Draw a Line in the Sand and Say “I’m Done!”

Summary

The Ramsey Show: "Draw a Line in the Sand and Say 'I’m Done!'" – Episode Summary

Release Date: January 15, 2025

Introduction

In this empowering episode of The Ramsey Show, host George Campbell and financial guru Dave Ramsey tackle the theme of decisively overcoming financial struggles by drawing clear boundaries and making definitive changes. The central message revolves around taking control of one's financial destiny, regardless of past mistakes, and committing to a path of financial freedom. Throughout the episode, callers share their financial predicaments, seeking guidance on debt management, budgeting, investment strategies, and major life decisions affecting their economic well-being.

---

1. Tackling Business Debt: Dante’s Landscaping Conundrum [01:09]

Caller Profile:
Dante, operating a landscaping business in Chicago, faces a daunting $68,000 in debt due to declining business in the past year and additional winter snow removal services that didn’t yield sufficient income.

Key Discussion Points:

• Debt Composition: Dante’s debt comprises $50,000 charged off by the bank and $18,000 currently being paid off, largely from credit cards and loans used to purchase landscaping equipment.

• Business Valuation: Dave Ramsey probes the value of Dante’s used equipment, highlighting that selling off non-essential assets could mitigate financial strain.

  Dave Ramsey [02:31]: "How much equipment could you get away with not having? In other words, if you sold it, it wouldn't put you in a tough spot given your current business load."

• Mindset Shift: Emphasis on changing spending and income habits over considering bankruptcy or debt relief programs. George Campbell urges Dante to redefine his business operations by selling unnecessary equipment and focusing on revenue generation without falling back into old spending habits.

• Action Plan:

  • Sell $20,000 worth of equipment to reduce debt.
  • Utilize tools like EveryDollar for budgeting.
  • Set a clear, actionable goal to become debt-free within 18 to 24 months.

Notable Quote:

Dave Ramsey [06:06]: "Without hurting the revenue for the business. Yeah, dude, 100% go do that."

---

2. Overcoming Personal Debt: Christy’s Struggle as a Single Mom [09:08]

Caller Profile:
Christy, a single mother in Grand Junction, Colorado, juggles a $7,000 student loan debt alongside the costs of raising her 4-year-old child. Earning approximately $2,000 monthly, she barely manages $80–$100 for essential expenses after debt repayments.

Key Discussion Points:

• Financial Overwhelm: Christy feels trapped in a cycle of debt, struggling to afford necessities while aspiring to buy a new car and eventually a home.

• Career Advancement: Dave Ramsey advises Christy to aim for higher-paying opportunities, suggesting that increasing her income is crucial before attempting to invest or take on additional financial responsibilities.

• Budgeting and Savings: George Campbell reinforces the importance of detailed budgeting using EveryDollar to identify and cut unnecessary expenses, thereby freeing up funds to aggressively tackle debt.

• Long-Term Goals: Encourages Christy to focus on paying off her current debts, building an emergency fund, and setting clear financial milestones to transition into higher education and improved career prospects.

Notable Quote:

George Campbell [07:24]: "Instead of filing bankruptcy, what if you made a goal to say, I'm going to be debt-free in two years..."

---

3. Navigating Home Ownership and Expansion: Grant Considers a Second Mortgage [21:08]

Caller Profile:
Grant has recently paid off his first mortgage and is contemplating upgrading to a larger home to accommodate his growing family of eight. His current home is valued at $270,000, and he’s looking at purchasing a new property worth approximately $400,000.

Key Discussion Points:

• Debt Strategy: Grant inquires whether upgrading to a bigger house with another mortgage aligns with Ramsey’s financial principles or if he should continue living debt-free and save to purchase a home outright.

• Financial Balance: George Campbell acknowledges that while Ramsey advocates for debt-free living, strategic, temporary reversion to Baby Step Six (paying off a second mortgage) can be acceptable if it doesn’t overextend financial commitments.

• Affordability and Planning:

  • Calculate monthly payments to ensure they don’t exceed a quarter of take-home pay.
  • Utilize existing home equity to finance the new purchase while maintaining aggressive mortgage repayment schedules.

Notable Quote:

Dave Ramsey [21:43]: "Well, in a perfect world, if Dave was on air, he'd say, well, I wouldn't want you going back into debt."

---

4. First-Year Investment Decisions: Federico’s 1099 IRA Dilemma [28:53]

Caller Profile:
Federico, a 23-year-old NASCAR engineer, is debt-free and has managed to save $15,000 with an additional $3,000 invested in dividend-yielding stocks. As a first-year 1099 employee, he's contemplating whether to maximize his 2024 IRA contributions for tax benefits.

Key Discussion Points:

• Traditional vs. Roth IRA: George Campbell suggests Federico consider a Roth IRA over a Traditional IRA, emphasizing the long-term tax-free growth benefits despite the lack of immediate tax deductions.

• Investment Strategy:

  • Diversify investments across large-cap, mid-cap, small-cap, and international mutual funds and index funds while avoiding single-stock investments to mitigate risk.

• Maximizing Retirement Savings:

  • Prioritize employer matches to effectively gain a 100% return on investments.
  • Continue contributing to retirement accounts as part of the broader Baby Steps framework.

Notable Quote:

George Campbell [29:35]: "I was going to go that direction. But the girl thing, I only have one girl and I don't know, I feel like I'm on thin ice if I recommend that."

---

5. Salary Negotiation Tactics: Maria’s Architectural Career Advancement [34:43]

Caller Profile:
Maria, recently licensed to practice architecture, is preparing for a salary negotiation with her current employer. She seeks guidance on determining a fair salary range that acknowledges her new responsibilities and qualifications.

Key Discussion Points:

• Research and Preparation:

  • Utilize multiple sources like job sites, LinkedIn, and industry contacts to establish a realistic salary range based on experience, location, and specialty.

• Mindset and Expectations:

  • Maintain a positive outlook by valuing the growth and experience gained from the new role over solely focusing on salary figures.

• Negotiation Strategy:

  • Enter discussions with a well-researched salary range without being fixated on specific numbers to maintain flexibility and professionalism.

Notable Quote:

Dave Ramsey [34:43]: "Do not lose sight of the fact that this employer has, by your words, always been very generous to you."

---

6. Funding Surrogacy Amid Financial Strain: Thomas’ Family Planning [35:27]

Caller Profile:
Thomas and his wife are planning to build a small residence next to them to facilitate surrogacy and accommodate family needs. With $40,000 saved and an investment property valued at approximately $270,000 (with $170,000 owed), they seek advice on financing the project estimated between $80,000 to $100,000.

Key Discussion Points:

• Asset Liquidation:

  • Suggest selling the investment property to free up capital, considering the potential profit and the ongoing financial burden of rental income.

• Income Stability:

  • Emphasize the importance of increasing income to cover anticipated losses in Thomas’s wife’s military benefits due to medical separation.

• Strategic Planning:

  • Develop a comprehensive financial plan that prioritizes the surrogacy project while ensuring long-term financial stability through debt repayment and emergency funds.

Notable Quote:

George Campbell [38:35]: "So we have one thing solved. Sell it, take all the profits and use it to fund the surrogacy."

---

7. Evaluating Life Insurance Policies: Rob’s Whole Life Dilemma [43:37]

Caller Profile:
Rob, aged 69, holds two whole life insurance policies with Northwestern Mutual valued at $96,800 in cash value and a $150,000 death benefit. Considering his robust financial standing with a $3.7 million nest egg, he questions the necessity of maintaining these policies.

Key Discussion Points:

• Policy Evaluation:

  • Analyze whether the death benefit serves a practical purpose given Rob’s financial security and lack of dependents reliant on his income.

• Cost-Benefit Analysis:

  • Weigh the $741 annual premiums against the tangible benefits of the death benefit, suggesting that discontinuing unnecessary policies can free up funds for more beneficial investments.

• Strategic Financial Decisions:

  • Encourage redirecting the cash value from whole life policies into higher-yield investments, enhancing overall financial growth and flexibility.

Notable Quote:

Dave Ramsey [45:56]: "Yeah, I agree with George. You just got $78,000 wealthier. That's the way I look at it."

---

8. Diversifying Investments Early: Aaron’s High-Income Strategy [48:27]

Caller Profile:
Aaron, a 22-year-old earning $90,000 annually with a 401(k) match, seeks advice on diversifying his investment portfolio beyond his current Roth IRA contributions.

Key Discussion Points:

• Investment Diversification:

  • Recommend allocating investments across large-cap, mid-cap, small-cap, and international mutual funds and index funds to minimize risk and maximize growth potential.

• Maximizing Employer Match:

  • Prioritize contributing enough to earn the full employer match, recognizing it as an immediate 100% return on investment.

• Avoiding High-Risk Investments:

  • Advise against single-stock investments due to increased volatility, encouraging a focus on diversified mutual and index funds.

Notable Quote:

George Campbell [50:34]: "I would avoid single stocks because of the risk and volatility. I would stick to those funds that you mentioned, mutual funds, index funds."

---

9. Late-Life Financial Planning: Judy’s Investment and Relationship Challenges [65:31]

Caller Profile:
Judy, aged 65, has zero savings and works part-time, earning $1,600 monthly. She lives with her boyfriend, who is also her financial supporter. Facing relationship instability and financial insecurity, Judy seeks guidance on investing versus saving.

Key Discussion Points:

• Emergency Fund First:

  • Emphasize establishing a three-to-six-month emergency fund before considering investments, ensuring financial stability in case of relationship breakdown or unexpected expenses.

• Investment vs. Saving:

  • Counsel Judy to prioritize saving over investing due to her vulnerable financial state and reliance on her boyfriend’s income.

• Relationship and Financial Independence:

  • Address the risks of financial dependency in personal relationships, encouraging Judy to seek financial independence to safeguard against potential relationship dissolution.

Notable Quote:

Dave Ramsey [72:46]: "And I would imagine the warranty is going to cover the engine, the gasket on it. Unless you didn't put oil in it."

---

10. Emergency Planning for Aging Parents: Andrew’s Surrogacy and Financial Management [53:06]

Caller Profile:
Andrew seeks advice on consolidating his aging parents' financial accounts to fund a surrogacy project. With complex financial holdings, including traditional IRAs with annuities, a whole life policy, gold assets, and a checking account, he aims to build a new residence for his parents.

Key Discussion Points:

• Financial Consolidation:

  • Recommend liquidating non-essential assets like gold and evaluating the cash value of life insurance policies to fund the surrogacy while minimizing tax impacts.

• Tax Implications:

  • Advise consulting a tax professional to navigate withdrawals from traditional IRAs and understanding the capital gains implications.

• Long-Term Care Considerations:

  • Stress the importance of planning for ongoing care needs, shifting from relying solely on family support to potentially incorporating assisted living solutions.

• Strategic Financial Planning:

  • Encourage a collaborative approach with all involved family members to create a transparent and sustainable financial strategy that prioritizes both immediate and long-term needs.

Notable Quote:

George Campbell [58:03]: "So, if that's the case, I'm going to go strategically through a prioritized list of what I would liquidate first..."

