Don’t Become a Victim of Your Circumstances

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show – “Don’t Become a Victim of Your Circumstances”

Host: Ramsey Network
Episode Release Date: January 23, 2025
Title: Don’t Become a Victim of Your Circumstances

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In this engaging episode of The Ramsey Show, host Ken Coleman and co-host George Camel delve into the central theme of taking control of one’s financial destiny, emphasizing that individuals can overcome their monetary setbacks and build wealth regardless of past mistakes. The duo addresses multiple listener calls, offering tailored advice and practical solutions to diverse financial challenges.

1. Balancing Career Aspirations and Relationship Dynamics

Caller: Charles from Portland, Oregon
Timestamp: [01:44] – [08:43]

Charles shares his dilemma: nearing graduation, he aspires to become a state trooper, which necessitates relocating—a prospect that strains his relationship with his girlfriend, who values her current job and is reluctant to move. Ken Coleman initiates the conversation by probing the emotional readiness and willingness of Charles's girlfriend to sacrifice her comfort for his career goals.

Notable Quotes:

• Ken Coleman: “This is a sacrifice that couples have to learn to make.” [04:33]
• George Camel: “If it’s meant to be, it’s meant to be. If you live apart for six months, you’re gonna survive.” [08:07]

Advice Provided:

• Commit to the Plan: Ken encourages Charles not to waver on his girlfriend’s willingness to relocate for the required two-year period.
• Support Her Career: George suggests that Charles assist his girlfriend in finding similar work in the new location, fostering mutual support.
• Marital Steps: The hosts recommend formalizing the relationship through marriage soon to solidify their commitment and financial partnership.

2. Early Financial Decisions and Housing Choices

Caller: Timothy from Erie, Pennsylvania
Timestamp: [10:43] – [19:57]

At 19, Timothy is grappling with the decision to rent or buy a home amidst plans to propose to his girlfriend. Despite having substantial savings, he lacks a credit score and is concerned about securing a favorable mortgage rate.

Notable Quotes:

• George Camel: “The right time to buy a house is when you’re financially ready.” [12:15]
• Ken Coleman: “Clarity always breeds confidence. And confidence breeds courage.” [60:02]

Advice Provided:

• Build an Emergency Fund: Prioritize establishing a fully funded emergency reserve before committing to a home purchase.
• Manual Underwriting: George explains that with proper documentation, trending financial practices like manual underwriting can facilitate mortgage approval without a traditional credit score.
• Increase Savings: Both hosts recommend continuing to save diligently, proposing marriage, and postponing the home purchase to strengthen financial stability.

3. Dealing with a Spouse’s Spending Addiction

Caller: Jessica from Knoxville, Tennessee
Timestamp: [32:12] – [38:39]

Jessica seeks guidance on insulating herself from her husband’s uncontrollable spending habits, which have led to significant debt accumulation and financial instability despite her efforts to separate their finances.

Notable Quotes:

• George Camel: “Pay off your debt today with the money you have.” [34:08]
• Ken Coleman: “This is a tough, tough call.” [36:00]

Advice Provided:

• Secure Finances: Jessica has already taken steps to separate her finances, including paying off a substantial portion of the debt.
• Protect Her Assets: Both hosts affirm that debts solely in her husband’s name won’t legally bind her, advising her to swiftly clear any remaining personal debts.
• Consider Separation: Given her husband’s refusal to engage in therapy or alter his behavior, the hosts suggest contemplating separation to protect her financial and emotional well-being.
• Legal Consultation: Seeking legal advice is recommended to navigate the complexities of marital debt and financial disentanglement.

4. Managing In-Laws Living with the Couple

Caller: Chris from Grand Rapids, Michigan
Timestamp: [43:15] – [51:12]

Chris discusses the recurring issue of his in-laws moving back in due to their poor financial decisions, despite his and his wife’s attempts to assist them through budgeting and financial peace courses.

Notable Quotes:

• George Camel: “If they can do it on their own, say, hey, it’s best for everybody.” [47:17]
• Ken Coleman: “They’re entitled adults.” [48:58]

Advice Provided:

• Set Boundaries: Chris and his wife need to firmly establish boundaries, limiting the duration and conditions under which the in-laws can stay.
• Encourage Financial Independence: The hosts emphasize that the in-laws must take responsibility for their financial situations rather than relying on the couple’s support.
• Firm Communication: Communicating the necessity for the in-laws to move out to avoid further financial strain is crucial, even if it causes temporary familial tension.

5. Preparing for Retirement with Limited Savings

Caller: Monica from Des Moines, Iowa
Timestamp: [53:42] – [63:04]

At 56, Monica is concerned about her retirement savings and whether she can retire comfortably at 67. She outlines her financial status, including her IRA, savings, and lack of homeownership.

Notable Quotes:

• George Camel: “You need to increase your income and savings rate.” [57:44]
• Ken Coleman: “Clarity always breeds confidence. And confidence breeds courage.” [60:02]

Advice Provided:

• Boost Income: Both hosts stress the importance of increasing income, whether through career advancements, additional jobs, or enhanced investment contributions.
• Optimize Savings: Monica is encouraged to consolidate her savings efforts, focusing on optimizing her IRA contributions and reducing unnecessary expenditures.
• Long-Term Planning: The hosts advise considering extended working years or alternative retirement strategies to ensure financial security.

6. Overcoming Significant Credit Card Debt

Caller: John from Miami, Florida
Timestamp: [65:00] – [85:17]

John confronts a daunting credit card debt of $96,000 following job loss and subsequent underemployment. He expresses anxiety over his inability to secure full-time employment and the looming financial crisis.

Notable Quotes:

• George Camel: “Attack these debts from smallest to largest.” [72:20]
• Ken Coleman: “Clarity breeds confidence.” [60:02]

Advice Provided:

• Debt Snowball Method: Implementing the debt snowball method by targeting the smallest debts first to build momentum and systematically eliminate larger debts.
• Increase Income: Urgent focus on securing stable, higher-paying employment to generate the necessary funds to manage and pay off debts.
• Expense Reduction: Minimizing discretionary spending, such as dining out, and optimizing essential expenses to allocate more resources towards debt repayment.

7. Navigating Career Changes and Anxiety

Caller: Stephen from Little Rock, Arkansas
Timestamp: [79:15] – [85:17]

Stephen discusses his career setback after losing a high-paying trucking job due to anxiety issues, leading to a significant income reduction and mounting debts.

Notable Quotes:

• Ken Coleman: “Clarity always breeds confidence. And confidence breeds courage.” [60:02]
• George Camel: “Use that passion to fuel your debt free journey.” [84:14]

Advice Provided:

• Manage Anxiety: Steven is encouraged to continue seeking medical and therapeutic assistance to manage his anxiety, facilitating a potential return to trucking or exploring alternative roles within his expertise.
• Leverage Skills: The hosts advise utilizing his operational experience to seek higher-paying, less anxiety-inducing roles in the trucking industry or related fields.
• Debt Repayment Plan: Following a structured debt repayment strategy to systematically eliminate debts while improving his financial stability.

Insights and Conclusions

Throughout the episode, Ken Coleman and George Camel reinforce the importance of proactive financial management, clear communication in relationships, and the necessity of setting boundaries to safeguard one’s financial well-being. They consistently emphasize that regardless of one’s current financial predicament, taking decisive action and seeking expert advice can transform one’s financial future.

Key Takeaways:

• Proactive Financial Planning: Regular budgeting, saving, and debt repayment are crucial in overcoming financial challenges.
• Relationship Dynamics: Open and honest communication about financial decisions strengthens relationships and ensures mutual support.
• Personal Accountability: Taking responsibility for one’s financial actions prevents dependence and fosters independence.
• Mental and Emotional Health: Addressing underlying emotional issues, such as anxiety or compulsive spending, is essential in achieving financial peace.

Final Thoughts: The episode serves as a compelling reminder that individuals are not powerless over their financial circumstances. With the right strategies, support, and mindset, anyone can navigate their financial hurdles and build a secure, prosperous future.

Upcoming Events: Ken and George promote a free live stream event on January 23rd, encouraging listeners to sign up for financial empowerment resources and the chance to win $4,000. They highlight the importance of taking immediate action to transform one’s financial narrative.

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This detailed summary encapsulates the episode’s core discussions, offering actionable insights and highlighting the hosts’ empathetic and solution-oriented approach to financial coaching.

Transcript

[George Camel]

Hey, guys, if you're ready to get ahead with money and start building wealth this year, don't miss our free Take Control of youf Money live stream. It's on January 23rd, and you could win $4,000 just for signing up. You got nothing to lose. Go sign up right [e-mail] livestream.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome to the Ramsey America. This is where we coach you to win in your life. We want you to win with your money, win in your profession, and win with your relationships. The phone number to jump in today is Triple 882-55-5225. Triple 882-55-2225. Alongside George Camel, who's looking natty and he's looking sharp. Man. The apparel today, the corduroy.

[George Camel]

Well, we got a big event tonight, Ken, so I had to pull out all the stops.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right, the live stream tonight. It's in the lobby right now. Rehearsals are speak.

[George Camel]

I hope everyone listening joins us.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, I like that.

[George Camel]

If you're listening to the show right now, you have no excuse not to join us. It's free. Go to Ramsaysolutions.com livestream and you'll be entered to.

[Ken Coleman]

What if they have plans tonight?

[George Camel]

Well, they can always rewatch it, but if we sign up, we'll send you all the info. We'll get the email to you, the replay, all that good stuff, and you'll be entered to win.

[Ken Coleman]

That's what I want to make sure is that they can get a to be a part of that. I'm Ken Coleman, by the way, and we're here together for you today. George will lead out on those money calls, and I want to help you on the income side of things, and we'll work together. So let's get to it. George, you ready to go?

[George Camel]

I'm pumped.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. Portland, Oregon, is where we're going to start. Charles is there. Charles, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hey, guys, thank you so much for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

You bet. What's going on?

