Fix The Money Mess That’s Stressing You Out

Summary

The Ramsey Show – "Fix The Money Mess That’s Stressing You Out"
Host: Dave Ramsey
Co-Host: Rachel Cruze
Date: May 29, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Ramsey Show focuses on helping listeners untangle the financial—and emotional—messes that often go hand-in-hand with debt, strained relationships, and poor money management. Dave Ramsey and his daughter, Rachel Cruze, respond to real listener calls, touching on everything from deep consumer debt and enabling family, to tough love in relationships, career transitions, and practical steps toward financial stability. The tone is direct, occasionally blunt, but always with the goal of empowering people to face reality, make concrete plans, and move forward.

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Key Discussions and Insights

1. Facing and Fixing Big Debt and Marital Stress

Liz’s Dilemma: Out-of-control Debt and Budget Shortfall

• [01:08 – 09:00]
• Liz in Charlotte calls in, revealing she took over finances after discovering her husband had run up about $200,000 in consumer debt (cars, credit cards, a HELOC).
• Their combined gross income was high (~$250k at the peak), but Liz’s variable income has dropped; now, their take-home is only $7,700/month and they’re $2,700 short monthly.

Dave and Rachel’s Guidance:

• Immediate Steps:
  • Both spouses need to do the budget together for accountability (“You’re carrying it by yourself and it’s crushing you. I can hear it in your voice.” — Dave, [07:00])
  • Stop 401(k) contributions immediately—“You don’t go $2,700 in the hole while funding a 401k. That’s borrowing money to put it in a 401k. No, I’m not doing that.” ([08:14], Dave)
  • Sell both vehicles (“These cars have got to go. They’re crazy in this situation.” — Rachel, [08:32])
  • Audit every dollar to find missing money—gross income doesn’t add up to net, so “something’s wrong.” ([08:34], Dave)
• Emotional Note:
  • Dave calls out lingering resentment about the hidden debt but urges “hooking arms” to pull through as a team.

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2. Enabling Family and the Cost of Generosity

Jay’s Struggle: Supporting Disabled Parent & Two-Car Debt

• [10:33 – 18:53]
• Jay, 27, lives at home, working two jobs and going to school, but is $35,000-$45,000 in debt largely due to car loans—one for himself, one for his disabled father.

Key Insights:

• Jay can’t afford to support others while drowning financially.
• Dave’s tough love: “You are way too broke to be supporting other people. That’s why you’re stuck.” ([13:32], Dave)
• Jay needs to sell the Denali, pay off his debts aggressively, then help family emotionally rather than financially.
• Rachel: “All the debt you’re feeling are these two cars.” ([14:42])
• Path to freedom: Get rid of the expensive car, focus full force on debt, and then plan for independence.

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3. Relationship & Finance: Buying a House Before Marriage

Kevin’s Question: Buying a Home With Girlfriend

• [21:45 – 28:40]
• Kevin and his girlfriend, with help from her dad, want to buy a home before marriage—“We feel like we’re wasting money renting.”

Dave’s Response:

• Absolute NO: “It is absolutely, relationally, legally, financially stupid to buy a house with someone you’re not married to.” ([23:19])
• Strong warning to re-order priorities: Get married first, then talk about a home together.
• Statistics: Married men have 4x the net worth of unmarried men by 35; unmarried cohabiting women have 14x less net worth at 50 ([28:40])
• Notable Moment: “Go to the preacher Saturday and get married. Saturday!” ([27:12], Dave)
• The statistics on the “marriage advantage” are cited repeatedly.

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4. Student Loan Stress and Budget Chaos

Jennifer’s Hustle: Teacher With Side Gigs & $100k in Loans

• [34:30 – 41:18]
• Jennifer and her husband work long hours, have paid off ~$100,000 already, and have ~$100k left in government/private student loans. Income is inconsistent, and her health is suffering from the grind.

Action Plan:

• Get on a detailed, every-dollar monthly budget—clarity reduces stress and fuels motivation. ([36:59], Dave)
• Rachel: “You can still budget with an inconsistent income… Just every month, guess what you’ll make and adjust mid-month.” ([38:26])
• Don’t count on loan forgiveness; just finish paying them off.
• Celebrate their hard work: “You’re killing it, Jennifer. You’re doing real.” ([40:53], Dave)
• Statistics: Teachers are among the most common millionaire professions in their studies.

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5. Red Flags in Relationship Commitments

Emily’s Fork in the Road: “A List to Earn the Ring”

• [44:14 – 52:06]
• Emily, 31, has been with her boyfriend four years. He gives her a list of things to improve (“change” and “adversity”) before he’ll propose, after moving three times for his career.

Dave & Rachel’s Response:

• Deep concern at the conditional love (“If you had a daughter and her 18-year-old boyfriend said, ‘do these three things to get married,’ you’d tell your daughter, run!” — Dave, [50:29])
• “You want a partner… you need to be able to authentically be yourself at home. Image-managing for your spouse is an exhausting life.” ([51:05], Rachel)
• Notable Exchange:
  • “I think when he said this, you’ve already made your mind up… It’s weird.” ([50:57], Dave)

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6. Older Parents, Low Income, and a Second Career

Adult Children Coaching Parents Toward Financial Security

• [66:01 – 75:14]
• Two segments:
  • Ethan and his brother try to create a plan for their mother (55, $19k in retirement, $16k consumer debt, $34k HELOC) to get stable before retirement.
  • Jake in Ohio co-owns a house with his 57-year-old mother, who has only $8,000 for retirement after a divorce years ago; both want an exit that doesn’t “scathe” either.

Dave’s Advice:

• “This is about more than numbers—it’s about hope. What do you want to be when you grow up? At 55, you get a second chance. Encore career.” ([69:17], Dave)
• Adult children should encourage dreaming and upskilling, not just saving every penny or cashing out tiny retirements to pay debt.
• Do not cash out her 401k if at all possible—focus on boosting income and finding renewed purpose.
• For Jake and his mother: Time to separate finances, sell the house, and each chart a new path.

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7. Family Business Succession

Buying Out the Parents

• [86:16 – 94:17]
• Caller wants advice on how to buy parents out of a family business (focus on both business and real estate assets).
• Dave breaks down: Business and land must be valued and purchased separately; get parents’ retirement by giving them the profits over several years, then work out an estate plan for the land.

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8. Budgeting, Income, and Work Choices

Young Family Facing Instability

• [117:04 – 125:51]
• Brianna, mom of three children under two, struggles with negative cash flow on husband’s seasonal bricklayer income.
• Dave and Rachel:
  • Core issue is lack of steady, year-round income plan—“You’ll have to make overall decisions about his career that allow you to feed your children without the government doing it.” ([119:57], Dave)
  • Urge sale of the $17k truck: “You do not get to own a $17,000 truck when you’re taking welfare to pay for your kids’ food.” ([122:10], Dave)
  • Emphasis: Revisit the whole approach—career choices, expenses, and family planning all need a cohesive plan.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• The “Missing Money” Problem:
  “Where’s the other $13,000 going? …So far, the only place I found it going is a 401K.” – Dave, [04:37]

• Tough Love:
  “You are way too broke to be supporting other people. That’s why you’re stuck.” – Dave, [13:32]

• On Buying a House Together Unmarried:
  “It is absolutely, relationally, legally, financially stupid to buy a house with someone you’re not married to.” – Dave, [23:19]

• On Financial Enabling in Families:
  “You can do the wrong thing out of a good heart.” – Dave, [14:15]

• On Relationship Ultimatums:
  “If you had a daughter and her 18-year-old boyfriend said, you have to do these three things to get married to me, you would tell your daughter, run.” – Dave, [50:29]

• On Hope and Reinvention at Any Age:
  “At 55, you get a second chance... your encore career, everything started at your mom’s age.” – Dave, [69:17] (referencing Mary Kay of Mary Kay Cosmetics)

• On Parenting and Marriage:
  “You want a partner…that you can authentically be yourself with at home.” – Rachel, [51:05]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Household Debt, Budget Crisis, and Spousal Accountability: [01:08 – 09:19]
• Supporting Parents to Own Detriment, Car Loans and Family Boundaries: [10:33 – 18:53]
• Buying a House Before Marriage & The Marriage Advantage Discussion: [21:45 – 31:09]
• Side Hustles, Student Loan Chaos and Extreme Budgeting: [34:30 – 41:18]
• Relationship Red Flags and Emotional Labor in Love: [44:14 – 52:06]
• Parents’ Encore Careers, Adult Kids Coaching Mom & Joint Housing Messes: [66:01 – 75:14], [96:07 – 101:49]
• Family Business Succession & Buyouts: [86:11 – 94:17]
• Hard Truths on Budget, Career, and Vehicle Sales: [117:04 – 125:51]

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Final Thoughts

The episode is a sweeping look at the messy intertwining of money, relationships, and life choices. The Ramsey approach combines tactical budgeting and debt advice with unflinching, sometimes uncomfortable, emotional reality checks. At every turn, the lesson is the same: face the facts, make the hard decisions, and work together—whether as spouses, parent and child, or business partners—to build a new, sustainable path forward.

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For more Ramsey resources or to ask your own question, visit ramseysolutions.com.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

This is an ad for BetterHelp. The time to fix your budget is before you're in debt and the time to deal with stress is before it becomes a crisis. Talking to someone can help you find a path forward. Go to betterhelp.com Ramsey to get 10% off. Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broken. Common sen so we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey network and the Fair Winds credit union studio, this is the Ramsey Show. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality number one best selling author, co host of the Smart Money Happy hour. My daughter is my co host today. The phone number here is 888-825-5225. The call is free and some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. Liz is with us in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hey Liz, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Caller]

I'm calling because about three years ago I had discovered that my husband had amassed a pretty substantial amount of debt. Just kind of a combination of bad decisions, bad luck, overspending. And I had kind of stupidly let him, you know, he was bringing in most of the money. I had let him take control. So about three years ago I started managing our finances and I've been able to kind of rein it in some and make some progress. But my job that the past two years have been pretty steady has slowed back down. And so every for the last three months, we're about $2,700 short a month. I know. And I just, I don't really know what to do because I've put our household expenses to nothing. I've gotten rid of. The only two things I could still get rid of are our home security system, which is $25 a month, and then house cleaning for my mental health. But other than that, I've, I've gotten rid of extras.

[Dave Ramsey]

So how much debt is there?

[Caller]

Probably right now about 200,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

All consumer debt, Liz, it's, he took out a huck. There's some credit card debt to car payments.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, what do you owe your cars

[Caller]

between the two of them? 48,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Break them down to him for me.

[Caller]

His truck is about 18 and mine is like 33 or so.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what do you make a year? And what does he make a year?

[Caller]

He makes with his bonus, about 160,000 a year. My job varies. I work on it as needed basis for a law firm. So the past two to three years I'm, I made about 90,000. But I'm probably tracking this year what it had been like the previous five years, which is 45 because I.

[Dave Ramsey]

What you gave me does not equal $250,000 worth of expenses. Where is this money going? What's your house payment?

[Caller]

Our house payment is 1,900 and then we have a HELOC, which is 470amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, well, that's only $2,500. That's only $30,000 a year. And you have a $250,000 household income.

[Caller]

Well, I guess I'm factoring in like all the, like the debt, all the monthly payments we're making.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I am too. I don't get to $2,700 upside down. Your household income is $20,000 a month?

[Caller]

No, it's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, no, it is. I mean it's not your take home pay, but your household income is $20,000 a month. 160 plus 90 is 250. That's $20,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

What hits your account every month? Liz, what do you actually have to work with after taxes?

[Caller]

Right now what we're working with is about 7700amonth because I haven't been working.

[Dave Ramsey]

Where's the other $13,000 a month going? That's. Are you still putting money? Are you still putting money? I know she's not. So she's not, she's not at 90 anymore. She's at 60.

[Rachel Cruze]

She's at 45. And your husband's 160.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but the.

[Rachel Cruze]

So but even at $160,000 income.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Are you putting money in a 401k still?

[Caller]

He does. I don't.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you manage the money now, so. Yeah, we are putting money in his 401k.

[Caller]

Okay. We. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And what else is coming out of your checks other than taxes?

[Caller]

Insurance? He has this debt where he, this company called beyond finance. So that's 750amonth that he's paying towards something that he had the, some debt consolidation company.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that comes out of his check.

[Caller]

That comes directly out of his. Well, it comes, it just auto drafts out of our.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now that's checking account. That's after 7700 went in. And I'm still trying to find like $10,000 a month that's missing. And so far the only place I found it going is a 401K.

