If You Don’t Stand for Something, Your Money Will Fall for Anything

Summary

The Ramsey Show Podcast Summary

Episode Title: If You Don’t Stand for Something, Your Money Will Fall for Anything
Date: August 28, 2025
Hosts: Dave Ramsey & Jade Washall, Ramsey Personalities

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Main Theme

This episode centers on how setting clear personal and financial boundaries—what you "stand for"—is essential to making wise decisions, avoiding disasters, and building a future of stability and wealth. Through real-life caller questions, Dave and Jade guide listeners on maintaining principles in relationships, debt, wealth-building, and life's unexpected challenges.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Relationships and Financial Boundaries

• Don’t Merge Finances or Debts Prematurely
  • Dave and Jade caution listeners (Caller: Garag from Canada, [00:44]) against paying off debts for non-spouses or co-signing on major assets with someone you aren’t married to.
  • “You don’t pay off dating relationships’ debt. You do that when you’re married.” – Dave ([01:15])
  • They share horror stories about relationships—and finances—ending badly when these boundaries are not honored.
  • Jade adds, “You already have distance working against you. You definitely don’t need borrowed money working against you.” ([04:20])
  • Actionable Advice: The best support one can give in such cases is emotional, not financial; prioritize your own financial independence until legally joined.

2. Major Life Transitions: Babies, Moving, and Debt

• Pause Debt Payoff in a Storm

  • A young couple expecting their second child and preparing for a move is advised to pause extra debt payments and stockpile cash instead ([10:33]–[16:47]).
  • “In a storm—and a baby on the way is a storm—push pause on your baby steps, stack cash, and then get back to it when the new normal sets in.” – Dave ([13:09])
    • Move before the ninth month of pregnancy, avoid financial and emotional overload.

• Selling/Saving for Home Upgrades for New Family Circumstances

  • A grandmother raising her grandchildren (Jen, [48:56]) is advised to sell the house and boat to properly house her new family unit, rather than go into further debt for renovations.
  • Jade: “The dream changes—the new dream is raising these kids.” ([51:46])

3. Investing as You Age and Approach Retirement

• Evaluating Low-Risk Investments

  • A 78-year-old caller (Denise, [16:47]) asks about municipal bonds versus annuities. Dave firmly encourages her to learn more about mutual funds for better returns, unless risk is intolerable.
  • “I would take the $250,000 in CDs and I would put it in mutual funds... But I want you to be comfortable with it before you do it.” – Dave ([18:54])

• Transitioning Accounts After a Spouse’s Death

  • Marsha ([116:04]) receives a roadmap to move IRAs into Roths, pay off remaining mortgages, and support family without becoming overleveraged in her 70s.

4. Marriage and Money Philosophy

• Couples Out of Sync: When to Seek Counseling

  • Caller Tam from North Carolina ([22:44]) can’t save money because her spouse keeps going into credit card debt.
  • “You can’t out-earn his craziness. This isn’t a savings vehicle issue, it’s a broken marriage issue. Get counseling.” – Dave ([24:02])
  • Emphasis on the importance of united vision for financial and marital health.

• Starting Marriage in Debt: Best Practices

  • Mike from Dallas ([32:59]) and his fiancée have $177k in combined debt and significant stock options.

  • The Ramsey playbook:

    1. Liquidate non-retirement investments (including stock options) to dump debt.
    2. Use baby steps—start with the smallest debt.

  • “The shortest distance between where you are now and wealth is to be completely debt-free because your most powerful wealth-building tool is your income.” – Dave ([36:29])

5. Staying Focused and Avoiding Lifestyle Creep

• Power of Singular Focus
  • Dave and Jade discuss how true success comes from periods of intense, focused efforts, even if it means going out of balance for a short time to reach a goal ([41:36]).
  • “When you choose a singular focus, you set yourself apart. We call those people successful.” – Dave

6. Handling Envy, Social Friction, and “Must Be Nice” Comments

• Dealing with Jealousy When You Win

  • Jessica from Massachusetts ([106:29]) wants to know how to handle friends/family who make snide comments as she moves ahead financially.
  • Jade: “That’s called Haterade.”
  • Dave: “Real friends are exposed when two things happen: crisis and success.” ([108:10])
  • Their advice: You don’t need to explain your success. Distance yourself from negativity and confront it if the relationship matters.

• Notable Quote:

  • “Envy is evil at its core... Jealousy is ‘I want what you have.’ Envy is ‘I don’t think I can have what you have, so I don’t want you to have it.’” – Dave ([113:14])

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Quotes & Memorable Moments

• (01:15) Dave: “You don’t pay off dating relationships’ debt. You do that when you’re married.”
• (04:20) Jade: “You already have distance working against you. You definitely don’t need borrowed money working against you.”
• (13:09) Dave: “Push pause on your baby steps and just stack cash. Even if we weren’t talking about moving… a baby on the way is a storm.”
• (18:54) Dave: “I would take the 250,000 in CDs and I would put it in mutual funds—but I want you to be comfortable with it.”
• (24:02) Dave: “You can’t out-earn his craziness. This isn’t a savings vehicle issue. It’s a broken marriage issue.”
• (36:29) Dave: “The shortest distance between where you are now and wealth is to be completely debt-free because your most powerful wealth-building tool is your income.”
• (41:36) Dave: “When you choose a singular focus, you set yourself apart from the general population. We call those people successful people.”
• (113:14) Dave: “Envy is evil at its core... Envy is ‘I don’t think I can have what you have, so I don’t want you to have it.’”
• (111:07) Jade: “Are you still doing that little business?” (on dismissive friends)
• (110:17) Dave: “I’m casually not going to show up at your next deal... I’m not going to hang out with a bunch of goats.”

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Financial boundaries while dating: [00:44] – [05:50]
• Pregnancy, moving, debt & stress: [10:33] – [16:47]
• Investing after receiving a settlement: [16:47] – [20:13]
• Marriage misalignment; counseling needed: [22:44] – [26:13]
• Aggressive debt payoff as a married couple: [32:59] – [40:34]
• Power of focus, avoiding distractions: [41:36] – [44:10]
• Handling windfalls, retirement, and giving: [116:04] – [123:42]
• Social friction from financial success: [106:29] – [114:16]

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Tone & Takeaways

Dave and Jade maintain their trademark blend of tough love, plain talk, and humor. They urge listeners to live intentionally, plan for the unexpected, and, above all, "stand for something"—commit to core principles that guide every financial and life decision.

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For New Listeners

Whether discussing dating boundaries, the weight of debt in new families, or navigating friends' envy, this episode is a masterclass in why standing for principles—no matter how uncomfortable in the moment—prevents even costlier mistakes down the line. Jade and Dave’s advice is pointed and compassionate, offering callers both practical steps and needed reality-checks.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. From the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey show where we help people build wealth, do work that they love and create actual amazing relationships. Jade Washall Ramsey personality number one best selling author is my co host today. The phone Number here is 888255. 225. Garag is with us in Canada. Harry, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey, good morning. I'm doing well, thanks. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

I appreciate you taking my call. First time caller. I'm honored to talk to you. So my, my question is more of a, like a principal's question rather than financial. So I'll give you some context after. But my question is, should I accept my girlfriend's extremely generous offer of paying for me?

[Dave Ramsey]

No.

[Caller]

Okay. I didn't buy to say that. I'm very hesitant. She made the offer about a week ago and I've been sitting on it.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you don't pay off, you don't pay off dating, relationships, debt. You do that when you're, when you're married. When you get married.

[Caller]

Well, that's the thing. So we're, we're both divorced and we. Since the first time, since my divorce, I, I've actually considered getting married again. I thought I never would get married again. And the thing is we were in a long distance relationship. I'm in Canada, she's in Switzerland. And part of the reason to pay off the debts and so that I can afford to save up for chips, to see each other back and forth.

[Jade Washall]

Why, why can't you say what's your job like?

[Caller]

I'm trying to pay off these debts. Right. But I'm, I'm currently on track to try and clear these before next summer. So. Before the beginning of next summer. That's my, that's my goal.

[Jade Washall]

How much is it?

[Caller]

It's about 35,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you make, sir?

[Caller]

Okay, what do I make? Approximately 85,000 gross.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so what's it take to fly to Switzerland? How much money does it take to buy an airline ticket from where you are to Switzerland?

[Caller]

1600, approximately.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so tell her to buy an airline ticket and come to Canada and visit.

[Caller]

Yeah, she's done that a couple times. Okay. And already.

[Dave Ramsey]

So we want to increase the, you want to increase the frequency of the trips by her paying off your debt? No, thank you.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't match up. What she's saying is I'd rather pay $35,000 than 1600 for to go to Canada. That doesn't make sense mathematically or logically.

[Caller]

Fair enough. Okay. I get so. So that I can also go there back and forth and just be a little more fair about it. And sitter.

[Jade Washall]

Well, you don't really have the money to do that. I think if you set up the conversation and say, okay, we both agree that it's important for this debt to be gone. However, how we do it is where we differ. I think it's my responsibility to pay off my debt. We're not married. I don't want to put you in that situation. So we're. What I need from you is to support me in the best way possible. Which your support for me would be if you could come visit me while I'm busy paying off this debt and putting my income towards that. That would be the best way to support me during this time.

[Caller]

Yeah, that makes sense. That's kind of. That's what I was originally thinking and I just didn't know if I should.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you're going to change the tune of the relationship. You're going to change the whole thing if she pays you off your debt. Yeah, you know the old joke. You know, you know the old joke. If you loan your brother in law a hundred dollars and he never speaks to you again, is it worth the money?

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Because what happens when you loan people money is it changes the relationship. You know, now she's looking at you is like. And you're going, I feel like I didn't own that. You know, all this other stuff now enters into the equation. Rather than I'm a dude over here doing my thing, girl over there doing her thing. We'd be talking. That's way different than you got into my wallet.

[Jade Washall]

You already have distance working against you. You definitely don't need borrowed money working against you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Or you know, just any kind of feigned obligation. I mean, what happens if she pays that off and then this relationship goes sideways? Oh, now what are we going to do? Then she calls us on the air and goes, I was so dumb. I paid off this guy's debt over in Canada. And we're like, yeah, you were.

[Jade Washall]

Ye.

[Dave Ramsey]

That'll be the call right here.

[Jade Washall]

That is. I know that we're talking to Garag, but I'm like, I want to talk to the girlfriend because I need to make her understand this is a bad move to even offer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So folks, do not pay debts for people you're not married to. Do not buy houses and Cars for or with people you're not married to. Crap happens and you're going to get sideways and you have a problem. The worst one I can ever remember was a guy bought a house with his girlfriend. They're going to shack up and he gets killed in a car wreck. And now she owns a hat and there's no will. She now owns the house with her future mother in law.

[Jade Washall]

Oh, Lord.

[Dave Ramsey]

She's now a partner.

[Jade Washall]

Oh, my God.

[Dave Ramsey]

She's not his heir. They're not married.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, that's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So his half of that house goes to his mother.

[Jade Washall]

Oh my gosh.

[Dave Ramsey]

Who she didn't like. Of course.

[Jade Washall]

Of course.

[Dave Ramsey]

And now this is great. Now I have a partnership. This is the crap you don't think of when you think, oh, we're just gonna play house and really be instead of really being like grownups and get married. Yeah, yeah. It changes the whole deal, man.

[Jade Washall]

I remember a guy called in. Yeah. He had a girlfriend, he co signed on the car with her. 17, 18,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

They broke up and she got the car.

[Jade Washall]

Well, she stopped paying it. And he called in, he said, hey, I've got a mountain of debt. She's not paying the loan. How do I get out of it? I said, is she gonna refinance it over and put it in her name? He said, no. I said, well, you better add it to your debt, snowball.

[Dave Ramsey]

Then you better get. Better get rid of that car.

