When Money Gets Complicated, Clarity and Wisdom Matter Most

Summary

The Ramsey Show — “When Money Gets Complicated, Clarity and Wisdom Matter Most”

Date: January 30, 2026
Hosts: Jade Warshaw and George Kamel

Episode Overview

This episode of The Ramsey Show is centered on navigating real-life financial complications — from overwhelming debt and the fallout of hidden addiction, to improving household communication, tackling tough tax questions, and rebuilding from rock bottom. With callers facing everything from six-figure debt to life-changing cross-country moves, hosts Jade Warshaw and George Kamel focus on honesty, clarity, and determination as the keys to overcoming financial chaos.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Marriage, Debt, and Addiction: Dealing with Hidden Gambling Debt

[00:29–09:01]

• Caller (Heather, Indianapolis): Recently married, discovered husband was hiding $150K gambling debt, husband unable to work due to injury.
• Gambling stopped after marriage, but the debt remains. Heather controls finances, but fears possible relapse.
  • Jade: Stresses importance of pulling credit reports & freezing credit as safeguards ([02:55]).
  • Heather: Therapy has helped, but resentment over the debt lingers.
    • Jade: “The challenge for you… is going to be not feeling resentful towards him for having piled up all this debt and now you’re having to sort through it.” ([07:05])
• Is bankruptcy an option?
  • George: Advises against bankruptcy for now — focus on “debt snowball,” smallest to largest, make four walls the priority: food, shelter, utilities, transportation ([08:28]).
  • Uncomfortable, difficult solutions may be necessary: more jobs, long hours, uncomfortable conversations with creditors and insurers.
  • Jade: “None of [the solutions] are going to be fun… But it’s something you can work through.” ([08:26])
• Action Plan:
  • Pull & freeze credit.
  • Consider additional sources of household income (even remote work).
  • Maintain relentless transparency & boundaries about financial behavior.

2. Financial Control as Abuse: Recognizing and Responding

[10:32–19:01]

• Caller (Maggie, Atlanta): Asks if her husband’s financial manipulation is abuse; 6 kids, no control over accounts, husband hides savings and unilaterally switches access ([10:38]).
  • Husband punishes her by cutting off access to family funds; insists decisions are his alone.
  • George: “This guy is 100% controlling, and that’s 100% a financially abusive situation” ([13:37])
  • Jade: “If you can’t have access…what are we even doing here?” ([17:28])
• Key Advice:
  • Demand transparency; get a debit card on joint account ([13:07]).
  • Secure personal funds when feasible ([16:18]).
  • “I'm way more concerned with your safety and security...than I am with his comfort at this point.” — Jade ([16:55])
  • Seek support and therapy; be prepared for the marriage not to survive unless radical change occurs.
  • “There has to be a come to Jesus moment.” — George ([18:52])
  • Marriage health is tied intrinsically to money behavior; abuse/control in money usually signals deeper emotional issues.

3. Repaying Family Student Loans: Moral vs. Legal Obligations

[21:21–27:28]

• Caller (Lily, NYC): Parents took out $150K in Parent PLUS loans for her education, expected her to repay.
• Moral quandary: Should she continue heavy payments to her parents’ loans if they’re making ongoing poor financial decisions (buying $60K cars, no lifestyle changes)?
  • Jade: “At that point, you signing up for these loans is no different than you signing up for a credit card or a car note… because you agreed.” ([24:21])
  • George: Advice is to follow debt snowball across all loans, including Parent PLUS. “Put all the money on the next smallest debt…that’s how this works.” ([26:32])
  • Continue payments as agreed, but prioritize her own debts if necessary.
  • Emphasizes the value of integrity and honoring agreements, even if not legally required.

4. Emergency School Balance: Facing a $36K College Hold

[27:28–31:12]

• Caller (Janae, Baltimore): Owes $36K directly to private Christian college, must reduce balance to $1K to stay enrolled.
  • School allowed balance to accrue due to initial financial aid ineligibility from poor grades.
  • Janae works 2 jobs, earns ~$3K/month, no savings, family relies on her financially.
  • George’s Guidance: Be honest with school about inability to pay; may need to pause education and work full-time to clean slate, then transfer to an affordable school. Hard but necessary.
  • Jade: “Clearly this private Christian one is costing a lot of money you don’t have.” ([30:33])

5. Windfalls and Priorities: What to Do with a Surprise Bonus

[37:01–41:46]

• Caller (Jimmy, Salt Lake City): $7,300 bonus (pre-tax), wants advice: emergency fund, overdue honeymoon, or speculative investment.
  • Both hosts are clear: establish a $1,000 emergency fund, apply the rest to HELOC (Home Equity Line of Credit) as long as it’s in debt snowball territory.
  • “Let the honeymoon be the why to kick it into gear…Let that be the way you celebrate.” — Jade ([40:06])

6. High Emotions Around Home Ownership in Later Years

[76:07–84:39]

• Caller (Sabre, Atlanta): 68 and 57, debating whether to buy a house or focus on retirement when apprehensive about taking on a mortgage late in life.
  • Income ~$120K, $100K in retirement investments, $20K savings.
  • George and Jade recommend: continue investing 15% to retirement and save for down payment simultaneously; don’t overload on retirement savings if it prevents homeownership.
  • Mortgage should be no more than 25% of take-home pay.
  • “Retirement is not an age, it’s a financial number. You get to retire when you can afford to cover all expenses from investments.” — George ([84:39])
  • Consider 15-year mortgage for increased security.

7. Crucial Tactical Advice — Surviving at Rock Bottom

[86:09–94:22]

• Caller (Keegan, Cincinnati): Living in a hotel with pregnant partner, car just totaled. Only income was Instacart deliveries. Nearly out of cash.
  • Both hosts stress “four walls” — food, shelter, utilities, transportation. Immediate action:
    • Walk/bike to nearest stores for ANY work (fast food, Kroger, etc.).
    • Approach local churches (not just for charity, but for odd jobs).
    • Communicate with hotel, explain situation, try to extend stay week-to-week ([91:45]).
  • Memorable quote: “This is the gap between you and homelessness. You understand how on fire this is?” — George ([91:14])
  • Short-term: Survive. Credit card debt can wait until back on their feet.

8. Medical Debt and the Insurance Maze

[96:17–99:39]

• Caller (Gwen, Lynchburg): $23,000 in NICU bills, supposed to be covered by insurance but claims delayed. Hospital refuses to meet, now in collections.
  • Strategy: File a formal dispute with collection agency (certified letter). Demand itemized bills, insist on resubmission to insurance.
  • “You need to keep pushing to get in touch…pester them until they go, ‘I gotta get Gwen off my back.’” — George ([98:41])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jade: “The challenge for you beyond the finance of this…not feeling resentful towards him for having piled up all this debt and now you’re having to sort through it.” ([07:05])
• George: “This guy is 100% controlling, and that’s 100% a financially abusive situation.” ([13:37])
• Jade: “If you can’t have access…what are we even doing here?” ([17:28])
• George: “Marriage is not an age, it’s a financial number. You get to retire when you can afford to cover all of your expenses from the investments you have.” ([84:39])
• Jade (to young couple on brink of homelessness): “Hit the pavement. Make a list of everything in a two to three-mile radius… apply everywhere.” ([91:14])
• George: “This is the gap between you and homelessness. You understand how on fire this is?” ([91:14])

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Important Timestamps by Segment

| Timestamp | Topic | |-----------|------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:29–09:01 | Marriage & Hidden Gambling Debt (Heather, Indianapolis) | | 10:32–19:01 | Financial Abuse in Marriage (Maggie, Atlanta) | | 21:21–27:28 | Family Student Loans Moral Obligations (Lily, NYC) | | 27:28–31:12 | $36K College Debt Balance Problem (Janae, Baltimore) | | 37:01–41:46 | How to Use a Large Bonus (Jimmy, Salt Lake City) | | 76:07–84:39 | Homebuying in Late Life (Sabre, Atlanta) | | 86:09–94:22 | Living in a Hotel on the Brink (Keegan, Cincinnati) | | 96:17–99:39 | Medical Debt & Insurance Fight (Gwen, Lynchburg) |

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Additional Highlights

• Tax Talk 2026:
  • Standard deduction increases: Single $16,100; Married Filing Jointly $32,200 ([67:09])
  • Federal brackets adjusted for inflation; clarified difference between marginal and effective rates.
  • “Don’t let Dave Ramsey be your Why. You need something more.” — George ([61:41])
• Two Types of Emergency Calls:
  • Couples trying to plan, and people fighting just to keep the lights on.
• Compound Wisdom:
  • “Time in the market beats timing the market.” ([46:31]) — stay invested, ignore scary headlines.

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Conclusion & Takeaways

This episode is packed with tough love, emotional support, and no-nonsense financial guidance. Whether grappling with trust and transparency in marriage, planning against overwhelming odds, or rebuilding after disaster, Ramsey’s team takes each situation as unique but leans on core principles: open communication, relentless honesty, action over avoidance, and a focus on practical, incremental solutions over magic bullet fixes.

If you’re lost or overwhelmed by money problems, clarity and small wins matter. Control what you can, stick to the plan, and don’t be afraid to seek help or draw boundaries — even (especially) with the people closest to you.

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For more advice or to work the Ramsey Baby Steps with expert support, visit www.ramseysolutions.com.

Transcript

[A]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today.

[B]

Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union studio, this is the Ramsey Show. I'm Jade Warshaw. Next to me, George Campbell. Taking your calls, going to the phone lines where we have Heather in Indianapolis, Indiana.

[C]

Heather, what's up, H. Hi.

[B]

How are you guys doing? Good. How can we help?

[C]

Long story short, I got married in August, and once we combined in some finances, I found out that my husband had a lot of gambling debt. I had a baby in October and my husband tore his Achilles in May. So he's currently not working. And I just went back to work from having my baby. Basically. I found out in December that he's got 150k in debt. Most of it is from gambling, and he didn't think he was going to be alive to face the consequences that led up to this debt, unfortunately. But he met me and we got married and had a baby and things have changed.

[D]

Wow.

[E]

So you quite literally saved his life, Correct?

[C]

Yeah, we kind of both saved each other and, you know, that's why I fell in love with him, I guess.

[E]

Wow. So did you know about this, this gambling issue before you got married?

[C]

I knew he gambled. Right. Like when we won 25,000 in Vegas. It's great. When he lost 16,000 in one day, it's not. So I knew about it. I just didn't know how bad it was until after the fact. Right. I started asking more questions once I knew.

[E]

Yeah. How long of a process was this that he went into all this debt before you were married and during.

[C]

No, it stopped as soon as we got together. But he gambled like seven years maybe.

[B]

So over the course of seven years, it's accumulated 150,000.

[C]

Correct. He's got two payday loans. He's got some 401k and then just whatever on the app you can, like, take money. I'm not a big gambler.

[B]

So is he still current? Is he currently. Because you just said he's not accumulated since you got married.

[C]

So he has. He hasn't continued to gamble since we got married, but he hasn't paid any of his debt.

[B]

Are you sure that he's not. How do you know?

[E]

If he's stuck at home all day since May and he hasn't opened a gambling app or went to a website, I would be shocked if he's not going to Gamblers Anonymous.

[C]

Well, we did get into therapy and did some couples counseling. But I control all the finances. So, I mean, unless he's doing something behind my back and taking out additional loans, there's nothing, to my knowledge.

[E]

I would be pulling his credit report to get a full picture and freeze his credit. Have you done that?

[C]

I haven't freezed his credit, but I did pull up and found out, like, all the creditors that he has.

[E]

So he was withholding this information. This wasn't just like. Well, he did let me know. You found this out?

[C]

Correct. It kind of got like breadcrumbed along. Right. And then once I knew my spot, I was like, what's happening? Where's all your money going? What's what? How did we get in this situation?

[E]

Okay.

[C]

Then he was open and honest. Right. That's how I got help and took control.

[B]

Okay, so you guys have. It sounds like you've turned the. The corner. This is no longer happening. You've got control of the money. You've done all the. The due diligence there. So how can we help today? Is it. How do I pay this off? Is that just the biggest question?

[C]

Yeah, it says, I want to know how we approach a judgment this large. Is a snowball method realistic in this situation? Should we consider bankruptcy or are there other options?

[B]

Is this only debt of all the 150?

[C]

Yeah, 153. The house is in my name. The cars are in my name. I don't really. I only have like 4000 maybe credit card debt. It's all his debt.

[B]

Okay. The cars are paid off? No. Okay, so what's up on the car? Tell me all the debt.

[C]

I owe 127,000 on my house. We have about 4,000 left on my car to pay. He might have 11,000 left in his truck to pay. We got a $53,000 judgment on the one creditor, 19,000, the other one. And then he took all of his 401k out.

[B]

Okay. Okay. So what's you guys income is? I mean, I guess he's not working yet. Will he go back to work? Tell me more about that.

[C]

So he tore his Achilles and he's currently healing. I hope and pray he can go back to work. He's got a physical at ups, so he does have a good job and makes good money. But right now he's not working. Only I am, and I make $68,000 a year.

[B]

Okay, and what did he make when he was working?

[C]

Each year is a little different, depending on overtime, but at least six figures if he's not like 95 to 1 10, depending on the bonuses and how many hours we get.

[E]

Is there any disability income coming in or worker's comp, anything like that?

[C]

He was on workman's comp, but they cut him off. They only gave him six months, and then they stopped. So it's all in limbo right now. We're waiting for his IME and what to do.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

Is he able to walk on it? What is his current status?

