Stop Obsessing Over Pennies While Ignoring the Plan

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show
Episode: Stop Obsessing Over Pennies While Ignoring the Plan
Release Date: May 23, 2025

Hosts: George Camel and Jade Warshaw
Description: The Ramsey Show empowers listeners to build wealth, pursue fulfilling work, and cultivate meaningful relationships by addressing financial challenges and providing actionable advice.

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Introduction

In the episode titled "Stop Obsessing Over Pennies While Ignoring the Plan," George Camel and Jade Warshaw delve into the common financial pitfall of focusing excessively on minor savings while neglecting comprehensive financial planning. Through a series of listener calls, the hosts address diverse financial dilemmas, offering tailored solutions that emphasize strategic planning over penny-pinching.

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Key Discussions and Insights

1. Executor Mismanagement and Family Estate Disputes

Caller: Carrie from Bend, Oregon
Timestamp: [00:41] - [05:39]

Carrie seeks advice on pursuing legal action against her brother-in-law, the executor of her late father-in-law's will, who allegedly sold the estate without adhering to the will's stipulations. The estate, valued at approximately $900,000, was intended to be divided equally among three beneficiaries, including Carrie's husband. Instead, the executor sold the house and assets, providing only a $5,000 cashier's check without proper accounting.

Notable Quote:
Jade Warshaw: "You go in front of the probate judge and say, hey, here's what's going on." [04:56]

Advice Provided:

• Legal Action: Petitioning probate court to enforce the executor's accountability.
• Evidence Gathering: Collecting all relevant documents and communications to support the case.
• Cost-Benefit Analysis: Weighing the potential financial gains against the costs and emotional toll of litigation.

2. Balancing Work and Single Parenthood Amid Divorce

Caller: Nathan from Bozeman, Montana
Timestamp: [10:04] - [18:03]

Nathan discusses his recent separation and the impact on his finances and parenting. With full custody of his 12-year-old daughter, he grapples with high debts totaling $32,500 and seeks to balance work commitments with quality time for his child.

Notable Quote:
George Camel: "When life gets really hectic, I don't take time to plan my healthy meals." [08:19]

Advice Provided:

• Prioritization: Emphasizing the importance of financial stability as a foundation for family well-being.
• Budgeting: Encouraging the creation of a detailed budget to manage expenses and debt.
• Therapeutic Support: Utilizing professional help to navigate emotional challenges during separation.

3. Building Wealth While Caring for an Elderly Parent

Caller: AJ from Orlando
Timestamp: [22:35] - [31:22]

AJ contemplates taking on debt to build a mother-in-law suite for his aging grandmother. With a proposed budget of $50,000 to $60,000, he seeks guidance on whether this financial commitment aligns with responsible wealth-building principles.

Notable Quote:
Jade Warshaw: "I think you need somebody who's going to help you give you some actionable steps for everything." [18:45]

Advice Provided:

• Debt Avoidance: Advising against incurring new debt for non-essential projects.
• Alternative Solutions: Considering assisted living options or leveraging existing family resources.
• Long-Term Planning: Evaluating the financial sustainability of supporting an elderly parent without jeopardizing future financial goals.

4. Navigating Debt Repayment Strategies in Marriage

Caller: Haley from Huntsville, Alabama
Timestamp: [43:45] - [52:43]

Haley and her husband face $60,000 in debt, predominantly from auto loans, hospital bills, and credit cards. With a combined household income of $90,000, they seek strategies to eliminate debt while maintaining their financial commitments.

Notable Quote:
Jade Warshaw: "I want you to have the bank statements from the month of May ready." [48:49]

Advice Provided:

• Debt Snowball Method: Prioritizing debts to accelerate repayment.
• Open Communication: Establishing financial transparency between spouses.
• Lifestyle Adjustments: Reducing unnecessary expenses to allocate more funds toward debt.

5. Managing High Medical School Debt

Caller: Shirlene from New Orleans
Timestamp: [76:37] - [85:35]

Shirlene seeks advice on consolidating her substantial federal medical school debt of $700,000, which carries interest rates between 6.8% and 8.5%. She is contemplating whether to refinance or proceed with debt consolidation to achieve a lower interest rate.

Notable Quote:
George Camel: "I just don't want you guys are good to take on that for the rest of her life, which could be 20 years." [28:07]

Advice Provided:

• Refinancing vs. Consolidation: Evaluating the benefits of each approach based on her financial situation.
• Interest Rate Negotiation: Exploring options to secure lower interest rates without extending the repayment period excessively.
• Debt Management: Encouraging a disciplined repayment plan to reduce the principal and interest over time.

6. Utilizing 529 Plans for Graduate Education

Caller: Alyssa from Los Angeles
Timestamp: [66:31] - [71:22]

Alyssa inquires about reallocating funds from her children's 529 college savings plans to finance her doctorate program in nurse practice. With $48,000 in the 529 plans and a total program cost of $81,000, she seeks guidance on the implications of such a move.

Notable Quote:
Jade Warshaw: "I think you need that. I think you need somebody who's going to help you give you some actionable steps for everything." [17:19]

Advice Provided:

• Beneficiary Reassignment: Legally changing the 529 plan beneficiary to herself.
• Financial Impact Assessment: Understanding the long-term effects on her children’s college funding.
• Income Prospects: Highlighting the potential income increase post-graduation to offset the initial financial strain.

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Conclusions and Takeaways

The episode underscores the importance of comprehensive financial planning over mere cost-cutting. By addressing significant financial decisions with strategic thinking, listeners can avoid the pitfalls of focusing on minor savings at the expense of long-term financial health. Key takeaways include:

• Strategic Debt Management: Prioritize debts and explore consolidation or refinancing options judiciously.
• Comprehensive Budgeting: Develop and adhere to a detailed budget that aligns with financial goals.
• Open Communication: Foster transparency within families regarding financial matters to ensure collective progress.
• Long-Term Planning: Consider the sustainability and future implications of financial decisions, especially when supporting family members.

Overall Message:
Focusing on a holistic financial plan ensures that short-term sacrifices lead to long-term financial stability and wealth-building, rather than getting entangled in the immediate gratification of cutting small expenses.

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Notable Quotes:

• "You go in front of the probate judge and say, hey, here's what's going on." — Jade Warshaw [04:56]
• "I think you need somebody who's going to help you give you some actionable steps for everything." — Jade Warshaw [17:19]
• "Don't let a lender tell you when it's time to buy a house. You decide." — Jade Warshaw [36:36]
• "Term life insurance can replace income, pay off debts, cover funeral expenses." — George Camel [52:27]

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This episode serves as a reminder that while minor savings are beneficial, they should not overshadow the necessity of a robust and well-thought-out financial plan. By addressing substantial financial issues with strategic solutions, listeners are better equipped to achieve lasting financial wellness.

Transcript

[Caller]

Foreign.

[George Camel]

To you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Live from Ramsey Network, this is the Ramsey show where we help people build wealth, do work that they love and create amazing relationships. I'm George Camel joined by best selling author Jade Warshaw and we are here to take your calls and help you take the right next step with your money and your life. Give us a call at 888-5225. Carrie is our first victim here in Bend, Oregon. What's going on, Carrie?

[Caller]

Hi, you guys.

[George Camel]

How can we help?

[Caller]

So I have, I have. It's kind of an emotional question, but basically our, our brother in law has not done what he was expected to do as the executor of a will that we would be involved in. And it's got to the point where we would need a lawyer. So that is my question. Should we pursue a lawsuit even if we don't have the money for a lawyer? But we, we would probably have the money once the lawsuit was settled.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, you got to tell us more. Make, make your case for us here.

[Caller]

Okay. So my judge Warshaw, my father in law passed away in 2018 and left everything to his wife, which is my stepmother in law. She passed away in 2020. Le to her son and which is a stepbrother. And then. And then two other brothers.

[Jade Warshaw]

Mm.

[Caller]

The stepbrother that's the executor of the will went and sold everything in the house. Sold the house, the land, all of it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Behind our back. Behind our back.

[George Camel]

That was not the stated wishes of the will.

[Caller]

No.

[Jade Warshaw]

What were the stated wishes?

[Caller]

That the three beneficiaries were her son and then the other two brothers.

[Jade Warshaw]

And is one of those your husband?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[George Camel]

How big was this estate? Do you have any idea?

[Caller]

The house sold for about. It was listed at 795,000.

[George Camel]

Okay. Anything else?

[Caller]

Everything that was in the house, tractors, cars, everything. I mean he had two acres.

[Jade Warshaw]

What do you think? It was all worth.

[Caller]

Speaking to a lawyer. They said it would probably be about 100,000 for everything in the house because we don't have any documentation for it.

[Jade Warshaw]

So we're talking about 900.

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

So you'd be owed about 300 at the end of this if all things had gone to plan.

[Caller]

Yes. Minus the back taxes that were paid when the house sold.

[Jade Warshaw]

How much was that?

[Caller]

And not very much. Less than 50,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

But he also did a complete remodel to the house that we didn't know about either. I don't know if that is in the consideration or not.

[Jade Warshaw]

So let me just make sure I understand this. The will said everything was supposed to be split three ways amongst the brothers. One brother said, forget that, I'm going to sell all of this myself.

[Caller]

Yep.

[Jade Warshaw]

And then where is that money? Like he. So he sold the estate, he sold the property. Where is the money? Do you know?

[Caller]

He's got it.

[Jade Warshaw]

And how long, over what period of time did all of this happen?

[Caller]

Well, I accidentally came upon the house being listed on Zillow. When I was looking at land prices in that area. I saw the, the house that my father in law built on Zillow. When, when this has been going on a little bit before. The house sold in October. So a couple months before that.

[Jade Warshaw]

October of last year. 2024.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so when that happened, did you guys go to him and say, oh, so you just sold everything? Like, okay, so you're going to divvy it up three ways? And then he said what?