---

Key Insights and Conclusions

Throughout the episode, George Campbell and Dave Ramsey reinforce foundational financial principles centered around Ramsey’s Baby Steps:

1. Save an Emergency Fund:
   Prioritize building a three-to-six-month emergency fund to cushion against unforeseen financial setbacks.

2. Debt Snowball Method:
   Effectively manage and eliminate debt by focusing on paying off smaller debts first to build momentum and confidence.

3. Budgeting with EveryDollar:
   Utilize tools like EveryDollar to create detailed budgets that align income with expenses, ensuring financial discipline and proactive money management.

4. Increase Income Streams:
   Encourage seeking higher-paying job opportunities, side hustles, or business optimizations to enhance income and expedite debt repayment and savings growth.

5. Smart Investment Strategies:
   Advocate for diversified investments through mutual funds and index funds while avoiding high-risk single-stock investments, especially for those in the early or unstable stages of financial growth.

6. Strategic Asset Liquidation:
   Recommend selling non-essential or underperforming assets to free up capital for debt repayment, investment opportunities, or significant life projects like purchasing a new home or funding surrogacy.

Final Thoughts

The episode underscores the importance of decisiveness in financial planning—drawing lines in the sand to refuse detrimental financial behaviors and committing to structured, strategic actions towards wealth-building and debt elimination. By sharing real-life caller scenarios and providing tailored advice, George Campbell and Dave Ramsey offer listeners actionable insights to transform their financial situations, emphasizing that it is never too late to take control and proclaim, "I’m done" with financial instability.

Notable Closing Quote:

George Campbell [84:57]: "This is the Ramsey Show. You know, every year I hear the same excuses for why people don't get the life insurance they need to protect their families. So this year, let's clear the air and look at the facts."

---

Join the Movement

The episode concludes with invitations to upcoming events and resources, including the Investing Essentials virtual event on March 4th and 5th, campaigns to participate in listener surveys for a chance to win gift cards, and promotions for life insurance and self-defense products through Ramsey's trusted partners.

---

Conclusion

The Ramsey Show delivers a potent message of financial empowerment, blending compassionate guidance with practical strategies. By confronting real-life financial challenges and offering clear, actionable solutions, George Campbell and Dave Ramsey inspire listeners to draw definitive lines in their financial sand, paving the way toward lasting wealth and stability.

Transcript

[George Campbell]

Hey, guys, if you're ready to get ahead with money and start building wealth this year, don't miss our free Take Control of youf Money live stream. It's on January 23rd, and you could win $4,000 just for signing up. You got nothing to lose. Go sign up right [e-mail] livestream. Livestream from Ramsey Network. It's the Ramsey show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell, joined by my good friend Mr. Ken Coleman, and we're here to serve you in whatever's going on in your life. Maybe it's the job that you want to quit. Maybe it's that side hustle thing that you want to go do. Maybe it's, how do I move up in my career? How do I get out of debt? We're here to answer those questions and help you take the right next step. The number to call is 888-255-2225. Dante's gonna kick us off in Chicago. What's going on, Dante?

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, guys, I just have a quick question. So I'm $68,000 in debt, credit cards, and loans. 50 of it has already been charged off from the bank. The other 18 I'm still currently paying off. So my question to you is, what do I do with the 50 grand has been charged off? I don't know if I should do bankruptcy or, like, debt relief program or. Or what are my other options?

[George Campbell]

None of that. And here's why. Number one, you're not actually gonna change any of the habits that got you here. So we gotta dig into that part of what caused me to go $68,000 into debt with money I don't have. And the other piece is it will destroy your financial life for the foreseeable future. So what I'd rather see you do is go, what do I need to do with my income and my spending in order to climb out of this thing in the next 18 to 24 months? If that was the only option, then you'd start getting creative. You go, all right, what can I do with my work? You know, what are you making right now, Dante?

[Ken Coleman]

I do landscaping. So all this debt came. I bought a landscape business, and I bought a bunch of equipment. So all this debt is mostly used equipment. And so we do landscaping, but the last year or so, it went kind of down. And then winter, we do snow removal. And when. When there's no snow removal, we went down even some more. So that's what ended up getting us into debt with expenses.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much value does landscaping equipment hold? In other words, is. Let's say you paid X amount of dollars for the equipment. How much can you get for it now?

[Ken Coleman]

I could get maybe 20, 25. They're all used. And then the other one was just like running expenses. So half of it was used equipment, half of it was running expenses.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much equipment could you get away with not having? In other words, if you sold it, it wouldn't put you in a tough spot given your current business load.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, I could maybe get 20 now and then maybe still move forward.

[Dave Ramsey]

Bro, there's the answer.

[George Campbell]

Without hurting the revenue for the business. Yeah, dude, 100% go do that.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's the 18 right there. Plus some you don't need. Who, who put this idea of bankruptcy in your mind as the way to get out of this?

[Ken Coleman]

Just, I just been doing my good research myself. I just been googling and trying to see what I can do. And then I like that was one option was bankruptcy. Like I had 25,000 in the credit card, 25,000 on the line of credit and then 10,000 personal loan. And then I have another and that's 50. Those 50 was then charged off. Then the other 10 is on another credit card that I'm still currently paying. And then the eight grand is another credit card separately also. And I'm also paying that down as well.

[George Campbell]

Now you said you were using it for business expenses. So your business wasn't profitable and you were artificially propping it up with debt.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Was it profitable now?

[Ken Coleman]

Where does it stand and now where it's profitable? Yeah, I.

[George Campbell]

What's it making every month? What's the net profit?

[Ken Coleman]

We are net profit? I'm not sure net profit. At the top of my head, it's roughly like 120 gross. I'm paying myself like 40 grand on my head and I have like one part time employee that you pay out.

[George Campbell]

Of the 120 gross.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Okay. So how do we get this business to where you can pay yourself 60? What must be true?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm not sure. I need help.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, no, no, no, no. You know the answer to that. You may not know how you're going.

[George Campbell]

To do it, but charging more clients.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, maybe. Yeah. Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Are you working 40 hours a week? How many hours are you working right now in the business?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm working a lot. Like 50, 60 hours a week. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's more clients. I mean, you know the answer to that. I think it's a great question that George Asked. And I think you cannot let yourself cop out. Now, I understand the emotion behind your answer, so I'm not picking on you, but I'm actually trying to encourage you that you actually know the answer. Because if you and I went to lunch today, let me tell you, who doesn't know the answer to that is me. Because I've never run a landscape business, George. However, I've run businesses before. And if I were to sit with you long enough, Dante, I then would be able to answer the question, true or false.

[Ken Coleman]

True.

[Dave Ramsey]

If I understood your business the way you understand it, I could figure it out. And so there. I want to make sure that the mindset right now is all right. I started out in this deal. I got over my skis a little bit, didn't have the business with all the equipment, went through downturns, by the way. That's. That's the nature of business. I don't care what it is. Okay. And so you've learned a lot, but you've got to make sure you've got a mindset right now that you are not a victim. And so, George, I don't know why we're not talking about selling this equipment. We. We just brushed right past this. That, to me, would be a resetting of the business.

[George Campbell]

Yeah. And then going forward, we're going to cut up these cards. We're not going to put a dime on credit for this business or in our personal life. Can you draw a line in the sand today and say, I'm done?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know what I would do if. If he's got $20,000 worth of equipment and he owes 18, I would pay off the credit cards, cut them up, take the $2,000, and that becomes the retained earnings that we teach in entre leadership. And let's get that part going. Let's go. We got at least $2,000. Our goal is to heart is not touch that unless it is an absolute four alarm fire emergency. And I'm going to build on that 2,000 and have a goal to have 20,000 in the bank and then have a goal of 50,000. Like, that's how you build a business. You go one month at a time and you take everything that you've learned to this point and you go, okay, now I know actually how I'm gonna increase revenue and I'm gonna keep the revenue in the form of retained earnings and then paying yourself more, as George.

[George Campbell]

Was saying, and in your personal life and in your business life, here's the number you want to focus on. Is margin. It's the gap between what you're taking in and what's going out. So in your personal life today, what are your monthly expenses?

[Ken Coleman]

Probably about 4,000amonth.

[George Campbell]

Well, you just told me you're making 40 grand a year, which means you're in the hole by eight.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Yeah. That's why these all your credit cards are the way they are.

[George Campbell]

So here. Here's one lesson. We gotta go. What is causing us to spend $4,000 a month? If that's cost of living, we need to find a different place to live. We need to get a roommate. If it's eating out, we need to cut off that whole piece and go. We're gonna meal prep. It's gonna be rice and beans for the next few months, maybe a year or two. So you're gonna do an audit. I'm gonna help you with this by giving you our budgeting app called Everydollar. And you're going to list out your income for the month, list out every single expense, and then see where you actually stand. And if you don't like what you see, change it. I got to spend less. I got to make more. Because here's the math on this. Instead of filing bankruptcy, what if you made a goal to say, I'm going to be debt free in two years, I'm going to sell 20 grand worth of equipment that'll get me out. Right now we're down to 48 grand in debt.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that's the. So that's another question that's charged off already. What can I do with that?

[George Campbell]

Well, you're going to need to settle eventually, right? With the creditors?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

So they're going to be coming for you. I'd be proactive and saying, hey, I'm trying to figure out a way to get this paid off. It's going to go into your debt snowball, and maybe a year from now, they're willing to settle for, you know, 30 grand instead of 50. We don't know. It may not be new enough. You may need to pay the full 50. But this is not going to go away. This is going to take you busting your butt, two grand a month toward the debt. You're debt free in two years. That's the math on it. If you do what Ken and I said. So bankruptcy is not the only option. You've got a ways to go. Call us back if you need help. Hang on the line. We'll send you every dollar. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Ken Coleman]

Mortgage rates have dropped.

[Dave Ramsey]

So if you're thinking about buying a home in the next year.

[Ken Coleman]

Contact your local Churchill mortgage team right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you wait, more people will be.

[Ken Coleman]

In the market competing for the same.

[Dave Ramsey]

Homes and potentially driving up prices. Churchill will help you do the MA to be sure your budget is correct, making your home a blessing and helping.

[Ken Coleman]

You build lasting wealth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Learn [e-mail] Churchill Mortgage.com this is a.

[George Campbell]

Paid advertisement in MLS ID 1591 in mlsconsumeraccess.org Equal Housing Lender, 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100, Brentwood, TN 37027. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Exciting day around here because we are launching our Investing Essentials event. It's a two night virtual event hosted by Dave Ramsey and yours truly, George Camel. We know investing can be overwhelming, confusing. It's not something that you can pick up in a 60 second social media post. So at this virtual event, Dave Ramsey and I will walk you through how to maximize your retirement plans, how to pick mutual funds, how to invest with confidence. And it's the only place to get Dave's personal playbook on real estate investing. And Dave will explain how he made hundreds of millions in property investing debt free. And he's going to go, this is Nerdville.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[George Campbell]

We're going to be, we got charts and graphs and formulas. It's going to blow your mind. Stuff we have never covered here on the show. So join us. Investing Essentials. It's happening virtually March 4th and 5th and you can watch from the comfort of your own home wherever you are. Tickets start at 199 bucks. Get yours [e-mail] events or click the link in the show notes. If you're on podcast or YouTube, what's.