[C]

He's in physical therapy, so he just got into a shoe in December. And, like, he can't really do a lot of steps. He cannot drive, like, going from the gas pedal to the brake. So he still has some healing to do, and it's kind of all on me.

[E]

Yeah. Well, that's. That's really stopping you guys from being able to crush through this debt. Right now, you're just in survival mode until we get his income back in place. Is there anything else he can do that isn't physical to bring in some income?

[C]

No, like, he can't walk or drive. So, like, I don't know.

[E]

I'm saying any other job. If he can't work right now, he needs to do something, even if it's from home. Can he do customer service?

[B]

Right. His mind is not broken. His Achilles is broken.

[C]

Correct. But he's watching the baby. So then we would have to figure out childcare right now. And I just picked up a second job.

[B]

Is there any family around that could help with that? Do you have a local church? Is there anybody that you can reach out to? Even if it's part time? Right. Because the baby sleeps at night. So even if he's doing some sort of night customer service. Right.

[C]

Yeah. Like, we can look into that. But with workman's comp, it would definitely. Like, I don't want to commit fraud on that.

[B]

He's not getting paid anymore. Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. I don't know how any of this works. I've never been in a situation like that before.

[B]

So here's what I want. I want you to be open to solutions, because I think that you're kind of camped out on me. We'll just file bankruptcy. But I want you to be open to the solutions that George and I give. And I just want to be upfront in saying they're going to all suck. Like, none of them are going to be fun and none of them are going to be things that you want to do with your time. They're going to be things that feel like impositions because they are. They're going to be very uncomfortable. It's going to require him to do jobs and work that he doesn't want to do at times that he doesn't want to do it. Like at night when most of us are watching Netflix. It's going to cause you to be doing things that are uncomfortable, like calling workman's comp, whoever that is and figuring out what does it mean? Are we getting any more money? Will there be any repercussions if we go ahead and work since the payments stopped? Right, right. These are all the things that you guys are going to have to do. And the challenge for you beyond the finance of this, Heather, is going to be not feeling resentful towards him for having piled up all this debt and now you're having to sort through it. You're having to have this discomfort in your lives because of it. I would not file bankruptcy, you know, just yet, George. I, I would work through this. You're going to have a timeline on your horizon. But he heard his Achilles. He's not. He didn't have heart surgery. So he's going to recover. He's going to go back to work. It's just really hard right now.

[C]

Correct.

[B]

I'm sorry I had to get you off for the clock, but I really, I really, really want you to understand that this is something you can work through. I would do the debt snowball, which is what you asked. Smallest to largest minimum payments. And right now, if all you can do is the four walls, that's okay until he gets back.

[A]

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[B]

All right, back to the phone lines we go. We've got Maggie, who's in Atlanta, Georgia. Hey, Maggie.

[C]

Hi. Yes, I'm trying to find out if the way my husband is treating me financially is considered abusive or is it if it's acceptable and what I should do.

[B]

Oh, boy. Tell us more.

[C]

I'm in my mid-40s. So is he, and we have six kids. And I have been financially dependent on him for 20 years. Well, more than our entire marriage. I don't work and I've never worked. Last year, he. He artificially reduced the amount of money in our family income so that it was below how much we needed to have just sufficient funds. And so over the course of the year, we basically blew through all of the extra savings that were in that account. And then towards the end of the year, there were some medical problems with our family, and we really tipped the budget over the top. We did not go into debt because he's putting aside money somewhere else also. Where do you know he's putting it into savings accounts. I used to be able to see them, but I can't see them anymore because he hid them.

[D]

He. He.

[C]

Like, I don't because I'm dependent and I'm not really that into the finances stuff. Like, I could see them through a budgeting app, but now I can't, so.

[B]

Yes.

[E]

And that was all intentional.

[B]

Yes.

[E]

And he's doing this to punish you?

[C]

Yes. So he sent me a text saying that since I wasn't ready to talk to him, he just went ahead and made decisions himself. And so he cut me off from the family credit card, which was in his name. Right. It was a card for him. And he told me that he had reduced the amount in our family budget more substantially and that he told me to use a credit card debt. Two months before then, he had asked me to open in my own name. And I didn't. Like. I didn't know that that was going to be a problem. But now he wants me to use that, and obviously that makes me financially responsible. But he said he was. He threatened to. To ruin my credit and not to pay anything that went over. So now I feel really nervous to use that credit card at all because I'm not the only one drawing from this account like he draws from the account.

[E]

So he's controlling what amount is even in the account for you to spend on the family?

[C]

Yes.

[E]

So can you use a debit card attached to that bank account?

[C]

I don't yet have a debit card, but if that's a good option, then I could go.

[E]

So your name isn't even on the bank account?

[D]

It is.

[C]

My name is on the bank account.

[E]

So you should be able to get access to a card tied to that account. You can go down to the bank and ask for one. Okay, I would do that today. And that way you don't need to use this credit card. You don't need to even have the chance of racking up any debt. And then it becomes an issue of, hey, we don't have enough to cover the bills. And I don't even know what we need to cover because you have access to everything and won't let me even see it. And so you guys have some deep marriage issues, and the financial part is just a symptom.

[B]

Yeah, this is for me. It's a major problem for me. This has nothing to do with finances. I mean, obviously what George said is important just for the here and now, but this guy is 100% controlling, and that's 100% a financially abusive situation. So tell me. I guarantee you this is not the only place that he's asserting control. Guaranteed.

[C]

Well, I've recently been walking out of that with a therapist because I've just started to assert my own autonomy.

[B]

Okay, and what does that mean?

[C]

I. I stopped presenting things to him as a, can I do this? Or whatever, and just doing what I need to do. Like, I'm not doing anything stupid. I'm running a house.

[B]

And what does that work?

[C]

Well, sort of. He's not happy about it, but, yeah, he's not. Like. Like, the only escalation is him.

[B]

I don't know.

[C]

I guess you could call it, like, berating or that kind of thing. Not. He's not like, physical or anything, but.

[B]

And you're okay with that?

[C]

Well, I do believe that he will get better.

[E]

What makes you believe that?

[C]

The Lord told me.

[B]

How long have you been married?

[C]

Over 20 years.

[B]

And how long has he been asserting this berating behavior?

[C]

Since before we got married, but I was also a part of that. Can I ask you a question like that?

[B]

Can I ask you just. You went there, so I'm going to go there with you. Do you think that you have to be in the house for him to get better, or do you think you could be somewhere safe and he could get better? You think he. Do you think you have to be there for him to berate you, or do you think that you could be somewhere safe, him not berate you and get better?

[C]

So that's kind of like what caused this whole thing, is that I basically refused to sit there and listen to him berate me. And I told him that I wanted to have conversations by email. So that's why he said that I wasn't talking to him.

[B]

Understood. But you're still living in the house. No. Yes. Okay.

[C]

And most of the days are peaceful. It's just.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

He has some growing to do for sure.

[B]

Understood. Okay.

[C]

Well, I have one other question about money.

[D]

He.

[C]

We got Christmas gifts that were like a check. I got one in my name. He got one in his name. And I mentioned putting mine in my own private account. He didn't like that. He said that that needed a lot more conversation. So I was really wanting to know if it's wise or foolish of me to put this large cash sum into.

[E]

At this point. You're protecting yourself because I don't know if this marriage is going to survive. And so at this point, you have to then go, I need to create my own bubble over here because this person isn't safe.

[B]

Yeah, I 100% say that.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

So that is actually wise to do in this moment. And I know God told you, but it doesn't mean that this marriage survives. Sometimes he. Maybe it takes this marriage not working for him to get better. I don't know. I hope this marriage survives, but I'm also not. I'm not a betting man, but I'm betting he's not going to change tomorrow and just go, wow, I had a revelation. I've decided to give you full access to the accounts and be transparent. For the rest of my life.

[C]

Right.

[B]

I'm also thinking about your safety and security. You're just not in a financially safe or secure environment. Therefore, your kids are not either. So there's part of me that is. I'm way more concerned with that, obviously you called this show than I am with his comfort at this point at all. Because there's kids involved. And if you can't have. If you can't have access, if you're home taking care of the kids, but you're not allowed access to money that it takes to do such work, then what are we even. What are we doing here?

[C]

Right.

[B]

So I'm concerned about that. I'm with George.

[E]

I have a concern. There's also something more nefarious happening, some financial infidelity on his part of why he's hiding this. If you are correct in that there is no wild overspending happening, then he's hiding this for a different reason that may be beyond just control because he doesn't trust you. And so that is also something to consider here. And so I would demand transparency. I would demand that you have equal access to the money and that you have an equal vote in this marriage.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

And if that doesn't happen, then you guys need to go to counseling. And if he's unwilling to go to counseling, you go alone. And then you'll have to make your own decisions on whether this is safe and healthy.

[B]

Does he go to counseling or is he willing to go?

[C]

We've tried in the past, but, yeah, he left it, didn't want to do it anymore.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Maggie, do you think then that it's wrong if. If he made the decision unilaterally not to put his entire income into the account?

[B]

Yeah, I think that's wrong.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

I think that's very.

[E]

My wife stays at home. She has full access and transparency into everything that we do. There are no hidden accounts. There's no mine in hers. She sees the budget. I see the budget. She can check the savings account at any moment. That is a healthy marriage. And any other picture is going to lead to unhealthy behaviors and an unhealthy marriage. And so we can't continue on this way and pretend like it's all going to work out.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

There has to be a come to Jesus moment. And that means him going to counseling as a last ditch effort to go, hey, if this is going to work, you're coming with me and we're going to figure this out.

[B]

Yeah. I think, Maggie, from where you sit, you called about a financial issue. But, you know, George and I both know money touches everything. And it's never just compartmentalized. It's never just money. These. These characteristics float into all the other areas of our life. And I know based on what you said, what you're experiencing is not just happening with the bank account. There's a control issue here. And the fact that this other person is not interested in bettering themselves, whether it be through counseling or through changes of behavior, that's. That's a big red flag. And I know you've devoted 20 years to this thing, but, man, oh, man, please, please, please keep yourself and your kids safe and do what you need to do to do that.

[A]

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[E]

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[B]

You're listening to the Ramsey Show. We've got Lily who's in New York City. New York. What's up Lily?

[C]

Hi. To reference Dave, Are you better than you deserve?

[B]

I think so. How about you?

[C]

I hope so. So I, I have student loans myself. I'm in baby step two. I have a thousand dollar emergency savings fund and then my dad and mom collectively have about $150,000 of parent plus loans in my name or not in my name. They're legally theirs, but they took them out for me to go to college. And as George would say, it's kind of like a sp. I pay them back. That was about 10 years ago. So the expectation is that I pay for them. But. And they recently changed it, changed the payment so that I am technically able to afford it. But that would almost cut what I'm paying my loans off in half and drastically increase the amount of time that it takes for me to pay my loans back. And also they're making, they've chronically made poor financial decisions and I don't want to be enabling them. Like for example, they just bought a car that's going to cost them $60,000 by the time they pay it back. So I, I don't want to make a lot of sacrifices in my life if they're not willing to change their lifestyle. And these loans are legally in their.

[B]

Name when you pay it. Are you logging on and making the payment yourself or are you giving them the money?

[C]

I'm logging on. I'm able to log on and pay the money myself from my bank account.

[B]

Okay. Help me understand, Help me understand. The last part of your argument, which is the agreement was, yeah, you pay these things off. You know that you're not arguing that point. If you pay off the 150, what's the, what's the problem with that? What's that got to do with, with them and their lifestyle? Basically.

[C]

Because, so right now if, if I were to not pay the loans at all, like it wouldn't. No one's gonna come after me. They're legally in, in my parents names.

[B]

Right, but you did agree to pay them back.

[C]

Yeah, but so I just, my thought was if I am like more fine, like it's worry about myself first and focus on paying off my things first and then helping them.

[B]

But you did. Well, you're not helping them. Hold up. You're not helping them. You told us that 10 years ago. It was from the beginning that it was, we'll take these loans, you'll pay them back. They were not, it wasn't a bait and switch. You knew that going in. So you, at that point, you signing up for these loans is no different from you signing up for a credit card or a car note in my mind, because you agreed, okay?

[E]

And this is my debt. Morally and relationally, legally, you're right. It's in their name.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

This is just as much their problem. If you decide to not pay, it's on them. But at this point, the relationship is soured because you're not, you know, Thanksgiving looks different now when they're like, you're looking at their car in the driveway going, you shouldn't have bought that. You could have paid off my, a bunch of my student loans with that kind of money. And they're looking at you going, homegirl took out 200 grand in loans and isn't paying back after she said she would. Right.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

What is your degree in?

[C]

Mechanical engineering.

[B]

Great.

[C]

I make 91,500 a year.

[B]

Great.

[C]

And how much debt do you have in your house? I have just under 20,000.

[E]

That's your all student loans.

[C]

13,000 are in our federal loans and then the other 7,000 is a private loan.

[E]

Okay.

[B]

And that's it? No other debt to your name?

[C]

No other debt. I paid off all my credit cards and I not going to use credit cards.

[E]

And no car loan?

[C]

No, I own my car.

[B]

Okay. So the, the, the parent plus loans, I'm assuming those are also broken up into probably at least four by semester, right?

[C]

I actually, there's three, but yeah.

[B]

Okay. So what I would do is I take all, all the loans, all, all the individual loans, the three parent plus loans, the federal loans, however, they're broken up. And the, the, the private loan, however, it's broken up. And I would debt snowball it. Smallest to largest minimum payments and knock out the smallest one first and put these $150,000 apparent plus loans right in there wherever they fall. Smallest to largest and just knock it out. This has gone on for 10 years.