[Caller]

Well, he is not talking to us. He won't answer calls, he won't return anything from his lawyer. And we found out that the only thing that his lawyer has for us is a Cashier's check for $5,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

And you said, what's this for? And he said what?

[Caller]

They didn't, they didn't say.

[Jade Warshaw]

And so then did you then go to whoever the lawyer was who first, you know, read the will and said, this is the executor. You went to him and what did he say?

[Caller]

He, the. My brother in law won't return any phone calls to the lawyer.

[Jade Warshaw]

Got it. Okay, so now you guys basically on the run. So you guys then need to go to a judge and say, hey, the executor of the will is not carrying out the wishes of the will and he is keeping all the money for himself when the will clearly states.

[George Camel]

I feel like, yeah, he essentially committed fraud. So what you'd have to do is petition in probate court to force the accounting of this. Force him to show up, force him to deal with this. I don't know. He may have spent all this money.

[Caller]

Exactly.

[George Camel]

So we just, I don't know that you're going to get what you're hoping to get out of it. I mean, it sucks that this happened.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Over five. I'm just trying to understand the five year play here because, and I don't want this to sound any type of way, but if I know I have an inheritance from Grandpa and grandpa died, you know, last year, I feel like I would have already known. Forget five years. I would be wondering, okay, when are we selling the estate? When are we getting the money? So I want to know more about that negligence. I'm not trying to, yeah.

[George Camel]

Say we're not sending him, but there's a lot of other pieces here that we're confused about. Like was the estate officially closed in probate court? What happened with probate?

[Caller]

Well, the house was my father in law's that he, he built this house on two acres. And it was just the agreement between all of us that we weren't going to do anything right away because a.

[George Camel]

Written agreement or just a phone call?

[Caller]

No, no, just. Just talking that we didn't want to set. We didn't want to because we would like one of the three of us to buy the other two out and keep the property.

[Jade Warshaw]

Got you. Okay.

[Caller]

But, but he went behind our back and we did. We knew nothing about the remodel, anything. He was still talking to us about how it would be awesome that we moved there and things like that. Completely lying to us.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, okay. And what was your timeline for moving into the house? Because again we're talking five years. Was this like on, like what was the timeline in you all's mind for saying here's when we're going to buy you out. Here's when that's going to take place.

[Caller]

When I was looking on Zillow, we were getting prices for the land to find out how much the land was going for. So we knew how much to we would be paying him for us to move back there.

[Jade Warshaw]

Here's the reason I'm asking these questions. I'm trying to get inside of the brain of the son in law here.

[Caller]

And I'm kidding.

[Jade Warshaw]

The only thought, because you're the only caller on the line, right? So the only thought that I could pull up in my brain is maybe this guy was thinking, hey, they said they're going to buy me out. They haven't bought me out yet. Who knows what's on fire in his life. Maybe he thought, whatever, they're not going to buy me out. I'm going to force the sale of this by just selling it myself. I don't know, I'm just trying to think what could be going on here because this is a extent, like five years is a big timeline here. So I'm trying to figure out what, what could have gotten lost in translation. Either way, I think the first advice we gave stands, which is you go in front of the probate judge and say, hey, here's what's going on.

[Caller]

And do you know if you have to pay an attorney to do that for you? Because that's. That's my main question. If we should pay attorney fees for such.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I would have gone through the attorney who was dealing with the executor, but it sounds like you can't find him and he's not talking. So now, yeah, I'd be calling up that circuit court or whoever, whoever you've been in contact with and saying, what do I have to do to get in front of a judge? I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know. And I've never had to deal with this. I say, what do I have to do to get in front of a judge? Judge. Because the executor of the will is not doing what the will says and then go from there, I'm guessing, yeah, it's going to cost you a little.

[George Camel]

Bit, and it's going to cost you your piece, it's going to cost your time, and it's going to cost you your money. And so I would just tread lightly before you pursue this for the next five years, all to find out there's nothing there. And that's going to really add insult to injury here. So I would try to get all the evidence you can all do, all the homework you can get all the family members you can involved, get a copy of the will, get documentation of everything you can, all the communication with him or lack thereof, and then see what happens. But it might be worth at least reaching out to an attorney to see what the next step would be. Confession, folks. When life gets really hectic, I don't take time to plan my healthy meals. Some days I can't even remember what a vegetable looks like. That's why I keep field of greens handy. It's a superfood powder made with real fruits and veggies selected by doctors to help your heart, lungs, metab metabolism, and more. I mix field of greens with water, I shake it up, and I'm ready to go. And to tell you the truth, I did expect it to kind of taste like compost, but it's really delicious. Plus, field of greens promises your doctor will notice your improved health or you get your money back. So go to fieldofgreens.com Ramsay for 20%.

[Jade Warshaw]

Off your first order.

[George Camel]

That's fieldofgreens.com Ramsay to save 20% on your first order. Nathan is up next in Bozeman, Montana. What's going on, Nathan? How can we help today?

[Caller]

Hi, I was calling in because I'm trying to figure out my next Steps on trying to build wealth and spend time with my daughter after my wife has left.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness. I'm so sorry. When did she leave?

[Caller]

About six weeks ago.

[George Camel]

Is this a very sudden thing or were there marital issues beforehand and you saw this coming?

[Caller]

There was a few marital issues, but I feel like she left very prematurely. We haven't. We hadn't even been married a year yet when she had left.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow, so you have a young daughter. How. How young is the daughter?

[Caller]

I actually have a daughter from a previous relationship. She's 12, almost 13.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so married less than a year, wife takes off.

[George Camel]

Is the daughter living with you full time?

[Caller]

Yeah, I have full custody of her.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so are you filing divorce? Because I wouldn't touch much of this until a divorce, because some of it. I'm guessing some of it's in her name. Talking about the debt.

[Caller]

Mostly a lot of debts in my name. But there is, like, a car that she took out dead on before we got married.

[George Camel]

Is that in her name alone or do you want it to.

[Caller]

It's just on my name. But I did co sign for a truck for her brother.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[George Camel]

Yeah, you're on the hook for that one. If he doesn't pay, is he making payments?

[Caller]

He's making payments, yes. I've also talked to him about him refinancing into his name, so I'm hoping that he can go through with that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, good luck. I mean, he couldn't get the loan without you before, so.

[George Camel]

Yeah, that's scary.

[Jade Warshaw]

Chances of that happening might be slim unless something's changed for him recently. Yeah. I think the first step is if this marriage is over, like ended officially and figure out is she going to. Is this going to be a situation where you guys can sit down together and figure out how to just divide this right down the middle. Are you going to have to get lawyers involved? But I would not start on this until you know how it's going to land because I wouldn't want you to end up paying something you didn't need to pay or think that something wasn't going to go on you that does end up going on you, that sort of thing?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Do you have contact with her?

[Caller]

No, she left the phone and hasn't talked to me since.

[George Camel]

She left her phone.

[Jade Warshaw]

Are you sure that she left and somebody didn't? Something foul play didn't go on. That sounds kind of odd.

[Caller]

Well, I do have contact with her sister and her mother because they're not happy with her choices, and so I do have contact there. So I know that she's alive. She just moved to, like, a town 30 minutes away.

[Jade Warshaw]

Got it. Okay. Okay.

[George Camel]

Well, there's going to have to be some level of communication. I don't know if that's going to have to be through a lawyer if you can't get in touch with her. But we've got to get this thing settled because there's no legal separation right now. Even you guys are still totally legally married.

[Caller]

We are totally legal married. And I'm trying to do things the. The biblical way. I hope that there's. There's reconciliation, but there was quite a few problems with parenting and whatnot, and I. She's with another guy right now, so that's not looking.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's not looking too good.

[George Camel]

What's your total debt?

[Caller]

I would say the debt that I have for my car and credit cards is about 4,500 and the truck is 28,000.

[George Camel]

Okay. That you cosign for.

[Caller]

Correct.

[George Camel]

And what's your question specifically today that we can help with?

[Caller]

Well, I'm emotionally, I'm trying to move on, and I have a job that's about 40 hours a week. And I also do, like, Instacart and Spark, just like, delivering groceries to people. And I don't want to spend all my time working because I want to spend time with my daughter. But I'm trying to also find that good comparison because I know that she's going through a hard time and.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I think. I think that, you know, we. We hear this question a lot, which is, you know, I prioritize my family. Am I. Is it bad to work more? Is this a negative thing? But I do think that when we think about the priority of our family, there's kind of like subcategories underneath that. Like, what does that mean to prioritize and take care of my family? And part of that is I go to work and I make sure that I have financial stability so I can provide stability and peace in our life. That's part of taking time, and that's part of prioritizing your family. You could say that also spending time with them follows falls into that priority. Right. But it's not the only thing. Time is not the only way that we prioritize our family. It is one of the many ways. So I think if you can view it like that, it'll kind of free you up to realize, okay, the time I do spend with her, I'm going to make that very quality. But it's also so important for me to go out, make sure I have the stable job, make sure I'm working, paying off this debt, able to stay in whatever living situation you have, all of that sort of thing.

[Caller]

Yeah, I'm in a public housing right now, like state funded housing.

[Jade Warshaw]

And see that's proven my point. Like we got to get out of that because that, there's no, you know, that doesn't feel stable at all.

[George Camel]

What's your income?

[Caller]

It's about 33,000 with my full time job.

[George Camel]

What's your full time job?

[Caller]

It's working as a mental health technician in a child's hospital.

[George Camel]

Okay. What's the upward mobility look like in that field? Because that feels awfully low for a full time job at a reputable facility.

[Caller]

Right. I think there's, there's potential to move up, but I'm not sure what the pay scale looks like.

[George Camel]

Okay. That's for the long term. I think there's sort of some, you know, stages here we need to work through. One is the current urgent, putting food, you know, on the table, making sure the lights, bills are paid. Can you cover all of your bills right now with your monthly take home pay?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

And cover all the minimums on your debt payments?

