If Nothing Changes Your Money Won't Change

Summary

The Ramsey Show – If Nothing Changes, Your Money Won’t Change

Date: March 26, 2026
Hosts: Dave Ramsey, Rachel Cruze, Chris Hogan (occasional), Ramsey Team
Theme: Take control of your finances, change your behaviors, and build wealth—regardless of past mistakes.

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Episode Overview

This episode underscores the heart of The Ramsey Show: if you want to change your money, you have to change your actions and mindset. Dave Ramsey and his co-hosts field questions from callers navigating marital money disputes, business dilemmas, debt crises, and life transitions. The discussions offer practical advice grounded in Ramsey’s “baby steps” and no-nonsense, sometimes tough-love, wisdom. The core throughline is personal responsibility, the power of teamwork in relationships, and the importance of avoiding debt.

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Key Discussion Points & Call Highlights

1. Combining Finances in Marriage

Callers: Ben (Charlotte, NC), Ashley (Dallas, TX), Cassandra (Raleigh, NC)
Time: [00:44], [54:56], [95:46]

• Ben’s Dilemma: Struggles to fully combine finances with his wife due to her fears and past family trauma.
  • Dave: Suggests the two possible issues: lack of trust or control issues—“Either she's a selfish princess…or she doesn’t trust you that she will have a vote.” [02:15]
  • Rachel & Chris: Urge Ben to dig deeper into his wife’s “why” and communicate openly.
  • Quote: “If you want to win with money in marriage, you have to have oneness. Money is a tool you use together, daily.” – Chris Hogan [04:31]
• Ashley’s Marital Struggle: Signed a prenup, feels excluded from husband’s business finances, does unpaid work, and has no clarity or control.
  • Dave: “You don't have a prenuptial problem or a financial problem. You have a desperately bad marriage problem.” [58:50]
  • Urges her to seek counseling: “If there’s no change, you shouldn't be there.” [61:13]
  • Chris: “Your husband’s kind of a jerk, do you agree?” [57:36]
  • Advice: Go to marriage counseling, don't let it be a ‘prenup’ excuse, and refuse to become a victim in the arrangement.
• Cassandra’s Budget Debate: Discusses how to categorize certain expenses as she and her husband combine finances.
  • Dave: Recommends starting with granular line items for transparency (“have the emotional shock”) and then, over time, simplifying categories. [96:50]
  • Budgeting detail helps develop healthy financial habits as a couple.

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2. Young Couples & Money Mistakes

Calls: Jack (Houston, TX), Oscar (Orlando, FL), Samantha (Cincinnati, OH)
Time: [05:30], [11:14], [66:14]

• Jack: 20-year-old business owner, profitable, asks about going into debt for business property.
  • Dave: Advises against debt, “move at the speed of cash.” There’s time to grow and learn—use business profits, avoid leverage. [08:06]
• Oscar: 20, young family, high-interest debts, low income, living with in-laws.
  • Dave: Blunt critique: “You guys need to look at each other and go, okay, we have done our last stupid thing. I mean, 27% on a car—good God!” [15:16]
  • Solution: Use existing cash to pay down debts (except for car loan), increase income with extra jobs, stop using credit, and plan a debt-free roadmap.
  • Chris: Encourages envisioning the future: “When you’re 26, where do you want to be?” [18:09]
• Samantha: In a relationship, not married, bankruptcy, combined child, partner unwilling to change.
  • Dave: Strong advice for marriage (“The number of couples who succeed financially and relationally like this is zero.” [71:34]); calls out the perils of “playing house” without marriage.
  • Stats: “The net worth of a single lady shacking up as compared to a married lady at 35… is 13 times less.” [74:55]

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3. Dealing With Overwhelming Debt & Bankruptcy

Callers: Abby (Oklahoma City), Jessica, Leah, Matt (Fort Worth, TX)
Time: [44:13], [40:50], [36:49], [22:09]

• Abby: $90,000+ in debt, upside-down car, single mom, struggling to see a way out.
  • Dave: Bankruptcy would not solve her core problem (student loans and family debts can’t be discharged). Focus: sell the car, wait for child support arrears to fill the gap, use private sale, and possibly hardship deferment for student loans [49:00].
  • “The car is the problem. You hang on; I’m gonna have Christian pick up and get you a Ramsey-trained counselor.” [52:28]
• Jessica: Owes $7,000 in taxes, also expecting a baby.
  • Dave: “You don’t get to choose—pay the IRS now. The penalties and interest are worse than a payday lender.” [41:15]
• Leah: Special-needs child, asks about adequate life insurance as a stay-at-home mom.
  • Dave: “All stay-at-home moms should have life insurance to replace the actual marketplace value of their duties.” [37:38]
  • Recommends $500K+.
• Matt: Tried to get his mom out of debt before retirement; she’s unmotivated.
  • Dave: “You want your loved ones to win with money more than they do, but you can’t force them. Have a closing conversation—then drop it.” [25:04]

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4. Windfalls & Major Decisions

Caller: Michael (Little Rock), Jimmy (Atlanta), Donnie (Richmond, VA), Chris (Roanoke)
Time: [86:24], [33:14], [107:04], [113:50]

• Michael: $400K legal settlement, $70K debt, wants to do the right thing.
  • Dave: “Pay off your debts, set aside wedding money, and build a life where you don't need this settlement. Invest the rest and let it grow.” [91:21]
  • Chris: “If you start living off it, it'll be gone in 20 days.”
• Jimmy: Self-employed, 5 paid-for houses, considering using DSCR loan for remodels.
  • Dave: “I own several hundred million in real estate—100% paid for. Move at the speed of cash, don't use DSCR loans.” [35:29]
• Donnie: Successful TikTok sports card shop with his son, considering leaving his steady finance job.
  • Dave: “Do it, but remember: this won’t last forever. Platforms change. Bank your profits and look for what's next.” [110:19]
  • Be on multiple platforms; don't rely on one channel (TikTok).
• Chris: Has leftover 529 funds after cash-flowing college.
  • Dave: Use the 529s as intended, then invest extra with flexibility outside college restrictions. [114:11]

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5. Budgeting, Business, and Financial Planning

Callers: Tanya (Richmond, VA), Rose (Phoenix), Jack & others
Time: [80:58], [102:14], [05:30]

• Tanya: Balancing growth of a young concierge therapy business with debt payoff.
  • Dave: “You can’t borrow your way out of debt. Use business income to get debt-free, but the real growth comes from more clients, not spending.”
  • Chris: It's okay for all her income to go to debt in the early days. [84:35]
• Rose: Paid off half the joint mortgage on a home with her sister; sister is upset.
  • Dave: “No reason to be mad, nothing’s hurt. Mortgage payoff doesn’t affect trusts.” [104:34]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Money & Relationships:
  “If you keep doing what you've been doing, you're going to keep getting what you've been getting.” – Dave Ramsey [18:44]
• On Financial Teamwork:
  “Money is a tool that we use every day in our life. When we see that as a household and togetherness, it helps so many decisions.” – Rachel Cruze [04:28]
• On Debt Reality:
  “Everything you had was north of 20%... Like, do you like getting screwed? You signed up for everything possible that was horrible!” – Dave Ramsey [14:29]
• On Trying to Help Loved Ones:
  “You can't answer questions people aren't asking. I quit presenting myself as the answer to problems people aren't trying to solve.” – Dave Ramsey [26:07]
• On Entrepreneurial Risk:
  “TikTok Shop won't be around forever... Be looking for the next way to sell. Don’t marry one platform.” – Dave Ramsey [111:18]
• On Marital Alignment:
  “I would not ask someone to be in an abusive, toxic environment for 20 years... This is abusive, toxic.” – Dave Ramsey (to Ashley) [61:13]
• On Budget Shock:
  “The emotional shock of looking down at your line items—‘my mentored coffees cost that much?’—is good for you.” – Dave Ramsey [98:12]

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Important Timestamps

• Combining finances in marriage: [00:44] – [05:30]
• Young entrepreneur and debt: [05:30] – [09:59]
• Crisis debt and tough advice: [11:14] – [20:41]
• Inheriting parent’s business and debt: [124:00] – [126:33]
• Life insurance for stay-at-home parents: [36:49] – [40:50]
• Prenups, boundaries, and trust: [54:56] – [62:58]
• Budgeting details and habits for couples: [95:46] – [102:14]
• Windfall and life planning: [86:24] – [94:03]
• TikTok Shop: Side hustle to business leap: [107:04] – [113:24]
• Final financial-planning questions: [117:14] – [123:43]

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Episode Tone

Direct and practical with a mix of tough love and encouragement. Dave and team don’t sugarcoat the consequences of poor decisions or the challenges of changing habits—but constantly assure listeners that transformation is possible through focus, teamwork, and a willingness to make hard changes.

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Key Takeaways

• Change starts with you: If you want your money to change, your behavior must change first.
• Couples need unity, not secrecy: Financial “oneness” is crucial in marriage. Avoid financial secrets and work as a team.
• No more debt: Avoid debt at all costs; “move at the speed of cash.”
• Take responsibility: Own your mistakes and vow not to repeat them.
• You can’t force others to change: Inspire by example, not by nagging.
• Plan for the future: Windfalls are opportunities—secure your future, don’t fritter them away.
• Budget matters: Start detailed, then simplify as you gain discipline.

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For Listeners:

If you’re stuck, struggling, or just want to make a change—remember Dave’s refrain:
“If nothing changes, your money won’t change.”
Take ownership, get on a plan, and surround yourself with accountability.

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Listen to the full episode at ramseysolutions.com or search for The Ramsey Show on your favorite podcast platform.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studios, this is the Ramsey Show. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, my co host today Rachel Cruz, number one best best selling author, co host of Smart Money Happy hour, Ramsey personality and my daughter. Open phones at 888 825-5225. Ben is in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi Ben, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey Dave, how you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

I was calling to get some input on combining finances with my wife James. When I, when we bring it up, it causes arguments and I guess how can you take the baby steps to becoming a team?

[Dave Ramsey]

So why does it cause an argument?

[Caller]

I think just the, I guess the oneness. Not being in control of her finances for herself but combined is one. I think that scares her a little bit.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You know, she doesn't think she has a vote.

[Rachel Cruze]

It's not that.

[Caller]

I think it's. She scared when we set up because I've talked about doing a budget every month of possibly causing an argument if something doesn't go as planned. But I've reassured her that no, that's, that's not going to happen.

[Rachel Cruze]

Ben, how long work together?

[Chris Hogan]

How long have you been married?

[Caller]

Two years.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't think you're telling me everything.

[Caller]

I am. I mean we've had plan conversations about it. I've tried open, open, opening up about it. We have a joint account and all my money goes into that or our money, but her paycheck stays.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, one or two things is going on. Either she's a selfish princess and she wants to control her own life and doesn't want for anything or she doesn't trust you that she will have a vote in this process

[Chris Hogan]

or that you're not going to misbehave with money. Has there been anything in the past, Ben, of something that you've done that could have broken that trust?

[Caller]

Not from our relationship side, but her childhood. Her mom didn't. I guess she took the selfish act when they got a divorce. So that kind of scares her.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, she took the what?

[Caller]

So she tried taking all of her. Her dad's money? Yes.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but there's laws that dictate who gets what in a divorce. And if the reason we're not going to combine our finances is because I'm planning my divorce, we have other Issues.

[Caller]

So we aren't planning a divorce. I'm just making assumptions. I don't know definitively.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Yeah, I don't either. So I, you know, I don't know. You know, we're not sure why. Why this lady doesn't want to do this other than her parents got a divorce when she was a kid, which is really not a reason to not combine finances with my current husband. If I'm deeply in love and we have a high quality relationship that we both have a vote in and there's communication on and full transparency.

[Chris Hogan]

Do y'. All.

[Dave Ramsey]

Unless. Unless she thinks you're trying to control her or she is doing a bunch of crap that she doesn't want you to know about.

[Chris Hogan]

Do you guys make a significant difference in salary? Ben?

[Caller]

No, just. She brings home around 3,500 every month and I bring home around 4,000.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay. Yeah, I. I don't know. I would. Yeah, I would dig into more of her. Why. Which I don't know if you've done that of understanding.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you have, you can't. You're having trouble verbalizing.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah. So I would figure out what is the. What is really going on with her of her hesitation and her refusal. And. Yeah, depending on what. I mean, those are two extremes. On the. On the spectrum is what Dave laid out, which is true. So she falls on one end of the spectrum and not. And. And out of that then is what you're gonna have to talk to her about. And you guys together, get a plan where you're both comfortable. And the why is the motivation is so that we can work together and have a oneness in our life. And our money is a tool that we use every day in our life. And so when we see that as a household and we see that togetherness, it helps so many decisions and the logistics as well, like, fall into place. So, yeah, I think you need to do some more digging, Ben, on what's going on in her fears. And then you need to be able to verbalize that to her on why you're wanting to do money differently than you are now. And that's going to be important too.