[Caller]

Well, I mean his, his take home pay is he gets after taxes like 3400 every two weeks and then he gets a big bonus in January which we use this year to pay off A credit card, right?

[Dave Ramsey]

That's 7,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

And then you bring in 700amonth is what you're saying, because you said 7,700 hits your account every month.

[Caller]

I mean, that's when it's been the last, like, three to four months. Because I haven't really been working. Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so can you pick up the same type of position somewhere else since this. They've slowed you down.

[Caller]

I can't because I work for a law firm and I'm covered by their liability insurance. So I. I can't do the same

kind of work for anyone else because of.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, is there another law firm that'll hire you and quit those guys?

[Caller]

I mean, I've been looking. I haven't found anything yet.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, because you're, you know, we're not going to stay at 45, and we have a market income, our market value of 100. Okay, so a couple of things backing up then. So number one, the two of you need to sit down together and work on the budget. You can do the details, but he needs to feel the weight of the responsibility of this with you and be carrying it emotionally. You're carrying it by yourself, and it's crushing you. I can hear it in your voice. Okay? And you're still harboring a large amount of resentment, which is fair. You're still pissed off about him running $200,000 in the hole without bothering to tell anybody. Okay, that's thing one, though. The you're not. Your only shot at your marriage getting through this is the two of you hooking arms, putting your. Both of you putting your shoulders in the same end of the harness together and pulling this wagon together. Okay? Now you can do the details. You're the detail person, and you definitely have to know what's going on because we can't count on him. Okay? So that's thing one, Thing two. Then once you're doing that, then I want you to go find where all this money's going, because stop his 401k immediately. You don't go $2700 in the hole while funding a 401k. That's not logical. That's borrowing money to put it in a 401k. No, I'm not doing that. So stop his 401k in the morning or tonight or whatever. Stop yours. No saving money, no investing money.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I'd be selling the cars at this point.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's the next one. Sell the cars. These cars have got to go. They're crazy in this situation. But you've got to go find where all this money's going because when you add this up and look at the gross, gross amount that you guys have been making and you're only getting $7,000 home, something's wrong. If you got a huge tax refund, something's wrong.

[Rachel Cruze]

There's a, well, and I think a

[Dave Ramsey]

big gaping holes in this of his

[Rachel Cruze]

160 is the bonus which they use to pay off the credit card. So that's not, that's not in the paychecks either month either.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you got to figure out where all this is going because it's not, it doesn't add up to 250,000. And that's what we got to get to foreign.

[Rachel Cruze]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Jay's in Oklahoma City. Hi Jay, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing well. I'm doing well.

[Rachel Cruze]

How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

All better than we deserve, Sir. How can we help?

[Caller]

Yes, I'm just calling. I am 27 years old. I still currently live with my parents. I am 35 to $45,000 in debt. That's with credit cards, two vehicle loans and personal loans. And I make roughly 32 to 3,500amonth. I work two jobs and I'm going to school and I'm just, you know, very overwhelmed and I just feel like I'm finding financially behind in life.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. So did you say you had two car debts?

[Caller]

Yes. They. It's a 2021 Hyundai Elantra and a 2018 Denali. The Elantra, I have about 11,000 left on it. The Denali, I have 21,000 left on it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you married?

[Caller]

I am not.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why do you have two cars?

[Caller]

The 2021 Hyundai Elantra is mine. The 2018 Denali is my father's. He is disabled, so he is on a fixed income. And he had no vehicle? He had one, but that broke down on him and we both needed reliable cars. So that I believe, looking back on it, was too much of a burden to take on.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You need to sell it. You can't afford the Denali. It's one of your problems. What's the nature of your father's disability, hun?

[Caller]

He has nerve damage and he has severe arthritis in his hands. So some days.

[Dave Ramsey]

You said you're living with your parents. Your mom is involved too?

[Caller]

Yes, she is the only one working.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does she mean?

[Caller]

She makes about. She makes 20 an hour.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And your dad has disability income coming in, I assume?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Was the. Was. Is this just SSI or was he military or.

[Caller]

It's ssi, but I guess something came up. They said that my mom makes too much money, so they're threatening to cut it off.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, there's not. There's not a thing where the spouse makes too much money. If someone's permanently disabled, your mom can make $800,000 a year and your dad still gets his disability SSI. So that somebody's confused somewhere on the messaging. Okay, so here's the deal. Your dad's income from disability and your mom's $20 an hour adds up together to determine what kind of car they pay cash for. And they manage their lives. They're like grownups and stuff. And the Denali's gone. You are way too broke to be supporting other people. That's why you're stuck.

[Rachel Cruze]

How does that hit you? Jay.

[Caller]

Hits me. But I. I've seen it and I've looked at the numbers. I've known it for a while, and it's like, you know, a realization.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm just the mean guy that said it all out loud.

[Caller]

Well, I. It. It just, you know, hurts because I want to help.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like, I want you to be able to help, but you're not helping. You're hurting because you've, quote. You guys have woven together a situation that is not good for any of you. And that can happen. You can do the wrong thing. Out of a good heart. Right. And you got a great heart. You're trying to help your dad, and I appreciate you doing that. That's good. That's a good man. Okay. Trying to help your mom. And you're living there, so you feel like you owe him, because you do. That's okay. I get all of that. That's fine.

[Rachel Cruze]

But basically, all the debt you're feeling are these two cars.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

I mean, that's basically all of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you didn't have the Denali payment, your life all of a sudden starts working again. Yeah. And then we begin to work extra like a crazy man and clear up the credit card debt, clear up your little $11,000 car debt, and you'd be debt free in, gosh, about a year. Because you don't have any overhead. You're not paying rent, right?

[Caller]

No, no, I'm not.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I mean, and you're buying some food maybe and stuff for the house and maybe paying a light bill or something, but you don't have much overhead. So, you know, basically we're Talk, you know, $2,500 a month, which is $30,000 a year that you could be throwing in debt, and that means you're debt free in a year. Of course, we're getting rid of the Denali, too, but that's part of the equation. But, yeah, once that's gone and you do these things, and then mom and dad scratch together a little bit of money, and they go buy a five, $6,000 car, and that's fine. There's nothing wrong with five or $6,000 car. You can get a lot of car for five or six grand. It's not pretty, but it's reliable. And you're not trying to win any sex appeal jobs anyway. They aren't. At their age, they don't need to pick up a date. They're fine. So, I mean, that's it. And then you start working to get out on your own, and you can emotionally support them and coach them and be there for them and drop by dinner occasionally for them and that kind of stuff. And then you start your own life, and that's gonna be the best thing ever happened to them and to you.

[Rachel Cruze]

How will that conversation go with your parents, Jay?

[Caller]

I think it will go very well. I think. Yes, we. We. I have a great relationship with my parents, and my dad is always telling me that he wants me to win. He wants me to do better than he did, so.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, good. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's wonderful. That's a very supportive environment.

[Rachel Cruze]

And how much is that payment a month?

[Dave Ramsey]

Which one?

[Rachel Cruze]

The Denali.

[Caller]

Then the nollie is 508.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Really? Okay. I would have guessed double. Okay. But just the same. So, yeah, I, I, I don't think it's good for them to have that burden. And I know it's not good for you. The car that, that the car was. Oh, you had a valid need, and you purchased about four times as much car as you should have or five times as much car as you should have to cover your dad's need. And then that's when it exposed all this other stuff, because when you put stress on that budget, all the little stupid things are really exposed, then you can kind of get away with those and forget about them until you put stress on it, you know?

[Rachel Cruze]

And I can see how all you know, it's $21,000 Denali, you know, versus a brand new $90,000. Right. So he's probably thinking in his head as he's doing it, oh, this is a good deal. Okay. It's not crazy. Like I can.

[Caller]

And then.

[Rachel Cruze]

But here's the problem. Are these small, these purchases, Small purchases that we make start when we justify them. You put them in the whole picture of your Math. And a $500 car payment making. What was it, 3,500amonth? That's what he said.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Start seeing $40,000 a year for a $20,000 car.

[Caller]

Eating.

[Rachel Cruze]

Eating away. Yep. With another $11,000 car and another $11,000

[Dave Ramsey]

car and credit card debt. Yeah. So that's, that's what you got to do. So hang on, Jay. I'm going to send you a copy of the book, the Total Money Makeover that how to do the baby steps that we talk about here. And we're also gonna sign you up for every dollar for our budgeting app. And it'll hold your hand as you walk through this process. But beans and rice. Rice and beans. And what'll happen is you'll get a new level of energy when you have a clear path and you can map out, I'm gonna knock that debt off, and then I'm gonna knock that debt off, and then I'm gonna knock that debt off, and then by this date, I'm gonna be completely free, and then I'm gonna save my good three to six months down payment. And by somewhere in that, that timeline is when you decide you're going to move out on your own. And all of these things come together. You get out on your own, and you're debt free. And you got $10,000 in the bank. You're a different guy. It puts you in a whole different world.

[Rachel Cruze]

And what's wild is all that can happen in 18 months less. Well, being debt free and saving up $10,000. Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, yeah, you're right. You're right. Good point. Yeah. And only 18 months. And think about where you were 18 months ago, about right here. So nothing changed. Nothing changes until something changes. So hang on. We're going to send you a copy of the total money makeover and get you moving here, my man. Get you moving. So, Rachel, I would say that in 30 years of doing this, that a high percentage, and I'll call it maybe even 90% of the people that are struggling with money issues have. They're either struggling with their spouse or they're struggling with some other family members with money. There's a relational component.

[Rachel Cruze]

9 out of 10.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's a relational component, a negative relational component to about nine out of 10 people that are having money problems. Foreign.

[Rachel Cruze]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Kevin is in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi Kevin. How are you doing?

[Caller]

Well, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So my question is, I'm currently living with my girlfriend and we want to start to look to buy our first house we're currently renting. I make good money. She has a lot of money that she made throughout college and her dad is also going to gift us $35,000 for a down payment. We just kind of feel like right now we're wasting money renting. And I know you're totally against doing this before marriage but it just kind of feels like the smartest option right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long you been living together?

[Caller]

We've been living together for one year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why don't you get married?

[Caller]

So if it was up to me, I would have got married last year. She is going to be competing in the 2020 Olympics. So we want to make sure that she's ready to go for that. And she is.

[Dave Ramsey]

Marriage negatively affect competing in the Olympics?

[Caller]

Just the whole wedding and planning for all that, she just wants to stay focused on.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the wedding affects it, but not marriage. Yeah, you're willing to buy a house, which is a big deal, but we're

[Rachel Cruze]

not willing to do a wedding while competing in training.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's too stressful to do a wedding. But it's not too stressful to buy a house. It's inconsistent.

[Caller]

The wedding's going to be a fun, big party that we could all enjoy it together.

[Dave Ramsey]

You ever bought a house?

[Caller]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

It ain't. It ain't an easy process. They're. They're gonna do a. Yeah. Okay. So, Kevin, you guys are gonna do what you're gonna do. And I'm not sure why you called us because you knew what exactly what we were going to tell you. And it is absolutely, relationally, legally, financially stupid to buy a house with someone you're not married to. Her father willing to give her shacked up boyfriend $35,000 and have no protection on where that money's gonna go is idiotic. That's just dumb. Okay? No way he should do that. Because here's what could happen, okay? Both your names are on the deeds. And you decide. I'm leaving because I don't like Olympians and I'm gonna go do something else with my life. Now she's got the whole thing, but he can't get his money or her money out of this thing. Cause they can't even find you. These are the calls we get on the show. But that's never going to happen in your case. Yes, it is. Crazy people do crazy stuff all the time. It's why we have a show. And it's compelling radio. You know, it's compelling calls. So please don't do this. So what would I tell you to do if I were your friend, and I am your friend, even though I'm fussing at you because I don't want you to do this for your own sake. I don't want you to be one of those callers that has a horrible situation and you have to call me back and try to unweave Barrel of fish hooks you got yourself into. And so what I would do is I would call the preacher and I'd go get married Saturday and I'd have a party after the Olympics. And then you're legally and relationally and financially on the same page, committed to then. If you want to talk about buying a house and then if her dad wants to give you all a wedding gift of $35,000 to help you on a down payment, I'm in. Let's talk about whether you're out of debt. Let's talk about whether you have your emergency fund in place. But conceptually, then I would go ahead. But if you're unwilling to commit to marriage, you should not be buying a home together. These are permanent decisions that are not easily undone. So. Yeah. Period. Period. And it's not. The data tells us that your likelihood of having one fourth of the net worth that you have, that your friends that are married have when you're 35, 35 year old men that are married have four times the net worth of 35 year old men that are shacked up. That's the data and that's where this is going. Because if there's always an excuse, there's always an excuse. But we're gonna go ahead and buy a house now. I think you're probably gonna buy the house. I don't think you're listening to the dadgum thing I said. But I wish you would reconsider and I wish you'd play this back for her dad where I called him an idiot. Because this is just dumb. He's trying to do a nice thing for his daughter and he thinks you're a good guy and he's trying to be a good dude. And he hasn't thought through the unintended consequences of this, which is this crap only works when everything goes right. If anything goes wrong, she's screwed in this scenario and she don't want to be in that. And you don't want to love. You want to love her better than that. So we're going to see the preacher Saturday. Saturday.