[E]

Aren't, you know, the longer you let this hang, those parent plus loans have a higher interest rate. And so the longer you wait on this, that it's going to balloon to 175,000 if we just fight over this for the next few years.

[C]

So, okay, so the debt snowball is you make minimum payments, so my loans are lower than theirs, so I would be paying off my loans first, but at the same time making minimum payments on theirs. Is that.

[B]

So you make, you make minimum payments on all of your debt, regardless of what the minimum payment is. And then whatever the smallest loan is, maybe it's one of the federal loans or maybe it's one of the parent plus loans, whatever the smallest balance is. Not, not by monthly pay, by balance, whatever the smallest balance is, that's the one you put all the extra money on, and that's the one that you're going to knock out first. And so, and then the, the idea is you start feeling the momentum off of this, and then you feel good and you do the next. You put all the money on the next smallest debt, then that one's paid off, you have all that freed up money, and then you put it on the next smallest debt. And that's how this works. Just. That's a good clarification, a good clarifier. When you're doing the debt snowball, it is by balance, not by monthly payment. So that's a, that's a good thing to remember going forward. Thank you for the call. We've got Janae, who's in Baltimore, Maryland. Janae, you're on the line, my friend.

[C]

Hi. So I'm 22 years old and I'm currently back in college. I took around like a break for a bit. However, the college that I go to right now, it's like a private Christian college. And I owe them around like $36,000. They've been allowing me to push the balance off for the past three semesters, but they're saying that I need to get that balance down to $1,000 by the next semester. So essentially I would have to be able to pay 35,000 by closer to the end of August.

[B]

What is it? Is it because it's a Christian school? Is it because it's like, are you borrowing directly from the school or something? That it's not allowing you to wait until you've graduated to pay these things back?

[C]

No. So when I first went to college, I kind of messed up with my grades and things like that. And so when it came down to me doing my financial aid again, when I finally decided to get serious about school, school stas for just didn't cover the full amount.

[E]

Okay, so is this a payment plan directly with the school?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

It's not technically a loan. It's just a balance that you haven't paid yet?

[C]

Yes. Okay, so it's just a balance.

[E]

Are you currently going to that school?

[C]

Yes, I am.

[E]

Okay, so what's likely going to happen is they're not going to let you continue going to the school after the six months if you don't pay it. Did you get clarity on what happens then? Because at this point it may be moot for you to even go to class right now. You might need to take a gap and solve this.

[C]

So they essentially told me that if I can't get it down to the thousand dollars on its own, then I just won't be able to register for my next.

[E]

Exactly. And so you can't afford six grand a month right now. Are you working?

[C]

Yes, I am.

[E]

How much do you make a month?

[C]

I have two jobs, one through the school and one throughout this outside of school. The job that I work outside of school, I maybe can bring like 3000, possibly 4000. Sorry, possibly 2000, 2,500amonth.

[D]

And my school maybe maybe like 565 to 600amonth.

[B]

So you got 3000amonth total. Do you have any money saved anywhere?

[C]

No.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

So my family went through a rough patch so I've been giving them pretty much any spare money.

[B]

And here's the thing, you need to.

[E]

Work with their, with their office and just be clear with them. I don't have this money. I can't pay. I don't make a $6,000 a month. I got to cover my own bills. And so that might mean you can't go to school right now. You need to get to work full time, overtime, pay what you owe and then maybe go to a different school that you can actually afford. Cuz clearly this private Christian one is costing a lot of money that you don't have.

[A]

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[B]

All right, you guys asked for it and we listened. The Live like no one Else cruise is back by popular demand. This is your moment to celebrate your debt freedom with Dave and the Ramsey personalities in the Western Caribbean. You can share your story with Dave, swap jokes with George or sing karaoke with me apparently and more so if you're on Baby Step four or higher. This is your chance to join us. The cruise is going to be March 14th through the 21st, 2027 and if you register and book by February 1st, you can save up to $300 this week only. Okay, so save up to $300 this week ONLY when you book by February 1st. So guys, remember, cabins are limited. Lock in your spot. You only need a 600 deposit, a $600 deposit to lock in your spot. So do that. All you have to do is click the link in the show notes or go to ramseysolutions.com events in order to learn more. I hope I see you guys out there. It was a fun time.

[E]

Just seeing that ship brought me back good memories.

[B]

Back to the Caribbean. All right. Jessica, who was far from the Caribbean is in Phoenix, Arizona. Hey Jessica.

[C]

Hi.

[B]

What's up? How can we help?

[C]

So I'm sure you'll ask questions on more specifics but my essential question is I'm 44, married, no kids and completely debt free with a paid off home. Unfortunately, my dad did pass away about a year ago. He did own his home free and clear. I have two additional sisters. The home is worth about seven. My mom who is not married to my father and is financially set with About a million in retirement and owns her home free and clear, is considering selling it and moving it to Arizona. And our question is, should we gift this house to my mom? Obviously, I can get into specifics about our finances to see if that's a good idea, but just kind of want to know the pros and cons of that and any potential pitfalls of that decision.

[B]

So let me just make sure you said all that very quickly. So you're doing fine. Mom is doing fine. And then you have this home with your other three sisters.

[C]

Other two sisters?

[B]

Yeah, other two sisters. Do they want to sell it or do they want to gift it to her to your mom? Do they both agree?

[C]

My. My older sister and I are both very financially well off. We sold a business. We each have about $8 million invested in the market and homes that are over 1.5 million and debt free and earn about 250 a year. My younger sister does well, but she's not in the exact same position. So our thought was my mom pays her 250,000 for the house. Melissa. And I forego receiving that money from my mom. That way she can upgrade the house and do anything she wants and still be within her budget. And then she finally gets to live out, hopefully the next 30 years actually living, because she's worked her butt off her entire life and provided for us and is an incredible mom and she's never done anything for her. So where's the problem? But I don't know if there's good. That's what I wanted to hear was my hope that I didn't know if you were like huge red flag.

[E]

I mean, relationally, if everyone's good with this, if everyone's happy with the decision and Mom. Does mom actually want this house?

[C]

If she can redo it how she wants, then yes.

[E]

Can she? And she can afford to redo it how she wants. You're not going to fund that as well?

[C]

Absolutely, because we're not having her pay us each the 200. That extra 400 will allow her to do exactly what she wants.

[E]

Okay, so she's getting a free house plus 400 grand.

[C]

Correct.

[E]

That's a pretty sweet deal. Well, the one thing to think about is the step up in basis. So when you inherited the home, you get a step up in value, but when you gift it, you know, that's a different situation. And so what is the house worth today?

[C]

About 700. And my dad passed away about a year ago, so I think the basis, you know, step up is limited. But obviously when we go to sell the house, eventually, when my mom passes, if it remains in the trust or even not with her will, then we would have that amount to pay.

[E]

I mean, I would definitely work with an estate attorney on this and a CPA to make sure that you, you know, dot the I's and cross the T's here. But there's no big red flags other than understanding the financial components. Obviously your dad let this, you know, and let you guys inherit the home. I don't know what the relationship was with your mom and if there's any bad blood there and if that's odd or awkward for her, but as far.

[C]

As the money part, she'd be thrilled.

[E]

Okay. Everyone's happy.

[B]

I love the idea. I don't see why there's any problem in it. I think that you guys are good daughters, especially the $400,000 cash part. That's pretty.

[E]

That's a good place. These are good problems to have.

[B]

Very good.

[E]

I already have $10 million, so I don't need this extra house sitting around.

[B]

We needed the win. Thank you, Jessica, for the call. We needed that one. We got Jimmy, who's in Salt Lake City, Utah. Hey, Jimmy, how can we help today?

[D]

Hey, can you hear me?

[B]

I can.

[D]

Awesome. So I just want to say I'm a great fan of what you guys do for people and everything. So I unexpectedly received the largest bonus of my life this week. And I wanted to tell that where to go before my wife decided on how to burn through it.

[E]

How much is the bonus? We have to know.

[D]

Well, before taxes, we're talking like 7300 is also probably after we're like three grand or something.

[B]

Okay, well, way to go. It's your largest bonus to date. Congratulations. Yes.

[D]

And so I had a couple places that I itemized that it should possibly go, and I needed help with making the right decision. One, we have about an emergency fund that would last me till about Tuesday of next week. So wondering if. Wondering if we should do that to create. Create our non existent emergency fund. Two, we got married over a decade ago. At the time, you know, we had a lot of young kids and stuff, and we decided to, you know, go cheap. And we haven't gone on our honeymoon yet. We. I promised her we would go at 10 years. 10 years has come and went this year. And we're still not, you know, we still don't have the money saved up for that. So the possibility to spend that to take her on a honeymoon or my third option was to use it to buy the IPO. SpaceX, when it releases.

[E]

Oh, boy. Do you guys have any debt?

[D]

Yes. Yes, we do. We've been working through it. It's just home loans.

[E]

Multiple.

[D]

No, it's one. We do have a HELOC we use to purchase another property, but we'll be all the way through paying that off within the next two years.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

We'll be down to our mortgage only, which right now we're sitting at, like, a $220,000 balance. I think it's worth about 6.

[B]

How much is the HELOC that you took out?

[D]

Well, it ended up getting out of hand, and I think it got all the way up to 80, but I think we're down to owing like 40 on it now.

[B]

Oh, and how much is your income?

[D]

Which is our income? Oh, that's a loaded question. Probably about 90. 90,000 a piece, maybe.

[E]

Okay. You guys make 180.

[B]

Yep.

[E]

So this HELOC we would put in baby step two, which means bad news, bud. The vacation's gonna wait.

[B]

Yeah, you need to. You need to do what you said, which is stock up that emergency fund to a thousand bucks, because getting you to Tuesday isn't gonna work. And then. Yeah, the other two or three thousand needs to go towards baby step two. My guy.

[D]

Okay.

[E]

And I would let the honeymoon.

[B]

I'd let the honeymoon be the. Why? To kick it into gear to get this. This HELOC paid off. This 40,000. If that's all the debt you have to your name. And then let that be the way you celebrate is we're doing an amazing honeymoon once we pay this debt off, because we owe it to ourselves.

[D]

Okay. I like that plan a lot.

[B]

I do, too. I do, too.

[E]

You guys work really hard. You have a great income. And so the fact that it's been a decade and we have almost nothing in the emergency fund, we're taking out the heloc. It just tells me there are some other behavior things we gotta fix. And you guys can fix it really fast with this income. That's the good news. You'll knock out the HELOC real fast if you put all of your attention toward it. You'll get the emergency fund done real fast if you really focus on it. And then the vacation will be really fun instead of a sinking feeling like, oh, why are we here? We have a HELOC on our back. We don't have anything in savings. Why did we do this?

[B]

Yeah, that's right. So, George, why don't you explain how you arrived at putting their HELOC in Baby Step 6 versus Baby Step 2.

[E]

Yes. So when it comes to HELOCs, if the HELOC balance is more than half of your annual income, we would make it a baby's baby step six item.

[B]

Yes.

[E]

It's large enough that it feels like another mortgage in your world. And if it's less than half your annual income, put it in baby step two, inside of the debt snowball and knock it out. Because that tells me it can get rolled up in there and it'll get knocked out fast. It's not going to take take seven years.

[B]

That's right. Yeah. They were right at the line with the 80,000. Just under the line to put it at baby step two. I'm sure they're excited about. That stinks.

[E]

But you know, you throw four grand a month at, it's done in 10 months. If you can throw more than that, it's done even faster. And so 12 months from now, I think you guys could be in a place where you go, let's book this trip.

[B]

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And that's, that's the thing, guys. When you set out to do baby step two, you set out to pay off your debt. You have to have a really great why almost like that carrot dangling in front of you so that you know why you're going after this. In their case, having a honeymoon after 10 years, that's a pretty good reason why. Maybe yours is a trip that you want to take. Maybe it's to pay for your kids college, maybe it's to have your dream house. Whatever it is, your why should be so strong. Because that's going to be your ultimate motivator.

[A]

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[E]

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[B]

All right. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. We're here in the Fair Ones credit union studio. Taking your calls. George, what do we say we go back to the phone lines?

[E]

I'm down.

[B]

We've got one here in our neck of the woods. Robert is in Nashville, Tennessee. Hey, Robert, how are you?

[D]

Hey, guys. I'm fine. How are you today?

[B]

Excellent. How can we help out?

[D]

Okay, I'll tell you my questions first and then I'll give you all the particulars if you want them.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

I'm looking. I'm looking at retiring at the end of the year. And I'm looking at all the indicators. Gold's high dollars down one buckets. Moved a bunch of cash has the biggest cash cash position ever. Should I take part of my 401k and move it into my cash mutual fund for now?

[E]

How much money do you have? What's your total nest egg?

[D]

Okay. Total nest egg. My wife and I have 400k and a 401k in Roth. We have 100,000 in the high yield savings account. We plan on using that interest draw off of it yearly for part of our retirement living. My annual rate of return on my mutual funds is 10.89% over the last 23 years.

[E]

Way to go. That's exactly what we tell people you should be. So you've been doing it right? So you're. You're heavy in equities. You don't have a lot of bonds right now. What's the split?

[D]

It's. It's probably. I've been very aggressive because I found Dave later in life.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

I've been very aggressive.

[E]

It's worked out.

[D]

I'm probably 93% in stocks right now.

[E]

Dave Ramsey would like. So here's the deal. Dave is not a fan of the asset allocation theory of.

[D]

Of.

[E]

Let's move you to 60% bonds because we're spooked. Because the truth is you are missing out on a whole lot of returns because you could live another 30 years. Right. How old are you?