[Dave Ramsey]

Jack is in Houston. Hi, Jack, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey, how are y' all doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So I had a question. I'm young, I'm about 20, I have my own business and I am also a full time college student. I'm kind of trying to decide if it is better for me to invest in myself than set a set amount to put into like savings or stock accounts. I know you have a rule of about like 15%, but for me, I'm about to transition to maybe. I guess another question would be, is it okay to go into debt for a business property, kind of like a house, as long as it's just that, like not like car spending or anything like that.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, a house as a business property? What's that?

[Caller]

No, I mean if, like, if I took out a loan for a business property, would that be bad necessarily?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, it would be bad.

[Caller]

Go into debt over that at 20

[Dave Ramsey]

years old, you're in college, that'd be really bad. It'd be dumb. Why would you saddle yourself with that? So what are you studying in school?

[Caller]

Business management.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and when will you graduate?

[Caller]

Two years from now. But I'm kind of already phasing out to possibly just not finishing my degree. I'm making about $100,000 a year and I only work weekends. And so the amount of income I make for the time.

[Dave Ramsey]

What are you doing?

[Caller]

I build show trucks. You build what, like big lifted trucks, like audio Systems, lifted trucks, etc.

[Chris Hogan]

Are you bringing home 100,000, Jack? Is that like what you paid yourself or is that what the business brought in?

[Caller]

So I'm the sole owner, I only pay myself. That's what the business profited. But I mean, there's taxes and I still put money into. I put at least a $7,000 in my Roth IRA. That's like, my goal is, I'll always do that. But I'm like, I have a lot of cash stacked up and no debt. And so I have a lot of cash that I'm like, hey, I could maybe get a $80,000 piece of property, build a $50,000 shop on it. I could pay for half up front. And would it be a bad idea to necessarily take out a loan on something that I'll own instead of renting?

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I would stay right where you are until you can pay cash for that.

[Caller]

So just say, save up cash completely.

[Dave Ramsey]

We own real estate that our businesses are in. We pay cash for it as we go, we move at the speed of cash, and that'll keep you from getting your pinched later when something turns down in this business. I also think that if you're studying a good business curriculum, you're probably going to learn some things in the next two years that you will use in your business for the rest of your life. I have a four year degree in business and finance and I use some of the things I learned 40 years

[Caller]

ago almost every Day, Sam, Dave, we

[Dave Ramsey]

got a lot of calls on this show where life happens.

[Caller]

One day someone's healthy, they're working, providing

[Dave Ramsey]

for their family, and then a curve ball hits. You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah. And that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Zander is essential because it protects your family if the worst happens. Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook and that's long term disability insurance. Yeah, it's important to understand the difference between them. Life insurance steps in when you die.

[Caller]

Disability insurance steps in while you're alive but can't work.

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Caller]

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[Dave Ramsey]

make all the difference.

[Caller]

Go to zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

[Dave Ramsey]

Protect yourself, protect your income, protect your family. If you have a simple tax situation like you haven't had any major life changes or big investments, use Ramsey Smart Tax. It's really affordable, makes filing super simple, and it has built in support in case you need a little help. Ramsey Smart Tax Filing early means you get the best deals and you get that tax stress off your shoulders. So as soon as you get all your tax documents, go to ramsey solutions.com smart tax and file quickly, easily and affordably. Oscar is with us in Orlando. Hi, Oscar, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey. I'm doing good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

That's good. So I currently have $2,000 in debt. Me and my wife. That's her credit card debt. I also have. That one's at a 17% interest rate. I also have 3053ish at a 30% interest rate on one of my credit cards and then $1,200 on another credit card at 0% interest rate and $2,800 in collections currently. And I also have my wife's car, which owes $10,000. And we currently are at 27% interest rate. And I have $8,800 cash. And I want.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have how much cash?

[Rachel Cruze]

8,800.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. Okay. All right.

[Caller]

So I don't know what I should do with it. Rather pay off the car because then I could pay it off within a month. And we've been making payments on it for three years now, and we already gave 8,000 towards the original $13,000 debt towards it. So I kind of just want to get rid of it. That way I don't have those extra $500 I could put towards my savings and then pay off the other debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

So how old are you guys?

[Caller]

I'm 20 and my wife's 21.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. Okay. And what's your. What's your. What's your household income, sir?

[Caller]

Right now my take home is a thousand three hundred bi weekly.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, all right, say that. How much again?

[Caller]

That's 2,600amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Does your wife work?

[Caller]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why?

[Caller]

He stays at home watching the kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, how many kids have you got?

[Caller]

I got one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And $2600 a month is your income?

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you're working 40 hours?

[Caller]

Yeah, sometimes 37, sometimes 40. Once I get my promotion, I'll be working 50, and then my income will jump up. When is that a new job? That's probably in about two more months.

[Chris Hogan]

What are you doing?

[Caller]

Oscar for work manager, Chipotle.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay, okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because you're not making any money.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[Chris Hogan]

Are you guys able to pay rent? How much is your rent or mortgage?

[Caller]

So currently we're living with her parents because my collections is on the other apartment I have. When I used to sell cars, I used to make like 4 to 5,000amonth. But I got another job and I'm trying to, like, change my career path and just get more steady income.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't mind if it's not steady if you're making twice what you're making now.

[Caller]

Yeah, I didn't like it either.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay. There's that.

[Caller]

Yeah, that's the biggest thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

So have you kind of. I mean, just listening to your situation and your story, you're 20 years old with a baby. You live with her parents. You make $2,600 a month.

[Rachel Cruze]

And.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you apparently don't read anything before you sign debt because you've got some of the worst debt products on the planet. I mean, everything you had was north of 20%. Like, do you like say, come over here? I like getting screwed? I mean, you like signed up for everything possible. That was horrible. How do you do that?

[Caller]

No. So my credit cards that I got, I paid the rent from my last apartment that I had with it once I lost my job because there was a job that I had lined up that I didn't get and that kind of messed me up. So I just used my credit cards to pay it. And then as far as the car, I told her not to do it because I was working at the car dealership and I was able to get her a better deal. But it was, it was a rough time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I mean, like, you guys need to figure out a different way of looking at life. So you don't sign up for anything ever that looks like this again because you're getting tattooed by everybody on the planet. I never saw anything like this. This is a mess. Okay, so the bad news is you don't make a lot of money and you've got some debt. The good news is $20,000 makes you debt free. Yeah, completely debt free. You need $20,000 and you have 8,800. So really $10,000 makes you debt free. And you're only working 40 hours, so you need to be working an additional 40 hours starting right now somewhere else. In addition to what you have now, you need two more part time jobs and you need to pile up some money so you can get out of your mother in law's house.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, make it a goal, Oscar, to make an extra two grand a month. Whether it's Uber Eats, like whatever it is that you're just doing something.

[Dave Ramsey]

I would list my desk smallest to largest and use the 7800 will clear off almost everything except the car and leave $1,000 in your emergency fund. And I would list these debts smallest to largest. So the 1200 is gone, the 2000's gone. The 2800 is gone. I think the whole 3000 is gone. Right at it. I'm going to knock out all of those and all you got left is the car. And then $2,000 a month extra and you start throwing everything you can at that car. Maybe $3,000 a month at that car. And you'll be done in two or three, four or five months. Five months max. But you need to create some extra Income until this Chipotle promotion comes along. Because you guys don't make any money. You're starving to death. Okay? And. But yeah, you could clean this up with the money you have in the bank. Everything but the car. And. And then go get three extra jobs and work like a crazy man. But the two of you need to look at each other and go, okay, we have done our last stupid thing. We are not signing up for any more debt. We suck at picking out debt. I mean, 27% on a car. Good God. I mean, really? And we can't do this and survive. We're going to live at your mother's the rest of our life if we do this. So never again. And next time, I can't pay my rent. I just can't pay my rent. I don't put it on a credit card. We have to work with a landlord instead of the credit card company. You choose your poison. We don't borrow money anymore. Oscar, you guys have. You've stepped in every bear trap known to man.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah. And you guys are young, but honestly, I would sit down with her and look out in five years and say, hey, when we're 26 years old, where

[Dave Ramsey]

do we want to be?

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, what's a. What's a dream scenario? What kind of career do I want to be in? What kind of house or area of Orlando we want to live? Like, start actually creating some of this, like, future thinking. And that sometimes does help when there's like a crisis right there in the present, right where you're like, nope, that's not getting us to where we want to be. And so it helps you stop. But if you. If you're still on the line, Oscar, we'll have Christian pick up and get you Ken Coleman's book Find the Work youk're Wired to Do. And there's an assessment in the back. And it's very helpful just to start thinking through what you want your career to be so that you can up your income long term throughout your life.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. If you're making $4,000 a month and you hate it, if you're not doing anything illegal or wrong or unethical, keep making $4,000 a month until you find something making $5,000 a month that you like. You don't just go, I don't like doing this. I'm going to quit and move in with my mother in law. Bad choices. You keep working until you have something to move to. You don't. You don't stop the income flow. And so, yeah, these are the mistakes you've made that have gotten you here. And so what you need to do is assess. When I went broke all those years ago when I was 28, I had to look and say, okay, what were the stupid butt decisions I made? And there were plenty of them that put me in this situation so I don't ever get back in this situation again. And that's all I'm telling you to do is the same thing I had to do. And you can do it. You can do it. But if you keep doing what you've been doing, you're going to keep getting what you've been getting, too. And quit trying to figure out the interest rates on these things other than stay away from them. That's a good plan. So. Wow.

[Chris Hogan]

Well, just a lot of credit cards and cut up all the credit cards tonight. You listed out three of them for us. Just get rid of them. Just say we're gonna do something totally different with our money.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, we're gonna be on debit cards and a budget on every dollar. Christian will get you a copy of Ken's book because I don't think you chose Chipotle because it was your debate. Chipotle, however you say it. I don't. Apparently you don't even need to go there. I don't know. But the I don't think you picked that place. I think you just fell into that instead of going, I always wanted to manage a restaurant. I don't think you said that out loud. Foreign.

[Caller]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. I am right here because some extraordinary women in my life, mentors, friends, my wife, my mom, because they're all amazing. And one of the common themes I've heard from all of them is that between the responsibilities and expectations that the world places on them and the expectations they place on themselves, women are under incredible pressure every day. And they're often encouraged to overlook their own emotional well being to care for others. Therapy offers a space for women to learn how to navigate those competing expectations, set healthy boundaries, and communicate what they want and what they need to do that. I Recommend Better Help. BetterHelp is an online therapy platform that matches you with a licensed therapist based on your goals and your preferences. You can message your therapist and schedule sessions right in the platform. And with over 30,000 therapists, they have the right person for you. And if the first therapist isn't the right fit, you can switch anytime at no additional cost. Your emotional well being matters. Find support in therapy. Visit betterhelp.com Ramsey to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H-E-L-P.com Ramsey.

[Dave Ramsey]

Matt is in Fort Worth, Texas. Hi, Matt. How are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

Good.

[Caller]

How are you doing today?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So I've been trying to help my mom get out of debt for the past three years. She wants to retire in three years, but I can't get her Gazelle and debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wait a minute. You're kind of breaking up. Can you get with where your phone is still and is working? Try again.

[Caller]

Yeah. I've been trying to help my mom get out of debt for three years and she's retiring in three years as well. Or she wants to, but I can't get her to become gazelle. Intense.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. She's broke and staring down the barrel of retiring broke but won't fix it. Why?

[Caller]

I have no clue. I've asked and I've prodded and I've tried to get her to. To see how scary it could be retiring if nothing. But.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are you?

[Caller]

I'm 25. How old is she turning 60 this year?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, she's not going to retire at 63 because she's not going to have any money.

[Caller]

Yeah, she thinks she has a pension plan, but that's. I've already looked and I've been helping her with her finances and I don't see it working for her for covering all her expenses and still her debt.

[Chris Hogan]

How much debt does she have currently?

[Caller]

40,000 total.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay, what's it in?

[Caller]

20,000 in student loans, 16,000 in personal loans from credit cards, and then 4,000 in a remaining credit card.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay. Did she go to school? The student loans, was that hers or was it a parent plus loan?

[Caller]

She was going to school, but she. She didn't finish her last class. And so these are just the remaining student loans.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay.

[Caller]

From her own degree.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So when you sit and say, mom, this is serious, if you don't fix this, you're going to be up a creek without a paddle. What does she say?

[Caller]

She kind of laughs it off.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And. And we've. We've gone through the baby steps and.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, we haven't. You have. She hasn't done anything except laughter.

