Money Is About More Than Math, You Can’t Put Peace Into a Formula

Summary

The Ramsey Show: "Money Is About More Than Math, You Can’t Put Peace Into a Formula"

Host: Rachel Cruz
Guest: Dr. John DeLoney
Episode Focus: Exploring the intersection of money management with personal relationships, emotions, and life circumstances beyond mere numbers.

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Introduction

In this emotionally charged episode of The Ramsey Show, host Rachel Cruz and her co-host Dr. John DeLoney delve deep into the intricate ways money intertwines with our personal lives. They emphasize that financial decisions extend beyond mathematics, impacting relationships, mental well-being, and one's sense of peace.

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Caller Highlights

1. Greg from Houston, Texas: Setting Boundaries with Family During Holidays

   • Issue: Greg and his wife faced pressure from family members wanting to use their vehicle for an extended holiday tour. With a new baby and other responsibilities, they decided to decline the request.

   • Discussion:
     Greg expressed feelings of guilt and concern about disappointing family. Dr. John DeLoney and Rachel Cruz supported Greg's decision, highlighting the importance of setting personal boundaries despite familial expectations.

   • Notable Quote:

     "You do get to set that boundary and, whether I think it's stupid or Rachel thinks it's stupid, it doesn't matter. It's what works for you guys."
     (04:11) - Greg

2. Kayla from Fort Worth, Texas: Budgeting Amid Holidays and Debt

   • Issue: Kayla is navigating through Baby Step Two with $32,000 in debt and an income of approximately $70,000. With numerous birthdays and Christmas present, she struggles to budget for gifts and personal expenses like haircuts.

   • Discussion:
     Rachel Cruz advised prioritizing debt repayment and maintaining essential expenses while being mindful of discretionary spending. The conversation emphasized the significance of focusing on long-term financial health over short-term gratification.

   • Notable Quote:

     "In the next 60 days, remember that four years from now, no one's probably going to remember this Christmas."
     (12:30) - Rachel Cruz

3. James from Ontario, Canada: Managing Extra Income and Mortgage Decisions

   • Issue: James received an additional $1,800 from child benefits, which initially went towards home upgrades. Now, with an emergency fund of $14,000 and $20,000 idle funds, he seeks advice on whether to invest, pay off the mortgage early, or prepare for a potential move due to poor neighborhood relations.

   • Discussion:
     Rachel recommended diversifying the use of the extra funds by investing, saving for the children's education, and considering mortgage payments if stable. Greg stressed the importance of financial security over potential higher returns from investments, advocating for reducing risk by paying off the mortgage.

   • Notable Quote:

     "Peace. And you can't take my calmness. Doesn't show up on a spreadsheet."
     (35:54) - Greg

4. Heather from Chicago, Illinois: Navigating New Income and Retirement Planning

   • Issue: Heather's husband secured a stable job with a significant salary increase but lacks retirement benefits. They are facing $17,000–$18,000 in debt at 0% interest and have $35,000 in savings.

   • Discussion:
     Rachel and Greg advised using the increased income to pay off debt, establish a robust emergency fund, and start retirement planning through Roth IRAs. Emphasis was placed on transparency between spouses and strategic financial planning to ensure long-term security.

   • Notable Quote:

     "You can always get back into debt and... but here's what's happening. Millions and millions of parents are walking into the gym and watching their kids struggling."
     (75:18) - Greg

5. Heather from Orlando: Adult Children Moving Back Home and Charging Rent

   • Issue: Heather and her husband are experiencing their adult children moving back home unexpectedly. Despite the children earning good incomes, they feel taken advantage of when charging rent.

   • Discussion:
     Rachel advised setting clear boundaries and time limits for how long the children can stay. Greg emphasized the importance of fostering independence and ensuring that the children understand the value of financial responsibility.

   • Notable Quote:

     "The greatest gift you could give them is their independence."
     (75:34) - Greg

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Key Insights and Conclusions

1. Beyond the Numbers:
   Money decisions are deeply intertwined with personal relationships and emotional well-being. Financial boundaries are essential for maintaining peace and ensuring personal and familial well-being.

2. Setting Boundaries:
   Whether it's declining family requests during holidays or managing adult children moving back home, clear and respectful boundaries help prevent financial strain and emotional distress.

3. Debt Management vs. Investment:
   While investing can yield higher returns, Greg and Rachel stress the value of financial security and peace of mind that comes from reducing debt and owning your home outright.

4. Transparency and Communication:
   Open communication between spouses about finances fosters trust and ensures that both partners are aligned in their financial goals and strategies.

5. Promoting Independence:
   Encouraging adult children to take responsibility for their finances teaches valuable life skills and prevents long-term dependency, fostering healthier familial relationships.

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Supporting Segments

• Promotions and Giveaways:
  The show featured Rachel's announcement of the Ramsey $5,000 Christmas Cash Giveaway, encouraging listeners to participate for a chance to win big during the holiday season.

• Financial Tools Recommendations:
  Rachel highlighted tools like the EveryDollar app for effective budgeting and managing finances efficiently.

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Closing Thoughts

This episode underscores that while financial literacy is crucial, the emotional and relational aspects of money management are equally important. By addressing personal boundaries, fostering open communication, and prioritizing peace of mind, listeners can navigate their financial journeys with greater confidence and harmony.

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Remember:
Money is not just about numbers; it's about the relationships and peace it can help build or disrupt. Make intentional choices that align with your personal and familial values.

Transcript

[Rachel Cruz]

Hey guys, this Christmas we're giving away cash. So enter the Ramsey $5,000 Christmas cash giveaway. For your chance to win big this holiday season, go to Ramsaysolutions.com giveaway to enter. Now live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey show where we help people wealth, do work that they love and create amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with my good friend and best selling author Dr. John DeLoney. And we'll be answering your questions all about life, money, relationships, anything and everything. So give us a call at Triple 882-55-5225. We're going to start off with Greg in Houston, Texas. Hey Greg, welcome to the show. Hello.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Thanks for having me.

[Rachel Cruz]

Absolutely. How can we help?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So my wife and I ran into a situation with family and we wanted to know if we are wrong or selfish for not allowing our family members to come and use our vehicle for two weeks in conjunction with their holiday visit plan.

[Greg]

God, what a jerk. Greg. No, he's kidding. Yeah, I'm totally kidding. Why would you think you're in the wrong there?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Well, we live far away. They haven't seen us in a while. We have a new baby do. And all of those are kind of some of the circumstances that led us to go back because we do want to see them. But it was contingent on how did they approach it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Was it that they're flying in and they don't want to rent a car for two weeks or what's the scenario?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes, it was a little bit of their financial planning and they said, hey, we want to come see you and we're going to fly in. We'll spend a couple days for you, but if it's okay. No worries if it's not. But we would like to use your vehicle for a couple weeks to go around the state of Texas, see other family and then we'll bring it back and then leave for a little bit and fly back to their home. My wife had to call with her family and immediately said we really don't feel comfortable but I'll talk to Greg and see. And ultimately we were very aligned, but it put her in that awkward position. We're not going to see family for the holidays with the new baby.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh.

[Greg]

So. But they said, they said since since we can't borrow your car for our Texas tour, we're not coming at all. Forget you guys.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Correct.

[Greg]

Well, dude, that's all you need to know.

[Rachel Cruz]

Well, because they can't afford, I guess to.

[Greg]

They can, they can afford to come visit.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but they can't.

[Greg]

Yeah, but they're not going to come if they can't turn it into like a multi. A multif. Family tour.

[Rachel Cruz]

Right.

[Greg]

And you're not going to foot the bill for their vehicle.

[Rachel Cruz]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Greg]

Yeah, yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

You're good, Greg.

[Greg]

And let me.

[Rachel Cruz]

I hate that it does, it does make you feel like it. Like, I understand even the question, Greg, because I probably would feel that way of like, golly, I feel bad. Should we.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

My wife is literally due a week from today. So we, he was hoping that we'd see, you know, family during the holiday. And so it made her stressed out and we were aligned. But, you know, we just. Now we're like, well, we made the decision and they said, well, we're not going to be able to come. And you know, we just wanted to double check and we felt like the answer you gave us was right. But, you know, there's still that gut feeling of like, man, we really wish we could have done something different. But.

[Greg]

Yeah, I guess what I really wish is, I really wish a. Her parents or her family wanted to actually see this newborn. They don't. They wanted to use this newborn as an excuse to come to town so they could take a tour. I mean, the whole thing's just silly, but like the meta here is. And by the way, you're going to face this for the rest of your time together. Different family members who want to use you guys for their different expectations or their different pictures of what they want their life to look like. Just make peace with whatever boundary feels right to you guys. Y'all get to do that. And whether I think it's stupid or Rachel thinks it's stupid, it doesn't matter. And it's what works for you guys. And almost every boundary comes with a cost. Yeah, it just stinks sometimes, man. I hate it for you.

[Rachel Cruz]

Well, and I think it would be another thing, Greg, if they're like, hey, we're coming in, you know, one of the evenings, we're going to drive and see some of our friends, whatever, whatever down the street. Can we use your car for that night? Or, you know what I mean? Like, if it's, if it's like a 24 hour, I don't know, but for a week, two weeks, five days and beyond, you're like, no, like, we need our car.

