You Can’t Outearn a Busted Budget

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show – "You Can’t Outearn a Busted Budget"

Episode Overview Release Date: July 8, 2025
Hosts: Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruz
Description: In this episode of The Ramsey Show, Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruz delve into the critical topic of budgeting, emphasizing that no amount of income can compensate for poor financial management. Through engaging conversations with callers facing diverse financial challenges, the hosts provide actionable advice rooted in Dave Ramsey’s proven principles to help listeners regain control of their finances and build lasting wealth.

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1. Introduction

The episode kicks off with a welcoming atmosphere as Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruz set the stage for a series of real-life financial dilemmas brought in by listeners. The hosts emphasize the importance of budgeting and financial discipline as foundational elements for financial stability and wealth building.

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2. Caller Stories and Expert Advice

A. Nick from Edmonton, Alberta: Overcoming Financial Despair

Timestamp: [00:58]

Situation:
Nick, a resident of Edmonton, shares his predicament of losing a sales job in fundraising for charities. With only $400 left and struggling to pay bills for his children and fiancé, Nick feels overwhelmed and uncertain about his next steps.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz advises Nick to prioritize the "four walls" — food, shelter, utilities, and transportation. She emphasizes the urgency of securing immediate income, even if it means taking jobs below his usual pay grade, such as construction or retail.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “In a dire situation like this, your most important footing is to be paying what we call your four walls.”

Ken Coleman's Input:
Ken encourages Nick to adopt an out-of-body perspective, urging him to commit to making $4,000 in the next 30 to 45 days by taking any available job, highlighting the importance of perseverance and adaptability.

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B. Crystal from Denver, Colorado: Navigating Post-Settlement Challenges

Timestamp: [11:09]

Situation:
Crystal recounts her journey from receiving a $120,000 settlement after a severe car accident to facing new financial hurdles, including a $1,500 property tax bill and unexpected $10,000 car repairs. Despite paying off her home and car, Crystal lacks sufficient savings to cover these emergent expenses.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz emphasizes the importance of addressing immediate needs first and suggests increasing work hours cautiously to avoid further health deterioration. She also recommends seeking multiple opinions on car repair costs to potentially reduce expenses.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “In three weeks, you can do it. You can get this $1,500 paid off. Now you've got 1.5 grand to fix the car.”

Ken Coleman's Insight:
Ken acknowledges the emotional strain Crystal feels and reiterates the necessity of focusing on essential expenses before tackling additional financial obligations.

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C. Jeremy from Hartford, Connecticut: Balancing Family and Financial Goals

Timestamp: [23:06]

Situation:
Jeremy and his wife have recently had a second child and are transitioning to a single-income household as his wife becomes a stay-at-home mom. They purchased a house seven months ago, and Jeremy is contemplating selling his garage to reduce expenses, fearing it might send the wrong message to their children about money and dreams.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz and Ken Coleman discuss the importance of teamwork and open communication in financial decisions. They encourage Jeremy to consider the long-term benefits of financial stability over short-term passions, suggesting maintaining essential income streams while reassessing non-essential expenses.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “You're being an adult and that would be the lesson that my kids would learn.”

Ken Coleman's Strategy:
Ken dives deeper into Jeremy’s financial picture, suggesting that if the garage isn't generating income, it might be pragmatic to let go of it temporarily to stabilize their finances.

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D. Anna from St. Paul, Minnesota: Preparing for Retirement with Confidence

Timestamp: [33:48]

Situation:
Anna and her husband, approaching retirement, have successfully eliminated all debt and accumulated over $450,000 in their 401(k) accounts. They seek guidance on integrating their retirement funds into a secure plan without depleting their savings.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz recommends consulting with a SmartVestor Pro, a Ramsey-endorsed financial planner, to create a comprehensive retirement strategy. She emphasizes the importance of preserving the principal and leveraging investment growth to sustain their retirement needs.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “You can even go on ramseysolutions.com and our investment calculator and plug in some of these numbers to know how much interest is going to be gained and you guys living off that.”

Ken Coleman's Contribution:
Ken adds that working conservatively with investments ensures that the principal remains untouched, providing financial security throughout retirement.

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E. Luna from Lafayette, Louisiana: Transforming Household Budgeting Dynamics

Timestamp: [45:32]

Situation:
Luna receives a weekly allowance of $725 from her husband for groceries and family expenses but struggles to make ends meet. She feels frustrated as her husband doesn’t understand why the allocated money doesn't cover all needs and why she can’t save.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz strongly advocates for joint budgeting and financial transparency. She advises Luna and her husband to merge their finances, eliminating separate accounts to foster cooperation and mutual understanding in managing household expenses.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “I would sell them all. She can start fresh by removing all that crap.”

Ken Coleman's Approach:
Ken emphasizes the importance of partnership in marriage, suggesting that financial decisions should be made collaboratively to strengthen the relationship and ensure financial stability.

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F. Nico from Morgantown, West Virginia: Transitioning to Self-Employment

Timestamp: [55:22]

Situation:
Nico, an animal control officer earning $35,000 annually, aims to shift from a stable job to running his custom woodworking business full-time. He seeks strategies to mitigate financial risks during this transition.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz advises Nico to establish a financial cushion by saving 6-12 months of his current income before fully committing to self-employment. She highlights the importance of patience and preparation to ensure a smooth transition without financial strain.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “The worst thing someone can do is put all this pressure to survive.”

Ken Coleman's Guidance:
Ken provides a rule of thumb, recommending Nico save six months’ worth of income to cover his expenses, ensuring he has sufficient funds to support himself while his business grows.

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G. Jason from Boston, Massachusetts: Evaluating Downsizing for Lifestyle Convenience

Timestamp: [65:38]

Situation:
Jason is considering selling his $1.3 million home to purchase a newly built townhouse costing between $1.5 to $1.8 million. He seeks advice on the financial implications of this move, aiming to reduce upkeep and mortgage responsibilities.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz and Ken Coleman analyze Jason’s financial situation, questioning the necessity and financial sense of downsizing under his current circumstances. They discuss the importance of balancing lifestyle desires with financial practicality, suggesting careful evaluation of long-term benefits versus short-term conveniences.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “People applaud it, but you want to be home with your kids too. Use that money for what you want to do.”

Ken Coleman's Perspective:
Ken questions the opportunity cost of selling a house with significant equity to purchase a more expensive townhouse, urging Jason to reconsider the financial benefits of maintaining his current property.

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H. Amber from Charleston, West Virginia: Leveraging Assets to Eliminate Debt

Timestamp: [96:34]

Situation:
Amber possesses a valuable collection of purses worth $10,000 to $15,000 but is burdened with $4,100 in credit card debt and $18,000 in student loans. As a stay-at-home mom earning an additional $1,500 monthly, she contemplates selling her collection to pay off debt.

Advice Provided:
Rachel Cruz encourages Amber to liquidate non-essential assets, including her purse collection and other collectibles, to aggressively tackle her debt. She advocates for the debt snowball method, starting with the smallest debts first to build momentum and achieve financial freedom.

Notable Quote:
Rachel Cruz: “You have to sell this thing. You have to work and tell your sweet girlfriend, honey, sweetie, you're going to be watching movies.”

Ken Coleman's Insight:
Ken emphasizes the necessity of eliminating high-interest debt and utilizing available assets to accelerate debt repayment, reinforcing the importance of financial discipline and strategic planning.

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3. Key Takeaways and Expert Insights

• Budgeting is Fundamental: No matter the level of income, effective budgeting is essential. Without a solid budget, financial stability remains elusive, regardless of earnings.

• Prioritize the Essentials: Always ensure that the four walls—food, shelter, utilities, and transportation—are covered before addressing other financial obligations.

• Emergency Funds are Crucial: Building and maintaining an emergency fund provides a safety net against unexpected financial challenges, preventing debt accumulation during crises.

• Debt Snowball Method: Tackling debts from smallest to largest can create momentum and foster a sense of achievement, making the debt repayment process more manageable.

• Teamwork in Finances: Open communication and joint financial planning between partners strengthen relationships and promote mutual understanding in managing household finances.

• Strategic Transition to Self-Employment: Before leaving a stable job for self-employment, ensuring sufficient savings and a clear financial plan mitigates risks and supports business growth.

• Asset Liquidation for Debt Repayment: Selling non-essential assets can provide the necessary funds to eliminate debt swiftly, freeing up future income for savings and investments.

• Financial Planning for Retirement: Consulting with financial advisors and utilizing investment tools helps secure a comfortable and sustainable retirement without depleting principal savings.

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4. Notable Quotes

• Rachel Cruz: “You can't outearn a busted budget.”
• Ken Coleman: “When you are in debt, you have to go completely scorched earth. You have no time to yourself. You have no expenses that are going out, that are not food, shelter, utilities, transportation.”
• Rachel Cruz: “The people that win with money the fastest build wealth the fastest, get to their goals the fastest.”
• Ken Coleman: “These days, business as usual is anything but. [...] So you need NetSuite by Oracle, trusted by more than 41,000 businesses, including Ramsey Solutions.”

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5. Conclusion

In "You Can’t Outearn a Busted Budget," Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruz effectively illustrate through real-life scenarios that financial health hinges more on disciplined budgeting and management than on income levels alone. The episode reinforces Dave Ramsey’s time-tested financial principles, offering listeners practical strategies to overcome debt, build emergency funds, and achieve long-term financial stability. By fostering a mindset of teamwork, strategic planning, and disciplined spending, the show empowers individuals and families to take control of their financial destinies, regardless of their current economic challenges.

Listen to the full episode here.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their work and their relationships. Phone number for you to jump in. 888-2552-258882-55225. We'd love to hear from you. Thrilled to be alongside the ever. She's just the picture of serenity. Rachel Cruz, ladies and gentlemen.

[Rachel Cruz]

Thank you. Ken Coleman.

[Ken Coleman]

Good to be with you always good.

[Rachel Cruz]

Always great to host with you.

[Ken Coleman]

Always fun. Let's go to new here.

[Rachel Cruz]

Some of our friends in the lobby.

[Ken Coleman]

We had a great crowd, by the way. Very fun, lots of clapping. They're making us feel very validated. Thank you very much. So fun. Can't wait to meet them during the breaks. Nick is up in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada. Nick, how can we help today?

[George Kamel]

Hi. I'm going through a little bit of a financial low. Literally have like no money left. About $400. Don't know how I'm going to pay the bills for my kids and my fiance and every. I just can't seem to get a job. And the one I did, I can't see. I didn't get to hold it. And I just. I need to know a solution to get out of this.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, man. So you're really going through it right now. What was the job that you had that you lost?

[George Kamel]

It was a sales job where you fundraise for charities.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, that's a tough job because you only get paid when you raise money, correct?

[George Kamel]

Pretty much, yeah. If you don't raise money, they let you go. And my manager, like my team kind of collapsed like the higher ups. And so I was let go because I didn't get the training.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure. All right. The last job you had, what was the income that you had or. So it's two questions. You only have to answer one. Essentially, what income do you need to be bringing home, whether that be a week or a month. That would stabilize you at least in paying the basics, taking care of the family.

[George Kamel]

Basically about one to thirteen hundred dollars a week.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

Maybe a little bit less, but that's not including taxes.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So four, you need four to five grand is what you're looking at, Nick.

[George Kamel]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So in a dire situation like this, your most important footing is to be paying what we call your four walls. Okay. So that's food, shelter, utilities and transportation. And so making sure that those four are covered, first and foremost, debt. Everything else can be put off to the side. We will Deal with that. When you actually have money, but you have $400 to your name. And this is, this is crunch time. Like when, when is, are you guys rent? Do you own a home?