[Caller]

Yeah, my wife and I, we've done it and I tried using that as. Look at, look at what we've kind of been able to do. You could kind of live like this as well, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

I don't know. It's not clicking.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah. It's a hard reality when you realize you can't force people to do anything. You can't say the right thing well enough to get them to see this or that. I mean, like, there is a point in an adult's life that they have to make a decision on what they're going to do. And she's telling you through her decision making of what she's gonna do. And so there's a part, Matt, that I hate to say it. I think you've done everything that you can possibly do to help her.

[Dave Ramsey]

I probably have one closing conversation. It's mom, I'm not gonna bring this up again unless you bring it up. If you need some help, if you want some coaching, fine. I'm going to be giving you zero money when you're old, so you probably should figure this out. But I'm not gonna beg you to do this stuff anymore. I want you to win with money more than you want to win with money. And I'm through talking to you about this and you laughing when I do it. So we're not gonna talk about this subject anymore unless you call me and say, help me, and I will help you by teaching you. I will never help you by giving you money, period. And then end it. Just drop it. Because you're not making any progress. You're beating your head against a rock. And she's not changing. She doesn't want advice. And so one of the things I figured out when I started doing this show years ago is I quit answering questions that people didn't ask. Yes, you know.

[Chris Hogan]

Yes, I know.

[Dave Ramsey]

I quit coming into someone's life and presenting myself as the answer to your questions that you're not asking. If you ask a question, I'll help you. I'm obligated then to answer your question. But I'm not going to just walk up to somebody randomly in my life and go, hey, that's stupid.

[Chris Hogan]

I know.

[Dave Ramsey]

But if you ask me, I'll tell you that's stupid. I love you enough to tell you the truth.

[Chris Hogan]

And what's frustrating, Matt, is what you've experienced, you and your wife at 25, of going through the baby steps and doing this and probably paying off debt and having an emergency fund and retirement. And you're seeing the progress. And you look over at someone you love, like your mom, and you're like, you could be doing this exact same thing. And so the motivation is totally understandable where you're coming from. But you have to understand the result is not. You have no control over that at all. At all. And so there's a part you have to Love.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you start winning at something, you want it for the people you love 100%. You can't make them do it.

[Chris Hogan]

I know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like, you know, I've got a friend that lost 100 pounds and his wife didn't. And he. He's frustrated with her. And I'm like, dude, you know, that was you just a few years ago. So you decide that you had to make the decision you have to make. You can't. Your wife's not gonna lose weight because you want her to. She's gonna lose weight when she wants to. Nobody got you to lose weight until you wanted to. Same thing. You gotta make these choices. You can't. But he feels so much better, and he feels his dignity coming back. You know, his clothing fits all this kind of stuff. And he wants that for somebody that he loves, and he can't. But you can't make somebody else do want something. You can only present to them what it's done for you. This is what's worked for me. You've done that. And then I would have one closing conversation and say, I'm not gonna bring this up again. But also, be forewarned. I will not be writing you checks because I've tried to help you, and I'm not going to be writing you checks at any point in your life. It's not gonna happen. So you should figure this out. This should scare you. Where you are is scary. And if it doesn't, I can't help you. If you want some coaching, some advice, I'll be happy to show you what we did. I would be honored. I'd be excited to show you what we did. But I'm not gonna bring it up again unless you do and just drop it. That's what I would do. And then move on to the next thing. You can't. You know, the problem with most of us is we love somebody. We see them doing something that's hurtful to themselves, and we want them to be healed more than they want to be healed.

[Chris Hogan]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And we want them to have a quality spiritual walk more than they want to. We want them to lose weight more than they want to. We want them to get out of debt more than they want to. And that's not unusual. That's a. Most of us have had that experience. We want something for someone we love more than they want it, and you just kind of have to stand back and go, dad, gum, I just can't.

[Chris Hogan]

Well, and it's a weird feeling, too. This is always funny saying next to you, saying, this. But Matt, as a 25 year old is doing better financially than his mom. And when you become an adult and you start to outpace your parents in any level of life, that is a weird feeling. And so, Matt, you're kind of grappling with this. Like, I'm more of an adult. I'm more. I'm like the parent in this situation, Matt, is how you're probably feeling. And that's a weird role reversal. And you don't have to do that. But that's part of growing up too, is seeing that and being like that feels so strange. But I feel like I've passed my parents in whatever the category is in life. And so that's part of adulthood too, Matt, with your mom, sadly, yeah, that's

[Dave Ramsey]

just part of the thing. So.

[Chris Hogan]

And I was trying to think, what category have I passed you in? Dave, Then I think.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think you've raised better kids than I did.

[Chris Hogan]

Insult toward me.

[Dave Ramsey]

Unbelievable. You're better at parenting than I was.

[Chris Hogan]

No, no. I laugh all the time, though, because sometimes my kids, if they say something to me, I've used this line multiple times. Every parenting expert's probably like, that's terrible. But I always am. Like, if I ever had said that to Papa and Mimi growing up, fill in the blank with my consequences, it

[Dave Ramsey]

would not have gone well for my health.

[Chris Hogan]

I know you all old school parents get away. Yeah, they do. They. We discipline. But also, y' all ran a tight ship growing up. Probably tighter than Winston. I do, but yeah. It's so funny.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's all kinds of ways you've passed us up. Rachel. It's okay. It's all good. You just gave me an underhand pitch I couldn't resist. It was T ball.

[Chris Hogan]

That's good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. The thing is, when you're trying to convince someone in your life that you care about about, all you can do is not tell them what they're doing wrong. Instead, just show them what you've done. And I can't tell you, you know, how many ways things you can do to fix your life. But I can say, this is what I did, and I feel this way now. I had this experience. No one can take your experience away from you. So just tell people your story.

[Chris Hogan]

And in the marriage context, Dr. John DeLoney talks about this all the time when you're trying to get your spouse on board, use I statements versus you. Well, you're doing this. You're doing this. Yeah. So much about your story and what's going on inside of you is going to be the thing that's going to possibly move you someone to a different action, but also it puts the self responsibility on you and not that you're trying to implement and change someone else because at the end of the day you're not going to be able to. If you're looking for a more budget friendly way to save on medical costs and stay true to your values, Christian Healthcare Ministries is a great option to think about. CHM is not health insurance. It's a health cost sharing ministry. A biblical community based way for Christians to share each other's medical bills. That means no enrollment deadlines and you can choose any doctor or hospital you want. That kind of freedom is big, especially if you're self employed between jobs or you just need something that fits your budget better. CHM has been around for decades faithfully serving the Christian community and many members save hundreds of dollars a month compared to traditional health insurance. And that margin gives you breathing room when you're working the baby steps and trying to steward your money well. And right now CHM's offering new members a 50% credit towards their first month of membership. Get [e-mail] budget and use promo code RAMSEY. That's chministries.org budget and promo code Ramsey.

[Dave Ramsey]

Jimmy is in Atlanta. Hi Jimmy, welcome to the Ramsey Show.

[Caller]

I appreciate you taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller]

I got some on the run by. I just turned 65 about two weeks ago. Been self employed most of my life. Semi retired for last year. I own five houses that are paid for except for mine it still has about $175,000 mortgage and four and a quarter. We have no debt to speak of. We have income approximately 100 grand a year. That doesn't include the rentals with the five houses. Two of the houses I've got to remodel completely and I've already remodeled two out of my pocket. Total value of the properties are Prop 2.2 and I have just under 400k in a money market and I've bought 2 houses. The last 2 I paid cash for and I remodeled out of my pocket. My question is your thoughts on these DSCR loans that I'm considered doing one of those and modeling the other?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, well I wouldn't. I don't teach people to borrow money Jimmy, because I have found that the fastest way to wealth is to get out of debt and stay out of debt and that's why you've worked so hard to be out of debt and so you have 400k that you can do the remodel with.

[Caller]

Yeah, but I've seen that dwindle down from about seven to four. And I've got.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because you. Because you've been doing remodels.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

And your net worth didn't go down. Your net worth went up because the value of the property went up because you remodeled it by more than the cost of the remodel.

[Caller]

Well, last two houses at $400,000 houses, I paid 120 for one and 150 for the other. And I've got two more that I could possibly pick up. And that's why I was wont to hang onto my cash and use one of these to remodel the.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm not going to tell you to go into debt to buy real estate. I'm not going to tell you to go into debt for anything. I own several hundred million dollars worth of real estate and 100% of it is paid for and we remodel 100% of it with cash or we don't do it. And even if you were going to go into debt, the DSCR loan is not a good loan because it's a higher interest rate than a standard loan.

[Caller]

I've been quoting six and a half. Six and three quarter.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, it's a higher interest rate than a standard loan. That's what I just said. Yeah. And so, yeah, it's not a good bargain. So why are you wanting to pay a subprime rate to borrow money when you have the cash in the bank to do the job? Absolutely not. I wouldn't do that. I kind of think you're going to, but you ask me and I wouldn't do it. I would pay cash for the remodel or I'd dump one of these properties and take the cash out of that and move it around. If some of these properties are not fun and you rather be in a different property, that's fine. I've got a couple up for sale now. I'm going to do some 1031s on, do some tax deferred exchanges on some of the properties. We've got to re situate some of our portfolio of real estate. You could do some of that, but definitely not going to borrow money. Definitely not.

[Chris Hogan]

And you don't need to either, Jimmy. It's not like you don't have anything, right? I mean, it's not like it's. Okay, well, we have no money. You have money. So just pause on buying a new property and use that to remodel and up the other ones or yeah. Or sell them.

[Caller]

Or dump them.

[Dave Ramsey]

Or dump them and use that money to buy the other ones. I don't care. But there's no way I would tell you to go into debt. It's not going to make your dreams come true. It's going to make your nightmares come alive. Lee is with us in Leah is with us in Cincinnati. Hi, Leah, how are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes. So my husband and I, we have six year old boy, girl, twins, and when they were born, I cut back and I currently only work very part time and he's the breadwinner and we have term life insurance as you recommend for his salary. But my little boy is profoundly autistic, so he requires lifelong care. If anything were to happen to me, should I also have a life insurance policy for the same amount that we have my husband for? Because he would have to take on that caretaker role and he would no longer be able to do the work that he does.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, all stay at home moms should have that. Do not create an income. Should have life insurance on them to replace the duties that they have. Yours is accentuated with the autism situation, but still just the same. When Sharon had littles at home, when Rachel was small, we had life insurance on Sharon because if something happens to Sharon, I gotta bring Mary Poppins in so I can work and I have to pay her. And so then you figure out what the actual marketplace value of a stay at home mom is. Because they do a lot. They tutor, they keep the home clean, they make supper, laundry, laundry. They do all this stuff. I mean, there's this huge, huge number of things. If you have to pay someone to do all of these things, you're gonna find out that it's, you know, it's a 40 or a $50,000 a year job.

[Chris Hogan]

Would you have a special needs trust for him? Would you?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, we have all of that. We've got everything taken care of.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, we have the only, we only have our mortgage. That's the only debt. We have everything. We have the 529s because I have two other children as well. But my, my life insurance policy is only $25,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you need 500 on you.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Or more.

[Chris Hogan]

I mean, maybe more.

[Dave Ramsey]

500. 500.

[Chris Hogan]

If you're healthy, Leah, and you're young. How old are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm 36.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, it'll be, it will be so inexpensive. I almost would get, I mean, well,

[Dave Ramsey]

500 would create a $50,000 income stream that would allow him to hire Mary Poppins to come in and help.

[Chris Hogan]

I think you're.

[Dave Ramsey]

But if you, if you, if you want to spend more than that or if you wanted to replace his income, then you would have that amount and have him not working outside the home at all, which is probably not what's going to happen, but. Could be. Could be.

[Chris Hogan]

Or he could pull back some. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, again, if everybody, if you're, if you're not overweight and you don't smoke. Term life insurance is unbelievably cheap.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Chris Hogan]

That's why, Leah, I almost would just, just for out of safety, because it's not that much more expensive.

[Dave Ramsey]

Get in touch with Zander and price it out. Price out 500, price out a million, and just go, okay, what do I want? It's the cost of a pizza for you. It really is. It's zanderinsurance.com. just call them. And we've been advertising for them for years. And people are blown away at how little life insurance costs. And once you see how little it costs you, it's like, why doesn't everybody have good life insurance to take care of their families if something happens to them? Yeah. So, yeah, you're very wise to ask that question. It's a very valid question. And by the way, it works for anyone who's got a stay at home situation. Yours has got an extra twist on it because of the extra challenges you guys have. But. But it doesn't invalidate the other ones either. So. Yeah, do all of that. Every bit of it. Very cool stuff. Very cool. Open phones here at Triple 882-5-5225. Jessica is in right quick. Jessica, what's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

So I just filed my taxes for 2025 and we owe the IRS about seven grand.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you have seven grand?

