Financial Irresponsibility Always Has a Cost

Summary

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The Ramsey Show - April 8, 2026

Episode: "Financial Irresponsibility Always Has a Cost"

Hosts: Dave Ramsey & Jade Whelan Ramsey
Summary by: Podcast Summarizer

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Main Theme

This episode revolves around the real-life financial crises that arise from irresponsibility (and sometimes dishonesty) with money, and the transformative power of owning your mistakes, learning from them, and adopting common-sense financial practices. Dave and Jade offer tough love, practical steps, and encouragement, taking several listener calls that span marriage and money secrets, debt paydown, financial boundaries with family, and responsible lifestyle choices.

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Key Discussions & Insights

1. Marriage, Trust, and Money – When Financial Irresponsibility Comes to Light

[00:45–08:00]

• Caller (Taylor, Dallas): Newly married, Taylor discovers her husband—a 1099 graphic designer—hasn’t paid taxes for several years, leading to $35-40k in unexpected tax debt.
• Advice: Immediately sought a CPA, is working to remedy the tax situation.

Key Insights:

• Bigger than the Money: This is not just about a financial mistake, but about dishonesty and dangerous behavioral patterns in marriage.
• Tough Love:
  • Dave: “What else is rumbling around in your little mind that you haven’t told me about and you forgot and didn’t think it was important?” ([02:07])
  • Jade: “My mom used to tell me, ‘The patterns that you allow from the beginning will persist throughout the marriage.’” ([03:31])
• Action Steps: Address behavioral issues through honest conversation and counseling—not just by fixing the money problem.
• Memorable Quote:
  • Dave: “I don’t want this to settle into, you’re his mommy, and you spend the next rest of your life bailing this guy out... Adults file taxes. Adults take care of business.” ([04:52])

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2. Young Adulthood, Sacrifice, and Delayed Gratification

A. Should I Buy a Motorcycle Before a House?
[10:43–14:44]

• Caller (Jordan, Lansing, MI): 20 years old, wife and a baby on the way, wants a motorcycle before a house.
• Advice: Don’t buy “toys” before providing for your family and securing your future. Prioritize home ownership over fun purchases.

Notable Exchange:

• Dave: “For the rest of your life, Jordan, you will fight between the little boy that lives inside of you and the man that has responsibilities.” ([12:03])

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B. Newfound Wealth, Old Debt — Trust Funds and Car Payments
[14:50–20:23]

• Caller (Bridger, Salt Lake City): 21, newly married, received a $27k trust fund; significant car and credit card debts.
• Advice: Sell the expensive cars, pay off debts, buy reliable “boring” cars, and boost income. Cut up the credit cards.
• Eye-Opening:
  • Jade: “Car payments will make you a millionaire in 15 years.” ([19:48])
  • Dave: “If you do, when you take out a car payment, what you are doing is looking in the mirror and saying, ‘I desperately want to be middle class the rest of my life.’” ([19:22])

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3. Commentary on Gen Z & the Value of Responsibility

[21:11–24:21]

• Dave and Jade praise Gen Z for seeking advice, making tough decisions, and owning their financial futures.
  • “Those two 20-year-olds are probably 30-year-old millionaires because of that one phone call. If they follow through.” ([23:33])
  • “There’s a percentage of every generation that's completely useless. ... Most of the Gen Z is pretty incredible. I think it’s my favorite generation I’ve done this for.” ([21:01])

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4. Tough Housing Dilemmas & Emotional Toll

[26:31–30:03]

• Caller (Sarah, Albany, NY): Inherited and tried to renovate grandmother’s dilapidated house, then suffered a family tragedy and property disasters; now emotionally and financially spent.
• Advice: Don’t keep the house. Finish minimal repairs to recoup as much as possible and sell; accept some loss as the cost of an “expensive lesson.”
• Empathy: Dave acknowledges her grief and exhaustion, stresses that “we’ve all done stupid things and lost money. Welcome to the club.” ([30:39])

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5. Relationship & Career Moves — Chasing Opportunity vs. Dependency

[33:27–41:38]

• Caller (Madison, Pittsburgh): 19-year-old wants to move in with boyfriend to start her career as a nail tech and save for her own salon.
• Advice:
  • Don’t tie your economic future to someone you are not married to.
  • Establish financial independence before making a big move.
  • “I want you to be a standalone woman with square shoulders and a strong backbone.” — Dave ([35:30])
  • “There’s no reason for you to put yourself in that position … you’re worth way more than that.” — Jade ([42:20])

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6. Unconventional Retirement Investing?

[44:11–50:42]

• Caller (Alex, Portland, OR): Wants to invest $50k up front, then “coast” toward retirement.
• Advice:
  • Not possible to lump-sum into a retirement account due to contribution limits.
  • $50k isn’t enough to generate lasting income.
  • Plan for continued regular investing, balance fun with ongoing financial discipline.

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7. Life Insurance, Estate Planning, and Baby Steps

[53:52–58:58]

• Caller (Ann, NYC): Spurred by a car accident, seeks guidance on when and how to fit term life insurance and estate planning into their budget.
• Advice:
  • Start immediately; use trusted providers for insurance (Zander) and wills (Mama Bear Legal).
  • Update plans as net worth grows.
  • “Life insurance is not a baby step ... you just don’t know what tomorrow holds.” — Jade ([59:32])

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8. When Rental Properties, Investments, and Marriage Collide

[59:38–63:48]

• Caller (Cade, Dallas): Multiple rental properties, significant assets, debating with wife the timing of selling investments to get debt-free.
• Advice:
  • Debate is not whether to be debt free, but how and when.
  • Lay out the numbers and map scenarios to find the right balance.

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9. Familial Scams and the Limits of Helping Elderly Parents

[66:26–74:32]

• Caller (Ian, Atlanta): Father-in-law (80) fell for international scams, now broke/indebted with only Social Security income and at risk of lawsuit.
• Advice:
  • No reason to panic—at his age and income, he’s “judgment proof.”
  • Creditors may put a lien on his house (especially after a court judgment), but won’t foreclose for such a small amount.

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10. Tactical Debt Payoff — The Power of Intensity

[75:09–83:57]

• Caller (Rachel, Baton Rouge): Considers a 0% APR balance transfer for a high-interest SoFi loan.
• Advice:
  • Don’t confuse interest rate tricks with real solutions: “There is not an interest rate that gets you out of debt. What gets you out of debt is when you get so pissed off that you attack this stuff with a vengeance.” — Dave ([77:23])
  • Pay smallest to largest (debt snowball), increase income, cut everything optional.
  • Key moment: Dave’s impassioned reminder that financial products marketed as “help” are often traps.

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11. Boundaries and Giving: Helping Without Enabling

[85:25–93:57]

• Caller (Cassandra, NYC): After paying off $80k debt, feels “caught between responsibility and boundaries” helping family (domestically and in Haiti) who increasingly demand/expect money.
• Advice:
  • Set hard limits and boundaries (amount and frequency); you are not “the financial plan” for your extended family.
  • No guilt for not being able to fix everyone’s life; charity must be voluntary and within your means.
  • “You’re not Jesus. The job’s taken.” — Dave ([92:17])

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12. Single Parents, Guilt & the Best Gift for Your Kids

[116:56–124:23]

• Caller (Faith, Dayton, OH): Single mom, 30, wants to save for her son’s future but is buried in debt and guilt.
• Advice:
  • Focus on your own debt-free journey first; modeling sacrifice and discipline for him is more valuable than token savings.
  • After debt freedom, aggressively invest for your own future to ensure you are never your child’s financial burden.
  • “He has a mom who is a warrior princess who knows how to fight and scrape and cause things to happen. That’s going to help him more than $10 a month in a savings account.” — Dave ([120:18])
  • Ramsey team gifts her access to Financial Peace University and budgeting tools.

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13. Other Memorable Segments & Quotes

• Interest-Only Mortgages:
  “Interest-only is just renting a house, but you carry all the ownership risk.” ([97:05] Jade & Dave)

• Saving for Dream Trips:
  “You can drop $15k in Italy in 10 days and still be called frugal.” ([103:33] Dave)

• Marriage & Financial Mismatches:
  “We get in relationships what we tolerate. For 10 years you’ve tolerated being treated this way." ([109:46] Dave)

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Notable Quotes & Moments by Timestamp

• “[For the rest of your life, Jordan, you will fight between the little boy that lives inside of you and the man that has responsibilities.]”
  — Dave Ramsey ([12:03])

• “[Adults file taxes. Adults take care of business, even if it's not their natural strength.]”
  — Dave Ramsey ([04:52])

• “[Car payments will make you a millionaire in 15 years.]”
  — Jade Whelan Ramsey ([19:48])

• “[You're not Jesus. The job’s taken.]”
  — Dave Ramsey ([92:17])

• “[If you do, when you take out a car payment, what you are doing is looking in the mirror and saying, ‘I desperately want to be middle class the rest of my life.’]”
  — Dave Ramsey ([19:22])

• “[You have to get to the point where instead of blaming people, you’re just mad about it... the same people that screwed you aren’t going to come save you.]”
  — Jade Whelan Ramsey ([83:13])

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Episode Structure / Timestamps for Key Calls

| Timestamp | Caller/Segment | Topic | |------------|-------------------------------|---------------------------------------------------| | 00:45 | Taylor, Dallas | Husband hid tax debt; marital honesty | | 10:43 | Jordan, Lansing | Motorcycle vs. house purchase at 20 | | 14:50 | Bridger, Salt Lake City | Trust fund; car debt for newlyweds | | 26:31 | Sarah, Albany | Emotional/financial cost of inherited fixer-upper | | 33:27 | Madison, Pittsburgh | Moving in with boyfriend for career | | 44:11 | Alex, Portland | Living minimally, travel, lump-sum retirement | | 53:52 | Ann, New York City | Life insurance, estate planning | | 59:38 | Cade, Dallas | Should we sell stock/rentals to be debt free? | | 66:26 | Ian, Atlanta | Elderly parent, scams, court, reverse mortgage | | 75:09 | Rachel, Baton Rouge | Balance-transfer to deal with SoFi loan | | 85:25 | Cassandra, NYC | Family expects money: boundaries vs. guilt | | 116:56 | Faith, Dayton, OH | Single mom, debt guilt, saving for son | | 99:01 | Mark, Washington DC | After paying off debt, how much to spend on Italy?|

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Tone & Style

• Candid, No-Nonsense: Direct, sometimes blunt advice grounded in data and personal conviction.
• Supportive, Encouraging: Especially with callers seeking a better future; frequent praise for hard work, “scrappers,” and “warrior princesses.”
• Tough Love: Emphasis on personal responsibility, dignity, boundaries, and getting “mad enough” to make a change.

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Bottom Line

Financial irresponsibility always has a cost—but with honest assessment, a strong plan, and the will to change, you can rewrite your story. Take radical ownership, set clear boundaries, and lean into the “uncommon” power of common-sense money management. Whether healing a marriage, climbing out of debt, or securing your children’s future, the journey starts (and ends) with you.

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Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fair Winds Credit Union Studios, I'm Dave Ramsey. This is the Ramsey Show. Jade Washall Ramsey personality number one best selling author is my co host. Today. Open phones at 888, 825-5225. The call is free and some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. All right, Taylor is in Dallas. What's going on, Taylor?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. So I'm calling in. Me and my husband got married about seven months ago and over the course of this tax season and gathering all of our documents, unbeknownst to me, he has not paid taxes for 23 or 24 and now 25. And so, yeah, kind of a big deal going into a marriage, wanting to like that. I'm very type A and on top of that sort of thing, I'm a W2 employee. And so it's pretty simple, straightforward. Every year he's a 1099 graphic designer. And so now this year we're in years past, I would get a return. We are going to owe a pretty big deal on top of owing for 23 and 24. And so I just kind of want some advice on what to do. I will say first and foremost, same day I found out, I contacted the CPA and we're in the process of, you know, we finalized 2025 and we're working on 23 and 24. But definitely unexpected, you know, going into a marriage and now having what could potentially be up to a 35 or a $40,000 debt.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So what does Mr. Creative say about his irresponsibility in lying to you?