[Caller]

Hey. So I'm about 10, 10 months away from graduating college. I. I want to become a state trooper, like, immediately after I graduate. And this would require that I move. The state would have the final say of where I would have to move. And my girlfriend, who really likes her job, I'm trying to get her on the same page. You guys have any advice?

[Ken Coleman]

Where is she right now? Like, I get the same page thing, but what's the actual conversation? The latest status as to her emotion, her openness? Give us a better picture.

[Caller]

Yeah. So we live Together. She's super, super supportive of the idea becoming a state trooper, but again, she really likes her job. So leaving our town that we live in is. She's not excited about it, but I think she is willing to do it for about two years.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, she gave you an ultimatum. Two years.

[Caller]

That's how long the state would require that I stay in one spot.

[Ken Coleman]

Aha. And then after two years, would you have the flexibility or the freedom to say, all right, we want to move back to the town you're in now?

[Caller]

Yes, sir. Yeah. That's how. Yeah. You can request a transfer after two years.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, listen, I've been married almost 27 years. Based on what I'm hearing, it feels like she is on the same page. She's not thrilled about it, but she's willing. And I think that willingness. She gets to determine willing. And it sounds like she is. Unless I'm missing something.

[Caller]

Yeah, I think. I think you're totally right.

[Ken Coleman]

I. So then take it. So it's almost like you needed some confidence today because. Because. Yeah. Well, listen, it. The more you waver with her willingness, it could affect her willingness. And so in this situation, the fact that you're a young couple, you're engaged to be married, you guys are playing house already, you know, and have you proposed yet?

[Caller]

I have not proposed, but it's. It's in the works.

[Ken Coleman]

I must have seen the wor. I just assumed that. Thank you, George, for correcting that. But I just think the fact that she said, all right, I'm willing to do it for the two years, she's not thrilled about it. This is a sacrifice that couples have to learn to make. And I would tell you, there will be a season or two or three. Who knows how many seasons that you're going to have to sacrifice for her as well. So this is a good woman on the surface here, that she's willing to do this because she really likes what she does. And to the extent that you can be supportive of her and help her figure out how can I do something that's very similar to the work that I love right now in this new town, that would be great, too. But, George, I would not waffle on her willingness. I would say, okay, thank you, sweetheart. Let's go. Two years from now, we come back.

[George Camel]

What do you think I'm in for this plan? I'm just. I'm wondering, does she need you financially? Are you supporting her in any way, or are your finances completely separate?

[Caller]

Yeah. So right now, my. We live together in an apartment, and she works full time, and I. I'm getting supported by a 529 plan because I am a student.

[George Camel]

Okay, so you need her more than she needs you. She has money. Okay. I'm just wondering, you know, how far away is this new town you'd be moving to? Is it 45 minutes or 5 hours?

[Caller]

It totally depends on what the state says. I. I haven't gone through the process yet.

[George Camel]

Okay? There's a lot of unknowns. So what I. What I would do is say, hey, I don't know where I'm going to end up. What are you thinking when this does happen? Are you going to live on your own and stay here for a while, for a season? And we try that out, and if it becomes too, you know, unbearable, then you can move closer. Or do you want to wait it out till I'm stationed, you know, planted somewhere, and then we figure it out? I don't know that I drag her with the ultimatum of you're either coming with me or it's over, you know, to this new phase. Because who knows what's going to happen? You know, I've. You know, we hear the stories of people who move for a significant other they're not married to, and things don't work out. And now there's extra resentment because she moved for your job that didn't pan out, and now it affected her career and her life.

[Ken Coleman]

But I don't sense that. I don't sense that that's happening because he's calling us. He already has the green light from.

[George Camel]

Her to say, sure.

[Ken Coleman]

Am I right?

[George Camel]

It's a reluctant. I'll go.

[Ken Coleman]

I think Charles is a little bit scared. Should I do this? Is that right, Charles?

[Caller]

Yes, sir. I love her very much, and I really. I want her to be very happy.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, the fact is, she's a good woman. And you're a good dude. The reason that you're thinking through this is because you really do have a sense of the compromise that she's making. And I think George is right. I think you guys, as a couple, need to figure out what our future is. You need to put a ring on her finger soon, and you guys need to start playing this out. What does this look like? What kind of money does she need to make? What's the job market? Look, she's got a head start on this, so the fact that we have a general idea of what she loves helps. What we don't know is your location. And when will you know that?

[Caller]

Before I start the academy. So I'll Graduate with my Bachelor's in about 10 months. And then I'll be working on the application process in my last quarter.

[Ken Coleman]

So she has a. So I'm trying to figure out what her.

[George Camel]

About a year lead time on how.

[Ken Coleman]

Much lead time will she have when you can say to her, hey, we're moving to this town, so, yeah, I'll.

[Caller]

Know before the academy. And the academy is about 16 weeks.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. So, you know, it's not a six month lead time, but it's enough time to do some work and figure this out. And I think that you guys got to start this marriage with this, hey, we are going to bend together so that we don't break. And she's showing a willingness to bend. And so you want to help her get back into the work that she loves, return that favor. And I think if you do this with a lot of sensitivity, but also with confidence, then, then I think you guys will be okay.

[George Camel]

Sensitive, confidence. That's how I've always thought about you, Ken. I like it.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I'm trying to get to the sensitive part. I'm working on it, George.

[George Camel]

Yeah, well, you know, I don't know what I hope. There's, there's a. There's an element of, hey, if it's meant to be, it's meant to be. If you live apart for six months, you're gonna survive. And so if it's 40 minutes away, she doesn't need to uproot her whole life and job for this, for a season. That's kind of where I'm going.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree, but they may be married, so if they're married, she's coming with them.

[George Camel]

I'd hope so. I think within these 10 months, let's figure out a plan. Let's put a ring on.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm expecting. I am expecting him to put a ring on her finger. And at this point, we're moving together and starting the life off that way, so. But anyway, appreciate the call, Charles. I think you're a good young man and appreciate the fact that you want to serve your state.

[George Camel]

Yeah. And if I ever get pulled over in the Oregon area, I hope Charles is there.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, no, you were the guy, too.

[George Camel]

Don't give me a ticket.

[Ken Coleman]

Sir, sir, by any chance, is your name Charles? Yeah. I like that. All right, quick break here on the Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. What does the future hold for business?

[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

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[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

Have future proofed themselves with NetSuite by.

[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

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[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

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[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

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[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman. Excited that you all are joining us today. 888-255-225. Let's get back to the phones. Timothy is joining us in Erie, Pennsylvania. Timothy, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hi, Ken. Hi, George. How are you guys?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, we're having a blast today. What's going on with you?

[Caller]

It's great, man. Well, I appreciate everything you guys do. I've been following you since I was 18. I just turned 19 not too long ago, so I'm freaking out right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, what are you freaking out about?

[Caller]

Everybody likes to share a little bit of details of, you know, their input on life and everything that's going on. And I'm really, really, really trying to get like, you know, a place to live. I'm going to be proposing to my girl soon, so I'm trying to figure out whether I'm renting or buying. I'd really like to buy, but I, I'm trying to follow you guys as much as I can. And like, I, I don't want to have a credit score or a credit card, but, you know, I've called two places and they've given me two different answers. I've tried with Churchill and there's just a lot going on. So some advice would be great. Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

You got, my guess is you get some, you get some cooks in the kitchen that are on the family side and friend side weighing in as well as my guest.

[Caller]

Yeah. Okay.

[George Camel]

What is the urgency to buy a house now at 19?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah. Like I said, I'm proposing to My girl soon. So that's the main one. I mean, I have. I have like a year to figure this all out. But I'm just trying to figure out.

[George Camel]

Is there a law in Pennsylvania that says you can't rent if you're married?

[Caller]

No, there's no law. No. No. I just. I just don't know. Like, I want to be putting as much as I can into savings. Right. So I don't know if I should be. How long I should be renting for, if I should, like. I know I'm okay to do that.

[George Camel]

But let me free you. There's no timeline for this. The right time to buy a house is when you're financially ready. If that's at 19, you're crushing it. If that's at 25, you're crushing it. And so I just want to free you from this idea that this has to happen now. And I've got to propose in the next two months, and I have to buy a house five months later. I can free feel that on you of just the aggression toward your goals. And I want to redirect that towards a healthier approach.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And Timothy, just full disclosure. My wife and I spent three years in an apartment, one in one city, two in another city before we bought. And it was because of what George said. We were renting until we were able to buy a home.

[George Camel]

So tell us about your financial situation. Sounds like you're debt free.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, I'm debt free. I'm working for an amazing company that they'll pay for me to go to school if I want to. I'm going to pursue a career in, like, home adjusting, and they'll pay for me to do that too, so. Great.

[George Camel]

What's your income?

[Caller]

Income right now is about like 35,000. I work two jobs. I work at a restaurant.

[George Camel]

Okay, and how much do you have.

[Caller]

In savings and then savings? Right now I have about 15 grand in my regular savings fund, and then I have four grand in retirement and a couple thousand in my emergency fund.

[George Camel]

Okay, what's the 15 for? Is that for a ring or other stuff?

[Caller]

No, that's just for the house. I actually have a fund for ring.

[George Camel]

Okay, but you don't have a fully funded emergency fund. We got this twisted. We got to get the emergency fund first, then we can start saving for the house. Okay, so how much would a. Three to six months? Yeah. What's three to six months of expenses.

[Caller]

For you right now? I know it's lower, but I mean, right now it's like 1000 and some change a month.

[George Camel]

Okay, well, let's pretend like we're in the real world. You got rent to pay, you got bills as you move into this next phase, let's call it 15 grand, as your emergency fund. And you have four grand for your down payment. Is that more fair?

[Caller]

Sure, we could do that.

[George Camel]

And we also need to buy a ring for this lovely lady. Right?

[Caller]

Right.

[Ken Coleman]

How much? But he says he's got a ring fund. How much is in that?

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, I've been saving up for that one for a while. I have about like 3,000 ready for that. And that's all ready to go.

