Stop Letting Excuses Steal Your Wealth

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show – "Stop Letting Excuses Steal Your Wealth"

Episode Overview

In the March 3, 2025, episode of The Ramsey Show titled "Stop Letting Excuses Steal Your Wealth," host Dave Ramsey, alongside co-hosts Dr. John Deloney and Jade Warshaw, delves into various financial challenges faced by listeners. The episode focuses on overcoming common financial obstacles, providing actionable advice to help individuals and couples regain control of their finances. Throughout the show, listeners call in with personal financial dilemmas, seeking guidance on debt management, budgeting, investing, and maintaining healthy financial relationships.

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Table of Contents

1. Introduction
2. Caller 1: Kayla from Jackson, Michigan
3. Caller 2: Caleb from Salem, Oregon
4. Caller 3: Laura from Los Angeles, California
5. Caller 4: Paul from Palm Springs, California
6. Caller 5: Sarah from Miami, Florida
7. Caller 6: Steve from Lafayette, Indiana
8. Caller 7: Shelby from Idaho
9. Concluding Remarks

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<a name="introduction"></a>

Introduction

The episode kicks off with Dave Ramsey promoting the upcoming Money and Relationships tour featuring Dr. John Deloney. He emphasizes the show's mission to help listeners build wealth and take control of their finances, regardless of past money mistakes. The co-hosts engage in light-hearted banter, setting an approachable tone for the financial discussions ahead.

Dave Ramsey [00:27]: "This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to get coached up on their life. Specifically their money life, their professional life, and their relational life."

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<a name="caller-1-kayla-jackson-mi"></a>

Caller 1: Kayla from Jackson, Michigan

Caller Profile: Kayla and her fiancé are grappling with a combined debt of approximately $56,000, including student loans and vehicle debts. With their wedding scheduled for March 29th, Kayla contemplates using retirement funds to eliminate their debt.

Key Points Discussed:

• Avoid Using Retirement Funds: Dr. Deloney strongly advises against tapping into retirement savings due to penalties and taxes.
• Focus on Debt Repayment: Emphasizes the importance of managing individual debts before merging finances post-marriage.
• Strategic Asset Liquidation: Suggests selling the truck to alleviate high monthly payments, freeing up $300 for debt repayment.
• Education vs. Debt: Recommends prioritizing debt reduction over immediate educational pursuits to maintain financial stability.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney [02:17]: "I would not use the retirement to pay this off. The retirement is there as retirement."
• Dave Ramsey [05:38]: "Starting off this marriage debt-free or with very little debt is going to be so much more relaxing."

Advice Given: Kayla and her fiancé should avoid using retirement funds to pay off debt. Instead, they should:

1. Sell the Truck: Even if slightly upside down, it reduces their monthly obligations.
2. Allocate Savings: Utilize the $12,000 savings to pay off the car, freeing up monthly $135.
3. Debt Snowball: Apply the freed funds towards student loans, accelerating debt elimination within a year.
4. Maintain an Emergency Fund: Keep at least $1,000 aside to handle unforeseen expenses.

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<a name="caller-2-caleb-salem-or"></a>

Caller 2: Caleb from Salem, Oregon

Caller Profile: Caleb and his wife, both 26, have two children and are on Baby Steps 4, 5, and 6. Caleb was recently diagnosed with leukemia and underwent treatment, with his sister acting as a bone marrow donor, saving his life. His estranged sister is now incurring significant debt through real estate flipping and Airbnb rentals, repeatedly seeking financial assistance from Caleb and their family.

Key Points Discussed:

• Debt Management: Balancing aggressive debt repayment with maintaining a reasonable lifestyle.
• Emotional Boundaries: Handling familial obligations without compromising financial goals.
• Financial Responsibility Post-Crisis: Ensuring long-term financial stability after medical emergencies.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Ramsey [13:28]: "Baby Steps… paying off the house… intentionality."
• Dr. John Deloney [09:06]: "She needs to live reasonably… make marriage a whole lot easier."

Advice Given:

1. Set Firm Boundaries: Clearly communicate the inability to continue providing financial support to the estranged sister.
2. Protect Financial Peace: Focus on debt repayment and building a secure financial foundation for the family without external financial pressures.
3. Prioritize Family Stability: Avoid adding financial complications during a sensitive post-medical treatment period.

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<a name="caller-3-laura-los-angeles-ca"></a>

Caller 3: Laura from Los Angeles, California

Caller Profile: Laura and her husband face a combined personal and business debt of $150,000, primarily from credit cards and personal loans. Additionally, they have a $280,000 mortgage, car payments totaling $700 monthly, and private school expenses for their four-year-old son amounting to $850 monthly.

Key Points Discussed:

• Credit Card Debt: Managing high-interest credit card debt through strategic repayments.
• Asset Liquidation: Advises on ending unnecessary leases to free up monthly cash flow.
• Budget Reallocation: Redirecting freed funds towards debt repayment to eliminate the debt within a manageable timeframe.
• Long-term Financial Planning: Emphasizes the importance of clearing debt to enjoy future financial endeavors, such as education.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney [23:32]: "You have a good income. It's not wonderful for LA, but it's wonderful for the rest of the country."
• Dave Ramsey [30:04]: "You can appreciate the call. You can do it."

Advice Given:

1. Terminate the Lease: End the current car lease to eliminate the $400 monthly payment.
2. Sell the Truck: Assess the value and proceed with selling the $19,000 truck to reduce debt.
3. Debt Avalanche: Allocate the additional $1,100 monthly (from terminating the lease and selling the truck) towards paying off credit card debt at an accelerated rate.
4. Maintain Emergency Funds: Ensure a $1,000 emergency fund is preserved to handle unexpected expenses without accruing new debt.

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<a name="caller-4-paul-palm-springs-ca"></a>

Caller 4: Paul from Palm Springs, California

Caller Profile: Paul, a 22-year-old recent husband, is a college dropout working in the logistics sector. His 22-year-old wife aspires to be a stay-at-home mom. Paul seeks guidance on establishing a stable career to support his family's financial needs.

Key Points Discussed:

• Career Development: Encourages proactive steps to advance in the logistics industry.
• Financial Communication: Highlights the importance of open discussions about financial goals and responsibilities within marriage.
• Resource Utilization: Recommends leveraging books like The Total Money Makeover and services like Financial Peace University for financial education.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Ramsey [36:09]: "Find out who's the logistics veterans in the company portal. Reach out and seek mentorship."
• Dr. John Deloney [41:25]: "You've got time. You have a great joint income."

Advice Given:

1. Seek Mentorship: Connect with experienced professionals within his current company to gain insights and guidance in the logistics field.
2. Invest in Education: Utilize resources like Total Money Makeover and Financial Peace University to build a strong financial foundation.
3. Set Financial Goals Together: Collaborate with his wife to define mutual financial objectives, ensuring both partners are aligned in their financial journey.
4. Leverage Existing Assets: Utilize the $250,000 in savings to invest wisely, ensuring higher returns compared to low-interest debts.

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<a name="caller-5-sarah-miami-fl"></a>

Caller 5: Sarah from Miami, Florida

Caller Profile: Sarah's parents hold a flexible premium adjustable universal life insurance policy, which has severely depleted its cash value to $1,000 after 39 years of payments totaling $48,000. Sarah is seeking advice on whether to continue paying the policy or terminate it.

Key Points Discussed:

• Policy Sustainability: Evaluates the viability of continuing an unprofitable life insurance policy.
• Alternative Insurance Options: Recommends term life insurance as a more cost-effective solution.
• Financial Asset Management: Suggests reallocating existing funds into higher-yield investments to secure financial stability.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. John Deloney [54:17]: "It's a horrible product. You end up with nothing."
• Dave Ramsey [59:20]: "They have millions of people stuck in these fees with nothing to show for it."

Advice Given:

1. Terminate the Policy: Advise Sarah to convince her parents to surrender the universal life policy to stop further depletion of cash value.
2. Shift to Term Insurance: Recommend switching to term life insurance, which provides adequate coverage at a fraction of the cost.
3. Invest Liquid Assets: Utilize the $250,000 in cash by investing in diversified assets to achieve better returns, ensuring funds are available for emergencies like assisted living.
4. Regular Financial Reviews: Encourage ongoing assessment of financial products to avoid long-term traps like unproductive life insurance policies.

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<a name="caller-6-steve-lafayette-in"></a>

Caller 6: Steve from Lafayette, Indiana

Caller Profile: Steve and his wife have a $175,000 mortgage at a 2.79% interest rate. They also have $420,000 in a 401(k) and $400,000 in money market CDs earning 4.5%. Steve is contemplating whether to pay off the mortgage or keep the funds invested to earn higher returns.

Key Points Discussed:

• Interest Rate Comparison: Analyzes the cost of the low-interest mortgage versus potential investment returns.
• Investment Growth: Emphasizes the benefits of investing freed-up funds at higher yields after paying off the mortgage.
• Financial Discipline: Highlights the importance of continuous investment and avoiding frequent fund adjustments that can hinder growth.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Ramsey [75:02]: "Paying off a low-interest mortgage frees up cash flow that can be invested for higher returns."
• Dr. John Deloney [76:28]: "It's like ripping off the band-aid; you eliminate the debt and redirect funds towards growth."

Advice Given:

1. Eliminate the Mortgage: Recommend using the $175,000 from the money market CDs to pay off the mortgage, eliminating the 2.79% interest expense.
2. Invest Freed Funds: Redirect the $1,700 monthly mortgage payment (mostly interest) into investment vehicles like index funds to capitalize on higher returns.
3. Avoid Frequent Transfers: Advise against moving funds between accounts to prevent lost potential gains and added complexity.
4. Financial Planning: Encourage setting clear financial goals post-mortgage payoff to maximize investment growth and financial stability.

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<a name="caller-7-shelby-idaho"></a>

Caller 7: Shelby from Idaho

Caller Profile: Shelby and her husband, married for 15 years with two children, are navigating financial challenges after her husband was diagnosed with leukemia. Shelby's estranged sister has accumulated significant debt through real estate endeavors and is persistently seeking financial help from Shelby and her family.

