Set Money Goals Your Future Will Thank You For

Summary

The Ramsey Show — Episode Summary

Episode Title: Set Money Goals Your Future Will Thank You For
Date: July 2, 2026
Host: Dave Ramsey
Co-host: Rachel Cruze
Podcast Network: Ramsey Network

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Ramsey Show revolves around setting practical financial goals, handling setbacks, and building money habits that benefit your future self. Dave Ramsey and Rachel Cruze field a variety of real-life money questions from callers, offering actionable advice on debt, budgeting, college planning, relationships, investing, and recovering from major financial hardship. Their signature blend of direct talk, personal stories, and motivational guidance dominates the session, with a focus on prioritizing essentials, regaining hope, transparency in relationships, and learning from mistakes.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Prioritizing Financial Goals When Overwhelmed

• Caller: Jennifer (New York City) — [00:44]
  • Situation: High household income ($267k), but overwhelmed with IRS debt ($8k), credit card debt ($25k), minimal college savings for two kids nearing college.
  • Main struggle: Deciding what financial goal comes first—paying off debt or saving for kids’ college.
  • Advice from Dave and Rachel:
    • "You're not eating out. You're going to be on beans and rice. You're going to be living like you make $50,000 a year so you can put your kid into school. Or she's not going. These are your two options." (Dave, [04:44])
    • Prioritize clearing all debts (IRS and credit cards) first, pause college savings temporarily, and radically reduce spending. Consider community college and scholarships.
    • Rachel recommends following the Baby Steps: “Get yourself in a place where you're debt free, fully-funded emergency fund, then start investing for retirement and kids' college.” ([05:22])
  • Notable moment: Emphasis on getting the whole family to agree on priorities—even if it means a hit to ego or lifestyle ([08:31]).

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2. Motivating Yourself to Stay on Track

• Caller: Jamie (St. Louis) — [10:25]
  • Situation: Family of six, living on $55k/year, $23k in debt (mainly from a work van), seeking motivation to keep progressing on the debt journey.
  • Advice:
    • Use “feedback loops” and small wins. “If we can see and feel traction towards our goals, we can keep going. When you don’t, everyone quits.” ([11:21])
    • Create a detailed EveryDollar budget, cut all unnecessary expenses ("you’re going to feel like you got a raise"), and focus on income growth—potentially building his own business as a floor installer.
    • Dave shares: “The trick we all have to learn is not to do the same dumb thing... when you get to be my age, they call you wise because you’ve quit doing so many dumb things.” ([18:02])
  • Rachel's encouragement: Have a "dream date" with your spouse, plan 10+ years ahead, and connect your daily struggles with future hopes ([18:54]).

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3. Home Buying After a Life Reset

• Caller: David (Phoenix) — [21:34]
  • Situation: After past mistakes, sold house to pay debts, is now renting, business is growing, has $200k in investments, considering when to buy again.
  • Advice:
    • “Rent is patience.” ([22:31])
    • Avoid using retirement accounts for down payments. At least 5-20% down, try for a 15-year fixed mortgage with a payment no more than 25% of take-home pay.
    • Weigh market growth vs. business growth; don’t be pressured by time—2–3 years of renting is reasonable ([28:01]).
    • “What I don’t want is to wait too long because you lack hope, or go too fast because you’re desperate.” ([29:55])
    • Encouraged to find stability before jumping back in ([29:10]).

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4. Transitioning from Intensity to Intentionality

• Caller: Rose (Austin) — [33:51]
  • Situation: Paid off $23k debt, working 7 days a week, nervous about slowing down after “gazelle intensity.”
  • Advice:
    • "Just back off your number of shifts. You don't have to go from hero to zero… go from full-on Sprint to a jog." (Dave, [35:58])
    • Rachel: Trust your new habits, not your former self. Keep part of the side hustle if the budget feels tight, but phase it out as your main job income rises ([37:35]).

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5. Getting (and Staying) on a Budget

• Caller: David (Indianapolis) — [38:12]
  • Situation: Six years of marriage, household income $215k+, never followed through with budgeting.
  • Advice:
    • Don’t wait for a crisis to create urgency; let your future motivate you ([40:05]).
    • “Please don't ask God to bless you if you're going to be mediocre handling your money. He wants excellence.” ([41:58])
    • Make budget meetings a regular, scheduled event, and use EveryDollar to build a habit ([41:09]).

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6. Relationship Money Issues: Engagements, Joint Assets, and Hard Conversations

a. Should We Sell the House for Debt?

• Caller: Adam (Syracuse) — [44:05]
  • Situation: Engaged, significant equity in house, $55k debt (truck and student loans), considering selling house.
  • Advice: Don’t combine finances or pay each other’s debt until married; better to sell truck, not house ([47:00]). If selling house is already the plan due to its condition or fit, that’s another story, but don’t do it only for debt payoff.

b. Combining Steps 4–6 (Retirement, College, Mortgage Payoff)

• Caller: Christina (Cincinnati) — [49:01]
  • Baby Steps: Put 15% of income into retirement; modest contribution to 529 for one-year-old daughter marks progress, but no need to panic.
  • Rachel: “Plan for life—don’t feel locked to a job only for a future benefit.” ([51:44])

c. Pre-Marital Stress over Joint Finances

• Caller: Bill (Austin) — [65:14]
  • Issue: Purchased house and cars with girlfriend, unable to discuss finances productively.
  • Advice: Seek marriage counseling. "You're starting to regret. You're starting to resent her for not carrying her half...And yet you signed this deal up." ([71:08]) Decide quickly: align and marry or separate and untangle assets.
  • Rachel’s additional note: Humility and emotional intelligence are crucial—don’t shame your partner; seek mutual understanding ([71:32]).

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7. Handling Major Medical Expenses & Emergencies

a. Medical Crisis During Job Loss

• Caller: Paige (Denver) — [77:51]
  • Issue: Husband laid off, $3k medical debt, $15k emergency fund, ongoing medical bills.
  • Advice: "Everything's on hold until he gets a job." ([79:10]) Both spouses should aggressively pursue interim income. Don’t pay off medical debt right now—protect cash reserves. “The storm is here. We're putting plywood on the windows. When the storm passes, we'll take the plywood down.” ([83:18])

b. Dental Emergency

• Caller: Nick (New York) — [97:24]
  • Issue: Wife needs full mouth reconstruction, $70k–$150k cost, no insurance, have $80k emergency fund.
  • Advice: Shop around and get multiple opinions, even if it requires travel. "I want to gather enough information to make an intelligent decision and also to not get screwed over by an industry that doesn't mind overcharging." ([102:58]) Use emergency fund if necessary once fully informed ([104:22]).

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8. International Perspective & Tight Budgets

• Caller: Johannes (Australia) — [87:57]
  • Situation: Carpenter apprentice, $71k net income, higher city costs, still dipping into savings.
  • Advice: Reduce expenses wherever possible, explore cheaper rent, side hustles, and income growth. Accept that for three years, progress will be limited—but don't slide backward ([95:44]).

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9. Financial Recovery after Divorce & Losing Retirement

• Caller: Karen (Cleveland, OH) — [119:09]
  • Situation: Age 65, divorced after discovering spouse lost all retirement to day trading, left only with house ($300k, paid for) and $70k inheritance.
  • Advice: Sell house, buy something smaller (e.g., a condo), invest the difference, and potentially triple her income if possible. Dave: “How we got here doesn’t change the answer, although… it adds to the emotion.” ([121:54]) Emphasized the importance of full financial transparency and joint decision-making in marriage ([125:42]).
  • Key quote: "If you can't sit down together and both of you talk about everything going on with your money, you shouldn't get married in the first place." ([126:16])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Dave Ramsey:

  • "You're not eating out. You're going to be on beans and rice. You're going to be living like you make $50,000 a year so you can put your kid into school. Or she's not going. These are your two options." ([04:44])
  • "The trick we all have to learn is not to do the same dumb thing... when you get to be my age, they call you wise because you've quit doing so many dumb things." ([18:02])
  • “Rent is patience.” ([22:31])
  • “Please don’t ask God to bless you if you’re going to be mediocre handling your money. He wants excellence.” ([41:58])
  • "The storm is here. We're putting plywood on the windows. When the storm passes, we'll take the plywood down." ([83:18])
  • "If you can't sit down together and both of you talk about everything going on with your money, you shouldn't get married in the first place." ([126:16])

• Rachel Cruze:

  • “The fastest way we've seen for people to get control of their money is for you guys as a household to be stable and to get the spending under control.” ([05:22])
  • “Your money habits are different today than they were when you started this. You're not the same person.” ([37:35])
  • On fun: "Find the joy in life. When you can do that, contentment starts to build—and that gets magnified as you build wealth." ([57:22])

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Memorable Segments & Timestamps

• Jennifer's college dilemma and family priorities: [00:44]–[08:44]
• Motivation & feedback loops on the debt journey: [10:25]–[18:54]
• Home buying after a major life reset: [21:34]–[30:38]
• Transitioning away from ‘gazelle intensity’: [33:51]–[37:35]
• Relationship money mistakes (joint house before marriage): [65:14]–[73:59]
• Medical and dental emergency dilemmas: [77:51]–[104:55]
• Losing everything to spouse's day trading: [119:09]–[128:01]

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Tone & Style

• Straightforward, direct, and sometimes blunt
• Emphasis on hopeful, practical solutions, learning from mistakes, and not shaming
• Balanced with empathy, especially for callers in distress or dealing with major setbacks
• Frequent references to Ramsey's trademark “Baby Steps,” as well as Christian values and wisdom

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Additional Tips and Takeaways

• Emergency Funds: Don’t use for non-emergencies. Protect cash when facing job loss or instability.
• College Funding: Debt freedom and household stability come first, even if it delays or alters college plans.
• Budgeting: Consistent, detailed budgeting is foundational—even for high earners.
• Debt Payment: Attack one debt at a time with intensity; use side hustles and lifestyle cuts.
• Home Ownership: Don’t rush to buy; prioritize down payment and stability over speed.
• Marriage & Money: Full joint decisions and transparency, never combine finances before the wedding.
• Handling Medical Emergencies: Collect multiple opinions, shop services, use emergency fund judiciously, but don’t drain it lightly.

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Closing

This episode emphasizes the importance of tough financial prioritization, the discipline to defer non-essentials, and the hope that comes from making progress, even if slow. Listeners are encouraged to build habits their future selves will thank them for, guided by honesty, joint decision-making, and a willingness to change course when life throws curveballs.

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For more resources, budget tools, or to ask your own question, visit www.ramseysolutions.com.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is the Ramsey Show. Rachel Cruz, number one best selling author, co host of the Smart Money Happy Hour and Ramsey Porter personality and my daughter is our co host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Jennifer is in New York City. Hi Jennifer, how are you?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Hi, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Great. How can we help?

[Caller (various female callers)]

I am feeling very overwhelmed right now. I have a daughter going into her senior year of high school, another one going into her 10th grade of high school. I, over the last year or two have been trying to bills while also saving for college. So right now I don't know what I should be tackling first. I have $8,000 that I owe to the IRS, $25,000 in credit card debt, and I am putting away about $200 a month for their college.

[Dave Ramsey]

And how much do you have saved for their college?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Almost nothing because I just started. So I opened up 529 plans about

[Dave Ramsey]

a year ago and $200 a month for, for one year is $2,400.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yes, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

And where is your senior in high school planning to go to college?

[Caller (various female callers)]

We're looking at SUNY schools because we're trying to stick to 20,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're looking at what schools?

[Caller (various female callers)]

City, SUNY, State of New York school.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, oh, okay.

[Caller (various male callers)]

All right.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah, yeah, in state tuition, they're affordable, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, in state tuition. Yeah, for sure.

[Rachel Cruze]

How much you guys make a year, Jennifer, or you make sure?

[Caller (various female callers)]

My husband and I both work full time and we both also have second jobs and our combined income is about 267,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you're just kind of getting started on this paying attention to money thing.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Well, well, we've been. Yeah, well, not. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, you make a quarter of a million dollars a year and you're broke, so explain that. Why?

[Caller (various female callers)]

We have a lot of expenses. We've been sending our kids to private school and instead of. Yeah, well, the, the idea was that they were going to get college scholarships from the school that they're attending.

[Rachel Cruze]

Will that happen at any level?

[Caller (various female callers)]

I mean, I think so. Yeah. But in case it doesn't, right now we're still focusing on SUNY schools, but even still we'd like to use the scholarships towards that. Also, we do live in New York, So I know $267,000 sounds like extreme amount of money, but New York is probably one of the most expensive places to live, so everything is just a lot more elevated in cost. Yes, we do live a very comfortable life. We are not holding back. We eat out frequently. I have started changing those habits recently, but I fear it's too late. And I just don't know.

[Dave Ramsey]

It is too late for a senior in college.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because you're not at your current pattern, you're not going to have money for the first year's tuition.

