Debt Freedom Isn’t Fast—It’s Focused

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show – "Debt Freedom Isn’t Fast—It’s Focused"

Episode Overview Released on June 4, 2025, The Ramsey Show hosted by the Ramsey Network delves into real-life financial struggles and solutions. In this episode titled "Debt Freedom Isn’t Fast—It’s Focused," host Jade Warshaw and Dr. John Deloney engage with callers facing various financial and personal challenges, providing actionable advice grounded in Dave Ramsey’s proven financial principles.

---

1. Lee's Crisis and Financial Recovery

Caller: Lee from Nashville, Tennessee
Timestamp: [00:38] – [05:00]

Lee's Situation:
Lee recently moved back to her hometown after her husband of 20 years accepted a plea deal resulting in a 10-year prison sentence for a sex crime. With four children—one in college and three at home (ages 15, 11, and 9)—Lee faces significant financial strain. Despite having $50,000 left from the sale of their home and $260,000 in her 401(k), she grapples with $7,000 in credit card debt and substantial legal expenses amounting to $150,000.

Notable Quotes:

• Lee Warshaw: "I've had a year to process it, but there was so much to process that I'll probably be processing for a decade, you know." [01:26]
• Dr. John Deloney: "The water bill doesn't care. [...] you're going to have to go get it done." [05:27]

Advice Provided: Dr. Deloney and the caller emphasized the importance of focusing on immediate financial survival. They advised Lee to:

• Apply for teaching positions promptly, leveraging her background in education.
• Utilize resources like Ramsey’s budgeting tools and career assessments.
• Maintain discipline in budgeting to cover essential expenses while seeking additional income sources.

---

2. Jerry’s Dilemma in Billings

Caller: Jerry from Billings, Montana
Timestamp: [10:44] – [16:19]

Jerry's Situation:
Jerry has amassed a portfolio worth approximately $3.6 million through real estate and metals investments over 43 years. With his daughter showing little interest in managing these assets and moving 1,200 miles away, Jerry is uncertain how to pass on his wealth without losing control or witnessing mismanagement.

Notable Quotes:

• Jerry Warshaw: "I want to pass on, [...] I couldn't have built this without my wife's support." [11:24]
• Dr. John Deloney: "If she's being a good steward of it, I think that's a green check mark." [14:59]

Advice Provided: The discussion focused on:

• Trusting his daughter to manage the assets responsibly, even if her approach differs.
• Considering stipulations or conditions in his will to ensure certain assets are preserved.
• Exploring options like setting up a trust or gradual transfer of assets to allow her to adapt to managing them effectively.

---

3. Kim’s Financial Planning and Retirement

Caller: Kim from Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Timestamp: [23:06] – [32:43]

Kim's Situation:
At 56 years old, Kim plans to sell her house and invest the $450,000 proceeds to secure her retirement. She has limited retirement savings: $20,000 in a current 401(k), $4,000 in a Roth IRA, and $20,000 in savings. She faces the challenge of maximizing her new investment while preparing for retirement without significant prior savings.

Notable Quotes:

• Kim: "I have about $5,000 in credit card debt, but I have enough in the bank to cover that." [03:37]
• Dr. John Deloney: "Contribute 15% of your gross every single month." [27:22]

Advice Provided: Key recommendations included:

• Avoid withdrawing from retirement accounts to pay off debts due to tax implications and penalties.
• Focus on increasing retirement contributions to 15% of her gross income.
• Utilize employer contributions effectively and invest wisely to grow her retirement funds.
• Leverage tools like Ramsey’s investment calculator to project future savings and retirement readiness.

---

4. Logan’s Balancing Act Between Wealth and Loneliness

Caller: Logan from Iowa City, Iowa
Timestamp: [33:23] – [40:04]

Logan's Situation:
Logan manages and runs a solar sales team, earning $220,000 annually. Despite financial success, he feels isolated living far from family and friends in Utah. His primary goal is companionship, leading him to question whether the high income and demanding job are worth the personal sacrifices.

Notable Quotes:

• Logan: "I'm just trying to understand if it's worth living far away from home." [33:54]
• Caller: "One share, one step, and this could change one person's life forever." [23:06] (Note: This appears to be part of an advertisement and is omitted in detailed call summaries)

Advice Provided: The hosts suggested:

• Setting a clear timeline for remaining in Iowa, focusing on saving a substantial amount before considering a move.
• Utilizing technology to maintain connections with family while working towards personal and financial goals.
• Redefining success by balancing financial ambitions with personal happiness and relationships.

---

5. Funeral Prepayment Concerns from Robin (Facebook)

Caller: Robin from Facebook
Timestamp: [40:22] – [43:15]

Robin's Situation:
Robin questions the wisdom of prepaying for cemetery plots, feeling conflicted between planning for the future and adhering to Ramsey’s advice against prepayment.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney: "Don't prepay it." [40:57]
• Robin: "Because it's a gift. [...] I'm of the opinion put some money aside and when the day comes, then the day comes." [41:23]

Advice Provided: The hosts recommended:

• Avoiding prepayment for funerals and cemetery plots.
• Instead, allocating funds to a will or other arrangements to ensure clarity and flexibility.
• Emphasizing trust in God’s provision while organizing one’s affairs without locking money into prepayments.

---

6. Beth’s Inheritance Conflict

Caller: Beth from Georgia
Timestamp: [70:50] – [75:15]

Beth's Situation:
Beth is set to receive a $100,000 inheritance from her parents. Her husband believes the money is jointly owned and wants to invest it in stocks, while Beth feels the money should be considered her personal asset.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney: "If Sam Warshaw [...] It's mine, not yours. Can we talk about it together?" [71:30]
• Beth: "It's not his, it's mine." [70:50]
• Caller: "It's your money." [74:20]

Advice Provided: The advice focused on:

• Encouraging open communication between spouses to reach a mutual understanding.
• Reiterating the importance of working as a team in financial decisions.
• Advising against unilateral decisions that can lead to marital conflict, especially regarding significant financial gifts or inheritances.

---

7. Brian’s Investment in Rental Properties

Caller: Brian from Louisville, Kentucky
Timestamp: [77:11] – [85:39]

Brian's Situation:
Brian, a debt-free homeowner in Wisconsin, seeks advice on expanding his investment into rental properties. With $200,000 available and an inheritance of $150,000, he's torn between leveraging debt to purchase multiple properties versus using cash to secure fewer investments.

Notable Quotes:

• Brian: "And we're trying to get qualified for a home and the credit report came back and she has been late on payment." [87:35]
• Dr. John Deloney: "Don't get into debt to have to cover that stuff." [93:23]

Advice Provided: Recommendations included:

• Starting small by purchasing one property with cash to minimize risk and complexity.
• Avoiding excessive leverage to protect against potential market downturns.
• Emphasizing the importance of financial discipline and gradual growth in real estate investments.

---

8. Ashton’s Parental Debt Crisis

Caller: Ashton from Charlotte, North Carolina
Timestamp: [87:03] – [126:25]

Ashton’s Situation:
Ashton is 37 with a daughter, recently moved back with parents while renting out his house. He faces $4,500 in credit card debt, $3,000 in personal loans, and $7,000 on a car loan, alongside significant student loans totaling $60,000. He seeks guidance on whether to withdraw funds from his 401(k) and Roth IRA to pay off debts and invest in rental properties.

Notable Quotes:

• Ashton Warshaw: "Should I withdraw the funds from that 401k and that IRA [...]" [87:35]
• Dr. John Deloney: "Do not touch that 401k. Do not touch that Roth IRA." [89:56]

Advice Provided: Key points included:

• Do Not withdraw from retirement accounts due to penalties and tax implications.
• Focus on paying off high-interest debt first to free up future income for savings and investments.
• Develop a clear plan using tools like budgeting apps and financial Peace University to regain financial stability.
• Recommending selling the house if it can help eliminate debt and provide a financial cushion.

---

9. Thomas’s Grief and Financial Planning

Caller: Thomas from Miami, Florida
Timestamp: [96:33] – [127:49]

Thomas’s Situation:
Thomas and his wife are navigating grief after Thomas’s wife experienced a miscarriage. They are on Baby Step Two, actively paying off debt while managing finances. They wish to use their experience to help others by sharing their story and offering support.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney: "How can we help?" [87:48]
• Thomas: "We want to be able to use this as an opportunity to help other people." [97:05]
• Dr. John Deloney: "You're going to love the Ramsey101 YouTube playlist." [127:12]

Advice Provided: The hosts advised:

• Taking time to heal individually and as a couple before extending support to others.
• Engaging in community support groups or grief counseling to build empathy and understanding.
• Leveraging their shared experience to create meaningful support systems within their community.
• Emphasizing the importance of mutual support and open communication during the grieving process.

---

10. Miles’s Housing and Credit Issues

Caller: Miles from Hartford, Connecticut
Timestamp: [117:39] – [125:03]

Miles’s Situation:
Miles faces financial turmoil as his parents have accumulated $400,000 in Parent Plus Loans, leading them to risk losing their house. His father is decades older, and his mother recently passed away. The loans are tied to his sister’s education, who shows financial irresponsibility.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney: "They can't discharge those Parent Plus Loans with bankruptcy, can they?" [118:15]
• Caller: "They are going to have to sell the house." [121:54]
• Dr. John Deloney: "It's your money. You're not being nearly controlling enough." [125:22]

Advice Provided: Recommendations included:

• Selling the house to cover outstanding debts and prevent further financial loss.
• Clearing the debt to protect his parents' remaining assets and alleviate financial stress.
• Communication with his sister about her financial responsibilities and setting boundaries.
• Avoiding bankruptcy as it does not discharge Parent Plus Loans, urging alternative debt relief strategies.

---

Key Insights and Conclusions

• Focus Over Speed: Achieving debt freedom is not about quick fixes but maintaining focused and disciplined financial strategies.

• Communication is Crucial: Open and honest dialogue between family members and spouses about financial responsibilities and expectations is essential to prevent conflicts and ensure mutual understanding.

• Avoid Using Retirement Savings for Debt: Withdrawing from retirement accounts can jeopardize future financial security; instead, prioritize paying off high-interest debts using other resources.

• Start Small with Investments: When expanding investments, especially in real estate, beginning with smaller, manageable steps can mitigate risks and build confidence.

• Support Systems are Vital: Leveraging community support, whether through faith-based groups or financial counseling, can provide the necessary emotional and practical assistance during challenging times.

• Responsible Inheritance Management: Handling inheritances with clear intentions—splitting between saving, spending, and giving—ensures the fortune benefits all parties without causing familial discord.

Notable Inspirational Quote:

• Scripture & Wisdom: "Look at the birds of the air. They don't sow or reap or store away in barns. Yet your heavenly father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?" – Matthew 6:26
• Jordan Peterson: "Pursue what's meaningful, not what is expedient."

These insights underscore the overarching theme of the episode: Debt freedom is achievable through focused, disciplined actions and supported by strong communication and community ties.

---

Conclusion This episode of The Ramsey Show offers a comprehensive exploration of personal and financial crises, emphasizing the importance of disciplined financial planning, effective communication, and the utilization of support systems. Through real-life stories and expert advice, Jade Warshaw and Dr. John Deloney illustrate that while debt freedom may not be swift, it is attainable with focus and perseverance.

Transcript

[Jade Warshaw]

Foreign to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Welcome to the Ramsey show, where we talk about your life and your money. It's a call where you are the star and we take your live calls. You can call in at 888-255-2225. That's the number to get involved. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to you is Dr. John Deloitte Deloney. Wow. What's me next to you? I'm next to you. You got the doctor on your name. I'm sitting next to you.

[Caller]

That's right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All right, let's get it started. We got Lee in Nashville, Tennessee. What's going on, Lee?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey there. Oh, what's not going on? Yeah, yeah, I'm. We're in a bit of a crisis. I'm gonna try to keep it all together. We're not really in a crisis. We're actually in recovery. Trauma crisis. So we recently moved back near my hometown because my husband of 20 years was. Well, he took a plea deal, but he was essentially convicted of a. A crime that will put him in prison for at least 10 years. There. Wow. Oh, man.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Holy smokes. How are you feeling? I mean, I'm better than I was.

[Jade Warshaw]

I've had a year to process it, but there was so much to process that I'll probably be processing for a decade, you know.

[Caller]

Do you have little. Do you have little ones?

[Jade Warshaw]

So we have four kids. The oldest is a junior in college. And then I have the younger three still at home with me. My youngest of those three. It's 15, 11, and 9.

[Caller]

So a plea deal on 10 years. That means he was in to some not good stuff, huh?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. It was a sex crime.

[Caller]

Yeah. Okay. God, dude, I'm so sorry.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, thank you. You know, spiritually, we're doing very well. We have. We have a great church here, good support system. You know, he had lived for himself for about 20 years and for the last year, I mean, something like this will really break you when you realize it hits you between the eyes what you've been doing to yourself and your family. And he's been living for Christ for a year. So seriously, we have that solace, but it doesn't really. Now I'm here, I'm boots on the ground trying to figure this all out. And I've been a stay at home mom for 15 years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Are you still.

[Jade Warshaw]

And he was. No, we're divorcing. Let's put it this way. It's. It's amicable in the sense that it's with a lot of peace. Like we had a year to, to kind of work through the peace and forgiveness and watching him walk, if that makes sense.

[Caller]

Sure, yeah. But there's the spiritual connection, there's the resolution of the court deal. But that light bill keeps coming and that water bill keeps coming. Right. And that rent keeps coming.