[Rachel Cruze]

We do not. And we also have a baby on the way, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you have any money?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, but we're saving that for like when I'm off work and no, honey,

[Dave Ramsey]

you owe the irs. You don't get to choose between what you pay the IRS and then you figure out how to not do that. That no way. You do not want them on you. The penalties and the interest you're getting ready to take on make you wish you'd done a payday. Lender. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. So how much do you have saved for when you take time off?

[Rachel Cruze]

About 2,400.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And what's your household income?

[Rachel Cruze]

Is about 1:20.

[Dave Ramsey]

And why did you miss your taxes that far?

[Rachel Cruze]

They didn't, apparently. I, they went, my job went off the new tax table. I don't see that. I could see like 3,000 being off, but not that much. So. And I was just trusting that I was getting enough taken out and I didn't look at my pay stuff.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Yeah. So what I would do is pay whatever you have towards the, towards the irs. And then I would pay the IRS off as fast as you possibly can. And then very quickly I would start stacking up money for you to take some time off. You make enough money to do all of that, but you're gonna do nothing else. Don't talk to me about going out to eat and don't talk to me about vacations and don't talk to me about a $10,000 nursery for the new baby. You have a freaking tax problem and a savings problem you gotta fix before you do any of that kind of stuff. When you've saved up and paid cash for a reliable used car, you want that thing to last. And the best way to keep it running for the long haul is to take care of it with people you trust. That's why I'm proud to welcome Christian Brothers Automotive as the official auto repair partner of the Ramsey Show. At Christian Brothers, they treat you like family. You'll get digital vehicle inspections so you can see exactly what your technician sees. A complimentary shuttle to keep you moving. And every repair is backed by their nationwide nice difference warranty. They've even been ranked number one by JD Power for customer satisfaction among aftermarket full service maintenance and repair providers six years in a row. Visit jdpower.com awards for the details. So if you want your paid for car to keep going and going, trust Christian Brothers Automotive, visit cbac.comramsey to find your local shop and get an exclusive Ramsey discount of 10% off your visit.

[Chris Hogan]

10% off up to a $250 value.

[Dave Ramsey]

See store for detail. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Rachel Cruze Ramsey, personality number one best selling author and my daughter is my co host. Today Abby is with us in Oklahoma City. Hi Abby. How are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

Better than I deserve. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

I know that you say bankruptcy is very very bad, but I was wondering if there's any situations where it may be the only way out. I am 34, I'm a single mom of two kids and I am over $90,000 in debt and I bring in about 64,000 a year working three jobs, so I feel like I'm drowning. And I've been doing the baby steps for like six months, but really, like going in deep with it. Seriously, for about three months. And I just don't see, like a way out. And I found out recently when I went to try and do get out of my car loan that I'm $17,000 upside down. So I just don't know what to do.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry. You're scared.

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm very scared. I have a 13 year old and a one year old.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

And my one year old has very complex medical issues. So the.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much do you owe on your car?

[Rachel Cruze]

37,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so you bought a car that you can't afford and it has made this whole thing happen?

[Rachel Cruze]

Pretty much, yeah. My car loan is $850 a month.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good God. And what is the rest of the debt? The other 50,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

So I have 30,000 student loans, 13,000 medical, 6,500 to my grandma, 2,200 in a payday loan when I was desperate. And I owe 2,300 to my lawyers.

[Dave Ramsey]

For what?

[Rachel Cruze]

Child support for my baby.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is the child support coming in?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good.

[Rachel Cruze]

We're just still going back and forth because he owes me 26,000 in arrears.

[Chris Hogan]

Do you think you'll get that?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Chris Hogan]

You do? Okay. When will that come, do you know?

[Rachel Cruze]

Anytime between the next 10 days and if we have to go to trial over it, up to a year. But I will 100% get it.

[Dave Ramsey]

He has it.

[Rachel Cruze]

It's just. Oh, he has it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

He just doesn't want to give it. He wants to be told he has to give it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Yeah, well, we'll tell him. That's good. We can help him with that.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, so you owe 37 on your car and someone told you your car is worth 20. Like the dealer said that's what they would give you for it.

[Rachel Cruze]

I went to 13 different dealerships and the highest I was quoted was 22.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay, well, that's because they're all buying it at wholesale. Dealers do not pay retail for a car. They sell cars at retail, but they buy them at wholesale. And so who do you owe the 37,000 to?

[Rachel Cruze]

Santander.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is that?

[Rachel Cruze]

It's a bank.

[Chris Hogan]

A local bank?

[Rachel Cruze]

No, it's one of those Will finance anybody. Deal.

[Dave Ramsey]

So your interest rates 15%?

[Rachel Cruze]

16 and a half.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay, I'm sorry. All right, so.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I tried. I had good credit when I got this loan, so I don't really know what Happened.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know what happened. You signed a loan that you shouldn't have signed. That's what happened. You screwed. You allowed them to screw you. Oh, my gosh. You got. You got taken to the cleaners.

[Rachel Cruze]

I did. I. My engine was dying on my other car, and I had a newborn baby, and I went in, and they saw a helpless person.

[Chris Hogan]

Desperate.

[Rachel Cruze]

Me.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah, they got you. They got you coming and going. Okay, so number one, the answer to your question is bankruptcy is not really your problem. Not going to solve your problems. Okay. Because the only way the car goes away in bankruptcy is if the car goes away.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And the student loans are not bankruptible.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So that's. The two of those things are most of the debt. Oh, and by the way, you're not going to bankrupt your granny either.

[Rachel Cruze]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so that's the one. I had those three things together that you're not going to bankrupt on. Or, you know, then you really haven't accomplished anything by filing bankruptcy because you're going to have to pay the student loans and grandmother, and you're going to get the car repoed, which you could do without bankruptcy. That's not a problem. Just quit paying it. They'll come get it.

[Rachel Cruze]

You know, so it's okay to let

[Dave Ramsey]

it repo before you'd file bankruptcy because you're going to lose it in bankruptcy anyway. Right?

[Caller]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

I just didn't know if that was.

[Caller]

Have you just.

[Dave Ramsey]

Kelly, I don't want you to do that. That's not my suggestion. But before we file bankruptcy, my point is, bankruptcy is not doing anything for you.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because the car, the student loans, and grandma. So you end up bankrupting on $2,000 worth of stuff or something here. That's silly. No, we're not going to do that. All right, so. But let's try to get you out of this mess. So, you know, I'm gonna look up on kelley Blue Book, kbb.com what private sale is on that car, and you're gonna find it's more like 28,000, but you're still 10,000 in the hole. You're not 17 in the hole, but you're probably 10. And I don't doubt. What kind of car is it?

[Rachel Cruze]

24 Ford Edge.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, geez. Okay. Boy, did they get you. Sold you a piece of crap car on top of it.

[Rachel Cruze]

But anyway, at least it's not a Chevy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, it's. No, it's. There's a lot of Chevys that are better than that. Anyway, the. Yeah. So we need to get Rid of the car. Let's try to figure out how we can sell it to an individual for 25, 28, something like that. Then where are we going to come up with the 10 difference? Any ideas?

[Chris Hogan]

I'm praying that this check comes in.

[Dave Ramsey]

Any ideas?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, I've just been hanging on to getting that payment.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so if that comes in, you sell the car the next day and you write a check for the difference.

[Chris Hogan]

Yep. And then you free up almost $900 a month.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And that. That takes care of that. And then you use some of the money to buy you a five or six thousand dollars car that you pay cash for.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And your student loans are on hardship deferral anyway. You're not paying them right now anyway, Right?

[Rachel Cruze]

I've been paying like $50 a month on them.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I wouldn't. I call them up and put them on hardship deferral. Let's just put them on hardship for six months and let's work on some of this other stuff. So. But we need. The primary thing we got to do is figure out a way to get out of this car sooner rather than later. So if it's going to be a year, I don't want you driving this car. A year. It's going to be a year before you get the child support money. So if you're not going to get the child support money anytime soon, then we got to find $10,000. Any other places you can get it?

[Rachel Cruze]

I mean, I could go into more debt with my grandmother. I just don't want to.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I don't want to do that. Any chance you could borrow 5,000, $10,000 from the credit union?

[Rachel Cruze]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

You shut your credit.

[Rachel Cruze]

I lost my job when I was seven months pregnant. And it. I couldn't get another one until recently. And so I used my entire savings, everything. And so my credit is now not great.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Abby, you're not bankrupt. I don't know how much pain you're going to be in with this car before you get out of it, but that's going to be the answer. And that's the way through, because the car is the problem. You hang on. I'm going to have Christian pick up. I'm going to get you with one of our financial counselors, Ramsey trained counselors, as our gift. We're not going to charge you a dime. We're going to take care of you because you're out there by yourself and you're alone and. And it's really scary. And we're going to help you, okay? When you're drowning in credit card debt and collectors start threatening lawsuits, a rep from some call center debt relief company can't protect you. A lot of so called debt relief programs leave people wondering, am I actually protected if I get sued? When all you've got is a legal plan added on as an upsell, of course you feel stuck. But Guardian isn't another debt relief company. They're real attorneys. And with Guardian, you're assigned an attorney from day one. That means if a creditor sues, you're not scrambling and you're not hit with surprise legal fees. Now look, I'm telling you straight, Debt settlement isn't pretty. I'd rather see you get out of debt the old fashioned way. But if you're out of options and you're staring down bankruptcy, Guardian gives you real protection and a path forward. Guardian's attorneys have helped over 55,000 people across the country settle more than $600 million in debt. Not with gimmicks, with legal expertise. So if you want real help instead of a sales pitch, go to guardianlit.com Ramsey that's guardianlit.com Ramsey Attorney Advertising Results may vary and no specific outcome is guaranteed. Ashley is in Dallas. Hi Ashley, how are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm good. How are you doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. How can we help?

[Rachel Cruze]

So my husband is a business owner and when we got married, I signed a prenuptial agreement, you know, saying what's his is his and what's mine is mine. Since then I've had our daughter, I'm a stay at home mom and I get told, you know, this is not mine. I don't have any say in the finances. I don't know how much money we're making or if we're making any at all. And, but I get asked to do paperwork to do this for the business, do this and this, but I am not included in the said business.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you mean paperwork?

[Rachel Cruze]

Like whenever something needs paid, it's. They put it on me. Like you need to call and pay these bills or you need to get this insurance updated or can you fix this for the store? Like constantly I'm getting told to do work for free basically.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well you're obviously not okay with this situation. So what has happened to make progress so that it's not this way anymore? I assume you've had a discussion with your husband. Like, I'm not okay with this.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, in the beginning I didn't have anything to do with any of the stories at all. I wasn't helping with anything. I just Kind of stayed home with our daughter or. Not at the time, we didn't have our daughter, but I just kind of stayed home when I was pregnant and when we had our daughter. But over time, I'm getting dragged into it. I'm being asked to do a lot of stuff. When I get asked, can I be added into anything in the business so I have financial security for myself or if I can know any of the details about the bank accounts or anything like that? I'm told no, that this is not my business and it's theirs and it's not mine.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Outside of it's. Who's theirs?

[Rachel Cruze]

My husband and his partner.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Chris Hogan]

Outside of the business, Ashley, do you have access to money at home? Do you know what's sitting in your

[Rachel Cruze]

money to pay bills? There is never money. Put in our personal checking account. Everything. They use money from the business checking account for everything, which I do not have access to.

[Chris Hogan]

To pay your home bills. Your husband is functioning out of the business account?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Chris Hogan]

Do you think something sketchy is going on?

[Rachel Cruze]

No. No. I. I mean, it's a small business. It's nothing big. They have a few locations for it.

[Chris Hogan]

Your husband's kind of a jerk. Do you agree?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Chris Hogan]

Okay. Probably work on that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Like when prenuptials are involved. At what point? Because I know when you. Y' all say, like, when you get married, everything's supposed to be confined. At what point is a prenuptial in a disagreement?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, here's the thing. It has nothing to do with the prenuptial. Prenuptial dictates what happens at divorce. It doesn't dictate what happens during the marriage.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

It just says upon divorce, he gets his business. You don't get it. That's all it says. Okay, But a prenuptial is not a thing that says. Okay. You are now a woman that's not allowed to ask any questions about her husband's business. That's not what a prenuptial does. It's not how it functions. Okay, so he had you do a prenuptial because he's a jerk, not because he owns anything of substance.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so he doesn't own enough for this business is not that big a deal. It's not nearly as big a deal as he thinks he is. He's, you know, so, you know, you. You don't have a prenuptial problem, and you don't have a financial problem. You have a desperately bad marriage problem.