[George Camel]

You're crushing it. Okay, so here. If I was in your shoes, and I've been in your shoes, here's what I would do. I would pause and I would rent. Maybe it's for a year, maybe you renew for two years and you stack up a nice big down payment as you get to be married and experience all of that joy and chaos because it's going to be a wild ride. So to add on home ownership on top of that, that's a lot at your age. But I love where you're going with it. And I also know you don't have a credit score because you're debt free. And you're saying, are you worried about not being able to buy a house because of that?

[Caller]

Yeah, I'm terrified. I like they, there's, you know, I mean, I keep hearing stuff like people keep telling me, like, higher interest rates for, you know, even though I can do manual underwriting, but then they'll be like, yeah, expect higher interest rates, but.

[George Camel]

Okay, can I ask you this? Have any of them actually done it?

[Caller]

No.

[George Camel]

Okay, can I tell you this? I have actually done it. So would you trust my experience over theirs? George, I trust you any day that means the world.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

So let me tell you this. There are a few hoops to jump through. One being verification of income. You have that for 12 to 24 months?

[Caller]

Yeah. Coming up on me.

[George Camel]

Great. You'll need rental payment history on time. Rental payments for at least 12 months. You'll have that once you've rented, Right?

[Caller]

Okay.

[George Camel]

You have a 12 month history of your bank statements and saving statements. Your debt to income ratio is amazing because you don't have any. And then you have something else you're paying for, like a cell phone bill or an insurance bill regularly.

[Caller]

Yeah, insurance.

[George Camel]

Great. That's all it takes to do manual underwriting. So anyone else who's saying otherwise has not done it. And if you call Churchill, I'M sure they told you that. They said, hey, you do need on time rental payments. Was that the one that threw you off because you didn't have that.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. And they suggested what I could do is I could, you know, pay a little bit of money. How to track record to my mom and dad and like, pay.

[Ken Coleman]

Exactly.

[Caller]

They could put that in the savings account.

[George Camel]

You could pay your parents 400 bucks a month for 12 months and that could count.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

And so just rest assured, it's not as scary as you think. The reins aren't going to be astronomically higher. I've done it myself. I had a great rate when I did this back in 2019. It was a very easy process. Churchill makes it super easy. They'll walk you through everything you need to know. But I would not let that be the stress point. You got enough on your plate right now. I would continue saving. I'd get, I'd propose, get married, pay cash for the wedding, rent for a year or two, and then you guys will have a fat stack of money and you'll be able to do it from a place of strength.

[Ken Coleman]

And the key there, Timothy, is what George just laid out for you. The time it's going to take to save up the down payment, the right kind of down payment. You're going to have all of those qualifications taken care of. So deep breath, exhale. And, and, and don't listen to all the voices that want to throw an opinion at you. George just gave you the absolute truth. There is no other opinion you need to be considering, period.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

You got it?

[Caller]

Yeah. I. Would you recommend what they were saying with like, you know, living at home for a little bit and then giving them money? Or would you say like, get on my own?

[George Camel]

I would. I mean, you're mate, you have a salary. I'd say it's, it's healthy and independent for you to get on your own. If you want to stay home until you have the next step of proposal or engagement, that's totally fine. But I would start making payments to your parents.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Just so that you're not caught off guard, you know, come six months from now. But I do think it's going to take more time to get a down payment. You know, 15 grand is not going to cut it in today's housing market. And so we've got tons of resources for you, Timothy. Log on to ramseysolutions.com realestate. We have an entire home hub for you there. And I'll even give you Ramsey plus, which will include my Video course on how to buy a home the right way. And watch that, you can watch it with your soon to be fiance and go, hey, this is a, this is going to be on our radar in the next few years. I'd love to watch this and get prepared and see what you think of it.

[Ken Coleman]

And Timothy, the only thing I'd add is I don't want you to take some of this nervous energy and let's put it into making more money. You're working two jobs and pulling down 35,000. I want to see that change. You need to be, you need to be getting more money for your time and so put all that energy into increasing your income right now. You have everything else under control and that focus on making more money will help with your nerves. George gave you a lot of clarity and the clarity that George gave you should give you confidence now.

[George Camel]

Right?

[Ken Coleman]

So we want confident Timothy going out there, he's got a plan and let's go make more money because more money allows us to advance the plan quicker.

[George Camel]

That'll increase your savings rate, help you get that down payment faster.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[George Camel]

So it's a great, a great call. Timothy, thank you for that question. You're, you're far beyond Most Americans at 19. So I want to encourage him. There's, and to that, the interest rate question. My interest rate. I actually ran the numbers with the folks at Churchill and they told me if you do our plan 15 year fixed rate loan with at least 10% down, you will get the same rate as someone with excellent credit. So he disproved it with facts. But you know, people don't care about facts in the face of their feelings. A lot of the times, well, it's.

[Ken Coleman]

Just people don't know what they're talking about and so that's why they come here. And George just dispels the fake news folks.

[George Camel]

Buck the system.

[Ken Coleman]

There it is. That's why I wrote the best selling book Breaking Free from Broke. Go get it. Listen to the man. He's wearing corduroy.

[George Camel]

That's, that's all you need to know.

[Ken Coleman]

It's all the credibility you need. All right, quick break. More of the Ramsey show coming right up. Statistics show that half of Americans don't.

[George Camel]

Have enough life insurance or they don't.

[Ken Coleman]

Have any at all.

[George Camel]

I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're not going to die or something.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life.

[Caller]

Insurance is if you hate your wife and kids.

[Ken Coleman]

And I immediately went and got term life insurance.

[George Camel]

That's a gut punch.

[Ken Coleman]

For decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse, they've lost somebody important to them.

[George Camel]

Me too.

[Ken Coleman]

They don't know what to do next. You're going to have a crisis here. You know, you got two options. While you're sitting and talking to a.

[George Camel]

Young widow, she's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow.

[Caller]

That's exactly.

[George Camel]

These are the two options. It's saying I love you to your family. Term life insurance, Jeff Zander and the team at Zander Insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years. They're the only people I trust.

[Ken Coleman]

Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman. The Phone number is 888-2552-258882-55225. What are your money questions? You need to know what to do with it. You need to make more of it. Well, you got the duo today. We want to help you make more money and keep it. Let's go to New York City where Rob joins us. Rob, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hey, guys. Appreciate you taking my call. I guess I've got kind of like a decent problem to have, but it's kind of a problem nonetheless. Okay. I think I've kind of been, I'm 25. I've saved about like 200 grand. I don't know what for. And I'm making about like 120 a year. But I kind of like, I kind of like live like a rat because I don't eat too much. Like, every time I move, I get a place with a cheaper rent. And then I've gotten promoted every year I've been there and I make more money. But for me, it's kind of like I've been very removed from the present. I feel like I, I don't know why I'm saving the money. I don't, I'm kind of from out in the sticks. I don't really like New York City. Like, I like fishing and eating wild plants and stuff. Like, I kind of don't have much reason to be in New York, but it's like a really good job. Yeah, but I'm not present and I don't.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, Rob, I feel you. I'm so glad you called today. I feel like I walked into the studio today in large part to get to talk to you, man. This is first of all, kudos. The first half of your description of you George is like you're the poster child for George, but then you start talking about eating wild plants and fishing and then you lost him. But the fact that you've saved $200,000.

[George Camel]

At 25, George, you haven't let lifestyle creep crush you. I love that you've stayed a very sane person.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[George Camel]

And you're self aware enough at 25 to go, this ain't it. Most people, rob, that takes 20, 30 years of a career to finally admit that. So I'm proud of you.

[Ken Coleman]

So, Rob, you're a young guy. You may never have heard this phrase before, but I'm going to introduce it to you because I think it's a great metaphor for where you are. There's an old phrase called the golden handcuffs and it's referring to somebody who had been at a company for a long time. They make good money, they got great benefits, strong retirement, and they don't want to be there, but they feel the golden handcuffs because it's good money. And there's an emotional handcuff there that says if I were to leave this, it would be foolish. Those who don't have what I have would think that I'm crazy. And I think you're experiencing that rarely enough at the age of 25. Does that feel right to you?

[Caller]

Yeah, exactly. And like, you guys also mentioned the term lifestyle creep, but for me it's kind of like maybe I've, maybe, maybe that should happen. I can be like a little bit more present.

[Ken Coleman]

I think you should probably enjoy life a little bit more and. But the good news is George is on today and George can speak to that because I'm, I, I am in a fun way. I play with you a little bit on this because George does very well, but he really is the most frugal person and he will say things sometimes in conversation. We sit right next to each other and he will say things sometimes where I literally look at you and I go, bro, like you've earned it. Live a little bit. So I want you to speak to that mindset in a minute, but I want to first focus on this biggest issue. Rob, you don't need George and I's permission today, but I think you need to hear Us say it is okay for you to leave New York and a really good paying job to go do something somewhere else that is more in line with the way you want to live. And you can still make that 120k and more. And I think just acknowledging that, I hope will set you free today. That doesn't mean you leave today. And it doesn't mean you walk in and resign and just go wee. But if there's anybody who could, you could, because you got $200,000 in the bank.

[George Camel]

That's financial peace right there.

[Ken Coleman]

And so my question is, is what's the work that you're doing? What field are you in?

[Caller]

So I work in, like, financial services. I work in risk management at one of, like, the brokers in the city.

[Ken Coleman]

Very, very prestigious is my guess.

[Caller]

Yeah. And that's like another thing. It's like, you know, that probably attracted me to it. And I do like my job. Like, I actually. Great as far as jobs go. Like, I enjoy it, but I also kind of burn myself out again. I kind of like pathologize the kind of like, live to work thing. Well, you know why, you know all that?

[Ken Coleman]

You know why you're trying to prove something to somebody.

[Caller]

Probably to myself.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go. Hey, by the way, the voice in our head is the most damaging, the.