[Jade Warshaw]

Correct. And as you know, we, I mean, he was an excellent provider. He had a very high paying job, actually, and some side jobs. And we, you know, we were kind of, we're 40 and we were kind of at the crest of about to push that snowball all the way down and really start building some serious wealth and had a kind of a plan to pay our house off in the next three to two to three years. At that point, you know, it's just a lot. And. But by the time we had hit January 1st, you know, he, we had spent like $150,000 on criminal defense and bond and civil attorneys, divorce attorneys. There's an attorney for everything.

[Caller]

And so how bad is it? How bad is it right now? Who do you owe?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's not, it's not bad. Right now I have about 7,000 in credit card debt, but I have enough in the bank to cover that. I have about $50,000 left from the sale of our home. And because of the circumstances and how much we had to spe didn't benefit community property in the divorce. I'm getting his 50% as well. So I'm leaving with everything we had left.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And how, what does that amount to? Can you tell us a little of that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, it's 260,000 in our 401k.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

75 in a pension through a former employer.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

10,000 through another employer in like a. Basically 401k through the military.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Because that's the other thing. We were two years from military retirement.

[Caller]

Yeah. Hey, Lee, can I, can I encourage you to do one thing that's going to be really, really hard?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

It's going to be the probably the toughest thing, existentially or spiritually that you're going to have to do for the next six months to a year to maybe two years and beyond. Okay. In this short phone call, you've mentioned all of the things that were about to happen or that were going to.

[Jade Warshaw]

Happen, and they're not gonna happen.

[Caller]

And they're not gonna happen. And every second you spend thinking about what almost happened or what could have happened is energy taken away from a mama that now has to provide for three kids all by herself.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. That's pretty much all day long. I mean, the grief is crushing.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. It's overwhelming. And it will be that way. And here's the crummiest, hardest, harshest thing I'm gonna say probably today on this show, the water bill doesn't care. Right. And so this is going to be one of those things. You're going to wake up in two and a half years and wonder how you did it and you're just going to have to go get it done. Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. And yes. And that's been the hard part right now is so when I moved, I lived with parents for a while. They really did not have room for us and they are not in a good school system. My kids have always been in private school or homeschooled. So knowing I needed to utilize the public school system moving forward, I moved to an area that has a really good public school system. And my parents helped me. So I'm renting a house that has plenty of room and it's a great location. It's wonderful for me and the kids. It's right.

[Caller]

Can you afford it?

[Jade Warshaw]

And my. I can't afford it on my own, but my parents are willing to pay half the rent pretty much indefinitely.

[Caller]

Is that okay with you? Does that come with strings?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, it's. No, it does not come with strings. I will say I have. It would with my in laws, but it doesn't with my parents. They will do anything they can to help us. And I'm willing. I would love to eventually be completely.

[Caller]

I know, I know, I know. You are, you are willing. You're out at sea and it's. You got to grab that life raft. And I'm so. What a, what a blessing that they're willing to step up.

[Jade Warshaw]

We won't, we won't starve. You know, they're. They're nearby. Sure. I mean, I don't worry about us in the sense that I know it's all gonna work and end up on the streets or something, but I'm paralyzed in terms of what to do next. Pay off all the debt and lose the cash. I obviously have been kind of looking around at jobs, but I'm a little bit paralyzed with that. I'm thinking about maybe the school system because most of my experiences with teaching and that's great.

[Caller]

Listen, schedule, apply today. The dreams you had about the home school and the private school. There's a, there's a period to end that sentence. It's over, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

It is, it's over.

[Caller]

The dream of the, like the Goat farm and the five acres and the chickens, that's over, right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yep.

[Caller]

For now. For now. What we're going to do right now is we're going to survive. So by the end of today, you're calling the show on a Tuesday. By the end of Wednesday, I want you to have applied to every open teaching position in your local district. And if you're, if your district's like every other district in, in America, they're desperate for teachers. Is it going to be ideal? Nope. Is it going to be the best situation for you in the dreams you had? Nope. Are you going to be an amazing teacher with empathy and compassion for those kids? Absolutely. Is it going to take care of you and give you and your family insurance? Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Because we, we haven't lost our insurance yet, but the divorce will go through in the next couple months and I'll lose my insurance immediately, and then the kids will lose their insurance whenever the.

[Caller]

So, so get on it today. Like the only way to get through the paralysis is to take a step.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Is that. You get what I'm saying?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, I do. I. I feel a little bit. I mean, I haven't made a resume and it's got all these gaps. I don't even know where to start on that. How do I explain all of that?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, we'll give you. We're going to give you a bunch of gifts before we get off the line with you. We're going to give you paycheck to purpose. That's Ken's book. We're going to give you Proximity Principle. That's Ken's book. We're going to give you, find the work you're wired to do with the assessment inside. All that's going to walk you through the career side of this.

[Caller]

There's a resume guide on online, so go to ramseysolutions.com and put in the search thing, the resume builder, and it will walk you through a template on how to do that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And hey, call us back. Call us back. If you need us, we're here. It's the same number. We'll be here to help you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're going to die or something.

[Caller]

Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids. And I immediately went and got term life insurance.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's a gut punch.

[Caller]

And. Oh, you're telling me. And for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse, they've lost somebody important to them.

[Jade Warshaw]

Me, too.

[Caller]

They don't know what to do next.

[Jade Warshaw]

Me too. I mean, you're gonna have a crisis here, and, you know, you got two options. While you're sitting and talking to a young widow, she's concerned about how she's gonna invest all this money properly and not mess this up, or she's concerned how she's gonna eat tomorrow.

[Caller]

That's exactly.

[Jade Warshaw]

These are the two options. Take care of your dadgum family.

[Caller]

Term life insurance can replace income, pay off debts, cover funeral expenses. So your family can actually have the opportunity to just be sad.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

To just miss you.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's exactly what it's supposed to be. It's saying I love you to your family. Term life insurance, Jeff Zander and the team at Zander Insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years. They're the only people I trust. Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Back to the phone lines. We go where Jerry is in Billings, Montana. Hey, Jerry, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

I need some help passing on my man, my portfolio.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Passing it on. Okay, tell us more.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, passing it on. Passing on to my. Well, we have one child.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I've been married for 42 years and I've been working in mining for 43 years and made a lot of mistakes whenever I was young and got myself really, really upside down in. Upside down in debt. And I put all my money into metals and real estate.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, how'd the real estate do?

[Jade Warshaw]

Really good. Good in Montana is really good. Hey, yeah, out of that, my, my child is moving away. She's moving out of state. And she interest in what I've built or what my wife and I built because I couldn't have built this without my wife.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Talking about the real estate stuff.

[Jade Warshaw]

Everything, everything. The metals and on and on. I couldn't have built this without my wife's support.

[Dr. John Deloney]

When you say she has no interest, what does that mean? Does it mean that she doesn't want to manage properties and manage a metals portfolio?

[Jade Warshaw]

She. No, no, she doesn't. And she is a millennial, and I' up on millennials, but she's dialed into, hey, if we're going to go off and we're going to grow corn or whatever, out in the Midwest. And my question. I've worked. I've worked for four decades to build this. And I went way, way, way down. And at one time, I was like 85,000 in unsecured debt. And I climbed out of that without.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I got you. Huh? So you. You feel a personal connection to this. Like, this is. This is not just money you built. Your whole story is, like, wrapped up into this.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I get it.

[Jade Warshaw]

I worked hard for this. And she's showing no. No real interest. And I.

[Dr. John Deloney]

But let's. Let's be fair.

[Jade Warshaw]

Not to be unfair, but her. Her husband comes from a different lineage.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, but, Jerry, it's not even about that. You're just two different people.

[Caller]

Yeah. It's not. It's not an IND of what you've done. You did a great job, man.

[Jade Warshaw]

Here's the question. What do I do with it? Because I'm not going to give it to somebody that doesn't appreciate it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think. Well, I think you let. Let's talk about it, because I. On the one hand, I hear what you're saying. I'm not saying I agree with it, but I 100% understand what you're saying. And on the other hand, I think there's a part of this where she's not. Jerry, she's who she is. And so she's going to have different interests. Her story is going to be different. The things that are. The ways that she wants to divest her energies are different from you. Now, I do agree with you that if you have the sense that she's not going to manage money in general. Well. Or if she's got some, you know, proclivity to go off the rails or something, that's something. That's a totally different conversation. But if you say, hey, I'm leaving you. You know, when I beam up to heaven, I'm leav leaving you my portfolio. And the thought is, you'll manage it and you will be a good steward of it. She might not keep it in precious metals. She might decide to roll it over into mutual funds and do it that way. But if she's being a good steward of it, I think that's a green check mark. Same thing with the properties. If you leave her the properties and if maybe there's some really important piece of land, I don't know that you're like, hey, no matter what, just don't sell this piece. I'd like this to be generational. Maybe you make that stipulation. But to assume that she wants to be a Real est mogul over, you know, this huge. I don't know how much it is. We didn't even talk about how much. That's a little bit unfair, John. Am I. Am I off?

[Caller]

Yeah. What are we missing, Jerry?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, we're missing this, okay? I've worked very, very hard and to build this, to pass on, and because I'm. I'm in my golden years. She's moving away. She's moving out of state about 1200 miles away. And. Okay, too bad. So sad. I'm out here. Hold on, hang on, Hang on just a second.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I've helped take care of my parents, and I helped take care of my wife's parents. And I didn't think it was really unreasonable to say, hey, look, you bet, dad. We can. We can. We can watch the dogs for the weekend while you guys go on your hot air balloon. That. That is not an option. I don't have a 401k.

[Caller]

Okay, how much. How much do you have in your total all portfolio? How much are you worth?

[Jade Warshaw]

Multiple seven figures.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Tell us.

[Caller]

10 million. 20 million?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, that could be a lot of things.

[Jade Warshaw]

About. About 3.6.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, 3.6 million. Okay. First off, I want to say good job, Corey, because the fact that you. You've told us a couple of different times I did this, and I think that no one's telling you. No one in your life is saying, hey, really? And so I want to tell you that's a really great job. It's not. It's not easy to fight back and acquire what you've acquired and amass what you've amassed. So really, really great job. I'm proud of you for that. Now.

[Caller]

Yeah. Here's the second thing. You know what? You raised exactly what you wanted to, which is a tough, smart, bullheaded daughter, just like her old man, with her own thoughts and her own. I'm gonna do it my way. And so it sounds like you're grieving the fact that she's not living by you anymore. Is that fair?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, no, no, no, that's not fair. What. What I'm grieving is the fact that she's not appreciating.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No.

[Jade Warshaw]

What I'm passing on.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Show us. Tell Jerry. Explain to us what she's done. That's unappreciative because we're missing that piece. Tell us. Give us a picture of what that looks like.

[Jade Warshaw]

The lack of. The lack of concern for the properties that she's been taking care of.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And. And I gave her a little bit of responsibilities. I've given her cars, I've given her real estate, I've given her all kinds.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Of stuff, and she's not taking care of it.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's all gone by the wayside.

[Caller]

Did she ask for any of this stuff?

[Jade Warshaw]

No.

[Caller]

Okay, so let me, Let me, Let me. It's a little bit of a different direction, but let me see if this is a way I can. I can put this on the table that we can both digest it. My dad was a policeman, okay? He was a homicide detective, and then he was a SWAT hostage negotiator. And then he quit all of that to be a minister. And then he became a policeman again years, years later, and then he became a college professor and he just retired. We always talked about, when I was a kid, about me going into law enforcement and I wanted to get into the FBI and I wanted to be a hostage. I wanted to do all that stuff. And instead I went into education. But what I took with me from my dad is that when there's hurting people, you show up. And I learned how to talk to people in hard situations. And, and, and so I didn't get into, quote unquote, the family business, but I took his lessons and his skills that he. I watched him teach me, and I put them on the table. I. For some reason, it sounds like you gave her all this stuff that she never asked for and you're holding her accountable for it. And now you're going to take half million dollars and instead of cashing out and making sure you have a safe, good retirement and leaving the rest to your only daughter, it's almost like you're punishing her for not loving the same things you love or not wanting the same things you wanted in your life.

[Jade Warshaw]

I want that. That's a huge thing. I want a secure future, and I want her to have the secure future.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And.

[Jade Warshaw]

I think, here's to me, that she is completely oblivious. Nobody, nobody, unless they can do this. Nobody has any idea what it's like to work in an underground mine. And that's what I've done for the last 43 years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

But she's not gonna work in an underground mine, and she doesn't need to. All she needs, all she needs to be is a good steward of what you give her. And she doesn't have to do it in the exact same ways. She doesn't have to keep it in gold and silver and precious metals. She doesn't even necessarily have to keep the real estate. If she's not a great. She might not just be A great. Everybody's not a great landlord, everybody's not a great real estate manager. But if she can transfer that wealth into the things that she's good at.

[Caller]

Into selling eggs or whatever, it's. It's all in the same family.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right.

[Caller]

Yeah, I. If she's a person who lacks character, that's one thing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's one thing.

[Caller]

I don't hear that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I don't either.

[Caller]

I hear a dad who's sad that she's not going into the family business. And, man, you got to make peace with that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, you guys, if you're looking to.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Save big on groceries without sacrificing quality, you've got to check out Aldi. That's right, Rachel, because let's be real, I'm bougie, but I'm also frugal, so. You are Bougie, George. Thank you for admitting it. So why pay more for the same stuff just because it has a fancy label? Aldi shoppers save up to 36% on a typical shopping trip over name brand products at other stores, which adds up to about $4,000 per year for a family of four. It's crazy. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And you know what?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Their organic produce, their fresh meats, and.

[Jade Warshaw]

Even their private label, it's all delicious. So it's good quality stuff that's not going to bust the budget.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And the best part, no membership fees, no gimmicks, no headaches. Just a simple shopping experience with the lowest prices of any national grocery store.