[Greg]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And we're actually, actually plugging along with our baby steps and our. Both of our cars are paid off. And they have. Mine has over 200,000. My wife says over a hundred thousand. So they're they're due for like maintenance and we're like, we don't even really drive our cars like that, so.

[Rachel Cruz]

Right, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We just were worried like if there is a maintenance issue and now we're working on our emergency savings build up now we're going to have to offset that. And obviously if they didn't have the funds to get a rental themselves, they're not going to be paying us for any.

[Greg]

Yeah, but Greg, this isn't about a rental car.

[Jasmine]

Yeah.

[Greg]

Because it's not like Rachel said, it's not like they were going to fly there and they just needed a car to get around town. Because then I would tell you, dude, you have two cars and your wife's not driving anywhere. Let them borrow your car. This is, they wanted to use your home as a, as a landing place for them to take a two week tour around the state. And for those who don't know Texas, you can drive 14 hours one direction and not get from one side to the other. Right.

[Rachel Cruz]

It's. And not see anyone in the process.

[Greg]

Yeah. So it's not like you're going to like Rhode island and you can, you can make a lap around the whole state in an hour or two. This is like major travel. Thousands of miles. You put on the car. I guess I want you guys to internalize. They aren't not coming because they can't afford a rental car. They're not coming because you would not let them use your house as a landing pad for a big two week vacation. And that's something to grieve.

[Jasmine]

Yes.

[Greg]

Right. Did your wife call them and say, are y'all seriously not coming to see the birth of your new grandchild?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, she has, she has not done that. I'd recommend that additional conversation. Okay.

[Greg]

I'd recommend it because here's why. Sometimes people put a boundary down and they get stuck and then people respond to that boundary and they get stuck and then you got two people making up stories about the other side of that boundary and it's, it's hard to like, it's hard to go find an olive branch. And I always want to know if I have a boundary and somebody responds poorly to it. I always want to make sure that they are responding in the way that I'm, I'm the story I'm making up about them.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right, Right.

[Greg]

So are you guys really not going to come because of a car? Are y'all really not going to come because you can't turn this into a two week vacation? Just. I just want to Clarify. You don't want to see the birth of your first grandkid because of this. Is that what we're doing? And let them be adults and respond back.

[Rachel Cruz]

And it's not a guilt trip on them.

[Greg]

It's a clarification.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, it's a clarification so that you, Greg, and your wife can get the full information from their side to say, okay, no, that's really what they. Yeah, that. I mean, as they stumble through figuring out their. Their response to it, it's. Yeah, I.

[Greg]

It.

[Rachel Cruz]

It gives you a level of clarity and a. A piece in the puzzle in this kind of conflict situation to say, okay, this is the truth, and this is what I'm hearing from them, and now I can take it.

[Greg]

And, yeah, I was recently talking to a young professional, and they got crossed with a really close friend, and that really close friend bombed a bunch of text messages in a way that was out of character, and that person was clearly going through something else. And then there was kind of a caustic, like, no fly zone, and it got awkward and weird. And then my. This. This young professional was like, oh, they told me, I don't want to talk ever again. So I get that. This is your best friend. This is your old friend. It's been two or three weeks. Send a message that just says you miss them and if they're ever ready to talk because it gives them a chance to go, okay, dude, I had a bad night. I sent a bunch of crazy things. I hung up the phone, I got mad. Give them a path back. And if they then don't respond, then all of your story, your story has appeared at the end of it. You got to grieve it and you got to go move on from there.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Okay. In 20 seconds, John, talk through setting up a boundary with families because holidays are coming up.

[Greg]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruz]

What is it written down? Clear communic. How you can.

[Greg]

In the Deloney House, we write them down and we email them. By the way, there is a trend now which is to cut off all family for any mean thing they said 25 years ago. If at all possible, if you can go see your family, be with your family. If you can find it in your heart to forgive yourself, don't go to abusive situations, of course, but if they have different politics than you or they eat weird food, go see your families, for crying out loud, and just know it's not gonna be perfect.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's good. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Mary]

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[Rachel Cruz]

So the holiday season is here. Officially. We are in November. I'm about to. I'm about to put up my Christmas tree all next weekend. I can't wait.

[Greg]

Is that like a controversy?

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Some people are like the anti before Thanksgiving.

[Greg]

Oh, yeah, yeah. You hate gratitude. I forgot about that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's not your thing.

[Rachel Cruz]

Just hate Thanksgiving.

[Greg]

That's right.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, the holiday. Holiday season is here and we're kicking things off with something really special that will brighten your Christmas. We are launching the Ramsey $5,000 Christmas cash giveaway.

[Greg]

Five grand.

[Rachel Cruz]

Your chance to win some cash this holiday season. So you can enter daily for a shot to win one of our 500 weekly prizes or the grand prize of $5,000. Go to ramsaysolutions.comgiveaway to enter. And while you're there, make sure to check out our 50 Days of Christmas deals. So you can save up to 30% on all the gifts that we have. Right. There's, there's so many things you can buy people. But buy, buy things that actually have.

[Greg]

Don't buy junk this year. Buy things that can help people transform their homes.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's right.

[Greg]

This is it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Some fan favorites like the total money makeover, financial Peace, kids, a bunch of stuff there. So Again, go to Ramsaysolutions.com store or click the link in the description if you are listening on YouTube or podcast. But again, to enter the giveaway every day, you can [e-mail] giveaway.

[Greg]

Go get it, guys.

[Rachel Cruz]

Up next, we have Jasmine in Long Island, New York. Hey, Jasmine. Welcome to the show.

[Heather]

Hi, Rachel.

[Rachel Cruz]

Hi, John.

[Heather]

How are you guys?

[Greg]

Good.

[Rachel Cruz]

Doing great. How can we help?

[Kayla]

I have a budgeting question. So right now with the holidays coming up and in my life, all the birthdays just pop up from September to December. But I'm also in baby step two, so I'm really just trying. My question is how do I budget for stuff like that if do I know? It should be gazelle intensity. So I don't know if I shouldn't be putting my thoughts into that and just not be budgeting for it or at all. So I'm not really entirely sure what to do. Yeah, I'm 32,000 in debt and I make around 70. I don't, I don't pay any rent or anything like that. Like, I live at home. I cut like I started using the Every Dollar app.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh good.

[Kayla]

Last in September.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yep. And tell me about who are the people in your life, like, who's having the birthdays and for Christmas, who would you be in charge of buying gifts for? Like, do you have kids of your own or these nieces and nephews?

[Kayla]

No, it was just my brother in law, my boyfriend, my stepmom, my best friend. And then Christmas it would be just we're doing a secret Santa for Christmas. So I normally that's, that's fine that I'll just do the secret hands, but I have like three secret Santas I'm a part of. Whether that's at work and my group of friends at work or like my boyfriend and I exchange gifts or at my house we're doing a secret Santa. But then I always end up like, oh, I really feel bad.

[Rachel Cruz]

Sure.

[Kayla]

Not getting this person something or they got me something. It's like, I also have, okay, we have church events that I want to go to. Like, okay, can I get my hair done? Stuff like that. And unfortunately my hair is not cheap. I had to think of, I have to cut out a lot of things and I just feel guilty. I feel like I. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Am I saying like, so here's the deal. I think the, you're, you're looking at this a little bit of a short term perspective. Like here in the next 60 days, here's all these things that I have to do and the people have to buy for. Just remember that four years from now, no one's probably going to remember this Christmas. Right? I mean like so, so if this Christmas looks different, which it's going to be and it should, Jasmine, if you're on the, if you're doing the debt snowball, it's going to look different than Christmases when you weren't budgeting and when you were in debt and you weren't being intentional with your money. It's going to look different. So how different is it going to look is the question. And I just, Jade Warshaw said this on the show last year and I, I just own it too. I think adults don't need to buy adults gifts. I think brother in law is fine. Like brother in law has a job hopefully and can buy brother in law stuff. Right?

[Greg]

Like, forget you guys. I want gifts. I Want lots of gifts?

[Rachel Cruz]

No, I just think of them. I, because I hear people, Jasmine, all the time. I mean in a similar, similar, you know, situation as you. And they're like, well, my Aunt Rita. And I'm like, Aunt Rita can buy her own blender. Like, like we don't need to be funding adults and like helping. Do you know what I'm saying? Like I understand the generosity piece. I get that. And if it's maybe something small and sentimental that meant something, maybe you saw a funny coffee mug and it was like, oh, that's funny because it's like this inside joke and it's $7 right. Like if you want to do something little. But, but this idea that we have to be somewhat even extravagance, you know, $50 plus for adults in our lives. I don't know, I just, I'm just not about it. I'm not about it. So.

[Greg]

And Jasmine, we call her fun ruiner.net.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, no, I'm the fun one out of every, all the personalities. So if I'm saying this so again.

[Kayla]

In terms of so like hair for example, because I, if I wanted to get my hair done, if I needed a haircut, like am I allowed to?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, I mean, yes, yes. I would say, you know, basic necessities. Right. Are going to be in your budget throughout this, this, this debt free period now is it? Are you gonna.

[Greg]

There's different versions of haircuts my wife gets.

[Rachel Cruz]

Don't. Yeah, I mean, I mean I would say I wouldn't go. I, if I were getting out of debt, I would not pay for like an update like to get it done for a party specifically. But if you have to get your hair cut and colored in life, I would put that in the budget while I'm getting out of debt.