[Caller (female)]

Okay, what do I do?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I mean, you don't. I mean, you told me you're gonna save $2,000 and it's $20,000 that you need, right?

[Rachel Cruze]

We all gonna try to cash flow any level of it, Jennifer. Like if it's 10 per semester with what you. Is that what you. Is that part of the plan? Thinking through that or.

[Caller (various female callers)]

I mean, in a perfect world, I'd find a way to. To pay off the bills, right? The credit cards and the IRS within the next 12 months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so what y' all have to do. I'm sorry, Jennifer, apologize for interrupting, but what you're gonna have to do is y' all are gonna have to decide what's important.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Is it important for your daughter to go to college? And if it is, then you're gonna have to stop doing a whole lot of the stupid butt stuff you've been doing today.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yes, for sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't have a choice. The arithmetic tells you that. Okay. And so you're not eating out. You're not going out to eat. You're going to be on beans and rice. You're going to be living like you make $50,000 a year so you can put your kid into school. Or she's not going. These are your two options.

[Rachel Cruze]

Or a community college for the first time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Or a community college. Or she gets scholarships.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, or the scholarship.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you're not going to have the money otherwise.

[Caller (various female callers)]

I'm going to. I. I'm calling because I want to try and have the money.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, well, what I'm saying is, is that all the stuff you're telling me that you know, the excuses you made about where $260,000 went.

[Rachel Cruze]

So, Jennifer, the. But I would say the baby steps. You're new to this, so the order of importance for anyone starting this, really, regardless of kids and circumstances, it really is getting yourself in a place where you're debt free. You and your husband have a fully funded emergency fund of three to six months of expenses. And then you guys start at that Point then investing in retirement and kids college. So that's, that is the baby steps if you want to look at the plan. So that would mean that if you follow that plan, there's probably going to be some different courses of action in the next two years with not only your expenses, but maybe her school choice for the first two years, you know, if that's what you guys stick to. But if you and your husband sit down and decide, no, college is more important and we want to cash flow that first before we pay. If you want to do the baby steps out of order, you won't be doing the baby steps right, you'll be doing your own plan. But the fastest way that we have seen for people to get control of their money is for you guys as a household to be stable and to get the spending under control, to get the debt paid off. Because you're feeling like you're trying to do 18 things at once and you just don't get a lot of traction when you do that. But when you focus in on one thing at a time, again, it's not ideal timeline wise with your stage of life with kids. I totally hear that. But it is the fastest way from point A to point B to actually have some control over your money long term and building those habits. But that would mean college may look a little different for your daughter, the senior for maybe the first year or two of her college.

[Dave Ramsey]

I think you and your husband need to sit down and say we're going to clear the irs, we're going to clear the credit cards now, now and pause college. And she goes, and don't put anything in college. And then she's not, you're not going to have the private school tuition when she leaves that. So you've got that free up in your budget to put towards college. Once she goes and you put her in a community college and she applies for 73,000 scholarships. Okay. We had a lady that was a personality for a while named Christina Ellis and she had a number one best selling book called How I got a half a million dollars in free money for College. And she went on and got her master's degree in business from Vanderbilt, all paid for. Single mom's daughter, single mom came and said, I don't have the money. The only way you're going is if you go get scholarships. And she sat, she had to sit and apply for scholarships like two hours a day like it was her part time job. But it worked. She got hundreds of thousands of dollars and you can look the book up On Amazon how I got a half million dollars in scholarships and Christina's still out there teaching people this stuff. She's incredible. So that's one thing. The second thing is choose a college and sit down, the three of you, right now, you're senior, your husband and you, and say, we cannot afford for you to go anywhere except here. First year. And a community college for free or almost free is not a bad thing. All those credits will transfer. You get a lot of your basics out of the way. If you're going for a four year degree and the kid is not, you know, no one knows where you went to school. All they know is where you graduated from. And even then they don't really know that. They don't care.

[Rachel Cruze]

And that's going to be a hit to the, to the ego in a sense of going from private school, Manhattan.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yep.

[Rachel Cruze]

To a community college. But it's long term. It's the smart decision, Jennifer, for her long term as well, so that you don't rack up student loans.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. But your family's gonna have to change your priorities because y' all are way out of wheel.

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[Dave Ramsey]

Jamie's in St. Louis. Hi, Jamie, how are you?

[Caller (male)]

I'm doing good, thank you.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Good.

[Caller (male)]

Sorry, I'm kind of nervous. I really didn't think I'd get on the show.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, surprise. Here you are. You'll be okay. We've never lost a patient. What's up?

[Rachel Cruze]

I won't let Dave be mean to you, Jamie.

[Caller (male)]

Well, I just. I just recently finished listening to the Total Money Makeover and been listening to George's book. I mean, it's really got me motivated to. To make changes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good.

[Caller (male)]

And I just kind of want to keep that motivation going. We've already, like, eliminated $200 worth of subscriptions. We've had good. We do live on one income. And I'm just, you know, it's giving us higher aspirations for the future. But I'm just wondering how we keep those. That motivation going and keeping that larger goal from kind of demotivating us in our current situation.

[Dave Ramsey]

Feedback loop. The psychologists tell us that if we. If we can. If we can see and feel traction towards our goals, we can keep going. When you don't feel like you're getting anywhere, when you feel like the only light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train, everyone quits. So you can go through a long journey, as long as you can measure your progress and sense it with a feedback loop. And so that's one of the reasons we want to do something like a debt snowball, where we list our debts, smallest to largest, and we attack the smallest one with a vengeance. Because when we knock that one out, it gives us positive feedback, oh, this might work. And then you knock another one out. You're like, your hope level continues to increase. And as your hope level increases, your sacrifices, you're willing to sacrifice deeper because it's starting to work, you know, and things are starting to move in the right direction.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep, absolutely. Jamie, what is your situation? You keep saying that. What. How much debt do you guys have?

[Caller (male)]

So we're married, and we have four kids, and we live on about $55,000 a year.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Caller (male)]

And we're currently about $23,000 in debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Well, that's tough, but doable. But two things tell me immediately when I hear that situation. One is a detailed budget. In every dollar. You're going to feel like you got a raise because you've got a large enough family that there's a level of chaos.

[Caller (male)]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. That's just normal. I mean, it would be weird if you didn't. If they're all regimented little Stepford children or something. You'd have a weird bunch of kids. Right. There's a chaos level when you got four kids. And so it goes with the territory. And so you guys have to force some order and some organization to the money side of the equation. And that's also going to add some order to the rest of the thing. While you're doing it, you can't keep from doing that. And then the second thing that comes to mind is 55,000 is low. What's your career and what's your aspirations there? We need to get your income up, man.

[Caller (male)]

I am a floor installer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Mm.

[Caller (male)]

How old are you currently work for? I'm 34.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, when you're 44, what are you going to be?

[Caller (male)]

Probably the same thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Probably not a good plan.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nothing wrong with being a floor installer, but maybe you need to own a floor installing contracting company and they work

[Rachel Cruze]

for you or you're the. The leader of the division of the company who is.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Doing it. You know what I mean? Like what? Yeah. What are the. The climbing the ladder, so to speak of how do you want to keep advancing? Is going to be big, Jamie. And.

[Dave Ramsey]

And again, I'm 65. Your knees are going to be hurting when you get there.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, No, I totally agree.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, Jamie, for you guys, I'm just curious. The debt that you have, what was it? 25,000, 22,000. What is the smallest debt there?

[Caller (male)]

It's primarily just one. It's the work van that I have.

[Dave Ramsey]

The what?

[Caller (male)]

The work van that I have.

[Dave Ramsey]

A work van. I misunderstood you. Okay, so you.

[Rachel Cruze]

So you do you run your own company?

[Caller (male)]

No, it's just. It's a private company. It's just me and. And another guy. So. So, I mean, there is growth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wait a minute. I mean, you and the other guy do installing together and you're. You're independent contractors. You own your company?

[Caller (male)]

I don't.

[Caller (female)]

He.

[Caller (male)]

He's the owner. I'm his employee.

[Rachel Cruze]

Why do you have.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why do you have a van?

[Rachel Cruze]

Why do you have the van debt?

[Caller (male)]

Because I'm slow.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry.

[Caller (various male callers)]

It was.

[Caller (male)]

I. I just. It was just a bad decision, kind of.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller (male)]

I just did it so that I could try to make more money.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Okay.

[Caller (male)]

Because I would have my own vehicle and I would also help with making more progress within the company.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's two of you? Yeah. Yeah. So. Okay. So rule number one is we don't buy vehicles on debt. Rule number two is we don't buy vehicles, period, for someone else's company. We buy them for our own company. So I want you to take this van and start doing some side hustle work that doesn't compete with your current boss, but that allows you to make some extra money here and there, utilizing the skills that you have. And let's take this van and start talking about how someday you're going to be self employed and make a whole lot more than you make now. But let's start moving that direction because this van is a big, big debt. With your income and with four kids, if you know that van payment, you probably wouldn't even been calling. But the good news is you're learning, you're growing. You've already gone through a couple of audio books. You're calling us on the air asking, you're open, you're not being belligerent and prideful about. You're saying, I want to learn, I want to learn. And you're the kind of guy we help all the time, and we love helping you. We're glad you're here. Proud of you for taking those steps. Those are big steps. 34 years old, four kids, van payment, you go, I got to learn something new. This isn't working. Good for you. Good for you. Because you do. If you keep doing the same thing over and over, you keep getting the same result and, you know, it's pretty predictable. So, you know, so what we gotta do is we gotta think about how your career unfolds over the next 10 years and how this van fits into this, that, and how we get the van paid off. And

[Rachel Cruze]

I do think a budget, honestly, Jamie, and your situation and for you and your wife to be on the same page. And you guys have a plan going forward of where the income is going because that will be tight with four kids to be on that. And so I think it's even more important, right, for you guys to be looking at every single dollar. And you've already cut $200 of subscriptions, which is amazing. And so, you know, just continuing to look at that life style and just say, okay, where can we pull back to throw extra money at this van? Because if you, if you didn't have the van payment, to your point, I'm

[Dave Ramsey]

like, that margin, it would change everything.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, the margin helps so much when you look at the monthly numbers. But well done, Jamie. And you and your wife get on the same page. You guys do this together.

[Dave Ramsey]

Jamie, if you've made mistakes with money, that makes you over 12 years old. Every walking person has made mistakes with money. I have a PhD in Dumb. I've done things that make what dumb things you've ever done look horrendously smart. I mean, I have done some stupid stuff in my life. The trick we all have to learn is to not do the same dumb thing. You know, figure out what's dumb, never do that one again. Figure out what's dumb, Never do that one again. Figure out what's dumb, Never do that one again. And if you keep doing that, when you get to be my age, they call you wise because you've quit doing so many dumb things that there's not much left to do but some smart things. And you really do get a whole pile of that behind you. And so if you've made a mistake, there's no reason to shame yourself about it. You know, just go, hey, I made a mistake. I didn't know I was a dumb, dumb thing. Doing a dumb thing doesn't make you dumb. Doing a dumb thing three times in a row makes you dumb.

[Rachel Cruze]

And you know what I think, Jamie, because you, you started the call with just like, gosh, it could feel discouraging as we start climbing this mountain, you know, how do you not be discouraged just knowing the season of life you guys are? And I'm just assuming because of your age and the four kids, you guys got little kids at home and it's just there's a lot happening and you're in the day to day. So much that grind. That's how I feel as a mom sometimes. I'm like, it's just one day at a time, one day at a time. And for you and your wife to go out, Winston and I do this once a year. We call it our dream date. It sounds kind of cheesy, but we just say we put money off the table. We've done this for years and we just look ahead. We usually do like a 10 year look ahead and we say out loud how old our kids are going to be in 10 years, how old we're going to be and what do we want to do within those 10 years when we get to that age? What kind of house do we want to live in? Where do we want to live? Where are our kids going to be in school? What kind of bucket list trips? Maybe we've checked off big financial goals. Like just dream, like get out of the day to day, get out of the overwhelming numbers and you guys together, just start this like refreshed, looking at the future together and just dream and have fun.

[Caller (male)]

Foreign.

[Rachel Cruze]

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[Caller (female)]

All.

[Rachel Cruze]

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[Dave Ramsey]

David is in Phoenix. Hi David, how are you?

[Caller (male)]

I'm doing well. I love you guys.

[Dave Ramsey]

Thank you. You too. How can we help?

[Caller (male)]

I spent the first two decades of my adult life pretty income driven in terms of my lifestyle. I'm married, I've got four kids, but we never really saved or invested too much. And I was also kind of in living for me mode. And some knuckleheadery and personal sin led to us needing to sell our house and use the equity that we had built to pay off some of the consequences of my actions. And here in the last two years or so, the Lord has really given me a second chance in a lot of ways.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's his specialty.