[Jade Washall]

Oh my gosh, she wouldn't sell it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, yep, that's the problem. So that's the kind of stuff we run into these days. And it's the unintended consequences. Not thinking things all the way through. There's an old book out 100 years ago by Dr. Stephen Covey called The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People. And one of the habits is begin with the end in smart. Yeah. So begin with everything possibly falling apart. That could fall apart in mind. And you'll go, oh, I would never do that.

[Jade Washall]

Well, yeah, that's opposite of what you want to do. Because when you're excited about something, you like to visualize all the ways that it works out.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you know, yeah, there's only one way it works. And if it's all work.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it never works that way. Nothing ever works the way it's supposed to. Ever. Exactly. The timeline. Something changes and then there you are caught.

[Jade Washall]

But that's not being. That's not being a Debbie Downer and it's not being, you know, a pessimistic. That's just being.

[Dave Ramsey]

We're not dream killers. We're nightmare killers. Because your little dream is going to be a nightmare, and we're going to kill it before we can let it grow. Kill it now. Stomp that thing. Yeah. Nip it in the bud.

[Jade Washall]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I'm happy to kill your nightmare. You just don't see it as a nightmare. You see it as a dream. But I'll help you with that. And so, because we love you and we want you to win, we want you to prosper, we're thinking about the good version of you ten years from now that has served, survived all of life's bumps and bruises, and prospered anyway. And that's how successful people actually do it. They fail forward.

[Jade Washall]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

They don't make a set of assumptions that things are always going to work out the way they are. So there's about 90 ways this could go wrong and only one way it goes right? So we don't do it most.

[Jade Washall]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say most. Success is a result of something that was learned, not a bright idea that was executed the right way the first time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the number of times we've launched a product at Ramsey that the prototype ever sees the light of day is precisely zero. What we think is gonna work doesn't make it through beta.

[Jade Washall]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

It doesn't make it through alpha. It doesn't make it through any of those Greek letters because it is a delta. And so there you go. Yeah, you look that one up. Anyway, open phones here at 888-820-552.

[Caller]

SA.

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[Dave Ramsey]

Steve is in Pennsylvan. Hi, Steve. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing well. How are you doing, Dave?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

So my wife is pregnant with baby number two.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yay.

[Caller]

Yes. We are shocked and very excited. We have about $30,000 in debt. We're moving for a job in the coming spring. How should I handle debt, payoff and preparing for baby?

[Dave Ramsey]

When's baby do you.

[Caller]

End of April, Beginning of May.

[Jade Washall]

Mm. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're moving before a baby comes? In the ninth month of a pregnancy.

[Caller]

It's a little less than ideal. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sounds like suicide, my man. Why? Why, Ape? Why are you moving out? That date. What's the. What's driving the date to be crazy?

[Caller]

That's when we agreed with my employer about making the move would be in the spring. Before that, we found out we were pregnant.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you're being transferred with the same company.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Have you said anything to them about possibly coming a month later or two months earlier?

[Caller]

We haven't. I've spoke with my wife about that, and she said that she would prefer to be moved before the baby comes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Then two months earlier. I don't want to move in the ninth month.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's just. I mean, a lot of stress. I've. I mean, my wife Sharon's had three children, and I can't imagine asking her to move our home in the ninth month of a pregnancy. It's tough enough to do it. It's tough enough to do it two months after a child's born.

[Jade Washall]

I did that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, it's tough. Yeah. And so that's just a bad. It's just a bad plan. But anyway, we're gonna move in the spring sometime. So you're stand. Your question still stands now that I got into your business, but you called and asked, so there you go. But anyway. But so. And what's your household income again?

[Caller]

I make around 100,000. I work about 45 hours a week, and I have unlimited available. I have unlimited overtime available.

[Jade Washall]

Okay. Do you have any money saved? I Know you said you have 30, but I'm just asking.

[Caller]

We. Yeah, we have baby step one done. And we've been working on paying off the debt. I guess one thing that would be important to make of note is the debt is solar panels. So it's kind of tied to the house that we would sell.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's your only debt?

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. Well, number one, in general terms, what we tell folks to do when, you know, you're in a storm and I got a baby on the ways of being in a storm, storm is to push pause on your baby steps and just stack cash. So even if we weren't talking about moving, even if we weren't talking about all the other things, we would just generally say, let's see how a stack of cash we can build as much as we would have put on the debt, which is a lot, the same intensity we're going to stack cash with. And then if health insurance covers what it's supposed to, which is most everything, and if. And if everything goes well, baby and mama come home, everything's okay. The day they come home, we push play again, which means we would empty out this account that we haven't used but was there just in case. We emptied it out down to $1,000. And so you really don't lose any traction mathematically that way. In your case, what you're going to have is a stack of cash. You sell your house, solar panels are cleared, you have no debt, you make the move, your stack of cash becomes your emergency fund. You go to the new place and rent, and you start saving towards the down payment.

[Caller]

Okay, that's what we were thinking. So that.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much equity have you got in your house?

[Caller]

I think when we sell the home. So we bought a fixer upper and we've pretty much completely redone everything. I think we stand to make about 50k minimum inequity above the solar panels. But no, that would be not including the solar panels. If we take the solar panels out, I think it'd be about 25k. That's on the low end.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And if you stack 25k then. And you say, or let's call that your emergency fund. Whatever you stack, if you call that your emergency fund because you don't end up having to use it after the move, then you've got 25k to put as a down payment on the other side. And if that works.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Washall]

And I'm going a step deeper. I don't know when you plan on putting your house on the market, but Just having that cash there. Also, I'm thinking two things. Moving in general is so expensive. So you're moving from Pennsylvania to where, South Carolina? Yeah. So just keeping in mind like start pricing that out now because when we moved from south Florida here to Tennessee, the boxes alone, the boxes, the U haul truck. Are you going to get one of the pods? Are you going to all that stuff if you're stip doesn't cover it like that's if you're even getting a stipend, I don't know. But just price that out because there's a lot going on there that has the potential to creep up on you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, it can turn into a serious chunk of money.

[Jade Washall]

100%. Dave. I was shook when I saw the cost to have someone drive your stuff midway across the country.

[Dave Ramsey]

Boxes, $20,000 throwing away. Yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a big deal. Yeah, it's, it's pretty serious. So yeah, that's. Be ready for all of that. Plan that out. Plan the move out and try to, to where you're not moving with a three month or three day old child or, or, or a child that's getting ready to come in the next three days. Those are, that's just a, the worst possible scenario from a family standpoint.

[Jade Washall]

It really is, it really is.

[Dave Ramsey]

The further back you can dial it one way or the other outside the ninth month, either after the baby is born or before she said she wants to move before. So let's talk about, you know, talk about February.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, can't hurt to ask. Yeah, to ask.

[Dave Ramsey]

It probably doesn't make that much difference to them anyway. So. Yeah, I'm going to ask for sure. Good question. Denise is in New Jersey. Hi Denise, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm good, thank you.

[Dave Ramsey]

How can I help?

[Caller]

Yes, so I just received a personal injury settlement of 200,000. And I know you don't like municipal bonds, but I'm hoping you tell me in my case it's okay to do. I already have CDs, 450,000 in CDs. I have mutual funds, 230,000. I have savings and checking. I have every. I have no debt. So I, I don't need to shelter the 200,000 because it will be tax free on a personal injury. But I really don't want any more interest.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't understand you. You don't want the money to grow.

[Jade Washall]

You don't want compound interest.

[Caller]

Well, it's going to put me in another tax bracket.

[Dave Ramsey]

So What? There's not 100% tax bracket. So I, you know, Dave, I want to make $2,000 instead of $40,000 because of the tax bracket. That's not logical, Denise. No.

[Caller]

Okay, so you think annuities then would be.

[Dave Ramsey]

No. How old are you?

[Caller]

78.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. So you've got all kinds of people in your ear, don't you?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay.

[Caller]

So I don't know what to do with the money. I mean, and more since these. I don't think I can add it to my ira.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you can't. So you are someone that risk terrifies you, doesn't it?

[Caller]

Well, not so much at my age. No. I mean, I really, I think I have enough for, you know, to take care of myself.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, Well, I mean, if I put, okay, I'm 65, so I'm a little bit younger than you, but not much. And If I put $250,000 in a high yield savings account or CDs and I make 3% on it, and instead I could have put it in a mutual fund and made 13%, that means I missed out on $25,000 a year worth of income, which is what you've done with the CDs and what you're getting ready to do with these bonds. So you need to decide if you are willing to put more money in mutual funds or not. And I would sit down with a smartvestor [e-mail] and start to learn about the market and how the market's performing and what's going on and get comfortable with it. I personally, you know, would take the 250,000 CDs and I would put it in mutual funds and I'd put this 200,000 in mutual funds. But I want you to get comfortable with it before you go do that. But no, I'm not dumbing it down to municipal bonds. And no, I'm not going to tell you I would do that because I wouldn't do that. That would be a l.

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Jade Washall]

Oh, that is tbd.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, Dave.

[Jade Washall]

But it will be there when they need it.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. We're going to show you how to stick to a budget and even find thousands of dollars, usually up around $10,000 of margin using every dollar. So you get out of debt, start building wealth and you get to ask questions during the live Q and A. So sign up for [e-mail] webinar ramseysolutions.com webinar Did I mention it's free? Tam is in North Carolina. Hi Tam, how are you?

[Caller]

Hello. Thank you very much for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. How can I help?

[Caller]

And getting ready to go back to work. And I would like to know how do I save money when I go back when my husband does not want this to. So quick backstory. We've done the Dave Ramsey we came out of debt and in 2021 he says he no longer wants to do that and he wants to live for the day. And since then we are in this cycle of constantly being credit card debt of 20 to 30 thousand dollars. I'm current stay at home mom, but I'm going to go back to work. And I told my husband well when I go back to work I want us to save for our future. So I just want to know how do I do that?

[Dave Ramsey]

You go get marriage counseling.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

What sparked it, what sparked him to about face? Something caused that.

[Caller]

That I don't know because we before we got married he was a hundred thousand dollars in debt. We dated. I told him I can't be in debt. I introduced him to Dave's ranby. We, we got out of Debt. Then he put us back into debt for a car and then we got out of debt for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I can't help you. Honey, there's nothing we can tell you that's gonna work. Nothing will work until you guys fix your marriage. You can't make enough at your new job to offset his stupidity and immaturity. You're going to retire. You're going to retire broke. Get ready to enjoy dog food. Alpo is your choice for dinner.

[Caller]

That's why I was thinking when I went back to work, honey, you can't.

[Dave Ramsey]

Out earn his craziness. You can't make enough to do it. So you don't have a savings vehicle issue. You have a broken marriage issue.

[Caller]

Gotcha.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You guys have got to work on that. And if you ignore that and you think, oh, I'll just go get a job and save my money, he's going to go in debt further than any amount you can possibly save. Because there's no off button for this guy the way he's operating right now.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. And you guys were never. It sounds like you were never aligned when you paid off the first hundred thousand. It sounds like his motivation was, I got this girl, I'm going to impress her. We've just gotten married. Right. Even though your why may have been something different, and it may have seemed as though you were aligned, but clearly you were not. So that's one of the things that you can talk about in counseling is what do you guys align on as your vision for the future? And it can't be about today. It has to be about where you see yourselves in X amount of years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And honestly, I mean, I'm not being mean or anything, but his behavior pattern is one of someone who's going to be broke when people say, thank God it's Friday, oh God, it's Monday. And that's their whole planning vision is make it to the weekend like they're freaking Huey Lewis or something or whatever. Whoever sung that song.

[Jade Washall]

Working for the weekend.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

Is that Mike in the movie Lover Boys?

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I've done this before, hadn't I? Yeah. I always get criticized for my own lack of music knowledge.