[Dave Ramsey]

A recommended snack for that? Since people can watch that in the comfort of their own home, you kind of know the content.

[George Campbell]

We went, we went deep into the cookie jar at the event and so I'm feeling it's going to be a cookie kind of evening. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, kind of a comfort food.

[George Campbell]

Yeah. Working. That's in March. You're kind of just like get me to spring already.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

So yeah, get your favorite snack and.

[Dave Ramsey]

Post up and watch for you are famously gluten free. I think America would love to know what is your favorite. Go to gluten free cookie.

[George Campbell]

Oh, well, you know, you got Tates. That's a, that's a standard feel like a crispy cookie.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[George Campbell]

Chips Ahoy did come out with one recently that hits.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[George Campbell]

And Oreos. Now gluten free as well. So a lot of options for us gluten free gladiators out there.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's the bonus content you didn't know you came for today.

[George Campbell]

Thanks for thinking of us, Ken.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I'm always thinking of the people. Man of the people, I've been told.

[George Campbell]

I love it. Well, let's be men of the people and let's go out to Christie and see if we can be of service.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

In Grand Junction, Colorado. What's going on, Christy?

[Ken Coleman]

Hi.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey.

[George Campbell]

How can Ken and I help?

[Ken Coleman]

So I am wanting to buy a new car. I want to be financially able to buy a house, and I am also needing to get out of debt. So I have about $7,000 in debt from school loans. I just recently graduated with an associate's degree and so I've been working a lot. I also have a 4 year old. I'm a single mom and I make roughly $2,000 a month. And by the end of the month, I'm left with maybe like $100 to $80 to do things that I need to do, like get an oil change and buy clothes and stuff like that. And I'm just really struggling financially and I'm done. I don't want to be this way and I don't want to do this the rest of my life.

[Dave Ramsey]

Love it. Christy. That's a great place to be. You know, being done is an awesome place to be. Now, I know it doesn't feel that way, but. George, can I get an amen on that?

[George Campbell]

Oh, absolutely.

[Dave Ramsey]

So we can help. So, Christy, what are you doing for your job?

[Ken Coleman]

I am a medical assistant.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and you're making what per hour?

[Ken Coleman]

19.

[Dave Ramsey]

Uh huh. And what'd you get your associate's degree in.

[Ken Coleman]

Science? My associates in applied science.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what, what was the purpose of that? What were you thinking? What are you aiming towards? What are you thinking about?

[Ken Coleman]

The original plan was to get my associate's degree to help me get a foot into the door for getting my bachelor's in nursing. Nursing is very competitive and so having that on my record makes me look a little better, I guess, than most people applying. So did you want it as well?

[Dave Ramsey]

Did you want to do nursing? So you want to be.

[Ken Coleman]

If I.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So if we could fast forward your life. You're a nurse right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. I'm asking, that's what you want. What kind of nurse? You have any idea?

[Ken Coleman]

I eventually would like to get my master's in OB GYN and become a midwife, but that's like four years down the Line.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. But let's stay. Yeah, I love that. No, I love it. But if we could be a nurse today, you would be a nurse. A labor delivery nurse.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Okay, great.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's really important that you visualize that and write that down. So the question becomes, how much money and time is it going to take to get the other two years so that you get the nursing degree and you're ready to go?

[Ken Coleman]

To get my master's? It would probably be another two to three years.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, no, you don't need the master's. You don't need the master's to become a nurse. I'm asking, what is it going to take for you to be qualified to be a labor delivery nurse?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm not sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Hey, fun. Homework assignment number one. You got it. You started this call. I'm done. So before you lay your head on the pillow tonight, you need to know the answer to. How many more years of college do I need to get a nursing degree? The second thing you need to know before you lay down your head tonight is in your area. Where are all the institutions? Like, a list of the schools that have nursing programs. If there are some online programs that'll help you get certain amount of. I mean, I don't know. I want you literally to have a list that if George and I knocked on your door tomorrow morning and we said, christy, what are our options in the future to get that nursing degree? You could hand us a piece of paper, go, there it is, George, right there. And we would say, okay, great. And it has the cost. It's really important for someone who's in your position that's really frustrated with where you are in life, to have a clear picture of what it would actually take to do the thing that you actually want to do, because it takes away all of the fear. Right now you're in an emotional state that is probably frustrated and intimidated by what it takes to get where you want to go. Is that true?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, a little bit. And I understand your question a little better. So I might. To get my nursing degree, I would need two more years.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what I thought.

[Ken Coleman]

Two years of the prerequisite. Prerequisite course.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what I thought. So two more years.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm kind of just waiting. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much money do we need to complete that? Two years worth of coursework.

[Ken Coleman]

So I signed up for fafsa, which here in Colorado is a program that you can sign up for, and it, like, signs you up for every single scholarship grant, anything that you can get.

[George Campbell]

Perfect.

[Ken Coleman]

So I think that I could get enough scholarship money to pay for my entire schooling. Seeing as how I'm a 4 year old and I'm a single mommy, I think that I'll be okay there until then.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm like, that's awesome news. So here's the deal. I want to hand it over to George to kind of pour through your expenses, because I think you got to do some work there, too. But it's. Here's what I want to tell you. I want you to aggressively be looking for something that's paying you 25, $30 an hour. Okay?

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because it doesn't matter what you're doing now. It doesn't even need to be the medical assistant or medical. Like it's anything anywhere that pays you more money than you're making right now. And the reason is to create some margin.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then George is going to talk you through paying off that $7,000, which is going to also free up more money. We got to get you a raise through income and expenses. George, tell her how we're going to do that.

[George Campbell]

So, Christy, my first question is, why are you paying 40% in taxes and deductions? Because you told me you're. You're making 19 an hour. It's about 40 grand a year. But you're only taking home 24,000 a year. Are you investing right now?

[Ken Coleman]

No. So I am trying to pay back my school loans. I have $7,000 in debt and school loans. I just recently bought a phone, too, because my old one broke. And so that's about $800 to pay that off. And then my son is in school, and I'm paying $300 a month for that. And I'm also on scholarships. So that is $300 with scholarships for paying for my son's school. And then just normal, I got food, rent.

[George Campbell]

So when you said take home pay, this was after all of those other expenses were paid. Your debt payment for the phone and. Okay, got it. That makes a lot more sense.

[Ken Coleman]

Yep.

[George Campbell]

So you actually have more margin than you think. But you're saying after all that's paid, I have a hundred bucks extra I could throw at the debt. It's not going to make a debt. And that's where Ken's advice comes into play. Think about it this way. For every extra dollar an hour you can go make, that's 2 grand a year at 40 hours a week. So if you can go make 25 an hour, you're going to get a $10,000 raise. Can you get out of Debt a little easier if you had an extra ten grand a year laying around.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yeah, exactly.

[George Campbell]

And this might be a side hustle. Yeah, you might do your 40 hours and then do another 10 hours doing this. I don't know, your, your family life and you know I want to respect that, but this is going to be some sacrifice and hustle. But to Ken's point, if we can get you out of the student loan debt, free up a payment, get your emergency fund so you never have to go into debt again, now we have a foundation to where we can step forward from a place of strength into that next piece of education. And then once you're a nurse, goodness gracious, sky's the limit.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And now you're going to cash flow. The master's degree, that's your next goal.

[George Campbell]

So car and house, love that for you.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's going to have to be down the line.

[George Campbell]

I wish we could do it all at once, Christy, but we like the car.

[Ken Coleman]

I am kind of in dire need of a new car. My car right now.

[George Campbell]

Then let's pause everything and stack up money for this car and then we'll push play on the debt. Snowball. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Ken Coleman]

You've got a lot to keep organized in life. Kids and calendars and carpooling and cleaning. I mean, it is so much. That's why you need a Knockbox. That way if something happens to you, you leave your loved ones with happy memories and not a huge mess. Knockbox is a complete system to help you organize your accounts, personal history, estate planning documents and all your other info in one place. I'm talking about everything from life insurance policies and social media accounts to your dog's vet divided into 15 simple categories. Plus they've got checklists that tell you what to add to each folder so your family won't have to guess where everything is. So start getting organized [e-mail] Ramsey your family will thank you. That's Knockbox n o k box.com Ramsey.

[George Campbell]

Foreign welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ramsey personality George Camel, joined by best selling author Ken Coleman. Hey, George, we are here. Ken, we're live. We're doing it. Call us up, triple 882-55-5225 and you'll be, you'll be blessed to talk to Ken today, I'll tell you that much. It's blessing.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know if I. Well, you're really setting me up there. Blessed.

[George Campbell]

We'll see what Grant thinks. He's in Chicago.

[Dave Ramsey]

Boy, now I got A bless. Grant.

[George Campbell]

Grant, how you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, George. Hey, Ken. Thanks for taking my call. Guys, I'm really excited to say that right before Christmas I paid off my house. So I'm officially on baby six.

[George Campbell]

Way to go.

[Dave Ramsey]

Strong golf class for that one, right?

[George Campbell]

You got how many kids?

[Ken Coleman]

I got six kids ranging from 12 years old all the way down to 10 months. Eight of us living in this beautiful paid off house.

[George Campbell]

Good for.

[Ken Coleman]

Question is, I know I could save up for another eight years and pay cash for a bigger, better house, but by then my kids are going to start graduating, they're going to move out.

[George Campbell]

Then you'll be downsizing.

[Ken Coleman]

Would it ever make sense under the Ramsey plan to upgrade to a bigger house with another mortgage? Or is it better to just stick drinking this debt free Kool Aid and eventually pay cash?

[George Campbell]

Well, in a perfect world, if Dave was on air, he'd say, well, I wouldn't want you going back into debt. But also, it's not a sin to go revert back to baby step six for a few years and knock out the mortgage. And so as long as you're doing it, you know, 15 year fixed rate, the payments, no more than a quarter of your take home pay. And with all the 100% equity you have in the house, roll that into the next one plus any savings and try to minimize the mortgage and then knock it out quickly. So what are we talking? What would it take for you guys to upgrade to a home that's like, all right, we got room, six kids. We got room for all eight of us with room to spare for all eight of us?

[Ken Coleman]

It looks like if we hit something in the $400,000 range, based off of our location, we'd be stepping up from 1800 square feet to somewhere approaching 3,000 square feet, like 2,829.

[Dave Ramsey]

How many bedrooms?

[Ken Coleman]

That's what our market's looking like. Four bedrooms. At least that's what we've got right now.

[George Campbell]

There's tiny bedrooms, but do you need five bedrooms? Six bedrooms?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you got multiple boys?

[Ken Coleman]

No, one boy. The rest are lovely girls.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, I was going to say, because if it was, if it was mostly boys, she just pile them on top of each other. They don't care. They live like rats anyway. I got two boys, I can say.