Key Points Discussed:

• Emotional Boundaries: Balancing familial obligations with financial well-being.
• Debt Relief Strategies: Managing debts accumulated through external family influences.
• Financial Independence: Maintaining autonomy in financial decisions despite external pressures.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Ramsey [82:23]: "Guilt should never be a reason that we give."
• Dr. John Deloney [82:25]: "Set boundaries… decide how much you're willing to help and stick to it."

Advice Given:

1. Establish Firm Boundaries: Clearly communicate the limits of financial assistance to the estranged sister to prevent ongoing debt accumulation.
2. Provide Cheerful Support: Offer financial help willingly within the set boundaries, avoiding obligations born out of guilt.
3. Prioritize Family's Financial Health: Focus on stabilizing their own finances and avoiding further debt through external familial pressures.
4. Seek Professional Guidance: Consider consulting a financial advisor or therapist to navigate the emotional and financial complexities of familial financial obligations.

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<a name="concluding-remarks"></a>

Concluding Remarks

Throughout the episode, Dave Ramsey and his co-hosts reinforce the importance of disciplined budgeting, strategic debt repayment, and informed investing. They consistently advocate for avoiding high-interest debts, liquidating unproductive assets, and maintaining clear financial boundaries within personal relationships. The episode emphasizes that overcoming financial excuses involves proactive planning, emotional resilience, and unwavering commitment to one's financial goals.

Final Takeaway: Excuses can significantly hinder wealth-building efforts. By addressing debt systematically, making informed financial decisions, and maintaining healthy financial relationships, individuals and families can effectively reclaim their financial independence and achieve lasting prosperity.

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Notable Quotes from the Episode:

1. Dave Ramsey [00:27]: "This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to get coached up on their life."
2. Dr. John Deloney [02:17]: "I would not use the retirement to pay this off. The retirement is there as retirement."
3. Dave Ramsey [05:38]: "Starting off this marriage debt-free or with very little debt is going to be so much more relaxing."
4. Dr. John Deloney [54:17]: "It's a horrible product. You end up with nothing."
5. Dave Ramsey [82:23]: "Guilt should never be a reason that we give."
6. Dave Ramsey [75:02]: "Paying off a low-interest mortgage frees up cash flow that can be invested for higher returns."

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Resources Mentioned:

• Financial Peace University: A comprehensive financial education program designed by Dave Ramsey.
• Total Money Makeover: Dave Ramsey's bestselling book focused on debt reduction and financial freedom.
• Churchill Mortgage: Recommended for those transitioning from renting to homeownership.
• Investing Essentials Virtual Event: A two-night event offering in-depth investment strategies and real estate insights.
• HealthTrustFinancial.com: Recommended for unbiased health insurance advice.
• Build a Business You Love: Dave Ramsey's book offering strategies for entrepreneurs to grow their businesses effectively.
• JoinDeleteMe.com/Ramsey: Service to remove personal information from data broker websites.

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Conclusion

"Stop Letting Excuses Steal Your Wealth" serves as a comprehensive guide for listeners facing diverse financial challenges. Through real-life scenarios and expert advice, Dave Ramsey and his co-hosts equip their audience with the tools and mindset necessary to overcome financial setbacks and build a foundation for long-term financial success.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey, guys, Dave Ramsey here. Me and Dr. John Deloney are coming to a city near you on the Money and Relationships tour. It's happening soon, so don't wait.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Get your [e-mail] tour.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to get coached up on their life. Specifically their money life, their professional life, and their relational life. Triple 882-55-5225 is the phone number to jump in America. It's your show. Triple 882-55-5225, alongside the fabulously fly I feel like today Jade War. I gotta say, I think you got a 90s vibe. And I don't have a problem with it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm in it. I'm all the way in it. Number 23.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I. I'm not ashamed of my age. I gr2 from high school. We've got a big group of fantastic looking young scholars, high schoolers from a local school here today looking at us and they're all like, yeah, he's pretty much my dad's age and I am. So.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Can we clear the. We're not the same age, though, Ken.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you're younger than me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Just put.

[Dave Ramsey]

Look at you, all ashamed. Are you shaming me?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm not trying to be where you're at yet. I.

[Dave Ramsey]

No. Well, you look great, though. You're pulling off the 90s vibe. Making me look cooler than I'll ever look just to be next to you. Fabulous. She'll help you out with how to save the money, how to budget the money. I'm going to help you out with how to make more money. That's our combo today. You ready to go?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Let's do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. Kayla's up first in Jackson, Michigan. Kayla, how can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. Thank you for having me.

[Dave Ramsey]

You bet. What's going on?

[Jade Warshaw]

So my fiance and I combined are about 56,000 in debt, and I'm wondering if we should use his retirement. Not exactly sure how much is in it, but it's somewhere around 50,000 to pay that off.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, man. So these are retirement funds. It's not just money that's invested in a brokerage, correct?

[Jade Warshaw]

I believe so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, When's the big day?

[Jade Warshaw]

March 29th.

[Dave Ramsey]

So right around the corner?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Okay, so split up the debt for us. Who's whose is whose.

[Jade Warshaw]

So we both have 16 and some change in student loans. I have 3500 on a car and he has close to 20 on his truck, which we're probably planning on selling.

[Dave Ramsey]

There we go.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

The biggest one that's a good move.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All right. Like, I love the fact that you guys are looking at this debt and you see that it's an issue. I think that's a green light. That's a plus. I would not use the retirement to pay this off. The retirement is there as retirement. If you pull it out now, you'll be penalized for it. You'll pay taxes on it and you'll have to pay a fee because you're pulling it out before 59 and a half. So for that reason, I would not do that. I, at this point, even though the wedding is just around the corner, I would focus on you two paying down your individual debts with your individual income. And then when you do get married, you can come together and tackle this right now. Yeah. If I'm your, your fiance, I would look into selling that truck. Do you know the numbers around it? Do you know what? He could sell it for a private sale.

[Jade Warshaw]

We were looking into it and I think he'd probably be just a little bit upside down on it. Maybe like a thousand or two thousand, something like that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. And if I were him, if I could save up that one or 2,000 really quick, plus another two or three just to get a junker, I would. Do either of you have money saved? That's not retirement. Even if it's just a couple of thousand or a couple hundred?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, but I'm going back to school soon, so we're trying to pay for that without taking out more debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

What are you going, what are you going back to school for?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, well, I'm not in yet, but I have an interview interview for X ray and sonography soon, so hopefully one of those too.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nice. What's that going to cost you?

[Jade Warshaw]

Total program somewhere on 20,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what are you doing for a living right now?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm painting. I just have done it throughout college. So just doing that and then.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, like abstract art or painting people's houses.

[Jade Warshaw]

Like commercial painting.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, the reason I'm asking this question is I'm going to challenge you that starting off this marriage debt free or with very little debt is going to be so much more relaxing. You know, it's funny, you posted an Instagram reel today of you and I together on this show. And it was. And I was talking about the young man. I was telling him, you need to learn how to get out. Get out of your parents house and learn how to live on your own. Because when you get married, what's going to happen is you have these two individuals that have grown up in two different households. And there's a lot of culture shock.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And. And I'm just going to bring that back up because it's fresh.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm going to get. I want to get Kate Jade back here. Involved, Caleb. But I. I'd like to see you use that money to knock the debt off and let's hold off on paying your way through the school. I just think life. Do you agree with me?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I couldn't agree more.

[Dave Ramsey]

Take. Take the reins from me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I couldn't agree more. And you're. Instead of surrounding yourself with financial problems. I'll put that in quotes. Because going to school is a good thing, but the 20,000 that it will cost is a problem right now. Instead of surrounding yourself with more problems, it's really focusing on one thing at a time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And saying, okay, out of the two issues, paying for school and the current debt, what's the biggest, most burning priority? And the truth is, it's the current debt that you have is the biggest priority because. How old are you?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm about to turn 24 and he's 23. Which is why I thought about the retirement. We're still so young.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't want to do that. You're robbing yourself. You're just going backwards.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. You've got time. And if that. That's the one thing I want you and you to take away from what Ken and I are telling you. You have time. You. Yes, the debt is something that needs to take care of, to be taken care of, but it's not to the point of doing something extreme and making a further mistake like taking out your retirement. And that's the thing, Ken, I think that people have to be careful of. And Dave would say it like this. You know, when you get desperate, you know, you start getting stupid. Right. And so you've got to be careful. Right now you feel desperate, you're like, oh, my gosh, look at all this debt. Don't turn around and do something stupid. Trying to solve for the desperate.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, can we ask you, Kayla, how much cash you have set aside for school?

[Jade Warshaw]

Together? Right now we have 12.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so doing the numbers here, you said you guys have collectively 54,000. I'm gonna keep it because you're gonna be married by the time you split this out and try to take it on your own. You're basically gonna be married. So let's say you got 54,000. 20 of it is your. Your fiance's truck that dinks it down to 34. If you put 12 on it, that takes you down to 22. Boy, that's really doable.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I mean, I'm looking at this. Yeah, Ken is right. The truck gets out of the way. Your husband does that. He starts working on that today, right? Why not? You can take the 12,000 you pay off your car. How much is your car payment?

[Jade Warshaw]

Mine is like 135.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, now you've got another 135 back in your, you know, month to month.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's his truck payment?

[Jade Warshaw]

300.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, look at that.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's a big, big.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, you're creeping up on 500 extra dollars every month. Then you take the rest, the other 8,000 that's left, you put it on your student loan. And that's how this works. And before you know it, you're going to be out of debt. This $56,000 debt problem is going to be gone, I predict in one year, oh, 100%. And then come this time next year, you're going to be paying for school and you're going to be so much more peaceful. Imagine studying without debt, Kayla. Imagine taking your exams without thinking about making your car payments. Right? That's what I'm talking about. So I want you to get there, make sure no matter what you do, you keep $1,000 set aside as your baby step one, baby emergency funds. You need that there in case something happens, but everything else needs to go to the debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I agree it's not what you expected, but I think it's the best plan, especially being a young married couple. I mean, it's just going to make marriage a whole lot easier as you experience that first year of just learning how to live with somebody else. And it's a lot harder than anybody tells you, by the way. So don't add money complications to it. Great. First call, Kayla. All right, quick break. Jade's gonna tell me more about 90s fashion and then we'll be back. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Dr. John Deloney]

There's a time in your life and did the baby steps for renting. But you don't wanna do it forever because when you rent, you're still paying for a mortgage, just somebody else's. Plus, rent means instability in your budget because it always goes up, never down. So when you're ready to buy, make sure you work with a mortgage partner. You can rely on Churchill Mortgage. Churchill is Ramsey, trusted to help you make the move from renting to home ownership. Wisely. Churchill understands that when you buy a home the Ramsey way, your mortgage payment will be a consistent, manageable part of your monthly budget. Plus, when your home is paid off, that was your largest expense. Now it's extra money in your pocket and an asset towards turning you into a baby steps millionaire. So get started on the American dream of homeownership [e-mail] that's churchillmortgage.com this is.