[George Kamel]

We rent, yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, when is rent due?

[George Kamel]

At the first of, of the month.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, so you've paid it for July.

[George Kamel]

Or do with them? Yeah. Utilities are due very, very soon though. And we didn't pay last month because we didn't have the money. And that's, that's a big concern.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Yeah. So. So staying current on these four things is, is your most important meaning, Nick, if you have to go wait tables and, and then work at Target at night, like whatever it is, you need to be doing something. Like tomorrow, tomorrow you need to go be applying. And I don't care if it's below your pay grade. Below what you. A role you would usually take. Like you are in a situation that's dire. And your fiance, what does she do for work?

[George Kamel]

She's a stay at home mom. We have two kids and our oldest has two disabilities, so.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

We tried daycare for him and. Yeah, no one wants to watch him.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Can she do remote work? Something with a computer? Customer service where she's.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I'm talking lines. Yeah, like 15 hours a week. I mean anything. Anything.

[George Kamel]

I, I can try. The issue is our son kind of needs her attention like all the time.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And so what can you, like, what would you do today? What would you do? Forget career path. Forget.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, this is like how I got.

[Ken Coleman]

To go make $2,000 between now and the next two weeks. What would you do?

[George Kamel]

I was looking at selling my computer.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I like that. But let's talk about work for a second. What would you do for work?

[Rachel Cruz]

To make money? To go. To go.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't. So I don't live in Edmonton. Right. I have no idea. So I jump up and I. And I show up on your front door tonight and I go, nick, I gotta make $4,000 in the next 30 to 45 days. I'll do anything. I'll shovel, I'll go work on a construction crew like that. I'll do anything. Nick, tell me, where can I go make this money? What would you tell me?

[George Kamel]

The oil fields.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, what could I do in the oil fields? Look at me. I am the ultimate city slicker. I'm wearing white pants today. How does a guy like me make money in the oil fields? Tell me, Nick, this is great. How do I. What could I do?

[George Kamel]

Like I would have to tell you to go get a sales Job in a car dealership.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, no. I like the oil field. What would I do in the oil field? Keep going.

[George Kamel]

I don't know, do something construction, move pipes. Perfect.

[Ken Coleman]

So you don't have to have any knowledge at all. You just got to be. Have a pulse and do what you're told. Yes.

[George Kamel]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

All right.

[Ken Coleman]

Could you think of three or four or five more of those type of jobs for me? City slicker, American guy, no skill. Could you think of three or four more of those where I can go make some money.

[George Kamel]

Like working in a restaurant, Working retail?

[Ken Coleman]

Fantastic. Nick today.

[Rachel Cruz]

And Nick, we're gonna go work. I'm not kidding. 12 hour days. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

You're gonna be somewhere at 7:00am and you're not getting home until 8:00pm like, it's, it's. It is how I feel with what you just gave me. And I know you're talking, you know, on a show to two people. So I may not be getting the authentic Nick, but, like, I. Like, I would be in an absolute panic. Right. Do you. Do you feel that level of energy personally? Where are you at just emotionally with this? Like, this is scary.

[George Kamel]

So, yeah, like, to be honest, I feel like I kind of failed my family a little bit. And I been applying for job after job and retail. Like, to me, I don't care if I'm picking up poop at a. At a farm. I just. I want to get food on the table. And so.

[Rachel Cruz]

So are you. Are you applying for these jobs like what you're just saying. And they're not taking you?

[George Kamel]

The job market here is just. It's very poor.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, let me tell you where I would go.

[George Kamel]

Very poor.

[Rachel Cruz]

All right.

[Ken Coleman]

The exercise I did with you, Nick, the reason I did it that way is because I wanted you to stop thinking about yourself because you're scared right now. You're also down on yourself. And I wanted you to take on this out of body experience and say, what would I tell Ken to do? But the reality is everything that I just was trying to get you to tell me. Well, here's what we're looking for right now. We're not looking for a job where I've got to go apply and wait for two weeks. Rachel's made this very clear, and she's right. We don't have time for that. I'm talking about the jobs that nobody wants. And I can promise you, I don't care what the job market is. There is always a list of jobs that nobody else wants to do, and those are perfect for you. Nick, because you show up, there's no applying. You show up on the job site and go, hey, give me a shovel, give me some work gloves. This is where I'm at. I've got a fiance, I've got a child with disabilities, I have to work. I'll be the hardest worker you've ever had. This is the approach. This is the approach. Two things are happening there, Nick. Number one, you're showing up where nobody else wants to show up. There's a great chance that you're gonna get the job. Number two, you got a story to tell and people want to help people who are helpable. So you show up and say, I'll do whatever, I don't know what I'm doing, but I'll do exactly what you did tell me to do and I won't quit. And I'll work 12 hours because I got to take care of my fiance and my two babies. That's a story. Rachel, final thoughts on this?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, I mean, it's that. Yeah. And Nick, I mean, honestly, in the next, you know, two to three, four, five weeks, as you start making this money again, I'm going to implore you, like making sure that you guys don't get behind on utilities, don't get behind on rent. Like, that's going to be your, your number one thing. All the debt, any payments you have, we can worry about that later. But don't forfeit your, your family's survival needs. Food, shelter, utilities, transportation. For anything else, that is your number one. We need to get those covered for the next month or two and then we can look on beyond that. But you, you gotta find that paycheck and it can be anything, anywhere but 12 hour days. That's my challenge to you.

[Dave Ramsey]

I've been doing this show for over 30 years and some of the saddest calls I've taken are from situations that are completely preventable.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible. People that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. We actually took a question of a lady and she had three kids pregnant and husband didn't have life insurance. And I'm like, I can't even imagine. Or even if it was opposite, right? If a mom passed away, there's a dad with kids and trying to figure out, how am I going to afford childcare? How do I outsource some stuff that maybe she was doing? Like, and it just Takes the grief and the sadness of something like a sudden death to a whole new level. Like when you have to think through, how am I going to pay my bills, how am I gonna be next week? Yeah. In the middle of all that grief, like, it's just, it is, it's terrible. And so life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance. And we keep re upping it because I'm like, I just want it there. Like, there's something about that safety of knowing that you have money if something suddenly happens and it doesn't cost much.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because Xander shops among a gazillion different companies, it doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here. You got to say it out loud and you got to say, I'm going to say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place. The cost of stinking pizza there really is.

[Rachel Cruz]

So that is one thing to do, to say I love you to your family.

[Dave Ramsey]

So we've used Zander for all of our family's needs for insurance for many years, including, of course, term life insurance. To get a free quote, go to 800-356-4282. That's 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, Crystal's up next in Denver, Colorado. Crystal, how can we help today?

[Christina Ellis]

Well, I am, I'm at a loss here. I guess I'm kind of struggling. So I was in a really bad car accident about, gosh, I want to say about four or five years ago, they did eventually pay out about 120,000. Now I have utilized that money to pay off my home and follow the Dave Ramsey way. You know, pay off my car, pay off the main necessities that I needed to try to get caught up. But now I'm suffering from this realization that, you know, all these extra bills are starting to come in and I don't know what to do with them. I can barely walk, you know, barely work. I keep my part time job, which gives me full time payment on all my bills. But now I have an excessive, like house tax payment that I didn't realize was supposed to be due in April. Certain little things like that my car broke down. I'm like, what the heck is happening? I just paid Everything off to try to get caught up. And I feel like I'm back behind again.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, man. Okay. Did you, did you set any of that settlement aside for like three to six months of expenses? Do you have any savings?

[Christina Ellis]

No, I don't have no savings. I don't have no money to, for, for my retirement. I have nothing left.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, and you use some of this to pay off your home. So your home is paid off?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, I used 80 of it to pay off my home. I used the other 10 of it to pay off my car. Okay, so that was 90 right there?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

What's the total right now, Crystal, of bills that are coming in that you didn't expect? So this is above and beyond your normal L expenses. Can you give us a total?

[Christina Ellis]

Probably about 4,000. I was just listening to what you guys were telling that other gentleman and I was like, lord, I wish I could just grab a shovel and put on something, go do that kind of work.

[Ken Coleman]

So.

[Rachel Cruz]

But $4,000, what's your, what's the disability? Crystal, you said you can only work part time. Is that because of the car wreck or is there something else health wise going on?

[Christina Ellis]

It's all due to the car wreck. My arm is, is pretty much broken. I'm a, I'm a. I'm a cleaner. So I go in, I'll clean the house for, you know, three, four hours at a time, and I get paid full time. You know, it's a blessing to be able to do that, but the more work I pick up, the more my body deteriorates.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, Crystal, let's go back for a moment. We're going to dig in here. So I want to know the total amount of money in bills that you were sharing with Rachel and I to start the call. That number is $4,000.

[Christina Ellis]

In excess this month.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, so. So you have the tax bill on your home. How much is that?

[Christina Ellis]

$1,558.28. I just called them and they said they don't care.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Christina Ellis]

I didn't invite.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, and then. And then a car. Yep. Okay. And then something with your car. Correct. What was that?

[Christina Ellis]

That $10,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

How much?

[Christina Ellis]

$10,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

What?

[Christina Ellis]

$10,000 to fix.

[Rachel Cruz]

How much is it worth right now? Like, if it was fixed, how much would it be worth?

[Christina Ellis]

About 18,000 probably.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. What's wrong with it?

[Christina Ellis]

I got myself a decent car.

[Ken Coleman]

I thought, what's the, what's wrong with the car that's going to cost 10,000 to fix?

[Christina Ellis]

Apparently I didn't know. But you Know the wind shelter is now broken. I didn't know it had a stupid front camera that they got to fix. So I called the insurance. They're gonna pay like $500 on that stuff.

[Rachel Cruz]

Well, you don't need a kid, you don't need a camera. You don't need a camera to drive it. Is it drivable?

[Christina Ellis]

It's drivable, but it's affecting apparently the whole system in the car. So apparently I have to get it fixed for it to, for, for the system to work.

[Ken Coleman]

What system?

[Christina Ellis]

I knew nothing about. I didn't know I was purchasing such an extravagant car or otherwise. I don't think I would purchase it.

[Ken Coleman]

What kind of car is it?

[Christina Ellis]

Honda.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Christina Ellis]

I thought I was getting a good car.

[Ken Coleman]

You are. Hondas will run for, you know, 500 years.

[Rachel Cruz]

I mean, you can get from point A to point B. But the system you're saying is the camera and other things. Right. But your engine works, you can turn. I'm being for real, like, you can literally turn the turn the key. You can drive. There's acceleration, braking, like the basics to get you to and from somewhere is okay. Is that correct?

[George Kamel]

No.

[Christina Ellis]

So it will go. But when you push the park button, sometimes it keeps itself in drive. And apparently it's all due to the stupid electrical that is attached to that stupid camera.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, and how long ago did you buy the car?

[George Kamel]

Oh, gosh, I probably.

[Christina Ellis]

I just bought it last year.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Was it okay. And did you buy it from a dealer?

[Christina Ellis]

No, I did not.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, you bought it for private sale.

[Christina Ellis]

Private sale because it was $10,000 less than all the cars that were available out there.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, gotcha. All right, so let's keep running the numbers here. So we've got a $10,000. We're being quoted 10,000 for the Honda to be fixed. We've got 1500 for the housing tax. What else is a bill that has come up on you that you weren't prepared for? Is there anything else?

[Christina Ellis]

So primarily those two are the main ones that I've been stressed about.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, if those two weren't in the picture right now, would you, would you be through your disability or through your part time work? Would you be able to cover all your basics?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

And you'd have margin.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, all right.