[Ken Coleman]

That live under a bridge.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah. I literally was going to go that direction. But the girl thing, I only have one girl and I don't know, I feel like I'm on thin ice if I recommend that.

[George Campbell]

But, you know, but I Think you're still going? All right, for the. For the house that we would want. What's your current house worth?

[Ken Coleman]

Current house is worth 270.

[George Campbell]

270. And let's say the next house was 450. Right. And let's say you want to do that. How long do you have? Is this a year from now? What's the urgency?

[Ken Coleman]

The urgent Yesterday. I'm living my best life now. It's just close quarters.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're very cheery for a guy with six kids. I'll be honest with you.

[George Campbell]

How do you have time to make this call?

[Ken Coleman]

I got no payments.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but you also don't have any sleep either, Are you. But, oh, here's a question America wants to know. I know this. Are you done having kids or are there more on the way?

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, I. If the Lord wants me to have more kids, I'll have some more.

[George Campbell]

Oh, God bless the Catholics. There we go.

[Ken Coleman]

Whoa.

[George Campbell]

I'm kidding. I'm kidding.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow.

[George Campbell]

Thank you, Grant, for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

You just dropped Catholicism on him.

[George Campbell]

I just thought maybe, you know, they're like, let's have more babies. More and more. But, hey, I'm happy for you guys. He's living his best life.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you think there's a possibility that more kids are coming?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, everybody tells me, like, you know, what causes that, right? And I say, yeah, and I'm not willing to give it up.

[George Campbell]

Well, you got a 10 month old.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wait a second. You're getting partial information. No one says you got to give it up, but there are other things you can do. Maybe you should seek a family planner as a. As a side of this call.

[George Campbell]

Ken will give you advice off air for that one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, hang on the line. I'll give you a couple tips on when we go to commercial break.

[George Campbell]

Thank you for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, Grant, I'm willing to give it up.

[George Campbell]

Let's talk about it.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's the best thing I've heard in a long time.

[George Campbell]

You're in baby step seven. Do you guys have a bunch of money in savings outside of your emergency fund?

[Ken Coleman]

So not a bunch of money in savings. Why? Because I got a little gazelle intense on paying off the house there at the end. I have three to six months of expenses because I have no expenses. But yeah, so savings are a little low right now. 6,000 in the bank.

[George Campbell]

How much could you save up in 12 months for? You know, and as a kind of a down payment, plus your equity.

[Ken Coleman]

Plus. Plus equity. I would be approaching 2285.

[George Campbell]

So you could save up. You're saying 15 grand in the next 12 months?

[Ken Coleman]

I think so.

[George Campbell]

Okay, so just set a goal. And you're married. You have a wife.

[Ken Coleman]

I am.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

You didn't know the doubt I had.

[George Campbell]

That you never know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thought we had covered that earlier, but.

[George Campbell]

I would set a goal with her and say, hey, here's what we're wanting to do. We want to upgrade about a year from now. Here's how much I think we can save. We're going to take all of our equity plus the savings and throw it at the next one. And then there likely will be a gap of, let's say, 50 to $100,000. And here's how we're going to tackle that. We're going to attack that two years or three years, whatever it is, just set a goal and don't let this linger and don't do a 30 year with as little payment as possible. Get aggressive and get rid of it and get back to baby step seven. No time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you have Ken and I's blessing that you're not, you know, it's not going against the Ramsey plan to, to get another mortgage and to be temporarily in baby step six. You guys have done such a great job. You sound like you're a young family. You've got a 10 month old. How old are you? Two?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, so I'm 36.

[George Campbell]

Amazing. And so if we say, hey, by 40, we're going to be debt free again. Back in baby step seven, the house will appreciate. And so I would go down that path. You get. That's a lot of kids to debunk in a 1800 square foot helmet.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's a better man than I. I.

[George Campbell]

Tell you, I'd be out of there.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I reached my max capacity as a father at three. I readily admit that. I'm glad we have three.

[George Campbell]

I do think people are hardwired for a certain number.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's no question. That guy right there was born and created to father a lot of kids. He's very, very bubbly, very positive young man.

[George Campbell]

I'm a curmudgeon with one child.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you're a curmudgeon, period.

[George Campbell]

Without children.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. We were hoping that your sweet little princess knocked off some of the mud.

[George Campbell]

She has. She brings me joy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah. She's a sweet girl.

[George Campbell]

Wow. We got through that one, Ken. Let's move on to Federico, just down the road in Nashville. What's going on, Federico?

[Ken Coleman]

How's it going, guys? Big fan of the show, just by the way.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thank you, Dave.

[Ken Coleman]

Ramsey in high school, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, nice.

[Ken Coleman]

A little while. Yeah. So my situation, I'm 23, I'm a recently graduated college out of Middle Tennessee University and debt free. I was able to pay it out of pocket between some what I was making and scholarships and stuff. So yeah, I have my degree in.

[Dave Ramsey]

Engineering and I started being a in May.

[Ken Coleman]

I started as a NASCAR engineer for the number 25 truck.

[Dave Ramsey]

How about that? That's really cool.

[George Campbell]

Was that a dream?

[Ken Coleman]

Pretty fun, Joe.

[George Campbell]

I'm sorry, was that a dream of yours?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, so I've always been in the.

[George Campbell]

Automotive field or whatnot.

[Ken Coleman]

I used to be a technician and, and I mean now that I have my degree, being able to use it for nascar, I mean, it's definitely pretty cool.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh yeah, you can write it on the tv.

[George Campbell]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good for you, man. That's great.

[George Campbell]

So what's your question?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, so downside it is a 1099. It's my first year ever being on 1099. I've been on W2 since I was 15. With this being said, I was able to, you know, get a lot of money from not having any debt and I got, I was able to save 15,000 on my savings out of about 3,000 invested in dividends yielding stocks and, and the SB 500. But with that 5,000, a big chunk of money, I didn't want the better, worse, I didn't want the government to take it. Right. I didn't want to just, just sit in there not, not compounding any interest or anything.

[Dave Ramsey]

So my big question was, should I.

[Ken Coleman]

Invest into maxing on my 2024 IRA, making that a deductible for next year?

[George Campbell]

For last year you could, I don't think it's going to be that much of a game changer. I mean, and if you did that in a Roth ira, you wouldn't be able to get a deduction on your taxes because you're, you've already paid taxes, it's going to grow tax deferred and you know, you can withdraw it tax free and all that. So I don't think it's worth doing it for the tax deduction. I would do it because of where you're at in the baby steps, which is if you're debt free with an emergency fund, invest 15% of your income. And because you don't have a traditional retirement plan, the Roth IRA would be a great place to do that.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so I do believe, so I have my fidelity. I believe it's a traditional ira.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I was reading up that you can if your employer doesn't give you retirement, you can deduct up to 100% of it, which is 7,000 for one tax period.

[George Campbell]

That's on the traditional side.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[George Campbell]

And I'm saying if I were you, I'd do Roth side. I wouldn't do it for the taxes. I'd pay whatever taxes are owed and I'd rather be tax free. At your age, man, that's all going to grow tax free till retirement. So that's what I would do personally, but it's a great point. You can still max out your Roth IRA for 2024 people until tax day. So get to it. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Dave Ramsey]

Self defense can be a complicated issue, but there's.

[Ken Coleman]

One solution that makes it a lot easier a burner launcher. Burners look like firearms, but they're not. They're non lethal self defense tools. They shoot chemical irritant projectiles that stop.

[Dave Ramsey]

A threat in its tracks without the.

[Ken Coleman]

Fatal consequences of a gun. Burner launchers have been vetted by government agencies, police forces and private security agencies worldwide and no permits or background checks are required to buy or own one. Plus, burners are lightweight, easy to carry, and give you the power to protect yourself and your family even if you're.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not comfortable with traditional firearms.

[Ken Coleman]

Not to mention, they have more than 15,000 five star reviews. And right now Ramsey fans can get.

[George Campbell]

10% off an exclusive bundle which includes.

[Ken Coleman]

A burner pistol, CO2 cartridges and ammo. And other burner products like safety alarms, defense sprays and body armor are also 10% off. For our listeners, just go to burner.com Dave to learn more. That's by R N A.com Dave.

[Dave Ramsey]

The.

[George Campbell]

Ramsey Show Question of the Day is brought to you by Yrefi Student loan debt is a swamp thousands of people find it hard to escape from. So don't be another statistic in the student loan swamp. For distressed private student loans, there's why Refi we trust Yrefi because they help you with a low fixed interest rate you couldn't get anywhere else to help you stick to your budget and get out of debt. Learn [e-mail] Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey may not be available in all states.

[Dave Ramsey]

Today's question comes from Maria in Connecticut. I recently received my license to practice architecture. I'll be having a conversation soon with the management at my current job about a new role and the responsibilities that come with it. I also suspect that with those responsibilities will come a pay increase. My employer has always been generous. However, I would like to go into that meeting with an idea of what a fair salary looks like. I understand there are nuances to salary, such as your. Your years of experience, geographical location and specialty. I want to manage my expectations of what their offer might be so that I can be grateful to my employer if it's generous. Oh, that's fun. If it's generous. I want to be grateful if it's generous. On the other hand, here's the. Here's the other one. If. If I'm offered less than expected, I want to be prepared to find out why. Prove my value and prove my value. Where can I find accurate Sally data to know what fair is? Well, there's no Bible on this, so let's start with that. There's no one source. There are multiple sources. I would be checking job sites, and again, I'm not going to say names because I'm not endorsing, but you can go look and try to get a range with research. You can also. I would consult LinkedIn, you know, reach out to people that, you know, have similar experience. There are ways to get a range. And what you want to do is get a range. And you already laid out in your question, Maria, what we're looking at here, geographic region. You start with that because that's very, very different. You know what region you're in. You look at years of experience, qualifications, et cetera, et cetera. And because this is a new qualification that you will be getting, you are going to be at the bottom rung of the experience ladder. And so you've got to take that into account. So I think you've got enough markers to be able to do pretty good research and have an idea of the range of what you want. But do not lose sight of the fact that this employer has, by your words, always been very generous to you. And this is an opportunity to make a nice pivot. And even if it's not exactly what you want, you can't get lost in the number being absolutely ideal. You have to focus, George, on the fact that you've made the switch and now you're in the line of work you want to be in, and you got a chance to get experience, which sets you up for your future. So mindset and prioritizing your focus is the key here on how to handle this conversation going forward.

[George Campbell]

Yeah. To your point, Ken, the initial number is less important to me. It's more about how quality is the leadership at this company. What does a growth track look like in the role that I'm in. That's what I'm more interested in versus what am I making day one when I just got my license.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And she knows these folks. She feels valued by them. It appears so. That's a pretty good situation to be able to make that pivot.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, but I think having a range in your mind is good. It's not going to be $30,000. It's not going to be $300,000. So having a range is good. I wouldn't plant on one specific number. And if it's a dollar less, I'm going to leave. Yeah, that feels unhealthy.

[Dave Ramsey]

I agree with you there.

