I Haven't Been Paid In 20 Weeks

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show Highlights

Episode: I Haven't Been Paid In 20 Weeks
Date: April 2, 2026
Host/Panel: Dave Ramsey, Ken Coleman, Chris Hogan
Caller: Tom

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Episode Overview

In this episode, the hosts take a call from Tom, a master electrician who recently realized he hasn’t been fully paid for his work over the past 20 weeks, accumulating roughly $18,000 in unpaid wages. The discussion centers around how to handle being owed money, confronting dishonesty in employment, and developing the courage to move on to better opportunities—especially when fear of change or loss can hold us back. The hosts offer practical advice, tough love, and encouragement for Tom and others in similar predicaments.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Tom's Situation: How Did He End Up Unpaid?

• Tom explains he’s worked for another master electrician for about four or five years. Recently, he noticed that not all pay periods were accounted for, realizing he’s short by 20 weeks of pay (~$18,000).
  • Tom: "It used to be a company of five employees... everybody left... he got stiffed on a $25,000 job... I think he just transferred that deficit... to not paying me." (01:23)
• Ken Coleman challenges Tom: "Why are you just discovering this?" (00:55)
  • Tom admits he was distracted by significant life events like getting married, building a house, and having a baby. He concedes responsibility for not noticing sooner.
  • Ken: "Which would be all the more reasons. I counted all my paychecks." (01:11)
  • Tom: "Absolutely, absolutely." (01:15)

2. The Employer's Excuses & Character

• Ken identifies dishonesty: The employer failed to discuss the situation or his inability to pay.
  • Ken: "He never bothered to discuss this with you?" (01:46)
  • Tom: "Correct." (01:51)
• Ken and Chris Hogan call out the behavior:
  • Ken: "You discovered he's a snake. Now that we've established that... all they do is bite. Don't think the snake's going to turn into a rabbit. It's a snake." (02:22)
  • Chris: "Leave." (02:46)

3. On Moral Dilemmas and Taking Action

• Tom expresses ethical conflict—worried about leaving or filing a wage claim if his employer were to declare bankruptcy.
  • Tom: "That's part of the moral dilemma I've been having." (03:25)
• Ken's tough love: "It's not a moral dilemma. It's common freaking sense." (03:28)
• Tom's strategy: He stopped working until paid, considering pretending he would stay to recoup more owed money.
  • Ken: "This guy doesn't pay people and he lies about it. That's not going to change... Best thing you can do... is distance yourself." (03:51, 04:20)
  • Chris: "You have not been paying attention... cost yourself a lot of money. ...you're afraid to step out. You think this guy's the only guy that's going to pay you? In one of the most sought after trades there are right now." (04:39)

4. Practical Advice: Next Steps and Accepting Payment-in-Kind

• Ken and Chris urge Tom to leave and find a new job immediately. Master electricians are in high demand.
  • Ken: "There's a line around the block of people hiring master electricians..." (05:06)
• Tom’s employer offers truck/trailer titles instead of cash.
  • Chris: "Yes, yes, yes. Like instantly?" (05:27)
  • Ken: "I won't file a wage claim if you give me a truck and a trailer worth what you owe me 100% and I won't file a wage Claim... that's redemption for his thievery. ...Maybe you set up shop for yourself then." (05:30)

5. Lessons on Self-Management and Trust

• Ken warns about business skills:
  • "You can be a good electrician and a bad businessman. ...If you're setting yourself up in business, learn the business skills too." (06:01)
• Commentary on Tom’s Character:
  • Ken: "He works hard...high work ethic, high honor...tried to superimpose that back on the guy who's a snake... And you know what that'll leave is a scar." (06:31)

6. The Underlying Theme: Fear, Change, and Owning the Lesson

• Chris expands on fear and inertia:
  • "Fear of the unknown just holds so many of us up...you will put up with things that you would not normally put up with." (07:10)
• Ken discusses getting stuck in rumination:
  • "Rumination...is really dangerous. Can hold back a lot of progress." (08:04)
• Entrepreneurship and Risk:
  • Ken: "The entrepreneur is the only person who can go from sheer terror to sheer exhilaration and back every 24 hours." (08:25)

7. Final Takeaways

• Pay attention to your own affairs:
  • Ken: "No one else is managing you but you." (09:08)
• Don’t try to change bad people:
  • Ken: "Don’t try to make a snake into a rabbit. They're just snakes... just because you might be a good person doesn't mean you can expect that of other people." (09:09)
• If Tom had been responsible for payroll:
  • Ken: "The first day, he couldn't make a check... he would have sat down and told the guy day one. He wouldn't have lied to him. He wouldn't have hid it from him." (09:09)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Ken Coleman:

  "You discovered he's a snake. Now that we've established that, we also know one thing about snakes. All they do is bite. They don't do anything else. Don't be shocked. And don't think the snake's going to turn into a rabbit. It's a snake." (02:22)

• Chris Hogan:

  "You have not been paying attention to what's going on and cost yourself a lot of money. Number two, you're afraid to step out." (04:39)

• Ken Coleman:

  "That's a guy I can trust, the guy in my mirror, right?" (05:56)

• Ken Coleman:

  "You can be a good electrician and a bad businessman. So be careful if you're setting yourself up in business that you learn the business skills too." (06:01)

• Chris Hogan:

  "Fear of the unknown just holds so many of us up... When we don't know what's next... you will put up with things that you would not normally put up with." (07:10)

• Ken Coleman:

  "The entrepreneur is the only person who can go from sheer terror to sheer exhilaration and back every 24 hours." (08:25)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:12 – 01:11: Tom details his discovery of unpaid wages
• 01:23 – 02:21: Employer's background, company decline, and lack of communication
• 02:22 – 02:46: Hosts call out the employer’s character—“snake” analogy
• 03:25 – 03:51: Tom’s “moral dilemma” and Ken’s rebuttal
• 04:39 – 05:18: Action steps; demand for electricians in today’s job market
• 05:18 – 05:54: Truck/trailer offer as alternative payment—hosts recommend accepting
• 06:01 – 07:10: Importance of business skills and working with integrity
• 07:10 – 08:09: Discussing fear, inertia, and entrepreneurship
• 09:08 – 09:43: Key takeaways on self-management and trusting others

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Summary for Listeners

This episode is a direct, honest look at what can happen when you trust the wrong people in business and fail to keep close track of your finances. The hosts emphasize acting decisively in the face of dishonesty, the importance of being vigilant with your money and work, and being willing to leave toxic situations. They affirm that, especially in skilled trades, opportunities abound—and it’s better to move forward, even if it’s scary, than to stay stuck with a “snake.” The panel delivers hard truths, actionable advice, and encouragement to grow not only as a worker but as a businessperson. The ultimate message: Monitor your own interests, don’t try to change dishonest people, accept redemption where possible, and step forward into new opportunities—even when you’re afraid.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by CHM, a budget friendly faith based alternative to health insurance. Chministries.org budget I am a master electrician

[Tom (Caller)]

working for another master electrician for the last four or five years. And I recently discovered that we're about 20 weeks behind on payroll, which equates about $18,000. I'm looking for some advice on.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm sorry you haven't been paid in 20 weeks, but you recently discovered that I've.

[Tom (Caller)]

I've been getting paid but not, you know, like two pay periods in a month or three pay periods in a month, not four. And it's accumulated into. Yeah. In February. The most up to date pay period I have is October 4th.

[Ken Coleman]

Why are you just discovering this?

[Tom (Caller)]

Well, that's a phenomenal question. It's definitely my fault that I have failed to realize it for this long. I've been building a house, I just had a baby. I got married this year and it just.

[Ken Coleman]

Which would be all the more reasons. I counted all my paychecks.

[Tom (Caller)]

Absolutely. Absolutely.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so why is the guy not paying you what he owes you?

[Tom (Caller)]

Well, it used to be a company of five employees and then everybody left and it was just him and myself. And then he got stiffed on a $25,000 job. He put a lien on the property but never got paid for it. And I think he just transferred that deficit from supply stores lines of credit to not paying me because I don't

[Ken Coleman]

charge interest but never bothered to discuss this with you.

[Tom (Caller)]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

And when did you discover this?

[Tom (Caller)]

I discovered it the week before last on a Thursday.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Have you found a new job yet? Well, I'm not working for a crook. Why would you.

[Tom (Caller)]

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. I, I agree with you. My biggest concern is that I file a wage claim and he declares bankruptcy.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, that's probably very likely.

[Tom (Caller)]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

That's not. You're not going to get the money by sticking around though. You discovered he's a snake. Now that we've established that, we also know one thing about snakes. All they do is bite. They don't do anything else. Don't be shocked. And don't think the snake's going to turn into a rabbit. It's a snake.

[Chris Hogan]

Leave.

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Tom (Caller)]

All.

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[Tom (Caller)]

That's part of the moral dilemma I've been having.

[Ken Coleman]

It's not a moral dilemma. It's common freaking sense.

[Tom (Caller)]

Well, I have not been working. You know, I made it clear that I don't want to work until we're paid up. But my thought was by creating the illusion that I would continue working for him, maybe I could, you know, get. Get some of this money paid up before I tell him I'm leaving.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, let me try one more time. Okay? This guy doesn't pay people and he lies about it. That's not going to change based on any action you take. This is a guy. This is what he does. He's a liar and a thief. That's who he is. The best thing you can do with liars and thieves is to distance yourself from them so that you don't get lied to and stolen from.