[D]

Well, I'm 70. My wife plans to live to be 100, but I'm gonna die first.

[E]

Well, she'll outlive you out of sheer will. That's how the women are.

[D]

She fights me. Yes.

[E]

So here you're saying you want to pull it into cash?

[D]

No. No. I have a money market fund within my Roth and in with it. Within.

[E]

Yeah. You want to pull out of the.

[B]

Market it would be basically a high savings account at that point.

[D]

Yes.

[E]

I would not do that. And is it because you're spooked by the indicators?

[D]

I'm spooked by the indicators. You know, I've. I've lived through these corrections before.

[B]

Mm.

[D]

But now I'm 11 months from retirement.

[A]

Yeah.

[E]

Here's the good news. You guys have some cash. And so if the market was way down, what would you do? You would cut way down on your spending for a little bit and maybe dip into your high yield savings and try to not touch retirement, Right?

[B]

Correct.

[E]

Which means you can weather the storm. Because here's the truth. If you ignored headlines for the rest of your life, I guarantee you, you would be twice as wealthy than the person who goes, well, I'm spooked. Let me jump out. Let me jump back in. I always say, time in the market beats timing the market. And right now you think you have the crystal ball and so does everyone else, but I'm telling you, put away the crystal ball and just keep it riding.

[B]

But, Robert, you also have the gift of time, which means you have the gift of knowledge. And think back, because you said you've survived it all. Think back on those times where there was a dip, and think how quickly the market corrected itself. What was it, a year? Two years?

[D]

Yeah, that's true. Because I jumped out when Covid hit, and what happened?

[E]

It spiked back up.

[D]

Didn't, Did.

[B]

And do you regret that?

[D]

I did, because I missed a big part of that roller coaster.

[E]

You're living proof. Most of the best days happen right after the worst days, and nobody knows how long the worst days are going to be. But usually you stick around in cash, sitting on the sidelines way longer than you should, and then you jump back in way later when the market's already back up. And so if I'm you, I'm just gonna let it sit there and let it grow. And again, if there is a market correction, not a crash. If there's a dip, you'll be able to ride it out.

[D]

Okay, well, I need. I just needed somebody to talk me off the cliff.

[B]

Yeah, we're happy to.

[E]

I hope I did.

[B]

And you're.

[E]

You're right. There are. There's indicators that are freaking people out right now, and a lot of people are taking advantage of that. And it gets clicks, it gets views, it gets you to buy their crypto and their course and their gold and silver, but, man, I would not adjust anything you're doing right now.

[B]

I wouldn't either. And like, I Said somebody like Robert, who's had 70 years to watch this all play out, he knows better than you and I, you know, me in my 30s and you in your 40s, you know that. That was a joke, George.

[E]

Thank you. I am an old soul. I'm a 70 year old.

[B]

I'm in my 40s. But the point is, he's seen this happen, and he knows better than all of us that the recovery is real. And usually in a couple of years, you're right back actually in a better position than you were before the negative downturn. So remember that, Robert, whether you're.

[E]

You're 25 or 75, heed that advice. Time in the market beats timing the market.

[B]

Yes. All right, we've got time to take Josh, who's in Minneapolis, Minnesota. What up, Josh?

[D]

Hi. How are you doing?

[B]

Good. How can we help today?

[D]

Yeah, so I'm 26 with a net worth of about 800,000.

[B]

Nice.

[D]

Thank you. And I'm just trying. I quit my job two years ago. I'm deciding whether or not I should return to that high paying job, which I do not like, or use my savings as a Runway to transition into a different career more aligned with my interest.

[B]

Why would you go back to a job that you quit that you don't like when you have an $800,000 net worth and you can use it as a Runway to get to the job?

[E]

Yeah, this is like running back to the toxic ex.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

I think it's because, I mean, to be more specific, I want to build a career as a musician. And I understand that the odds of that paying off are low.

[B]

It depends on what you mean by that. If you want to be the next Bruno Mars, maybe the odds are low, but if you want to make a career in the many, many, many ways that people work in the music industry, I'm sure there's. There's plenty of options.

[E]

Jade has lived it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

I mean, I'd love to, like, make music and, like, spend time developing marketable skills like content creation, advertising, and running campaigns where if it doesn't work out as an artist, I'd be able to find a job more aligned in that industry. I'm just trying to make sure I'm making a financially, you know, responsible decision and have enough Runway, you know, I.

[E]

Wouldn'T drain your savings just because you're trying to pursue music. You can go do marketing for a full time job and you got plenty of time, nights and weekends at 26, to do the music and try to get that off the Ground?

[B]

What kind of artist are you trying to be?

[D]

It was like pop or rap a little bit.

[B]

Okay. How old are you?

[D]

26.

[B]

26. How long have you been pursuing music or you're just getting started at 26?

[D]

I've been making music for maybe about 10 years, but I haven't effort into like, yeah, I've been releasing. I just haven't been putting any effort really into content creation or advertising or, you know, ad management or anything like that.

[B]

Interesting.

[E]

What's all that talk about ad management? This feels very separate. Are you wanting to be in marketing and you're sort of like, well, I have these skills I can fall back on in case the music doesn't work out.

[B]

Or are you using that to have.

[D]

The skills, like, to fall back on in case the music doesn't work out?

[B]

Okay, I could tell you this, you know, and this is an unpopular opinion, but when it comes to wanting to be an artist, those folks who really make it, they don't have a fallback plan. They go hard all in into it.

[E]

It's all they think about.

[B]

It's all they think about. And so I'm just gonna level with you right here. I'm not trying to shoot a dream down, but the way you're talking doesn't sound like the person who's gonna go all in on this and really go get it.

[E]

I mean, haven't you had two years on the sidelines to be working on it? What happened?

[D]

I was traveling and learning Spanish in Argentina.

[E]

Bro, don't tell me you have this dream of being a musician and you didn't do it. With this two year gap you've just.

[B]

Had, you might be a free spirit. And I do hear that. And for that reason alone, I would not go back to this old job. But I don't hear the go get it factor of sacrificing it all to be the next Bruno Mars. If I mean otherwise, send us in your tape and we'll. We'll tell you the real truth.

[E]

I used to be that guy who bragged about running on no sleep. And then I realized being tired all the time is not a flex to show up as the best George Camel I can be. I need real rest. And that's why I got Casper Mattresses in my home. The experts at Casper designed their mattresses to help you sleep deeper, cooler, and more comfortably. And they've been top ranked in both the foam and innerspring mattress categories by Consumer Reports. You and your entire family deserve great sleep. So go to Casper.com Ramsey and use code Ramsey for 25% off mattresses and 10% off everything else. That gives you up to 1200 bucks off the Snowmax mattress, which is the exact one I sleep on. That's Casper dot com. Ramsey Code Ramsey.

[B]

All right, to the phone lines. We've got Kevin, who's in Tallahassee, Florida. Kevin, you're up.

[D]

All righty. Hey, guys, I just had a quick question. I really want to be able to get my finances in order to help my new wife be able to transition as a stay at home mom. But I'm not really sure how to go about that.

[B]

Well, I love that you're thinking about that and thinking ahead. The first place to start is, is it an affordable thing for you today to move that direction? So George and I can help you with that. What are you making with her working and what would you making if she stayed home?

[D]

So right now with the both of us working, we make it's about 8,000amonth.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

That would put. Without her working, that brings us to about. Sorry.

[B]

That's okay.

[E]

I hear the carries one 4,000.

[B]

Okay. So about half.

[E]

It'll half the income.

[B]

Oh, that's a big jump. The question is, can you afford to do this? So obviously the first questions that I have are, do you guys have debt?

[D]

So she. When we got married, she came in with no debt and I came in with all the debt we just have at this point. I just have a $4,000 auto loan. I do have some credit cards that were taken to collection about two or three years ago, along with a lease card that went into repo.

[B]

How much are the credit cards?

[D]

It was two of them. One was $1000 and one was $3000.

[E]

Okay, so about a 4000 balance on that or are there more penalties and fees?

[D]

As far as I've seen, it was just a $4,000.

[E]

Okay, what's the deficit on this repo that you still owe?

[D]

So they said that when they took the car that I would just be free and clear and it would just take the seven years for it to fall off my credit.

[B]

Really? They didn't come after you for the difference?

[D]

No.

[B]

Positive.

[D]

So far they haven't.

[B]

How long ago did that happen?

[D]

About it in February. In 2025, I would double.

[B]

I would just look into that. I would hate for that to come back as like a zombie debt that you thought was gone. And next thing you know you owe like a $10,000 deficit or something.

[E]

You get served a lawsuit over this thing because you didn't pay. And One guy on the phone told you. Now you're good, man.

[B]

Yeah, I'd want whatever it is in writing that I owe nothing. And I would keep that paper laminated and, like, under glass for life.

[E]

Frame it.

[B]

Okay. So that will be your homework getting off this call. So you got 8,000 bucks in debt, nothing else to speak of, no student loans? Nothing else?

[D]

No student loans, Nothing. Currently, no.

[B]

Okay.

[E]

Do you have any money in savings?

[D]

I currently have a thousand dollars in an emergency fund.

[B]

Good.

[D]

I just got that in there.

[E]

Congrats. Is she pregnant right now? Are you guys looking to start a family?

[D]

No, we're looking to start a family.

[E]

Great. Okay, you got lots of Runway.

[D]

We're expecting to start trying within a year to be able to make this transition happen.

[B]

I love it. So, I mean, it looks like you're familiar with the baby steps. You've already got the thousand dollars saved. So next on the list is, let's pay off this 8,000. And here's a fun experiment. Let's pretend like we only live on the 4000.

[E]

Oh, I like that.

[B]

And that way we can take 4,000 this month and 4,000 next month, throw it towards the debt. Debt's gone. And in the meantime, we got to experience running our household on $4,000 a month to see how does that feel? Do you like that experiment?

[E]

And then continue putting the four grand in savings, and five, six months later, you've got a fully funded emergency fund. Now we're investing for the future. And we've experimented for months living off of your one income.

[D]

I like that.

[E]

It's pretty good. That's really the barometer. It's. Can we cover all of our expenses from my one income and still accomplish our financial goals? Which means we got to be investing 15% of our income. And for that baby, we have to have a little leftover to put towards college and pay off the house eventually. Are you guys renting right now?

[D]

We are currently.

[E]

Okay, great. So the next step after that might be we want to save up a down payment. Once baby's here, once we're investing, that might be a longer term goal, but that's really the math on it. And I hope your income continues to go up. I found that once, you know, mom staying at home, the husband's like, all right, I got to go grind a little bit. And maybe that means you're going to get a promotion. Promotion and kind of move up in your career as well. What do you do for work?

[D]

So right now I'm a correctional officer for the state okay, what's the sort.

[E]

Of ladder in your field to move up?

[D]

Well, right now we're actually looking at getting a pay raise from 23 an hour to 28.

[E]

Nice.

[B]

Excellent.

[E]

That's like 10 grand a year.

[D]

Yeah, that's. It would be super exciting.

[B]

Yeah, that's wonderful if we get it.

[D]

But. And then we can always promote up and make a little bit more. But I'm actually looking at doing a career change for a possible. An even higher.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

What do you want to get into?

[D]

I kind of want to get into being a paramedic firefighter.

[E]

Oh, nice.

[B]

That's cool. Yeah. The main thing to be think about thinking about. I love these career changing discussions. I love the fact that you're thinking about the wife being a stay at home mom. Number one thing is just to make sure whatever you do, you have savings built up because that's a bridge that you're coming up against. And to have money saved is going to help you be able to do that. And then also, yeah, just making sure you're thinking ahead, especially with things like home buying, making sure that on the $4,000, you guys feel good about it, you don't bite off more than you can chew. Especially knowing that you might have a career change coming up. I'm not sure which is going to come first if you're thinking about the career change or if you're thinking about, you know, maybe one day buying a house and getting that down payment ready. But. But as much money as you can have set aside on hand, ready to make this transition. And the most research that you can do ahead of time, kind of like what you're doing now, getting all the answers, as many answers as you can anyway, is really gonna set you up for success.

[E]

Yeah. And you may wanna make that career change before baby's here. Cause it's harder if there's a gap in income and baby's here and it's solo income, that's gonna be a lot harder. And so I would really work your way through these baby steps fast, knowing I wanna make this career change.

[B]

Yeah, that's good.

[E]

But I like that advice, Jade. You wanna make sure that, that any money move you make is from a place of stability and strength, not from desperation and weakness.

[B]

Well, yeah, then you know you're really doing what it is that you want to do. And you can kind of take. Take your time in the way that is appropriate in order to do that. So Very, very good question. Thank you for the question, George. Let's do one of these social Questions. We haven't done one of these in a while and I like them.

[E]

Hit it.

[B]

All right. This is Keith from the Ramsey baby steps community. He says, how do you get through years of the boring Gazelle intensity grind?

[E]

Wow. Listen, if it's boring, you're doing it wrong. It's that you're not sitting on the couch.

[B]

Yes.

[E]

Like, you don't have time to be bored.

[B]

That's true.

[E]

But I think he's saying it just feels like a slog.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, if you've got the average person when they do baby step two, it's really a two year deal. Right? That's. That's what we're seeing.

[E]

18 to 24 months is the average.

[B]

Yeah. And so. But there, I mean, there's plenty of you who call in and took you three years or four years. It took my husband and I seven and a half years. What was your time?

[E]

Mine was. I mean, mine was pretty fast. I had a smaller amount of debt. 18 months to pay a 40k.