[Caller (male)]

It really is. So, you know, now for the last, I don't know, 18 months or so, we've been renting. So we're not homeowners anymore. But I've got a small business that is doing increasingly well, my income is doing well and we're, you know, our mindset is now very much shifted and we're trying to very much aggressively save and invest and sock away for retirement. But you know, certainly with an eye towards some of what we're socking away right now being the nest egg to help us enter the homeownership market again. However, I guess my question is, you know, we've talked about kind of a plan here of in the next 18 to 24 months, maybe, maybe purchasing a home again. But we would be using most of the investment and savings that we have set aside as the down payment probably for something like that. We're fairly comfortable in Our renting situation. And so I guess my question is, with as aggressively as I'm able to sock money away right now, does it maybe make sense for us to postpone that decision for a few years and not purchase a home in the next, you know, one and a half to two years, but maybe six or seven years down the road? I'd love your thoughts.

[Dave Ramsey]

Congratulations on the turn you've made.

[Caller (male)]

Thank you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Obviously a complete 180 in your whole life. And I can just tell from the quick version of your story. And very, very cool. Rent is patience. And then the question is, what are we being patient for? And your question, the way you posed it, is the right way of looking at it, I think. And that is, you know, is it worth it to delay until we can do this with even more downstroke? And at some point that becomes a personal choice. Okay. A first time home buyer. We tell folks, you know, when you're out of debt, are you guys. David. Out of debt?

[Caller (male)]

We're getting close. I owe my parents 10,000, which that should be knocked out here in the next couple months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and what are you making in the small business?

[Caller (male)]

Well, it's hard to put my finger on it because it's only been around for 18 months and it continues to grow. In 2025, the gross revenue was about 320 and my overhead was about 8%.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is it year to date?

[Caller (male)]

Year to date it's about. Gross revenue is about 300 in the first six months of the year.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's on a hockey stick curve then. Good. But okay. Yeah. Okay. And so you're. Yeah, Good for you. Congratulations. Obviously, the Lord is blessing the new direction of your life. That's cool. Well, again, with a new home buyer, you know, we just say put 5% down, whatever or more. As much as you can put down is a better. Anything that's not in retirement savings is your down payment, throw it at it and 15 year fixed where the payment's no more than a fourth of your take home pay. You've got a couple of moving targets here. One is you've got the moving target of Phoenix real estate, which has a tendency to shoot up. We've had a couple times in my memory of Phoenix having a bit of a bubble. It got really, really hot there, no pun intended. And it may again. And I wouldn't want to be on the other side of that. I don't want to be riding that up if that were happening. So that's Varia 1 variable. Number two is you've got this hockey stick business that's going up into the right in the right direction and you're going to be able to do a completely different house two years from now. What you could do today, if that thing continues to grow at that rate and do so reasonably so, you might choose a completely different house. So I'm going to try to balance those two things against each other. How fast is the market increasing? How fast is my business growing? And so how long am I going to have patience with this good situation with rent and stack cash? I'll give you a guess. I would not be outside a three year window to buy if I were in your shoes. Now I pay cash or I can't buy. So I couldn't do any of this. But I'm talking about the things that we recommend here on the air. 15 year fix. It's the only debt that we don't yell at people for. Okay. Is a house. It's the only one. And a 15 year fix where the payment's no more than a fourth of your take home pay and you put as much as you can put down. So just past the entry level, first time home buyer is someone probably in your situation where I'd love to see you have at least 20% down because you could avoid private mortgage insurance which is about $75 per month per hundred thousand borrowed. It's a lot.

[Caller (male)]

That's one of our goals.

For sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's a lot. And so avoiding that and then beyond that, everything we're doing is okay. We're either increasing the price of the house because we've got more and more and more money or we're decreasing the debt on the house that we buy because we've got more and more and more money. Or some of each.

[Rachel Cruze]

How old are you guys, David?

[Caller (male)]

I'm 41.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. So yeah. You guys. I didn't know. Yeah, I was gonna say if you're getting close to that point of retirement, then investing was gonna be important. But you guys have plenty of time, so that's great.

[Dave Ramsey]

I would take.

[Rachel Cruze]

You sound more mature than a 41 year old. I don't know why. David, you were older.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's the mileage in the story.

[Caller (male)]

I've been through a refining fire.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, there you go. There you go. But yeah, I had two to three years in my head to rent and then to buy.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I would not recommend a 5 year play in your situation with the variables you gave me. And if. And it feels like one year feels a little desperate.

[Caller (male)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Does that make any sense?

[Caller (male)]

Yeah. I mean, we've got. We've probably got about 200 set aside right now in investments and a SEP.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you're not using yourself. We're not using yourself.

[Caller (male)]

No, no, I. I would be not touching that. So primarily the brokerage accounts, how much

[Dave Ramsey]

is in the brokerage account

[Caller (male)]

between the. I probably got about 130 in there right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so if you took 24 months and added to that, that's not a bad plan. Yeah, that's what it feels like to me. But long, you know, but renting in the interim is just patience, you know, it's just, we've got to get a coup. These changes have time to cook up in your life. Your life has completely changed, and every segment of your life has changed. Every compartment department of your life has changed. So holistically, you are a life that has changed and so awesome. That's power. And I want some time for those seeds to germinate and sprout and take advantage of them. If I'm in your shoes.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, have some settling.

[Dave Ramsey]

What I don't want people to do is wait too long because you're lacking in hope or go too fast because you're somehow desperate and you're, like, freaked out about real estate. And so those aren't. Neither one of those are good motivators. So instead, just a wise, you know, I'm the tortoise. I'm plodding and I'm plotting while I'm plotting on how I'm gonna pull this off. And I think you're gonna be just fine, Dave. I think the house is going to be a natural next move in the next 24 months or so, and you're going to make a good decision. I think you got a. You know, you're like me. You got a lot of your bad decisions in your rearview mirror, and that's a good thing. That puts you in a good place.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well done, David.

[Caller (male)]

Sam.

[Rachel Cruze]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Thinking about our last caller getting back into the real estate market after a life check change situation. You for sure in any situation, if you're in the real estate market, want to have a pro in your corner. Someone that's high octane, high protein and knows what the flip they're doing didn't just get their license three weeks ago in their at your church or wherever you met them. No, no, no, no, no, no. Nothing wrong with being in church. But they need to actually be selling a lot of houses or they don't need to be listing yours. Okay. We do not endorse real estate agents unless they're high octane, high protein, high volume producers and they get it done and they do it the Ramsey way. That's why we call them Ramsey trusted, because we vet them and we obviously don't let everyone into that recommendation program. If you want to find a Ramsey trusted real estate agent that has your best interest at heart and they work, you know you can find them for free. Go to ramseysolutions.com agent or click the link in the description. Rose is in Austin. Hi, Rose. How are you?

[Caller (female)]

I'm doing good.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Thank you for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller (various female callers)]

So I'm almost done with baby step three, and I'm looking for any tips

[Caller (female)]

on how to move from Gonzale Intensity to taking my foot off the brake.

[Dave Ramsey]

You mean just move to intentionality from intensity?

[Caller (female)]

Yeah, I'm just, I'm just a little concerned on going back backwards if I, you know, take my foot off the brake.

[Rachel Cruze]

So fear is the number one thing you would say.

[Dave Ramsey]

You mean your foot off the accelerator?

[Caller (female)]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, we're gonna try.

[Dave Ramsey]

Just making sure I understood what we're talking about.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, we're gonna try to break a little bit.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, we need to break a little.

[Rachel Cruze]

What, what, what was your situation, Rose, before you started doing all of this? The Gazelle intents paying off debt and everything.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah. So I actually have been able to

[Caller (female)]

move out on my own, get my

[Caller (various female callers)]

own place before I and so forth.

[Caller (female)]

I've paid off about $23,000 worth of consumer debt. And now I'm finishing up that emergency fund. I do currently work seven days a week between my primary job and my side hustle. So I'm concerned on if I take

[Caller (various female callers)]

away that side hustle, if I don't

[Caller (female)]

have any margin in my budget, you

[Dave Ramsey]

know, what does the math tell you? If you take away the side hustle, what does your budget look like?

[Caller (female)]

Like, I can do it, but it's going to be a little tight.

[Caller (male)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you have to take away all of the side hustle? Can you take away half of it?

[Caller (female)]

I could.

[Caller (various female callers)]

My side hustle is waitressing, so I

[Caller (female)]

work nights and weekends.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So you could work not as many nights and not as many weekends and then give yourself a comfortable margin until your budget gets to where you're really comfortable with it. So you don't have to go from zero to hero, you can just go from, or hero to zero. You can just go from, you know, Gazelle and dial it back and go, okay, instead of a full on Sprint, we're gonna go to a jog.

[Caller (female)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then if that works, you can slow down, drop the side hustle altogether if you want. I mean, but if you want to, if you want some, if you want some emotional proof that this is okay, then just back off your number of shifts.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. And do you see your primary job rows going up at all that income over time? Like I just wonder in two years if that margin is filled with just your, your career versus the side hustle.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah, definitely.

[Caller (female)]

I'm currently the, the company I'm with, I do see a career with them. So since I've been with them, I've seen growth in my income. So I don't see that being an issue.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. Yeah, because that would be ideal, right? That you work in your 40 hour week job and that sustains your lifestyle. You don't have to have that second job. But may a season still while you're transitioning. Baby steps. And just for your comfort level. Yeah, I mean, I think that's what Dave said earlier was great.

[Dave Ramsey]

Just if you're going, if you're going super, super fast down the interstate, like you know, 130 miles an hour or something, those white lines are coming at you really, really fast. And then if you slow down to the speed limit, it feels like you're crawling. And so that's kind of what, that's kind of the emotion that you're feeling when you do this. Because you've been busting it. I mean, you've been going 80 hours a week. And just to go down to 60 is gonna feel like you quit emotionally. And that's different than the math. So Dr. DeLoney always talks about. John always talks about when we're dealing with something like this, where there's a fear, facts are your friends. And so let the math calm your soul.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. And, Rose, your money habits are different today than they were when you started this. If you're not the same person, you're not the same person. And so I would start leaning in and trusting the Rose that has created great habits, that has found herself on her own. She's budgeting. She's paid off debt. Like, she. She knows what to do. She knows how to live on less than she makes. I mean, all of that, that's who you've become. And being confident in that part of you, I think is important, too. And you have to have the numbers work right. So, yes, I would say for a season, if you still need some margin, keep part of that side hustle going just to give you some comfort there. But ideally, you can phase that out as your career goes up.

[Dave Ramsey]

David's in Indianapolis. Hi, David. How are you?

[Caller (male)]

I'm doing well. Thanks for taking my call, Dave.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller (male)]

So my question, my wife and I, we've been together for six years, and we've, over those six years, always been comfortably financially, but we've talked a lot about budgeting. Pretty much once every six months or so, we have a discussion on we should sit down and really budget, but we never get to the actual budget part that allows us to track moving forward. We kind of look in the rear view and say, okay, we're doing all right. And then, you know, talk about we should try to cut back here, try to cut back there. But it never actually rubber never meets the road, so to speak, where we have a budget that we execute against moving forward. So I wanted to get. Get your thoughts on any practical tips to kind of implement that and move forward in a way that makes it effective for us.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, you're battling one of the hardest things that I think Americans battle, and that is doing nothing or handling money poorly. You could still have a pretty dad, gum, good life. And, you know, it's almost like you need to have a crisis to wake your butt up, you know, because everything's just kind of going okay.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, that's.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's nothing to kick you off the truck.

[Caller (male)]

That's where we're at.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And so when I'm facing something like that, I just try to look in the mirror and sit down. Sharon and I sit down and go, okay, there's not a crisis here, but we're going to create one. We're going to emotionally decide that we're pissed about this. We're not living like this anymore. You know, you don't have to have a heart attack to decide it's a good idea to get in shape. You could just look in the mirror and go, hey, no more donuts, bubba. You know, that might be me talking to me, by the way. But, you know, so you know I mean that, right?

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, that. Okay, so I. Yes, yes. And amen. Dave gets pissed. I was thinking on the other end is to instead of cause for a lot of people, yes. They have this crisis moment and their past catches up with them and they have to change immediately or it's gonna continue what it's been doing. Right. Your past hasn't necessarily caught up with you. Right. You don't have great money habits, but it is what it is. So I would say let the motivator be your future. And you and your wife sit down and be like the money we are letting out of our hands because we're not being intentional. We're losing our future selves. Like the 60 year old version of us is gon to be so pissed at the 31st.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, they're pissed again. Wait a minute.

[Rachel Cruze]

Shoot.

[Sponsor or Advertisement Voice]

Dang it,

[Caller (female)]

man.

[Dave Ramsey]

Man.