[Rachel Cruze]

Saturday.

[Dave Ramsey]

This Saturday. That's a Southern Saturday.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's your Uncle Dave coming up.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's your Uncle Dave loving you. Because I don't want to talk to you when you're 30 and you've had all this struggle in your life because you've got things out of order.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it screws up everything. And the number of people we call that we get in here in your situation. And you knew this before you called me. So you Walked into the bear's den and said, hey, bear, will you eat? Yes, we will. So we love you so much. We're always going to tell you the truth and forcefully to try to get you to do it. So I want you to win, honey. And man, obviously, the girl's a great girl. I mean, Olympic champion. Wow. And you get to compete in the Olympics. You got some serious stuff going on. That's neat. So this is a great find. You probably ought to, like, make sure this gets wrapped up before she slips away.

[Rachel Cruze]

I was gonna say. Or she goes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Olympic season.

[Rachel Cruze]

Olympic, man. Not that you aren't, Kevin.

[Dave Ramsey]

But she said she's the one wanting to put it off, but she's tying it to the wedding and the stress of doing the wedding.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

But buying a home is stressful. Selecting a home is stressful.

[Rachel Cruze]

The quality of your life, the quality of your relationships, when you have commitment together, when you know it's going to happen anyways and you start creating a life together, there starts to be balance, give and take. You know, all of it. It just. There is like. There's so much data coming out that it is. There is an advantage to it, to being married. And you add the finances on top and doing something like purchasing a home together.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, by the time you get to 50 years old, folks, the numbers are staggering. You ladies, you have 14 times less net worth when you're 50 years old if you shacked up than a married friend of yours. 14 times less money. That's the reality. Men is five times less money at 50 years old. Married men, long term, live seven or eight years longer than unmarried men. Now, John Deloney and I were discussing that piece of research. He's convinced it's because our wives keep us from doing stupid things that kill us.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you gonna eat that?

[Rachel Cruze]

We are the logical people.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you gonna eat that? Are you gonna wear that? David, David, David.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Passive aggressive questions coming from a Southern belle. There you go. Yeah. Yeah, I'm convinced. This is real. Well, and ladies live longer, too. You have a 20% higher possibility of surviving a cancer diagnosis if you're married.

[Rachel Cruze]

And the stats on what is it? Is it fulfillment or happiness within the marriage? Yes, happiness before living together, before marriage even.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yep.

[Rachel Cruze]

So the whole generation shift has been we live together first. And actually the data is coming out against that on a happiness route versus, like, playing house together. Like, we are married and we're not. Because from the psychological perspective of the deep commitment that you have for protection,

[Dave Ramsey]

and that's Arthur Relationship Legally and all of that. The happiness profession.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, I love that. I mean, yes, it is all wrapped in together. And again, it's not what the culture's doing. I know it's not the norm, but that's what's coming out.

[Dave Ramsey]

So here's a good idea too. More people live together now than are that aren't married than live together that aren't married. In America for the first time ever. That happened about 10 years ago. The shift is so more people are shacking up. So I'm pissing a whole bunch of you off right now, but more people are shacking up than are married today. But here's the thing you gotta keep in mind, okay? Divorce rate's at an all time high. And if that's the case, then the splits that aren't divorced are at an all time high. Then we know those things are there. So what you got to figure out is what do most people do in a world where very few people are successful at any area of their lives and figure out what normal is and run from normal. Normal sucks. You don't want to be normal.

[Caller]

Sam,

[Dave Ramsey]

Let me tell you something. I see all the time people are working hard trying to get control of their money and then their phone bill shows up higher than expected again and they don't even know why. That's why I want you to switch to Boost Mobile. Here's the truth. Your phone bill should fit your budget, not the other way around. Your wireless company is counting on you just paying it without asking questions. With Boost Mobile you can unlock big savings compared to to the so called big guys. Bring your phone, keep your number and pay just 25 bucks a month forever on their unlimited plan. No contracts, no confusing fees. And that $25 price is locked in forever. And if you're skeptical, that's fine. Boost Mobile backs it up with a 30 day money back guarantee. Meaning you can try it without feeling trapped. So stop overpaying for something you use every day. Go to boostmobile.com Ramsey to make the switch today. That's boostmobile.com Ramsey25 DOL forever requires customers to remain active on Boost Mobile Unlimited plan. Guys, I wish we could get to every single call. Not every single call wishes it. But we wish we could get to every single single call. And we can't because the lines are full right now and they pretty much stay that way. You can get in if you try, but if you can't. Let me give you another idea. Go over to our website and use Ask Ramsey. Ask Ramsey is our Free AI tool that's built and trained. Only the only data in it is proven Ramsey principles. So three, four years worth of phone calls from this show dumped into it. The books we've written, dumped into it. The articles are all over the Ramsey Solutions website. Dumped into it. So if you want a Ramsey answer to your question, that's the only thing that's in this. There's no other answers in it, which means the answers are all right.

[Rachel Cruze]

And what's fun is you can build out a profile so it will remember you as you come back in your situation and everything. Like, it's amazing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I'm real proud of our tech team building this out. This is a good use of the AI technology. So you get an answer the same way you'd get right on the show. You can ask your question. It will remember you and update you as you go down your journey, and it'll walk with you. It's pretty cool. It's called Ask Ramsey. It's completely free. Ask your [e-mail] or if you're on a YouTuber you're podcasting, just click the link in the description. It'll take you right there. Jennifer's in Daytona. Hi, Jennifer, how are you?

[Caller]

I would like to say it's better than I deserve.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool. Right on brand. How can we help?

[Caller]

Okay, so long story short, I'm trying to figure out if we should refinance my private student loan. So me and my husband kind of discovered you and your whole program and baby steps and all that about a year and a half ago. And so I'm a full time teacher, so I teach in high school. So it's 40 hours, but 40 hours means 50. And then so I started working in a restaurant and then I started a baking business so I could spend more time with my daughter and making income. And then from that, my baking stuff, I started putting on a wedding show, which is making a lot more money, which is great. But because I made all this income more, my husband works about 50, 60 hours too, so probably more 60 because I made this more income. Now my government student loans are going up about $700 a month. And I'm starting to have some weird health issues. So where, like there's a new medication I want me to try. My insurance that I pay 12amonth for is denying the coverage of that medication, so I might have to start paying it. I just changed my entire diet to see if that helps versus paying for this medication, which is like 500 bucks a month, they said so I've changed my entire diet so that way I could save the money.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so wait a minute. How much student loan debt do you have?

[Caller]

So government student loans. I'm in the. And I know you're going to. You're going to roll your eyes on this one, but I'm in that. Like, what is the balance?

[Dave Ramsey]

What's the balance on your government student loans?

[Caller]

The government student loans is about 80,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And the balance on your private student loans?

[Caller]

About 17,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good news. All right, good. So $100,000 gets you out of student loan debt. How much other debt do you guys have not coming in your house?

[Caller]

We paid everything off. We paid everything off.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you're debt free. And what is your household income with all this activity? You guys are working like horses, man.

[Caller]

Oh, you have no idea. I'm so tired and my kids kind of miss me, but I'm like, it'll be fine. We'll make it work. So it' probably around 130, give or take.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, first rule is we need to find out exactly what our income is, and we need to have a detailed plan of where every dollar of that income is going on the every dollar budgeting app. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that will make you feel like you got a raise because part of this chaos that is your life right now is the finances are very disorganized and they' kind of floating around as separate numbers in your head instead of sitting in a line.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's because we don't add stress.

[Caller]

We don't have a set like paycheck, so. Because, I mean, my husband obviously depends on his hours, too, and the extra shifts I can pick up at a restaurant and things like that.

[Dave Ramsey]

I understand.

[Caller]

So if my salary, you've got all

[Dave Ramsey]

these wonderful things going on that are side hustles, but you still need a detailed game plan of exactly where every dollar comes in as it comes in. Sometimes it's going to be more, sometimes it's going to be less. But we need a detailed game plan, and you and him need to be agreed. I'm telling you, your stress level will go down, your fatigue level will go down, because you don't mind working. If you can see the traction, if you can see the progression. Like, if you look up and you go, we just paid off $20,000 in student loan debt and our private student loans are gone. See, then I'm not as tired.

[Rachel Cruze]

And you've been on this for a year and a half. Jennifer, you said, how much debt have you guys paid off?

[Caller]

So far almost 100,000. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

So like in a year, in another year you'll be debt free.

[Caller]

I'm kind of hoping so.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, no, no, no. That's a math thing. It's not a hope thing. Yeah, if you already paid off 100 in a year, you could pay off 100 in another year.

[Rachel Cruze]

18, a year and a half.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

They make 130, they have a hundred thousand dollars. So yeah, so it'll be a year and a half. But Jennifer, to the point that you can still budget with an inconsistent income, you guys just every month kind of guess and just say, okay, here's what we think we're going to make and when the 15th hits and it's a little bit less, you just lower that income. Which means you already have planned out which categories you're going to lower or what's going to be cut out of the budget for the remaining part of the month. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, we're not putting as much on the student loan is all it is.

[Rachel Cruze]

Fair, fair, fair.

[Dave Ramsey]

All you're going to be doing is putting everything on the student loan and how much you make up or down is going to be more on the student loan or less on the student loan that month. That's all it is. That's the only variable in this.

[Rachel Cruze]

But it helps you stay within the margin of your food budget, your out to eat. I mean all the extra stuff that just ends up kind of slipping away that can add up to a couple hundred bucks a month which makes a dent in this debt over, you know what I mean, over a period of time. But it is that kind of strict budget. But you guys have been doing it, I mean so you're paying, they've done a great job.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you only have the student loans debt debts left and we're on an 18 month schedule to pay them off, you're paying way more than minimums anyway. So whoopty doopty.

[Caller]

It went up.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, is it on? You said something Jennifer, as you were saying, the 80,000 and you're like, you're gonna hate this but you're on the,

[Dave Ramsey]

she's on the income.

[Caller]

Yeah. And they said like after 10 years I'm on like year seven of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

But 10 years ago I wouldn't do that. I would just get it paid off. Let's just get it paid off. Yeah, because you can't count on them. They lie. It's, it's the federal government and like 1.7% of the people that do the 10 year one payment repayment plan so far have actually gotten forgiveness. It's. Nobody gets it because it's so screwed up and bureaucratic and messed up that I'm gonna be the one. Yeah, no you're not. Don't do it. Just get it paid off. You're working like crazy, people. Cause think about where you'll be two years from today when you don't have a payment in the world except your house.

[Caller]

Wow, that would be so nice.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm telling you, all this other medical stuff you're facing will be affected by your stress level and your anxiety level. And when there's all this chaos and lack of organization and when the weight of the hundred thousand dollars is not there anymore, all of that's going to affect. It does affect health. It does with everyone, by the way, so.

[Rachel Cruze]

And well done you guys though.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, yeah, you're doing great.

[Rachel Cruze]

You're killing it.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're doing real.

[Rachel Cruze]

And in our millionaire study, teachers are on the list of the, the five careers.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Of baby steps millionaires, Jennifer. So you guys are. You're in great professions. You have got a great head on your shoulder. Just, just dial in the budget and I promise you'll be finding some more cash when you do that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Wow, that's powerful. And she's not lacking in energy. No, she can work.

[Rachel Cruze]

She's got a lot of energy. Jennifer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Highly caffeinated.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, keep at it, Jennifer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Me too.

[Rachel Cruze]

Spirit.

