If You Want To Do Great Things You Need To Do Hard Things First

Summary

The Ramsey Show

Episode Title: If You Want To Do Great Things, You Need To Do Hard Things First
Air Date: October 6, 2025
Hosts: Ken Coleman, Jade Warshaw (with Dave Ramsey cameo)
Podcast Theme: Building wealth, facing financial mistakes, and overcoming obstacles by taking control of your money and life—starting with the hard things.

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Episode Overview

In this dynamic episode, Ken Coleman and Jade Warshaw field listener questions on tackling financial challenges, big and small. The recurring theme is crystal clear: True financial transformation requires facing the hard stuff first—whether that’s selling your beloved car, digging out from mountains of debt, or making tough housing decisions after a divorce. Ken and Jade emphasize the power of momentum, the discipline of Ramsey Baby Steps, and the emotional grit it takes to break old habits. Along the way, they provide practical, sometimes tough-love advice on debt payoff, investing, budgeting, and overcoming scarcity mindsets.

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Key Topics & Calls

1. Tackling Large Debt and Overwhelm

[01:05–08:40]

• Caller Jessica: Nearly $1 million in debt—$210k unsecured, $658k mortgage, two car loans, $259k annual income (down from $300k).
• Discussion:
  • Jessica’s journey includes business failures and lifestyle inflation (luxury shopping, imposter syndrome).
  • Jade normalizes her situation: “Classic mo’ money, mo’ problems… you had a big income, so you could afford to make bigger mistakes.” ([04:21])
  • Ken and Jade agree: Make a drastic change for emotional and financial momentum. Sell the upside-down $59k car (worth $35k), pay off the deficit quickly, and embrace humility by driving less flashy cars.
  • Jade: “You’re used to making a lot of money. When you get a beater, it’s gonna mess with your ego big time—but it’s gonna be so good for your soul.” ([06:40])

2. Should I Sell My Car or Pay It Off?

[10:35–17:55]

• Caller April: Post-divorce, makes $50k/year, $29k debt on her car (worth $23k), $57k cash saved.
• Advice: Sell the car, use part of savings to cover the negative equity, buy a $10k used car, and free up her finances for homeownership.
• Ken: “The spiritual gift that I have… I can find you a car right now for $10k that is extremely functional—it’s not an absolute piece of crap on wheels.” ([13:41])
• Jade: “It’s gonna feel good…getting your own set of wheels.” ([15:39–15:55])

3. Graduating Into Debt: Now What?

[23:01–29:44]

• Caller Kevin: Pharmacy grad, $180k in combined student and credit card debt, wife still in grad school, just got a job with variable hours.
• Key Points:
  • Income is the immediate need: “You’ve got to be more resourceful. That means you’re working at a coffee shop, you’re working two, three, four jobs right now.” (Ken, [25:57])
  • Jade gives the marathon analogy: “Half the battle of running a marathon...is just going, ‘Hey, this is what must be true.’” ([28:14])
  • Ken: “If you want great things, I promise you, you’re going to have to endure hard things...it’s on the other side of hard things.” ([29:00])

4. Should I Build Savings Before Paying Debt?

[69:47–75:35]

• Caller Jane: Was in Baby Step 4, setbacks (child’s illness, job loss), now owes $9k on a line of credit, wants to stockpile a bigger emergency fund instead.
• Advice: Don’t pause debt payoff: $9k is manageable—focus and get it gone in a few months. Jade: “Pay that $9,000 off...and then stack up as much money as you want to keep the big bad wolf away from your door.” ([75:18])

5. Divorce and the House: Buyout or Sell?

[44:19–52:32]

• Caller Steve: Finalizing divorce, 50/50 split on 401k, needs $100k in cash (in 90 days) for house buyout, plus $150k alimony over 5 years.
• Advice: The urgency of $100k in 90 days is a red flag; consider renegotiating or selling the house for a fresh start rather than borrowing against 401k or taking on new debt. “I’d want a clean break if I could do it.” (Ken, [51:10])
• Jade: “Begin with the end in mind.” ([52:17])

6. Car Catastrophe: Fix or Ditch?

[86:57–95:33]

• Caller Matt: Owes $23k on a truck; engine failure will cost $15k to fix; he has minimal cash and was previously supporting his girlfriend.
• Advice: Don’t go further into debt—find a way to fix it with cash or downgrade to a less expensive vehicle. “Where there’s a will, there’s a way. You can come up with $15k pretty quick. No date nights, no nothing—you gotta come up with $15k stat.” (Ken, [92:51])

7. Guilt, Boundaries & Lending Money to Friends

[118:40–126:51]

• Caller Jenna: Former friend (silent for 3 years) suddenly asks for $900 to save her storage unit. Jenna feels guilt about saying no.
• Advice: Hard no—don’t give out of guilt; only give out of joy. “Guilt and generosity don’t live in the same house...When you give, it should be out of a cheerful heart, not a guilty heart.” (Jade, [123:27])
• Ken: “You are not a person who has done anything wrong, thus you should not feel guilt. But you’re such a kind Jenna.” ([125:59])

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Jade Warshaw [06:40]:
  “You’re used to making a lot of money. When you get a beater, it’s gonna mess with your ego big time…but it’s gonna be so good for your soul because that’s what’s gonna cause you never to do this again.”
• Ken Coleman [29:00]:
  “If you want great things, I promise you, you’re going to have to endure hard things…Pick any endeavor—physical, emotional, spiritual, financial…It’s on the other side of hard things.”
• Jade Warshaw [38:04]:
  “You can have a zero credit score and go and buy a home. America needs to know this.”
• Ken Coleman [123:14]:
  “Guilt and generosity don’t live in the same house.”

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Memorable Moments & Banter

• The lighthearted banter about “push presents” and “empty nest presents” ([19:00]) and Ken’s penchant for buying used cars with cash—‘the accordion method’ ([42:12])—brings humor and relatability.
• Jade describes swallowing your pride and “riding around in a beater” as a badge of honor and a soul-restoring experience, with Ken echoing her lived example of being a “one car family.”
• The recurring theme: “Normal is broke—common sense is weird.” (Ken, [00:13]) sets the standard for the show’s tough-love advice.

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Advice Highlights, Baby Steps & Ramsey Principles

• Momentum is Crucial: Make one big move (sell the expensive car, pay off debt all at once) to create psychological and financial progress.
• No Debt is Sustainable: Regardless of how “good” the loan (0% car loan, etc.), if you can pay it off, do it—risk isn’t justified.
• Don’t Let Guilt Dictate Giving: Only give out of joy and abundance, never compulsion or manipulation.
• Hard Choices Lead to Great Things: Embrace the discomfort—whether it’s changing your lifestyle, working extra jobs, or saying “no” to friends and family.
• Follow the Steps in Order: Budget, pay off debt, build your emergency fund, then invest—don’t try to skip ahead or “play financial Twister.”
• Manual Underwriting Exists: You don’t need a credit score to get a mortgage; seek lenders (like Churchill Mortgage) who do “manual underwriting.”
• Investing Comes After Debt: Focus on using every extra dollar to build momentum and pay off debt before investing.

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Key Timestamps

• [01:05–08:40]: Jessica’s seven-figure debt & facing shame with action
• [10:35–17:55]: April’s “nothingburger” car debt & the freedom to start over
• [23:01–29:44]: Kevin’s new life with debt; embracing the marathon analogy
• [44:19–52:32]: Divorce dilemmas, house buyout vs. fresh financial start
• [69:47–75:35]: Should you save more before paying off debt? (Answer: No)
• [86:57–95:33]: $15k engine failure—why not to incur even more debt
• [118:40–126:51]: Friend asking for $900—when and why to say “no”

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Episode Tone & Style

• Practical, Empathetic: Hosts balance actionable businesslike advice with empathy for callers’ backstories.
• Candid, At Times Tough-Love: Willingness to call out “stupid tax” and the emotional traps people fall into.
• Relatable & Encouraging: Recurrent reminders: No matter the mistakes or shame, “you’re not alone and you can dig out.”

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Summary Takeaway

This episode of The Ramsey Show drives home the message: If you want substantial financial results, you must first face the hardest—often emotional—obstacles head-on. That’s how you gain momentum, change habits, and create a life of financial peace. Whether you’re climbing out of massive debt, confronting ego and status, ending old relationships, or starting fresh, the journey is tough but possible—if you do the hard things first.

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For more resources, budgeting tools, and to connect with trusted financial coaches, visit ramseysolutions.com.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today.

[Ken Coleman]

Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. This is the Ramsey Show. So excited to have you with us. 888. 825,225 is the phone number to jump in. 888-255-225. Alongside the fabulous, the incomparable Jade Warshaw. I am.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

My friend, Ken Coleman. Just happy to be in her presence, folks. It's going to be good. Fresh off of Orlando. We might talk a little bit about that. We'll see. Landing, Orlando. I can't speak now. And Chicago.

[Jade Warshaw]

Chi Town.

[Ken Coleman]

Couple live events. So much fun. We are feeling the juice from those two great crowds. Jessica is up in Arkansas. Jessica, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hi, Good morning or good afternoon. I'm sitting at just a tad bit under a million dollars in debt. Almost 200 of that is unsecured. And we were contemplating bankruptcy. But my faith tells me that I should be paying all this, and I know I should. And I'm just. I guess I'm trying to see if there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

Us.

[Jade Warshaw]

There's always hope.

[Ken Coleman]

Why don't you lay it out for us? Give us the whole 1 million in debt. What is that?

[Caller]

So 210 is unsecured personal loans. 83 of that. 210 is credit cards. The house is 658.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And then there's two vehicles that. There's two vehicles in there. One's almost paid off. And then the other one is very, very upside down.

[Jade Warshaw]

Tell us the amounts. The first. And the second.

[Caller]

One is we owe 12,000 on it. And the other one is 59,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, and how much do you know off the top of your head, what that 59,001 is worth?

[Caller]

35.

[Jade Warshaw]

Girlfriend. Okay. How much do you guys earn? It's you and your husband?

[Caller]

Yes. And he is in a job transition, so we were making over 300. Now we're at sitting at about 259 a year.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, good. That's. Listen, there's your light at the end of the tunnel. Right there is. If you had told me that your shovel was 60 or 70,000, I'd be really hurting with you. But the good news is you have a really great shovel. 259. And you said that's with or without the job loss.

[Caller]

That's with the job loss. And his job is Going to be commission only. So we haven't, we don't know what that's going to look like yet. It could be amazing.

[Jade Warshaw]

So you make, you make 259.

[Caller]

We have some retirement funds in there from military.

[Jade Warshaw]

And how much of that is the military? Like how much of that is your income and how much of that is like pension type stuff?

[Caller]

About half.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, good. That is really, really, really, really, really good news. Tell me about the 210,000. Was this a business loan? What, what was that money for?

[Caller]

It was a little bit of everything, honestly. It was some bad business endeavors, me trying to be a serial entrepreneur. It was some bad financial decision imposter syndrome. I took, took a fantastic career opportunity and I just kind of shopped my way through the imposter syndrome until I got to therapy.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

And so that was some bad financial decisions there. Luxury shopping. And then I took over. I took out two personal loans to clear my husband's credit card debt as well. So that's what all that is.

[Jade Warshaw]

This is like classic mo money. Mo problems is you had a big income and so you could afford to make bigger mistakes. Right. But really, when we boil it down, Ken, this ratio wise, it's the same call we always hear, right?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

So that's the good news is, you know, you've got 260,000 in income right now. It's going to go up exponentially. And you got, you know, I'm not counting the mortgage debt because when we're in Baby Step 2, which is the step where you're paying off all the consumer debt, we really don't count the mortgage. So can you tell me how much you're doing? Monthly mortgage payment is so I can see what percentage of your life it is.

[Caller]

39, 38.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. And so that's going to be fine with what you're bringing home. So that the mortgage is not the problem. And I just wanted to explain that to you. It's no more than 25% of your take home. So that's not the issue. The problem is you feel overwhelmed because no matter how you slice it, if you, if you tell somebody you have $300,000 of debt, that that's a lot, right?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Are you familiar with our debt snowball?

[Caller]

Yes. I actually did it probably about 20 years ago and I. The only debt I carried up until three years ago was a mortgage and a car payment. And I would usually pay the car payment, you know, double or whatever.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, are you. Okay, we get that. But let's talk about the now because your question is, is there a light at the end of the tunnel? The answer is yes, if you're willing to look for it. And so are you done now? Are you done? Is this the last time you're ever going to do this?

[Caller]

Oh, for sure. Okay, so I can't do this again.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. So in this situation, my take is I would try to get massive momentum, you know, and Jade can speak to this. I'm going to give it back to her quickly because she and Sam paid off $500,000 in debt. So you got the perfect person to talk to today. But here's my only thing that I would say and I'll hand the baton back to you, Jade. I think they need a momentum play, like a big one. And so I would be attack, I would try to get rid of the $59,000 car payment instantly. Like, even if they go upside down, you can tell how we do it. But I, I just think there needs to be a dramatic move. I don't know what your take is, having done this yourself.