[Rachel Cruze]

Maybe I am more like you than I want to admit. No. Okay, so yeah, the future. We want to be able to do X, Y and Z in the future. Like this is where we want to be. And let the future be the motivator of your goals. Right? So you guys have to look ahead and say, what do we want our life to look like in five years, in three years, in ten years?

[Dave Ramsey]

Regret it. That is a nasty.

[Rachel Cruze]

And all of that. Yes. And David, seriously, the everydollar budget is gonna be everything for you guys. I literally just tracked my transactions this morning and Winston and I, we talked about our July budget, but it takes us five minutes now when we talk about it because we've been doing it for 16 years. So what I would say to you guys is what we used to do is literally put it in your calendar, on your phones or set one of those reminders on your iPhones and just say 8:30 tonight and we're having a 20 minute discussion about the budget. And do do that two or three times a week. Seriously do it a lot at the beginning. So you guys get in the rhythm of just looking and talking and looking and talking.

[Dave Ramsey]

And sticking to it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes, but you have to. You have to change that habit. And then as it goes on, you don't have to do that as much, obviously.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your household income?

[Caller (male)]

So base is around 215 and then usually around another.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I would ask, I would ask, I would just ask the question to myself. I would say, if I had somebody working for me that made 215 and they handle money the way this guy does, would I fire them? Well, please don't ask God to bless you if you're going to be mediocre in the handling of your money. He wants excellence. So be excellent. You know, treat this like it's your job. And you guys are not dumb people. So sit down and put it all in the budget. Y' all all talk about it, and then, by God, stick to it. And then you're going to go through about 90 days of back and forth to get it all figured out and get the rough edge of.

[Rachel Cruze]

And you're doing all this? Yes. And you do all of this for the goal.

[Dave Ramsey]

One of the biggest myths about money is that if you're winning with money, you're never supposed to spend any. That's not true. Some of the best money you'll spend is making memories with the people you love. That's why I was excited to find out about Young Washington from Angel. This movie tells the story of George Washington before he became a general or president. President. It's about failure, perseverance and leadership. And it's the kind of movie that's worth seeing on the big screen. And here's the best part. Angel has made it part of a bigger and better deal. Instead of just buying tickets at the box office, you can get a premium Angel Guild membership for just $15 a month. You'll get two tickets to Young Washington, access to Angel's family friendly streaming library, and free tickets to upcoming angel theatrical release every month. The truth is, the two tickets to Young Washington pay for the first month on their own. Celebrate America's 250th with a great movie this July 4th and a great deal. Sign [e-mail] Ramsey that's angel.com Ramsey. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. Adam is in Syracuse, New York. Hi, Adam. What's up?

[Caller (male)]

Hey, Dave and Rachel. How are you guys doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than we deserve. What's up? How can we help?

[Caller (male)]

So, a little bit of background. I'm 26. My fiance is 27. About two years ago, we bought a house from my grandfather. Got a pretty good discount on.

[Caller (various male callers)]

On it.

[Caller (male)]

Two years has passed now. We have about $200,000 in equity in the house. We're planning on getting married soon. We've been thinking about just eloping. And then we have a wedding date already set for November 5th of 2027. I have $55,000 worth of debt currently. She doesn't have any debt right now. Now. And we're thinking that if we get married soon that we just sell the house, possibly pay off my debt and then either rent for a little while or buy a lower priced house. And I'm just trying to. I feel like I'm more on the fence of actually doing the renting and I feel like she's just not, not. She's a little more on the other side of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you make and what does she make?

[Caller (male)]

So I just got a pay increase of about 20,000. I'll be making 70,000 now. She makes mid-80s, probably about 86.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you have how much debt? 50,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

55.

[Dave Ramsey]

55,000.

[Rachel Cruze]

What's it on, Adam?

[Caller (male)]

So 26 on a car loan and then 30 on student loans.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, the proper way to answer this is pretending that you all get married this weekend. And then this is what I would do, but I would not do anything else together until you're married. Okay. You quit paying people's bills that are your roommates. And I don't care if it's your fiance or not, it's still your freaking roommate because you don't have any legal ties whatsoever. And one of you just walks off or something happens to one of you or something like that. And those things happen in life.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. There's no repercussions, there's no protection.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're very, very vulnerable. So yeah, if you want to do a celebration In November of 27, that's fine. But I'd be married by the end of the week. Happy 4th of July. Woohoo. Fireworks. Okay, and so here we go.

[Rachel Cruze]

America's birthday and Adams.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right.

[Rachel Cruze]

Anniversary.

[Dave Ramsey]

On the 250th anniversary we got married. And so. Yeah, and whose cars the 26,000?

[Caller (male)]

It's my, it's my truck.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I'd sell your truck. I wouldn't sell your house.

[Caller (male)]

Okay. To give a little more background on the house, the house was built in 1918.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't like the house behind?

[Caller (male)]

We love the area and the property that we have, but we're not huge fans of the house itself.

[Rachel Cruze]

If you were going to move anyways, that's one discussion, I would not move because of the debt. But if you guys don't like the house and you want to do something living wise differently, regardless of the debt, then that's a totally different discussion.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but in that case, I would sell the house and buy a different house, and I'd still sell the house

[Rachel Cruze]

and I'd still live on one of your incomes for the next year after you get married and just pay off the debt or sell the truck and then live off one of your incomes.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you want to keep the truck, you need to pay it off inside of a year and a half and the other debt, too, and keep the house. And then when that's done, then we'll talk about selling the house and moving to a different house with the equity. But selling the house to get out of debt is.

[Rachel Cruze]

We rarely recommend that.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, almost never. Only in extreme situations where somebody's really going to be broke. But there doesn't need to be an hour house and our anything because you're not married. It's very, very dangerous. Don't do this, folks. So, yeah, you do what you want to do. But if I were you, I'd be married by the end of the weekend and have a wonderful anniversary that we can always Remember was the 250th anniversary of the United States of America. And there we go. Hee haw. You can make jokes about fireworks on your honeymoon the rest of your life, Right? So anyway, have some fun with it. But yeah, because, dude, y' all have been everything but married for a very long time. You talk like an old married guy. I mean, you don't even sound like, you know, so you really do need to get this stuff in the right order so that you don't get. Somebody doesn't get burned here. Christina is in Cincinnati. Hi, Christina. How are you?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Hi. I'm good. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

All better than we deserve. What's up?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Well, praise the Lord for that. So my husband and I are working baby steps four through six, and we were just curious on balancing working the steps at the same time. So we have a plan built like a plan built as we work all three. But we were just curious if we should be prioritizing, working one more aggressively than the other.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, four is six set. It's 15% before you move on. 15% of your household income going into retirement, that one's set. And then the only vacillation is between things that we want to do in the household because we're at intentional rather than intensity stage. Or do we need to save up and move up in car? Do we need to be saving up for a vacation? Those are kinds of competing things. Right. And then, you know, age and aspirations of the kids for college. It's a completely different discussion about baby step five if you have two people in high school versus two two year olds or two three year olds or something. Right.

[Rachel Cruze]

How old are your kids?

[Caller (various female callers)]

We have just one daughter and she's one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, there's no panic about baby step five. And so if you in that situation wanted to just do something that was representative of having touched that base, meaning we're going to put $100 a month or $200 a month or something in a 529 just to get started on it. It's not really enough, but it'll get us started and then we're going to concentrate on knocking out the house. That's what a lot of people do in your situation.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Or you look up and when the kid's seven, eight, and be like, okay, what's tuition looking like now? And how aggressively do we need to be saving for this then? But yeah, I wouldn't be concerned, but I would open one and start putting

[Dave Ramsey]

a little bit of money just to say I did. I'm on babysitt step five. And you don't have to be putting a lot in there and then attack the house. That's what most people do. What are you all trying to do? What are you thinking, Christina?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Well, so we do invest currently in a 529. We opened it pretty much after she was born, like the next month. And I think I'm in a unique situation. We're planning for life, but I actually work at a university and one of the benefits that we receive is that dependents can attend for free. Right now I have to be employed

[Caller (female)]

at the time, time of attendance.

[Caller (various female callers)]

So that's why we're kind of planning for life. But I think that's kind of what we're trying to balance.

[Caller (female)]

And then I know you guys Talked

[Caller (various female callers)]

about the 15% for baby step four, but with Roth IRAs, we're actually coming in closer to 19% of our household.

[Dave Ramsey]

I wouldn't do that.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Okay, so we should kind of readjust that to 15% to apply either to

[Dave Ramsey]

5 or 6 until your house is paid off.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, okay, perfect.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I wouldn't, I think you said it, Christina, but I agree with you on planning more of life happening because I don't want you feeling like you have to be stuck in a job for 18 years. Right. If you just for your kid to get free tuition. Right. Christina, in five or six years it may look different. So we need to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Almost made it. They fired me when they were 17. I've actually gotten that call.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, man.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

But good job, you guys.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

You're doing being a young family and doing this.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're gonna be. You're going to be in such good shape. You really are doing great. Well done. Let me tell you what I get asked all the time. When should I get term life insurance? How much do I need? Is it affordable? Those are the right questions to be asking. So let's take a quick review. The fact is, term life isn't a baby step. So if anyone is dependent on your income, you need to have 10 to 12 times your income in life insurance now. And most people are surprised by how affordable term life really is. Even if you're not in person. Perfect health. Look, I understand the hesitation since most insurance companies make it more of a hassle than it needs to be. Not at Zander Insurance. They're not an insurance company. They're a broker that works for you. That means they'll shop and compare the top term life companies to find the most competitive options on the coverage for your family. For almost 30 years, I've recommended Zander. For straight answers, competitive race rates and coverage that actually protects your family. Call 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com for a quick and easy quote. That's zander.com. If your private student loans are that means you've fallen so far behind that the loan is considered unpaid. Why Refi might be able to help. Why refi helps borrowers in tough situations. Explore low fixed rate refinancing options that fit their budget. Go to y refi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey might not be in all states.

[Rachel Cruze]

Today's question comes from Brett in Kansas. My wife and I are currently paying off $80,000 of debt. what point can we start to budget for a little bit of fun? We have been working nonstop to pay this off and want to add some fun money to the budget. Oh, it's a great question. And $80,000, that's a, that's a long trek. Right. Depending on what you guys make, could be a couple of years. And so, you know, one thing that we have found that helps a lot of families when there's a. When there's a lot of debt, a massive amount of debt is after certain debts are paid and you guys look up and say, okay, after we climb this mountain or after we do this, when it comes to the numbers, just to have like a breather to find something that you. Not expensive and not, you know, that's gonna cost you guys a lot. But like, what's one thing we can do to enjoy ourselves that we can look forward to? And sometimes that's like something for free, right? That you just plan and you're gonna make this thing special. But I would say to be able to piece it out when you look at the whole thing, I feel like it can be very overwhelming. But when you find these milestones within the $80,000 journey, that's helpful. But also the math is the math. And the deeper you sacrifice, the more money that goes to this debt, the faster you are going to pay it off. So if you go and take a trip or something, you pay off a debt. That's not, it's not going to work. Not going to work.

[Dave Ramsey]

I can never tell when someone asks a question this way whether they are just whining like, wha. Get over yourself. Or whether they really have been going like 100 hours a week and they really haven't even bought a jar of mustard. I mean, you know, like, what part

[Rachel Cruze]

of the spectrum is this?

[Dave Ramsey]

What extreme are they on?

[Rachel Cruze]

Right, Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you're on the whining side and you're just, oh, grow up, shut up. Fun is not defined by spending. You know, if you're on the other side. Yeah, do what Rachel said. Set yourself a milestone and, and go, okay, we're gonna go buy Chick Fil a with coupons and that's our big woo hoo when we knock out that particular debt. Okay. Cause we've not been out to eat, but we're gonna go do that. But you know what's interesting is that we define fun as with money. When can we do something fun? When you do something fun, it just doesn't necessarily require more money. But it's like the only way we can have fun is if we have money spending going on. Well, that's not true. We all know that's shallow and not accurate. So don't define fun as necessarily spending. So let's go throw the Frisbee in the park. That's fun. The one we've already got. You don't go buy one. The Frisbee, okay? And whatever, I don't care. But you know, but we define fun as I want to go on a cruise, you know, and no, you can't do that, you're broke. And $80,000 in debt, if that's what you're talking about. No, but if you're talking about I'm gonna.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, that's where you have to get creative. Cause I do know, you know, have fun is okay to have fun. It's going to the movies, it's going to the zoo with the kid. Like, all of this costs money to go and do experiences or to go do something for a lot of things. But what you're saying is exactly right. Find. Find the joy in life. Like, when you can do that, contentment starts to build. And that gets magnified as you build wealth too, which is an amazing charact to have. So. Yeah. What are the things that you can do? Is a game night, you know, as a family, Is it going on walks like, go, go do something. Go live your life and have a great life. It doesn't have to cost a lot.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And think about families that never. That lived in a time when you could not purchase fun. I mean, you were stuck with family Monopoly. You had to play Monopoly with your family. That was the only thing you could do because, I mean, jigsaw puzzles, you were stuck with that. Remember co when you were stuck in there with your family and you couldn't do anything because people found way to spend money then anyway, online shopping went out. Stacks of. Stacks of wine bottles outside their doorway. But. Yeah, but anyway. Yeah. So. But be careful how you define fun.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's a good point.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Eve is in Memphis. Hi, Eve. How are you?