[Caller]

Well, he is. It has been a rough couple weeks. He obviously is very apologetic and in his words, it wasn't intentional. It was kind of in the back of his mind and he knew it was not going to be good. But in his mind, he didn't realize it had been that long since he had paid taxes.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That doesn't make me feel better.

[Dave Ramsey]

Makes me feel worse.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like what else is rumbling around in your little mind that you haven't told me about and you forgot and didn't think it was important?

[Caller]

Yeah, that was definitely my first question as well. The first couple days when I pulled or asked him to pull up the IRS website so I could gather our documents and I realized that it had been that long. Yeah, that was not a Good feeling.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

How long were you together before you got married?

[Caller]

We've known each other for seven years. We've known each other since college.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long were you dating?

[Caller]

On and off for a while, but about a year before we finally got engaged and got married. Okay.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay. Well, you did the right thing by getting on the ball and getting a CPA and getting a hold of this. It does point to a deeper issue, um, because this all came about as a result of your diligence and you being on top of things. And this was all solved as a result of your diligence and your being on top of things. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, for sure.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

So that's where my issue is, and that's probably where my conversation would start, is this is a behavior that won't be able to continue.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Have you started that conversation?

[Dave Ramsey]

Not if you want to live.

[Caller]

Well, here's the thing. For being a young married couple, I've been intentional about us saving. And so we have a decent amount in the bank right now that once we know.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's not the point.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Besides the point. The money here is not the problem. I'm not concerned about that. You'll put money aside if you're concerned how we can talk about that. The problem here is my mom used to tell me, she'd say the patterns that you allow from the beginning will be the patterns that persist throughout the marriage. That's what she told me. And she's right. If you allow things to persist. So for you, that this is something that you guys have got to grab hold of immediately. And if I were in your shoes, I'd really be kind of searching, searching by memory and searching my heart. Is there anything else that sounds like this that's been going on to where I'm seeing a pattern? Because if I'm seeing a pattern that I'm really concerned if this is not a pattern, this is just a concealed incident that's very different. I'm probably going to be approaching it a little bit differently. But nonetheless, this is a conversation. Have you had that conversation with him about the behavior? Not the money, the behavior?

[Caller]

Oh, for sure. That was the first thing, because to me, it's. It's the dishonesty of not knowing that, because that would have been vital information, you know, going into things. And so we've definitely, definitely had that conversation. And, you know, I did say it's not something I can just get over in a day. Like this takes time. Because it is. It is kind of a big deal, especially with the dollar amount it Is, you know, I file every year. I'm on top of this. And so to find out that not only are you not W2, which I knew, but to know that nothing's really been set aside with that in mind, that, oh, yeah, I'm going to owe

[Dave Ramsey]

this amount, here's where I want to get to if I'm you and him, for that matter, where we need to arrive at. Okay, you've already done the tactical things. You figured out how you're going to pay it, and you've figured out how to get the filing done. All that's done. I don't want this to settle into, you're his mommy, and you spend the next rest of your life bailing this guy out every time he is irresponsible or forgets something and throws it in the bucket of, oh, I'm a creative. I don't do details. No, I'm going to kill you. It's not going to happen. So, I mean, really, I'm going to lose it right here. So I want you guys, instead of settling into that rhythm, I want you to settle into a rhythm that says, okay, you're a creative and you don't do details. I get that. But you have to get that while you're a creative, you also have to be an adult. And adults file taxes. Adults take care of business, even if it's not their natural strength. So as long as we both are together on this and we're two adults making decisions about all the adult things together from this point forward, and there's no more deception or no more I forgot, and mommy take care of me, we're not gonna run that script out in this marriage. We're gonna be two grown people handling our responsibilities within our strengths. And you've got natural strengths toward detail and task orientation that he doesn't have. And that's fine. I have that my wife is more of the free spirit, that we call him the nerd and the free spirit. You're the nerd, he's the free spirit, I'm the nerd, Sharon's the free spirit, so on, right? So you can accept those things, but that does not give you a pass on emotionally carrying the weight of the household and the making of adult decisions together with me, you don't get a pass on that. And so as long as we can make, as long as you feel assured, maybe meeting with a marriage counselor a couple of times and you guys get some language to this that you can some tools in your belt so that he really grasps what this does to your psyche and that we're not going to have a pattern going forward. To your point, Jade, then I'm good with it. I think you've done everything perfectly. Just make sure that we're okay, that however we got here is gone. We're not gonna get here again. And the way we avoid that is the two of us standing side by side, both of our shoulders bearing the weight of being adults. And then we make the decisions together. Then having said that, you know, he's gonna have more of a natural tendency towards fun and creativity. You're gonna have more of a natural tendency towards detail and task orientation. And that's good. We'll utilize those strengths in executing the plan that we developed together.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, it's really important. I think a lot of times in the beginning of marriage, you kind of tiptoe around things. Everybody's still trying to be on their best behavior. You don't wanna rock the boat. You don't wanna, you know, be too strong on certain things. But actually now is the time to really lean into those issues and try to get them right side up early on.

[Dave Ramsey]

And she's so on it that this

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

is like, listen, she's gonna be the best thing that ever happened to him.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, he got lit up and he deserved to be. He deserved to be lit up. Oh, my gosh. Jordan is in Lansing, Michigan. Hey, Jordan, what's up? Oh, no, you're not up. You're gonna be up after this commercial break. I'm gonna learn to do this podcast radio thing. One.

[Caller]

Sam,

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Caller]

I'm doing better than I deserve, Dave. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Just the same. How can I help you?

[Caller]

Well, I'm 20 years old. I've got a wife and a baby on the way. No debt, making a decent amount of money, saving up money for a house.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's decent money?

[Caller]

I make about 70 grand.

[Dave Ramsey]

And does she work outside the home?

[Caller]

She is getting her nursing degree this spring. She'll be passing. So she works. She maybe sits a kid right now, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

So she's gonna make more than you?

[Caller]

Okay, probably.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, definitely. I mean, a nurse ought to make more than 70. Yeah. Okay, cool. Good for y'. All.

[Caller]

Yeah. I'm wondering if it's financially responsible to want to buy a bike before I buy a house. When I say bike, I mean motorcycle.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I, I would go with yes, because, yes, it's irresponsible. And my reason for just thinking that outright is one is strict strictly for you, and the other is for the wife and the baby and the family and everybody else to live in and for the future.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. Reason I'm asking is I got a big, big tax return and I was like, man, this is nice. I've got a nice big chunk of money that I didn't expect coming. And.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, for the rest of your life, Jordan, you will fight between the little boy that lives inside of you and the man that has responsibilities.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the interesting thing is, if the man that has responsibilities wins the fight, the boy that lives inside of you gets to buy his toys. Meaning that you do things in the right order, you'll get the bike someday. And if it's not out of order, and it's out of order if you do it now. Yeah, but I can easily see 20 years old. I mean, that's still, you know, but yeah, you got married, had a kid. Hello. And now, you know, so it just all sudden changed. Right. So. And all your buddies, you know, they may not have the same grown up responsibilities that you've signed up for recently. So, you know, that kind of thing. So that's the environment you're in. But yeah, the, the, the truth is, when you're 30, which one will you be glad you did first, the house or the bike? You'd be glad you did the house first. Your 30 year old version of you won't look back at the 20 year old version and go, come on dude, you know you don't want the 30 year old version talking to you. The 20 year old version of you that way.

[Caller]

Nope.

[Dave Ramsey]

So yeah, go get your house, get out of debt, build an emergency fund and buy some toys and buy her a nice couch or whatever it is she wants. And you guys, but you do that in the right order. We're also not going to spend the equivalent amount on the baby's nursery dressing up everything in the rental house while we're trying to save up for a home. And so if you just go, what would the future version of me want to do? That's the mature side of every one of us. Then I get to do that. And by the way, I'm a guy that's got a pretty good collection of toys today. But I got them after they didn't matter financially and my family was more than taken care of and we were set. And so now when I buy a toy it's irrelevant and to the financial situation. And that's the manly, the grown up way to do it. But it's, you know, but you're, I'm 65. I still have that guy lives inside of me that fights with the other guy inside of me and everybody does, right?

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So it's cool you asked the question though. That tells me you probably have a clue like you already knew the answer.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Going to say his conscience was telling

[Dave Ramsey]

him he wants somebody else to tell him what he already knew.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Uh huh.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Well if we didn't tell him, his wife was gonna tell him.

[Dave Ramsey]

We do a lot of that on this show.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I know. Those are the things we tell people

[Dave Ramsey]

what they already know and we make good money telling them what they already know. It's kind of ridiculous if you think about it.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Man. It's not bad.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. Bridger is in Salt Lake City, Utah. Hi Bridger, how are you?

[Caller]

Good.

How are you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Well, I'm newly married, about eight months married and I and my wife previously got married, made some not best financial decisions but we recently got access to $27,000 through a trust fund. And just wondering your guys expertise on the best way to utilize that and turn our life around.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool, that's a great question.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, tell us, tell us about your current finances. You said you made some mistakes, what do those look like?

[Caller]

So we have two car payments, we got one that is $16,000 and then her car is $20,000. Both of those total up to $1,000 a month. They're both each $500.

Wow.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your household income?

[Caller]

We both make 55,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

So 110 or.

[Caller]

Sorry, both together.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, your total household income is 55.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

What are your careers?

[Caller]

She is a receptionist, and I work for my dad.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

How old are you guys?

[Caller]

I'm 20. She or I'm 21. She's 20.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so 16 on a car. 20 on a car. And what else in debt?

[Caller]

We did have 8,500 on credit cards, but about a week after we got that trust fund, we paid all those off. Did you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Did you cut them up?

[Caller]

Not yet, no.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You got to cut them up by

[Dave Ramsey]

the time when you get off the phone, get them out and cut them off.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Otherwise you're going to run them back up again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Now, after you paid that out. After you paid that off, now there's 27,000 left. Or is that less the credit card?

[Caller]

That's what it started out as. Now we currently have 17.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Got it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

We had to spend 500 on a car repair, and then we already spent $1,000 on our discretionary spending.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Got it. Is there any other debt laying around besides the cars?

[Dave Ramsey]

That's a cool way of saying I just blew $1,000 discretionary spending. What are you in Congress?

[Caller]

No, definitely not.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Is there any other debt besides the two cars?

[Caller]

That's about it. Just the two car payments.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay, okay, so we.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you're 20. You guys are 20 years old, correct?

[Caller]

20 and 21.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay, so there's. There's two things at work here. First off, you guys. Income. We got to get it up. Somebody's not working full time hours. Is that you or your wife?

[Caller]

So we're both actually working about 40 hours a week. I try and work 50.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, your job sucks.

[Caller]

Her receptionist job is not. Not the best. She does not. Definitely could make more.

Yeah, the pay is.

She's an esthetician on the side. And so we're trying to get that up, but I mean, that doesn't really bring really anything.

[Dave Ramsey]

Bridger, here's the thing. Here's some data points for you from 35 years of doing this. All right? I have never met someone that became a millionaire when they owned cars with payments.