[Jade Warshaw]

No, I, I agree with Ken. 100. You do. You need to do something that's going to shake you emotionally, that's going to shake you financially, that's going to almost like, it's like the gun going off of the race. Right. And I, I agree with Ken. You guys need to pull together and I mean, with your income, in a couple of short months, pull together that 24,000 that you're upside down on this vehicle and get out of it and, you know, drive the $12,000 vehicle for a while. Figure out a plan to save up another, you know, couple thousand dollars to get you a beater. And here's the thing. I'm going to be 100% straight with you. You're used to making a lot of money. When you get a beater, it's going to mess with your ego big time because in your mind you're going to go, wait a minute, I work too hard to be driving a car like this. Wait a minute. Nobody at my work drives a car like this or nobody in my social circle. Right. Because you start hanging out with who you earn money with. Right. And so you're going to be the one. And it is going to create questions and it's your choice whether you answer those questions. But I'm just letting you know right now, Jessica, that's going to happen. And there's going to be an incongruency for a while with the how hard I'm working and how much money I'm Earning versus the lifestyle I'm living. And, and I'm telling you that as a person who did that for quite a while. And that's gonna be so good for your soul because that's what's gonna. Cause you never to do this again. You're gonna go, oh my gosh, I never wanna feel that again.

[Ken Coleman]

Seriously. I think it's right. And you know, not trying to steal too much of your story, but I mean, Sam and I were hanging out last night, Jay Sussez, and he reminded me you guys had one car for a long time.

[Jade Warshaw]

We didn't get a second car until a year into working here.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, but that was just cause you adjusted to it. The massive debt payoff. You guys were one car family, so.

[Jade Warshaw]

But you said it, Kim. We got used to it.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right. You did fine.

[Jade Warshaw]

You get used to anything.

[Ken Coleman]

Right? Right.

[Jade Warshaw]

You could be making multiple six figures and get used to whatever lifestyle you create.

[Ken Coleman]

So yeah, that's hilarious to me that you were here for a year before you got wheels.

[Jade Warshaw]

And even still I was a little reluctant. I was like, we don't need it. Listen. Now get me that G wagon. I'm ready.

[Ken Coleman]

Ken, come.

[Dave Ramsey]

Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're going to die or something.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids. And I immediately went and got term life insurance.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's a gut punch.

[Caller]

And.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, you're telling me. And for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse, they've lost somebody important to them.

[Dave Ramsey]

Me too.

[Ken Coleman]

They don't know what to do next.

[Dave Ramsey]

Me too. I mean, I have a crisis here and you know, you got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow. She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up. Or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow.

[Ken Coleman]

That's exactly.

[Dave Ramsey]

These are the two opt. Take care of your dadgum family.

[Ken Coleman]

Term life insurance can replace income, pay off debts, cover funeral expenses. So your family can actually have the opportunity to just be sad. Yeah.

[Caller]

To just miss you.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's exactly what it's supposed to be. It's saying, I love you. To your family. Term life insurance, Jeff Zander and the team at Xander Insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years. They're the only people I trust. Go to Xander.com or call 800-356-4282.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, April is up next in Ohio. April, how can we help you today?

[Caller]

Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call. So I am recently divorced, 44 years old. I make 50,000 a year. I have one debt and it's a car, and I owe 29,000 on it. And I have to decide whether I want to keep the car, sell the car, pay the car off, or what to do with the Dag on car, because I want to be completely out of debt and I want to eventually buy a house.

[Ken Coleman]

Tell us how much the car is worth right now on the open market.

[Caller]

About 23, probably so upside down.

[Ken Coleman]

6. Do you have any cash?

[Caller]

I have 57,000 in the bank.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, this is a.

[Ken Coleman]

That's the only. Yeah. Sorry. Is that the only debt you have?

[Caller]

It is the only debt I have.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, Go ahead, Jade. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. In the. In the infamous words of Ken Coleman, this is what I'd call a nothing burger. Oh, which means there's no problem here.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[Jade Warshaw]

You can decide today to just pay it off. We've got the money, right?

[Caller]

Why.

[Jade Warshaw]

Why are you not doing that? What's stopping you?

[Caller]

Because I'm trying to. I'm trying to make sure I have enough money for our down payment on a house. And so in the. The Jeep is currently my ex husband's name. So I have to either refinance it my name, pay it off, get it titled to my name, or I thought about, you know, living like no one else so I can live like no one else and selling the Dag on thing and driving the junker for a little while. But I mean, I don't really want to do that because my car is rel. It's only got 50,000 miles on it. Like it's a good vehicle. It's not really the vehicle I wanted when I purchased it, but.

[Jade Warshaw]

What about his name? It's in his name.

[Caller]

It's in his name.

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, either way. Yeah, either way, you've got to. If it's going to be your car, you've got to move it to your name and make sure that you're the one who gets the title and everything like that.

[Ken Coleman]

You don't have to eat up most of the 57. I get what you're saying. So you said you're upside down. Six. Okay? So if you sell it for 23, okay. And then we take the six out of the 57, that leaves us with 51 and we're whole on the car. And then I'm telling you right now, like this is the spiritual gift that I have that nobody knows except for James Childs. He can attest to this. I can find you a car right now for 10 grand that is extremely functional. It's not an absolute piece of crap on wheels and it will get you through it. And let's say now you're down to 41,000, you're debt free, you've got a serviceable car, more than enough in the emergency fund, Jade, to fix the ten thousand dollar car. I mean you could go twelve and get a very serviceable car. And now you're debt free, emergency fund. And now onto Baby Step 3B, which is saving for the house. Unless I'm missing something, there's no reason for you to hold on to this money because we're not telling you to go empty it or even cut it in half.

[Caller]

Right. So you think your advice then would be to sell the Jeep, buy something cheaper.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And just take the 6,000 loss instead of paying it off completely.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, I thought the 6000 is paying it off completely. You're gonna sell it for 23 to keep it.

[Caller]

I mean your, your advice is to sell it instead of keep it.

[Ken Coleman]

I would, personally, I would.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh.

[Ken Coleman]

Because it's attached to him. I'll explain my reasons. There's no right or wrong on this is what I'm guessing you're gonna say. Yeah, you can keep it and pay it off. Like to Jade's point, you could pay the entire 29 down today out of the 57. Now you got yourself a car that you're used to and yada yada, yada.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, the only reason I wouldn't do that is because, yeah, Ken is right, it's too much of your take home pay. Like it's too much of your pay. It's more than, it's more than 50%. And you probably would not have bought this car if you were just you, right, you would have bought something more.

[Ken Coleman]

And my advice was based on helping you save for the house. So I gave you the advice to spend the least amount of money but still be moving forward in your life.

[Caller]

Gotcha.

[Ken Coleman]

You tracking with me? So you sell it, you get 23 for it, you're going to come out of pocket six to take care of the loan. Now. Now you just got A bunch of money back. What's that car payment every month?

[Caller]

563.

[Ken Coleman]

Girl, that's. That's like almost eight grand a month. I mean a year. We just saved you. Now, now, okay, you go buy a ten thousand dollar car and. And you're still left with forty seven thousand dollars the way I added it up earlier. And so you still got a real nice case of momentum here because you're coming out of the divorce. We got rid of a car with your ex's name on it. It's too much car for you. All the things. So that's why I gave you that plan. Because that is what I would do if I were you. That's what I would do.

[Jade Warshaw]

And it's gonna feel good getting your own. I almost said set of wheels and then that felt very retro. You're gonna feel good getting your own.

[Ken Coleman]

It's cause she hangs out with me. That's me. That's my old influence on you.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's your whip. You gotta feel good in your own whip. That's not it either.

[Caller]

Yes, exactly.

[Jade Warshaw]

You know what I mean?

[Caller]

Okay, awesome. Well, that helps so much. I thought that's what you guys would say, but I wanted to just make sure because I was literally gonna call and just pay that off today. And then I do. I really want to do that though.

[Ken Coleman]

I want. So think about. See, here's the thing. We get rid of a car attached to a chapter of your life. It's over. That's not the single reason for this, but it's a good reason. And you. It's all about momentum. Many times our advice is about momentum. Getting that. And boy, just getting rid of that $560 car payment.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's a lot.

[Ken Coleman]

That's gonna feel great. Getting rid of that other car. And now you go get your own thing and you go, I'm sacrificing on dollar car because I want my own house.

[Jade Warshaw]

Ooh, I like it.

[Ken Coleman]

I own the prize. And so if I am sacrificing Jade in the short term to see that, it's going to give me a absolutely legitimate shot at the long term that I desire. Man, that feels good. I'm in. You don't have to talk me into that kind of a sacrifice. And the other thing is I like to say this and I get too excited about this. I know. But I can't begin to tell you how many decent cars there are out there for 10, 12, $15,000. And most Americans are just. They think they're above it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I don't understand. I mean, I get it. I get it. It's a, It's a status symbol. Right.

[Ken Coleman]

I totally understand.

[Jade Warshaw]

But I've said it before. I'll say it again. Ken, you, you get in the car and, yeah, you ride to work, but other. It's sitting outside. And most of us, let's be honest, most people in America, if you have a garage, it's filled up with junk, and you let that beautiful Mercedes or that Beau Acura or whatever you drive, sit outside, get in the rain, get in the, in the snow, and then when you go to work, it sits in the parking lot.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And no one is walking in the parking lot going, oh, I wonder if that's Bob's Sedan. Right.

[Ken Coleman]

No one cares. Nobody cares. And I'll tell you this. Couple things, and Jade can back me up on this. She knows what I drive. It would surprise a lot of people what I drive. I drive an older used car. It's a fabulous little Mercedes. Looks fantastic. Looks better. Looks. Looks newer than it is. But I'll tell you this. Nobody, and I mean nobody, pulls up next to me at the stoplight and goes, oh, I got that Ken Coleman over there. I'm not sure why he's driving that late. Nobody cares. Nobody even notices me on the interstate.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Ken Coleman]

So, you know, I choose to do that because I've got higher priorities.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. I, I, My money.

[Ken Coleman]

My money is in other places. And, you know, I do. And so, you know, for me, it, it has always been functionality over status when it comes to a car. Now there's a. There's a day coming.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, it's coming when I get all.

[Ken Coleman]

The kids off the payroll.

[Jade Warshaw]

G wagon.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, man. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

They see me rolling, I'm gonna have.

[Ken Coleman]

A car with a trumpet on it just so everybody knows I'm coming. Not a horn. Like a. Yeah, like, oh, here comes Coleman. He wants everybody to know that his kids are out of the house. It's gonna be like. It's gonna be like a. By the way, at the Ramsey show, live.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

I learned a new term.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hit me.

[Ken Coleman]

I didn't know there was such a thing as a push present.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm wearing mine right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, it's ridiculous.

[Jade Warshaw]

What made you transition to that?

[Ken Coleman]

Because I'm gonna have a baby. A empty nest present for myself when I get the kids off the payroll.

[Jade Warshaw]

James, you going in?

[Ken Coleman]

Daddy is gonna go buy himself a really fun toy and just say, it's mine, because I've taken care of everybody else forever. Thank you, ma'. Am. There's a Lady out there who's giving me a really solid head nod.

[Jade Warshaw]

I like that. You get a retirement present. You get a present when you have babies.

[Ken Coleman]

I am now getting present. It's an empty nest present. Boy, Stacy is such a lucky lady. Touche, sir. That's great. She'll get something too.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, what are we talking?

[Ken Coleman]

I don't know. I'm making it up on the spot. I don't want to. I don't want to commit.

[Jade Warshaw]

Feels expensive.

[Ken Coleman]

It's going to be expensive. Hey, side note though, I think we should have a spin off show where you people call in and you find them used cars. Cars live on the air. And then. I would love to do that. I'd love to be your used cars. Ken's cars. I like this. Got a nice little ring to it. All right, we'll talk about it. We'll see what happens. Folks, stay tuned for that wildly popular segment.

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[Ken Coleman]

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[Ken Coleman]

All right, folks, the all new. All new. And I say, when I say all new, I mean all new.

[Jade Warshaw]

Brand spanking.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Every dollar is here and boy, oh boy, is it. It's worth all the hype. You can watch the premiere on our YouTube channel to actually see how everydollar works. It's more than a budgeting app. We've got all of the great, great things that you knew, if you've been around for a while about Financial Peace University, actual coaching, so many great prompts. I mean, it's just there for you. People are finding thousands of dollars in margin in just 15 minutes just through the prompts and the pathway that we're walking you through. So imagine how you could, how much you could find to put towards your money goals. Again, go to our YouTube channel, Ramsey show, and we've got the premiere there. Jade Warshaw, Rachel Cruz, George Camel, our money personalities did a great job with that. Super interactive.

[Jade Warshaw]

You need to watch it because it really does explain. I mean, we can't do it justice just talking about it for a second, but that premiere will do it justice.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So fun. Kevin is now joining us in Miami, Florida. Kevin, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Well, hi, I'm just calling because I recently graduated from grad school and I have some loans and debt, I guess you can say, so kind of transitioning in life from being like a student, basically enjoying the workforce. So I just wanted some advice and like some wisdom I guess you can, I can take with me as I start this new stage of life.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. How much, how much debt do you have?

[Caller]

So it's me and my wife, which, my wife is still in grad school. She's in her, currently her second year of grad school. And I have a total of 180,000 and140 of it, it's from my student loans and then 15,000 is from her student loans and then we have a total of 16,000 in credit card.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you have a job?

[Caller]

So it took me a while to get licensed in my state, so I just got approved to be working in my state.

[Ken Coleman]

License to do what?

[Caller]

Pharmacy.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so I appreciate that you're licensed now. Do you have a job?

[Caller]

Yeah, I just got a job yesterday.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, congratulations.

[Caller]

Yeah, so I started that job in two weeks.

[Ken Coleman]

Do me a favor. Do me a favor. Can you adjust your phone? I feel like you've got a sock over your phone.

[Caller]

Oh, can you hear me better now?

[Ken Coleman]

It's a little bit better. Sorry, I'm really struggling. My ADHD is like flaring. How much are you going to make as a pharmacist?

[Caller]

So the job I have is it's not full time or part time. It's basically as needed for them. So the hours aren't guaranteed, but I'll be making $71 an hour.