[Rachel Cruze]

So should I leave? Because at this Point. It's getting a very questionable. Because it's putting too much on my mental toll.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, no, I'm not telling you to leave. I'm telling you to work on your marriage, but quit defining it as a prenuptial problem or he's got a control problem at the office. No, he's got problems. And we need to be in marriage counseling working on him treating his wife and child better. Because number one, from a business perspective, we coach 10,000 small businesses. We tell every one of them, do not pay any personal bills out of your business account ever. It's bad business. It's bad accounting. Your home electric bill is not deductible as a business expense, and so you should not be paying it out of your business account. You take money from the business that's profitable home and you pay home bills with that. That's just good business practices. So he's not real good at business either.

[Chris Hogan]

And you're not. And you're not signing your name personally to anything, Ashley, are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

No. Good.

[Dave Ramsey]

He just wants her to do some of the accounting.

[Chris Hogan]

I know, I've just listened to too many podcasts.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I hear you. Well, that there's money too many of ours.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, no, that too, but money being sent in the Cayman's and Ashley's names on it and then the law comes after her. That's just what I didn't want. I went extreme for a second, but she seems clueless. You seem clueless. And what's going on because. No, you have no information, so I just want you silence stuff. Yes, they're telling you to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like for instance, if you sign. If he's not filing his taxes properly and you sign the joint return, you're on the line. You're. You just signed up for the tax problem.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, we filed separately this tax season.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And the season before that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Before that we did not file together. I don't think. We've only.

[Chris Hogan]

How long have I been married?

[Rachel Cruze]

We've only been married one year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

But we've been together three or four years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Ashley, you have a tremendous marriage problem, hon. That's what you've got. And we're not able to work on that in this setting. Effectively, we're not able to help you with that, but we can just help you identify that. So the situation you have, you're not crazy. It's weird and it's wrong. I can tell you that just as a dad, just as a grandpa, as a husband, if you're my daughter, as a husband, a friend, I would Tell you to go to a marriage counselor. You need to go see a pastor, see a marriage counselor. And I don't end. I don't tell people to end marriages on this type of thing alone. But if this is the way you're going to be treated for the next 20 years, yeah, you shouldn't be there if there's no change. I would not ask someone to be in an abusive, toxic environment for 20 years. And I'm not going to tell you to do that. And that's what this is. This is abusive, toxic environment. And you don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure that out. You already knew that. But what I would do is say, I'm going to a marriage counselor. Are you coming? Because I'm considering ending this marriage. I'm not going to be treated this way anymore. And then go to a marriage counselor, even if he doesn't come and get some coaching and have someone in that kind of a setting, not a couple people on a podcast telling you to leave your husband. We're not going to sign up for that response. Responsibility. You should sit down with someone that guides you through this and gives him every chance to turn around before you end this. And then you systematically bring it to an end at some point, if there's zero change and zero hope that it's ever going to be any different.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, because the picture of health in exactly what you're explaining, like, we have friends and he does real estate deals, and she helps and does the books, but they pay, you know, like they pay a salary out of their company to them. And she doesn't necessarily get it because they're keeping stuff in the business and all of it. But, like, they see it as one. Like, we are, if we are a household and when we make money out of the business, it goes into the home. And whether you choose to, quote, unquote, get paid or not, it doesn't matter, because you guys are bringing home an income together that you're both in on. You're both working out of the same account. You're both doing this together. And so there's a healthy way to do everything you've just explained. You guys are just doing it completely backwards. And the way you're being treated is just horrific. Ashley, from what you've told us, I

[Dave Ramsey]

hope a counselor can help God get ahold of his heart. Because the heart that he has right now and the way that caused you to sign a prenup says, I like my business more than I like Ashley. That's what he's told you on the front end and you went, oh, I'm okay with that. And you signed up, and I'm not okay with that. And you aren't okay with it anymore either. So I wouldn't, I wouldn't marry a guy who likes his business more than likes me. Owning a business can be a heavy load. You want to serve your customers well, make a healthy profit and grow. And your team, family and customers are all counting on you. And now everybody's talking about AI like it's magic and you're wondering how to keep up. You're carrying a lot, but you don't have to do it all alone. That's where NetSuite comes in. Over 43,000 businesses, including Ramsey Solutions, use NetSuite to lighten the load by bringing all their numbers into one system. Accounting, inventory, CRM, payroll, the works. And now NetSuite's AI takes it further, automating busy work, flagging inventory issues, spotting cash flow problems in real time, and catching risks before they hit. So you're not just closing the books faster, you're making decisions confidently. And when your numbers are right, that takes a lot of pressure off your shoulders. And yet switching systems is a big move. But NetSuite's suite success process gets you up and running fast. Go to netsuite.comramsey for a free product tour and to schedule time with a NetSuite rep. That's NetSuite.com Ramsey. Samantha is in Cincinnati. Hi, Samantha. How are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

Hi, Dave. I'm good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

So I have, I have a boyfriend. We have a one year old. And it's always, when I make more money, we'll save more money. But now he's making three times the income that he was and we're still not saving. I mean, money burns a hole in his pocket. It's gone as soon as it gets it. So I just don't know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why are you not saving?

[Rachel Cruze]

Because I filed bankruptcy. So we, we did not get married. Just, I mean, honestly. Taxes, insurance, I get state insurance for the kids, and then I know, like, they'll count his income towards the bankruptcy. So we were trying to pay that off before we considered it.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, you're in a bankruptcy now?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, I'm in a chapter 13 where I pay it back.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And how long have you been in the chapter 13?

[Rachel Cruze]

Maybe like six months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and how much money do you owe?

[Rachel Cruze]

I think it's like, I think it went down to like 47,000 that I'm paying back.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and how much do you make?

[Rachel Cruze]

So I had a high risk pregnancy and took off work and I just actually started back.

[Dave Ramsey]

How are you paying a bankruptcy?

[Rachel Cruze]

He's. He, he pays it. So that's.

[Dave Ramsey]

He didn't file bankruptcy.

[Rachel Cruze]

I make sure the. Yeah, so he gives me the money for it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, he gives you the money so you can pay it?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So why didn't you get married? Because he's giving you the money for the bankruptcy anyway as if you were married.

[Rachel Cruze]

I think they're. I think there were. I think more. So he's worried about them taking. Because they take it if you make over so much. Like, you know, they tell you if you make over, like for.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, that's not true. Not if he doesn't file. Only if you file. You're in a bankruptcy and you need to get out of the bankruptcy and get it paid off. And he makes enough money to do that. You shouldn't have been in bankruptcy to start with. Yeah, okay, you got bad advice and he's looking for an excuse to not get tied into this. So you said kids. I thought you had one kid with him.

[Chris Hogan]

Him.

[Rachel Cruze]

I do. I have one kid with him. I have. And I have a kid prior.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Chris Hogan]

And is that child with you full time? Samantha? Both.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep, I have both full time.

[Chris Hogan]

How old are they?

[Rachel Cruze]

Eleven and one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. Well, so the answer to your. The reason I'm asking all these questions is the answer to your question is that that when you are married, your husband and the husband and wife join together and they do life together and they clean up debts together. And that way they don't have the freedom to blow the money because we have a mess to clean up. And so right now he's acting like he's dating you, not having children with you.

[Caller]

You.

[Dave Ramsey]

Which is way different.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right?

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, if he, you know, if you said my boyfriend who I date, not who I have kids with, but a guy that I date is blowing some of his newfound income, I would say, well, you have a boyfriend. That's irresponsible. Oh, darn. But you don't have a boyfriend. You have a husband and everything. Except legally, right?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, but I'm nervous. I feel nervous to get married because,

[Dave Ramsey]

well, if he's not worth marrying, he's not worth living with and doing life with.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, I guess that's true because it's

[Dave Ramsey]

the same stinking thing. The only difference is you put a piece of paper in place and then we decided we're going to Be two grownups that do life together.

[Rachel Cruze]

But if you recommend helping.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I would recommend that the two of you start seeing a couple's counselor and make plans to get married and then make plans for the two of you to combine your finances and get your bankruptcy dismissed and clear those debts. Working together and raising these two children together and build a beautiful life together over the next 10 years. But right now there's this disconnect in his brain between his responsibilities and his realities. He's acting out. He took. He got a huge raise and he goes and blows it all. He's acting like a single guy. Dude ain't single anymore, honey.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And he.

[Chris Hogan]

But the hard thing is there's no major leverage to pull because he's not married. You know what I mean? That's the messiness of.

[Dave Ramsey]

And here's the problem. Here's the problem. The number of couples that do what you all are trying to do, that succeed financially and relationally is very close to zero. The data is in. The statistics on shacking up and playing house are horrendous. It does not work. The number of people who become millionaires shacking up is almost zero. It's almost zero.

[Chris Hogan]

And not even the money piece, the relational piece, Samantha, you know, like, it's just because there's no. He doesn't. He doesn't have to commit to anything. He could choose tomorrow to walk out and there's no legal revocations, except possibly some testimony.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, child support.

[Chris Hogan]

Child support, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

But. Yeah, and you'd have to go after that in a weird way because it's not a divorce and not a breakup. So I think the two of you need to sit down and go, okay, we've been acting like a couple of 16 year olds in heat. And we're going to have to change that. We're going to have to actually be two grownups now and go and build a grown up adult like life where we are responsible to and for each other and to and for these children.

[Chris Hogan]

And. Yeah, I was gonna say, and there's a part too of like, we've created a human together. We don't have a choice on whether we're gonna choose to be adults or not. We have a child in this world. So we made that decision when we chose to do this.

[Dave Ramsey]

You got a 3x raise, what you used to make, and your wife sits in bankruptcy. These are not even things that should come out of someone's mouth. But it does because of the arrangement you all have allowed yourself to get into. And so what I would advise you is to go see a couples counselor and start working through some of these issues and sometime in the next 30 days, go see a judge or a pastor and get married. And then let's put our finances together, let's put our incomes together, let's put our problems together and let's put our dreams together and let's go live this life in a prosperous and fun, wealthy, healthy, relational way. And these children are going to grow up in a much better situation then and they're going to be much more functional.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, unless he's just a horrible person.

[Dave Ramsey]

If he is, why are you there?

[Chris Hogan]

That's right. Then you got to call it Samantha,

[Dave Ramsey]

then go the other way. Yes, yes, but I didn't hear that. All I heard is an irresponsible child.

[Chris Hogan]

No, I know, I know, but she's got three kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what I heard. Bless your heart. But that's what I would tell you to do. So I went places you didn't think you were going to go. You thought I was going to tell him how to straighten up and not overspend. But him overspending is a symptom of the situation you all put yourselves in with the choices you've made. That's what I would tell you, is to fix that. Because again, the Data on millionaires, 89% of them, 9 out of 10 millionaires did not become millionaires because of inheritance, which means they did it. And so you study how they live, what their habits are, what their processes are. If you want to be one of them, okay. And one of the things that keeps coming up over and over and over again is we saw almost zero. I mean, there was less than 4% were not married. And we're living with someone they weren't married to. They're all married. And 84% of them that are married, some of them are single. But 84% of them that were married said, I have a cooperative, aligned, goal setting spouse that works with me, not against me. And that's how we got here. We didn't get here by dragging a princess or dragging an irresponsible 16 year old little boy along the way against his wife. We didn't get to millionaire doing that. And so there's this. The data is in on this. It's ridiculous. The net worth of a single lady that's shacked up as compared to the net worth of a lady that's married at 35 years old is 13 times less. That's the data,

[Caller]

Sam.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, we wish we could get to every call and every question here on the show. And if you have a money question and you want an answer for your situation, here's a quick, easy way to do it. Go to our website, ramseysolutions.com and click on Ask Ramsey. Ask Ramsey is our free AI tool that's built and trained by proven Ramsey principles. See, if you don't know how AI works, AI is going to regurgitate, spit back out what it has in it. So it's only as good as the data set that's entered into it. And so if AI is researching everything in the entire web, it's got a bunch of junk in it. But if AI has only been fed the diet that you want it to eat, it's going to spit back out what you have fed. And so all of the last three years of shows us answering questions are dumped into this tool. All the books we've written are dumped into this tool. All the financial Peace University lessons are dumped into this tool. And so it has Every article on RamseySolutions.com all of our articles that we've written. So all of the knowledge base that you hear us putting forth here on the air is dumped into this tool. And then AI answers the question. It's almost as smart aleck as I am. It's crazy. Crazy. It's not quite. Actually, I want to add a little sarcasm to it, but you probably could

[Chris Hogan]

say, answer this like Dave would.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I bet it would probably get in your face then. Yeah, probably bust on you. Love you. Well, yeah. Ask your question [e-mail] it's completely free. Check Ask Ramsey ramseysolutions.com you're going to love this tool, by the way. It's very popular, a lot of people using it. All right. Jason is in Atlanta. Jason, how are you?

[Caller]

Great. How are y'? All?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve, sir. How can we help?

