Debt Can’t Be Your Normal Anymore

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show — Episode: "Debt Can’t Be Your Normal Anymore" (Released June 25, 2025)

The Ramsey Show, hosted by Jade Warshaw and Dr. John Deloney, delves deep into listeners' financial and personal struggles, offering compassionate advice and practical solutions. In this episode titled "Debt Can’t Be Your Normal Anymore," the hosts address various debt-related concerns, ranging from personal debt management to navigating complex financial inheritances. The following summary captures the essence of the key discussions, insights, and conclusions drawn throughout the episode.

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1. Supporting an Adult Child with Addiction

Caller: Nicole from Waco, Texas ([00:32])

Nicole seeks advice on managing her financial support for her 24-year-old son battling drug addiction. Despite multiple rounds of rehab, her son struggles to maintain sobriety and has recently been hospitalized for mental health issues.

Key Discussion Points:

• Balancing Support and Accountability: Dr. John emphasizes the importance of letting her son face the consequences of his actions to foster independence.
• Setting Boundaries: It's crucial for Nicole to cease continued financial support for rent if it enables her son's instability.

Notable Quote:

Dr. John Deloney ([02:25]): "The greatest gift is letting him learn from some of these consequences."

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2. Managing Inheritance and Debt

Caller: Lisa from Grand Rapids, Michigan ([10:42])

Lisa inherited approximately $500,000 to $600,000 and is contemplating whether to pay off her $24,000 student loan debt. Her financial advisor advises against immediately settling the debt, conflicting with advice she's received from following Dave Ramsey's teachings.

Key Discussion Points:

• Trusting Personal Financial Goals: Dr. John challenges Lisa's reliance on her advisor, reinforcing the principle that paying off debt is a crucial step toward financial freedom.
• Emotional Barriers to Debt Settlement: Addressing Lisa's feelings of doubt and the influence of longstanding negative feedback on her financial decisions.

Notable Quote:

Caller ([12:46]): "What in the world is going on inside your chest that you doubt you so much?"

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3. The Importance of Generosity in Wealth Building

Caller: Michael from Naples, Florida ([21:50])

A self-made multimillionaire discusses Baby Step 7—giving generously—and questions its role within the Ramsey plan, seeking a deeper understanding of its theoretical foundation.

Key Discussion Points:

• Generosity as a Financial Principle: Emphasizing that giving reflects a controlled and healthy relationship with money.
• Emotional and Spiritual Fulfillment: Generosity not only aids others but also nurtures the giver's sense of purpose and connection.

Notable Quote:

Caller ([22:33]): "Generosity is not just the exchange of dollars, it's the exchange of ideas, it's the exchange of compassion, it's the exchange of love and connection."

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4. Navigating Job Loss and Debt Accumulation

Caller: David from Harrisburg, Pennsylvania ([33:34])

David shares his ordeal of losing a well-paying job after relocating to support family. With mounting credit card debt of $2,000 and no immediate means to repay, he feels overwhelmed and seeks guidance.

Key Discussion Points:

• Immediate Action Steps: Encouraging David to secure immediate employment through any available means while maintaining essential expenses.
• Prioritizing Expenses: Focusing on the "four walls"—rent, utilities, transportation, and food—to ensure basic needs are met before addressing debt.

Notable Quote:

Dr. John Deloney ([38:14]): "You're in survival mode to keep food on the table."

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5. Retirement Concerns Post-Divorce

Caller: Carrie from Minneapolis, Minnesota ([44:10])

Carrie, a 47-year-old divorced teacher, is anxious about her retirement setup. With $122,000 in a savings account, $26,300 from bartending, and $70,000 in a Roth IRA, she wonders if she's on track for a comfortable retirement.

Key Discussion Points:

• Assessing Retirement Savings: Dr. John guides Carrie through evaluating her current savings and projected growth, highlighting the need to increase her contributions.
• Optimizing Financial Accounts: Encouraging Carrie to separate her emergency funds from her primary savings to ensure financial stability.

Notable Quote:

Dr. John Deloney ([46:00]): "You're going to have to cut this thing off at the source and say, I just... I gotta get in here and make some real moves."

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6. Balancing Debt-Free Living While Planning for Large Purchases

Caller: Meredith from Salt Lake City, Utah ([87:15])

Meredith is contemplating purchasing a Dodge Challenger with cash while being in the process of saving for a house. She seeks advice on whether indulging in the purchase aligns with her financial goals.

Key Discussion Points:

• Prioritizing Financial Goals: Dr. John assesses the balance between enjoying current earnings and maintaining focus on long-term objectives like homeownership.
• Financial Discipline: Emphasizing the importance of staying debt-free and ensuring that lifestyle choices do not impede financial progress.

Notable Quote:

Caller ([92:57]): "Why do you not want to be debt free?"

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7. Handling Personal Debt While Engaging in Marriage

Caller: Emma from Des Moines, Iowa ([97:53])

Emma expresses concern about managing her $12,000 credit card debt while entering marriage with a financially stable fiancé who owns a house with significant equity.

Key Discussion Points:

• Combining Finances Transparently: Advocating for joint budgeting and accountability to prevent financial strains within the marriage.
• Addressing Emotional Aspects of Debt: Recognizing feelings of inadequacy and ensuring mutual support in financial endeavors.

Notable Quote:

Caller ([105:00]): "He's not better than you... You're a person of dignity and respect towards your soon to be ex wife."

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8. Inheriting and Managing a Significant Investment Account

Caller: Rebecca from Salt Lake City, Utah ([110:30])

Rebecca recently inherited a $4 million investment account following her husband's passing. Overwhelmed by managing the funds and dealing with requests for financial assistance from family and friends, she seeks strategies to handle her newfound wealth responsibly.

Key Discussion Points:

• Establishing a Support System: Encouraging Rebecca to build a team of financial professionals to manage her investments and estate.
• Setting Boundaries with Requests for Money: Advising Rebecca to prioritize her financial well-being and handle requests with compassion but firmness.

Notable Quote:

Caller ([112:04]): "When you spend money, when you give money, I want you to sometimes close your eyes and imagine Oscar sitting right next to you."

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Conclusion and Key Takeaways

Throughout the episode, Jade Warshaw and Dr. John Deloney provide invaluable advice tailored to each caller's unique situation. The recurring themes emphasize the importance of:

• Proactive Debt Management: Tackling debts head-on to prevent long-term financial instability.
• Financial Transparency and Collaboration: Whether in personal relationships or family dynamics, open communication about finances fosters trust and shared responsibility.
• Balancing Present Enjoyment with Future Security: While it's essential to enjoy financial success, maintaining discipline ensures sustained wealth and reduces stress.
• Leveraging Professional Guidance: Building a team of trusted financial advisors can streamline complex financial situations, especially during significant life changes.

Notable Closing Quote:

Dr. John Deloney ([121:48]): "You're not living in reality right now. You think you have $40,000 minus the debt. You really only have $8,000 to your name."

This episode reinforces the Ramsey Show’s commitment to empowering listeners with the knowledge and strategies needed to overcome financial challenges and build a secure, debt-free future.

Transcript

[Jade Warshaw]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today.

[Dr. John Deloney]

From the Ramsey Network, it's the Ramsey Show. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to me, Dr. John Deloney. We're taking calls about your life, your money, your mental health, all of it. You can get involved. The number is 888-825-5225. It'll get you on the line. We've got Nicole, who's in Waco, Texas. How can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Today I am calling. I have a son who is almost 24 years of age, and I'm not sure how to help him anymore. He has had a drug addiction since the age of 18. He's been in rehab, out of rehab, and he is living on his own now and has an apartment, but recently was put in the hospital for mental help. And I just don't know how to help him because I was able to get him some help, but then he quits the program. And I know financially he needs money for rent, but I've helped him multiple times with rent, and I don't feel like I should continue doing that. I just want some advice on how to help him.

[Caller]

Yeah, that's. I mean, unfortunately, I've had this conversation with too many parents over the years of young men and women just that age. And there's that balance between. There's a real chance he ends up on the street, and there's a real chance that he never learns to stand up on his own two feet. And so at the same time, the greatest gift is letting him learn from some of these consequences. And yet, when you've struggled with addiction for seven years, some of those consequences may be catastrophic. Right. And that's just a scary place for a parent to find themselves.

[Jade Warshaw]

It. It really is. He's. He's one of six. He's the youngest of six kids. And none of my other kids have this issue. And he grew up in a good home, but he's made some very poor choices from the time he was 18 till now, and they are becoming very catastrophic.

[Caller]

Yeah. So first thing I want to do is I want to free you from what you just what. What you're carrying around. How about that? Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, that'd be good.

[Caller]

You're. You. You've got to set down the comparison. He's not like my other five. I must have messed up with this one, because what it does is it ends up making him an object, and he's just not your son. And let's bring him back to being your son. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

And his Choices at this point may or may not. Who, who knows? But trying to reverse engineer how we got here isn't the time right now. Right now is the. Is we want to keep him. I agree with you. I'm not just going to put money into a bottomless pit because the way he's going to get help from this, he's going to continue to stay in rehab, he's going to work these programs and he's going to learn to begin very gently carrying the weight of the bar that is life. And that's how his body will learn that he can get stronger.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. He just, you know, he was, he just was admitted to. Because he attempted suicide. And so he was, he was admitted to a inpatient hospital where he got some help for a week. And then I had arranged, when he came out to do a 10 week outpatient program where he could continue to work and get help. The professional help he needs.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Jade Warshaw]

And he did it for one week and he's already quit.

[Caller]

Yeah. Where is he going?

[Jade Warshaw]

He was going to a.

[Caller]

No, no, not the place. But when he quit, where did he go home to?

[Jade Warshaw]

He went home to his apartment.

[Caller]

Okay. Is there a possibility, and I don't know the nature of his addiction and, and all the ins and outs like you do, Is there an opportunity for you to say, I'm no longer funding this, you can stay here or you can stay in rehab. That's it.

[Jade Warshaw]

I, I've, I've, I asked him, I said, well, if you're, if you're going to quit because he thought it was stupid. And you know what it is, is they're calling him to accountability and he doesn't really want the accountability.

[Caller]

But here's the thing, here's what you have to acknowledge, and this is so scary to acknowledge this as a parent who loves her kid. He knows he doesn't have to because he has a paid for apartment that he's going to walk out the door and go to. He knows that and.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

There's some, there's some debate in the literature and some back and forth mumbo jumbo, but one of the cornerstones of addiction is people who are struggling with connected relationships with safe people. Right. And that's where like. And nobody wants to move home with mom. And I don't want someone who is struggling with addiction that is going to blow up your family living at home either. So only you know the nature of it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

But if he knows, man, I can just walk out this door, go back to my apartment, all my bills are Paid, I can go use. I can just sleep and get, get back to my life. This sounds nuts, but he'd be crazy to not do that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. And I did tell him that I was. I told him that I would no longer help fund that. I've. I've helped him in the past, but I could not if he wasn't going to stay committed to a program to get him the necessary professional help he needed. I no longer could help him fund him. I love him, but I won't find if he comes up short on his rent or if he doesn't have groceries or if he can't pay his utility bill.

[Caller]

Okay. I think that's an important part of his recovery. But I hesitate to tell you that's what you need to do right this second. Because, I mean, this is a seven or eight minute phone call, but I think that's where you're at. And the challenge as a parent you're going to have is never letting him. And this might happen. I've recommended parents in the past for particular situations. Write your kid a letter and send it to them every week. And they may throw it up, they may throw it away, they may rip it up, or they may just throw it on the floor somewhere. But one night they're going to look and see all those letters. They're not going to be able to tell themselves the story that my parents don't care. And yet that only works if they have a place that you can even mail it to. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

Or every week I want you to come over for Sunday lunch. You can't come over if you're using, but I want you here. I'm not going to text you. I'm not going to text you. I love you. I'm not going to text you a Bible verse. I'm going to call you. You don't have to answer. But every day or every other day or every week, you're going to see my name pop up on your thing. Because I love you and I care about you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

And I can no longer in good conscience keep going into the weight room and taking all the weight off the bar and wondering why you're not getting any stronger.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right?

[Caller]

Right. And you have to live with the understanding that he's gonna go live on somebody's couch. The exact people he doesn't need to be around.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. I think my greatest fear is that he's going to commit suicide.

[Caller]

And if you're, if you're at that point, then I think you sit down with the social worker at the last rehab place and say, I want to see if we can commit him involuntarily because he's, he is a demonstrated harm to self and they may not do that. The threshold for that type of commitment is very, very high because you're taking away somebody's civil rights. Right. But if, if I can show you. He is repeatedly said he's going to die by suicide and then I'm, I'm going to do everything I can on that front.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. And, and that's what I, you know, I, because I feel like I'm the only one in our family who stays connected because everybody else is kind of.

[Caller]

Where's dad?

[Jade Warshaw]

Dad is. We divorced a couple years ago after 32 years of marriage. And he, he's traveling. He's a traveling minister and he's no longer in the area.

