Our Amish Contractor Keeps Missing Deadlines For Our House

Summary

Episode Overview

Main Theme:
In this episode of The Ramsey Show Highlights, a caller named Susan seeks advice from Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruze, and George Kamel about her ongoing frustration with a home addition project that's months behind schedule. Having entrusted the job to an Amish contractor, Susan faces delays, shifting commitments, and inconsistent work, prompting her to ask: What should she do next with a contractor who keeps missing deadlines? The hosts explore the nuances of handling contractor disputes, protecting your investment, and dealing with culturally unique circumstances.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Caller’s Situation: Contractor Delays and Inconsistency

• [00:06] Susan explains her family’s $313,000 home addition project which began in July and was expected to finish by Thanksgiving but is now nowhere near completion.
  • Initially, they trusted the contractor but became concerned as promised deadlines repeatedly passed.
  • The contractor continues to give new completion dates, none of which have been met.
  • Susan asks: "I just wanted you guys' advice on how to proceed with goals not being met on the project."

2. Nature of Delays and Contractor’s Excuses

• [01:07] Susan clarifies that while the contractor doesn't disappear for long periods, there are days when promised work doesn't happen.
  • “He keeps on communicating with us, and he shows up, but it’s not consistent.” (Susan, 01:23)
• [01:32] The Amish factor: The contractor cites "butchering days" (when crew are unavailable), car breakdowns, and various reasons for delays.
  • Rachel Cruze and George Kamel react with disbelief at the nature of these excuses.

3. Community Reputation and Current Options

• [02:09] Susan notes that the contractor is locally known and regarded as a "good guy."
• The family is weighing two options:
  1. Redraft the contract with new, clear deadlines and commitments.
  2. Consult a lawyer, end the relationship, and try to recover money.

4. Payment Status and Leverage

• [03:28] Most of the project funds ($300,000) have already been paid; only an $11,000 retainage is left.
  • Rachel reacts: “Oh, man.” (03:38)

5. Advice from the Ramsey Team

George Kamel

• [03:41] Suggests a two-pronged approach:
  1. Sit down with the contractor and present the seriousness of their position.
  2. Prepare a new contract with clear, near-term deadlines—make clear that failing this will result in legal action to recover funds and hire someone else.
  • Quote: “We’ve given you $300,000. This job is now going on three to four months overdue. I’m very close to calling an attorney...” (George Kamel, 03:41)

Rachel Cruze

• Reiterates that a new, enforceable deadline is essential.
• Emphasizes the importance of having “a level of intense conversation, a very direct and clear conversation with him," rather than informal communication (04:24).
  • Asks whether Susan has already been direct with the contractor.
• Reminds that construction projects are notorious for delayed timelines and budgets, but this is beyond the norm.

6. Direct Communication: Has it Happened?

• [04:59] Susan confirms they've had direct conversations expressing their dissatisfaction, particularly after deadlines passed.

7. Next Steps and Cultural Factors

• Rachel and George recommend:
  1. Setting a reasonable, new deadline.
  2. Exploring legal action if that deadline is not met.
• Both acknowledge the unique cultural context of hiring an Amish crew, with Rachel candidly stating:
  • “I don’t know a ton about the Amish community, but you have chosen someone that’s in a type of culture…” (Rachel Cruze, 05:27)
  • “I’ve never heard of this. This is the first time ever that I’ve heard… that they have days they have to take off. I mean, I don't know.” (George Kamel, 05:44)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Yeah, that’s a low bar, though.” (Rachel Cruze, 02:00)
• “It’s like, he doesn’t cheat on me. He’s pretty great. And it’s like, well, that’s a pretty low bar.” (George Kamel, 02:03)
• “We’ve given you $300,000. This job is now going on three to four months overdue. I’m very close to calling an attorney...” (George Kamel, 03:41)
• “I don’t know a ton about the Amish community, but you have chosen someone that’s in a type of culture…” (Rachel Cruze, 05:27)
• “I’ve never heard of this... that they have days they have to take off.” (George Kamel, 05:44)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:06 — Caller describes project delays and concerns.
• 01:07 — Contractor’s inconsistent presence and communication.
• 01:32 — Reasons for delays connected to Amish crew.
• 02:14 — Family considering contract renegotiation or legal action.
• 03:28 — Payment details (majority already paid).
• 03:41 — George Kamel’s recommended approach.
• 04:24 — Rachel Cruze on the need for direct communication.
• 04:59 — Susan confirms they’ve had direct conversations.
• 05:27 — Discussion of Amish cultural factors.