[George Camel]

Hardest person to please.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So here's what I would say. In short order, you enjoy doing work in the finance field. So there are lots of ways you can do that somewhere else, where you're close to fishing, where you're in an environment that you enjoy, and the hobbies and the things that you need to be healthy distractions from this, this voice that you're dealing with that says, I've got to prove, I've got to prove, I gotta prove. And, boy, you're talking to a guy who is currently in recovery from that kind of stuff. Okay. I'm as serious as I can be. I get it. I've been living my life with a chip on my shoulder because of something that happened to me when I was 14.

[Caller]

I relate to that.

[Ken Coleman]

Listen, I'm in the middle of recovery. I'm being as vulnerable as I can be. I'm uncomfortable right now, James, how vulnerable I'm being. But Rob, like, so what has helped me is to go, wait a second. There's this voice in my head that is constantly asking, am I good enough? So I don't know what your voice is, but I think at this stage of your life, at 25, the fact that you resonated with Something that I said, and it's in your story, and I'm not going to unpack that on the air. I think you know what it is. But can I tell you, I would go get some therapy and dig on that now at 25, and I think that will be the bridge that you build mentally and emotionally that will lead you out of New York, lead you to where you need to be and doing similar work that you're doing. And I think you'll be more fulfilled than you can ever imagine. Jordan, I want you to weigh in on that because you also have a unique point of view, and I think you resonate with this as well.

[George Camel]

As you guys are talking, Rob, I think you've got somewhat of a flat tire. Your financial life and your career life, you're crushing it. I would assume, prove me wrong. That relationships may be struggling, social life might be struggling, spiritual life might be struggling. And I think leaning more into those areas right now can help you realize, oh, I actually like New York. I like this job. I just needed a better community. I need to get plugged into a local church. I don't know what that is for you, but I realized that at 25, you kind of have this quarter life crisis of, like, what did I. I just followed this path that was laid before me, and here I am. And they told me it would be amazing, and it's not.

[Ken Coleman]

That's great insight. You know, That's a great insight, Rob. Maybe it's not New York. Maybe it's just you and functioning in New York. But for a fun exercise, if you could snap your fingers right now and you're doing similar work and you're making similar money with a nice path to making more money, is there any place in the US that you would just go, okay, if I could transplant from where I am to here, Ken, I think that would be a fun adventure to see if that was awesome. What comes to mind.

[Caller]

So my favorite states are, like, Vermont and Maine. I. The thing is, like, I think I could go, like, an hour up the train line from New York and be like, I've been up to, like, Tarrytown and, like, Sleepy Hollow up there. And it's awesome. Like, it's trees and rivers, all that junk. Not junk, but all that stuff. And my concern is, like, do I overdo it or underdo it? So I felt like I've been not present for, like, five years after college or four years, whatever. And now I'm kind of like, do I like yo, yo and, like, live in a van for A year and like start a, you know, channel and go fishing.

[Ken Coleman]

So. So, Rob, the answer is never to yo, yo. And when any of us. Yo, yo, we're not healthy.

[George Camel]

And never YouTube in the RV, please. Yeah, just keep it to yourself.

[Ken Coleman]

You know what I think you ought to do? And I'm going to be super, super practical here, George, please tell me what you think. I think you need to spend a weekend. You got all kinds of money. I'd like to see you rent a cabin up there in Sleepy Hollow and see if you can find Ichabod Crane while you're up there. You know, the Headless horseman. The whole nine yards.

[George Camel]

Full hatchet, full castaway for a long weekend.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, go fish, go hunt and practice. This idea of being present. I think you've self diagnosed pretty well, George. That's what I'm. I think he knows he's not present and I think he needs to feel something, you know?

[George Camel]

And that's when you see. Is scratching the itch enough or is this a full time move? I need to get out of the city completely, forever.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[George Camel]

And we can't decide that for you, Rob. But I hope we've given you enough next tactical steps to get there.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Rob, listen to your heart. I'm just telling. Listen to your heart. Listen to your heart. And then engage the brain, the logic. It can move on its own, but the heart and the head must be connected on big moves like this. But I think you're a sharp young man and I think you're gonna do great things. This is the Ramsey Show.

[George Camel]

Okay, here's the hard truth.

[Ken Coleman]

Your investment dollars could be winding up in the pockets of companies that hold positions you don't agree with. People are unknowingly putting money into tech giants and household brands that don't match.

[George Camel]

Up with their core values.

[Ken Coleman]

But here's good news. Timothy Plan is at the forefront of biblically responsible investing.

[George Camel]

That means Timothy Plan uses a strategy.

[Ken Coleman]

That lets investors chase competitive returns while staying rock solid in their beliefs. So if you're ready to invest with a clean conscience, it's time to check out Timothy Plan.

[George Camel]

Request [e-mail] to learn more or contact your financial advisor today to see if.

[Ken Coleman]

Timothy Plan is right for you. Timothyplan.com Investing includes risk, including possible loss of principle.

[George Camel]

Before investing, carefully consider a fund's investment objective.

[Ken Coleman]

Risk, charges and expenses contained in the.

[George Camel]

Prospectus or summary Prospectus, [e-mail] Read carefully before investing. Mutual funds distributed by Timothy Partners Ltd and ETFs distributed by Foresight Fund Services, LLC.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Camel. I'm Ken Coleman. The phone number to jump in is 888-255-2225. Let's go to Jessica, who is joining us in Knoxville, Tennessee, just on the other side of the city State. Jessica, how can we help?

[Caller]

How do I insulate and separate myself from my husband who has a massive spending addiction?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, no. What? Can you describe that briefly to us?

[Caller]

Yeah, it's super easy. He spends and sends and spent. He has had to empty his 401k three times to pay off debt that he has accrued. He takes out consolidation loans with out my consent. He bought a car without my consent. The payment for that is almost a thousand dollars a month.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, my goodness.

[Caller]

And it just, like, it just goes and goes and goes.

[Ken Coleman]

How long has this been happening?

[Caller]

Oh, years.

[Ken Coleman]

And this entire time you have always said, stop doing this. I'm not in favor of this. This scares me. Yeah.

[Caller]

Yep. He has no, like, no concept of it.

[Ken Coleman]

Have you guys been to therapy?

[Caller]

Yep.

[Ken Coleman]

And.

[Caller]

And he. He won't go.

[George Camel]

Well, then you haven't been. Do you go on your own?

[Caller]

So I've been going, and then I started doing the Snowball Method. So I have been spending the last five years, like, doing anything that's associated with me, and I have, like, simultaneously been paying off and saving, and I've paid off so far. $31,751.84. I have $19,391.17 in cash saved.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you have separate accounts?

[Caller]

Yes. $9,608.14 in investment saved. And I have $6,005.43 left in debt, like on credit cards.

[George Camel]

Pay off your debt today with the money you have.

[Caller]

Okay.

[George Camel]

And do you have any debt that's in your name beyond that, or is the rest in his name only?

[Caller]

The rest is only in his name.

[George Camel]

Okay, so that's going to be his name.

[Caller]

The stuff that he's buying, like cars and all this stuff because they were obtained during marriage. Am I going to get stuck with these?

[George Camel]

Your name's not on there, so you're not going to be liable for that loan. Okay, so here's the deal. You've already separated finances.

[Caller]

Heading. This is heading clearly towards divorce. Because I. I can't.

[Ken Coleman]

Does he. Does he know this?

[Caller]

I've already explained this.

[George Camel]

Is he in La La land? Like, does he shut down when you bring any of this up?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

He thinks that because he is the breadwinner and he makes all the money and because I'm on disability, that he should be able to spend whatever he wants, whenever he wants. And I.

[George Camel]

So he doesn't understand that his decisions affect you financially, emotionally, maritally. Okay. He's made that very clear on where he stands.

[Ken Coleman]

And he's not participating in therapy. So I think we've got some real clear gates that you have walked through here. And I think certainly separation is of order here to see if there's a wake up.

[Caller]

I've gone through fair. Like, I've been doing therapy. So, like, that's not. This is not like I need to go to therapy. I need to like.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, no, I'm sorry. You're right. I think.

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

But I was. When I asked that question, I was talking about you two as a couple to see if we've actually fought for this. Yeah. You can't do it for him. I know you can't do it for me, but.

[Caller]

And it's to the, you know, that whole. You can lead a horse to water. Can't make them drink that part. So.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Caller]

I just been trying to figure out, like, how do I separate and insulate myself from that? And then with what I have saved and what I have, like, investment wise, like, in theory, I know that a judge or whatever would maybe do some type of spousal support, but I know that's not guaranteed and it's not for forever, but I have an income of $1,054 a month from disability.

[Ken Coleman]

And that's my question. Are you. Does your disability prohibit you from being able to make a steady income?

[Caller]

I think I can make like $600 a month or something.

[Ken Coleman]

Why? Because you'll lose the disability payment.

[George Camel]

How much is the disability payment?

[Ken Coleman]

Hold on a second. But you missed my question, Jessica. I'm saying, is there an end to this physical challenge that you will be able to get through through medical care, or is this a. I'm trying to understand what you can actually do. Forget the benefit payment.

[Caller]

No, no, it's permanent disability.

[Ken Coleman]

So you are unable to work from home, do a remote job, and make. And work 40 hours a week.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. That's what I wanted to understand. So you've got it? Yeah. This is. George, this is a fixed and a very low fixed income. Yeah, yeah.

[Caller]

Like, I've had five separate spine surgeries. Like, just that part of me, like, I'm. I'm a mess.

[George Camel]

So sorry, Jesse. I wish I could, you know, have my rose colored glasses on and tell you the three steps to solving all of this. I can't change people. I don't have the magic wand. And so if you've made it very clear of, hey, this is what it's going to take for this marriage to work and he's unable to fulfill that, I would be talking to an attorney and figuring out how do I at least protect myself, how do I begin a phase of separation so that you don't get dragged down with him?

[Ken Coleman]

And I would say, Jessica, George told you. I hope you caught it. Pay off the debt today. Your debt. Go ahead and do that. I know that cash is very attractive sitting in that savings account, but one of the best things you can do to protect yourself on a very low fixed income is to have no debt. So I'm glad she has that right, George. Yeah, that's what we want.

[George Camel]

We want saving grace quickly.