[Caller]

Okay, Yeah, I believe it.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're getting killed by your cars. You signed up for it, but you're getting killed by your cars. So what would I do if I woke up in your shoes? I don't know if I Can talk you into it. But if I can, when you're 30, you have a shot at being a millionaire. If I can talk you into doing this. Sell both cars, have no payments. Use the money to pay cash for a couple of $7,000 cars.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And buy a boring car. Not a cool car. A boring car is one that doesn't have a lot of miles, that grandmother drove to church on Sundays only, and that your friends think you're a goober because you bought it. That's a good car. That's a good $7,000 car. If you buy a cool $7,000 car, it means somebody ragged out the Camaro. That's the only way it's worth seven. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you want a Camry, an Accord, stuff like that. I'm serious. A grandma car, a boring butt car. Pay cash for them. Get rid of these two car payments, and then do what Jade was talking about. And let's work on your careers and let's double your income in the next three years and never have a car payment again. Because if you do, when you take out a car payment, what you are doing is you're looking in the mirror and saying, I Lord, I desperately want to be middle class the rest of my life. That's what you're saying when you take out a car payment? Because that's what the data tells us.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Well, he's sacrificing so much money. If you were to take that money and invest it, what you and car

[Dave Ramsey]

payments will make you a millionaire in 15 years.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Oh, yes. Oh. If you took that car payment from today until age 61, so 40 years, that's $8 million, my man.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That's stupid money.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hope you like the cars.

[Caller]

Buying a home is one of the biggest financial decisions you'll ever make. But too many people base the decision on opinions or what the market is doing that week.

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Caller]

Churchill will tell you the truth, and they won't push you into more house than you need. And once you understand what you can actually afford, you can move forward with clarity and confidence.

[Dave Ramsey]

So if you're ready to Buy a home, choose the right guide and stick to a plan. Go to ChurchillMortgage.com and get started. That's ChurchillMortgage.com this is a paid advertisement in MLS ID 1591 nmlsconsumerexess.org equal housing lender. A lot of the old fogies my age make fun of Generation Z and made fun of millennials too. There's a percentage of every generation that's completely useless. And that includes my generation. My generation. The ones that were useless, we called them hippies. Okay. And they're still smoking pot at 70 years old. And so they still get on weed. But a percentage of every generation is useless and a percentage of Gen Z is useless. They're participation trophy collecting, living in their mother's basement, making fun of capitalism with a $1,200 Apple phone that their mother bought them. They're useless. But we also get the most of the generation Z is pretty incredible. I think it's my favorite generation I've done this for, you know, since the boomers were the target market. When I started this, I was in my 30s.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so the target market was my generation. And that's who was having little kids and having asking us the same questions we get asked. And so I've gone X and Z and millennials and Everybody and this Z's. I mean think about, we had two different 20 year old callers already this hour.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Both of them married, both of them making big boy big girl decisions. Both of them making big girl big boy mistakes. They're gonna make mistakes, but owning them coachable. Both of them if they do and both of them. You did not get the pushback. Sometimes we get a pushback and we all know all you listening and we know they're not gonna do it.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

They're not gonna do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're not gonna do it. They're not gonna do it. Those two though, I think there's a chance both of them are gonna do it. And so those two 20 year olds are probably 30 year old millionaires because of that one phone call. If they follow through.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Absolutely.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that's why we come down here, that's why we turn these microphones on. It's for you.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Absolutely.

[Dave Ramsey]

Those of you that want to listen, those of you that want to do better, those of you that want to win and take the data of the decades of experience that the Ramsey solutions. But now it's with everybody else in the building. There's a thousand of us. The research, the data, the 30 years of being on this microphone taking these same phone calls with different little twists and turns to them, but they're still there. And so I'm really excited about what 15 years from now all the Gen Zs look like, because they're a very serious, sober minded. The good ones. And I think there's more good ones than normal.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Always. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And they're not who they've been made out to be in the media. That's a bunch of crap. So I'm your biggest supporter. If you're 22, if you're using your brain, okay. If you want to plug your brain in, Ramsey, we're fans of you. We're not going to put you down. Now you start the other crap. I'll knock you in the head just like I will any generation. Right. You start telling me how capitalism is the problem. Capitalism is not the problem. You're the problem. So get up off your butt, leave the cave, kill something, drag it home. That's, you know, get a job. There's nothing new about that. That's the same in every generation. So, you know, and Donald Trump's not your enemy and Joe Biden isn't either. They're neither one of them gonna fix your life. Look at them. Come on, you gotta do this. So all that stuff and. But I just, when we take these calls, I see patterns in these calls coming in like today. And it just gets me. I just want to share with you guys. Observe what we're observing. It's exciting what this nation could look like, what this economy could look like. Based on people like those callers contributing to the economy and becoming a positive thing for their families. Generational. Think about where their grandkids will be. That guy, if he takes his car payments alone, he'll have $8 million at 65.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

You put it in the calculator while we were here.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Plugged it in.

[Dave Ramsey]

What if he does that? Talk about this. I mean, and then what if the kids that he raises takes that 8 million and turns it into 80 million? Yes. I mean, this is changing your family tree. This is what it looks like. And this is the power of God's ways of handling money, of grandma's ways of handling money. We call it common sense, but it's so rare. It's like having a superpower. And so we just keep bringing it back to you all the time. And we just got to tell y', all we're fans of you. If you're 22 or 25 and assuming you're one of the good ones. Okay. If you're not, then you're not going to like it when you call here because we're going to box your ears like we would anybody else because we love you and we want you to win and we're going to get you on track. That's what we do. Sarah is in Albany, New York. Hi, Sarah. What's up in your world?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

How can we help?

[Caller]

I am calling because my husband and I about two years ago on his grandmother's house when she passed and we were all fired up about it. It was my husband and I working on it, you know, with our own two hands together, fixing it. Problem is, she'd lived in that house for about 50 years and not a lick of work was done to maintain it. And it is way more than we anticipated. And then Fast forward to 2025. You know, we had a major structure fire. We're fighting with the insurance company in a different property. We lost my daughter. We had a major water break in the grandmother's house.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, you just drove. You lost your daughter. Whoa. You drove by the. What a baby. One of your child?

[Caller]

It was one of my oldest daughter. She's grown.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, how old was she?

[Caller]

25.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, my gosh, honey. Oh, wow.

[Caller]

Needless to say, all of the excitement and drive and you know what? Maybe you and I can do this. We can fix this house together. It can be for our kids use. It's.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's no fun left.

[Caller]

All that drive is gone. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what is the condition of the property today?

[Caller]

So when we purchased it, it was technically legally livable, but, you know, all the windows needed to be changed out, the electrical knob and tubing. The interior was from the 50s.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

And when'd you spend the money?

[Dave Ramsey]

What is the condition of the property today?

[Caller]

So today we've replaced all the windows. The electrical's still there. I had replaced a whole bunch of floors and done a whole bunch of painting in there. And then the water break, I mean, I'm talking a swimming pool amount because nobody's living in it right now. So it wasn't caught right away. And that resulted in most of the interior work that we've done, or actually I did most of that.

[Dave Ramsey]

What did you pay for the property?

[Caller]

We paid 73, 75.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much acreage is with.

[Caller]

About half an acre. It has two parking spaces. It technically has a garage, but it's sagging off. And it's like if it went on

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

the market as is, what do you think it could go for? What do you think you could list it for.

[Caller]

If it went on the market as is, we would probably get, like, 74, and it wouldn't qualify for traditional financing because.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but that's okay. So if you could get 74 it. You got 70 in it. Is it paid for?

[Caller]

No.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Well, you've put lots more in.

[Caller]

Oh, yeah. No, between the. What we paid for it, the closing costs, and the money that we've put into it, we're in it for a little over a hundred right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but the money. Do you have any debt? What debt do you have around it?

[Caller]

So there's the loan that we took for it ended up being, like, 82, I think, for the purchase and the closing cost. And then there was 82 left. Yeah. And then on top of that, we put about 7,000 on a home Depot guard, which is all into that house. And then we put other cash that we had into it as well.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

But the only.

[Dave Ramsey]

I was talking about debt. Okay, so in Debt, you have 82 and seven.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And where are you living?

[Caller]

Yeah, so we don't live there. We have our primary home, which we still have a mortgage on as well.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is it worth,

[Caller]

this house?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, ma'. Am. 100.

[Caller]

Yeah. 200,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what do you owe on it?

[Caller]

I mean, it could be more if we fix it a little bit.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you owe?

[Caller]

We owe about 75 left on it, I want to say.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, all right. Well, I mean, you have two options. One is dig deep and find some energy and get this thing fixed up and at least get your money out of it and sell it. I would not keep. Needs to go away.

[Caller]

No, we're not keeping it.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I would fix it up enough that I could get my 90,000 bucks out of it and lose some of the cash I put into it and all the effort I put into it. But you're gonna have to dig deep to find the energy to fix it up that much. The other option is take a complete whippin and probably sell both houses so that you've got the cash to take the whippin. But I really wouldn't do that. I'd dig deep and finish. Get it at least up to 90 and get where you can at least get the credit card paid off and the mortgage paid off and move on. And whatever cash you put in it, you just lost. And we've all done stupid things and lost money. Welcome to the club. At Ramsey, we don't partner with companies chasing trends or pushing gimmicks. Trust is earned, and that's why we send people to Fairwinds Credit Union. See, a lot of banks rely on teaser rates, marketing hype, and fine print. But that's not how Fair Winds operates. They've been serving members for 75 years, and you don't last that long by cutting corners. You last by serving people well. There's a reason their name is on the studio wall. They built products that help you manage money intentionally, not pull you into debt. If you're looking for a practical way to organize your money the Ramsey way, check out the Fairwinds Smart bundle. It pairs a high yield savings account for your emergency fund with a checking account that doesn't drain your balance with fee after fee after fee after fee. Open your Fairwinds Smart Bundle today at Fairwinds.org Ramsey and get the Rams Be Weird debit card. That's Fairwinds.org Ramsey insured by the NCUA. If you're working the baby steps, the best and fastest way to do it is by using every dollar. It's more than just a budgeting app. Now, the plan, the Ramsey plan is built right in. You track your progress. You get personalized recommendations and coaching, personalized for your particular situation. It'll help you free up more money and work the plan faster. It's like having one of us walking with you every day, showing you the next right step and holding you accountable. Start every dollar for free by downloading it in the App Store or Google Play. Madison is in Pittsburgh. Hi, Madison. How are you? Let me try again. Hey, Madison, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So I was wondering if it would be smart for me to move three hours away from where I live now to move in with my boyfriend so that I can build up a clientele where he's at and build my own salon.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

No, no. What's one thing got to do with the other? What's moving away got to do with building the salon?

[Caller]

So the area that I'm in right now, there's not as high of a demand because there are so many salons over here. And I also don't have the greatest relationship with my family.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

So I would rather be around people that want to be around me.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Sure.

[Caller]

Such as his family and him. And he has also said that he would help me build what I am wanting to build if it's over there.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So what kind of a salon are we talking about? Hair?

[Caller]

No. Nails. I do nails.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I love the idea of you going someplace where you can have the business that you want to have. I love the idea of you exiting what might be a kind of a toxic relational environment with your family. I think that's all great, and if you've identified the right place to do that, I think that's fabulous. What I don't like is you tying up your business, your prosperity with someone that you're not married to. Because what happens if this guy turns out to not be the guy that you marry? Well, now you're tied to him economically, which means if this starts going south but your business is doing well, you might be less likely to end that relationship because you're economically tied up in it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Or worse than that, your nail salon takes off really, really slow, and so you become financially dependent on a guy you're not married to, and he's now controlling the whole thing.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah. Even worse.

[Dave Ramsey]

Really not a good thing for you, my little sister. I want you to be a standalone woman with square shoulders and a strong backbone.

[Caller]

So we were planning in about a year, at a year and a half, we are going to get married.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Great.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long have you been dating?

[Caller]

A little bit over a year and a half.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. How old are you two?

[Caller]

I'm 19 and he's 20.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And your nail salon clientele is going to be. Working in a salon with someone else, and they have the rent and they bring you in and you work for them, but you build up a client base. Or you're wanting to start a salon at 19 years old in a strange location where you know no one from scratch and build a whole business. Which one are you saying?

[Caller]

So I have a job lined up there for whenever I am out of school and I am licensed, which will be around two months from now. And I was going to work there for two to three years and then hopefully save up enough money to open up my salon. I like that on my own.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. Very good. I like that a lot.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

How can we help you solve the problem to where you can go there, do what you're saying, but do it without living with your boyfriend.