[Christina Ellis]

A little bit of margin.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, good. Now we know what we're working.

[Christina Ellis]

I believe so.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so the real pressing issue is the fifteen hundred dollars. Feels like that one.

[Rachel Cruz]

We need to get that one paid quickly. Yeah. So that's going to be your One priority. And Crystal, what I would. I mean, this is the hard thing about money is it flows two ways. It comes in and it goes out. And so there's no other way to fix that issue. Meaning money flowing in for a short period of time is probably going to be your best bet. And I know from a health standpoint, that's really difficult. And I'm not talking long term. I'm not talking, you know, five years of doing this, but if you can pick up more time with the cleaning, because, like, what you're saying is. Is great. It's physical labor, but it's for a short period of time, and you get paid really well. So I think that this is like a great lane to stick in. I would stick in that lane then.

[Ken Coleman]

Versus trying to wonder, what else can you sell? Do you have things that you can sell to get at least a thousand dollars of the 1500? Could you cover the whole amount by selling things that you already own?

[Christina Ellis]

I was trying to sell a couple of appliances here that are half broken, and nobody even wants those for a hundred bucks.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I understand, sweetheart. I'm talking about something that I'm talking about. I understand, but let's. Is there anything you can sell that's not broken or half broken?

[Christina Ellis]

No, sir. I live only by my mommy.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. Are you plugged into. Are you plugged into a local church?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Have you told the church what's going on with you?

[Christina Ellis]

Yeah, unfortunately, my church does not help with situations like that.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right. What about our friend group? What kind of a friend community do you have around you?

[Christina Ellis]

Oh, really? I just have family, and I kind of mentioned it to them, and they kind of said, well, you better figure it out. And I was like, wow. All righty then.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

All right.

[Christina Ellis]

So I'm on my own on this one.

[Ken Coleman]

So we're running through the list of quick fixes. You're just going to have to grit through this. And you've done it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Up to this point.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And I just want to encourage you that, number one with the car, I would go get a second and third opinion. Sometimes one mechanic at a dealership is going to quote you something. So I would go, honestly, go find somebody, like in a local shop. I mean, anything, right. That get two or three opinions. And my guess is that 10,000 is going to lower to seven. I think you can find a. I think you can find a better deal than what you have. Usually the first opinion is mostly the most expensive. So let's just pretend that's the Case, Crystal, do you think you could make, do you think you can make an extra $300 a week?

[Christina Ellis]

If I try really hard. I'm hoping to pick up another house somewhere here or. There you go.

[Rachel Cruz]

So Crystal, that's. So that's, that's it. You got to just back out the math and say, okay, I need to get this 1500 in the next two months and what I need, bare minimum.

[Christina Ellis]

Bare minimum, get it in three weeks.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, get after it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, so then let's do it. You can do it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Because here's the deal.

[Rachel Cruz]

In three weeks, you can do it.

[Ken Coleman]

You can do this. And this gets the tax thing out of your hair. Now you've paid the house off, you got, you can cover things. You can figure the car out. You can figure the car out. I drive that car until it absolutely stopped.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And Ken, I would say for the baby step purposes, you know, not, not to keep harping on Crystal's situation, but this is why we do say before you pay off your home or anything, you need to have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses, cash in the bank that's there as your emergency fund, be funding some retirement. And then the house comes later because if she had six months of expenses, three months of expenses saved, this wouldn't, you know, be as big of an issue. So remember that savings, liquid cash, you guys, is really important in life so that you're not stuck in a situation like this.

[Dave Ramsey]

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[George Kamel]

Hey.

[Ken Coleman]

If you're tired of getting to the end of the month and realizing you've been living paycheck to paycheck and you feel like you just can't get ahead, stuck in the hamster wheel, I want to make sure that you're aware of our free Every Dollar trainings. These are new trainings every week this month. They're all hosted by one of the Ramsey personalities. We'll show you how to stick to a budget, even find $9,000 of margin using everydollar so you can get out of debt and start building wealth. So again, it's free. You can ask questions during this live Q and A. It's all free. Sign [e-mail] webinar everydollar.com webinar Jeremy is up next in Hartford, Connecticut. Jeremy, how can we help?

[George Kamel]

Hey, thanks for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure. What's up?

[George Kamel]

So we are. My wife and I just had a second child about a week ago.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, congrats.

[Rachel Cruz]

Are you alive?

[George Kamel]

Thank you so much. I'm alive. Awake and well. Enthusiastic.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Very, very impressive. I wouldn't be able to put two syllables together. Good for you.

[George Kamel]

Well, let's wait till the end of the call.

[Ken Coleman]

Fair point. Fair Point.

[George Kamel]

We bought a house November, so about seven months ago now. And we decided that my wife, we prayed about it. My wife's going to stay home and raise our kids the way that we think is best and the way we feel pressed to do so, which is to love. Lord. What this means is, of course, we're down to my one income. And the biggest question I have, I suppose, is I rent a garage. I'm very into cars. They are my passion. They're my hobby. But I think what makes sense is to get rid of the garage so that I can afford to obviously raise my family. The. I guess my question or concern is what? Like, am I teaching my kids that money is more valuable than dream singles? Like, I want them to grow up and think that kids means you have to give up things you enjoy?

[Ken Coleman]

I think that's twisted. I, I think if anything, it depends. Yeah, I think it depends on a. How you communicate it because they're little right now, so they don't even know what you're doing.

[George Kamel]

Yeah, right.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that's one, two. If you communicate that for a season in life, when your mom came home, I gave up this garage in these cars because I couldn't do both. And so for a season I sacrificed. So I think it teaches sacrifice, I think it teaches discipline. I think it teaches a very countercultural message of waiting on things. Right. So I think it's all about how you, how you teach that and how you, I don't, I don't think in any way it's teaching them that you've given up your dreams.

[Rachel Cruz]

But my question is, what's me, Jeremy? It's, it's teaching them you're an adult.

[Ken Coleman]

And you sometimes you gotta make tough decisions.

[Rachel Cruz]

Adult decision to go from two incomes to one income. So that means we don't get to do everything we like. Because you guys are more important in this season. I mean, do you know what I'm saying? Like we just talked to so many people and they don't live in adulthood, if you will. Like, you know what I mean? It's all of, and you're like, you can't do that. That's not how the world works. And so no, to me I'm like, it's the opposite. It's like, oh no, actually we're making trade offs and still living within our means to actually make the decisions that are truly valuable. Right. I mean to you all you're choosing. Not really, but sort of the value of raising your children and your wife being a stay at home mom, which is the most incredible gift for cars.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

So if anything it's like how much money is this? Like to me I'm like, that, that's, that is great. And your kids aren't even gonna know it because by the time they even understand what's going on, Jeremy, they're going to be 7, 8, 9, 10 and you guys are going to be in a completely different financial situation. So I wouldn't know, I would not worry about this at all in my head. Well, you're, you're being an adult and that would be the lesson that my kids would learn. I don't know. Am I, am I am, I'm a boomer. Who am I? Right?

[Ken Coleman]

No, I mean we both.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, I mean that's like the least Gen Z I feel like I could ever say.

[Ken Coleman]

No. I think it's great. I, we both said the same thing. But you're, you're retorting. I want to hear this retort.

[George Kamel]

Well, my, so, so part of the reason I'm slightly concerned so this is now started a new career path I guess a few weeks ago at the same job which was the intention was to do this years ago, but they kept kind of kicking the can down the road, so to speak. So the raise we got, I have now, because I'm in training, is very minimal. So we are, I mean, we've given up a lot in our budget already. We're past the four walls, but like not far at all past the four walls for the time being. Supposedly it's only a few months. The thing that scares me, I guess, is I don't know. So I rent a double deep garage bay four minutes from my house for $350 a month on a commercial lot. So they don't care if I run a business out of it for 350amonth. I, shortly, outside of the blessing of God, will never find that again. You know, my concern, I guess is I don't have like high prospects. I don't know that I'll be able to get something like this back.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, all right, so I got it. Let me, let me dive in. Let me dive in. All right. Let me ask some questions like I'm a bad lawyer on a TV show I think we can get to. Okay, because.

[George Kamel]

Ready?

[Ken Coleman]

All right. Because I get where you're going. You're trying to convince us and we don't have any numbers. All right. Do you make any money on this garage, this $350 a month expense? Do you fix cars up for other people or are you just messing around with your own cars?

[George Kamel]

It used to be like I'd run a business after work, but now with a second child and trying to improve my marriage, I'm home more often. So the last few probably months, I haven't done work out of it. It's just been a place to keep my project.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, let's go back. So when you weren't with the second kid or the new baby, how much money were you making above and beyond the $350 through this garage doing car stuff?

[George Kamel]

Probably like a grand or two. Just.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

Just enough to keep enjoying it.

[Ken Coleman]

And how many hours a week was that prior to baby to get to that number?

[George Kamel]

A week? Probably 10.

[Ken Coleman]

10 hours a week. Okay, so you've cut back because of new baby. And so we're now not putting the 10 hours in. So as it sits right now, it's a $350 expense. There's no income, correct?

[George Kamel]

It's correct. Right.

[Ken Coleman]

And what are you projected to make after your training period in the new job?

[George Kamel]

Supposedly. Supposedly, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you not believe these people? That has got a heavy, heavy dash of cynicism on that statement. I've heard it twice.

[George Kamel]

Well, this, this the position I'm in now. Was supposed to have in years ago, but they keep changing management.

[Ken Coleman]

But let's play this out.

[George Kamel]

Management didn't promise me.

[Ken Coleman]

So what have you been told? After the training period, how much more income per month or per year will you be making?

[George Kamel]

They haven't told me a number, but based on the colleagues I'd be working with, if I guess low, it should be near 90,000 somewhere on there.

[Ken Coleman]

90,000? In addition.

[George Kamel]

No, no full time that year.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, what are you making? What are you making to this? Prior to this point, what's your income minus the wife?

[George Kamel]

About 60.

[Ken Coleman]

And how much was she making?

[George Kamel]

He was making about. Well, she was self improved, about 40.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so with this, theoretically, with this raise, you would almost be back to where you were with her, her income.

[George Kamel]

Yep.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I'm not trying to.

[Rachel Cruz]

When will that be happen? When will that happen?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. What's the timeline on this?

[George Kamel]

About five months from now. Now at this age? Five months from now.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, there's all my questions.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's good, I think.

[Ken Coleman]

Thank you. It paints a different picture in that.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

If I'm you now, this is where this could be great. Rachel could hate this idea. And I. Well, and I welcome it. But I've heard what I needed to hear. Jeremy, load it.

[George Kamel]

All right.

[Ken Coleman]

And I think this is a conversation between you and the wife. And I think you find 10 hours. 10 hours. Again, you got to give her the time. See, I knew you were gonna do that. Rachel, I'm not saying he's gotta help.

[Rachel Cruz]

Out at home, but here's the reality.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm not done with my thing yet.

[Rachel Cruz]

Keep going, keep going.

[Ken Coleman]

I'll be quick.

[Rachel Cruz]

Keep going.

[Ken Coleman]

I would find the 10 hours. I would find the 10 hours and I would start making money on the garage again. So that this is a completely moot point.

[Rachel Cruz]

Is it 10 hours a month or a week?

[Ken Coleman]

A week.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, here's my. Can I. Okay, mom of three. Realistically.

[George Kamel]

I'm listening.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Realistically, you work. Jeremy, what time do you get home from work?

[George Kamel]

Typically? 5, 4, 35.

[Rachel Cruz]

Beautiful. I'm handing babies off. I'm like, hello.