[Dave Ramsey]

A paid advertisement in MLS ID 1591 in mlsconsumeraccess.org Equal Housing Lender, 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100, Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Welcome back, America. You're joining the conversation about your life here on the Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman alongside Jade Warshaw. So happy you're with us. Triple 882-55-5225. Investing can be overwhelming and certainly confusing. And it's not something that a TikTok or a Instagram reel is going to give you some depth on. So if you're feeling that, we want you to know about our Investing Essentials virtual event. It's happening tomorrow. Dave Ramsey and George Camel together we'll be doing the event here from our headquarters night one tomorrow, March 4th. It's a two night event. So tomorrow and Wednesday you're gonna get two hours of teaching about maximizing your 401k and picking mutual funds. Also, you're gonna get Dave's personal playbook on real estate investing and he'll tell you how he's made hundreds of millions of dollars in property investments. Tickets are $199. Get yours right now. Ramseysolutions.com events ramseysolutions.com events or click on the link in the show notes if you're tuning in on podcast or YouTube. So this is a great event tonight. Event starting tomorrow and you're going to learn a lot. And I'm going to tell you something, if you're out there and you're going, I need more money in my life.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Come on, Ken.

[Dave Ramsey]

Then this event is for you trying.

[Dr. John Deloney]

To get that money. And that's what I'm talking about.

[Dave Ramsey]

More money. And I want a bag of money, you know, so that's the event you don't want to miss.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That money in is money for anybody who is not in the know.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know this. I'm hip, I know these things. I just use words like that. I forget that people aren't as up with it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We got to keep up with you, Ken.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know. I'm trying to stand on business as you told me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Am I?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Are you trying to stand on business?

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm not sure, if I know how to use that one. I'm still working.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You hold that thought.

[Dave Ramsey]

You what? Where's she going? Oh, no. James, I'm not sure what's happening right. Shut up. Are you for real right now? You just pull out a hack that says standing on business?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I got that just for you, Ken.

[Dave Ramsey]

You stash these?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I knew the time would come when you would be ready to say, listen.

[Dave Ramsey]

This was not planned.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I knew the time would come. And. And now see what kind of lit.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm telling you, I'm rocking that lid.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And now, whenever you're ready to go on one of your rants, I want you to put that hat on.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, well, I'm gonna keep it on the entire segment. It's not. I'm not a fan of black and red, but listen, I'm gonna go with it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I like it.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, very good. Let's see how I do with this. James, this is all very exciting. I love so much of this. Let's go to Caleb in Salem, Oregon. Caleb, how can we help?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Hi there.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thanks for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

You bet. What's going on?

[Jade Warshaw]

So my wife and I are 26. We have two kids. Two. And under. My instinct is to have no life and pay off our house as fast as possible. And she wants to live reasonably. And so I was wondering how you balance the gazelle intensity as you step into 4, 5, 6.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, I'll tell you what. I think the best thing to do here, Jade, is to go right to Caleb's wife and what she thinks is reasonable. In other words, she wants to live some life. You don't want to have a life. So what is her definition of have a. Have a life? What does that include from a budget standpoint? And. And where does that challenge you? Let's. Let's get real about this.

[Jade Warshaw]

Sure. I guess. She's working part or full time now as a paramedic, making about 90. And I'm. I'm salary and supply chain at about 60.

[Dave Ramsey]

Great. 150. Joint income. That's good.

[Jade Warshaw]

We're pretty comfortable. But I've considered moving to a different job that might pay more, but it would not allow me to be at home as much.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much more?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, probably 80.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And then how much less would you be home?

[Jade Warshaw]

So right now I work hybrid. I'm home, working from home two, two to three days a week. But my work lets me pick my hours, and I can be flexible around my wife's schedule. It would cause us to have to do childcare, which we don't and just make things more complicated.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the only debt you have is the home, Correct. Oh, bro, this is easy for me. I mean, I. You got to find a way to, to make some more money somewhere else. Because if it throws the, the family dynamic off as much as it sounds like, and they incur more expenses for.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Child care, you could easily end up spending that 20,000 a year taking, taking care of these kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So I, I would be patient and this is happy wife, happy life. But this is also, to Jade's point, she got to it faster than I did. But this is a net net. It's not like a whole bunch of, of win for you, a financial windfall. So I would just be patient. Man. You got a good joint income. How soon will you pay the house off? If you just stay at the current.

[Jade Warshaw]

Rate we're projecting around six years. I wasn't sure if that was.

[Dave Ramsey]

Bro, that's phenomenal.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's amazing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How long were you in? How long were you in baby step two? I'm just curious, how long did it take you to pay off whatever consumer debt you had?

[Jade Warshaw]

We've never had debt. We've been married. We both cash flowed our two year degrees. Her from the fire department and me through a charter school in high school. So we've been debt free and my work paid for us to go through fpu. And so we've just been.

[Dr. John Deloney]

What do you owe on your house?

[Jade Warshaw]

About 280.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You know, it does bring up an interesting conversation. So obviously the way we teach the baby steps is baby steps. One, two, three. Those are. You move intensely, right? That's gazelle intense. You're going fast, you're sacrificing, you're doing whatever it takes to get this debt paid off. But then when you move into baby steps, 4, 5 and 6 particular when, particularly when it's time to pay the house off, that's the time where we say, hey, you don't have to be intense anymore. It's really about being intentional. And you're moving methodically with intent toward paying off the house. Right. It's not you sacrificing everything. Right. But in cases where, where I kind of am willing to play the game a little bit is in cases like yours where it's like, listen, we never had debt. We never went through a season where we were really sacrificing to win. We never needed to. And I say kudos to you for that. But in those situations, that's the time where I'm like, listen, if you Want to get a little bit more intense to do it. I'm not mad at it. I don't think the means that you stated earlier was the way to do that. But it would have been one thing to me if your wife was like, listen, man, we just spent three years, you know, in the trenches. I want to take a break. But in this case, you really didn't. And if you wanted to get more intense along with your intentionality, I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing when you haven't gone through that baby step two situation.

[Dave Ramsey]

I agree. But not at this particular.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Not in this way, because now you're.

[Dave Ramsey]

Increasing your expenses to take this opportunity. And when you. And just, by the way, challenge us on the numbers off this call. Right. So take the $20,000 gross that you're going to make. So we know you're going to take taxes on that. So run your taxes on that. You have a pretty good idea what that is. Okay. And then you look at the increase in child care and you start playing that out. And. And so that's how you just walk through these decisions. If you had said to us, caleb, I'm going to make an additional 20k, keep the same schedule, get to work at home, then I think it's a very different conversation. But, man, you're in good shape. And listen to your wife on this one.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you don't listen to us, listen to her.

[Jade Warshaw]

Perfect.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You the man. I appreciate that. You know. Fascinating. I love to hear a young man who's going, I really want to pay this off. And he's. And he's. He's like, hold me back, Jade. Right? Hold me back. Like, am I doing. And. And boy, as opposed to the opposite effect, you know, where people just like, oh, they're not even thinking about it at all. They aren't willing to sacrif advice. Really interesting way of coming at this.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It is, it is. And I think it's worth that conversation because. Yeah. When Sam and I, after we spent seven and a half years paying off our debt, I was. I. We're weary right? At that point, like the last.

[Dave Ramsey]

More intensity, you'd have been like, hey.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Man, I listen, I tried to do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

You tried.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I've tried a couple of times to go really hard on something. And Sam's like, I need you to calm down.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's.

[Dr. John Deloney]

He's out there.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's like, yeah, I see him. I see him, too.

[Dr. John Deloney]

He's like, I need you to calm down, Jade. And it's true. Even if you've done a thing, an intense two year battle. Right. And I think that's the way the. That's why the baby steps are the way they are. Because we need a break. We need a breather to live and enjoy life. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I can't believe you just pulled the standing on business hat out of the. For those of you that are watching on YouTube, you have to check it out. You made these hats.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

All for that moment.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

How funny is that?

[Dr. John Deloney]

This originated with Sam Warshaw. He was like, we need to get Sam a standing on business hat. We need to get.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, there's two of them. So I think he and I will sign them to each other and they'll just be bros. That's right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

But you got to pull that out when it's time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Sam, you and I a stick with these hats. We'll smoke a stick soon on that. All right, quick break. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored by Better Help. All right, so I was born and raised in Texas and I love the myth of the lone cowboy. You know, the guy who doesn't need anyone or anything. It's a fun story and it's a lie. In our self obsessed society, we're obsessed about our own diets, our own workout routines, our own jobs, our own social media feeds, everything. It's easy to forget that no one can do life alone. And I don't care if you're an introvert, an extrovert, or whatever you want to call yourself. We all have to have a community and a support system to do life with. It's time to shift the focus from doing it all by ourselves to knowing that we can only be well and whole when we ask for help. Therapy can be a great source of help and support for any area of your life. And if you're thinking about starting therapy, try BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy so it can fit with your schedule. To get started, just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist. And if it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. This month, start to build your support system with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H-E-L-P.com DeLoney the Ramsey show continues. I'm Ken Koma. Jade Warshaw is alongside triple 882-55-5225 is the phone number. Laura is joining us now in Los Angeles. Laura, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi, I. My husband and I are in a lot of debt from a small business we started, and I need you to guide me how to get out of it, I guess.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, give us some numbers.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so we're talking. If we're combining personal and business, it's about, like, 150.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. How much is from the business, though? I'm just curious.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I would say all of it because we put in from personal into the business, but just the bit like the credit cards would be like 90,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And what's the rest of the. The debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

They're all credit cards.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All of it's on all 150s. On credit cards?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, my word.