[Ken Coleman]

Get that out now before your brain.

[George Camel]

Talks you out of it, reduces your expenses so that you're going to be able to hopefully survive off of your fixed income even if there isn't spousal support. That's where I would go. Sit down and make a budget for yourself based on. Here's what my expenses would be if I was doing this on my own.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, man.

[George Camel]

So sorry.

[Ken Coleman]

Tough, tough call. Today's question of the day is brought to you by. Why refi? Why refi Refinances defaulted private student loans. Defaulted means when the borrower can't make the required payments. So if that's you and your private student loan, contact y refi, they can offer a low fixed rate loan built for you. Go to yrefi.comramsey today. That's the letter y r e f y.com ramsey it may not be available in all states.

[George Camel]

All right. Today's question comes from Camilla in Hawaii. My husband and I are on baby steps four and six. We have no kids. He's in the military and I'm a lawyer. Our gross annual income is $250,000 and we have no debts except our mortgage of 350. We have a fully funded emergency fund and we invest 15% of our income and we still have 3,000 left over at the end of every month. Is it a mistake to put all the extra money towards paying off the house early? I'm wondering if we should be investing a portion of it and taking a more balanced approach.

[Ken Coleman]

Now that's a fun question of the day.

[George Camel]

Is really fun. So here's the deal. I do you have to throw it every single penny at the house? No baby steps four and six you're moving from intensity to intentionality. I am a nerd. I might be throwing it, all of it towards the house.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, is it? No. If that's you, every dime is going.

[George Camel]

But you also might want to go, we haven't taken a vacation in five years. We should probably save up for that. So what I would do is set up sinking funds for things that you actually enjoy like a vacation or hey, it's really time to upgrade that car. We're in four and six. We make 250 grand. We don't have any debt with the mortgage. Let's enjoy life and upgrade a little bit with a reasonable approach. And that's where the sinking funds in the budget and planning for that fun money. Help me let loose of the reins of I got to pay all every penny should be going towards this. You don't need to live like you're, you're on fire because nothing's on fire here. But I would set a goal and say, hey, if we put a grand extra on the mortgage, we'll be done with this five years early. Let's make that a goal. The extra two grand let's put towards these other things for now. And you can always change it as you enter different seasons of life.

[Ken Coleman]

A quick follow up question for new folks that are joining us all the time. We have so many people joining us all the time that are new to the show. George, when you say sinking funds, are those separate savings accounts or is it all just clearly earmarked in one savings account?

[George Camel]

I like to set them up separately. So there's a car savings account and we're going to put 500 bucks a month into that account. That helps delineate it so you don't go, oh, there's a big pile of money for lord knows what, that's where.

[Ken Coleman]

And you don't have to have an Excel spreadsheet for that when you've got the separate account so you can set.

[George Camel]

It up in your every dollar budget.

[Ken Coleman]

I love throwing George the questions like that. I got nervous sometimes. One of the people I know.

[George Camel]

One of these days you're going to catch me, Coleman.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't think so. I think, I think you're too smart. All right, fun hour. This is the Ramsey Show.

[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

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[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

That's by R N A.comdave welcome to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell is alongside. And we are here to help you win with your money, win in your profession and win in your relationships. Triple 882-55-2225 is the phone number 888-25-5225. Chris is going to start us off in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Chris, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hi. Thanks for having me on the show. So recently my in laws have moved back in with us for a second time. They've made plenty of poor financial decisions and again wound themselves back up living with us again as of the beginning of this month. And we're kind of trying to figure out what we can do to, you know, we tried helping them and they don't really want our help.

[Ken Coleman]

What was the attempt? Describe the attempt to help.

[Caller]

Yeah. So without providing any financial, you know, help to them, we offered to sit down, help them with the budget. My wife and I have taken the financial peace courses. We're trying to they did actually say they're going to attend it with me as we are going to reattend it again. So they're interested in it. We'll see if it happens. I'm in school for finances, so I feel like I'm pretty, pretty decent at making a budget. So I'm trying to help them with that. And they shut us down immediately and get pretty upset with us.

[George Camel]

Why did they shut down?

[Caller]

I think it's just they, you know, they struggled with it for so long and they don't feel like they need the help and they can figure it out on their own.

[George Camel]

Well, then have them move out. Why are you enabling them?

[Caller]

You're right.

[George Camel]

If they can do it on their own, say, hey, it's, we've, we've been happy to help. Sounds like you guys have it figured out. Best of Luck out there. Sometimes the best thing you can do for someone, even though it feels harsh in the moment, I agree.

[Ken Coleman]

And Kris, I have a question. Did they ask to stay with you or did your wife offer?

[Caller]

They, they kind of assumed at first, and then my wife finally did offer, but under temporary circumstances of, you know, hey, we can, we can help you for like a month, get you situated, get you going. So we're still, we're coming up at the end of that month. It doesn't seem like they're going to get out. They recently refinanced a payday loan, refinance their car.

[Ken Coleman]

Are they both working?

[Caller]

My father in law works and his take home comes out to about 60,000 a year.

[Ken Coleman]

And so is the mother in law able to work? Does she have a passport?

[Caller]

She is able to work. She is able to work, yes, but she's just not.

[Ken Coleman]

She's just putzing around the house.

[George Camel]

So it sounds like there really were no conditions of them living here other than, hey, let's aim for a month. Yeah, I would have a lot of strings attached.

[Ken Coleman]

When this happened last time, how long did they stay? And was there a same kind of a deal? This is a certain amount of time. Or did there. Was that not the case?

[George Camel]

Right.

[Caller]

So when they moved last time, they kind of followed us when we relocated across, across the state because they wanted to be closer to grandkids. They had a house, they couldn't make payments on it and move at the same time, so they decided just to let it foreclose and moved in for.

[George Camel]

A couple months so they could find.

[Caller]

A new place here after their foreclosure of their house.

[Ken Coleman]

If you said to your wife today, hey, babe, I think I need to be the man of the house. I know they're your parents, but this is. I'm the man of the house here. And to a lot of people that may sound archaic, but I'm gonna stick with it. George. And you said to her, I'd like to have a respectful conversation, but say, hey, the month is coming up. We agreed to a month and we think that you guys need to move out. It's best for everybody. And we can't. We've tried to help. You've met it with resistance. And I'm enabling you some form of that speech. In Chris's words, if you suggested that to her, how would she react?

[Caller]

Obviously, I think she would be upset in the fact that it's her parents. She doesn't want to just throw them out. But she has come to understand, you know, that we're enabling them by doing this. Not, you know, they're not willing to accept our help. Even if they were to, even if they were to stay longer but allow us to help them with a budget so they can get going in the right direction, it wouldn't be as bad. But the fact that they won't even allow us to help, I definitely think.

[George Camel]

She would understand that.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. But my point in asking that was if she's not comfortable with you doing it, is she comfortable doing it?

[Caller]

And we brought that up and she's, she's getting a lot more comfortable with.

[Ken Coleman]

It, then let her. That's what I would do. I'd let her lead. But I would keep saying, babe, I'm here to support. You got to have this conversation. If you're not comfortable, I'll be the bad guy. But you've got to kind of, you really got to keep that thing going. You cannot, because it's going to end up affecting your relationship.

[George Camel]

It probably already has. And so she needs to be leading this. It's her parents. And so for the son in law to get involved, it's just too sticky. And.

[Ken Coleman]

But unless she's not willing. That's why I threw that out there.

[George Camel]

It sounds like she, she knows they're not going to care what she has to say. And so that can be a conversation you guys have together, the four of you, and say, hey, we love you guys. We want to help you get back on track. Here's what it's going to take. Here's the conditions. We want you to be financially independent. You're going to start paying rent. We're going to show you how to budget. You're going to take fpu, and we're going to, we're going to help you get out of this thing. But it's not going to be by bailing you out financially. It's by showing you the steps. You've got to be willing to do the work, otherwise this situation can't work.

[Ken Coleman]

I think it's not already. Sorry, George, interrupt. I apologize. I. I think that. Thanks. I want to point this out and tell me if you disagree, because I want Chris to hear this. I think his wife needs to hear this. I don't see a scenario where this doesn't really ruffle their feathers. It sounds like the parents are like, look, leave us alone. We'll figure it out on our own. Obviously, they don't know how to. And they're not interested in leaving anytime soon. And there is a sense of entitlement this is now not an entitled, spoiled teenager. These are entitled adults.

[George Camel]

That's scarier.

[Ken Coleman]

Aren't mature in their finances and they are leveraging their parental position over their daughter. And I don't see how this goes well.

[George Camel]

This might be manipulative.

[Ken Coleman]

My point is, is that I think this is a rip the band aid off. Respectfully. I don't mean like, you know, slash and burn, but I don't see how this goes well at all other than it, it frees up Chris and his wife and creates a boundary that needs to be in place. Do you agree with that?

[George Camel]

Absolutely. I don't think they should be living with him. I understand you guys tried it. You tried to help him once. I think at this point he makes good money, he can figure it out. Rent, he's going to have to figure out these payday loans. And you can always be there to support with resources and say, hey, show up to this course with me. Show up to this course. But intermingling them with your personal life in your own house, I think that's not going to work anymore.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And you know what's interesting to George? What I heard. I appreciate that Chris and his wife wanted to help him do a budget, but you know what? Showing somebody how to do a budget is not enough if they don't want to do it. No amount of instruction or they're not.

[George Camel]

Experiencing enough pain right now because they're living rent free. But when you need a roof over your head, mama's going to work. She has no option.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yeah? What is she?

[George Camel]

And so I don't think this is going to lead to them actually living on the streets. It's just going to lead to them saying, all right, we got to figure this out. And asking your kids to bail you out is just a gross injustice to me.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, I was just sitting here thinking as I have, I have 19 year old, two 16 year olds. I don't want my kids coming back to live with me. I love my kids. I'm brokenhearted with my oldest in college for the first time. Right. But at the same time, it's natural, it's normal. And I don't want him to come back and live with me. The only thing worse than your kids coming back to live with you are your parents.