[Caller (female)]

I'm fine. Thank you for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller (female)]

So, just a bit of background. My husband and I, we have been in education for years, and I mean our own education, and have followed unpredictable work, moving internationally and really genuinely not having a savings margin for a lot of our adult life. And so we don't really have a habit for that. And we're wanting to get on the same page for that. But I grew up watching my dad go bankrupt twice from day trading on borrowed house equity, and that makes me scary wary of risk. And my husband had the opposite background of growing up pretty humbly and family saving in very boring savings accounts and bonds. And I feel like now he's going in the off direction. He's drawn to crypto and IPOs, and he feels like he's older and he's had to wait so long to have the margin to invest that he wants a fast return. And he is reasonable. But we're both scientists. We like to see the full picture and get a full understanding And I feel like I'm lost with trying to figure out everything. And with his hours, he doesn't have time to like, sit down with people.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So, you know, I think, I think it's a good idea with his hours that he sits down with you and he sits down with people because he's getting ready to make some huge mistakes.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah. I just feel like when I do the research myself, he listens, but like, I'm not confident enough to explain it back to him clearly. He wants it like.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, so let's pretend for a second. Let's pretend that we actually. Because you sit down across the table from both of you and say, hey, husband, your parents had it wrong. They never invested. They only saved. You have to invest. And by the way, Eve's parents obviously had it wrong. They day traded into bankruptcy twice with the home equity. And both of those things are influencing these decisions in a toxic. And then you add to that he's decided he's going to be desperate and rash, which when I'm desperate and rash, because it's coming at me, I don't. I'm late. I'm late to the game. I'm late to the game, so I have to play catch up. I'm going to swing for the fence. I'm going to try to hit home runs, only you're going to strike out. Because as soon as I get that desperate, the way your husband is sounding, I get stupid. And it sounds like he's getting stupid. Crypto's stupid. It's a stupid swing for the fence. Okay, Day trading, stupid. It's a swing for the fence. But also not investing and instead just saving like his parents does is stupid. So, Rachel, your book, we've got to send it to them. Know yourself, know your money, because their family of origins are really impacting this.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Of the fear and the motivation of what's going on. But then you got to get beyond that. Eve and I would want to know from him, like, what, what, what, what is that motivation? Like, I know, I understand that he feels. Well, that he feels like he doesn't have enough time, but if you guys ran out numbers in an S&P 500 to see where you guys would be. Cause how, how old are you all?

[Caller (female)]

I'm 40. He's 48.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. So I'm just curious to say, like, yeah, in the next 20 years, if you did the safe route, pretty much guaranteed, what are we going to have?

[Caller (female)]

So income and like net take home right now is about 11,000amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so what if we put away $2,000 a month?

[Caller (female)]

That's what I kind of want to do. And I think where I think he's like, we could. We need to rerun some numbers of budgets. We've got some money getting freed up now. We have a kid who was in private school who's going to a public high school. So we have margin. I can see the margin coming. We've agreed we're going to save up the emergency fund.

[Dave Ramsey]

Eve, if you put $2,000 a month in just an S&P 500, which is an investment in the stock market, but it's not a day trade and it's not crypto. Okay. The average annual rate of return of the stock market in the United States since it began is 11.8%. If it averaged 11% and you put $2,000 away from age 40 to age 67, you'd have $4 million. That's what you should be doing to

[Caller (female)]

consider about as well. So I think we, we haven't been saving for college yet. I think we kind of need to look, we need a succinct, succinct, relatively succinct way to see what are the investment strategies, what are the ways to do this, and what point we should think about.

[Dave Ramsey]

And that requires sitting down with someone that knows something that you all don't know.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

Check out smartvestoramseysolutions.com and sit down with a financial planner who gets excited about watching your money grow. Right. They're not anti that kind of thing. They're pro all of that. And look at the big picture. And it's wisdom. And I, and I feel like that's what's scaring me about his decisions is it feels immature. It does not feel wise.

[Dave Ramsey]

Foreign.

[Sponsor or Advertisement Voice]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Bill is in Austin, Texas. Hey, Bill. What's up?

[Caller (male)]

Hey, Mr. Ramsey and Ms. Cruz. I appreciate you guys taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. How can we help?

[Caller (male)]

So I'm trying to get on the same page with my girlfriend here, and we're trying to start saving money. I want to obviously start planning for our future. I think we just can't get on the same page. Every time I bring up finances, it often turns into a confrontation. So I'm just trying to figure out the best way to go about it and show her, you know, what we're looking at financially, because we've really never sat down together and looked at it as a whole. I just want to see what you guys.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long have y' all been dating?

[Caller (male)]

Based on my finances, we've been dating for two and a half years.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay. How old are you guys?

[Caller (male)]

I'm 26 and she's 28.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so when you start talking about, you know, someday when we're married, we're going to combine finances, and this is what it looks like, it turns into a confrontation. What does that mean?

[Caller (male)]

So basically, like, I obviously want to start planning for our future and stuff like that, and I've told her that, and she doesn't want to obviously take any steps to start planning for our future because we're not married now.

[Caller (female)]

I know.

[Caller (male)]

Obviously you said not to, you know, get onto houses and cars and stuff together until you're married. And I've already made that mistake. But I'm trying to show her you've

[Dave Ramsey]

already made that mistake. You bought a house together?

[Caller (male)]

Yeah. So I work for a home builder.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't care. You bought a house together. Make sure I understand what you're saying.

[Caller (male)]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you bought cars together?

[Caller (male)]

I own mine outright, and then I'm

[Dave Ramsey]

on hers as well, so. And you're shocked that this woman doesn't want to talk to you about money anymore until you marry her? Of course she doesn't.

[Caller (male)]

Well, yeah, I just, you know, she's

[Dave Ramsey]

tired of waiting on you.

[Caller (male)]

I know. I just want to feel like it's going to be, you bought a house. I think that marriage Flips a switch, you know, and then it's like, all right, well, now we have to.

[Dave Ramsey]

You bought a house. That's not like a little small step. This isn't like we shared coupons at Costco. You bought a freaking house, man.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then you bought a car for her, and it's in your name, and she feels insecure about you talking about the future without a ring on her finger. Well, no kidding, dude.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is you.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, I've been thinking about, you know. Yeah, I know. I've been thinking about, obviously, marriage and stuff. It just scares me because I'm like, I mean, we've been basically married, but how do you.

[Dave Ramsey]

How do you scared about marriage after you bought a house together?

[Rachel Cruze]

Because a house is not a life, so. I know.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah. I just don't want to feel like

[Dave Ramsey]

that's the mortgage company going to flip

[Caller (male)]

a switch in her, you know, in her.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes.

[Caller (male)]

In her mind. That, wow, okay, now we're married. Now we need to save money. It's like, why aren't we saving money right now?

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so is the saving the money the tension point that you're wanting to put money away and she just wants to spend. What is that one of the tension points?

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, it's tension point on that. She owes money back to the irs. So I'm trying to tell her, hey, you know, this. This can really screw us, you know, in the long run if they start garnishing her wages and everything like that. So, like, we got to get on top of that. She's making minimum payments, but, like, we need to start, you know, taking it more serious and. Okay, you know, I'm trying to.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, I'm going to quit baiting on you. What would I do if I were in your shop? Shoes? The two of you need to schedule a meeting with a marriage counselor this week, and I want you to begin pre marriage counseling and decide if you're going to get married and if you can align enough on your finances in order to spend your life together. And then you either need to pull the plug on this thing and sell the house and the car and go on your merry way, or you need to get married as soon as you can get aligned. And I'm talking a month from now. You're going to make a decision because you're trying to handle all of this while she feels like she's dangling on the end of a hook like a worm over a bass and she's tired of it.

[Rachel Cruze]

Because.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, she's tired of it, and she doesn't know how to focus. You're not in a seat to tell her what to do about anything. Anything. You're just the boyfriend.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you guys cannot, you know, you can't go. If it's your wife, the two of you can sit down and go, hey, we're the two of us. We're going to attack this IRS thing because this is going to screw us. So your statement would be correct, then. You're trying to make a statement from a position of power that you don't have. Position of a seat that you're not sitting in.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, yeah. I'm just trying to.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know. You want everybody to be on the same page.

[Caller (male)]

House and everything. I pay for everything. You know, for the house, I pay for the house. I pay for my car, water, trash, and, you know, everything that comes to the house, I pay for. Auto, insurance.

[Dave Ramsey]

What does she make?

[Caller (male)]

She makes 3,000 per month. And then she makes commission depending on, you know, sales that she makes.

[Dave Ramsey]

So in your pre marriage counseling, if you're gonna go do what I tell you to do, you guys need to sit down and do a mock budget that says, if we were married, we would put all of our money on the table. And here's what we would do with our money. We would pay the house payment, we'd pay the car payment, we'd pay the irs. We would eat and our money would be shared, and we would make decisions together that are wise and going forward. But you're starting to regret. You're starting to resent her for not carrying her half of the load. And yet you signed this deal up.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You made this mess.

[Rachel Cruze]

And Bill, I would also. And lead with a lot of humility, too.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

I feel like, you know, you're pointing at her. You're going to screw this up if you don't. If you're just doing minimum payments. And it. It felt a little. I understand what you're saying. You have an urgency, but the urgency can come off as very shameful and down putting. And you have it figured out and she doesn't. And do you know what I mean?

[Caller (male)]

Like,

[Rachel Cruze]

the emotional intelligence of. I think a healthy marriage is both sitting down and being, okay, what's your desire? Here's my desire. Here's what I'm thinking. Here's the story that I've made up in my head, Bill, is that you think I suck with money. And I have to get this right for you to marry me, to make me worthy of marriage. Am I not worthy now? I don't know. There could be so many things attached to this and you gotta walk through all of that. I'm. Before you get married, I would go

[Dave Ramsey]

to a pre marriage counselor today and I would get these, get to the, get to the down, get to the root of it all and let's see if we can get aligned and then very, very quickly get married or let's start taking this thing apart.

[Rachel Cruze]

Because if I'm her, my car is attached to this guy, my home is attached to this guy. I make 3,000amonth and here he is

[Dave Ramsey]

and I owe the irs.

[Rachel Cruze]

Here he is telling me what I need to be doing.

[Dave Ramsey]

After he signed me up for all this. He still resents me because he has to pay for everything.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep. And do I. And if I. I don't know, there would be a lot, I think there that she may not even realize. I don't know.

[Dave Ramsey]

But she feels, she feels hung out to dry, you know, and no, she don't want to talk about the future with you because the present with you sucks. Of course not. I mean, it's not good, but it's all good.

[Rachel Cruze]

And Bill, Bill is try. I hear you, Bill. Like, because we have some people that they're so hardcore with. I mean, obviously not our principles because he went and bought a house and. But like, people are so good. I mean, their motivation is good of like, I want to save money, I want to be responsible and I want these things. But you end up coming off very unattractive, very controlling, kind of shameful when

[Dave Ramsey]

you do it out of order, particularly.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, yeah. So there has to be a lot of humility in this and, and you guys need to get on the same page. And she's going to be different than you too, Bill. When it comes to money, she might be a spender always. And you may be the saver always. And that is the dynamic, which is beautiful in a marriage. You need each other, so that's a good thing. She doesn't need to turn into you, but she does need to be a responsible adult too. So I hear, I hear that. That side of it. Oh, man, Bill. Put a ring on it. If she's the one, if she's the

[Dave Ramsey]

one, the only shot you've got at this is not continuing like it is. And it's not just go get married this weekend either, because you've got a mess. You don't know what you're getting into. So you guys need to get some good coaching, some good counseling from a good marriage counselor and settle in and get married very quickly as soon as you can.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, make a decision. You guys are 27.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so because she's dangling on the end of a hook and she's tired of it, I promise you that's what's going on. Promise you. And you know, that's the way it is. Open phones at 888-820-5525,

[Caller (male)]

SAM.