[Jade Warshaw]

We even opened up personal loans to pay for the credit card so we can have more space for the credit card. It's a mess.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So how many credit cards total?

[Jade Warshaw]

I would say there is about seven.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Seven. And then you said you have personal loans open, too. Is that included in the 150 or is that. What is that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, that's included in the 150.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so your thought is like, hey, we use these personal loans to pay down the credit card to clear up more space so we can borrow more on the credit card.

[Jade Warshaw]

Exactly.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's the. What's your income situation? Are you guys still working in the business?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, no, We. It took us a while, but we brightened up to. To close that business. Well, it's still open, but it's not running.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, gotcha. So what's your income?

[Jade Warshaw]

My husband makes about. I would say 120, and I make 80.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Where does that money take?

[Jade Warshaw]

We each have jobs.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Got it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so we got $200,000 combined income.

[Jade Warshaw]

Correct.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Do you have any other debt outside the 150? I know she asked you that, but I'm just totally clarifying. This is all debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, yeah, we have a mortgage, a car, if you're. If that's what you're asking.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, we want to know total debt. Tell us about your cars, your student loans, any. Anything that you owe money towards that you make a monthly payment towards. We want to know about it. So go ahead and tell me your mortgage. I'm just curious. What do you owe on it?

[Jade Warshaw]

I would say we owe it like four hundred thousand. So. So monthly I paid three thousand three hundred for mortgage.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

The car, I paid seven hundred a month. I think there's like nineteen thousand left on it. We have a leased car. That's four hundred dollars a Month? My son's school is eight hundred and fifty a month. My.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Is that private school or is that daycare?

[Jade Warshaw]

Private school.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. How old is he?

[Jade Warshaw]

Four.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, okay, keep going.

[Jade Warshaw]

My school one is 400. So our personal loans, his is 1600amonth, mine is 850amonth.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, and how much. But that personal loan is included in the 150 you told me earlier.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, tell me when you guys get your paychecks, like after everything's taken out. What do you take home every month? What's your check look like? Be both of you combined?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, mine is about 2000 and his is about. Oh no, that's on every other week.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So 4,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

About 9,000 for him.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, that's the good news.

[Dave Ramsey]

So 13 net. And just a real quick question. I don't want to get bogged down on this, but why is the 4 year old in a private school?

[Jade Warshaw]

Because of, I don't want him to learn anything.

[Dave Ramsey]

That right, but is it pre K?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So it doesn't have to be in pre K. I'm just wondering right out of the money there, there's some money to be saved on some home care maybe versus But I, I, I don't, there's bigger issues going on, but y'all gotta, y'all gotta like cut back big time.

[Dr. John Deloney]

There's the big, big time.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's the bumper stickers that Jade's about ready to walk you through.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, I think that's, I mean, jumping off with, with Ken's point could be a good place to start. You know, the only way to get out of Deb, there's two methods you could invoke here. You could work more right. To have more margin. You could also cut back on your budget to find more margin. Or you can do a combination of both. And to Ken's point, that school might be a great place to start because I don't know what you were going to say as far as like, I don't want them to learn certain things. It might be some of the same feelings that I have and my kid is in private school, but for right now it's okay. Or in there in daycare. And for right now it's okay. So it might be worth it for you to invoke that when they get a little bit older, could be that it's your kid, your partner.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I was gonna say yeah. And I, I might step on toes here, but since we're here, I'm gonna go ahead and say it. Cause I know a lot of Americans are thinking this, so I'm gonna go ahead and say it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Get in there. You might have to put your hat on.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't remember anything from my 12th grade year. Your 4 year old, no matter what they're trying to teach the kid. I mean, I get it. I'm not in la. I get it. But I don't know, I would be looking to sa hundred dollars a month tonight.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, what matters most is what you teach them at home. Yeah, but again, we're. I know. We're really getting into your personal life.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know. And I got to be careful. I'm not judging you. I'm just saying, you know, the four year old, we could cut that. That's 800 bucks a month. That's 9, 600 a year.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's a lot for where you're at right now. It is a lot. We just want to highlight that it is a lot. Next thing is, I'm looking at possibly both of these cars. I want to know about how you can get out of this lease. When is this lease over?

[Jade Warshaw]

Like very soon. I would say like four months.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. And then your option, you just turn the car in and you're out.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, So I would do that. Don't try to buy back the car or nothing like that. Just get out of the lease. And in the meantime, do you have any money saved?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, everything is gone.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Then what I'd be doing, knowing that this lease is about to come up, I'd be like, we gotta stack up $3,000 because when this lease goes away, we need to be able to buy a car in cash. And that's what that, that's kind of the car plan. So write that down in your notebook as when we've turned in this lease in three months. In three months, we'll also be buying a three to $4,000 car. I know you have the margin in your budget to do that. Okay, so that deals with one car. Let's talk about the $19,000 car. Do you know what that car is worth? The payment was kind of high. Didn't you say it was like $700?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, it. I think we bought it at 50,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. Do you know what it's worth now?

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, that's your second piece of car homework. I want you to go on Kelly blue book.com look at private sale because it sounds like if. If you bought it at 50 and judging by the height of your payment, I feel like you've been Paying this off kind of fast. Is that, am I wrong?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, you're, you're, yeah, you're right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so you might actually, you might not be upside down. And if you're not, I would still get out of this and get into something cheaper because the $700 payment, you need that money. And so now we've just found eleven hundred dollars in your, in your budget with these cars and you need every dime of that to go towards paying off this, this credit card debt. The good news is can, I mean, you guys have a good income. It's not wonderful for la, but it's wonderful for the rest of the country.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And it's doable. And again, not telling you what to do with your kid in school, but if we take the 800 on top of that, now we're right at the doorstep of two grand that we found in your monthly budget. That goes a long way to paying off $150,000 in debt. Okay. Because now you're looking at, if we just take 2,000amonth that you found and you put it towards debt, that's 24,000 a year. That's a long haul. Right. And this is a drastic change of your lifestyle. You're not going on vacation, you know, you aren't going out to eat. You guys are going to have to really hustle. But again, my co host today, this is a woman who, her and her husband paid off half a million dollars. She needs a little pep talk as we go into the break here because mindset wise, what does she got to be thinking right now?

[Dr. John Deloney]

You've got to be think the hard part is you're making a good income. And to not be living in that income feels like, oh, man, I've been working hard. But the time will come when you do get to do that. So just hold on. If you clean up this mess, you're going to enjoy your income like you never have before. Right now you've kind of faux enjoyed it with all these things on payments and it's not all it's cracked up to be, but if you walk through this journey, you're going to get to enjoy the fruit of 220 plus thousand dollars a year with no debt and payments. You can send your kid to the school that you want to and you don't have the stress associated with it because you'll actually be able to afford it.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can do it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You can appreciate the call.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, quick break. Jade Warshaw, Ken Coleman, this is the Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. You know, one of the first things I discovered working in the financial world is how absolutely devastating it is when the breadwinner of a family dies and there's too little life insurance or none at all. Grieving families are suddenly left behind, scrambling to pay bills and trying to make ends meet. I also discovered that there are a lot of rip offs in the life insurance world like that whole life crap posing as an investment opportunity. What you need is level term life insurance, usually 10 to 12 times your income, which is the smartest, most affordable way to protect your family. The key is finding an independent broker who represents a ton of companies and works for you, not for the insurance company. This is exactly what my friend Jeff Zander and his team at Zander Insurance are all about. They shop the term life companies to find you the best options and they've been around for over 95 years, so you know they'll be there when you need them. Zander is the real deal and that's why they've handled all my personal insurance for over 25 years. I trust them and you can too. Visit Zander.com for instant online quotes or for a more personal touch, give them a call at 800-356-4282. Alongside Jade Warshaw, I'm Ken Coleman. You're listening to the Ramsey Show. So excited that you are with us today as we help you win with your money, win in your profession and win with your relationships. Triple 8, 8255225 is the phone number. We'd love to hear from you. We go to Paul, who's right here in our backyard, Nashville, Tennessee. Paul, how can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. How are you guys doing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, sir, what's going on?

[Jade Warshaw]

So I am 22 years old, about to turn 23 and so is my wife. We recently just got married about six months ago and I knew before we got married that she wants to be a stay at home mom, but I have no idea how to have a career or a job or whatever to support that kind of thing. I'm a college dropout and so I'm trying to figure out like how, how does one have a career?

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. Well, I'm a college dropout as well. And so I want you to stop saying it that way the rest of your life. I want you to stop saying it the way that you said it. I'm not criticizing you. I'm actually going, hey man, everybody's got their story, everybody's got their reasons for it. That does not limit you. And so I want to make sure we get our shoulders back on that. Okay, so I'm a college dropout, all right? And. And so I'm not going to let you talk about me the way you talk about you that way. All right? You got this, Paul. All right, so let's talk about real numbers. All right, so she wants to be a stay at home mom. Love that. Greatest job in the world. Mad respect for it. My wife Stacy was a professional, made really good money, and then she's been at home for a while. I got mad props for that. How much money? I think you got a number in your mind or let's come up with a number. If you earned X amount of dollars, that would replace her income at the minimum. So what's the number?

[Jade Warshaw]

We don't have any kids right now. But to just stick her at the house, I would have to be making 85. But to have the amount of kids that we want, I'd probably have to be making 150 to 200.

[Dr. John Deloney]

How many kids do you want?

[Jade Warshaw]

Maybe she wants five.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, Lordy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hello. Well, so are we trying right now or is this just something we're talking about? Because we've been married six months. Okay. Thank the Lord. Yeah, y'all need to slow your roll and learn how to be married. For heaven's sakes. You've been married six years.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, we're waiting like five years to have kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, well, let me also say. You know what, Paul? Let me just tell you all those plans are great. You have no idea what's in store for you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

No idea.