[Ken Coleman]

$71 an hour. Do you have any sense on how many hours you're going to get? Because I don't like the way this sounds for a guy who's got all this debt.

[Caller]

Yeah.

Honestly saying. But I've been applying to all these places and this is basically the only one that really got back to me. Right.

[Ken Coleman]

But you understand, like, that's not a great deal. You don't even know how many hours you're going to be working two weeks from now.

[Caller]

Yeah, I mean, I. During the training period, I'll be getting 10. 10 training. Training days, I guess you could say. So I'll for sure have that. And then after that, how it was.

Explained to me, there's some weeks I'm.

Going to be making. Doing like 20 hours in a week, and then there's some weeks I'm going to be doing like 40 hours a week. So.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so you understand, though, that you've got to be more resourceful. Right now that means you were working at a coffee shop. You're working two, three, four jobs right now.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow. I mean, by the way, looking for a better pharmacist gig, because this is going to eat you alive. What. What is your total monthly bills when it comes to just these loans, all this stuff combined.

[Caller]

So the loans are still in grace right now, and I don't fight the repayment of it till, I guess, December.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

So that's not long, brother.

[Ken Coleman]

December is literally around the corner.

[Caller]

Okay, Exactly. So that's one of the reasons I'm calling, because it's just like.

[Ken Coleman]

Income, my friend. Listen, our debt snowball plan, I bring Jade in on this, but I'll just say this. Income, income, income is your issue right now. You got a wife who's in grad school. I don't know how much she can work with the grad school load. So I'm being realistic there. I don't know what she can do. So she can't do much or anything. I mean, you're the one that's got to be working. And when I said two, three and four jobs, I wasn't just saying it, you know, to hear myself think and talk. You've got to bring an income because December is coming quickly and it's going to be a rude awakening. And so it's the debt snowball plan. Jade will walk you through it step by step, what you have to do right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, there's two. There's two things at play here. And Ken said the first one, you need money. Like, you got to have money coming in. And then the second thing, sure, you can tighten up your spending and tighten up your budget and those sorts of things by the way we'll make sure that we give you a budget, we'll give you every dollar before you get off this call, because you need it. But that is the equation. You guys have a hole here and you dug the hole and now you have to do the work to get out of it. There's not really an easy button here. I wish there was. If there was, I would slide it your way. But there's not. So it is what Ken said, which is probably wasn't what you planned. Right? We all plan. I'm just going to get a great job right away and I'll just be able to get out of it. But that's not the reality here. And a part of this, I would say of the equation, I would say 80% of you doing this is just accepting that this is what must be done. And if you can do that, then you can go about the business of actually doing the actions. So part of it is saying, hey, if I want to get where I want to go, there's part of this I just have to accept. It's like, it's like running a marathon. Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, when Sam and I ran our first marathon, it's like in your head you go, I know I want to do this. This race seems good. I'll feel great when it's all over. I want to accomplish this. And then when you start the training, you're like, oh, wait a minute, this is, it's every day and it gets progressively harder. And what if I get injured and my body hurts and all these things? And half the battle of running a marathon, which in this case, you're dead, as the marathon, half the battle is just going, hey, this is what must be true for this amount of time. And if I just embrace it and do it, the finish line will be there. That's right, the finish line is there. But if you want to cross it with any amount of grace or style or good timing, then you have to embrace the training. And that's how it works.

[Ken Coleman]

Hard things, if you want great things, I promise you, you're going to have to endure hard things. I don't care if it's athletically, I don't care if it's wanting to start a business and grow it and become self employed. I don't care if it's. I want to go into ministry and touch lives and pour my heart out for you. Pick any endeavor. Physical, emotional, spiritual, financial endeavor. If you want to be great or do something significant. Forget great. Sometimes we did, we make great too, too. Like you know, oh, it's about if you want to do something significant, I can tell you it's on the other side of hard things.

[Jade Warshaw]

Can't avoid it. You know, you cannot. It's. It's unavoidable.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And it's like sometimes we like all success and all the things, and we're helping people with money, success, work success, relationship success. That's what we're about here. I'm just gonna tell you something. I've been married 27 years. As James said earlier, God bless Stacy. I mean, the woman has had to endure some hard things to make it this far. You know, I mean, it's just. It is what it is.

[Jade Warshaw]

But there's also. And let's break it down further because there's the hard things that we want to do. Like, we say, I'm gonna go to school. And I know that's gonna be a challenge. And I know it's gonna. Like, there's the hard things we want to do, but there are then the hard things we don't want to do, and those are part of it.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I think that's really the main. Yeah, you know, where it disconnects. It's like, wait a second. I knew I was going to have to do hard things, but nobody told me I was going to have to do hard things I didn't want to do.

[Ken Coleman]

Correct. Yeah. It's like all that training and everything, or I'd rather have been home watching football, elbow deep in some salsa. You know what I mean?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, that's what I want to do. But nobody wants to be out there pounding the pavement, putting the effort in. So back to this situation, especially young couples or young people coming right out of this. I got this degree. It's such a huge accomplishment. I don't want in any way downplay it. And you think, okay, I just did all this work and now what. Now what is I got to pay it off or else I'm going to be miserable and you can't just go. Well, I applied to all these different places. I got a part time pharmacy thing. No. Okay, I'm in.

[Jade Warshaw]

Now I got to go.

[Ken Coleman]

I got my foot in the door, but it's not a great gig. So now I got to go work, Work four other jobs to be able to take care of my wife and I, who she's in grad school. Like, this is the reality. So I wish we again had an easy fix, but we don't work the baby steps. And working the baby steps, it's a simple process, but it is extremely difficult. Hard hats are required.

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Ken Coleman]

All right. Are you staying on track with the baby steps? If you'd like to know where you are, how you're tracking, take a quick quiz and you can check your progress and get a personalized plan to keep that momentum going. You can head to our show notes and click on the link. Are you on track with the baby steps? Complete the quiz and it gives you a really fun update and some great inspiration. Austin is now joining us in Florida. Austin, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hey, how y' all doing?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, we're having a blast today. What's going on with you?

[Caller]

Good, good. Hey, listen, so I was up at the bank the other day and I was just moving some money around and whatnot. I've been trying to get out of debt. I've been doing very good. Over the last 11 months, I paid off $22,000. Wow. Yeah, so I've been trying. I've got, you know, 8, 900 bucks left to go. I'll be completely debt free. And the lady up there at the bank was telling me I need to get a credit card to get my credit score up to have reoccurring payments on my credit so I can get a house. Because I'm looking, you know, in the next two years to get a house. And I've been working the Ramsey plan and I don't want to go for the credit. But I'm stuck right now because I'm so close to having a good credit score opposed to having no credit score. So I need. I need somebody with a little bit of a.

[Ken Coleman]

Talk to Jade. You need to listen to Jade, not the nice lady at the bank. Yeah, the nice lady at the bank has ulterior motives. No matter how sweet and bubbly she was. And I can just picture her, she was probably just as sweet as sugar. And she probably had a lot of credibility because. Swayed you a little bit. She kind of knocked you off balance a touch. So glad you called today. And I would like you to never listen to that lady again. And I'd like you to listen to this lady. So with no further ado, take it away.

[Jade Warshaw]

She probably also had a set of assumptions that you would go to that bank to get the loan for your mortgage when the time is.

[Ken Coleman]

I think that's what she was doing.

[Jade Warshaw]

So she.

[Caller]

She thought.

[Jade Warshaw]

She thought. Listen, you already know the answer, Austin. I can hear it in your voice. But for you, and really more so for the benefit of folks listening, Austin, you know, if you've been hanging out with us for a little while, you know, we teach all the time, the credit score is not necessary. And I'll reiterate that with you. Again, I get it. Society teaches us this from a very young age, right? We're just bombarded with the message, right? Never leave home without it. Right? And you're. You're actually scared to leave home without your MasterCard, right? So I get it. But I like to remind people that the only reason you're hearing that message so much is because there's money on the other end of it. You know, for businesses and for banks, what we teach is actually just as true. The truth is, yeah, you can have a great credit score and go buy a house. That is true. There's no falsehood to that. But it's also true and just as true that you can have a zero credit score and go and buy a home. And America needs to know this, right? There are companies that do manual underwriting which say, hey, we're not looking at a credit score. We're simply looking at how you manage your money. And that does exist. So in that way, having a zero credit score or an indeterminable credit score is the same. It really. It's better than having a good credit score because it doesn't have the stress and the debt attached to it, right? And so that's how that happens. You pay off all the debt, and in six to eight months for some people, maybe 12 months, your score rolls to zero, which means we can't find it. Like I said before, indeterminable. And when that happens, now is the time. That's when you can strike, Right? If your score hasn't rolled away yet and it's low, yes, you're going to have a problem. But once it hits zero, that's the sweet spot of when that happens. And we would always recommend Churchill Mortgage to you. They do mortgages and the majority of the United States. So, yeah, it could take a little due diligence. You hop on their website, do a little research, get connected with someone and start making your plan. And all they're going to want to know is what we're all kind of used to. They're going to want to know your pay stubs, right? Show us your pay stubs. They're going to want to know, you know, can you keep the job? How long have you been at, you know, getting paid? And if you. Maybe if you're, you know, a small business like Sam and I were, they might want to see your tax returns, your business tax returns. That's fine. And then they're going to want to see your trade lines. Have you been keeping up with your cell phone payment, your utility payment? And they want to see proof that you've been paying rent. And that's really important for folks who are living at home. Make sure there's some paper trail to show, hey, I've been paying rent on time. Even if it's to your parents. Just make sure you're documenting that, because that's really all you need. And then from there, it's basically the same process, Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right. Exactly right. So this is a myth that she just busted and. Hope you get it, Austin. Stand strong. You're going to stand strong and just smile and wave like the. The penguins from Madagascar. When people hit you with these things, I mean, you know better, don't you?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so you just got a master class. You don't need a credit score, do you, Austin?

[Caller]

No, I do not. And that's just. I was stuck because I didn't know if I needed it, you know?

[Ken Coleman]

You don't.

[Caller]

Within the next two years or not, you know. Another quick question.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

Another quick question. You got just a second?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, it's got to be fast. We got other people waiting. What's going on?

[Caller]

Right. The neck. The next question. My bank. So I don't really want to bank there, but it's the closest one anywhere around where I'm living at. And the fair winds is probably an hour and a half away from where I'm at. What can I do with that?

[Jade Warshaw]

What's causing you to go into the bank all the time? Because I feel like, so, like my.

[Caller]

My rent, everything is cash. All that's a cash deal right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Why?

[Caller]

So to get. To get. Just because the. Where it said I'm renting out some property and we pay the landlord cash. So we're saving up to get out of debt.

[Jade Warshaw]

So everything.

[Ken Coleman]

I. I don't know that you have to. Well, I. I just. I. I don't know why you have to pay cash. I just. I don't understand that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Let's talk about that. So if you're doing cash as some sort of an envelope system to try to just like keep your piles of money separate and manage it better, that usually works better for things that you can easily pay cash for, like groceries or maybe gas or. Or things like that. But I do find that things like rent or car payments, it is more convenient to pay for them online. So unless you're receiving, like your income as cash, and then you would have to deposit it in the bank anyway. But if you're receiving your income as direct deposit, I would recommend keeping it as direct deposit. That way you can bank at an establishment that you feel good about and do most of it online.

[Ken Coleman]

And Fairwinds can take great care of you. I mean, I'd call it him. Call them and go, hey, I live an hour away. Just let them walk you through it. But I don't know that you have to do that. I just. Personally, I know it's 20, 25. I just.

[Jade Warshaw]

Cash. You got a problem with cash, Ken?

[Ken Coleman]

I don't have a problem with it, but pain, it just seems really inconvenient. When he started off the call, he's like, I was at the bank the other day and I was moving my money. I was like, did you go see the mercantile and get your eggs while you were there? It felt a very general store. Yeah, it felt like. I'm not sure this is the best use of our time.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, that's a good point. That's a good. Now I do. I will say if you are on baby step two and you're really trying to be on it. I do love cash for that purpose. But again, just for like, use it for the groceries. Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

For the budget, rent, rolling up with a wad of cash. I don't know if I feel good about that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, that's nothing.

[Ken Coleman]

Fundamentally Wrong with it?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, there's nothing. Well, his problem is there's no bank.

[Ken Coleman]

Right. And I'd love him to be with Fairwinds.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. I would say.

[Ken Coleman]

And so, you know, if he's not having to drive. I can't remember the last time I had to go into the bank.

[Jade Warshaw]

Bank. I try at all costs not to go into the bank.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. They're never open. Have you noticed that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Actually they are. More now than ever. I feel like it used to be like on Saturdays they'd be closed, but now they're open on Saturdays, I think.

[Ken Coleman]

So banks are open on Saturday. Everybody. Sometimes it's like until noon or something.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Listen, I just remember the day going.

[Ken Coleman]

To the bank on a Saturday. I promise you that right now there's too much football to be watched. Especially this time of year.

[Jade Warshaw]

Year.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, I.

[Jade Warshaw]

No comment.

[Ken Coleman]

No comment.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm not, you know, I need to get into the. The football game. I haven't. Let me. Yeah, I mean, I can't even tell you.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, all right, very good. Anyway, the point is that much cash, big transactions, a lot of cash. I just, you know, I don't know. I'd be careful.

[Jade Warshaw]

Rent feels like something you should pay online. Let's do it like that.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And it protects you, you know, the online, the banking for everyone's credit un. There's protections in using online banking, which I like.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Now I'll tell you where I do like cash when I'm buying a car for the kids.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, did you slap it on there on the table?