[Caller]

So where I'm stuck at is I'm not. I'm not 100% confident in myself that I'll be able to run and manage my own salon.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you're not. You're. You got a job.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So go take the job. What does it pay?

[Caller]

So it's really just going to depend on how many clients I get. I'm pretty sure it's going to be based off of I'm going to pay rent to rent a Chair there, and then probably pay a little bit in commission.

[Dave Ramsey]

So there's no base pay at all?

[Caller]

No.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Do you have any money saved? Do you have any money to your name?

[Caller]

I do. I work right now. I'm a home health care aide for my mom. I make 1150 an hour, and I have about 1000 saved.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so how are you not going to starve to death when you go take this job on straight commission with no base pay?

[Caller]

So I was planning on moving over there, and before I get licensed, I'm going to. It really just varies on when I'm going to get licensed. I was going to start at a different job, and then whenever I have enough saved up to be enough saved up besides my emergency fund to be able to.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think I know why your parents are a problem for you. Because they're telling you that this is dumb and you don't want to hear that.

[Caller]

It's not exactly that. I just don't. I've never really had a good relationship with my dad. My mom fully supports me.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I just think you need to get yourself in a better spot before you do this.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is a nightmare looking for a place to happen. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you don't have any money, and you don't have a job lined up to eat, and so what? 100% this screams is you're gonna be dependent on this guy that you're not married to from the first moment you make this decision. And you don't do that unless you're married. It's not good for you. It's a dangerous, vulnerable situation for you. He kicks you out. You know what you are? Homeless.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Uh, I'm not gonna let anybody I love do that.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And we love you, and we're gonna talk you out of it.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

And by the way, even if he was the best guy ever, why would you want to put yourself in that position where you're completely dependent on him? That's.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's not a good thing unless you're married. If you're married, sure.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Fine.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you're married and he has an income and he wants to support the family while you get your first and second job going here and all that kind of stuff, that's fine. But if he's not, then we're just playing house. This is dangerous for you, and there's

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

no reason for you to put yourself in that position.

[Dave Ramsey]

I just wouldn't do it. You need a different set of income, a different set of savings to protect you, to allow you to be standing as a standalone grown Woman operating her own home and then be dating this guy.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Or be married to him. I don't think y' all are wanting to get married right now because you don't think you're ready. And I don't have any money.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

If I were her, I'd probably keep doing what I'm doing and try to get a job at a local salon, save up as much money as I think. You know, I need to be able to make that leap and get my own apartment.

[Dave Ramsey]

And if you need to just take no contact with your family, but you live in the area where they live, that's fine.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not a big deal. Just set up a boundary. I'm not gonna interact with you people. You're morons. I mean, you can just. That's fine. You can do that. But I want you to have some safety for you. Because when you have to bet everything on someone else that is not legally bound to you, that is a very dangerous scenario for you. And we get the call when this 19 year old, beautiful Madison is 25 and she's living in her car and she calls us because he kicked her out. Oh, and there's a baby now, but there's no, you know, we can't find baby daddy. Cause he's not actually the husband. And this is a guaranteed way to end up spending the first, the next decade of your life in poverty. Don't do it, please, honey, please, please, please don't do this to yourself. So, okay, I don't. The. You have to be able to put. When you're making big decisions, you have to be able to put all of the key elements of the decision on a piece of paper and look at them. And they all have to line up and say, this life changing, major decision I'm making, you know, all of these things say it's a good idea. And when we list them down for you, Madison, all of them say it's not a good idea.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Well, you have to run it. You have to run it through not just best case scenario, but through worst case scenario.

[Dave Ramsey]

Absolutely.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You have to look at the worst case scenario.

[Dave Ramsey]

Absolutely. Well, I mean, best case scenario is you don't have any income.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you're waiting on clients to walk in the door and you're paying chair rent and you're living with him and you don't have any income. So from day one, you are 100% dependent on this guy to eat and to have shelter. That's your best case.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You're just worth way more Than that,

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Caller]

Hey. Doing good, Dave, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Yeah, I want to know if I can just invest 50,000 into my retirement account and then just work on retirement minimally for the next 30 years until I retire.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, the regulations don't allow you to put it into a 401k or a Roth IRA at that sum, that lump sum. So no, you can't do that. But could you invest it? Can you invest it and say in your own mind that particular mutual fund is my retirement account. You could do that. But you can't just randomly add 50,000 to a Roth or 401k.

[Caller]

Yeah, that's kind of my goal. As of right now, I. I have about 20,000 invested into various 401ks and Roth IRAs. I'm about to max out my Roth IRA for this year. I'm on baby step number four right now, but I don't have kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

And if you're on baby step four, then no, I would not do that.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

What's the purpose of you wanting to do it that way?

[Dave Ramsey]

Is that you have a mortgage, right?

[Caller]

No, actually my mom is. She's gonna help me out with a tiny home and I've always kind of lived under my means. My real goal is to just kind of travel the world and just really kind of enjoy the next 20 years, because I'm probably gonna end up taking care of my mom when she gets into her elder years because she's single, so she's gonna need help. So as of right now, like I said, I have about 20,000 invested, and my job is going to allow me to get to about 50,000 that I can invest this year pretty easily. And I guess what my question is, can I just invest that all into a mutual fund through a brokerage account and then just kind of Enjoy the next 20 years of my life?

[Dave Ramsey]

You could, but it's not enough.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

50,000 will create $5,000 a year income.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

It's a great place to park the money while you travel, but it's not a solution to say, and after that, I'm never investing again.

[Caller]

I don't mean never investing again. Just like right now with my job, I make. I work a full commission job, But I am projected to make probably about 180,000 this year.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are.

[Caller]

Totally. I'm 36.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And you're single, Obviously, I'm single.

[Caller]

Yeah. I completely debt free. I just paid off my car and I realized, what do you do? I don't want to be in debt. I work in home improvement.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. Okay. You're mathematically not ready to do what your dream is yet.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're going to have to work a few more years to do that. And so, I mean, you're making $180,000 a year if you need $30,000. If you need $50,000 a year to travel, then you need a half a million.

[Caller]

Oh, no, no, that's not what I meant. I'm thinking of just bringing my retirement up to $50,000. I put the numbers into your website and I was looking over.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then quit.

[Caller]

Huh?

[Dave Ramsey]

And then quit and then go travel the world?

[Caller]

No, I mean, I would work periodically. I just want to take a month off here, a month off there, come back, just kind of have the majority of my money go towards traveling, and then anything that I don't spend, go towards retirement.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Right. The majority of the money that you're earning, not that lump sum, that lump sum is just going to go away forever.

[Caller]

Correct. That's just going to go into my brokerage account and max out my 401ks every year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. It's never a bad thing to invest. And so investing is a good idea. It's never a bad thing to have fun. So having fun's a good idea. It's never a bad thing to be generous as A matter of fact, people that are wealthy and healthy do all three. And so, yeah, I think now that I'm understanding your plan a little bit better. I thought you said you were. I misunderstood. I thought you were saying, I want to put $50,000 away and never, never work again and go travel the world. And I'm like, yeah, dude, you're gonna be skinny.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You know, I mean, the 180 that you make now, what do you think it'll go down to when you're kind of doing this plan and working periodically? And what do you anticipate that being it's performance based?

[Caller]

I mean, I was pretty thin last year and it went down to 80 just because business was slow, you know, I guess my market I was in was a lot slower than what I'm in now. So I know that that can fluctuate.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

What I'm getting at is if it's just you, you're still earning a fine income. I mean, $80,000 while traveling. Is there a way where you can still do some investing and that you're not putting it completely on hold?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah,

[Caller]

kind of wondering what a good number to shoot for would be. After I hit that, after I invest that, the rest of the 50k.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I think it's whatever number allows you to continue to do what you're planning to do. But I don't necessarily know that you need to live on 80,000 while you're traveling. Maybe it's.

[Dave Ramsey]

So if you, if you make 80,000 and you put 15% of that away and you have an emergency fund and you spend the rest of it on travel and living, you're gonna be okay. You just kind of follow the minimalist.

[Caller]

Yeah, I've always been minimalist. So, I mean, I've. I can tell I've spent as little as like a thousand dollars a month before depending on that.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That's what I'm saying. I think you can do both. I don't think you have to say, I'm not gonna invest anymore. I think that you can continue to do that.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I want you to work enough that you make at least 80, and I want you to put 15% away, and I want you to take as much time off as that allows you to take off and travel. And put the 50k with a Smartvestor Pro. Go sit down with one. Go to ramseysolutions.com, click on Smartvestor. You sit down with a professional investment company. They'll help you, teach you, show you, and understand your plan and what you're trying to do. And now that I understand a little bit more. But if you could do that right there.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, that's good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Put 15% away. Travel, live minimalist, Make a minimum work enough, you make 80, then you're making more than most people. And, and, and you can go travel. Have at it. Have at it. Oh, and by the way, as young as you are, your mom's young. Maybe she ought to actually have a freaking plan so she has some money.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Good point.

[Dave Ramsey]

So that you. She's not a burden in her old age. There's an idea man. So I had a really crass friend that was in his 80s and he was a multimillionaire and he was kind of a jerk, honestly. But he was a friend. But he used to say this all the time and I don't like it, but there's enough truth to it that it needs to be said. He said, you know what an old man is that's broke? I said, no in the way. He said, you know what an old man is? That's rich. I said, no. He said, grandpa. Oh, well, I don't like that. Listen, I tell you what, you know, one of my goals is to not be in the way.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Be grandpa.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't want to be in the way, man.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Listen, he's telling the truth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, he's grouchy.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I mean, grouchy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Kind of like Oscar in the trash can on Sesame Street. This guy's got that down. But. But, yeah, yeah, but still, it's like, I don't like that. Not everybody. No. And people aren't that. Yeah, they are.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah. I mean, you don't want to be the burden. You don't want to be the work

[Dave Ramsey]

my whole life and then be a problem.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yes. You want to be able to be fun.

[Dave Ramsey]

I end up working in McDonald's at retirement. It needs to be the one I own in St. Thomas, you know, Come on. Hello? I don't need to be, you know, I'm sorry, I'm not mad at you people, but there's no chance. I want to be a Walmart greeter as my retirement golden years. Okay, no chance. I. I don't mind saying hi to you in Walmart, but I don't want to be paid to do it. Hello? Okay, so come on.

[Caller]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Ann is in New York City. Hi Ann, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi, I'm great. How are you guys?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

I love it. So I had a question about life insurance and estate planning. My husband and I are in our mid-30s and we have a two year old baby. I knew that term life insurance was something that we had to get, but I recently got into a car accident. I'm okay, my car's totaled. And that really brought this task of, you know, life insurance much more to the forefront.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. I'm sorry you went through the car accident, but I'm glad you're awake. Okay, good.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, thank you. We've been working very diligently in baby steps too, and we're about like three or four months away, all depending on when we get our refund because we're just going to put everything to the final day. So with the term life insurance should, I'm assuming we should be putting that as a line item now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Caller]

Probably adjusting our. Okay. Right. That makes the most sense.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Caller]

So then my follow up question is when it comes into budgeting for like estate planning, I know we're going to have to hire a lawyer, draw up a will and all of that stuff is going to cost more money.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You know what, you might not need to do all that just yet. You could take the wills quiz that we have and you might be able to just do one online quickly with mama Bear and not get any, not do any lawyers or anything like that.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is your, what's your net worth?