[Jade Warshaw]

So beautiful.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so stop paying more and start shopping at Aldi.

[Jade Warshaw]

Find a store near you today at Aldi Us. That's a l D. I dot us.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Listening to the Ramsey show. All right, so many out there, some of you. So many of you guys out there are doing a great job of sharing the show. You're taking it to the streets, letting everybody know how to win with money. And we thank you for that. We tell you all the time, hey, share the show. And you guys have been doing that, but starting now in June, we're going to make that even easier for you. Because what happens is, like, sometimes people go and they'll just see, like, Dave Ramsey in his element, and they're like, oh, man, this is. This is a lot right now. Or they'll see me or John kind of like, wilding out about a certain topic. So what if we could send them the perfectly curated playlist just to get them on the on ramp so that they're seeing the right things first so they're just, like, not hitting it in the middle of the movie. Right. So this playlist is filled with classic Ramsey clips. Like what the baby steps are, how to pay off debt with the debt snowball method, how to build an emergency fund, and all that good stuff. So it'll kind of like track them through in order, which is good. So if you're interested, interested in that, there's a way to share it. All you have to do is click the link at the top of the show notes to open the Ramsey101 playlist. Okay. So that's what you're looking for. Ramsey101 playlist. You could text it, DM it, send it out in the group chat, you know, with a little, hey, I thought you could use this. Just don't sound like condescending or anything like that. Or if you're listening on radio, you can also find that playlist featured at the top of our YouTube channel, which is great. So think about it. Right now, take a moment and think about one person that you're going to share this list with. John, who you sharing it with with?

[Caller]

I will. I'm gonna keep that a secret because it's a family member.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Caller]

They need, they need, they need. All in.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's on a need to know basis. Okay. So one share, one step, and this could change one person's life forever. So forever. All right. There you go. Let's go to Kim, who's in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. Hey, Kim. What's up?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. I just want to get some advice on what should do with the money that I'm going to receive from the sale of my house. So I had lost my husband 20 years ago, and I was a stay at home mom at the time, and we. His life insurance policy had expired about two weeks before he died and he died unexpectedly.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm sorry.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thank you. Anyway, I just feel like, you know, I spent 20 years, like raising the kids and really spent everything I was able to make. I went back, became a teacher. I originally have an accounting degree. I knew that I really couldn't spend that time working in that field just because it was. It was just so much of my time was spent at work. And so I went back and became a teacher. And so I've been a teacher since 2008. I love what I do. I'm a special education teacher. You know, I don't make the greatest amount of money, but I. The only thing I guess I did write was the fact that I'm not in debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Good.

[Jade Warshaw]

I. My car, it's old, but it's paid for.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Good.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I have about $450,000 that I should walk away with when I sell the house I'm in.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wow. What are these? Cause what's causing you to sell the house? Is it just a life change? You need the money? What's up with.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I don't have the. I've obviously not been able to have the, like a retirement plan at all in the last 20 years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So when you were teaching, you didn't.

[Caller]

Put any aside in the teacher retirement system.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Usually you're required.

[Jade Warshaw]

I would always have to take it out and use it. And so right now I'm just. I have like 20,000 in a, in like I work. I don't work in a public school. I work in a charter school.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I don't get that teacher retirement when I retire.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So you have 20,000. 20,000 in a 401k.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right. And then I have about 4,000 in a Roth IRA.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then I have about 20,000 in my savings account.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then other than that, I don't really have anything else.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How old are you?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm 56.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So you're thinking, I'll sell this house and what. Tell me your thoughts and I can kind of help you stay on track.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I'm thinking buying something cheaper and maybe investing the rest. Or do I rent and invest all of it?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I will not do it.

[Caller]

That.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. I like how your brain is thinking. So if I were you, what area are you in? Okay, you're in Oklahoma City area. I would. Yeah, if, if I could. The450,000. Yeah, I'm. If I could get something in cash outright for maybe 300, I might do that and invest the other 150. And then my question would be to you is how much longer do you plan on working? Because that 150 will continue to grow, you know, so will the 20,000 and the, the Roth IRA. But you've got to continue working and you've got to start doing baby step four, because you're in baby step four, but you've got to do it, which is contribute 15% of your gross every single month. That's going to be the key here for the next 15 years.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. And I was going to start like. So my work contributes 7% of my income. No matter what I do, they contribute 7%.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's what we're, that's what John and I were talking about earlier. So how much is that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How much is that?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's only like 350amonth.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right. But what's it grown to?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, no, that's the one. That's the 20,000. That's the one I was talking about.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I've only worked at this particular school for five years.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So keep doing that. And then only ratchet it up to 15%. So they're taking the seven, you do the rest. And honestly, if you can, you let that 7% kind of be gravy and you still do 15%. If you can.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Because you're going to have a better choice when you do your own Roth IRA and you do your own. You're going to have a better choice of how it's invested. So that's the reason I say that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, okay. Well, I mean, I'm happy with how it's grown in this particular. However they've invested it at this point, I think it's decent growth. I want to say, on average, it's been 13ish percent.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, that's great. Then you add another eight to it and keep the train rolling. You know, that's what I would do.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm just concerned that, you know, is it going to be enough? And because I'm starting so late, and so that's, that's where I'm a little bit. I get tired of making the decisions alone because there's really nobody to bounce that off of. And, you know, I just. I'm concerned that, you know, what. What happens if I can't work, you know, or, I mean, I'll work as long as I can because I have the ability to do that in the field that I'm in.

[Caller]

Let me say this. Can I. Can I just. Normally, if you and I were just, like, sitting down having nachos, me and you and Jade, we're just sitting down, having nachos, talking through this, I would wait longer and build a better rapport with you before I said what I'm about to say. But since we're condensed, can I just throw it out there?

[Jade Warshaw]

Sure.

[Caller]

Okay, exhale. So for the last 20 years, you've been doing this on your own. Right. And you had three young kids at the time when your husband passed away?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, they were 13 and 8 at this point.

[Caller]

Okay, so you did what you had to do to survive. And I'm going to say this with all the love of my heart, so hear me. Okay. Can you say out loud, we're on the same team.

[Jade Warshaw]

We're on the same team.

[Caller]

Okay. Math doesn't care. And so over the last 15 years, 20 years, you made choices about what kind of shoes they were going to wear, what schools they were going to go to, what camps they were going to go to, what meals y' all had, all that stuff as a single parent, and I'm not going to judge you on that because I wouldn't wish what you experienced on my worst enemy. But the reality is you're 56 and there's nobody else coming for you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

But there's hope here.

[Caller]

There's tons of hope here. But you're going to have to adjust your lifestyle as though you are caring for the 75 year old version of yourself right now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So good.

[Caller]

So that means you're going to have to opt out on meals, opt out on vacations, and if you want to go see grandkids when you, when your children start having babies, they may have to help you get there. But we got to take care of 75 year old you. How's it going to sell?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Let me tell you right now, if you work, you're 56. If you work till you're 69, we're right now we've said we'll take 150 and invest it, put it with the 20. So now you're at 170. If you can invest 700amonth. I think you said they're already taking out 350. If you can match that. Right. So you're doing about 15. If you can let that grow, that's going to be $842,000. Okay? So take that as a starting point. I want you to get on that RamseySolutions.com investment calculator and I want you to play with that number. Play with that lump sum amount because if you can start with a $200,000 lump sum, it'll change everything.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Okay, very good. Let's be honest. Shopping for health insurance can be confusing with high costs, complicated terms and customer service that doesn't really serve you most fol. Just pick a plan and hope for the best. See, insurance companies don't work for you. They work for themselves. Meaning they love it when you overpay. So you need a guide on your team to help you make the best choices. Health Trust Financial works for you. They're not salespeople. They help you find the health insurance option that makes sense and saves you money. The fact is, health insurance is one of the biggest expenses in your budget. But most people who work with Health Trust Financial end up saving $500 a month. Imagine putting that kind of money toward the baby steps. My team has worked with them for over 20 years, and they've served thousands of people just like you. They're the only health insurance broker that's Ramsey trusted to help you. So stop throwing money away and get the health insurance that's right for you at Health Trust Financial. That's HealthTrustFinancial.com.

[Dr. John Deloney]

If you are sick and tired of living paycheck to paycheck and wondering where the heck your money's going, your first, first step, numero uno, is getting on a budget. Good thing. Our team is hosting a free budgeting training this month. You'll learn step by step how to make a budget, how to stick to a budget. And every dollar is going to be on their live right. So they're there to answer all of your important questions about budgeting. So spots are limited. You can sign up for [e-mail] webinar. Sign up for free today to change your life. All right. Logan is in Iowa City, Iowa. Hello, Logan. How can we help you today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, how's it going, guys? Thank you for giving me a chance to get on the phone. I didn't really know I could do this until my dad, dad mentioned it. So I'm grateful. I am in a spot where I live far away from home and don't see family or friends often at all. And I make really good money at the job that I'm at, and so that's why I've done it. And I moved away. Home is in Utah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

But I'm currently in, currently in Iowa. What are you doing? The number one. What was that?

[Caller]

What's the job you're doing?

[Jade Warshaw]

I sell solar panels.

[Caller]

Okay. Excellent. Going from job to job with the crew. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

So door to door, I, I manage and run, help run the sales team here. So I have, I have employees that set appointments for me and I walk into warm leads and close, close deals for solar appointments.

[Caller]

Outstanding. So what's your question, brother?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Yeah. So I've been in this job for only a year full time, and I've just to give you all the facts. I don't mean to boast or anything, but just to give facts so I can get the best perspective on my situation, if that's all right.

[Caller]

Yeah. Real quick, your phone is making a real fuzzy sound there.

[Jade Warshaw]

Is that better?

[Caller]

Much better. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Sorry about that.

[Caller]

It's all good.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. So I, I've made 2, 200 grand this last year, which has been so far the most amount of money I've made in a, in a fiscal year. But I Am just far away from family and friends, which are high value for me to be around. And really the, the number one pursuit that I want to pursue in life right now is just companionship.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So you're trying to see is it worth it?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. So I'm just trying to understand if it's worth living far away from home.

[Caller]

If it pulls me away from family. And what's your end goal?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, the end goal in, in general or with work?

[Caller]

Well, like this, like in my 20s, while my friends were starting families and like doing more hanging out, I spent more time in library studying. But I had an end goal. And yeah, I mean the goal is.

[Jade Warshaw]

To build currently financial freedom so that I can be more free.

[Caller]

How much cash you have in the bank?

[Jade Warshaw]

I have about 60 grand saved.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And do you have any debt?

[Caller]

No. You made 200 grand living by yourself. Why do you only have 60 grand in the bank?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, just investing back into the business.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And so for me, I think the, the key here is a timeline. I think that's what's going to set you free because you don't have any debt, you're already stacking up cash, you're investing back into your business. That's cool. I think what'll give you kind of a light at the end of the tunnel is to say, okay, I'm going to do this for four years or I'm going to do this for three years. And once I hit, like make a clear goalpost and a clear end zone so you know, when you get there, spike the ball. And now you can move on to the other thing that you really love. But right now it feels like it's just kind of an open, you know, it's just an open road and you could probably go forever and that's. That could mess you up. If you really miss your family, you really miss your friends. Did you have a timeline or is that kind of new information?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, I mean, I have, I have a one year and five year plan for business, but the struggle is just that I want to pursue relationships. And specifically from Utah, I don't know if you guys know, but it's a very dominant religion there and I'm part of the LDS faith. And so I want, I want someone as a partner, a life partner who has also grown up in that faith. And so finding a wife.

[Caller]

Yeah, but you can, you can find.

[Jade Warshaw]

Somebody, Iowa difficult compared to what it would be like in.

[Caller]

It is, but it is, but it's, it's not like you can pursue it if, I mean, it's just going to be, it's going to be less comfortable, but you can pursue it. There's a, there's a local church in Iowa. I'm confident of. There's probably multiple local churches there in, in Iowa. But I love what you said Jade, about I want to have $250,000 in cash in the bank and then I'm going to go back home.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And so saying that you're in Iowa and that means you can't get companionship, that's just simply not true. It might be more of a challenge than it would be in Utah, but.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I gotta believe there's a dating site specifically. For sure there is.

[Caller]

Yes. I assure you there is. But here's the deal. I think that that feels a little bit. I mean it feels Logan, like it's kind of the proxy challenge. The real challenge is it's not cool to say it if you're a 25 year old young man making money. But I miss my family.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Or I miss my buddies or I miss the action. That's all fair to say. Just own it. And maybe you build your business up right now. Maybe you could sell it to somebody for 150 grand. And you've got 60 and you got 150. I'm gonna take 210 back to, in my, in my checking account. I'm gonna go home and I'm gonna call it. I'm gonna start a new business there. If you can do warm leads, if you can go door to door in Iowa, you can go door to door anywhere. That means you can, you're, you're the person that can make any kind of money anywhere because you're not scared to go door to door.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you know, let me just give you a little bit of hope possibly. I mean you said you made 200k last year. I think he's only been doing this two years. I'll tell you. I moved to, from South Florida. I lived in South Florida for my entire adult life. It is my home and it's where all my people are. And when my husband and I picked up and moved here to Nashville, I. Let's see, it'll be three years in July. And I am just starting, right? To be like, okay, like, like just starting.