[Tom (Caller)]

Agreed.

[Ken Coleman]

So I'm afraid, sir, you've lost your money because you didn't keep your finger on the pulse. And that's on you. It's also on him because he's a snake. But dude, you need to get a job yesterday and quit trying to figure out a way to get this snake to not be a snake. He's a snake.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah. I just think you're afraid of something. That's why you're doing this moral stuff and throwing these words around. All that is is you justifying your lack of inaction. And you've just been. Two lessons you got to learn here. You have not been paying attention to what's going on and cost yourself a lot of money. Number two, you're afraid to step out. You think this guy's the only guy that's going to pay you? And you're in one of the most sought after trades there are right now. Massive need.

[Ken Coleman]

There's a line around the block of people hiring master electricians there. There's such a shortage of people in the trades, so you can go get something tomorrow and you should have. Yesterday

[Tom (Caller)]

he. He offered to transfer the titles on some trucks and trailers to me. Do you think I just take that and run?

[Chris Hogan]

Yes, yes, yes. Like instantly?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Yeah. I won't file a wage claim if you give me a truck and a trailer worth what you owe me 100% and I won't file a wage Claim on you with the state. Yeah, he needs to do that. And that's redemption for his thievery. Okay, yeah, take them. And then, hey, maybe you set up shop for yourself then. Have you got a truck and a trailer? Let's go, baby.

[Tom (Caller)]

Yeah, yeah. That is the plan.

[Ken Coleman]

That's a guy I can trust, the guy in my mirror, Right?

[Tom (Caller)]

Very true.

[Ken Coleman]

But now you're going to have to have someone help you with the books because you don't pay attention to them much. Sorry, Tom. You walked right into it, buddy. I love you, man, but, yeah, you can be a good electrician and a bad businessman. So be careful if you're setting yourself up in business that you learn the business skills too. So. Wow. Ouch. You know what that is? That's a guy who works his butt off.

[Chris Hogan]

That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

He works hard. And most of everything, he's gotten. He's outworked everybody else and he thought he could outwork this. And folks, when you get in a situation like this, what you can't do. And Tom's a nice guy and he's an honest guy and a good guy. We're picking at him a little bit, having some fun, but we've all done things like he's done. What he did is he took his personal character of high work ethic, high honor, high integrity, and tried to superimpose that back on the guy who's a snake because he thinks other people are going to be like he is. And you know what that'll leave is a scar.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, it already has. Here's the great news. Until the very end of that call, we thought he was getting nothing. And so the lesson here is, and again, not picking on Tom, but there's fear. We didn't have time to break it down, but for him holding on. And I'm going to tell you, fear of the unknown just holds so many of us up, us all caps. I've done it. When we don't know what's next, right? Whether he goes out on his own or he's got to get out on the street, you will put up with things that you would not normally put up with. And I'm telling you, for everybody listening and watching, there's a lesson here. He's terrified of something, maybe just change. And that's normal, by the way. Doesn't make Tom a weirdo. That's all of us. So learn the lesson there that when we have that fear, the fact that he called us today is good. Get some insight from other people, Dave, because what will Happen is you get into this in this loop that I can.

[Ken Coleman]

Rumination.

[Chris Hogan]

Thank you. That's the word. And it's really dangerous. Can hold back a lot of progress.

[Ken Coleman]

So I spoke at a church yesterday, and between services, go out and talk to people and all this stuff, and a guy came up and he's like, how do you get over the fear running your own business? And I said, I'll let you know.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, great statement, right?

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, the editor, John Johnson of Ebony magazine said the entrepreneur is the only person who can go from sheer terror to sheer exhilaration and back every 24 hours. That's right. And so, yeah, that's so, yeah, I got me a truck and I got me a. A trailer, but. And I have the skill. But now. Good. That's scary as hell.

[Chris Hogan]

It is scary. And I won't acknowledge that.

[Ken Coleman]

Right. So, yeah, you're right, too. That's very good. Well, I tell you, that's a good guy. The couple lessons. If you listen to this show, you can learn things. That's the idea. It's not just entertaining, although Ken is quite entertaining. But the very much. But the two takeaways is one, you got to pay attention what's going on. Yes. In detail, because no one else is managing you but you.

[Chris Hogan]

That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

And then two is, don't try to make a snake into a rabbit. They're just snakes. And so just because you might be a good person doesn't mean you can expect that of other people. You can't always expect other people to react the way you are going to react to do what you would do in that situation. Because let me just tell you, if Tom was in charge of the payroll, the first day, he couldn't make a check, a payroll check, he would have been sweating and terrified and would have sat down and told the guy day one.

[Chris Hogan]

That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

He wouldn't have lied to him. He wouldn't have hid it from him.

[Dave Ramsey]

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