[Greg]

I would not.

[Rachel Cruz]

Wait, are you being for real? You would buy a brother in law a gift over. No, no, no.

[Greg]

I was playing, I was messing with you.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Greg]

I was like, John, no, because here's the thing and Jasmine, how old are you?

[Kayla]

I'm 22.

[Greg]

Okay, this is the rest of your life. There will always be another thing. Right? So as soon as the new year comes around, there's going to be a something with the election and then there's going to be a we have to all go get drinks because we're sad or we're really happy and then there's going to be somebody's birthday and then your nephew's going to have like a.

[Rachel Cruz]

There'S a destination wedding cookies.

[Greg]

Yeah. That he wants you to Order for school and to fund his clarinet program. There's always going to be a thing. And unless you draw a line in the sand and say right now I am broke because my net worth is negative, like I have less than zero when it comes to my name, I do have a salary that comes every month, but I have less than zero until you draw a line in the sand and say, I at least have to get to zero. And get to where if anything happens to me, I'm going to be okay. Then you're not in a place to buy gifts. And I, and I'm just telling you this as I'm twice your age, I'm down the road. There's just always. I feel like the older we get, the more these we have to's just accelerate and accelerate and the seasons get.

[Rachel Cruz]

More expensive because it'll be friends, getting married, bridesmaids, bachelorette parties, weddings, babies. I mean, like, yeah, the life continues.

[Greg]

A cool thing. You want to find out if this dude's for real your boyfriend? Tell him we have to do the most loving gift for each other for the holidays. And it can cost no money. Competition on Ready, go. Okay.

[Kayla]

And I have one more. I'm sorry that I'm taking advantage of. When I was budgeting, how do I deal when there's like five paydays? I get paid every Thursday. And for example, October had five Thursdays in the month. Do I treat the last week a part of November or. Because I'm not sure if I should see extra money or that I could put towards my. Obviously. Or how do I really view that?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes. So you would look before the month begins and see how many weeks are there and then total up how much am I going to make for that month? So October, when you were budgeting in September for October, you would have looked to see, to say, okay, we have five weeks in October coming in and I'm going to use that, that income of those five weeks to be my. The top of my October budget. So it doesn't matter when you get paid, it's how much you get paid throughout the month. So some months you may get paid less because of where the payday hits within the week. And if that week is technically this month or last month, does that make sense?

[Kayla]

So if I have like my insurance bill, for example, comes out on the, on the second, that's before the payday in November.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's right.

[Kayla]

Would I take that?

[Rachel Cruz]

I would use my October October money then to fund that. To fund for the second. Yeah. Do you have. Do you have everything? Yeah. Do you have every dollar premium, Jasmine? Yes. Okay. The paycheck planning part of every dollar premium is exactly what you're talking about. And that's going to help you if you go into that function, I think it's only on desktop, so get on your laptop and do it. And it's able to. You're able to list out when all of your bills hit. So exactly like that. Your insurance is like, the second, you know, I know you don't have rents, but, you know, say you had a mortgage and it comes out the 10th, and then you have, you know, all your cable and electricity comes out the 20th. Like, so you're able to actually see when do bills hit? When does my paycheck come in? And do I have enough within that paycheck to fund that week or that two weeks to make sure that I don't go into the red? So the paycheck planning part of every dollar premium will help. And it'll show you, like, green or red. Like, it, like, literally walks you through it, which is so great. So make sure to check that out. Thanks for the call.

[Mary]

I've been doing this show for over 30 years, and some of the saddest calls I have taken are from situations that are completely preventable.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible air. People that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through, how am I going to pay my bills?

[Mary]

How about the middle next week?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. In the middle of all that grief, like, it's just. It is. It's terrible. So life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like, so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance.

[Mary]

And it doesn't cost much because Zander shops among a gazillion different companies. It doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here. You got to say it out loud, and you got to say, I'm going to say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place. The cost of stinking pizza. To get a free quote, call 800-356-4282, that's 800-356-4282. Or go to zander.com.

[Rachel Cruz]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. We're going to start off with James in Ontario, Canada. Hey, James, welcome to the show.

[James]

Hello. How are you?

[Rachel Cruz]

Hi. We're doing well. How can we help?

[James]

Well, okay, so I'm doing my first formal budget. And I say formal because intuitively I had a good sense of what was going on from paycheck to paycheck. But this is the first time when what got me into everydollar was something that you said when I first discovered you, like last week, which was, a budget enables you not to feel guilty about putting money aside for certain things. And I thought that I like that because I always felt guilty saying, no, we can't do this. No, we can't do that. Because I had an intuitive sense which was roughly correct. So my net income from my own income coming home is 3,600amonth. And pretty much all of that goes to the mortgage, groceries, et cetera. But then we have another 1800 from our child benefit that we've been using to upgrade our house that we purchased in 2021 because it's an old house and so the windows needed doing, so we did that. And the insulation needed doing, we did that. And it gets to minus 40 here. So we needed to not freeze to death in the winter. And now that those upgrades are done, that child benefit of 1800 is effectively spare now. And it just never occurred to me what to do with it. I just never had budgeted. I pretended like my income alone was the only income I had. And now this is actually tripping me up.

[Rachel Cruz]

I actually have some money. I have some money. A good problem. James, James, do you have any consumer debt?

[James]

No, just the mortgage. 94,000 right now.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, good for you guys. Do you guys have money saved in the bank, cash that you can get to?

[James]

Yes, yes. So we have about a $14,000 emergency fund.

[Rachel Cruz]

Great.

[James]

And we have $20,000 just kind of sitting there waiting for something to do.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, good for you guys. So, yeah, I mean, if I were you in this situation, I would start investing. You're at the point with investing and I. Investments look different in Canada than here in America, but I would still. I would still reach for that 15% of your income. And so when you start doing that, some of that may be taken out of your paycheck if it's pre tax or post tax. So I would account some of that that will probably go into investing. Your kids, are they out of the house? Do you have one still living with you?

[James]

Well, they're five, three and one.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Oh, so you have little ones. Okay. Have you guys?

[James]

We have little ones and another one on the way.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, great.

[James]

Looking far into the future sure is part of how I want to arrange this. And another factor, this question is a bit two pronged because part like the other prong of this question is does it make sense to pay off the mortgage early? And the reason I'm asking that is when we first moved here, I did what I thought was a neighborly thing. Go up and down all the streets around me saying hello, how are you? I'm the new neighbor. And it has not really gone anywhere in terms of us meeting neighbors or people or anything. But when I visited my hometown, we made friends. Red waste because I thought it was me for a long time. I guess we guess we're horrible people, nobody likes us, but no part of this area just isn't working for us.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, so y'all may move somewhere else. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[James]

And how to prepare for that because I'm not really sure what I'm getting into and I don't want to make this mistake again because I thought this would be right for us and it clearly isn't.

[Rachel Cruz]

Sure. Well, you know, it is always hard when you're moving somewhere to know what the chemistry is, you know, within the neighborhood and the neighbors. So I feel like that is, that's a, that's a hard thing. It's kind of a gamble always when you're buying a home, you know, not knowing exactly what the community is like. But yeah, so I mean if that's not in the near future, then I probably would put some of this at that point towards the house. But I would also be thinking about these four kids and their future. So education wise and all of that. So putting some money away for that as well. So I would probably divvy this up a little bit in different ways. I would be using some of it for investing, I would be using some of it for kids future and whatever that looks like for you guys. I don't know if that's a four year university or you know, whatever it is for them. Putting some aside there. And then if you do have anything extra. Yeah, you can throw it at the mortgage. But also, I mean you guys are making 3, 600amonth, is that right?

[James]

3, 600 for my income. Then another 1800 from the child benefit.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes. Okay. Yeah. So 4400 total. So. And I mean 5400. Yes, yes, yes. I'm sorry. Yep. And yeah, I mean overall I would say you can, you could even Take some of this, too, James, and. And up your lifestyle a little bit. I mean, if you guys, you know, need some room for the baby coming and having some. Some money set aside to upgrade some baby stuff, if you want that. So a little bit. A little bit of this as well, percentage wise, and you and your wife can decide on what that is, you know, put within your monthly budget. Just to give you guys a little bit of breathing room, maybe in the food category or whatever it is.

[James]

Well, yeah, I mean, we budget. My budget had $50 for restaurants per month, and we basically never go out and buy all our food with 50% stickers.

[Rachel Cruz]

So, yeah, so I would put some back to loosen that lifestyle. Yep. I would. Yeah, put that. Put some of that back in the budget to spend as well.

[Greg]

Can we talk about the most concerning part of this call for me?

[James]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Greg]

Explain 40 degrees below zero to me.

[James]

It doesn't always happen.

[Greg]

I'm from Texas. That sounds like. Like in Texas, they teach you that hell is not hot. It's actually cold, and it sounds like.

[James]

Yeah, it's true.

[Greg]

Can you go outside or will you just die?

[James]

You won't die if you're bundled up well enough. So I'm from central Canada, where it gets that cold, but it's drier. I'm used to dryer. So you go outside. If you're bundled up well enough, you're okay.

[Greg]

It's a dry. Okay. That's what, Arizona.

[James]

It's humid, and it pierces right through you. I dare not even walk out the door. And since our house still leaked air, even with all the upgrades, we're all with jackets and blankets on the inside during the winter anyway. So.