[Caller]

I'm in year seven and I'm not even there yet.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So roots are a very real thing. Like when you put down roots somewhere, it's like a plant. Like in my house there's tons of plants everywhere. If I repl plant something and I don't treat the roots, right? And I just pull it up and I. I replant it. It freaks out for a while. It drops, leaves. It does a whole lot of things because it's trying to adjust to new soil. If I move it from downstairs, upstairs, a new environment, like all of those things when you had roots down, it. It does something. It shocks your system when you pull that up. And so I think that's just what you're feeling. It's not to say that you can't exist and you can't thrive in this new environment, but you do have to give it time, and you have to give yourself the space to just learn how to grow in a new place. And so hopefully that kind of helps you out a little bit. The good news is, with the interwebs and the Internets the way they are, you know, you can FaceTime and you can hop on and see your people, and you know you're making a lot of money. So hop on a plane and go see them as often as you can. That's what I do. But give it a timeline, and I promise you, you'll. You'll make it through. It's tough. It's not easy. It's not easy. All right, John, I love a good social question.

[Caller]

Oh, great.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I do. But where are mine? Do you have your. Oh, there it is. All right, from social media, we have Robin. I love a Facebook question, because people on Facebook, they are different. Okay. She says, after getting married, how long is too long to wait on getting baby step two started?

[Caller]

I think before you get married. After you get married, like the day after the wedding, I guess.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Not that. Come on, John. We got other things to focus on.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The day after.

[Caller]

The day after the wedding.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I think as quickly as you can get on the same page about it, instantly. Okay, that was an easy one. Okay, let's see what Janelle from Facebook asks. She says, I know you aren't supposed to prepay for a funeral, but what about cemetery plots? It's getting dark.

[Caller]

I, I what, what is, like, Is there, like, a standard Ramsay teaching on cemetery plots?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Don't do it.

[Caller]

Don't do it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, just don't do it. Don't prepay. That is what we say. Honestly, I don't get this question a lot. I would just not prepay. I think that you can get a deal if you prepay, and that's why people do it. But my thing is, like, I'd rather. I'd rather put it in my will what I want, and then the money is there. For everybody to carry out those wishes.

[Caller]

Well, because it sounds like, and again, I'm speaking out of my ears here because I don't keep up with this. My grandparents both had plots next to each other and I'm wondering if that's a thing that you did back in the day.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think it is.

[Caller]

But if I had bought cemetery plots when I was younger, I would have bought plots in Texas.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

My whole family lives in Nashville now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right.

[Caller]

And that's where my kids are born and raised. This is their home. Right. And so I wouldn't want them having to move me back to this plot that I. Right. So. So I'm of the opinion put some money aside and when the day comes, then the day comes. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Because wishes change. All right. That's a strange way to end this segment, but we'll be right back with you. Before you know it, you guys, one of the best gifts that you can.

[Jade Warshaw]

Leave your family after you're gone isn't stuff, it's peace.

[Dr. John Deloney]

When something happens, your loved ones don't want to be digging through drawers or.

[Jade Warshaw]

Guessing passwords to access your important information.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That is why I love Knockbox. That's N O K as in next of can box. Knockbox is a super practical physical system that helps you organize all your important.

[Jade Warshaw]

Documents like accounts, passwords, assets, medical records, even your will in one safe place.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And your Knockbox is divided into user friendly categories to help you get organized so you can give your family clarity.

[Jade Warshaw]

Not clutter when they need it Most.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Go to knockbox.com ramsey and check it out.

[Jade Warshaw]

Foreign.

[Dr. John Deloney]

This is the Ramsey show where we talk about your life and your money. We're here on the Ramsey network taking your calls. 888-825-5 225 gets you on the line. I'm Jade Warshaw next to Dr. John DeLoney. Let's chop it up with Natalie in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. What's up, Natalie?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. So I am calling about a question if is it appropriate to support, financially support a missionary with debt and who is making some questionable financial decisions?

[Caller]

Tell me more.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. So my, my husband and I have a family member who works as a missionary here in the US We've financially supported her for years. She carries those student loans and car loan debt. In our opinion, she's made some very questionable financial choices. She. Well, she announced she's going to be going overseas for a year. She's going overseas for missions and for the first year she will be traveling to meet with different teams to see where God is calling her. Prior to going, she's going to take two months off at home to rest.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

This is coming after a beach trip with friends, a retreat in Colorado, and an upcoming tropical overseas vacation for her birthday.

[Caller]

Why are you calling us? You know the answer.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You just don't feel good about giving her the money.

[Caller]

Yeah. Have you sat down and said no?

[Jade Warshaw]

No.

[Caller]

Why?

[Jade Warshaw]

Family. So it makes it.

[Caller]

No, no, no.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hard.

[Caller]

No, it makes it more important because the rest of the world doesn't seem to be telling her the truth.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And they're desperate for someone who loves her, like, like her aunt to say, hey, look. Because she's living in an alt universe.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Can I raise my hand here?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Because I'm gonna raise my hand because I'm gonna act like, well, part of me is I don't know. And then I'm also gonna act like I really don't know for the people who really don't know. So here's the way my brain filters it. And you guys tell me if I'm wrong. I'm thinking, okay, if I am, let's pretend I'm the missionary. If I'm Jade, if I want to go to the beach, I pay for that. If I want to go do Jade things, I pay for the jade things. And then if I think, hey, I'm going to go do this work that is a like a mission and I'm giving some of my funding to it. And then if I say, john, if you care about this, would you like to fund some of it too? The money you give me is only going to the mission trip then. And I don't think that's wrong. If you saw me go to the beach and I used my own money to go to the beach.

[Caller]

Not at all.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So what are we talking about? Or are we talking about she's using missionary money to go to the beach.

[Jade Warshaw]

So her entire salary is funded through missions. So all of her income would be going towards.

[Caller]

No, I. And the reason I'm smiling really big is I knew these students.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I don't know.

[Caller]

So. Yes, because. Because here's what you're doing. You're giving her $5,000 a year and it's going to her student loan interest and you're paying the interest on her car note.

[Jade Warshaw]

Note.

[Caller]

Yes, yes. You are not serving the least of these and under underprivileged communities that desperately need food and shelter and support. Yeah, you're paying a car note.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Why isn't it separate? Why is it all together?

[Caller]

Because it's a. It's a whole ecosystem dude, we're about to get some educators canceled. It's a, it's an ecosystem where I am. You, you. You raise support for your salary.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay?

[Caller]

And let's say you make 50,000. Like quote, unquote, make $50,000 a year. You go meet in homes, you meet with folks and you get a number that will be your number for the year.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Got you.

[Caller]

But you, quote, unquote, live off that. Right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so now there's red tape.

[Caller]

Well, it's. It's the red tape at the discretion of the 24 year old who's raising money saying, well, I need new speakers or I need new this or I want to. I need to get new. New shoes or new. And then there's those who give to missions where we are putting food. I want all of my money going directly to X, Y and Z.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So maybe you need to pick that. Natalie, you need to pick the form, you know, the framework where all the money just goes directly to, hey, we're packing backpacks or we're giving clean water or whatever that is. Maybe that's a better model for you.

[Jade Warshaw]

So am I being too controlling by analyzing all the money going towards.

[Caller]

It's your money. Okay, you're not being nearly controlling enough. Now here's the thing. I go to a small local church. There's about 150 people here in Nashville. I have. There's two elders at that church and there's a pastor at that church. Whenever I place membership at a church, I am submitting myself to those dudes leadership. And that's a very unpopular thing to do in the 21st century. I don't care. I'm submitting. Me and my family are submitting to their leadership. So I write them checks and I trust them that they are going to use that money in a godly manner. I'm a Christian guy when it comes to somebody. Not. I had one of my friends, kids reached out raising money. She is going to be at a camp all summer. I've been to that camp. I see the amazing work they do. And that was one of the funnest checks I've ever written. In fact, I asked her to send me a video of her like a secret video recording of her writing her dad a letter telling him what a great dad he is. Cause he's one of my close friends. But I know exactly where that money is going.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, let me open a bigger can. Let me open a bigger can of worms. It's almost like too, like, okay, it's like when you're tithing to your church. That money is pooled and it's paying salaries for the pastors.

[Caller]

It's a trust.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Salaries for the staff. And some of that money is going towards outreach or missions or whatever things in the community that they deem necessary. However it is that they want to do ministry. And how many times do people get upset because maybe they see their pastor took a trip and they're like, he shouldn't have done that. And it's like. I don't know. Like, there's part of this where if you're gonna be too. You know what I mean? There's part of it where it's like.

[Caller]

To me, it comes down to trust. It comes down to trust.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And if. If my pastor takes a trip, which, thank God, he does. I know he needs it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Because I trust him. You don't trust this young woman.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Woman.

[Caller]

That's what it comes down to.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And so don't do it.

[Jade Warshaw]

How would I approach that after. Like, we have financially supported her for years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

This year we're not gonna. We've. We're. We're not gonna be able to do it this year.

[Caller]

Yeah. Give her a long lead notice and say, this year we're going to allocate our resources elsewhere. And if you want to be. I had a couple of my uncles sit down and have hard conversations with me over the course of my entire life. And I'm so grateful they did. Did two different uncles. Did about two different things. And so if you want to interject yourself in that way. Awesome. Or just say, this year we're going to spend our. We're going to allocate our giving dollars in other places. That's it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And that's okay. You don't have to feel any type of way about that. You don't have to feel guilty. You don't have to feel anything other than this is a choice that I feel good about.

[Caller]

But if you don't trust the people who are being a steward of your giving dollars. And again, I. I think your important call out. Not every single solitary penny needs to go to.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right.

[Caller]

Like, there has to be administrative overhead. That's just a part of life.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And I want people in leadership to be able to exhale and breathe because I know the literature on leaders and they burn out and they need. I want them there for the long haul. So all that's fine and good. That's not why you're calling. You don't trust this young girl. You're seeing how she lit. You don't like her entire lifestyle. Does that make sense?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And that's what it comes down to. And so, yes, it's a simple conversation, well in advance. Like, honor her in that way and then let them know.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Could be a good chance, too, to kind of share. Because you mentioned earlier she's got student loans and she's got card notes. Could be a good chance to, like John said, sit down and teach her about, you know, good money management and what that's mean, meant for you and your family and what that looks like that could help her in the long haul to get more people who are willing to sponsor her or, you know, again, I did not know how this model works.

[Caller]

Oh, yeah. Well, here's my. Here's my unpopular hot. Take it for what you will. If you have a car note and if you have student loans, you have obligated your time and your resources to banks, not to God. And so if you chose to take those products or those experiences before you could pay for them, then opting to travel around and find God's calling and do all this, like, I think you have an obligation to pay your debts off before you start asking people. Unless you ask, hey, I want some help paying off these student loans so that I can get into the mission field. That's why I think it's super imperative to not go into debt for these things.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Very steamy. That was a hot take. All right, Dave, you have some strong opinions? Possibly, Yeah, I think so. Okay. Because you really prefer credit unions over big banks?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, credit unions, for one thing, are nonprofit, which means that the members, the customers own the credit union. So any profits that the credit union makes goes back into customer pricing so you get better interest rate on savings, cheaper checking and so on, that kind of thing. But what's more important than that, though, is the fact that the customer is the owner, changes the spirit on the credit union. So I find very few credit unions that aren't very customer centric.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, and I think we have found.

[Jade Warshaw]

One that is incredible and that's Fairwinds.

[Dr. John Deloney]

They are an incredible credit union that is really out with the heart to help the customer.

[Jade Warshaw]

They're the right kind of people with the right kind of values, and they've done a really, really good job with customer and the deals that they're offering. The Ramsey Tribe is incredible.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, absolutely. And I love that the things that we teach, they so line up with. And you're right, their customer service is unbelievable. Winston and I just signed up and we got an account. And I'm not kidding, it Took less than five minutes. It was so user friendly. Like the step by step approach was unbelievable. And then the next day my phone rings and it says fair wins on my phone.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I answered it and talked to.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Someone there and they said, yeah, they give calls to every new customer. And so again, they just really care about your experience and I so, so appreciate that. Plus, anything that you can do at a traditional branch, you can do with [e-mail] or on their app. And you'll have free access to over 33,000 ATMs.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, you guys know how much I hate banks in general and so for me to do this is a big deal. Talk to our friends at Fairwinds and check out the combined checking and savings bundle that they created just for the Ramsey tribe. You guys, it's incredible. Yeah, you gu. Guys, it's so easy to join Fairwinds.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No matter where you live. So go to Fairwinds.org Ramsey.

[Caller]

Fairwinds is federally insured by NCUA.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You're listening to the Ramsey Street Show. We've got Taylor in Calgary, Alberta. Hi, Taylor.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. How are you guys doing today?

[Dr. John Deloney]

We're good.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I, I was just wondering about whether or not I should take out a student loan for hair school. I'm currently only making about $700 every two weeks on the high end and I just wanted some advice from you guys on whether or not I should do this.

[Dr. John Deloney]

What are you making the 1400 doing?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm working as a receptionist right now for a storage unit.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And what does it cost? Student loans aside, what does it cost to get the training that you need for hair?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's $17,500 for the schooling.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How long does it take?

[Jade Warshaw]

Eight months.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And so I live in Alberta and with student aid Alberta, they give you six months before you have to start paying off your student loans as well. And I believe the interest rate for them, I don't have an exact number yet, but I believe it's between 5 and 10% for interest after the six months.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. You know, I'm never. Taylor, I'm never going to tell you to go into debt to get the things that you want for many, many reasons. A, that would be like a punishment on your dreams, which is not the way to go. Right. You want to do hair, you shouldn't be punished for it with debt. Debt and payments. You should be able to go and do hair and pay as you go and then enjoy that degree once you have it. I have two parts to this, this thought. A, I want to talk about how we arrived at hair, what kind of hair we're going to be doing, and what the plan is going on from there. But I also want to talk about how we can get this $17,000 and possibly make this happen if it feels like the right path for you. Do you have any debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

I have a little bit of credit card debt. I have less than a thousand dollars in credit card debt.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And my boy and I, because I live with my boyfriend currently, and we have a little bit of financing, we finance some stuff from Amazon, but that's only like $500. So I'm only. I only have about $1,500 in debt right now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Any money saved?