[Caller]

Well, about eight months ago, me and my wife decided we wanted her to be a stay at home mom. And that's about the same time that we heard about the baby steps and started listening to your podcast. And so far we paid off about 53, 000 in debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good for you.

[Caller]

About 8,000 left.

[Dave Ramsey]

Way to go.

[Caller]

But my wife's a teacher and, and when she quits in May, they're telling us that we can take her retirement out with no penalty because she's no longer an employee. But we also can't put any money back into her retirement.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's not true. No, no, stop, stop. That's not true. You misunderstood what they said. Or they were just in error. One of the two. You cannot take your retirement out with no penalty. You can take your retirement out without them withholding. But the IRS has a penalty.

[Caller]

Okay. Just paying taxes on it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And 10% penalty. Yeah. Taxes and 10%. So, no. No, we're not going to do that. How much has she got in her retirement?

[Caller]

Probably 10,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, not much. Okay, well, basically, if you cash that money out and use it, it's. It's going to hit you about 40%, 30% tax bracket, plus a 10% penalty. So it's kind of like borrowing $10,000 at 40% interest. Interest.

[Caller]

Oh, wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Wouldn't recommend it.

[Caller]

We should just move that to my retirement.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I'll just move it to an IRA with a SmartVestor pro. Get on Ramsey Solutions and find a smartvestor pro in your area and roll it. Anytime you leave a company, we tell you to roll your retirement into an IRA so you can control it and pick the. And pick some good mutual funds. So you have 8,000 left, and you've already paid off 53. And you've got until May to finish up.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Way to go, man. You've done so good.

[Chris Hogan]

Well done, y'.

[Caller]

All.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you make?

[Caller]

170.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay. So you guys can live on your income and Finish up the 8,000, right?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good. Good. Way to go, man. What do you do for a living?

[Caller]

I'm a lman.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, wow. Good for you. Excellent career. Excellent. Okay, cool. And so you're. How many babies have you got?

[Caller]

Got two along the way.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, so you're gonna be home with three babies. Very cool. And she's been a teacher, but she now wants to be home with the babies. That's awesome, man. And you're bringing home the bacon as alignment, and so y' all can afford to do that. And you cleaned up the 53 grand. Great job. Proud of you, man. Go get them, hero. Yeah, just knock the 8 grand out and roll the 10,000 over into an IRA. We don't want to. We don't want to give the government half of it just because it's a small amount. I still. If it's 100,000, you'd really never do it. But at 10,000, you're like, well, whatever, but it's still 4,000 bucks you're giving up for no apparent reason. So. No, I would roll that and just let it grow into an IRA and let it grow. Very, very good question. And again, congratulations. I'M proud of you. Tanya's in Richmond, Virginia. Hi, Tanya. How are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

Hi, Dave. Hey, guys, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey.

[Rachel Cruze]

So I am a mother of three and I have a faith driven entre. I am a faith driven entrepreneur and I have a business that's a baby, so she's only about 2 years old. I am a concierge therapist and I am trying to figure out. My question is how do I continue to grow my business successfully

[Caller]

with also

[Rachel Cruze]

trying to get out of debt? Personally, I feel like I'm using my business money a little too much for our personal debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Our. You're married?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what is his income?

[Rachel Cruze]

So he works for the government and he makes approximately about 70,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool. And what are you making profit on your concierge therapy business?

[Rachel Cruze]

So last year was my second year and profit was. Was approximately around 34,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not so much. Okay. And so is this like a concierge medical where you're getting a annual or a monthly fee and then you're just like on call as their therapist?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes. So what I do is I do fitness and wellness. So I go to people's homes. So I don't have the brick and mortar. So I don't have a lot of overhead head.

[Dave Ramsey]

So that's the coner part. That's the concierge part. Okay. Okay. So, yes. All right. And so where are you getting your clients?

[Rachel Cruze]

Word of mouth. I do a lot of networking. Like I network all the time. I have been doing my best to grind. Like I said, I want to be of what God's given me.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And that's awesome. And so how would having more money expand that part of the business? How would the business grow if you had more money in the business? Because you're not spending money, you're spending Hustle.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes. My goal is to eventually get a brick and mortar, so I would love to grow the business financially so that eventually I can get a brick and mortar.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. But my. You asked if I'm taking all the money out of the business to pay debt. I feel like I'm not growing the business. But you're not growing the business with any money. Money cost. You're growing the business with your sweat.

[Caller]

Oh,

[Rachel Cruze]

yeah, that's true.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you're not starving the business growth due to the money coming out to pay debts at home, but you're just not making much. I mean, 34,000. You're not, you know, you're not making any money yet. You need to be making three times that to start being to justify being a therapist, Right?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So I assume you're licensed.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, I am licensed, but I don't. I do private pay. I don't take.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I understand. But you and I know marriage counselors that make $150,000 a year.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. And so that's my point. You know, if you have a unique take on this, and I love the nuance of it, I think it's cool.

[Chris Hogan]

Tanya is there because you said you have three kids. Do you. Do you have the time to have more clients? And that's their problems that you're not getting more clients.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, that's exactly. I do have the time, but yes. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Chris Hogan]

And how much debt do you guys have at home?

[Rachel Cruze]

So we did have. We have a home that we. About two grand. I think we only about 210 on that. And we did actually just take a HELOC out to pay off to consolidate the debt for my student loans because the interest rates were extremely high, and I felt like every year I was just paying off interest and I wasn't

[Caller]

able to actually pay off the student loans.

[Rachel Cruze]

We did combine a few of our credit cards.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what you've discovered now is you can't borrow your way out of debt, so. Ouch. Yeah. So you're gonna have to earn your way out. And so this is you going to. If you're going to create more income, you're going to have to arrange your life in such a way that it allows for that. And. And so I would love for you to be booked up enough that you're making 100,000 instead of 34. And then you're not calling me because you're starting to plow through this debt, then that's been consolidated. You're starting to see a way through it. But, you know, so what you're dealing with is you've got three kids and $103,000 income and a pile of debt, and you're underutilized in terms of what you could be making in the marketplace.

[Chris Hogan]

But because there's not much overhead, I'm okay with that. 34 saying, okay, all my job, all my work is going to go for us to pay this, and then his is going to go to debt. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you can kind of slice it that way.

[Dave Ramsey]

She needs to be making 100.

[Chris Hogan]

She needs to be making more. Yeah. But she said it feels like it's all going to the debt and the expenses, but that's okay because you're at least paying off Debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly.

[Chris Hogan]

Which is helping.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly. It's not costing your business. Other things are. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. I'm Dave Ramsey. Rachel Cruz Ramsey personality number one best selling author and my daughter is my co host. Today Michael is in Little Rock. Hi Michael, how are you?

[Caller]

Good. How are you all doing? It's a pleasure to speak with you all.

[Dave Ramsey]

You too, sir. How can we help?

[Caller]

So I am a 24 year old father of one. I've got a fiance that's a stay at home mom. When I was born, I was born with some disabilities due to a medical and I actually sued said company that calls these issues, you would say. And that settlement pays out in two months. And I'm really lost on where to start. It's about $400,000 total that I will be getting.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow.

[Caller]

And I think my main question is should I immediately clear any debt and use my income to build wealth?

[Dave Ramsey]

The data tells us that that's the most sure way to build wealth. The downside of that is the guy in your mirror, you have to follow through. So if you blow them, I mean if you pay off all the debt and you don't take care of your income and use it to build wealth, then you're going to have just blown the money, right?

[Caller]

Yes. You're very much in.

[Dave Ramsey]

Can I ask how much debt do you have?

[Caller]

Thousand. Oh, debt is roughly 70,000 and that's between cars and medical bills only.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

I don't do the whole credit card schemes. I think that's all just a scam.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So when are you getting. Getting married?

[Caller]

We haven't set a date in stone yet due to this trustee payout. Why?

[Dave Ramsey]

What's the trustee payout have to do with getting married?

[Caller]

I'm not really sure. Honestly, it kind of comes to. Do we want to spend money on a wedding? Do we just want to elope? I want to elope. My wife wants. Well, my fiance wants to have a wedding. So we're kind of stuck between the two.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you're having a wedding.

[Caller]

That's what everyone's been saying.

[Dave Ramsey]

You lose. So how much are we going to spend on the wedding?

[Caller]

I didn't want to spend over 8,500.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. What is the nature of your disability?

[Caller]

I was born with bilateral club feet at birth and I've had over 32 surgeries on my legs.

[Dave Ramsey]

How are you doing now?

[Caller]

It's, it's a struggle. PT twice a week exercise. But it's definitely something that.

[Chris Hogan]

What do you do for work?

[Caller]

Michael, I'm a lot manager for a car dealership, so my job's pretty laid back.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so what do you make?

[Caller]

I make 1850 an hour and I don't make less than 45 hours a week.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and you're able to live on

[Caller]

that in a way, yes, comfortably, no.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. So what's your long term career plan?

[Caller]

I am very big on wanting to start investments. I'm not sure where to start with that. I've looked into mutual funds.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's not a career plan, that's investing. What's your career plan?

[Caller]

I think my career plan is to stay in a dealership life, potentially in a finance role.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So I want you to start moving towards something that doubles or triples your income on purpose. And I don't know what that is exactly. Dealership life is fine. I have no issue with that at all. There's a lot of money in the car business and a lot of people make a good living, a great living in the car business, so. But I want you to start thinking about, okay, what's the 32 year old version of you look like? Cause you got a 10 year old and a wife at that point, right?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

And 1850 ain't gonna cut it.

[Chris Hogan]

And my fear is that you think this 400,000 you invest in, you're just gonna live off of it the rest of your life. And that just wouldn't be good for you, Michael.

[Dave Ramsey]

What I wanna do is create. And it's not enough. What I wanna do is create a life where you don't need this much money. And then the money will explode and do fabulously for you, but create a life where you don't need this money. And that involves getting married and spending. I think you're going to spend 20,000 on your wedding, not 8,500.

[Caller]

Oh, God, don't say that.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, that's way less than the average, by the way. But maybe 15, I don't care. But you two put together a budget between 10 and 20 that you can both agree to and set that money aside. Out of this money, you pay off the rest of your debt out of this money. And I want you to also think about, is there a class or a certification I need to take to move towards what I need to become to be a great dad, a great husband at 31 years old. That makes a lot more than 1850 an hour.

[Caller]

Okay, awesome. Would you immediately max out your Roth account if you were handed $400,000 today?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, and I would immediately pay off all those debts And I would immediately set aside 15,000 or so for a week wedding. And then I would build a life that doesn't need this money other than that and just let the money grow and sit down with a smartvestor pro and learn about mutual fund investing. But mutual fund investing is not a career. And 300,000 will not produce enough for you guys to live on. So it sounds like a lot of money because you've never had that much money. But it's not going to create enough money for you to get the life I want you to have. Have not yet. It will in 10 or 15 years. So if we can leave 300 of the 400 alone, which is about what it sounds like we're going to be doing, okay, if we leave 300 of the 400 alone and put that in investing, including a Roth IRA and some good mutual funds, in seven years that'll be 600. In 14 years it'll be a million two. And so when you're 35 years old, you'll have a million dollars in that account. Account. If you keep your stinking hands off of it. Because you build a life without the money. You build an income, a career track without the money that feeds your family. And then you let this thing do, let this money go over here and cook. So money is not microwavable, but it does really good in the crock pot. And so that's what we're setting up here is let it. Leave it alone, let it cook. But if you keep screwing around and buying cars you can't afford and putting

[Chris Hogan]

them on payments, but you just buy them.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Well, you pay cash for whatever car you buy.

[Chris Hogan]

If he takes that 300 and starts going on vacation, buying cars and living

[Dave Ramsey]

off, it'll be gone in 20 days. Yeah, and it won't have doubled if you take the interest off of it. If you take the income off of it, let it alone. Pretend like you don't have this money and it will set your life up and your children's life up and your grandchildren's life up. But you're going to have to leave it alone and go have a life of your own and build out the career side of things. So hang on. I'm going to send you a copy of Finding the Work youk're Wired to Do by Ken Coleman. It's got a great career assessment in it to get you to thinking. And you and your fiance get the wedding planned and get married. You have babies, get married and start your life off. Do the stuff that the data tells Us is going to cause you to succeed.

[Chris Hogan]

And Michael, go sit down with the smartvestor pro. Don't go to someone who's explaining stuff that you don't understand and put it in a boring mutual fund or an index fund or something. But like, look, make sure what you're putting that money into is boring, has a good track record. And again, just setting it aside, don't talk to someone who's like, oh, you can invest in this business over here and do this and that and that

[Dave Ramsey]

coin and I'll lose. I'll make sure you lose all of it.