[Rachel Cruze]

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[Dave Ramsey]

What would it feel like to have no payments? Wow. I mean, no car payment, no master card, no American distress, no discovered bond, no fleeced vehicles, no student loan that's been around so long you think it's a pet. What do it feel like to have no house payment? No payments. What could you do if you were out of debt? Anything you want. How fast you'd become wealthy? I mean, baby steps. Millionaires get there fast. If you follow the baby steps, it's the fastest way to get out of debt and become wealthy. And outrageously generous. If you live like no one else later, you can live and give like no one else. If you want to learn how to do that, the EveryDollar app will teach you everything you need to do. And it'll put you on a budget to help you do it. You are in control of your life and your budget, so why don't you do something with it? You track your progress. You get personalized recommendations. You get coaching for your situation. You do it the Ramsey way on every dollar you can start it for free in the App Store or Google Play. Paige is in Denver. Hi, Paige, how are you?

[Caller (various female callers)]

I'm doing all right. Thanks so much for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. How can we help?

[Caller (various female callers)]

So my husband was recently. His position was eliminated after several years with a Christian organization. And so we are. He's actively looking for a job, but we have some medical debt. I have a child that has a chronic illness, so we have monthly bills for his care. And so I have a little less than $3,000 in medical debt right now. We have four months reserve. We do not have any debt except our home. But I'm.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much is the 4 months reserve? How much money is that?

[Caller (various female callers)]

I have about 15,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then how long ago was your husband laid off?

[Caller (female)]

He was.

[Caller (various female callers)]

He was let know in April. His kind of contract ended this last month and now he's been given two and a half months severance.

[Dave Ramsey]

So he's known about this for months upon months upon months. What type of work was he doing in the ministry?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Christian education. So he. He's been actively looking and applying for jobs. So hopefully. And there are a few things that he's got on the Horiz, but we have these medical bills. So I'm trying to figure out how to pay those off. The best. I understand like the snowball method and

[Dave Ramsey]

I was going to say none of that works right now.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Everything okay?

[Dave Ramsey]

Right now everything's on hold until he gets a job.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you working outside the home?

[Caller (various female callers)]

I do, I just, I work with the same organization and so I, I'm looking for some other options. I think it's possible that my, my position feels a little precarious right now as well.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's probably probable.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right. So. So yeah, we're just trying to figure out. I've called the medical. I've called billing for all of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Doesn't matter. It's only $3,000.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

You could write, you could write a check today, but I'm not going to.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right. That's my question. What do I do? How do we move on from here?

[Dave Ramsey]

We wait. We wait and we go get income. Both of us go get income now.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Was he teaching or was he in administration?

[Caller (various female callers)]

He was in administration.

[Dave Ramsey]

Does he have the ability to start doing online teaching as a side hustle starting tonight? Ready, set, go.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Sure. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, I think sign up, start being professor to some online classes tonight. You can sign up for those immediately and income will start coming immediately. I want him to load up on that while he's looking and turn the television off or throw a brick through it. No wasting time right now. No wasting time. Income. I want some interim income until he lands the next gig. Because until then we're in limbo. And limbo is scary as crud, isn't it, Paige?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Indeed.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Because he was laid off in April. Right. And you said they all had two months of severance. Severance.

[Dave Ramsey]

No.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so you're ending. Yeah. So you're calling at the end of. At the beginning of July when the severance is.

[Caller (various female callers)]

No, he was paid out. So he was paid out through his contract, which was the end of June. So now we are starting the two

[Caller (female)]

and a half month.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, that's good. Okay, so you have July and August of severance, which the way I look

[Dave Ramsey]

at that is if he lands something this week, that's two and a half months signing bonus to the next gig.

[Caller (female)]

Right.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Great.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's flush money. It's gravy money, it's extra money. And we write a check, pay off the. So what you're dealing with, and it's a fair thing that you're dealing with though, is my child has an illness and I've got this financial stress and we've all. Or, you know, he's lost his income. I'm probably going to. So you've got a lot of angst in the air. And what I'm trying to do is get the.

[Rachel Cruze]

Get something controlled.

[Dave Ramsey]

The faster some kind of money starts coming in. Even if it's not the permanent solution, the lower your anxiety goes.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Okay. Yeah. And we've met our out of pocket deductible for the year, and that is part of his severance. He'll be. They're going to cover COBRA for us through the end of the year, so we're not going to incur any more medical bills.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you're probably gonna get a health package at the next place and he's probably gonna land that in the next 30 days.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right. And he's working hard to do.

[Caller (female)]

So.

[Caller (various female callers)]

It's just a tricky time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, it's just scary. Until walking the Grand Canyon on a freaking tightrope. I mean, this is scary.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so I think you're gonna be okay. I don't hear anything that panics me. But I can relate to your anxiety and I think your anxiety is very valid.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

But I don't want it to be my activator. And so what we're going to do is we're going to protect the 15,000. Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

But the answer is we don't pay the 3,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Don't pay the 3,000 a day. Protect the 15,000. Protect the severance. Cut everything out of your budget. Go to beans and rice. Rice and beans. You're not going out to eat. We're not going to celebrate the severance check, you know, unless it's with water and cereal. Right. I mean, mean. So we're gonna. We're gonna, we're gonna. The storm is here. We're putting plywood on the windows. And when the storm passes, we'll take the plywood down.

[Caller (male)]

Sure.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what we're doing.

[Caller (various female callers)]

And. And we feel like we've kind of. We've been taking those steps. I think it's just a matter of, do I call these medical companies and say, I can't do it? Just let it run.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're useless. They don't care.

[Caller (various female callers)]

That's what I'm finding. It's been really frustrating.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You're not dealing. You're not talking to Intelligence Life.

[Caller (various female callers)]

So we just let it sit until something lands and then pay it off.

[Dave Ramsey]

They'll use the fact that you called and try to turn on your honor and turn on everything else to get you to go ahead and pay it. They'll shame. They'll shame you, won't they?

[Caller (various female callers)]

100%. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what they do. Yeah.

[Caller (various female callers)]

We've had. I mean, already somebody say, well, we won't make another appointment until you pay this bill. And I've said, but I am paying. Like I have been making. We've been making.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I won't make another appointment with you anyway. I'm tired of you people. I think we'll go somewhere else. So I can, I can handle that.

[Caller (various female callers)]

It's just a trick. We just feel like we've been in this tricky place and so I just.

[Dave Ramsey]

Medical professional actually said that. Was that a collector or the actual administrator in the office?

[Caller (female)]

It was the.

[Caller (various female callers)]

No, it was a billing department.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's bull. They don't have control of the appointments. So that was complete bs.

[Caller (various female callers)]

So it sounds like we are just the best thing is to hold tight.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Really.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm just trying to give you some information to that. That make. That normalizes where you are to where it doesn't feel quite so sketchy. Yeah. So the billing department doesn't make appointments. They're full of crap. They were just trying to collect a bill and they make up stories and they shame and they do whatever. So heck with that. And yeah, he gets a job, but he's got a game on. I mean, get part Time income, short term income, long term income, income, income, income, income. Both of you like your hair's on fire because the faster you stack cash, the lower your stress goes and the better he interviews. When you walk into interview and you're scared to death for your house being foreclosed on, you don't interview as well as when you walk in with cash stacked in the back bedroom. You walk different and you talk different. Your octave is different in your voice. Everything changes. You got, you have zero swagger when you're desperate and you don't want to do that. You don't because you're not attractive. Hire at that point scares people when you're scared. So you got, that's why I'm telling you go get some income. And it'll, it'll help him close the deal on the permanent upgrade and he'll probably get an upgrade in his, in his job. Wow. Sorry you guys are facing that. We're on your team though. We're here to help you. If you need us again, you call anytime. When I started, I had great ideas and I knew how to serve people, but I didn't have systems in place yet. At that time, I sold books out of the trunk of my car. It was a lot harder to start a business back then. Shopify makes it easier. Shopify is the business platform powering millions of businesses and about 10% of all E commerce in the United States. If you've got a product or even just enough idea, Shopify makes it simple to get moving. You can build a storefront, write product descriptions and even improve your product photos all in one place. You don't need 10 different systems duct taped together. Shopify handles everything you need to make sales from payments to marketing and analytics. Plus that purple shop pay button is one of the best converting checkouts on the planet for fewer abandoned carts. And if you get stuck, Shopify offers 24. 7 support. So if you've been sitting on the sidelines, it's time to turn those ideas into Sign up for your $1 per month trial at shopify.comramsey that's shopify.comramsey shopify.com Rams. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Rachel Cruz Ramsey personality My daughter is my co host today Johannes is calling us from Australia. Hey Johannes, what's up?

[Caller (various male callers)]

Hello there, Dave. Not much yourself?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve, sir. How can we help?

[Caller (various male callers)]

That's great, Dave. I have a basic question here for you. I'm a carpenter apprentice and I Have a. Me and my wife have a yearly income of $71,000 and 71 and a half thousand dollars. We are struggling to make ends meet at this stage. We've been. Over the last 12 months, we've been dipping into our savings just to try and stay afloat. And one of my, my concerns is involving car insurance that I have for my youth and if I invested prematurely.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so do you have debt?

[Caller (various male callers)]

Well, yesterday morning when I called first I thought no. And then after thinking about it, I do. I have a step pay account with Cornwealth, which is a small credit card. It has about $400 on it. I mainly use it for fuel. The only reason I opened it up is to pay an electricity bill. And then I have a personal loan from my dad of $3,000. And then I got a month to month phone plan paying my wife's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's not, that's just, that's just utilities.

[Caller (male)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. And so 71,000, $72,000 coming in. So $6,000 a month. And how much is your rent or your mortgage?

[Caller (various male callers)]

We are renting. It's 440 a week, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

So 1800 bucks a month. Does that sound right?

[Caller (various male callers)]

Correct.

[Caller (male)]

That's correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and what is, I don't know, the tax rates and so forth. In Australia, out of $72,000 a year, how much do you get taxed?

[Caller (various male callers)]

So that's the net income, the tax.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, that's net of tax.

[Caller (various male callers)]

That's net.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, good. Okay. All right. So we've got $6,000 a month to operate from. We've got about 2,000 going out in rent and she leaves us 4,000 to do everything else with. Does that sound good?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Correct.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Yes, sir.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, where, where would you say it's going? Is there one big expense or is it a bunch of little things?

[Caller (various male callers)]

For the majority is a bunch of little things. The, the biggest expenses here is obviously groceries, which, which, counting up the average groceries, we spent the last few months on a month to month basis, about 1700 bucks because we got two kids as well as three pets. So nappies and baby wipes and stuff like that can get quite pricey here. And then for work, because I have to travel out of town quite often. I've been spending a minimum of $150 a week on fuel. And then utilities are the other big one. It's about $600 every three months for power and about $200 every three months for water. So that's $800.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what has, what has changed dramatically in the last year that put the pinch on.

[Caller (various male callers)]

So we were, we were living in Stanford, a small country town and we moved about 13 months ago. We moved to a bigger city which, which for my job, which increased the rent and well, just about everything else, to be honest.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, cost. Cost of living is higher there than it is out in the country. Yeah, that makes sense.

[Rachel Cruze]

Does your income go up for the move?

[Caller (various male callers)]

It did, but my wife isn't currently working. She's a stay at home mom. She's got a bunch of undiagnosed medical issues that we are trying to sort out.

[Dave Ramsey]

She working in the other place?

[Caller (male)]

No, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

So that didn't change a.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Well, she receives a, like a state income payments.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Caller (various male callers)]

So with my, with my pay going up, her pay from the state went down dramatically.

[Dave Ramsey]

So did you ended up netting less by moving or netting more between her going down, you going.

[Caller (various male callers)]

We ended up netting slightly less by moving, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

And your cost. And your costs all went up.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Our cost of living went up dramatically.

[Dave Ramsey]

Can you move back? Can you go back to where you were? You were better off before the move?

[Caller (various male callers)]

I was, I was definitely. Unfortunately, that, that's not really an option for us at this stage.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because of your job?

[Caller (various male callers)]

Yes. Yes, sir, because of my job.

[Caller (male)]

Okay.

[Caller (various male callers)]

I'm doing a shift, I'm doing. Sorry, I'm doing a carpenter apprenticeship, which is a four year based job.

[Dave Ramsey]

How far into the four years are you?

[Caller (various male callers)]

I mean, just over a year now, sir.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so you got three more years of that and then what does life look like after that?

[Caller (various male callers)]

Well, life, life. After that I'll obviously be qualified and I want to get a, get a few more building certificates behind my name so I can eventually grow up. Like eventually move on in my career.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, but after three years, does your income jump?