[George Camel]

Can you imagine if.

[Ken Coleman]

Unless it's a health situation and you're there caring?

[George Camel]

Yeah, there's.

[Ken Coleman]

Let me see.

[George Camel]

And generationally and different cultures that are going to come at us. Ken is to go, you don't understand. I get it. But this is a very different situation. What I'm talking about enabling misbehavior versus living generationally with grandma.

[Ken Coleman]

Thank you. Very clarifying that you bailed me out from all the hate. What I'm saying is your parents come back to live with you because they can't support themselves financially because of their irresponsibility. That's what I'm saying. Oh, wow. Not easy stuff, tough stuff, Chris. But you and your wife, you got the right instincts. Follow them. This is the Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored by Better Help. Hey everyone, listen. We all have stories.

[George Camel]

The family and cultural stories that we were born into.

[Ken Coleman]

The stories of the things that have happened to us, both the good stuff and the challenging stuff. And we have those stories that we constantly tell ourselves. And none of us can go back and change any of our old stories. But the world is waiting to see what each of us is going to write next. As we enter 2025, I encourage you to examine your old stories and be intentional about the new stories that you're going to write.

[George Camel]

And I'm not talking about making goals.

[Ken Coleman]

That are going to be long gone by February. I'm talking about writing new stories that will change your life and the lives of those you love for the better forever. If you're like me, therapy can be a great place to explore the old stories and heal from them and begin writing new ones. If you're thinking about starting therapy, I want you to consider my friends at Better Help. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy and you can talk with your therapist when it works for your schedule. You just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist and you can switch at any time for no extra cost. So start writing a new story this month with better help. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H-E-L-P.com/Deloney. Hey, Dave Ramsey here.

[George Camel]

Dr. John DeLoney and I are coming to a city near you on the Money and Relationships Tour. You, the audience will vote to choose the topics.

[Ken Coleman]

We talk about things that impact your.

[George Camel]

Life, like investing in your future, money, stress in marriage, and more. We're coming to Louisville, Durham, Atlanta, Kansas City, Fort Worth and Phoenix in April and May. 2025. Tickets are at their lowest price right now. Grab [e-mail] tour.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman. So excited you're with us. Triple 882-55-5225 is the phone number. Let's go to Des Moines, Iowa. Monica is there. Monica, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hello. Thank you for taking my call today.

[Ken Coleman]

You bet.

[Caller]

I am just extremely worried and hope that you can help me break down what I currently have in retirement to maybe give me some peace of mind that at the age of 67, I may be able to retire frugally.

[Ken Coleman]

How old are you now?

[Caller]

I'm 56. I'll be 57 in April.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, give us the numbers. George has got his handy calculator ready to crunch.

[Caller]

Great. Great. Well, I'm going to tell you. The salary that I make currently is $47,840. I currently have an IRA that has $47,702 in it, and I can contribute 200 per month to that IRA. I have a CD that I locked up for 13 months at 5% interest. It currently has $36,022 in it. I have a Roth IRA and a job I started a year ago. It has $2,581 in that I am contributing 8% and set it up for a 2% per year increase until I reach 15%. And then in my savings, I currently have $12,237. I put 20% of each check into that savings account. I do not have any debt. I'm debt free, but I do not own a home. I went through a divorce in 2018. Took years to pay off my debt to get to where I am now, debt free.

[Ken Coleman]

What would be three to six months expenses for you?

[Caller]

Very minimal because I live with my significant other. He doesn't have a house payment, so I just pay utilities. We split utilities. We split groceries. So, you know, maybe, maybe 1,200amonth.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so you have more than three to six months in that savings account with the 12,000. That's what I was trying to get to.

[Caller]

Oh, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

So you're doing 17 things at once, Monica, and none of them are inherently bad. So let me encourage you that you're in a good spot at 57, being debt free. You've got a little nest egg going. You've got some savings going. But we're doing like seven things. Like, you got the CD over here. We got some savings here. We're doing a little investing here. What's the deal with, with increasing it from the 8%? Why not just go? I'm going to invest 15% with the Ramsey plan. I'm going to do the Roth accounts and see where I go there.

[Caller]

I'm. I am so open to that. That's why I wanted to talk to you today.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

I am completely. I live very frugally. The only thing that I spend a decent amount of money on is good organic produce and grass fed meat.

[George Camel]

I want to keep you, which means you need more in retirement because you're going to live to be 120 at this rate by eating so healthy.

[Ken Coleman]

Monica, quick question, George, before you get to your. Your crunching of numbers. Do we expect to marry this significant other?

[Caller]

I would love that. But the Significant other is 60 years old and never been married, never had children. I'm working on that. We're both Christians and I'm not feeling comfortable with the situation that we're currently in. I was going to say we're not married.

[Ken Coleman]

Not sure what church is good with that situation. Monica.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

No judgment here. I mean, working on that. And we love that you're working on it.

[George Camel]

She's working on it. She's working on a lot of things, Ken. A lot of irons in the fire.

[Ken Coleman]

But see, that changes the equation a little bit. George, I wanted you to have that information.

[George Camel]

That's good to know because you don't have a mortgage and you may not.

[Ken Coleman]

What's his. What's his income?

[Caller]

He is 100,000 a year, but he retires next July.

[Ken Coleman]

What kind of nest egg does he have?

[Caller]

I think he said he'll be able to with what he has in his pension and retirement. He'll retire with like 50 or 60,000 a year. So it's not a ton.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Okay. All right, George, take it away.

[Caller]

I'm.

[George Camel]

You guys have separate finances.

[Caller]

Correct.

[George Camel]

Okay. So I'm going to pretend like this is Monica's situation through retirement, is that she's doing this on her own. Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah.

[George Camel]

So I crunched your current numbers. Here's what I found out. You got 50 grand in retirement accounts. Let's say from 57 to 67. You invest 15%. You never get a raise. It's about 600 bucks a month. Right. Of your $48,000 salary and assuming a 10% rate of return, you'd have 258,000. Now that's great. That's not enough for me to retire on. I don't know about you. I'd want a bigger nest egg.

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

So what does that tell us? We need to, A, get our income up and savings rate up. And B, we might need to work longer than expected if our body allows us. So you might need to do both of those things. And I would recommend it because if we can get your income up, get your investing rate up, have you work a little bit longer now, we can go. Okay. We might retire with half a million. The other piece of this equation is you're gonna have to pay rent the rest of your life if we don't get into a house with a fixed expense. And so that's the part that worries me here. I hope you guys are together a long time. I hope you get married, because that changes this equation completely. But this idea of you sort of just not having anything, not building towards something at your age gives me some pause.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Have you had this conversation with him that just how you feel about your own finances?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

How does he react?

[Caller]

And I'm going to tell you, to be honest with you, I. I have so much anxiety over this that it's been a year that I can barely sleep because this. It takes the enjoyment out of my life because of this constant fear and worry. Now, I know we none of us know about tomorrow, but you still have to have a plan.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Well. And George is addressing that plan. So when George hits you with that, what is your reaction that you can do tangibly when it comes to income saving money, what immediately comes to mind? Because you got to stop worrying and start getting busy. Part of this challenge is you didn't have a clear vision of what you need to do. George just gave it to you. But now the second thing is we start getting busy, and the busier I am attacking something that is a potential problem, the less I'm worrying about it. Do you resonate with that?

[Caller]

Yes, I do.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. So what can you do tactically, coming out of what George just told you?

[Caller]

Well, first and foremost, immediately, I can increase my. My Roth to 15%.

[George Camel]

Good.

[Caller]

Maybe get a second job or look for another job with a higher salary. Yeah.

[George Camel]

Can you make 60, 70,000 in your field doing something similar with your experience?

[Caller]

I have a pretty decent amount in Social Security right now, which probably won't be there, but for years I made six figures. It's just the rigorous travel in the sales that I was in. I just couldn't deal with it anymore. I was on the road, you know, four nights a week.

[George Camel]

Who told you there's no sales roles that you could do without traveling all the time?

[Caller]

No one.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, she just. I get it. You downshifted. I get the downshift. But, hey, you downshifted. Now you're on the other side of this, and you got a lot of experience. My guess is your resume is very impressive.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Let's Go get it. Monica, you can sell. You are a six figure earner. Go. You want to attack this worry and sleep well at night? Start making some more money and putting more money away.

[Caller]

Agreed.

[Ken Coleman]

Come on, Monica, do not let this fear happen to you. You need to happen to it. Let me tell you something I've learned, okay? I've had the privilege at Ramsey Solutions, not counting the Ramsey show, but on the Ken Coleman show. George, I've coached over 10,000 people and they're trying to make more money or experience more meaning and work. And Monica, here's what I want you to hear. There's a formula that I've learned because people call me and they're paralyzed. Do I take this job? Do I stretch out to this? Do I get a degree? You know, they're trying to figure out what do I do to make my life better through my work. And here's what I've learned. George, you've heard me say this. And Monica, I want you to catch this. Clarity always breeds confidence. And confidence breeds courage. And I think that's what you need today. And George just gave you tremendous clarity. And you got it. You repeated back exactly what we would want you to do. There's your clarity. Let that clarity, that action plan that you laid out for us so clearly, let that be the thing that you focus on and watch what happens. George, your confidence is going to go up. And then the confidence gives you that courage to keep going, keep trying, get a new gig here.

[George Camel]

The income then goes up along with confidence.

[Ken Coleman]

There we go.

[George Camel]

Savings rate goes up. The nest egg will start to grow. And you might need to work until you're 72. And I hope you're able bodied with all those organic foods. Oh, that. You know, you're still very limber.

[Ken Coleman]

Monica's eating clean. She can.

[George Camel]

She can. We could learn a thing or two from Monica.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Hey, Monica, hang on the line. Jump on ramseysolutions.com guide. We've got a free investing guide. It's going to walk you through this much more detail. Anyone can go get a Ramsey Solutions.com guide.

[Ken Coleman]

Monica, you're going to be okay. This is the Ramsey show.