[Greg]

We have this thing in Tennessee. I don't know if they have it there. It's called fire, and it just warms up everything. Y'all should get that.

[James]

We don't have a fireplace in here either.

[Greg]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, man, That's a bummer. Well, I hope that helps.

[Greg]

James, you're doing great.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And congrats on the baby on the way. It's very exciting. Let's go to a social question. John. We got Becca from Facebook, and she says, what are some positive ways to redirect a spouse that continues to push off opportunities for easy earned income?

[Greg]

Can I say that again?

[Rachel Cruz]

What are some positive. She's being Becca. What are some positive ways to redirect a spouse that continues to push off opportunities? The. The. The. The husband. The husband doesn't want to work, and she's like, oh, my God, that's an easy way to make some money. And he's like, I don't want to work.

[Greg]

Okay, number one about your husband, as though he's a doodle. That is the positive redirection is what you say to those designer dogs that God never intended, that people in suburbs create one.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know, put a poodle with something and I know, put a poodle with.

[Greg]

Some kind of animal and create an animal. And God's just up there going, what are y'all doing? There's so many other problems to solve, but so don't talk about your husband like a positive redirection. I think you sit down and you have a harder conversation about, what is this money for? What are we trying to accomplish together and how are we going to get there? It can. It can be an easy, like, hair, life's good, we're paying off our debt or we've got everything. Okay. And then somebody offers a thousand bucks to come do a job. It's easy to go, no, I don't need that. But your partner's sitting there going, that's a thousand dollars. We're not doing a lot of work. That's a values conversation. That's not a money conversation. If your husband's just sitting around not working and playing Fortnite, that's a different conversation. Right, but let's stop with the little no redirection. I don't know the. How do we gently redirect our husbands who either a won't provide or be, or she's.

[Rachel Cruz]

I mean, or personality wise. So let's just say every, you know, if they're trying to get out of debt, if they don't have an emergency fund, and she's like, oh, my gosh, we got to get on this.

[Greg]

Have that conversation.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, yeah, if that's it. But then if you're on the other end of it and you don't have to. Right. There's a job for a thousand bucks, and you're like, eh, I'm.

[Greg]

The time here at home with you guys is more valuable.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes. But what is hard is some spouses are more, you know, what is it? Utilitarian, esque? Like, it's just like this idea of like, oh, my gosh, how could you not go? Opportunity. Like, they're so driven. They see, oh, my. This time to what you're going to make. Why would you not. And they think the other spouse is crazy. That can happen, too, so. Well, thanks, Becca, for your question. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Greg]

This show is sponsored by BetterHelp this month is all about gratitude. And most of us have people in our lives that regret grateful for. One of those people, for me, is the wonderful Marilyn Fanon. She gave me a chance. She taught me poise and professionalism and she challenged me. But there's one person that we often don't take time to think. Ourselves. We don't always acknowledge that we're barely surviving or that we're moving forward or that we're working towards a better life and better relationships. And in a world where everything seems to have gone bonkers, it's not always easy to be grateful. So here's my reminder to thank the people in your life, including you. And sometimes to do that, we need some professional help. We need to talk to someone trained to help us discover true gratitude for ourselves and others, especially in the holiday season. That's why I recommend BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy and you can talk with your therapist at just about anywhere so it's convenient for your schedule. You just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist and you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. This season, let the gratitude flow with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E L p.com DeLoney.

[Rachel Cruz]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Rachel Cruz and with me today is Dr. John Deloney and today's Rams Ramsay network app. Question is from Mason and he asks, I would like a reason, a reasonable explanation on why you only recommend a 15 year mortgage. Why shouldn't I take a 30 year out and dump extra cash into an ETF earning 10 to 12% and at the end of 30 years, I'd leverage my house and pay it off. Also have around $700,000 to spend from my investments.

[Greg]

Mason, you're smarter than. Mason, you're smarter than us. You got us. You got us on this one, man.

[Rachel Cruz]

Hadn't thought of that before.

[Greg]

Yeah, way to go, man.

[Rachel Cruz]

Wow. We'll just change our whole policy. No. So, Mason, the biggest goal when it comes to your money, one of the, well, not the biggest one of them starting out, is to become debt free as soon as possible. And so for a lot of people, this journey of even paying their house off, which is a, obviously the largest asset most people have, it's going to take around nine years. And so there is a psychological change that occurs when you know, here is my payment. And even though my intentions are good on a 30 year to either pay it like it's a 15, put what, what would have been on the mortgage, but now I can invest that money instead. You know, all of those are good intentions. And what we see over and over again is that human behavior can definitely trump what we had planned. And things come up, life happens. And if you think over, you know, 10, 15, 20 years, 30 years, there's a lot of life to happen. So the probability that you would actually do this. Right. And do it every single month consistently is probably pretty low considering the, we're talking about 30 years. 30 years. So the idea of doing the 15, I mean it's just it, there's mathematically it's faster, it forces you into a faster payment plan. And then when people are doing the baby steps and they get to this step, they're paying it off in nine years versus 15. So you'll be paying it off earlier. Now some people I know get a 30 year because the rate is better, you know, the payments is more reasonable for their budget. Right. There's a lot of different reasons, but again it's, it's putting systems in place that the rhythm of your money in your life will get you to where you want to go as fast as possible. And that's the 15 over the 30. And what's wild about mortgages too is, you know, even an extra payment, one extra payment on a 30 year mortgage on a half a million dollar house at like a 4% interest rate, you pay it off four years faster and you save. It was like I think close to maybe $60,000 in interest, one extra payment a year, that's on a 30. So if you imagine a 15 and doing that an extra year or doing four extra payments a year. Right. Like you can just see the math. It's just. Yeah. And when you're talking about a house and you're talking about a mortgage and interest and time, it's just big. So when you can like condense it and do it real as fast as possible, you're going to be better off.

[Greg]

Well, and I think it's important to call this out. And I've noticed this among, like George, like we just call them the finance Bros. But like the guys with the spreadsheets that they roll out 30 years and they put all these assumptions in there. They've never read Nassem Taleb and they have never experienced the pain of when the whole thing collapses. Right. When it crashes and when the roller coaster goes way, way, way down or when you lose your job or your wife gets cancer. Or when your kid passes away or you have to move or you get laid off or whatever. And I think if your, if your goal in life is to squeeze every last potential gap between an interest payment and a potential earned return on some sort of fund that you're trading, knock your lights out. Knock your lights out. And we'll be here when you wreck. When you have taken call after call after call of somebody saying, hey, they're taking my mom's house away because she. Fill in the blank. Or my wife and I have to move to go take care of my dad because he fell and now we have.

[Rachel Cruz]

Or my wife wants to stay home, we can't afford them.

[Greg]

Or which payments. If your goal is to always be looking for the spread and try to cover the spread, this isn't what we're trying to sell you. What we're trying to sell you is a total rejection of that way of thinking. We're trying to sell you something that the American household no longer has, and that is peace, that is the ability to sleep at night. I will gladly, gladly cash out the gap between a 30 year mortgage and a 15 year mortgage right now, which isn't a ton right this second. In fact, I think the 30 year mortgage rates may be less than the 15 year because they're trying to sell those because they can hold on to them longer. I would gladly sell that over this, this imaginary 30 year return I would have on this little bit of money if I constantly did this every month for 30 years and nothing bad ever happened to my family.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's right, yeah. Yeah.

[Greg]

I would gladly trade that gap for knowing that no one could ever take my house away, period. Ever. And it's, I call it my sleep tax, it's my soul tax. I just walk around knowing, you can't take my house.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

No matter what happens, my mom gets cancer, my wife passes away, they cannot take my house. And so if that's not what you're into, there's no math problem that we're going to sit down and map it out for you.

[Rachel Cruz]

Right, Right. Because that's, and that's the thing too about paying your mortgage off early, because we hear kind of similar argument, oh my gosh, why would I pay it off early? Why would I not just invest that money or if I have this money, it's making more, you know, in the market versus my 2% interest rate that I got 10 years ago. You know, why would I ever unplug something that's making that much to throw at debt? That's only like a 2 to 3% interest rate. And it's that exact. It's the exact same thing. Because peace. And you can't take my calmness. Doesn't show up on a spreadsheet. It just doesn't.

[Greg]

Right.

[Rachel Cruz]

And we had our Money in Marriage weekend last weekend here with about 600 couples or so. And there were a lot on baby step seven, which means they've paid off their house. There was a good amount of them. I was kind of surprised when I was asking what baby step everyone was on. There was a good amount of baby step seven. And I was like, oh, wow. And I said, okay. So for those of you that paid off your house, keep your hand up if you regretted it.

[Greg]

0.

[Rachel Cruz]

0 hands were still up.

[Greg]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Because it's like, no, you. When you really don't have a mortgage payment, you're not like, dad gum it. And if you are still, you can always borrow back on your equity and go and invest it. Right. I mean, like, you can always get back into debt and. Because there's something to be said about, about us as people. Our. Our human soul at a very, very deep level rests in a place that does not show up on an Excel sheet. It just doesn't. And so we talk more about the person than we do the math on the show because we really believe in the people. We believe in you. If you're listening or watching, you are the solution to your problems. You are the one that's going to make choices in your life, like empowering who you are as a whole person, not the little financial geek, you know, over here. You as a whole person, as a. As a son, as a daughter, as a husband, as a wife, as a mom, as a dad, as a friend. Like all these elements of you, money is just a part of it. But on this show, it's the thing that ends up being magnified into a lot of our dysfunction is what we end up seeing. And so you can't forget you are a person. You are a whole person. And that piece is part of it. It's not always the math.