[Dave Ramsey]

I like, I like it. I like her. She's neat. So way to go, kiddo. Push on through and get this stuff out of your life. But the best way to do it, the most efficient use of money is a detailed plan. And one of the things, folks, if you think about it this way, if you worked for a company called you Incorporated and your job at U Incorporated was to manage money for you Incorporated and you manage money for you Incorporated the way you manage money for you now, would you fire you? And if the answer is yes, then probably you ought to change something. And don't be sitting around shocked that you're broke if you're doing a bad job handling the money. And so, you know, like I've got 14 profit centers here at Ramsey. I just met with one of them a while ago for an hour and a half going over their detailed budget. And the vice president of that area is showing me with SmartVestor. We were looking at SmartVestor stuff and he's showing me exactly what we've got coming in, exactly what we got going out. We're going over the details and you know, we have, believe me, he has a stinking budget it. And believe me it's organized. And believe me, he executes cuz it's his freaking job. Hello. And get to keep that job is how he does it. Hello. So he's really good at it. If you're waiting for the perfect interest rate before you buy a home or refinance, that moment may never come. That's why people should talk to Churchill Mortgage. Because rates move every day. And when rates drop, buyers flood the market, which means more competition and higher home prices. Smart buyers know they can't time the market. They move with a strategy. Buy the home you can afford now and refinance later if rates improve. Churchill helps you understand what you can actually afford, not just what you qualify for. And with their certified Home buyer program, you can get fully underwritten before you shop so you can make moves faster and make stronger offers. And right now, Churchill has a special offer only for the Ramsey audience. Go to ChurchillMortgage.com RamsayOffer to learn more. That's a special website. Remember this? Churchillmortgage.com RamseyOffer this is a paid advertisement. The Churchill Certified Home Buyer program is available for qualifying borrowers and select loan types only in mlsid159nmlsconsumerexcess.org/al housing lender, 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100, Brentwood, TN 37027. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality. My daughter is my co host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Emily is in Raleigh, North Carolina. Hi Emily, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey, Dave. Hey, Rachel. I'm doing good. How are you guys?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

My question for you is I've been with my boyfriend for four years now and we're at a fork in the road where we had a conversation yesterday and he gave me a list of things I need to work on to earn an engagement. Should I leave?

[Rachel Cruze]

What?

[Caller]

I know the answer.

[Rachel Cruze]

Wait, what?

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are you? You?

[Caller]

I'm 31. He's 38. We've both been married.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Can I ask not to be like overly vulnerable Emily? Be like, what's on the list?

[Caller]

Two things I struggle with change and adversity.

[Dave Ramsey]

You struggle with change and you struggle

[Caller]

with adversity, with dealing with adversity.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you have to fix both of those to earn his hand.

[Caller]

It's not something he wants to come home to every day for the rest of his life.

[Rachel Cruze]

What?

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow, that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Do you feel like you have that attitude while you are dating? Like, has there been conversations? And he's like, you see the glass half empty. I need someone with the glass half full. Like, what have the conversations been before this list was created?

[Caller]

It was a call. I asked a question back. Has it, oh, have you always felt this way? He said, no, it's just been this last year. And I asked him, well, we've gone through a lot of challenges and adversity this last year. It's probably been the most challenging year we've had.

[Dave Ramsey]

What kind of adversity did you face that you weren't good at?

[Caller]

According to him, I have changed my career and moved to. I've moved out of state three times in the last year to stay in this relationship and I'm being asked to do it again and I don't want to do it without a commitment.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the adversity is, you've had all of these moves and you're sick of it. And that means you're. According to him, you're not good at adversity.

[Caller]

Yeah. And my response is, if things can stabilize for more than one year, then I will be able to be content again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why does he. Why does he move every year?

[Caller]

And we're ambitious people, promotions. We decided to open a franchise, which is why we moved, and it didn't work out. So there's been some financial hardship along the way that has caused more stress. So that's essentially what's been the most recent adversity we've gone through. And we're about to go through it again. So I'm a little nervous. I feel like I have to watch myself if I decide to move forward again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sharon and I moved out of a home that we had had for 15 years, that we built. Custom made, beautiful home. And in 21, when people were paying more for properties than they should have, someone paid us more for that than they should have. And so we sold and we were homeless and we went and bought a house and we moved. Those were decisions we made together. And there was always stress associated with a move, but I don't think either one of us would call that adversity. That was we decided to change our location together. And together we changed our location. And whatever drama there was was outside of our house. That was she and I facing that drama. Not like, I'm weak and I can't handle the change and you're strong and you can. We didn't have that discussion because we both decided and did it together. So I'm a little bit confused coming from that point of view as to how moving is actually adversity.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, she's. She said she followed him around. She had to move three different times to stay in the relationship. So he's asking her to move with him, and she's like, I don't want to move again.

[Dave Ramsey]

I got that part. But I don't even think this. I think adversity is the wrong word.

[Rachel Cruze]

I think that, okay, it could be the wrong word, but I think it's stressful. I think her following him and then having to, quote, unquote, put on a brave face, and you can't even authentically be yourself when you are stressed.

[Dave Ramsey]

Adversity is you have a.

[Rachel Cruze]

Of having to move.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have a cancer diagnosis. Adversity is someone in your family has sickness or an illness. Adversity is you got fired from a job that was not your decision.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, their franchise failed.

[Dave Ramsey]

A failed business is an adversity. But moving cities to take a better job and choosing to do that with your boyfriend is not adversity. It is change. It's dramatic change.

[Rachel Cruze]

And you could hate that, though.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm good with hating it. I'm just curious. It's just curious word choice for me.

[Caller]

That.

[Rachel Cruze]

On his part.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Or on yours to adopt it. Either one. But the. Interesting. Interesting. So I think this doesn't come down to your deficit. And he's got it all together. I think it comes down to you're sick of following this guy around.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Caller]

I don't get anything out of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

And he knows it. And he knows it. He knows you're sick of it, and he wants you to not be sick of it.

[Caller]

It.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you're sick of it.

[Caller]

Yeah. I feel like it's a too bad, so sad, oh, well kind of response.

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Like.

[Caller]

And I'm just. It's just a fork in the road in my life.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

So I'm just hard to listen to you guys every day, and I.

[Rachel Cruze]

And that's heartbreaking. Emily, I'm sure you've been with them for four years.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

But, I mean, I think that's hard. The truth is just listening to you. I mean, you're not an immature little girl. You're a grown woman that's got strong intellect, and you're articulate. And so I think when he said this, you've already made up your mind. You just wanted to hear us say it, too, that it's weird. So I'll say it. It's weird. That's A weird request. If you had a daughter and her 18 year old boyfriend said, you have to do these three things to get married to me, you would tell your daughter, run.

[Rachel Cruze]

I'd be like, here's my list for you. Chad, you need to change these things.

[Dave Ramsey]

Head out the door, bubba.

[Rachel Cruze]

Chad.

[Dave Ramsey]

Chad. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Let's change our commitment issues, Chad.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, man, I'm sorry I've been following your butt around and all you got for return for that's criticism. So, yeah, I think you already made your decision before you called us, but it's just you hadn't, hadn't said it out loud and now you did.

[Caller]

Yeah, I'm sorry.

[Dave Ramsey]

It hurts.

[Caller]

I appreciate it. You know, it's just talking to like minded people, getting their opinion on it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, well, and here's the truth too, Emily. You want a partner, you want a spouse in your life if you choose to get married to him, that you can come home and be who you need to be at home. Then again, you don't. I mean, and I get that like some, you know, people complain in marriage, like so and so complains all the time, but there's a level of authenticity of like I need to just to like unload right now. Like I'm so stressed and I need you to partner with me in that and hear that in me and empathize and ask questions, be curious, like do this life with me, not that I have to image manage in front of my spouse. Do you know what I mean? Like that's, that's going to be an exhausting life.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I have to do this to earn.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is a conditional love versus unconditional love.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'll show you.

[Rachel Cruze]

And we're getting your side of the story. And I'll say more and more now we get DMs from the person on the other side of this story. You know what I mean? And you, and you hear. So I.

[Dave Ramsey]

Let me tell you, you can DM if you want to dm. But you did leave your girlfriend of four years who followed you in three different cities feeling this way. Even if, even if you didn't say it that way. You left her feeling like you said it that way. So you still screwed up, Emily.

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm sorry.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Sorry. That's awful. People do like change, by the way, when it's changed for the better, they love it. You ever bought a new car? It's exciting and fun. It's change. When you've worked hard to buy a car the right way, you paid cash with no payments, hanging over your head. The last thing you want is to worry about it every time you drive. That's why we trust Christian Brothers Automotive as the official auto repair partner of the Ramsey Show. See, most people don't stress about their car because it's older. They stress about it because they don't know what's happening under the hood or trust the people that are working on it. But Christian Brothers Automotive uses digital vehicle inspections. You can actually see what your technician sees and know what's urgent and what can wait. Plus, Christian Brothers stands behind their work with their nice difference warranty. Three years or 36,000 miles, whichever benefits you more. So if you want real peace of mind with the car you worked hard to own, go to cbac.com Ramsey use the promo code Ramsey and you'll save 10% off your visit up to $250. Cbac.com Ramsey C store for details. If you're working the baby steps, the best and fastest way to do it is by using every dollar. It's more than just a budgeting app. It is the Ramsey plan built right in. You track your progress. You get personalized recommendations and coaching for your situation that will help you free up more money. Work the plan faster. Get out of debt faster. Become wealthy faster. It's like having one of us walk with you every single day, showing you the next right step and holding you accountable. Start the everydollar process for free by downloading the app in the App Store or Google Play. Thomas is in Phoenix. Hi Thomas.

[Caller]

How are you, Dave? I'm doing well.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. How can we help?

[Caller]

So I just finished baby step two and I'm 52 years old and so I'm doing steps three and four right now. And I just wanted some guidance on whether I should do focus more on investing or paying down my mortgage once I get three accomplished.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

And I got numbers.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, cool. We teach to do baby steps one through three, which is $1,000 saved, then out of debt, everything but the house. And then three is a full funded emergency fund with great focused intensity, one of those things at a time until it's accomplished. So you should not be doing anything on four until three is done. And you probably can do that in just a month or two or maybe in 10 minutes, I don't know. But call baby step three completed. Then we change from scorched earth intensity, like running for your life intensity to intentional and we relax just a little bit. Okay. And this is when you could upgrade a car or do some other, you know, go on a trip or something like that. But until then, till you get past baby step three, you don't need to be eating out. You don't need to be buying cars. You don't be doing nothing. Okay? So once you're there, then baby steps four, five, and six, we do simultaneously, which is kind of what you're trying to do right now on 3 and 4. And that's 15% of your household income going into retirement. And if you have kids, college to deal with, that's baby step five. And then any.

[Caller]

Never married, no kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Then any other money beyond 15% of your income being saved would go on the house mortgage. And so we're running baby steps four and six simultaneously. But it's very simple. You put 15% away, and every other dollar you can find that you don't need to use to have a good life, you can throw at the debt. And what typically happens is people are paying off their homes using that system in between 7 and 10 years. So let's. Let's look at you. Let's look at your numbers. What's your household income?

[Caller]

So I'm a fed, and I make 55, 471 a year, and I have a VA compensation, which is 21,701 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you have $76,000 income. Thank you for your service. And. And you owe what, on your home?

[Caller]

191,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you said you're 55 years old?

[Caller]

52.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, 52 years old. That's right. Okay. All right, so cool. So what we would prescribe is you get your emergency fund finished, and then you're putting 15% of your income away. It's about $10,000 a year, about 800 bucks a month. And if you're working for the Fed, you could, you can, you could. You could put it in the Thrift Savings Plan, the tsp. Or. And. Or you could use just a Roth IRA and good mutual funds, and that'll take care of a bunch of it. You put 8,000 in that, and that's what I would.

[Caller]

Yeah, TSP has Roth now, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. But they also don't have as good options as the open market does for mutual funds. The best option in the TSP by far is the C Plant. It's the only thing that even mimics the market. And it's about like, an s and P500. So it's a good investment. It's not a bad investment. And so if you need to do some in the TSP, what I would do is put $8,000 into a Roth getting with a Smartvestor Pro and put $2,000 into the TSP. And then beyond that, if I can find any money in the budget, I'm going to start throwing it at the house.

[Rachel Cruze]

Do you have any money right now, Thomas? Saved in retirement.

[Caller]

I've got.

Oh, for retirement, I got 26 in the tsp. 26,600.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Because I was just.

[Caller]

I was just running out is the caveat is there's a. There's an investment packet that is being handled. And it was my dad's, and he made my stepmom the beneficiary. She doesn't touch it. She doesn't need it. And she's like, this is yours when I die. How much it is?

[Rachel Cruze]

You don't know how much it is.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So I would.