[Caller]

I think I'm at 10,000 now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you don't, you don't need a lawyer.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Do a state specific will.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You need, you just need to go to. So let me help you. Both things. We can do both things for you. They're both Trusted people that we've done business with for years and years and years and years. So. Zanderinsurance.com Z A N D E R For 30 years I've told people to go to Zander. They're my insurance agent. Chef Zander's a personal friend of mine. Okay. And they shop among a gazillion companies to get you the best possible deal on a term policy. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then go to Mama bear, go to mamabearlegalforms.com and like 70 bucks you can have a will done. And it's perfect for you. In New York, all wills should be state specific. And so this is software that will print out a will for you that's for New York. You have to feed into it what you want the will to say and then it'll print it out and then you sign it and it'll tell you what the proper notary or whatever you have to do in New York is. I don't know that. But some states require notary witness, some just require a witness, some don't require anything. So you just gotta know your specific state and they'll tell you every bit of that. And it's like 50 to $70. You'll have the whole set of documents, you'll have a full estate plan, you'll have your life insurance in place and you really, your budget won't skip a beat.

[Caller]

Okay. I love it. I suppose the follow up question as well. So my husband and I, we have combined earnings are about 150A year. But we have, each of us have side businesses that have been doing well and we love it. So I know that once we get past baby steps three, then I know we're like, we're on track to becoming the baby steps millionaires. So when it, when our net worth continues to increase, I'm assuming that the life insurance policy and like the state specific will, that's something that we can upgrade. Yes, I suppose in a few years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. If you, if you start to have a multimillion dollar net worth, you need a lawyer to do your estate plan. Okay. It's worth paying an attorney at that point. If you, you know, unless there's just something super simple about your will and everything, it's okay, you can still do it. You could have a $10 million net worth and be just fine with a simple will for Mama Bear. But if you want to spend a little bit of money at that point, have an attorney look at it. That's perfectly fine. Nothing wrong with that. And life insurance, you could Just add some more policies if you want. Keep in mind and that what you want to buy is 15 to 20 year level term insurance. And it should be about 12 times your income on you. About 12 times his income on him. And that way if something happens to you in a car accident, God forbid, he could take that amount of money, the 12 times your income, and invest it and it will produce your income without touching it. And so let's just say you made $100,000. And so he. So you took out a million two and he invested a million two that will create $100,000 of income without touching the million two forever, perpetually. And so that's where we came up with those numbers. And here's the thing. You're in your 30s, if you're not overweight and you don't smoke, a million dollars then cost hard. It's the cost of a pizza to get life insurance. And it's just ridiculous that people don't have it. So you need to go get your stinking. Do the things she's talking about. And I'm really glad she called and I'm sorry she had that accident, but I'm really glad it woke everybody up. And we said, hey, we gotta deal with all these things. Cause stuff happens in life.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, she's paying attention. And that's, that's the best thing you can do is pay attention to what's going on, be intentional about making those solutions and don't wait. Life insurance is not a baby step. And I think that's the thing to remember. I remember having that aha moment even back when Sam and I were paying off our debt. Because the truth is, you do wrestle with it in your mind. You think, oh gosh, I, I'm cutting in so many areas, I'm too broke to die. I'm too. Yeah. And, and the last thing you, you want to do is add something to the budget. And you really do have to because you just don't know what tomorrow holds.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. This is true. Cade is in Dallas. Hey Cade, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey guys. How's it going?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Perfect. So we're in a pretty good situation, but my wife and I were having a discussion. I would call it a disagreement, but differing on opinions sounds like a disagreement. I appreciate it. And so we have about five rental properties. Not about five rental. We have five rental properties and our main property as well as a good amount. I say good amount, right? That's subjective. But about 75k in cash in our bank and about 150,000 in stock. And so we were. We're all about paying off debt, but right now we're in a pretty good position. Two houses paid off, three houses with mortgages, and then one house with a pretty big mortgage, which is our primary residence.

[Dave Ramsey]

And your household income is what?

[Caller]

I make about 150. Wife makes about 75. So 225. Walmart.

[Dave Ramsey]

Got it. Very good. Okay. And what's the balance on your home market?

[Caller]

350.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, cool. And how old are you guys?

[Caller]

40 and 35.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool. You've done really well. Congratulations. It's fun to have these discussions by because you got to this point. So if you're asking what I would do. Are you. I sell the stock and take the 75K. That's two and a quarter. And I'd put that on that 350 by close of business today.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm assuming you have an emergency fund in addition to the 75, right?

[Caller]

No, the 75 is just cash in our. So we would. But you know, let's just say we need 25 in there for the emergency fund.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Okay. Then put input 200. That leaves 150. And then that brings up the question you were going to ask about whether we sell one of the rentals.

[Caller]

Right, right. So then the, the question becomes. So, you know, back in, I would say about 10, 15 years ago, I got into the real estate craze. Listen to all the gurus. And I've heard you say before, you know, rentals come with their fair share of problems and I have a fair share of dog day stories for you, but nonetheless came out the other side. Okay. Yeah. And all of them are cash flow, you know, quote unquote cash flow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So the two that are paid for, what are they worth?

[Caller]

Each 200 and about 150.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And the other two, and you have three then that have mortgages.

[Caller]

Correct. 5100, 150. Again, these are just ballpark numbers, just small mortgages.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good, good. All right. And is there any of who wants to sell some of the houses to get the debt paid off?

[Caller]

That would be my wife. We bought into the. Let's go debt free. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so here's the thing. The only question, the only thing we're arguing about is not, not when, not if we're going to be debt free. It's just when.

[Caller]

Yes.

Okay. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

That, that helps the argument. Okay. Because if the argument is I'm going to stay in debt the rest of my life, we Got a different discussion. But if it's like, okay, I got small balances on these things, I got this pile of money so I can throw 200 at the house. Let's get the house knocked out and then we'll whittle away on the mortgages, on the rentals. And you'd map that out and you say with a $225,000 income, it's going to take us 40 years to do all that. Or if we sell one of them, we can do it in two years. Or if we sell two of them, we could do it real fast. That's the argument, right? So we're arguing about two years or four years or whatever these numbers are. We're really not arguing about the concepts. And so is it, do I don't want to give up these houses, I would rather fight with it for four years. She's saying, I want to be done today. If we gave up two of them, we could be done done today. And that's about the numbers roughly. And that's the only argument is whether we, what are we going to do with the next four years? And either, either answer is in the wise column. So we're not going to. We're not going to call it for you.

[Caller]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. Financial stress does not just damage our bank accounts. It can also take a toll on our mental and emotional health and our relationship. Money worries cause anxiety and they are one of the leading sources of conflict for all types of couples. I know this. My wife and I have struggled with money conflicts for years. Listen. Therapy can help even with money conversations. Therapy is not about financial advice, but it can help you build healthier ways of coping, give you strategies to communicate about money, and give you a plan moving forward. I want you to consider talking to my friends at Better Help. BetterHelp is an online therapy platform that matches you with a licensed therapist based on your goals and preferences. Better Help therapists work according to a strict code of conduct and they are fully licensed in the United States. You can message your therapist and schedule sessions right in the platform. And if the first therapist isn't a great fit, you can switch at any time for no additional cost. When life feels overwhelming, therapy can help. Visit betterhelp.com Ramsey to get 10% off your first month. That's better help. H lp.com Ramsey Foreign.

[Dave Ramsey]

We wish we could get to every call and question here on the show, but we can't. You can't get through. There's not that many lines. So if you have A money question and you want an answer for your situation. We got a tool for you to help you head on over to our website and use Ask Ramsey. Ask Ramsey is our free AI tool that's built and trained on Ramsey proven principles. We downloaded several years of answers from this show into the data. All the financial peace university lessons, all the articles we've written that are on our website and the books we've written are all downloaded into that. So AI knows what Ramsey would say, one of us here on the show would say and it will give you that answer free. And it's not polluted with outside confused information from Reddit or TikTok or other stupid places that people get bad information. Instead you could just go to ramseysolutions.com and ask Ramsey and you'll get a Ramsey answer to your question. If you want to know what we think, it's an easy way to do it and it's completely free. Ian is in Atlanta. Hi Ian, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey Dave. I'm doing good. Appreciate all your help through the years. My wife and I, you've helped us out a lot getting our finances in order. So appreciate all that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thank you.

[Caller]

We found out before Christmas my father in law was had fallen into some scams, thousands of dollars. He actually maxed out all his credit card and then he wound up mortgaging the house to pay off the credit card debt. We think he may even now have go so far as to get a reverse mortgage on the house. Tomorrow he has to go to small claims court to deal with one last creditor, about $2,500. The only income he has, legal, legitimate income is his Social Security. So we're not sure where to help him, where to step in and help him. At this point he hasn't let us not help him, but he hasn't given us a lot of room to help him. But it's, you know, tomorrow he has to go to court and we're just not sure what to do, what he can expect there and what to do after that because like I say is this one last debt and all he has is the house and social trip. We don't want him to wind up homeless.

[Dave Ramsey]

So how old is he?

[Caller]

He is 80.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

How's he been clearing the other, the other debts? You said this is the last one?

[Caller]

Yeah, the rest of them, when he mortgaged the house, he paid everything off but he missed this one card. He actually wrote him a letter and explained his situation to him and they still moved forward with it. Like I say, he Got the letter in the mail that he has to be in court tomorrow for this. For this last 25. Who's the creditor?

Know?

I. I do not know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

What are you thinking about? Are you thinking about.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I'm sorry, what state is he in?

[Caller]

Georgia.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right, go ahead.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I was going to say, what are you thinking about paying the 2500 for him? Is that what's on your mind?

[Caller]

No, we're not. We. We're not giving them any more money. My wife is. You know, that's her dad. She's. She's helping out some. I'm not entirely sure, you know, what, you know, she's doing, but I know she's not doing a lot because. Because we know how bad it was. We actually. We were actually. I took his cell phone. I was paying for his cell phone. He was supposed to pay for it. We actually went over the house, took it from him. So, you know, to try not to keep him. Keep it from happening again. But yeah, we're just trying to find out what he can expect tomorrow from the court. Can I get that all. He has Social Security. What can they get? What can they do?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, to start with, what will happen tomorrow is uneventful. You ever been to traffic court for a ticket, right?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like, the first time you go to traffic court, you're like, oh, I'm going to court. And then you go in there. It's kind of funny. It's kind of not much to it. It's uneventful, anticlimactic. You know what I'm saying?

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

They tell you what you already know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's exactly what's going to happen to him tomorrow. Okay? So these attorneys have entire cases, boxes and boxes and boxes of people that they're suing. Tomorrow. They roll them all in on two wheelers. No one comes to oppose them, and they get judgment on all of them in about 10 minutes.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Dave Ramsey]

They don't go through them one by one by one by one. The only one they will pull out is if someone actually shows up. So if he actually shows up, they'll pull it out and they'll talk about it, but they will do nothing. Because here's the deal. The Guy legally owes $2,500 and he has not paid the bill.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

He will lose the lawsuit.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

I got scammed is not a defense.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so he loses tomorrow, and they take a judgment lean tomorrow. Now then, on to your question. What can they or will they do with a judgment lien? 98% of the time on 2500 dollars, they'll do nothing with it because it's too much trouble. It's not enough to screw with.

[Caller]

With.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

But they take the judgment lien. If they're in a state where they can garnishy, they can clean out bank accounts, and they can. And they can garnish wages. They cannot touch Social Security in any state.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

They could take a lien on his house, but were they to do that in the state of Georgia, and they would have to go through, they had to spend 1,000 to $2,000 to do a foreclosure, to collect $2,000, and they end up owning a house which, by the way, has a mortgage on it.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And they get to keep that mortgage. The bank does. So the chances that a Bank takes on $100,000 or $50,000 or whatever mortgage to try to collect $2,500 on a credit card is zero. Never seen it happen in 40 years.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not going to do it. So they take a lien on the house so that if the house ever sold, they get paid, and they will do that.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

In most states, as soon as the judgment is final, it's an automatic lien on property that you own. I don't know for sure in Georgia, if it is, it is in Tennessee. Okay. So it's an auto. As soon as the judgment's final tomorrow and they. And they record it at the courthouse, his title is now clouded. If he tries to borrow money on the house or try to sell the house, they have to get paid because they now have a lien on the house, but they won't execute on the lien and force the sale of the house. It's not practical. Not practical. And if as long as his Social Security comes to an account that is standalone and doesn't have any other money in it, they can't take the money out of that account because it's Social Security money.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

But if he has. If he, if he's got $10,000 laying somewhere, which he doesn't, based on the story you told me, but if he had $10,000, he probably would have paid this bill. Right. But, but, but, yeah. So basically, he is largely what we call judgment proof. There's not a lot they can do with the judgment.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because he's too stinking poor.