[Ken Coleman]

That's fine. He can do that until nighttime and then he goes to the garage.

[George Kamel]

No.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruz]

Husband watching a show with me. And then on Saturday. No, you're not going to the garage from 7am to I said have a conversation.

[Ken Coleman]

I said have a conversation. This doesn't feel like a conversation.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, it doesn't.

[Ken Coleman]

This feels like a confrontation. And if that's how it's gonna be.

[George Kamel]

That conversation I have at home.

[Rachel Cruz]

Jeremy, I could not.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, if she's gonna react the way Rachel reacted, let it go. 10 hours, get rid of the garage.

[George Kamel]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Ken, why would Stacy feel if you worked?

[Ken Coleman]

I think if it was important to me and it made money, she'd be fine.

[Rachel Cruz]

Every Saturday, you'd go for 12 hours. You basically didn't say that.

[Ken Coleman]

I said find 10 hours spread out over seven days.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's a lot. There's not that many hours.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, there's.

[Rachel Cruz]

There's not that many hours.

[Ken Coleman]

24 in a day. Everybody gets the same amount.

[Rachel Cruz]

Not right now, Jeremy. I wouldn't.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd at least float it.

[Rachel Cruz]

10 hours a month.

[Ken Coleman]

You saw what I did. I floated and got smacked. Question is, are you willing to do the same?

[Rachel Cruz]

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[Ken Coleman]

All right, let's go to Anna, who's joining us in St. Paul, Minnesota. Anna, how can we help?

[Christina Ellis]

Thank you for taking my call.

[George Kamel]

We did the baby steps. We have no debt. We're less than a month away from my husband's retirement. Wow. Now we want to use our 401k as part of our retirement plan, but we just don't know where to go and whose advice to trust. And we don't want to run out of money.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, it's a good fear. How old are you guys, anna?

[George Kamel]

I am 60 and my husband's 6. Almost 67.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, great. Okay. How much do you guys have in your 401k?

[George Kamel]

It's just a little over 450,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

100. Okay, 450. And is that all the retirement you guys have or do you guys have a Roth IRA or anything else?

[George Kamel]

I have a little, but not very much. I didn't work very much.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. And any other accounts or is that the 450 which you guys will be living.

[George Kamel]

That is the, that is it for the. Well and their Social Security and I do some odd jobs.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Okay. Do you guys have, you guys run a budget on how much household expenses and all that you need a month? Yes. Okay.

[Christina Ellis]

I.

[George Kamel]

Between about 40 to 200amonth.

[Rachel Cruz]

42. And how much do you guys get from other funds like Social Security and all of that?

[George Kamel]

I think it's, let's see, 3,400amonth.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, great. So you're not looking at, you know, way too much to pull out just to sustain life besides like a trip or something, but just like what you guys need month to month? I mean it's not, yeah, it's not that much that you're looking at. So yeah, when it comes to the actual running the numbers and everything, a couple of things. One, I would sit down with a SmartVestor Pro. I would have a financial advisor in your corner just to look over, especially where you guys are age wise and stage of life, to be looking over your whole financial picture. So everything from estate planning, you know, anything with taxes, these investments, your home, I mean all of that, they really can get a good picture and help you get a really detailed plan that will make you feel, I think, really secure because you're going to be seeing numbers and knowing exactly what's going on. So you can go to ramseysolutions.com and check out a Smartvestor Pro. We have many in your area, Anna, so I would do that. And then also, I mean, honestly, when you're looking at the math of it, we don't know exactly what the market's going to do year to year. But kind of one of the, one of the rules with investing, if you think if you don't touch the principal, then in this 450 it doubles every seven years is kind of like the rough math you can play. So it'll be 900,000 in seven years and then 1.8 million. And that's really, you know, not touching. That principle is going to be key in order for that math to work out. But you guys can, you can even just go on ramseysolutions.com and our investment calculator and plug in some of these numbers too and to know, okay, if the market on average is Making, you know, you can do, you know, 8, 9, 10, 11% on what your money probably will make on average over the long haul. You can see how much interest is going to be gained and you guys living off that. Because I think the key really with investing if you want this to go the furthest is not touch that principle. And it's really that interest that you guys are using to be living off of. And, and the encouraging thing, you know, is that you guys, there's not going to be, there's not a ton that you're needing month to month. I mean it's like not even $2,000. So I think you guys are gonna be completely fine. But I do, I think you would feel better, I would feel better if I were you is to be able to look at everything, my whole financial picture. And honestly a smartvestor pro could sit down with you and do that. And so that's what I would do. I recommend this for everyone is to get a someone, a financial planner in your corner because it is so helpful to look at the bigger picture. And that's really what they're going to be able to walk you through and do. But just know, you know on the front end that you guys know what your expenses are, which is great. You know what's coming in outside of investments and then to know, okay, we're not needing a ton, month to month that we need to live off of. So you're not even really going to touch the principle when it comes down to it, which is great.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And I think Rachel's absolutely spot on. I would only add that when you're sitting with a smartvestor pro, you really want to look at this number and you want them to help you project to where you understand what a low output would be as far as interest, medium and high. And then I personally would go, okay, let's just do our planning on what a low number would be.

[Rachel Cruz]

Be conservative in it to Rachel's point.

[Ken Coleman]

To be very conservative so that we're not touching that, the principal. And so then I would do whatever it takes, part time job, you know, cut some expenses here and there just to leave that nest egg that, that alone. Leave that alone if you can, for as long as you can.

[George Kamel]

We have month. We have money in a money market too for like our emergency or like you said, if something comes up. We have about 60,000 in that.

[Ken Coleman]

Perfect. So that's going to keep you from most likely touching anything for emergency. That's a pretty good amount. So again you're looking at your month to month expenses, what do we live comfortably with? And we're going to make up the difference so that we try to not touch that principle. And that's the goal. But you got to get with that SmartVestor Pro, somebody who you trust, who explains it to you in a way that you guys go, oh, totally get this. Here's what we think we ought to do. And then we make up the difference. So you guys are in good shape. You just, what's, what's missing from this equation for you going forward is knowledge. Just really understanding the numbers.

[George Kamel]

And Ramsey Solutions, the smartvestor Pro is somebody they endorse to go talk to.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So if you go to ramseysolutions.com and you click on Smartvestor Pro, these are independent financial folks. It's just that we have vetted them so that they're advising people right within our values. But we don't give investment advice. You know, we can't do, we don't do that. So these people are, are trusted in the sense that we know that they give advice that Dave has given for decades. Okay. And then you vet them yourself as well. So yeah, go interview three or four, sit down with them. And you got some chemistry there, you know, like, you know, I'm sure you, you, you really trust the lady who does your hair, Anna. Yeah, I think it's the same process. However you came about picking her. I know Rachel's very finicky with who touches her hair. So that's a process. Whatever you want it to be.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. But have somebody, and I remember that has the heart of a teacher is what we always say, not the heart of a salesman. And these bar investor pros should have that. But I want you to fully understand after meeting with them to the point that you can teach someone else what you're doing. Right. Like, I want you to be able to know that. So ask questions. If you get a weird feeling about somebody and you don't like them, don't use them. Right. Trust your gut in it. But having someone in your corner I think is one of the best things that you can do long term for you guys just to help. And we meet with ours once a year.

[Ken Coleman]

Ken Winston and I do the same.

[Rachel Cruz]

Thing and we look at everything and it's just, there's something about having a third person that knows every number, knows where everything is invested, and they can even make changes in a great way to help you even more. You know what I mean? Some of this stuff could be in like really low risk. You know, investments, and they could maybe up it a little bit and you can even make more, depending on what everything's in. So having someone in your corner in that way is smart.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And we can't underestimate enough this process. When we say go meet with three or four different investment professionals, we mean that that's not just a rule of thumb. The reason is, is because chemistry matters, trust matters, all of that. And I joke about the person doing your hair, but I think it's the same thing. It's like you're just not going to go to somebody who you don't like or you don't think is going to do a good job, or every time you make a request, they talk you out of it. We just have to apply some common sense here. And I don't think we can, we can really accentuate that enough that, to your point, do you understand what it is that your investment pro is telling you that you should do?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Because if you don't understand it, don't agree to it.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's right. No, under. Yeah, the fully. And I think too, this is, this can be an intimidating industry to kind of tap into if you're not used to meeting with someone, because there's kind of a jargon, you know, there's a language, you know, there's all this stuff around it. But again, the, the people that we want our listeners to be sitting down with and advising is someone that's not going to turn their nose up. They're not going to make you feel dumb or stupid for asking questions. They are going to be extremely humble people that are going to help you and be advised in the right way. They're not going to try to sell you on a reverse mortgage or, you know, doing something stupid that it's within the values of. Yes, let's get our house paid off. Let's live below our means. Let's, you know, here are my financial goals. Like, Anna, like, what are you guys wanting to do? And how can we make this 450,000 stretch as far as we can to do the things that we want to do with our lives? And so someone that's on your team in that corner, that's. That's what we're looking for.

[Ken Coleman]

Thank you for the call, Anna. You guys are in good shape and just a little bit more knowledge. Here's what happens. I'm telling you, when we get clear on any issue in life, through knowledge, we have confidence. And when we have confidence, we're willing to make good decisions and move forward. You guys are going to do great. Thanks for the call.

[John Delony]

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[Rachel Cruz]

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[John Delony]

Don't like that. And just a year ago, get this, the average person had about 300 pieces of personal data floating around online. Now it's over 600. It has doubled in a year.

[Rachel Cruz]

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[John Delony]

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[Rachel Cruz]

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[John Delony]

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[Rachel Cruz]

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[John Delony]

Yes. So go to joindeleteme.com Ramsey for 20% off. And that discount brings their annual plans down to about nine bucks a month. So go check it out. Joindeleteme.com Ramsey.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their work, and their relationships. The phone number for you to jump in today is 888-2552-258882-55225. Alongside the incomparable Rachel Cruz, I am Ken Coleman, and we're here together to help you out. Luna is going to start us off in Lafayette, Louisiana. Luna, how can we help?

[Christina Ellis]

Hey, y'. All. Okay, So I get $725 a week to cover groceries, diapers, lunch out, eating out for my family of five. And I'm frustrated with myself because it seems like I can't. It's hard to make that work. I'm always asking my husband, hey, can I get an extra transfer of $100 here or $150? And I'm just really frustrated Myself. And I think he's. Or I know he's also frustrated and doesn't understand how $725 doesn't work, and he also doesn't understand how I'm not saving some of that that I get every week.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I was getting ready to say when you started listing out all the things that the 725 was to cover, I was like, the eating out part is not even possible after all the other things.

[Rachel Cruz]

Do you think it's an issue that your husband gives you money once a week and you don't have access to money except having to ask him for it, and he doesn't understand why you're not.

[Ken Coleman]

Is that what you think is going on?

[Rachel Cruz]

Is that what allowance?

[Ken Coleman]

I don't think it's an allow. Is it an allowance?

[Christina Ellis]

Okay, he's never said allowance, and I have never said allowance.

[Rachel Cruz]

Is that what it is, though? You have a different account, and he puts in $725 a week into your account, Luna. Is that right? Right?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, wow. Good pickup. I thought this was just, like, a line item in the budget. Oh, so he gives you $725, and.

[Rachel Cruz]

He'S expecting you to save some of this money in your account? Okay, Luna, I think we got some other issues. Does that feel weird to you?

[Christina Ellis]

You know, we've been married for 15 years in August, and he has always been the one who's handled the money, so it doesn't feel weird.