[Caller]

I don't feel comfortable asking.

[Dave Ramsey]

I would plan like that doesn't exist.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. So if you ran. If you did the numbers I just typed in the calculator real quick, Thomas, with your 26,000 that you have and you put 800 bucks away between now and 67, you'll have $565,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you've got your military retirement of 21,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. I came up with the same numbers when I used your calculator, which doesn't include. It doesn't include the Fed contribution.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Rachel Cruze]

So good. And whatever's gonna happen.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, wait a minute. Fed's contributing to your tsp 5%. Is that a match?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, you do the. You put 5% in the match then for sure. And the other 10%, you can put in a Roth IRA. So match in the C plan. TSP, Roth and then Roth and a good growth stock, mutual funds. And with your SmartVestor Pro that you can [e-mail] and yeah, you're gonna have half million to a million dol. You know, by the time you need some money. And you're doing really good.

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm glad, Thomas. Well done.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you got $21,000 a year coming in as long as you're alive, military retirement, which is excellent. So very cool. And the house will get paid for using this system. But no, I would not put more or less in retirement. I would work that exact plan and

[Rachel Cruze]

then bump it up once the house is paid off. Throw in more at investment and you can have more there at retirement. So well done, Thomas. Which is so encouraging to do all of this in your early 50s. Like, he's jumping on the plan now, you know, on baby step three, starting retirement I mean, it can be done. Yeah, it's great.

[Dave Ramsey]

Ever since we started doing this, we've had people in their 50s and 60s and 70s ask, you know, is it too late? Well, not if you're breathing. You still got a shot, you know, so just keep sucking wind and working on it. Right? It's not too late. That's the idea. So you can do a lot of stuff in a few years, but is it easier if you start earlier? Yeah. For you 21 year olds, 100 bucks a month and you're a millionaire in no time, man. I mean, just shut up. Hello. That's way different than saving 800 bucks a month to end up with a half million.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So, yeah, get that compound interest, the eighth wonder of the world according to Einstein, working in your favor. Right. And it's. It is. If you run compound interest numbers, it blow your freaking mind how powerful that is. All right. Ted is with us in Nashville. Hi, Ted. How are you?

[Caller]

Howdy. I'm well. How you guys doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

Wonderful. My wife's 31, I'm 36. We're on 4, 5, and 6. We owe about 328,000 on a house that's worth about 550,000. We have about 300,000 saved currently for retirement.

[Dave Ramsey]

Way to go.

[Caller]

I'm about. I'm about six years away from being eligible from collecting my pension and retiring from the military. I'm in the blended retirement system. And I was doing. I was reading some of the literature recently, and I hadn't realized that I have an option to take a reduced pension at either 25% reduction or 50% reduction in exchange for the lump sum.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do it.

[Caller]

And I got on Ask Ramsey last night. Yeah, and Ask Ramsey. AI was very helpful. I ran a couple of models and it all looks like a good idea. I mostly wanted help deciding if I'm missing something, figuring out what exactly I want to do with the lump sum.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nope. You roll the lump sum into an IRA so there's no taxes on it that way, and you leave it alone. And you let the lump sum grow because the lump sum will grow and feed you more than the pension would have fed you because the mutual funds are growing at a greater rate than the pension is.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's not even close.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And when you die, the pension dies with you and lump sums don't die with you, so you end up with a half million or a million dollars as a result of this. Over in your inheritance versus when you die. Your pension just goes poof.

[Caller]

Yeah. The model that I ran, I'd be giving up $480,000 of future pension payments. And if I invested, that all would grow to about 3.2 over the same time period.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you did it correctly. That's why we tell you to do it. That's exactly it. No, you didn't miss a thing. That. That's how smart it is. It's. It's not just a little bit smart. It's like way smart. Dave, we got a lot of calls on this show where life happens. One day, someone's healthy, they're working, providing for their family, and then a curveball hits. You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah. And that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Zander is essential because it protects your family if the worst happens. Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook, and that's long term disability insurance. Yeah, it's important to understand the difference between them. Life insurance steps in when you die. Disability insurance steps in while you're alive but can't work, so it replaces a large part of your income so the bills still get paid while you get back on your feet. Now, if your employer gives you free disability insurance, great. Take it. If it's discounted there at a better price, take it. But if not, Zander can help you find the right plan. Whether you're single or married. It's not optional. If you're going to be out of work for a while, then you need to make sure the money's still showing up. And that's why Zander is our go to. They make it super simple to get the right coverage at the best price. No pressure, no upselling. I've trusted Jeff, Zander and Zander insurance for over 25 years, and so is my family. Don't wait. It's fast, it's easy, and it could make all the difference. Go to zander.com or call 800-356-4282 to protect yourself, protect your income, protect your family. Ethan is in Atlanta. Hi, Ethan. How are you?

[Caller]

Good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Caller]

Hey. So I'm going over my mom's finances with her. She's 55 years old, has only $19,000 in retirement and a ton of consumer credit Debt and a HELOC loan. And I built her a spreadsheet just to get everything out in front of her so that she could see what her finances look like. And I was trying to teach her the debt snowball method. She's got about $200 that she could start throwing at consumer credit debt. But I was wondering if there's a quicker way that we could get her. I say we. My little brother and I, we're trying to get her position better financially before she kind of hits that retirement age.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's very neat. And she's accepting your coaching. That's interesting. Yeah.

[Caller]

Hesitantly, but yeah,

[Dave Ramsey]

I heard. How old are you?

[Caller]

My little brother's. I'm 27. My little brother's 24. And we're just trying to.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you do for a living, Mom.

[Caller]

And take care of her? I'm a mechanical engineer. I work on elevators.

[Dave Ramsey]

Ah, okay. All right. So you're a detail guy.

[Caller]

Yes, I love spreadsheets.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You love spreadsheets. Yeah, I can tell. And you're a good son. You're really helping her. That's awesome. And I appreciate that you're guiding her on that. What is her income?

[Caller]

So she makes $20 an hour. So after taxes, her take home is roughly. She nets $2,500, but her monthly gross is 3,400, so about $41,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does she do for a living?

[Caller]

She's a custodian at.

[Dave Ramsey]

And where's your dad?

[Caller]

Alden County. My dad's kind of out of the picture. He's off doing his own thing. Just their divorce really contributing be. They are separated. Yes, they're divorced.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are they separated or are they divorced?

[Caller]

They're divorced.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. Because that'll matter in her future. How long have they been split up?

[Caller]

I think they're coming up on, like, 11 years being divorced.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good.

[Rachel Cruze]

All right, so how much. How much credit card debt is there?

[Caller]

So minus the HELOC loan, about $16,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. And is she using credit cards to get BI monthly? That 3400 isn't covering her expenses. Or is it just kind of flippant spending that's caused it?

[Caller]

So her. It's kind of a messy situation. She right now is living off of just her paycheck. I made sure that she, like, when I talk to her, she's just using her debit card to pay off all of her debts. So she's not using her credit cards at all.

[Dave Ramsey]

I was in Palm Beach a while back where Mar A Lago is, among others. And about three doors down from Mar Lago is a property that is probably a couple hundred million dollars in value. And the lady that lives there was Mary Kay of Mary Kay Cosmetics. She built that house. You've heard of her, I'm sure.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. She got divorced at 55 years old and started from nothing and decided, I don't want to be broke anymore. So she started her whole life, her encore, her whole career, everything started at your mom's age. And so that is really encouraging. I want that for your mom. I don't know if I want her to be in a $200 million house next to Mar A Lago, but anyway, I want a second chapter beyond the 11 Year Ago Divorce, beyond being a custodian because she didn't sign up for the trip she's on and I want her to sign up for a new trip. So I'm going to ask her, as her 65 year old older brother, what she's going to do in her encore career. What's the next chapter of your life look like, honey? What do you want to be when you grow up? Because now at 55, you get a second chance. You've got 40 years, 30 years of income potential and I don't want you. There's nothing shameful about being a custodian making $20. But part of her problem is she's a custodian making $20 and the life that she settled in on, she'll still be doing that 25 years from now if she doesn' and have some kind of a wake up call. You follow me?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that's a bigger concern than a little bit of credit card debt.

[Caller]

I agree.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I want to. I'm gonna put a bunch of inspirational literature around her, make sure she has friends that are inspiring her. Charlie Tremendous Jones said, five years from today, you'll be the same person you are today, except for the books you read and the people you meet. So I want her to meet some new people because you become who you hang around with. I want her to read some new books. I want her to get her nose back in her Bible and her tail end back in church. And I want her to get fired up and wired up about who she's going to be in this next chapter. And I want her making $45 an hour, 48 months from today. This is the kind of way I want to think about this for her. I want her to have a better life than she's got lined out right now. Then. Then obviously the byproduct of that is, it solves your problem that you're facing. Because part of what you're facing is you're taking very little income and trying to squeeze a lot out of it. That's what your spreadsheet told you, right?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So part of what you got is a huge income problem. But the reason you have an income problem is you've got a perception problem. And the dreams die on the first go round. And we need a new set of dreams. So that's. Yeah, yeah. I want Mary Kay story for her.

[Caller]

I want that too. I was wondering what your thoughts on this were. If she only has about $19,000 in retirement due to the way the company that she's worked for structured it. It's really messed up. What if she were to take that $19,000 out of the 401k and obviously has to pay taxes on it and just knocked out all of her consumer debt and then she's left with only the $34,000 on the heel, having to pay off that HELOC and then that would make her cash flow about 1300amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. If we don't do the other thing I was talking about, it won't matter.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because she's going to struggle to make ends meet at 20 bucks an hour. That's below the poverty level. She's gonna struggle. Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it's gonna get harder and harder and harder as she ages because it's, you know, it's hard to be a custodian when you're 70. So. Yeah. You know, your feet hurt. Hello. Your back hurts. Hello.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I wonder, you know, even Ken's book, we could give her, give her a copy of that. Cause there's a great.

[Dave Ramsey]

Finding the work you're wired to do.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Cause there's a great assessment in the back just to start jogging her memory of what she enjoys. Right. You find what you're good at. Her natural bent. That may has been squashed for years. I mean, who knows, right? But just to get some ideas, the

[Caller]

divorce definitely did a number of steals.

[Dave Ramsey]

Your. It steals your.

[Caller]

Encourage her with this. Because when I showed her the spreadsheet, it deflated every kind of belief she had because she wasn't snowballing, she was paying extra.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So I know I would not cash out their retirement because I don't want you to have to. I don't want her to have to pay the temporary penalty plus her taxes on the retirement. I would stop adding anything to retirement and I would lean in and pick up extra jobs and Start taking classes and do whatever we want to do for this next chapter, and then begin clearing the debt that way. But if we waived a wand and she had no debt, including her HELOC, and she's at $20 an hour at 55 years old, and she has no hope of that changing much except for a little bit of a cost of living raise every so often, and it goes from $20 to $20.45 or whatever. Right. That's not. We're not prescribing a prosperous future with no debt. And so your spreadsheet's not going to get fixed until you put more on the top of it. But, yeah, keep working on it and keep encouraging her. But if I were in her shoes, I would spend 80 to 90% of my energy dreaming again and setting up my next career and 10% of my energy trying to manage the mess that I'm sitting in. And I'm gonna work my way out of this manure and. And go on to the next thing. The best revenge is success. So. Hang on. We'll send you a copy of Ken's.

[Caller]

Sam,

[Dave Ramsey]

Tess is in Detroit. Hi, Tess. How are you?

[Caller]

Hi, I'm well. Thanks for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller]

Well, my husband and I have been mulling around the idea of buying a

new car, and we finally decided on

one we might like. And separately, we look it up, we're like, hey, this is pretty good.

What will fit us?

And then I said, well, let's go buy it, because we have cash. We can just buy it. And he said, oh, you know, they have zero percent financing. Why wouldn't we do that? And I thought, you know, I listen to the show all the time, but I don't really know. I would say you don't do it because you don't want any debtor.

All correct.

Why wouldn't you, you know, use their money?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, well, hypothetically, that would be the cop would cause you to have more money or build some wealth because you did that. That would be the hypothetical. In other words, yes, I'm paying no interest, and, you know, my investments are paying me. But the truth is, what ends up happening is it's not going to be a problem for you. You got plenty of money, I can tell you.

[Caller]

Yeah, it would not be a problem.

Yeah, but you would lose money by doing that.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you don't. You don't. Because here's why. Two reasons. Number one, what car is it? What's the car?

[Caller]

Well, I don't know if you like it, but we did. It was.