[Caller]

Yeah, that's true. Yeah.

Yeah.

And we're trying to help him, but it's just. Yeah, it's, it's. I mean, you've probably gotten these calls before and, you know, it's frustrating to hear about other people falling into these scams. And then, you know, scam was almost a year. Well, Dave, he. He was gonna marry Jennifer Aniston.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay.

[Caller]

And he was, you know, getting the. Buying the Apple gift cards and sending 100 and $200 here and there and just bad work.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you're ready.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Romance scam, huh? Wow.

[Caller]

Yeah. And it was one of the big ones too, so. Yeah, I mean, you know, we've heard other people fell into it. We just never. I thought, how do you fall into that? And then he said, I hit my father in law, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm so sorry. Yeah, yeah, it's. It's heartbreaking. But it sounds like the money is gone. It doesn't sound like it's recoverable from anything. And so my guess is that tomorrow will probably end the drama on the 25.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Until you all. Until. Until you all sell the house after he passes away.

[Caller]

Okay. Okay. Because he was talking about not even going. What good would it do to go? And I'm.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's right. He's right.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're gonna lose. You just walk in there and you're gonna lose. There's no. They can't. They don't send you to driving school. You know, it's not. It's not that part of traffic court. But you're just. You're gonna lose because there's no defense. There's not a. You know, there's no fraud or something like that committed. It's not identity theft. It's not. He borrowed the money and he signed up for the debt. He didn't pay it, he loses. It's very simple and very cut and dried. And I promise you there'll be a thousand at least in these cardboard boxes sitting there and they'll all go boom. With one drop of the hammer. Right. One smack of the gavel and it's over. And it's like a conveyor belt for lost a lawsuit factory. And it's just. It's boring is what it is. But unless you're the one that's all freaked out because of it. Yeah. So anyway, I. I think he's okay. I think he's probably in good shape. I can't be 100 sure, but based on what you told me, I don't know of anything. That any way they can get to him at this stage? Because everything's gone, basically.

[Caller]

Sam,

[Dave Ramsey]

Rachel is in Baton Rouge. Hi, Rachel. How are you?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. I'm good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

My question, is it smart to do a balance transfer that is offering a 0% APR PR for 20 months to take care of a portion of a personal loan that my husband and I have?

[Dave Ramsey]

A personal loan to who

[Caller]

it's with so far? Loan that we have.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, gross. What? How much is so far screwing you for?

[Caller]

We have 15,000 left.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's the interest rate?

[Caller]

12.31%.

[Dave Ramsey]

Aren't they helpful? I know how they paid for that stadium now. Okay. 12%, huh? On 15,000. And what's your household income before taxes?

[Caller]

112,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so how fast you gonna pay off the 15?

[Caller]

Well, we would like to pay it off within a year and a half.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's awful.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Is there something ahead of it? Is that why it would take so long? Like do you have other debts you're attacking?

[Caller]

First we have, we still have a thousand left to pay off on a furniture that we brought. And then we also have a car loan. We have 18,000 left on that.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

And then starting back in July.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I was going to say the car shouldn't come before the 15,000.

[Caller]

Okay. Our payment is pretty high. Our payment is $679. Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what we have learned is the fastest way to get out of debt. And the most sure way to get out of debt when it comes to everything but the house, is to list your debts, smallest to largest, pay minimum payments on everything but the little one. And attack the little one with a vengeance. And I mean no eating out, I mean no vacations, I mean nothing scorched earth on your lifestyle. And you attack these debts. You make too much money to be this freaking broken. And if I'm you, I'm going to pay all of this off in just over a year.

[Caller]

A year?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes. But you have no life during that year. You understand me? And right now you're trying to slow walk this and figure out some interest rate that gets you out of debt. There is not an interest rate that gets you out of debt. What gets you out of debt is when you get so pissed off that you've been screwed over by Sofi and the car companies that you attack this stuff with a vengeance.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Are you guys doing anything outside of your normal jobs, any side hustles, anything to bring in extra money.

[Caller]

No, we aren't.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That's the key, I'm telling you, that's the key to knock this out. Because the longer the horizon on this, the the less likely you are you are to complete it. If you're not attacking this with intensity, it's just gonna be, ah, I'm tired of doing this. Oh, we've done it long enough. This is. We paid off the car. That's good enough, Right? You've got to be intense tents, which means the income that's going towards this debt has got to be as high as possible.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And the outgo is nothing. I mean, I'm not kidding. Do not see the inside of a restaurant unless you're working there as your extra job.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Because if you did that, if you committed, if you and your husband both said, man, we're both going to do a side hustle. We're both going to bring in an extra two or three thousand dollars a month. Oh, my goodness.

[Dave Ramsey]

So, Rachel, here's the deal. Okay? You can wander into debt, and we've helped more people get out of debt than any other organization in America. We know what we're doing. You can wander into debt, but you cannot wander out. You have to get angry about this situation. So angry that you become sacrificial in your lifestyle because you want rid of this. Because it's standing between you and prosperity. It's standing between you and becoming a millionaire. It's standing between you and changing your whole family tree. You got screwed by Sofi, but you allowed it. You signed up for it. You got screwed by the car company, but you allowed it. You signed up for it. So no more.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm not going to. I'm not going to. I'm not going to be the person that gets stepped on anymore, and I'm going to punch back so hard that it goes away. When you do all of that, your question that you called in with becomes almost irrelevant. That's right, because 12% on $7,000 is not your problem. That's seven. $800. Yeah, it's $800 for a year. $800 does not fix a $30,000 problem. And you have a car debt, a sofi debt, and $1,000 debt. That's 30,000 bucks. And so you've got, you know, and you don't have an $800 problem. Problem. You have a $30,000 problem. $2,500 a month for one year, and you're done. Now where are you going to get it? You don't get it from cutting lifestyle and increase in income and cutting lifestyle and increase in income, and you're going to go so hard that your broke friends think you joined a cult. Now, I don't know if you're ready to do that or not. I can't make that decision. For you. If I could, I would. Because I know that the 10 year from now version of you would love you.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You're gonna, the time is gonna pass anyway and you're gonna go, ah, if only I had listened to that guy on the radio.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, and here's the other thing. The faster you get out of debt because of increased income and sacrificed lifestyle, the more likely you do get out of debt, the more you drag it out and slow walk it. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. The better the chance is that you just stay in debt forever and it just becomes normal. Well, everybody's gotten screwed by Sofi, so we might as well just be like everybody else. And your brain starts to normalize the stupidity that is America today.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so, and then we've got Gen Z saying, I can't afford to buy a house because Congress screwed them with student loans. Their college screwed them with student loans. Ford Motor Company, Lexus Motor Company, Toyota Motor Company, put them in twelve hundred dollars car payments so far, put them in twelve percent personal loans. And we're here to help you with your money. Oh, bull crap, you're here to help you with my money is what you're here to help. We know who you are. And you know this is, this is it. And you know when you look at Gen Z, they got record credit card debt record, car loans, record student loans. And then they say, well, I can't afford to buy a house. Well, no kidding, because you got screwed by everybody in sight. And the only thing I would do if I was Gen Z is I'd get really angry about that and I would clean this mess up and take these villains out of my life and say, never again. See, I was 28 when I went broke and American Express called my house and asked my wife why she would stay with a man that wouldn't pay his bill. And she called me crying at the office and said I was thinking the same thing. I got so mad that I'm 65 and I'm still mad. If American Express calls my house now, it's a wrong number because I'm not going anywhere near anything that freaking company does. Everybody, they screw people for a living. I don't want anything to do with Citibank. What's in your wallet? Money. Not your crap. That's what's in my wallet. So you gotta get that thing going like that, that swagger. And you know, that's what happened with Jade and Sam. He said, I'm not living like this. I've had it. Yeah, I'm done.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah. You have to get to the point where you're, instead of blaming people, you're, you're just, you're just mad about it and you're realizing, oh, the same people that screwed you aren't going to come save you. You know what I'm saying? Like, they're not going to help you, so you have to help yourself. That's the only way. That's the only way you get out of this. It's the only way.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. When you get twisted up about it and you say, I'm looking around out here and none of these people have my best interest at heart.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Nope.

[Dave Ramsey]

And including the balance transfer, 0% credit card. Well, you know, you know what that is, is betting you are not going to pay it off in 20 months. And you're not going to pay it off in 20 months if you don't change the way you're doing this.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

And they're just going to send you more offers.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, no, they're going to jack you to 28%. They're going to make so far look like a good deal.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

At the end of 20 months, they're going to hand you a, you know, oh man, it's going to be bad. It's going to hand you a new piece of paper and you're going to go, I think I got a little throw up in my mouth. Yeah. Because I've signed. I did it again. I signed up with one of these companies, Fifth Third's here to help. Give me a break. They're gonna screw you. When you walk into the finance company or the finance office of the car dealer, it should have a sign over the top of it that says enter here to get screwed. Because that's what they're gonna do. They're gonna jack you up. And it's to their benefit, not yours. All you get out of it is toxic smell from the plastic that's new in the car and we call it new car smell. It's the plastic that's new and it's toxicity. Let me help you with this. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio, I'm Dave Ramsey. Jade Washaw Ramsey, personality number one best selling author is my co host. Today Cassandra is in New York City. Hi Cassandra, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi, baby. First, thank you for your incredible gifts and the wisdom you share so generously. Your teachings truly made a difference in my life.

Years ago

I joined Financial Peace University and wiped out $80,000 in debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Look at you ever since. Proud of you Way to go, kiddo.

[Caller]

Thank you. Thank you. But now I feel torn between responsibility and boundaries. I have family in a third world country and also families here who are struggling financially. I have been helping, but now it feels expected. And they openly talk about what they want me to pay for. I feel guilty saying no, but I also worry because they do need the money. How do I help in a healthy way without being taken advantage of or feeling resentful and are becoming their financial plan, knowing that I'm supposed to give anyway. And lastly, I don't appreciate that the privacy and the mystery of where the money is coming from is not there. And therefore, it doesn't feel like I'm giving money. It's more. It feels more like. Not. It doesn't feel like I'm giving money like a gift, but more like an obligation.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's true. That's what entitlement does. That's no fun. Okay, so what amounts of money and how much is stateside and how much is in the developing country?

[Caller]

Okay, so my family in Haiti. In Haiti, everything. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

They need everything we're talking about.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now. How much money have you been. How much money have you been giving the people in Haiti? And who is it, your mother or your dad or what?

[Caller]

So my. My parents live here in the States, and I help them out as well. They have retired, but they do not have that much money to retire off of. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, that's one. Who. Who's in Haiti?

[Caller]

My brother and my sister and my siblings. So my brother has five children and a wife, and my sister has two children, and her. My nephew just had a baby and. Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

What kinds of money in a year's time? How much money are you filtering to

[Dave Ramsey]

these folks in Haiti?

[Caller]

So sometimes I send like $600 to one, $800 to the other, I send $400. So it depends because sometimes the kids needs to go to school. So we pay for. I pay for them to go to school, and then I pay for. I also pay. I've been. I'm also working on helping them to come to the States. So that involves applications.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

So if you had to put a rough estimate, what's a dollar amount that you would say yearly, I'm spending this amount of money on Haiti, I would

[Caller]

say about like $10,000.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

10,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and how about your mom and dad?

[Caller]

Okay, so my mother, she. I've been giving her about $400 to $600 month, but I think scaling back off of that because I. I found out that she hasn't Been using it appropriately.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's she using it on?