[Dave Ramsey]

You have zero idea. So let's do what we. Let's focus on what we know. She's in a job right now, correct?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

And she's not coming home anytime soon because there's no reason to come home. Correct?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. What she earn take home is 33.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, great. And what do you take home right now? Oh, 33,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, $33,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you guys are fine. You're 66. Take home. That's not bad at all. You guys can stack cash. You have any debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

No debt. We've made sure to. I made sure to pay all my college debts off.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right, so I'm going to bring Jade back in in just a minute to pick you up right where I just left you. But I want to talk about what you want to do. I think this is what I've been doing for years, is coaching people to find work they're wired to do. I'm going to give you at the end of this phone call. My bestselling book, find the work you're wired to do. It has the get clear career assessment in it. Okay. And I want you to take it. And then I want you to read the book because the book is me coaching you along with your assessment results. But let's just see if we can get a couple ideas, because I just believe, Paul, that you know what it is or you have a couple ideas of something that you would like to do. And if I could wave my pen pencil and go poof and you were doing it and making the money you'd like to make, what is it that you would like to do? Any ideas?

[Jade Warshaw]

I would want to probably own a real estate and or logistics company.

[Dave Ramsey]

Great. And why logistics? What about logistics intrigues you?

[Jade Warshaw]

I've just been kind of good at it and it's fun. Maybe that's weird to say, but it's fun.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's perfect. My assessment measures three things, Paul. What you are good at doing. You just said you've always been good at it. And what you love to do. That's amazing. I love to do what I'm doing right now. It's fun. It's really fun. So that's not weird. So logistics has got a lot of application to it that's very versatile in the world of work. Because if you're good at logistics, there's some operational roles, a lot of ways you can go with that. And then real estate, if you're smart, you transition to that over time. That's great. So what's keeping you from moving into logistics over the next year? Two or three, what do you think is missing? Do you have to have a degree to work in logistics?

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, I work for a logistics company right now. We supply apartments. But I don't really, like, know what to do to get into the logistics space.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, let me ask you a question. Who, since you're in logistics right now, who at your current company would be able to answer that question about what would it look like to climb the ladder into logistics?

[Jade Warshaw]

I could probably find some people on our like, company portal that I could probably email. Logistics.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, Paul, I'm going to give you the magical key that most young people never discover. You ready? You find out who are the logistics veterans in the company portal. You send them an email or a chat or a voicemail and it sounds kind of like this. Hey, so and so. My name's Paul. I'm a young guy who would love to get into logistics. I've always been good at It, I really love it, but I need someone with experience to just give me their wisdom on the multiple ways that I can grow and climb the ladder in logistics. Would you be willing to spend time with me if I bought your coffee or lunch and you just rinse and repeat until you get somebody to do that and then you actually pay attention to what they tell you and then go find some other things good on message boards and logistics, read, listen to podcasts, find everything it is about, about logistics that are out there. And believe me, it's out there and you figure out how to get there. Now once you know that, that's a good move for you. In my assessment, the Get Clear career assessment will help you with that and it's going to validate all the stuff we're talking about, start moving forward with that. And by the way, Christian, let's also give him a copy of my book, number one bestseller, the Proximity Principle. I'm just piling it on the young man because I want to hand you over to Jade. We got a couple minutes and I want her to walk you through how you will get ahead financially now that we're going to have a path and we're going to be making more money, how we plan for little ones and mama to come home down the road.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. I want you to have a clear picture in your mind by the time you leave this call. Ken gave you the career piece, so let's talk about what it could look like. So you've got kind of a five year play here, right? There's five years where both of you guys are in the workforce. During that time you're getting your income up. It's 66 now, you know, by the time she takes the baton or you take the baton from her, hopefully you're carrying that on your own and more. So the key here is the house. Like that is the key. That's the foundation of all of this. If you can set yourself up, you don't have any debt right now. Right. If you can get into a house and you're already projecting saying, okay, this house, it can't be more than 25 of our take home pay, my take home pay, because you're going to be the only one working. So at this point, let's say you're making 66, 000, right. You're carrying that on your own. Okay. Payment can't be any more than twelve hundred dollars. Right? That's, that's the max. So now is the plan, the time to start saving towards that and making that Happen. Right. That you've got five years to make that happen. And then it. Once you're in baby step four, you're saving. You're putting aside 15 of your income. That's 825 bucks a month from now until the cows come home. I mean, if you just did that on one salary with your kids, like, you could retire with $5 million. So there, this is, this is the picture that I want to paint. You're creating stability by your home. And by the way, when you get that home, it's got to be based on your income, not both of you together. Just what yours is. That's going to be the key to this. And then from then on, it's. It's you guys making can. How can I say this delicately? A lot of times folks call in and the, the childbirth has kind of taken over all other thought process.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And it's like, you just have to understand that kids are expensive and they're not getting any cheaper. So you guys might get to three babies and go, oh, yeah, okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, it's really hard to make current decisions on hypothetical future decisions. And what I mean is what you're saying, yeah, sure, I understand. We want five kids is what she's saying. But we don't know how that's going to happen.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah. You may look at the situation and go, okay, I haven't gotten quite to 66,000. I'm at 50,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

What. How does that play into this? And that's okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

A lot of life happens between now and five years from now. And everything we lay out, it's awesome. But life has a real weird way of never turning out exactly the way we plan it to. So that's why you want to make these great money decisions now and then deal with what happens when life throws it at you. Great hour. Jade Warshaw. Always fun. This is your show. It's the Ramsey Show. If you need health insurance for yourself or your family, you might be lost in a maze of confusing terms, overwhelming options and questions about networks, not to mention high costs and bad service from insurance companies that don't care about what you want. Common concerns like those are why I'm.

[Dr. John Deloney]

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

Going to HealthTrustFinancial.com today.

[Dave Ramsey]

HealthTrustFinancial.com this is the Ramsey show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about their life, specifically their money, their profession, and their relationships. Alongside Jade Warshaw, I'm Ken Coleman. 888-255-225 is the phone number to John. Jump in. She'll coach you up on saving money, budgeting money, investing money. I'm gonna coach you up on how to make more of it, as the young people call it, Munion. This is a new term I learned today for some high schoolers. I can't wait to drop that on my kids.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, they're gonna.

[Dave Ramsey]

And see how love it and hate it and hard they roll their eyes, as my daughter likes to say all the time. You're so cringe, dad.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, man. You know, make a meme out of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, it's. It's what I'm supposed to do. It's part of the role of a dad. But we're here for you, America. You ready to go?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm ready.

[Dave Ramsey]

She's ready, folks. Sarah is up in Miami, Florida. Oh, near your old stomping grounds. You like that, Sarah? How can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi, guys.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Thank you so much for having on. So my parents opened up a credit card for me when I was younger in my name.

[Jade Warshaw]

So right now their card has about 18,000 and that. And I want to know what's the.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Best way to go about paying it off.

[Jade Warshaw]

They've already agreed to help me pay off. Since it's the three of us, our.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Charges are on it, but I want.

[Jade Warshaw]

To know what's the best way to go about it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So the 18,000 isn't just your spending, it's. It's your parents spending as well?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, the three of them.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, wow. Okay. Do you know who spent what? Is there any. Do you know who's on the hook for how much?

[Dave Ramsey]

Is there a spreadsheet?

[Jade Warshaw]

In November, we had a trip where.

[Dr. John Deloney]

They put about $5,000 in charges. And then it's been open since I.

[Jade Warshaw]

Think I was 16.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So I can't, you know, exactly point out who has what. But I pay off. Yeah, I pay off every month, like.

[Jade Warshaw]

What I put on.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Obviously I've stopped now just because we're Trying to pay it off so there's no more charges going on to it.

[Jade Warshaw]

But I want to know what's the best. They've agreed to pay it off, so.

[Dr. John Deloney]

They'Ve put money on it, but it's just 18.

[Jade Warshaw]

It just seems so huge to me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Who's. Like, who's the primary? Who's the primary on it? Are you the primary and they're the cosigner or how. Who's. Who's in charge of it? My mom is a primary. Okay, can. My first order of business would be for me to be taken off of it. Just from a credit perspective, just from a responsibility perspective. This is you doing damage control, saying, hey, the truth is. And I'm not saying you say this to her, but I'm saying this to you. The truth is, they pulled this debt out in your name before you were of age to even be able to make the decision to say yes or no. That's the truth. 16 is not the time for you to be deciding if you should have credit card debt with your parents. The answer would be no, but you didn't know that. Okay, so first order of business is mom and dad, I need you to take my name off of this, and I want my name off of this. So that's numero uno. You do that tonight. Because the truth is. How old are you right now? I'm 26. Yeah, you're 26. And the truth is, one day you're going to want to do something that requires your credit score to be zero. And as long as this is around, your credit score can't go to zero. Right. Which is what we're trying to get to. So that needs to happen. And then after that, you can say, okay, let's look at the charges are. Let's look at what the charges are now, and let's go through and let's kind of itemize this thing. And I'm fine with you going, this was me. I will pay that. And this was not me. I will not pay that right now. If we're. If we're trying to play a chess game here, it's really important that you get your name off of this thing first.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I was going to ask. I love the advice. Do you think that's going to go down? Okay, Sarah, I'm curious.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, they're pretty reasonable. Okay. Okay. Because if you start talking about what you're not going to pay, they may not want to take your name off it.

[Dave Ramsey]

I. I think Jay's exactly right. Is there any way and you have to forgive me. I don't. I really don't know this. I just don't know. Yeah, what can they, how far back can they track? Can they track the expenses over the lifetime of this card or is that like going to some, like, credit card database?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think that would be hard to do. I'd probably go back $18,000 worth of charges because the thing is, they've been using it, paying it off. Using it, paying it off. So as it stands now.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you can't. Okay, so of the eight, that's what I'm asking.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So of the 18 that's on there now, it's like a fresh start. That's. Can they track that?

[Dr. John Deloney]

They being Sarah, the credit card.