[Jade Washall]

I knew what you were talking about.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I mean, anyway, you're gonna be broke if your whole planning horizon is trying to get to the weekend so I can smoke and drink. And I just. That's all I want to do. I just want to live in the moment. That means you're four years old, emotionally.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you're not Going to ever build wealth, and you're not going to build a quality successful anything because no one does anything of high quality in five days. So you have to have a longer planning window for that, a bigger vision for your life, for your money, for your health, for. I mean, that's the same thing that leads to extreme obesity, because why not? Why wouldn't I eat everything in sight? Because I'm living for the moment. And in the moment, that donut tastes good. And in the moment, I'm going to have six desserts and four bottles of wine. I mean, and then Wonder why I'm £600. It's the same thing. It's the same thing. I mean, there's just no off button when you're that impulsive and immature. And all the data points tell us it's a very sad person. A lot of anxiety, there's a lot of depression around that because there's no vision. And, you know, the Bible talks about it. It says, where there is no vision, the people perish. Now think about that. Perish. What's that mean? Roadkill, baby. Perish, die, don't win. That's what that means. And so, you know, in any area of your life, for your marriage, your kids, I mean, think about if you taught your kids that way. You know, I'm going to live. I'm going to do the easy thing with the kids. Well, what you raise is animals that will drive you bananas because they have no discipline. Because they have no discipline. But that's all thinking in the moment. What's easy Right now? I want the easy button. I want the easy button. I want the easy button.

[Jade Washall]

Think about what you're planting, because whatever you plant later on, that's what you're going to reap the harvest of.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's so sad. It's an awful way to live. And it's such an indication of a lack of maturity, lack of hope. And so that's the stuff you got to work on, Tam. It's not. It's, you know, there's no amount of mean. If you go make $200,000 a year and you save all of it, he'll spend 300 because he knows his wife's over there stacking cash. So he's going to be really. He's going to have, hey, I need two boats, you know, I mean, really. So this. This is. Austin is in Oregon. If I push the right button. Anyway, Austin, there you are. Is in Oregon. Hey, Austin, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing wonderful, Dave. How are you guys doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Today better than we deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

So my wife and I were three months married right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Congratulations.

[Caller]

And one. Thank you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Caller]

And one of the things that we decided to do when we first got married was to do your guys baby step program. So we just finished step one. We got a thousand dollars set aside right now, and we're about to just attack baby step two. We have about $10,000 in debt. And annually we bring in household income of around 95,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, great.

[Caller]

So we want to get this. We want to get that debt free as fast as possible.

[Dave Ramsey]

Agreed.

[Caller]

So I'm. I'm thinking of picking up a second job, doing a few hours after my normal job every day just to get that extra income, just to throw out all that debt. My wife, she's 100% bored on this and everything. She's thinking about picking up some shifts at her local fire department. Great volunteer down there. And one of the things that she brought up, and I didn't necessarily have an answer for, but I 100% agree with her, is she wants to make sure that we still have time for us during this entire.

[Dave Ramsey]

She'll budget it.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, but it's 10,000. It's not gonna last long enough to matter.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You ought to be done in a couple months.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, that's my hot take. If you had said we have 70,000. Yeah. Then I would say, okay, yeah, this is months and months ahead of you of, yeah. Burning the candle at both ends. But for 10,000, you're gonna be done in two months, three months, right. With doing all the things you said.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. You're gonna have.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can hold your breath for two months.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, really, it's not like we're doing two years here or something, so. But the other thing is this. The other thing is this. Anytime you're doing anything, you're out of balance. Okay? If you have a brand new baby in the house later, you're gonna be out of balance. Cause this kid is a demanding little piece of flesh. When they're brand new, okay, they want your attention all the time. They are peeing or pooping or crying. Cause they're hungry all the time. And so you're out of balance. You're probably not doing some other stuff like you should because you're taking care of this baby right now. You're getting out of debt. You're out of balance for a short period of time. Jade just ran a half marathon. You're out of balance for a short period of time because you're training in the mornings rather than doing something else. So you're always out of balance. So just choose you're out of balance. And then when you do have time together, turn off the stupid television and put down the screens and look at human beings in the eyes. And then all of a sudden, oh well, we did spend time together. Who knew?

[Jade Washall]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Netflix is not time together. Okay, Scrolling doom scrolling is not time together. I've been helping people get margin back in their budget for over 30 years. And switching your phone plan is one of easiest wins out there, especially with Boost Mobile. Boost gives you unlimited talk, text and data for just $25 a month. And I'm not talking about some promo rate that goes up later. That $25 price is locked in forever. No contracts, no headaches. And with their 30 day money back guarantee, there's no risk. So stop wasting money. Go to boostmobile.com Ramsey today restrictions apply. See boostmobile do for details. Guys, if you like what you hear around here, we could use your help. Click the subscribe button, the follow button. Share the show. If there's a share button on your platform, do it that way or send a link or let people know. Just say, hey, people, listen to the show. You're our best marketing plan. And a bunch of you have been doing that. We know because our numbers are way up. Thank you very much for all the help. Mike's in Dallas. Hey, Mike, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing well, Dave. Blessed. How about yourself?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Hey, just had a couple quick questions for you. Me and my fiance, we're getting married here and we've combined finances. We've got about $177,000 in debt and we met before taxes, about $200,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good for you. What do you all do for a living?

[Caller]

So I work in construction and she's a program manager for a, for a wireless company.

[Dave Ramsey]

Excellent. So what's the 177 in debt?

[Caller]

We've got student loans, about 75,000 on her end, 20,000 on my end. We've got about $9,000 in credit card debt. And then we. The rest is two car payments that we've got. Obviously the, the credit card debt is kind of the biggest.

[Dave Ramsey]

She got two $30,000 cars.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Geez. Wow. All right. And so when are you getting married?

[Caller]

Friday.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, wow.

[Jade Washall]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, here it comes.

[Jade Washall]

This must really be weighing on you for you to call two days before a wedding. Wow. So how can we help?

[Caller]

Just kind of wanted to see what Y' all think would be best to kind of put our money towards paying down first. We've got about $5,000 in savings. We've got 401ks and stock options as well. So I think we kind of want to hold on to just the stock option side of things.

[Jade Washall]

How much is that?

[Caller]

Stock options in the stocks? About $100,000.

[Jade Washall]

Wow. Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is that in a retirement plan? It's not, is it it?

[Caller]

No, sir. It's not in our time.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not restricted at all.

[Caller]

No, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Listen, if you cash that out, you got 100k.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Jade Washall]

Who's that?

[Caller]

Would have to pay taxes on the back end. About 20. About 20K. That's mine. And 80K is hers.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. So we would. The way we teach is through a series of baby steps. Are you familiar with it at all?

[Caller]

Yes, ma'.

Am.

[Jade Washall]

Okay, so then, you know, the first part of this is you go down to $1,000 and anything above that goes towards the debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's not retirement.

[Jade Washall]

That's not retirement. And in your case, that's 100 grand. Yeah, that's a lot.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm using that to clear this debt up. I mean, because otherwise you effectively are borrowing on student loans to buy stock options.

[Jade Washall]

Exactly right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm not doing that.

[Jade Washall]

Now. I asked about the money because we didn't go into how aligned you guys are on this. Obviously, you've started combining finances, but this whole idea of the baby steps and really what it takes to walk this plan, to be successful with it. When you go back to your fiance, who will be your wife, you know, come Monday and say, here's what I want to do. How is she going to react to that? And do we need to talk about that?

[Caller]

No, she, she supports, you know, we're. We. We try to follow the Bible as best we can. And she knows that I'm wrapping my head around this, trying to get us on. On the right path towards starting a family and buying a home.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool.

[Caller]

And so she's.

[Dave Ramsey]

So, Mike, what I figured out many, many years ago and is for our teaching is the shortest distance between where you are now and wealth is to be completely debt free because your most powerful wealth building tool is your income. And so do anything that I can use to clear that up, I'm gonna use to clear that up, because then I got $200,000 to work with to build wealth with. So temporarily, we're gonna put 401ks on hold. We're gonna liquidate anything that's not retirement, including those stock options. Including the five, four of the five grand. Now, this is after you get back from the honeymoon. Okay. We're not doing it between now and Friday. Okay. But when you get back from the honeymoon. And so basically I've got 100,000 now I got 77,000 in debt.

[Jade Washall]

I'd be looking at these two cars.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm going to be listing the debts, smallest to largest, and that's the first hundred and five thousand I'm going to pay off is the first 105,000 smallest debts. So credit cards, the student loans are probably broken up into several loans, are they not?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So I'm gonna get them out as individual loans and I'm gonna list every debt, smallest to largest balance, regardless of interest rate. And I'm gonna not take that 104,000 and go as fast through there as I can. And then wherever that lands me, gonna cut up the credit cards and then we're gonna probably. The cars are gonna be the last two things you pay, actually probably where you're gonna end up. And then you're going to just attack those. You only got $77,000 in debt. You got 200,000 to work on. If you're both completely focused on that, you could be debt free in a year. And then you don't have any payments. And now we build the emergency fund up to where it should be. Three to six months of expenses. That's baby step three. And then we restart the 401ks. And now we start building wealth. And you're going to be in a really strong position to do that. But what happens is that people keep this stuff, they tinkering around, they keep trying to hack, find some kind of shortcut or some kind of hack. Like I'm going to keep the stock options because I like those. I heard you say it. And I'm just going to work on it over here. No, that's a hack. You're trying to find a shortcut. And listen, the stock options are not as valuable as you being free mathematically.

[Jade Washall]

In no way does the math work on that because people look over here and they say, in his case, 100,000, I've got 100,000. Like you don't have 100,000. If you owe someone 177,000, you're still 77,000 in debt. That's what math says.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, the math ain't math.

[Jade Washall]

Ain't math.

[Dave Ramsey]

There you go. That's what you say. So. Yeah, that's exactly right. So that's how I'm going to do It. And what we're going to do is give you guys a wedding gift. Financial Peace University and everydollar, the full every dollar experience, the paid version. And if you guys come back from the honeymoon, start going through all that together, you guys start talking this through, learning the details of what we're showing you. And you're going to see how that in 10 years you're going to be multi millionaires. If you follow this, if you screw around with this stuff, you're gonna be 10 years and you're gonna look about like you look now. And that's what most people do. All the money comes in, all the money goes out, and they're just a rat and a wheel. They just run, run, run, run with no traction because they don't execute on a detailed, proven process. And that's what we're gonna beg you to do. So you hang on and we'll have Kelly pick up and we'll give you our wedding gift. Congratulations on your wedding Friday. That's pretty cool. I'm with you. Who calls two days before, three days before? Not me. He's feeling the weight. He's not thinking about anything like this. No, not a phone.

[Jade Washall]

He's feeling the weight.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, he's just a planner extraordinaire. I mean, that may be what? He may be the super nerd. And that's going to work to his benefit, too.

[Jade Washall]

Well, he has to promise us not to mention this at all until you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Get back from the honeymoon. Yes. Please do not bring any of this up and really don't even reveal that you were thinking about this two days before the wedding. Don't tell that until maybe 10 years later. Don't reveal that. That's not gonna go well for you.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, the names have been changed in this conversation to protect the innocent.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, his name's not really Mike. His name is really Joe. And he's not really in Dallas. He's really in Minneapolis. So anyway, but okay, so I hope you never know around here. There is something unbelievable, folks, about the power of focus. When you can choose extreme focus, meaning you're not doing anything else, you're only doing one thing. When you choose that. In a culture that has the attention span of a gnat that is so distracted, everybody's looking at their phone 2,600 times a day. They're thinking about 47,000 things at one time, and they're not good at any of them. When you choose a singular focus, you set yourself apart from the general population. And we call those people successful people.