[Dave Ramsey]

No. What car is it?

[Caller]

It's a Hyundai Santa Fe that we rented when we were in California.

So we wouldn't have ever looked at that car, but it was a rental.

And we're like, wow, this was really nice.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was a rental.

[Rachel Cruze]

They rented one and liked it, and

[Caller]

now they want to buy it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, I see. I see.

[Caller]

Oh, it was a rental. That made us decide this.

[Dave Ramsey]

I understand. Understand. Yeah. That's happened to me. Okay. And I also decided on some cars I would never buy after I rented them. But. But the. The Jeep Wagoneer and the. Anyway, the. Yeah. Whew. Bad car. The. I haven't looked at Hyundai's program, but every program I have ever looked at, the only way they give you 0% is if you pay MSRP. You pay full price. You pay sticker. So 0% is not really 0%. So I bought a new Raptor Bronco the other day. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's cute.

[Rachel Cruze]

Cool.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I bought that car.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's the adjective you use for your car. I have a cute car.

[Dave Ramsey]

It is. It's cute. It's a cute. I mean, compared to my big truck, it's a cute little car, but it's brand new. And I call the dealer that I work with on Ford stuff when I'm buying it. Great people. And I just buy it for a few dollars over invoice.

[Rachel Cruze]

But do they do that for everybody?

[Dave Ramsey]

They do that for everybody because they get manufacturer rebates and kickbacks and 14 different things. And they make plenty of money on the car at inv. So $500 over invoice, $1,000 over invoice. That kind of thing is fairly typical on a car. Like you're talking about. Like I'm talking about. Okay. And that's a lot less than MSRP, a lot less than this on the sticker. So 0% is not 0%. That's problem number one. Problem number two is, I have met. We did detailed research with 10,000 millionaires. And the number of millionaires that we interviewed that told us that they became millionaires because they used 0% financing and you kept their money working for them was precisely zero. None of them do millionaires. Just don't do this. Okay.

[Caller]

Right. I agree. I'm on this.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't want a stinking car payment rebuttal for him. Even if it's a zero percent, I don't want a stinking car payment. And it's that simple. So, yeah. So, yeah, you win the argument. And it's an interesting discussion. But that's the two reasons. One is you're paying too much for the car, and so it's not really 0% because you're really interested. Ended up, in a sense, borrowing the money at an interest rate. And then the other thing is that real people that have real money don't do this crap. And you've got real money, and that's why you stopped and said, I don't think so, honey.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. And the problem is when you don't have real money and you still go into this, if you miss a payment or something goes off, sometimes they backtrack all the interest, and it's an absolute disaster.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can really get the terms that you have to abide by to continue to get zero percent. And to get zero percent in the first place are pretty horrendous. So basically, very few people, by the time they get through all that at the dealership, end up with 0%. And so it's a bit of a bait and switch to get you in the door and get you going, oh, we'll get you in the finance office, and then we'll get your real loan, you know, and that happens a lot because you got to have all kinds. Well, that's it. That's. Don't do it. Michelle's in Sacramento. Hi, Michelle. Michelle.

[Caller]

Hi. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

Oh, good. Okay. I just had a quick question about shared bank account. So my husband and I have been married for. We're going on eight years, and we have a shared bank account, and then we have a separate one through a failed business attempt, but it was a personal account, and he wants to keep that open and have my paycheck go directly to that because. Okay. And so it's kind of now, I got to think about it. He's one. We just barely got to baby step three, and we are completely out of debt, and we have our first month expenses for emergency funds in there saved up, and we're moving, trying to get that moved up, but I just don't feel comfortable keeping that other bank account open. It felt like, like, you know, just.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, I'm. I'm confused. We are working. We are working on the baby steps, which indicates that both of you have some exposure to Ramsey, and yet he now has decided he has a better plan, and that's that we don't do anything. We separate everything and act like we're roommates.

[Caller]

Yeah, kind of. But he's wanting, like, he still is giving me access to the family and the groceries and the. All of that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, that's nice of him.

[Caller]

He wants. And it's not like he's.

[Rachel Cruze]

Why does he want to do it, Michelle, What's. I don't understand his. Why keep it open and put your income in that. For what though? Like to.

[Caller]

Oh, so there's. So he has an ex wife and he's nervous if something happens there. He wants to make sure that we have separate. That doesn't affect the family account.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. How can his ex wife get into the family account? She can't.

[Caller]

I. I'm not sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, she can't Even, Even in California they don't allow that.

[Caller]

That's fair. Yeah. So it's just, it's just kind of a. It's. I don't know if it's him trying to be like he's trying to think that it's like a safety thing or a backup safety thing or whatnot. But. No, I, he and I have sat down and had this. Had a conversation about it. I said I. I'm not comfortable with.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Like I'm not doing it is.

[Caller]

Yeah. We've already been through eight years. There's nothing to be insecure about. You know, I know yours. And we've already gotten out of everything.

[Dave Ramsey]

So if you're worried about me, we got a different issue. And it's not a separate account. If you're worried about her, you have a different issue and it's your lack of knowledge of how the legal system works. She's gone. She's called the ex for a reason. She's a used to be.

[Rachel Cruze]

I mean, they've settled everything.

[Dave Ramsey]

She was the starter wife.

[Rachel Cruze]

You guys have been.

[Dave Ramsey]

She's a starter wife.

[Rachel Cruze]

You guys have been married for eight years.

[Dave Ramsey]

So.

[Rachel Cruze]

So interesting.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah. And there's. And there's only left of like maybe two or three. But. But. And that's the thing is like we're on the same page with everything else. But it's just for some reason and he wants it to go to like, you know, this is where we pull to go for.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I mean when you, when you say, no, I'm not going to do that and I'm not okay with that. What's. What's going to happen?

[Caller]

I don't know. I don't, I don't think it's anything. I don't know.

[Rachel Cruze]

Because he wants.

[Caller]

To me. It makes sense to keep it everything in the. Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

Wanting to have a separate account in general to put all of like you guys together. Like. And he's just saying Hey, I want to save your income over here. So when we go on trips or need to buy a car, we pull out of that account. Is that what you were saying?

[Caller]

Yeah, that's. Yeah, that's okay, So I would have a.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so what I would do, Michelle, is I would go get our smart bundle at Fairwinds Credit Union. This is what Winston and I did. You have a checking account in there, and then you can have up to 10 high yield savings accounts. So we have our emergency fund in one. And then you can open up another one and. Yeah, and if you guys look at the budget and say, hey, we're gonna do the budget and we're gonna save some amount of money, this amount of money, and maybe it comes out to your paycheck and that's what you'll agree. Let's put my paycheck in this high yield savings. And we're. That's gonna be our big bucket of savings throughout the next couple of years. And we need to pull from it. Yes, that's what Winston and I do.

[Dave Ramsey]

We have a. I know, but you, you. You are, aren't putting. You already were putting 15% of your income away before that, and you were already you out of a house mortgage.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, but I'm saying the one, she's

[Dave Ramsey]

a baby step three. So you should not be saving money in addition to 14, 15% of your income.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's fair.

[Dave Ramsey]

Except for miscellaneous living expenses.

[Rachel Cruze]

But I am saying a different account that you guys put the amount of money, maybe that goes to your. That's your paycheck to be saving in general later on in the baby steps. That's fine to have another account to

[Dave Ramsey]

do that, but both your names are on it and the amount that's going into it happens to be some amount.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's right. That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

But it doesn't need to be. We need to hide your check over here in a failed business checking account. Yuck.

[Rachel Cruze]

No, I'm trying to. Trying to paint another picture for you, Michelle.

[Dave Ramsey]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. In the Fairwinds Credit Union studio, I'm Dave Ramsey. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality. My daughter is my co host today. Open phones at Triple 882-522 5. Steven is in Tulsa. Hi, Steven, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey, guys. Thank you for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller]

So my brothers and I were working on a plan. We're trying to figure out the best and most efficient way to my parents out of our family business so they can retire.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool. Okay. So what does the business Net profit,

[Caller]

net a year is right around a million. Gross is last year gross was about 8 million.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and what are they wanting to be paid?

[Caller]

They haven't settled on a number. The company was evaluated at around 14 million.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, it's not.

[Caller]

They, I wouldn't, not even close.

[Dave Ramsey]

A million dollar profit company is not worth 14 million on any planet.

[Caller]

So with 600 acres of land, well,

[Dave Ramsey]

you might have a piece of real estate that's worth some money, but the company itself is generating a million dollars. And if you're, if you would be racing to pay $14 million for that. So what is the land worth?

[Caller]

Sure, yeah. The land itself is the bulk of that. I'd say that's at least 9 million. 9. 10 million.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, that'd be about right if it's 10 million. So a company is netting a million is probably worth about four. Okay. And the land is worth nine. So you have two transactions is my point. You have a real estate transaction.

[Caller]

Okay, I see.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have a real estate transaction and the purchase of the actual business. Because you could pick the business. What kind of business is this? Farm. Farming?

[Caller]

Yeah, it's farming. It's a specialty crop.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. I was gonna say you can pick it up and go to somewhere else. That's not possible. Okay. But, but yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Do your parents own the land outright, Stephen?

[Caller]

No, that's, that's another thing. They, some, several of the acreage they do own upright, but, but a majority of it has a loan on it.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much debt is against the $10 million in real estate? State?

[Caller]

It's right around 2 million. So they have a good amount of equity, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And good amount of debt for, for a small company.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. All right. I'm trying to think how to structure this. All right, let's go back to the. The easiest one. Okay. The easiest one is the business itself, not counting the land.

[Caller]

Land.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. If you were to give them $4 million for the property or not for the property. 10, but value the property. 10 million. And we're going to give them 4 million, then the way I would do that is I would take, I would tell you and your brothers to take a bare minimum wage for the work that you do, whatever your, what is your position with the company?

[Caller]

Operations manager.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what do you get paid for being operations manager? Manager.

[Caller]

We need to get paid around 100,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So if you. And you can live on that?

[Caller]

Yes.

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I would tell you to continue to take 100,000 each as your salaries, which nets the company $1 million. Am I correct?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And I would give them the $1 million for four years. You get 100% of profits or 90% of profits for four years until we get to, to $4 million. If we have a better year and we have a great crop, we might get there in three years, we might get there in three and a half. But you're going to get out of there. You get a percentage of profits, the lion's share, the biggest portion of the profits, 90% or so, until you get to $4 million. Mom and dad, that's how you buy them out of the business. Then We've got a $10 million real estate transaction to do. That's a separate transaction that's much more complicated.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because you take payments on $10 million out of your million dollar profits and you don't have any profit anymore. So this business is not viable. It's not a profitable business. If someone came in and borrowed to buy the land and the business and borrowed $14 million, they would lose money. And so the business cannot afford to pay market value for the land and make a profit. So what are they going to do? They're going to will it to you. Are they going to take $4 million as their retirement and then give you boys them the dirt when they die and you guys work to pay that $2 million off? That's what I would recommend. But I don't know if your parents are that generous or can see their way to do that.

[Caller]

I believe that, that, that's, that's the play. Honestly, they don't have, you know, they've been running this business for a while. So I don't have any, hardly any retirement. The business is their retirement. So I would see that as a.

[Dave Ramsey]

If they got $4 million in a mutual fund four years from now and they live off of that and they give you guys the land as a part of their estate planning, they could do it pre death unified estate tax, gifts and that kind of thing. There's all kinds of ways you can do it. And we can even do an LLC and do partial interest and devalue those interests. There's all kinds of stuff an estate planner can teach you to do to get that land transferred to y'. All. And then you guys, after you get your parents paid off, go get that mortgage paid off quick. And you're sitting there with all this debt free and this is a stinking cash cow now. You're killing it. It's wonderful.

[Caller]

Awesome. Thank you. Thank you for your Help.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. That's what I would do. But if they want to be paid 14 million, I don't think you can do it. I think you'll go broke.

[Rachel Cruze]

He can't. But could they go out and get.

[Dave Ramsey]

They couldn't get. No one would give.

[Rachel Cruze]

Would do that. Yeah. Is what you were saying.

[Dave Ramsey]

What you'd have to do is sell the land and sell the business. But you can't sell the business separate from the land because it is a specialty crop on that land. So they are inextricably tied together. Where, like, Ramsey could operate in any building. We happen to own the building. But that's a separate thing than Ramsey.