[Dave Ramsey]

Does the credit card have a. Obviously it's a website, but does it have the capability that she and her parents could go in and they could get an itemized list of, of the current 18k? This is what it's made up of so that they can divvy it up?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I mean, yeah, you can probably go back. My guess is probably three months of expenses is probably 18,000 because they spent 5,000 just in November. Right. So you could probably just pull up the past, you know, three or four months statements.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the reason I'm so hung up on that, Sarah Jade's advice is absolutely stellar. And to the extent that you can find out what is yours, and you and mom and dad are all mature and we go, okay, this is our chunk, and this is your chunk. And let's say you come back and I'm making this up, but let's say your chunk is half of it at 9k now because you're off the card. And what you're going to do is you're going to pay 9k to mom and dad to put on the card. Hopefully they'll do that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Hopefully they will.

[Dave Ramsey]

But that ain't your problem. And you will come to an agreement. Mom and Dad, I owe you $9,000 and I'm going to make that right. So whatever the number is, that's what we want you to do. And that's going to make this clean from a boundary standpoint for you, which is really important.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Really, really important. And the hard part is, you know, I would tell you, hey, like, if, if for some reason you ask them to take you off and they give you a problem, you could contest it, like with the, with the credit bureaus and say, hey, I got this when I was a minor. The hard part now is you have been spending on it and it's kind of been, you've okayed it from a certain perspective. So I, I really would. It's all going to melt down to how you have this conversation to get them to take you off.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right.

[Jade Warshaw]

But yeah, that's a good idea.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'll definitely do that.

[Jade Warshaw]

I just had one more question. I am worried about my credit are. But when they take me off the.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Card, will my credit be impacted? It probably wanted to go down. That's the part where I'm not exactly sure. Because you're not disputing it. You're not saying, hey, this never happened. It'd be one thing. That's why I said if you went to the credit bureaus and said, hey, they did this when I was 16, I didn't give them consent. Yeah. Then it almost be fraudulent and they take you off and for you it'd be like it never happened.

[Dave Ramsey]

But I want you to coach her up on stuff that she just said. She didn't catch what you said earlier. She said, I don't want my credit score to go down. You want it to go to zero. Give her the quick cut talk on why. I don't think she caught that. Am I right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's very good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You need to hear this. It's important.

[Dr. John Deloney]

The key is, the key is for your credit score to go to zero, not necessarily to go up. So the truth is, if you've had any sort of of debt that you were using and you pay it off and you close it out, or in this case, you get it off of your credit report, it could impact your credit report. But over time, when you stop borrowing money and there's no open accounts on your credit, your credit score is going to go to zero. And so if that credit is the only debt you have, once your name is removed off of that, over time, in a very short period of time, six months to a year, your credit score is going to roll to zero. And a zero credit score is just as good as a high credit score. Okay? That's the one thing they don't teach you in school. They don't teach you on the Internet. They don't teach that because nobody benefits from that but you. No company is making a bunch of money on that but you. Okay. That's why they don't teach it. But it's absolutely true. So that's what we're working towards. Get this in the motion, get it happening, get your name off of it and don't borrow any more money and you'll be good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. But you got this. I think a lot of people don't realize you can buy a house with zero credit score.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can live life without a credit card. It's all very doable. If you want to know more about that, just go to ramseysolutions.com you know, and search. We've got articles on that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

People think we make it up, Ken.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, it's, it's, it's a real thing. It is doable. So. Sarah, you got this, kiddo. Thanks for the call. We're rooting for you. All right, quick break. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsey Show. Rachel, do you ever get these sketchy text messages that are like, hey, you need to update your address and verify so we can get you the package you didn't order? Yes, I have, George. Sketchy.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And never trust them. And that's why we recommend Delete me.

[Dave Ramsey]

They help with that?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, they do. Delete Me actually goes in and removes your information from data broker websites. And it is an incredible service that everyone needs.

[Dave Ramsey]

And there's a lot of shady companies out there that solely exist to sell.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Your personal data to bad guys. And that means your info, like your.

[Dave Ramsey]

Email address, your home address, your kids names, your name, everything is just out there for scammers and spammers to find.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And then once they remove your information, then they're going to send you a detailed report telling you where they found your information, when they removed it, how many hours they've saved you. I mean, it is incredible. So detailed and it's beautiful.

[Dave Ramsey]

I love these reports so far. Get this. They've reviewed 27,000 listings on my behalf, removed me from 240 data broker sites, and saved me 77 hours of time. It's incredible.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Absolutely amazing. And Winston and I now get fewer texts, weird emails, spam calls, all of it.

[Jade Warshaw]

I love it.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you got to be sure to check them out.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Ramsey fans get 20% off their annual plans.

[Dave Ramsey]

Just go to join deleteme.com/ramsey. That comes out to less than nine bucks a month. Super affordable.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It's amazing. So again, that's joinedeleteme.com Ramsey. Make sure to check it out. You guys, listen, I know a lot of you would rather watch paint dry in slow motion than file your taxes.

[Dave Ramsey]

But thankfully, you don't have to dread filing when you've got Ramsey SmartTax. It comes packed with everything you need.

[Dr. John Deloney]

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Dr. John Deloney]

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[Dave Ramsey]

It's a no brainer. Just go to ramseysolutions.com smarttax and see how simple tax filing can be. That's ramseysolutions.com smarttax. Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside Jade Warshaw. I'm Ken Coleman. Triple 882-55-5225 is the phone number to jump in. We'd love to have you. Palm Springs, California is where Jenny joins us. Jenny, how can we help you today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. Hello. My, I'm a 90s kid, by the way.

[Dave Ramsey]

Nice.

[Jade Warshaw]

Come on, Jenny.

[Dave Ramsey]

Love it.

[Jade Warshaw]

My parents are getting older, so now they're in their late 70s. They've done well for themselves, but now I'm helping them because I noticed they were paying quite a bit of money into a flexible premium adjustable universal life insurance that they've had since 1986.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, man. Man, that thing's got mold on it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

My.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, my dad worked in law enforcement and his initial hourly rate was only $4.80.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Wow.

[Jade Warshaw]

So it made sense to them back then to have this hundred thousand dollar policy for him because, you know, you don't know what's going to happen. So. But after doing some research, I've gone back and forth. The policy has been sold from company to company. They don't even have the records for this policy because it's 39 years old. And their cash value has basically depleted my mom's very.

[Dr. John Deloney]

What is it? Do you know what it is? The cash value?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, yes. So the first. Well, the cash value now is I think down to $1,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh my gosh. And they've been paying into it since the 80s? Basically, yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, Lord. Basically they've totally paid $48,000, their money into this policy.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And so they have three different. Well, one policy is 25,000. Two riders, one for 50 and one for 75. So basically 150 for both my parents.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right now what happened was they said, oh, you stopped paying your payments. But my mom said no way. I've paid my, she's paid over the amount over all these years. And basically what happens. And I have been researching so it's imploding on itself. So now their cash value is gone. And my question is right now we're at, we're at a level playing field. Do they stop paying this? I'm trying to get the answers from somebody. They won't give them to me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Well, let's find out. Policy what's the rest? Tell me more about their financial setting because the hope is that you can get to the point where you're self insured. That's, that's the hope is to get to that point. So tell me more about their finances. Aside from this, this universal life. Do they have a nest egg and if so, how much is that?

[Jade Warshaw]

They, they've owned four homes. They currently own three homes. But my parents, being the great people they are, are leaving those homes to their children.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, what are they worth?

[Jade Warshaw]

Sell those? I would say they probably worth a million and a half.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so 1.5 million. Do they have debt on them or are they cash? Paid for cash?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, they only owe a little bit left on one home, I think. 25000 left on one home.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so essentially paid for. So three homes worth 1.5 million. Do you know what their nest egg is that's in the stock market?

[Jade Warshaw]

Savings. I, they don't have stock market. My mom didn't come from that era. She didn't want that. So I think in savings they have liquid about 250,000.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, 250,000 cash. Okay. So they're millionaires, they're doing fine. These, I mean, is the assumption that these homes are going to continue to go up in value? They've been taken care of.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. So there's worse things that could be going on here. The chances of them, you know, going out and getting a term life insurance policy for anything reasonable at this point, you said they're in their late 70s is not happening. Right. So the best you can think through is, okay, if one of them were to have an event that was not paid for, if any of one of them were to go into assisted living, is there money to pay for it and the other spouse, the remaining spouse, still have money to live off of. That's kind of the equation that you're doing in your head, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so a couple of things that I would do for that to be more of the case of this $250,000 in cash, I would want to invest some of that because I'd want it working for me. That's a big chunk of money that should be making. I mean, over the last three years, if that had been invested, the rate of return would have been unbelievable on that. But just even in a normal market, in a normal market, you're looking for at least a 10 annualized rate of return. That means if we look back on the track record over the course of, you know, five or six or 10 years. We're looking at 10%. Is that annual annualized percentages of return there? So that 250. If you can talk with them and say, here's the truth. And I didn't ask you this. I guess I should. Are you sure that this is their only life insurance that they have, or is there another policy or something else laying around?

[Jade Warshaw]

I am pretty sure. So I am not very smart on life insurance policies. But once you stop paying, they're gone, right?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are they?

[Jade Warshaw]

My dad's 78 and my mom is 75.

[Dave Ramsey]

I just don't think they need insurance at this point.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think they're okay now. Well, I mean, here's my thing with all those houses.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then what. What's. What's beyond the house?

[Dr. John Deloney]

They've got 250 cash. But I'm always looking at what if one of them becomes very ill and they need assisted living or they need somebody.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's why I'm with you. I'd invest that and I would use that as, like that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's that fund. That's the fund for that. Here's the thing. I don't know. What are they paying a month on this coverage? It's a hundred thousand dollars. What are they paying on it?

[Jade Warshaw]

So she's been paying $185, and their premium was only 50.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, it's peanuts.

[Jade Warshaw]

54.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, it's.

[Jade Warshaw]

But that's what I'm. Now that their. Their cash value is gone, where do all these fees come from after they make their own?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Because it's just. It's a terrible product.