[Ken Coleman]

You guys have a budget meeting?

[Christina Ellis]

No, we don't have a budget meeting.

[Ken Coleman]

You have no idea what his income is?

[Christina Ellis]

Okay, it's. I do. I do.

[Ken Coleman]

What's. What's your household income?

[Rachel Cruz]

Do you have access? Can you log into his account, Luna?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, I can log into his account. I can all log into our Edward Jones account. He's been a broker for seven years. I think that.

[Rachel Cruz]

A real estate broker.

[Christina Ellis]

A real estate broker, yes, for about seven years after he got out of the Navy. And I think 400 a year would be the average income. The only debt we have is our primary residence. Our house is worth about 1.2 million, and we owe 500.

[Ken Coleman]

So he's making about $400,000 a year.

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, on average. And you know how real estate is. I mean.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure. And he's giving you basically $3,000 a month.

[Christina Ellis]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, well, I don't know what the specific thing you called about, but I'll go right in on the thing that you laid out first, because Rachel's boiling over here. I can feel a source of heat to my right.

[Rachel Cruz]

I don't like it.

[Ken Coleman]

I get it. I don't either. But one of the things that I think might help is for his frustration. He's not dealing in reality, minus the whole weird relationship thing that's going on with this deal. But I would show him I'd start delivering receipts. Have you ever done that before? When he gets frustrated. Go, hey, look, Sparky. Let me show you what I spent the 750 on this week.

[Christina Ellis]

Yes. I've said, hey, can we go through my. Yeah, I use my debit card. And I said, let's go through my checking account. I mean, it's public Walmart. It's food and.

[Ken Coleman]

But he's not willing to do it.

[Christina Ellis]

Not really.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, well, there's part of it. So now we have another relationship issue. It's weird.

[Christina Ellis]

Oh, I'm sorry to interrupt.

[Ken Coleman]

No, go.

[Christina Ellis]

I've even said, hey, this Monday through Wednesday, I want you to go to the grocery store, and I want you. Whatever meals you want, I want you to buy the food, because it really is food. And I feel like things like haircuts or buying my three children clothes that they need.

[Ken Coleman]

You sold me. I know, because I'm plugged in enough to know. And Stacey handles all that.

[Christina Ellis]

Frustrated with myself, though. And. Yeah, like, okay, like, what, 7, 25 a week? Why can't you make this work? And it's just been hard.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, this is counseling. I think this is therapy, Luna.

[Rachel Cruz]

I'm like, do you. I'm hearing you say all of this, and do you feel, like, completely isolated and making decisions completely apart from your husband, who's supposed to be your partner in life that's supposed to be in the trenches, and you guys are doing life together, and he's pushed you off on an island and said, little one, stay over there. And if I decide and I grant, because I am so wonderful and apparently know everything, grant you the money, then maybe I'll give that to you. Like, it's so disconnected. Like, you emotionally have zero support. And the fact that he's not even interested in what you're saying makes me feel like there's, like, a lot of marriage stuff there, Luna, where I'm like, it's just not loving. It's just. That's just not a loving way to treat your wife. And let's say you were. Let's say it was absolutely ridiculous. Luna. Let's just pretend, okay? I don't really think it is, but, like, what if it was? Then. Then at least, like, as a husband, at least sit down and help me problem solve what's going on instead of just leaving me out on my own. Like, there's just. That's not connection. That's not doing life together. That's not.

[Ken Coleman]

It's like he's shaking his head saying, do better.

[Rachel Cruz]

And it's a. And I'll tell you this, Luna, and I don't like it. I don't even like saying out loud because it's kind of weird. But all this. We hear this a lot. Husbands giving wives allowance or even wives. My wife only gives me $400. You know, it's a. It's a parental type relationship in that way. And that is not a marriage. A marriage is two adults coming to the table and getting to make decisions together for the good of our family.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so what would you do? I want you to put yourself in Luna's shoes. What would you do today if you're in her shoes?

[Rachel Cruz]

I would say I want you to close your checking account, I'm closing mine, and we're going to the bank and opening up one joint account because I'm sick and tired of doing this on my own. I'm sick and tired of you accusing me of something that is not realistic and not reality. And not only are you accusing me, but you have zero empathy or zero interest in coming into my world and being interested. And I don't feel loved. I don't feel supported, and that does not make me feel taken care of. What would is having a husband that sits down across the table and genuinely, genuinely wants to hear what's going on and where I'm struggling and to say we are on the same team. And, Luna, you get to make as. You get to make the exact same decisions as I make because it's our money.

[Ken Coleman]

Love it.

[Rachel Cruz]

First of all, how do you feel about that, Luna?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yeah, it's great. Because then I have another question, Luna. How's that feel?

[Rachel Cruz]

Is that too much for you? Do you even want that? I don't even know if you want that.

[Christina Ellis]

Oh, no, that would be amazing. That would be.

[Ken Coleman]

What if he blows her off? What if he goes?

[Rachel Cruz]

Then you have a marriage issue, Luna.

[Ken Coleman]

Then what would you do?

[Rachel Cruz]

I'm taking you up a house. I'd go see a therapist. I'd go get a third party involved.

[Ken Coleman]

You'd lay the law down?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, because I need help in my marriage.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree.

[Rachel Cruz]

My husband is not on the same page with me.

[Ken Coleman]

I think she has to be prepared for that stuff.

[Rachel Cruz]

And if it's not there, Luna, the problem that we see consistently because this is the one piece of advice, what I'm giving you. A lot of people give us hate for, give us so much crap for saying, combine your finances. People hate this. But the problem is when you start to isolate yourself in different parts of your marriage and to say, that's yours, this is mine, that starts to become the marriage like that. And that is not what we signed up for when we stood on an altar and said, I take you as my husband, I take you as my wife. For better, for worse, richer or poor, like we are in this life together. That's what marriage is. And when you start to freaking separate everything constantly, it plays into parenting, it plays into decisions with in laws and holidays and sex and like, name it all, that's the state of your marriage. It's just coming out as a money and control issue that he has. And I would get the root of that.

[Ken Coleman]

I can count on one hand, James, the amount of times I've sat next to fired up Rachel, and I like it more. Please.

[John Delony]

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[Ken Coleman]

A paid advertisement in MLS ID 1591 in mlsconsumeraccess.org equal housing lender. All right. Nico is up in Morgantown, West Virginia, home of the West Virginia Mountaineers. Nico, how can we help?

[George Kamel]

Hey, I was hoping to get some advice on kind of setting myself up to mitigate risk in moving from A full time job into being self employed.

[Ken Coleman]

Love this question. Question. I've gotten this hundreds and hundreds of times in my time here. So let's walk through this. What are you currently doing and how much are you making?

[George Kamel]

I am an animal control officer for the county and I make about 33 to 35,000 a year. We have, you know, an undetermined amount of mandatory overtime that we have to do on call weekends.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Do you have any debt?

[George Kamel]

I just finished paying off my credit cards as of the end of June.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

And I have about $7,000 left on a truck loans on a truckload.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And are you done with their credit cards?

[George Kamel]

Yes, they are. Zero dollar balance.

[Ken Coleman]

And you're gonna cut them up, get rid of them?

[George Kamel]

Yep.

[Ken Coleman]

And we got 7k on a truck loan. What's the truck worth?

[George Kamel]

The truck is worth probably about 10.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

And an old beast ranger.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And then what's the business that you want to. Are you already running it on a side hust or is this something that you would start from scratch?

[George Kamel]

Yeah, it's. I've been running it and it kind of was an attempt at full time for a little while and I had a whole bunch of mental health stuff that I was dealing with at the time that made it not functional.

[Ken Coleman]

What is.

[George Kamel]

A custom woodworking?

[Ken Coleman]

Custom woodworking. Okay. And how much money were you making profit before you went to the test stuff.

[George Kamel]

In that I kind of was already going through some of the tough stuff at the moment where I transitioned into doing that because before that I was self employed as a professional musician. And so doing the music stuff, I was making about. About 25, 30 as well.

[Ken Coleman]

So have you ever made any kind of income on the woodworking?

[George Kamel]

Yes. Yeah, absolutely.

[Ken Coleman]

Give me an idea.

[George Kamel]

I want to say during the most profitable stuff, probably about 10 or 12,000 a year. But that was with only probably working about three months out of the year or so.

[Ken Coleman]

Got it. Okay. So here's my rule of thumb. I just wanted to kind of get an idea here. But my advice for someone who wants to go from day job to working for themselves is very few but very clear rules. Rule number one, I want you to. In this case, you don't really have enough of a track record to get to step one for me. But I, I want someone to have six months at a minimum 12 months ideal of the income that they pay themselves. Excuse me, that they make in the day job. I want that to be in the account of their dream job. In other words, the company you own, this woodworking let's, let's call it Nico's Woodworks. And let's say you make, you said you make about 34,000. So I would want six months of your income currently as animal control minimum in Nico's Woodworks bank account. Ideally I want 12 months. And the reason is, is when you go from this day job where you can count on a check, Rachel, and you come in, I want you to be set up, set up for cyclical, seasonal, whatever where you're the chief everything officer and you got to go get the client and you got to go do the work, you got to hire the crew. And so the reason I like 6 to 12 months of your current salary in the bank of your self employment situation is it gives me some breathing room. I think the worst thing someone can do, Rachel, is put all this pressure to survive.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's it. I was going to say the urgency.

[Ken Coleman]

It'S just too much when you're trying to start something. So, so that, that to me is the minimum. And then I will leave once I've got that six to 12 months in the bank and I've got a pipeline of two or three jobs waiting on me. That would be an absolute ideal scenario. Now you're not there. So I would tell you, you're an animal control guy until we get back in this stuff and you can get half, let's just call it, let's call it 17,000. 17,000 minimum in, in your account. I really prefer you to get the full 35. That'd be kind of fun. And I think it would require you to be patient, which I think patience is a virtue when you're starting your own company. But that's the advice I give so that there is no interruption of income and there's not all this stress to survive because all of a sudden the dream becomes a nightmare. And that's why I give that advice.

[Rachel Cruz]

But you're not there yet, Nico, with your woodworking. Did you have to turn down jobs? Like, did you have like a good word of mouth situation where people were coming and asking for projects and you just didn't have the bandwidth to do it there.

[George Kamel]

There have been ones that I haven't booked because like people are coming to me and not kind of recognizing the costs of custom work like that. And there have been stuff that I've. That I've had to turn down, yes.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

But most, mostly it was an issue of pricing, having the kind of the bandwidth to be able to be putting the time into it. That was.

[Ken Coleman]

Now. Have you addressed that?

[George Kamel]

Sustainable.

[Ken Coleman]

Have you addressed the mental health challenges that held you back?

[George Kamel]

Yes. Yeah, yeah. They're. They're currently. Currently in the works of continuing to be addressed, but they're. They're a whole lot better than they have been.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, see, I would add that to the mix. I gave you a financial rule of thumb. I would also add in there. You know what, I want to make sure that whatever I'm doing, if I'm working with a therapist or a professional or a medical situation, that I've got a pretty good prognosis on that recovery as well. Because you will always have that waiting for you. Don't rush. This is what I'm getting at.

[George Kamel]

Yeah. And this is, this is very much like. I'm aware that this is not going to be a tomorrow or next week or a month from now kind of a jump.

[Ken Coleman]

Perfect. I'm definitely able to remove. See, we don't like jump. I love that you said the word jump. Remove the jump. Everything I gave you was about walking just effortlessly carefree into the future.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. You made a comment to turn down or some people didn't do the job because of pricing. Do you feel like you're. You're going to have the clientele to pay for what you're doing? Because you're right. I mean, custom woodworking, you pay a pretty penny for it versus going on Amazon or something. Do you think that there's enough there, enough demand to keep?