[Caller]

Well, here's another thing. That youngest son of yours needs his dad to show up at his front door and say I love you and give him a hug and say I'll walk with you in this next chapter. But I agree with you. I think the days of just funding this thing, hoping it gets better, you've proven that doesn't work. And so work with the social worker at the hospital to come up with a plan for what's next. But I think that's the right move.

[Jade Warshaw]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

Foreign. Let's get right back into it. We're going to the phone lines where we have Lisa in Grand Rapids, Michigan. What's up, Lisa?

[Jade Warshaw]

Good afternoon, John and Jade. First I have to say, John, as a phone therapist, I love you. You're amazing.

[Caller]

Well, thank you. That makes me feel good. I appreciate that.

[Jade Warshaw]

You're welcome. Here's my question. Earlier this year, my uncle died and has left me a significant amount of money. My financial advisor is telling me that I shouldn't pay off my debt, that that's a bad idea. And I know from following Dave since about 2001 or 2002 that he says yes, pay off your debt minus student loan debt from 2013. And with the amount of money I received last week, and there's a lot more money still to come, I could pay off this debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How much is the inheritance?

[Jade Warshaw]

Around 500 to 600 grand.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, and how much debt do you have?

[Jade Warshaw]

My student loan as it sits right now is 24,000. I already got one check from the inheritance and paid off a huge amount of the debt, but I have about 24,000 left today.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How is it being distributed? Are you at one point going to get a lump sum or is it always going to be kind of parceled out over time because he had properties.

[Jade Warshaw]

And other things as they sell? It's sounding like we're getting checks as we go.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I just got a six figure check last week.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And what was the six figures?

[Jade Warshaw]

103.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And so you're saying you only have 24,000 left of the debt. So at that point you already went against the financial advisor's advice.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And how do you feel.

[Jade Warshaw]

To go against his advice?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, like you paid off the debt. How do you feel having done that?

[Jade Warshaw]

I felt like it was a great thing to do.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Caller]

All right. Okay. I want to play therapist with you for a second. Even though I'm not a therapist, I'm just a. I'm a. I'm a faker on the radio. What in the world is going on inside your chest that you doubt you so much?

[Jade Warshaw]

In all honesty, in life, I've always been questioned when I make decisions about anything with my parents. And I've often been told that I'm wrong or that it's a bad decision or that I didn't research it enough.

[Caller]

How old are you now?

[Jade Warshaw]

Mid-50s.

[Caller]

Okay, can we just, can we just decide? Just me, you, Jade and, I don't know, couple million people listening that for the first time we're done listening to those old voices that said, you don't know what you're talking about. Could we be done there?

[Jade Warshaw]

I try.

[Caller]

I know. I know. And the only. And you know this. As a therapist, the only way to truly get there is to practice it. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

So who do you owe money to now in the world?

[Jade Warshaw]

Student loans.

[Caller]

Oh, so you haven't paid them yet. You're thinking about paying, but you haven't written that check yet?

[Dr. John Deloney]

She paid all but 24,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

All but 24,000.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And that's the only debt I have.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Clear it today. Today.

[Caller]

Dude, what would that feel like to be, like, go into therapy tomorrow and you don't owe anybody anything?

[Dr. John Deloney]

And just a reminder. Go ahead. You go. You go.

[Jade Warshaw]

I was gonna say when I. When I've been thinking about it, I'd been excited. I've been excited of the idea of, like, since college, since, like, 2001 or 2002. And to know that I would finally be debt free is a huge deal to me. And then be able to get the rest of this money and then start to do some things in life that I haven't been able to do, like travel for sure.

[Caller]

Lisa. Yes. This is the whole point of why we do what we do at this moment.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Anyone who says, you know what? You shouldn't be free, you should just let me have your money, because I can get a small percentage off the earnings that I'm going to invest in one of my special products. That also gives me a kickback because clearly I'm in this job for me, not for you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And John just said what I was about to remind you of the fact that he. He makes a commission off of anything that you invest. So for him. Yeah. I'm not saying he's a bad guy or, like, investors are a bad guy. I'm not saying that. But there is a vested interest there for you to invest larger sums of money. And just don't forget that. And don't forget that he works for you, for crying out loud. You don't work for him. So at the end of the day, guess who gets to make the decision?

[Jade Warshaw]

Me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes, ma' am.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And if you have a decision to make and it lights you up like a Christmas tree right now, and it's not like something morally questionable.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right.

[Caller]

You're 50 plus years old. Those days of you taking that spark inside and that joy and being like, hold on, I got to put that flame out because one time or because my dad always said, or because my mom, dude, they don't get a vote anymore. No more. And by the way, your uncle thought enough of you to leave you half a million dollars. So if nobody else, if you, if you don't think I have any other data in the world to say I'm trustworthy. Your uncle sure thought you were half a million dollars trustworthy. Which is pretty amazing too. Jade, how often I don't want to gender this but I. It's. It's majority women.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Caller]

That I hear experience that this sense of hey, you're probably wrong. You're probably the probably just you listen, you let me make this decision for you. In fact, usually it's with men it's the opposite. It's like, hey, listen to other people before you go bull charging into something. But I hear this man and it, I guess it breaks my heart. You have a woman who just got this, who's been dreaming of this moment, feels so good. And then she goes and talks to someone who's supposed to be.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

A supporter and says actually you're stupid, you should do this.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think probably even I think what you're saying is accurate but I think even more it boils down to just women tend to put everybody else first and what everybody else want first. Not all women. That's not. I'm not trying generally the whole population but it tends to be something that we struggle with. And I think she had this idea of what she wanted to do. Then she goes and talks to old boy and old boy is like no, I want to do this. And so it's easy to just surrender your will and be like, well if they want to do that and that people pleasing of like I'll just make them happy. That makes sense. You know, and kind of putting your own thoughts secondary and what your own desire secondary. Man, that's got to stop today.

[Caller]

Yeah. Get online, go to Ramsey Solutions.com and check out our smartvestors and fire this person. In fact don't even fire them. Just don't ever go back or call them back. And if they are your registered financial advisor, get online and put in your zip code and we're going to send you a couple of folks in your area that you are. I want you to interview them and I want you to get that same feeling in your chest like I can trust this person. This person's teaching me, not mocking me. This person is walking alongside me and Jade. I've had this experience with Churchill. I've had this experience with Smartvestor Pro where I've had this experience with Xander when I want to do a thing. And they say, I will do that thing. But actually this is in your best interest and you can make. I can make more money here, but this is the right thing for what you told me your goals are, and that is to owe nobody anything. And that's what you want in one of these advisors who's walking along 100.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, you want them to explain their point of view. You want to be heard on your point of view, but ultimately you're the one that gets to make the decision. And so as long as you feel like they're honoring your choices and trying to feed that into the plan, that's what you want. And then also acknowledging at some points they're going to know more than you. Like, do you know what I mean? Like, there is that part of it. But in this case, this was, this was a choice that didn't really have much penalty. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, she could have not paid off the debt and been fine and she could paid off the debt and been fine, but it was her wishes to pay off the debt. That's not going to light anything on fire. So he should have been like, yeah, 100%.

[Caller]

Well, you're talking 25,000 bucks against half a million dollars.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right. That's right.

[Caller]

Good grief. Lisa, pay this off and call us back ASAP and we will scream. I'm debt free right here on the show. Proud of you, Lisa. Congratulations.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All right, John, let's, let's take a quick question from the Ramsey Network app. It says, is your recommended percentage to pay for rent the same as it is for mortgage? So we say, yeah, okay. Yeah, so we say that your mortgage payment shouldn't be any more than 25% of your take home pay. And I'd say that goes along with rent as well, because it's not a thing about renting or buying. It's the idea of what portion of your budget is it taking up and how much is then left in margin for you to do the other things like pay your other bills and get ahead on debt and just live a life without being tight. You know what I'm saying? So, yeah, it's the same thing. It has nothing to do with whether or not you're renting or buying. It has to do with you having the right ratios of money going to the right thing. So 25% is what you're looking for every time. Because when it creeps above that, that's when people start calling into the show, talking to you. And I, you know, there's a, there's a method to the madness. People.

[Caller]

Foreign as an investor and a.

[Dr. John Deloney]

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[Caller]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

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[Caller]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

Straight to the phone lines we go where there's Michael in Naples, Florida. What's going on, Michael?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, Jade.

[Caller]

Nice talking to you.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I've been a fan of your show for the last couple years. I enjoy the stories. I'm not a Baby Steps person myself, but I am a self made millionaire multimillionaire.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wow.

[Jade Warshaw]

Coming from a poor person to, you know, I feel like I'm in a pretty good position. But my question is this. As a fan of your program, I'm intrigued by the idea of Baby Step seven, which is to give generously. And I've never heard that Baby Step discussed in any kind of detail on your show. So I was wondering if you guys would go into the theory behind that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, I love this question. And you're right, we do spend a lot of time talking about getting out of debt or investing or saving. And we don't generally get to spend as much time on the Baby Step 7 topic, which is great. So I mean, I can tackle it from kind of my way of thinking and I'm sure John has a take on it as well. I think that giving is probably one of the most important things that you can do with money because at the end of the day, money is very much linked to our heart. And I think that if we can control our heart and control our money by letting money be something that flows freely in and flows freely out. It really shows a level of self control in our life. I think money is one of those things that it's, it's amoral, but if you don't control it. Right. It can be very powerful. Right. And so it's one of those things that by giving, we're really making sure that we're keeping money in its rightful place. We're able to say, hey, this is, this is not mine. I'm not greedy. I'm a person who can let it go out and let it come in. And my heart is okay with both of those actions. And then I kind of think of like, this is the way I was taught when I was a kid. And I think it's so true. Like if you hold money with an open hand, there's the space for it to leave and there's the space for it to come in. Whereas if money comes into that hand and you close it, nothing can get out and nothing can get in. And it's the same way with your heart. And so for me, I would say that's why it's such a big important part of it. And then the other part of it is I'm a Christian person and so I believe that generosity is kind of the crux of so much of what we believe. And at the end of the day, every good and perfect gift comes from above. So what we have, if we have it and it's good, it's from God. And so we have to have the ability to let him do what he wants to with those gifts. We just are the manager of those gifts. We're the stewarder, the steward of those gifts. And so if he says, hey, I want you to take some of that and put it towards this thing over here, then we have to be willing to do that. And so always having an open heart to do those things, that's, that's kind of my point of view. John, what you got to say on the matter?

[Caller]

Yeah, man. Michael, I think this is a great question. Tell me where it comes from for you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, as I said, I'm a fan of the program and became a fan during COVID And I just love the stories and you know, I understand the mechanics of the baby steps. I mean, I became a self made multimillionaire not through the baby steps, because Dave Ramsey wasn't a thing when I was growing up or when I was working. I just had my own way of doing it, which is different from the baby steps. And the step seven is always kind of, you know, what Is this about. Because is it a motivational factor? You know, it feels so great to give that, you know, it helps you get. Get there. Is that it? You know, just. And I've never heard anybody call in.

[Caller]

Your call. I mean, your question, dude, I, I would high five you if we were sitting here together. I think it's a great under asked question. What does the status you said get there in your mind? Where is there?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm not sure I understand your question.

[Caller]

Is, is, is getting there this idea of being a multimillionaire? What? Especially as someone, as a self proclaimed former poor person. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

What, what does being a multimillionaire now, what does that mean to you?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, it means not having to work. I retired at age 56 and I did it right on my own schedule using like basic principles of math.

[Caller]

Yep.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I think it's more, you know, not having to worry about different factors affecting your basic living. Because when you're poor, that's what you're concerned about, you know, getting by.

[Caller]

Absolutely.

[Jade Warshaw]

When you pay the bills.

[Caller]

And so there's a sense my goal, there's a math problem and you've solved that math problem. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

I mean absent one of those caustic Reddit calamities. Right. That are just fun to go down YouTube, rabbit, hol. Good. Right? You're going to be good and you're going to be fine. For me, I, I echo everything Jade said. For me, generosity is, it's really this idea of picking my eyes out of my own belly button. Right. Out of my own survival and recognizing this. It's, it's a posture on how I interact with the world. Which is, I may have driven to work and worked my butt off and gone like for my own story. I worked a ton of grad school. I grew up in the home of a CO and a minister. Like, I worked really hard, got a bunch of education, worked a lot of 20 hour days for years to get X, Y and Z. And generosity is this idea of me taking my eyes out of my belly button and looking up and saying, I drove to work on roads other people paved. I sat in classrooms at the feet of other people who went and learned a whole bunch of stuff. I use laptops that nobody built. And by the way, there are people in my community that may maybe don't have access to those. And in the same way, and I can now be a link, a bridge towards them. And some of that access, whether that access is basic food, whether that access is educational opportunities, where that access is helping somebody Fill in the blank. But it is a posture. And I always want to answer this question. I'm a millionaire. I'm a baby steps millionaire. I'm a multimillionaire. And my question is always going to be the same. For what? For what? And if it isn't, to make sure I can be the best steward of this money, that I can take care of myself, I can anchor in so that now I can help everyone around me so that I can make my community better. I can help people who are struggling. I can help people be a part of some of those same things that I was a benefactor of. It's just a posture. And I go back to that simple thing that Jade mentioned, and I love it. Which is. And I got this actually from Dave. Dave. Dave has a fascination. He loves to have dinner or lunch with billionaires. Right? He's a multi, multi, multimillionaire. Dave's not a billionaire. He loves sitting down with his folks. And he said, except for one, every billionaire he sat with is a person of high integrity, with real open hands. And this idea of generosity is not just the exchange of dollars, it's the exchange of ideas, it's the exchange of compassion, it's the exchange of love and connection. It's all these things that we say, woo, woo. And you don't show up on a spreadsheet, but have to do with a life well lived. And so I'll ask you, man, you've accumulated millions and millions of dollars and you did it, quote, unquote, your way, used a spreadsheet. You just climbed and scratched and clawed and now you're 56, 60. I don't know how old you are now, but you've retired, you're not working anymore. And the question I'll ask you after you've solved for safety, like, for what, what's all this money going to be for?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, Well, I mean, number one is you don't know what's coming. I mean, I think, you know, just history provides us a good idea, but it's mainly, you know, for self preservation and for preservation. My family. A lot.