[B]

Right on, right on. And so no matter where you are, there is going to be some moment, even if you're one of the 18 months who is like, I don't feel like going to my side hustle today or I don't. For the love of God, can I just order a pizza? You know, whatever it is that it is that you want to do that's gonna pop up. And I think it's so important, George, to have that reason why. Number one, because that's kind of like the North Star on this whole thing, is why do I want to do. The reason why can't just be because I want to get out of debt or because I want more money.

[E]

That's not. It's a good idea.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

Don't let Dave be your why as much as he's going to be proud of you, but don't let that be.

[B]

Your why you need something more.

[E]

Maybe baby step three is also. I mean, that one is boring. Baby step three is way less exciting than two when you're paying off debt, because three, you're just like, all right, I got to stack some cash over here. I'm not seeing much progress as far as paying off debt and freeing up the payment. You're just sort of building your little, you know, acorns for the winter.

[B]

Baby step three is a sleeper, I will say, in many ways, and I know it's hard to believe, but I actually think that that might be the hardest of the baby steps. The toughest.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

Because you thought after two like the hard part was over.

[E]

You ran a marathon and you're like, wait, there's a 5k after this. I gotta run.

[B]

Oh my God, you gotta start warming up again.

[E]

Can't catch a break.

[B]

You know, I think the big thing as far as answering the question and how to stay intense through years of the grind. For me, the unlock has been finding ways to reward myself throughout the journey. Whether you're on two, whether you're on three, whether you're on four, five and six. In baby step two, it's little things like after I pay off this amount of debt, I am ordering the pizza. In baby step three, it might be a small thing that another, but then as you move on, it's okay, I'm gonna buy the new couch. Okay, we're gonna take the vacation. Okay, we're gonna upgrade the cars. So make sure that you're rewarding yourself throughout the process. Nothing that could throw you off track, but just enough. Enough to keep you going until the next step.

[E]

Hey guys, George here. Listen, just because it's 2026 now doesn't mean 2025's ideas all go away. Some things are timeless. Like if you want to win with money, it's still the same playbook budget like your money depends on it. Avoid debt like $10 lattes and build wealth on purpose. But here's the truth almost nobody tells you. Most banks make money when you lose yours. They want you swiping, overdrafting and racking up fees because that's how they stay rich while you stay broke. And that's why I tell people to go with Fairwinds Credit union instead. They actually want you to win with money and become debt free. And their smart bundle gives you a no fee checking account, a high yield savings account, and my favorite, the new Ramsey branded debit card that says debt is normal. Be weird right on the front. It's not just a piece of plastic with your money attached. It is a declaration. It says you're not buying the lie anymore. You're taking control of your money for real. So this year, forget the gimmicks from the big banks. Forget so called rewards that keep you broke. And instead partner with a credit union that actually backs you. Working the baby steps. Go to Fairwinds.org Ramsey to get started. That's Fairwinds.org Ramsey insured by the NCUA way.

[B]

All right, tax time is just around the corner. 2026 taxes. Don't worry, George and I have you covered with everything that you need to know. George, this feels Like a. A talk nerdy to me segment. It is.

[E]

That's the. We had to brand it so that people would listen in.

[B]

Yeah. So. So. So talk dirty to me about which this year is going to be April 15th. It's always April 15th, 2026. Extension deadline, October 15th, 2026. Tell us everything we need to know.

[E]

Okay, this is the important parts. These are the changes for 2026. And the big highlights are tax brackets have been adjusted for inflation. Oh, oh. And tax rates stay the same. That's 10% to 37%. So those tax rates for the brackets stay the same. The income thresholds have increased. If you're watching.

[B]

Tell me more.

[E]

If you're watching on YouTube or Spotify, we have the visuals up so you can see the table. Because this is one of the most confusing things about taxes.

[B]

People get it twisted.

[E]

People say, well, Jade, I don't want to make a dollar more because it'll push me into the next bracket.

[B]

Yeah. Assuming the wrong thing.

[E]

Only that new dollar is taxed at the new rate. So you got to understand that. So let me go over the. The numbers. So 10% bracket is up to 12,400 if you're single, 24,800 if you're married filing jointly. Then from that number up to 50,400 if you're single, 12% bracket, and for married filing jointly, $100,800. And then we move to the 22% bracket, which is from that 50 grand up to 105,700 if you're single and up to 211,400 if you're married filing jointly. If you're doing the math at home, it doubles for those married filing jointly. Keeps it simple. And then 37%, which is the highest bracket it Any money you make over $640,600 if you're single will be taxed at 37%. And married filing jointly, any dollar you make over 768,700 will be taxed at 37%. Have you fallen asleep yet?

[B]

I wanted to, but I forced myself to stay awake in order to say the words, yes, paying taxes sucks, but making money is always going to feel nicer.

[E]

Yes. So you need to think about what the marginal tax rate is versus effective. So effective, meaning you got up into that 22% tax rate, but when you average it all out, it was really 15% is what you paid on your total income. So there you go. That's the federal brackets with the adjusted thresholds.

[B]

What about standard deduction increases?

[E]

George don't get me started.

[B]

Come on, wind it up. Let's go.

[E]

So this is. Most people will benefit from taking the standard deduction. And so this is probably you. If you're listening, the standard deduction lowers your taxable income and is now higher again for 20, 26, which is good news. So standard deduction if you're single is $16,100. So the IRS basically says, says, we didn't see that money.

[B]

It's a freebie.

[E]

The rest we're gonna touch, but that part we won't. Married, filing jointly, $32,200.

[B]

That ain't bad.

[E]

And head of household, 24,150.

[B]

So for all of you saving up every single receipt, thinking that maybe you can outdo it, you're probably not gonna.

[E]

So unless you're a business owner, you got a very complex Schedule C situation or you're self employed. Some people are 1099. Sometimes it makes sense to itemize. And you can check with a CPA or tax pro on that.

[B]

Now, there's a lot surrounding the one big beautiful Bill Act. And I know people, I know one big beautiful bill. There's a lot of questions around that. How's it gonna affect us this tax term, George? What do you have to say about that?

[E]

So for anyone that makes tips, you're happy about this? No tax on most tips, which is a first for many workers.

[B]

I love that. I have to say, I think that's great.

[E]

They're hustling out there. Yeah, let them have. And then you've got overtime pay deduction for hourly workers. So that's nice as well. If you do overtime and then senior shout out to the AARP members out there, you get a deduction. A new $6,000 deduction available whether you go standard or itemized. For taxpayers age 65 plus, subject to income limits.

[B]

Okay, do we know what those are?

[E]

Dave Ramsey. Sorry.

[B]

Yeah. You ain't getting it.

[E]

He hits the age, but not the income.

[B]

Not the income.

[E]

That's okay.

[B]

He'll be fine.

[E]

He will survive. Survive.

[B]

All right. I love that. So just a couple of smart tax tips going forward. Make sure that you're gathering up your documents early, guys. Don't wait till the last minute. You're going to need your W2s, your 1099s, any receipts. Start gathering that stuff now, put it in a folder, because they're going to need it. Also, you need to decide whether you're going to do this thing yourself or whether you're going to hire a tax pro again. If it's simple, just your basic W2, you probably could handle it yourself. But if it's a little bit more complex, you're probably going to need a pro. If needed, make sure to file your extension. Okay, File the extension, but you still gotta pay April 15th.

[E]

Yes. Don't get it twisted. It's illegal to not pay in time. It's not illegal to file the extension. So it's okay if you don't file in time, file the extension, but you gotta pay what you owe. And you can use tax planning to reduce surprises next year. I always ask my tax guy, hey, what can I do better next year?

[B]

That's right.

[E]

What are you seeing? I want to always improve and pay the government a little bit less if I get can. And so the bottom line for 20, 26, higher deductions and inflation adjusted brackets may lower your tax burden. But deadlines and planning still matter. So be proactive to keep more of your income and avoid stress.

[B]

That's right. And George, good tax planning isn't about the loopholes, although we might confine you some of those. It's about being intentional. You work really hard, don't give more than you need to to the irs.

[E]

Which is what a refund is, by the way. If you get a refund this year, just know you overpaid the government as a blessing to them, and they said, no, we can't take that. Legally, you can have it back.

[B]

That's right. That's what you're ref money that you could be putting towards whatever baby step you're on. So take a closer look at that. But for any questions around how to file taxes or if you need to work with one of our pros, go ahead and head to ramseysolutions.com taxes that's ramseysolutions.com taxes. All right, George, we did it. I feel good. That was very, very nerdy. That might be the nerdiest we've ever gotten.

[E]

No insults, no injuries. We all learned something. Use that at your next trivia night.

[B]

All right, let's go back to the phone lines. Taylor and Chattanooga, take us back down to earth. What's up?

[D]

Yeah. So me and my wife have accumulated about $92,000 in consumer debt. And we have a plan to get out in the next 24 months. But I just want to make sure it's the right plan.

[B]

Yeah, tell us, is it the Ramsey plan? Tell us what you're planning.

[D]

Well, so it's actually kind of complicated. So we owe, in bills, about $3,000 a month. That we're just trying to survive on at the moment, but we also want to take anything extra and throw it at bills. And we don't have $1,000 emergency fund. We just can't afford to do that. And I'm 100% commission based real estate agent, so checks don't always come.

[E]

But how you're saying you can afford to pay off 92,024 months, but you can't afford $1,000 emergency fund?

[D]

Not at this moment.

[B]

Why? What does that mean? Explain why you feel that way.

[D]

So, so basically my wife is a full time student and she's a full time worker and she makes just enough to cover the bills. My checks are kind of foreign and for them they have a lot of space in between them at times. So when we do make the money, we just started this plan.

[B]

Got it.

[D]

This is the first month. So the money that we just had, we wanted to make sure we were good for the next couple months because this debt really weighs on me.

[E]

What kind of debt is this? Can you break down the 92,000?

[D]

Yeah. So about $45,000 is her car and we're upside down on that one. It's probably worth about 33. So we're upside down about 13, 17 is my car. 17 is a personal loan. And then the rest is credit cards.

[B]

Okay, how much is the credit cards? So I don't have to do the math.

[D]

I'd probably say about 8 to 9,000. Okay, maybe 10.

[B]

So my first order of business, I really would be trying to get out of this $45,000 car. It's worth it to get the $13,000 loan and figure out a way to just get a cash beater, spend 4 or 5,000. I think that's going to be worth it to you. And at the end of the day, you're more like 18,000 in on a car versus 45,000 in on a car. Have you tried that?

[D]

We have not. We've looked into a lot of options into getting out of the car, but at this point we just kind of gave up on trying to get out and just more trying to pay it off.

[B]

What did you look into?

[D]

Selling it and trying to get something super cheap. But we don't have cash saved up. We're actually like, you know, at times are $100. So what you would need to do.

[B]

What you'd need to do is you'd have to get a loan for the difference. Difference. Since you don't have it, you would, you wouldn't be able to sell this car for 45000 because it's not worth that. What you would need to do is go down to a credit union, go to a bank. I don't care how you get the loan. Anything's going to be better than this 45 000. And then from there you have an irregular income. It doesn't mean you can't contribute. It just means that you need a peaks and valleys fund over to the side and use your income to build that up so you always have a month's worth of income there. That way you feel the freedom to to actually use your monthly cash flow towards the debt and towards an active budget.

[E]

And I get two jobs in between these checks coming in to keep some stability to get you guys moving on this planet.

[B]

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[C]

You're not just sharing costs, you are sharing.

[B]

Community and families have trusted CHM since 1981 with billions of dollars in medical bills shared. You can see any doctor or hospital you want with no network restrictions. And members say that often save hundreds of dollars a month compared to traditional insurance. So make a change that fits your budget and your values. Check out chministries.orgbudget to learn more. That's chministries.orgbudget. Back to the phone lines. We've got Saber in Atlanta, Georgia. That's a strong name. I like it. What's up Sabre?

[C]

Hi Jaden George. I have a quick question my husband and I are disagreeing on to buy or not to buy a house.

[B]

To buy or not to buy. That is the question. Tell us, tell us both sides of the equation.

[C]

So he is 68 and I am 57 and I feel like I don't want to take on that risk because he's older.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

So I don't know. So I have a fear factor of doing that now.

[B]

The fear factor of him being older. Is it we'll get this house. We won't pay it off in time. There's not enough money there and I'll be left if he passes with this huge mortgage. Is that what you're saying?

[C]

Saying yes.

[B]

Okay, tell us about you guys, net worth.

[C]

So we have our baby step three. We have our fully funded emergency fund.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

We have about $20,000 in savings and we have about a hundred thousand dollars in investment.

[B]

Okay. $100,000 in retirement investments.

[D]

Correct?

[C]

Correct.

[B]

And that's all you've got?

[C]

Yes.

[B]

Okay, now when you said the 20,000 saved, that's the emergency fund, or was that above the emergency fund?

[C]

Above the emergency fund.

[B]

Above. Okay.

[E]

You both working full time?

[C]

Yes.

[E]

Okay. What do you guys make as a household?

[C]

We bring home about 120ish.

[E]

Okay, and what's the plan for the house purchase and the down payment and the price? All of the.

[D]

That.

[C]

Well, that's what, we're kind of having an issue because I want to put all the extra money into retirement funds and he wants to not do that and get a chunk for a down payment.

[B]

Yeah, I, I do think at this age you're going to want to do that simultaneously because with no debt, you're going to want to take advantage of that 15%, as much as you can at age 57 and 68. How much of the $120,000 income is his and how much of it is yours? And how long does he plan to continue working? Working?

[C]

We make about the same right now he plans on working at least until 75.

[B]

Okay. Yeah, because I don't think he has a choice. Okay, good.

[E]

Do you guys have any debt?

