. And it failed. And we did that together.
Caller
Yes, sir.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah. So I would probably sit down, Mary, and you guys need to have a discussion for. To your point, today's point earlier, that maybe some valid. Maybe some valid concerns that he may have. And what does he need to see within you to get any level of that trust back on your side. Because you guys as a couple are going to function better when you see yourselves as a unit. You guys have been married 19 years and you've never combined this part of your life. And so that is a desire of yours. And so there that question I would want to know from him, hey, what are the things that you need to see? And I am willing to make some changes when it comes to the way I handle money or communicate about money. But I do desire that we are seen as one in all of this. Right. And what are those steps to get there? Cause I would be curious what he'd want to see from you. And if it's ridiculous and it's crazy and it's controlling and it is super, you know, all of this, if I don't want you to ever spend money on avocados or something just crazy, then there's gonna be some of his issues that are, that are in this as well. And not just you. And so.
Dave Ramsey
But if you have a reasonable acceptance of his need to save, he has a reasonable acceptance of yours to enjoy money. Yes, that's a good, healthy balance inside your budget budget. And that should be there. That's, that's accurate. Rebuilding trust. Henry, Henry Cloud's book, Trust. It gives you a great way to do that. And I think a good entry point here is just first, start budgeting together. If you budget together for 90 days, the amount of discussions you're going to have to get on the same page is going to be amazing.
Caller
Foreign.
Dave Ramsey
But your money's never going to return the favor if all you do is hope for the best. If you're ready to learn how to make your money work for you, check out the SmartVestor program. SmartVestor can help you find advisors who specialize in retirement planning, charitable giving, advanced investing strategies, and more. Whatever your goals, your pro will take the time to explain your options so you never have to invest in anything you don't understand. Head to ramseysolutions.com smartvestor to get connected. Ramsey Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros. Learn more@ramseysolutions.com SmartVestor. Alex Alexis. I'm sorry. Is in Fort Wayne, Indiana. Hi, Alexis. How are you doing?
Caller
Great.
How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Better than I deserve. How can we help?
Caller
All right, so me and my husband,
we just, we've owned our home for
a little over a year now and we renovated our entire home and now
we have, we suspect, like 70,000 or more in equity and then we're expecting
our first baby here in July. So we've been working really, really hard to make, like, smart financial decisions.
Our question for you is, would it
be wise to ref our home and
use the equity to put it towards an investment property?
Most likely it would be farmland that
we could later build on. Or should we wait at least one more year and then sell the house after? Like, we don't have to pay capital gains.
Dave Ramsey
You should wait and sell the house and not buy something unless you're going to move into it.
Caller
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Because you can't afford investment property. You don't have any money.
Caller
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
If you go into debt to buy a piece of land that's just sitting there and you're paying payments on it, that destabilizes your home, where your new baby is. No, we don't do that.
Caller
Okay.
Yeah, I think the goal would be to continue to farm that land.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, well, so what?
Caller
And make some money off of that farm.
Dave Ramsey
You're not farming it now.
Rachel Cruze
What do you guys do for a living, Alexis?
Caller
My husband is.
He works at a steel mill. And then I am a stay at home mom.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. How much do you guys make a year?
Caller
We make anywhere from 5,500 to 7,000amonth.
Dave Ramsey
So the land is how much land?
Caller
It would be eight acres.
Dave Ramsey
Eight acres.
Rachel Cruze
What would you farm on it?
Caller
Corn, Beans, slightly.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
You can't make the payments on that, that amount of money with farm and beans on eight acres.
Caller
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
The numbers don't work. And so it's like he's got a dream of owning some dirt.
Rachel Cruze
I was gonna ask, is that like a. Like a passion kind of thing for you guys or what causes you to do that?
Caller
Yeah, I think the goal would be,
right now we have a small house that we own, and so the goal would be to eventually build on that property, and then we would like to own some property.