[Caller]

How many, how many family members do you have? You have wife, kids? You have family? Like, tell me about it.

[Jade Warshaw]

No kids. So anyway, this goes back. I mean, my. I grew up in a large family with eight kids, so that'll teach you a lot. Lot.

[Caller]

Yeah. Of course, there's only one pancake left. And it's a war, right, for that last pancake.

[Jade Warshaw]

But my father, he always said, you know, you're here for one purpose. Which is to serve. And I always thought that's crazy because who's gonna serve me? You know, nobody else served me over the course of my life. And I'm 65 years old.

[Caller]

Can I tell you something?

[Jade Warshaw]

Nobody served. Yeah.

[Caller]

And I want you just to internalize this. And we only have a second. I wish I could talk to you for an hour because you're the kind of guy I love, love to just have a drink with. Your line of thinking is still rooted in poverty. It's a mindset of what about the next minute and the next minute after that? And I want you to do the math and play it out. If there's a nuclear calamity, your dollars in the account aren't going to save you. I want you to back up and exhale and say, what if I practice serving one person? And then I want you to see how that feels and be about generosity city.

[Jade Warshaw]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

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[Caller]

On the YouTube.

[Dr. John Deloney]

On the YouTube, it is a tube.

[Caller]

That you get on 100 years old.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All right, we got David. He's in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. What's going on, David? How can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi, guys. I'm calling in because I am just at my wit's end and I need help. A couple years. For the past couple years, I had a really good paying job that I ended up leaving in January of this year to move back. I moved from Nebraska to Pennsylvania to be with family. And in these past six months, leaving that good job, I tried to get another job, and that didn't work out. That lasted two months, and then I finally got hired this earlier this month, and in two weeks, they let me go.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, no.

[Jade Warshaw]

And my debt has been piling up. I have a credit card that called and said, you owe $2,000 minimum payment, and we're closing your account in 40 days, and I have no way to pay it because I'm out of work. Well, and I'm just calling because I don't. I don't know what the. What to do.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's frustrating. I can. I can tell. It's. It's like a double whammy. There's the job thing, and then you've got these debt collectors calling you, you know, blowing up your phone every day, making you feel like a bad person. Am I right?

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, it's demoralizing that, you know, I thought I could go and get a job. And I was like, oh, it's easy to keep a job, but I didn't realize how much your world can turn upside down the second you lose out on a paycheck. And then it goes into the next week and the next month and then two months and.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, listen, what you're describing, what you're describing is what we are, every day on this show, we're trying to let people know, hey, you're literally one missed paycheck away from it. Feeling like it's pouring rain outside. Okay, so let's talk about the job side first. What were you doing before that quote, good job that you had? What were you doing and what were you earning?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I worked as a technician for the largest private company in the world, and I was earning just shy of six figures, about 80 to $90,000 a year.

[Caller]

Okay, what precipitated that move where you thought, I'm just going to quit this and I'm going to move across the country? Without a job, without savings and be around family. What happened to cause you to move?

[Jade Warshaw]

So it was a, it was a multi month process. But I had a family member who back here who was like, hey, I need, I need help. You know, I can't find a place to stay. You know, if you move in, you and a couple some siblings and they're like, well, you know, it's going to be cheaper for three of us to share a place rather than just two. And I'm like, yeah, I can see that. And plus I had some other family stuff going on, so I figured it wouldn't be a bad idea because it's. I had got hired from another for a job before the move. So I came out, moved in literally the next day and working, unfortunately that just didn't work out. It was too far. It was almost hour and a half, two hours commute and the schedule was on call. So it just didn't work out. Okay, too far away.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And so now since then, since you've lost those opportunities, how many other jobs have you been applying for or you know, interviewing for?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, I've been applying to just about everything in the area from, from nature, park ranger to, to janitor. I'm applying to anything at this point.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And what does that look like? Can you walk us through what that looks like? You, if you find a job you're interested in, what, what happens next?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, obviously I'd want to stay there and build up the.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No, no, no. I mean, as you're, as you're applying for jobs, what does that process look like? Because if it look most of it's online. Exactly.

[Caller]

That's it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's where your problem is. Yeah, and I'm not Ken Coleman. I actually wish that he were here right now, but he would, he'd be the first to tell you. If you're just going online, filling out resumes, it's going into a black hole. And so we've got to start thinking about who we know and are they in fields that might be linked to the things that we want to do and who can we reach out, who can we network with, who can we ask and say, hey, is there anything in your company, do you know anybody? Can you put in a word for me? If we can create some sort of relational connection, that's really what gets, that's what's going to get you in the door and get your stuff moved to the top of the pile.

[Caller]

But that's for, that's for career stuff right now, bro. You're like in A survival situation. I am. This is like going to knock on the door at Walmart and Taco Bell and say, I'm ready to work today.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, yeah, that's a good point that John made. In the meantime, anything, like, nothing's stopping you from doing those basic things that are out there, right? Like he said, the targets and the, the Uber eats and the, the driving job now.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And there's a big. Can we be honest? How old are you?

[Jade Warshaw]

30.

[Caller]

Okay, 30. Like, I just want to put this out there, man. If I'm in your situation and I left a job at the premier company in the world and I was a high paid technician and I left to go bail out a family member to go help them out, and I'm struggling to even get a call back from a janitorial service. Right. There's a part of that that hurts, man. There's an ego part of that that doesn't make you broken or somehow weak or weird. It just, that's heartbreaking, man. It's a bummer. Right? And can we also be honest? Living with your siblings at 30 is not great either. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Say no.

[Jade Warshaw]

You think you're making the right choice. I was trying to help.

[Caller]

I know you were. And that's, that's why I'm doubly, I'm triply heartbroken for you. One, you had a great job and a great place and you were standing on your own two feet and, and you did something altruistically to go help family. And when you moved in with those three siblings or however many people are living there, you probably got a real quick understanding of why they don't. They struggle. Right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Man, John, you just made a really great point.

[Caller]

Like this hurts all the way around. You left a job to go help somebody and now you're the one needing help. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Exactly.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. That orbit thing is real. It's almost like you just got sucked into a, an orbit that wasn't the one. You maybe should have sucked them your way over to what you were doing, which was successful. But I mean, that's spilled milk. I think right now. The main thing is today, your homework today is like John said, you're going out, you're going to Walmart, you're going to Target, you're calling Amazon Flex. You're, you're, you're just landing anything. And I get it, like John said, it's going to feel beneath you and that's fine. Just know that you're doing this, you're in survival mode to keep Food on the table. And then as for the money side of things, really do focus on those four areas that are of the biggest concern right now. We call them four walls. So this is your priority, not the credit cards. Your priority is first I pay my portion of rent, I pay my portion of utilities, I make sure my transportation, I've got gas, I'm paying my car note, if I have a car note and then I have food. Right. Those are the four things that no matter what, those are your priorities. If the credit card companies call, you can tell em to piss off because you don't have any money to give them right now. Right, right. And they're gonna kick and scream and threaten and all this stuff. And at the end of the day you're like, yeah, go ahead. You, I have nothing that you can take from me. I have no money.

[Caller]

I have four roommates. I'm 30. Come get it, come get it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Exactly, exactly. But knowing those four things are on lock is going to give you a little bit of peace and it's just going to make you feel okay. I'm in control, I have a game plan. And yeah, pick up one of these jobs. And I think that if you continue to pound on doors, we're going to make sure you have all the resources you need. We'll give you find the work you're wired to do. From Kind Coleman. It's got a career assessment in there that'll help you get started. We'll give you paycheck to purpose. Hey, we're even going to throw in a couple of every dollar. We've got some gift cards that are the for Aldi that'll give you some extra groceries. Just anything to kind of stretch this out for you so that you can have some breathing room until you can get landed. And I don't, I don't know, I'm not trying to tell you what to do, but it doesn't seem like there's much for you in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania.

[Caller]

Yeah, David, I. While you're knocking on doors and driving between places, cuz for real, this is emergency time. You got to go get several jobs and that's not where you thought you'd be at 30 helping out family, but here we are. I want you to be honest about the question. Do you think you can solve the puzzle that your family member has put in front of you or is this a moment when you exhale and say I've done my best, I tried, I moved across the country and I'm going to call my colleagues back at my former job and see if I can get my job back because I'm going to move back across the country and rebuild my life because I had a good thing going. It's okay to say I moved across the country. I gave up everything. This is not for me. And I'm going to start looking nationwide for new jobs because I'm going to get out of this three roommates at 30 situation.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Foreign.

[Caller]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

Thanks for hanging out with us on the Ramsey Show. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to me, Dr. John Deloney continuing to take your calls. It's a live show if you didn't know it, meaning you call in and we answer the question right on the spot, even though technically it does air the next day. Right, John? Always it still counts as live. You can get in on the action by calling, 482-55225 and we'll get you on the line. And if nobody picks up, just leave a message because we do go through those and we want to make sure that we hear your question. All right, We've got Carrie, who's in Minneapolis, Minnesota. What's up, Carrie? Hi.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm so happy to be here. I'm calling. I'm 47 years old and I'm concerned about my retirement setup. And I don't know if it's too late for me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, tell us what you're concerned about.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I was married for almost 18 years, got divorced, met someone with no plans to get married because we both been there, done that. And I'm just Now in my sixth year of full time teaching at 47 years old. So I haven't been paying into the retirement system very long.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I do have some savings and things like that, but I'm definitely worried about my future down the line.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So tell us what you have in real numbers. What do you have put aside in retirement?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right Now I have 122,000 in the savings account.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Just a regular savings, high yield.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, just a normal savings account.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's where my paycheck goes and everything every month. And then I have another 26,300 that I get from Bar. I bartend as well on the weekends, so I make, you know, between 1 and 2000amonth there.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's a weekend gig.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And what about retirement? Did you put anything in a 403? Because.

[Jade Warshaw]

It'S whatever the school contributes there. I'm not. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So what I'm hearing, I do have.

[Jade Warshaw]

A Roth IRA too.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, okay. What's in the Roth IRA?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's about 70,000 right now. And I put. I contribute about a hundred dollars a month into that. And I don't know if I should be doing more or what.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you said you don't know what's in the, the education, the 403B. 401K.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I'm not really familiar with it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, but you know they're putting something in there.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So here's what I kind of hear and then I'll tell you what I, I think we can do here. I feel there's a lot of. I think we can streamline this because there's a lot of scattered thinking. I asked you what money you had set aside, but. And you've got this account that's housing savings, but it's also housing your paycheck. And then you've also got your bartending money going into there. We're not sure what's in the 403B. Like, does that make sense? So I think a lot of this, a lot of this you're going to feel better about to just get some real answers pinned down. So I like giving folks homework. So I think your homework today is you're going to find, you know, you're going to dig through the junk drawer or go through the notes app on your phone and you're going to find the login and find out what's in that 403B, because it's your money and you should know what it is. So that's your first thing. So that way we can know specifically. Okay, here's all that I have in retirement. I have the 70,000 in my Roth IRA, you know, and I've got this much in the 403B. So that's thing one your next piece of homework is I want you to separate these accounts a little bit. I want you to have a checking account that your check like your, your income comes into, and that's the account that you budget out of. And then I want you to have a separate account for your three to six month emergency fund. And that can be that same high yield savings account that you have, but I want you to separate that money. Okay, so that's thing number two is separate accounts. And then thing three I want you to do is what I'm about to go with you and do right now, which is I want you to play with the retirement calculator. So right now I'm just on ramseysolutions.com investment calculator, and I'm going to put in. You told me you were 47 years old and you told me, let's just start with the 70,000 in the Roth IRA. So I'm going to plug that in. And then you said you're putting a hundred dollars a month towards that and probably if it's invested well, you should be getting an annualized return of somewhere between between 10 and 12% to be somewhat conservative.