[Jade Washall]

That's right. That's right. Listen, even Michael Jordan could only do basketball. We saw what happened when he tried to do baseball.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was kind of ugly.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

One of the greatest athletes to ever walk the planet. He really was. Wasn't that bad. But it didn't transfer. No, it didn't transfer. He, he, yeah, it was.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. Focus in one area.

[Dave Ramsey]

The only thing he did is try. You gotta give him that. But, yeah, focus. There's a power to focus. These days, business as usual is anything but. Tariffs make trade policy a moving target. Supply chains are squeezed and cash flow is probably tighter than ever. So if your business can't adapt in real time, you're in a world of hurt. That's why you need NetSuite by Oracle, trusted by more than 42,000 businesses, including Ramsey Solutions. You need to see what's happening, what's stuck and what's costing you and how to fix it. And NetSuite is the number one cloud based business management suite because it helps your business make the right decisions fast. It brings accounting, financial management, inventory and HR into one place so you're not left shuffling a dozen different spreadsheets. That gives you the visibility you need to make quick decisions based on actionable data. And NetSuite AI automates everyday tasks so your team can focus on strategy. It's one system for full control and no guesswork to tame the chaos. And right now, if you're leading a business doing more than a million dollars in annual revenue, download NetSuite's free ebook, Navigating Global Trade. 3 insights for [e-mail] Ramsey that's NetSuite.com Ramsey welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Jade Washaw, Ramsey personality, is my co host today. Number one best selling author Sean is with us in Tennessee. Hey Sean, how are you?

[Caller]

Better than I deserved, Dave. How are y'?

[Dave Ramsey]

All? Just the same, sir. How can we help?

[Caller]

So recently just graduated from college, bought a house and started running the race like everyone else. And figured out that's not quite going too well. I've racked up about $125,000 in debt. That's between student loans, a car loan and consumer debt. And that's not feeling great, but it feels manageable. The only problem is now my wife is going through school as well. So when she gets out, she'll have student loans.

[Jade Washall]

So you're actively taking them? You're actively taking the student loans out now today?

[Caller]

Well, yes, she is. Took out her first one just this month.

[Jade Washall]

And how much further does she have to Go.

[Caller]

She'll have the four more years.

[Jade Washall]

Okay, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you. You went to. She went to school. You were in debt. You can't breathe. And so your plan is, honey, you need to go back to school and let's go further in debt to make sure we fail. Why is this a plan?

[Caller]

Well, it wasn't a plan until just recently.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not a plan. It sucks. She should not be in school. You don't have any money.

[Jade Washall]

You got to stop it.

[Caller]

I'm currently the only one with the income. And this was before I found y'. All.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I mean, you don't have to find us to go. I can't breathe. Let's go deeper in debt. That was kind of what Charles plan was. It doesn't even make sense, man.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, what's she going to school for? What's she trying to become?

[Caller]

So she's going to school to become a pharmacist. I just recently graduated from pharmacy school, currently right now at a pretty good job. It's 125,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, that's pretty typical.

[Jade Washall]

That's good. So here's my suggestion. Hear me out, because this is a big turn from what you're doing. My suggestion would be, you guys are together, you're married, You've both just finished school. You realize that your student loans were a mistake. Couldn't you work for a while? Could she delay just a little bit while you guys start to clean this up? Is there something else she can do that's adjacent while you guys clean up this mess and start saving for her to go little by little? Because we don't want to repeat the same mistake twice.

[Caller]

Right, Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. I don't have a plan that helps you if she continues in school and is racking up debt. There's not a plan that helps that. So it just doesn't. It's not logical to me. I don't mind her being in school. I don't mind her being. Having the goal of being a pharmacist. That's all fine, but let's just pay for it and. Right. You can't pay for it because you're so far in debt you can't breathe because you bought a bunch of crap you can't afford, and now you're buying even more crap you can't afford called her education. So you guys are really got to talk about this and change this direction. I don't think you're going to. But you're. You're going to crash.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're going to Crash, you're going to hit the wall, man. And it's going to be bad because you just keep buying stuff.

[Jade Washall]

Well that's, it's, it's. It really is insanity. You did a thing, it caused you to feel crazy and you're doing it again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thinking more of it. Let's do more. It didn't work. So let's double down on didn't work. Yeah, it's not. No, no, no, no, no, Sean. And so not for your sake, man. I want you guys to be free and I want you to be able to live your dreams. And all you're doing is creating a nightmare that you may never get out of. I don't know how long it's going to take you guys to clean this up. So. No, I would not do that. I would stop school if I'm her. I'm going to get a job making as much as I can. Make you take on as much as you can. Make you guys live on beans and rice. Rice and beans. Sell the stupid car and let's tear into this debt and get it cleared up in a couple of years and let's try to knock this out and then start saving for her to go to school and pay cash for it. And then your income will go way on up and you will have no debt and you're in a position to build wealth. All along the way have had a lot more peace.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. And by the way, now's not the time to buy a house. And all those other things that people do when they too late enter the world, you know?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Yeah. You jump. You jumped in the middle of a rat race and acted like a rat and that's not man, it's going. It's a problem. So Maven need to sell the house. I don't know you guys.

[Jade Washall]

Did they already get one?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. He said he already bought a house, bought a car and. And I already did all that. Yeah. Yeah. Jen is in Mississippi. Hi Jen, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi Dave. I'm great. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Caller]

Great. Thank you for taking my call. I. I'm married. I'm 60. We're in our forever home. It's a two bedroom and started the debt snowball in January with 243. 243000 in debt too. It was a lot of credit cards and different loans and a car and a boat.

[Jade Washall]

Is any of that the house?

[Caller]

No, I have it down now too.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you owe on your boat?

[Caller]

The boat? I owe $68,000? Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sell it.

[Caller]

Okay. Well, I have a. There's been like a curveball in our life since we started all this. I have the debt down to 150 right now. January.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you owe 68,000 on a boat, right? Sell it.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you live in a two bedroom house and you have a $70,000 boat.

[Caller]

Well, it's not a small two bedroom, but anyway, we recently, last year got custody, temporary custody of our three grandchildren. And it's turning into permanent, and we really need to build onto this house to get them three to get some bedrooms. And I don't know how to manage paying off the debt and getting this.

What is your home worth on 250?

I owe 100 on it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. I would not build onto it. I would sell it and buy a home that has bedrooms.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's not a good plan in your situation. You have so many balls in the air, you're gonna drop one. Wow. What in the world happened, kid, that you end up with these babies?

[Caller]

Well, there was a trap. There was a death. The dad died in a motorcycle wreck. And then they became homeless and living with four different people in a year. And they had no bed, they had no structure. The oldest one was eight. She was spelled second grade and was going to fail it again. So we took them, got got temporary custody, and it's turning in to be full time, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm sorry. You just gave your life away for those kiddos and you should because you love them and you want to take care of them. You're.

[Caller]

Well, they didn't ask for any of this.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know you're a neat lady. I appreciate you. Sell the boat and sell the house and go get a house that holds these kids. We're going to focus on the kids, not on your dreams that you used to have. We have a new dream now. It's raising these kids. And everything revolves around that. You took that on and that's. And so I'm gonna. I would not do an extensive remodel and wait on that for them to have a bedroom. I'd simply put a sign in the yard, put a sign on the boat and. And then let's go get a house that holds, that's got four bedrooms, maybe a different neighborhood, maybe further out of town, I don't know. Know. But looking for a deal. And let's try to get, you know, let's focus in on them, on those babies. Let's see if we can get them, get them back on track. Bless their hearts. Thank you for doing that.

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[Dave Ramsey]

You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes.

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[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook and that's long term disability insurance.

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Protect yourself, protect your income, protect your family. Kyle's in Wisconsin. Hey, Kyle, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing great. How are you guys?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. What's good up?

[Caller]

So my question is currently on baby step 4, 5 and 6. Married, no kids yet, but that is coming up, hopefully soon. My wife and I are currently doing 15% investing. We're debating on getting your thoughts, I guess on reducing that investing to the company match, which would free up more in our monthly budget to do on the mortgage because I currently drive 40 minutes each way to work. And my thought is if I didn't have the mortgage, I could afford to take a lesser paying job that's closer to home.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why don't you take a greater paying job that's closer to home? Now.

[Caller]

I've looked in the area, but we currently live in a smaller farm town and I currently work in a slightly bigger city. I just haven't seen any.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you make?

[Caller]

Better income? Wife and I combine for two.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what do you make? You're the one making the drive.

[Caller]

Oh, sure. I currently make about, about 120, 130, 000 a year.

[Jade Washall]

So can I ask. I'm gonna try to come at this another way. So you're saying the difference between the match and you going full 15, how much is that, that monthly for you? What's the number amount?

[Caller]

Roughly 1500 would be the less amount of investing in the extra to put on mortgage. And my voice is shaking. I'm pretty nervous.

[Jade Washall]

And how much, how much time? Because that's what's in question. How much time does that $1500 save you and paying off your mortgage?

[Dave Ramsey]

It's 18,000 a year. What's the balance on the mortgage?

[Caller]

We currently owe 460.

[Jade Washall]

Okay, so this is a long, this is a long term play.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

So my question would not, would not be about backing down your 15 because that's so important in the grand scheme of things. That's a lot of time that you'd be losing out on compound interest. My what I'd be solving for is what can my wife and I do combined that will find us fifteen hundred dollars a month? Is it a side hustle? Is it something she can do? Is it something that we change about our lifestyle? Are there cuts in the. Do you see what I'm saying? Is there a way that we can get a lot closer to that 1500 without sacrificing something that's very, very important? Because I wouldn't want you to sacrifice something so important. Do you see what I'm saying?

[Caller]

I do, I do. I have one other bit of info and I don't want it to come off as. I'm not trying to brag or anything like that, but we do currently have about 150,000 invested total and we're both in our 20s.

[Dave Ramsey]

401K.

[Caller]

Correct?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay. All right.

[Caller]

So my thought is we live pretty frugally based on calculating different things. Even if I did nothing, that's still going to grow to obviously a very nice nest egg. Obviously. More.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're in your 20s and you commute 40 minutes.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

That would be called normal.

[Jade Washall]

I was going to say.

[Caller]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

Most people do. Lots of people commute an hour plus to go to their job.

[Caller]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm not sure we're solving for the right thing. No, I would not stop putting 15% away. And do you not like your job?

[Caller]

No, no, I do. It's just the drive can just, I get. It's not super long. It's just winter time at everything. It's just, it can be long hours, just different things. So I just want to see anything I can do to knock the mortgage out.

[Dave Ramsey]

But then also, I mean, you're solving for in your 20s, you want to drive 10 minutes and so you're willing to take a $60,000 pay cut to do that once you get the house paid off. Even if the house was paid off, I don't think this is a wise thing to solve for.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

The trade off is not worth it. Now what I might do, I mean, if that is that great a concern to you, move closer to your work and let's solve the thing a different way. But this idea that I'm going to plan my life so that in my 20s I can make half what I used to make so that I don't have to have a commute, that's a bad trade, man. That's a bad trade. You need to trade something else. Yeah, there's something else needs to move in these variables. There's a handful of variables here. Let's turn a different knob.

[Jade Washall]

That's what I'm saying. The last knob to turn is your future, which is your retirement.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I'm going to put 15% away. I may move or I may get peace with the 40 minute commute, but I'm not going to take a job under any circumstances. In my 20s, half of what I used to make unless I can't find a job because I, and there's like integrity problems at the other place or I hate the place or ethics issues or something like that. But none of that is up here. This is just, I don't like driving 40 minutes.

[Jade Washall]

I'd just be trying to whittle down that 1500. Can I get it to 700? Can I find 700 somewhere? I'd be looking at that number.