[George Campbell]

All right, let's go out to the phones. Thomas is in Sacramento. Up next. What's going on, Thomas?

[Ken Coleman]

Hello. How's it going?

[George Campbell]

Great. How can we help?

[Ken Coleman]

So my question is my wife, recent, not recently, but a couple years ago, was diagnosed with cancer and had her had a hysterectomy. And so we're trying to have a surrogacy to have a biological child. And we're just trying to find out the best, smartest way to get that much cash because it's around. It depends on how we do it, but like 80 to 100k and so we have like 40 saved up. But. Yeah. I just don't know if we should sell our stuff. Like our house. Like our other house. What do you mean?

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you mean by other house?

[George Campbell]

Tell us about an investment property.

[Ken Coleman]

She will. She's. We were both in the military and then I got out and then she piece moved, so now we live in California. So our old house in Arkansas, we just rented it out at the time.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's it worth and what do you owe on it?

[Ken Coleman]

We owe like 170 and Zillow says like 270.

[George Campbell]

I think we just found our answer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Man, there's the answer.

[George Campbell]

I think this baby trumps having an investment property. Are you guys going to be financially okay losing the rental income?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I mean, we only make like 100 bucks after because we don't charge that much rent. But the other issue too is she's in the military. They're going to kick her out of the military because of the cancer. Has reoccurred now a couple times. So then we're losing. She's primary breadwinner. What does they just medically separate. Like they look at her and go, well, she's can't deploy. She can't do her. She can't do her job. I mean, she could still do her job, but she can't deploy, so they're gonna medically separate her. Essentially, we'll get to keep the health insurance.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's good.

[George Campbell]

But, but, and is there any income that will still come in?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, she. We don't know exactly how much she'll get. VA disability.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

But they won't give us that rating until kind of the final steps. Like that's like right before they do the deed, they pretty much tell her, okay, you're going to get this. But we're estimating, I mean, with cancer she should get 100%, but you can never be too certain.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what would your income need to go to to make you feel comfortable after all of this? We've already figured out how to fund the.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, I would have told you to sell this house even if this wasn't the case.

[Dave Ramsey]

I agree.

[George Campbell]

Just to not be a long distance landlord and be done with it. So we have one thing solved. Sell it, take all the profits and use it to fund the surrogacy.

[Dave Ramsey]

You already got 40,000 in the bank. And so. Yeah, so let's say you walk with. What did we say? You said it was worth what, 280?

[George Campbell]

You said 270. I mean, I take Zillow with a grain of salt. It could be a.

[Dave Ramsey]

It could be way more like it.

[Ken Coleman]

I feel like it's overpriced on Zillow personally, but I mean, I don't know much.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you still stand to walk with about 100,000 or 80,000 somewhere in that.

[Ken Coleman]

Range, something like that.

[George Campbell]

Which on top of your 40 is more than enough to cover.

[Dave Ramsey]

That takes care of that.

[George Campbell]

Plus emergency fund.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right. So what kind of income would you need to. How much would you need to increase your income to make you feel calm at night? Not knowing what that military number is going to play out to be?

[Ken Coleman]

That's like the big issue is I don't really know because. Right. Well, sure, she's definitely gonna lose like two. She's gonna lose like two to 3,000amonth in income. But once she gets kicked out, we don't have to live where we live because, you know, we're. The military's making us live here.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what's a conservative. What's a conservative number? Can we say 36, 000? Like if you increased your income by 30, if she's gonna stand to lose 3,000amonth. I'm being very conservative because I'm thinking ahead. I'm thinking rainy day. What's the umbrella? So what I'm asking you is does that make sense? If not, give me another number.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that sounds about right. Probably another 20 to 30, somewhere in that range that I would have to supplement to be comfortable living where we're at. I mean, we could deal with because we already dropped like 3,000 in savings each month right now. So, I mean, we could.

[George Campbell]

You've got Mark, theoretically, which is we.

[Ken Coleman]

Would be fine, but then we wouldn't be able to be because we're already pretty tight with our money. So we would.

[Dave Ramsey]

But don't do that. Don't accept that. In other words, I appreciate what you're saying from a number standpoint, from an attitude standpoint, I'd prefer you go. I'm not going to deal with anything. I'm going to happen to something. And so I'm going to go make an additional. I'd like to see you try to make an additional 2500amonth to come up with an additional $30,000 a year. I don't care how you do it, but if it was me, George, that's what I would be doing. I don't know if you have a different thought on that, but I would be wanting to pad my stats, if you will, on that situation. Then if it's extra and we don't need it, awesome. We got gravy. We got the college fund started. You know, there's many things you can do with that extra 30 grand, but I would be trying to do that.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, I think that'll give you a lot of peace during this chaotic time is just control what you can control. Control your spending, control your income. And I. We're wishing you guys the best with the surrogacy. And I mean, what a blessing to have this house that we can just sell to fix this problem, you know, it's a beautiful problem to have.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

So, and I, again, I think this baby trumps the investment property, especially when you're essentially losing money on the deal. That baby will trump it all. So wishing you guys the best with that. Thank you so much for the call that puts this hour of the Ramsey show in the books. Thank you to my co host, Ken Coleman, everyone in the booth keeping the show afloat. And you, America, will be back before you know it.

[Ken Coleman]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. Hey, folks. We all have stories.

[Dave Ramsey]

The family and cultural stories that we were born into, the stories of the things that have happened to us, both good and bad, and the stories that we constantly tell ourselves. And while we can't go back and change any of our old stories, the world is waiting to see what you and I are going to write next as we enter 2025.

[George Campbell]

I want to encourage you to examine.

[Dave Ramsey]

Your old stories and be intentional about the new ones you're writing. And I'm not talking about goals that are going to be long gone by February. I'm talking about writing new stories that will change your life forever for the better. And if you're like me, therapy can be a great place to explore the old stories, even heal from them and begin to write new ones. And if you're thinking about starting therapy, I want you to consider my friends at Better Help. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy and you can talk with a licensed therapist when it works for your schedule, you just fill out a short online survey to get matched with the licensed therapist and you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. So start writing a new story this month with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E L p.com DeLoney.

[George Campbell]

From Ramsey Network, this is the Ramsey show where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Camel joined by Ken Coleman and the number to call is 888-825-5225. Ken is the man. If you need help getting that income up, he's the man. When it comes to getting your income up, we say your income is your greatest wealth building tool. A lot of people are going, I gotta make more. Ken is so good at guiding you through, coaching you through how do you make more for your current state in the short term and in the long term. And I'll be alongside, answer all of your money questions and whatever else is.

[Dave Ramsey]

I thought you were going to say something else because you're telling me I was the man.

[George Campbell]

So I thought I'd make you feel good.

[Dave Ramsey]

While I appreciate it, a little, a little disappointing, but that's, it's wow. But let's help some people, shall we?

[George Campbell]

That's the goal we have. Up first, we got Rob in Columbus, Ohio. Rob, what's going on?

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, guys.

[George Campbell]

Hey.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey. So I'm looking for a little guidance here. You know, back in 1980, long before I became a Ramsey disciple, I purchased two Northwestern Mutual whole life policies. They have a cash value of 96,800 and a death benefit of 150. Now I'm just looking for a little guidance on, you know, is it worth my while to cash this out, pay the taxes and reinvest it or has the train too far down the tracks with that significant death benefit?

[George Campbell]

How old are you?

[Ken Coleman]

69.

[George Campbell]

Okay. And you're wondering, hey, if I cash this out, I'll get 96,000 that I could invest minus some surrender fees.

[Ken Coleman]

I would deduct the basis. I would probably end up my calculation, I'd end up with about 78,600 to invest.

[George Campbell]

Okay, 78,000 that you can do what you want with. Or you go, I'm just going to keep paying this monthly premium and I'll have $150,000 death benefit, the face value of the policy, Right.

[Ken Coleman]

Currently.

[George Campbell]

Okay. What's your financial situation?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm very financially secure. And no debt at all?

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, what does that look like? What's your retirement look like?

[George Campbell]

10 million in the bank or like where. What's the nest egg?

[Ken Coleman]

3.7.

[George Campbell]

Amazing. So you're self insured, you don't need life insurance?

[Ken Coleman]

Probably not.

[Dave Ramsey]

The question is for you, why in the world would you continue to pay that monthly premium knowing what you just told us?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I mean, last year interest and dividends came to about $4,000. So after I paid the interest in dividends, it was just, you know, do I set that up?

[Dave Ramsey]

What are you paying per month? What are you paying per month to keep this policy going?

[Ken Coleman]

It's 741 a year for both policies.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so here's my question. $741 in the grand scheme of things, not a huge amount of money, but it's still $741 for a benefit that you don't need. You don't need $150,000 upon your death.

[Ken Coleman]

You're right.

[George Campbell]

Okay, so when you think about the purpose of life insurance, which by the way, we only recommend term life insurance instead of these whole life policies because of how expensive they are and because of a whole host of other issues. The goal is to replace your income if something should happen to you so that your loved ones won't have to grieve financially. And so are there people in your life who rely on your income today?

[Ken Coleman]

No, just my wife's not.

[George Campbell]

And on top of that, you're self insured. If something happened, she's got $3.7 million sitting there, right?

[Ken Coleman]

Correct.

[George Campbell]

So the 150,000, that's cute compared to the nest egg you've been able to build up. And so that's the point and the goal of having that term life for, you know, 15 or 25 years. Over that time, you follow the baby steps, you pay off your House, you've been investing consistently for decades, and here you are with this policy. So if I was in your shoes, just because it would pain me to keep making this payment, this crappy product, I would be done with it. I take my 78, invest it, go on vacation, do what you want with it, but I wouldn't continue paying it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I agree with George. You just got $78,000 wealthier. That's the way I look at it.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, we love that.

[George Campbell]

Now, if you were in, you know, if you were destitute financially, you had no nest egg, this was all the money to your name, and you were in ailing health, I'd go, okay, I'd probably just keep paying the policy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Because it's going to be more helpful than it is harmful. But, man, you've done such a great job regardless of this crappy product that it's impressive.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

What do you. If you know there's a 25 year old listening who says, I'd like to have $3.8 million, what do you tell that person? What was the key to your success?

[Ken Coleman]

You know, I mean, I've worked hard, I've invested well. But also, I mean, I got to give some credit to Ramsey. I attacked my mortgage first, and I did not spend money that I didn't have.

[George Campbell]

That simple. Live on less than you make. Get rid of your dad.

[Ken Coleman]

The things my grandmother taught me. I mean, it was very, very, very simple. And, yeah, I've done well with.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, good.

[George Campbell]

That's amazing. Thanks for the call, Rob.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'd be planning a $78,000 spend party. Like, I'd be like, let's get together. What do we want to do with 78 grand?

[George Campbell]

Divvy it up.

[Dave Ramsey]

Have fun with that.

[George Campbell]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, give a little, you know.

[George Campbell]

Fun to kids or grandkids. College fun. Go on a nice vacation. Yeah, that's living like no one else. All right, Aaron is in Youngstown, Ohio. Up next. What's going on, Aaron?