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Summary Conclusion

The hosts underscore the need for clear, documented expectations in home improvement projects and advocate for direct, assertive communication with contractors. Given the advanced payment and ongoing delays, George and Rachel recommend drafting a new contract with strict deadlines and being prepared to seek legal recourse if commitments are still not met. The episode highlights the complications that can arise when dealing with small, culturally specific contractors and the importance of protecting your investment with well-defined contractual safeguards.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Susan]

My family started a large home addition project last year in July. The project, we're paying about $313,000 for the project, and it was supposed to be done by Thanksgiving, and it's not anywhere close to being done right now. And so we are new to this kind of project. So initially we just kind of trusted our contractor, but as the time went on, it just. Things didn't seem like it made sense. And the timing that he was giving. And as Thanksgiving went by, he kept on giving us, oh, it will be done by this other date. And it's not done. And it's not done. And I just wanted you guys advice on how to proceed with your just not, you know, goals not being met on the project.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Is he just not showing up, Susan? Like, are there days and days and days that. That he's not even there? Doesn't have any crews there?

[Susan]

There's not days and days and days, but maybe there's like a couple of days that he says they will be there, but they're not there. But then they show up. And so he keeps on communicating with us, and he shows up, but it's not consistent.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, is it. Is there any. Is he giving you a reason for why this is happening? Is it material? Yeah. What's he saying? What's his reasoning?

[Susan]

He's. Well, we are using an Amish crew in Indiana. And so the Amish, they have butchering days where they can't come because they all have to butcher. They have a car breakdown. He gives us different reasons throughout the whole thing.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Susan]

And so he's at least like, the proof of him is that he communicates and he's not given up on the project. Like, he hasn't disappeared. And the other contractors.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, that's a low bar, though.

[George Kamel]

Yeah.

[Susan]

Yeah, I know.

[George Kamel]

It's like, he doesn't cheat on me. He's pretty great. And it's like, well, that's pretty low bar.

[Susan]

Exactly.

[George Kamel]

Yeah.

[Susan]

This is the local connection. I'm sorry.

[George Kamel]

Go ahead, go ahead.

[Susan]

So he's using contractors locally that we have talked about with other people, and they say, oh, yeah, he's a good guy. And so. And we. Anyway, so the options that we're thinking about right now to get this project moving faster and putting some pressure on him is do we write a new contract for him and say, we know it's passed, we need new deadlines and new commitments. And some people have told us that we need to just Hire a lawyer and be done with him and try to get as much money out of it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Have you already paid him the full 313?

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[George Kamel]

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[Rachel Cruze]

Have you already paid him the full 313?

[Susan]

We have a retainage of just 11,000 left from the budget.

[Rachel Cruze]

So you've given him 300? Basically.

[Susan]

Basically, yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, man.

[Susan]

I, I, and another.

[George Kamel]

Yeah, well, I would, I think there's a combination. And Rachel, this is your world. Y' all do this kind of work. I, I would sit down with him and say, we've given you $300,000. This, this job is now going on three to four months overdue. I'm, I, I'm very close to calling an attorney to get this thing settled and get my money back so that I can go hire somebody to do the work that you agreed to do by this date. By this contract we have. And, and, and I would have a new contract prepared and say by this date this is what it's going to be and if he doesn't sign it, that's cool. Then he might call your bluff and then we'll need to go get an attorney and figure that out.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, because I mean, with some real estate, you know, especially if you're doing a remodel or something like that, for some people, they say, like, okay, it's going to take twice as long and twice as expensive. Right. That's kind of the rule of thumb, which, this, which sucks. Right. I mean, I think you can do it very much in a tightened up timeline and budget, which is what, you know, I've experienced before. But all that to say, I do wonder for him. Have you guys had a level of intense conversation, a very direct and clear conversation with him, or are you just answering him via text and calling it a day?

[Susan]

No, we've had some direct conversation. We've talked to him about not yelling at him, but our frustrations with how the project has been handled.

[Rachel Cruze]

Sure.

[Susan]

Much more towards like, you know, after the deadline has been passed. So like in December, we had lots of them. Now even more so this month. Just. Yeah, the deadline's been passed. They haven't been showing up as much as I think they should be to try to get it done as fast as possible.

[Rachel Cruze]

So I think. I think the two things are, you need a new deadline that's reasonable, and he needs to be able to meet that deadline. And if not. Yes, then maybe there is some. Some legal, you know, processes that you go to. And also, and I'll be honest, too, Susan, I don't know a ton about the Amish community, but you have chosen someone that's in a type of culture.

[George Kamel]

That I've never heard this. This is the first time ever that I've heard well that they have days.

[Rachel Cruze]

That they have to take off. I mean, I don't know. I don't know.

[George Kamel]

I've never heard of this.

[Rachel Cruze]

I don't know if that's a reality in his world or not that you have to take into consideration because you, you hired him.

[Dave Ramsey]

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