[Ken Coleman]

My favorite move is the accordion.

[Jade Warshaw]

What say you?

[Ken Coleman]

I call it the accordion. I lay it out on the hood of the car that I'm offering.

[Jade Warshaw]

That is gangster Ken Coleman.

[Ken Coleman]

I think it kind of is. I cuz you're making an offer, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

They're asking this. I don't want to pay this.

[Jade Warshaw]

You just silently put it out, pull.

[Ken Coleman]

Out the envelope and I do this number and I just kind of count it out on the hood trying under the guise of being accurate. But it's a hidden flex.

[Jade Warshaw]

Y' all don't know that. Ken said G. Way to go tell.

[Ken Coleman]

That's how I bought my last kid's car. Nice old lady counted it out for.

[Jade Warshaw]

Take it or leave it.

[Ken Coleman]

What is she going to do? I'll make you an offer you can refuse. For way too long I struggled with sleep and woke up groggy after tossing and turning all night. But now I look forward to bedtime.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I wake up bright eyed and bushy tailed.

[Ken Coleman]

Thanks To Casper, a company that's been perfecting better sleep for over a decade using durable, high quality materials that actually last. My whole family now sleeps on Casper mattresses. Yes, even the dogs have their own Casper dog bed. To no one's surprise, and it's not just one man's opinion. Casper customers keep their mattresses for years. And 4 out of 5 customers recommend them to friends. And with free delivery and 100 night trial, Casper is no gimmicks. A mattress you can trust, backed by quality that lasts. So go to Casper.com Ramsey and use promo code Ramsey to receive 25% off all mattresses and 10% off everything else with code Ramsey. That's Casper.com Ramsey exclusions apply. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio alongside Jade Warshaw. I'm Ken Coleman. Steve is now joining us in Columbia, South Carolina. Steve, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Yeah, hi Ken. I, Jay, it's great to be speaking with you guys today.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, good to talk to you.

[Caller]

So I've got a. I'm on the cusp of finalizing a divorce and we came to a mediated settlement. And as part of it, Basically there's a 50, 50 split of the 401k, but then I also have to come up with 100,000 in cash in 90 days to buy her out of the house. And then additionally there's 150k lump sum alimony payment over 5 years. So kind of two questions is basically how would you guys Recommend Coming with 100k? Because I got some advice from the lawyers that I didn't really appreciate and clearly they weren't part of the Ramsey program. And, and then treat the alimony payment going forward. I treat it as a debt in the baby steps or as like a line item in the budget going forward.

[Ken Coleman]

Why don't we address that one first? Jay, tell him about where that goes in the budget.

[Jade Warshaw]

The 150 over five years. Have you calculated it out and seen what that looks like monthly?

[Caller]

Yeah. So about 2500amonth.

[Jade Warshaw]

Can you, can you afford that?

[Caller]

And it, and it fits? Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, good. So yeah, that's a line item on the budget. I would do it that way, especially if you can afford it. What's your income?

[Caller]

About 180 a year.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, good.

[Caller]

That ends up being about like 8,8000amonth.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

So the 100k in 90 days to buy out the house.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Why'd you agree to that?

[Caller]

It's definitely, definitely the house. It's in terms of everything else available in the area. There's, there's no way I'd be getting anything close to this. And, but I'm talking about the term, the time.

[Jade Warshaw]

Like do you have a hundred, do you have $100,000?

[Caller]

Yeah. So that's exactly it. I think, I think it was a matter of kind of signing it and not really paying attention to that. 90 days. I've got about 50, 55k in cash right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, well, that's a good start. How much is your car worth?

[Caller]

So not much. So it's a 2007 Subaru Forester.

[Ken Coleman]

So what happens if. Let's come at this thing from another angle. Just, I'm trying to figure this out for you. What happens if in. You don't have 100k? What, what, what is the kick in, in the contract? What, what the agreement?

[Caller]

So it's just part of the court order. So I think it'd be going, going back, back in front of the judge.

[Jade Warshaw]

I think that's your best bet. This was a, this was a bad negotiation on your part or on your lawyer's part? Because you don't, you can't get the money in 90 days. And so when this goes back in front of the court, you need to have a better plan of what that is.

[Ken Coleman]

Why not sell them?

[Caller]

I was going to say the original, well, the original thought was basically kind of part of the quadro from the rest of the 401k. So my half of the 401k, use part of it to be able to pay her off.

[Jade Warshaw]

That was your plan?

[Caller]

That was the, that was the original thought. And then again the lawyers even suggested doing a home equity loan, which I flat out just a bad idea because.

[Jade Warshaw]

You have to put yourself, you have to reverse engineer like you have to reverse the situation and say, if I were in any other setting, would I borrow from my 401k to buy a house? No, you wouldn't. Would I take out a personal loan, you know, to, to up the Annie on my house? No, you wouldn't. And that's the way I'm looking at it. I think that you either need to give yourself more time. If this is like something that you're like, I love this house, I don't want to give it up. I'm never going to have a house like this again. You either need to give yourself more time. I mean, I've talked to people. There's years to come up with the money. Not that I want you linked to her for that long, but.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you have kids?

[Caller]

Adult kids? So she's in college now, but yep.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. So where's your ex going? She's just gonna go rent somewhere.

[Caller]

Starting a new career in another state.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I hear I'm gonna come back to this because I, I now again, I've never walked through this before. So Jade and I are kind of on the same page.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I'm thinking about you could do maybe a cash out refi. I don't know if there's, there's because you have to take her name off it anyway.

[Ken Coleman]

I would sell the house. And do you have any equity in it at all?

[Caller]

Yeah. And that's basically what I'm buying. Buying out of.

[Ken Coleman]

How much equity do you have in the home?

[Caller]

About 200k in equity.

[Jade Warshaw]

So why wouldn't you?

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, I don't understand. Given that equity stake that you have, this is just a house and it's got a bunch of pain attached to it. You are single. You got all this money that you, that you're gonna have to pay out over five years. I, I personally, and again, I don't know what you think about this.

[Jade Warshaw]

I do it a little differently.

[Ken Coleman]

I know. Well, because I'm giving you another train of thought. I'm not going to advocate for my point of view. I'm going to say if it were me, I'd sell the house.

[Caller]

If, if exactly what's been going on in my brain. So to sell it. No, no, no. Just the back and forth. So there's, like you said, there's, I.

[Ken Coleman]

Like a clean start in this situation.

[Jade Warshaw]

There's, there's that. But also, I mean, you did make a good point earlier where you said with the market and when you bought this house, you might not be able to get something like that again. And I do feel that if emotionally there's not the attachment that Ken and I think there might be and you want to keep the house. Yeah. Standard is you would refi, get her name off of it and then you would pull the cash out when you refi and then she would get her portion. The only reason I kind of disagreed with Ken's sentiment initially is because the 100,000 is her money. Money. It's not you giving a hundred thousand of your money at this point. Now that is her money because you're separate. So there's a different way to look at that. It's like I'm just, I'm just giving her her money. I'm not giving away my money, if that makes sense.

[Caller]

Right.

[Jade Warshaw]

So that's if you want to do the 90 day deal. That's how you would get it. But Ken has a good point. Do you really want to be in this house or is it worth it to you to maybe get less house and have a fresh start? That's the question only you can answer that.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Or rent for a bit. I mean, your life's not over, so.

[Caller]

Yeah, I definitely know that. Starting. Starting over. But. Yep.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And it's not over. It's starting over. And so there's a whole lot of new things coming your way. So again, I don't want to advocate for it. That may be too aggressive.

[Jade Warshaw]

How long were you married?

[Caller]

You know, 20 years.

[Jade Warshaw]

20 years. Oh, listen, Ken may have a point. The kids. Do you have kids?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Remember, they've got the.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, that's right. That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

Is it just one college?

[Caller]

Yep, just one.

[Jade Warshaw]

Ooh, yeah. You got your work cut out for you. In terms of sentimental thoughts versus fresh.

[Ken Coleman]

Start thoughts, I mean, you make a good end.

[Caller]

I've been working through those you make.

[Ken Coleman]

Here's. I'm not advocating, but I am going to say. Because I like when you push back, so keep pushing on this. But in your shoes, if you sell this house, then you're able to pay her her money and have that done, set aside, put it away, get it over with. That's what I would do. I would want a clean break if I could do it. And I'm just looking at the numbers. You're gonna have to pay her 100,000 in 90 days and then you got 150, which is alimony over five years. That's a lot of money coming out of your pocket.

[Jade Warshaw]

It could be nice to have a smaller.

[Ken Coleman]

And I'm just saying I might rent for a year, reset my life. I don't think renting for 12 months is a bad idea for a guy in your shoes. Get rid of the house, move on into a new chapter of life.

[Jade Warshaw]

And another. Okay, I'm going to throw something else in there. And this is soon, so don't, don't be mad at me, but you'll move on at some point and meet another lovely lady.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm excited.

[Jade Warshaw]

And do you want to bring her into that house or do you want to bring her into, you know, fresh start? Steve?

[Caller]

Yeah, so we'll see about that one.

[Jade Warshaw]

But sure, I know I jumped ahead, but do you see what I'm saying? Like, there's begin with the end in mind is what I'm saying.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. I don't know. I don't know why I feel that way. But that's what I would do in that situation. And just start fresh.

[Jade Warshaw]

You're not wrong, Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

Start fresh. Get her the hundred thousand. That's her money to your point. And now work on the rest of it. Oh, Devora sucks. Hate that for you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, me too.

[Dave Ramsey]

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[Ken Coleman]

This is a paid advertisement. Homebuyer edge and seller guarantee are available for qualifying borrowers and select loan types only and are not available in all states or locations. NMLS ID 1591 nmlsconsumeraccess.org/al housing lender.

[Caller]

All.

[Ken Coleman]

Right, let's go to Chris who's joining us now in North Carolina. Chris, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hey, how you doing? So yeah, I got sick before COVID and I was bedridden for three years and went through a financial problem real bad. Lost my business, had credit card debt, go crazy and, and a couple years later now it's coming back to haunt me. I just now was able to start working again. Barely two months in and I've got haven't been served yet but they're trying to serve me with judgment. I don't have any assets. Before all this happened, I turned my house over to my wife and my property over to daughter so have no assets to worry about that. I guess my question is should I go through with a bankruptcy before I meet the salary, yearly salary requirement to do so or should I not do bankruptcy and wait to see what happens?

[Jade Warshaw]

Short answer is we're not doing the bankruptcy. But tell me, give us more context. What caused you to be sick for three years? Is that over and done, or can that come back?

[Caller]

It's possible. I had Lyme disease, and I didn't know that I had it. I was undiagnosed. And then when I got Covid, it dropped my immune system enough to make both of them a problem. And by the time they found it, it went to my heart, my brain, and I had to be on a year of treatment, and I was still just about two years. I was completely bedridden, and then just slowly started getting better.

[Jade Warshaw]

And your wife. Did your wife leave you during that time you said you left, that gave her the house? What does that mean?

[Caller]

No, no, no. We're not legally married, so. So we're. So luckily for her, she doesn't have to deal with that financial part now. We've been together this whole time.

[Jade Warshaw]

So you're living with.

[Ken Coleman]

Why did you call her your wife?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I'm confused.

[Caller]

What's that?

[Ken Coleman]

Why did you call her your wife and then just tell Jay that you're not married?

[Caller]

Well, I guess that. What would you call significant other than a girl? The proper terminology. I just say wife.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I'm not trying to. Okay, I'm not trying to get too technical. I didn't know if there was another part of the story that we needed to know about.

[Jade Warshaw]

So. Okay, so your significant other, you've been together a long time. Everything's in her name is what you're saying. So you. You literally legally have no assets.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so you've just gotten back to work. What are you. What kind of work do you do now? And what are you earning?

[Caller]

So project manager, and it's 130,000 a year.

[Ken Coleman]

That's good news.

[Jade Warshaw]

And how much is the debt?

[Caller]

Definitely, I think it's like around 70, 80,000, something like that. Okay, so first, some is credit cards, some is loan.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so first, your homework from. From me tonight, anyway, is I want you to go and find out exactly how much you owe. I want you to have it written down. This much is credit cards. This much is medical. This much is, you know, personal loan. So you get a sense of what it is and the amounts. Because the way we're going to attack this is what we call the debt snowball, where you list them smallest to largest, and you pay minimum payments on everything and, you know, put it it as part of your monthly budget. And then whatever money you have left in margin, which is your extra money, all the extra Money goes to the smallest debt. So let's say you have a medical bill, and one of them's only, you know, 800. You could essentially knock that 800 bill out in one shot. And then, you know, you just keep working through them like that. So $130,000 can. That's great. That's a great income. 70. I'm going to let you know right now what you shown us, aside from the medical part, because that makes this feel very different. But the numbers alone, it. I mean, I want you to feel good in this case about being average, because this is really just kind of your average debt scenario. You got $130,000 income, you're paying off 70. Yeah. You're going to have to live on not very much. Maybe you live on 80 to make this happen quickly. Right. And the average person is out of debt in about two years, two and a half years. So that's where you're going to be with this.

[Ken Coleman]

And. Yeah. Are you. I got a couple questions, Chris, but are you tracking with Jade.

[Caller]

Somewhat? What are you not getting?

[Jade Warshaw]

If you live on 80, that frees up 50,000. And I know taxes and all that, but do you see where I'm getting.

