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Financial Advisor
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Sarah
I'm considering leaving my husband, but I feel like I'm financially trapped with, like, the amount of debt that we have. I just feel like I'm not able to leave with my daughter.
Financial Advisor
Okay. What happened to your marriage, hon?
Sarah
We've been married for about 13 years, and it's just been a lot of verbal abuse. And over the last five years, since we've had our daughter, I just kind of started realizing that it's not something I want her to be in and grow seeing that type of treatment. So I just am at this point where I'm, you know, trying to look at my options right now. And we've done couples therapy, and it just doesn't seem like it's kind of clicking with him. I just kind of feel like I'm at my wits end with it.
Financial Advisor
So I'm sorry. And how many kids you got?
Sarah
We have one.
Financial Advisor
What age?
Sarah
She has four.
Financial Advisor
Wow. Well, you know, obviously we're gonna be a proponent for anybody to do anything they can to try to stay together, but not in an abusive situation without some traction on that. So I certainly understand where you are. A friend of mine that does divorce recovery counseling has always told me for the last 30 years that divorce turns a marriage into a business transaction. So this is now about incomes and assets and liabilities. So what is your income?
Sarah
So my income is approximately 56,000 a year.
Financial Advisor
Okay. Can you live on that as a single person? Yes.
Sarah
In our area?
Financial Advisor
Yes. Yes, you can. Okay. And you said there's death that makes you feel like you're trapped. How much debt do you guys have?
Sarah
So besides our house, my husband has a camper loan, his truck loan, and a four wheeler loan. And then we have about, I think, 12,000 in credit card debt, and I have 27,000 in student loan debt.
Financial Advisor
Okay. All right. And what's. What's the home worth?
Sarah
In our area, homes that are equivalent to ours are going about 35,000.
Financial Advisor
$35,000.
Sarah
I'm sorry, 235,000.
Financial Advisor
Okay. I feel better now. Okay. I thought you were in the camper for a minute. Okay. And. Okay, 235,000. And what do you owe on it?
Sarah
We owe 179,000.
Financial Advisor
Okay. So there's a little bit of equity there. Okay. I don't know how divorce works in Wisconsin necessarily, but obviously your next step is to gather information. Information always relieves anxiety. The unknown, it creates more anxiety than a known bad thing. If we got bad news and it's clear that's less anxiety than unknown than this just a boogeyman in the closet thing. So you need to sit down with an attorney and find out exactly how this is probably going to go down. I mean, a good divorce attorney can tell you in 30 minutes this is probably how this is going to go down. And it could sound like he gets all of the debt with his camper truck and four wheeler and they sell the house. And the house equity clears up the debt that is on the credit cards and maybe on the student loan and maybe some of his debt as well, because you'll probably get half the equity each in most cases. So either one of you have a big retirement plan?
Sarah
I have one through my employer. It's a state pension fund, but Nobody has a 401k. I believe my husband has a 401k, but he doesn't have much in there right now.
Counselor
Okay, what does he make?
Sarah
He makes about the same as I do, about 50,000 a year.
Financial Advisor
Okay. And then there's child support and then there's alimony. And those are the things, those are the variables that if I were you, I would want to learn about those things so that you know, you know what you're facing. And you're probably not as trapped as you think you are. I mean, you go get a one bedroom apartment or a two bedroom apartment, sell the house, pay off all the debts, and start over as a single lady making 56. Yeah, that's not, that's not, that's not really trapped.
Sarah
Yeah, I felt like I was trapped though, just because I. I mean, I still care about him and I don't want him to be stuck. But at the same time, I'm looking at it as like, financially, we got into the situation and I feel like I'm responsible to pay off like the debts and everything.
Financial Advisor
I don't know why all of those are his toys. Like I said, a divorce turns a marriage into a business transaction. If you want to get all romantic and start paying stuff you don't owe, that's a different discussion. If you're gonna do all that, you probably need to go back to marriage counselor and try to save the marriage. But, you know, once the decision is made and the switch is flipped, it's every man for himself, you know, it's not mean. I don't. I'm not trying to destroy him in this situation, but he could sell the four wheeler, the camper in the truck, and be out of debt too. Hello?
Sarah
Yep.
Financial Advisor
Okay, so you both are going to
Counselor
Be okay on the other side.
Financial Advisor
Nobody's trapped here except by decisions to hold on to a bunch of crap you can't afford. That's the only trapping there is.
Counselor
And staying in an abusive relationship, yeah, that's a worst trap to me. And so I think those next steps will help you get some clarity on this.