[Chris Hogan]

Put it in something boring with a great track record and leave it alone. I'm telling you, that's going to be your best, that's going to be your best bet. And then you get to look up at 50. You got a couple million in there. At that point you're like, well, what do we want to do with our lives?

[Dave Ramsey]

50, it'll be 10 million.

[Chris Hogan]

Then you get to make some great decisions. But don't let 24 year old Michael do that now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Just wait and you're very wise to ask this question and you got a whole lot more of an answer than you were looking. You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car. But it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage to protect your biggest assets. I recommend using Ramsey Trusted Pro. Whether you're looking for car, home or any other type of insurance, Ramsey trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would find what you [e-mail] insurance. Cassandra is in Raleigh, North Carolina. Hey Cassandra, what's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

Hi Dave. Hi Rachel. My husband and I are finally combining our finances. There's a couple charges that we're not quite sure where to put them in our budget. And my initial thought was to put them straight into what would be our personal funds. But I'm unsure if that's good. And I want to set a strong foundation for the future.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good for you.

[Rachel Cruze]

So I'd love your opinion on that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thank you for phrasing that that way. What are the charge? What is the category?

[Rachel Cruze]

So the categories are like a subscription to a deodorant company, an alcohol budget for my husband. For me, I set aside a little bit of money a month to go out with my mentor or my co workers or my boss for drinks or for coffee or something, you know, kind of be there with my co workers and build relationships.

[Dave Ramsey]

Essentially you could, you could just have an Individual line item for each one of those things and just call them what they are. Are. That's fine. And we are agreeing to the deodorant budget. We are agreeing to the mentor budget and coffee budget. We are agreeing that, you know, you're. We're allocating this much for you to have a cocktail after work or whatever it is that he's doing. And we're agreeing to that and do it very individually and. Or you could do what you're talking about, and that is just increase your personal by that much. And you just take care of that within your personal. He could in his, quote, his fun money, and you could in your fun money. Right. Either one's fine. Here's what's interesting. Here's what we did as an example at our house that ended up being weird. We originally separated food and restaurants, and I recommend that when you.

[Chris Hogan]

Groceries.

[Dave Ramsey]

When you start budgeting. Yeah, groceries and restaurants. Because otherwise you'll go to the restaurant and eat your groceries.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you want to make money for the grocery store. Okay. So we separated them initially. After doing it for several years, we got disciplined enough that we were able to just call it food and forget it. But when we first started, we needed the individual detail.

[Chris Hogan]

We still keep it separate.

[Dave Ramsey]

You do. Okay, that's good.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. And then we have Cassandra. I don't know if you all have other subscriptions. We have a subscription line item in our budget that, like Disney plus, Amazon, pr, like these things.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but that's not deodorant.

[Chris Hogan]

Well, it's a subscription.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know, but I mean, I would

[Chris Hogan]

count it as a subscription.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. It's just an Amazon button. I mean, that's. Yeah.

[Chris Hogan]

No, I mean, that's almost.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's almost in like.

[Chris Hogan]

But that seems to justify not putting too much in my personal. I try to avoid to spend, and I allocated it.

[Dave Ramsey]

The point is, it might be a good exercise to just make them line items for the first year and then over time, you'll go, okay. I get comfortable with just melding them all together. So what we have ended up doing is we have. We used to have a bazillion line items, and ours are now very broad buckets.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because. But I've been doing it 35 years. Okay. So, you know, it's different. Right. But when we first started, we needed the emotional shock of looking down and seeing my mentor coffees cost that much or his drink after his happy hour costs that much. You know, and he needs to see that. And Go. Yeah. And you need to see that. And it's good for everybody to get the. All that. So I. I would run it out as just individual line items, and you can do that in every dollar. You can add customized line items very easily just because. Just for visibility. And. And it's just kind of a reminder. I spend that on alcohol. I spend that on deodorant, you know, and it's just. That's okay if you do that. I'm not griping at you about any of that, but I think the. The line item is just like, staring you down every month and going. Making you make a value choice. Is that really what. How I want to live? Is that really who I. I want to be?

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And. And you might decide I'm spending too much or I'm not spending enough on that.

[Chris Hogan]

Yeah, yeah. And then if you feel comfortable with it, then I would probably lump. Anytime we go out to a restaurant, even if it is for co workers or if he goes out with friends for lunch or whatever, we just dump everything into the restaurant category. Like, if we go out to a restaurant, that's where it is, regardless of reason. And then I'd probably move. Yeah. A deodorant subscription to your personal line item. That's what you're choosing later on. Later on. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's probably where I would go. But. But for the first. Yeah. A couple months, six months. As.

[Dave Ramsey]

Maybe the first year.

[Chris Hogan]

As detailed as you can be. I think it is just a good rhythm to be in. To be able to see those charges and just see, okay, that is. That's the transaction for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

It kind of. Folks, for those of you thinking about this, because we're talking to all of you out there, not just her. The. It kind of falls in the same place in your brain that doing the budget at all. When you wrote down everything, you're like, holy crud. And so that's the thing you want to have happen. You'll feel like you got a raise. When you do a detailed monthly budget before the month begins, and you tell every dollar what to do before the month begins. You always feel like you got a raise because you always have this experience of, we spend what.

[Chris Hogan]

Yep. And we don't have to do that. We can lower that category.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you also have the experience of, where's all this money going? I mean, the chaos and the disorganization in our life is eating half our salary. And so you have that experience, and the shock effect of that starts to modify your behavior. Where now you're controlling your life and your money instead of your life and your money controlling you. And this is a. What she's talking about is a brilliant question because it's not only did she phrase it properly, I want to lay the right foundation, but she's recognizing that I'm setting new grooves in my brain. I'm setting new rhythms in my thinking and the way my behavior is acting out in this. So I want to be careful how I do that. That was our indirect comment, but it was a great comment. So really good question. Cassandra, thank you for doing that. I appreciate you calling. Rose is in Phoenix. Hi, Rose, how are you?

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm fine, Dave and Rachel, I appreciate you listening to me and answering my questions.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure, I'll come. We help.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, well, just quick scenario. I'm 72.

[Caller]

My sister, whom I live with, is 70.

[Rachel Cruze]

We share our property together. She has. My sister has owned this property.

[Caller]

She's the one who initially bought it like 30 years ago. I have moved onto this property and been here for about the last 10, 11 years.

[Rachel Cruze]

I mentioned to her at the beginning of the year that this year that I was thinking about paying off half

[Caller]

of the mortgage because I've been saving and saving.

[Rachel Cruze]

I've been listening to you for several

[Caller]

years, Dave, and you guys, I appreciate you so much.

[Rachel Cruze]

But basically she got mad at me

[Caller]

for doing that and claiming that I

[Rachel Cruze]

did it behind her back.

[Caller]

She also had the flu last month.

[Rachel Cruze]

Sometimes she was sick for three weeks.

[Caller]

She's self employed.

[Rachel Cruze]

I'm retired. I did get my Social Security and

[Dave Ramsey]

I do get the houses in your, in both of your names, correct?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruze]

Because we.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why did she not want you to pay off. Why did she not want you to pay off half the mortgage?

[Caller]

She claims that I paid the mortgage off. This is in early February, the first, second through the fifth, while she was sick of the flu and that I took advantage, she says, of her being ill and doing this without consulting with her. Her.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I said to her, well, Theresa,

[Caller]

you're my sister, but you're not my parent. You're not a spouse and you're not my boss.

[Chris Hogan]

Does it harm her in some way?

[Caller]

I'm sorry?

[Chris Hogan]

Is it going to harm her in some way? No.

[Rachel Cruze]

My gosh, Rachel, we, we, we went from $237,305. Yeah. Down to. We're now down. Well, we both paid our half of the mortgage February the first course. Excuse me.

[Caller]

March 1st.

[Rachel Cruze]

And so with that payment, which our

[Caller]

monthly payment is $1,510 and 4 cents a month. So we split that in half.

[Rachel Cruze]

So now our mortgage is down to come April 1st.

[Caller]

Our current mortgage payment or total is.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I don't understand why. I don't understand why she's mad. How is she hurt?

[Rachel Cruze]

She's mad because, well, okay, I forgot

[Caller]

to make that point.

[Rachel Cruze]

She.

[Caller]

When she talked with me the other day about this, she says now me

[Rachel Cruze]

paying off half the mortgage is screwing up her getting a trust placed on our entire property.

[Caller]

Now she can only do half of a trust. Is there such a thing as half a trust? This is. And I said to her, is that what your attorney told you?

[Dave Ramsey]

No. There's no such thing as a trust on a property that you don't own all of. She can't put it through this property in a trust. She doesn't own it all. Even if there was a mortgage or not a mortgage doesn't screw it up at all. So she's got bad information and she's just mad about something she doesn't even understand. No reason to be mad. But it is weird you're continuing to pay the payment when you don't owe your half anymore. Hello. Hey, guys. Dave Ramsey here. Every day on this show, we help people work through real money problems and figure out what to do next. Now, you can get that same kind of help anytime with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help.

[Caller]

Help.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's fast, simple and free to use. Go to ramseysolutions.com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's ramseysolutions.com. If you're working the baby steps, the best and fastest way to do it is by following the Ramsey plan. And every dollar will guide you right through that. More than just a budgeting app, the plan is built into every dollar. You can track your progress, get personalized recommendations and coaching for your situation. It'll help you free up more money and work the plan faster, which means you're going to get out of debt, build wealth faster, be aligned with your spouse faster, which means you're going to get out of debt and build wealth faster. You see how this is working now, right? Start every dollar for free by downloading it in the App Store or Google Play. Donnie is in Richmond, Virginia. Hi, Donnie. How are you?

[Caller]

Good. How's it going, Dave?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So my question is, I started a side hustle about 13 months ago with my son. Basically a tick tock shop. It's done pretty well in my opinion. I'm kind of thinking about leaving my job. My wife's saying, hey, go all in, do this full time. Sounds crazy to me to, like I said, leave my. My career to do a tick tock shop.

[Dave Ramsey]

But what is a TikTok shop?

[Caller]

So tick tock is. I'm sure you've heard of the apps. You go in there.

[Dave Ramsey]

We do, but I don't know what a tick tock shop is.

[Caller]

Gotcha. Gotcha. So it's a marketplace on Tick Tock where we go live and we sell things to other individuals. We sell.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay, I got you. Okay. Selling things on ebay or selling things on Facebook. Marketplace or selling things on TikTok. I got you. Okay, and what are you selling?

[Caller]

We're selling sports cards. So we do live selling. So we'll open the cards for people, they buy and then we open them on the, on the screen for everybody, and everyone excited. We had a big card.

[Dave Ramsey]

Gotcha. Okay. And what are you making?

[Caller]

So last year was our first year, really hitting it hard. We did it every night. About $200,000 and 60 of that I gave to my son.

[Dave Ramsey]

Profit?

[Caller]

Profit, yes. Profit in overall revenue was over 700,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you had 500,000 invested in the cards

[Caller]

and other things. Yeah, we could probably be a little more efficient this year. It was our first time. We didn't really know what we were doing, so we had to buy things a couple times. Didn't really know exactly, but yeah, mostly cars. The cards are very expensive.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you're. Yeah, you're buying them and sell. I mean, you're buying them for 500, selling them for 700, probably profiting 200. So your cost of goods sold was 500k, does that sound right?

[Caller]

Roughly, yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, roughly, what do you make at your day job?

[Caller]

About 100,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you made twice as much at this as net profit as you did at your day job.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you did it at night, but I'm guessing at night is when you do this. Right?

[Caller]

Well, there's people on there doing this all day long and.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but I'm thinking prime time is prime time time.

[Caller]

Well, it is, but at the same

[Chris Hogan]

time, that's old school.

[Rachel Cruze]

It is.

[Caller]

It really is. Because when I see them all during the day, they're doing just as well during the day. I see people doing, you know, having six or seven of these guys streaming it at a time all day long. But I was with you. Prime time seems like, like nighttime, but it seems like when I go in the mornings on the weekends is also prime time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. I don't know, I've never done it, so I just was guessing. Okay.

[Chris Hogan]

What kind of job do you have? What's your career?

[Caller]

So I work in finance.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, that's pretty vague. What do you do?

[Caller]

So I do, I work for a military contractor company. We just, we do, we DOD work during the day.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, cool. So how hard would it be to replace that if TikTok folds up?

[Caller]

I mean, I wouldn't think very hard. I was a blue collar worker in my former life, so if I needed to go back to work and do something, I think I could probably do pretty much anything and get a job. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. I would do it.

[Caller]

Really?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, definitely.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well you have a year track record. There's no reason to think it's not projected into the future. Reasonably, I think you'll make 300 or 400, not 200.