[Caller]

No, I understand that. I guess when you talk with two different attorneys, I'm getting, you know, three different opinions. I've got, you know, bankruptcy attorney saying, hey, do bankruptcy, another bankruptcy, tell me, don't do bankruptcy because you have no assets. North Carolina, it's very rare for them to garnish your wages if they can at all. Though the worst you're going to deal with is judgments that may come back to haunt you. And you've got another bankruptcy attorney says, why wait? Why wait until you make that 130,000? Because North Carolina, man, as soon as you hit that 50,000, you can't do chapter seven, so why not do it now?

[Jade Warshaw]

Let me tell you my reason.

[Caller]

All the debt behind you.

[Jade Warshaw]

My reason is when once you file bankruptcy, you're going to lose. You're. You lose control over the situation.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

And now a court says, here's what the judgment is. Here's what you have to pay a month. Here's what it is. Here's what we'll take. You have no assets, but do you see what I'm saying? You lose control over the situation, and there's a. There's an emotional component that's going to go along with that, that says that it's basically you signing on the paper that says, I lost control. I'm not fit to handle this. By myself here. You guys take it. That's going to take an emotional toll, not only on you, obviously, it's going to decimate your credit. I'm sure your credit's already bad, but that's going to take seven years to fall off your credit. So this is going to haunt you when you can look at the situation and go, actually, there is some agency and some autonomy that you can take over this and you get to decide. You can say, you know what, I made a mess. And instead of losing your confidence, you can build your confidence up by cleaning it up one debt at a time. And that does something for you as well. When you take control of a situation and you clean it up and you make something wrong. Right. That's building something in you that at this time in your life, you really, really, really need.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Listen, you've been through it. Amen. Yes. And amen to everything Jade said. Chris. And I agree with one of the bankruptcy lawyers that you shouldn't do this for all the reasons just gave you. But the thing that I'm concerned about for you, you've had your life turned upside down, and, man, I hate that for you, man, I have so much compassion for you. But I think it as it would anybody, Chris, it jaded you or it shaded some of your perceptions about what you should do. The fact that you are living with a woman that you refer to as your wife and you signed a house over to her that you bought. Am I understanding this correctly?

[Caller]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

Brother, that needs to change. Do you want to be with this woman the rest of your life, yes or no?

[Caller]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Ken Coleman]

Is there a reason why from her that you guys aren't married? Is it her or is it you?

[Caller]

Well, religiously, we're married. We went through all of that. So, I mean, we're a family, all that. We just didn't.

[Jade Warshaw]

What do you mean you got marriage license?

[Ken Coleman]

What do you mean religiously, you're married.

[Jade Warshaw]

Married.

[Caller]

So we went through the ceremony, but we never did a certificate. So in North Carolina, technically, we are married. As far as, you know, North Carolina, when you're living with somebody for seven years, you're leaving common law. Okay, common law. But as far as.

[Jade Warshaw]

Why not go down to the courthouse today and get.

[Ken Coleman]

Hold on, finish that sentence. I want to hear this reasoning really quick. The irs, the government finished that.

[Caller]

Yeah. As far as, you know, doing a marriage certificate, IRS and all that taxes, we are. We file separately. We're separate. We're not. Not legally married.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I get it. My point is, you Signed your house over to somebody. And I don't know where that falls in North Carolina. North Carolina law. I don't have time to figure that out on this little bit of a call. But that needs to get. Yeah, yeah, you need to get that. That needs to be fixed. Like, A, don't file bankruptcy. B, get the house back in your name. If that's even possible.

[Caller]

I got you.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, dude, this is not something to chuckle about.

[Caller]

Out.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't think you get.

[Caller]

No, I don't think you get. The concern is what's going on now. The concern is what's going on now is that, you know, going out, you know, we've got credit card and bank.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller]

When did you lean on the house?

[Jade Warshaw]

Here's what I think you did. Here's what I think you did. And I. I'm not trying to make a bad situation worse, but I have a sense that you guys capitalized on the fact that you never got the marriage certificate when you saw that it was about to start pouring rain on your situation. And I think you transferred that house over to her name.

[Ken Coleman]

I do, too.

[Jade Warshaw]

And if you keep evading this, it is gonna follow you. You've got to deal with this.

[Ken Coleman]

Dig out.

[Jade Warshaw]

Trying to move stuff over here and move it over here and do the big roofs. Just deal with it.

[Ken Coleman]

We've seen people do this, Chris. And you've. You've done all these kind of little maneuvers and you think it's funny. Hey, you called us. I'm going to tell you something. What you're doing, there's nothing funny. It's scary.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you've listened to me for more than five minutes, you know that being normal with your money is not a good thing. Because normal is broke. And I want you to be weird. That's why I love what we're doing with Fair Wind Credit Union. Our friends at Fairwinds just launched a brand new Ramsey debit card. And it says, debt is normal. Be weird right on the front. I love that because every time you swipe it, you're choosing to live differently with no credit card payments and no debt. You see, Fairwinds has been helping people like you ditch debt faster and build wealth for years. They're not trying to shove credit cards or auto loans in your face like the big banks do. And they've worked with us to create the Smart bundle for Ramsey fans. It includes a no fee checking account, a high yield savings account to supercharge your emergency fund, and now the Ramsey debit card to help you stay focused. On the baby steps. We're excited for you to try it. So check them out [e-mail] Ramsey that's Fairwinds.org Ramsey insured by the NCUA.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, our Ramsey Show Question of the day is brought to you by Y Refi. Defaulted private student loans can drag on for years. But why Refi helps borrowers explore custom refinancing with a low fixed rate and a payment you can actually manage. Go to yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter Y, R, E, F y.com Ramsey not available in all states.

[Jade Warshaw]

All right, today's question comes from Chelsea in Idaho. She says, says my daughter recently graduated college and we will be traveling for the final step of a job interview soon. She's already passed the first three steps in the process. Is it ever okay to request your expenses be comped by the company you are applying to? She estimates the airfare, Uber hotels, meals, and three days of missed wages at her currently job at her current job will run her roughly $1,000. This would make a huge impact on her monthly budget for a job she doesn't even have yet. Would it be inappropriate for. For her to email the company and ask for reimbursement for at least some of these expenses?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes, it would be wildly, wildly silly. Not even inappropriate, just ridiculous. You're guaranteeing she doesn't get the job. And Chelsea, I'm honored you sent the question to us, but the fact that you're asking us this concerns me. This is entitlement 101. You are not entitled to your expenses for applying to a job.

[Jade Warshaw]

If your money's tight, it's not their fault.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, my goodness gracious. By the way, this is the world we live in where parents are showing up to job interviews and then the kids are complaining, mom, it's going to cost me a thousand dollars. She goes, I'll tell you what. I'll email the Ramsey show people and see if that's appropriate. It's not appropriate. It's called the cost of living. I'm. I'm mildly irritated right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Get. Get all the way irritated. I want to see what happens.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't want to.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, I.

[Ken Coleman]

God bless you for the question, but no, please don't do that. And explain to her why. I'm not sure you know why. It's not done. It's unreasonable.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

This is you trying to win the job and you're competing against other people and you don't say, hey, this cost me a thousand bucks to travel here to Apply. They're going to go. We don't care, and we don't want.

[Jade Warshaw]

You here because you're too soft and you're already causing. You're already drama. Let me tell you, Ken101, there you go. When you're. This is just from being in entertainment. When I used to be in entertainment, my agent would say, just show up and do the job. Don't be drama. If you're drama, you could be the best on stage. But if you're a drama, they'll never have you. But back, like, just go, it could be the worst room ever. And go, this is such a nice place. Thank you for having me. Like, everything is a graciousness, not. Hey, you know, the M and M's were a little bit. There were too many red ones in the dish. Could you. This. That's what this is. There's. There's too many red M and M's in my dish. And you got it. You. When opportunity knocks, Ken, you have to be ready to answer the door. That's on you.

[Ken Coleman]

I just looked in the drawer over here. I thought maybe there'd be some Tums. I got a little indigestion right here on that question right there. You know what I'm talking about? People in the lobby. You know what I'm talking about. It's gonna be a little something there.

[Jade Warshaw]

She got it.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you for real?

[Jade Warshaw]

She got the Tums right there.

[Ken Coleman]

Lady. Lady. James, she just reached up with a bottle of Tums. So. Fantastic. By the way, I do not endorse them. It's just a fun joke. All right, Jane is up in Washington. Jane, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hi. So about 10 years ago, we took the Financial Peace University, sold the suv, got a minivan instead, and worked our way up to step number four. Life happened, and we're back down at step number two with the number of emergencies that we have had in the last seven years. I want to be stockpiling money. I want to get that six month of income or of household needs saved up before we tackle the debt that we had to take on a couple years ago.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, well, let's. Let's go ahead and head that idea off. That's never something that we would recommend. And Jade will walk you through why, but let's first get a picture of where we are. So at one point, you were working the baby steps, and you got to baby step four. And now all these emergencies, you're saying the emergencies are responsible for the debt. And if that's true, how much debt do you have. Now.

[Caller]

We only have $9,000 in non mortgage debt right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Is that on a credit card?

[Caller]

No, it's a personal line of credit for. We had to have the siding replaced. A storm came through, damaged both our roof and our siding.

[Ken Coleman]

You didn't have insurance? Hello.

[Caller]

I.

It didn't even occur to me to go through the insurance. When we did this four years ago. The house was livable, but the roof was leaking and the siding was damaged enough on replace the whole thing.

[Jade Warshaw]

Are you sure? Or did somebody make the decision and say we don't want to submit this claim because we don't want our premium to go up and so we'll just take out debt?

[Caller]

So my husband and I are first time homeowners. Neither of our parents ever own their homes. And I guess in the discussion years ago when we were having that, maybe it was part of the. We didn't want the premiums to go up.

[Jade Warshaw]

That feels right.

[Caller]

But this was.

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

So the $9,000 on a credit card is solely based on. You've mentioned several emergencies.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Tell us. So what emergencies are coming up in your life that have put you in a position where you believed that you had to do $9,000 worth of credit cards?

[Caller]

Well, we had one child who was failure to thrive. And for two years I was unable to work taking care of that baby.

Okay.

We have another child who is special needs. So the one who is failure to thrive is doing fine now. But we do have one who has some special needs and that impacts my ability to work.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

So we went from two incomes to one.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. What's your household income?

[Caller]

Credit card?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's.

[Caller]

We're hoping to hit 100,000 next year. This year. My husband was laid off this year. Three months out of work.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

But with his new job, he'll be 100,000 next year, but not this year.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, great. And are you able to work outside the home?

[Caller]

Home.

Not outside the home.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

I do. I do some work online and bring home about $6,000 a year.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And so. Okay, so I want to give Jade. I want Jade to answer the core question as to why we would not have you work on baby step three ahead of baby step two, which is only $9,000. And I know that may seem like a lot, but in the grand scheme of things, Jade, it's very dual doable.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. So I just want to make sure it's just the two kids or are there more?

[Caller]

Just two home now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Two home. I think life has hit you with a lot and because of that, it's kind of inflated the feeling of the debt more so than it is. You mentioned before that, you know, it took seven years. You know, you've been in this for seven years. And so I just feel like there's been a lot of lot that's happened that much of it has not much to do with the debt, but it all kind of is conglomerated together in your mind. Because when I look at this right now, I go, oh, $9,000 of debt. Why isn't that gone in two months? Because if you do the budget, our.

[Caller]

Household, our household needs are high enough that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Help me understand, help me understand why. Because what it sounds like is, is help me understand where that is. Because what I'm hearing is in a generalized situation, rent is usually the highest or mortgage is the highest. And then the second highest thing, if there's kids is some form of daycare. And usually that's. Those are the two that are kind of causing things to be really tight. Because your debt's not the problem. The nine thousand dollar debt is not what's breaking you. Is there something more in the equation that you're not telling us about? Are there cars? Is your mortgage a crazy amount of your take home pay?

[Caller]

No.

So food, medicine, say, oh, medicine spend. Yeah, we have certain medications, you know, insurance covers so much. But yeah, between food and. We're not in any medical debt.

[Jade Warshaw]

Tell me right quick, Tell me right quick because we're up against the clock and I'm sorry, but tell me what you spend in medication and tell me what you spend on your mortgage.

[Caller]

We spend fifteen hundred dollars a month between food and medicine and twelve hundred dollars a month on the mortgage.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, this, this shouldn't be a problem. I think that you guys need to get on a really, really tight budget. I love that you know your numbers. But pay that $9,000 off, it's going to take you two to three months to do it and then stack up as much money as you want to to keep the big bad wolf away from your door.

[Caller]

Sam.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, everybody. You need insurance and nobody really likes digging into insurance. Right? You know you need it.

[Jade Warshaw]

George does.

[Ken Coleman]

George kind of does. Outside of, outside of George, nobody does. But we know it's hard to, it's hard to figure this out. And that's why we have our Ramsey trusted insurance pros. And you're never going to deal with sleaziness salespeople. We vetted them, they're going to coach you up, make sure you get what you need and you can find Them by going to Ramsey Solutions coverage, ramseysolutions.com coverage. And you can connect with a Ramsey trusted agent or you can click on the link in our show notes. All right, Doug is up next in Connecticut. Doug, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hey, how are we doing today?

[Ken Coleman]

Good. How are you, sir?

[Caller]

Excellent, Excellent. Thanks for taking my call. I got two questions. One, the first one's a real simple quick yes or no, I hope, anyway. You know, Dave talks about doing 15% in retirement after you're completely debt free. Besides the house, that 15%, my company goes at a 5% match. So is that 15%, like 10% that I put in, plus the 5% is 15% or is it 15% and whatever the company matches is added bonus?