[Jade Warshaw]

I know that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So if I calculate that in 20 years at age 67, you're going to have $588,000, okay, I would say that that is not enough to want to retire comfortably. So that's why I want you to play with this, because I want you to see what happens if I contribute 300amonth. What happens if I contribute, you know, and start playing with these numbers to get to the point where you feel comfortable about where you're at. Does that make sense?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So right now you told me you're making the 26,000 from bartending. What else? Else, what other money are you making?

[Jade Warshaw]

I make 20, 2800amonth. Teaching. That's my main gig.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So the 2,800 and then the other 2,000 from bartending. So you're like 48amonth?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And how much is your rent?

[Jade Warshaw]

I actually don't have rent. I'm very lucky. The person I live with, I just have to contribute just my own bills, like my phone and my, my insurance and things like that. My car.

[Caller]

How long does this arrangement last?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right, that's. And okay, yeah. We've been together nine years.

[Caller]

Are you married?

[Jade Warshaw]

No. There's no plan to get married. He's been married, I've been married.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you guys just like it the way it is gonna be?

[Jade Warshaw]

I guess so, yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you're Are you fine with that?

[Caller]

No. You're not fine with that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I mean, I mean, I get it. I'm fine with it. I mean, our stuff is separate and.

[Caller]

Right? Think, think about this. Think about you in 15 years. And he goes out for a walk and, and falls over from a heart attack, which unfortunately, I wouldn't have a job if that didn't happen all the time. And are you gonna quote, unquote, is your 65 year old self going to be fine with this? Is your 70 year old self going to be fine with this arrangement? When you look up and you got.

[Jade Warshaw]

Nothing and he's 15 years older than me, so that is a concern because he is older. Yeah, because.

[Caller]

So you, you've made peace with this arrangement that you don. But it just is. But you have a math problem that I hate. I hate to say it like this because it sounds cruel, but this math problem doesn't care about this arrangement you've made peace with. You get a math problem ahead of you, right? And if through this arrangement you've just decided this is going to be the way this is going to be, man, then you've got, like Jade was saying, you got years of work ahead of you. Because that's the only other way to solve this math problem. Because you all aren't living a true partnership.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And the hard part is, here's the thing. Let me. I agree with what John is saying, but let me just back out just for a second because let's pretend that you're like Jade, this is our arrangement. We don't, I don't hold your same values and I'm living with this guy. It works for us. Fine. What I would then say to you is, what's your plan? There's two things to think about. A, is your, your name's not on this mortgage. Your name's not on this. You don't know. Is he leaving the house to his former children? Is he leaving the house? Do you see what I'm saying? I just want you to make sure you're in a place to where if something happens with him and your housing situation should change that. You're able to stand on your own two feet. If you guys are not gonna get married and you're not gonna change the situation. That's what I'm concerned about.

[Jade Warshaw]

You're totally right. He. I know the houses will not go to me, so I'm pretty aware of that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

My, my dad did put me on his house, but it's. It' hour away and it's two hours from my job. So I do have, I will have a house someday. I mean, that, that is there. Here's what I don't want to depend on that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, exactly. And here's what I don't want. When, when people go into retirement, the, the line item that they need the most stability around is their housing. That's why we don't like folks renting going into retirement. I want you to have something that by the time you retire, it's yours. It's paid for. Right. Which feels pretty impossible to do while you're living with old boy. Right. So you need to figure out what does this look like if we're living together? Am I going to be part owner of this thing? Do I need to have my own space? And he has his own space. But you've got to create and solve for your own security going forward. Most phone plans are like bad roommates. Unpredictable, always asking for money, hard to get rid of and they never do the dishes. But Boost Mobile, totally different story. It's just 25 bucks a month for unlimited talk, text and data. No contracts and no weird hidden charges.

[Caller]

Just 25 bucks a month?

[Jade Warshaw]

Forever.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right. The $25 price will never go up. And if you're still skeptical, I get it. That's why Boost mobile offers a 30 day money back guarantee.

[Caller]

So try Boosting Boost.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You'll love it.

[Caller]

Or get your money back.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Go to boostmobile.com Ramsey to make the switch today.

[Caller]

That's boostmobile.com Ramsey restrictions apply.

[Jade Warshaw]

See boostmobile.com Ramsey for details.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Thanks for hanging out with us on the Ramsey Show. We've got Candace who's in Charlotte, North Carolina. Candice, you're on the line.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey y' all, how are you today?

[Caller]

What up?

[Jade Warshaw]

I am calling because I am looking to get some ducks in a row to buy a house, hopefully in the next couple of years. And I've been debt free since 2018 but I'm hoping to get manually underwritten through Zander or another company like that. But recently looked at my credit score and saw that it is still there. It has dropped significantly but it's at a 668. And I was just wondering how to get rid of it or how long does that take?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Where did you check your credit score?

[Jade Warshaw]

So Credit Karma actually sent me an email this week and they had two different scores. Listen, two different agencies.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm tell you right now, credit karma plays games. First off, it's not real, okay? I'm telling you, I'm going to tell You a real. This is based on a true story. When my husband and I were going to buy our first house, we had paid off off. All my debt was paid off and had been paid off for about eight months. And I was waiting and waiting for my credit score to drop to zero so we could apply for this no score loan. And I kept checking Credit Karma and it was telling me, yeah, my score was in the 668s and it was offering obviously, loan products to get your credit score up. Right. Don't you know, when I finally went on, like a real credit reporting agency and I looked to see, like, directly from TransUnion Equifax tax, it was zero. It actually was zero. But Credit Karma was reporting it as a low credit score so that I would engage in debt products.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, wow. Well, that's a relief.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. So pay. Pay the 75 bucks or whatever it is. And I think it's free. I think. I mean, when they pull, it isn't like 75 bucks. You can go to AnnualCreditReport.com and get it free.

[Caller]

AnnualCreditReport.com and get them for free.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, get the real one and see what happens. And then if. If for some reason you still check and it's there, then really go through with a fine tooth comb and make sure and find out what is it that's open, because that means something is open somewhere.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, well, I. Well, according to Credit Karma, I checked and it shows that everything has been closed since 2018. And there shouldn't be anything else outstanding. But I will check the other website. Thank you so much, guys. I appreciate it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, do it.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I tell you what, man. And those, you have to remember those sites, the whole point of them is to make money selling a dead product. Another. Yeah. Another credit card or another personal loan. And they'll tell you, here's what we recommend in order to get your credit score up.

[Caller]

Yeah, dude, I didn't know they could do that. That's kind of shady. Kind of super shady.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's super shady.

[Caller]

And by the way, you'll get your mortgage not through Xander. Xander does insurance products. You'll get it through Churchill Mortgage.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right. That's right. Very good. All right. Jordan's in Dallas, Texas. Hey, Jordan. How can we.

[Caller]

We help.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, so I was wondering if it makes sense to buy a car.

[Caller]

I'd be paying off in cash.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm following the rule. That's not more than half my income.

[Caller]

But it is a going to be.

[Jade Warshaw]

A Dodge Challenger and I drive A lot for it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Are you concerned about the fact that it's a Dodge Challenger or the fact that you're just paying cash for it? I'm sorry, we're not trying to make fun of your car.

[Caller]

I kind of. I kind of. Jordan. I kind of am.

[Jade Warshaw]

And a Fiat and a Hyundai Elantra.

[Caller]

This is my fun car now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Okay.

[Caller]

So you know what you do? You ru.

[Dr. John Deloney]

What's it cost?

[Caller]

I heard. I heard a comedian recently say that actually Dodge Challengers are part of a secret government program to identify those guys in every neighborhood. Exactly.

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, I'm trying to make it easier for them.

[Caller]

There you go. There you go.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So what's it cost?

[Caller]

Yeah, so it's going to cost depending.

[Jade Warshaw]

On which one I get. Anywhere between, you know, 20,000 to 24,000. Combine it used, I invest 15% of my income.

[Caller]

You know, all that's kind of covered. But. Are you already married? No, I'm not married. Yeah, see, I don't think anybody's going to date you in this car. I'm just kidding.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Don't let John.

[Caller]

I'm totally playing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Unless it's a bad color. What color is it?

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, this was supposed to help out with that.

[Caller]

Oh, bro, no. Get a truck. You're in Dallas, Texas, for God's sake. But, hey, you do it. I'm serious. You do whatever you want to do.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It depends on the type of lady you're trying to attract. Okay, so here we go. So you've got the 20. It's going to be 20 to 24,000. You've got the cash to pay for it. You're out of debt. Yes. You're in baby step four. Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so do you own a home?

[Caller]

No.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I've moved, like, six times in the last five years. So why? I wasn't going to buy a house until I kind of settled down.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Caller]

And so I have, like, a separate.

[Jade Warshaw]

Saving fund for a house.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you've got three to six months of expenses.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, yes, I have a little bit more than that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And how much is that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, So I have 30,000 for emergency fund, and then I have my down.

[Caller]

Payment, like just an S P500.

[Jade Warshaw]

About 46,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

My guy. Good job. Yeah, bro.

[Caller]

You're marryable. Just get this car and vroom, vroom it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

But please get it in black. Don't get it in a crazy car.

[Caller]

No, get it bright orange if you're gonna go for it, dude, Go for it, man.

[Jade Warshaw]

Go for it. Okay, okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Get some racing stripes on it.

[Caller]

I Man, I just want to tell you, get a Camry, but you do you, man. You. You get your charger.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, I mean, I. I think you've got it. You. You're doing everything right. You've got your emergency fund, 30,000. You've already got 46,000 in this house fund. I think 20 to 24 is a. We didn't ask you, though. How much is your income?

[Caller]

85K before bonuses.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Get your car.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Dude, I'm proud of you. I'm happy for you. That's great.

[Caller]

Yeah. Good for you, man. And hey, I could tell He. He knows he's cool. He. I like that dude.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Are you convincing yourself or.

[Caller]

No, no, no, no. Like, it's kind of like this. Like back in college, like, if I was like, hey, do you like Seinfeld? And they're like, I hate that show. I just knew we weren't going to be friends, right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes, yes.

[Caller]

And so normally if I'm somewhere and somebody cruises up and vroom, like a charger, we're probably not going to hang. I like that guy, though. I would want to hang out with that dude. You know what I mean?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I got you.

[Caller]

It's like when somebody pulls up and it's just like, we're probably not gonna be friends. I just, like, I can just probably tell.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So do you feel like you're only friends with people who drive trucks?

[Caller]

No. Goodness, no. Goodness, no.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How do you feel about people who drive Cadillacs or Teslas?

[Caller]

That's gonna say, like, George drives like. Like a gen 1 Tesla that I've had to push down the highway. No, like, he's a great friend. He might not want to be friends.

[Dr. John Deloney]

With you now since you roasted him.

[Caller]

No, he knows. He. He knows. He gets it. No, it's good on him, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Good on him. So Sam and I were out. Where were we? We were out this weekend, and I saw a truck that looks like yours. And I said, oh, John just got a new truck. It looks just like that. He goes, oh. He goes, I didn't know he was that guy.

[Caller]

I know, dude, trust me. I'm struggling with that too.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm like, I. I feel like you are this guy.

[Caller]

No, I got in. I got. I did. I got a new truck and I got in and it automatically adjusted for where I had said it last. And I was like, dude, I'm that guy.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No, it's great. I've had.

[Caller]

I don't have crank windows anymore. I just push a button and the window comes down. The whole thing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, that's been since, like, 1998.

[Caller]

But not in the cars I drive. No, I'm still struggling. I'm struggling. So, Jordan from Dallas, I'm taking out my own insecurities on you, brother. I'm glad you're buying yourself a charger. Charge them up.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Man, oh, man, I love this. Okay, so I'm just saying nobody in.

[Caller]

Fort Worth would drive that car. That's all I'm saying. All right, go ahead, Dallas.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so in that same vein, let's take this question of the day from the Ramsey Network app. See, there's a couple of them here. Let's go with this one from Abigail. She says, why do you use the term fun money instead of allowance for spousal personal spending?

[Caller]

Because my spouse isn't my child.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Listen, I wish Sam Warshaw would be like, here's your allowance.

[Caller]

If I said the words to my wife, hey, here's your allowance, I would wake up and I'd be on a feeding tube somewhere.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You look like Rocky Balboa after Clubber Language. Just done. Oh, gosh. Yeah.

[Caller]

The guy in the middle, like, yeah, yeah. No, because it's. Yeah, because we're not children.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And by the way, with all due respect and love and care, Abigail, use whatever term you want to use. Like you're all growed up. You could call it shenanigan money. You could call it singing and dancing. I don't call.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Whatever you want. Yeah, whatever. Whatever I want. Money. Yeah. Yeah, whatever.

[Caller]

I want money. Not your money. Like, I. Yeah, don't. Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Allowance. Allowance. Sounds like somebody is giving me something as a handout. Somebody else giving it to me. Not giving it to my, you know.

[Caller]

Not me making an adult choice to, to we agree on. This is what you're going to spend. This is what I'm going to spend. We shake hands, we high five, and we can call it whatever we want.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes. Yeah. That's really where that ends. Fun money sounds fun allowance sounds like somebody put baby in the corner.