[Caller]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you could pick this up and put it in another office building somewhere. Right. So the real estate doesn't destroy the business or vice versa. Versa. But where it's tied together with a specialty crop in particular, it's hard. I don't know. Maybe they're growing, what, avocados or something. California. Right. So I don't know. I didn't ask him what the crop was, but. And you know, it's probably some kind of something that has been done there for almost generational on that piece of dirt. So those trees or that those plants

[Rachel Cruze]

are an essential part.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're mature to produce the crop that they're producing. And you couldn't just go do that.

[Caller]

That somewhere.

[Dave Ramsey]

Somewhere else, probably. I'm not an agricultural expert, but that's common sense, I guess. Wow. Interesting. Very interesting. Yeah. Yeah. So one of the things we've worked with a lot in our entree leadership materials is succession planning. And we've done a bunch of it here at Ramsey. I mean, you're looking at part of it right now. Rachel is one of the Ramsey personalities. The ability to carry on a brand after I'm not here for whatever reason. And so you've got to have a plan to carry on the brand. You got to have a plan to carry on the leadership. You got to have a plan to carry on the ownership. And Rachel and our brother Daniel and I just did a panel at the entree leadership summit in Disney two weeks ago for 3,000 business owners. And we're talking about family business.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. And I think what's hard in family business, depending on how it's structured, is that for a lot of people, they grow a business, and that's their retirement. Retirement. And so when you hand it off, purchasing the business is usually the name of the game in family business. And so making sure you sit down and you do it well with an attorney. Right. You said the estate attorney. But lots of communication on the front end too that everyone understands what's happening. Really, really important.

[Dave Ramsey]

All the spouses and everyone understand. If you're a business owner who's serious about growth, you've got to be at entree leadership summit. 2020 summit is our world class leadership conference where you will learn from the people who have influenced the way we lead at Ramsey. You'll also connect with like minded business owners who are facing the same challenges as you. To get your tickets for May 2027, go to entreeleadership.com summ. Thanks for joining us America. We're so glad you're here. If you're buying or selling a home, it's a big deal. You need to get someone in your corner that really knows their stuff. Not somebody got a license three weeks ago and you knew them in high school. No, that's not what we're doing. We're getting a pro that sells 100 houses a year, something like that. Get somebody that's high octane, high protein. Ramsey trusted only has high octane octane, high protein real estate agents in our program. The Ramsey trusted program is the only way to find a top agent that we have interviewed. We have done the due diligence on them. It's a free service. Find a local pro, a Ramsey trusted real estate pro for free. @ramseysolutions.com Agent Jake's in Columbus, Ohio. Hi Jake, how are you?

[Caller]

Fantastic. How are you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. Well, what's up?

[Caller]

All right, so about a couple years ago, I decided to purchase a home with my mother and with the agreement that she'd only be there for like two to three years and then it essentially transferred into my name. So recently we've been having more arguments because she likes to run the household her way, I like to do it my way. And she pulled from her 401k to pay for the down payment for the house. House. So she only has about 8,000 in retirement. So my question is, I'm trying to figure out how we can get out of this with both of us not being scathed.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I mean, how much did she put into the house?

[Caller]

I believe a down payment was about 10,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and so what do you owe on the house now?

[Caller]

239The last time that I checked.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's it worth today?

[Caller]

The last thing I saw it was 259 to 260.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so if you sold the house and she got her $10,000 back or whatever she Put down back and then you split any other profits. What would be wrong with that?

[Caller]

Yeah, that's fair. I guess. It's mostly just I'm concerned because she's 57 and only has about 8,000 in retirement. And you know, I want to help her the best way that keeping the

[Dave Ramsey]

house doesn't affect that positively. Yeah. She's got to get on her own and start putting money away for retirement. That's what fixes that. The house is not causing her to have retirement or be broke.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does she make?

[Caller]

I think. I'm not sure what she makes now. She made about 40 last year. Year. But my dad passed away when I was 16. I was like 11 years ago.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. I'm sorry.

[Caller]

It's all right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so she. She has struggled ever since.

[Caller]

Yes and no. She for a time period had a really well paying job, but the amount of hours she worked she said kind of just burn her out. But that's where most of her retirement money came from. From in the first place was just from that job.

[Rachel Cruze]

So how often is she working? What's her work schedule look like right now?

[Caller]

So she works. She has two different jobs, but they're both like part time. Just one, she's an accountant for a restaurant and the other one, she's kind of like a personal assistant.

[Dave Ramsey]

The problem is, is your mom is a widow with a broken heart and she needs to dream again because she's not got any income and she's 55 years old. She's still very young.

[Rachel Cruze]

Young.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And she desperately needs to say what am I going to do with my life the next 20 years? I need a career where I make. Where I'm working towards making a hundred thousand dollars a year, not working two part time jobs and living with my son. She's. Part of the problem is she's emotionally just getting by.

[Caller]

Well, she said she doesn't want a

[Dave Ramsey]

career, she needs a career.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

She needs something to put her hand to, to. To give her meaning and give her something to drive for. She's too young to sit on her butt. She can't. She. And she can't afford it. So consequently her career has been deteriorating rather than going up.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so this is what she needs. So it will be good for you guys. It'll be good for her because it will force her to face all of this. For y' all to separate this out, this house does need to be sold her. If you give her how old? You're 27, 28, right?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you give her all the money from the house and just go live your life. You're okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So give her all the money and tell her to put it. And help her put it in some good investments and help her to pay for a class and go take a class at the community college and start to. What do you want to be, Mom? Do you want to be a nurse now? Do you want to. What is it you want to do with your life? You're going to have to do something. Something. And so it's time to sign up and dream. But the, the plan that you guys had before dad died is over now. We need a new, different plan. We need a new plan. And it's heartbreaking, but it is her reality and she's perfectly capable. Her biggest problem is she's just still living with a heartbreak. Am I wrong?

[Caller]

Yeah, because they divorced when I was a baby. Baby. So it wasn't.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so she. Okay, so. But she's never really done anything since then then, right?

[Caller]

Well, she had, like I said, like that. I think she's only there for like six years. Six or seven years. The one job that she had, I was saying that yeah, she had a good income from. But yeah, after that she hasn't really had anything that was like.

[Rachel Cruze]

What are you doing, Jake? What's your job?

[Dave Ramsey]

Job?

[Caller]

I work as a utility locator. I locate power lines.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Okay. Yeah. I think it's good for both of you to sell this house. You both need separate financial lives instead of trying to mingle it together. And you know, and, and I think for both of you to encourage each other in this new endeavor for her and you encourage her, but there's only so much you can do, Jake. You're not going to be able to change her. You can't make her go do something. But you can, can speak and be encouraging in your conversations with her and what you see in her and what she's good at, what she loves, I mean all of it. So. But I would for sure sell this house.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Prospering for someone. This is the second call we've taken today on a 55 year old lady.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Prospering for someone is not merely making more money. You're prospering when you, your spiritual life is full, your relational life is full.

[Rachel Cruze]

Taking care of your body, your meaning,

[Dave Ramsey]

your physical life is full of life.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, all of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that is prospering. But these things are holistic in that they are tied together. And so when you allow one area of your life to completely deteriorate 100% of the time, some of the other areas are also deteriorating. And so you get out of shape. You've given up on God, so you walked away from your spiritual life. You isolate yourself from friends, you pull away from relationships. All of these things are. And what we find is that people that are successful work the opposite side of that. And they are very intentional about building friendships. They are very intentional about their physical health. They are very intentional about their spiritual walk. They are very intentional about. About their career and their money, income. And they do all tie together. If you have only one of those working in the wheel of life, as Zig Ziglar used to call it, these different areas, you only have goals in one area of your life or two areas of your life. The other side of the wheel is flat and you have. Any time you have a flat tire, you have friction and it's a problem.

[Rachel Cruze]

You know, we were just having. We did a podcast with a guy yesterday. You did one interview and I did another. And he was talking about how he interviews very high successful people, billionaires, people that have sold companies. You know, I mean, just insane. And he said, and you can sit with them. And you feel almost like this energy from some. Some are still anxious and discontent and nothing is satisfying them. And he said, all these buckets of their life, you can tell there are absent some of them, they're not taking care of themselves physically. They don't have good relationships.

[Dave Ramsey]

And other ones, you get holistically feed.

[Rachel Cruze]

And he's adding, you feel a peace. There's something about this, this well roundedness. And again, there's certain seasons of life, you're going to be working on your marriage more, or certain seasons in your life, you'll be working on your career more. I mean, you know, it goes through seasons, but overall, the overall scope of your life, having. He would call these buckets, he said, all of them full. And like there's a. There's a leveling to that and a beauty, a grounding that you really do feel. And it's those people that live a. A peaceful life.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, absolutely. That's how it works. So that, that's Jake. That's what we want for your mom, and that's her advice. Five years from today, you'll be the same person you are today. Except for the books you read, the people you meet, the goals you set, the decisions you do towards those goals. That's Charlie Tremendous Jones, and he was exactly right. All right, let's cut to the chase. It's easy to get discouraged about crazy house prices and interest rates. But when you have the right real estate agent to help you buy and sell the right way, you'll have confidence to make smart decisions. Ramsey trusted agents aren't just experts who guide you through buying or selling. They're people you can trust to have your back from the first call to closing day. Find a Ramsey trusted agent near [e-mail] agent that's ramseysolutions.com agent. Ramsey show. Question of the day is brought to you by why Refi out of control? Private student loans can make it feel like you're stuck financially. But why Refi helps borrowers explore refinancing with low fixed rates and payments that make sense for their budget. Visit yrefi.com Ramsay that's y the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey might not be in all states.

[Rachel Cruze]

Today's question comes from Sarah in Illinois. My boyfriend and I have been together for three years and he recently took a job four hours away. I own my condo and still pay about $1,500 a month in the mortgage, even though I'm at his place 60% of the time. He's asked me to pay for a bigger apartment since we both work from home and need more space when I'm there there while I still have my own bills. I understand the larger. I understand the larger place benefits both of us. Should I help pay for the new apartment? No, Sarah, I would not. That's his apartment and you have yours. And if he wants a bigger one, that's great. But.

[Dave Ramsey]

And if he wants his girlfriend to live there, maybe she should be his wife. Oh, that changes the equation.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, no, I wouldn't be mingling bills. I wouldn't be trying to pay a rent. Because here's the thing. If you guys break up and then he's stuck with that rent that he can't afford, what's he gonna do? So it's way better when you are dating to keep your finances separate. You pay your stuff, he pays his. And if he wants a bigger apartment so that you all can work there together and all the things, he wants

[Dave Ramsey]

you to live in that city and you sell your condo and we get a place there. Oh, that would be a great idea. After we're married. This is what's putting the problem on it. Yeah, put a ring on it. That's the problem. Because it sets you up for a, you know, you're getting a bad end of this deal all the way around. It's, it's killer for you. So. And it this used to be, you know, when I started the show, Rachel, the. But the biggest thing that came up was credit card debt. Cut up your credit cards. And now I still say that. And then the next thing was, we laughed and called it the. Instead of the Dave Ramsey Show. In the old days, we called it the Sell the car show because, like, the answer to every question was sell the car, sell the car. Now the answer to every question is get married.

[Rachel Cruze]

So true. Though, the amount of relational mess that happens, the entanglement of dating people today

[Dave Ramsey]

and how it messes up your finances.

[Rachel Cruze]

Keep it separate when you are married, combine it. It's just that easy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Stop confusing it. Yeah. Because the data is in. It's in. I mean, the. The research is in. There's stacks and stacks of paper that says you're screwed. That's what it says. Every bit of the data says you are messed up. Because again, I covered this in another hour. But a lady in her 30s has a net worth if she's not married and she's living with someone and. Or does not marry. A net worth that is about 1/10 of her married friends.

[Rachel Cruze]

And the guy is what, five times. Has a fifth of his net worth

[Dave Ramsey]

and a Guy has about 25% of the net worth he should have. Yeah. And so there's a thing we used to call in, in the literature, the marriage advantage. And it's still there, but it's even more pronounced now in the financial realm. But it's pronounced in other realms as well, like, for instance, physical health. A man that is married lives seven years longer than a man. That's not. On average. That's just a statistic. Okay. I mean, you could argue why we could have lots of fun with that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Women help men.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's. Why. Are you going to eat that? Yeah, I mean, it's. That's real. And so the.

[Rachel Cruze]

Now don't get married to someone who's a loser too, but don't be dating those people as well. We're not saying just.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't think that's her problem.

[Rachel Cruze]

No, but just in general. We're just making generalities. So remember, be smart about it. If you enter into a lifelong covenant, make sure it's someone worth doing that. But people you're dating long term should be worth that. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. But here's what's interesting, for Sarah's sake.