[Caller (various male callers)]

After I finish my apprenticeship? Yes. About estimation. About 25 to 30 a year net.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, so you almost. It's like you guys have three years of this way of life.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Yes, yes.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Which I. Yeah, no, no, you're good, you're good, you're good. Which is a good thing because at least you have an end dates that you're like, okay, hang on. The 1700, if we can cut that to 1300. Like right. If you can just find these small cuts and it's gonna strain. It's gonna strain you guys. It's not gonna be fun.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Maybe even rent something cheaper than what you are. I mean, I don't know anything you can do to get closer to balance. Nothing you're describing. Your current situation is a difficult situation to prosper in. But it is an okay situation to hang out in until we finish the apprenticeship. It's like saying in the States, we'd say you're in college for three years more, and when you get out of college, well, then you go. Then your income goes up. Now we go into prosperity mode. But right now you're just paying a price to go win with this apprenticeship. But I think I'm gonna look around and go, you know, finish up her diagnosis so that you can figure out what she's struggling with and then what opportunities she's got to create some kind of income that might be better than the state income that's probably not hard

[Rachel Cruze]

for to do than what she's making

[Dave Ramsey]

once she's got some health, her health back. And then anything you're allowed to do while in the apprenticeship as a side hustle, I'd be picking up. And anything I can do to cut my expenses like rent and other things, I'm gonna do that. But if you don't do much, if you don't have much progress, as long as you don't go backwards.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes. The dipping into savings is where I would say make it a goal to don't do that from an income, expenses. And it's just for three years, right? For three years. This is what this has to look like. And then, oh, my gosh, it opens up 30 grand. Changes your life.

[Dave Ramsey]

It sure does. You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car. But it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage to protect your biggest assets. I recommend using Ramsey Trusted Pro. Whether you're looking for car, home, or any other type of insurance, Ramsey Trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would find what you [e-mail] insurance. Nick is with us in New York. Hi, Nick. How are you?

[Caller (male)]

Hi, guys. Thanks in advance for your help.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller (male)]

Okay, so here's my problem. My wife, she's been to a number of different dentists, and it's been an evolving problem. Not evolving. She's been using the same diagnosis for a number of years, but we haven't really known what to do about it. Basically, we've seen a few dentists that have all said the same thing. She needs to have like a total mouth reconstruction. And it's phenomenally expensive. We don't have dental insurance. It's out of pocket. The quotes are from like 70,000 to $150,000 that we would either. I mean, I don't know what to do about it. I don't know. I mean, technically I could take money out of my retirement and pay for. For it. We do have quite a big emergency fund that could probably pay for it, but that leaves us, like, wiped out. Then my sort of preference is to figure out a way to pay it incrementally, like, you know, 20,000 a year or something like that. But I don't know. I just don't know how to go about it or I. I'm not really sure what. You know, my inclination would be to get a bunch of credit cards.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much is in your emergency fund?

[Caller (male)]

Like 80.

[Caller (female)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[Caller (male)]

So I think.

[Rachel Cruze]

How urgent is the surgery?

[Dave Ramsey]

What is the. I mean, that's obviously. I mean, tremendously painful thing.

[Caller (male)]

It's going to be awful.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I mean, currently she's in pain, right?

[Caller (female)]

Well, yeah.

[Caller (male)]

I mean, like, basically her bite has collapsed, so her teeth hit each other and the enamel wears away. So she gets a lot of cavities. Her teeth are all loose from sort of hitting each other incorrectly.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, gosh.

[Caller (male)]

So it's not fun. She can't bear the idea of spending all this money on. That's out of pocket on. I want her to get it done because I want her to be happy and healthy. But I also.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is your household amount of money?

[Caller (male)]

She doesn't work, and I'm a freelancer, and it varies. It varies from about 140 to $200,000 a year. So, I mean, theoretically we could tighten belt and probably pay for it this year, but that would be really.

[Rachel Cruze]

Could you. Could you pay for cash flow some of it and take some out of the emergency fund?

[Caller (male)]

Yeah, yeah. Well, I could pay for the whole thing out of the emergency fund, but then that puts the emergency fund to zero, which I understand is the point of the emergency fund, but.

[Rachel Cruze]

Or cash flow some of it and take it down to 20,000. Right. Cash flow the rest of the surgery.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So I'm. When I run into something like this, the biggest problem is that I feel like I don't know what's going on. And I've got to figure out enough of what's going on to make a wise decision. Okay. So far you've gotten this wide variety of solutions from 70 to 150,000.

[Caller (female)]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so that alone, if I'm in your shoes, that throws up red flags for me. And I says, okay, I've got to understand what the difference in 70 and 150,000 is. Why is that there Is it because the dentist is. You know, one of them is a Bentley salesman and one of them is a Chevrolet salesman. Why is that? Because that's true in dentistry. There's a wide variety of the way people approach things, the techniques that they use, the machinery that they have, the equipment that they have, how much they think of themselves, how much practice management has gone into, jacking you up. And it's all over the place in

[Caller (male)]

the world who their clients are. And who their clients are.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, exactly. So I'm going to. I mean, on something like this, you know, it could be that you. That she goes to Kansas City to get the work done instead of New York.

[Caller (male)]

That's what I was advocating, trying to find a cheaper dentist in a smaller

[Dave Ramsey]

market, cheaper in quality, but it's just someone that has a more common, sensical

[Rachel Cruze]

approach to this clientele than New York City. You know what I mean?

[Dave Ramsey]

Because this is a big enough thing that it's worth a few plane tickets and a few hotel stays if you saved. If you saved a hundred bucks.

[Rachel Cruze]

Have y' all looked at that, Nick, as an option? Did you price out other areas of the country?

[Caller (male)]

I have. I mean, I have. I haven't taken it to, like, going to. Going to Des Moines yet, but. But, like, I have, you know, like, I've looked in a bunch of different places, and one of the cheaper ones we found is in. Is in Florida, near Miami. Okay, that's the $70,000 option.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, then. Then I. I want to know why it's cheaper, and I want to learn enough about this to do this. So, you know, like, one of my buddies about two years ago was diagnosed with cancer. And the good news is he's doing great, but he didn't know anything about cancer. And now he's a God gum cancer expert because he's just studied it because he had to, to stay alive, you know, and to understand the treatment options and the protocols and the prognosis. And when someone says stage two or three, what do they really mean? And we hear all that stuff, but you suddenly matters when it's you, like, you know, the definition of major surgery is surgery on me. You know, that's that. Right? So this is all of a sudden, it matters. So I'm gonna learn a lot more, and I'm gonna do that because I want to gather enough information to make an intelligent decision and also to not get screwed over by an industry that doesn't mind overcharging.

[Caller (male)]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the dental industry has a component to it. Not everyone, but there are members of it that don't mind overcharging, charging.

[Caller (male)]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so I'm going to learn about all of that. And hey, you know what? I'm going to put you on hold. I have been endorsing a dental operation in Dallas, Texas, just outside Dallas, Texas, in Granbury. Granbury dental, for almost 20 years on a local Dallas radio station endorsement. And I know those guys, and I'm going to put you on hold, and we're going to connect you with them and just let them. Let them teach you and let them put in a bid. God help us. If that's what we want to call it. Right.

[Rachel Cruze]

Or at least let them give you advice as like a.

[Dave Ramsey]

I do trust those guys. I've known them a long time, and if I had to do something like that, that'd be. That'd be one of the people I would talk to. Anyway, so. Okay, I just made a national ad out of a local. But anyway, hang on. And we'll get you set up with that. So I want to learn, because I. Until I understand enough of the basic components of this, I am cynical and I worry about getting screwed.

[Caller (male)]

Me, too.

[Dave Ramsey]

Once you get that. Once you get that settled, you write the check out of the emergency fund.

[Rachel Cruze]

Nick. Use the emergency fund and you get

[Dave Ramsey]

your wife's health back.

[Caller (male)]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep. And then you guys build it back

[Dave Ramsey]

up and then just filled it back.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah. Because $80,000 dollars, maybe too much anyways. And you guys can always go to three to four months. Do you know what I mean? It won't take you forever to build it back.

[Dave Ramsey]

And. And. But even if you use 70 of the 80, if that ends up being where you are and you're down to 10 and you rebuild and your wife's got her health back and this whole thing is in the rearview mirror, it's worth it. That's how I would do it.

[Caller (female)]

Okay.

[Caller (male)]

All right, That's.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's very helpful, but I'm not doing it. Except in the context of all the other stuff we said for the last five minutes.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Minutes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

In other words, I know what's going on. And so. Because I don't have any doubt, this lady has issues, okay. Because she's had multiple people look at it. But I have had customers over the years that said, you know, the doctor told me if I didn't have this $20,000 dental surgery, that I wasn't going to have my teeth. And then they go to three other doctors and they go, no, you're fine.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, yeah, totally. And she's obviously gotten multiple opinions over enough course of time.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's first thing is you start to get enough other people looking at it to call BS on the others, you know. And yeah, that's true in anything. Whether you know, if I'm dealing with a legal matter, I'm not going to just accept one lawyer that says you're screwed. I'm like, no, I think I'm not. Yeah, I think you're not my lawyer.

[Rachel Cruze]

But that's a part of, of, of life of big decision making anyways. Multiple options when you're shopping for a house, have multiple ones that you're, that you're looking at car shopping, go drive multiple before you buy. You know what I mean? Like that that's a wisdom play anyways. And especially something this high dollar with health attached to it. Yeah, you definitely want to make sure that someone's not just out pricing you because they're in Manhattan and they can, because if they can, they're doing it, you know. But if you can find something else, well worth it. Well, I hope it goes well.

[Dave Ramsey]

Next one. Airline tickets save you 20 grand.

[Caller (male)]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I hope that, yeah, her health and all of that. I hope it stores up because that has to be not a fun thing to live with on a daily basis.

[Dave Ramsey]

I have the pain tolerance of a nothing. I've been in self care. A little baby girl. Yeah.

[Caller (male)]

Sa.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey guys, Dave Ramsey here. Every day on this show we help people work through real money problems and figure out what to do next. Now you can get that same kind of help anytime with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help. It's fast, simple and free to use. Go to ramseysolutions.com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's ramseysolutions.com. Well, you can't control the market, but you can control how you invest and if you invest with confidence. Two years ago we did for the first time something we've never done. I opened my personal investing playbook and went through some of my real estate purchases. How I decide that I went through how I decide about any investment, the ones I've decided to stay away from and why. And George Campbell and I put that together and did that as a virtual, virtual two night event called Investing Essentials. We've only done it two times. We're going to do it again the third time. September 1st and 2nd. My playbook and George Camel that Simple. And we're going to go into taxes, navigating wills and building a lasting legacy as well. Little basic on the estate planning stuff. Tickets start at $199. Get yours [e-mail] or click the link in the show notes. If you're listening on podcast or YouTube. Kim is in Dallas. Hi Kim, how are you?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Hey Dave, how are you?

[Caller (female)]

I'm good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. What's up?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Quick question.

[Caller (female)]

I'm in a program to purchase a home. It's no down payment, no closing cost, no pmi. The catch is there is a lien on the home for five years and each year you're in the house it goes down. But I'm completely debt free. I have about six, seven months of savings. Did I focus more on building up my retirement or getting a conventional loan or going continue the route that I'm on?

[Dave Ramsey]

Is this a. Some kind of a government first time homebuyer program or what?

[Caller (female)]

No, it's. It's a legitimate program.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I didn't ask that. I said is it a government. Government first time home buyer? It's a private company. It's a private company.

[Caller (female)]

I guess you can call it private.

[Rachel Cruze]

I know it feels.

[Dave Ramsey]

Feels like a government first time homebuyer program.

[Caller (female)]

No, it's. I don't want to say the name, but it's. They help a lot of people get into homes. It's a nationwide program.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah.

[Caller (various female callers)]

And it's. It's.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah, it's an actual program and it's been pretty successful from what I've been seeing.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, well, it doesn't. It feels very risky. It feels risky.

[Dave Ramsey]

Just say the name.

[Caller (female)]

It's naca.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Naca.

[Dave Ramsey]

Naca. Okay. Not familiar with them.

[Caller (female)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right.

[Rachel Cruze]

Liens on homes and. No, nothing down.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nothing down. No pmi. All this scary scares me. Okay. And it scares me because if something happens during the five years, you could really end up seriously trapped here. And the other thing that I don't know, the program, so I don't know details.

[Rachel Cruze]

Neighborhood, I don't know anything. Corporation of America. It's a non profit to help own our.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah. But anything that sounds too good to be true usually is my experience. And this sounds a little wacky. Again,

[Caller (female)]

I really don't agree because I know someone is in one of their homes.

[Dave Ramsey]

So it's highly unusual, wouldn't you say?

[Caller (female)]

Well, to a point. But they used to have the PMI and then they removed PMI and put the lien. Put did the lien requirement and what it is, it's a $25,000 lien and each year you're in it, it reduces by 5,000. So you have to be there at least five years.

[Caller (male)]

Years.

[Dave Ramsey]

What price range?

[Caller (female)]

I'm looking at probably about up to 250 in my area.

[Dave Ramsey]

And they're taking a 2. They're only taking a 10% lien.

[Caller (female)]

Well, that's, that's just me. In other areas you could be a million. It just depends on where you're at.