[Caller]

And nobody puts baby in the corner. That's right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I'm big on vocabulary when it comes to money. How we talk about things really matter. I, I, you know, we talk all the time. If you're married, you say things like, we, our us instead of mine, you, yours. And it's the same thing with this. It really does matter, the vocabulary that we're choosing. So in this case, I think in my.

[Caller]

I, I have to go back and check. I think, think the line item that Sheila put in the budget is John's crap I think that's what it says.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That feels accurate. I like that.

[Caller]

I think that's what it says.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I like Sheila. I need to spend more time with this woman.

[Jade Warshaw]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

Ronnie is in Knoxville, Tennessee. Ron A. What's up?

[Jade Warshaw]

What's up?

[Caller]

How you doing?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Doing good. How can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

I have a. I'm sorry, I'm a little emotional.

[Caller]

You're good, brother.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Ronnie, forgive me.

[Caller]

No, there's no forgiveness needed, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

We're with you, bud.

[Caller]

Glad you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Cole, I'm sorry. It's really hard to talk about.

[Caller]

Yeah. What happened?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm calling because my wife, we've been married 25 years and she like the day before Mother's Day, she come up to me and said that she didn't love me anymore and she wanted out of the marriage.

[Caller]

Oh, man.

[Jade Warshaw]

And so here I am today. I have to pick up the divorce papers. I was gonna pick up Thursday and, and more than likely I'm gonna end up losing my home too because she's. I. I have a feeling. I don't know what's going to happen. The house is either going to get sold or she's going to buy me out. And I'm assuming she's going to buy me out because she loves the house and we have a 17 year old and so that's their home and I don't know. I don't know what to do. I've got as far as money for me, I've got like $36,000 to my name and that's money I saved up in savings and I was going to use it. My, our plan was I was going to use it to pay my automobile off and, and the job that I'm doing right now, I was going to help my wife pay the house off early so we wouldn't have any debt before we retire.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So this came out of the blue. You. You feel completely blindsided?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, mate.

[Caller]

How old are you, ma' am?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm 57.

[Caller]

Yeah. Dude, I'm so sorry, brother. Sorry. Before you get into any big decision makes making, before you start talking, I'm gonna have to do this and cash this out or whatever. This is going to be a humble pill to swallow, but I want you to exhale and not make any crazy decisions until you're actually looking at the paper in hand. Okay. And do you have an attorney working with you?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm attorney shopping right now, so I meet with one Friday.

[Caller]

All right. If you feel a sense of trust and a sense of partnership with this attorney, I'm going to give you some language. It's really hard to hear, but this is just the, the most honest truth I can give you. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

If your wife has said our marriage is over and papers are coming your way on Thursday, then you are entering out of a marriage into a business transaction action.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Caller]

Okay. And so you want to make the best business deal Both for your 17 year old and for you. And you want to remain a person of dignity and respect towards your soon to be ex wife. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And we're going to take care of that 17 year old and that might mean selling the house and a portion of the funds go to like whatever, but y' all have to figure that out. How you divide up retirement, that's what, that's what the attorneys are going to do. All that stuff. Okay. And dude, there's going to be all kinds of stuff about infidelity and questions and like years of your wife's text messages and emails are going to come to light. So are yours. All that mess happens unless y' all shake hands on a mediation. But all that stuff's going to get taken care of. I just don't want you cashing something out. Going and selling a bunch of stuff.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Like don't do any of that.

[Caller]

Don't do anything until you actually have real facts in your hand. Hear me say this. Facts are Your friend, not the stories you're making up in your head because you're scared and because you're heartbroken. Okay. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I. I can't afford a lawyer.

[Caller]

Well, you can't afford not to have one.

[Jade Warshaw]

I know.

[Caller]

Okay. It's going to cost you five grand of that 36,000 or ten grand of that 36,000. It's money well spent. If it's going to save you half a million dollars against this house you have, or $250,000 against this house you have.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And your retire. Whatever retirement y' all have saved up.

[Jade Warshaw]

He doesn't have any. I've got 18,000 of a 401k that I have from a previous job.

[Caller]

That's all you got?

[Jade Warshaw]

Thank you. Thinking that I was thinking of turning over on a cd.

[Caller]

No, we're not doing anything.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Don't do that.

[Caller]

No.

[Jade Warshaw]

You okay?

[Caller]

Sit tight.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Don't cash out anything.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

How many. How much other retirement do you have?

[Jade Warshaw]

That's it. That's all I got.

[Caller]

Okay. So I'm gonna say something harsh. Okay. Because I love you. I only have a few minutes. You're broke, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Okay, so we're probably. We're probably talking about going to a one bedroom apartment for at least a year while you let the smoke clear on this deal. Okay. And you got the cash to do that right now if you. She ends up getting the house.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, what am I supposed to do with my truck payment?

[Dr. John Deloney]

How have you been paying it?

[Jade Warshaw]

I've been taking it out of that $36,000. That's what.

[Caller]

Are you working?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Are you working? Are you working full time?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm. I'm doing it. A small job I'm doing. I remember you talking to somebody about doing Amazon Flex. I'm on the Amazon Flex waiting list, but I'm also doing spark delivery right now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How long have you been doing that? How long have you been out of career work?

[Jade Warshaw]

Since March.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And what were you doing before that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Before March, I was working at Denso Manufacturing.

[Caller]

Will they give you your job back or they let you get go.

[Jade Warshaw]

I would love to go by there and see if I can't get my job.

[Caller]

I would go there today. And if not there, you stop by Home Depot on the way home. Stop by Walmart on the way home. You got to get a job. You got to get several jobs. Cuz forget this. Let's say your marriage was. Was strong and ironclad. You're knocking on the door of 60 and you have no money. You get what I'm saying?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And I also think this is an. Mathematically, this is a very solvable problem. Okay. I don't want you to do anything drastic or anything like that, but you do got to. You got to just get after it now.

[Jade Warshaw]

All right?

[Caller]

And by the way, this is going to sound counterintuitive. You're heartbroken right now, but having a sense of purpose every day when you wake up, a thing to go to will help your nervous system. It'll help your body immensely.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

All right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Ronnie, let's talk about that car, your truck, real quick. What do you owe on it?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, 34,000 on it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Do you happen to know what it's worth?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, the dealership actually sent something in the mail wanting to buy it back from me for 27,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, we can't go by that.

[Caller]

They are lowballing. You decide. They're not.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's not going to happen.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Your. Your homework is to find out what that would be worth. Private sale. Because I want you going into those negotiations with the idea that you're going to sell that truck and use some of the 36,000 to get yourself a cash car. You're not going to do that today, but I want that to be part of your. Would you do it today, John?

[Caller]

Brother, I might. Because I'm just saying, mathematically, if you were still married and you called this show. That's true, you don't have a job, I would tell you, sell that truck and take 10,000 of that 36,000 and go buy yourself a used F150 50 or used 2006 Tundra.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And, yeah, I'd pull the trigger on that. Yeah.

[Caller]

Because you can't afford the truck you got. You don't have a job, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And. And when this starts to go down and unravel, you're gonna. You're gonna need every dime you can get your hands on.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I know it.

[Caller]

But if you. If you went and sold that truck today, private sale, somebody will buy that truck on Facebook Marketplace this weekend. Especially where you live there in Knoxville. A good truck is. Is always marketable. And you took 10,000. You got 36,000 the bank. You took 10 grand and went out self and bought yourself a truck that runs. Nothing nice, but something that runs well. Now you've solved two. You've killed two burns at one stone, and now you don't. You don't owe anybody anything.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, the reason why I had this truck to begin with is I bought it back in 23, and I was driving my wife Honda Accord that Had she bought it when we were Dayton. It had like 320, 000 miles on it. And, and I was, I couldn't build a savings account because I keep, kept dumping out.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right. But that's not going to be this next truck, right? Don't, don't put that on this next vehicle. This next vehicle is going to be a nicer ten thousand dollar vehicle. There's plenty of vehicles out there that's got a couple hundred, you know, run.

[Caller]

It's going be great.

[Dr. John Deloney]

My, my, my Cadillac's got 150 on it. It's just fine.

[Caller]

The truck I'm selling to my son is, got 200,000 miles and it's a great, great truck. I've been driving it for years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Just make sure. Yeah, I get the inferent.

[Caller]

You're not in 2023 anymore. Your life just transformed not by your hand, but in your lap.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Get the car facts on the vehicle, make sure you know what it's been through and make an educated guess there.

[Caller]

And, and let's go get two J O B s jobs this weekend. Game on, brother. We're with you this whole way.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, Rachel, the Internet officially knows too much about all of us. So much, George.

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean our names, our addresses, even our relatives names. And what's crazy is even if you opt out, data broker websites can still get your info. Don't like that.

[Caller]

And just a year ago, get this.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The average person had about 300 pieces of personal data floating around online.

[Jade Warshaw]

Now it's over 600.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It has doubled in a year.

[Jade Warshaw]

You guys, that is so concerning. Because that info then can be used in phishing, scams, impersonation and even harassment. That's why George and I both use and love Delete Me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes, Delete Me scrubs your personal info from hundreds of these data broker sites.

[Caller]

Not just once, but all year long.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And there's real privacy experts behind the.

[Caller]

Scenes doing this, not bots.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So this is digital hygiene.

[Caller]

We all need.

[Jade Warshaw]

We all need it. And then they will send you a detailed report showing exactly where they found.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Your data and what they removed.

[Jade Warshaw]

And you can even request custom removals if you have something specific you want.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Them to look out for.

[Jade Warshaw]

Exactly.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And this is not being paranoid, this is staying protected.

[Jade Warshaw]

And so far Delete Me has removed my info from 240 listings and saved.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Me 94 hours of time it would.

[Caller]

Have taken me to do it.

[Jade Warshaw]

I love it. And you guys, in a world where strangers can google your grandma and get enough info to scam her in just Two clicks. Delete me gives you peace of mind.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

So go to joindeleteme.com Ramsey for 20 off. And that discount brings their annual plans.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Down to about 9 bucks a month.

[Caller]

So go check it out. Joindeleteme.com Ramsay Ramsey.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The Ramsey show question of the day is brought to you by Y Refi. Let's be real. Defaulted private student loans don't just go away magically on their own. But why Refi will help help you explore a low fixed rate loan based on your unique circumstances. So go to yrefi.comramsey today. That's the letter y r e f y.com ramsey remember, it may not be available in all states.

[Caller]

All right. Today's question comes from Todd in Wyoming. Todd writes, my fiance and I have been together almost five years. She has student loans over 175,000 bucks and she earns $165,000 a year. Year. She's working hard on paying off her loans. I make about 150,000 a year. I bought a house almost six years ago and have paid off nearly half the mortgage with around $250,000 in equity. My fiance wants her name added to the title and mortgage once we are married. Would that be a wise decision for me to add her name onto the paperwork?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Interesting. I feel like this question is not, not about the question. No, that makes sense.

[Caller]

This is about, I'm doing good with my money. My wife, the woman I'm about to marry is not so good with her money.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I mean, okay, so let's, let's back it out on, on. In any normal circumstances when there's trust and everybody's feeling good about combining finances, you know, the whole thing about adding someone to a mortgage, you can't do that unless you refinance. Right. And that's kind of a big deal. Especially if you're one of these person people who had like a two or.

[Caller]

Three, six years ago, you got this dude's got a low interest rate.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Exactly. So I wouldn' necessarily do that today. You could easily add her to the deed and that way she's, she's an.

[Caller]

Owner of the house.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. And you can do that very easily. Now if you were to, you know, let's say you get married and you never add her to the mortgage, you never refinance and you were to pass away, it's still going to go straight to her. She's, she would still be able to assume that mortgage.

[Caller]

Yeah, we, I called a mortgage professional and the professional said if somebody's an owner on the deed, but they're not. Their name isn't on the mortgage. That doesn't matter when it comes to ownership. And if the person. If the husband, if you died in the situation, that's the one and only time your. Her name would get moved to the actual mortgage if she wanted to keep the payments without a refi.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Being able to afford it is a whole other question, but just being able to make that transition. But that being said, I don't really feel. I almost called you, Ken. I don't really feel, John, that the question is about that. I feel like he's more thinking. Like you said, she's got this deep debt, and I don't. And I kind of don't know if I want to combine finances. That's what it sounds like.

[Caller]

Well. And so here's the deal. I think this is the way I would look at it, Todd. And. And check me on this, Jade, if I'm wrong, Todd. Yes. I would add my wife. The. The day after we get married, after my honeymoon, probably I would add my wife to. As an owner of the house. Right. I put her name on the deed. No, absolutely. I wouldn't worry so much about. About refinancing especially. You got this house six years ago. You probably got a good interest rate. But I want you to think about this. Y' all together make a little over $300,000 a year. And y' all are going to have $175,000 in student loan debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right?