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, George. How are you?

[George Campbell]

Great. How can we help?

[Ken Coleman]

So, first and foremost, thank you guys for taking my call, man. It's, it's such an honor to speak to you guys today. Excited? Secondly, a little bit about me. I'm 22 years old. I work for Altium Sales in Lorstown, Ohio. I make around 90,000 a year, including profit sharing. And the only debt that I have is my mortgage.

[George Campbell]

Awesome. What's your question?

[Ken Coleman]

My question is, given the circumstance, how would I diversify my portfolio? Given right now, my company also does a 10% match amazing. I'm only investing in the Roth right now.

[George Campbell]

So are you investing 15% of your gross income regardless of match?

[Ken Coleman]

Right now? Currently I do 50% of my income after taxes. So that would be the Roth. Right now I'm not doing anything towards the 401k.

[George Campbell]

Okay, so you got a Roth IRA that you're contributing to.

[Ken Coleman]

Correct.

[George Campbell]

Do they have a Roth 401k option through your employer?

[Ken Coleman]

No.

[George Campbell]

Okay, I would check in on that, but here's the strategy. Match beats Roth, beats traditional. So you're investing, you got the match that's 100% return. Next, do all the Roth you can. For you, that might just be the Roth ira. And if you still have money beyond that in that 15%, go back to your traditional options in the 401k. As far as diversifying, what are you invested in right now? What funds did you choose inside of your retirement plan?

[Ken Coleman]

Right now I'm currently doing American funds, just a couple different growth index funds, a few different mutual funds. I think right now I have a couple separate stocks that I'm also investing in as well.

[George Campbell]

I would avoid single stocks because of the risk and volatility. I would stick to those funds that you mentioned, mutual funds, index funds. And there's four types you want to diversify across. And it basically is like a large cap, mid cap, small cap, and international because that'll diversify even amongst those funds. And to help you do a deep dive on this Jump on Ramsey Solutions.com guide, we have a free investing guide where we walk through exactly how to choose those funds. Appreciate that.

[Dave Ramsey]

You should invite him to your live stream.

[George Campbell]

You and Dave join us for the Investing Essentials livestream. The ticket is on me, Aaron, so hang on the line. It's on us today. Thank you so much for the call. He may have planted that to get a free ticket. I don't know.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'd like that money.

[George Campbell]

Appreciate that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Smart move.

[George Campbell]

This is the Ramsey Show. You know, every year I hear the.

[Ken Coleman]

Same excuses for why people don't get the life insurance they need to protect their families. So this year, let's clear the air and look at the facts. Most people are concerned about price, but term life rates have never been lower. Having 10 to 12 times your income on a 15 or 20 year plan.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is in many cases just plain cheap.

[Ken Coleman]

Second, life insurance through your work is not enough, especially since these plans go away. If you change jobs, you need to have your own policy so you're not without protection when your family really needs it. Third, stay at home, parents need life insurance, especially those with young kids. People don't realize how quickly the costs add up without someone at home taking care of things. So no more excuses, folks.

[Dave Ramsey]

Get the protection your family needs.

[Ken Coleman]

Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

[Dave Ramsey]

They've been my choice for all my.

[George Campbell]

Insurance for over 25 years and are.

[Dave Ramsey]

The only people I trust. Hey, guys, I've got a big announcement. George Camel and I are bringing back.

[Ken Coleman]

Investing Essentials, our two night virtual event deep diving into investing and real estate. Learn step by step how to get the most out of your 401k mutual funds and real estate investments. Because there's no better time to get the clarity you need to invest with confidence. Watch live on March 4th and 5th. Get tickets today at ramseysolutions.com events.

[George Campbell]

This is the Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell joined by Ken Coleman. The number to call is 888-825-5225. Andrew's up next in Pittsburgh. How can we help? Andrew?

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, guys, can you hear me?

[George Campbell]

Yeah, loud and clear.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, great to talk to you. A huge fan. I'm calling today about my parents. My dad has Alzheimer's and my mom had a pretty significant stroke about four months ago, so they're not able to live independently much anymore. Fortunately, my sister has been able to take care of them at her house most of the time, and I'm taking them to their cabin on the weekends. But ultimately we're looking to build them like a small residence next to me with lots of grandkids to drop in on them through the day and stuff. We're hoping to keep construction costs under 250,000 and pay cash for it. My parents have done an awesome job at living well within their means, but we're looking at their statement from their financial advisor, and it's kind of like a mixed bag of things that don't give us a good feel for exactly how much is available or liquid at least at this point. So I guess our question is if or how we try to consolidate all these accounts to keep it simpler and have enough money to cut checks for the home they're building in the next few months. And I have the list for you when you're ready.

[George Campbell]

Okay. Are you like a financial power of attorney? Can you make financial decisions on their behalf?

[Ken Coleman]

Fortunately, no. It's my sister. She has all that responsibility right now.

[George Campbell]

Okay. And you and her are working in tandem to figure this out?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. As well as my other sister. Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Okay. All right. So what as you Dug into the numbers. What do you mean parts of it may not be liquid?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, they have traditional IRAs, each of them. So my mom has 150,000 in hers. My dad has 580,000 in his. They also have a $47,000 investment. It sounds like a blend of mutual funds. Both of the IRAs are set up with annuities.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

They also have a Pacific life. It sounds like a whole life policy. It shows a value of $31,000. They also have a bunch of gold, probably at least 20,000. And they have about 90,000 in their checking account.

[George Campbell]

All right, and you're going.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I'm intentionally leaving out the $80,000 worth of long term care insurance coverage because that's a whole other nightmare that we're going through.

[George Campbell]

Was this advisor, was this the one who got them into all this?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[George Campbell]

Oh boy. I might find a new advisor. Yeah, they've been selling them crappy products for a long time.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[George Campbell]

All I heard washing. More commission for me. More commission for me. Here's a whole life. Here's an annuity. These are some of the most complicated and expensive products that your parents honestly didn't need with this level of wealth.

[Ken Coleman]

That was my initial thought also. So I'm glad to hear you guys say that.

[George Campbell]

Neither here nor there. But here's what I would do if, is figure out what, which of these has the least impact tax wise. So think through some of that tax strategy. Because the traditional IRAs, they haven't paid taxes on the funds. So if you just withdrew 250. No, you're going to have to pay taxes on that as they file their taxes. So I would sell whatever else like, you know, the gold. Again, there's. You're going to have taxes probably with, with anything that's not just straight liquid cash in a checking account. The cash value on the whole life, that's 31,000 worth of cash value.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[George Campbell]

I might get rid of that before I dip into the retirement accounts. You're going to need to dip into the retirement accounts anyways with a project this big.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[George Campbell]

And you guys need them living on the same property with you.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. I actually have a couple other lots next to me that are. They're mine.

[George Campbell]

Oh, nice.

[Ken Coleman]

And we're going to set them up on one of those. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

How many square feet is this potential build?

[Ken Coleman]

We're trying to keep it under a thousand. It's just going to be a single level. You know the basics.

[George Campbell]

Okay, but you're still thinking 250 grand is what this Might cost.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, we have some grade to deal with on the properties.

[George Campbell]

Okay. Okay, so you've done your homework. It sounds like this is not a wet finger in the air.

[Ken Coleman]

No.

[George Campbell]

Okay, you're right.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

So if that's the case, I'm going to go strategically through a prioritized list of what I would liquidate first and I would, I would honestly get a second opinion. And if you want one, you can jump on ramseysolutions.com and click on Trusted Pros and you'll see a network of investment pros that we trust to help you out in this situation. And they're not going to sell you garbage products, I can guarantee you that. So what are your thoughts, George?

[Dave Ramsey]

Maybe on a tax advisor as well.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, tax pro as well would really help. Going. Here's, here's what's going to have the minimal tax impact based on what you sold, what the cost basis was, what the capital gains tax, all the nerd nerd Tron stuff as you dig into this. But it sounds like your sister is going to have to be very involved too.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[George Campbell]

Because she's making all these moves happen on your parents behalf. But the good news is the money's there. It's not going to decimate you're. You're probably talking about, you know, liquidating a quarter of their nest egg to make this happen.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[George Campbell]

And then what's the ongoing cost to take care of them? They need 24 hour private care or.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, we're trying to work that out. No, I don't think they do need 24 hour round the clock care. But being that they'd be living next to me, we'd set them up with cameras and things like that, you know, in case of emergency or something. We'd be pretty handy to go over and see what's going on. Yeah. But no, we're trying to get home care to come by at least for, you know, some of the basics. But my sister's able to handle that right now. And I think that's probably one of the problems we're running into with the long term care insurance is they don't want to pay because it seems like they can, you know, we can handle it. And it's, we're just, you know, so.

[George Campbell]

You'Re having to fight that and go, no, this is, this is something, this is exactly why we got long term care insurance. So that if it got to this point they could have care that was covered.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Andrew, I would encourage you to talk with their doctors also get some advice from People who may have walked this road a little bit. I'm only saying this because my brother in law is dealing with this right now. And I will tell you that unfortunately the Alzheimer's situation is not going to get better. It's going to get worse. With your mother, it's probably limited on what she can do. Depending on her symptoms. Post stroke, at some point, assisted care, assisted living is something that you need to at least kick the tires on. I just don't know how long your sister or you with cameras can. You have to think about you guys and your ability to step in and do what you need to do while your life is moving. And I, I'm not trying to be sober, but I am trying to give a bit of wisdom, just a little bit of observation I've been able to take in as my brother in law walks through this. They're just not. That situation is not going to get better for your mother.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And so my dad's actually the ones with all. The one with Alzheimer's.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know. Yeah, I know. But she can't, she can't take care of him. Them. It's all you guys. And I'm saying before I spent $250,000 on a home, I would really look at this from multiple angles to see, you know, how long that solution that you're describing. And I understand your heart not trying to talk you out of it. I'm just trying to give you another perspective because I got, I've got no emotion attached to it. But I would really be playing that out with your sisters as to how long that model is sustainable.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

I would also just come up with a game plan with whoever's involved. Is it more than just your sister involved?

[Dave Ramsey]

My other sister got two sisters.

[George Campbell]

Okay. I would get together with all three of them and go, okay, here's what's, here's where we're gonna lay this all out. Here's how we're gonna fund this project. Here's what the ongoing care is gonna look like. Here's the priority in which we'll spend this money. And that way everyone's on the same page. Because this is the kind of stuff that will destroy relationships.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right.

[George Campbell]

When there's surprises, things weren't communicated.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right.

[George Campbell]

I expected this. I was supposed to get this.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right.

[George Campbell]

And I want to at least savor these relationships.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that's what I'm cautioning, Andrew, is look at all of the possibilities and how this thing could go so that there are zero surprises.

[George Campbell]

Do they have a will in place?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[George Campbell]

Okay, good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sorry. You're going through this too. Andrew.

[George Campbell]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're carrying a lot.

[Ken Coleman]

Thanks.

[George Campbell]

It's not gonna be easy, but you're doing the right thing. You're a good son, very noble thing to do. And I'm wishing your parents and your whole family the best through this process. Man. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does the future hold for business?