Dave Ramsey
There we go. Okay, so now here's what I would do that makes more sense than I'm gonna farm this and call it an investment on eight acres. Okay. That just doesn't. That's not enough to spit on. So, no, what I would do is have your baby, you guys, live your life, stack some cash and say, all right, the goal, to use your phrase, the dream is to buy a piece of property and build a home on it and sell ours and move into the new home on the piece of property. And that piece of property and home after construction are still a reasonable part of our budget. No more than 25% of your take home. Pay on a 15 year fixed. And then if he wants to have a gentleman farm on it and have a little bit of a side hustle, that doesn't kill me. Okay. And that's kind of fun for him, apparently. And so on. Right. But that's truly gentleman farming.
Caller
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
And your life is about to be so different now, being parents. And so. And I think you did say you're a stay at home mom, so you guys have other kids. But I would take this slow. I would not be in a rush to make these big decisions. I mean, honestly, I think a few years of saving is going to be just fine. And then you guys may sell that house, go rent somewhere to be able to put down a good down payment. Construction, loan, all of that. You know, there may be a process.
Dave Ramsey
The reason you are framing this poorly as an investment idea is because you're in a hurry and you have to
Rachel Cruze
borrow on your primary residence.
Dave Ramsey
Exactly. If you slow down and make this deal your primary residence later, after the baby's here and you've got some money saved and you make a good solid purchase and you think about building a home on there and selling this home and putting all of the equity into the new purchase and again then it becomes a wise thing. But all of that slows down your excitement level that caused you to move too fast and move into a bad idea. Julian is in Baltimore. Hi, Julian. How are you?
Caller
Good. How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Better than I deserve. How can I help?
Caller
Yeah, so I'm in baby step number two and I'm working on paying off my student loans and I have a
little bit of credit card debt left.
Dave Ramsey
How much debt?
Caller
I.
There's $3,800 on it, which I.
Dave Ramsey
On the credit card. How much on the student loan?
Caller
Oh, yeah, 70,000 on the student loans.
Dave Ramsey
And what do you make?
Caller
The big one right now, I just
graduated college in May, So I'm doing 35 hours a week at $17 an hour. So my take home is right around 500.
Dave Ramsey
Why did you go to college? What do you make? I mean, what do you do? That's. That's awful.
Caller
Yeah, well, that was just my job. I was in college. I'm currently looking for a career, but I. Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
What's your degree in?
Caller
Science and policy.
Rachel Cruze
Well, he just graduated.
Dave Ramsey
I know. What's your degree in?
Caller
Environmental science and policy.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. So how's the new. How's the big boy job hunt going?
Caller
Well, I have my resume. Started tailoring my resume.
I have also applied for to be a game warden with the department of natural resources, which is my second choice, and that would be doing 80,000 a year for that.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. And your degree does somewhat prepare you for that. Okay. Yes, that makes sense. All right, so, yeah, now I'm caught up. Okay. But you need to be in the big boy job quick.
Caller
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. All right. The way you presented this is like 17 hours.
Rachel Cruze
It's been three weeks.
Dave Ramsey
I know, but $17 an hour was, like, success or something. It's not success. It's. No, we're not doing that.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Anyway, how can I help? How can we help? What's your question?
Caller
Yeah, so once I get that big
boy job, and like I said, I'm
on baby step two, but once I get that big boy job, I want
to pay off my loans, but I
also want to save up to buy a ring to propose to my girlfriend.
Yay.
Dave Ramsey
I love it.
Caller
Thank you. We've been dating for three years, and
I really want to take the next step with her. And I've talked to her family, and
I just was curious how you would do that because I have such a big payment in my student loans. Should I hold off on that for me?
Dave Ramsey
No, I think you get rid of the credit card debt, and then you save up some money for a rent, and then you get back on the student loans.
Caller
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
So have you got a. Have you got a budget in mind on the ring?
Caller
Yeah, somewhere around 2000.
Two to three thousand.
Dave Ramsey
That fits. Good. Good.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah. And you may just be working three jobs to get there faster, too, you know?
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
Hopefully you get the 80,000.
Dave Ramsey
If you get the 80,000, that's it. So a good rule of thumb for those listening, not for you, because I like your 2000. Okay. Okay. But a good rule of thumb is a maximum of one month's pay for your ring. Jewelry store in the mall will tell you three months, but they sell rings. It's like asking a dog if it's hungry. Okay. So of course they're going to do that. But the. So one month. And so in your situation, that 2000 is very reasonable, given that you're going to have to stop paying on your
Rachel Cruze
debt to do this.