[Caller]

And y' all are gonna have to bust your butts and get this paid off. You make 300 grand a year. You can get that paid off in two years and just move on with your lives. So that's the way y' all need to think about Yalls money. And if that makes you feel uncomfortable, then I would check myself before I wreck myself and get married.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Listen, I agree with this statement. The only thing I disagree with is the y' alls. I'd say you guys. How about that, right?

[Caller]

That's Texas versus Florida. It's all good.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You people. All right, we got Meredith in.

[Caller]

What do you mean, people?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Meredith, what's going on?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi, James. John, thank you for taking my call. My question is, can I afford tickets to a Dolly Parton concert or should I focus solely on buying a house?

[Dr. John Deloney]

And where is that concert?

[Jade Warshaw]

It is in Vegas.

[Dr. John Deloney]

This is my kind of call.

[Caller]

Okay? This is Baby Step 9A, which we don't talk about very much. And that is if you can see Dolly. You go see Dolly.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Always see her In Las Vegas.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I mean, maybe not always. Let's. Let's roll it back. Listen, I want to say yes no matter what, but I can't. So you said, should I do this or focus on a down payment? So I'm assuming that you are actually incorrectly on baby step 3B, which would mean there's no other debt. Can we check that green?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No other debt. Okay. That would also mean that you have three to six months of expenses. Can we check that box, green?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. That would also mean that you have begun baby step 4 in some capacity or negative.

[Jade Warshaw]

And remind me, what step four.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Investing 15%. Have you started that yet?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, yes. Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so we can check that green, and then have you started anything towards the down payment, or you're just thinking about it?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, I have probably about 50,000 that I can put toward it. Of course, that's really including, like, any expenses like closing costs, etc.

[Caller]

Sounds like you're going to see Dolly.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Get good tickets.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I like that.

[Caller]

Get good seats.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Get right up front. Who's going with you?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm not sure yet. Probably family member or friends. I can get them to come to Vegas with me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wow. I love this for you. What's your income? You're doing great. What's your income?

[Jade Warshaw]

About 60,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wow. You've done so well.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thank you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I'm proud of you.

[Caller]

And really like the math problem here is this. When it all comes down to it, this might mean you buy a house in January instead of December, after tickets, after plane rides, after hotels, it's gonna be a couple thousand bucks. And you're saying I would rather buy a house in January and have had this amazing experience before buying a house in December. Right.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right. Yeah. And I. I'm definitely a saver. So I'll probably be trying to get it closer to a thousand dollars for all the expenses. Definitely.

[Caller]

Yeah. Best of luck to you. I don't think you can sneeze in Vegas for a thousand bucks. If you're gonna go, you might as well go. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You've got the money. You said you got three to six months plus 50,000 saved, plus you've been.

[Caller]

Investing, plus you don't owe anybody money. Go enjoy yourself.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Have a good time. What hotel are you staying in?

[Jade Warshaw]

Cosmopolitan? I don't know, but I know that the show is at Caesars Coliseum.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, great. Don't stay at Caesars, though. Stay at the Cosmo. All right. I like this call. I'm so excited for Meredith. That's great. That's Fun. Are you a Vegas person, John?

[Caller]

If I'm going for a thing. So, like, me and Blake Thompson and. And Brian Williams, two guys who work here, we went down to see Social Distortion, my favorite. That was a. We had the time of our life. If people are like, let's just go to Vegas. I'm not a fan, really. I get burned out within 24 hours.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, you can't stay long. I feel like three days is the limit.

[Caller]

If I'm going for a thing, then I love it. I'm going to watch the fight. I love it. If. If I'm going just to, like, look around and stand in circles.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No gambling for you. No tables, no blackjack.

[Caller]

No. I like. I do got you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. That's why you got to set a limit on it. For sure. Oh, boy, oh, boy.

[Caller]

This happened the last time I was there. So the concert. The Social D concert has a big mosh pit, and it's a big, chaotic event. And I was down in there, and I had. I did. I had took a little bit of money to set on fire, and I ended up sat by some guy who helped me out, and. And I had a silly, silly day at the blackjack table.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Nice.

[Caller]

But I was so over the top, which I know is hard for you to imagine. I was a little bit. A lot. Somebody stops me in the mosh pit, and they're like, hey, there's that guy. And I was thinking they were talking about the show, and I was like, yeah, what's up? I'm kind of cool. And he goes, that's that goofball from the. From the casino earlier. And I kind of made a scene. I never win anything.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think that's so fun when people are winning and they make a scene or a table is high, but then.

[Caller]

You'Re so the deal. We all got to get T shirts, got to pay for, like, breakfast and dinner. It was a blast, man. So I. Yeah, it was a good time.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, man. That's right.

[Caller]

Are you. Are you a Vegas person?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Las Vegas. Aside from going to the beach, that's my favorite trip. If I can go every year, I go every year. Yeah, that's my jam. Sam Warshine.

[Caller]

I good on you, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Listen, go see Dolly Parton.

[Caller]

Meredith. Go see Dolly Parton.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I saw Bruno Mars in Las Vegas. Wait, no, I saw him in Miami. Who did I see in Las Vegas? Oh, you two.

[Caller]

Is that pretty awesome?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, my gosh.

[Caller]

Did you go to Sphere?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes, I went.

[Caller]

You did?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes. And. And.

[Caller]

And I heard that was a spiritual experience.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It was it was okay. I didn't have great seats. I sat in the wrong spot. But my memory from that is I passed Bono in the hallway and he said, what's up?

[Caller]

Did you say what up, B?

[Dr. John Deloney]

It took me a moment. I was like, you know, you have that moment where you're like, I can't believe this is him. But Bono spoke directly to me.

[Caller]

I can still, I can still feel the glow.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I lifted off the ground a little bit.

[Caller]

James is in there weeping. He's like, bono never talked to me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Look, James, I don't feel like James cares about Bono.

[Caller]

Are you kidding me?

[Dr. John Deloney]

You know, do you care about the edge? I love Bono, but the edge would mean more to me if I saw him. Yeah, I didn't see him. You know what? I think I feel the same way. I think I would.

[Caller]

I think you guys are both need to seek professional help immediately.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Does. Does U2 not make your list?

[Caller]

I love you two. I just think the edge makes jangly noises with tons of reasons.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No, don't say that. Yeah, that's excellent. You're kinda right. Now this has been the Ramsey Show.

[Jade Warshaw]

These days the Internet is chock full of so called investing advice from random goobs with zero qualifications. Listen folks, you deserve guidance from someone who knows what the flip they're talking about. That's why I recommend the Smartvestor program. Smartvestors can help you find a professional financial advisor who can teach you to make your own best decisions with your own money. Get [e-mail] smartvest again ramseysolutions.com smartvestor Ramsey Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros.

[Caller]

Learn [e-mail].

[Dr. John Deloney]

From the Ramsey Network app. It's the Ramsey Show Show. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to me again, Dr. John DeLoney continuing to take your calls. It is a live show so if you call in, you're talking to us live in the moment. How about that? We got Linda who's in Fort Worth, Texas on the line. What's going on, Linda? How can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey you guys. I am in credit card debt. I pay about a third of my net income in credit card debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Holy.

[Jade Warshaw]

I am wondering. Yeah, I know and it wasn't intentional.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I.

[Jade Warshaw]

From the beginning of 2024 to. To the end of 2024 I am. My job changed and I got like over a $30,000 pay cut.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so what are you making now?

[Jade Warshaw]

So now I currently make 46,000. However I'm a teacher. So starting in September, my new job. I should be making about 52.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Something like that in September.

[Jade Warshaw]

How do I not know? Because. So I know my base pay, but I'm teaching English, and there's stipends. According. There's stipends with that. So we don't know what the stipends are. They should be about $5,000.

[Caller]

I used to get a stipend schedule, but you may have to call central office. Are you. Are you with Tarrant County? Who are you with?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I'm actually. I live outside of Fort Worth. I'm in Greg County.

[Caller]

Okay. Okay. I. I would. If you haven't already. I would call them just for the peace of mind, just to see what the. What the stipend schedule is. Yeah, whatever that's worth. I. That. That un. That not knowing. Because that's 500 bucks a month, right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, it is.

[Caller]

That's a lot of extra money on an annual basis. I would. I would just reach out and call them because they'll have. They should have a schedule that. That should already have been voted on and everything. Right.

[Jade Warshaw]

So. Yeah. So they just sent out, like two weeks ago what the pay scale is going to be. So I know I'm getting a 2000 DOL. For sure. It's just the stipends that they haven't sent out yet.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So we think it's going to be 52 in September.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's what I'm. Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So the problem here is the credit card debt. Is there other debt to speak of?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I do have a student loan, which I don't. I only pay like $40 a month on that, which I know that's right now. That's, like, not a major issue for me right now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It will be.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I know.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. What's the total amount of it?

[Jade Warshaw]

But it's the 53,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I would call that an issue. So we got the student loan. We've got the student loan. We've got the credit card debt. What is that total?

[Jade Warshaw]

$25,742.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And then what else? Any vehicles?

[Jade Warshaw]

And then I owe a family member about 7,000, which they said, don't worry about it. I'm worrying about it. It's on my list. It's going to get paid back.

[Dr. John Deloney]

When they said don't about it, is that, hey, this was a gift, truly, don't worry about it. Or was it, hey, it's still a loan, but you don't have to worry about paying it right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's a loan. You don't have to worry about it. If I don't pay it back, they're not going to be upset with me. Like, there's not going to be any problems. But they don't. They're. They're not rich. So $7,000 to them was a significant amount of money.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How long have you. How long ago did you borrow it?

[Jade Warshaw]

About six months ago. I had a plumbing issue that obviously, I mean, I can't even pay my bills. Right. Like, I go into debt every month right now.

[Caller]

Do you have a. Do you have a summer job?

[Jade Warshaw]

I do. So I taught summer school, which I just finished last week.

[Caller]

Great.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then I D.O. visitations for CPS. Like parent child.

[Caller]

Fantastic. Cool.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Good. Okay. So, yeah. So we've got student loans, credit cards, family loan, any auto loan. Anything else we should know about?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, thank God my car is paid for.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right, Great. Yes, I'm happy about that. And are you currently working? Are you using a budget every month?

[Jade Warshaw]

I do. I do. So right now, bills, not including food, my bills are $3200. I make $3188.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so where's the overage going?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I have a mortgage which is 1433, and then I pay 9, 155 in credit card, and that's just my minimum. And then that leaves me about $800 for general bills and, and some food.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, but you said. I thought I heard you say that your bills are 32 and you bring home 31.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So where's the extra 188? How. What are you doing to cover the extra? Is that going on? Credit cards acting?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so there's. Okay, this is good. This is good. We're. We're finding the source of the issue. So I say this all the time, and I'll say the same thing to you, Linda. You can't solve a problem while simultaneously creating it. Okay? So debt is your problem. So at some point you're going to have to cut this thing off at the source and say, I just. The first step in solving this is you have to become a person who doesn't borrow money. Otherwise it's all for. Not like, what's the point of paying and working so hard to scrap to pay these things off if you're actively borrowing against your own efforts, Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So today, because here's what's going to happen, you're going to put yourself in a position of survival when you do that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you're going to say, okay, I must now, I must make changes before I kind of had the option, you know, just in case. If I don't, I still know I have this credit card here. Right. But now when you cut that credit card up and you know, it's not an option now, it's like, oh, my gosh, it's, it's, it's game time. I gotta get in here and make some real moves. I have to earn money. I have to make this happen. I have to cut back in other areas, Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So that's what I would say is numero uno. A lot of people miss that step, and it's. It's a costly one. So let's draw that line in the sand today. That's your homework piece of number one and then number two. Now we're just solving this like any other equation. And John, it's the same two factors every time. You got to get money in, you got to get more. More and more money coming in. And you've got to get tighter about the money going out. That is always going to be the solution to these problems. And it's not easy. But what else could you do to find money for the rest of the summer? And what else can you do to find more money? When the school. When school starts up in September.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I'll continue doing my visits when school starts. Right now, I'm currently. So my original job was with the government, so I'm in an all cert program for teaching. So right now I'm like, in college this semester, this summer.

[Caller]

I've been there. That's exactly what I did. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And honestly, I love teaching. I have. And I have equity in my house. I was blessed with, like, right now, life is so freaking good.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes. That's not the problem.

[Caller]

Yeah. You're drowning. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, no. I mean, I'm not spending.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, but you called in because you make 3100 and you spend 3200, so that's still a problem there. Many things can be true at the same time. Right? Like, life can be good in a lot of other areas, but financially, your life is not good right now.

[Caller]

But here's what I want you to do. Several simple things. I want you to get on the phone today with Xander and check all of your insurance experiences. Okay. I want you to cut every single solitary streaming service you have. All of them.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Because what you're trying to do right now is find 150 bucks a month just to break even. Steven.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Everything. And you have to tell all your friends, I can't eat out anymore. And that Means when you're going to do a home visit, you pack a ham sandwich to go with you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Now, I don't know anything about this home business.

[Caller]

Yeah? What do you make it on those home visits per visit?

[Jade Warshaw]

Not very much. I only make 15 an hour.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Then I think you got to find a better side hustle.