[George Campbell]

Ask nine experts and you'll get 10 different answers.

[Dave Ramsey]

Economic growth or a recession. Business taxes will go up or down. AI will help us work or it.

[Ken Coleman]

Will replace us all.

[Dave Ramsey]

But there's no such thing as a crystal ball.

[Ken Coleman]

That's why more than 40,000 businesses have.

[Dave Ramsey]

Future proofed themselves with NetSuite by Oracle.

[Ken Coleman]

The number one cloud enterprise resource planning system.

[Dave Ramsey]

Ramsey Solutions uses NetSuite and you should, too. Whether your company's earning millions or even hundreds of millions, NetSuite helps you respond to immediate challenges and seize your biggest opportunities with one unified business management suite. There's only one source of truth for the visibility and control you need to make quick decisions. NetSuite's real time insights and forecasting help you see into the future with actionable data. And when you're closing the books in days, not weeks, you can spend less.

[Ken Coleman]

Time looking backward and more time focusing on what's next.

[Dave Ramsey]

And speaking of what's Next, download the CFO's guide to AI and machine learning.

[Ken Coleman]

At netsuite.com Ramsey it's free. At netsuite.com Ramsey you spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car. But it's also a good idea to.

[George Campbell]

Put in the work searching for the.

[Ken Coleman]

Right insurance coverage to protect your biggest assets. I recommend using Ramsey Trusted Pros. Whether you're looking for car, home or any other type of insurance, Ramsey Trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would. Find what you [e-mail] insurance.

[George Campbell]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Ken Coleman. Hey, if you're ready to get your finances in order once and for all in 2025, you gotta join us for our free live Stream. It's on January 23rd, take control of youf Money. It's hosted by Dave Ramsey and Jade Warshaw. And you're gonna learn how to stop living paycheck to paycheck, how to free up more breathing room so you can pay off debt fast. Finally, get ahead with money. Plus, Rachel Cruz and I will join at the end for a Q and A where you can ask your money questions live. And if that didn't sell you. Here we go. When you sign up, you'll be entered to win into our cash giveaway. Five people will win four grand each.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, wow.

[George Campbell]

And again, this is a free live stream. So go sign up ramseysolutions.com livestream or click the link in the description if you're listening on podcast or YouTube.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, I was thinking about that when you said that that means four people or five people.

[George Campbell]

There will be five people who win four grand each. So 20 grand total.

[Dave Ramsey]

Five people are gonna sign up for this thing for free and get a massive boost into their baby step situation for 4k is 4k.

[George Campbell]

Worst case, you get information and motivation to help you get out of debt. Best case, you might get a little cash to speed it up. I'll take the odds on that one. All right, Judy is up next in Tampa. How can we help Judy?

[Ken Coleman]

Hi there. Thank you for taking my call. So I am 65 years old. I have zero savings right now. And I wonder if I should start instead of building up a savings account, build up a investment account like mutual funds as you and Ramsey speak about all the time.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, we say, you know, you can't save your way to.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, the thing is, I'm 65 and I. Nobody knows how long they're gonna live, so like 65, what if in five years, you know, it's. It's not gonna move a lot.

[George Campbell]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, if you're not here in five years, it won't matter.

[Ken Coleman]

That's true.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you can't, you can't use that. You can't use that line of thinking. Right. You gotta, you gotta plan for the best, you know, and hope for the best. But you know, once the worst happens, it really doesn't matter because this is for your long term play. Do you work right now?

[Ken Coleman]

I work part time. Yeah, I work. I make about sixteen hundred dollars a month.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you single? Married?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm. I live with my boyfriend. He covers most of the expenses. Most of my income is disposable. As I said. I hate that term. But yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

What happens if. And boy, I'm sure that's nothing but bliss with you guys. Well, what happens if you guys have a breakup? He's been your sugar.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old is this. How old is this young fellow? Oh, wow.

[Ken Coleman]

He's. He's. He's my age.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's your age. And you. Did you just slipped in there that you've tried to break up with him a couple times?

[Ken Coleman]

I. I We had. Well, yeah, we. Yes, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, what happened?

[Ken Coleman]

There was a big difference. Well, the last time this. He was. His drinking was out of control, but he has stopped drinking. And so we're back together the last two months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[George Campbell]

He's been two months sober. That's good.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Really, really, really good.

[Dave Ramsey]

I really appreciate you sharing all this, and I'm glad we know this now because I think it really. It. It's. It's really. I'm really, really passionate now about making sure that you stop relying on him.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now I'm happy you guys are back together. Hopefully that sustains. But you've tried to break up with this guy twice. This is a relationship that we could at least say has not been stable, so.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, it is 18 years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. But my point is, is you guys aren't married. There's no. There's no legal involvement.

[Ken Coleman]

He doesn't want to marry me. That's the problem.

[Dave Ramsey]

I get it. And you're broke.

[George Campbell]

But I'm saying it put. He's saying it puts you in a precarious situation financially because you don't have any legal financial protections. So you need to treat your finances.

[Ken Coleman]

I do own a home that I am. That. I mean, as I said, as you know, I live near Tampa, so the home just got flooded, so we. So that put me back in the. Not in a hole. I'm not in a hole. I'm not in debt, but it wiped out any savings I had.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you living in his home right now?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm living in his home, but I was in my home.

[George Campbell]

Okay. And what's going on with your home to rent out? Is it being now we're going to.

[Ken Coleman]

Rent out my home.

[George Campbell]

Oh, boy. What's your home worth?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, there's good news and there's bad news. The good news is we bought it at 50, and it's probably anywhere between 2 and 300,000 now, is what it's worth.

[George Campbell]

And is it paid for?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We bought. We bought it kind of together. We bought it together and we paid cash for it at $50,000 during the hosting.

[George Campbell]

You and your boyfriend?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

So what happens if you guys split and you wanted to sell?

[Ken Coleman]

It's not. It's my name. It's in my name only. Only?

[George Campbell]

But you said you guys bought it together.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, he gave me the money.

[George Campbell]

He said, wouldn't he want to write to some of the money?

[Dave Ramsey]

Hold on, I need to hear the voice. What did he say? Give us the whole voice treatment on that what did he say?

[Ken Coleman]

I didn't do it very well.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do it again.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, here. We will get married. But you can have this house and now and then if anything happens, you always have this house.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow, this is still like married. I feel like you guys are a reality show waiting to happen. You know, 65 year old's been dating 18 years bought. This is interesting. George.

[Ken Coleman]

I can't force him to marry me.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, Judy, no, no.

[Ken Coleman]

You want to, you want to. You want to hear something even worse?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

You do?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

My work. I work for him.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh boy.

[Ken Coleman]

He has a small business.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're right, Judy, that was worse. See, George and I are on Team Judy.

[George Campbell]

Okay?

[Dave Ramsey]

We're wearing Team Judy T shirts right now. And. Good. And, and so you need to accept this, that you have got to get a different job, a full time job that's not paid by this guy. And you need. George. I want you to step in on what you think she should do with that.

[George Campbell]

I'm just wondering what's it like when you ask for a raise from your boyfriend? That's got to be awkward.

[Ken Coleman]

He said he's a. I love this voice.

[Dave Ramsey]

I can talk to Judy. I could talk to Judy forever.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, this Judy.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're nominated for my favorite caller ever. Okay, George, let's, let's help out.

[George Campbell]

Let's answer your original question.

[Dave Ramsey]

You gotta say you gotta save money. You can't save and invest until you make more.

[George Campbell]

So here's the deal. There's a foundational savings you need before you ever put a dime into investments. And that's an emergency fund. So you need three to six months of expenses.

[Dave Ramsey]

She doesn't have any.

[George Campbell]

Let's pretend like you do have expenses. So what would it be?

[Ken Coleman]

I do. I do have to pay. Like now I'm on Medicare and I. So I have to pay that. And I have to pay for my phone and I have to pay for my car insurance.

[Dave Ramsey]

Correct.

[George Campbell]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

So that does. And I, and I get a Social Security check. So that kind of eats up my Social Security.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your Social Security check?

[Ken Coleman]

It's about. Well, it was a thousand, but now they take Medicare out of it, so it's little less than that. 875.

[George Campbell]

Okay. That's not enough for you to retire on. So our game plan is, hey, when and if Judy can't work anymore, how is she going to survive if sugar daddy's not in the picture?

[Ken Coleman]

Stream of income I have is that we're going to rent out the house for approximately 1300amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but that's not enough to live off of.

[George Campbell]

Would all that money go to you? Yeah, he wouldn't take a dime of it.

[Ken Coleman]

Well. Well, as soon as I pay back some money that I borrowed from him.

[George Campbell]

See? Do you see how this gets messy and complicated? The house is in my name.

[Ken Coleman]

And I went, what's team Judy gonna do when she doesn't have the ball, you know?

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, I'll tell you right now. If Judy doesn't make some changes, Judy's gonna have to find another sugar daddy. And I don't know how many of those are left, sweetheart, when you get to your age, you know what I mean? I mean, just keeping it real.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't want one. I don't want one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, great. So then how do we exist without a sugar daddy? The answer is more income. As George was taking you down the.

[George Campbell]

Line, get your own savings in place, then you can begin investing. And all of that is going to take more income because you don't have a ton to throw at any of this right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay? So like I said, If I have five to $10,000 saved, then I can start investing.

[George Campbell]

So you say, Yeah, I would say 10,000 minimum. And then you can begin investing. And I'll, you know, we'll send you our investing guide. Go to ramseysolutions.com guide. And we have a whole guide showing you the right way to invest, what to invest in. You don't need to be risky.

[Ken Coleman]

I got that. The mid cap, the large cap, and the small cap, and the international mutual.

[George Campbell]

Index and mutual funds.

[Dave Ramsey]

You need to make some money and start taking care of Judy. If this guy wants to.

[Ken Coleman]

I lost some money twice. I mean, I had some money, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know, I know, Judy, but that doesn't matter.

[Ken Coleman]

Like, you know, the hurricanes. The hurricane.

[Dave Ramsey]

I get it.

[Ken Coleman]

That cost 20,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know, but we're talking about the future. George, let's put her on hold. Christian, let's get her a free ticket to the live stream investing event.

[George Campbell]

Yeah, that'll be great.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think that'll also help her.

[George Campbell]

Join us March 4th and 5th. Judy, you can watch with your boyfriend. I don't know if he's gonna like it, but he can be there and hang out, but he can make that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Voice the whole time. It'll be great.

[George Campbell]

Best impression I've heard today. You know, this is the Ramsey show.

[Ken Coleman]

There's just something so exciting about a new year. But honestly, sometimes it can feel like, oh, I thought I'd be so much further along by now. Especially when it comes to Money. But here's the truth. No matter what your current money situation is, I promise you can turn it around this year. That's why I want to invite you to EveryDollars free livestream on January 23rd. It's all about helping you take control of your money so you can make progress this year. Plus, I'll be taking your questions live along with Dave, Jade, and George. Anything you want to ask, it's on the table. And get this. You could win $4,000 just for signing up. Guys, this can be the year where you go from feeling behind to getting ahead. Sign up for the free live [e-mail] livestream. That's everydollar.com SL livestream.