[Jade Warshaw]

No.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I want to say 90% of our money goes towards bills, towards rent, because.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You'Re not making much. What's he making?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, he just got a new job. He's making, I want to say, about fifteen hundred dollars every two weeks. Take home.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How old are you guys?

[Jade Warshaw]

He just started this. I'm 21. We're both 21.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So as your older, hopefully surprisingly young looking sister, I want to tell you that one thing, that one pattern that I see you starting is this pattern of if I want something, I maybe just go into debt to get get it, even if it's not a lot. And that's usually how it starts. I can tell you for me, Taylor, it started with, I just need a winter coat and express has a really cute pink peacoat. You know, it's only 500, you know, and it, that's the way it starts. It starts really low like that. And I always say that debt is a drug and credit cards are the gateway in. Right? And so you start with this credit card thing on Amazon and then you got the other credit card thing and now you're thinking, oh, maybe just a student loan. And that really is how it starts. And before you know it, like I said, it's a drug. Before you know it, you're hooked because it teaches you that you can't really exist without it. That's what it does to you. It, it breaks down your ability to take your own money and manage it and feel good about it. Right? And so you're still young, you're 21, and I just see you on the cusp of this behavior and I'm like, I see you on the cliff and I'm just like, pull her back, pull her back. Right. So, so that's, that's what I want to kind of get into your brain. Let's not keep going towards this. Let's walk away from the edge of this debt cliff.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And I think there's probably plenty of opportunities around you, and there are. That you can make more money. You could probably double your income or even triple your income very quickly if we just go for the right options. And once you can do that now we can start to save up for this dream of doing hair, you know, so.

[Caller]

Okay, yeah, here's the problem, Taylor. You call. You probably could not have called two of. Two of the worst people to ask this question. Between the two of us, we had over a half a million dollars in debt. And here's the frustrating thing I'm pretty good at. I may not be great on the radio, but I'm pretty good at my helping people behind closed doors job. Jade is one of the most extraordinary talents and brilliant people you ever meet. And we lost years of our life paying these things back.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, Can I add another thing?

[Caller]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Jade Warshaw]

The whole debt thing.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I also have some money from my grandfather when I was younger. Like, he had put away kind of a trust fund. Now, unfortunately, the company that he had put that into turned into some sort of mortgage stock, I think. I don't know, this is just stuff that my mother's told me. But I. If I'm able to access that money later, like, I'm able to pull it out of the stock.

[Caller]

Did you ever meet your grandfather? Did you ever meet your grandfather?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, I did.

[Caller]

If he had been able to slide 17,000 bucks across the table and pay for you to go to school, for you to have a career, would that have given him joy?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Caller]

Yeah. So that might be a way to honor your granddad.

[Jade Warshaw]

Honor him. Yeah, yeah.

[Caller]

Be a good steward of that money.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

I, with it being in my mom's name and I, I don't not talk to my mom, but.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, let me back out.

[Jade Warshaw]

Let me back out.

[Caller]

That's kind of one of those pipe dreamies. Like, I know a friend who's got a thing, who has a roommate, who has a dog, who knew this one guy one time. Time. Here's the thing.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Jade was. What Jade told you is way more important. There is no hack to learning the muscle or to earning the muscle of being able to want a thing and save up and go get it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And I'm telling you right now, money could fall from the sky. I would probably tell you right now, if 20 grand just fell out of the sky, I'd probably tell you to pay off the 1500 bucks. Either marry this knucklehead or get your own plate. And then bigger than that, you've got to learn to save up for something that you want and prolong. Feel that pain and then go earn it. And then decide when you're holding the cash to actually want this thing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Delayed gratification is the greatest muscle you can build up because it puts all the balls in power in your court, if that makes sense.

[Caller]

In every single image on Instagram tells you that delayed gratification is for old people and suckers. Please, please don't listen to that. You want. You want a new jacket on Amazon? Awesome. Just save up and buy it. My. I promise you, when you get 500 cash, you're not going to want that thing as bad as you think you do.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, right.

[Caller]

Paying for a car in cash, you end up buying a different car 99 of the time.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right.

[Caller]

Because you're like, all right, I'm just gonna part with this much money.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And that's. That's interesting that you said that, John. It's a phenomenon that happens, Taylor, when you're broke and you're scrapping for money. Everything your eyes see, it's like, I want that. How can I get that? It's like, yeah, you just. You just want so much. And then when you get on the other side and you've learned delayed gratification, you've learned how to make your money behave, you've learned how to make yourself behave. Suddenly you look around and you're like, yeah, like, it. It just. The dial on what you need and want immediately just downshifts down. It goes from, like, being on level 10 to just on level 2. And you're like, yeah, I might get that. I don't know. Let me research a little bit more. And you. You just learn how to take time and keep the power in your court. So, yeah, this hair thing, I didn't ask you, what type of hair is it? What are you going to be doing? Braiding, extensions, color.

[Jade Warshaw]

So it's a. It's a schooling for kind of everything. So I'd be getting my diploma, so I'd be t. How to cut hair, how to do different types of haircuts, that sort of thing. I'd learn how to dye hair.

[Caller]

Have you ever done any of that before?

[Jade Warshaw]

How to do. Yeah, I've been doing hair. Well, it's been a passion of mine since I was. I want to say about five or six. I've always been a very, like, cosmetology.

[Caller]

Type Girl, have you ever thought about applying to get a receptionist job at a salon?

[Jade Warshaw]

I, I have been applying for jobs. There just isn't anything in the market right now. And I've been applying to jobs as the hair stylist and just kind of brought up the fact that I would be an apprentice, fact that I'm not in school or anything like that right now.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So instead of when you apply for these jobs, instead of telling them what you're not yet, tell them what you are, tell them how long you've been doing hair, tell them what you're great at doing as a receptionist, and make sure you see them in person. Proximity principle, as Ken Coleman would teach, is so very important.

[Caller]

Go knock on doors.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You that book.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, technology has changed a lot in the last 30 years. Now the hot topic is AI. And I understand that it might seem intimidating, but if you use AI the right way, it's just another tool to help you work smarter and faster, like a calculator or a cordless drill. So if you run a business, you'd better get on board with it before you get left behind. And NetSuite by Oracle offers AI powered tools that help small businesses improve efficiency and make smarter decisions by bringing all their major business processes into one platform. That way there's one one source of truth for the real time data you need to take advantage of opportunities. Then you can forecast better, scale more efficiently and streamline those manual tasks that take too long. So join the more than 41,000 businesses, including Ramsey Solutions, that rely on NetSuite to help tackle some of their biggest challenges. And right now you can download the CFO's guide to AI and machine learning learning at netsuite.com Ramsey that's free at netsuite.com Ramsey.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So John, earlier this year we released, actually it was at the end of last year, I guess we released. Released. No, it was the beginning of this year. We released these videos, 90 Day Money Makeover. It was basically this documentary series that was sponsored by EveryDollar where we followed an individual, or in this case a couple of individuals over the course of 90 days. And they were people who called into the show. And you know, people call in all the time, we give them advice. But to be able to follow them for 90 days and see are you actually going to take the advice? And I mean, we did this together. Remember Heather?

[Caller]

Oh yeah, dude. And you went out and visited her on her farm and yeah, she made some and then she came into the studio. She flew to Nashville, we flew her to Nashville. And it was. It was amazing, man. What a great experience.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Great. And so every episode is a little bit different. Every situation is different. But yeah, we check in with them at 30, the 30 day point, the 60 day point, the 90 day point. And at the end they come to Ramsey Solutions and we all celebrate with them. They come to like, our staff, you know, meeting, get together and everybody celebrates them. It's this amazing thing. Matter of fact, we have a video to show you guys so you can kind of of get a sense of it. What's going on, Heather?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm just. I'm tired of debt controlling me in all aspects of my life.

[Dr. John Deloney]

She's got a lot going on. We've got to simplify it. She's got the farm, the divorce, the debt.

[Jade Warshaw]

We're just praying the money's there.

[Caller]

I guess you can't breathe.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Are you ready to commit to it? Are you going to do it?

[Jade Warshaw]

I need help.

[Caller]

I'm done with it.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm getting the truck listed and putting.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That up for sale. Do I want to pet a chicken? No. I see you doing a lot. That wasn't even part of the homework. And we're only at the 30 day point. I want to be on today.

[Caller]

So let's go through divorce, right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

There's no guarantee that the bank would let her keep the house. I want you to start dreaming what another living situation might look like if it doesn't go your way.

[Caller]

Way. It's not what I want to do.

[Jade Warshaw]

But it's not always what I want to do.

[Caller]

Very few people are sitting on one variable that could change everything.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's just really hard and it's scary.

[Jade Warshaw]

I can't keep this up for another year.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Ooh, spoiler alert. Heather changed her life, didn't she?

[Caller]

Dude, that's one of the coolest stories I've been a part of since I've worked for this Ramsey team. She came here and the thousand plus employees always here celebrated her. It was pretty amazing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. To be a part that, that. Yeah, I agree with you. It's probably the single coolest thing we've done. The good news is this opportunity is still available. So if you're out there and you saw that and you're sitting in a mess right now, or, you know, you need a change and you could use a little accountability, a little bit of help. We're looking for, folks, if you're interested in your own 90 day money makeover, you can click the link in today's show notes and you can fill out the form and our Producers will review your submission and your story and be in touch. And I'll even be in the. Like, I talk to you guys on the phone. I email you. I, you know, if you get to that point. So we go through it with a fine tooth comb. But if you're interested, man, we could sure use the stories because it provides hope.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

A. A you get your life together, and then by. By way of you getting your life together and other people seeing it, it provides hope to them and they get their life together. So it's an amazing chain that you get to be a part of. Very, very cool.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow.

[Caller]

If you've ever wondered what it would be like, like, I just want Jade to come sit at my kitchen table and walk through this with me. And I want Deloney to be honest with me. I want Rachel Cruz and Jor. I want people to say, this is what this is.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And it's. That's so good you said that, John. It's 100% real. Like, it's not. They didn't like Frankenstein that together. We really went to Heather's house and I really hung. Used her daughter's bathroom, and I, like, was up in there, and she made some really delicious bread and cookies, and they were really good. But yeah, this is a real thing. We really get up in your stuff and we sit knee to knee with you and.

[Caller]

But I took a farm woman and said, you gotta sell your house.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You did? She did. She did.

[Caller]

And you told her, like, you got to sell the horse. Like, you don't. Only George Camel tells you to sell a horse. Yeah, right. And. But here it was like seeing her months later, come to the. Come to the building and talk about how she's free. Wild, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. And you can watch that episode. If you want to see the rest of that episode, it's on our YouTube highlights channel.

[Caller]

And they'll put in the link to the show notes here. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And the link is there in the show notes, man. So, so, so good. I can't wait to do that again. I love that scene series. I love real life change. My favorite thing to do here at Ramsey is anything where I can talk directly to you guys. The show is great, but if we can be in the same room together, man. Love that. All right, switching gears, the Ramsey show question of the day is brought to you by why Refi defaulted. Private student loans can feel like a wall that you'll never be able to climb. But why Refi may be able to help you get over it. They'll work with you to Explore a payment plan that's tailored to your situation. Go to yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter Y, R, E. Remember, it may not be available in all states.

[Caller]

Ooh, Today's question. Dude, this is like the Hot Take show. Today's question comes from Linda in Georgia. What's your feelings on how receiving an inheritance should be handled with a spouse? I'll be receiving $100,000 from my parents, and my husband wants to invest it in stocks. I disagree and feel like because this money is from my parents life, work, it's not his, it's mine. We have a home, land, and vehicles paid for, but my husband says it's his, too. What are your thoughts on this? Oh, geez.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Holy smokes. Let me tell. Let me tell you the way I would feel about this in story form.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Dr. John Deloney]

So if Sam Warshaw, my husband, came home and said, you know, the worst happened, so and so passed away, and I'll be getting a hundred thousand dollars and O.J. by the way, it's my money. You have no say in this. Let's just say Sam would be like a magic trick. He gone, he gone, he's gone. Unsolved mystery is really what it. Remember William Shatner? Was it William Shatner with Unsolved Mysteries?

[Caller]

No. Oh, yeah, it was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

My point is, I'm not being violent on purpose. I'm just saying, like, that would create such.

[Caller]

My wife would kill me and they would never find my body.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. It would create such division vision in our lives. I said, it's mine, not yours. Now can we talk about it together.

[Caller]

And let's flip it around. This is a stupid way to. To deal with a hundred thousand dollars.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Caller]

To just dump it into stocks.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right, right, right, right.

[Caller]

And so the real question here is. Here's what I'm. I'm reading between the lines because I'm not talking to Linda on the phone. She's never liked how her husband handles money.

[Dr. John Deloney]

There you go.

[Caller]

He's always deciding, we're buying this, we're buying this. Which means he's buying this. He's buying the cars, he's buying the land, he's buying whatever. And finally she gets a little thing that's hers, and she says, my precious, it's mine. That's right. You can't touch this. Finally. And he is saying, no, no, no, I'm the smart one, you're the dumb one. I always work out. And so I want to do. And so here's the deal. This is one of those moments, I think Jade exposes. It's like when it rains real hard, it exposes even the smallest cracks in your home, John.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yep.