[George Kamel]

I do. I do think there is. I think that it's going to be a continual effort to try and kind of get my way into some of those circles. Yeah, yeah, certainly. Which is, which is another part of the stuff that I'm hoping to, you know, work with a. Work with a small business coach and stuff like that to be able to.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm going to. I'm going to give you a book called the Proximity Principle, which I wrote, which is basically for this. And it's very simple. The whole book can be broken down into this. The right people plus the right places equals opportunity and fun little book. We'll give it to you whatever format you want. And I want you to read it won't take you long, but it's going to help you identify the five people that I write about in the book that are doing what you're doing in the world that you want to be doing it, and that will bring more opportunities for you. So that'll be my gift to get you started. Fine. If you want to do a business coach down the line, I wouldn't spend any money on that yet. Let's just get out there and get our toes back in the water. Like you did before. You only made $12,000 over a year. That's not a lot you can acknowledge. It's not a criticism. That's just a. We never really got a chance to launch, and I want you to really play this thing out. Sounds like your head is very level right now. I'm proud of you for that, Rachel. He doesn't seem like he's got all this angst. He's got some experience here. He's got a vision, and I think you're all set up for this. Just take your time. Take your time.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's great, Nico.

[Ken Coleman]

Thanks for the call. You know, that's the real challenge for so many entrepreneurs. You know this for so many people.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know.

[Ken Coleman]

We know this from new data, by the way. 70% of Americans, Rachel, identify as wanting to work for themselves.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, wow. Seven out of ten.

[Ken Coleman]

Fun quiz. How many? What's the percentage of people that actually do work for themselves in the United States? Take a wild guess.

[Rachel Cruz]

Small business owners.

[Ken Coleman]

7% want to work for themselves. How many actually do? What's the percentage?

[Rachel Cruz]

I'm going to go 20%.

[Ken Coleman]

No, six.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, my gosh.

[Ken Coleman]

So that shows you.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, it's good.

[Ken Coleman]

It's really hard, number one. Number two, it's really scary.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, it's one thing to sit there under the risk there with a lemonade and going, I'd love to do this for myself.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know.

[Ken Coleman]

And then moving forward on it, so. And it can break you financially, which then breaks you emotional.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's right. That's right. No, it's a. It's a. It can definitely be a huge risk. But stuff with our entree leadership and then your stuff can. I mean, like, really, it touches on all of that, which is great.

[Ken Coleman]

Proud of you, Nico. You got this, man. Keep. Keep moving forward. All right, folks, we'd love for you to help us keep growing. We're getting new people joining all the time. YouTube, podcasts, wherever you listen to podcasts, of course, radio, SiriusXM all over the place. And you can help us grow by liking, subscribing and sharing. We appreciate that very, very much. Jason is up next in Boston, Massachusetts. Jason, how can we help?

[George Kamel]

Hi. Thanks for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

You bet.

[George Kamel]

My wife and I were 42 years old. We have two boys, 16 and 1 3. We bought our house in 2021 for about 1.3 million. We locked in at 2.7. Very low rate. But frankly, my Wife and I, we travel a lot for work in the house. It's a real drain on my time and energy. I move tomorrow. Downsize.

[Christina Ellis]

Like a townhouse?

[George Kamel]

More of a new built townhouse in the area we live in now. But my wife has an implication. We've put down some routes. The kids are entering public school, one is going into first grade next year, and one will be going to kindergarten in a couple of years. Townhouse, I'd like to move in. From what I've seen around here, a new build would cost between 1.5, 1.8. But it's really the lifestyle issue, so it's the financial issue that I'm thinking of making the move. So would this be a good idea and how I can. And how can I purchase with my wife more effectively?

[Ken Coleman]

How much would you make if you sold it, your current house?

[George Kamel]

So right now I'd say it's probably worth about 2.5. We probably make between 1.3 and 1.5 million.

[Rachel Cruz]

And your problem, Jason, it's not the mortgage a month that's stressing you guys out, it's the upkeep. Is that what you're saying?

[George Kamel]

It's the upkeep. Because we both travel a lot and I like to do a lot of things myself. I'm very hands on. On. I always grew up with the, with the attitude that no one's gonna take care of my house as well as I do in, in the people I've had work on my house. It's been, you know, a managing process to make sure that, you know, doing the right thing and stuff like that.

[Rachel Cruz]

Can you give me a picture a little bit like, are you on multiple acres? Is this just cutting the yard and doing landscaping, fixing, heating and air? Like, what's, what is the upkeep specifically is like, are you on a farm? Do you know what I'm saying? Like, give me a picture of it.

[George Kamel]

No, no. We're on about an acre on land. The house is about 4,000 square feet. So it's a lot of. The outside's a lot of upkeep cutting along, you know, making the property look nice. It's this every day there's something. Right. We recently had the H Vac replaced. There were problems with that. We've had every project we've done to this house. There's been issues and a lot of managing just on top of keeping track of two young children and the demand of our jobs.

[Ken Coleman]

So the appeal to you is I go in a townhouse and I don't have to do anything except for H Vac. I'd have to pay somebody to come out and do that or I'd try to do it myself. So this is all about convenience for you because you just feel overwhelmed with all the stuff you have to manage. Is that what I'm hearing correct? Okay, here's the challenge. Here's the challenge with that. And I'm dying to know what Rachel thinks, but I had to jump in and just say, simply put, to me, it makes no sense. And I think that your income is going to validate what I'm feeling, but I'm going to go ahead and jump out. Then I could be wrong. I think for you to sell this house, take every nickel of what you make on it, and buy a townhouse with that, because you said the townhouse is going to cost you 1 5. It makes no sense. Now let's see if I'm right. What is your combined income? You said you both travel for it. What's your combined income?

[George Kamel]

It can vary a little bit, but usually between 350 and 400 a year.

[Ken Coleman]

Bro, pay somebody to do this crap around your house.

[Rachel Cruz]

Get a yard guy. Jason, stop. I want to put the pride down. Jason.

[Ken Coleman]

Your wife is right, by the way. You're not going to win this with your wife. And Rachel explained this. She has a female perspective that I. I don't. Won't understand, but I understand the outcome. And you won't win this with your wife. Not to mention, I don't even think it's a fight worth fighting. I think it's silly. I think you'll regret this move. That's what I think. And you got to let it go. Listen, you need to take on the Persona of somebody like me. I can barely hammer a nail, and I am fine with it. I've come to grips with it. Winston, Rachel's husband's a friend of mine. He can do it all. Guy has a real tool belt with tools in it. I. I can't even buckle a tool belt. And I'm okay with it as I pay somebody to do that stuff for me. Guys come and cut my grass every Friday. It's great. I'm. I'm adding to the local economy. Rachel, am I wrong with that combined.

[Rachel Cruz]

Income, I'm with you. You know, keep some of the stuff you want to keep doing because you enjoy it. Winston likes to tinker, so I feel like he's always, like, turning around.

[Ken Coleman]

He's doing somebody to tinker.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, he's doing something. But I'll tell you, you he sold his lawnmower. We moved into our house. This was five years ago, because he was so determined to do the yard work and to mow the lawn because he wants our kids to see. I mean, it was like this whole thing. And then he just realized, you know, we talked about it and I'm like, you can. But also you could get your time back on a Saturday or a Sunday and hang with us as a family.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

And everyone's gonna be okay. And can I tell you, Jason, it took probably 5ish months.

[George Kamel]

Months.

[Rachel Cruz]

Probably 5 or 6 times where he finally was like, this is nice. Okay. This is nice. And so. I know. Jason, I'm so sorry. I'm on your wife's side.

[Ken Coleman]

Me too.

[George Kamel]

Okay. Yeah. I'm just a big, I'm a big opportunity cost guy.

[Rachel Cruz]

And you know.

[Ken Coleman]

Opportunity cost. Then why in the world do you think that selling this gargantuan house that's got a ton of equity in it to put all of that into a town home, you think that's a good opportunity cost?

[George Kamel]

Cost? I have no mortgage.

[Ken Coleman]

I understand you could pay all this current house with that income.

[Rachel Cruz]

How old are the kids, Jason? You say three and five.

[George Kamel]

There'll be three and six this month.

[Rachel Cruz]

Three and six. Okay. And one's already in school. Right, Right. Your wife and you like your school. Like, are you guys happy with where you are? Are.

[George Kamel]

We love the school system. It's the best in the state.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Okay. I think you're. I think, I think you're good, Jason. I would just.

[Ken Coleman]

It's not worth the trade off.

[Rachel Cruz]

And again, if you had called, Jason, I'll give you a scenario where I would say, you guys like this, you know, is that we got, you know, we have people that call all the time that they bought a house in 2022 at the height of the market, and they, they. And then now your wife wants to stay home and your income's going to be cut in half and your mortgage payment now is bumping up in Boston to 50% of your take home pay. You guys are overwhelmed. You have two car payments, you have credit card debt, still have student loans. And you're like, we just can't make any traction. I'm losing sl. Like that scenario. We would be like, all right, we gotta, we gotta make some big changes here. But Jason, everything you laid out, I hate to say it, I mean, you called more a primary, primarily a money show. And finances isn't the issue in the situation. It's just convenience. And then you go down the list. And the convenience again. Again.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, he pulled the mortgage card at the very end of it.

[Rachel Cruz]

But if he said, yeah, but that's. That's not our big thing. But the Ramsey thing, you know, you pay it off a baby step six, you're okay.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree.

[Rachel Cruz]

And. And again, Jason, if you had said, we're on a 20 acre farm and I can't keep up the work and it's exhausting. Our chickens are everywhere and our cattle, and it's just too much and we can't. We don't have time. Like, do you know what I'm saying? I'd be like, that's a lot. If you're traveling, I wouldn't want to deal with that either. But it's a yard, Jason. You got a yard yard?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

And there's pay someone to mow the yard.

[Ken Coleman]

There's H Vac companies. Man, those dudes come out and imply that you're sitting inside drinking an all or Palmer, watching golf. That's what I do. Hey, guys. It's right around here. Let me show you. I walk out, I show them where to go. I got the money, pay them when it's done. Great. Guys don't care at all whether I can turn a wrench, which I can't. So I get some of this.

[George Kamel]

This.

[Ken Coleman]

But I. I guess what we're having.

[Rachel Cruz]

It'S more ego, I think, J. I.

[Ken Coleman]

Mean, honestly, it's pride.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, Pride and ego.

[Ken Coleman]

It's 100 pride.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I also can appreciate, which we do to agree. And I.

[Ken Coleman]

And I also think there's a little bit of fear and I think that you're gonna have. Yeah, I knew it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Of what? Your kids.

[Ken Coleman]

Not what are you afraid of? Go ahead. It's okay. You're safe.

[George Kamel]

Yeah, it's just the anxiety of home ownership. Just afraid of, you know. Know. No, just afraid of it being gone tomorrow.

[Ken Coleman]

Gotcha. I got you. But you're not overextended.

[George Kamel]

No.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And you have a big emergency fund.

[George Kamel]

Yeah, we have about 100k in cash savings.

[Ken Coleman]

Dude, you're fine. You're fine. Take a deep breath and please hear your wife on this. Hear why she doesn't want to move, and then just say, yes, dear, and move on.

[Rachel Cruz]

You're not saying yes, dear blindly. You're using some logic.

[Ken Coleman]

Listening to her heart.

[Rachel Cruz]

It's logistic. Yes, there's a. There's a logic side that it makes sense.