[George Campbell]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. The moment you've all been waiting for. It's here, guys.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is?

[George Campbell]

The Ramsey show annual listener survey is now live. Ken can stop texting me every day, wondering when it's going to drop. When's it going to drop?

[Dave Ramsey]

I feel like you oversold that one. That was good. Tease.

[George Campbell]

That was the goal. Yeah, I'm a real pro.

[Dave Ramsey]

We do like to know what people think, though.

[George Campbell]

Now, really, this is our biggest surprise survey of the year, and we want to know your favorite parts of the show, what you like, what you don't, what you want to hear more about. Whatever it is we want to hear from you. And we actually, our team pours through this data and uses it to craft what happens on this show.

[Dave Ramsey]

And they tell us what to stop doing.

[George Campbell]

Exactly. They go, ken, don't do that. They don't like it.

[Dave Ramsey]

So it's usually a long list.

[George Campbell]

So there you go. Enough with the YouTube comments. Let us know in the survey and we'll take it to heart.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, there we go.

[George Campbell]

Two ways to participate. You can just text the word Survey to the number 33789 or go to ramseysolutions.com survey and if you're listening on podcasts or YouTube show notes, just go to the show notes. It's Ken's favorite place to hang out.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's my favorite place to send people. You know why?

[George Campbell]

Because it's all there.

[Dave Ramsey]

Everything you could ever want on the show is in the show notes.

[George Campbell]

What was that? Link days. It's in the show notes. What was that? It's in the show notes. There you go.

[Dave Ramsey]

I could answer every call that way. I could just go, next. Show notes. Show notes. I could get through a record amount of calls.

[George Campbell]

I'm impressed. And here's the deal. If you sign up for this Survey and you actually complete it, you'll be entered to win a $500 gift card as a little thank you. Enter to win. You know you're not guaranteed, but there's a chance.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nothing says I appreciate you more than cash.

[George Campbell]

Exactly.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

I don't know where the gift cards to, but I'm excited to find out.

[Dave Ramsey]

Where would you like a gift card to? George, if one practical asking for a friend. If one was to get you a gift card that delighted you, where would it be?

[George Campbell]

Oh, man. My. My practical.

[Dave Ramsey]

Come on.

[George Campbell]

Says Amazon or Costco. Love it. Because Costco, that one $500 gift card, that's one trip to Costco if you're lucky.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'll be honest, that's a disappointing answer. Someone's buying you a gift. Where do you want to get brand? Huh?

[George Campbell]

Where do you want one?

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know.

[George Campbell]

Academy, so you can get more pickleball gear. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Maybe Ralph Lauren. I don't know. J. Crew. I'm going to pick a lot of specifics. You gave me Costco.

[George Campbell]

They have everything.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like the show notes.

[George Campbell]

Exactly.

[Dave Ramsey]

Let's get to the phone.

[George Campbell]

Raymond is up next in Portland, Oregon. What's going on, Raymond?

[Ken Coleman]

Hi, Ramsey. Thanks for having me.

[George Campbell]

Sure.

[Ken Coleman]

I was wondering, would it be worth for me to finance a vehicle? My vehicle is in the shop right now. It has a blown head gasket, and it also has a timing chain that needs to be replaced. It's going to cost me $4,000 to replace. And they can't find an engine for that vehicle because it's so old.

[George Campbell]

Okay, how old is the car?

[Ken Coleman]

2012.

[George Campbell]

That's old. Oh, my goodness.

[Dave Ramsey]

They can't find an engine. 2012. What?

[Ken Coleman]

No. 2012 Chevrolet Colorado. They said the engines are discontinued.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, let me ask a question. Does it have to. Are there other chevrolet trucks or SUVs where that engine is compatible?

[Ken Coleman]

They said they can find one, but it's going to be a used one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. But I would be barking up that tree to see what that's going to cost.

[George Campbell]

Well, the question is, you put four grand into this thing at that point, what is it worth?

[Ken Coleman]

Right now it's probably worth four grand.

[George Campbell]

Just so it's worth four grand right now. But if you did this repair and put four grand into it, what. What would it be worth?

[Ken Coleman]

Probably same thing. Four grand.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what he's saying. Okay, that changes my answer, I guess.

[George Campbell]

And how much money do you have saved right now?

[Ken Coleman]

Right Now I got $600 in savings. I got $10,000 or no. $11,000 in retirement.

[George Campbell]

Okay, we're not going to touch retirement. So you're down to. In liquid cash. You got 600 bucks?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I got 600 in savings. And then I got just a little over right now. Just right about $1,000 in checking.

[George Campbell]

Okay, so you don't even have the money to do this repair?

[Ken Coleman]

No, I do not.

[George Campbell]

And your solution is to go finance a $25,000 car?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, the thing with this vehicle is I have a warranty on. I bought a warranty package when I bought the vehicle. The vehicle is paid off cash. I have the title in hand, but I have an extended warranty on it. And right now they're going through to verify if they will cover anything on the vehicle under that warranty.

[George Campbell]

Okay, so let's play the scenario out. Let's say they cover it and they cover all $4,000 of the repair. Now you have a drivable $4,000 car.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[George Campbell]

Okay. And we'll drive that while continuing to save up. And then once we have enough money.

[Ken Coleman]

What I have the problem is, is if they're going to say it's going to need a new engine, and they tell the warranty company that. Where are they going to get an engine at? I don't know. That's what.

[George Campbell]

Put a used engine in it and you'll ride it out.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you already said. We already. We already covered that. You could get a used engine.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Campbell]

This isn't your forever car. We just need to go. There's a gap right now. You're broke.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I would imagine the warranty is going to cover the engine, the gasket on it. Unless you didn't put oil in it.

[Ken Coleman]

No, I put it all in. I do my regular maintenance, all right?

[Dave Ramsey]

So I got to believe that it would be covered.

[George Campbell]

How long have you been living paycheck to paycheck, Raymond?

[Ken Coleman]

I've been living paycheck, paycheck since I was born.

[George Campbell]

You want to try another way? Would you be open to that?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm actually on your guys's system right now.

[George Campbell]

You're calling me asking if you can finance a $20,000 car? I don't know what system you've found out, but the Ramsey plan was on.

[Dave Ramsey]

The back side of the page.

[George Campbell]

If we have to make the repair to get by, we make it happen. We pause all of the baby steps, we save up aggressively, sell anything we can to avoid debt. So that would be the game plan for you. And the question is, how can I build a habit where you learn how to save up 500 bucks or a thousand bucks a month to pay cash for things versus turning to payments to solve problems. Do you see the difference? So that's where if they can't fix it and you need to get rid of this. If it's undrivable, then we need to go. We'll sell it for what we can. Plus use any savings we can to buy a car from Facebook Marketplace and whatever car we can afford in cash. That's what we drive for the time being. And the goal is that you're not doing this for very long. It might be five months, it might be a year. So what is your income?

[Ken Coleman]

I make about 54,000 a year.

[George Campbell]

And what other debt do you have?

[Ken Coleman]

I have a mortgage. I bought a house for the first time. My mortgage is 342,000.

[George Campbell]

What's the payment on.

[Ken Coleman]

2278Amonth.

[George Campbell]

And what's your take? Home Pay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Ken Coleman]

About 4,000.

[George Campbell]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Dude, you're not even living paycheck to paycheck.

[Ken Coleman]

I got. I got my mom helping. She lives with me. She. She co signed the house with me and she's paying her portion. She pays me a thousand a month for her portion. I pay the rest.

[George Campbell]

What's the long term game plan? Well, you get married, kick mom out, but she's still on the mortgage and has to pay.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, she just pays.

[Dave Ramsey]

She lives with you and your wife and chips in.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm not married.

[George Campbell]

I know.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's asking you what the long term play.

[George Campbell]

I think I'm the only person thinking about Raymond's future.

[Dave Ramsey]

I am. I'm just enjoying your version.

[George Campbell]

Okay. So I'm with you anyways. I'm playing. I'm just. I'm kind of role playing here. Raymond to go. We've got to make different decisions. This house was a mistake.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[George Campbell]

I'm not telling you you need to go sell it tomorrow. But this is a glaring problem in your life as you try to get out of this paycheck to paycheck cycle. And this car is one symptom. This is one Jenga piece in this mess. Can you make more money? What are you doing full time right now?

[Ken Coleman]

I am a driver for Amazon.

[George Campbell]

Okay. Can you work more hours?

[Ken Coleman]

I can, yeah. I can request overtime.

[George Campbell]

I would be doing that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. It's just you and mom at the house. I'd be working a lot if I were you.

[George Campbell]

And my car's in the shop and I'm desperate for a better car. Dude, I'd be working as much as I can selling Anything in that house that's not tied down to get out of the situation, you have no other debt other than the mortgage.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, come back to the work part is, I have a problem with that because my mom works too. She works on the days that she works on the days that I don't work, and then she goes work on the days that I don't work.

[George Campbell]

Why can't you guys work at the same time? Did I miss something?

[Ken Coleman]

So I have a 13 year old daughter.

[George Campbell]

Oh, so someone needs to be there.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So when, when I'm at work, she watches her and then when I'm at work, when I she's at work, I watch her.

[George Campbell]

Man.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is there a special condition? I mean, why does the 13 year old need to be watched?

[George Campbell]

I think we might need to figure out a childcare situation to where you both can work at once, but man, that's messy. Hang on the line. I'm gonna send you a copy of my book Breaking free from broke. And hey, if you want to catch the rest of the Ramsey show, we got more where that came from. Head over to the Ramsey network app. Just search that in your app store or click the link in the show notes. If you're on radio, stick around. The show will. Hey, what's up, guys? Episode 2 of 90 Day Money Makeover.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is available right now on YouTube.

[George Campbell]

This series follows real people as they.

[Ken Coleman]

Take on the challenge of transforming their finances and their lives in just 90 days.

[George Campbell]

In this episode, watch as they face.

[Dave Ramsey]

New obstacles, celebrate wins and push forward on their journey. And of course, I'll be walking alongside.

[George Campbell]

Them every step of the way.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, now here's a little sneak peek.

[George Campbell]

Of what the new episode is all about.

[Ken Coleman]

Me and Dara back in November have a new son, A baby boy. We'd have $87,000 in debt. I've been in debt since I was like 18 years old. I gave birth to him. I knew. I said I cannot leave him with.

[Dave Ramsey]

Someone that I don't know.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't care if we're eating rice and beanson. I told him there was no going back. When you guys called into the Ramsey.

[George Campbell]

Show, it was like, I think that we should push them harder.

[Ken Coleman]

Baby Jonathan being born is a wake up call for us to finally change. I can't go on another month wake up call, you know, the next 20 years, this is important. You know, we gotta get this right. You want to pay off your debt, you want to get your time back.

[George Campbell]

You want to get your home.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nothing usurps those three.