[Caller]

I can, yeah.

[George Camel]

And then how much is left over after all that?

[Caller]

I haven't created a budget and that's the first thing that I need to do. I'm taking the Financial Peace University class through my church.

[George Camel]

Good.

[Caller]

Right now we just did the first lesson.

[George Camel]

Awesome. And does your daughter know about your financial journey? Obviously she knows about mom, what's going on there? How is she doing? What are her urgencies?

[Caller]

I think that it's, that it's to be there for her kind of. That's, that's what I feel, but I'm not sure, you know, I know that I want to build wealth and I'm trying to figure out a way to do that.

[George Camel]

But right now we're trying to survive. Yeah, building wealth is great for the next 10 to 20 years, but right now she's got an absent dad who's just in, frozen in grief right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, I think you gotta silo this a little bit into the different buckets of what's going on because right now it feels jumbled up. And I understand that because you're going through a lot financially, you're going through a lot emotionally, you're going through a lot career wise. Like there's a lot here. So there's the housing situation, like that's a line item like of thought. Then there's the fractured marriage. That's a line item of thought. Then there's the financial struggle. That's a line item of thought. And then there's making sure my 12 year old daughter is okay. Right. So there's all these different things that are going on. Are you speaking with anybody to help you sort through all this other than us? A professional?

[Caller]

I am, yeah. I'm meeting with a therapist.

[Jade Warshaw]

Good.

[Caller]

That's Christian therapist.

[Jade Warshaw]

So, okay, I think, I think you need that. I think you need somebody who's going to help you give you some actionable steps for everything. Money does touch all of these areas, but there's a lot deeper issues that are going on that I think you need to figure out. What's the priority? Because it's going to be very hard to tackle all of these things at once. So you need to figure out what is the top priority for me today to work on and what's my goal and at what point do I move on to the next thing. Getting off this call, George, I'd say the first thing is to start putting a clear end to this marriage. And that looks like filing for divorce so you can start building some closure there. Hey guys, what's up? It's Jade Warshaw. And look, if there's anybody who knows about student loan debt, it's me. My husband and I had $280,000 of it, but we were able to dig ourselves out. And you can too. If your student loan payment and interest rate are burying you, refinancing could be the solution. Now, I recommend contacting my friends at Laurel Road today through their online application. You can get an initial rate quote in less than five minutes. And if you have a more complex situation, you can schedule 30 minutes to talk to an actual human being. Thank goodness Laurel Road makes it simple. There are no fees involved and you could save thousands over the life of your loan. Remember, you should only refinance if it makes sense in your situation. So if you're looking for a low rate or a shorter term so that you can pay off these student loans fast, talk to my friends at Laurel Road about their competitive interest rates and how you could actually get a lower rate by signing up for autopay. Listen, nobody's coming to save you from your student loan debt. If you want it gone, you can't mess around. Go to LaurelRoad.com Ramsey to find out more about student loan refinancing. Again, that's LaurelRoad.com Ramsey.

[George Camel]

We love an excuse to give you guys a deal. And so good news for you. The memorial Day sale is here four days only. You can get our most popular hardcover books for 12 bucks. Select Questions for Human Humans decks for 11 bucks and more. Books include Building a Non Anxious Life, Breaking Free from Broke. That's Mine. Baby Steps, Millionaires. Plus lots of other products like Ramsay Merch Questions for Humans Decks. A lot of stuff on there. This is the stuff that helps you take action with your money, your work and your relationships. You can make some real progress on what matters to you. So go check out everything we've got going on ramseysolutions.com store or if you're watching on YouTube or podcast, click the link in the Description. Sale ends on Monday, so jump on it. Jade wanted to sing Jump on It so badly that I did belt it.

[Jade Warshaw]

The last time I tried that though, I got called out. They're like, jade, this, this song is no longer like politically correct.

[George Camel]

Oh, wow. I thought it was like an FCC violation. They just, we can't do this anymore.

[Jade Warshaw]

No, it's just think about it. And then I thought back on it and I was like, yeah, this song is a little sketchy.

[George Camel]

Wow. Okay, good. Good to know. I'll stay away. AJ's in Orlando. Up next. What's going on, AJ?

[Caller]

Hey, how's it going?

[George Camel]

Great. How are you?

[Caller]

So I'm great. Me and my husband are both currently out of debt except for our mortgage, which we bought a house recently.

[George Camel]

Cool.

[Caller]

But. And I know that the Ramsey program doesn't endorse ever going back into debt after you're out of debt, but we are considering taking out a loan to build a mother in law suite in my backyard for my 82 year old grandmother.

[Jade Warshaw]

Look at you trying to throw that guilt on us by saying it's a mother in law 83 year old grandmother.

[George Camel]

Oh, okay. Is she in very poor health? What's the reason for her moving in with you guys?

[Caller]

So she's slowing down for sure.

[George Camel]

But you don't want her in the house. You want her to like, you want to build her a dog house in the back.

[Caller]

We both have very strong personalities and we both agree that that probably wouldn't work.

[George Camel]

Okay, what's the in law suite gonna cost?

[Caller]

So we think we can build something pretty nice for around 50 to 60 thousand dollars in our backyard.

[George Camel]

But she's gonna have to come into your house for like everything, right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Or will she have her own entrance?

[Caller]

So it would be her own entrance and her own kitchenette and her own kind of little garden area and like.

[George Camel]

A shower and all of that?

[Caller]

Yep.

[George Camel]

For $50,000.

[Caller]

Yep.

[George Camel]

I've got a bridge to sell you. Are you guys doing this yourself? Are you gonna just go to Home Depot and try to like hammer it together?

[Caller]

No. So we're looking at a couple of, like the kits that you can get. And so some of the work we might do ourselves after we have the kit to save on cost.

[Jade Warshaw]

What do you mean by kit?

[Caller]

So they have like, you know, like modular home kits. So.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Or like, you know, like there's, there's like it comes up a little bit cheaper because then they're not having to put the house together on site. They put the house together before and they either bring it to you or.

[George Camel]

Essentially grandma's living in a souped up shipping container.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. And this would be nicer than a shipping container.

[George Camel]

And souped up. That helps.

[Jade Warshaw]

This is so that as she ages, if you need to care for her, she's on site. Is that why that.

[Caller]

That is the goal. So she also has. Oh, my gosh, I can't remember what it's called, but she gets very dizzy sometimes. And so my fear is vertigo. Falls and she vertigo. That is it. And she. If she falls, she's in Texas. And you know, we, we talk every couple days on the phone, but, you know, nobody checks on her that often.

[Jade Warshaw]

So she's in Texas. You're in Orlando. No, you're in.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. So is there. I'm just thinking through this. Here's where I'm thinking. A, it's debt. You were never going to say to do that. B, I'm wondering what this does to the value of your home. Because a kit doesn't sound like a great thing if I'm looking to buy somebody else's house. And then the third thing I'm wondering is if the goal is to be able to take care of her. What would it look like to just put her in an apartment that's near you?

[Caller]

So Orlando rent is very expensive. She also currently lives on. So it's a family ranch property that just. She lives on down in Texas because nobody else lives in Texas. So I just think that, like, her going from living with all of this open land to putting her in an apartment would be a rough transition for her.

[Jade Warshaw]

You're squeezing her into the little kit as it is.

[Caller]

But we are, we are on an acre property, so.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Okay.

[Caller]

You know, we have outdoors available that she could sit outside and fill fresh air. And she's not super close with her. Like you're not.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Up against what would happen. What would happen with her Property there, would you?

[Caller]

So it's currently in an undivided interest between my uncle, me, my brother, and my grandmother.

[George Camel]

Wow, that sounds super simple and not complicated at all. So what would happen? You can't sell it then because there's too many people involved.

[Caller]

Yeah, there's too many people involved that it would make sense to sell.

[George Camel]

Would they buy her share out then?

[Jade Warshaw]

Mm.

[Caller]

We have talked about trying to buy her share out.

[George Camel]

Wouldn't that be you buying her share out?

[Caller]

It would. It's not something that we can do right now. Since we just purchased our home. We're not looking to try and purchase that other part of the property.

[Jade Warshaw]

What about. What about the other family members? So, okay, you guys are taking on this burden of taking care of a person who is a family member to many. Is there anybody else who's willing to kick in and say, hey, if you take grandma, that's, you know, you're. You're paying a financial cost and a just lifestyle physical cost. You know, amongst the brothers and sisters, if it were my mom, there's four of us. We'd all be thinking, okay, what. What are we all chipping in to make sure mom's okay? So is that a conversation that you can have with siblings to figure out, like, what's the budget here to make sure somebody's here to take care of her? And she's, you know, got a living situation that works.

[Caller]

Right. So my brother is not financially responsible in a way that he could. He could support that. And then she has two sons, one that lives in Tennessee and another that does live in a different part of Florida, that they would never take on the cost of having her come live with them or near them.

[George Camel]

So this is all on you for the rest of her life.

[Caller]

Well, and it's not something that I really regret, like, this woman has poured into me.

[George Camel]

Oh, sure. This is family.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Caller]

It's something that I'm very happy.

[George Camel]

I'm just making sure you guys are good to take on that for the rest of her life, which could be 20 years.

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, let's go back to the apartment thing, because I want to clarify. I'm not saying that's it forever, but it is it until you guys can save up the 50 or 60,000 and get this kit. What's wrong with that? I'm just trying to keep you free. That's my goal here. You guys worked really, really hard to get free. And.

[George Camel]

And I'm wondering, why does she have no money?

[Caller]

So it's not that she. So she Lives. She is very small expenses since the house is paid off and it's on the ranch. So it's not that she doesn't have any money.

[George Camel]

What is her income?

[Caller]

Like, so she has Social Security, and I'm not sure what her Social Security pays her a month, but. And then she had some savings that she got from my grandfather.