Dave Ramsey
Yes, but. And I think you're very wise. And, yes, I would do all of that as soon as you possibly can.
Caller
Okay. Yeah, the. The credit card should be paid off by the end of July. I also am a lacrosse coach, so I run multiple camps and do individual lessons. So I'm kind of already doing a side hustle on top of that. And that will stay good once I get that Career path.
Dave Ramsey
Good.
Caller
But. Yeah, so I was. That was.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, you'll be able to attack the 70, but. And is she out of school, too?
Caller
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
And what's her career?
Caller
She's a.
Dave Ramsey
She's a nurse and she got the passer bars and got the job.
Caller
She's finishing up nursing school. So this. This semester, it will be here last semester in December.
Rachel Cruze
Will she have debt
Caller
a little bit as well?
Yes.
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
So when you combine incomes and combine those two student loan debts, and you guys have a wonderful life starting off, and you attack those student loans to get rid of them, and then you go be millionaires, we're going to be so proud of you.
Caller
All right. Thank you.
Dave Ramsey
Go do it, man. Go do it.
Rachel Cruze
Well done.
Dave Ramsey
Very well done. Good stuff. Good stuff. That's cool.
Rachel Cruze
Well, fresh off the grad stage. Dave's like, what? What are you doing?
Dave Ramsey
Well, I'm working 35 hours. I heard 35 hours a week at $17. What'd you hear?
Rachel Cruze
I heard that, too.
Dave Ramsey
And that's the definition of sucks right there.
Rachel Cruze
But he also was a lacrosse coach. He's killing it.
Dave Ramsey
No, he didn't. That buried that lead.
Caller
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Dave Ramsey
In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt free stage. Austin and MacKenzie are with us. Hi, guys. How are you doing?
Caller
Pretty good. How are you?
Dave Ramsey
Welcome, welcome. Where do y' all live?
Caller
Mount Pleasant, Michigan.
Dave Ramsey
Ah, okay. Where's that? Near.
Caller
Like in the middle.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. Right in the middle.
Rachel Cruze
I love Michigan. People always put up the.
Dave Ramsey
Always put the hand up. Talk to the hand. Yeah. Good. Very cool. Well, welcome to Nashville. And you're here to do a debt free scream. How much debt have you paid off?
Caller
We paid off $117,417.
Brian Buffini
Love it.
Dave Ramsey
And how long did that take?
Caller
19 months.
Dave Ramsey
Good for you and your range of income during that two years, years.
Caller
We started at 100,000 and then we ended at 203,000.
Dave Ramsey
Well, that's a little jump. Nice. What do y' all do for a living?
Caller
I am a health insurance agent, I'm
a broker and I'm a stay at home mom.
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
So how'd you double your income in 18 months, dude?
Caller
Well, we actually, once we had our first child, I realized we weren't sure if she was going to stay home or continue to work. And when I was holding her, I realized, realized we have to keep her home with her mom. And that just really set a fire to pick things up for me.
Yeah, so he just worked really hard to up the sales.
Dave Ramsey
Wow.
Rachel Cruze
Golly. Baby, will motivate you?
Dave Ramsey
Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You're holding that child. You're like. This just got real.
Rachel Cruze
Oh, my gosh. So.
Caller
Wow.
Dave Ramsey
So what was the 117,000 in debt? What kind of debt?
Caller
Credit cards, two cards, student loans, personal loan, medical, and our house.
Dave Ramsey
Wow, you paid off your house?
Caller
We sure did.
Yes, we did.
Dave Ramsey
So what's the house worth?
Caller
It is worth 135,000.
Dave Ramsey
Very cool. Good for you guys in Mount Pleasant, Michigan. What does that buy? How many square feet is that? How many bedrooms?
Caller
It's about a little over a thousand square feet and it's a three bed, one bed bath.
Wow.
Dave Ramsey
Very cool. And how old are you too?
Caller
27.
Dave Ramsey
And you have a paid for house in Michigan?
Brian Buffini
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
That's pretty amazing, y'.
Caller
All.
It feels good.
Feels great.