[Dave Ramsey]

But even then, the purpose of it is so he can quit his job.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, you're right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And we're solving, that's what we're solving. That's the solutioning for all the way through. And that's. I just don't want to participate in that part of it either.

[Jade Washall]

I hear you.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I think, I think I'm going to solve this a different way and, and I'm going to keep putting 15% away to your point. But even if you made more on these side hustles, and you got the house paid off. Then you quit your job over a 40 minute commute. I just. I still can't get there. I can't go there with you. Austin is in Missouri. Hey, Austin. What's up?

[Caller]

Hey, guys. Appreciate you speaking into my situation.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure.

[Caller]

I have a. I have a question about blessing. I've got my life. I'm a pastor and. Excuse me, My. My church just updated its PTO policy. So they bought us out of our pto. And we can choose to take that in a taxed check or take it and have it put directly into our annuity. And we don't have any debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, you are in debt.

[Caller]

We are not in debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not in debt. Okay.

[Caller]

No, sir. Other than our home, we own a home. We owe about $40,000 on it. I think we could sell it between 2 and 250. We would like to buy another home. We don't have one that we're actively working on buying, but we would like to.

[Dave Ramsey]

How big's the check?

[Caller]

And I'm just 8. $600.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Let's pay the house down.

[Jade Washall]

You only have 40,000 to go. Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Now you only got 30,000 to go. That's awesome.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Washall]

I didn't ask. Do you have three to six months of expenses?

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, we've. We've got about $25,000 in savings.

[Jade Washall]

Okay. Yeah.

[Caller]

Sorry, I should have said that.

[Jade Washall]

No, that's okay.

[Caller]

Yes, ma'.

Am.

Even with the tax that might come on that you'd say just put it toward the house.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, yeah.

[Caller]

Currently got.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, definitely. That's where. That's where you are in the baby steps. All lump sums. Unless you need it for something around the house. That's the other thing. We're in baby steps 4, 5, and 6. So we're being intentional, not intense. And intentional might mean you need to upgrade a car. There might be a couch with a spring sticking through it. You need a new couch. I don't know. You may need it for some of that, too. But if you've got it as free and clear and you don't have other needs for it before I would put it into the annuity, into your retirement, I'd put it on the house.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And let's get that house knocked out. You're heading in the right way. Way to go, man. That is so awesome. That's very, very good. So, Jade, I think it's good occasionally to recap on a couple of these things. When we laid out the baby steps and came up with that process and started teaching people to follow that. We RAN that was 25 plus years ago. And we ran a whole bunch of scenarios down and said okay, what are the numbers that allow people to get their home paid off to invest for their kids college and still be putting something away for retirement? And we ran the scenario at the time is a long time ago, like a single mom making $23,000 or a doctor making 230,000. Now the numbers would be different than that, but you still run the numbers out. The expenses are different than they were then too.

[Jade Washall]

But you want it to work for anyone.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly. And oddly enough, it wasn't a biblical exercise, it was just a math exercise. But oddly enough that 15% in baby step four has turned out to be the right number. It turned out because we ran like 12, we ran 17, we ran 10, we ran 20. And then the house didn't get reduced if too much was going in.

[Jade Washall]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

Or 10%. It wasn't enough. It wasn't building up fast enough. And so guys, these numbers work. So you're not going to catch us adjusting them very often because they've proven out over decades and that's work for everyone. All kinds of different scenarios.

[Caller]

Foreign.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

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[Dave Ramsey]

The 2026 goal planner Ramsey Gold Planner is now available. And between now and September 1st, Labor Day, you can get the best deal ever on the thing. $35.97. This is the best deal you'll get on the planner for a limited time. These planners go really, really fast. We only do. They're very expensive to produce and we only do about 10 or 20,000 of them. And they always sell out very, very quickly. So don't wait. Grab it. Buy labor day for just $35.95. So the way this thing is laid out out, we turn our creatives loose and they have just a lot of fun in their own little sandbox there. It's a beautiful, beautiful piece of work. And Jade has written, Rachel has written and John Deloney have Written the entrance. A little devotional to start each month with.

[Jade Washall]

Basically, yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so you can open up when you get each month. And then when you turn the next page, you have on the two pages face up in the spiral bound, you've got the entire month. And then when you turn the next page, you've got a week. And the next page is a week, the next page is a week, next page is a week to get through the month. And then you get a new devotional, a new write up by one of them and it takes you all the way through your year. For 2026 it is a very, very popular item. It's very well done and I think you're going to really, really enjoy this year's version as well. So get [e-mail] store. Click the link in the description. Get it before the first of the month because after Labor Day it's going to be 35 97. Right now after Labor Day it's going to go way up again. This thing is very expensive to produce and we just do a limited quantity of them. So be sure you get them before they're gone and before the price jumps up as well. Daniel's in Ohio. Hi, Daniel, how are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

So last month it kind of kicked for me and I just got really sick and tired of being sick and tired.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool.

[Caller]

I've been like this before and that kind of makes my wife question if I'm serious or not. But last time I had a financial advisor. He actually idolized you and just everything that you did. And he was very close to being a multi millionaire before he eventually passed away. Right after he was helping us with our budget. So I got real disheartened and stopped budgeting. I just stopped everything.

[Dave Ramsey]

And why did I not inspire you instead of disheartening?

[Caller]

I know, I know. And that's, that's kind of what I'm feeling now. I'm feeling more inspired to do this. And I mean, how ashamed he would have been. Just, it just scares me. And so I'm starting my baby steps. I know I need to save my thousand and I don't think I'll have an issue with that. My issue is I went to one of those stupid buy here, pay here car lots where they, they are the bank, so they finance you through themselves. And I ended up paying close to $34,000 for a Dodge Caravan. It was 19 9, but after interest it was close to $34,000?

Oh, boy.

I have been paying $175 a week for this van for the past two and a half years. And, yeah, I've had nothing but issues with it. So next month, I'm getting a check from a job for $2,500, and I was going to use that to buy a family vehicle with no payments and give the van back on a voluntary repossession. No, I just listened to an episode today that said you would never do that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nope.

[Caller]

So I thought I would call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so the 34,000 is not the balance. 34,000 is the total of payments, including all interest through the end of the loan. And so that's not your. That's not your payoff balance. So what you need to get from them is what the actual payoff is. If you walked in there with a.

[Caller]

Check today, it would be right around 14,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, good.

[Jade Washall]

Oh, that's way better.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's the van worth?

[Caller]

It's probably worth about $2,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Who said.

[Caller]

The transmission is going out?

[Dave Ramsey]

You said okay.

[Caller]

Yeah, I said okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the transmissions struggling, but. And the vans. But. But you paid originally 20,000, and now you think it's worth 2. Two years later? That's a bit of drama. I don't believe you.

[Caller]

It wasn't in the best condition when I got it.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know, but you didn't pay $20,000. You're not that dumb. For a van that was worth eight and you didn't. And so this van's not worth two now. It's probably worth seven or eight.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

You need to figure out what the van's really worth and get the drama out. Because if you turn this into them, they're gonna sell it for two, and they're gonna come after you for 12, plus repo fees. You lose control of the sale price of the van when you do a voluntary or a regular repo. And they're gonna sell it at below wholesale because it's what they do at those lots. This is the scam they run. So they. They want you to do this. So now I'm gonna find out what the van's really worth, I'm gonna get it sold, and I'm going to cover the difference with a loan at the credit union or wherever. Even on a credit card, if you borrow four or five thousand dollars and you get out of a $14,000 loan and a crappy van and you take 2,500 bucks and go get your little car, I'm with you on your general direction that this thing's got to go. But. But a volunteer repo is not a good plan.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, you're gonna end up owing 6 or $8,000 more by doing this. That's. That's why it's not a good plan. That's. You understand they're gonna sell it for way cheaper than you would sell it for, so the hole that you're in is gonna be a lot larger, and then they're gonna come after you for that amount of money.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're gonna get sued for that amount of money. If you don't pay it to them, and they will, this group will. They'll come after you. It's what they do. It's their modus operandi.

[Jade Washall]

What's your. What's your hesitation?

[Caller]

I. I worry, like, even if I sold the van, I worry about not being able to get a loan to cover it. My credit is at, like, a 574.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. That may be difficult. And, you know, you might go back down and talk to them and say, is there a situation where you guys would buy this back and let me sign a note with you for the difference and just pay them? I'd rather you owe them five or six thousand dollars than. Oh, Than have it voluntarily repoed. Right.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you talk to them. I talk to your credit union. I'd take out a credit card. Any of that. Because any of that's your all. We're at the end of the day, what we're doing is reducing your debt. So any of that, we're just changing the structure of the debt and reducing it, and that's what you've got to do, man. And you can't just. You can't sign up for something that's horrible, stick your foot in a bear trap, and then go, oh, the best way to get out of the bear trap is chew my foot off. No, you can't do that. You got to open the thing, heal. You got to fix it. You know, you got it. You're going to have to go through some more pain to fix the bad decision that you made when you impulsively did this. And you knew better when you were doing it the whole time. The whole time. Yeah. So this is. This is the price you pay for that. And that's okay. We've all done stupid stuff, but just, you know, don't. Don't compound it and make it worse. Now you go, you know, fix it the right way. The least damage to your foot after you stuck in a bear trap.

[Jade Washall]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so. So Guys, when you have a car loan of any kind, doesn't matter whether it's pay now, pay here, buy here, whatever tote the note people, or whether it's freaking Lexus Motor credit and Ford Motor cred and Chrysler credit and anybody like that, it doesn't matter. This is not a Hertz rent a car that you can just drop the thing off, right. And say, I don't want it anymore. They're going to assess that. They're going to run it through a repo auction. And I've bought cars at repo auctions and they sell below wholesale and sometimes they run them through Manheim. They run them through the big auctions, the auto auctions, and they, you know, they say this is a repo. And you know, and so you're expecting some dings, you're expecting some problems with it. If you're the buyer, I'm going to discount it below wholesale so that I'm getting a deal if I'm the buyer. And so it's going to bring the least possible price in that scenario. And then they're going to sue you for the difference. And you've got a repo on your credit.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. Meanwhile, you could have sold it and.

[Dave Ramsey]

And, you know, doubled or tripled and cut, cut the problem down. So you guys, I, I don't like my car anymore, so I'm going to, to just drop it off at the dealer. Y' all can't do that. Okay. You're killing yourself. It's not a herz Rent a car. Today's Ramsey show question is brought to you by why Refi? If you've been been turned down for refinancing your defaulted private student loans, you're not alone and you're not out of luck. Why Refi exists to give people like you another shot. Go to yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey. Not available in all states.

[Jade Washall]

Today's question comes from Savannah in Alabama. She says, my partner and I are engaged in living together. Together I have about 200,000 in student loan debt and he has 125,000 left on his mortgage. We have separate finances and he's supportive of me getting out of debt. The problem is that I have a hard time watching him splurge on hobbies and travel, which he can easily afford while I can't. I agree that when we get married, all this changes. And we've already talked about being frugal together. Is it fair to ask him to save now for when we get married. And if not, how do I manage this disconnect?

[Dave Ramsey]

He should want to save. Yeah. Because he's going to have to face the piper later.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it's going to cause him to kick the can down the road on the marriage date.

[Jade Washall]

Well, that's my thing. It doesn't sound like there's much of a date. She doesn't mention a date. And so I wonder about that.

[Dave Ramsey]

We're already acting like we're married in every sense of the word. Word. We're living together. Go get married. Like, this weekend. Yeah, that solves it. Which is what you should have done in the first place, actually.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, the whole thing is weird. They're living together. It's his mortgage. It's her debt. Yeah. There's a lot of problems here.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're trying to do everything in the wrong order and in the wrong way. So it solves it all. Just go get married. This way we can. And then both of you attack. That shuts down the whole discussion. If you were living separately and he was making a lot of money and had no debt except his mortgage and the same question came up. I would expect him to want to. If he called and asked us what to do, we would tell him to save money like crazy so that as soon as he comes home with a honeymoon, he makes a big old lump. Some hit.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

On that thing. Right.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that would be the more normal way to. I don't know. Normal is the right word, but it would be the more the. If everything was in the proper order, that's the way it would go.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Instead, we've gotten things out of order here.