[Dave Ramsey]

Now you get it. Now you know why we hate it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

They. They got nickel and dime to death on their own cash value. They're not. They're horrible products. And that's what we try to tell people. You pay into this thing for life, and at the end of the day, you have nothing to show for it. All they have is their hundred thousand when they pass away, which I, you know, if, if they keep it around. Yeah, if they keep it around and they're like, I'm happy to pay the $185 a quarter or whatever it is, you know, they're not getting rich off of this thing, which is what we've learned. And when they pass away, you're not getting rich off of it either, is what it amounts to. And so. And here's the thing. If they had passed away, they wouldn't have gotten to keep the cash value anyway. That's the, that's the most ridiculous thing about this whole thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So they're in it. It's not. It's a horrible product. If they want to get out, they can get out. If they stay in, it's not the end of the world. They've got the money to pay for it and it's in. In many ways, I guess at this point it's better than nothing because it's not overly expensive monthly, but that cash.

[Jade Warshaw]

Would there be a penalty for them to get out of it now if they say, okay, we don't want it.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Anymore, yeah, ask about that. Ask and find out. At this point, I feel like they could probably surrender it with no issue, but just find out about that and push for that, push for that.

[Jade Warshaw]

But this 250, I'm trying and I can't get anybody to help me or help him while we're both here. But nobody will help. Nobody will answer my questions. It's all, well, we don't know. We have to look it up. And nobody has answers for me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

When you. Well, that's because they don't want you to get out of it. They've gotten $48.

[Dave Ramsey]

They just don't like the answers. I would, I would really just put the pressure on somebody and become their worst nightmare. And you'll be surprised somebody wants to get rid of you. You can be nice, but just. You just like a bulldog.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, I'm a 90s kid. I'm good at getting somebody's work.

[Dr. John Deloney]

There you go.

[Dave Ramsey]

Come on.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You get into it. I mean, like New kids on the.

[Dave Ramsey]

Block, Hanging tough, You know what I mean? That's what I'm dropping. That's our theme song.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, hanging Tough.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I. I like it. Yeah. I mean, there's no cash value. I can't imagine what they might charge to surrender this at this point. But check into it and, and if, if you want to lapse it, let it lapse. They're not going to get into anything else though, at this point, is what I'm saying. And the good news is that they have the money to self insure, but pushing on that 250 to get that invested. I would do that if I were you.

[Jade Warshaw]

And do you know, will the premium keep going up and up and up so they get their fees.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Say that again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, the premiums on the whole life keep going up.

[Dr. John Deloney]

They might.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I'm telling you, they might.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can cancel this thing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Get out of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

Get out of it. It's.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And if there is a penalty at this point, it's like, who cares get out of the thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

They paid $48,000 into this and they have a hundred thousand dollars of coverage.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's the last call for our two night virtual event, Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials. It's set for May 21 and 22 and you do not want to miss this. I'll unpack my personal playbook on investing.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And real estate and show you how.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can feel confident in your investments, too.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Tickets are 1 99.

[Dave Ramsey]

Snag a VIP ticket and you'll get two sessions with a Ramsey preferred coach. You can join from anywhere. Go to ramseysolutions.com events and get your ticket today.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's terrible.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm unfortunately, I'm unfortunately at the time of my life where insurance is such a fraud. And I know I'm saying that blanketly, but after looking at all of this for them, I'm thinking, what a fraud. You could have put that money into something else. And I don't want to make my parents feel bad about it because they said what we thought was right at the time.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It happens all the time. That's why we teach term life insurance is the best way to get it. With term life insurance, you're only paying for insurance. With all these other universal life and all these other you're giving them extra for them to invest it for you at a horrible rate of return. It's loaded with fees and at the end of the day, you're in. You end up with nothing. That what these people have ended up with is so typical. And so your best bet, term life insurance, check out our friends at Xander Insurance. They will hook you up.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Yeah. And it's peace of mind and it's for the term and that's why it's so beautiful. Once you get past that, you don't need it. Guess what? You're not paying for it. All right, quick break. More of your calls coming up. This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Colme. Jade Warshaw is joining me. 888-255-225 is the phone number to jump in. We'd love to hear from you. Javin is joining us now in Hattiesburg, Mississippi. Javan, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Good. How are you today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Doing pretty good. Okay, so a little bit of background for my question. Me and my fiance, we recently got engaged back in September and we are set to get married in November of this year. With that being said, as you know, I am very excited and there's nothing That I want more than to marry her. But I am also very nervous because I've never had to financially lead anybody in my life. And so I guess my question is what, what are some of the best steps that I can take in order to ensure that we'll have a. We'll be financially successful and we'll keep the money fights to a minimum?

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, really thoughtful question. How old are you?

[Jade Warshaw]

22.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you have any debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Does she.

[Jade Warshaw]

So she doesn't have any debt right now, but she's going to school to be a PA and she is, she wants to go to PA school, but you know, obviously her parents didn't save any money for her and to go to school, so she's gonna have to take out loans, I'm guessing.

[Dave Ramsey]

And when will she start?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right now. That's kind of unknown. She has been applying to different schools. She did have an interview and she got wait listed. So right now it's just kind of unknown.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, I, I want, I, I want Jade to weigh in obviously on this. But from a. I really thought it was in a really mature way of asking the question, you never had to lead anybody. And when it comes to husband and wife and the word leading could get tricky for some people. And I think what I'm going to say, hopefully, hopefully helps everybody. I wouldn't look at it as telling her what to do if that's what we think leading is. I think modeling the way that's great, Ken, is what I would define as leading when it comes to a marital relationship. And so modeling the way is you being disciplined with money, you being transparent about money, you being thoughtful about money. Just coming at it from a. It's a we. And so, for instance, give you a classic example, leading her right now would be sitting down with her and going, hey, here's my view on student loan debt and just debt in general. Here's what it does to me, here's why it does that to me. And when I say the why, I don't mean like Ramsey bullet point language. I mean like you personalizing going, that's right, I grew up this way or whatever. So that she goes, she feels very safe. Because you're not talking at her about this. You're going, here's how I feel about money in general. And I feel as your future husband that I have a responsibility to lead us is how I would say that. And say, can we talk about what it might look like to save up and cash flow PA school? Or I'm going to bring you in here. Because I wanted to try to take the. I wanted to give him some wisdom from my, you know, as a man in the marriage. Stacy, very strong. We've always been on the same page about money when we didn't start that way. In other words, we might start a conversation. We ain't on the same page.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

But when we finish the conversation, Jade, we got to get on the same page. And so I'm bringing you in here. I'm tagging. This is like a wrestling match, and I'm tagging you in the corner over there.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You're jumping off the ring.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm getting out. I'm getting out of the ring, and I need you to come in because I do want the female perspective as well.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay. I'm jumping off the ropes into the ring.

[Dave Ramsey]

Be gentle now. Don't. Don't elbow drop.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I think Ken is exactly right, and I think as much as you can when you have this conversation, Ken is right. Tell her the way that you're feeling. But as much as you can reiterate over and over and over again that you agree she should go to school.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, yes, good point.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I agree you should go to school. I agree. I do want you to be. Become a PA. I agree. Your career is very important. I think whenever you're having a discussion like this, the person who's. I'll say their thing, the thing they want to do when their thing that they want to do is on the line, it can get defensive easily. Even if they're, you know, a person who doesn't want to argue. It's just easy to think, like, what does this mean? Does this mean I can't go to PA school? Then? Does this mean I can't do my dream? Right? So reiterating that over and over is going to be so important. And then saying, having ideas of, here's what we can do. Yeah. I was thinking, how can we make you go to school? Because I really want you to be able to go to school because it's important for you to become a PA here's how we could do it. Cash and funded in cash. Right. And so being able to talk about it like that, I think is going to be really important. And.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, but you're gonna be fine, young man. You really will. If it's a. If it's a conversation, not. You're not dictating, you know, it's not like the old school. I'm trying to think of Mad Men where, you know, a guy barks at his secretary and, yeah, as long as the posture is, I want what's best for our marriage, and this is about peace and us not being, like, you know, millions of couples that fight over money, and then that turns into marriage issues that I think I'm just trying to take the pressure off. Javen, does that make sense to you? Like, you don't have to be a know it all. You don't have to be this wise, you know, Sage. No, you just got to be smart with money, and you're going to walk along with you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, and by the way, as a. As a wedding gift, by the way, I want to give you total money makeover, Dave Ramsey's classic book. You know, so close to 10 million copies, I think, sold or whatever it is, that's just kind of the basics. And if you were to just follow that, because you guys aren't in any kind of trouble, but if you were to just follow that, that would be great. What else can we give them?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, make sure they have Financial Peace University.

[Dave Ramsey]

Let's do that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That'll be good. And along with that, you'll have every dollar. We're just going to set you guys up. You're getting married. This is our newlywed gift to you. So you get total money makeover. You get Financial Peace University. We'll give you every dollar premium for several months. You can hang out with that for a while. And, yeah, I think if you can start having these conversations, maybe you start by not talking about PA School. Maybe you just start by saying, hey, what do we believe about debt? And you just have those conversations. How do we want to handle our money? And then this happens. The. The. The. The conversation about school comes up as a result of you guys talking about the other. The other things. So.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I agree with that. Really good question, though. I. I love your heart, Javen. I think it's great that a young man is thinking about that. And, you know, it's. You got to make the big decisions early in marriage.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And. And then you spend the rest of your marriage managing those decisions. And money is one of them, man.

[Dr. John Deloney]

It really is. Do you ever can. Do you ever listen to Jefferson Fisher?

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, sure. I had him on the front row seats coming out soon.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, that's right. You did. Oh, man. All I could think of was him when I was thinking about this conversation, because it's all about finding what you agree on and restating what you agree on so that it doesn't.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Escalate.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's right. And. And I would also Liken it. I'm glad you bring that up. I would also liken it to this. This gonna give some people some heartburn, so hang with me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I would liken it to the family member that you're going to see on a regular basis so you can't be a jerk when that uncomfortable political conversation happens.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Oh, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

In other words, like if it's Uncle Larry who you see once a year, you might come at Uncle Larry if he says something. You know what I mean?

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

But like, if it's your grandmother or somebody where it's like you choose relationship over being right or the thing that you. The zinger where you're like, you just feel like I need to zing you and just kind of let you know what I think of people. We can do that on top. Tough topics. And politics is one, money's another. Faith and religion, things like that. When there is some respect to say, I'm gonna understand you.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because here's what I've learned about politics. You're never going to convince somebody else because of your five points that you're going to make in a debate. Well, what's the key point about to understand them.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And how can you understand you're talking too much?