[Jade Warshaw]

Basically, yeah. Typically we think of it as whatever the company adds as the added bonus. And that's just the reasoning for that is if for some reason you went to another job and they didn't have that bonus, you would still be in the rhythm of giving 15% of your income. Like, that's just a great, great way to do it. And since you're debt free, except the house, like, if you wanted to go above 15%, you could. And I think it's a good idea if you do.

[Caller]

Totally. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so the main question. Thank you very much. Appreciate that. That answered a lot of questions for me. So the situation. FPU graduate 13 years ago. I just started listening to podcasts like two months ago and rediscovered Dave, and I've listened every day. So love you guys. Thank you very much. Downloaded the EveryDollar app literally three weeks ago. So my situation is this. At $23,000 in an emergency fund, that is my. That's about five months of expenses right there. 280K in retirement, which I recently stopped contributing to. I have zero credit card debt. I'm single, I don't have any kids. I make about 140 to 160 a year. Take home. I take home about 6,500 to 9,000amonth, depending on the season. Winters are a little slower. I do have a mortgage, but I failed with the car. I got a car literally a year ago, financed it. However, I got. I took a three year loan on the car and they were offering zero percent.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

So I figured, oh, I'm going to beat these guys up because, you know, I got zero percent. Right. Payment is $1,000 a month, which is comfortable, I can get by. But I also get a $600 a month car allowance from work. Right. To go towards basically whatever I want. To put so in my head I'm thinking yeah, $400 a month out of pocket, no sweat, it's all good. But like I said, 0%. I currently owe 26,000 on the car and with doing the every dollar budget app, I literally last month found an extra $140 of extra income.

[Jade Warshaw]

Great.

[Caller]

Which I already put towards the car. So I'm down. I want to get rid of this car. I just. With a 0% loan, I can't see how and a lot of people can't see how it makes sense to take my money that I've been saving up. 23,000 for the last God knows how many years it took me to get there.

[Jade Warshaw]

Sure. Why did it take you so long with this great income did you have. You're single? Yes.

[Caller]

Yeah. Like a girl then. But yeah, single, yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

But why did it take you so long? Or is this new? Is this income new? I mean.

[Caller]

No, this is not. Income's not new. I've been with the company about seven years and I'd say the last couple years I built my book of business. So you know, I'm definitely, you know, the income has been growing under year after year.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah. And like I said, I just, I just, I had a, I had a car that was paid for before I got in into this car. But I'm 45 years old. I'm 6 3, 250 pounds. So a nice little, little car is not doing it anymore. So I needed something a little bigger so I went with the suv. Right. So wait a minute, wait a minute.

[Jade Warshaw]

I've heard a lot of reasons for keeping a car. I think that's, I think that's.

[Ken Coleman]

You act like you're an NBA player. You're not that big.

[Caller]

Yeah, I think you like, listen, I.

[Jade Warshaw]

Think you like the fact that you got 0% interest. I think you like the fact that you're doing job is kicking in the $600 a month and you're like, hey, what's the big deal? It's $400 a month. It's for three years. Do I really, Jade, have to, you know, can do. I really have to pay this thing off. And here, here's where I, I'm just going to tell you where I see risk. Where I see the risk is if you got fired tomorrow, you'd be on the hook for a car loan and you'd be on the hook for the whole thousand dollars. And I'm always going to tell you to go the path of least beneficial risk. Like there's Times where risk could be beneficial. Right. You. There's a certain amount of risk that you take when you take out a home mortgage. Right. But for the benefit outweighs the risk. In this case. There's risk there. Do you really need it? Is it going to affect you? I think it could. And I think that you could easily pay this thing off and just be like, you know, give the finger to the whole thing and just say, I don't need a payment at all. I have money. Bye, bye, Felicia. And just pay it off. Off.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Caller]

No, and, and I, I agree. And at the end of the end of the day, like I said, I just did just started the every dollar budget. So I'm sitting there like, if I could literally find an extra 3, 4, 500, and I probably would have found more money, but I had two vacations last month. So yeah, at the end of the day I could, I could easily probably find an extra 5, 6, 7, 800. Who knows, you know, at the end of this month and throw it towards the car now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, let me tell you what I do. Let me tell you what I would do, Doug. I would. Would go to my employer and I'd say, you guys are giving me the 600 bonus, which I really appreciate. I love this money. It's so helpful for me. I'm planning on paying off the car. I did the, I did the math and I found out that if you paid me the 600 over the entire length of this car payment, it would amount to X amount of dollars. Is there a way since if I, if I prove to you that I paid it off in full, that you'll still give me that money as my stipend end. That's what I would do. Does that. Is that fair? Ken, you're the.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd want to do a little research before I took that proposal to them. Like, you know, because if they're going.

[Jade Warshaw]

To pay it anyway.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I just want to go ahead.

[Caller]

Yeah. The car allowance is more for like repairs, brakes, auto. Because I, I drive my own car. I put about 25 to 30, 000 miles on the car a year outside sales.

[Jade Warshaw]

So they'll give it to you anyway.

[Caller]

They give it to me. Oh, I'll give it anyway. Yeah. If I have no car payment, I'm getting that money regardless.

[Ken Coleman]

So, Doug, you called us. I think we're talking all the way around this thing, Doug. We're dancing all around this thing. You called to say.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

What, what was your question? Your core question.

[Caller]

Should I empty my high Yield savings account, which is where my emergency fund is, where I'm getting for 4% interest on and just basically dump it maybe minus the thousand to keep my emergency fund.

[Ken Coleman]

It's like you've listened to this show before.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Doug, how much do you have in Your emergency fund?

[Caller]

23,000.

[Ken Coleman]

And how much is to pay off the car in of front full 26.

[Jade Warshaw]

Do it.

[Ken Coleman]

Done. And then you build the emergency fund back up. You got a great income and you're single. Stop the vacations, man. You're living high on the hog, buddy. You know, you could build, you could build this. You're golfing. Yeah. Like, I mean, listen, that's the plan. You empty it out. You say if. $1,000. So you're going to have $1,000 in there. You're back to, you know, you see what I'm saying? You pay the car off and now you're back to baby step three. You get the three to six months and now you can go back to, you know, your vacation single guy and all that. This should be an easy fix for you. Easy fix.

[Caller]

So I, I, I agree. And it was one of those things where I've been since I've been listening to you guys. Like I said, I rediscovered the baby steps. Rediscovered Dave and I had, I basically went from baby step one to three, back to two. And you know, listen, you need to.

[Jade Warshaw]

Discover yourself without a car payment. Yeah, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

You're playing financial twister. You know, right hand on red, you know, left foot on green. No, we don't have a financial twister plan. We have the baby step plan and you just got to follow it. And here's the good news for you, Doug. Like you have the means to do this immediately.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And now you got yourself a paid for car. How's that going to feel?

[Jade Warshaw]

That's a baller.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's going to feel great.

[Ken Coleman]

And an unbelievable deal from your company that like I would take that 600amonth and stack that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

For what? If you, any car replacement, anything. Oh, come on. Give him that, Give him that.

[Jade Warshaw]

My, my computer is dead. I want you to go to ramseysolutions.com I want you to look at the investment calculator and I want you to plug in. If you take that $600 and you just drop it in your investments for the next 20 years, what that's going to be and your mind is going to be blown.

[Ken Coleman]

Dougie, Doug, no.

[Caller]

100%. Yeah. All right, I agree.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go.

[Caller]

Very much.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Thanks for the call. Don't overcomplicate it. You know, I hate to do this, but they're not my steps. Dave came up with them, so I can refer to them and be kind of obnoxious about it. But I mean, there's a reason why there's one and then it leads to two and then it goes to three.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's called a system.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, pretty simple stuff, but I love that. I'm gonna give Doug, by the way, the caller of the day award for the rationale of being six' three, about 240.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Is that what he said?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm like, are you trying to get a date or keep your car? What's going on?

[Ken Coleman]

He's like, I got to get a bigger car cuz I can't just fold up like an accordion in this, in this sedan. Like the guy's a tight. Like he's an NFL tight end. Come on, man. On that. The. I should be riding around on a bicycle. I'm a little guy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Many of you listen to the Ramsey show because you're sick and tired of getting nowhere with your money. You work too hard to live paycheck to paycheck with no money in the bank. But here's the deal. Just listening to the show won't change that. If you want different results, you have to do something different. We've helped millions of people save money, ditch debt and build wealth. And you can too. But you gotta have a game plan. And that begins with our get started assessment. Go to ramseysolutions.com start now. Take the free quiz and get your free step by step action plan. If you've had it with money stress and are ready to take control of your money for good, go to ramseysolutions.com start now.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fairwinds Credit Union studios alongside Jade Warshaw. I'm Ken Coleman and we're going to go to Matt who's joining us now in Fort Worth, Texas. Matt, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Yes, sir. So as of this past Monday, I had a truck that I've been paying on for about two years. I had an auto loan for about $30,000 on it. I owe about 27 or, I'm sorry, $23,000 still on it. And the motor blew up. It's unfortunately just a bad design from General Motors. They've had issues with this vehicle or these motors for substantial amount of years at this point and I am now falling victim to said bad design. It would be about $15,000 to have the motor replace and I'M trying to decide if what's my best option for it before I try to go trade it in and then be upside down on it.

[Ken Coleman]

You owe 23.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Ken Coleman]

If you get the motor fixed, if we could snap our fingers and it was just fixed today and it was paid off. Is this a truck you'd be happy to drive for a while and could you.

[Caller]

The truck's in great condition. Other than that, if the motor were to be fixed, there is a company that sells a motor that has the system that caused it to have this issue in the first place deleted. And that's the option that I went and got quoted from when I talked to a shop.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you have the 15,000 in cash?

[Caller]

I do not.

[Jade Warshaw]

What do you have in cash?

[Caller]

I. I don't have much. My girlfriend just finished school and I was basically the primary provider provider for about a year and a half with us.

[Ken Coleman]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. How old are you?

[Caller]

About 30 years old.

[Ken Coleman]

You're 30. Okay. You complimented.

[Caller]

You.

[Ken Coleman]

You sounded much. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

You did, you did.

[Ken Coleman]

Why are you the primary provider for your girlfriend? You guys aren't married.

[Jade Warshaw]

Is she 32?

[Caller]

No. She's a little bit younger than me. How old is she? She is 27.

[Ken Coleman]

You really don't know how old she is? You had to think about that. That's kind of funny to me.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's a different issue.

[Ken Coleman]

That's a who. Different show. Different show. But I'm going to go ahead and tell you you probably need to be on top of that one. Okay. You should. So you need to come up with 15 grand. What do you make?

[Caller]

I work in public safety, so last year I made about 70,000. I'm probably on track for about the same this year.

[Ken Coleman]

And, and, and, um, if you weren't helping provide for your girlfriend, it's just you, right? Just rent or do you own a home? I mean, what's, what's the situation there?

[Caller]

No, it would just be rent and my normal expenses.

[Ken Coleman]

And I'm sorry for following up on this is. Is she able to support herself now?

[Caller]

Yes, she's working full time again. She just started with the. The school year.

[Ken Coleman]

J.

[Caller]

She works as a. A American sign language interpreter and she started interpreting with those school.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. All right. Jade, I don't know where you're at on this, but I. There's. There's a part of me that goes, because he's already upside down in this. The trade in option to me is just foolish. You're just not going to get anything at all. I'd rather see him working two, three, four jobs.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And come up with 15 grand to get that truck fixed. And then. And then you got to swallow the pill and pay it off. But if it's a good. If it's. If the truck's in good shape, other than this defect. Yeah, that. And again, I'm giving you the answer on what I would do.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, yeah, I mean, if you roll out the numbers, if we, if we looked it up and said, what could you get for this with the bad engine? I mean, what is it? What would your beer do.

[Ken Coleman]

You have any idea?

[Caller]

Yeah, I've been shopping around with a couple different dealerships. I reached out to GM recently because. Or, I'm sorry, gmc, because they have the highest rebates and stuff right now. Because. Okay, GM would give me 9,000. Okay, give me 9,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, because if you think about it like that, and then you add what you would have to kick in to cover the upside down plus to get another vehicle. Do you see what I'm saying? You're still shelling out $15,000. So that's kind of the numbers on it. I. I can't see why you wouldn't just at this point. I hate it. But, yeah, I don't think the numbers. Numbers are good for you either way. So it's. Do you want to keep the car and pay the 15, 000, or do you want to get out of the car and get another beater? Which I don't think you do. I think you'd rather drive the more the nicer car of the two. If you can just get the money.

[Caller]

I've tried that.

[Jade Warshaw]

You can't go into debt for this. I'll tell you that. Like, if you end up. If you can't find the money and you end up having to go the other route of, of, you know.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

If you. Because here's the thing. If you do a personal loan to get from upside down, your numbers are going down. And I can. I can advocate for that. Right. I can advocate for you getting out of debt and then having to get a beater car and taking out a personal loan to do that. Right. What I can't advocate for is you taking out a personal loan to keep a $23,000 car that you were already in debt for. Does that make sense? Sense. So if you can't come up with the money, you might be going down in value.

[Ken Coleman]

But I'm sitting next to a person who, who with her husband, they had one car for how many Years, A decade. So where there's a will, there's a way. And what I'm saying is, is, is figure out a way to, to get where you need to get. And I think you can come up with 15 grand pretty quick. A single guy, guy who's able bodied.

[Jade Warshaw]

Now you might have to stop taking care of your girlfriend.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, no, that's done. I'm already assuming because she's just your girlfriend. She's a, she's a grown woman. You got problems. So taking care of her problems aren't. Isn't your problem. You can't, you know, in fact, you guys have been, you know, playing house for apparently a long time anyway, so no date nights, no nothing. You got to come up with 15 grand stat. Did we lose you?