[George Camel]

So I'm wondering, can we use her money to fund this or cover her apartment versus you guys taking it on?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Because you're going to be paying for everything from here on out.

[George Camel]

Why not use her Social Security to pay for an apartment for her or even like a assisted living community?

[Caller]

So it's possible, and we haven't gotten in depth into finances with each other yet, that she would. She would contribute some of it. So, like. But if we paid $60,000 for a kit, she probably wouldn't be able to afford the full $60,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, how much was it did she get from. How much is in her savings from her husband?

[Caller]

That. That I don't know.

[Jade Warshaw]

So we need to find that out.

[Caller]

Very frugal.

[George Camel]

Well, she might have a million sitting in there, and she's just very frugal. Yeah, she might have a dollar sitting in there. We don't know.

[Caller]

She's too generous to be a millionaire.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, let. That doesn't make sense. Hold on, let's say this. Let's say this. If you're going to do the very generous thing that I think that you're wanting to do, which is say, hey, we want to take care of you. You've got this health issue. We want to make sure nothing happens to you. You've poured into us like you said, then I don't think it's unfair to say, what can you contribute? Because the truth is, as we age, it is our job to make sure that somebody can take care of us with our own money. It's not supposed to be. The burden is not supposed to be passed to somebody else. Even if you don't feel that it's a burden, you going into debt is. And it's not a bad or wrong thing to say. Grandma, what can you contribute for your own care as you age? Because we want to make sure. We want to know what there to take care of you. I would not go into debt for this, aj I think you want to go into debt for this. And I think you're thinking of all the reasons why you need to instead of.

[George Camel]

My fear is you're paying for this thing. Long after she's gone, you still have a payment on this kit, I wouldn't do it.

[Caller]

As moms, we have enough stuff that we're juggling without pacing through a huge grocery store for hours and paying premiums for name brands.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's why you need to try Aldi. Aldi makes shopping for groceries more affordable, saving your family nearly $4,000 a year and way easier.

[Caller]

They take the guesswork out of shopping.

[Jade Warshaw]

With better choices like their exclusive Aldi.

[Caller]

Brands, so you can save money and time and focus on what really matters.

[Jade Warshaw]

So stop paying more and start shopping smarter at Aldi, where you'll save with.

[Caller]

The lowest prices of any national grocery store. Find a store near you today at Aldi Us. That's Aldi Us.

[George Camel]

The Ramsey Show Question of the day is sponsored by why Refi? If you're buried in defaulted private student loans, you're not alone. Reach out to Y Refi to see if they can build a custom plan. To help you dig out, visit yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey may not be available in all states.

[Jade Warshaw]

All right, today's question comes from Toby in Pennsylvania. They say, I'm seeing some mortgages advertised with only 1% down required. Is this a feasible way to get a house if we don't have enough for a 5% or 10% down payment?

[George Camel]

You owe me a Coke.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow. Jinx.

[George Camel]

These just break my heart. It's just these too good to be true advertisements where they go, hey, and they're everywhere. It's like, bad credit, no problem. Come take out a loan at 98% interest. It's fine.

[Jade Warshaw]

Ye.

[George Camel]

That's kind of the vibe with these.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, it is. And think about it. You know, you want to make, when you buy a house, you want to make money at the table immediately. Right? It's. It makes you feel good. All of it's good. And any money that you're putting down that is less that you're paying a month. Right? So let's not forget that. I think sometimes people think that, like, the down payment is some sort of, like, consequence you have to pay for, like, getting the house. It's like you got to pay the down payment.

[George Camel]

You're going to waive the down payment. You can take out 100% on the loan.

[Jade Warshaw]

Like, that's, that's not a win. Like that. That's not a prize that you get. So I think reframing it in our minds, that 0% down or 1% down is not a prize. It's actually putting you in a negative position. Not Negative, but in a less favorable position when you buy this house. And so that's part of it. You know, we want to know that there's equity there right when we move in. That gives us peace of mind. And the bigger part is if you're not putting anything down, I want to know what this payment is getting ready to be. Because when we're putting money down, we're making that payment lower and lower and lower, which is it's a smaller and smaller percentage of our, our, our world and our monthly budget, which is what we're aiming for. So the question I would have for you is why do you want to put 0% down? Because if you're telling me you can't afford to put 5 to 10% down, you're also telling me you can't afford a home. Because what I find all the time, and this is the sad part, people will go in and buy a house for three or four hundred thousand dollars. They can't afford the. And then when something like the AC breaks for 3 or $5,000, they can't afford it and they go into debt for it. So you got to make sure your mind is right. Homeownership is an expensive endeavor, and it's more than just the monthly payment. I mean, that is definitely the starting point. But this is something, it's your biggest asset you're going to have. And you want to make sure it's a blessing and not a burden. And if you go to that thing and say, hey, I can't afford 5%, I'm sorry to tell you, you just can't afford to buy yet.

[George Camel]

Yeah, and there's a ton of red tape and very strict rules to even qualify for any of these. And even if you do, guess what? They're going to get you a different way with a crazy high interest rate with tons of fees built into the loan cost somewhere else that you're not seeing because you're not paying attention, you're just starry eyed, you got private mortgage insurance to pay.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's right.

[George Camel]

And I've never seen this work out where someone's like, this was a great idea. We can totally afford the mortgage. It's usually broke. People trying to get into a house before they're financially ready and they see these advertisements, which if it's being advertised, that's probably a sign to you to step away.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I hate to say it, George, but you make an excellent point, which is so true. A lot of times these deals are marketed to folks who truly can't afford It. And it's like, it's marketed as your way in or your window in, but really they. You're. They're kind of like treating you like a sucker. It's like, this guy will fall for this. We can get them to go for this. Because they're so desperate. Right.

[George Camel]

And kind of knowing that they prey on these people. I mean, it's borderline predatory. A lot of these USDA loans, FHA loans, even VA loans. Hey, veterans, zero percent down.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, gosh.

[George Camel]

And you're like, kill you with a fees. You're causing financial harm because they're getting into a home they can't afford, but they think they can because the lender said they could.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's right. That's right.

[George Camel]

Stay away.

[Jade Warshaw]

Just beware. Just beware. Don't let anybody prey on you. You're not desperate. You're not behind. You're running your race. And when you. It's you against you. So when you hit that milestone of buying the house, that was when you were supposed to cross that finish line. Just remember that.

[George Camel]

Yeah. Don't let a lender tell you when it's time to buy a house. You decide. Sage is up next in San Antonio, Texas. What's going on, Sage?

[Caller]

Hey, how's it going? I had a question. Basically, I'm 25. I just had twins two weeks ago or three weeks ago.

[Jade Warshaw]

Congrats.

[Caller]

And I actually had a stroke last week, a small one. But I'm doing better now and I'm back at work, actually.

[George Camel]

My goodness.

[Caller]

I. Yeah, I have. I also have a toddler. He's two. And that being said, about two years ago, when my son was first born, I got into a really horrible financial decision. This is before I knew the Dave Ramsey show and everything that y' all preach about. I got a car for my wife because I. We needed two vehicles. I was working out of town. And when I say I have a horrible interest rate, it's horrible. It's 22%. It was a stupid decision. I'm debating on either doing a voluntary repossession. It's not that I can't afford the Vehic vehicle, but it's just I've had the vehicle two years and $2,000 has been paid towards the principal. 500amonth payments. Another thing being said, I did recently get approved to get refinanced at a lower interest rate. Still not great, but 13%.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'll take it.

[Caller]

I'm basically asking if I should refinance it or just go ahead and do a voluntary repossession.

[George Camel]

Why can't. How far underwater are you?

[Caller]

It's. It's pretty bad. The vehicle is worth 7,500 and I owe about 18, 2. It's when I. It was a horrible decision on my part at the time I was extremely, extremely desperate for a vehicle. Went to the first place I could. Didn't even look around. She needed a vehicle and I needed my truck for work. I was working about four hours from home at the time and staying out of town. And she of course had our newborn son, my oldest one, who was currently 2.

[George Camel]

What other debt do you have?

[Caller]

I have a credit card owe $400 on. I'm actually going to pay that off today. And then I have my truck which I owe $7,000 on that. The truck loan. It is a low interest rate because I did a collateral loan on it. We moved into a house renting it and it was. What's the truck, the trucks worth? Pretty much what I owe on it. It's worth about 9,500. And then I have a vehicle that is paid off, another truck. So my. The reason I was debating voluntary repossession the Jeep was I would give her the truck that I currently owe on. It's a. It's a nicer, big back seat, it'll fit all three of the kids. The double stroller in the back and it's got the best AC I've ever.

[George Camel]

Why can't you drive the paid off truck? Yeah, sell the truck.

[Caller]

I'm currently doing. I'm currently driving my paid off vehicle for work. I'm a welder. And then my other truck, it's.

[Jade Warshaw]

You said there's 2,000 in equity in that one.

[Caller]

Yeah, I could probably. If I were to sell this one, the paid off one, I could probably get about six or seven thousand dollars for it.

[Jade Warshaw]

So why can't you sell that one and drive the one that's got 7,000 to go?

[Caller]

It's kind of a funny situation with that one. That one. I, I don't necessarily make the payment on it, if that makes sense. I'm my. I have 12 siblings and my younger. One of my younger brothers is actually making the payment on it every month. So he pays the insurance, he pays the payment. It was to kind of help him out in a sense and to kind of get rid of that payment for me.

[George Camel]

How is that helping him out? Well, because he's making a payment on.

[Jade Warshaw]

A car, he doesn't drive on it or did you guys co sign together?

[Caller]

No, IT loans completely in my name. My dad wrote us up a contract to where once the, the loans paid off, the title goes to him. And then if for some reason he doesn't want the vehicle by the time he pays it off and everything he put into it is he does not get any of it back. It would just go towards the loan balance.