[Jade Washall]

He doesn't think that you guys are getting married anytime soon, nor does he.

[Dave Ramsey]

Have an incentive to.

[Jade Washall]

No, he doesn't. So of course he's supportive of you paying off your debt. That doesn't. That's no skin off his back.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And there's no reason to get married. He's got everything he needs.

[Jade Washall]

There you have it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hello. All right. I'm just saying. All right. Maya is in Colorado Springs. Hey, Maya. What's up?

[Caller]

Hey.

How are y'?

All?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Hey.

So I've got a debt snowball question, so getting ready to start. Baby step two. And I've got all my debts listed out, smallest to largest. But I was evicted in January and I still owe that apartment complex about 14,000. Doll.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why were you a victim?

[Caller]

Number six on my list. I lost my job due to a medical complication. I'm re Employed now and was able to get another rental place with a larger deposit.

[Dave Ramsey]

Great. What do you make?

[Caller]

My. Yeah, I make about 42,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, good. All right. So you got a huge debt there, huh?

[Caller]

Oh, that's just a portion of it. I'm about 53 in total. But my question is my ex boyfriend, my boyfriend at the time was a co applicant on that apartment with me. He was in another state. He never lived in that apartment. He was just helping me out because my credit is so bad. So I'm wondering if I should get that one paid off first so that he's not screwed when his lease is over or if I should still just follow the snowball and go smallest to largest.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, he's already screwed because he's got a judgment against him.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So I mean when his lease is over, that's going to show up on his credit bureau.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I mean show he's got a judgment. Had a judgment against him that's been paid off or he's just got a judgment because the lease he signed got evicted. So that's going to. Yeah, he's got a pretty heavy damage to him already. Most of the damage has already been done is my point.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So whether it's paid off or not is not. Is not really going to keep him from getting something over in another city. City. So you got 56, 54,000 you said. What's the other debts?

[Caller]

53. Let's see. Let me pull up my notes real quick. I've got some credit card debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much?

[Caller]

Small personal loans.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much credit card?

[Caller]

About 16,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. That's, that's 30 of the 53. What's the rest of it?

[Jade Washall]

Personal loans. How much is that?

[Caller]

I've got about 14,000 on a car that was wrecked that I didn't have insurance on and then a little over 12,000 to the apartment complex and then just some other small things like old wife fighters that I haven't paid.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

Insurance I in debt on, stuff like that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. You are paying double and triple for a lot of things because you're paying it poorly. There's a lot of things on this list that are out of control things. A car that I wrecked I didn't have insurance on. Other stuff I haven't gotten around to and it's piled up back there. So there's a lot of different crisises represented in those things that you created by not taking care of business.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like keeping car insurance in place, that's like a priority because otherwise you end up with this mess on a car. And you don't even have the car anymore.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Jade Washall]

What kind of work do you do?

[Caller]

I'm a dog groomer.

[Jade Washall]

A dog groomer. Okay. And I'm just trying to understand how this all originated, how this kind of started spiraling out. Like Dave was saying, where that instability came from. Is it coming from dog grooming as a profession, or is it coming from something else?

[Caller]

No. So in November, I was diagnosed with a disease that prevents me from driving, and I'm a mobile dog groomer now. It's managed and medicated, and I'm back to work. But that's kind of when all of that happened.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Caller]

I wasn't able to pay the rent and the car insurance and everything just quickly piled up. The credit card debt is just, for me, being irresponsible.

[Jade Washall]

And you've cut them up. So sense.

[Caller]

Oh, yeah.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. So. Okay, yeah, no, I'm going to work the debt snowball straight up. List your debts, smallest to largest. Pay minimum payments on everything but the little ones, and attack the little ones with a vengeance. And work your way straight through as fast as you can. Are you on a salary at 42?

[Caller]

No, I make around 800 a week, depending on, you know, tips and all that sort of stuff.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right. Okay. Okay. Are you able to work more than you're working?

[Caller]

So the branch in Colorado Springs just opened about two weeks ago. I was able to pick up a third day, and as it grows, I'll be able to pick up more.

[Dave Ramsey]

Work day?

[Caller]

Yeah, I currently work three days a week.

[Dave Ramsey]

What are you doing with the other four days?

[Caller]

I doordash take care of my kid in my home and.

[Dave Ramsey]

Didn't sound like it didn't sound like it to me. It sound like you're doing nothing?

[Caller]

Pretty much, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Listen, you're broke. You got to be working girl. Yeah, all the time.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old is your baby?

[Caller]

She's three.

[Dave Ramsey]

And who takes care of him when you're working?

[Caller]

My fiance.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. When are you getting married?

[Caller]

That is to be determined, depending on how long it takes us to not be broke.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's how. No, that. That's how fiance works. We have a date. Otherwise. Otherwise we have a promise that has not got a date.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so, yeah, that's an issue. How long have you all been engaged?

[Caller]

November.

[Dave Ramsey]

Being debt free is not required to get married in the state of Colorado.

[Caller]

This is true.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So what does he make.

[Caller]

Right now? He's not working because he was in a motorcycle wreck.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Y' all are A hot mess.

[Jade Washall]

How is he taking care of a baby? I mean a three year old.

[Caller]

Yeah, I mean he can manage.

[Jade Washall]

I think he can work. I think. Think you both need to work more.

[Dave Ramsey]

A lot more. Yeah. Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

That's why I asked the question before.

[Dave Ramsey]

Less partying, more working. Lots more working. Money comes from work. You need money. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Jade Washoff, Ramsey personality number one best selling author is my co host today. Andreas is with us in Austin, Texas. Hey Andres, how are you?

[Caller]

Hey Dave, thank you. Thanks for taking my call. Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

How can we help?

[Caller]

Well, I need your help trying to figure out how to retire my wife. We have, we had a baby a few months ago and it has now, it's now time for her to go back into the office. And every time she leaves for the office, I can see it in her eyes. It's killing her to, to go to the office. And I would love nothing more than to work, you know, and just take. I mean, sorry, I am working but you know, take care of all the bills and do all that. The problem is she makes more money than I do and not by a small margin. She's in software, I'm in construction. And so.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you mean trying to figure.

[Caller]

Out, you know, Now I make 5,000 take home.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does she make?

[Caller]

7,200Amonth.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And can you live on $5,000 a month?

[Caller]

We have to figure it out. We got a mortgage but no other payment.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much is your mortgage?

[Caller]

Mortgage by 3441.

[Dave Ramsey]

I can't live in that house. You can't live in that house if she's at home. Home.

[Jade Washall]

That's the big picture to this. That's the big key to this is you'd have to sell the house, you'd have to downsize and it'd have to be something to where the mortgage is. No more than 25% of 5,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Take home, pay 1,250.

[Caller]

1250, half the house. We, we do have various investments. We have about 415,000. And what across we have about. Some of it is retirement, about 60 for each of us in 401ks. Then the rest of it is in brokerage accounts and some company stocks.

[Dave Ramsey]

So which totals? What the non retirement totals, how much?

[Caller]

So the 412 minus about 120.

[Dave Ramsey]

So let's call it 300 grand. Okay. Okay. So what's your loan balance on the mortgage?

[Caller]

We have, we owe 269. We have about 200,000 in equity.

[Dave Ramsey]

So if you paid off the mortgage with your brokerage account, you done no mortgage, now you got $5,000. That's better than selling it. That's extra. Extra information we didn't have early in the conversation.

[Jade Washall]

It's a big piece of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah, I think you should probably do that anyway. You should do that anyway.

[Caller]

The money. So is that. Yeah. What now does that make sense? So I mean having the money and the, you know, invested is not. That doesn't make more than. Because I think our interest rate on the house is 6%. But the average return on the investment should be like seven or something for the year. Right?

[Jade Washall]

Sure. But you said you opened the call with saying you are looking for a way to use your words, retire your wife, but she wants to be a stay at home mom. And you were looking at how can I do that? And we were saying, here's the solution to what you're saying now, to Dave's point, we would have told you to do that regardless because it's non retirement funds, it's stock and you still have the debt of your home laying around. So we probably would have suggested that.

[Dave Ramsey]

To you regardless of the fact no one has ever. No millionaire that we've ever interviewed. Dude, Andres has said the way I got rich was I borrowed money on my house and invested it in a brokerage account. 00 millionaires say that.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So that, that's, that's mythology from Tick Tock. Okay, this doesn't work because in the real world we have this thing called risk and babies. So if we paid off your house, how much other debt do you have?

[Caller]

Have nothing. We own our cars, we don't have anything else.

[Dave Ramsey]

So without a house payment, sit down and do a budget with your wife tonight on the Every Dollar app and commit to living on your income and not a dime more.

[Jade Washall]

And just to. Just to drive this solution home, I just wanted to ask, did you have any suggestions of how you could do it?

[Caller]

Well, I mean, so here's another factor because she's in software, her next, she should be getting her trajectory. She should be making 400,000 like pretty soon.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Caller]

So I'm just wondering if we can move, you know, move the assets that we currently have around and of course I'm going to do my best to get my money up too. But just if we can do something here just with what we have to get to that point where she can step away from that job, you know, in the next five or five or five years or so.

[Sponsor/Announcer]

So you're saying, can we push?

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm so Confused. You. You are so screwed up on your goals, you need to decide what it is you want. Honey, you called up and said, my wife's eyes when she leaves the brand new baby, she just has, I want to retire my wife. We just told you how to do that. Now you got her working five more years. I'm confused.

[Jade Washall]

Well, that's the biggest question is, is this her saying to you, I want to stay at home, or is this something you've put in your brain that you want to, like, surprise her with?

[Caller]

She has. She has expressed, you know, not demanded, but express. It would be nice to have that option. Sorry, I made up.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, y' all gotta sit down tonight and figure out what you want to do. Does she want to work and make 400k or does she want to be at home? Yeah, clearly, to pay off the house. Either way. And, you know, figure out if you can live on five grand. Dude. And then you work your career and get your career up and someday she goes back to work. By then, her software skills will be completely irrelevant and she gets to start completely over. So if she steps out, you don't get to step out of that world for five minutes, much less five years. And so that world's cutting edge, bleeding edge changes every 10 minutes. And so the number of things that the people in this building that do software engineering are doing today that they did five years ago is zero. Nothing is the same. And so about the time I start understanding a little bit of what they're doing, it's over and I have to start again. So, yeah, that's. But that's okay. But it's not a skill set that you can put on the shelf and take back off the shelf, like, later. You know, it's not like I'm a nurse. You know, anatomy is not going to change when you come back five years later. Okay, but the. And, you know, there may be a few medical procedures that are different or something like that, but nursing will still be nursing five years later. You can put that one on the shelf, keep your certs active, go back to work when the kid goes to kindergarten. That's not an unusual thing. People do that stuff all the time. This one, you're just saying, I'd rather be home than make 400k. And that's not. That's perfectly okay, but you don't want.

[Jade Washall]

To enter that on assumptions is all I'm saying.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you don't want to go. You don't want to go. We're going to do this and hope it works. Out. You need to lay down. This is what the budget looks like on $5,000 and this is what we are both willing to do.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And if you're not willing to do that, then don't quit.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. And weigh out all the opportunity costs on that. Cuz $400,000 is a big income. And I'm not saying money is everything, but to Dave's point, there's a lot to be weighed and considered there. Kind of like what you said in the first segment about you have to make a decision with the end in mind.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm pretty sure 98%. I made that number up of 99.9% of the ladies who have their first child and when they go back to work, it's very difficult.