[Caller]

Look at this.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. He takes a job and leaves. Now follow me. Oh. Now pay for it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Now pay for it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now pay for following me. Yeah. I mean, yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

What a prince.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. There we go. It's. It's all right there on the paper. I'm just saying. David is in Phoenix. Hey, David. I. How are you?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. Hi, Rachel. Good. It's a pleasure to speak with the both of you. I've heard Dave talk before about the if Dave dies meeting, and it got me really thinking about my own family. And I feel like I need to have a similar conversation with my parents soon as they get older, just to give some context. I'm 23 years old. I have three siblings. My parents are 72 and 68 years old. My oldest sister is in her early 50s, and I also have a brother and sister in their twenties who both have Asperger's syndrome, and they still live with my parents. My parents are both retired, and to my understanding, they have a net worth of around $2 million. I'd like to have a family conversation sometime this year so everyone can get on the same page, especially my parents and my older sister, about the expectations for responsibilities and how the assets would be handled when they eventually pass away. Because as of right now, we're both kind of in the dark. So I want to know what are the most important questions that I should be asking, and what are some of the key topics discussed in the Ramsey family meetings that would be most important for any family to cover?

[Rachel Cruze]

It's a great question.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have to lay a foundation with your family first before you have that other part of the conversation. And the first part of the foundation is mom and Dad. I am not wanting to have this conversation because I want any of your money. I don't need any of you. Your money. I am concerned about my two brother. Is it a brother and a sister that have Asperger's?

[Caller]

Yeah, it's a brother and a sister.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm concerned about my brother and sister and how they're going to be cared for and what your wishes are. And if I don't know your wishes in detail, it will be hard for me to honor your memory. And I'm deeply concerned that I can do the right thing and that my older sister and I are in agreement on how we're going to do exactly what you want us to do do when you pass away. Okay. And they need to hear that that's a foundational thing. You are not coming at this like, I want some of the money. Oh, no, we're not going to talk about it because we're giving it to the two that are disabled, you know, and so, you know, they'll get their backup, you know, you'll get a resistance there, a defensiveness that we don't even need to start with. So let's just lay that down. Say the only reason for this is for me to have the information to be able to own, honor your wishes and execute and ensure that what you've wished in the well, even if I'm

[Rachel Cruze]

not the executive, and to make sure that brother and sister have the documents in place, that they're gonna be taken care of. You know, I wanna make sure that there's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

That things are laid out from a legal perspective.

[Dave Ramsey]

Once I know what you want, then I'm gonna help you get what you want. Now then, do we have a proper will, which in this case would include probably special needs trusts to take care of the two special needs people. Right. Okay. And then how's that money gonna be invested, want done with that property and what do you want done with that investment account and how do you want it handled and who do you want us to contact?

[Rachel Cruze]

Who's the executor? Is it sister that's going to be doing all the details?

[Dave Ramsey]

Is my older sister the executor? That's fine. If you don't want me to do anything with it, I won't do anything with it. All of that's okay. I just want to know that for your all's peace of mind that we're all on the same page. And then what we're going to do once we're all on the same page, the Ramsey thing is we just sit down and part of the meeting is we go through the real estate that we own and we look at it and we go, okay, here's what the will says about this real estate. What portions of it are in a trust and which portions of it are in LLCs, and what portions have already been moved into the children's trust. Because we've done some stuff there from an estate planning standpoint, taxes wise. Here's the life insurance that's in place and here's the beneficiaries on it and where it will go. In my case, there's not any. And you know, what do you want to have happen with the home place? What do you want to have happen with this or that? And it can go all the way down to my wife's 97 year old dad told the kids about 8 or 10 years ago, his kids to walk through the house and put a sticker on the back of something if they wanted it. And so the house has got all these sticky notes in the backs of the pictures and the backs of the figurines and stuff. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Now I will say it's funny. He asks. The meeting is not called. If Dave dies, it's when Dave dies.

[Dave Ramsey]

Dave will not live forever. If Dave dies this year, as long as you, it's if Dave dies this year.

[Caller]

Okay, that's it.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's the Monty Python meeting. I'm feeling much better.

[Rachel Cruze]

We want him to live forever.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's just a flesh wound.

[Rachel Cruze]

Not gonna happen. But we love him.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey, what's up, guys?

[Caller]

It's Jade Warshaw. Listen, summer spending adds up so fast. Between vacations and road trips and camp fees and events and all the extra gas and grocery stores, runs, money can get tight before you know it. To really get your money under control and keep it that way, you're going to need a plan. And that's what you'll get with the EveryDollar budget app. It helps you track your spending, free up cash to put toward debt and savings. And it's the simplest way to make a plan for your money before the month begins. So no more wondering where your money's going.

[Rachel Cruze]

You're telling it where to go.

[Caller]

Download EveryDollar in the app Store or Google Play and start from for free Today.

[Dave Ramsey]

Our scripture of the day, John 14:27. Peace, I leave with you. My peace I give to you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid. Babe Ruth said, never let the fear of striking out keep you from playing the game. Brianna is with us in Sioux Falls, South Dakota. Hi, Brianna. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

I'm wondering if I should get a work from home job. I am a mom of three under two and we're going under every time we get paid.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, my goodness. You have twins?

[Caller]

No, I just had a baby. He's three months. Just about three months old.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, wow. Okay. So how much is the new job work from home is going to pay?

[Caller]

I don't know. I'd have to see and find one, I guess. But I did look into it and I'd have to make at least least 3,000amonth for it to be worth it. Because right now we are on like, SNAP and WIC and Medicaid, so I'd have to be able to make enough to cover all of that.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does your husband make?

[Caller]

He makes roughly 43 after taxes. Okay. And we're about 34,000 in debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does he do?

[Caller]

He is a bricklayer he works for the Union.

[Dave Ramsey]

So with $43,000 income, you qualify for every part of welfare. I didn't, I didn't know.

[Caller]

Yes, through the, through the winter is when we qualify. We're just getting out of the winter because like we went through about two or three months where the max amount of money that we made was maybe 800 for that whole month. So we qualified for all of that. Rick. And my K do called.

[Dave Ramsey]

But when. In the summer when he's working. You don't qualify.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, okay. That makes more sense now. I'm, now I'm tracking with you.

[Caller]

All right.

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So he makes a lot more in the summer, like a bazillion times more. So how long has he been doing that?

[Caller]

He's been with the same company for about five years now. Six years maybe.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, so he just started working. Yeah. My first piece of advice for you all will be to pan back from this and say we're a young couple with three children and we're going to have to make some overall decisions about his career that allow us to feed our children without the government doing it. So what is he going to do in the winter when he's not laying brick? In other words,

[Caller]

we've gotten by. By God's grace at this point.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you got bye bye, snap. Because he wasn't working in the winter. So he needs to be working in the winter. That's my point.

[Rachel Cruze]

Is he not doing anything in the winter?

[Caller]

Yep. He'll do side jobs.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

But he didn't not enough have anything this winter.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. He needs to be making a thousand bucks a month somewhere. I mean a thousand bucks a week, you know what I mean in the winter? Waiting tables. I mean doing anything.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what are we going to be doing when we're 44? Because this plan's not real good.

[Caller]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's leaving your family very vulnerable.

[Rachel Cruze]

Are you stressed?

[Dave Ramsey]

And I don't know how you're going to work at home with three kids under 22 and get any work done.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Are you, did you have a career before?

[Caller]

Yes, I actually, that's why we have, we have about 12,000 in student loans. Because I was a medical assistant.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, but you're saying with daycare for three to three under two, that's the most priciest age to put them in daycare. It's what you're saying. It just, it's not making sense from a. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can't go into the workplace. I understand that. I don't have a problem with that assessment But I really want you guys to visit this instead of just going and saying. Our plan, that we didn't have a plan was he's a bricklayer and he doesn't work much in the winter and we keep having babies. This is not a plan. It's put you guys, it's painted you into a corner and your life is not fun. And so I want good things for you guys. And it's going to involve him making some changes in views on his income. What's he going to be doing in the next five years that doubles his income? Or in the next 10 years that doubles his income and that sustains his family through the winter? He needs to be asking himself that. You two as a couple need to be asking yourselves that. And then that starts the whole conversation. So part of your debt is a student loan debt. What's the rest of it?

[Caller]

17 is in a truck loan. And then we have 4,000 in a personal that got us through one winter. And then then roughly about 15 in medical. Some of that's in collections. And then we owe family about a thousand.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, I'm gonna. I'm gonna be mean. Are you ready?

[Caller]

I am. I'm gonna say you're gonna sell the truck.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I'm gonna say it worse than that. Okay. You do not get to own a $17,000 truck when you're taking welfare to pay for your kids food.

[Caller]

I agree.

[Dave Ramsey]

That is not okay.

[Caller]

My husband that decision about three years ago. This truck has eaten us alive since we got it and everything.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's gotta go.

[Caller]

Yeah, the only. So I'm gonna. I guess. And then if this is gonna be the thing, I've been telling him that we have to get rid of it as well. But if we only get about 10 grand for it, we're still gonna have to pay that set outright when we sell the truck. And we don't have any savings at all whatsoever.

[Dave Ramsey]

You'll be borrowing it from the place that has the truck loan to cover the difference. And I bet you can get more than that for it if you sell it. Private sale. But he's been looking up trade in and looking up what some what Carvana will give him for it. And that's nothing compared to what he can actually get for it. A good working truck will bring a lot of money in Sioux Falls, South Dakota. Okay. And so he can get a lot more than 10 for it. And you're gonna have. You probably are in the hole some. I'm not arguing at that point. You're gonna have to Borrow a little money to cover that hole. But I'd lot rather you be 4 or $5,000 in debt than 17. And again, I'm addressing hand on the decision making paradigm that you guys are using to run your life. And what you're doing is you're doing, I'm gonna do this over here. And I'm gonna do this over here. I'm gonna do this over here. But when you tie those three things together, they're not logical and anymore. And it's creating pain for you guys. And I don't want that for you. I want you to win.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well. And you want to make sure your money habits and decisions, kind of what you're saying, regardless of what happens, are steady. Meaning that before they had kids, she was working as a medical assistant. He's a bricklayer. Can kind of do, you know, seasonally, I'm sure they were fine.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Rachel Cruze]

Like his seasonal work and her, they could just make it. And then you pull her out of the workforce with three babies and suddenly your paradigm has to shift to your point.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can't like it's a lot of diapers.

[Rachel Cruze]

You can't have that. Yeah. You cannot continue to do what you've been doing. And I'm talking to him. Yeah. What you did three years ago, meaning your truck, your choices on restaurants. I mean like all of it, it all changes because your life has changed.

[Dave Ramsey]

And your choices on side jobs in the winter.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

And. Or an overall career change over the next five years that causes your family to be able to stabilize and sustain.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. That gets you to 70. I mean the manual side of the trades is wonderful. Is amazing. And so there's a lot of opportunity for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're a lot better than 40 grand a year.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And so. But yeah. Don't get stuck in. What I'm doing is okay when what I'm doing is not okay. That's the thing. And I'm not hollering at you. I'm not hollering at him for that matter. But you know, when he was by himself and wasn't married and he was laying brick and he had a little downtime in the winter, he'd work it out. But now he's got responsibilities.

[Rachel Cruze]

And Brianna, I don't even know how you're coherent making a sentence of with a three month old and two Todd. I mean two babies, like that's like you guys, you have a lot on your plates. And honestly, if you were just a full time mom taking care of the household, making sure those babies are alive at the end of the day. Right. I mean, like, that's a full time job. So I understand the money needs to happen and I hope that, yeah, there's a good situation that you can bring in some. But I. I mean, honestly, call me old school, but I'm leaning on.

[Dave Ramsey]

On him.

[Rachel Cruze]

Dude, get to work. Get to work. I got three babies at home that I'm taking care of. Yeah, that's no joke.

[Dave Ramsey]

And. And it's. And it's not just. It's not that he's not working hard now, but it's get to work in a way that it brings in the money to take care of your family and get your truck sold. Dude.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, but when you bring $800 home a month.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know. Get your truck sold and then you get to work. Yeah, you gotta get. You gotta get some stuff going here and get you a $5,000 truck. That's the thing.

[Rachel Cruze]

Call us back, Brianna, if you guys need anything. We are.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hang on. We'll send you a copy of the total money makeover and get you on every dollar and try to help you if we can. That puts this hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the prince of peace, Christ Jesus,

[Caller]

Sam.