[George Camel]

And then I was, okay, this financial inbreeding needs to stop. This is chaos what you guys have done to your family's finances.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's kind of a sticky situation because he's 18 and he's, he was, he went out and about and he was going to be in the same situation I was in. He was actually calling. He called me for advice today. He was about to. I said, man, I'm the last one.

[Jade Warshaw]

You want to call for advice, so let's not go down. That's not. Trace that rabbit too far. So the car is supposed to go to him. There's 2,000 in equity in it. He's been paying the note. Can you just get this out of your hair and just.

[Caller]

Yeah, so that's our next step with the, with the bank. We're actually talking to the bank about getting the truck that I have the loan on out of my name and financing it into his name.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

The only situation with that is because he's only 18, they're wanting to give him a lot higher interest rate.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

But that's nothing down or nothing.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's not your problem. You need to give him the ultimatum of, hey, this weekend we either go and move this into your name or I'm keeping it and I'm doing what I will with it. Like that ends this weekend. That's. That's what I'm doing.

[George Camel]

And then what? What's your household income right now? His wife staying home with the kids?

[Caller]

Yeah, she's a stay at home mom. I make about currently probably $5,000 a month net.

[George Camel]

Okay. You guys have a lot of car in your life. You either need to save up the difference that you're underwater on or you need to go get a loan for the difference to lower your debt amount. I don't know that you qualify for that. But do not do a voluntary repo. It's going to destroy your financial life. You're going to sell it at auction for pennies versus what you could sell it for, and then you're still going to owe the difference. Do not. Let's be honest. Shopping for health insurance can be confusing with high costs, complicated terms, and customer service that doesn't really serve you. Most folks just Pick a plan and hope for the best. See, insurance companies don't work for you. They work for themselves.

[Jade Warshaw]

Meaning they love it when you overpay.

[George Camel]

So you need a guide on your team to help you make the best choices. Health Trust Financial works for you. They're not salespeople. They help you find the health insurance option that makes sense and saves you money. The fact is, health insurance is one of the biggest expenses in your budget. But most people who work with Health Trust Financial end up saving $500 a month. Imagine putting that kind of money toward the baby steps. My team has worked with them for over 20 years, and they've served thousands of people just like you. They're the only health insurance broker that's Ramsey trusted to help you.

[Jade Warshaw]

So stop throwing money away and get.

[George Camel]

The health insurance that's right for [e-mail] that's healthtrustfinancial.com.

[Caller]

Foreign.

[George Camel]

From Ramsey Network. This is the Ramsey show where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell, joined by Ramsey personality Jade Warshaw, and we're taking Your calls at 888-255-225. Be brave. Call us. We'll help you take the right next step for your life and your money. Haley is going to kick us off in Huntsville, Alabama. What's going on, Haley?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi.

[George Camel]

How are you doing? Great. What's going on in your world?

[Caller]

So we are about just over $60,000 in debt. And we are wondering how we can get ourselves out of this situation and what the next steps are.

[George Camel]

How'd you get into it?

[Caller]

Bad choices, bad decisions.

[Jade Warshaw]

What kind of debt is it?

[Caller]

Auto loans, some hospital bills and a little bit of credit card.

[Jade Warshaw]

Can you break it out for us by amount for each of those categories so we kind of see what we're dealing with.

[Caller]

Yes. We have 44,000. Just over 44,000 in car loans. How many cars? Two.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Is it split even like 20 and 22 or what is a it?

[Caller]

Oh, no, mine still has 26,000 left. And my husband's we just got. And it has about 18,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, gotcha. Okay. What else?

[Caller]

And, and then the. We got about three loans combined. That's about 13,400.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

Two are kind of personal loans and.

[Jade Warshaw]

One was a shed. Okay, so 13,000 in loans. What else?

[Caller]

Then about 750 in credit cards. And then hospital bills is almost 2,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, cool.

[George Camel]

What's your household income?

[Caller]

Together we bring home about 90,000 a year.

[George Camel]

Awesome.

[Jade Warshaw]

Let's Take home. Okay, good.

[George Camel]

Are the. Is that the car that you just got? Your husband's. Is that still worth something since you just took out that loan? It's worth more than 18.

[Caller]

Well, Kelly Blue booked it, and it says it's about worth 12,000. So you just got it down?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, gosh, I just got it. Did you roll over? Did you roll over? Bad equity? No, negative.

[Caller]

I got it myself. I got it as a surprise to him because I started working because I've been a stay at home mom. So I got overly excited making money and made a bad decision.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so what happened then? Because, you know, you've been in this mindset of the. The person who just bought this car is now the person who's calling. So what happened that triggered you to go, wait a minute. This is. This is not good.

[Caller]

Kind of just seeing it all together and I don't know, I was. Something was going through me. I guess I got a little excited because I was finally making money that I made versus him. And I guess I got excited and.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thought he deserved what he said.

[Caller]

Something nice. He loved it. He's quite different from me. I don't think he cares as much about the debt.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, I do.

[George Camel]

That could pose a problem for this journey you're about to embark on, Right?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Because we're gonna. We're gonna suggest some extreme changes, and he's got to be on board with that. Do you think he could get on board?

[Caller]

Y' all are gonna. Y' all gonna hit on my head. Y' all gonna tell us to probably sell some stuff. And I was like, I already know what they're gonna say.

[Jade Warshaw]

But what's he think to that?

[Caller]

He usually disagrees with me.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. All right.

[George Camel]

Would he agree with you to sell these cars to get out of this debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. Because you'd be taking back the gift you just got him.

[Caller]

Yeah, I've wanted to do that, but together it's 19,000 negative equity. And we've tried to get a loan to cover that difference so we could sell them, and we cannot get a loan.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. The good news is, here's the good news. The cars together, they're not. You know, you could reach in and pay these off probably over time. The. The. The 750 in credit cards doesn't scare me. You can. You should pay that off this month and cut those credit cards up and be done. You should feasibly be able to reach over and pay off the $2,000 of medical debt really fast. That's out of your life. And now We've got three, you know, loans dealing with actually the personal loans. I think you could probably break those up in the snowball and knock those out relatively quickly. So there's some parts of the debt free journey that really are. This is the debt and I'm just locking in and I'm. There's no get out of jail free card that I can cash in. I've just got to work more, you know, pick up an extra job, sell some of the things I like and live on hard. Yeah.

[George Camel]

My guess is your expenses are pretty high because as you guys have made more money, you've increased your lifestyle.

[Caller]

Yeah, we have. Including all the debts, it's about 5,000amonth with regular bills, everything else.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. So that should leave 2500 of margin, right?

[Caller]

Yeah. And I don't know where that's going.

[George Camel]

That's the key word.

[Jade Warshaw]

So we're going to give you every dollar before you get off the call. And I want you guys, this is date night this week. I want you. You've already kind of foreshadowed that you're going down this path. I want you to tell him, hey, I called in the show. They gave us this gift with the caveat that we would make it our next date night. Going to sit down and we're going to list everything that we're spending money on. I want you to have the. The bank statements from the month of May ready. Right.

[George Camel]

To see here's really what's happening each month.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. And so what's going to happen is you're going to do May's budget, even though we're already in May, and you're going to see how much you're probably already over budget. Right. And then you're going to start June's budget together on the right path. So it's perfect because you'll be all ready to start afresh for June and then from there on. Yeah. With the 2500. Yeah. You're knocking out the medical debt in June. You're probably going to find. Because you're going to cut back more. So you're going to be able to pay off the credit card in June as well. That feels really good, doesn't it?

[Caller]

Yes, it does.

[George Camel]

And would he be willing to cut up cards and never use a credit card again?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

You said he'll agree with you. So if you say, hey, we're cutting up the cards, I'm gonna. We're only going to use money we actually have. We're not going to have a promise that will happen. Because I found that that changed it for me. Haley. When I was getting out of my debt, I realized that cutting up the card was one of the best things I did. Because it's. It's burning the ships. It's saying there is no option to go into debt. I froze my credit, so I couldn't even open up a line of credit if I wanted to. And do you see what I'm saying? You have to add friction back into your life as you've gotten more out of control.

[Jade Warshaw]

And, Haley, another thing that I want you to talk about when you guys do this budget date night, because George is right. You got to stop with the credit cards. But my. My thought is, if you tell your husband this. What's his name? You don't have to tell us.

[Caller]

It's Chase.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. I was gonna say we can call him Biff.

[George Camel]

I was gonna guess Chase. I love a Chase from Huntsville.

[Jade Warshaw]

Let's say you gotta tell Chase the deeper meaning of why you want to do this. Because if it's just, we got too much debt, we gotta sell these trucks, we gotta sell these vehicles. He's gonna be like, what. What is happening?

[George Camel]

What happened to the woman that just impulsively got me a surprise truck?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. So you've gotta. And this might take some soul searching for you, Haley, to sit back and go, what do I really want? What is it that I'm trying to achieve and why you trying to achieve it? Is it peace? Is it stability? Is it, you know, some sort of identity that you're searching for? Because you did mention that when you started making money, it made you feel like, oh, I'm here. So there's something there that if you can articulate what it is for you first, and then now you'll be able to articulate it for him, and then that's probably something he's going to be able to connect with you on. Right. He might not get on board with, let's just cut up our credit cards because it's a smart thing to do. He might not get on board with that. But if you say, for the first time in my life, when I made a little bit of money, I felt like I was here and I was seen. And I realized I don't want that to be for not. I want that to mean something, and I have a chance to be here with a legacy. Like, talk to him, and then he'll get it.

[George Camel]

Create the vision, and then selling the car becomes a byproduct of reverse engineering this vision. That's a very different story than we got to sell the cars because Dave said it's, I want peace in my life. I want freedom. I want our kid to not know debt. And we've had debt our whole marriage. And we've got to change our family tree. It starts with us. Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance or they don't have any at all.

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't understand this, John.

[George Camel]

Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're going to die or something. Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey.

[Jade Warshaw]

The only reason to not have life.