[B]

No.

[E]

Okay, that's good news. So if you look at the baby steps, you guys are square and baby step four, which means you're investing 15% of your household income. So that's step number one. We want to at least be doing that. So for you guys at 120, that's 18,000 a year going into retirement accounts. Then anything above and beyond that we can now put in a separate account for a down payment. So based on that, how long will it take you to have a solid down payment and then have a mortgage payment that you guys can actually afford based on your take home pay? That's the big question mark. What is a house cost that you guys are looking at?

[C]

Probably around 350.

[E]

Okay, and you, we're starting from zero here with our down payment. So what is your down payment goal? Have you guys crunched any of those numbers to go, hey, we'd like to have $50,000 to put down?

[C]

Well, I, I hear Dave, all the time say 20%. I would like to have a little more. I'd like to have 60 to $75,000 to put down.

[B]

Yeah. I think for you guys equation, the way you have to look at it these days is what you have to put down to get it it to where it's no more than 25% of your take home. And at this point it usually is going to be more than that 20% rule that kind of got squeezed out with the housing market. So I would be looking in a, in a calculator and say okay, what do we need to put down? What do we need to solve for in order to have that take home pay where it's no more than. I'm sorry to have that mortgage where it's no more than 25% of our take home pay after taxes. And so that's what I'd be looking for. What's your monthly take home payment pay.

[C]

In my every dollar. We do about 6,000 average a month.

[B]

Okay. And that's just after taxes.

[E]

We've already, that feels real low taxes.

[D]

But we've, well we al.

[C]

We've already had money taken out for the investments at that point.

[B]

Okay, so what you want to do is find out the number. That's just the after tax number.

[E]

It's probably closer to 8,000.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

We put 2,800amonth into to retirement.

[E]

Oh, you guys are really socking it away. Okay.

[B]

Oh wow. Okay.

[E]

So you may want to ratchet that down. Otherwise it's going to take you seven years to save up a down payment. Do you see how we need to split the difference here?

[B]

Ratchet it down?

[E]

Now it's 1500 going into retirement which just freed up 1300 to go into savings. Do you see what we did there?

[C]

Yes.

[E]

And now we can start saving, you know, more measurably to go, hey, we can have 20 grand a year. So in three years we'll have the down payment to put down. And you know that might get you close. Right now on my calculator I'm seeing about 2,500 bucks a month for that mortgage. With the numbers you just gave me on a 15 year.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

Which means we either need to save a little more, rates need to come down a little more, the home value, we need to maybe look in a $300,000 home. So there's going to be some compromises here or we go make more and we speed up this whole process and we can increase the amount of mortgage we can take on, but we need to Also understand, seven years from now, he's not going to be working anymore. Well, now you need to be able to cover that mortgage off of whatever income you have. Social Security, you continuing to work, all of that.

[C]

Right.

[B]

So I think those are the. Those are the problems, or they're not problems, they're equations that you need to solve for in order to go into this with a peaceful state. I'm all for you guys having a place of your own and going into retirement with something that you can call yours, as opposed to in a renter's position. I think that the mortgage is the biggest line item on your budget and you want to go into retirement having control over that. So what George said is just right. It's going to take some time for you to sit down and think of this, but the advice that I want you to take away from us and that I want you to share with your husband so you guys can discuss is you got to do the investing and the saving for the down payment simultaneously. And it's really going to help you do that by keeping the investment at its proper amount at 15%. If you try to do more than that, it's really going to make this thing lopsided and it's going to be harder for you guys to do the things that you need to do to put you in the safest position in the right amount of time. So that's me final word on that.

[E]

Yeah, I'm going. If you could do 1500 to retirement and throw 3000 into the down payment fund, that's 36 grand a year. You got your down payment two years while investing. I like that plan.

[B]

Yeah, I like that plan, too. And let's kind of zoom out on this a little bit because I do think that this is something that people ask us a lot. Even if it's somebody who was in baby step two, maybe it took them a really long time to do baby step two. Maybe they're already in their 40s or something like that and they're thinking about buying a house. Once you get into baby steps four, five and six, you really guys don't want to delay. You don't want to delay the down payment really any more than two to three years. Delay it by your investing, if that makes sense. So if you think that it's going to take you more than two to three years to save your down payment, you should probably go ahead and start investing beyond that two years because we really don't want you to miss out any on any more time in the market. Is basically what that boils down to. And that's why I suggested, what I suggested with them is because they're already 57 and 68 years old, like they, they don't have the time to waste.

[E]

I'll be projecting, hey, based on the real numbers of our Social Security, what I'll be making, can we afford to cover this mortgage payment without his current income?

[B]

Yeah, that's the big, that's the big number that you're going to want to know. Because the truth is they're probably not going to have time to pay off a mortgage before he retires.

[E]

Yeah. I mean, that's seven years from now.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

And if they get the house in two years, we got five years to knock out this entire mortgage with that income. It's not going to happen. And so we need to look at reality.

[B]

Yes. And another good reason for 15 year mortgage versus a 30 year mortgage, because that's going to give her a lot more security.

[E]

She'll pay it off in her lifetime.

[B]

Exactly, exactly. So there's a lot of reasons, there's a lot of methods to the madness of what we teach George. And a lot of it has to do with setting you up to really be in the most secure position that you could possibly be in. It's very conservative. But at the end of the day, you're not going to be worried about your house 15 year mortgage. You're not going to be worried about if you have enough in retirement if you do the things that we teach in the order that we teach it. So it's super duper important.

[E]

And remember this, retirement is not an age, it's a financial number. So I don't care if you go, well, I'm 67, it's time to retire. Not if you're broke.

[B]

That's right.

[E]

So you don't just get to. Because it's time for everyone to go live in the, in, you know, their 55 plus community. You get to retire when you can afford to cover all of your expenses from the investments you have. And maybe Social Security is gravy on top, but never rely on that, especially the younger generations. We all see the writing on the wall.

[B]

All right, we know Social Security. I mean, it has the ability. I've been reading articles that say that it could be depleted as early as 20.

[E]

34 for Uncle Sam is not doing great financially. They're like $38 trillion in debt. They're running out of money left and right. And so we got to look at the cards and go, we got to Invest for ourselves. We can't rely on any government program to save us in retirement. You got to create your own ship here, build your own ark.

[B]

And of course, you'd want to do that anyway, because the way they're investing that money, obviously there's not enough of it to go around anymore.

[E]

It was never meant to replace 100 of your income.

[B]

That's right. Yeah, exactly. So let this be a word to the wise. Do your own investing. Think ahead and be proactive. Guys, work these baby steps. All right. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. We're here in the Fair Winds Credit Union Studio. George Camel, Jade Warshaw. You ready to get to these phones?

[E]

I'm your hype man. Let's go.

[B]

I'm ready. Keegan's ready. He's in Cincinnati, Ohio. What's up, Keegan?

[D]

Hi. I was calling in because we live in a hotel and we just totaled our car to that we use for Instacart. How do we recover from what part?

[B]

The hotel?

[E]

Three.

[D]

All three?

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

Okay, so you want to get out of the hotel?

[D]

We want to get out of it. First, we need to get a new car. Second, we want to get out of this hotel because she's pregnant.

[E]

And how long have you been in and why?

[D]

That's why. Because some family things with her family and I kind of. We lived up in Columbus, and she had some stuff going on with her family, and we decided to move.

[B]

Okay, did you. So you did not have your own place prior to this? You were living with family?

[D]

I was living with my parents.

[B]

How old are you guys?

[D]

I'm 21. She's 24.

[B]

Okay, so you're in the hotel. How long have you been in the hotel?

[D]

Since about July.

[B]

Oh, boy.

[E]

Goodness. What. What's the rate to stay there?

[D]

It's like. It's expensive. It's like 1400amonth or something.

[B]

Okay, 1400amonth. And what's your income? I mean, I know the car got totaled, but what are you earning?

[C]

So.

[D]

So we were earning about, like $800 a week.

[E]

Was that both of you doing Instacart or what?

[D]

That was both of us doing it together, yeah.

[E]

In one car?

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Okay.

[B]

Can I ask why? Why? Why. Why is one of you not working outside of the car? Basically, so we.

[D]

I was, but then I just had to quit my job because I wasn't getting paid well enough for us to, like, kind of survive off of it. And Instacart was just better for both situations we really couldn't control, but I.

[C]

Wasn'T Getting paid overtime and I was.

[D]

Working so much, but they didn't pay me overtime for it, so.

[E]

And what kind of job were you working?

[D]

I was working for a marketing firm.

[E]

Okay, and so you would get a marketing job today if you could?

[D]

Yeah, I would.

[E]

Okay, and how about her?

[D]

She would probably do something server related.

[E]

Okay, and can you do that as we speak? Can you work at this hotel? Hell, that would probably be a better bet right now.

[D]

Like, what do you mean? No, I've tried, but they said they don't have anything.

[B]

What about cleaning rooms?

[D]

I. They have someone who does that.

[E]

Okay, and did you not have insurance?

[D]

I did, but we only had liability.

[E]

Okay. So it's on you.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

So yeah.

[B]

What must happen? I mean, this is as quickly as you can. Instacart's not an option anymore, clearly. So both of you have got to. I don't care if it's walking down to the nearest fast food place or walking over to Walmart or Target. You gotta. You gotta get something somewhere that's within walking distance or bus riding distance.

[D]

Yeah, say I can, we can uber some places, but that just gets expensive.

[E]

How much money do you guys have?

[B]

That's why I said bus riding.

[D]

Not enough to keep us afloat for like another week maybe.

[C]

Maybe.

[E]

Do you have like a few hundred bucks?

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Okay. And do you have any debt?

[D]

Yeah, I. We both personally do. I have like five, six grand in credit card debt and she has like.

[E]

Four, so all credit cards. About 10 grand total.

[D]

Yeah.

[E]

Okay. Yeah. And there was no car loan to speak of?

[D]

No, no, we paid the car in cash.

[E]

Okay, that's good.

[B]

Yeah, that's good.

[E]

Do you guys have any friends or family that you can lean on right now? Now, a church, community, anything?

[D]

Not, I mean, honestly, no.

[E]

Okay, well, you're going to need to find something because this hotel is about to kick you out.

[D]

Yeah, yeah, I've talked to them before and we like kind of talked to them. So, like, I was hoping maybe they could help us out just by a little bit of time, but I don't know if that really is realistic or not.

[B]

How often are they having you pay? Is it every week? Is it. How often do you have to make the payments?

[D]

I do usually weekly, but sometimes they let me get like, I'll be. They let me get a little behind and it back if I need to.

[B]

Okay. Yeah, I'd be requesting. I let them know what happened number one, and say, I know I've been paying you weekly. Can I pay you, you know, at the end of the month. Can we make this more of a monthly deal? Because right now you guys are kind.

[E]

Of like, this is desperate. Can you get a bicycle off Facebook marketplace for $40 and make it somewhere and work. What is the closest retail options by the hotel?

[D]

Like Kroger.

[B]

Great. Perfect.

[D]

There's like a Kroger.

[E]

How close is it walkable? Likeable?

[D]

Yeah, within like a mile.

[B]

Okay, that's what I want you to do. That's your homework.

[E]

After this call. Both of you are getting a job at Kroger today.

[B]

Yeah. Make after this call. Literally right after, talk to your girlfriend. And you guys sit down and make a list of everything that's in a two to three mile radius. A Waffle House, Kroger, McDonald's, everything. And I want you guys, that's your field trip this afternoon and tomorrow is you're going to apply at every one of those locations until you get a job.

[E]

This is the gap between guys in homelessness. You understand how on fire this is?

[D]

Exactly.

[E]

Like, you don't even have a car to sleep in at this point.

[D]

Yeah, no, exactly. That's what made it, like, scary today is because, like, we've at least had options, like, okay, this, this. And I'm sure if I, like, it's just scary because, like, I don't. We don't know where, what the next plan is. Essentially, like, I was hoping they can help. I'm sure they. I know the owner and the manager pretty well here, and I'm. We're pretty, like, close to each other.

[B]

Good. But that's not going to last you.

[E]

Long until you stop paying.

[B]

So do that.

[D]

Exactly. I was going to say, like, that only last me maybe two weeks.

[B]

Yeah. Do that homework that I just gave you. And then the second piece of homework is I want you to find a local church, and I want you to walk up in there after you've applied at all these places, and I want you to walk up in there and say, here's the deal. And I want you to tell them exactly what you just told George.

[E]

We're scared. We're borderline homelessness. We're just, we're. We're good people. We just want to find some honest work.

[B]

Them say, I, I, we can. Can we serve and, and get a wage? Is there something can do to earn some money? We really need help, and we're willing to work in order to have it. Okay, so those are the two things that I want you to do.

[D]

Okay. I said there's like, because we gone to a church over here. A couple of times. And there was a Catholic church that kind of helped us out with rent, like not the past month. So there's people that I think may help. I just don't know if we should ask the church, the same Catholic church.

[C]

Again and be like, hey, if you're.

[B]

Willing to work, I would, I would say I'm not just asking for like benevolence. Can I work? Is there something I can do? Can I help with parking in the morning? Can I help with this or that? Do you need something out of store? Like, whatever it is, I would be willing to work and whatever. I mean, go to a couple and say, we're just trying to get back on our feet and we're willing to work and serve to do that. And I think this is, you guys can pull yourself out of this. At one point you were making $3200 a month. Right. So I want you to remember that.