[Greg]

And to you leverage people, you'll need to go read Wendell Berry. You'll need to go read Nassim Taleb. People who love risk. Because I love risk, but the goal of risk, I actually do. I'm kind of a conservative. Risky, but I love it. The thing that the modern kids that are all into like, risk and leverage, I'm going to go is you can't leverage something that if the risk doesn't pay out, you Lose it. All right? And there's no better way to risk when you have a house, when you are your own bank and when your kids school is taken care of, bro, then go to Vegas, then you can play. Right?

[Rachel Cruz]

Right.

[Greg]

Then you can start doing these things. But this leverage, there's a fulcrum to leverage. And if your fulcrum is your home, dude, they're going to come take your house. The market doesn't ride bulls forever. They will come take your home. And that just tells me you watch a lot of Instagram and a lot of tick tock and you know how to make use chat GPT to make some cool Excel algorithms. You don't understand what it's like to sleep in a house that you don't owe money on.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yep, that's right.

[Greg]

This is what it is. And they can't take your house away. I'm all about leverage. I'm all about risk. I love it. But I don't risk my wife's house. I just don't.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

And when you get that through your mind, then you can play these. Well, then I'm going to leverage my house and pay it off. But have around play that game after you have, you've covered the ground floor.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I think that's part of the misnomer too, of, you know, that the 700 grand that he has, you know, typed out, you know, there's something about also just chasing money to a degree that there is a level of emptiness out there. Y'all, money is not a God, it is not an idol. It will not fulfill you like it's not. But it also will destroy you if you don't have peace around it. So getting yourself in a healthy position mathematically is very smart. That's what we want you to do. But then on top of that, knowing that it has a placement in your life that you're not constantly chasing, because the finish line, the finish line, Mason, is always going to move. It's always going to move. So contentment is key in this as well. Thanks to everyone, all the guys in the booth and Taylor. Thank you, Taylor and John, for a great, a great segment. Thanks, America, for listening. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Mary]

Do you ever feel like you're finally making progress towards your goals only to get quickly distracted by something else in your feed? Well, that's. That's why we created the Ramsey Network app. Your single source for content that keeps you motivated. The Ramsey Network app is designed to keep you laser focused on reaching your goals. Loaded with over 7,000 hours of Ramsey shows. This free app is the best place for uninterrupted content and no distractions. Plus, you can search specific questions to get more personalized content in seconds. So for the days you need some extra motivation, you'll have proven advice at your fingertips. It's time to get serious about your goals and shut out the distractions for good. Simply search Ramsey Network in the App Store or Google Play. If you're listening on a podcast, just click the link in the show notes to download our free Ramsey Network app.

[Rachel Cruz]

Today, live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey show where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with my good friend and best selling author, Dr. John Deloney. So give us a call at 888-825-5225 and we'll be answering your questions about money, relationships, career, life. So give us a call up first. Starting off the hour is all the way in Hawaii. We have John. Oh, John, I hit the wrong button. So sorry. Hey, John. Welcome to the show. Aloha, Aloha, welcome, welcome. How can we help?

[Jasmine]

Hi, thanks. So thank you for taking my call first off, but I'm getting an insurance payout of about around 70,000 plus or minus a few thousand. And I've never really kind of gotten a lump sum like this. I am a little in debt. Before any of my injuries happened, I was in no debt and had plenty of savings, which is why I was able to pretty much survive. And I need some advice. I'm either looking at a, investing it into myself, of my career, of getting the rest of my pilot's licensing and opening the opportunities for that to come out. And the second thing I'm thinking about is maybe buying a house or property, but the fact of what I'm seeing in the market and 8% interest rates pretty much scare me.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. What happened, John? What's what. What happened that you got this payment?

[Jasmine]

It's. I, I was injured and I'm getting pretty much an insurance payout due to this injury. I had to go through a little.

[Greg]

Bit of.

[Jasmine]

Trying to get like super, you know, it's super.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Yeah. No, that's good. No. Are you okay? How are you doing now?

[Jasmine]

Oh, yeah, I'm fine. Oh, I'm fine now. I had to go through a couple surgeries and I had to rehabilitate myself and everything.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I'm so sorry.

[Jasmine]

Mostly back, mostly back to 100. Yeah, it was, it was pretty, it was pretty, pretty bad.

[Greg]

So you've you've got.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

That you've got some huge plans for the $70,000. And 70 grand is a lot.

[Jasmine]

Yeah.

[Greg]

But you mentioned like education, buying a house, getting a ponytail, buying a dragon. Like you got a lot of plans for this money. My first question to you is almost all insurance payments aren't. They're not a lottery winning. They are to make you whole. Are you going to need a knee replacement down the way? Are you going to continue to need extra medical treatment or physical therapy or counseling down the way that this. You need to put some of this money aside for.

[Jasmine]

I do not believe so there should be no. There should be no other treatments. More about just keeping myself healthy.

[Greg]

Okay.

[Jasmine]

And taking care of myself, which is. I am very goal oriented on doing for the future.

[Rachel Cruz]

So what kind of debt do you have? Currently.

[Jasmine]

It'S maybe about 30,000 plus or minus a few grand. And before any of this happened, I was in zero debt.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, and what does that debt consist of?

[Jasmine]

Okay. I know, I know it all. I'm paying it down very quickly now that I'm back at. I'm working right now. So it being.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, that's great. Is that 30,000, is it all medical or is there credit card debt? What kind of debt is it?

[Jasmine]

Right. So about 10 grand of it is about a personal loan, which is about 5% interest.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Why did you take that out?

[Jasmine]

And the. That was actually kind of. It was a little bit to put into my savings and a little bit to pay off just to reconsolidate credit card.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, okay. And. And was the credit card debt like due to the injury because you couldn't work and you guys were using it to, to get by or what was the credit card debt?

[Jasmine]

No, no, I. I got the personal loan well before the injury sustained this injury.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Jasmine]

Before that.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Okay.

[Jasmine]

Yeah, I'm. It's almost getting paid off. It's more.

[Rachel Cruz]

Gotcha. Okay, so 10 grand personal loan. What's the other 20?

[Jasmine]

The other 20 is credit card. And that's ranging between three different cards.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Jasmine]

Not maxed out.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Jasmine]

Anymore. Anywhere between 15% and my highest one is 77.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So what I would advise you, John, to do is yes, I would pay off this, this 30 grand. Like today I would get. I would be completely debt free and I would take the rest of the 40 and I would take some of it and create an emergency fund of. I would probably do six months of expenses just because of what you walked through. Do you have money saved?

[Jasmine]

Yeah, I already have that already. I that was the first thing I did when I got back to work.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. How much is in there?

[Jasmine]

About 10.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So yeah, if you, if you need to bump it up any, you can just to cover that full six months. So my word of caution for you, John, is whenever we hear someone that gets a lump sum, and it could be from an inheritance, it could be an insurance payout, just like what you're explaining to us. You know, some people it's like this like massive, like, you know, tax refund too, like whatever it is. And it's a lump sum.

[Jasmine]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

I would use it obviously to pay off this debt. But I say that with a word of caution because sometimes when you go in and just you kind of get this, I mean, I don't want to say free money because you went through hell and all this stuff, like, I'm not saying it's free, but essentially you're, you're being handed $70,000. And nothing, nothing about John changes money wise with your behavior, with your habits. So people that work their way out of debt, like if you didn't get the 70 and you're working your way out of that 30,000, something changes in that process. Like the feeling of that sacrifice, understanding, like you're cutting expenses, it's hard, it's not always fun. But man, you're doing something, you're paying a price to win. And when there's a lump sum like this, you don't always feel that emotion. And that feeling I do think is important, that experience, because it changes you. And so while again, I would pay this off today, I would take this money and pay off that 30 grand. I just want you, John, to promise yourself. Are you married?

[Jasmine]

I am divorced.

[Rachel Cruz]

You are divorced.

[Greg]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, that's fine. So I would promise yourself, promise yourself that you're not going back into debt. I would be cutting up the credit cards, no more loans. Like we're not, we're not doing this again. And if you can draw that hard line in the sand, I want you to do that as you're paying this debt off with this lump sum that you're getting. But do you hear that caution that, that the behavior of you is what's going to allow you to win down the road and your behavior isn't necessarily going to change through an experience of sacrifice. Does that make sense?

[Jasmine]

Yeah, absolutely. Without any sacrifice, you don't really gain anything. Before I was even all that, most of this credit card debt that I'm in right now is actually from my injuries from pretty much trying to it took no over two years to get everything like kind of back into normal. And that's only savings I had up. I had. I had no credit card debt. I had good savings. I had good crypto, you know, and I didn't know if like I. And I'm dwittling that down now.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, that's great. Sorry, John, we got to go to a hard break, so. Yeah. So again, that 40 that's left.

[Greg]

And by the way, check your local taxes because you may have to pay state and federal taxes on the lump payout. It may be that that's all you get out of this thing. So.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yep. Look into that. And then I would probably. Yeah, if you want to go back and get your pilot's license and that's something like career wise that you're looking at, I would definitely.