[Ken Coleman]

Let's talk about nesting. Okay. Hello. That's a thing I didn't realize.

[Rachel Cruz]

When your kids are in school too and you get emotionally attached. That's a hard. That would be. That's a hard change, Sam.

[Ken Coleman]

Folks, graduation doesn't come with a gps. We have a lot of students have recently graduated. They're walking into the real world with no clue as to the direction they want to go professionally. That's why we launched the get clear career assessment. Find the work you're wired to do student edition. This is a assessment and then a book that is designed to coach you through your assessment results on what you do best, what you enjoy doing most, and the results that you want to put into the work world. And that will help you build a real plan and see a path with confidence. 34.99. You can get a copy today at ramseysolutions.com store ramseysolutions.com store Rebecca is up in Los Angeles. Rebecca, how can we help today?

[George Kamel]

Hi, I was looking for some advice. So I recently moved to California from Baton Ridge, Louisiana with my husband and I wanted to know if it be okay if he were to become a stay at home dad.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, why wouldn't it be okay?

[George Kamel]

Well, I'm just, we're pondering over the phone.

[Ken Coleman]

So what do we. What? Yeah, give us the, is it good, is it bad? Give us the pros, the cons that you're wrestling with.

[George Kamel]

Okay, so it's, it's good. We. I make an oncologist, I make around $525,000 a year. Okay. Which is about 43,000. Luck. We have no debt at all. We don't even have a credit card. But we just don't know if we should do this.

[Ken Coleman]

But what's making you have pause? Let's just take your side of it. What makes you go, I don't know, I think I need to call the Ramsey show. What are we wondering?

[George Kamel]

Because. Well, it's not the money, but it's the thought that people are going to look because most people who have a stay at home parent, it's the mom. I'm worried about the cultural change and I'm worried about, let's say he was on the pta. Other kids saw my kid's dad there and they started just talking.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

I don't even know what they would say.

[Ken Coleman]

Gotcha. I get, I understand now. Does he share that same concern?

[George Kamel]

He, he. Not very much.

[Ken Coleman]

So was this his idea?

[George Kamel]

So it was my idea, but he has supported.

[Ken Coleman]

What was, why was it your idea? What were you thinking?

[George Kamel]

Well, before I was able to start, well, before I went back to school and became oncologist, he was always making way more money than me and I always thought I would get to. But now I've nearly doubling what he's making. No, I'm over doubling what he's making.

[Rachel Cruz]

And do you want to be a stay at home mom or better? Rebecca?

[George Kamel]

I do, but that's when the money comes in. Because right now he's making.

[Rachel Cruz]

What is he making?

[George Kamel]

About $175,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

What does he do?

[George Kamel]

He is a project manager at a point.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, well, wait a second, I'm confused.

[Rachel Cruz]

How.

[Ken Coleman]

How you became an oncologist. That's a very specific path. And so when did the shift happen? Happen. And I'm fine with it. But I'm just curious. When did you want to become a stay at home mom? And then why are we moving to la?

[George Kamel]

So basically I was going to be a nurse practitioner. I got done with college and everything to get there. I was a nurse practitioner for one year until my mother got breast cancer. Okay. And I saw what she went through and I really just wanted to help women who were going through what I saw. My mother.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I get it. Totally. Wow.

[Rachel Cruz]

Rebecca, how old are your kids?

[George Kamel]

My. So my kids are two and five.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, okay.

[Ken Coleman]

But Yla, just real quick, I'm trying to get as much of this picture as I can. Why? Why Los Angeles?

[George Kamel]

Yes. So basically in Baton Rouge, the most I was going to be able to make was around $300,000, which is great. But we're actually outside of LA. Okay. So I saw this job and I was like, at the time I didn't have kids. Really? I was pregnant, but I didn't have kids yet. Okay. So I was like, let's do this.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Then you have babies and you're like, oh my gosh.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Christina Ellis]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

So you don't have nobody.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So Ken, I would love your thoughts on this. Okay. Because number one, the situation, if the dad, if your husband ends up being a stay at home parent and your only concern is what people think, you got to throw that out the window. Rebecca. That's easier said than done. But you can't live your life like that. Like, that's exhausting. People do it all the time. Gets them in debt with a lifestyle. I mean, like all the things like just seeing other people thinking what they're going to think about you. So easier said than done. But I put the blinders on for that. My second thing is, and this is a little bit more of a bigger picture concept, but you know, you live one life and there's a life you want to live. And if you're able to live and do the things you want to do, the golden handcuffs of a big salary is not always the best choice. Now, is there a world, Rebecca, where maybe you say, hey, I am gonna. I don't even. I don't know. I don't know if this is an option. I'm gonna pause and I'm gonna stay home till the kids go back to school, and then maybe I'll jump back in. I don't know if it's like, hey, I'm gonna work four years. We're gonna save X amount. So that way we can both basically retire and put $2 million away and call it a day and ride off into the sunset and do whatever we want. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you do have an incredible opportunity to use this money as a tool in your life to do the things that you guys wanna do. But when the tool becomes. Becomes the handcuffs of a life, that's where it sucks the joy out. Where I feel like in America, people just applaud it. People would hear this usually Rebecca, and be like, oh my gosh, incredible. Go make a crap ton of money for the rest of your life. And who cares about any other desire? But you're like, I want to be a. I want to be home with my kids too. So I'm saying use that money and that income for whatever period of time it's going to be to magnify what you want to do. Does that make sense?

[Ken Coleman]

It does. I, I have more questions and comments still. I. If. How should I put this? I mean, if you could go home today, like Rachel said, press pause on being an oncologist and money wasn't an object, would you do that?

[George Kamel]

100%, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And is it true that the only reason you're in the area that you're in outside of Los Angeles is because of the salary with that job?

[George Kamel]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And if you could make that salary in Baton Rouge, how quickly would you be in the moving van?

[George Kamel]

I would be dumping everything I own truck.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. I've asked enough questions to tell you that I think life has changed. And you chased the dollar. Nothing wrong with that. No shame in your game. But I would go back to Baton Rouge and I'd be a stay at home mom if I were you. And I have your husband go back. He can go back and make that money. Now, I know there's some planning. I'm not trying to make this sound so simplistic, but I think Rachel's absolutely right. I could not agree more with her. And I just heard your heart on this issue. You're living a life you don't want to live right now. Now. It's really good, Payne. That's the only good thing I heard in this entire scenario.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know. Can I tell you, there was a couple at money in marriage two years ago, and she was a like a scientist or something. She did something just, like, crazy smart. She was making almost a million a year. And she stood at the microphone at money and marriage with just tears because all she wanted to do is just be home. But she feels like it would be so irresponsible to walk away from something that insane. Most people could never, would never do it.

[Ken Coleman]

I understand that.

[Rachel Cruz]

And we. John and I both coached her. They were debt free. I mean, everything. And we were like, do it. Walk away. And they came back. Oh, no. They went on the Ramsey cruise. I saw them on the cruise. And they. I was like, how are you? And her, the life in her eyes, Rebecca, she was like, totally different person. Best decision I ever made.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

And so we get these golden handcuffs, Rebecca. And I know we're making it sound quick like you're saying, but I think.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd make moves to go back. Go back to your homeland. I can hear it in you. Change your life. Change your life.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And then we're not worried about any of this other nonsense. That was funny is what you presented is not the issue you need to take. So glad you called. Really proud of you. You got more earning potential down the line. Go be a mama.

[Dave Ramsey]

Why is it that when warm weather hits, people start losing their common sense? They swipe credit cards left and right, saying, I need a vacation. I deserve this. But by August, they're stuck cleaning up a mess. Listen to me carefully. You don't need to spend five grand on beach trips and theme park tickets to make family memories. Here's the deal. Instead of having the summer you deserve, have the summer you can afford. That means planning ahead with the Every Dollar budget app. It helps you track spending and give every single dollar a job job. That way you make sure the essentials are covered and have some fun without making a money mess. Look, you got to start bossing your money around, or else it'll always be the boss of you. Download Every dollar today.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their work, and their relationships. The phone number for you to jump in today is 8888-2552-2588-8825-522, 5. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is alongside and we're here to coach you up. Lane is going to start us off in Savannah, Georgia. Lane, how can we help? Hey, guys.

[George Kamel]

I am 23 years old and I am about $21,000 in credit card and personal loan debt.

[Rachel Cruz]

No.

[Ken Coleman]

How'd we get there?

[George Kamel]

Like Dave says, dumb with money.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Buying stuff. Well, what is it? Was it a one purchase? Multiple.

[George Kamel]

Multiple purchases over. I'd say probably the past six years. That's a.

[Ken Coleman]

And you called us today. Why?

[George Kamel]

I have. I struggle with budgeting just because there. I have many things. I mean, I don't really know. I've never had a good way of budgeting. I've tried every dollar, but I don't know. I think I'm scared to budget my money to pay off the debt. I don't know. I just pay minimum payments and I'm just.

[Ken Coleman]

You come from. Do you think you're living your life the way that your family lived their life with money growing up?

[George Kamel]

Well, my dad was a business owner, so we never really had to worry about much. But I'm just. Yeah, I'm trying to match what they did when they had their money and I'm not there. Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you think that this is. And by the way, we're not trying to come up with this big, bad reason because we've all been there, but I'm just curious, is this impulsive, fun stuff for you over a period of six, seven years? You're just like, this is fun and this seems like fun, and I want to do this and I'm just going to go do it. And that's how we got all these loans and credit card debt.

[George Kamel]

That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Kamel]

That's right.

[Ken Coleman]

And when you say it's hard to make every dollar work for you, what's. Describe as best you can. What's happening when you try to go into every dollar and use it?

[George Kamel]

Well, it's really just. I don't know how much to budget for, say, groceries because I don't go grocery shopping every week or every month. Maybe sometimes I might buy enough groceries one month to supply me to the next. And I have a vehicle payment that I paid and some months it's supplied with other money that I make other places and not from my one income.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you. Okay. Do you have a stable regular income?

[George Kamel]

Yes, sir.

[Ken Coleman]

What is that? How much do you take at home.

[George Kamel]

After taxes? It's usually around 820 a week. Week.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right. And then you. How Many. How much money do you make is additional irregular income?

[George Kamel]

It's. It just depends, right? Usually. I mean, some weeks I'm making more money. Some weeks I'm not making anything at all.

[Rachel Cruz]

And what are you doing? Are you working overtime on your current job or something totally different?

[George Kamel]

That's. Yeah, just overtime. Sometimes it's more, sometimes it's less.

[Ken Coleman]

Gotcha.

[Rachel Cruz]

And, okay, so you're making around, what, 45 or so a year?

[George Kamel]

Yes, ma'. Am.

[Rachel Cruz]

Around 40. 45.

[Ken Coleman]

What do you think's going on, Rachel? What's happening here?

[Rachel Cruz]

Well, I mean, Lane, I just don't think you're planning. Well, there's just a part of me that's like you're kind of just on a whim, like, okay, I'll find money here. Put something there, and there's not really a plan in place is what it sounds like, which is to me, the reason why you got into all this credit card debt, too, is there's not really a plan. And if you don't have the money, just swipe the. And pay the minimum payments. And your interest rates on those credit cards, I mean, they're probably horrible, right? 22%.

[George Kamel]

That's right.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[George Kamel]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

So how many cards are there?

[George Kamel]

There's five cars.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Lane, do you have the opportunity to work overtime as much as you want?

[George Kamel]

Not really. It's more of kind of like a weekend basis.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Okay.

[George Kamel]

One week in a month.

[Rachel Cruz]

Are you single?