[George Camel]

Hey, what's up, guys? It's Jade Warshaw. And I'm just going to cut to the chase. If anyone knows about paying off student loans, it's me. Okay? My husband and I had $460,000 of debt and 280,000 of it was student loans.

[Ken Coleman]

So I know the pressure that you feel when you have that debt weighing you down.

[George Camel]

But I Also know there's a way out because we did it and you can too. Getting out of student loan debt starts with taking control of the situation. And Laurel Road can help. Laurel Road offers a free 30 minute consultation with a student loan expert to go over your repayment options and help make a plan based on your specific situation to get your student loans paid off fast.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Camel]

Truth be told, refinancing is not the move for everyone. And my advice is that you should only consider it if you can get a lower rate or a shorter term.

[Ken Coleman]

But if refinancing is your next move.

[George Camel]

I think it should be with Laurel Road. They offer low competitive rates and terms that could help you pay less over the lifetime of your loan. Plus they offer interest rate incentives like an auto pay discount. So go to LaurelRoad.com Ramsey to find out more and schedule your free 30 minute consultation. That's LaurelRoad.com Ramsey. Laurel Road is a brand of Key Bank National Association. If your holiday ham tends to last longer than your New Year's resolutions, then I got a fresh challenge for you. Make this the year you take control of your financial future with an actionable plan. Sound intimidating?

[Ken Coleman]

You don't have to do it alone.

[George Camel]

Smartvestor pros are financial advisors who can walk you through what you need to know about retirement planning, wealth management and anything in between. Find a pro near [e-mail] Smartvestor Ramsey Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros. Learn [e-mail] SmartVestor.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell joins me and we're thrilled you're with us. 8882 so this is fun. We get to do this every once in a while. We got John on the line. George and John is from the Miami area and he's 46 and he's single. That's what I know. And John reached out to us and he said I need some help with my budget. And we love this. So we're going to go through the numbers we got. I mean the budget man right next.

[George Camel]

To me, that's like cracking my fingers. I'm ready to go.

[Ken Coleman]

I love it. The people heard you crack the knuckles.

[George Camel]

That was real life. No sound effects.

[Ken Coleman]

So this is real.

[George Camel]

So I've plugged it into our budgeting app. Every dollar. So these are John's real numbers here and we're going to see what his situation.

[Ken Coleman]

So we're going to walk through it right now. All right, let's go. John Are you there?

[Caller]

Yeah. Hi guys. How are you?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, we're great, man. How you feeling about this? Live on air budget ectomy?

[Caller]

Well, I'm happy to be on the show. I recently started to watch some YouTube videos and I came to explore your show and I thought to myself, why don't I reach out to you guys and see your. What's my options? Am I completely bankrupt? So I'm going to be able to get out of this and if there is a way, maybe you can show me.

[Ken Coleman]

I got good news, John. I don't know what the bad news is going to be. George is going to let you know shortly. The good news is you can get out of this and boy, oh boy, do you have the man to help you. He's wearing corduroy today, so he's got a little extra credibility and confidence. All right, George, take it away. Let's do this. Every dollar.

[George Camel]

So, John, I've got your numbers here and I have them in every dollar. But for the people's sake listening out there watching, what is your total debt load.

[Caller]

Combined? About 96,000 between eight cards.

[George Camel]

Wow. All credit card debt.

[Caller]

All credit cards.

[Ken Coleman]

Oof. Wow.

[George Camel]

And what is your income?

[Caller]

So I lost my job beginning of last year, which was 1.75k. I was able to find temporary projects with consistency, anywhere between 65 to 7,500amonth. But it's only been like four months last year and I have about two months this year which is ending next month.

[George Camel]

So you're going to lose all of that income next month?

[Caller]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

What field are you in?

[Caller]

In operations.

[Ken Coleman]

And you're just. What would you say is the reason why you're having a hard time finding full time employment?

[Caller]

I'm not sure. I don't know if it's something to do with economy. I don't know if it's something that in my search, maybe combination, I don't know.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you getting opportunities and just not winning the job or is it a lack of interviews?

[Caller]

Lack of interviews, I would say.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And when you look at the field, are there multiple opportunities that you see out there that you are qualified for and enter in the range of salary that you're used to making?

[Caller]

Not really, to be honest. It's. It's more diluted right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, well that is true. I mean the white collar jobs right now, we've seen a slow, slowing, what they call a softening in the job economy. So that's real. But let's go stay on the budget. But we do got to talk about Income here. Go ahead, George.

[George Camel]

Well, that's. That's the big key, because your budget with every dollar is income minus expenses. So I've got it on the screen here. Our team's going to throw it up for you. And here's the deal. I'm going to assume 6,500 bucks is coming in this month. Right. So I'm going to show you an example of what it would look like to get on this money plan. So you've got 6,500 coming in and you got no savings.

[Caller]

Correct.

[George Camel]

All right. And then you're not. Are you paying rent or mortgage right now?

[Caller]

I'm staying in an apartment for free for two months until end of. Actually, mid of next month.

[George Camel]

Okay. So we're going to need to figure out where we're going to live and how we're going to afford that. We need income before that happens, of course. And then I see here it says car rental, $1,000. What's going on there?

[Caller]

Well, that's only for two months, actually, for. For this period. Just because the project is very far away and I don't have a car.

[George Camel]

So what is your plan to get around once this project's over?

[Caller]

Probably not having a car and just using Uber whenever I need to, which will cut it probably by half.

[George Camel]

Okay, we'll keep going here. You've got groceries, 200, restaurants, 500. Correct?

[Caller]

Correct.

[George Camel]

I think I see a spot we can cut right now. Could you just not eat out and increase your grocery budget a little bit?

[Caller]

I mean, I could probably cut it by half. You know, I would say some of it is also to meet some people, talk about some maybe connections about work.

[George Camel]

Can we do a cup of coffee instead of a fancy dinner?

[Ken Coleman]

That's a great point.

[Caller]

Sure.

[George Camel]

Okay, that'll cut it down. So I'm going to cut this down to 100 bucks for restaurants, will increase your groceries by 100 to make up for it. And so we'll save some money right there. Then you've got a phone. 65 bucks a month.

[Caller]

Correct.

[George Camel]

We could do a little better there, my friends at Tello. 25 bucks, unlimited everything. So that one, you could shave off 40 bucks a month right there, and then the rest is all of your debt. I mean, I'm staring at. Let's see here. The. Every dollar adds it up for me. You have over $3,500 in just minimum payments on these credit cards.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's crazy.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, wow. I need some Tums.

[Caller]

I know.

[George Camel]

So here's the deeper question. You don't Need. This is not the point of the call, but what got you here to where you ran up a hundred thousand dollars in credit cards?

[Caller]

I think it was just accumulation from like two years before. Maybe it was like third or maybe close to 40%. And I think last year was just a lot more than that.

[George Camel]

But a guy making 175 has no need to go into credit card debt. So what was going on in your life that you were spending this money on?

[Caller]

Well, as I said, I think it started before that. I had probably at least 35 to 40% just been irresponsible in the way of thinking. Money is still going to flow for a long time.

[George Camel]

So has that spending addiction ceased, or are you still adding to this credit card debt?

[Caller]

No, the cards are maxed out, so even if I wanted to, I can't.

[George Camel]

You know, it's bad when even the credit card companies cut you off.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness. Okay. Anything that we can sell?

[Caller]

I wish.

[George Camel]

Did you purchase anything on these cards that was a physical item that you can go sell on Facebook, Marketplace?

[Caller]

No, I did not go into luxury item spree.

[George Camel]

So was this experiences?

[Caller]

It was. I had to relocate to another city, another state for the project last year. Some of it was paying for accommodations. It was just. Yeah, I think it was just months of doing that.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Well, here's the deal. We need to get income in our life asap. And that's where Ken's advice is going to come into play here. Because without income, this whole plan is moot. The budget needs income in order to cover the expenses and attack the extra debt. So here's your goal is cover your four walls. That is your priority before any credit card goes, company gets paid. Cover your food, utilities, shelter, transportation. Keep it all to a minimum.

[Caller]

Okay.

[George Camel]

Okay. Beyond that, you're going to start attacking these debts from smallest to largest. So I see here your credit card number one. The balance is 2,600 bucks. If I click into it.

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

So that's going to be your first one to tackle. You're going to make minimum payments on the rest. So you've got to make at least $3,500 of payments. Then anything beyond that, throw toward card number one.

[Caller]

Yeah. Onto the print. I actually was paying all the smaller cards, but the big cards, I wasn't able to. 3 cards already been closed by the bank.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

During collections, I'm pretty sure that I'm already starting to get calls. So three cards already been. I called them also to let them know that, you know, after years, I'M unable to make payments on, you know, two of the cards. And I guess they already closed three accounts. Two for personal and one for business.

[George Camel]

Okay, and are you able to make all of your payments currently on the remaining cards?

[Caller]

Yeah, just the small ones. Correct.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

So. Yeah. Yeah.

[George Camel]

So with this debt snowball, as you clear each debt, it's going to also clear up that minimum payment, which frees up more money to attack the next one. Are you getting that?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Which means once you get started on this, it feels overwhelming now, but, man, if you can get that job making 150 again, we can get rid of this debt. Think about it. If you can throw 50 grand at this debt per year, you're done in two years, and we're never going into debt again. John, that's what we're talking about. A short season of sacrifice.

[Ken Coleman]

Is this contract work remote.

[Caller]

Right now?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. The work you're doing on these, you told us you had these contracts. Is that remote work?

[Caller]

It's a project that moves around. In that case, they're actually here in Florida.

[Ken Coleman]

So it's all right, here's my point. The white collar world, the kind of jobs it is tightened, it is a softer market, so you're working really hard to replace it. However, you're also at Home Depot or Lowe's or Walmart or whatever. You are working. You've got operational experience. You've been a manager of processes that is extremely versatile and valuable. My point is, you aren't waiting for another contractor job while you're looking. You are working, working, working to knock these credit cards down. That's the key to winning on this deal. George, tell people how they can get every dollar. Just like we recommended.