[Greg]

You got any money left?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, I think that's great. Thanks, John, for the call. Glad you're okay. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Mary]

Hey you guys. I'm not a fan of the big banks and you probably already know which ones I mean, but I do like Credit UN because they're nonprofit organizations that focus on their members. And I'm proud to endorse Fairwinds Credit Union because they share the Ramsey mission of helping people get out of debt and live generously. In fact, they design products to help keep you from going into debt in the first place. Fair Winds has been in business for over 75 years and they serve hundreds of thousands of members worldwide. You can feel secure because your deposits are federally insured by the NCUA up to $250,000. It's easy to join and Fair Winds partners with more than 5,000 credit union locations around the country so you can bank in person wherever you live. But if you prefer the online experience, you can log on to Fairwinds and do anything you could do at a physical location. So go to Fairwinds.org Ramsey to learn more. And while you're there, look at the combined checking and savings account bundle they created just for Ramsey fans to help you take control of your finances. That's Fairwinds F A I R W I n d s.org Ramsey. These days the Internet is chock full of so called investing advice from random goobs with zero qualifications. Listen folks, you deserve guidance from someone who knows what the flip they're talking about. That's why I recommend the Smartvestor program. Smartvestors can help you find a professional financial advisor who can teach you to make your own best decisions with your own money. Get [e-mail] Smartvestor again Ramsaysolutions.com Smartvestor Ramsey.

[Rachel Cruz]

Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros.

[Greg]

Learn [e-mail] SmartVestor.

[Rachel Cruz]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. We are taking your calls at 888-825-5225. And next up we have Mary in Chicago, Illinois. Hey, Mary, welcome to the show.

[Heather]

Hi.

[Rachel Cruz]

How are you doing? Well, how can we help?

[Heather]

So my question regarding our finances, my husband and I, he just got a new job, be making like 140,000 a year and went up from about 50.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, wow. So big jump.

[Heather]

Yeah, yeah, big jump. Finally.

[Greg]

What's he doing? What happened?

[Heather]

Well, he was kind of on his own in construction and just, it was very, it was all over the place. Some days working, some days not. And it just wasn't consistent enough. So he got a better job, you know, 40 hours a week constantly. And. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Wow. Good for him.

[Heather]

Yeah, yeah. Much better opportunity for him.

[Rachel Cruz]

Good.

[Heather]

So my question, like, even now with this one, he has no kind of retirement into it. So it's all on us. We have very little because of not making any money in the past. We have about 18, no, 17 or 18,000, I would say, in debt.

[Rachel Cruz]

Credit card, okay.

[Heather]

It is at 0%. I have the money stashed away and I know you guys say to pay it off, but it just always scared me because until now we didn't have it. And I just always stashed money kind of so I know I could pay that. I have about 35 in cash, so I could pay that off and kind of start from there, I guess. But like I said, it's zero percent and I know I should pay it. Like I said, it just scares me. So my question really is like, how do we invest kind of for our future retirement? Because he doesn't get any of that and nor do I. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. What does he say about all of this when it comes to paying off debt? Because you keep saying I, you know, I have stashed away 35,000 and all that. Does he.

[Kayla]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Does he want to pay it off is what would he say about that?

[Heather]

Yeah, he wants to pay it off, too. He doesn't really know how much I have stashed. I, because I just. Yeah. Dash it little by little, kind of.

[Greg]

Mary, are you safe at home?

[Heather]

Oh, yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Are you sure?

[Heather]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Very. Yeah.

[Greg]

What is it about your home that you've been hiding money from?

[Rachel Cruz]

It's just because he wasn't Making a lot. Is that it? And you just thought, oh, my gosh, we're gonna be okay.

[Heather]

Yes, yes. It just. Yeah. So I'm afraid. Yeah.

[Greg]

But if he knew how much you would have, he would take it and spend it.

[Heather]

No, I mean, not, like, foolishly spend, but he would, like, say, let's get out of debt, like, pay it all off and start, like. Whereas I'm. I'm still afraid to, I guess, get rid of it. Like, you know, it's still kind of like a little cushion for me.

[Greg]

So.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

Rachel's gonna walk you through the money part, but I want. I just feel compelled to say this. There is tension in your home. There's two people keeping secrets from each other. And if you're that scared of what's coming next for your family, you need to. If in your safe, you need to have the courage to sit down with your husband and let him know I've been hiding money because I haven't been. Because I'm not. I don't feel safe.

[Heather]

Yeah.

[Greg]

Because there's a tension there, and he doesn't know what it is, and he blames himself for it, and he's trying to solve it. And that's. It's not fair. If you. If you have to hide money from him because he's going to go blow it and put you all at financial risk or he's struggling with alcohol or gambling, that's a totally different story. But if you just have said, well, he's going to want to pay all our debts off, and I don't agree with that, so I'm going to hide money from him. Yeah.

[Heather]

I mean, I shouldn't have said hit, but, like, he doesn't really watch the finances like I do, and.

[Greg]

Okay.

[Heather]

He just doesn't know where I'm at with how much. He doesn't realize, probably, that I have this much saved on the side, like, you know.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And your motivation for it, Mary, was that for some reason, if he doesn't get a job because he was on his own for so long with construction, that we'll at least have enough to pay for food next month, because I'm just stashing and stashing. So it's like you're always running from behind on the defense at home.

[Heather]

And I just stash that away and I just like, yeah, okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

So, yeah, I mean, I think. I think John makes a great point. The first thing I would do tonight, everything needs to be laid out. Everything of, like, here's how much we have saved. Here's all of our debt. Here's the income, here's what we spend on food. Like, here's everything.

[Greg]

And here's how scared I've been.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I. And yeah, I have this saved over here. And it's probably more than you realize. And I'm doing that for a level of safety because I was so scared these past year, these past couple years when you weren't making, you know, the money coming in and I wanted, I needed safety. And now together we can start making these decisions. So, yeah, I would start there, Mary, for sure, because I think that's going to be great for your marriage because as you guys start this process and as he's starting a new job, there may be new stress or, you know, that he can come home and talk to you about. There could just be new lines of communication open that may not have been there before. So, so, yeah, so I would pay it off today. Like, I, Yep. I would take that 35, pay off the credit card debt, cut up the credit cards, be done with all of that. And then I, I would look to see how much it costs to run your home. Is it just you and your husband? You guys have kids?

[Heather]

Two. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. How old are they?

[Heather]

Eight and 10.

[Rachel Cruz]

Eight and 10. Okay. So, yeah, I would, I would probably lean on the six month emergency fund side considering that you're more of a conservative saver when it comes to money and that safety is very important to you. And I get that. You know, we always laugh that, you know, and I'm kind of like this too. I'm like, I want my emergency fund to have an emergency fund. Like, it just feels good to like, know every. If everything hits the fan. Yeah, we can, we can pay the mortgage and eat right. So like, I get that totally.

[Heather]

So I feel.

[Rachel Cruz]

So I would, I would do, I would run your budget and just say, okay, this is how much it costs to run our life. And then multiply it by six and, and that number. I would be curious for you if that feels good. Like, okay, this, this feels right. And I, and, and feels right from a logical standpoint that I know if something were to happen for six months, we could be okay. Like, that's a long time. Right. So. So that would be my next step. And then beyond that, when it comes to retirements. Yeah. There's a couple of places does his, I know his employer doesn't match. Do they have a 401k program at all?

[Heather]

No, nothing. Like he gets. No.

[Rachel Cruz]

But, yeah, no benefit, no benefits within that. Okay. Yeah. How big is the company that he's working for.

[Heather]

You know, like today actually, like, today's his first week.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, okay. I didn't know if it was a large type firm or if it's just, you know, I believe it. I mean.

[Heather]

Yeah, I believe it is. Okay. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Heather]

So I would say, I mean, he's working with a group of like 20, but there's different places around the city type of, you know, there's a couple different. What do you call them.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. I'm just surprised if a large company firm doesn't. Yeah. Offer that point.

[Heather]

That's what I said. Yeah. Too, Like, I think they do some that way and then they do some where they give you more of a salary and it's not on them to pay out a pension, to pay out insurance, like all that. You know, they're saving money, actually.

[Rachel Cruz]

Gotcha. Yeah, no, that's great.

[Heather]

What I think. I don't know for sure.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, so, so yeah, so that's the package that. Yeah. He signs onboarding and everything, right. Yeah. I would open up. Next would be a, would be a Roth ira. And for this calendar year, you guys may not make the mark for it, but as of now, you can each put in $7,000. You can actually open up a spousal Roth IRA. Mary. And then with his earned income, he can be able to qualify 150. He may, I think that the, if you're, I guess a single filer, it's 141. Yeah. I would double check, but I think you both are still eligible to open up a Roth ira. If not, you can do a backdoor Roth. But I would also sit down with the SmartVestor Pro. When you guys are in, after all this is done, after the debt's paid off, you have that emergency fund you feel good about, and then you'll be investing 15% of your income after that. And I would sit down with an investment professional and there's people in your area that, that we recommend and they're called SmartVestor Pros. So Taylor can pick up when we get off this call and she can help kind of direct you and sit down with them and, and really look at the best plan moving forward. Because also for your kids, you have young kids and, you know, what does it look like for them and college and all of it, because, yeah, 150 is an incredible salary. So you guys can, especially if you're used to living on 50, you'll have a lot of margin to be able to do some really great things and just making sure. That's all directed in the right way. So congrats, Mary, on the new job. I know that probably makes you feel feel great too, that there's some, some more money coming in. So excited for you guys. Thanks for the call. This is the Ramsey Show. Hey, you guys. When you go against what society thinks is, quote, normal, like avoiding debt, for example, it might seem weird at first and that is totally okay. We want you to be weird if that means you're doing things intentionally, including how you spend your health care dollars. And one way to be intentional is with Christian healthcare ministries. CHM isn't health insurance. They're a health cost sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families like yours take care of health care costs without sacrificing their freedom. Programs start as low as 98amonth. Find out more and [e-mail] budget that's chministries.org budget folks.