[Jade Washall]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now I have a lady working here that just had her third child and she couldn't wait to come back to work.

[Jade Washall]

Listen, you did not lie, Dave. There is no lie.

[Dave Ramsey]

So it, you know, finding reasons to.

[Jade Washall]

Get out of the house.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's a normal thing to have this, you know, have this angst. And if you're a career lady, that's a normal thing. And so you just got to work through what's real here. Many of you listen to the Ramsey show because you're sick and tired of getting nowhere with your money. You work too hard to live paycheck to paycheck with no money in the bank.

[Caller]

Bank.

[Dave Ramsey]

But here's the deal. Just listening to the show won't change that. If you want different results, you have to do something different. We've helped millions of people save money, ditch debt and build wealth. And you can too. But you got to have a game plan. And that begins with our get started assessment. Go to ramseysolutions.com start now. Take the free quiz and get your free step by step action plan. If you've had it with money stress and are ready to take control of your money for good, could go to ramseysolutions.com start now. Are you staying on track with your baby steps? You can take a quick quiz to check your progress and receive a personalized plan just for you. Simply head to the show notes, click the link titled are you on track with the baby steps? And complete the free quiz and we'll send you a personalized plan. Nicole is in Utah. Hi, Nicole. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm so good. Thank you so much for taking my call. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Good, good. I'm so excited. I can't. I'm a little nervous.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Caller]

So I have A question I. My husband and I are on baby step step number two. We've gone through a lot of. We've got a lot of medical and credit card debt. I've had really bad health problems the last three to four years. So now we are just struggling to pay all our credit cards and our medical bills. I was listening to you earlier and somebody called in and you told them to stop contributing to the 401k in those kind of cases. Is that right?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Caller]

Okay. My question is, would it be smart or really stupid to take that 401k money out to help with the debts and the monthly payments?

[Jade Washall]

I would not take the money out of the 401k that you have stocked up thus far, but I would stop contributing to it. How much are you currently contributing?

[Caller]

We stopped contributing about a month ago, so we're not contributing anymore.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much debt have you got on credit cards and medical bills?

[Caller]

In credit cards, we've got close to 20,000 in medical debt. It's probably 4,004.

[Dave Ramsey]

And how much are your. Do you own your cars?

[Caller]

We don't owe any on our cars. We drive beaters or 2004.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your household income?

[Caller]

It's about 115 for my husband and I make like 12. I just do part time work.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so are you. Are you still in.

[Caller]

No, I'm feeling better and I'm able to work now full time. So I'm slowly increasing that, which is helping a little.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. Okay. If you're all better now, why are you slowly increasing it?

[Caller]

Just to get my momentum up, back to where I'm 100% functioning. I had a knee replacement, three knee surgeries and carpal tunnel. So it's like kind of fresh and I still have to recover from it a little bit.

[Dave Ramsey]

When does. When did you have your knee replaced?

[Caller]

A year ago.

[Dave Ramsey]

You should be back functioning.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Take a year to do a knee replacement.

[Jade Washall]

Also depends on what kind of work you're trying to do.

[Caller]

Yeah, I actually worked as a lunch lady at the school and I also on the side do doordash deliveries just to try and make some money.

[Jade Washall]

So you're. This for you is a lot of standing, a lot of lifting. I still agree with Dave. I feel like you should be ready if you've done the physical therapy.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

What's the doctor say?

[Caller]

The doctors, I don't say much at all.

[Jade Washall]

Well, they'll let you know. You're clear to work.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I mean, yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah, I'm clear to work for sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And so you need we don't need to be doordashing and lunch lady. We need a real job and start getting some, some money coming in. And you guys aren't managing the 115 very well either. This should not. 24,000 should not be killing you if you make 115,000 plus your income.

[Jade Washall]

I think you're not on a budget. Am I right?

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you're not on a budget.

[Jade Washall]

Okay. So we're gonna.

[Caller]

We have a written down one, but we don't.

[Jade Washall]

It's not the same. Yeah, it's not the same. We're gonna hook you up with every dollar. The all new EveryDollar. It's the best budgeting app out there. There. But not only that, it's going to help you walk through what we're teaching you here. Okay. So at the end of this call, as long as you open every dollar, it's going to pick up where we left off and keep you on track. Okay. But you have to promise that you're going to log in and on board.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. No more eating out, no more vacations. And you need a full time job.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now a year after a knee replacement, you need a full time job and your family needs the income and you guys need to clean this mess up. So yeah, it sounds like talking to you that your body has recovered more than your emotions from the medical problems.

[Caller]

You hit the nail on the head there. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. I don't blame you. I'm a wuss when it comes to pain. So my wife is like a Navy SEAL and I get a hangnail and I'm an icu, so. So I get that. But I think it's gonna be really good for your emotions and everything. Your energy level will go up when you've got something to a harness to lean into to pull. And so go do that. Go do something now. And the more activity you have, the more endorphins are released, the more some of the cloud, the fog starts to lift and you go on. And so hard work actually solves a lot of stuff in this situation. But yeah, you guys need to get that 115 bark and then you add another 50 to it. And you guys are not only going to pay off this debt, you're going to build an emergency fund, you're going to start building wealth. And that's where we're headed with this. So let's go somewhere with this rather than simply survival and trying to find some hack so we don't have to deal with our disorganization like borrowing on your 401k or cashing out your 401k? Not going to do that. That doesn't make sense. You have enough money to get this paid off very, very quickly. You should be debt free in under a year.

[Jade Washall]

Amen.

[Dave Ramsey]

Maybe around six months, depending on what you make at your new job. Full time job, big girl job. Like get up 8 o' clock in the morning, go to work, come home.

[Jade Washall]

5 o', clock, you'll feel better.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, real job. And it's not lunchroom job. Go do something. I don't care what you're doing. Customer service. I don't care what you're doing. You don't have to do something that's necessarily physically exerting, but you've got to go get engaged for 40 freaking hours a week. And doordash is a copy out and go get it. Go get her done, girl. It's going to be good for you. Cynthia is in Panama City, Florida. Hi Cynthia, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. Doing better than I deserve. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Just the same. How can I help?

[Caller]

Great, great. Well, I wanted to say first of all, I'm kind of nervous. I hope that I can word this so that it's understood. And I wanted to say thank you for teaching me how to become a millionaire. I believe in the Bible, I believe your advice and I believe I will become a millionaire. So thank you for teaching me how to handle money now, now and when I become millionaire status perfect. And so my situation, I did complete financial youth university recently and I'm doing the every dollar budget. But I'm stalled out on baby step six because I'm in a situation now where I'm a caregiver for my parents, my elderly parents. They're 88 and 93. We went through the hurricane in 2018 that destroyed my house, house, their house. My husband helped us put everything back together, but he's passed away and now my plate is very full with being a caregiver and I never want to go through having to rebuild another house by myself. My question is, should I sell the house rent until I can make my next move and just bank the proceeds from the cell until I can get out of this state?

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you living with your elderly parents that you're giving care to too?

[Caller]

Partially. I'm there during the week and then I come here to my.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have a home. You have a home separate. And that's the home we're talking about?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so what's your current home worth?

[Caller]

3,70Ish.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the reason you're selling it is because you don't want to rebuild it if there's another hurricane, I'm afraid that.

[Caller]

Another hurricane will come and not only will I have damage to my house, but my parents house, evacuating them, finding a place for all of us going through the, the hell that we went through in 2018 alone.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're gonna do it again if you live in Florida?

[Caller]

Yeah, most likely. I mean, it's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Even if you rent, you're not gonna escape it.

[Jade Washall]

How long have you lived in Florida? Your whole life.

[Caller]

I moved in 2013 from Texas.

[Jade Washall]

And so in 2013, this hurricane that came through last, was that your first big one? One?

[Caller]

Yes and no. You know, I had lived in Florida be previously, but it was far away from the coast. That was Opal. Opal was just a lot of wind.

[Jade Washall]

And unless you plan on moving your elderly parents out of Florida and everybody sells and moves north, there's no avoiding this.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I mean, moving into a rental doesn't avoid it. It just means that somebody else has to rebuild the house.

[Jade Washall]

But you still have to evacuate. You still have to go through it.

[Dave Ramsey]

You still have to go through all the issue. So no, I, I don't think that's a logical fear that I would deal with. I know it's been hell and I know you've been wounded by this and I'm hearing the pain in your voice. I'm sorry for that. But no, I would not liquidate a home unless I'm moving away from Florida. Yeah, we've all done dumb things with money. I've done them with zeros on the end. One of the biggest mistakes I see people make with money is not having a plan for it. You got to have a plan. You got to be intentional. And you need to get a budget. You have to tell your money where to go so you're not wondering where it works. Went our budgeting app. Every dollar helps you do just that. It's the easiest and fastest way to make a monthly plan. For every dollar you've got coming in and going out, now's the best time to get started before the ridiculous holiday spending season gets here and sucks you in because you didn't have a plan. Don't let that happen. You're done making that mistake. Go download every dollar for free in the App Store or Google Play today. Buying or selling a home in this weird, wild world, right, requires facts, not drama. And there's a lot of drama and falsehoods floating around, particularly stuff like TikTok and so forth. Regarding real Estate and what's really happening out there. You need real facts. We'll help you with that. We have a website called US Housing Market Trends that gives you simple facts so you'll know what's really going on. Check it [e-mail] marketing or click the notes. And click in the show notes if you're on a podcast or YouTube and it'll put you right in there. Jessica is in Massachusetts. Hi, Jessica. How are you?

[Caller]

Good.

How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Caller]

I just have a question. It's kind of more of like, advice on how to proceed from here. So just a little background. My husband and I followed your steps. We paid off all of our debt. And thank you for the leadership in that way to get us through to where we are now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Congratulations. I'm proud of you.

[Caller]

Thank you. So we're having a little bit of an issue with interpersonal relationships now that we are in a spot where we're kind of living like nobody else, like you have stated. And a lot of our friends and family members are kind of making remarks towards us when we do do something because we have the means to do it. Like, we bought, you know, my husband bought his truck outright. And, you know, people are like, oh, it must be nice.

[Dave Ramsey]

Who are people people?

[Caller]

Some of it's mostly people like my husband's friends.

[Dave Ramsey]

He needs new friends.

[Jade Washall]

That's. That's called Haterade. That's Haterade. That's.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, listen, real friends are exposed when two things happen, crisis and success. That's when you find out who your real friends are. So your husband has found out that he has acquaintances.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're not friends.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah, so true.

[Caller]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

Friends know how to celebrate you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I mean, yeah, I've got. I've got a friend that hit up, you know, made. Made an amazing amount of money selling his business the other day. And the only thing I can think of to say is, way to go. I'm proud of you.

[Jade Washall]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because he's, like, my friend.

[Caller]

Right? Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I didn't roll my eyes and go, all billionaires should be taxed. You know, I mean, really, that's just dumb.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. So is that what they're saying? Must be nice. That's what they're saying to him.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah. And kind of like making, like, snide remarks like that when, you know, when we talk about it. And, I mean, it's not like we didn't try, like, before when we first started to do your program.

[Dave Ramsey]

Number one, we don't need to talk about it so much. We just need to do whatever we're going to do.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Doesn't need to be a lot of discussion. But number two, if somebody does that, they get about two of those and third strike, they're out.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. I mean, if it really. If you really think it's a friend, which the behavior doesn't suggest that, but if it is something that you're like, man, I really want to see, then just ask him about it. That's what I would do. If I had a friend that I'd been friends with for years and they started with this business, I would believe in the friendship enough to say, hey, when you say that, what do you mean? Because. Because if the tables were reversed, I'd be happy for you and I would just ask them and then you're going to learn a lot by their response, or he will, and then you can take it from there.