[George Camel]

Insurance is if you hate your wife and kids. And I immediately went and got term life insurance insurance. That's a gut punch.

[Caller]

And. Oh, you're telling me.

[George Camel]

And for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse, they've lost somebody important to them. Me, too. They don't know what to do next.

[Caller]

Me, too.

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, you're gonna have a crisis.

[George Camel]

Here, and, you know, you got two options.

[Jade Warshaw]

While you're sitting and talking to a.

[George Camel]

Young widow, she's concerned about how she's gonna invest all this money properly and.

[Caller]

Not mess this up, or she's concerned how she's gonna eat tomorrow. That's exactly. These are the two options. And take care of your dadgum family, man.

[George Camel]

Term life insurance can replace income, pay off debts, cover funeral expenses. So your family can actually have the opportunity to just be sad. Yeah, to just miss you. That's exactly what it's supposed to be. It's saying I love you to your family. Term life insurance Jeff Zander and the team at Zander Insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years. They're the only people I trust. Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. Hey, folks, how would winning $5,000 in cash change your life? This month we're giving $5,000 to one grand prize winner and we're giving away a $500 prize every week in May. It takes less than 15 seconds to enter. No purchase is necessary, and you can enter daily. To increase your chances of winning, enter the Ramsey cash giveaway until May 31st at ramseysolutions.com giveaway. That's ramseysolutions.com giveaway way. If you're tired of living paycheck to paycheck, you're wondering where your money's going. Your first step is Getting on a budget. Our team is hosting free budgeting trainings this month that you can jump in in on where you're going to learn step by step how to make and stick to a budget using every dollar. We're going to make it easy and dare I say fun. Plus you can get your biggest budgeting questions answered in a live Q and A. So spots are limited. Go sign up for [e-mail] webinar Sasha is in Baltimore. Up next, how can we help Sasha?

[Caller]

Hi guys. How are you doing?

[George Camel]

Great. Better than we deserve. What's going on?

[Caller]

So my question is I need some help trying to navigate, navigate if I should sell my house, rent my house or stay in my house. And I'm a mom of two. I have a 12 year old, I have a newborn and I'm really just trying to, I'm starting to really feel the heat of wanting to save for retirement, save for college, just having money to build experiences with my daughters and.

[George Camel]

This house is a burden. Can you not afford the payment?

[Caller]

So the payment is, it's decent. It's just that I feel like I'm one house emergency away from. So my mortgage, the mortgage I have now I also have two extra mortgages or what they call partial claims because I ran into like repairs and it really set me back and I wasn't able to make that mortgage payment. So I'm just like I'm at a space where I.

[George Camel]

So you basically owe the back mortgages payments that you missed. How much do you owe total?

[Caller]

So total is 130 like one, I would say 140 is 138 and some change.

[George Camel]

140 total between all the mortgages?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

And what's your monthly payment that you have to make?

[Caller]

1279.

[George Camel]

And what's the take home pay per month that you're bringing in?

[Caller]

About 4400. I make about 85k. A little bit over 85k.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so you're right there. Tell us what else, what other debt you have because something else is eating your lunch here.

[Caller]

Well, I have a newborn so that's my, you know the cost of having a newborn. But I also have, I don't have any consumer debt. I have a car payment and I have a student loan. That's it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. Car payment, that's all. That's consumer debt. So how much is your car? How much is your car? What's the balance?

[Caller]

Car is about 16k and my car payment is about 550amonth.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. And what's the car worth? Have you looked? If you were to sell it today and get something cheaper, do you know what you can get for it? Okay, let's call that home. Let's call that homework number one. Today when you get off the call, we want you to go on kellybluebook.com and we want you to look for private sale. If you were to sell it today on your own, what it would be worth? Because it could be, yeah, you sell that and you get 500 bucks back in your pocket. That'd be great if you can at least break even on it and then get something, you know, a little less nice in cash. Right.

[George Camel]

What's left on the student loans?

[Caller]

I guess what my issue is is even with the house thing, so I live directly across the street from a hospital. I'm able to move back in with my mom and have space and everything. But it's just. Even the idea of renting it to, like, traveling nurses and things, it's just the money for the repairs. So even just selling my car. Car. Where was that? Where's the money going to come from to buy another car that I need now?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I think it's working. It's aspirational, right? So if you say, if you look, if you do the homework tonight and you look up and you find, man, I owe 16,000 and, you know, maybe the car is worth 14, right? Let's pretend that you're at a deficit and it's 2000 now, you can at least start to, you have the information to go, okay, what would it look like for me to save up 2000? And then what could I, how quickly could I save another 5,000? And what's out there for 5,000? Right. You can start to use that as a jump off point for different ideas. Because a lot of times when you're in your situation, it feels like you're painted into a corner. And the best thing you can give yourself right now are lots of options and ideas forward. So right now, one option you have forward, like you said, is I could go live with my mom or I could rent the house. Right? You're already laying out ideas and I'm just giving you more. So. So I would say the idea of renting your house doesn't feel like the right move, because what makes home ownership stressful is you're on the hook for everything, right? And you said that earlier. You know, I, I fell on hard times, I couldn't pay for it, and now look, so if you're, if you're Gonna sell the house? If you're moving out of the house, sell it. I wouldn't move out and keep it. But is the. Is the allure to move in with mom, is it for childcare? Tell us more about that.

[Caller]

Well, the alert of moving with mom is just based on speaking to real estate agents. And the law is to get out of debt. It's really just to get out of debt, simplify, and just really try to rebuild from there. Plus, my mom would be there, so I would have the support.

[Jade Warshaw]

Is she local?

[Caller]

Yeah, she's local.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. So, yeah. So you got the 16,000. Let's. Let's look at the size of the problem. You got the 16,000 on the car. How much were the student loans?

[Caller]

Your student loans are 20, 23.

[Jade Warshaw]

Anything else?

[Caller]

No.

[George Camel]

You have 39,000 in debt and you're making 85K. This is a very solvable problem.

[Caller]

That makes me feel really good.

[George Camel]

Yeah. I think what you're searching for is a shortcut to, you know, make the problem go away faster. But you are the solution. You put this income to work. Everything above food, utility, shelter, transportation goes toward the debt. I mean, we can crunch some easy numbers here. Are you able to get your income up at all with side hustles? Drop the kids off at moms and you go to work at night?

[Caller]

Not at the moment, no. I'm not able to. And that's what a lot of the things when I was trying to think about, like, how would I like, especially with this newborn, maybe when she gets a little bit older, maybe.

[George Camel]

And it sounds like you're doing this all on your own. Dad's not in the picture.

[Caller]

I am. No, not really.

[George Camel]

No child support, no alimony?

[Caller]

No. And really, honestly, it's making me feel a lot better if I could figure out what I can do instead of just putting myself out there again to try to see if somebody else would help me.

[George Camel]

No, that's not what I'm advocating for. I'm trying to make sure there's not other income that is coming in or should be coming in to help you get through this.

[Jade Warshaw]

Here's the good thing. The good thing is, and I want to validate this, this a. A lot of times people call in and the mortgage is the problem. You. For you, that's not the problem. So that's a green check. I want you to leave off the phone feeling really good about where your mortgage is. So I don't think that's where we look for the solution. The second thing, Sasha, is there is a seasonality to life, that's very real, especially when it comes to the baby steps. Not just when we're in debt, but at different points of time when you have really little kids, that plays very majorly into what you're able to accomplish. Now, add into the equation that you're a single mom and this. It does. It doesn't change what you're able to accomplish. It changes how fast you're able to accomplish it. So there's part of this that I want you to know. Hey, as long as you're looking at this and saying, here's where I see the problem is, here's where I'm going to start to make adjustments in that area. But just knowing, hey, probably for the first year, this is going to be really tough, and I might not have the time to do some of the things I wish I could do, and that's okay. Okay. And in this time, the main thing to do is say this. Hey, number one, I am not going into any debt. Like, I've drawn a line in the sand. I don't borrow money, period. That is your numero uno right now. No matter, come hell or high water, you don't borrow money. So if you can do that, that's a win. And then number two, George, if I were, my number one goal would be I'm going to have $1,000 saved, by the way. Do you have any money saved?

[Caller]

Yes, I did save my thousand dollars for the first baby step, and I think I have, like, maybe two more days.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I was trying to figure out.

[Caller]

How I would do, like, improvements with the house and stuff like that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, improvements with the house is on down the list. I think your number one goal. First homework, I find out what the car is worth. Second financial goal is how quickly can I save $5,000 so that I can get out of this car. Because for you to get out of that car and have that $500 payment back, that is the breathing room you're looking for. And you can start to make some progress towards kicking out the rest of this student loan.

[George Camel]

Are you doing any investing right now, Sasha?

[Caller]

No.

[George Camel]

Nothing going toward 401k?

[Caller]

No. No.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Caller]

I want to get into that with.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, and you will. You will. But don't let that be the thing that's making you feel like you're behind or like something's not right. You will get to that. It is truly step by step, baby step at a time.

[George Camel]

Think about this, Sasha. If you can find 1600 bucks to throw at this debt every month out of your take home pay, you can be out of debt completely in 24 months. Worst case.

[Jade Warshaw]

Wow.

[George Camel]

Worst case if you just consistently, no matter what. Like Jay said, you're being very intentional with that budget throwing this money toward the debt. It's going to happen and that's if you don't sell the car. So you can do this. I just hope we can show you the forest from the trees and show you there's a way out that doesn't have involved selling your house, renting it out, moving in with mom. I would pause on that and see what progress you can make on your own as an investor and a person of faith. When your mutual funds and ETFs put your money into the dark side, you might feel a disturbance. Well, good news. Timothy Plan offers investments for people who want to be intentional about where their money goes. As the pioneering force in biblically responsible investing, Timothy Plan entered the investment space to offer clean alternatives to secular funds that invest in stuff you'd never willingly expose your family to. And for more than 30 years, Timothy.