Dave Ramsey
I bet.
Rachel Cruze
Pretty incredible. What year did you guys buy the house?
Caller
Two years ago.
Yeah, two years ago. So 22 years ago. Yeah. Yep.
Rachel Cruze
Amazing. See, we were just talking last hour about people getting in the market and doing all of this and getting out of debt and all of it. And you guys did all that of it in 18 months? Two years. Basically got in.
Dave Ramsey
Not only did they buy a home in their twenties.
Caller
Yes.
Dave Ramsey
They paid it off in their twenties. Guess what? They bought a 1000. What'd you say? How many square feet?
Caller
1000. About a thousand.
Dave Ramsey
About a thousand square feet.
Rachel Cruze
Well done, you guys. That's amazing.
Dave Ramsey
This is not, this is not going to be on the, you know, the land of the rich and famous. But it is a great starter house
Rachel Cruze
for kids because you guys are going
Dave Ramsey
to start, you're going to be millionaires.
Brian Buffini
Yeah.
Caller
I mean, hey, hey. It's a roof over our head.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
I love it.
Dave Ramsey
I'm so proud of you. Way to go. So did you sell anything, like the cars or anything?
Caller
No, actually we kept the cars that we currently have. And during the process, I actually called into the show to ask if I should buy a 1976 Corvette. And, yeah, it was interesting. He had told me, not necessarily something that you would have done at that time, but. But to keep it based off the income and where I was at during the baby steps. So probably would have maybe been a little bit sooner if I hadn't done that.
Rachel Cruze
But you kept the car.
Caller
Yeah, we kept everything.
Rachel Cruze
Because we told you to. That. We told you you could.
Caller
Yes. Rachel, you gave me a little more trouble than Dave did. Surprisingly.
Rachel Cruze
So funny.
Dave Ramsey
Surprisingly. We were all together.
Caller
Look at that.
Yes, it's funny.
Rachel Cruze
I probably was like, sell it. Oh, I think I do remember that. So I was like, I don't get it.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, but it wasn't. It wasn't. But how much money was.
Brian Buffini
Was it.
Caller
It was 7700. It was.
Okay.
Rachel Cruze
Okay, okay, okay. Oh, so. So what happened 19 months ago that you said, okay, we're going to start this journey to pay off all. I mean, that's a long list of debt.
Caller
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
I mean, in the house.
Caller
Yeah.
I don't think it was anything. One big thing in particular. I think it was just a bunch of little small things. But I think definitely our first daughter being born, we were like, yeah, we gotta. You know, leading up to that, we were like, we gotta get serious about this.
Dave Ramsey
What do you tell people? The key to doing this is, I
Caller
would say, at least for me and the people that I talk to, the ones that don't really make it or get anywhere are the ones that say that it's impossible to do or they just can't do it. And like, for us, we asked, how can we do this? What do we need to do? Exactly. So that's. That was my advice. If you're in that situation where it feels impossible, I definitely ask yourself how? And start from there.
Also, just, like, being honest with yourself and, like, putting the numbers in your face. Cause it took him. I won't say nagging, but persistently being like, hey, let's add up what you spent on this month, you know, and all this stuff. And it took me sitting down and looking at the number that I was spending on fast food to be like, actually, you know what? I can afford to put more money towards my debts. Like, there's no reason I. That I should only be making minimum payments on everything.
Rachel Cruze
Wow. So the. I mean, the budget and the revealing of, hey, this is what's going on, and here's what we have to change from a lifestyle perspective. Even.
Caller
Absolutely. Just be honest with yourself. Yes. Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
So good. Yeah. People live in a little bit of that denial, I think, at times, right, where you're like, it's not a big deal. It's not a big deal. And then, yeah, you add it up,
Dave Ramsey
you're like, oh, man, it is a big deal.
Rachel Cruze
This could be going towards something great.
Caller
Yeah, absolutely.
Rachel Cruze
Well done, you guys.
Dave Ramsey
So you guys are content today with an inexpensive home and some inexpensive cars so that you're 100% debt free? And I've often taught, and Rachel has too, that contentment is not on the same spectrum with ambition. Because you're very ambitious at the same time in that you leaned into this. You worked your tail off, double dirt, you cleaned up the mess, you paid it all off in 18 months, house and everything. Oh, my gosh. Where does that contentment come from?