[Caller]

She'll see. She likes to buy things and she likes to show off to her friends and she has money.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so can we look at, can we make the statement about everyone involved? A, we love them and we want good things for them. True, True.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. B, no matter how much money we give them, it's not going to be enough.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, you could, you could triple what you're giving them and nothing will change in their lives.

[Caller]

And that's why we are working now and getting them to the States.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but. And that's. So that's a good, that's a good. That's a sustainable investment. But just throwing $300 into a family of eight in Haiti doesn't even move the needle. You could throw 3,000 in that same hole and it would still go down the hole. So you can't give them enough money to be God. And you don't have that much money money. And so all you're doing is getting aggravated and helping a tiny, tiny bit. But the amount of money you're giving into these situations is not changing their lives. It might feed them for a day. It might help them with their application to come to the States, both of which are good things. But, you know, so if I'm going to give any more money, I'm going to have two different things on it. Three things on it. One is you're going to be responsible with the money that you have, Mother. Two, we're going to set a set amount, and that's all I'm going to do. Three, I'll help with the applications. Okay. But I'm not going to 600, 800, 400, 300. And them think, oh, she's just made of money. And I'm feeling used and guilty. And they're still. And they still want more. There's no end to it. And so what we've got to do is put a boundary on it, put an amount on it and say, I'm going to give you X per month and I'll help with the application. That's it. Don't ask for any more.

[Caller]

So should I do that? Like, so now would I now be on the hook? Because now I.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's up to you if you don't want. The amount of money you can give per month can be zero, but you need to set an amount.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

And that's for your budgeting purposes and you need.

[Dave Ramsey]

And for your sanity, because this has. This is like a dog chasing its tail. It's got no end to it. That's what's driving you crazy.

[Caller]

It is, but. But it's also expected of me.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't care what's expected.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You get to set the expectation.

[Dave Ramsey]

You get to decide what's expected. I'm not expected of anything. Bull crap.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You get. You can sit down with.

[Dave Ramsey]

Let me help you with this. You get nothing. I decide. I changed my mind. I'm not giving you any more money. You can do that. That's perfectly okay. And you have no reason to feel guilty for that at all. Okay. You know how much money I'm sending your family? None. You know how guilty I am about it? Not at all.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm not obligated. I'm not obligated. There's a lot of people hungry. I'm not. I'm not Jesus. I can't feed all of them. Okay? I feed some hungry people as an act of charity, but not as an act of obligation or guilt. And we do feed hungry people through the Ramsey Family Foundation. We do that. Okay. But we don't feed everybody on the planet. We don't have the money. And I feel zero guilt about that. Okay? So you have got. You've got to put this in your head that you're not Jesus. That job's taken. He already took the job. You can only do a little bit. You do not have the money to be God. You cannot fix their lives. And once you accept that, then you can explain that to them and say, I can't fix your whole life, but I can do this much a month. And that's what I'm willing to do. And if you don't like it, I can send nothing. Also. That's a possibility. If you're a jerk about it, if you don't appreciate it and say thank you a lot, I can give you nothing. That's a total possibility. But in the meantime, I willing to do this. But you're not the Messiah. The job's taken.

[Caller]

When I talk to people on The Ramsey Show, 90% of the problems I hear come down to one thing. Not having a plan. They're not living on a budget. They have no idea where their money's going. Money is just happening to them instead of them happening to their money. And, guys, that is so normal. But it doesn't have to be normal for you. And that's why I want you to go download our EveryDollar budget app. EveryDollar not only helps you tell your money where to go with a budget, it also builds a plan to free up extra money so you can pay debt off faster and start building wealth. And the best part, your plan is completely personalized to your life. It's the same advice that you would get if you called the show. And it's right in your pocket. So don't keep living normal. Go download the EveryDollar app, answer a few questions and get your plan today.

[Dave Ramsey]

Today's question of the day is brought to you by why Refi? If you've fallen behind on your private student loans and have stopped making payments, it can feel like every door is closed. But why Refi helps borrowers explore low fixed rate refinancing options that fit your budget. Go to yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey might not be in all states.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay. Today's question comes from Parker in Tennessee. He says, my wife and I move every few years for work and we rented homes each time. Our friends recently bought a house for 1.5 million, which I know is out of their price range. So I asked how they did it. They said they did an interest only mortgage. What are your thoughts on this type of loan? It sounds like it's renting a house, but you get the benefits of ownership. Would buying a house this way be a smart move for somebody that relocates frequently or should we keep renting? So there's, there's two concepts in there. There's the friends who have the 1.5 million dollar house which that feels like their personal residence. They're not relocating as often as you do. But you're saying is this a good idea for, for us since we relocate? And I would say no under any auspices of the, the idea, this is a horrible idea and it's the product is really just what it's what it is. You're only paying interest. So if you're not paying any of the principal, you're never paying down the mortgage. So in essence you're just renting a house. That's really what you're doing for a period of time. So I there, there's no real advantage that I can think of for you to do this. I mean after the interest period ends, your payment's going to jump up anyway because you will start paying principal and you're just paying more interest over time. It's probably, I got to believe it's one of the most expensive ways that you could buy a house.

[Dave Ramsey]

And actually on the short term owning a home is more expensive than renting. Heat and air goes out, roof leaks, property taxes go Up. Homeowner's insurance goes up. All of those things, you still got all those things. And if you move and try to sell the house and you've reduced the principal, not at all. You're likely going to take a loss.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Oh yeah, you'd be upside down between

[Dave Ramsey]

how often you move. So no, you need to stay away from it. So anything that sounds too good to be true is. And your friends Parker, are short term thinkers.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, I wasn't very smart.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're not thinking long term term. There are people that think, thank God it's Friday, oh God, it's Monday. I want something, I want it now and I'm going to buy it even though I can't afford it. And by the way, the interesting thing is the difference in a payment on an interest only loan and a 30 year, which we don't recommend. Not much difference. Not a lot of difference. No, because think about your 30 year mortgage. The first payment you pay has almost no principal riddle production, it's almost all interest. So the payment's almost the same. It's not $50 difference or something like that. It's not a lot different. But the concept is way different because it describes someone who's thinking short term and is immature rather than someone that's thinking long term.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

So the other part of this that I can't help but just call out is if you said, hey, they bought this house for 1.5, I know it's out of their price range. So I asked how they did did it. That, that's the wrong question to ask. You don't look at someone, you ask

[Dave Ramsey]

how they did it. So you don't do it right.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Not so you go, oh, they're buying things they can't afford. Let me figure out how to do it too.

[Dave Ramsey]

How I can buy things I can't afford.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, it's not a great method.

[Dave Ramsey]

Really bad. Yeah, that, that was, that was kind of laying there and I missed it on the page. Yeah, Mark's in Washington dc. Hey Mark, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey, how you guys doing today?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. Well, what's up?

[Caller]

So I've got a little bit of a funner question. I think you helped me out in the past. About eight years ago we were drowning consumer debt. Just bought a new house and since then we are 100 debt free.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good for you. House and everything.

[Caller]

Thank you, thank you. House and everything. We got really angry and really focused.

[Dave Ramsey]

Eight years later, knocked it out. Well, I'm glad I was there eight years ago. That's awesome.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That's really cool.

[Caller]

Me too. Me too. And we're kind of, you know, we've definitely let off the gas some. Still focused, still intentional, but still frugal.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good.

[Caller]

And I'd like to take my wife to Italy. And I'm curious as to how much would be a responsible amount to spend on about a 10 day trip to Italy.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your household in income?

[Caller]

It's about 200.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's your net worth now?

[Caller]

Right now it's probably just north of a million.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good for you. That's a nice eight year turn. Okay, and, and how much money do you have saved for the Italy trip?

[Caller]

So we're gonna go in the fall, so we're gonna work towards saving towards it. But I was, I was thinking like, for the way that we like to travel, which again was very frugal. I was thinking for Italy, probably between like 8 to 10, I would double that thousand.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I mean, you got to price it out and see.

[Dave Ramsey]

I would double that. Okay, you're a millionaire. You're responsible, you're careful. You make $200,000 a year. Of course you're paying cash for this. No question. And $16,000 on a, on a world class epic adventure is not out of hand for you.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I'd put 15 on the budget and say we need to save up 15 between now and the fall and then go do it upright. That's 10 days. That's, that's still not a lot of money. You're, you're still not, I mean, you're, you're not staying in the Four Seasons doing that.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Have you, have you, you priced anything out? Have you looked at it?

[Caller]

We've looked at flights. I've looked at a couple like Airbnbs and things like that that some people have sent me places that like, would kind of fit our style.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

And you know, they, I was surprised because they're like, you know, it's, it's kind of like going on a trip in the US like, it's not that bad going over there. And I was kind of surprised by that. So.

Okay,

I've heard you've been over there a couple times. Are there any things over there that like, we should definitely see, in your opinion?

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

What part of Italy are you going to

[Caller]

go? Sicily to Florence, which I told her, hey, I just looked at the map and those are on two.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah, that's right. Listen, I love Florence in that area. Florence, Pisa, and anything in that area. I think you're gonna, you can't go wrong Great food.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Tuscany is amazing. Yeah. I mean, the food, wine scene in Tuscany is off the chain. Of course. You got, Florence has got the statue of David. It's got, and, you know, an hour and a half away is the Leaning Tower. And so that's all touchable right there. That's all doable, actually. You can get down to Rome. Rome's full of tourists, everything.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's from the Coliseum to the Vatican to whatever and, and tourist hack. If you're gonna spend a little money, if you're going to Rome, if you're gonna go into the Vatican and you're gonna go into the Sistine Chapel and so forth, and you're gonna see the museum, hire a private guide. And you don't stand in line for two and a half days to get in. It's a mile and a half long. And you walk past every bit of it with a private guidance straight in like you're a snotty rich person and just go do it. For sure, sure. And it's definitely the way to go. And, you know, that's just a couple things, but I mean, yeah, Rome's full of things you've read about your whole life and thought about your whole life. And so it's, it's amazing. You stay there the whole time probably it just depends on what you want to do. I mean, and, and what it is you're after, what type of experiences you're trying to curate in the process. But yeah, you can, you can drop 15k pretty quick over there and, and still be called frugal.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Absolutely. Especially in 10 days.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you did it, Mark. You lived like no one else for eight years and now you're still young and you can live and give like no one else. And so, yeah, enjoy this. Plan it out. Stay within the plan and that helps you enjoy it. Cuz you're not stressed out about busting the budget or something. You're. But you're not being, quote, unquote, irresponsible. Not even close. Well done, sir.

[Caller]

Sam.

[Dave Ramsey]

Listen up, folks. If you've got a complicated tax situation and you're putting off filing your return, it's time to talk with a Ramsey trusted tax pro. Not next week, not April 15th, right freaking now. Ramsey trusted tax pros know the tax code front to back, so they can do the heavy lifting to help you file on time and explain things to you with the heart of a teacher. But they can only do that if you get on their schedule before they book up. Go to ramseysolutions.com taxpro to find a full time tax advisor who serves your area with excellence. That's ramseysolutions.com taxpro. Buying or selling your home is a big deal, and with all the clickbait headlines and conflicting data out there, it's hard to know what's really happening in the housing market. Well, we're here to make the latest trends easy to understand and factual. Median home prices went up a little last month to 400 and 3,000. We typically do see that in the spring season because it gets a little busier. Mortgage rates also dipped all the way to 5.43, down from 6.1 that we saw last February, giving buyers some breathing room. But since rates are unpredictable, the best time to buy is when you're financially ready, not when home prices or rates drop. To learn more about the housing market trends and to get some free tools to help you buy or sell with confidence, go to ramseysolutions.com or click the link in the Show Notes. If you're listening on podcast or on YouTube, Maria is in Houston. Hi Maria, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi. Thanks so much for taking the call. I'm calling about my marriage. My husband and I are not aligned financially and unfortunately I knew this before getting married. It's going to be 10 years we've been married and I was a single mom when we met. My daughter was 12. He helped raise her. She was 19 when we got married. But we keep our finances separate. He's a saver. In the past I've been a spender and I've worked really hard to get my act together. And he bought the house cash. He bought the house when we were engaged but he did not put my name on it. And I'm an entrepreneur when I wasn't. Whether or not I was earning money, I was responsible for all of the expenses of the house because he bought the house cash. And I'm now in a place that I'm earning money which feels good. And he's a lot of times as said what you now that you sit at the adult table, we can have adult conversations. Woo. And as long as I keep my eyes on God and I focus on myself and I, I'm okay with it. But I'm obviously not okay with it. Every time I bring it up it causes a big issue and so I just pretend like I'm okay with it and I know my daughter thinks not good for me and I don't know, I don't know what to do. What made me call you today is that we, we have A four bedroom house. We have a roommate. Because look, that roommate covers property taxes.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have a roommate living in your home that's paid for.