[Caller]

Make 20, 25 bucks an hour tutoring English or math at the local school. You're going to make more money doing that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, that's. That's what this amounts to. I know that you're burning the candle at both ends. I know that you're out there trying to do work, but you then have to say, hey, is this worth the time I'm putting into it? Or can I find something that I can make more per hour so that I can get this thing right side up and actually start making progress on this debt instead of minimum payments? You'll be paying minimum payments forever if you don't change this.

[Jade Warshaw]

Buying and selling a home is a big deal, and you want an expert in your corner fighting for you to get the right deal at the right price. That's why we only recommend Ramsey trusted real estate estate agents. They're handpicked pros who know their stuff, listen to your needs, and have your back from the first call all the way to closing day. To find a Ramsey trusted agent near you, visit ramseysolutions.com agent ramseysolutions.com agent.

[Dr. John Deloney]

We tell you all the time that we would appreciate it if you would like and subscribe and even share the show that's so important to us. And you guys have been doing that. So number one, thank you so much for doing that. It makes a huge difference for us and obviously it makes a huge life change for the folks who are able to view the show. But if you want to get a little bit more savvy about it, we built something very special. It's called the Ramsey 101 play playlist. And this will help you help those folks that you're sharing the show with. Okay. It's free. It's an easy to share playlist that really covers all the basics for someone who's really just getting involved with the Ramsey plan. Okay, so on that channel, there are clips on what the baby steps are. How to pay off your debt using the debt snowball, how to build an emergency fund, and a whole lot more. So this is what you want to share, and here's how you do it. You click the link at the top of the show notes to open the Ramsey 101 playlist on YouTube. YouTube. And then from there you could just text it, you could DM it, you could send it in a group chat or just say, hey, I found this for you and it might help. Right? So if you're listening to this on the radio, we've got the playlist featured at the top of our YouTube channel, so you can find it there as well. And just remember, it's one share. This is one step that could help somebody change everything in their life. Okay? So it's so, so important. And that's all there is to it. Ramsey 101 playlist. All right, Emma in Des Moines, Iowa is up next. What's up, Emma?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. Well, I'm wanting to know how I can deal with my own debt while going into a marriage without pulling my fiance down. And he's in a really good spot financially, so I don't want to, you know, ruin the relationship. I know finances is the number one reason for divorce, so.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Sure. Have you guys talked about this? Does he know about your debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, one of the first things we talked about.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Great. How much is your. How much do you owe?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's only about 12,000 in credit card debt. I don't have any student loans. I don't have any car payments. Okay, so it's just the credit cards.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you're done with using credit cards?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm trying to be. I've switched jobs. I had to move towns to move in with him, and then that caused me to have to switch jobs. So I was out of work for about a month or so. So he pays for a lot of the stuff because he makes a lot really good money. But I'm still on the lower end.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Earning wise.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Listen, I'm 100% about paying off debt for anybody. Single, married, engaged to be married. I'm always looking, though, for a change in behavior because that's what's going to make this thing stick. Right. It's like doing, doing otherwise, it's like doing a crash diet to lose weight and you never get to the core issue and you immediately put the weight back on because you keep eating nachos. Right. Like, it's that same thing. And so for you, yeah, the core issue is you're utilizing credit cards instead of doing whatever it takes to make sure that you're really in a secure place financially. So you could pay off this debt. But if you hit a hard time again, you're going to fall right back to credit cards. And I don't want you to do that.

[Caller]

That.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So similar to the Last call. There has to be that switch that flips that you say, this has been causing me heartache and pain. I'm not going to do this anymore. And are you and your fiance, do you. Is that going to be the move going forward? What's his. What's his thought about debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, he's, like I said, he's in a really good spot financially.

[Caller]

That's not what she asked. What does he think about debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, he wants to get it paid off, but he also knows that, you know, going forward, we want to start like a real estate business. So he knows that you sometimes have to go into debt to make money. Being like, like buying a rental property, obviously you have to go into a little bit of debt to get the property, but then you earn it, you know, earn it back. He's. He's definitely the more financial savvy person out of the two of us.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I don't know about that.

[Caller]

Yeah, that makes him unsavvy.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So here's what I, here's what John and want to do. We are going to gift you Financial Peace University because I think that you both could benefit from more financial literacy. Right? I think you're just seeing he has, he seems to have more money in the bank. He's better with money. I have a little bit of debt. I'm terrible with money. When really, I think you guys are both young and it's so important to really learn how money works, how debt works, is it necessary? Is it unnecessary? All of those things, things, things that I know I don't know, John, about you, but I wish I had known it when I was first getting my start. It would have changed everything. So we're going to make sure you have Financial Peace University. We're going to make sure you have every dollar. And to answer your initial question, yeah, I would work really hard to pay off this debt, Emma, but again, remember the point of paying off the debt is because you've said this is a negative thing for me. This is stealing my paycheck. It's. It's stealing my joy. It's making life frustrating when I have transitions between jobs. Right. Because now I got paid my debt and I lost my a job. So remember that. And remember that debt is not your friend. So that after you pay it off, from here on out, we set this foundation to where, yeah, we can use our cash. We've saved up money. If there's an emergency, we use the money that we've saved. If we like to purchase something, we save up the money to Purchase it, even if it's real estate. And so I just want you to remember this moment and remember this call going forward, because I think you guys are going to pay off this debt and I think you're going to, to go on to have a great marriage, but in two seconds with real estate, you could pile up another 500,000 like that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Think how that would feel.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And now when we go ahead, our.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wedding is August 30th of this year. When we get married, combining finances, how do we, how, like, how do we do that? I'm not really sure.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's a good question. So, so the, the practical side of it is you're going to have a checking account. And that one checking account is going to be the one that both of your paychecks go into and that both of you have access to. And in that one checking account, that's going to be the one that you link to your budget. And so that's the one that you can say, okay, we're forming our budget based on this checking account and this is how we're spending that money. Then you guys are both going to have a savings account account. And that savings account is going to be where your thousand dollar baby step one emergency fund goes. It's going to be where your three to six months of emergency fund goes when you get to that step. And that's going to be that. And then from there on, you know, if you decide you need another extra savings account once you get beyond three to six months of expenses, you can do that. But the point is, from here on out, everything is done in full transparency together. You're both on the account. Nobody has a side account over here for a rainy day that the other guy doesn't know about. Nobody's taking out debt that the other person doesn't know about. So that's kind of the practical side of it. But John, I mean, obviously there's a emotional component to it as well.

[Caller]

Yeah. And this is the money fights that you've, you've heard that, that, that phrase that you mentioned at the beginning of the call, like money fights are the big fight that breaks up relationships. It's not about owing $12,000. It's about something in your relationship dynamic makes you feel, feel so less than because you have $12,000. It's, it is, I'm gonna work really hard, we're gonna pay this 12,000 bucks off. We get married, we get one checking account, and one person says, I'm not putting my money in one checking account. Are you crazy? I get my money, you get your money. That's a money fight. Or, hey, we got everything paid off conversation. I want to borrow a million dollars for two rental homes. Like, that's money fights that breaks up marriages and relationships.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah. And we've had the conversation that it's not your money or my money, it's our money.

[Caller]

Perfect.

[Jade Warshaw]

Once. Once we're married, I think I just have a hard time with guilt, feeling like I'm taking advantage of him because he's got like over 600,000 of assets and investments. He's talked to a financial planner. He has like a financial planner.

[Caller]

Listen to me very carefully. He's not better than you. Yeah, okay. He's not better than you. He might know more about a thing. My wife is. Was, when we got together, was a world class elementary school teacher. She became nationally renowned for. For childhood literacy. You know what I know about childhood literacy? Almost nothing.

[Jade Warshaw]

And.

[Caller]

And I sit with people whose lives are falling apart. That's not what she does. Neither of us are better than the other person. All of our money goes into the same account every month. And we work, we go from there. And so, yeah, it's you not coming into this marriage. And if he makes you feel this way, you need to have this conversation before you get married. And if he tells you every day, I love you and I can't wait till we're married and you're bringing this in, I want you to go talk to somebody. Talk to our friend. Friends of better help. Okay? But you've got to talk to somebody to work on that idea that he's so much better than me. He's smarter than me, he's a better partner than me, and I'm just kind of this.

[Dr. John Deloney]

This dead weight.

[Caller]

Yeah, this dead weight being pulled behind the car because I'm bringing 12,000 bucks in. No, not at all. He picked you. You picked him. Keep your head high.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Does having more money and less stress sound nice but feel impossible?

[Caller]

Well, in my brand new book, Breaking Free from Broke, I share my story.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Of going from broke to millionaire and exactly how I did it.

[Jade Warshaw]

You'll learn about the money traps and.

[Caller]

Cultural lies out there designed to keep.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You brainwashed and stressed out.

[Caller]

From credit card schemes to mortgage myths to investing traps. So if you're not where you want.

[Dr. John Deloney]

To be financially, I can help you finally get ahead. You can get Breaking Free from broke [e-mail] store.

[Caller]

That's ramseysolutions.com store.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All right, everybody. If you're tired of Living paycheck to paycheck and wondering where the heck all your money's going. The first step is getting on a budget. I've said it before, I'll say it again. And good thing. Our team is hosting a free budgeting training this month. Honestly, every month they do this. You'll learn a step by step system of how to make and stick to a budget using Every Dollar, our budgeting app. Plus, you can get your biggest questions answered in the live Q and A. Trust me, it's so worth it. But spots are limited, so sign up for free [e-mail] webinar.

[Caller]

And hey, there's one more thing. Two weekends right now are on sale for the money and Marriage Getaway. Rachel Cruz, me and several of our friends spend three incredible days here in Nashville, Tennessee with you and your spouse house. Learning about tools to strengthen connection. Talk about intimacy, talk about sex. We talk about your money. We talk about every thing. It's all new stuff this year. We rewrite this every year and we have events on sale for November and for Valentine's Day weekend. And we can't wait. Listen, early bird pricing is available right now. Tickets are 749 bucks per couple. You will not find better prices for a marriage retreat for three days in Nashville. And we have some new stuff. Surprises for everybody this year. Get your tickets for the lowest price before they end. Go to ramseysolutions.com getaway or click the link in the show notes. These events sell out every year and they're a blast, so make sure you get your tickets. Ramseysolutions.com getaway yes, that is correct.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Actually, I think it's ramseysolutions.com well, it was up there.

[Caller]

Getaway.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It wasn't getaway. It was events. I think.

[Caller]

Oh, I think it's double checking.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Is it the same thing? Okay, try both of them. Type them both in. You'll get there.

[Caller]

Just click on the link in the show notes, YouTube or the podcast.

[Dr. John Deloney]

There you go. I like that.

[Caller]

Let's go to the Utes or Rebecca Salt Lake City Utes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's funny. Yes. What's up, Rebecca?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. So I, my husband passed away and left me a four million dollar investment account that I have no idea how to run. Be honest. He took care of all the finances and yeah, I'm just, it's a steep learning curve. I'm learning, doing a lot of reading. But the problem I'm coming up on is that people have sort of come out of the woodwork asking Me for money and help. And I've always had a hard time saying no to people. And. And, you know, so I'm. I'm just having a really hard time navigating, like, all the learning curve of learning how dividends work and investments work on top of, you know, people coming to me and saying, hey, I need four grand here, I need ten grand there.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Who are these people?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I grew up really poor. I have 10 siblings, so it's family. My mom, a couple friends. But I guess my husband was always a buffer because it was his money. It was never my money.

[Caller]

Hey, do me a favor. When did he pass away?

[Jade Warshaw]

In May.

[Caller]

May.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wow. That's.

[Caller]

What was his name?

[Jade Warshaw]

His name was Osper.

[Caller]

Pretty awesome guy.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

You miss him?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah. I'm so sorry.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. He's my best friend.

[Caller]

Yeah. Here's. Here's. Jay's going to walk you through the money part of this. Here's the. Here's my rule of thumb. No matter what. Okay. The first thing I want you to do in some of these as you get these, we're not doing anything with this money for six months. Okay? Okay. Unless they mail you a check and they liquidate stuff, we're leaving them stuff where it is. There's no pressure here. Okay?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

The second thing is, if anybody calls you within a month and a half of your husband's passing asking for money, they are declaring themsel unfit for any sort of support. That callousness and lack of care and compassion for you and your grief is.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Is.

[Caller]

Is. It's hard for me even to wrap my head around, and I spend my time working with people who don't know how to handle grief. Well, that's. That blows my mind. Okay. Down the road, I want you to always keep in mind this idea. When you spend money, when you give money, I want you to sometimes close your eyes and imagine Oscar sitting right next to you. And is he nodding his head with a smile or is he shaking his head no with that old Oscar smile, smirk on? Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

How are we going to be the best steward of the resources he left you to live on the rest of your life?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Okay. But we're not going to do anything right now. Jay, tell her about the smartvestor. Sit with somebody. You don't need to be. You don't need to be researching dividends on your own right now in the middle of all this grief.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No, what. What. What you do need to be thinking about is kind of amassing a team of helpful humans that can help you walk through this. If I were you, I'd. Yeah, I'd want a tax professional. I would want a smart vestor. I would want just an attorney just to be on my side, just somebody I know I can call if something pops up.