Caller
I would say we. We just have a lot of peace knowing that, you know, if something were to happen to me tomorrow, that the girls will be okay, that they're not going to drown in debt. We put a lot of things in place that you guys have recommended to give us that peace. And I'll say I. I know people that have much nicer cars and much nicer homes, but have a lot more stress on their shoulders. And that's just not something that I wish for myself or my family.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah.
Caller
Yeah. And I think I. I mean, I'm content with food in the fridge, a roof over our head, and happy daughters, you know, and, you know, just giving it up to God and he's provided what we need, and we don't need anything else. That's. I guess that's where the contentment comes from.
Brian Buffini
Yes.
Caller
Yeah.
Rachel Cruze
We complicate our lives so much. Right. I mean, and we. And we do it to ourselves.
Caller
Yeah. Chasing after the next big thing.
Rachel Cruze
That's right. Absolutely. And that keeps you in a broke cycle for so many people, and they don't even realize it.
Caller
Right.
Rachel Cruze
And you guys are just a beautiful example of what that looks like, because you're exactly right. I think trading the peace over the stress any day.
Caller
Yes.
Rachel Cruze
And people crave it. They don't know what to do, so.
Caller
Absolutely.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah.
Caller
We'll be saving up. We're currently saving up for our next house.
Guest Host
So we can cash.
Caller
Yeah, absolutely. So it'll take some time, but. But that's the next goal for us.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah. You guys are awesome.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
You're gonna be able to do. I mean, if you're making a couple of hundred, you're gonna be able to do Whatever you want to do in very short order because you got the stuff in the right order. You didn't go acting like you were richer than you are. And that's gonna set you up to build incredible wealth and generosity. In the meantime, you've got the piece of going, hey, this house, we got no payments. And I'll tell you something else. How long has the house been. How long has the debt been paid off? How many months ago was that?
Caller
February is when we paid it off.
Dave Ramsey
Have you noticed yet a difference in your sales?
Caller
Well, I noticed there's definitely a difference in everything that I do. Knowing that it's paid off. I mean, we've cash flowed three vacations since then as a little celebration, including this one. This will be our last one for a while. But there's definitely a different. There's a calm in the air that we've never felt before.
Dave Ramsey
Yeah. I've always coached small business owners and sales teams as well. That when you don't have a single debt in the world, you don't have to make a sale. And people can smell it.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
And you end up increasing your income.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Because they don't think. You don't smell needy. A needy salesperson. You can smell it.
Caller
The commission breath is awful.
Exactly.
Dave Ramsey
That's exactly what it is.
Rachel Cruze
And how old are the kids?
Caller
She just turned 19 months old. And she just turned five months old.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
Did you bring them or are they at home?
Caller
Yeah, they're here.
Dave Ramsey
You want to put them in the debt free scream?
Guest Host
Absolutely.
Dave Ramsey
All right, let's bring them up then. That's perfect. And what are their names?
Caller
This one's Harlan.
Rachel Cruze
So great.
Dave Ramsey
Little Harlan. Oh, cute.
Caller
And the little baby is Maggie.
Dave Ramsey
Oh, my gosh.
Rachel Cruze
So sweet. All right.
Dave Ramsey
Mom and dad changed their family tree. All right, Count it down. 117,000 paid off in 19 months. Debt free house and everything at 26. Let's see. Hear a debt free scream.
Caller
One, two, three. We're debt free.
Dave Ramsey
Well, you got to do the debt free scream early.
Caller
So good.
Dave Ramsey
That's awesome.
Caller
So good.
Oh.