[Caller (male)]

Mm.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I, I don't, I'm not gonna say anything disparaging about them because I don't know anything about them and I don't, I don't know enough to tell you to do it or to not do it. My tendency in general is to say, I'm going to buy if I don't have any money. I probably shouldn't be buying a home because that's going to put you into a pinch. Because home ownership on a monthly basis is more expensive than renting. Like your air conditioner breaks and you don't have a landlord to fix it. You be the landlord, your roof goes out and you got to put a roof on the thing. You know, the hot water heater blows, the stove goes out. And welcome to owning a house. The more stuff you own, the more repairman you have to know. And so if you're moving to this, you don't have any money. And no, I would not be investing while I'm doing a nothing down home deal. Absolutely not. I'd be stacking cash as high as I could stack.

[Rachel Cruze]

Get a big emergency fund to make

[Dave Ramsey]

sure I had a massive emergency fund. And in general, and again, I don't know enough about this to tell you not to do it. It sounds like you're going to do it no matter what I say. So I don't know exactly why you're calling, but. But the. But in general, I'm going to say get a 15 year fixed rate conventional Fannie Mae loan, put down a down payment 5%, 10% on your first time. You don't have to save up 20% to buy. And if you don't have the money to start working towards that, you probably don't have the money to own a house yet. And it's time to do something with your career.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Right.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's where I would be more nervous. From what I can tell, it sounds like it takes months and months and months of documentation to even apply to be part of it. So I think they do their work on the front end to make sure that whoever's applying. So there's probably a legitimate case for it. Kim. But getting into the home isn't what I'm as worried about for you. It's more maintaining it and not letting your heart home, you know, keep you broke. Like that's what we don't want either. You want your home to be a blessing and not a curse. And so I would just.

[Dave Ramsey]

Habitat for Humanity has a program that's not dissimilar. Yep. Okay. And it's a known. A much more known entity in a way.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yes. And that's kind of what this is.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so this sounds like it's modeled somewhat after that. And Habitat for Humanity puts people into homes that can't otherwise find a way to get into them. And. But they have had a problem. The dirty little secret is. And it's not their fault, but people get into the homes and then still don't go and save money. And they've had a problem with people get into a home, then they go buy a big screen for the wall and then they go buy something else for the house. And they go buy something else for the house. And they've got payments all around them then that they wouldn't have had had they not bought the home.

[Rachel Cruze]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so they've had some issues with people actually losing their Habitat for Humanity home because they didn't have good healthy financial habits when they went in. But Habitat does a good job. They're a good organization. So if it's modeled after that. I was thinking that's what she was gonna say. And then I could have at least more intelligently done so. Because we've done all kinds of stuff with Habitat helping them.

[Rachel Cruze]

Well, and I just wanna. Yeah. And it sounds like too, there's always a. There's a time limit to this. Whenever you get boxed into a time limit, that's like loan forgiveness. Right. If you go work for 10, you know, it's all these. These things that are long term of what you're committing to. You have to keep that in mind. Because I don't know what it looks like if. Kim, you have to sell in three years and get out of the program. What does that mean? You know, So I would know all of that information as well.

[Dave Ramsey]

It sounds like it's pro rata forgiven, you know, 5,000 a year for five years on the 25,000 is what it sounded like. If that's the way it really works, then at least you know what you're up against and you hope the house goes up in value that much Right, Right. And you hope you don't have a bunch of repairs that you can't afford to do.

[Rachel Cruze]

But get that emergency fund, Kim, in place.

[Dave Ramsey]

You got to have the emergency fund in place. And no, you don't need to be thinking about investing until this deal is settled.

[Rachel Cruze]

Get a six month emergency fund, pile,

[Dave Ramsey]

pile, pile money up, and have a nice, fat, juicy pile of money to offset the fact that you've not anticipated what all this entails and what you're getting yourself into. So, yeah, if it was a straight up government. Here's the weird thing, Rachel. Five years like that, if you don't have that lien, that five years goes by so fast. If you do have that lien, 73,000 things happen during that five years.

[Rachel Cruze]

It's just ups. It's like it attracts the stress.

[Dave Ramsey]

It slows down the calendar.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, it goes real fast if it's, it's, if it's free and, and there's no, no constraints and no liens. But, but man, when you're trapped in there, it just doesn't. It doesn't feel that way. Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

I hope it works out for you, Kim, though, because we do. We want everyone to be a homeowner, but again, we want it to be a blessing, not a curse. So having some cash for when things go wrong is going be really important in your situation.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Sa.

[Dave Ramsey]

Dave Ramsey here. For more than 30 years, I've been talking to folks on the air, and I can tell you that most people are broke not because they don't make enough money, but because they don't have a plan. You need to give every dollar you earn a job. Because when you do that, something changes. You stop guessing, you stop worrying, you stop stressing. Everydollar budgeting app will show you how to find extra cash, pay off debt, and finally start winning with money. But most people won't do it. They'll keep living paycheck to paycheck, keep hoping things will change without making a change. It's time to say enough is enough. It's time to take control of your money. It's time to start your every dollar budget for free today. Go download it in the App Store or Google Play. Play. Our scripture of the day, Philippians 3:17. Joining join together in following my example, brothers and sisters. And just as you have us as a model, keep your eyes open on those who live as we do. Margaret Thatcher said, don't follow the crowd. Let the crowd follow you. Karen is in Cleveland, Ohio. Hi, Karen. How are you?

[Caller (female)]

Good. How are you? Doing. Thanks for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller (female)]

I recently found. I'm 65 years old, and I recently found out that my husband lost all of our retirement and all of our money. And I ultimately ended up getting a dissolution. And he. Because he gave me the house. House. I have no debt, basically, but I have a $300,000 house. I had to get a job and have a little bit of alimony, a little bit of Social Security. I have about $70,000 from money that my mom left me. And I'm just wondering how to move forward. Do I sell the house and invest the money?

[Caller (various female callers)]

Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, Karen, I'm so sorry.

[Dave Ramsey]

You said you're how old?

[Caller (female)]

65.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long were you married?

[Caller (female)]

15 years. He's 59.

[Dave Ramsey]

What did he do with the money?

[Caller (female)]

He retired at 54 and took a lump sum. And then because he dabbled in the market, he decided to do that full time. And I managed the daily budget and he managed the retirement money. And what I did not know is that he moved his retirement money into his trading account. And last year he went all in on something and.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, my God.

[Caller (female)]

Lost about 500,000.

[Caller (male)]

Whoa.

[Caller (female)]

And so he left. And then he came back, and when I found out we were lost the rest of it, I told him to get a job and he left again.

[Rachel Cruze]

Oh, Karen.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what do you make it, your career,

[Caller (female)]

Tyler?

[Caller (male)]

A while back.

[Caller (female)]

Many years ago. So I've got. Because I'm 65, I don't want to start a career again. So I'm a receptionist, and I'm bringing in about 25. Well, about 1600. I mean. Yeah, 1600amonth.

[Dave Ramsey]

Other than your broken heart, how's your health?

[Caller (female)]

It's okay so far. I mean, I. My plan is to maybe work for another 10 years. I'll have to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruze]

Is the house paid for, Karen?

[Caller (female)]

It is.

[Caller (various female callers)]

Okay.

[Caller (female)]

He had me take my Social Security early, so I don't get as much there, and my 401k is gone.

[Dave Ramsey]

So that was part of what he lost?

[Caller (female)]

Well, we lived off of it for a while while he was investing, because I was older and I was 59 and a half.

[Rachel Cruze]

So you could take it without penalty? Yeah.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you got 70 grand and 300 grand and a $25,000 a year job.

[Caller (female)]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I. How we got here doesn't change the answer, although. It just. It adds to the emotion of everything. For sure. But I'm still going to say I'm going to set 20,000 of the 70 aside as your emergency fund. I'm going to sit down with a smartvestor pro and invest the 50 and do you sell the 300?

[Rachel Cruze]

I wonder what one.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's the history on the house?

[Caller (female)]

The history?

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, do you. How long you owned it or.

[Caller (female)]

Yeah, We've owned it 14 years. It's in pretty good shape. Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. I mean, if you, if you, if we're only doing math and all we're trying to do is just maximize everything, regardless of the emotion or regardless of just quality of life. You know, you go buy $150,000 condo and you take another 150 of that house and you put it in good mutual funds. Now you got 220 at 65. Now at 70, that 220 will be a half million if you don't add anything to it. So, yeah, I'm probably doing that.

[Rachel Cruze]

Go get a condo or something.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then the second thing I'm gonna do is I'm gonna reset your narrative in your head of I'm 65. I don't have time for another career. Yeah, you do. You got plenty of time in the world we live in today. Things spin up so fast and make so much money so quickly. I would not take somebody as bright as I'm talking to and make them only a receptionist because I'm 65 for the next 10 years and I make nothing. Instead, I'd try to figure out a way to go make some money. And I think, I think you got shops, girl. I think there's some stuff you can do. What was your former career?

[Caller (female)]

I was a medical lab technician making about 50,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Caller (female)]

Which is pretty intense of a job and hard to start up over. And. Yeah, okay, he. He's supposed to be giving me a thousand dollars alimony, but that's not going

[Dave Ramsey]

to change your life.

[Caller (female)]

I. Well, I don't know if it's going to be.

[Dave Ramsey]

Besides that, he's not dependent either. Yeah, he's not dependable. He's not. You can't. Can't project where you're going to end up with that.

[Caller (male)]

So.

[Caller (female)]

So if I rent, I mean, the al.

[Rachel Cruze]

I'd go buy something.

[Dave Ramsey]

150 to 200 cash for 150, 000

[Caller (female)]

and the condo fees.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but, you know, but you got 150,000 freed up when you do that

[Rachel Cruze]

and invest, it'll be good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Add to the 50, that's, you know, then you got 200 and that'll be. That will grow to a half million dollars by the time you're 75. And. Sorry, by the time you're 72. 72. So. And you'll be adding to it during that time. And so you could retire in a very good shape, you know, in your early 70s. But the very variable is if we could triple your income. And that changes. That changes the math on this, speeds it up dramatically and increases the probability of a good outcome. And the bad news is you're by yourself. The great news is you're by yourself. You don't have to convince anybody to do this, but you and all the baggage is in the rearview mirror. That's why they call them an ex. Wow. I'm so sorry.

[Rachel Cruze]

I know. Karen. That's horrible.

[Dave Ramsey]

Horrible thing to go through. So, yeah, gang, we talk about this all the time. Combining your finances and having full transparency and full decision making as a paired thing. Both of us know everything that's going on. Both of us know. And so that gives us checks and balances when we do that.

[Rachel Cruze]

And I can here in my other year, people are like, this is why you don't combine. You know, yada, yada, yada. But here's the deal.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly why you do combine. Because you. You got. You're looking over his shoulder, and the first time he day trades, you shut the whole thing down.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yeah, well, if you're invol. If you're looking at the details of what you're saying. But he took her. They had money combined, and he took her 401k.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but they weren't combined in their operating of their household.

[Rachel Cruze]

Okay, 100%. That's what I'm saying is I can hear someone say, oh, my gosh, that scares me. I want to keep my stuff over here to protect it, to make sure that he doesn't touch it. But what I'm saying is you shouldn't

[Dave Ramsey]

have to then you shouldn't marry him.

[Rachel Cruze]

That's it. That too, yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you can't sit down together and both of you talk about everything going on with your money, you shouldn't get married in the first place. Not talking about her. I'm just talking about.

[Rachel Cruze]

In general terms. Yes. And it's easy in a marriage just to let one person.

[Caller (female)]

Person.

[Rachel Cruze]

You do this, I do this. And it's kind of. That's kind of what she said. I did the monthly budget, he did the investing. And you both have to be doing both as well.

[Dave Ramsey]

George just did fresh research, and it was amazing. It used to be a lower number, but he found that if a person day trades for consecutively for 24 months, 97% lose money. I believe.

[Rachel Cruze]

Believe it.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's all of you. That's stupid.

[Rachel Cruze]

And all eggs in one basket. He put everything in one thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

I drive down that road, a kid throws a rock at my car. You know, I'm not driving down that road anymore. I mean, 97%. That's not even a statistic. That's just a fact now, so just day trading is stupid is what that means. And so soon as somebody says that all. All of your bells, whistles, and alarms need to be going off and going, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. With a capital H. No, we're not doing this. No. Wow.

[Caller (female)]

I'm sorry.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, Karen. I'm sorry you went through this. I'm not. We're not preaching at you.

[Rachel Cruze]

No. That. Just to be aware.

[Dave Ramsey]

These are the reasons situations like yours are why we get so hyped up against some of the things that happen. Happened to you.

[Rachel Cruze]

Yep.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what it amounts to. Wow.

[Rachel Cruze]

Karen, call us back if you need us, though we really are.

[Dave Ramsey]

We're cheering you on any way we can.

[Caller (various male callers)]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Absolutely. That puts us out of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

[Caller (male)]

It.