[Caller]

No.

I'm sorry.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, it's a bitter pill to swallow.

[Jade Warshaw]

It is.

[Ken Coleman]

But I, I just think the way Jade broke it down is great. And that just. Again, we're always trying to answer things like what would we do if you were in your shoes?

[Jade Warshaw]

If you can get the money.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Without debt. Yes. Keep the car. It's, it's used to your point. It's going to be a great car when you get it from fixed. But you can't, you can't do debt. I can't let you take out $15,000 of debt to. And put it with a $23,000 debt. I can't let you do that. And you should say that to yourself too, and go back and listen to this call. Right. Don't come off this call and go, oh, I can't get 50,000. I'm just going to marinate on it. Because when you do, you're going to see. Oh man, the last thing I want to do is go from being $23,000 and down debt, you know, to being 30, $45,000 in debt. That would be terrible.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree completely. Are you stunned?

[Caller]

Yeah, I've tried going that route. I just haven't been able to find a place to be able to do that. I initially did attempt to contact my bank to try for a personal loan because other than the faulty design, I don't have an issue with the truck. I enjoy the truck. I've been driving the truck for two years and it's been great.

[Jade Warshaw]

So then what do you think your option is? Because you're either you're either not getting the car fixed or you're. Listen, your other option is take the time, however long it takes you to save up the 15,000 and in the meantime you're Taking the bus and you're riding your bike and you, you're getting Ubers and you're calling up Leroy to hit you up for a ride, like that's, that's your option.

[Ken Coleman]

That's what I, that's what I think you got to do. Yeah, I don't think he likes that option. I'm not even sure he heard that. I went through that painstakingly. I think it went in one ear and out the other.

[Jade Warshaw]

Listen, it's not fun. That's why it's not fun.

[Dave Ramsey]

You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car. But it's also a good idea to put in the work. Searching for the right insurance coverage to protect your biggest assets. I recommend using Ramsey trusted pros. Whether you're looking for car, home or any other type of insurance, Ramsey trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would. Find what you [e-mail] insurance.

[Caller]

Foreign.

[Ken Coleman]

Folks, you've been paying attention to the news. You know the Fed just cut the rates for the first time all year. And the 15 year fixed mortgage rates have dropped to the lowest we've seen in 11 months. If you're financially ready, now's a great time to buy or sell. Why some of you are going, Ken, I'd like to play the market market. I'd like to see the rates come down. Can I just give you a little opinion here? A little off the talking points opinion?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Thank you. Here's what could happen if mortgage rates continue to have a slight drop. You're not going to see it, in my opinion, drop back down in the twos. But if you have a slight drop, here's what's going to happen. People are going to get back in the market and as demand grows, guess what else is going to happen Happen. House prices go back up. So for some of you are going, I'd like to see that rate drop. I'm playing the rate game. What you don't understand is as rates drop, housing prices will go back up. It is supply, demand. So I'm not pushing you to buy right now. But even though these rates are elevated from where they were several years ago, I'm telling you, Jade, it's just supply, demand, and it never fails.

[Jade Warshaw]

Reminds me of a song. Oh, you're not gonna get this one. Had to make it to the top just to see how hard they drop.

[Ken Coleman]

Yep. Nothing.

[Jade Warshaw]

No, nothing. Forest Frank. No one. Oh, well, okay, never mind. Yeah, she got it. Oh, thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

Lady in the audience. That's clapping. Forest Frank fan. I'll be honest with you, I'm a little embarrassed. I'm not even sure who that is.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Is that bad, James?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, it's not bad.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. James knows everything about music. They overplay him in the church youth group. Some kind of.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, it's a Christian artist.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's a Christian artist. That's why I said it was a deep cut.

[Ken Coleman]

Boy, oh boy.

[Jade Warshaw]

Listen, he's doing his thing.

[Ken Coleman]

Good for him.

[Jade Warshaw]

And it's, it was a great analogy for your real estate.

[Ken Coleman]

So here's the point. Now might be the time to buy. Thank you, Jade. Folks, I never know any music reference. It's just, it's terrible.

[Jade Warshaw]

There was a deep cut.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I like that. But here's the point I'm making. Now might be the best time from a home price situation to jump in or to sell. All right, so if that's you on either side of that coin, you need a pro to help you. That's why we have our Ramsey trusted real estate agents that are standing by in locales all across the country. You can find one for [e-mail] agents. That's plural. Ramseysolutions.com agents. All right, Julia is up in Bend, Oregon. Julia, how can we help you today?

[Caller]

Hi, I'm honored to speak with you both today.

[Ken Coleman]

Good to speak with you. What's going on?

[Caller]

Thanks. I have a two parter for you. I want to make sure first I'm like budgeting appropriately and putting the right amount towards debt given my income. And then with some upcoming fertility treatments on the horizon, whether that should be kind of cash flowed or do like a mini stork mode the stockpile, some of kind cash.

[Jade Warshaw]

I like this question. Tell us more.

[Caller]

Okay, so let's see.

Debt.

I just have 12,000 on the credit card. It's me and my husband and that's the main thing we're trying to get through. Next is a home equity line of credit which based on the amount I'm putting that with our mortgage.

[Jade Warshaw]

Great. Okay.

[Caller]

So luckily it's not very much consumer debt. I just feel like we should be able to pay off more and just things come up every month. It seems like that hinder our progress.

[Jade Warshaw]

What's you guys income?

[Caller]

We make 144,000 gross and taking home just under 8,000amonth. And what we've been able to do is rent out some rooms in our house and we part of that HELOC was completing an ADU. Oh that's additional income. So we have about 3,300 coming in now just as of last month.

[Jade Warshaw]

In addition to the 8,000.

[Caller]

I think that's be to going. Going to exactly be a big help. But yeah, that's all kind of new.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so what's the fertility treatments costing you? Is, are you cash flowing it currently or you haven't started yet?

[Caller]

We've been cash flowing up to this point of. It's just been like a five year journey, unfortunately. And we're finally at the time of like probably needing IVF or something.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

So what I'm looking at is my insurance thankfully covers up to $10,000 of assistance there, but I have to meet my deductible of 3,000. So assuming we're going to need more than that, because IVF can obviously cost way more than $10,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

What's the top question? Is, do I, sorry, what's the top end? Like if you were really like running it through, like what's, what's the most you could spend or that you would spend. Let me put it like that.

[Caller]

I mean, I don't even know because it looks like it varies by date, but it looked like in Oregon maybe like 10 to 15, hopefully not more than 20.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. You know, my thought on this is if, if anybody else called in and said, hey, we were thinking of having a baby and they became pregnant. Yeah, we would put them in stork mode. In your case, becoming pregnant is the cost ahead of time. Right. Like everybody else gets pregnant, then the cost comes, your cost comes ahead of time. So I would, I would still treat it the same way. I'm not going to tell you to wait to pay off debt to try to get pregnant, but I will say it must be done in cash. I think that this is you going in on a bet and it, you don't want to go into debt on that because that could add up my deductible.

[Caller]

Right. Of like 3,000. So I guess that was my question, like, do I stack up that three grand so we at least know when we're ready to start. We have that or just cash flow that as we go, which I think we can do.

[Jade Warshaw]

If you can cash flow it, I would cash flow it. If you can do a little of both, I think that's great. If you can cash flow this fertility and keep paying off the 12,000, I think that's winning. If you're finding that, hey, we, we literally don't have enough cash to do both of these. If you have to put less towards Your snowball, that's fine. If you have to cause it to pause briefly for a couple of months, I think that that's fine too do. Especially since you said, like, age wise, you're getting, getting to the end of this. I would do. I, I mean, if, if I were in your shoes trying to do what you're trying to do, I would do that. Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree. Yeah. I, I can't add anything to that at all. And I listen. Can I just say on a personal note, I was listening. Stacy and I went through your journey and it's really, really tough. And, you know, just hang in there. And these, these days of uncertainty can really eat away at you. So certainly understand where you're coming from. But please don't make. And not to say that you're planning to, but don't ever let the emotion drive you to a poor financial decision to put you in a bad spot. You guys walk through all of that. And so I just wanted to add that one little. I can't add anything. Financial advice, but as hard as it is, I just believe there's a plan and I believe you're going to be a mama when day. And that's all I want to leave you with.

[Caller]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah. It's tough stuff. You know, these numbers, you know, just. You look at the data out there, and I just feel like I'm supposed to say something about this not just to her, but to our larger audience. You know, we see the infertility numbers continue to kind of move up. That needle's moving up in the United States. And, you know, there's. There's nothing harder for young couples who want to start a family to have that, that need, desire unmet. And it can be really tough. And so here's the point that I'm making. You can really rationalize Jade doing what it takes. Untold amount of debt to go. My heart longs to be a mom or a dad, and we're going to do whatever it takes. And you have a lot of people encourage you, and the reality is you just don't know how all that's going to play out. There's no guarantee on these treatments.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

Except for the bill coming due.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. You want it to end well, but it's sad when it doesn't.

[Ken Coleman]

That's exactly right. So here's what I wanted to encourage people that may be listening, watching in this situation if that's the case. And I say go all in, but go all in and be able to Pay cash for it. So sacrifice in other areas of your life. Don't sacrifice your future on the altar of the immediate. Immediate where you want to do whatever it takes to become mom and dad. And I just would say, you know, sell the house. Like, change your living. Like, okay, we're gonna go backwards a little bit in every other of our life so that we can start a family. It's a very tempting thing. And you know how tough emotionally. I'm sure you've walked that through with other ladies in your life and friends. We're all kind of touched by friends that have gone through it. Just please don't fall into that emotional trust trap. I agree to where you can rationalize debt because it's going to make that existing pain even more painful. So tough stuff there. Julia, thanks for calling and sharing transparently with us. We're rooting for you here. You got this. Hang in there. Better days are ahead.

[Dave Ramsey]

How many times do you end up with too much month at the end of the money? Even if you can cover the bills, there's nothing left over. You work your butt off and you still feel broke. That's normal for most people. But you do not have to live that way. You can completely transform your money and your life with every dollar. Our world class budgeting app is better than ever now. Everydollar coaches you to find extra margin every month so you can make real progress and change your family tree. The Average person finds $3015 in just the first 15 minutes. That's extra money you could use to beat debt, to build wealth, to finally breathe again. Don't settle for living normal with money. Start every dollar for free by downloading the app today.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, let's go to William in Pennsylvania. William, how can we help you today?

[Caller]

Hi. So I got two questions. My main question is investments. Since I'm actually able to put money aside and save up a lot more, I'm wondering what places I can invest my money into for the best results in the long run.

[Jade Warshaw]

What are you?

[Caller]

I'm very young and I'm hoping to be able to have a lot more than just a 401k whenever I it's time to hopefully retire from ever able to.

[Ken Coleman]

How old are you?

[Caller]

22.

[Ken Coleman]

22. And do you have any debt?

[Caller]

Yeah, I have a house and two vehicles.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, boy. Tell us about those first before we get into the investing.

[Caller]

Okay. So last year I closed on my first home right before my 21st birthday. I moved in around September 3rd, I believe was my move in date. All the furniture outright, had the closing costs figured out, had the down payment figured out, and I owned three vehicles completely. I bought them all in cash.

[Jade Warshaw]

Great.

[Caller]

And once I figured out, you know, how much money I was making, it's not a lot, but for this area, it's quite a bit.

[Ken Coleman]

What do you make?

[Caller]

I was able to do. Right now I make $27 an hour.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And I appreciate all the timeline. Yeah, I get it.

[Caller]

Yeah. For Southwestern P Day, It's. It's substantial.

[Ken Coleman]

27 bucks an hour is great. But you said you have two car loans. What's. How much of the car loans.

[Caller]

Combined or like, separate.

[Ken Coleman]

Separate. You had two cars, two loans.

[Caller]

So my first vehicle would be my now wife's vehicle. We paid 15,000 for it, and I did have to get a loan for it, and I pay around 300amonth for it.

[Ken Coleman]

So you owe 15 on that one?

[Caller]

Just about.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And then what do you owe on the second car?

[Caller]

So I just bought a truck about three weeks ago, and it was 23,000. I paid just under 400amonth for it.

[Jade Warshaw]

And what do you take home every month from your job?

[Caller]

Combined? We combined. We both take home around $6,000 a month.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

So.

[Jade Warshaw]

And what do you pay in your mortgage payment?

[Caller]

My mortgage is 600.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow, that's good. Okay.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm afraid for you because you're starting a trend of debt, a bad trend.

[Caller]

I understand that. I was told. And I just realized that a couple weeks ago.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. I'm glad that you. And so you agree. Then you're like, I can't keep going down this route. Right.

[Caller]

Oh, no, that's the last purchase I'll be making for a long time.

[Jade Warshaw]

Good. Okay.

[Caller]

If I ever do again.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. I'm glad to hear you say that. So you started out with an investment question. I will get to that, I promise. Ken will make sure of it. But I did. I. I did want to address the debt. So you do. If you've been hanging out with us for a while, you know, can we do say that you do need to be paying off your debts before you invest, and there's a lot of reasons.

[Caller]

Behind that, of course. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right. And you want to make sure that when you do invest, you're able to invest an amount that's really going to move the needle for you, and you have the fullness of your income at your debt disposal to do that. So step one is you and your wife getting together and saying, how can we Quickly tackle this $38,000 of debt using our $6,000 a month income so that we can regain 700 bucks a month in payments. Right. That's the first plan. So do you have every dollar?

[Caller]

What do you mean, every dollar?