[Dave Ramsey]

100 ask questions.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Common ground. Where can we find common ground? And. And so this is a lot easier when it's your spouse. When it's okay, I'm just going to seek to understand how she thinks and feels about money. Yeah, let's start there.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Seek to understand. That's so good.

[Dave Ramsey]

Then I know what. Then I know what's going on.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, you're not trying to convince them. You're not trying to bring them over to your side.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you think about debt? And then she tells you and you go, what, what form that. What. What do you think is. See, all of a sudden, this isn't a game. It's not manipulate. It's legitimate, respectful question asking that allows you to get on her page. That does not mean that you agree with everything on her page. But you've got.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Just listening now.

[Dave Ramsey]

You hope it's reciprocated and in a healthy relationship it will be reciprocated. I think that's the lesson.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's a very good. Kim.

[Dave Ramsey]

At least that's the best you can do and hope it works out from there and without all else fails. Go get a great therapist for your marriage. You know what I mean?

[Dr. John Deloney]

I know what you mean.

[Dave Ramsey]

Come on. All right, quick, quick break. We'll be right Back. This is the Ramsey Show. Hey, guys, good news. Presale is on now for my new book, build a business you love. If you're a business owner, you know running a business is hard.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's why I wrote this book, to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Share what we learned over the last 30 years so business owners can grow your business faster with fewer mistakes. Pre order your copy today and you'll get access to over $350 in bonus items only at Ramsey Solutions.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Ramseysolutions.Com store.

[Dave Ramsey]

Pre order today. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman, joined by Jade Warshaw. Thrilled to have you with us. 888-255-225 is the phone number. Let's go to Lafayette, Indiana, and Steve is there. Steve, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, hi. Appreciate you taking my call. So my wife and I are discussing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Whether we should be paying off the house.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's pretty debt that we have and current mortgage, I owe about 175,000 and the rate is at 2.79%. We have 420,000 roughly in a 401k and about another 400,000 in money market CDs. And so I would like to keep it in the 401k. I'm sorry, in the, in the money market, in the CDs and get about.

[Dave Ramsey]

Four and a half percent off of.

[Jade Warshaw]

That and just apply the overage towards them, towards the, the mortgage payment.

[Dave Ramsey]

And my wife is looking to, to.

[Jade Warshaw]

Take it out of there and just, just pay it off, be done with it. Let's not worry about the house. So trying to figure out, you know, financially what the best direction is to go.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so let me just run that back real quick. So you're saying she's like, hey, we've got 400,000 in a money market, let's just pull out the 175 and pay off the house. That's what she wants to do, correct?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yep.

[Dr. John Deloney]

And you're saying you just want to use the interest as it accrues to pay off the house?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah. So keep the 175, you know, the full 400 in there because I'll be.

[Dave Ramsey]

Earning at a little bit higher rate.

[Jade Warshaw]

Than the 2.79 it's costing us for the mortgage.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I mean, I'm with your wife.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're not going to pay it off that fast if you run those numbers. I'm with Jade. If you run the numbers on the interest and what that's going to actually be. So for instance, let's put you on the spot over the next 12 months. What are you anticipating that the interest of the 400,000 is going to throw off? Yeah, I guess I didn't really do the math.

[Jade Warshaw]

Close enough to be able to throw a number on the spot.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, let's do it. Let's do it. So what's the return? What do you think you're going to get over the next 12 months on that money market market?

[Jade Warshaw]

So 400,000. Four and a half. So would that be 12,000? Am I doing that right?

[Dave Ramsey]

I think that's right. Let me get my cat.

[Dr. John Deloney]

You're breaking up a little bit my while. While Ken does that.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm not gonna put it. Yeah, go ahead.

[Dr. John Deloney]

My thought is just, it's kind of like ripping off the band aid in a way. You take the money out the, the 175, you pay off this mortgage, it frees up your payment right now. Which, how much is your payment right now?

[Jade Warshaw]

About 1700.

[Dave Ramsey]

But that's with.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Right. Insurance and taxes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I think, I think principal and.

[Jade Warshaw]

Interest is maybe 900, I want to say of that.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Okay, so immediately you free up 900. If you wanted to, you could invest that or I mean if you want to put it in a money market. I don't know why you have so much money in this money market, but I would invest that money and then you're completely debt free. And I, I love Dave Ramsey's take on this because he would say, hey, if you hate the feeling of being debt free and you, you're kicking yourself because you could have, you know, made some interest on the four and a half percent on your money market, you could always go back into debt and go back and do that plan. But I don't think you would.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, probably not. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I gotta, I gotta jump in, Steve, really quick because I, I'm 100 with your wife on this. Here's why. I just pull at 4.5% on the 400,000. That's 18,000 a year. However, if you pay the house off, you have massive, massive jump forward in your long term play. And then the second thing is I would take all that money and I would be investing most of that outside of your emergency fund, the six month emergency fund, Jade. I would be investing the rest of that after you pay the house off. Because I would rather get 8 to 10% versus your four and a half.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

And that's part of, so you had, you had asked or said like, why is there so much in the money market? So we had a, a pretty good chunk of Money that we came into.

[Dave Ramsey]

About two and a half years ago.

[Jade Warshaw]

I want to say it was at this point and put it in the market and then the market continued to decline. I did probably the worst thing ever, which is, you know, put it in.

[Dave Ramsey]

And take it back out.

[Jade Warshaw]

And so we had some, we had some other, like, personal things going on.

[Dave Ramsey]

In our life that said, okay, we.

[Jade Warshaw]

Need to, we need to minimize the risk of any further loss on this. So we pulled it out and threw it in like a CD ladder for about the last year and a half is when I pulled it out. So basically I put it in right when it started going down. And then, and then I took it out right as it started coming back up. So worst possible timing for me.

[Dr. John Deloney]

So did you learn from that though?

[Dave Ramsey]

That why I did.

[Dr. John Deloney]

I did. Okay, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, he's too excited about 4 1/2%. I wouldn't be excited about 4 1/2 percent.

[Dr. John Deloney]

That's not. Yeah, I agree. Well, I'm trying to formulate a clear thought here, which is as long as you're moving this money around, it's never going to work for you as well as it is if you park it in the stock market. I don't care if you park it in an index fund, but just putting it somewhere where it's having a better rate of return, especially if we're using interest as a basis for this argument. You know what I'm saying? If you took, if you took the 200,000 that will be left after you pay off the house. House. And you moved that and got a 10 or 12% rate of return, I mean, then this whole thing is kind of like a moot point.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's where I told exactly what I would do, Steve. Pay off the house. Get with a smartvestor pro in your area. Ramseysolutions.com make the connection. The smartvestor pros are people you need to sit with. If you don't have one and sit with them and interview them, get the right fit, right field, the connection, the chemistry deal. And then. And have them invest that money for you. You're going to be so much happier.

[Dr. John Deloney]

Yeah, because what did we say? We said that you were trying to, you were trying to keep the entry. I'm just thinking about the math. You were trying to keep the interest, throw the interest off of this 400, 000. What was that, 18, 000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

He was thinking, I'm going to pay the house off at $18,000 a year.

[Dr. John Deloney]

But I'm like, if you get the. If you pay it off today, the difference is really, I mean, you would. With the payment back, that's $11,000 a year. So really, we're saying keep the house around for six more years for $7,000 is really the argument. And I'd say no to that.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, it's not. Not a good move. Hey, I want to mention something. Then we got to get to our question of the day. If you're a business owner, I know we have a lot of people who are starting out. You just could be in the side hustle stage or you've got the business up and running. You need to know about Dave's new book, build a business you love. It's where he's unpacking how he took this business and where he started on a card table in his living room to now an over $250 million business. It's a proven system. Think of it as the baby steps for running a business. And you can pre order it right now. It's called build a business you love. Look at that. There it is. Look sharp, doesn't he? And so that book is now available to pre order for only $29.99. You'll get over $350 in free bonus items, including the entree, leadership hiring playbook, the ebook, and the enhanced audiobook. So you can get [e-mail] store ramseysolutions.com store or if you're watching on YouTube or podcast, we've got the link for the book build a business you love by Dave Ramsey, his latest book. You can get it in the show notes. So go get that. All right, let's get to our question of the day, which is brought to you by. Why refi default? It's private. Do you have a private. Excuse me, a defaulted private student loan and the payments are dragging you down. Why? Refi could help you save thousands of dollars. Visit yrefi.comramsey to see how they can help. That's the letter Y, r, e f y.com Ramsey. It may not be available in all states.

[Dr. John Deloney]

All right, today's question comes from Shelby in Idaho. She says, my husband and I have been married for 15 years and have two children. We're on baby steps. Four, five, and six. Last year, he was diagnosed with leukemia and underwent chemotherapy and a bone marrow transplant. My husband's estranged sister was a perfect match, which probably saved his life. Wow. Now she has gotten herself in deep debt trying to flip houses and rent out Airbnbs and has started asking us for money. We've already given her several thousand dollars last month, and we have heard from other relatives that she has started asking them for large amounts as well. My husband feels obligated to give her money because she saved his life. Life. And we now. And we know she'll be asking for more money again soon. How should we respond? Well, number one, guilt should never be a reason that we give.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes.

[Dr. John Deloney]

We should never give out of guilt. You give out of a cheerful heart. And that's the number one principle right there. Number two is if you have the abundance to give out of. You still have boundaries around it. It's not an unending well. That's like, yes, more and more and more and more. Right. You get to decide, okay, if we have the money to help estranged sister, what are our boundaries around that? And it's okay for you to let her know. Okay, we're willing to give you X amount of dollars, but this is the last time we're going to be able to do it because that's where our boundary is. And after that, you just hold up the boundary. Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Let the silence. I'm going to give you six words. We can't give more. I'm sorry. That's it. And just let it ride. And you say we can't. You have to tell them why. Just, we can't. Oh, I'm so sorry. We can't. I think that's all you can do here. This thing's going to be an ugly, ugly mess. This is the Ramsey show.