[E]

And you worked at a marketing firm. And so I would be looking for that next gig so that you can afford to get a car. And that might mean we start with the bicycle and then we upgrade to the moped and then we upgrade to the beater car and then we go from there. But you just need the next right thing to get you to survive another day right now. And then long term, we need to figure out a life plan because whatever got us here ain't it? And I heard a lot of, well, we had to. And then this thing happened and the family, at some point we have to just look in the mirror and go, dude, I can only control the guy in the mirror. And everything can't just happen to us. You have to start happening to your life. Otherwise you're going to be right back here next week.

[D]

True.

[B]

Yeah. So that's, that's current order of business. Just to recap, you're. You're making a top 10 list of everything in a 3 mile radius and you're going there. You guys are literally hitting the pavement and going to apply everywhere. Then you're hitting up these churches, then you're circling back. I would work, wait, after you've done those three, those two things, then I'd circle back to the hotel and say, here's what's happened to us and here's what I did today to correct it. But just so you know, it's probably going to take a couple of weeks for this to pan out. Can I pay you the rent at the end of the month instead of at the end of this week? And that's you know, hopefully going to be your savings grace here guys. I best of luck to you. Truly. Truly.

[E]

Stay warm, stay fed. Four walls, man. That's all you need to cover right now. Don't worry about the credit cards right now. We'll get get there.

[A]

When you're tired of feeling stuck with money, there's just one solution. To get different results, you have to do something different. No one accidentally wins with money. You have to have a game plan. And that begins with our get started assessment. Go to ramseysolutions.com start answer some questions and we'll show you what steps to take next. Don't stay stuck. Take control of your money. Starting Today, go with ramseysolutions.com start.

[B]

So if you're working the baby steps, the best and the fastest way to do it is by using every dollar. It's more than just a budgeting app now. It's a plan that's built right in. The Ramsey plan is built and baked into the app people. You can track your profile progress, get personalized recommendations and coaching specifically for your situation. That's going to help you free up more money and work the pla the plan even faster. It's like having one of us walking with you every single day in your pocket, showing you the next right step and holding you accountable. So start every every dollar for free by downloading it in the app store or Google Play today. Alrighty then, let's go to Gwen who's in Lynchburg, Virginia. Gwen, when you're up.

[C]

So my question is about medical debt and who I can contact to potentially get this taken care of.

[B]

What kind of medical debt? Like how long is. How old is it?

[C]

So our son turned 2 in October. He was born premature.

[E]

What's the total medical debt? Sorry, you're breaking up on us When? Can you speak clearly into your phone?

[C]

Can you hear me?

[E]

Yes.

[C]

Okay, so we have two different totals from the same hospital.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

The first one is almost $6,000 and the second one is right at 17,000.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Wow. My goodness.

[E]

Do you guys have insurance?

[C]

We do. And we had it ever since he was born, which is my confusion.

[E]

Okay, so you're saying it didn't get run through insurance properly or what happened?

[C]

Yes, and the hospital won't meet with us to figure out where the confusion happened. And it's been over a year, so this technically isn't their responsible it.

[E]

They've sent it to collections.

[B]

Have you, have you tried resubmitting the claims through your insurance?

[C]

I have, but we're running into the issue of it being over a year old.

[B]

At what point did you try resubmitting the claims? Because they come in pretty soon after the fact.

[C]

Well, we were in the NICU for over three months. So when they didn't bill any of it until after we were out of the nicu, and we didn't start receiving, like, the itemized bills until probably October, which was close to that year, Mark, already.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

From all the hospital bills, because it took them a while to run everything.

[E]

Well, even if it's in collections, you can still dispute it. It's not stuck at that chart. And so you have the right to dispute it. You can send a certified dispute letter to the collection agency, not just the hospital. And when it's formally disputed, you actually write them a letter. They have to stop collection activity until they can verify it.

[C]

Okay.

[E]

So that's your next piece of homework, is you write this dispute letter, send it to the collection agency, and after verification, then you can negotiate, and you can ask for the patient advocate or the billing supervisor. Those are the people you want to get in touch with. The front desk people cannot help. And so you need to keep pushing to get in touch with them. You don't need to physically sit down with them, but you need to get in touch with them, pester them until they go, I gotta get Gwen off my back. They're calling. She's calling me four times a day trying to get in touch.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Cause it sounds like. It truly sounds like some of these didn't even run through insurance or be submitted. And maybe you didn't realize that, but if that kind of statute of limitations is run out, then that's what I'd be trying to make right, is say, I didn't even receive these in time to dispute them, to resubmit the claim.

[E]

And at that point, you can go, hey, I need an itemized bill. Let's rerun that through insurance. And then you'll get a final total, and then you can dispute that with collections, and they can adjust the charge, and you can then settle and pay it off.

[B]

Yeah. Which is. I'm sorry that you're going through that. That's probably the last thing that you want to be going through. You know, you got a preemie to take care of. That's tough.

[E]

Yep. And that whole world is just filled with incompetence and errors, and some of them are malicious, and some of them are. Or just people not paying attention.

[B]

Yeah. Super frustrated. Sorry you're going through that, Gwen, but thank you for the call. Mark is in San Diego, California. Hey, Mark. How can we help today?

[D]

Hi, how are you doing? I'm just trying to figure out if me and my wife are able to buy a house out here in San Diego for some background information. We've already been here three years. We're both military, so we'll be here another three years. Years. But the past three years, we've been staying in apartments and paying about $3,000 a month in rent. And together we make monthly about 13,000 together.

[B]

Okay. What kind of money do you have saved?

[D]

Yeah, so that's the thing. We only have, like, $8,000 saved. Saved right now.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

I'm not sure where all of our money is going. I mean, we do a budget, but I feel like our lifestyle is maybe, like, increased or. Or something, because.

[E]

Sounds like lifestyle creep. The more you make, the more you spend.

[B]

Yeah, you got $10,000 going somewhere is. Do you have any kids?

[D]

We don't. It's just me here.

[B]

Oh, man. Y' all are living.

[E]

And when you say we do a budget, what does that actually mean?

[D]

We actually sit down and, you know, we go over together. I think maybe most of our money is going, like, to S. Funds. You know, maybe I'm paranoid about that. Like, for cart maintenance and registration over time. Just one example. And then maybe like, savings, like, as in, like, trips or. I don't know, something.

[E]

Okay, do you guys have any debt right now?

[D]

We have zero debt.

[E]

Okay, so your next order of business is stocking up the savings account. You can keep the saving the sinking funds. That make sense. You don't need 17 of them. But if you want to have a car maintenance and repair fund with a reasonable amount of. And there, that's fine. But I suspect if I took a look at your bank statement, it would tell a different story of a lot of eating out, a lot of shopping, a lot of just kind of sloppiness around all around. But if you got control of this, you guys could stack up cash so fast.

[B]

I mean, what. What would it cost? What are you. The. The properties or the condos that you're looking at? What do they cost?

[D]

Yeah, so our. Well, our lease actually ends in May, which is why I'm kind of, like, looking at this now, because I'm trying to figure out whether to, you know, for another year, stay in this apartment or out. I'm looking about $750,000 is about where.

[B]

Yeah. Okay.

[D]

Move out of our apartments. So here's into a house.

[B]

Here's the tough part with that, with your timeline. You told Me, you've got three more years in this location. It's hard. And then a year of that's going to be spent saving for this down payment, which puts you kind of at a two year horizon. I'm not sure that I would get into that situation that you're gonna have to turn around and move right back out and try to sell that place. Is it, is it guaranteed that in three years you're moving or you'll be relocated?

[D]

It's, it's not guaranteed because like I said, we can get another three, three years here probably if we like, if we really work to get it, we could probably honestly get it. And I feel like the past three years I've been throwing my life away with just paying rent.

[E]

And I feel like you're not throwing anything away. You're buying patience here, Mark, because here's the truth. How are you going to afford a $750,000 home four months from now? What was I see on the screen? It says VA loan. Well, is that your question?

[B]

Oh, were you going to try to put nothing down?

[D]

Correct. Exactly.

[E]

Okay, let, let's play that out. Nothing down. I'll put, I'll put, let's say $5,000 down. Your payment would be about $7,300 a month. Now rent looks like a deal, doesn't it?

[D]

That's true.

[E]

So you're not throwing away money on rent. It's actually a better deal for you right now because of your, where you're living and how much money you guys have to just stay put and renew that lease and keep getting the income up, keep stacking cash away. The truth is, for your first home, to buy an $800,000 home, it doesn't make sense.

[B]

No, that's your level jumping and you.

[E]

Would need like $400,000 down to make it make sense, even with your incredible income.

[B]

Now let me ask you this, because in many ways the idea of being, relocating could be a blessing for you guys. You could get to a less expensive area. Would your pay remain the same? Let's pretend you got stationed elsewhere, maybe somewhere up north. It may be a little less expensive cost of living. Would your pay remain the same?

[D]

No, it would, it would probably decrease drastically. And then that's where we would like rent out the house. Or if you sell it, because everyone down here is all about, you know.

[E]

You'Re going to lose money on that deal.

[B]

If I were you, I would spend this time, you've got three years with a great income, you've got an extra $10,000 a month after you've paid rent. If you guys really get on a true budget, we'll make sure you get on an every dollar budget. This could be the time that you guys are stacking up so that if and when you do get relocated, then you'll be ready to actually put down some roots and buy something that makes sense. That's within your price range.

[A]

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[D]

Foreign.

[B]

The Ramsey Show Question of the Day is brought to you by Y Refi. If your private student loans are in default, it's time for a plan. Why Refi helps you refinance defaulted private student loans into a low fixed rate payment so you can get back on the baby steps and start making progress. So go to yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter Y R-E-F-Y.com Ramsey remember, it may not be available and all states today's.

[E]

Question comes from Bobby in New Mexico. My wife and I are in our 70s and we are retired. We have no debt. We have a little over 300,000 in retirement funds and our home is worth about $450,000. Between Social Security and investment income, we make about 70 grand per year. I'm trying to eliminate as many expenses as possible from our budget. And my question is regarding our term life policies. We are paying $225 per month for two policies with 250 grand and $500,000 pay payouts. I want to cancel them, but my wife wants to keep them. Our kids are all doing well and don't need any financial help. What should we do?

[B]

I wonder how much is left on the term?

[E]

That's a good question. Is it like one year left or is there 10 years left but $225 a month? I mean, that's sizable. And you know, term life, it's going to get more expensive as you get older. You take out a policy of 60, it's a lot more expensive than if you did it at 30. So the point of term life insurance is to replace your income Income if something were to happen to you to cover those that are dependent on you. And so the fact that you guys have Social Security and investment income that covers you without needing to work, that gives me a little bit of peace if you wanted to cancel them.

[B]

That's true.

[E]

Now, is this thing burning a hole in your pocket at 200 bucks a month? It's not the thing that's tanking you. And so, yeah, if it's not a big part of your budget and it helps your wife sleep better at night knowing that, you know, she's covered, I'm. I hope she. You have the bigger part policy. And she would get a $500,000 payout and you're in your 70s. And so it's no joke that, you know, there's not a whole lot of time left. Hopefully you live to be in your 90s, but Lord, Lord only knows when you could go.

[B]

And so I think that's how much time is left. That's the big crux on this.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I'd be. I'd be inclined to keep it because at 70,000 a year with no payments, I can't see 225 breaking you.

[E]

Yeah, two grand out of that to cover these policies is not a huge deal breaker. So I would personally hold off on canceling them. It's a good deal right now for you as far as the payout versus what you're paying per year. And in your 70s, I would also look at your health and go, hey, realistically, how long do you think we'll live, barring any kind of crazy accident, God forbid. And so I'm glad you guys have term life. That's awesome. And I would definitely pause on this because your wife wants to keep it and because of your age and because of how small of a portion it is of your life as it stands.

[B]

Yeah. And I could see with only 300,000 in retirement, her wanting the extra 500,000 if something should happen to him. I could see that being a safety valve for sure.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, I'd probably say the same thing. Keep it.

[E]

Yeah, I actually, just looking at. I was on Xander's website getting quotes today to add another policy, and it was shocking how affordable it is, especially as you're younger. I'm young and kicking. 86.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

And I was looking, I was just clicking around and I went, okay, let's say you want a million dollar policy. Well, for a ten year million dollar policy, it was like 26 bucks. You bump it up to 15, it goes up a little bit. And the longer you go, the more expensive, obviously, because they average it out over the course of those 30 years. Obviously it would be, it would be more expensive later on. So they just take the average and go. Your payment is this. That's a level term life policy. And we always recommend if anyone. Depends on your income. Income. You need a term life policy that's worth 10 to 12 times your annual income. So you make $100,000. You need a million to 1.2 million in term life. And a 15 to 20 year term is what you're looking at. Especially because you're following the baby steps.

[B]

That's right.

[E]

So your, your house is going to be paid off by then. You've been investing for years. So if you need a policy, you probably do go to Zander.com or you can call 800-356-4282.

[B]

Yeah. And to be sure, the point is to get to the point where you're self insured and you don't need these anymore. Like I said, in their case, they're on the line. They're on the line with the three hundred thousand dollar nest egg. I would love if they had three million. Yeah, listen, if they had seven hundred, I'd feel a lot better about them canceling that. So that's what you're. That's the whole picture of this, guys. All right, let's go to the next thing. We've got Patricia. She's in Jacksonville, Florida. Hi, Patricia. Patricia, are you there?

[E]

It was a good effort.

[B]

It was a good effort.

[E]

Was she on mute?

[B]

Maybe.

[E]

I always wonder.

[B]

I'll come back to you later, Patricia.

[E]

Okay, we'll get there.

[B]

All right. Instead, let's go to John. He's in Los Angeles, California. John, are you there?

[D]

Yep, I'm here.