[Dave Ramsey]

But I think what you've got is you're not real friends is what I think.

[Caller]

Okay. All right, thank you very much. I appreciate that.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think you're just going to find out. I mean, you know, we found out during COVID we had a whole bunch of negative press and we found out who our friends were. Were. And we found out when we're very successful and we get in the hall of fame and we have another number one best selling book, we find out who our friends are. But the number of times I'm going to tolerate someone calling up and going, well, look at you, you know, I'm going to be going, well, look at you. I mean, seriously, I mean, I'm gonna.

[Jade Washall]

Give, I want to give a little bit of grace for sometimes people have. Have moments where they do not show up as their best self.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, I'm just, yeah, I'm saying I call them. You're saying call them out. You're going to be a little more gentle and calling them out than I am.

[Jade Washall]

I don't know about gentle, but I'm going to call them out.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I'm going to. Definitely. I'm going to be going, hey, you know that, that what you're doing. Yeah, don't do that. And we're not, you know, we're not going to be doing this anymore. So not, not if you want to hang around here. So, you know, and if it's family, then you just limit the amount of time you're around them. Just go, I can't hang out here. It's too much, too much negativity.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, all you're doing is trash. And everything I've been working hard for. It's like. You know the one I love is you're so lucky. Oh, that one pisses me off.

[Jade Washall]

That's your.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's your, like a hot button. I'm not. Lucky's got. Lucky's got work overall zones. What Lucky's got. Lucky's got call. Lucky's got hours spent while you were sitting on your butt drinking beer, watching Netflix. That's what Lucky's got. I got your Lucky.

[Jade Washall]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

That gets me Lucky's butt, man. That gets me going right there. You're so lucky. Luck didn't have squat to do with this, darling. It was not luck at all. God's blessings. I'll go with, okay. And my hard work. There is some corn in the field because we freaking planted some corn. Luck had nothing to do with it. Okay. Hello.

[Jade Washall]

I can tell this really bothers you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, this one bothers me. I can't stand it. It's like. And it's even. It's even people out there just in the comments and stuff. I don't read the comments and junk, but that I used to get, like, in. When I used to interface with people on Twitter when it was new and you could argue with people back then, it was kind of fun. And I would just go at them, you know, because it's so fun. And then. But then. But yeah.

[Jade Washall]

You know what I hate it's too. It's a. It's a combination of two when people say, oh, are you still doing your little budget or whatever? Oh, yeah, it's little or whatever.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Demeaning.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. Are you still doing that little business?

[Dave Ramsey]

Still doing that little. Yeah, I'm still. It's got, you know, I got a little million dollars from it, and so matter of fact, I got two little million dollars. There's two of those little million dollars over there from that and might be three soon. Those little billion dollars. Yeah. But still, we're still working on that little. Yeah, you're right.

[Jade Washall]

I hate that.

[Dave Ramsey]

So demeaning. I hate to pat you on the head.

[Jade Washall]

Aren't you cute doing that little.

[Dave Ramsey]

Aren't you cute.

[Jade Washall]

Still working on that little.

[Dave Ramsey]

You still doing that little Dave Ramsey cult thing? Yeah, that one. That's. That's just. That's hilarious. So here's the deal. The. The Catholics have a wonderful saying. They say that envy is one of the seven deadly sins. Wow.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so jealousy is. I want what you have. Envy is. I don't think I can have what you have. So I don't want you to have it.

[Jade Washall]

That's diabolical.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's diabolical. It's evil at its core. And so that's the kind of stuff you run into, Jessica, as you start to win. But it does. It separates the sheep from the goats. It separates the wheat from the tares. And it's pretty obvious. I mean, I got. I got poison over here and I got fruit over here. And so I'm gonna hang out with the fruit and the poison's gonna have to go away.

[Jade Washall]

Cause they can't cheer you on.

[Dave Ramsey]

You are opting out of my life by being a butt. I'm serious. I mean, it's just how this works. We'll talk about it depending on how long the friendship quote unquote's been going on, how gentle we are, or how much we talk about it. But if it's a casual thing, I'll just casually not be available anymore.

[Jade Washall]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm casually not going to show up at your next deal. I'm saying that because I don't want to hang out with a bunch of goats.

[Jade Washall]

That's so good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not the deal. So. Yeah.

[Jade Washall]

It is disappointing, though, when that happens.

[Dave Ramsey]

It does aggravate you, but. And I'm still capable, obviously, of getting aggravated about it, but. Yeah. You're so lucky. You're so lucky.

[Jade Washall]

Must be nice.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, man. Just line up behind that luck and think about the number of hours, number of airline miles. Oh, my God, the amount of time I spent in a jet flying and going through freaking tsa. And, oh, man, the stuff we've done. The stuff. The hard. The work. The hotel rooms. Gross, grotesque, gross. Instead of sleeping in your own bed. You know, you're so lucky. I don't think so. Our scripture of the day, Luke 6. 37. Do not judge and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. Benjamin Franklin said, creditors have better memories than debtors. This is true. Marsha's in Spokane, Washington. Hi, Marsha. How are you?

[Caller]

Hey. I'm just groovy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cool. How come we help?

[Caller]

Hey. Yeah. My husband passed away this last winter. Spring.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry.

[Caller]

And I'm. Yeah, it was kind of a bummer, but trying to get things put together financially, you know. Fortunately, I don't have a problem in that we have money, which is nice, but trying to figure out how to be wisest with what I've got. And I've been listening to you and, you know, hearing about. I think it has turned the IRAs into to Ross and wondering if that would be a good choice for me. What? I don't know if it helps you to know what I've got going.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are you?

[Caller]

I am 60. I'll be 67 in a week.

[Dave Ramsey]

67. All right. And how much were you left in our IRAs?

[Caller]

Well, I got 1.2 in SEP, 300 in an IRA. And then I've got right now 420 sitting in a high 3.75. And debts are about 50,000 on our house, and that's at about 3.75 all three. And then we have a rental in Huntington beach that we use for our kids who are missionaries down there and other missionaries to live in. And that one we owe about 725 on.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it does not create an income because you furnish it to missionaries.

[Caller]

Yeah, right. Yeah, yeah. It's just kind of on its own. I have income for. Fortunately, your last conversation with. Because we had years tell us.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, yeah, you're cutting out a little bit, Marcia. I didn't hear all that. You have an income.

[Caller]

That's what I have an income of Social Security of 3,700 from my husband and then about 30,000amonth from our network marketing business.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right, good. Okay. So you got plan to live on. Obviously.

[Caller]

I got plenty to live on. Yeah. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[Caller]

And if you got how to be the wisest.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

With the other stuff.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, the no brainer is take some of the high yield savings to pay off your mortgage.

[Caller]

Mm.

[Jade Washall]

The 50,000.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Like tonight.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. That's a no.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

The other two. The other two areas I do want to work on long term, but none of them are a panic is I want to start get with your Smartvestor Pro or whoever's helping you with your investment and start talking about moving the IRAs and the SEPs gradually into Roth. Because whatever's not there, when you hit 72 and a half, you're gonna have required minimum distributions and you make enough money from the network marketing stuff to pay the taxes that are created. If you move some money over systematically every year for the next several years. Because if it's all in Roth, it's growing from that point forward tax free. And it passes to your kiddos if you've got them, or your heirs, tax free. And no required distributions on any of it. If it's in a traditional. It's going to have required distributions over 10 years on inherited and required minimum distributions if you're alive and it's, you know, paying out to you, required to pay out to you. So they're going to get their tax money. It's just a matter of when and what it looks like.

[Caller]

Here's another thing I didn't throw in there on that 300 in the I. That's actually from an old IRA that he had with Shriners through whatever.

[Dave Ramsey]

But.

[Caller]

So I have three years to decide what I want to do with that. If I want to continue it where it is, move it into something else is. I don't really understand that.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know what it's in. Why you would have anything that's three years. What?

[Caller]

Well, it's within the three years. It's in Transamericans, I think is what does it. But I got a letter and within three years I need to decide what my final place I want it to land is again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you have someone that's advising you on your. On your investments?

[Caller]

Not really.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So jump on ramseysolutions.com and find a couple of the smartvestor pros and interview them in the area. We're not in the investment business, but these are people that we have vetted that give advice that sounds like we don't did it like we said it. Okay. And that's why we're willing to put our name beside them. And they have the heart of a teacher, which is most important because I want you to understand everything you're doing or don't do it. Okay. But basically I see two things. Three things I want to do. One, I want to pay off your house today. Two is I want to begin a systematic move of the IRA and the SEP into good growth stock mutual funds and Roth IRAs. And I think you can pay the taxes out of your huge income because you're making $360,000 a year. And I got a feeling you don't spend anywhere near that.

[Caller]

You're right. You're right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And so if you spend $100,000 a year on taxes out of that and you're able to move all this stuff into Roth, it's really a good move. And I'm going to begin to do that. It doesn't have to happen immediately, but put a system on that. And the third thing is I got to deal with that $725,000 mortgage.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

A mortgage has got to go away at some point. And I don't know when what you're going to do to make that go away, whether you're going to use some of your investments and some of your income to make it go away or whether you're going to look at selling it.

[Jade Washall]

Yeah. How long? I mean what did you think? When's that going to play out till having other people stay there?

[Caller]

Well, as long as the Lord calls their ministry to be there, they hold. They head up a ministry called Circuit Riders from Youth with a mission.

Down.

There and that's something we've been committed to do.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And what's that proper. What's that property worth?

[Caller]

About 2 million.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well I mean another option, Another option is find a million and a quarter property that you pay cash.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And move them into that. Sell that and make. And move them into that. That might be another option.

[Jade Washall]

That's a great idea.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know something like. Because that's not a bad. That's not exactly slumming it. So.

[Caller]

Yeah, no, no it's not. They have, they live downstairs and then upstairs is a mother in law and they have four staff members live upstairs and pay rent also up there.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller]

Which I don't know, I mean kind of playing around.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't care how you do it but some, whether you move to a million and a quarter, million and a half and you pay cash for that. But I don't want you sitting there 70, 75 years old, old with a $700,000 mortgage for a missionary property. I want you to pay it off.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Somehow or another because I want that stability and peace for you because you're being so generous and I appreciate what you're doing and I'm familiar with Youth with a Mission. Very familiar. And so I know exactly what's going on there and I think what you're doing is awesome. So keep it up. But let's figure out a way to do it where it doesn't leave you quite so vulnerable. And it could be that we, okay, we got 420 in a high yield savings. We take 50 out, that's 370 towards seven and a quarter. That's only 300,000. You may just pay it off out of your income, reduce it by that high yield savings and then pay it off out of your income. But I'm not going to be sitting there with a high yield savings account and a bunch of mortgages. That money needs to be used to start clearing stuff or some other strategy. But those are the three areas if I were in your shoes that I would be working on. I'm sorry for your loss and but it sounds like you guys have done an absolutely wonderful job creating income and taking good care of it. So congratulations. And obviously you and he together have left you in a really good spot. Yeah, that's good. So, yeah, three things. Let's clean up those sep iras and move them into rock roths. Let's pay off your house tonight. And then let's start trying to figure out how we're going to pay off the property in Huntington or how we're going to shift it to a different property to where we end up net. Net net debt free. And so, I mean, I don't care if you just pay it off and keep it. It's not a bad idea. I think that's kind of what I'd probably do. I'd throw 370 of that high yield savings at it and then chase the rest. You know, $30,000 a month coming in. I'm gonna just chunk that puppy and be done with it in about a year and a half, two years. I don't want you hitting 70 years old with a mortgage. That's what I don't want. Even if you got a million bucks laying over there, I still don't want you having a mortgage. So we got to work towards that. That's the direction. Good question. Good question. Marsha, thank you for calling. That puts us out of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace, Christ Jesus me.