[Caller]

For. Yes, we do.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why?

[Caller]

Yeah, because he that covered the property taxes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I mean, why can't you guys cover the property taxes? Y' all aren't broke.

[Caller]

Yeah, exactly. And so when he.

[Dave Ramsey]

Stop a minute. What does your husband make a year?

[Caller]

My husband retired at 43 and he now has a part time gig that he does just so he has play money.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what does he, what does he plan on living on if he retired at 43? Does he have a huge savings?

[Caller]

He does.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, how much does he have in his investments?

[Caller]

I don't know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because what do you think?

[Caller]

Have access, what do you think? I think 5 million.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And, and what do you make a year?

[Caller]

Conservatively? A hundred.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Okay.

[Caller]

Because it's commission based.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, so here's the thing. We get in relationships what we tolerate. For 10 years you've tolerated being treated this way. And you're running out of toleration, you're running out of steam. You're not willing to tolerate it anymore. And that's why you called us. And so I do not know in a radio call or a podcast call how to navigate through 10 years of you being treated like you're not an adult. And through all the pain that I hear in your voice. I don't think we can navigate through all of that in one phone call. But I will tell you, just listening to you, I think your marriage is probably going to end if you guys don't do something to heal it. Because I don't think you're gonna stay much longer if you don't do something to heal it. I don't know that you've said that out loud to yourself. And I'm not suggesting that. I'm just observing that I'm talking to a lady who's completely done.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah. If you've had to convince yourself that the only way to survive in there is to basically keep your mouth shut

[Dave Ramsey]

and, and have a roommate. Yeah, that's just strange. We have $5 million, but we're so cheap we have a roommate to pay our property taxes. No thank you. Not how I want to live. So what would I do if I were in your shoes, Maria? I think I would sit down. I would get on the phone and call your pastor, call your church and get a recommendation of a good faith based marriage counselor that can sit down with you and coach you. You and coach him. And then I would sit down with your husband and say, I've made an appointment with a marriage counselor on Tuesday because I want to try to save our marriage because it's almost over, and I want to try to save it. Do you want to come?

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Have you ever tried that?

[Caller]

We have. We've gone to that point, and he. We started. We'll do a couple sessions, and then we. Things get better. He's even put my name on some of. Because our finances aren't blended. He's even put my name on some of the accounts, but my name is still not on the house. And I. Yeah, so we've done it, like, three or four times, and I. One time, I actually.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, are you. Do you want to try again again, or are you done?

[Caller]

I don't know.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't want to try again unless I think it's going to work. And so I'm going to demand that this time it works.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Have you sat with a counselor? Just you?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. I think you guys have got that to do. I don't think we can help you on this show, hon. We're not. We're not. We're not qualified, number one. We're just your friend, and we're sitting here with you hurt, and I'm sorry you're hurting. I can't do anything about any of that. And I don't have a magic phrase to say that hasn't worked in three rounds of marriage counseling. But I will tell you, doing what I do and knowing that the number one cause of divorce is money problems and money fights over money, I will tell you that I'm honestly surprised you've made it as far as you have. Statistically, I'm glad you're still married, and I want your marriage to heal. But, yeah, you guys are. You're gonna have to sit down, and you guys are gonna have to lay out some milestones, some things that we agree that these things are going to happen, and these things are never going to happen again. And we've got our little list of five things that we always do and five things that we never do. And, you know, that will include full transparency and understanding where the money is. And I have a vote on the money. And you never talk to me like I'm not an adult again and tell me I get to sit at the big girl table. That's so freaking demeaning. It's unbelievable. But, you know. You know, but. But you put up with it for 10 years, so some of this is on you. So you've got to call this this and I, I recommend you try another round. But I would put very clear expectations in that round of counseling that these things have to occur or I'm not staying. And if you do stay after that, now it's your fault.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

I think that's what she's struggling with.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you keep staying and nothing changes. And now it's your fault. So if you want to make one more pass at it, you can. And I recommend you try it, but with some very clear objectives. I think we kind of went in sideways and said this just needs to get better as some kind of general statement instead of saying here's specific things that must change and here's specific things that can never happen anymore. And those are my conditions. Hey guys, Dave Ramsey here. Every day on this show, we help people work through real life money problems and figure out what to do next. Now you can get that same kind of help anytime with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help. It's fast, simple, and free to use. Go to ramseysolutions.com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's ramseysolutions.com. Scripture of the day is Philippians 4. 8. Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is absolutely admirable, if anything is excellent or praiseworthy, think about such things. Charles Schultz says, life is like a 10 speed bike. Most of us have gears we never use.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Interesting.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is true. Faith is in Dayton, Ohio. Hi, Faith. How are you?

[Caller]

Hi, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So I'm a single Mom. Mom. I'm 30 years old and I kind of just started, you know, kind of paying attention to my finances. So I'm a little late to the game, but I'm on baby step number two and I'm trying to pay off my debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good.

[Caller]

But at the same time, I want to make sure that I'm saving for my son, for his future. So in my budget, I have been putting a little bit aside, but not much. I've just been putting it into a savings account. Account. And I've heard you talk about like 529 accounts and different ways to save. I just didn't know if that kind of account is useful for someone who can't put like that much into it every month.

[Dave Ramsey]

Probably not, but I wouldn't be putting anything aside for your son right now. You are Investing for your son by getting yourself squared away. Because as you get yourself squared away and out of debt and build wealth, it's going to benefit him.

[Caller]

Yeah, I'm just, I'm my biggest. Where I feel, I'm feeling so much anxiety because I feel like my student loans are so big.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like how many, how much do you owe on your student loans?

[Caller]

I owe 54,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Cool.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you make a year?

[Caller]

I make 58,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Doing what?

[Caller]

I work for a construction. I'm an admin, like kind of assistant here but I just got promoted to salary so I'm making a little bit more.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you're 30 years old and your baby's healthy. How old?

[Caller]

He's 4 years old.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool, cool. And where's daddy?

[Caller]

He's, I mean he's, he's in town and stuff and he does give me some child support every month. It's like 400. But I do use a lot of that to like, you know, pay for child care and that kind of thing.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

That's what it's for.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. Every. And you have 50, 58,000 student loans. What other debts do you, you have?

[Caller]

I have 15,000 left on my car and then I just, I have a personal loan for 5,000 that I used to pay for a little bit for a lawyer and to like clear off

a couple credit cards that I had

when we were together.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Have you cut up all the credit cards?

[Caller]

Yeah, so the credit cards are gone and I've been door dashing every other weekend when I don't have my son and I've been putting everything I make onto that, onto that personal loan right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Great, very good.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

You're doing the right thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

And anything else you can find in that budget, you throw it on that too and get it cleared off. Then you get the car cleared off and then we go after the student loans. So you're right. With doordash and a 4 year old and 30 years old and making 58 with what you owe, it's going to be a little while. You're going to take a while, but it's not going to take 10 years. It's just not going to happen in two years.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you will be amazed when you knock off the car and the personal loan how much that frees up your budget to attack this student loan. And then you've probably got another two or three years at that point.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yeah. When you knock out the car that's going to give you a new lease on life. You're going to feel so good having that money back in your pocket every time you get in that car. And that's going to almost act like a reset set for you mentally when you start attacking the student loans.

[Dave Ramsey]

But let's reset for a second on your four year old son. Okay. Let me tell you about him. He has a mom who is a warrior princess who knows how to fight and scrape and cause things to happen. That's going to help him more than $10 a month being stuck in a savings account. He's watching you live your life well. And then as he watches you scrap and claw to get out of debt. He's gonna learn to stay out of debt when he's older because he'll remember what we went through. My mom was a single mom and it was tough. And that doesn't kill the kid. It makes him awesome. So he is really blessed.

[Caller]

I don't know why it makes me feel like, it makes me feel so guilty that I'm not like, you know, able to save more for him when he's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well. The best thing you can do for him is not be a problem later.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Truly.

[Dave Ramsey]

By cleaning this up and becoming a millionaire. And you actually can do that, believe it or not. Let's pretend that it's five, five hard years from today. And pull up the calculator. And so 35 to 65 and we save 15% of $65,000. Okay. Five hard years from today, you're debt free and you have an emergency fund. Okay. Student loans and everything. And that's going to be hard. That's like really watching every penny, door dashing, everything. You can do hard five years, but you're, you're tough. You can do this.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Five years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And then at 35 years old, you start investing 15% of your income because you have no payments.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

How much? 15%.

[Dave Ramsey]

15% of 60,000 would be $9,000 a year.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so that's gonna. 500 plus 2. It's 750 month.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And do that from 35 to 65 in a mutual fund. We're putting it in our calculator right now to see how rich you're going to be. Okay. Faith, that's $2.3 million when you're 65. So if you invest 15% of your income and you make $60,000 a year and you never get a raise for 30 years, highly unlikely from age 35 to age 65. And you're able to invest that because you cleared off this debt in the coming five years and you spent five more years of hell. The kid is nine years old. When you are debt free and begin investing, all right, and then when you are at his wedding, you will be a millionaire there.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, that's where you're headed. That's where you're headed. And that's the best gift you can give him. He's not going to be, he's, you know, harmed if you don't put a diamond savings for him today. Because by taking care of you, you're setting yourself up to be able to help him in any way you want to let.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

And, and by the way, you know, we've been teaching this. I know, Dave, you've been teaching this long enough that we have people who come and their parents did fpu and their parents walked the baby steps and now the children are standing on stage and the children are part of that legacy and they never come back and say, oh, it was so hard because my parents walked the baby steps and they came back.

[Dave Ramsey]

My mom never saved anything for me when I was 4. They don't say that.

[Jade Whelan Ramsey]

They say I learned how to handle money from a young age. I never got into debt. And then when I married my spouse, we immediately attacked our house and we became millionaire.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, my mom taught me how to do hard work. My mom taught me what resilience looks like because she lived it. These are the gifts you're giving him. He's going to have a great life because of you. And so quit putting money in savings for him out of some kind of false guilt that you're not taking care of him. My point is you're taking care of him beautifully. But you got to follow through on all this. It's not going to magically happen. There's no genie in a bottle that does it. It's not going to get easy. It's not going to be where there's no trouble. The transmission is still going to go out and the tire's still going to be low. Somebody's still going to steal something from you. Stuff's going to happen through your life. You can count on all that still occurring. But the point is you gotta have a target and a plan. And when you're working that you're gonna get to a place that you will have taken care of him better by taking care of you than by putting $10 a month aside out of some kind of misdirected guilt like you've done something wrong that you should be ashamed of. You're a single mom with a four year old and you're 30. You have nothing to be ashamed of. Now go get you some, girl. This is your time. It's your time. Go make this happen. And we're gonna set you up with everything, all right? We're gonna put you into Financial Peace University. We're gonna put you into our EveryDollar app. And we're gonna pay for all of it and give it to you as a gift. Cause we think you're a hero. That puts this hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to Financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.