[Jade Warshaw]

So Every dollar is our budgeting app. It's. It's really more than a budgeting app. It's giving you your whole financial snapshot.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. So you'll spend, I'll give it to you for free, and you'll spend, you know, five minutes telling them, you're telling the, the app your situation and it's going to craft a plan specifically for you, and it's going to help you find the exact margin that you need to pay off this 30 some thousand dollars of debt.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then as long as you follow the recommendations, I promise you're going to get there because it's going to tell you exactly what Ken and I would tell you here in this room with, which is. Yeah. List them small to largest. Start with the 15,001 first. But it's going to look deeply into your budget and find money that we can't see through the phone line. So that's step one. Now let's talk about your investing question. Ask it. Ask it again so I don't miss it.

[Caller]

So I do have a 401k that's obviously brand spanking new, but, you know, I don't want to just have to rely on that in 50 years from now if, you know, if I'm even able to retire. Why? I don't want to just have that. What do you mean, why?

[Jade Warshaw]

I, I'm trying to understand you. Why does that bother you to have a 401k?

[Caller]

I just don't want that to be the only thing I settle with.

[Ken Coleman]

What do you want besides that? That's just a traditional retirement account. So you want land? You want what? What do you want?

[Caller]

I mean, I would love to buy land. I would absolutely love to, but I just, I just, I'm new at everything. I just graduated almost five years ago.

[Ken Coleman]

That's true.

[Jade Warshaw]

You sound older than you are.

[Ken Coleman]

You do. I mean, you're an old soul. I think Jade needs to give you. I'm gonna have her walk you through the baby step plan and strategy so that you get this and she can touch on the investor so that you see the big picture.

[Jade Warshaw]

I do want to. I'm actually going to go in the reverse order of what Ken said.

[Ken Coleman]

She's going to do the reverse of what I said. Reverse sounds like my marriage.

[Jade Warshaw]

My bad.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, Stacey, here's what I think we should Do. Oh, you don't. Okay, Never. I will do what you want to do.

[Jade Warshaw]

Sorry, Ken, listen.

[Caller]

No, it's great.

[Jade Warshaw]

Sorry.

[Ken Coleman]

No, keep going. It's great.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so. So let's talk about the investment part first. So. Because you're not the only person with that question. So if you were saying to me, jade, I want something other than a 401k because I want to be able to retire before 59 and a half, I'm with you. If you said, jade, I just don't like the idea of all my eggs in one basket. Can I have something besides a 401k? I just love diversity, I would be right there with you. And I am. So. Yeah. Once you have gone beyond a certain baby step, all of those things open up to you. You and I want to talk about that. So to Ken's point, we talked about first, just save up. I'm going to walk you through the baby steps first, just get $1,000 saved. Do you guys have any money saved anywhere?

[Caller]

Oh, I. Yeah, we just paid off the wedding. We just got married last weekend actually. And after all that, I may have not done it the right way, but I did it. Everything is paid off. The only thing we owe is our debt now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Understood, but what do you have?

[Caller]

And I have money in the bank. In the bank, I probably have around four to five thousand dollars. That's like my. But my cushion is what I call it is my cash I keep in my bedroom. I have just under 10.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, okay. So you got $15,000 total. Excellent. That's just what you need.

[Caller]

I don't have money. I get nervous and I freak out. I need money.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, well, I'm about to freak you out for a minute, but it's so that you can feel your best in the end. If I were in your shoes today, Will William, I would take 14 of that 15, and I would pay off your car. And I know I. Yeah, just like that. And I know I just like swept the knee right there.

[Ken Coleman]

He's breaking out.

[Jade Warshaw]

I know.

[Ken Coleman]

The hives are. They're hitting his neck. I can see it on the other end.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I would do that. Because you. What's ultimately going to get you, what you want is to free up this infant income. And the debt, that's just. It's like a. It's like a dead weight around your ankle. Okay. And we gotta clear that out. So if you did that today, right? And you cash flowed the other thousand, because I always want you to have a thousand dollars saved. You need something, you would have 300 freed up today, immediately. And then you could take that and throw it at. Keep throwing it at the debt. Right. And how quickly could you have that $23,000 car payment off? Right.

[Caller]

I could have that paid off like the middle of next year, maybe three quarters away.

[Jade Warshaw]

If you both worked extra, you could have it done by the end of this year. Yeah, by the end of the year. Yeah. 12 months.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

So. And then you'd have that extra $700 and you and your wife could stack up, you know, three to six months of expenses. That's baby step three. And then after that, you're investing 15% of your income into your 401k. And 15 ain't too shabby. Like, if you keep that going.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, and then after that, we would say, hey, now let's take, you know, take a moment and focus on putting a little extra aside for your kids. This is another form of investing. It's called a529. You can throw a little in there, whatever you decide, and then you can say, okay, let's start paying off our house because we value real estate. Right. You wanted that diversity, so you start paying off your house. Most people who do this, William, pay their house off within seven to 10 years.

[Caller]

Yeah, I was hoping to pay it off in 15.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, okay. Even. Great. I love that. If you do it in 15 years, again, love that for you. Now you've got a piece of real estate. Now you've got your 401k. And then if you say, hey, I kind of like this land deal. Let's keep saving up money and buy another piece of land. Or let's keep saving up money. And I want to open another type of investment account. Account. I just want to open one that's not tied to retirement to where I can invest the money and get to it whenever I want. You can do that. It's called a brokerage account. There's so many options for you, but you must walk through the steps in order to free up the income and in order to do it. So that is the caveat. You need the income that you're now paying in payments.

[Ken Coleman]

One step at a time. William, we believe in you.

[Caller]

Sa.

[Ken Coleman]

Our scripture of the day comes from Deuteronomy 28, verse 12. The Lord will open to you his good treasure the heavens, to give the rain to your land in its season, and to bless all the work of your hand. You shall lend to many nations, but you shall not borrow. Our quote of the day. This is kind of scary. From Stephen King. Not a Stephen King fan, but I'll go ahead and read the quote. What separates the talented individual from the successful one is a lot of hard work.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, well, that's not. Well, the hard work is scary. That's the scary part.

[Ken Coleman]

I guess I should stipulate I don't know him and don't have any. I just don't like scary stuff.

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't either.

[Ken Coleman]

James. I'm that guy. When I'm in the movies with my wife and it's the previews and the horror comes up, I literally close my eyes. I do, too. You do too.

[Jade Warshaw]

Listen, I don't want that stuff going in my brain.

[Ken Coleman]

I do, too.

[Caller]

And I haven't even.

[Ken Coleman]

I haven't seen Shawshank Redemption, but he wrote Shawshank too, so he does. He has a lot of stuff outside the horror genre.

[Jade Warshaw]

I didn't. I didn't. I did not know that.

[Ken Coleman]

I did not know I had him as just a horror guy. And that's why I had to. Craig. I don't. No position against him. I don't like his work, let's put it that way. Other than Shawshank, which I didn't know. James.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, that's good. That's good.

[Ken Coleman]

Actually, now I'm second guessing.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

It's based on his novel.

[Caller]

Yep.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow, that's a. That's a classic.

[Ken Coleman]

James pulling the feather out of his hat today. Very impressive. Jenna is up in New York. Jenna, how can we help today?

[Caller]

How you doing? I'm literally losing sleep over a decision I have to make by tomorrow. And what I'm struggling with is whether to Give a friend $900 who hasn't responded to any of my calls or texts for, like, three years. And then she suddenly reached out, and she's literally begging me for help to pay off a storage unit lien that she says needs to be paid by four days from now. And she said it holds all her worldly possessions. So I contacted the storage company directly today, and in doing so, I learned she actually owes double that amount. And I'm kind of uncomfortable with the variety of the details they gave me, but it also. I could get the money, but it would be a financial hardship for me. But I know what I'm torn with is I'm feeling so guilty. What if this was me and. Because, like, what if this was me and, like, the way she worded it and stuff, and. But at the same time, it would be a boundary, you know?

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, Jenna, I love this. I love that you called us because you need somebody that's objective. Jade and I have zero feelings on this deal, so I'm going to ask you a couple questions. We're just going to rewind. When she first requested the $900, what did your gut. What did your body. What did your brain start say?

[Caller]

Well, I just felt so sorry for her because she hasn't talked to me.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, stop, stop, stop, stop. Let me re. Ask the question to make sure you get what I'm asking. About the $900. When she. If she'd have asked for $9, what would your brain have said? What would your body have said?

[Caller]

$9. Yeah, okay.

[Ken Coleman]

If it was $90, what would your brain and your body have said?

[Caller]

Said, yeah, okay.

[Ken Coleman]

When she asked for 900. Don't tell me all these other things. What did your brain and body say when you processed $900?

[Caller]

It was hard because I'm trying to follow some advice from you and pay off my mortgage.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes. And you just told us that $900 is a hardship that would be brought on yourself to help somebody pay off a debt. And this somebody's not even in your life. They haven't even returned your calls. They haven't even had the common decency to return a text. This is a hard no from me, Jenna.

[Caller]

She did return. She reached out three weeks ago, and then I got the text. Two days.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's fine. That's fine. But can I ask you a question? If I said today, Jenna, it is your mission to go out into this world and earn $900, could you do it?

[Caller]

I think I could.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, that's your answer. Because your friend can, too. And is. And the question I also have is, is this still your friend?

[Caller]

Well, you know, we were close, and she went through all these things for, you know, time's sake, I won't go through it. That she shared when she called me. And. And she says she's getting a contract in the middle of the month and that she would pay me back.

[Jade Warshaw]

Kibosh. I'mma put the kibosh on this right now, because here's the. Here is what I will say if you decide, because this is your choice. If you decide to give her the money, you are giving it to her. You cannot lend her this money. You either give it to her out of the goodness of your heart and out of the detriment to your own budget and to your own own life, or you don't do it at all. You cannot lend, because if you lend. If you lend it to her, you are not helping her. You're just moving the debt, and now you're straining an already strained relationship.

[Caller]

That's why I called, because I needed to hear you say that, because I knew that's what you would say.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, ma'. Am.

[Ken Coleman]

Listen, you didn't even tell us, nor do we need to know what are the other details that you found out from the storage facility. But it. It screams to me that you're not getting the full story from this fake friend. This is not a real friend, and I'm going to say it. Real friends.

[Caller]

I just feel very not generous.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, Jenna, that's your problem on how you feel, because I can tell you, you're a generous person. The fact that you're even considering helping this fake friend tells me you're generous. But you've got to make a good decision for you, not a good decision for her. Do you. Do you understand what I'm saying?

[Jade Warshaw]

Also. Also, can I just throw out there. Guilt and generosity don't live in the same house like they don't live in the same. You don't give out of guilt. You give out of the abundance of joy.

[Ken Coleman]

I think she's manipulating you. This is a person who did not return your calls, did not return your text three weeks ago when she knew she had a problem on the horizon. She thought, hmm, I better hit Jenna up, start acting friendly again. I think this smells. This stinks of manipulation. This is a fake friend. And I don't give 9 cents to fake friends, much less $900.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah. This is period. Really think about that, Jenna. When you give, it should be out of a cheerful heart, not a guilty heart. Not under compulsion, not under. Oh, what are they going to think of me if I don't give? That is the exact opp. Matter of fact, I would say wait until. If you are still thinking about it, wait until all those feelings dissipate. And then if you can really look at this and go, I am just so grateful to help my friend. I have the money. I feel joy about it. I feel good about it. Do not give with a guilty spirit. That is not generosity. That is guilt and shame.

[Ken Coleman]

I got another thought just now. Just Jenna, how much does she actually owe? Was 1800, right?

[Caller]

Yeah, 1800.

[Ken Coleman]

Why?

[Caller]

And that's the rent. So that means they won't take a lien if she pays it by the 23rd of the month. But she told me Tuesday. But she still would owe lien fees and late fees. And then the first of the month, she has two units. She has a $900 payment, and a 786 payment on the 1st of October, November.

[Ken Coleman]

So Jenna.

[Caller]

So I don't feel like I'm helping her because if I give her this money, then where she get in the next month?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes. Jenna, I wish you could see our studio audience. They are shaking their head. You just came into the light. You. You actually just. You took. You took us where I was trying to take you. In other words, the $900 isn't even going to solve the problem. And that tells me, and I hate to say this, Jade, but I'm old enough now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Do it.

[Ken Coleman]

To have lived enough life to know that she's hitting several people up for $900. This stinks. As my grandmother used to say to high heavens. There's an old phrase from the south. Jenna, this is bad news. And I am hoping to remove any unnecessary guilt. You are not a person who has done anything wrong, thus you should not feel guilt. But you're such a kind Jenna that.

[Caller]

My mother say that's not Christlike.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, that's another problem. We're now arguing with our mother.

[Jade Warshaw]

All right. And. Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Who's probably no longer here.

[Jade Warshaw]

So.

[Caller]

So listen, I guess I did need that non objective opinion because I knew if I give her the money, it's not alone. I'll never see it again.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm gonna say a final even know.

[Jade Warshaw]

If she's gonna put it on the storage.

[Ken Coleman]

I got a final word on this. Jenna. Know the reason you feel guilt is because you think that not wanting to pay her is wrong. That's actually right. And I'm going to flip it on you and say that if you give her this $900, that's wrong.

[Jade Warshaw]

Entitlement, baby.

[Ken Coleman]

It's stupid. It's not good management of your money. Therefore, Jenna, it would be wrong for you to give her $900. It's my best shot.

[Jade Warshaw]

Business.

[Ken Coleman]

Ken, where's my hat?

[Jade Warshaw]

Where's your hat at?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh my goodness. Remember folks, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace and that's to walk daily with the prince of peace, Christ Jesus.