[Jade Warshaw]

Plan has offered mutual funds and ETFs.

[George Camel]

That won't contradict your values or sabotage your faith. So if you're serious about investing with a clear conscience, Timothy Plan could be just what you're searching for. Contact your financial advisor today to see if Timothy Plan is right for you or visit timothyplan.com for more information. Investing includes risk, including possible loss of principal before investing, carefully consider a fund's investment objective, risks, charges and expenses contained in the Prospectus. [e-mail] Read carefully before investing Mutual funds distributed by Timothy Partners Limited and ETFs distributed by 4 Side Fund Services LLC. These days the Internet is chock full of so called investing advice from random.

[Caller]

Goobs with zero qualifications.

[George Camel]

Listen folks, you deserve guidance from someone who knows what the flip they're talking about. That's why I recommend the Smartvestor program. Smartvestors can help you find a professional financial advisor who can teach you to make your own best decisions with your own money. Get [e-mail] smartvestor again ramseysolutions.com smartvestor Ramsey Solutions is a paid non client promoter of participating pros. Learn [e-mail] SmartVestor welcome back to the Ramsey Show. If you're enjoying the show, if you ever have do us a quick favor, hit the subscribe button, hit the like button, hit the Review button, Share it with a friend. All of that really helps us spread the word. Get this message out to more people. And it works. The algorithm says, hey, let's show this to more people and we can help more people that way. All because you clicked a button, so means the world. Thank you for doing that. Alyssa is up next in Los Angeles. What's going on, Alyssa? How can we help?

[Caller]

Hi, thank you for taking my call. Sure. So I'm calling to ask if it's okay to use a portion of our children's 529 plans that we have been setting aside to help fund my graduate program.

[George Camel]

Okay, what's the graduate program?

[Caller]

It's a doctorate for nurse practitioner.

[George Camel]

Awesome. How much is it going to cost?

[Caller]

The total program is 81,000 without scholarships and grants, which I'm really hoping to get.

[George Camel]

And how much is in the 529?

[Caller]

About 48,000.

[George Camel]

Okay, so you would take all the money out and still have a deficit. How would you pay for the rest?

[Caller]

Okay, so the program I'm going to do part time and it's over five years and I'm going to try and cash flow most of it. I don't know because I'm still, I'm kind of transitioning from stay at home mom to working. I do work as a registered nurse right now part time. I don't know how much I'm going to be able to work while in the program. And so I'm just trying to figure out if I need to dip into it, you know, can. Is that wrong to be taken out of the 529?

[George Camel]

It's not morally wrong. You'd have to change the beneficiary to you, which is totally legal. It's more just, you know, knowing that you're not going to have money for your kid when it comes time for college unless you replenish this very quickly.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. How old are the kids?

[Caller]

14 and 16. And I think that their plan is they're trying to do service missions and such after high school. And so they would probably be entering college at the same time that I would be graduating. And my in laws graciously have made a 529 plan separately that could actually fund their first year of college.

[George Camel]

And then you would cash flow the remaining years.

[Caller]

Right. And actually we don't, we don't need any of my income. We live off of my husband's income. And so really like my first year out of this doctorate program, like I'd be able to give all of any income I make to, you know, my kids college.

[George Camel]

Okay, what's your husband make?

[Caller]

So after health insurance, what we taxes what we pay to retirement because we're in baby steps. 4, 5, 6.

[George Camel]

Awesome.

[Caller]

And it's about 122,000.

[George Camel]

Great. So you got 10 grand a month coming in. That's more than enough to pay your bills. So what you're really saying is, can I use these funds and then replenish them or cash flow them, you know, three years from now, four years from now?

[Caller]

Right.

[George Camel]

I think that's a great idea. I mean, as long as you're not going to debt, you're cash flowing this now. You earmarked it for the kids. But if you're saying grandma and grandpa have another fund set aside, we're going to be able to cash flow this. We've communicated to the kids the plan. You know, I just don't want them to go. I'm not doing missions. I'm going to go to a school that's $200,000. And, you know, regardless of what you say, I just want to make sure that we're all very clear about the near future.

[Caller]

Yeah. So we did. We actually did have a family council about this, and we talked it over with our kids because we're pretty transparent with finances with our kids. And so, like, they're okay. They're okay with me returning to school. They understand what we've agreed to pay for for their college. They know about the 529s that their grandparents have made for them. And like, everyone's on the same page and they're okay with it. They're supportive of it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Good.

[George Camel]

Love it.

[Jade Warshaw]

I love this green light family council.

[George Camel]

Yeah. And you're pursuing an awesome graduate program. You know, if you were just going because you were like soul searching, that's one thing just to go to more school. But this is. Is going to very much increase your income. Do you know by how much from what you're making now to what you would be making?

[Caller]

Well, so I'm just doing kind of an as needed right now. I probably make about 18,000 a year, which is nothing but registered nurses make. They can make a lot more. But as a nurse practitioner in this area, and I want to do a pediatric acute care, which is like emergencies, they could probably bring between 110, 140,000 a year.

[George Camel]

Awesome. That's a sweet upgrade. And the program seems reasonably priced for five years of school for 80 grand. Is that what you're saying?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Okay. Wow.

[Jade Warshaw]

And you'd be Dr. Alyssa.

[George Camel]

Pretty cool.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's pretty sweet.

[George Camel]

I like this plan. Alyssa, thank you so much for the call. This is great. I got a lot of, most of my family's in med. I'm the black sheep. I'm not going to do any of that medical stuff. But they're great fields and the less debt you have, the more fun it is.

[Jade Warshaw]

I think that's amazing.

[George Camel]

If you can cash flow all of this, I'd go for it. Shirlene is up next in Orlando. What's going on, Shirlene?

[Caller]

Hi, you guys. Thank you so much for taking my call.

[George Camel]

Absolutely.

[Caller]

I just wanted to say praise God for you guys. I have some hope again after putting my head in the sand. I have a lot of medical school debt and we're just in kind of, I would say, one third of the way through baby step two, but I still have a lot of medical school debt left. And so my question was, I have this high medical school debt, but I also have high interest rates on them. So I was wondering if I should consolidate to get a lower rate so that as I'm working through it, I'm not just kind of treading water.

[Jade Warshaw]

Maybe tell us more about the debt. How much is it and what are the rates? How many are there?

[Caller]

It's about, it's a 700,000 in medical school debt that has accumulated over time and it's broken down into 11 different loans and it's between 6.8% and 8.5%.

[Jade Warshaw]

Are they private?

[Caller]

No, they're federal.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, federal. Okay. Okay.

[George Camel]

My gut says I would consider refinancing before consolidating. I'm not a fan of consolidation because you're just moving the debt around and it hurts the debt snowball momentum. So I'm wondering, and Jade, I know we've got a partner over here.

[Jade Warshaw]

I was just going to say Laurel Road does do that. And so you can, can go over there, you can do a five minute consult. And I mean, they're looking at your specific situation. So I think that you 100% qualify to do that. Here's, here's the trade off and I want to be really clear about this. So sometimes when you do, if you were to do a consolidation, what I don't like about that is it groups it all together and you've got this one payment. And when we talk about doing the debt snowball, that almost feels insurmountable. But if it's something that they could go in and refinance sense, it sometimes does still lump it together. So just understand that going forward and figure out what makes sense for you, what's better. Would you rather have a couple of these that have a higher, you know, percentage or maybe it's some of them that you refinance because you're gonna have to work through this. What's you, what's you guys's income?

[Caller]

It's about450,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so how much? Okay, so it's the shovel to debt in ratio. Feels more normalized when you put it that way. Yeah.

[George Camel]

How many loans is it right now if you broke it all out?

[Caller]

It's 11.

[George Camel]

11 different loans.

[Jade Warshaw]

So yeah, I mean I'll tell you the, I'll tell you my thoughts on it. You know, my husband and I had 280,000 of student loans and the biggest one was 90,000. And the rate, I would say probably about that time the ratio that we were working with was similar to your guys's. And it's just, I'll tell you, it is daunting to look at a big old sum like that because a couple of them had been consolidated for a better rate. So I'll just let you know up front like that's what you're facing when you do that. And you have to ask yourself with the speed at which you're moving, are those percentage points worth it for that overwhelming feeling of saying I'm not going to get those dopamine hits every time I pay off, you know, one of these guys, if that makes sense.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

So a few things to consider, Shirlene, is make sure that it's 100% free to refinance, that you can get a lower interest rate. None of these are variable, right? They're all fixed rate.

[Caller]

They're all fixed rate.

[George Camel]

Okay, good. Make sure that you're not signing up for a longer repayment period and all that can just help you make a smart decision instead of just chasing a rate at all costs. But you guys can do this. I mean is this like a three year journey for you guys at end the this point to get out of debt completely?

[Caller]

Yeah, I think so. Yeah. That's what the numbers show. And we're being very intense about it and got every dollar and we're on the way and I'm probably going to cry but I had my head in the sand for so long and started out with 400,000 and then accumulated this 300,000 and I feel like you guys are such a godsend. I feel like this is exactly what God was telling me to do.

[Jade Warshaw]

I feel like we can be, we.

[Caller]

Can be the lenders, not the borrowers.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's right.

[George Camel]

Preach preacher lean. Beautifully said. We're cheering for you. You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car. But it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage to protect your biggest assets.

[Caller]

I recommend using Ramsey trusted pros.

[George Camel]

Whether you're looking for car, home, or any other type of insurance, Ramsey trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would.

[Caller]

Find what you [e-mail] insurance.

[George Camel]

Are you staying on track with the baby steps? You can take a quick quiz to check your progress and get a personalized plan made just for you. Simply head to the show notes, click on the link titled are you on track with the baby steps? And complete the quiz. Chris is up next in New Orleans. What's going on, Chris?

[Caller]

Hey, guys, appreciate it. Thanks for taking my call.

[George Camel]

Absolutely. How can we help?