[B]

What's up, John? How can we help?

[D]

Hi, I'm looking to get a new car. My car is getting older and I'm having a lot of issues with, you know, the engine and stuff. So I've been spending a lot of money to keep it running. I drive a lot for work and I'm trying to rationalize getting a car for 30,000 versus getting one for 15. But I feel like I'm in my car a lot, so I want to love what I drive. And financially I've been preparing for this moment for a long time, so I think I can.

[B]

So you have the cash for 30,000? You have 30,000 cash?

[D]

Yeah, I can put 30,000 up.

[B]

Interesting. What do you earn? What's your income?

[D]

I make 85,000 a year. But I'm like, very meticulous with how I spend my money, where it's going, and I have my emergency funds, investments, so I think if I can get to that number, that would be okay. Yeah, but I wanted to.

[E]

And you have no debt.

[D]

No debt.

[E]

Man. Way to go. How old are you?

[D]

26.

[E]

Goodness. Good job.

[B]

Way to go.

[E]

I'm very impressed.

[B]

I tell you what, we have some folks calling in at 26 and I'm praying for them.

[E]

But you're. Rarely have I greenlit a 26 year old buying a $30,000 car. And you, sir, I have checked all my boxes. You're paying cash. It's no more than half your annual income. And you've got no debt. And our emergency fund in place. You're investing for the future. And so here's what you need to know about buying a $30,000 car that you use for work. You are going to drive this thing into the ground and depreciation is going to hit it so hard. This car is going to be worth 15 grand two years from now. That's what you need to be prepared for. And that's okay because you're paying cash. You can't be underwater on a car you paid cash for. Just know that you need to ride this thing out. The longer you drive it, the better of a deal it is.

[D]

Yeah, that's the plan. I mean, it's a Honda Civic hybrid.

[E]

So, I mean, yes, my man, that is a fiscally responsible 26 year old.

[B]

Yeah, it is. Good for you, my guy.

[E]

I love it.

[B]

I, I have nothing more to add. I mean, I would go, I would go drop that cash today.

[E]

Maybe an upgrade to the Accord, a little roomier, who knows? Get crazy.

[B]

I don't know. The, the. There's a Honda Accord person. It's not me. I'm not a car person. I don't feel this is controversial. You can drop it in the comments. I don't feel safe in a car. I think I've always been in an suv and so when I get in a car, I'm like number one. I feel so close to the ground and it feels so small. I just feel like if somebody hits me, it's curtains for me.

[A]

Oh, wow, that's dark.

[E]

I will say my dream car. This was during COVID and I wanted to upgrade from my 09 Civic and I was looking at an Accord hybrid that was like a 2018. This is during COVID So two years old, three years old.

[B]

Old.

[E]

I could not find one for under $30,000 because remember how expensive cars were?

[B]

That's right. Used cars particularly.

[E]

And so I gave up, I gave up on car shopping for a little bit and then I fell into a very old Tesla that, that's I still have on my person.

[B]

It gets the job done.

[E]

Gets the job done.

[B]

Oh my goodness gracious.

[E]

He's thinking hybrid fuel efficiency, no issues.

[B]

I love that.

[E]

It's a smart man.

[B]

I love that. Okay, going back to our questions from social media, I love like this, it says let's see, let's go to Michael. Let's do that. Let's go to Sarah from Facebook. Our 16 year old son just graduated college and has his first job. He's too young for their 401k. So what would be some good options for him to invest in other than high yield savings?

[E]

Wow, what an impressive man.

[B]

He's so young he can't even contribute to the 401k.

[E]

Well, the fact that a 16 year old has a job at a place with a 401k tells me Doogie it. How's big boy stuff? So here's the good news. You can always invest into a Roth ira. As long as he has earned income, he can put up to that much in a Roth IRA. And the limits this year I believe are 7,500.

[B]

That's a lot of money. Yeah.

[E]

And so if he makes at least $7,500 this year, he can put 7,500 into a Roth IRA which means after tax money he's not going to get a deduction for it, but then it grows tax free for the rest of his life. And let me tell you, you can pop this into an investment calendar. 16 years old, $7,500 one time at 66, it would blow your mind how many hundreds of thousands of dollars that turns into without you lifting a finger.

[B]

That's right. Man, this kid's a genius. 16 years old, graduating from college with his first job in a 401k.

[E]

You raised him right.

[B]

Woo.

[E]

I'll tell you that much.

[B]

Gosh, I'm feeling behind in life.

[E]

Hey, George Camel here. So you're thinking about buying or selling your home? It's exciting, but there's a lot to think about and all those decisions can feel overwhelming. Well, here's the good news. You don't have to tackle the process alone. Ramsey's real estate home base is the place to find all of your free tools and resources for help to get prepared to buy or sell your home with confidence. You'll find calculators, start to finish, guides, a Podcast and even an in depth video course hosted by yours truly. What's not to love? So if you're ready to take the next steps toward your home goals, go to ramseysolutions.com realestate that's ramseysolutions.com realestate.

[B]

Our scripture and quote of the day, Ecclesiastes 4, 9, 10. Two are better than one because they have a good return for their work. If either of them falls down, one can help the other up. But paint pity anyone who falls and has no one to help them. Henry Ford said, obstacles are those things you see when you take your eyes off the goal. Interesting man. I was on that Ecclesiastes that I pity somebody.

[E]

I wanted to give you. I pity the fool.

[B]

I pity the fool. That's Mr. T reference for anybody who doesn't know about that throwback. All right, Stephen in Los Angeles, California. I bet he knows who Mr. Taylor is. What's up, Stephen?

[D]

Hey, good afternoon guys.

[E]

What's going on?

[D]

Yeah, my question is, you know, I'm in the process of selling my business and just at the same time my wife got a, well, the company that she works for pull out of California and he's trying to get us to relocate to Texas.

[E]

I.

[D]

I owned my business here for a couple of years and I support my parents here. We, I owe both the house, my parents and our primary resident in California. So my main question is, you know, I do watch a show and I'd bother you guys opinion, should I, should we stay and take the severance or should we just pursue fulfillment of life and pursue her career which is seems to be in a pretty good upward trajectory.

[B]

Interesting.

[E]

She excited about it?

[D]

Well, we just don't know what to do. It's a big dilemma for us because you know, we have all our roots and family here in California. It'll be pretty hard to know to leave everything and just move to another state.

[B]

Is there a big, is there anything financially that would make it a really great move?

[D]

You know, I don't think so. I've invested since I was young. I'm about to turn 50, 40, so I have pretty healthy savings account. It's more of a whether you want to just because I have no plans after I sell my business and I don't want to say like I want to think often because of the weather.

[B]

Do you plan on selling it soon?

[D]

Yeah, it's already, it's already in process.

[B]

Oh, okay. And what are you going to make from that?

[D]

Probably like 1.5 million.

[B]

Okay. And what do you already have saved.

[D]

I, you know, like I said, I started young investing so I, I probably have about 4 million in my savings account.

[E]

Dude, way to go.

[B]

Yeah, excellent.

[E]

This gives you flexibility.

[D]

So stuck 401k, Ira Roth, you name it.

[B]

And you're not sure what you'll do after this? Like you haven't, you don't have your eye on the next thing?

[D]

I have no plans, okay. Like I said, I'm not even 40 and I, and I don't want to just like quit and do nothing.

[E]

Sure. You have too much to contribute to society with a guy as sharp as you. So I hope you, I'm sure you will move on to something awesome. Next. But the big question is, you know, the family part, you know, is she going to make more. There's going to be more stability, long term opportunity, lower cost of living, all of that better quality of life. Is that going to be true in Texas?

[D]

I don't know. That's the part that we're trying to figure out. She's a very, very career oriented person. Like, you know, fulfillment of comes, comes with having a good career.

[E]

Well, I'm sure they're going to cover relocation costs, right?

[D]

Oh, absolutely, yeah.

[E]

And what's her pay raise going to be?

[D]

She makes about 150 right now and she's probably going to make around 170.

[E]

With no state income tax in Texas.

[B]

Have you ever been to Texas?

[D]

Just, you know, passing through. Not, not really living there.

[B]

I would before. I mean have you lived your whole life in California?

[D]

No, I moved around all over the place. Georgia, Florida.

[B]

Oh, okay, good, good, good, good. Okay, that's good. Because I was going to say part of moving is just new culture, just everything feels different. So I, if you have the opportunity to spend more time in the place that you're thinking of moving, I would just to see do we like this place? Do we get a feel for it? Maybe take a vacation to the area, that part of town where she might be working that you might be moving to and just see. Do, do we like it here? Do we get a good vibe? It seems like you have the money and the flexibility to do something like that and just get a sense of where it might be.

[E]

Financially, you can afford to do pretty much anything. You're not going to be spooked by, oh, the property taxes are higher, you guys can stomach anything financially. And I'm guessing it's actually going to lower your expenses while raising your income. And so that part I'm not concerned about. It's more the Lifestyle and quality of life. So I would go there, visit, look at the houses, look at where you would likely live and get a sense of what life would be like there. Are there kids in the mix?

[D]

Yeah, we got two kids.

[E]

How old are they?

[D]

They're three and seven.

[B]

Oh, okay. So they're, they're portable. They, they're not locked in anywhere. What did you mean before when you said you're supporting your family like extended family?

[D]

My parents, my parents are, they're older. They, the house that they live in is, it's actually pay for it. Basically just pay for their living expenses until, you know, their Social Security kicks in.

[B]

Okay. And do you foresee needing to be close by or is it literally you're just writing checks?

[D]

Well, they, they, they express that if we move, they want to move with us.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

Not in the same house, but like, you know, they probably going to sell their house and you know.

[E]

Okay, so now the whole family thing, they're portable too.

[D]

Yeah, that's the thing. Like, interesting. It's just, it's so much that we have to deal with by moving, you know, uprooting the whole family there. I just don't know if it's worth it.

[B]

Your money is going to go so much further though in Texas.

[E]

That's why the company's moving out there.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

So, yeah, that leaving in droves.

[E]

Yeah. I'm just wondering, what is the alternative here? Let's say she takes the severance and then what? And then she just looks for a.

[D]

New job here locally.

[E]

Okay, well, here's the truth. She could do that and you guys would also be fine.

[B]

There's no wrong answer.

[E]

And so I would really rely on her own excitement because everyone can be moved and there's nothing that can't be reversed. Let's say she hates it with a burning, undying passion and you guys all go, this is terrible. Well, you could pack up and move back and yeah, there's going to be a little cost and like emotionally it's going to be a little exhausting. You could go back to California three years from now and it'll still be there.

[D]

Just keep the house more expensive.

[E]

Yeah, I mean if you want to keep it with your finances. I don't love the idea of being a long term landlord, but if you're like, hey, let's try it out before we sell the house trial, you can, you can pay cash for the house in Texas, leave yours there and still be okay. And long term, if Texas is it, sell the house in California. So personally, I'M on team do the adventure.

[D]

Yeah. Yeah.

[E]

Because you can't do it. Like, the kids are in high school, and now they're mad.

[D]

It's. It's. Sorry, sorry, talking over here. But it can't be the fact that it's like, 75 here while the rest of the country is freezing, you know, right now.

[B]

True that. Now, that's why I said about visiting. And maybe it's like, when you go look at a house, you see it in the sun, in the sunlight, but you also want to look at it on a rainy day. You want to go to the neighborhood when it's dark outside, you want to see it at its worst. So if I were you, I love George's idea of kind of doing a trial run. Go down there for a period of time, first off, just to even see. And then if you're like, maybe we could do this. Maybe she accepts the job. You guys go down there, you rent a place. You keep the place in California, you keep the parents in California, rent a.

[E]

Sweet house in Texas for six months or a year. And that way, it gives you some buying time instead of going, oh, my gosh, we just got into this house.

[B]

Yeah, I really like that idea. So if that doesn't. If that doesn't fire you. You up, then that would kind of make me think, maybe we don't want to do this. Because to be able to try something and that still might be like, ooh, well, I'd rather.

[E]

Here's my thing. I'd rather regret doing it and saying we tried than not doing it. And her going, man, what would that have been like if I just stayed with the company? I have all of this, you know, built up in this company. I get to move. I get this upgrade and pay. We get this new adventure for the kids. Kids are very resilient.

[B]

Kids are very resilient. I work before, when I. It sounded like he had been rooted in California for longer, and I was like, oh, man, this could be tough. But after he said he traveled around a lot, that does create kind of just a feeling of, oh, I can go anywhere. I can make friends. Like, home is where the heart is. But if you're a person who's lived in the same place for maybe 15 or 20 years, moving can actually be very tough. Cause it's communities, it's creature comforts, all that stuff.

[E]

Their level of net worth and income. I mean, they could charter a private jet to go visit California five times a year and still be.

[B]

That's right. They totally could. And living in Texas, like I said before, that money is gonna, like, duplicate itself. Their cost of living is gonna allow them to have way more for their money, which is definitely.

[E]

Yeah, he can take the kids to California, and wife can work for a week or two, and he can just take the kids and take a little trip.

[B]

I don't know. She might be like, hello, out there. You left me. Come back and get me.

[E]

That's so fun.

[B]

Oh, gosh. When Sam and I moved from South Africa, South Florida, here to Tennessee, it was like, it's not easy. It's a. It's a. It's an adventure, for sure. You have to have a spirit of adventure, which I think is a good thing, because that's where opportunity is.

[E]

Amen.

[B]

It's out there in the adventure, people. All right, thanks for hanging out with us, George and I. Hey, remember, there's ultimately one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace, Christ Jesus.

[D]

Sam.