Dave Ramsey
You should not feel uncertain about investing. And you don't have to. That's why we created Investing Essentials, a two night virtual event where George Camel and I walk you through my playbook for investing and wealth planning. We'll simplify everything from 401ks and mutual funds to passing on wealth so you can invest with confidence. Tickets start at $199. Get yours today at ramseysolutions.com events or click the link in the show notes. Our scripture of the day. Hebrews 11:6. It is impossible to please God without faith. Anyone who wants to come to him must believe that God exists and that he rewards those who Sincerely seek Him. St. Francis of Assisi said, start by doing what's necessary, then do what's possible, and suddenly you are doing the impossible. People always want to know how I handle my investments. And a couple of years ago, we decided to open Dave's Investing Playbook on real estate and on other things. And that includes what I don't invest in and why. And we called it Investing Essentials. And George Camel and I did a virtual event for two nights. We've only done that two times. We're gonna do it again one more time, and we're gonna change up a little bit of the content and get a little bit into building a lasting legacy and dealing with the issues of wealth inside your family and looking at wills and estate planning just a little bit as well. So we're gonna get into all of that. It's two nights. It's a virtual event. September 1st and 2nd. Me and George Camel tickets start at 1 99. You can get them@ramseysolutions.com Jasmine is with us in Baltimore. Hi, Jasmine. How are you?
Caller
Hey.
I'm really curious how this is gonna go. Thanks for taking my call.
Dave Ramsey
Sure. What's up?
Caller
So I went into some debt. At the time, I wasn't super familiar with your baby steps, but I'm in baby step number two now building a homeschool app. And I'm thinking about taking some certificates, paying to take some AI product management certificates to put me in a different tax bracket. Entry level is like 100k. Can be, like, anywhere between 100k and 200k starting pay. And I'm wondering, is it like, it's such a competitive field, Is it worth me paying in to take those certificates and putting that time in to come out the other side, hoping to put that money back into my business.
Dave Ramsey
Are you already in the technological field?
Caller
Well, I'm the product manager for the app that I built. Like, I built this app from scratch for homeschoolers.
Dave Ramsey
That means you did it by yourself at your kitchen table.
Caller
No, no, I. I hired a web development company. But, like, I chose, like, how everything's supposed to function. Like, where the buttons are supposed to be, what needs to connect to what. Like, I designed it completely from that. And that's what a product manager does.
Dave Ramsey
I know what a product manager does. I have a bunch of them. Works for me. Okay,
Caller
I'm sorry.
Dave Ramsey
That's okay. The so I but I just didn't visualize how you're doing so but you've got no software engineering experience at all?
Caller
No.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. All right.
Rachel Cruze
And what would the courses is it the what you're going to to get and learn in those for the app or you said it's going to put you in a different tax bracket like
Dave Ramsey
what she just means she's going to
Rachel Cruze
make more money how though make more
Caller
money so I can move the business
Rachel Cruze
faster with with the day job make more money in what you're currently doing
Caller
or with the app make more money with getting the project management AI Project management certificates to get a different job.
Rachel Cruze
Okay. So right now I'm about 60. I gotcha.
Caller
I gotcha.
Rachel Cruze
Gotcha. And the field at which you're looking to get in is AI Project. Yes, I know. Thank you. I I yes. But I'm asking is that is the type of online course that you're taking do they see that as because it's kind of it's all pretty new. Do they need that as a standard or are they looking for something else? I just want to make sure you don't get in this and get something that people are like I don't even know what this is. And then does it really doesn't do
Caller
much for you know the Coursera certificates that you can get are specialized for project management training and then there's some for AI project management training. And if you pay like $300 you get access to like 10,000 different courses. I only need maybe four different certificates and I'm really burnt out at my job that I'm at and it's, it's not moving the needle fast enough for me.
Rachel Cruze
Okay.
Dave Ramsey
So yes, I would spend $300 on continuing education. Yes, I would pursue your dream. Where I've got a disconnect is that someone told you this guarantees and opens these doors and I'm not sure it does.
Caller
Right. That's why I'm like should I okay, so yes, do it. But I don't know that I'll get a job doing it. But I know that I, I, I have it in me to do that job if I were to get that job.
Rachel Cruze
Yes. Have you talked to people though that are that the job is out there and you could apply for it and they're saying hey, you do need these courses and then you could be in the running.
Dave Ramsey
Have you already got any certs in project management not counting AI?
Caller
No, I don't I just have proof that I can like that I can do the job because of that. What I've already done built the app
Rachel Cruze
that you did as proof too. Okay.
Caller
Yeah.