[George Camel]

We're gonna send it to John as well. We're gonna give you premium for one year so it connects to your bank account, has all the paycheck planning features to help you along this process. Everyone can go download it in the App store.

[Ken Coleman]

All right?

[George Camel]

How many times last year did you end up with too much month at.

[Ken Coleman]

The end of the money?

[George Camel]

Even if you're able to stay on top of your bills, there's nothing left over. No margin, no breathing room. You work your butt off, but you still feel broke. And now you're wondering if 2025 will be any different. It can be. You are not powerless over your money. When you take control of the things you can control, you will make progress and bring peace back to your home. And we're going to help you. On January 23rd, me and Jade are.

[Ken Coleman]

Hosting a Free live stream where we will show you how to free up.

[George Camel]

More breathing room this year. Plus, when you sign up, you could win $4,000 cash. It's going to be a blast, guys. Go sign up right now. Make this the year you stop getting by and start getting ahead. Register for free at ramseysolutions.com livestream. That's ramseysolutions.com/live stream.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show. You know, I think back, George, by the way, I'm Ken Coleman. George Camel with me today here. I think back to that last call with John as you were walking him through every dollar. You know, the. The theme there is, John, you've got to take control of your money. He's been very successful, but he's never really had control of his money. And by the way, you know, no judgment or shame there. We've all been there before. And the idea of taking control of your money, that thought leads to an action, George, that again, can turn anything around. And we've seen some extreme turnarounds here in our time at Ramsey Solutions and as co hosts of the Ramsey show. And it just makes me think, again tonight, why tonight's live stream is so important. It's a free livestream event. We've got over 400,000 people registered to join this free event. It's free live on YouTube 7 Central tonight. And if you're one of those people right now you're listening to us or watching us, you're going, I've never truly taken control of my money. I really think you ought to tune in tonight, George.

[George Camel]

Absolutely. Yeah. I'll be a part of it. Along with Rachel Cruz, Dave and Jade will be leading off, teaching you all the things you need to be doing to get ahead financially to start building wealth. And then we're gonna have a live Q and A where Rachel and I will join answering your questions. We're taking questions live from Zoom. We're taking questions live from email and social. And so this is your last chance to sign up. If you want some life change this year, tell your friends, tell your family. Again, it's free. Sign up for the live [e-mail] livestream. You'll be entered to win for a chance to win four grand. We're giving away $4,000 cash to five people, which is gonna be fun. And make sure you create a free everydollar account. You'll get a bonus entry in the giveaway for doing that. We're going to be using everydollar in the live stream to show you practically. Just like I did with John. How to find more margin, how to speed up the progress. So 7:00pm tonight, Central Time. We'll see you there. Ramsey Solutions.com live stream.

[Ken Coleman]

Now, you don't want to miss a minute of this, obviously, because every minute is planned out, but people are at home. Life happens. And for people who love you, George, because it's a growing number or up.

[George Camel]

To 10, it's a throw.

[Ken Coleman]

It's a. It's a really a large group of people. Do you have any idea about what time you're going to appear? If you look at the minute by.

[George Camel]

Minute, I believe the first section with Dave and jade's probably about 45 minutes. And then we're going to do about an hour of Q and A. We really wanted to make it about what people really experience.

[Ken Coleman]

If you're going to have to get up and go to the restroom, you don't you want to be back in your couch. That's right around 7.45ish.

[George Camel]

Yeah. And here's the good.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you wearing the corduroy on that, too?

[George Camel]

I am. I didn't want to have to wardrobe.

[Ken Coleman]

I want the American people who are listening today who haven't seen this corduroy. What did you say? I missed that.

[George Camel]

I said I don't want to have to do a wardrobe change. So I thought I'll just wear what I'm wearing.

[Ken Coleman]

I like that. Well, it's a fantastic job.

[George Camel]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. So you don't want it. By the way, I'm gonna. I have a bucket of popcorn. I'm gonna.

[George Camel]

Must be nice to be Ken Coleman on his couch tonight. Well, watching us do the heavy lifting.

[Ken Coleman]

Listen, I didn't. I'm not starting tonight, all right? Tonight's a night I'm not starting. It's not my night.

[George Camel]

So it's gonna be awesome.

[Ken Coleman]

I'll be in the pajama pants watching you.

[George Camel]

I appreciate that.

[Ken Coleman]

A little bit of popcorn.

[George Camel]

Several hundred thousands, and it's gonna be great.

[Ken Coleman]

Your mom and dad are gonna be very proud.

[George Camel]

My mom is always texting me during these, saying, you need to smile more, Mike. Thanks, Mom. Very helpful feedback.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, I don't like your attitude. I think your mom's probably right.

[George Camel]

She's right.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, you know, why don't you do what your mom says?

[George Camel]

Listening to questions. You're focused. It's hard to smile. I gotta remind myself.

[Ken Coleman]

I've never noticed that about you. You strike me as a very joyful person.

[George Camel]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

Worried, but joyful. Stephen is up Next in Little Rock, Arkansas. Stephen, how can George and I help?

[Caller]

Hey, can y'all hear me?

[Ken Coleman]

Loud and clear, sir.

[Caller]

Okay, so I'm trying to get out of debt, and I lost my, like, the best fan job I ever had. I was making 100k.

[Ken Coleman]

And then what happened? And what were you doing?

[Caller]

I was driving a truck, and due to unforeseen circumstances, I lost my job.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

And so my new career, it's still driving a truck, but it's about. I got a huge pay cut.

[Ken Coleman]

How big?

[Caller]

Like, now I make about 35,000.

[Ken Coleman]

And that's because that's the only trucking job available to you.

[Caller]

I can't really go over the road. I hate saying that, but my anxiety is really bad.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right.

[George Camel]

Do you need to find a new career field?

[Caller]

No. This is the only thing I've ever been good at.

[Ken Coleman]

Is what? Driving?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

So the question then becomes, and again, before we start talking about, you know, you don't have enough money to pay your debt, we got to figure out how we get more money. And that's why I kind of interrupted here to figure out where. Where we are here. So I understand the anxiety. No shame in that. Don't be embarrassed by that. That's real. But couple things on that. Number one, that's treatable, Would you agree?

[Caller]

Yes. I am on medicine for that.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. But regardless of what you're doing to treat that, I would be looking mentally at. I've got to do the hard work. If it's a chemical thing, I'm doing meds. I've got to get to a point where I can get back on the road for a season if that's the best money I can make. Or I've got to expand my horizons and my thinking to, all right, I. I can do more. What jobs do not require me to be over the road for long amounts of time. I'm thinking ups, driving for one of the beer companies, Coca Cola. I mean, these jobs have higher pay than 35,000, and they also have a nice path in these large companies. So just trying to ideate for you to go, man, you can't accept whatever happened in the past that's got you here. It's going to be a lot longer and a lot harder. And George is going to walk you through this. The debt snowball, but you need more income and soon. Would you agree?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Camel]

Your hourly rate right now is about 17 bucks an hour.

[Caller]

Oh, then I must have done my math right. I'm making 18.

[George Camel]

Okay, you're making 18 bucks. An hour. So what we're saying is if you can go make $20 an hour temporarily, you'd get a raise right now.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Which wouldn't be that hard to find.

[Ken Coleman]

So give George your debt. Picture.

[Caller]

Me and my wife together have around 24 and a half thousand dollars in debt. Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Break it down for us.

[Caller]

Okay. The credit cards around 1500. The two personal loans of one's 2,500, the other one's 1500. And there's a car that's I think around 1500 and a building that's around 1500, and the rest is the student loan of my wife's.

[George Camel]

Okay. And is your wife working outside the home?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

What does she make?

[Caller]

She makes 24.

[George Camel]

24,000 a year or 24 an hour?

[Caller]

24,000 a year.

[Ken Coleman]

What does she do?

[Caller]

She is a occupational therapist or something like that. Like a.

[Ken Coleman]

Is she working 40 hours a week? Got you.

[Caller]

Yeah, she's. She's activities director at a nursing home.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. You see that there's potential for her to be doubling her income as well with not a whole lot of effort. Yes, my man. That's the conversation tonight over dinner.

[Caller]

We're both looking for jobs. Like, one thing I do on the side that I'm really passionate about is on Sundays after church, I go and preach to elderly at nursing homes because, you know, they're lonely and need people to talk to. Yeah, that's another reason I don't want to really go over the road to.

[Ken Coleman]

What'S that pay you?

[Caller]

It don't. It's. That's voluntary.

[Ken Coleman]

And I love that. I love that, Stephen. But that's not a job. And right now you need to get out of debt. You don't have a ton of spare time to be putting towards a lot of volunteerism.

[George Camel]

Use that passion to fuel your debt free journey. To say, man, I hate that. I can't do that right now because I'm out working three jobs. I want to get back to that. So let's get rid of this debt fast. You see how you flip the script?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

So you guys are making about 60k. You've got about $25,000 worth of debt, and it's going to take the debt snowball method. And so any money we have beyond our expenses, which by the way, should be minimal, we're talking about no eating out. Are you guys doing any of that right now?

[Caller]

No, sir.

[George Camel]

The old post church lunch isn't happening.

[Ken Coleman]

No, he's preaching.

[George Camel]

All right.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, real quick question. Super quick, Stephen. I just heard something you said one of the reasons you don't want to go back out on over the road truck driving is because you want to be there preaching to the. To the old folks, and I love that. With the medicine that you're on right now, are you able to drive without the crippling anxiety that got you out of the cab before? Yes or no?

[Caller]

No.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. I'd be working on that. I'd be working on getting to a point where you can manage your anxiety, because that's a hundred grand, man. Quick. They need truck drivers. It's the number one need in the market, George. I just wanted to throw that out there.

[George Camel]

No, that's true. And this income will change everything to clean up this 25,000 of debt. It's not on fire. We've seen much bigger numbers.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right. That's a good news.

[George Camel]

It feels like it is right now because of that lower income. You get that up, this problem will solve itself, man. This is the Ramsey Show.