Financial Advisor
Yeah. And I also might change the tone of the therapy sessions. Like if you go sit down with an attorney and you know exactly how good a position you're actually in, then you're coming at this from a little bit more strength and you're going, look, I really want this to work, but all of a sudden your body language changes, your voice tone changes because of confidence because you know you're going to be okay instead of trapped. Because, Sarah, what you've told me, you're not trapped unless you choose to be trapped. But you can choose that if you want, but you're not. And. But, you know, a much better outcome is for him to grow up and stop the negative behavior and you guys to sell off all the garbage and get your dad gum life back with no debt and just quit buying everything in sight but campers and four wheelers and toys and trucks. And this just sounds like boy, boy out of control. Little boy out of control buying crap. And so, I mean, I don't run into a lot of ladies that have bought a camper and a four wheeler.
Counselor
That's a. That's.
Financial Advisor
Occasionally I do, but generally that would be the guy they went along with it. Yeah. And the pickup to pull the. Gotta have the truck to pull the camper with. That's the other thing. So. Yeah, and occasionally I run into some lady and the whole thing was her idea, but usually she's gonna make her mistakes in other places. So, you know, but you know, like she said, she was participating in the decisions, so she's willing to take responsibility for her part.
Counselor
She owned up for that. She was an accomplice to some of these bad decisions. Yeah, but I like what you said there, that you need to know the facts because those unknowns can be scarier. And just you're overwhelmed by everything around you and you get the facts, you go, okay, yeah, we could sell that.
Financial Advisor
Yeah.
Counselor
You know what? That will be split or that won't be in my name. And then you know how to move forward.
Financial Advisor
Yeah, it's interesting. Like cortisol release, stress drug release is way lower on bad news. That's clear. Than on ambivalent. Ambivalent. Not knowing the unknown, it creates a whole lot more stress. Create your free every dollar budget today. The simplest way to budget for your life.
Theme:
This episode of The Ramsey Show Highlights focuses on helping a listener named Sarah who feels financially trapped in an abusive marriage. The discussion centers on navigating the financial complexities of divorce, overcoming emotional barriers, and regaining a sense of control and confidence during a major life transition.
Sarah’s Background
Quote:
"I feel like I'm not able to leave with my daughter." — Sarah [00:06]
Efforts Toward Reconciliation
Quote:
"We've done couples therapy, and ... it just doesn't seem like it's kind of clicking with him." — Sarah [00:24]
Debt Breakdown
Quote:
“I have 27,000 in student loan debt.” — Sarah [02:18]
Home Equity
Income
Quote:
“Yes, you can [live on that as a single person].” — Financial Advisor [01:52]
Retirement Funds
Strategy for Moving Forward
Quote:
“Information always relieves anxiety. The unknown, it creates more anxiety than a known bad thing.” — Financial Advisor [02:45]
Quote:
“A divorce turns a marriage into a business transaction. So this is now about incomes and assets and liabilities.” — Financial Advisor [01:27]
Reframing “Trapped”
Quote:
“You’re not trapped unless you choose to be trapped. But you can choose that if you want, but you’re not.” — Financial Advisor [05:54]
Responsibility and Guilt
Quote:
“I mean, I still care about him and I don’t want him to be stuck.” — Sarah [04:33]
Advisor’s Reframe
Quote:
“If you want to get all romantic and start paying stuff you don’t owe, that’s a different discussion. If you’re gonna do all that, you probably need to go back to marriage counselor and try to save the marriage.” — Financial Advisor [04:54]
Who Owes What
Quote:
“Nobody’s trapped here except by decisions to hold on to a bunch of crap you can’t afford.” — Financial Advisor [05:39]
Mutual Acknowledgment of Mistakes
Quote:
“She owned up for that. She was an accomplice to some of these bad decisions.” — Counselor [07:25]
Gaining Clarity
Quote:
“...your body language changes, your voice tone changes because of confidence because you know you’re going to be okay instead of trapped.” — Financial Advisor [05:54]
Final Message
Quote:
“Staying in an abusive relationship, yeah, that’s a worst trap to me. And so I think those next steps will help you get some clarity on this.” — Counselor [05:44]
On the Transformation of Marriage During Divorce:
“A divorce turns a marriage into a business transaction.” — Financial Advisor [01:27]
On Overcoming the “Trapped” Mindset:
“Nobody’s trapped here except by decisions to hold on to a bunch of crap you can’t afford. That’s the only trapping there is.” — Financial Advisor [05:39]
On the Power of Information:
“Information always relieves anxiety. The unknown, it creates more anxiety than a known bad thing.” — Financial Advisor [02:45]
Encouragement to Take Control:
“You’re not trapped unless you choose to be trapped.” — Financial Advisor [05:54]
This episode provides a compassionate, step-by-step approach for anyone facing the double burden of relationship dissolution and financial overwhelm. The advisors validate the emotional struggle, stress the importance of clear information and self-advocacy, and urge listeners not to mistake uncertainty for being “trapped.” Their guidance empowers individuals like Sarah to move forward with clarity, courage, and a fresh start.