[Caller]

You're hiring buffers is what you're doing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And they're the people who are helping you think through these things from all sides. Sides. The good news is you can find all that on Ramsey Solutions dot com. We can help you with the tax professional, we can help you with the, the smartvestor. And you know, we can even kind of put you on the right trail maybe to help you find a lawyer in your area. But it doesn't change what John said. Nothing's happening in the next six months to a year. That money is just going to sit there. My guess is, are you drawing some sort of an income from it already?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah, I am. So my husband was retired and so we lived off. It was, it's a bigger estate than what I inherited. He, he, he split it 50, 50. It was about $20 million estate. Okay, so I own a home that's paid for. I own two cars that are paid for. I have no debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Got it.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then a $4 million, $4 million investment account that I live off the dividend ends. But I've had people tell me like they're, they've said you should just get a job. Like that's what you need to do now is just get a job.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, let's talk about five years.

[Jade Warshaw]

I've got a five year old daughter and so I'm like, you know, I was a stay at home mom. So like my life's just been flipped upside down and people are, I mean, I had one person say, well, a good nanny solves everything. And I'm like, but I gave up my, I gave up my career. I gave up my career to raise my daughter. So I don't feel like it's irresponsible.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You get to live your life. You get to live your life the way you want to live your life. And there's a lot of haters out there that wish they could make the choices that you're going to have the freedom to make. And a lot of times people say things out of their own, their own uncomfortableness, their own what they wish they had, whatever. I can't comment too much on that, but I can comment, comment on. You have the freedom to do what you want to do. And in this season, if you want to stay home and take care of your five year old, you have the freedom to do that. And if you decide that that's, you're going to do that till she's 18, you can do that. And then if you decide, hey, there's some things I want to go out and pursue, you can do those things as well. So I think what I'm hearing the most, John, is a lot of these outside voices trying to kind of creep in and tell you what you need to be doing and how you need to be living your life. Life.

[Caller]

And here's your stock answer. Yeah, I'm not doing anything till after the new year. I'm making no decisions.

[Jade Warshaw]

Financially irresponsible.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No.

[Caller]

God no. For What? You have $4 million in a paid.

[Dr. John Deloney]

For house and it, that stuff is on, it's, it's on. Set it and forget it because you're drawing the dividends on it. You likely don't need to move anything.

[Caller]

And when you sit with a smartvestor pro, they're going to say, hey, everything's going to be fine right now. Let's exhale, let's get through the grief. And you like most people are realizing how much, how much paperwork there is, how much filing, right. There's a whole like a job to do after somebody you love passes away, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Not to mention you're clearly having to grieve alone because the vultures started circling like two days after the funeral was over. You don't need any of those people in your life. And I'm telling you this as someone like, listen, you're going to have guilt because you didn't grow up with very much. Right. And you're going to have brothers and sisters calling you like, well you, you need to, all that nonsense. They don't get a vote. I want you to repeat that line in your head. They don't get a vote. And if somebody presses you, you need to be, listen, I'm not doing anything until 2026 right now. I'm going to get through this false this summer. I'm going to get through this fall semester. I'm going to grieve. I'm probably going to see a counselor. I'm going to meet with some professionals to, to deal with this estate. I'm not getting a job. I don't need to get a job cuz my husband set us up. Amazing. I gave up my career. So man, we're so grateful that you're with us. We'll be with you every step of the way. You, you hang in there, okay?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Scripture and quote of the day Matthew 6:34. One of my favorite favorites. Don't worry about tomorrow, because tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own. On first glance, that kind of sounds kind of sad, but it actually is very helpful to just take it one.

[Caller]

Day at a time, because that's the only thing you can control.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, for sure. Well, Jordan Peterson said, if you fulfill your obligations every day, you don't need to worry about the future. All right, I'll take it. Listen, I don't just take it as it must be wise because someone said it. I like to think about it and marinate on it a minute and see if it really is wise. Okay. Connor's in Houston, Texas. What's up, H town?

[Caller]

What's up, Connor?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey.

[Caller]

Not much. How are you guys doing? All right.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I think I may be one of the few where we're thinking about.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Taking some of the credit card debt.

[Caller]

That we've built up over a couple years and consolidating that under a heloc.

[Jade Warshaw]

Which I understand is a popular topic.

[Caller]

You're one of the few who. What? It may be a good idea for.

[Jade Warshaw]

Me, particularly just with the context, but obviously I'm here for Yalls opinion on it.

[Caller]

I would love to hear why you are the. The unicorn you are. You are an Astros fan, which of course makes you a unicorn, but I want to know what makes you a unicorn in this mathematical situation.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. So just a little bit of context. I'll be quick. You know, 30 years old, married, no.

[Caller]

No car. We've owned our home for about five years.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm a commercial real estate broker, kind.

[Caller]

Of in my third or fourth year. Starting to make pretty decent money.

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, it's a tough kind of sled up for those first couple years, and we racked up about $32,000 in credit card debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Holy smokes.

[Caller]

Some of that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Some of that was kind of an emergency stuff on the pet side and just kind of.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Kind of.

[Caller]

Oh, yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's a long story.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The pet side.

[Caller]

What is the pet side? Fido needed Fido.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Fido needed a root canal.

[Caller]

Fido. Fido almost died, bro. How much did you spend? I just got to know.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, boy.

[Jade Warshaw]

All in all, it was about 12 grand.

[Caller]

It's about $12,000 dollars. And it was kind of in for.

[Jade Warshaw]

A penny, in for a pound, but.

[Caller]

Yeah. What is that? What is that? What is that? How poetic. What does that mean? Well, you know, we.

[Jade Warshaw]

He had trouble breathing, and we kind of checked him in to the emergency room, which was unbelievably expensive, you know, on oxygen. So the first night was five grand. They did a test to figure out what was wrong with him and pretty much found the cure of what we need to do in terms of antibiotics. And so, you know, you're in.

[Caller]

You're in $7,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Just like that, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

And it's like, okay, I know the cure. I'm not gonna let him die.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How old is Fido?

[Jade Warshaw]

He's nine.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Nine what? Just. I'm curious. Now we're curious. What kind of breed is he? What is he?

[Caller]

Mutt. You know, a lab kind of mutt.

[Jade Warshaw]

Big, muscular dude.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so. So here's what we've derived. You guys kind of have this thought that if something pops up, we can put it on the credit card. And that's gotten you $32,000 of debt. And now the thought is, hey, this feels like a lot to deal with it. Let's just sweep it under the rug. And by under the rug, we mean roll it into a heloc. Roll it into the mortgage to some extent. I mean, I think it.

[Jade Warshaw]

We just, you know, we think it's.

[Caller]

A more efficient use of the capital. Here's the point.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You.

[Caller]

You're like a chat GPT in these words. It's a pound of flesh for a penny of a pony with a frog on a horse and a box of farts to do. What are you talking about? What do you mean, a use of capital? Well, let me. Let me explain it. So I just. Doing rough math, you know, the interest.

[Jade Warshaw]

Rates on these credit cards is like 25%, right?

[Caller]

Our minimum monthly payment across three cards is roughly $800.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I get it again, Connor, I get it. You're. Now, now you're talking math, but if you cared about math, you wouldn't have put 12,000 on a credit card. If you cared about math, you wouldn't have accumulated 32,000 on credit cards with high interest rates. You see what I'm saying? So now that it serves your purpose of moving the debt, not paying it off, but moving it. Now we're starting to do math. Do you see what I'm saying?

[Caller]

So I. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So I want to just that I'm just making the call out. What I really would say, as your. As your buddy and as your two best friends that you called in to talk to on the radio, the best solution here. The debt is the problem. Let's just pay it off. You said, you know, you're. You're moving on up in the real estate game and you're starting to make some. Some good money. What's your. What's your income? You and your wife combined.

[Jade Warshaw]

This year, it'll be 230,000.

[Caller]

Why are we talking pay this off off?

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's done. It's done in six months.

[Caller]

No, it's done in three months.

[Jade Warshaw]

Which is the plan. I think the caveat here is we.

[Caller]

Want to maintain some liquidity just from.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No, you don't. No, you don't. You want to keep your lifestyle as it is.

[Caller]

That's it. You want to keep going out. You want to keep going Stro's games all summer, and you don't want to pay the piper.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You gotta pay the is, man.

[Caller]

Bro, it's. You're talking three months. Yeah. I promise you. I promise you. You're gonna put this on a HELOC, and your air conditioner is going to go out in the end of August, and y' all are going to be right back where you started. And now that you have an off ramp, you're going to be like, hey, dude, we can just exit here. And you're going to take that off ramp again. I promise you, if y' all suck it up and blow a summer pay paying off these last bills, you will get in that muscle memory, which is we will never borrow money ever again. Which means, actually you're going to spend, like Jay said, six months. Because you can put three months worth of retained earnings, or in your words, capital, in an account so you can serve as your own bank so you never pay interest again.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Do you guys have any money saved making that income?

[Caller]

Yeah, I just hit my goal of, like, six months of cash, so about $40,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then we have a good nest egg in the stock market.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, Today, Connor, debt free today. Pay it off.

[Caller]

Okay, I got. I got it. We have. We have our math whiz here on the phone, though. So how much are you making on this? 40 grand.

[Jade Warshaw]

The 40 grand is in the. In the bank account right now.

[Caller]

How much are you making?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Is it in a high yield?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, it's just in a checking account.

[Caller]

Okay, so if we're doing math, you're borrowing that money at 30% or 27% against those credit cards.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And even if. Even if you pay it off and roll it into your mortgage, what's your mortgage at right now?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Exactly.

[Jade Warshaw]

About $1,200 a month.

[Caller]

I mean, it's really low. No, what's your. What's your APR.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Your interest rate, bud?

[Jade Warshaw]

Just about 3%.

[Caller]

Okay, so you're borrowing money in the cat in the bank at 3% percent.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

That's bad math. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You have the money, you got it.

[Caller]

Off, and you're gonna have 10 grand left over cash. You'll have that back in two months.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And now you're not paying a credit card payment, so how quickly could you stack back up that savings?

[Caller]

Two months?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, just like that.

[Caller]

Relatively quickly.

[Jade Warshaw]

But, you know, we get.

[Caller]

I get paid every two months, every month.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Why do you not want to be debt free? Yeah, why do you?

[Caller]

Yeah, I think we're asking the wrong questions, Jade. Why do you love a HELOC so much? Why do you think, you know what, I'm going to put my house on the block a second time? I think I just.

[Jade Warshaw]

When I.

[Caller]

The plan was to have it paid.

[Jade Warshaw]

Off by next year this time, you know, June of next year.

[Caller]

And like, you have the money, but.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Why would you, why would you meander through this debt at such a slow pace when you can do it literally immediately, immediately. And you could go on your phone right now and pay it and pay it. In the time that we're on this.

[Caller]

Call, you still have $10,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

I think it's just PTSD of two.

[Caller]

Years of making no money and getting to my goal of having that cash. It's a blanket.

[Jade Warshaw]

Just pay it off.

[Caller]

It's a warm blank. It's a warm blanket. We get that. Totally get it. You know what I like, we tell people when you're getting out of debt to go down to a thousand and twenty,000. Every time I tell somebody that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Painful.

[Caller]

That's painful. Like it gets my heart rate up because I remember those days and it makes you work like a maniac to get it paid off and to never borrow again.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And it's. Then the math is going to check out for you, Connor, because right now you think you have 40,000, but you only have 8,000 and you're loaning the.

[Caller]

Rest of it out at for. And you're paying 30% on it or 27% on it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So you're not living in reality right now. You think you have 40,000 minus the debt. You really only have 8,000 to your name. That's yours anyway. So you might as well suck up the truth of that and pay the debt off. Pay it off and then stack up your money and actually have $40,000 of debt.

[Caller]

That's pay it off, pay it off.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Pay it off, pay it off, pay.

[Caller]

It off, pay it off. You'll like Fido a lot more if you're not paying that off. For a year.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's a good word, John.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, you guys. I was shocked to learn that 88% of you out there are sharing the Ramsey show. I mean, that is so incredible. Thank you so much. And I want to tell you that we're making it even easier to share. So this June, we have pulled together the brand new Ramsey101 YouTube playlist. A quick start collection of how to get started walking the Ramsey plan. Now, this playlist is perfect for that one person in your life who needs help winning with money and just doesn't know where to start. So here's what's inside. What the baby steps are and why they actually work. How the debt snowball helps you pay off debt fast. And how to build wealth and invest for the future and so much more. So here's what you need to do. Click the link at the top of the show notes. It'll take you straight to the YouTube page playlist. Copy it, text it, send it in a group chat. Just say, hey, I thought this might help. Because one playlist shared at the right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Time could be the turning point.

[Jade Warshaw]

One share, one playlist, one step could change everything for that one person in your life. So click the link, share the Ramsey show, and let's help someone out there start winning with money.