[Chris Hogan]

But with the caveat always. With the social media world, as you know, Donnie, I'm like, it just, it's ever changing. AI is changing everything. It's just knowing that this may not, it may be long term. I pray it is for.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, it won't be. This will not be around in five years. You understand? This will sunset and so be watching for the next way that people are selling stuff. Okay. This is a very cutting edge early adopter process that a small percentage of the population is participating in and even knows about for that matter. Overall. Okay. Now it's not like a mainstream thing. Like you walk into a 57 year old or 67 year old grandmother, she's not going to know what you're talking about. Right. And so it's not mainstream. And because it's technology and social media based, 100% chance it's going to change dramatically between now and five years. So be looking for the next way to do something similar or just close the thing up when it's done, don't be looking up and going, oh well, what happened to my business? Well, it changed. You can 100%. Cause I mean think about five years ago, nobody could spell TikTok.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it feels like 20 minutes ago the Internet wasn't even real.

[Caller]

Very true.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so it's not.

[Chris Hogan]

So it's just some cost, but do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but if I had baked the things that we do at Ramsey on a single platform, we would be out of business.

[Caller]

Makes sense. And we're trying to pivot to other avenues. Whatnot is reached out to us. EBay, live it's good. I don't have the time to do it unless I leave my main job.

[Dave Ramsey]

I would be investigating ebay live. I'd be investigating anybody that's doing something similar where you're on multiple platforms accomplishing the same kind of task.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that way you're not married to one platform. And when it has an issue, you know, like there was a moment in time that Tick Tock was completely in jeopardy of shutting down all the way. Like the US Government shut it down. Right. And so, you know, you don't want that to happen and be standing on one leg.

[Caller]

Exactly. Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nope.

[Caller]

100%.

[Dave Ramsey]

So, yeah, as long as you keep that kind of a mindset in your business acumen, then, yeah, go make 3 or 400k for the next two years while you're discovering the next thing to do.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And bank all of it. Don't spend it.

[Caller]

And that's. That's what I've been trying to do with. Just put it all to the side. That was my. My other caveat is, do I pay off my house or do I keep just loading up the bank account?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. That's very cool, Donnie. It's very interesting for you. He goes from blue collar to finance at the DOD to TikTok entrepreneur. This guy's flexible.

[Chris Hogan]

It's good.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's flexible, man. He's able to do just about anything. So, yeah, that's the good thing. And so you don't ever want to base your career or business idea on something that probably has a fairly short shelf life without having a plan for moving on to the next thing. But, man, what a great. Cool. I'm glad you're making so much money. Money. That's awesomeness. Very neat. Chris is in Roanoke. Hi, Chris. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm good, Dave. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Well, we've ended up, unfortunately, in baby step seven, and now we have 529 accounts that we don't really need. We're able to cash flow to college, and we're debating what to do.

[Dave Ramsey]

Don't cash flow to College. Use the 529s.

[Caller]

And then if we want to do additional investing for the kids, we should just do that on the side.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, if. But use the 529s for college. It gets some money out of there. That is cash flowing it. And then use the cash that you were going to use for college to do. If you want to build an account to the side. Just an UTMA uniform, transfer to minors act which is simply a mutual fund in the kid's name and then they can buy houses and weddings and stuff with that without having any issues with the 529. But don't cash flow college and trap 529 money?

[Caller]

Well, I've asked the kids about it. They're both in college now. One of them was interested in leaving the 529 intact to use it to pay for his kids college. And I didn't know how good an idea that would be.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I wouldn't do that.

[Caller]

And then the other one wanted to. We talked about putting half of it in a Roth IRA and putting the other half just in a brokerage account that they're both, you know, they're not minors, they're they're college students now and we could certainly pull out the same amount equal to their tuition and then just use that for, for anything really. I suppose.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah but that's using it. I mean so I mean we get the money out of the 529 is the answer to your question. And then whatever you guys want to choose to do with that money and how you.

[Chris Hogan]

There's leftover. He can use the rest for the kids or.

[Dave Ramsey]

But I would rather have a pile of cash for your son's kids in mutual funds that's not in a 529 than have it in a 529. Cuz I don't know what 20 years is going to do to 529s.

[Chris Hogan]

When I talk to people on The Ramsey Show, 90% of the problems I hear come down to one thing. Not having a plan. They're not living on a budget budget. They have no idea where their money's going. Money is just happening to them instead of them happening to their money. And guys, that is so normal. But it doesn't have to be normal for you. And that's why I want you to go download our EveryDollar budget app. EveryDollar not only helps you tell your money where to go with a budget, it also builds a plan to free up extra money so you can pay debt off faster and start building wealth. And the best part, part, your plan is completely personalized to your life. It's the same advice that you would get if you call the show and it's right in your pocket. So don't keep living normal. Go download the EveryDollar app, answer a few questions and get your plan today.

[Dave Ramsey]

Our scripture of the day. Luke 14:28. Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Won't you sit down first and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it. Mitch Albom said one half of knowing what you want is knowing what you must give up before you get it. Oh, there it is. Our Question of the Day is brought to you by why Refi? If private student loans are in default and it's knocked you off track, this is how you reset. Why Refi works with borrowers that other lenders won't work with, helping you refinance defaulted private student loans with low fixed rates so you can get back on the plan and move forward. Visit yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey might not be in all states.

[Chris Hogan]

Today's question comes from Joe in Pennsylvania. I lease a new car every three to four years because I'm retired and I don't want to deal with brakes or tires or any other maintenance issues. I'm not hurting for money and can afford to pay cash for a new car if I wanted to own one, but I don't. So what's your opinion on having a lease in my situation instead of a paid off car?

[Dave Ramsey]

A lease is the most expensive way to operate a vehicle mathematically, period. You're getting screwed. And so if you simply don't you want to buy, you want to keep a new enough car that you never have to buy a set of tires or buy a set of brakes. Brakes, then you're just going to be trading cars every time that you need to do that, every three to four years and pay cash for your cars, that's going to be the least expensive way to do this because the lease is capitalized on msrp, meaning those stupid payments that you're paying are based on the full sticker of the car. But if you walk in and buy a brand new car, and I'm assuming you have a million dollars or more and could afford to do that, and you're going to walk in, buy a brand new car. You can buy them at invoice, invoice or 500 over invoice or 1500 over invoice if it's a premium vehicle. And so you're getting the best possible buy paying cash. But yeah, you got money to throw away is what you're saying. And you're throwing a lot of it away. A lot of it.

[Chris Hogan]

It's just being wasteful at that point.

[Dave Ramsey]

But yeah, but if you've got, you know, if you've got $10 million, I don't know, we don't know your net Worth or your income. You just said you got plenty of money, and we have to take your word for that. I'm not sure I believe you. But anyway, because usually people that have plenty of money don't think this way. This usually, like broke people think this way. But anyways, no, don't lease it. If you got $10 million and you want to waste some money so you never buy brakes or tires, then buy a new car every so often and pay cash for it, and you'll get a better deal. Do what I said.

[Chris Hogan]

It's just so funny to me. Me, like, the brakes and tires thing, it would be one thing of like, hey, I'm a car person and I love new cars, and my thing is cars. And I just want to buy a new one every four years and drive something new. But I don't want to deal with the maintenance department. He's like, I don't think that's the truth.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know.

[Chris Hogan]

Like, that's. That's just like a funny. I'd rather him be like, I just like cars.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not. It's not what people say that are wealthy usually.

[Chris Hogan]

It's true.

[Dave Ramsey]

Just not. It's not. It's not.

[Chris Hogan]

Well, if you're that wealthy, you just have someone to go and take your car in.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not.

[Chris Hogan]

And do it for you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hello? Just call my guy.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. John is in Reno. Hey, John. What's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

Hi.

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. Hi, Rachel. Thank you so much for taking my call. It's a real pleasure. Longtime listener, first time caller. I'm looking for some Papa Dave advice on if a prenup makes sense for my situation. Maybe I'll give you a little bit of background. I'm 28 years old. I've been dating the fiance that I love to death for five years now. And we got engaged last year. Year. And we have a wedding scheduled for next summer in June.

[Dave Ramsey]

Awesome.

[Caller]

And yeah, yeah, definitely awesome. There's. I know, like, previous calls that you said that there's a. It only seems to make sense that there's a significant gap in the past times I've heard when you guys are discussing it, it's usually like someone has a million dollars, another person has 100,000. So my situation is I have 230,000 of a net worth, and she doesn't have. She has zero. No debt. I have no debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

And no, you don't need a prenup.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

She's worth. She's worth a quarter million.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think she's been hanging around five years.

[Caller]

Yeah. Yeah, that's fair. And then, yeah, I, I think the reason, outside of, like that gap, like I was contemplating, like, the idea that, like, I like that we would both know, like, the terms of. If we were to, like, end the marriage and something bad like that was to happen.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you do know the terms. The laws have set them in place. Typically, the judge is going to split the baby in half.

[Chris Hogan]

Oh, my gosh, what a horrible example.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's from the Bible. It's from Solomon. Okay, look it up. All right. Anyway, the. Oh, my gosh, it's an old. Rachel, you're okay, you're okay. Calm down.

[Rachel Cruze]

I know.

[Chris Hogan]

No, I just feel very.

[Dave Ramsey]

Anyway, you're going to, you're going to turn Whatever, whatever net worth you guys have grown together in your life together is going to be split down the middle. That's the terms typically. With rare exceptions. With rare exceptions. And your230 is not enough to tip the scales that much. She may out earn you through the next 10 years. And so, you know, that could come up that way too. So. So no, I wouldn't. In this case. I want you to fight for working together, fight for alignment, fight for shared goals and vision and serving each other and having a wonderful marriage and never worrying about whether we have to split this down the middle again. Okay. So.

[Caller]

Okay. Thank you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thank you.

[Caller]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. Good question. All right, Rachel, do you know. You don't know the Bible story?

[Chris Hogan]

Well, apparently not. It feels very Moses.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, Solomon, the wisest man that I believe. Yes, I got that. He wrote proverbs sitting in judgment. And a lady brought her baby up and two women were fighting about which child it was. And he said, well, just cut the baby in half.

[Chris Hogan]

Oh, and whichever one the mom said, okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And whichever one the mother was, it

[Chris Hogan]

feels like an old.

[Dave Ramsey]

Agreed. And so said. And, and so the saying is split the baby. That's where it comes from. And the mom liter. No one literally splits a baby.

[Chris Hogan]

I know, I know, but it's just such a. Just, just a sad. I don't know. Oh, my gosh.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's no show like when Rachel died.

[Chris Hogan]

I don't like it. I don't like it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Paul's in Philadelphia. Hey, Paul.

[Chris Hogan]

Paul Solomon.

[Caller]

Hey, Dave and Rachel. How's it going?

[Dave Ramsey]

Great. We're short on time. Go straight to your question, boss.

[Caller]

We'll make it easy. So mom died last year at 55. I'm 28. She left about half a million dollars in debt. That's 30k business debt. $200,000 mortgage, $180,000 in medical debt from a heart attack. 50,000 in personal debt. The world. She also left the business. The business is a home care business. Non medical. You know, not nurses or anything, just caregivers coming in to take care of grandma. Business makes about 800,000 a year. Profit 47%. I wish. Now, 47 gross profit.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's the net profit?

[Caller]

Yeah, it's not nets under 50k.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, it's not worth screwing with. Okay. You're going through a million dollars to get to 50K. Oh, my God. What a horrible thing.

[Caller]

All right, I know. Can you sell it from the business I'm in? That's that. Yeah, that's the question. Do I sell it now?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Caller]

Walk away?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, if somebody will buy it. And here's the thing. Here's the thing. You're not liable for her debts. Her estate is liable for her debts. And if her estate does not have a positive net worth, her debts are not going to get paid. So she didn't leave you $180,000 in debt. She left that in her estate. Now, if the business brings a million dollars, then you got to pay off her debts out of the million dollars before you get anything. So what you own stands good for what you owe when you die. Assets minus liabilities is your net worth. You do not inherit debt debt. Did you know that?

[Caller]

So even with the business. Yeah. I mean, well, if the business has a positive.

[Dave Ramsey]

If the business has a positive value, then yeah, you're going to have to use that value to first clear up her debts, which would include her medical bills. Okay. But if it does not have a positive value, you are not personally responsible.

[Caller]

Yeah, right. I got that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

But you think it's a smart thing

[Dave Ramsey]

to get out of it? You don't want it. You wouldn't know. You wouldn't go up and buy that business. You have any idea what you can get for it?

[Caller]

Probably four to 500,000. Good.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that'll clear off. That'll clear up all of our debts, right?

[Caller]

Yep. That's. That's the plan.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's exactly what I'd do. I got rid of two headaches, creditors and a business I didn't want. The doesn't make any money. This is all happening for me. I like it. That puts us hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace. Christ. Jesus.