[Caller]

And then all a sudden, your basement's full of water. Even with a little crack, your basement's full of water. And that's one of. Right. And so what we really need to do here, Linda, is get to the bottom of why are you suddenly wrapping your arms around this and saying, this is mine? If it's because you've never worked as a team, you've always, it's always been husband's way or the highway, then you need to, with your newfound economic security, and I hate to put it like that, but let's do it. Sit down at the table and say, I've never had a voice in this house. House. And my guess is, and again, I'm going to play both sides here. He has said, you've never spoke up once. And she'll say, I never had the ability to. And him saying, I've tried to provide all of this for us. And it will be one of those conversations. And again, there could be a million different scenarios. I'm making one up here.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think you're spot on, where both.

[Caller]

People are both kind of selfish, but at the end of the day, both are trying to do what they think is best for both of them, and neither of them are creating a shared vision together on what our life can, can be.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That. John, I think that you are 100% on the ball.

[Caller]

We'll see.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And let's just talk. You know, the, the marital stuff aside, like, there's obviously some issues there. I agree with what John is saying. When you get an inheritance, I do think that there's this part of it that it's kind of like the last caller. If somebody leaves you something, there's. There's a joy that they want you to get out of that, that gift. Right. Because it is a gift. And so with money, you do have to remember there's three things that you can do with it always and especially with an inheritance, you really want to remember. You can give some of it, you can save some of it, and you can spend some. Some of it. And I really think with an inheritance, you need to be careful to do all three of those. So it's really hitting the point of what it's there to do.

[Caller]

I was like, I always like the picture of the person who gave it to sitting across the table. And if you said, I'm going to do this, this, and this, would they sit back and smile. Yeah, that's what I always like to envision that. That, to me, is the picture of stewardship.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I love that. When you're tackling debt or building wealth, people can often forget about a very, very important, important step in reaching those goals. Spoiler alert. It's insurance. Having the right coverage, whether it's too little or too much, can impact how long it takes to get to your goals. And remember, if you're skimping on insurance, it might feel like you're saving in the moment. But when life happens, it's easy to fall back into debt without that safety net of insurance. So, guys, you need it. You need it. You need the right insurance and you need the right amount of coverage because the right insurance acts as a shield around your loved ones ones and your wallet if disaster strikes. And in some cases, it can even save you money if you're paying too much for insurance or for bogus ones like, I don't know, cell phone insurance, warranties, that kind of crap. So how do you know if you have the right coverage? You need to take the coverage checkup again. It's free, it's online, and it's a resource that creates a personalized insurance action plan for you. It's unique to you and your situation. It makes an overly confusing, toxic topic like insurance very easy to understand, and it gives you very clear next steps. So go to Ramsey Solutions.com checkup to take the coverage checkup or click the link in the description if you're listening on YouTube or podcast. Brian is in Louisville, Kentucky. What's up, Brian?

[Caller]

How's it going? What up?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Doing good.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, so I guess so a little background. I. I've been currently debt free. My wife and I paid off our house and we've even gone as far as we've bought our retirement home. Nice that we're gonna stay in Wisconsin. That's paid off. All our cars are paid off. Yeah.

[Caller]

And now I'm kind of.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm like a. I hustle a lot.

[Caller]

I mean, I have a little side hustles.

[Jade Warshaw]

My wife is a nerd. I'm a mechanic and I kind of buy and sell cars on the side to basically fund my hobbies and pay for everything I have. But now I'm kind of stepping up to. I'm trying to get into rental property and. And it's a little scary because I'm not dealing with smaller amounts of money now. And I'm trying to figure out if I need to. I mean, currently I have about $200,000 that I can spend. And my wife's mother just recently passed away and she got a little inheritance of some stocks that currently is worth about 150,000. And I'm trying to figure out if I need to. What we want to do is buy a couple houses because in our area there are travel, nurses and I can rent, I can rent each room in the house for eight or nine hundred dollars rather than renting it out like as just the whole house. And I can make more. And I'm trying to figure out if I should leverage a little bit of debt and buy multiple houses or should I just buy one?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, why not? If. For many reasons. But hey, it's your first time even doing this and you're already spreading, you're already making it tougher because you say, hey, of all the bedrooms, I have to list them, I have to rent them to four different tenants versus just one family. That already complicates it. I think that's a great idea, by the way. But it already complicates it. And then why not just. It's like a, it's like a franchise. Why not start with the one flagship store, make sure it's doing well, make sure it's in business making money. Then if that one does well, you open another location and you just go at the speed of success and at the speed of cash. Which by the way, has gotten you where you're at today, Brian.

[Caller]

And can I tell you why I think you're nervous? I don't think it's the dollar amount. I think you're, you're, you and your wife are very smart and you're a deal maker. Like, I think you're good at this. I think you're nervous. Here's what I think. I think you're nervous because you're really good with call bars and you understand it and you know how they work and you know how to fix them and you know what they're worth. And I don't know that you have that skill set here yet. That's why I think you're nervous because you're getting into what you like. I'm graduating up. As though what you've been doing that has bought you two paid for homes and has given you and your wife an amazing life, wasn't somehow was less than. You get what I'm saying? Yeah, you've done an amazing job, dude. It's awesome.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I hear that. But a lot of times I also have a.

[Caller]

Sometimes I feel I'm really good with.

[Jade Warshaw]

Money, but then I also Times I feel like I make stupid decisions. Like I have a hobby that literally, like, not only do I build cars, but I restore classics. And I, I don't even want to say how much it is, but I spent stupid amounts.

[Caller]

Yeah, but. But you don't owe anybody anything. You have two paid for houses and you can.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, you. There's a certain amount of margin in your world that you could literally set it on fire and it'd be okay.

[Caller]

I went fishing this weekend with my son. Do you know what I spent? I'm not even going to say it on the air because I'm embarrassed, but I just kept telling my son when we were running out of lures, go get another one, go get another one. Because we are having so much fun. But I've budgeted for that and we can do that. So you don't need to justify that, man. I'm glad that you have a passion that you're so good at and you restore all cars. That's amazing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Blessing. Yeah.

[Caller]

But here's the thing.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, one question. What, What? Couldn't I, couldn't I miss out, though? Like, I mean, houses are always going up.

[Caller]

Okay. I mean, couldn't I miss out if I buy?

[Jade Warshaw]

If I don't buy?

[Caller]

You could. Let's play that out. You could, but I want you to talk to a whole bunch of. Of leveraged rental home owners who during COVID out of nowhere were told you don't have to pay your bills or.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, see, see, that's why I actually, the, the reason I'm getting into this is because when I, When I moved to my current place, I transferred.

[Caller]

I. I've always worked on high end cars.

[Jade Warshaw]

I was, I used to work on Lamborghinis and Ferraris and now I work on more luxury lines like BMWs. And I got a nice offer to move down here and the lady that I rented from, that's what she does. And she actually introduced me to my wife. She worked. She's also a nurse. And that's how I met my wife.

[Caller]

Okay. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

But she does this.

[Caller]

And that's why I was thinking. Let me throw a wrench in. Here's what you're not hearing. You're not hearing. It has worked up until now. Everything is. It's called the turkey problem. The turkey thinks the farmer is the greatest person of all time. Because every day that farmer comes out and feeds it and takes care of it until the day before Thanksgiving. And what you're doing is you've seen somebody who in a season, this thing has worked. Worked. What if in 24 months, AI gets good enough that it really kind of shuts down the travel nursing market and just localizes it all.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And suddenly you've got four houses that the mortgage just keeps coming and you're gonna have to sell your Wisconsin house to make the payments on them because you can't rent them out. Will that happen? I hope not, but I don't know. I'm just making something up. But if you own a house outright, that you've taken this $350,000 and just bought. Bought one, and then Suddenly you've got four people renting it out from you at 900 bucks a month, then within a few years, you're going to buy another one with cash and then another one with cash. And if anything in the market, downturn, downturns, you're just out that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I think what John is saying is, is so. It's so good. And don't get me wrong, like Covid, that was kind of an outlier. We don't know if something like that's going to happen again. But the fact that risk does exist all the time, that's why they call it leverage.

[Caller]

There's another side of the fulcrum all the time.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And, and I also do want to say, plenty of people, Brian, probably go out and do what you're doing, and they're okay. You know, somehow they make it through. And people call here all the time, they've got a couple properties, and we don't necessarily tell them to sell them, and they. They find a way to make it through. But I want to capitalize on what you said earlier, which is, am I missing out? And I think that you need to reframe your brain on what that means. You could say, oh, I'm missing out, out on. On, you know, money. I could be earning on rent. Or you could say by buying these in cash, I'm missing out on the stress that everybody else has to think about. I'm missing out on the debt that every. Because. And those are things you want to miss out on. You want to miss out on debt. You want to miss out on stress. You want to miss out on the anxiety if somebody doesn't pay. Those are things that they're good to miss out on because plenty of people are doing this and they have to carry all of that because they've done it on deck debt. For you to be able to do this without that, what a wonderful thing to accomplish. I would say that you're more successful if you can carry less properties but carry them in cash and grow them over time than the person who is sitting there with a portfolio of 10 properties that they carry debt on.

[Jade Warshaw]

These days the Internet is chock full of so called investing advice from random goobs with zero qualifications. Listen folks, you deserve guidance from someone who knows what the flip they're talking about. That's why I recommend the SmartVestor program. SmartVestors can help you find a professional financial advisor who can teach you to make your own best decisions with your own money. Get [e-mail] smartvestor again ramseysolutions.com smartvestor Ramsey Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros.

[Caller]

Learn [e-mail] SL.

[Dr. John Deloney]

From the Ramsey Network, it's the Ramsey Show. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to me, Dr. John Deloney. We're taking your calls about your life, your money. You can get in on the show by calling the number 888-825-5225. Get some you at least to the answering machines and then from there you know, you could schedule a call. Very rarely do you just get like straight through. I don't know.

[Caller]

Yeah, you drive straight through.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, you get straight through. All right. With that being said, Ashton got straight through. Ashton in Charlotte, North Carolina. What's up, Ashton?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hello, how are you doing?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Good. How can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I'm calling. I am 37 years old. I have one daughter. I currently just moved back in with my parents because I'm actually renting out my house. So one of my questions is I have a 401k through my job. It only has about $5,000 in it. And then I also have a Roth IRA. IRA which has maybe about $1,000. Do I need both the 401k and.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That Roth IRA for retirement in the future or are you trying to cash them out for something?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, that was to be my next question.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I knew it.

[Jade Warshaw]

So with credit card debt, I have probably about $4,500 credit card debt, personal loans, probably about 3,000. Okay. And then I have a car loan for about 7,000. But then I also have student loans which are about 60,000. So my question is, should I withdraw the funds from that 401k and that IRA to like pay off the small loans like my credit card debt and maybe my personal loan. And then also with the money that I'm making from my home, should I take that money, pay some stuff off or. Because my plan is I wanted to save that money and like buy like another investment property so that I can keep.

[Caller]

God help you, passive income. Ashton, Ashton, just take about 75 off. Just slow down, slow down.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, I'm sorry.

[Caller]

No, you're good, you're good. Like what? Let me ask you this. Why are you renting your house out and living somewhere else?

[Jade Warshaw]

Just to get ahead and like, just to make. Get passive income. I'm tired of living paycheck from paycheck.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Here's what I like about what you're saying. What I like about is you're looking for. You're like, you know, knocking on the wall to see where the hollow spots are. Like you're trying to get out. And I like that. What I do think is that you're getting a little ahead of yourself. So I think John and I can help you find the right escape route to get out of this debt and get to where you're trying to get to. So first, first off, there's a point that we drain savings in order to pay off debt, but we never drain retirement savings because that is your future. And if you, if you drain your retirement savings, you're essentially robbing from yourself. You're robbing from your future self. And you're going to need that money. There is going to come a time where you will no longer be able to work. And I know it's a long ways away, but it will come. And that money needs to grow for you, so it's there when you need it. So no, do not. Even though it's only $6,000 today, do not touch that 401k. Do not touch that ro.

[Caller]

That 6,000 bucks. Just give or take. You're only. You're going to pay 30% in taxes and fees.

[Jade Warshaw]

Taxes. Okay, that makes sense.

[Caller]

So that 6,000 bucks, you might get 4,500 bucks or 4,000 of it. Right. You're. You're. They're going to just. I mean, you wouldn't borrow a loan at 30%, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

That mean. That'd be madness. So don't. Yeah, just. It's, it's just, it's not good any way around.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So we're not going to touch that. Do you have any other money saved, like liquid money saved or in a, you know, high yield savings or anything like that?

[Jade Warshaw]

So the money that I have rent, my house, I have that in a high yield savings account, but that's all the like money I have saved.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And how much is that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right now it's about 5,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so now that you're. I'm going to get to this in a minute. But I want to talk hypothetically right now, now that you're a landlord. Landlord. There's. This is the business. Right. And so there's part of this where it's like, hey, this $5,000 there. But as long as you're a landlord, you need a cushion because of the AC goes out in that house. Guess who's paying for it? The landlord. Right. And you don't want to go into debt to have to cover that stuff. So as much as I'd like to say, yeah, that 5,000 is yours, that would be a little bit tough for me to tell you that because anything can happen with that house. Which leads me to my next conversation. I love that you're looking for ways to get out of this, but living with your parents, do you have any kids or significant other, anything like that? It's just you.

[Jade Warshaw]

I just have a daughter.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So you going to live with your parents at this age is a tough call. And I'm not going to tell you, don't do it. I'm not going to tell you to do it. I am going to say if you are, if you choose to do it, you need to have a very clear timeline and you need to have a very clear set of goals at your to accomplish. If you're doing this. I would not do it while renting a house because you're still keeping around the very risk and the very ability to have to shell out cash that homeownership provides. So you're not really giving yourself that much breathing room by doing that. So you need to decide, am I going to be a homeowner and live in my house with my daughter and pick up extra jobs to pay off this debt, or am I going to sell my house house? Am I going to live with my parents for two years, clean up all this mess, save up for a down payment, and then go back and buy another house again? That's the decision that you've got to make. And maybe you make it on this call. I don't know. What are you thinking?