Dave Ramsey
Okay. So I'll be. Here's what's running through my mind. All right? We have 400 people of our thousand people that are in the technology side of things. Obviously we're leaning heavily into AI and obviously we have several project managers and lots of product squads working on things that are being led by different people.
Caller
People.
Dave Ramsey
And I'm trying to think through if this would cause us to consider hiring you. The fact that you built an app for your homeschool thing, I don't know if that qualifies you to be a project manager, even though you actually did manage a project. I'm not arguing that. I'm not sure we would hire you. And I'm not sure we would hire you because you had a certificate that says you're an AI project manager that costs you $300 to go through course there. I, I, I think we would talk to you.
Rachel Cruze
That's why I'm asking the companies that you're wanting to work for, Jasmine, what are they saying?
Dave Ramsey
It's not a golden key that opens the door.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah, but it's not Ramsey. She's asking.
Dave Ramsey
No, but it is. She's wanting to get a job making $100,000 a year.
Rachel Cruze
I know, but in technology companies, trust me, I got some friends working in those. Plenty of money there. It's crazy. So I was wondering, like, has she talked, like, when she's looking at these jobs, are they saying this is a hole that has to be filled and this is a way to fill that hole, or is it work experience? Like, I'm trying to figure out what it is for that next step. And is it courses or is it not?
Dave Ramsey
Yeah, There is plenty of money in technology companies, and we pay a lot of money to the technology team here. That's true. All of those are true. The only question I've got is whether this actually is the golden key that opens the door. And I'm not sure it is. And so what would be the next
Rachel Cruze
step for her to get on that path is my question.
Dave Ramsey
I think I would talk to someone who's actually doing the job that she wants to do, talk to the company.
Rachel Cruze
Company she's applying for.
Caller
I agree.
Dave Ramsey
Find someone that is doing AI project management and say, okay, what would qualify? What would make me get an interview and possibly get hired? Would this certificate help? Or is it a slam dunk if I've got the certificate? Or nobody gives a Crap. If I've got their certificate and talk to somebody who's actually doing that, and I think you're going to find that they're going to want some. If you want to be a project manager and you want to be an AI, both are cutting edge situations, you probably are going to have to have something more than what I'm hearing here. But I might be wrong. So I do want you to discover all of that. I don't want you to spend $300 and then be vastly disappointed that you didn't walk into the first place. And they went, oh, we have to have you. You got a Corsair certificate, which I'm pretty sure is not going to happen. Okay, so. And you Suddenly go make $100,000 a year. I just, it's. No, I don't believe that's gonna happen. But I do believe that you're on the right track and I want you to continue pursuing.
Rachel Cruze
Yeah, I would use Ken Coleman's principle, the proximity principle. Go talk to people in that field, Jasmine. And again to those companies that you're looking at to apply for and go out to coffee with some of them, like, hey, what are the first four things I need to be doing to get myself in the running for this? Cause this is a passion of yours. You're obviously somewhat educated in it because you built an app and you're like, you're actually in that world doing it. You're pressing the buttons, you're talking to the people. Develop like you are in this world. And so what's the next formality to actually make you in the running for it? And it may be this certificate, it may not. We don't know. But I would go talk to people in that field.
Dave Ramsey
Folks, the danger I want everybody out there to look for is this. Don't. When someone tells you in a trade school or a certificate program or a four year old, your education, that this is going to be the magic pill that makes your life all good. It's not. You're the secret sauce, not the education piece. You're the secret sauce that gets the job, keeps the job. And so when someone says, oh, we'll put you in a higher tax bracket, that sounds like a sales pitch from a trade school to me. And so I don't want you to fall for that. I want you to have good, solid information about make these decisions that puts us hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace. And that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace, Christ Jesus.
Date: June 25, 2026
Hosts: Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruze
Special Guest: Brian Buffini
This episode focuses on how clear priorities and intentional action are essential for making wise money decisions—whether building wealth, buying a home in a tough market, escaping debt, or managing finances within a family. Throughout, Ramsey and his team answer listener questions, provide real-life examples, and deliver practical advice, especially on navigating today’s real estate challenges.
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For more resources or to connect with a Ramsey Trusted real estate agent, visit ramseysolutions.com/agent