[Caller]

So my wife and I were on baby step seven. I'm 36. Yeah, yeah.

[George Camel]

Amazing.

[Caller]

Appreciate it. You know, we've grinded away our whole lives, lived below our means, done all the things that you guys say. It's worked well. We've got a couple young kids at home and we're rolling into a nice summer and we've got the itch to put in a pool.

[George Camel]

Yes, My kind of call.

[Caller]

That's right. It's a lot of money. The biggest thing for us is something that we're gonna do it. We want to do it while our kids are young, but we don't want to put our retirement future in jeopardy either. You know, we want to be able to thrive in our late 40s, 50s, and 60s. So want to know what, what you guys would have to say about it?

[George Camel]

What's the pool going to cost? You got some bids?

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. To do it right, it's probably going to be about $150,000 or so.

[George Camel]

That was my guess. Yeah, spot on. Okay, that sou Right. How much money do you guys have now outside of the emergency fund? Saved up for this?

[Caller]

Yeah, like, we've done pretty well. We've for retirement and investments, we've got about three, three and a half million. That a thought?

[Jade Warshaw]

Now wait a minute.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Is this a prank call? Why are you calling us?

[Jade Warshaw]

You didn't need to ask us this, Chris.

[George Camel]

Now the caller. Now everyone listening is mad at you. Like, this guy's a humble bragger. Okay, how much do you have?

[Jade Warshaw]

Congratulations.

[George Camel]

That's non retirement that you can use on the pool today.

[Caller]

Yeah. So in those, it's about 50, 50 split between brokerage.

[George Camel]

So you cash out, you know, 150 grand of the brokerage. A little more to counter and factor in taxes. Right. Count capital gains.

[Caller]

Yeah. It would probably be a mix of that and then just cash flowing it with what we have coming in.

[George Camel]

Do it.

[Caller]

Mix of both.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, do it. And I try to cash flow as much as possible.

[Caller]

Yeah. Wow. Okay. All right. I didn't think it would be that easy. It's just we've never been accustomed to spending that. Don't get me wrong. We haven't lived scorchers. We've lived a good life. But we have tried to live below our means. So when we're talking six figures to dig a hole in the ground and put water in, it seems. Seems a little bit crazy. But that's where we are.

[Jade Warshaw]

You do have to consider one really important caveat to this whole thing, which is if you do this, you have to invite George and I over for a pool party.

[George Camel]

100%. You got floaties.

[Jade Warshaw]

Do it New Orleans style.

[Caller]

That's right. That's right. We can do it.

[George Camel]

Are you going to have a pool house too? I feel like this. You got to up it at this point. We're. Now we're mad at you.

[Jade Warshaw]

I know.

[George Camel]

For not spending enough.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. This is. This is going to start the ball rolling.

[Caller]

This is very exciting in yalls terms. Baby steps, right?

[George Camel]

And you've earned it. You've earned it. You know, a lot of people think today, man, people think all those Ramsey people, they don't want you to have a good, good life. They want you to be frugal forever. I'm like, nope, you forgot the part where it said live like no one else. So later you can live like no one else.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's right.

[George Camel]

Later for Chris is a lot earlier because he worked his butt off. My guess is they've had a high six figure income for a long time, kept their lifestyle in check and then put away the rest of that money. $3 million. 3.5 million.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[George Camel]

In just investment accounts.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[George Camel]

It's insane.

[Jade Warshaw]

And if I may. Let me. I got. I got to get on some folks real quick, if I may, because George, every once in a while my. My celebrity self goes and looks at some of the comments of the YouTube.

[George Camel]

I could have warned you against that. Let me do that, Jade. That's my job.

[Jade Warshaw]

Every once in a while I do. And you guys, what George says is right. You guys get mad at people like Chris who call in and they're. They've done something good. Don't, don't, don't be haters. Don't Sip on that hater rating. Go in the comments talking about, oh, this guy's humble, bragging he didn't need to call the show. Don't do that. He's our hope. He's the one that's we can look at and go, chris did it. I can do it. Instead of being like that, you need to be asking questions. You need to be calling up Chris and saying, chris, bro, how'd you do it at 37? You got a pool. How can I do it? That's the spirit you need to have. Not hating on Chris because he's doing well in life. Don't. Don't have that spirit. That's an ugly. My mom used to say, like, that's. You're too pretty to be acting that ugly.

[George Camel]

Oh, I like that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

My mom never told me that. She never said I was too pretty.

[Jade Warshaw]

My mom told me that, you know, here's my version. Ugly.

[George Camel]

Don't be envious. Be curious.

[Jade Warshaw]

There you go.

[George Camel]

All right. I feel like y' all are setting up for, like, a read the comments like segment where you go through. Ready to read some mean tweets you do on your show.

[Jade Warshaw]

We're ready.

[George Camel]

It is fun. Yeah. That's half my job was just responding to the haters, and I'm like, what am I. I'm dragging myself into the mud with the pigs. You know, they're not gonna know who's who in the. In the mud pit. At this point.

[Jade Warshaw]

I've responded, like, two times, and I immediately regret it.

[George Camel]

It feels good in the moment. You know, it's like Taco Bell at midnight. You're like, this feels like a good idea right now.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm a call, James. Give me permission. I'm a call somebody out right now. So I again, was silly enough to go in the comments, and somebody was like, man, Jade's guns are big, but her stomach is big too. I was like, why? Who raised you say this? He was like, jade legit has a gun.

[Caller]

What?

[Jade Warshaw]

And in my mind, I was like, what's happening right now? So I'm just selling. I see what you guys are saying. And I almost responded. I almost responded. My milkshake brings all the boys to the yard. Oh, but I. Gosh, I didn't.

[George Camel]

That would have shut down the comments section.

[Jade Warshaw]

Didn't write it. I said it instead. On.

[George Camel]

I'm a little upset. No one's ever commenting. Look at George's big guns. It's always, look at Jade's big gun. I'm sick of this, Jay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm like, he gave me a compliment. Then he gave me a backhanded compliment. That's not right. Let me live.

[George Camel]

What a time to be alive. All right, Caleb. Save us from ourselves. He's in Knoxville. What's going on, man?

[Caller]

Hey, guys. It's great to speak with you guys.

[George Camel]

Absolutely. What's your question today?

[Caller]

Yeah, I was calling to see if me and my wife should pause our tithe giving fund to pay down debt a little sooner. We currently give about 10% of our income. We save it and give it where needed, whether it's our local church or to missionaries overseas. But we were just trying to see. We'd probably save maybe 600 extra dollars a month if I were to either cut it in half or not give at all.

[George Camel]

Well, you mentioned the word tithe, which makes me assume that you are a believer and this is a part of your spiritual belief, right?

[Caller]

Yes. Yeah. My dad has instilled that into me for a long time. So I've been giving 10%. 10% for a long time.

[George Camel]

Yeah. On paper, you're like, what am I? I could save this much and get at it faster. Like they would want that. Right? Here's how I look at it. Jade may have a different take. It's kind of like saying, hey, should I stop showering and brushing my teeth to, say, 45 minutes every morning? We'd all be like, no, don't do that. This is a part. This is a part of your values, your routine. Some of you, that. That makes you who you are. And that's why I would say, don't pause this. And you're talking to the math nerd who's like, no, on paper, it's amazing. And so I'm okay with it slowing down your debt progress. Because I don't see it as the make or break of you guys getting out of debt. I see it as a core tenant of your financial values being lived out.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Let me tell you, I think it bothers you, otherwise you wouldn't have called in. And that's not me. That's just me thinking, if you didn't think there was a yin and a yang to this, you probably would have just done it and not thought anything about it. But because it is morals and values based, the fact that you called us lets me know that something for you is not quite sitting 100. So that's why I might pull back and go, if this is for me, if it's a values thing or a morals thing, if I am not feeling 100, I can't do it. Because it's that nagging thing that's like.

[Caller]

Yeah. And that makes a lot of sense. And that's, you know, I appreciate that advice. And, you know, like I said, we've been giving for a long time and I don't think it'll make and break us getting out of debt. But I was like, man, I could probably put, you know, 6, 700 more.

[George Camel]

Here's what I would do, Caleb. This is, and this is what I've done. I go, okay, how do I now create $700 of margin without losing that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Good thought, George.

[George Camel]

Do I need to work more? Can we cut other expenses? And that encouraged me to get creative without losing my values. And so I don't want you to gain progress, but lose peace. It's not worth the trade off.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I'll tell you one more. I'll tell you one more, Caleb. And this is not like any shame or guilt because you can walk around and do whatever you want from this and God is not gonna. He's always gonna love you exactly like he does today. So there's that. But I can tell you when Sam and I were paying off debt, that you're right. There is that temptation to be like, ah, you know, but actually Sam and I leaned into that and we started giving more. And let me tell you, that for us was the pop off in a lot of ways. And it's not to say you give and God gives back money to you. I'm not saying that, but I am saying there is a principle of when you have your hands open, things go out, but a lot of things come in. And it just is something about the posture of your heart that God does honor in more ways than one and in many ways other than just money. So I think, I think you know what to do here.

[George Camel]

Beautifully said. Thank you for the call, Caleb. And it's a good reminder that tithing is not a baby step. If that's a belief you have as a believer, it's something you do throughout all the baby steps. And remember, you can always give more once you're out of debt. Hey, what are you still doing here? You know the rest of the show's happening on the Ramsey Network app, right? So you got to jump over there to continue watching. You can download it for free. Just go to your app store, type in Ramsey Network. It's completely free, and I'll drop a link in the show notes to make it easy for you. So if you're watching on the app, you're in luck. But if you're watching anywhere else, this show is over for you. So jump onto the app and let the fun continue. All right, go on now. Don't make it weird. Okay, I. I got nowhere to go, so you need to go. Okay, Bye. Bye, now. All right, this is. It's getting weird over there, guys. What do we.