[Jade Warshaw]

Definitely something I will consider. And like I said, another reason for me renting out my house is because I wanted to try to save up some money so that I can possibly buy another rental income.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And see, you can't do that yet. You got to pay off this debt first and you've got to pay off your current home first. This idea, and I know you're coming at me from something that you've heard something or seen something that seemed very successful and I get it. There's just this allure right now to passive income, which by the way is not really passive. You have to do a lot of work and like we've just discovered, you have to actually have a lot of money saved if you're going to float this thing. That's as respectfully as I can say that you're just not there yet to be able to do it successfully. The best way to do real estate is to go very slowly with cash. That's the way you're making money quickly. All these people who are floating several multifamily and all that, they've got so much debt and they're strapped up to their eyeballs. And if one thing falls in that line of dominoes, they're filing bankruptcy.

[Caller]

One tenant doesn't pay.

[Jade Warshaw]

That makes sense.

[Caller]

How much equity do you have in your home right now?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I just got about 30,000 left on it.

[Caller]

I mean, how much it worth if.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You sold it today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Probably about close to 300,000. It's a townhouse.

[Caller]

And you only owe 30,000 left?

[Jade Warshaw]

My mom's house before she passed away. Okay. And when she passed away, I'm the only child, so. Of course.

[Caller]

Can I tell you something crazy?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Caller]

What if you sold that house?

[Dr. John Deloney]

If you sold.

[Caller]

I'm just. If you sold that, that house and pay the capital gains, I don't care about all that. You sell that house, you pay off all of your debts. You have 100 grand in the bank.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's true.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's one route. That's one route you should. You could 100% consider.

[Caller]

And Jade and I. I wouldn't do it. I'm all about peace. And so, yeah, you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The only reason I wouldn't do it is because you only owe 30,000 on it and it is a family home and you're not. I didn't ask you. How much do you make? Tell me what you make.

[Jade Warshaw]

You just make about 50,000. Nothing.

[Caller]

Okay, well, 50 something.

[Dr. John Deloney]

50 something. And with the debt that you have, it's not out of reach. I'd probably keep the property because I don't think anything's on fire. I think you already have the help with your parents. They're helping you with childcare. They were willing to help you, you know, staying there. I think this is about you, you getting a second job and even applying for better jobs that will pay more. And I think it's about you getting a little bit more uncomfortable on the career side to make this happen. I want to hook you up with financial Peace University I want to hook you up with, ooh, every dollar. Because that's going to be the key for you to get out of this.

[Jade Warshaw]

Why is it that when warm weather hits, people start losing their common sense? They swipe credit cards left and right, saying, I need a vacation. I deserve this. But by August, they're stuck cleaning up a mess. Listen to me carefully. You don't need to spend five grand on beach trips and theme park tickets to make family memories. Here's the deal. Instead of having the summer you deserve, have the summer you can afford. That means planning ahead with the EveryDollar budget app. It helps you track spending and give every single dollar a job. That way, you make sure the essentials are covered and have some fun without making a money mess. Look, you gotta start bossing your money around, or else it'll always be the boss of you. Download everydollar. Today.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Thomas is in Miami, Florida, my favorite place in the country.

[Caller]

Welcome to Miami.

[Dr. John Deloney]

What's up, Thomas?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, guys. How are you doing?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Doing good. How can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Good, good, good. Before I get into my question, I just. I wanted to say first and foremost, Dr. John J. My wife and I are longtime listeners. We love you guys, and we just really appreciate what you do.

[Caller]

Thank you, brother. Appreciate you, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's so kind.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

So initially, when I submitted my question several months back, it was in regards to a pregnancy announcement in the midst of the baby steps. My wife and I are in the middle of baby step number two right now. We found Ramsay probably about three or four months before we found out she got pregnant. So we started to go gazelle intense and stop being stupid butt and all that stuff and picked up the second job. But we didn't get to have the opportunity to become parents on this side of life. My wife had a miscarriage earlier this month.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm so sorry.

[Caller]

Yeah, been there, brother. Hate that for you guys.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, and it's. It's come with its challenges, you know, but we do have a beautiful community of people around us, and it's a lot more common than we think. And so it's like, just no one talks about it, but when we started opening up and talking about it, a lot of people were like, yeah, us too. And you just got to keep on trucking and stuff, like. So my question today, initially I wanted to make it a financial one, but I guess is for the both of us, we want to be able to use this as an opportunity to help other people. Where we've been at, Obviously, we're very dedicated to the Baby steps. I still have a second job and we're working hard doing the debt snowball and all that stuff. We did pump the brakes a little bit initially when it happened but you know, we're kind of getting back on track now. I just want to know from your guys opinion, you know, what would be the best way for her and I to be able to move forward and use I guess this tragedy in life, to be able to be there for others and just let other people know that it doesn't stop life, that it's a part of life and it happens. But you can keep on moving forward and have hope in the future. Future.

[Caller]

I mean, my rule of thumb is I don't talk about stuff or try to teach on stuff until I've fully metabolized the grief. It doesn't mean it's going to go away or the loss doesn't go away. The second thing that I think is really important is I'll take it away from miscarriage because that's a really heavy topic for all of us. Yeah, I get a lot of emails I, I or direct messages especially from. It goes something like this. I cheated on my wife nine times. We rebuilt our marriage and now we want to have, we're writing a marriage book and we want to become like help other people. And I always want to say, hey, you're the worst person that you don't need to write a marriage book. Right. And so, and what, and here's what I mean by that is, is a, a personal experience in a thing is the gateway to become really skilled at sitting with other people. Does that make sense?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Caller]

And so what you guys have now is a shared experience. It's painful, it's hard. You are working through it and you know what it feels like from the inside out. That is a powerful, powerful thing. What I would suggest is also now learn the skills of sitting with folks, maybe attend grief classes, maybe attend a Sunday school where they have a ministry for this or something like that where you can begin to listen to other people's stories. And that's how you begin to earn that credibility. To not only have a shared experience, but also you've heard the stories of a bunch of other people because everybody experiences that differently. What was really, really hard on my marriage is I experienced it very different than my wife did. We had two very different experiences with the same tragedy. Right. And so, and we ended up having three. So it was a, it was a different one every time. All I have to say is love your heart and your Spirit, what I would do is begin to rebuild your life. Y' all are building a new life now. Y' all now know, like, pain, you know, how each other grieves, and you know, how each other says things that you wish you didn't say. All that stuff that comes along with pain in marriage, and then be on the other side of this thing in six months, in a year or two, maybe. At your local church, you say, hey, we're going to start a Sunday school class for people who've experienced this or any type of loss. Or we're going to, once a month, go volunteer at the church, I mean, at the local. Local hospital, and sit with folks who just found this out. And then over time, you become really skilled in the art and science and spirit of sitting with hurting people. And I think that's a. That's a thing that all of us need more of in our community. So I commend your heart. What do you think, Jade?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I. I think John is exactly right. And I want to ask another question, because my screen says, can I take my wife on vacation while we're in baby step two? I'm assuming that with this grief, you're wanting to get away and wanting to change scenery. Is that what that is?

[Jade Warshaw]

We. I mean, initially, you know, like John talked about, we kind of went through all the stages of this, and I'm not sure it's fully done either, because I still have my moments where when I think about it, I shed tears and stuff like that. But, yeah, she. I mean, it's crazy to say it, but honestly, it, like, made me be even more in love with her. And I guess in my own way, due to the things that I've been through in my life, it just made me fall in love with her all over again. I get it, and I just wanted to know how much of an amazing person she is. But we're in the middle of the baby steps right now, and so it's the point of, like, you being disciplined with our money and thinking differently. We do have money in the bank just from, you know, saving before we came to Ramsey and all that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. So let me talk to this for a minute, because, you know, we talk about stork mode, which is, you know, you're having a baby, and so you save up all this money. Then there's storm mode, which is a really tough storm comes. And a lot of times we hear that in the form of, like, a job loss or, you know, someone gets sick. But grieving is a storm and a big change. Is a storm. And I do think it's. Okay, I'm just gonna say this. And some people are gonna be like, what? There's bigger and more important things in life than money sometimes. And there's things that come up where it's like the priority was paying off debt and now the priority is me loving my wife. Well, in another way. And that could look like you guys getting away. I know you're not unreasonable people. So I don't think that you're gonna take a 30 day vacation to Scotland. Right. I don't. I think you're probably like, like, hey, let's, let's, let's, you know, get away for a weekend and do that. I feel like you're going to do something reasonable and it's going to be helpful to your marriage and it's not going to be this major cannonball into your finances. I trust that that's not what you're talking about. And I think that if that's what you need to do, I think you do that and you do it asap.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Okay. That makes me feel better. I guess, you know, in a way, sometimes when you're sifting through the guilt, you kind of want to find permission.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I get it. I just, I. I want her to. She's just the most amazing person ever.

[Caller]

And let me, let me tell you a couple of things that I learned in this process and just sitting with countless people in this. I promise you, you can't say dumber things than I said. I promise you. And I promise you, you can't mess this up worse than I up.

[Jade Warshaw]

Messed.

[Caller]

Messed it up. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And so if you said some things or thought some things or didn't understand the impact of things, don't beat yourself up, man. Definitely like exhale through it. The second thing is, is most men in this kind of situation, they run around and try to solve a problem. This isn't a problem to solve. She is a wife to love. And so ask her, how can I love you? And it might be how can I love you today? Day. Okay, here's a third thing.

[Jade Warshaw]

That one hit.

[Caller]

Have some. And by the way, today it might be, I just need you to sit here and hug me and watch old office episodes and someday it may be get away from me. I just need to be by myself. Here's a third thing. Have some sort of marker or ceremony whether y' all write a letter to this kid and talk about, we had plans, we had pictures of you guys at you and whoever you were going to Marry at a Thanksgiving table 20 years, years from now, it's not gonna happen. Like, write a letter to that little boy and read it to each other. And the final, I went and tattooed the three losses we had names and everything. I went tattooing on my body, like, come up with some sort of process, some sort of ritual, some sort of experience that y' all can share together to mark this moment. It's not about getting rid of it or it's not about moving on from it. It's about it. Like, like material metabolizing. It's a part of you now and it's a part of your shared experience. But ask your wife every day, how can I love you today? She might say, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. Keep asking her and keep asking her and keep showing up. You're a good husband, my man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, Buying or selling your home is a big deal. And between clickbait headlines and the confusing data, it can be tough to know what's actually going on in the housing market, in the real estate market. But we're here to help. We want to make sure you know the latest trends and make sure that they're easy to understand. Like, for instance, medium home prices went up slightly last month to about $430,000. There you go. More homes are on the market than previously. Right now there's nearly 1 million on the market, which happens to be the highest amount, by the way, since 2019. But in many areas, it's still not enough to meet the buyer demand. That that is true. Also, the average 15 year fixed rate rose to 5.90 last month. But the good news is it's still under 6%. So if you're financially ready, a small rate increase shouldn't hold you back from buying the home that you love. Now, if you want to learn more about the housing market trends and get free tools to help you buy or sell with confidence, and you can go to ramseysolutions.com market or you can click the link in the show notes. If you're listening on podcast or YouTube tube, Beth is in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. What's going on, Beth?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, the crux of my question is essentially my husband owns a home in New Jersey that he rents out to his ex girlfriend.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Let that marinate for a minute.

[Caller]

You just.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, I know. So they, well, he bought it, it's entirely in his name, both the mortgage and the deed. He bought it in like 2016, 2017, and then, you know, a few years later they broke up. They do share a child together, so that's kind of where the rental agreement came in. Yeah. So wanted to make sure that, you know, there was limited like, you know, disruption for his child. So. Yeah. So he rents out the place to his ex and now, you know, fast forward a few years, we are trying to get qualified for a home and the credit report came back and she has been late on payment. So it's affecting our, our qualification process.

[Caller]

You don't say. No way.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I know, I know.

[Caller]

I thought exes always did exactly what they said they were going to do.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So he's not collecting the rent and paying the mortgage, he's just assuming that she's paying it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Correct.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah.

[Caller]

Amazing. This is so great.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Okay. And let me say I kind of get that he was probably like, I don't want to have to be involved in this if I don't have to be. Right. Like limit contact kind of thing.

[Jade Warshaw]

But that's exactly it. So it wasn't a fun breakup. And so that's a part of the dynamic here. Right. One, he wants to obviously be low conflict, what's best for his, his child in the situation. So just keep that in mind where his intention was. So that, that's kind of the situation we're in.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right. How far behind is she?

[Jade Warshaw]

She's actually like the payments are up to, you know, are up to date. She has just had a history of late payments. So in this year alone, right. Like as of mid May, she was late on three payments and it's like past the 30 day mark. Right. So it's being, it's hitting his report and then we did a more extensive credit report and she was late about 20 times over the history of like the last like five or so years that she's been paying.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yikes. So you, you're not getting a house?

[Caller]

Yeah. You aren't getting a house.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Not for a while.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's surprisingly enough. Right. We did our credit report and his score isn't as bad as you might expect. Right. He's in, I think it was in like the low sevens.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Yeah, that's not as bad as I would expect.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right, Exactly. And that's what the lender said as well, you know, that he was really surprised. But it goes to show you that he is on top of his finances with the exception of this situation. So what's your question? Yeah, my question for you is what, like, what would be your advice in the situation to, to move on from the, from it? Right.