[Mary]

The Ramsey Christmas cash giveaway is here and you could win big. We're giving away $500 prizes each week and one grand prize of $5,000. Enter daily for your chance to win at Ramsaysolutions.com giveaway. It's that easy. Plus, our 50 Days of Christmas deals is on right now. Get up to 30% off best sellers and life changing gifts that won't break the holiday budget Ramsaysolutions.com store.

[Rachel Cruz]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Our Ramsey show question of the day is sponsored by why Refi? It's hard to make progress when you're trapped under an avalanche of defaulted private student loans. But why Refi helps dig you out and get the momentum with custom refinancing based on your ability to pay and a lump sum payoff option you could qualify for after 24 months. So go to why refi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey may not be available in all states.

[Greg]

All right, today's question comes from Bethany in Vermont. Bethany writes, I'm really struggling. I work in the financial industry and I'm extremely embarrassed about our financial situation. I started using every dollar and have been diligent for 10 months. Yes, I'm using I as my husband is not in agreement and it's very frustrating. He's in poor health and believes he will not live until retirement and does not need to worry about saving money for it. Oh man. We're 52 now. We combine our money. But he hates that I am quote unquote taking all his money. I pay all the bills and Keep the budget, which I show him every month, but he would rather buy a new six hundred dollar pair of boots than save money. I met my wits. And we tried counseling last year and didn't go well. How do I know when to call it quits? Well, sheesh. What do you think, Rachel?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, this is, this is a hard one. Yeah. Bethany, I mean, the, the first part of your. I'll let John answer the, the latter part of this question. But the whole idea that you're embarrassed because you work in the financial industry, that's, that needs to just leave. I mean, there's a lot of bankers that are broke that don't know how to handle money.

[Greg]

A lot of divorced marriage therapists. There's a lot of that' Life. Life is what it is.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So your occupation, you know, I mean, letting that dictate who you are. I would not let that be a shame cycle that I feel like, I feel like you're in. But yeah, you do have some major marriage issues. And, and the thing that is always evident in these types of questions is that money just ends up being the one pipe that you're seeing the problems in. And it's coming from a source. And the source is, is that your husband is an immature guy. I'm like, he, he's just, he, he does not look at life as taking care of his household. He doesn't look at life of worth living because he doesn't even think he's going to reach retirement, which is at that point in like another six years. So. Yeah, so this is someone that, that from a lot of different levels isn't okay. And you happen to be married to them. So when it gets to this point, that's, that's what makes it difficult within the marriage.

[Greg]

Yeah. And I think, Rachel, you nailed it. Dave has been saying this forever, that money is just a, it's a, it's an alarm for what's going on in your house. And what you have here is a husband who is, I've heard the phrase long tail suicide, which is I'm just going to drink or Netflix or lonely or just do nothing myself to death. Right. And I'm not going to die by suicide today, but it's just going to be this long fade out and I'm going to take every person who loves me with me because they're going to watch it in slow motion. And I don't care enough, like you said, I don't care enough about the spirit inside my own skin. I don't care Enough about the woman who said I do and married me is watching this thing happen in real time. I just don't care. Stop messing with my money and giving me rules. And I want to go buy a new pair of boots that you can bury me right. I don't. I can't answer the question. How do I know when to call it quits? There's. You just. I just. I can't answer that with this little information. What I can say is it sounds like there needs to begin. And I say this reluctantly. You need to begin to separate your money because this is good. It looks like I always look for trend lines.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

And this is one of those that feels like it's escalating. And I've been working hard for 10 months. He's in poor health now. He thinks he's going to die soon. So now he wants to buy. Like it's starting to just trend line one way in a negative direction.

[Rachel Cruz]

And you don't protect yourself. Yeah. And at this point, your future is right. Is up in the air because of his choices of spending.

[Greg]

Right. And so when it comes to call it quits about sharing your money, I think y'all are there. Maybe you can share some household bills, but you need to make sure your four walls are covered. Bethany.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

Because you have somebody who is actively trying to wrap the car.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Greg]

And. And at some point, maybe he goes and talks to somebody, but that's down the road here. And all I can say is I'm. I. It breaks my heart for you, but I'm. I'm never going to tell somebody unless it's a very specific situation. You need to get out of this right now. So I can't tell you to call accordance.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry, Bethany. So sorry. I hope. I hope that's helpful. All right, let's go to the phones. And we have Kayla in Fort Worth, Texas. Hey, Kayla. Welcome to the show.

[I]

Hi. So we've had. Can you hear me?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes, we can. Yeah. How can we help?

[I]

So my husband and I have had some bad luck with our cars recently. We're following the baby steps, but we are so, so frustrated. And I just need some encouragement to not get a loan for a new car and also advice for what to actually do since we've only recently finished our emergency fund.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Yeah. So you guys have your $1,000?

[I]

No, we have a fully funded.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, the fully funded. Oh, okay. Okay. So what's the situation with the car or both of them? What's going on?

[I]

Yeah. So going back to July. At that point, we're working on our emergency fund. And then after that, we plan to save up to replace my husband's car. But that's when my car, which is five years and 200,000 miles newer than his car, the engine just went out. So we took it to the dealership, and they are still four months later, waiting for a backordered part. They have no idea when they're going to have it, and they want to meet with us tomorrow to go over some options. And we're expecting them to try and get out of fixing our car. And then last month, at an oil change for my husband's car, they found maintenance needed. That's more than the car is worth, which just, like, kind of broke me a little.

[Greg]

So I would. Before you go, make up a story about what's going to happen tomorrow. Wait till tomorrow. Okay.

[I]

Okay.

[Greg]

And let's see what they're going to do. Because if this part is under warranty and they can't do it, they need to make you whole and then make you. Right.

[I]

It's not under warranty.

[Greg]

Okay. So y'all trying to buy a part and they don't have it for you.

[I]

So they. We had. They were going to fix our car, fix the engine, but they're waiting for a part to come in from, like, they're from their headquarter dealership, I guess.

[Greg]

Okay.

[I]

And that they've been waiting for four months. They have no idea when they're going to have anything.

[Greg]

How come you haven't taken the car out and taken it to another shop?

[I]

It's. So we're with the actual, like, dealership that we.

[Greg]

Yeah, it doesn't matter. If it's not under warranty, then they're just like a regular old mechanic. Yeah. Mechanic. They're just trying to make extra money on you.

[Rachel Cruz]

And they're actually probably the more expensive route. Kayla.

[Greg]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

I would go. Is the car. Is the car drivable or has it been sitting there for four months?

[I]

It's been sitting there for four months. They've already got the engine taken apart.

[Greg]

Yeah. So if they can't fix your car, then they have to put it back together in the original shape it was in. And here's the deal. You have to go in tomorrow without the possibility that you're going to take out a loan. Like, there's no kind of. There's no encouragement or no, like, pat on the back. What we're like, Rachel, man, what you're going through is. Is mind numbingly frustrating, and I Hate how badly you've been treated. Had this. Had you called three months and two weeks ago, I'd have told you to march in there. Right. But four months, they're just dragging you around, dragging you around, and they're gonna try to. They're gonna try to sloth a new car off on you and say, hey, we're gonna give you 1500 off just to make this thing right.

[Rachel Cruz]

Have they. Have they given you any price on what the part, how much this is all going to cost? Because I would get that information tomorrow, and then I. I would get a second opinion. I mean, even if you have to tow the thing to another mechanic just to be like, hey, that, like, I need you to look at this. And how much would this part cost you? And go get options. Because that's the frustrating thing about the car industry is it's like, oh, my God, one person here. It's one price, one over here. I mean, it's just. It's wild. So.

[Greg]

And the maintenance on that, on that, your husband's car, I would say thank you very much and take it to a completely different person and get a second opinion.

[Rachel Cruz]

Second and third opinion, always, when it comes to this. And how much. How much are your cars worth if you were to sell them?

[I]

My car when it's whole would be about $7,000 and is about 2,500.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, and how much do you guys have in your emergency fund?

[I]

We have 24,000 right now.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, well, Kayla, that's why you got your emergency emergency funds.

[Greg]

Do not borrow a car.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yep. No, do not get a loan. I would. You. I would. Yeah. I mean, this is why you have an emergency fund, so you don't have to go into debt. So I would raise hell in that.

[Greg]

In that dealership. They have treated you very, very poorly, for sure.

[Rachel Cruz]

But I would be using some of this money either to replace a car or to use this cash to be able to get it fixed asap.

[Greg]

Do not buy a car from them. They are not people of integrity.