[Caller]

I would sell them.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, you gotta Sell the house and let her get her own space. It's been how many years?

[Caller]

Five years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Since been married and they hit her and her new husband have a child together. Oh, gosh.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. This is overdue.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

This long overdue. And, and, and I wouldn't make a big drama about it. I wouldn't go talk about the past missed payments, and I would just say, hey, it's been five years. I think we've all moved on. I think we're all in a good place. And honestly, we're about to buy a house anyway, so we need to clear this out. We're gonna. And give. Give them the right amount of time. We're going to be selling the house in six months. Or, you know, give them a window to get out of there and then sell it.

[Caller]

Or if there's. If there's an incredible. I'm making up a number here, but let's say the house is worth 500 grand and he's got $200,000 in extra equity. If he wanted to make them just a stupid deal on it to let them buy it as like a gift to his daughter or something like that, he could do that. Y' all gotta sell the house. It sounds like if she's late 20 times over the course of five years, she's got other issues financially.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right. And that's. That's the other thing we're, like, you know, conscious of. Because.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right.

[Jade Warshaw]

If she can't, like, for context, to like the house, the mortgage payment is like eleven hundred dollars a month. Right. And it's like, you're late on that. You know, the last thing that I think he wants to do is. And he's not responsible for their finances. So, like, understand that. But the last thing he wants to do is kind of like throw them out. You know what I mean?

[Dr. John Deloney]

And, you know, throwing them out, you're giving them six months to. To get their own space. And it's fair. He owns the house.

[Caller]

But I personally wouldn't wait five or six months just because I don't trust what they would do to the house. Or they might just stop paying on.

[Dr. John Deloney]

An ultimate altogether, and they might. And if that. You can stipulize all that. Like, that can all be stipulations in how you do this. But the point is you're giving them a fair amount of time to find something new. And if you find that they are not holding up their end of the deal. Yeah. You accelerate that process and you can let them know that ahead of time we're Telling you this out of good faith because we love this daughter and we care about making sure you land on your feet. Now if you abuse that, then we'll accelerate this and you'll be out in a month. Exactly.

[Caller]

What's the custody of your arrangement with daughter?

[Jade Warshaw]

Every other weekend.

[Caller]

Okay. Every other weekend. So she stays almost all the time with mom. How come?

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, that was an agreement when they first broke up because he was working, you know, two jobs and like he, you know, insane hours. And so that was kind of what they agreed on then. And. But that's kind of. Yeah. Outdated as well.

[Caller]

Yeah. So, yeah. I, here's, here's the, the, the broader picture for me is this. He doesn't have an obligation to that mother or that her new stepdad, that's their, that's their responsibility to figure that out. And what I'm going to say is going to sound harsh, and I don't mean for it to sound harsh, but you and him, by the way, this house is yours too. It's your ys. Okay? And y' all need to decide what kind of life y' all want to live. To, to, to, to have. Right. And I wouldn't personally want my wife's ex boyfriend five years later still messing up my financial life.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right.

[Caller]

Okay. And I can't breathe right. If I'm away from my daughter for more than three or four days. Call me a sucker. I, I don't care. I don't like it when I'm on the road for two weeks at a time. I, I just, I get out of sorts. And so if he is okay seeing his daughter every other weekend, I'm more power to you. I couldn't live like that. And so it may be we're going to revisit a whole bunch of things. And if her new stepdad and her bio mom cannot afford to find a place to live, cannot afford groceries, I'm going to have a different conversation with them in the courts about my daughter's well being and safety.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Caller]

But I'm not going to burn down my financial life supporting somebody that has no interest in supporting themselves.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Because you're right. If they're struggling with $1,100 on this rent, they're struggling. Struggling.

[Jade Warshaw]

But they really. Again.

[Caller]

Or they're struggling. But you know why? Because they can.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't know. Yeah. How much of that. Because it's not like obviously with the, with the mortgage being only in his name and everything. She wasn't the most financially Responsible because.

[Caller]

She didn't have to be right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You've been the safety net there this whole time. But John is exactly right. You have a stake in this. And you all sit down, you sit down together and say, this is what we want. This has been going on long enough. It's been five years, for crying out loud. They're okay to go out on their own. And yeah, I am with you, John. I don't, I don't.

[Caller]

I could never do a walk through that house and I put on the market sooner rather than later.

[Jade Warshaw]

You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car. But it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage to protect your biggest assets. I recommend using Ramsey trusted pros. Whether you're looking for car, home or any other type of insurance, Ramsey trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you. Like we would find what you [e-mail] insurance.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Our Ramsey show Scripture and quote of the day, look at the birds of the air. They don't sow or reap or store away in barns. And yet still your heavenly father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? That's Matthew 6:26. Then Jordan Peterson said, pursue what's meaningful, not what is expedient. Let that one marinate. Put that tea bag in your water and let it steam deep. All right, let's go to Miles in Hartford, Connecticut. What's up, Miles?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey. Nothing much. Those quotes were freaking awesome. That's my favorite Bible verse and I love Jordan Peterson, so thank you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Perfect. It was just for you. Just for you. Miles.

[Caller]

We knew you were calling.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How can we help?

[Caller]

What's up, dude?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I got a bit of an issue my parents have recently come to light about. I've always known they have some financial issues, but recently the, the extent of it has come through. Basically, they are 400,000 in debt with parent plus loans and it looks like they're going to lose their house. They just started talking to a bankruptcy attorney. So I was just curious as to what some of their options might be.

[Caller]

Well, they, they, they can't discharge those, those Parent Plus Loans with bankruptcy, can they?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, they're in the process. They said something about basically they filed a criminal report. My mom says that she, she would not have checked off recurring every year. So she says it's fraudulent in that way. I suspect it's not fraudulent.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wait a second. So you're saying that she. Hold on. Let me make sure I get my Mind around this, you're saying that she signed for maybe one semester and they continue to send them for the other semesters automatically, and she wasn't aware of that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So how did you say.

[Caller]

But she. She continued to cash the check?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Um, yeah, because how did she think.

[Jade Warshaw]

School that went to her. Did it go right to the school? I don't know how they work, but.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I guess my question is, whoever the loans were for, how did she think it was getting paid for if she wasn't pulling out loans?

[Jade Warshaw]

I. That's a great question. Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The likelihood of these being discharged, unless it truly was criminal, which it doesn't sound like it was, is like 00%. So let's go back to your first question then. Okay, so what else do you. I mean, how old are your parents?

[Jade Warshaw]

My mom is early 60s. My dad is late 80s.

[Caller]

Okay, who do they sign these? Parent loan plus. These parent plus loans for?

[Jade Warshaw]

Mainly my sister. And I think some of it is me, but my mom says it's not for me, but I suspect it is.

[Caller]

So what degree does your sister have for $400,000?

[Jade Warshaw]

Early childhood development.

[Caller]

You can't be serious. That's impossible.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, they've probably been accruing tons of interest over. Over 40 years.

[Jade Warshaw]

I think my mom hasn't paid it in 10 years.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So it's just been so what I think what. What it sounds like. I think there's a lot of unknowns here. If I were you, I'd sit down with your sister first, probably, and say, think back in your mind, you know, tell me, what do you think? What was the student loan conversation with you and your mom? I'm just trying to get some thoughts around this because here's the hard part. Whether the money was for you or your sister, they took out the loans, and at some point in their minds, they thought, hey, we're gonna gift them, and I put gifts in quotes. We're gonna gift them an education. We'll take out the loans and out power names. Right? And so many parents do that and not realizing that it's just not a gift for anybody. And now they're in this situation and you guys are like, well, should we pay it back? But the truth is they took it out in their names. And if the. If the agreement was never for you to pay it, then it's not for you to pay. Now that's. That's like the truth. Now we can look at other ways to get around it, which is, Miles, how are you doing financially? Is there a portion of it that you feel led to take on to pay and then we could talk about that or, you know, same thing with your sister, if that's even a valid thing to discuss.

[Jade Warshaw]

So my concern isn't as much like feeling an obligation to pay it back. I don't. More so it's just like I don't want them to lose their house. And that's kind of what it's looking like it's going to be. And, yeah, they also, I guess, are going to start docking my dad's Social Security.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, they will.

[Caller]

Yeah, they're going to come for your soul, dude.

[Jade Warshaw]

They will.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You got to pay them.

[Caller]

How much are they on the house, do you know?

[Jade Warshaw]

I think 200 left.

[Caller]

How much is the house worth?

[Jade Warshaw]

Probably 400, 500,000?

[Caller]

Yeah, they're going to have to sell the house.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And by the way, I. I just want to say to you, it's really tough to watch people that we love go through things that we feel like could have been avoidable or could have been different, but their lives are their lives and, and we can't. You couldn't have changed that. Do you know what I'm saying? It was their choice to take on the loans. It was their choice to maybe not pay on the loans. It was their choice to stick their head in the sand for a decade or more. And it's just really tough to sit there and watch that. And it's totally. Yeah, of course nobody wants to see that happen. But I don't know that there's anything that you're going to be able to do to stop that. Unless you have $400,000 sitting around that you're happy to give as a gift.

[Caller]

Or if there's a way to go back and negotiate with the. On the interest, like, hey, we're going to write you a lump sum of $210,000 and maybe they'll negotiate with you. I. I don't know how they. I don't know what happens when you haven't paid on 10 years. My guess is they've sold it and then it's been sold four or five times.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Not if it's a federal loan. If it's a private loan, possibly you could, you know, make some deals, but federal loans, man, they. They don't keep racking it up much.

[Caller]

Yeah, but, yeah, there's. There's a pay the piper moment on this, and this is it. And your mom can file credit for fraudulent charges. Here's the deal. She's been getting letters and emails for a decade. That's just that's just the way that is.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Do you have money?

[Jade Warshaw]

A little bit. Not much. It's about 50,000.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. And does your sister have money? I mean, if you have debt. Yeah, yeah.

[Caller]

She's early childhood.

[Jade Warshaw]

I actually recently, I recently told her to watch a Ramsey show. So she's not in great shape.

[Caller]

Yeah, I, I, I don't know who's giving your parents bankruptcy advice here, but, but if they're filing for bankruptcy, it may be worse than they're telling you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That means there's a lot of other things, not just this 400, 000 of.

[Caller]

Student loans because you just can't discharge.

[Jade Warshaw]

There's other stuff.

[Caller]

Yeah, you just can't discharge student loans.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Though, and hear me say this because I'm not saying you have to. If you wanted to. Yeah. Your sister could say what portion of the student loans are mine? And you could say what portion of the student loans are mine? And you could either say, yeah, I'm going to give you a lump sum for what the original amount was and I've washed my hands of it. Or you know, if you are a person who has the means to help and you'd like to help, I just want you to hear me say you have the ability to do that. That's up to you. You set boundaries around it, you make clear expectations, move on. But you're not in, you don't have to do that in this case. So it's just one of those things where. John, I hate Parent plus loans for this very reason, dude. For this very reason. Because it, A, it's debt, so it's chains and shackles, but B, the water is so muddied because it's, well, it's for your education. Education, you know, pointing to the, the son or daughter, it's for your education, but the parent is the one that says, yeah, but I'll sign it, I'll take all the onus on me. And then decades roll by and life doesn't go the way mom and dad thought it was gonna go. And they put it off and put it off. And now it's like, well, technically this is on you because it's your education. And they're pointing back at the son and daughter again. And then the son and daughter feels the weight of it, but they're like, I never. Half the time they didn't even know that that was the way college was being paid.

[Caller]

Paid for. Right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's like, I didn't even know you did this. You know, it's just such a Kid.

[Caller]

Would sign for a staffer loan back in the day and. And didn't know that mom and dad had signed for another.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right. It's like the Spider man meme where they're all pointing at each other like, who was it?

[Caller]

And like you said, this points to a bigger picture of financial. Just mismanagement just sounds like a mess. And then you got a young man looking at the door and here's what he's staring down. My parents are gonna lose the house. They're moving with me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. Now what?

[Caller]

They're moving in with sister.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Now what?

[Caller]

Yeah, and there's a. Yeah, there's a very much a now What? And they're 60 something years old and they're going back to work at wherever they can get a job.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So this is a, a message for parents right now who are in their, I don't know, 40s, and your kids are getting ready to go to college. You have very important choices to make, and those choices are a, making sure your kids are set up to go to college by educating them and setting expectations on we're not doing debt. I don't care how you do it, but we're not doing debt. And three, make sure that you're taking care of your retirement and taking care of your own self and don't pass that burden off onto your children. That's not fair, it's not nice, and it's not loving your children.

[Caller]

Well.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, you guys, I was shocked to learn that 88 of you out there are sharing the Ramsey show. I mean, that is so incredible. Thank you so much.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And I want to tell you that.

[Jade Warshaw]

We'Re making it even easier to share. So this June, we have pulled together.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The brand new Ramsey101 YouTube playlist.

[Jade Warshaw]

A quick start collection of how to get started walking the Ramsey plan. Now, this playlist is perfect for that one person in your life who needs help winning with money and just doesn't.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Know where to start.

[Jade Warshaw]

So here's what's inside, what the baby.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Steps are and why they actually work.

[Jade Warshaw]

How the debt snowball helps you pay.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Off debt fast, and how to build.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wealth and invest for the future and so much more. So here's what you need to do. Click the link at the top of the show notes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It'll take you straight to the YouTube playlist.

[Jade Warshaw]

Copy it, text it, send it in a group chat. Just say, hey, I thought this might help.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Because one playlist shared at the right time could be the turning point. One share, one playlist, one step could change everything.

[Jade Warshaw]

For that one person in your life. So click on.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Click the link.

[Jade Warshaw]

Share the Ramsey show and let's help someone out there start winning with money.