[Rachel Cruz]

Thanks for the call, Kayla. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Mary]

Motivating your team to work and lead with the same passion you have is one of the toughest things in leadership, but it's crucial if you want to scale your business. Fortunately, Entrez Leadership Summit is the leadership event that will equip you to build a team that fights shoulder to shoulder with you so you can grow like never before. Join us in Denver, Colorado, May 18th through the 21st by going to ramseysolutions.com or click the link in the show notes.

[Rachel Cruz]

Welcome to the Ramsey Show. I'm Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with Dr. John DeLoney and taking your calls. So up next, we have Heather in Orlando. Hey, Heather, welcome to the show. Hi.

[Heather]

Thank you.

[J]

It's an honor to be on.

[Rachel Cruz]

Absolutely. We're glad you called. How can we help?

[J]

Well, I had written in because I, we have two adult children that have moved back home and we are charging them rent. However, I do feel guilty about it at times, and then I feel like we're being taken advantage other times. So I just wanted to hear what your take would be on it.

[Greg]

I was about to high five you. So tell me about your sons.

[J]

So our second son, we have four children. Our second son, he lost his job a couple about a year and a half ago.

[Rachel Cruz]

How old is he?

[J]

And he was 29. He's now 30. And he, he was renting a place with our youngest son and he was behind on his rent and we, we paid to have his rent caught up so our other son wouldn't get penalized for it. Then we allowed him to move in. He was without a job for six months. He did get a job, and once he started, we were having him pay $200 back for the loan and $200 back for rent. So that has been going on since last August. And then our young, he was supposed to get married and that didn't happen and his housing fell through. So he at the last minute asked if he could move in with us at the end of August. So he's been here for two months and we just started charging him rent. So they make a lot of money.

[Greg]

You do or they do.

[J]

They do. I mean, we're fine. My husband and I are fine. But they do make a lot of money. And at times I feel like we're being taken for granted.

[Greg]

You are. You are. Okay, I, I've, I've, I'm working on a huge project. And one of the chapters of the project right now is tentatively titled Millions of Unmarriable Men. And these are men that always go through life with a safety net that is probably mom's house.

[J]

Yeah.

[Greg]

And what it's robbing them of is, I mean, you're talking about a 30 year old who makes great money. Essentially what's happening here is, and by the way, the thought, I have a 14 year old, the thought of him moving away in four years, I can get choked up without even, without even blinking twice. Okay.

[J]

Right, right.

[Greg]

So I get it. And if you throw in any sort of divorce or childhood Issues. There's always this sense parents feel if I want to catch up, up, I want to make this thing right. I don't. I don't want to contribute anything any more hurt or anything like that, but here's what's happening. Millions and millions of parents are walking into the gym and watching their kids struggling. And they run over and take the weight of off the bar. And then their kids are 30 years old and they get laid off. And the kid looks around and just goes, mommy and you. And here's the thing. It feels good, doesn't it?

[J]

Yeah.

[Greg]

Yes.

[J]

It feels so good sometimes. Sometimes I get angry about it.

[Greg]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

It's good.

[Greg]

I'm glad you. I'm glad you feel both. And both of those are normal reactions. I want my son and my daughter to always know, no matter what. No matter what, they will always know where the key is to come into my house. They're always welcome home.

[J]

Right.

[Greg]

And I want them to be strong enough to really never have to. Right?

[J]

Yeah. And see, my husband and I, we got married young, 19 and 21, and we had four kids, you know, right. Within seven years. And we never. We worked our butts off to, you know, just live paycheck to paycheck. And so we never had a safety net, either one of us. And so we always wanted to make sure that our kids didn't feel that and that we were that. So our oldest son is married, has a three year old and another on the way. He's never come back home since he's been married. But our other three kids have come back. All of them. Two of them have come back twice. And then our youngest just came back.

[Greg]

But can I tell you why they come back?

[J]

Because they can.

[Greg]

Yep, because they can. And so I do think there's a moment in time when the greatest gift you could give them is their independence. And I think there's something fair to say, hey, me and this old man over here, your husband, we got married real young. We had all four kids, and we want to have our adventures. Y'all are moving out. And you got three months, you got six months, you got 90 days, you got 60 days. What I've been telling parents is this. Tell them they got 60 days or 30, let's say 30 days, maybe 60 days at the most. And say, I'll give you another 30 days if y'all watch all nine FPU lessons back to back to back. You watch all these lessons, I'll give you another month. You can stay to launch. But just as.

[Rachel Cruz]

And what's so hard about this, Heather, is, you know, what you intended as a mom to help and to be a gift and to be a blessing when that is not done with boundaries, with clear communication, with an end date. Like the son that was going to get married and to up fall, it didn't happen. And so his housing, you know, who knows what that story is? And I'm like, yeah, if he's like, oh my gosh, I was supposed to move in here and now I can't, you know, get rent somewhere, can I, can I stay with you guys for a month while I find another place? Right? Like, I mean, there's a, there's a, there's, there's, there's common sense in this, right? So it's not that you're not being, you know, half hearted about it, but also what that ends up being. That gift and that great heart that you have, Heather, it ends up hindering your kids. Kids. And it's, and it's the enabling side that is so difficult. I was reading a, A parenting book recently and they were talking about how my generation, my, my, the boomer parents ended up kind of becoming helicopter parents to a degree. Toward the end of like my high school when phones started to be a thing and they said, you know, hover, hover, hover, hover, hover. And nowadays the style of parenting is not helicopter parents, but they're snowplow parents. They go through and they just clear the way where there's no bond bumps, no moguls. They don't have to, they don't have to get nervous that, oh my God, I'm about to fall nothing. It is a clear path. And what that and what. And again, if we knew that that was the healthiest thing for people and they would end up on the other side being a healthier person, then that's great.

[Greg]

But it doesn't, it doesn't, it doesn't.

[Rachel Cruz]

All the research shows it's the opposite. It's exactly what you're saying about the weights. It's a great picture because they end up being weak.

[Greg]

Like, there's no, they're just not strong.

[Rachel Cruz]

There's no strength.

[Greg]

That's right.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I don't know if this helps at all, Heather, but we had Taylor, our beautiful Taylor in the booth. She's our phone screener there. She's wonderful. And, and when, when you said yeah, about unmarriable men, she's nodding her head because a lot of men in their 20s and 30s are back home and great girls are like, oh, oh, but I gotta. I got a failure to launch Matthew McConaughey. I gotta go home to your parents to like.

[Greg]

And here's the thing, parents, for those of us. Listen. I remember pacing the house with my wife asleep, not knowing how we were gonna do it. Like those. Those that I can get real visceral real quick. My son and my daughter, hopefully, thank God, will never experience that. That doesn't mean that they have won. That means that I'm going to have to do different things to inject challenges into their lives. Meaning I could buy you a car. I'm not going to. I could pay for everything. I'm not going to. I've got to inject struggle. Because at the end of the day, I don't want them waking up and being 30. And because of me, they don't have strength and they don't have grit. That doesn't mean we're going to intentionally make them suffer. But that means I've got to be intentional about making sure they've got strength, that they develop different places that I developed. Right.

[Rachel Cruz]

Absolutely.

[Greg]

It's part of it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And the relational aspect of life, whether it's within a marriage, you know, kids, adult kids, I mean, all of it. It is. There's. There's a lot of obstacles and complications in different situations, but that's one thing John, you talk a lot about. So I'm really pumped that you and Dave Ramsey are going on tour.

[Greg]

Yeah, we're gonna be on the road.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know. So you guys are doing a money and relationships tour.

[Greg]

Dave and the Kid.

[Rachel Cruz]

So it's Dave and the Kid. And again, it's. This is such a fun event because you. The audience, shape the content that they're doing. So it's calls just like this of like. Oh, my gosh. Relationally, here's the thing I'm dealing with, or my money, here's this over here. And that depending on the city, depending on who's in the audience ends up building out the event, which I love.

[Greg]

So every show's gonna be different, all new stories. And. Yeah, I'm. I'm pretty excited about this. I don't usually get nervous. I'm kind of nervous for this. Hey, me and Dave being on stage together for two and a half hours, it's going to be a trip.

[Rachel Cruz]

It's going to be funny.

[Greg]

And the audience lobbing grenades, and it's going to be a blast.

[Rachel Cruz]

So good. So if you are in Louisville, they'll be there. April 21st, Durham. April 23rd, Atlanta. April 25th. That's my birthday. Happy birthday.

[Greg]

I'm going to get you two tickets.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh my gosh, what a great gift. Phoenix, May 5, Fort Worth, May 7 in Kansas City, May 6. You can go to Ramsey Solutions.com tour to check it out. And all of you listening on podcast and watching on YouTube, the show is ending for you. But if you head over to the Ramsey Network app, it is free. You can watch the third hour completely distraction free, which is awesome. And go further into all the content we have there. So make sure to check out the Ramsey Network app and we will see you there.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Hey, you're still here. What are you doing? You do know that the rest of today's show is playing right now over on the Ramsey Network app, right? All you gotta do to finish the episode is search Ramsey Network in the app store, Google Play store, or just click the link in the show notes to download the app for free. Yep, you heard me right. For free. Then right there on the home screen, you can watch the rest of today's show. Bada bing, bada boom. All right, I'm getting out of here.

[Greg]

Enjoy.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We'll see you on the app.