[George Kamel]

No.

[Rachel Cruz]

No. Are you married?

[George Kamel]

Single. Not married.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

You're single.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, Lane, here's. I mean, here's what I would do if I were you, number one. And I would do it right now while you're on the phone with us. I'd get out your credit cards and cut them up, get rid of them. Oh, you did? Good for you. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Did you close the accounts?

[George Kamel]

I haven't paid them off.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, yeah, you got to pay them off, so.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, that's fair.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Yeah. No, but. Okay, so what I would do is list out these credit cards, smallest to largest. So out of the five, do you know the. Do you know the balances on each of them?

[George Kamel]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. What are they?

[George Kamel]

Well, not my heart.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. If you. If you had to just guess, what would you say? Probably, like, one first card is What?

[George Kamel]

So the personal one. Personal I have is. It's 5,500 right now. And.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, so.

[George Kamel]

And then it's credit.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[George Kamel]

The highest credit card I have is 4100.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So the other ones are probably, gosh, like, little ankle biters. Probably like a two grand, a two grand, a three grands. Like, they're probably just kind of. They're probably small and. Okay, so what I need you to do, because I think you can do this, Lane. I really do. I think that there's. There's a lot of hope here. Number one, I'd be taking as much overtime as possible. Like, anytime it's an option, it's a yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I would also go get a second job somewhere, go wait tables, go do something. Because here's the thing, we always say this. When you are in debt, you have to go completely scorched earth. Like, you have no time to yourself. You have no expenses that are going out, that are not food, shelter, utilities, transportation. That's it. Like, there's nothing. You're going to be eating. Eating turkey sandwiches for every meal at home. Like, do. You're gonna do nothing? Nothing fancy, Lane. Nothing. And this is gonna be one of your biggest obstacles, Lane, because you have not had to tell yourself no in six years. You haven't. You haven't had to say no. Something comes up, you just like, well, I'll just do it. This is gonna be the biggest discipline challenge for you. And so what I want you to do is I want you to make a budget, and you're gonna have your rent, rent, your utilities, your food and transportation. So your car loan. How much is your car for your car loan?

[George Kamel]

It is 869.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay, how much is it worth? Or what? How much do you owe on it?

[George Kamel]

43,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

You owe 43,000 and you make $40,000. Lane. Lane.

[Ken Coleman]

Gosh. I got this. A giant truck.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, Lane. Okay, how much? If you sold it today, what would you get it for? What would you get for it?

[George Kamel]

Kelly blue book says it's worth 38,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

Beautiful.

[Ken Coleman]

Sell it.

[Rachel Cruz]

So great. All right. You're going to scrape together 2,000, $3,000 in the next 60 days, Lane. Okay? Doing whatever you can, you're going to pay. Pay off the difference of this truck, and, well, you got to scrape together a little bit more. I don't know if a bank would give you a loan. I don't even know if I want to. Like, what other toys?

[Ken Coleman]

Now that we're on this track real quick, what other toys do you have that. That are associated with this credit card debt? Any toys? Huh?

[George Kamel]

A girlfriend.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, geez. I wouldn't call her a toy. We'll just move right on. I meant like machines like bikes and motorbikes or. Or boats and stuff. Like Is there anything else you can sell?

[George Kamel]

I don't have any of that. Really. It's just like Damon Console. Most of the. Most of the credit cards, I'll be honest, are. Are say, vacations.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh.

[George Kamel]

And stuff like. I mean, just buying gaming consoles, you know, you're broke. Only $20 a month.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, you're broke, dude.

[Rachel Cruz]

You're playing. You got to get out of this truck. Like, that's the number one thing that's going to free you up almost $11,000 a month.

[Ken Coleman]

Huge.

[Rachel Cruz]

You have to sell this thing. You have to work. And tell your sweet girlfriend, honey, sweetie, you're going to be watching movies.

[Ken Coleman]

She needs a job. Why is she on a gaming console?

[George Kamel]

But it's not her.

[Rachel Cruz]

It's not her business.

[Ken Coleman]

I know, but they're playing games. Why are they playing games?

[Rachel Cruz]

Go sell the gaming console. Yeah, and Lane, like, nothing, bud. You gotta. You. You have to grow up. This is. You're 23. Like, you can't be just saying yes to everything. That's what children do. Do what feels good, and you gotta go scorched earth, man.

[Ken Coleman]

Saw a commercial last night for spam. Didn't even know they were allowed to sell that anymore. Anymore.

[Rachel Cruz]

Lane.

[Ken Coleman]

Lane, go get you some spam. Get some tuna, ramen, PB and J.

[Dave Ramsey]

Listen. Your home is your most expensive asset. And now you're ready to sell fast and for a lot of money. But in this wackadoodle real estate market, one mistake could cost you tens of thousands of dollars. Here's the deal. This ain't amateur hour. You need a pro in your corner. Someone who knows how to price your home right, market it well, and negotiate the best deal. That's where a Ramsey trusted real estate agent comes in. To find one near you, go to ramseysolutions.com agent. That's ramseysolutions.com agent.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, folks, we all know that buying or selling a house, it's a big deal, takes up a lot of calories in our life, and you can really mess it up. It's a big, big financial transaction. And the Ramsey trusted program is the only way to find a top agent that you can trust that'll help make this entire process a blessing, not a burden. You can find a local Ramsey trusted real estate pro 4 [e-mail] agent ramseysolutions.com agent all right, Sue is up in Chicago. Sue, what is going on today?

[Christina Ellis]

Hello, Rachel. Hello, Ken. Thank you both so very much for having me on.

[Ken Coleman]

You bet.

[Christina Ellis]

So my question is, should I sell my Purse collection in order to pay off my debt.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, my goodness. Tell us about the purse collection. This one hurts.

[Christina Ellis]

So I've been a collector since I was younger, and more recently, in the past few years, I've gotten into purses and name brand purses, the vintage ones. And total, as of now, I have about 50 of them, and they're maybe about 10 to $15,000 worth of purses.

[George Kamel]

Wow.

[Ken Coleman]

Tell us about your debt.

[Christina Ellis]

Current debt is 4,150. So 4,150 in credit card debt, and then I have 18,000 in student loans.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. And how much do you make in year?

[Christina Ellis]

So I am a stay at home mom, but I do have a side gig. With my side gig, I bring in roughly about 1500amonth. And currently I'm trying to put all of that towards the debt.

[Rachel Cruz]

Or do you have a. Are you married?

[Christina Ellis]

I am, yes. What does he make after taxes and after investments? He brings in about 75 to 85,000 a year.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

And that's the only debt you both have is you. The credit cards and your student loans?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, and besides our mortgage, but that's it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And are you guys tackling this together, like, using some of his income where you can?

[Christina Ellis]

Well, I feel guilty. I'm trying to just use all of my income because this was all of my spending. So I kind of told him, you know what, Let me take care of it, and then after I'm done with this debt, then we can tackle anything else. Well, hopefully we won't have any more debt, but tackle it together.

[Ken Coleman]

Rachel's shaking her head now.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know, Sue, I know you feel guilty, but the people that win with money the fastest build wealth the fastest, get to their goals the fastest. They put everything in the middle of the table, and they take all past mistakes, all the things aside, and they say, okay, we are in this together, moving forward, I hear. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, so that's what. So, yes. Would I sell the purse collection? I mean, maybe if there's one or two, like, sentimental ones that you want to keep. But I mean, I would do anything to get out of debt as quickly as possible. I mean, if this would be, like, if someone called, I just have a motorcycle that I love, we'd be like, get rid of it. Like, I mean, you just. You. You really go scorched earth when you're. When you're getting out of debt.

[Ken Coleman]

So let's split the difference. So let's say you said there are purses between 10 to 15. Say it's 12, five. So you get 12, five. And you said your total debt was about 60 total.

[Christina Ellis]

In total, 22,150.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, I thought you said 40.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, the credit card is 4,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh my gosh.

[Ken Coleman]

4,100. Sorry, she wrote 41,000. Yeah, yeah. So you've got 4,100 roughly in credit cards and you got 18,000 student loans.

[Christina Ellis]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so the 12 five, you do the snowball method. You know our snowball method? Correct? Do you know our snowball method? Debt snowball.

[Christina Ellis]

I'm pretty familiar with it. I mean, I just started listening to you guys a few months ago.

[Ken Coleman]

So real simple. Smallest debt, you list out all your debts. And in this case you have $4,100 is your smallest debt. The next debt is 18,000. Is that one loan or is that multiple student loans?

[Christina Ellis]

It's multiple.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so you would go smallest to largest.

[George Kamel]

Largest.

[Ken Coleman]

You list them out. Okay, so what is your debt situation? The student loan debt, what is that? Can you give us those amounts?

[Christina Ellis]

So one of them is about 6,000. There's another one for five. And then the remaining balance, okay, so it holds.

[Ken Coleman]

So you got 4100 is your, is your smallest debt credit card, Then you got a five thousand dollar student loan, then you got a six and then whatever's left, right. So if you sell the purses for 12, five, just a number that I'm using here, middle of the range you gave me, then you're knocking out a good chunk of this.

[Rachel Cruz]

You'll have like 10,000 left.

[Ken Coleman]

About 10,000 left. And then you're making in your income, your side income. You're making about 1500amonth you said, Is that right?

[Christina Ellis]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, Rachel, so then I'm bringing it back to you.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Hubby comes involved and you guys are completely debt free. So Sue. And instead of 10 months, it's in five months, you cut it in half. So then you guys can start saving for an emergency fund together. Do you all have any cash saved at all anywhere?

[Christina Ellis]

We do, actually. So we have the thousand dollar emergency fund and then we kind of skipped part two for a little bit and started saving up monthly y. And we have about 5,000 in cash.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, amazing.

[Ken Coleman]

We're knocking this out.

[Rachel Cruz]

We're throwing that, we're throwing, throwing that there. And then, and then in two months, three months, you guys will be completely debt free and you build back up your savings together. So the, the exercise, Sue, I think of you guys, it's not just a tactical combining money and working this plan together, but it does something when you view yourself as on the same team. I mean, honestly, like. And I know he may be frustrated that you did this spending. It was the student loan before you even met him. Yeah, okay, so that. That was in the past. And so I'm like, you know, I'm not a sports girl. I don't know why I'm thinking of this, but I'm like, if you're on a team, you know, the quarterback throws, sometimes the wide receiver doesn't catch it. Bad play, very good, but it's a mistake, and you get back up and you run the next one. And so there's just something about. This is very exciting, this team mentality.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm so proud right now. I. I could burst the vaults.

[Rachel Cruz]

I was looking, looking at the Vols schedule. UT Vols.

[Ken Coleman]

You used a football match for. To coach.

[Rachel Cruz]

And I said the right positions and everything. You did it right. But yeah, I mean, see, like, there's just something about when you guys lock arms together and you're both on each other's team, you know, and so there's something really beautiful there. It's amazing. So when we have couples that come and do the debt free scream on the stage, majority of them say, our marriage is so much better. Not. I wrestled this thing to the ground by myself and I did it all. And then now we're doing. No, it's. It was like we were all in this together and we. We. We won together, we lost together. But, like, we. You have a teammate with you. And so from an emotional standpoint, I would say dive in and you guys work together. And I thought you were a little.

[Ken Coleman]

Kind on the purse situation. You said hold back a couple that she liked.

[Rachel Cruz]

I didn't know there was any.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd sell them all. She can start.

[Rachel Cruz]

Do you have, like one or two. Do you have, like, one or two from when you were a kid and you were like, oh, that was.

[Christina Ellis]

No, these are just recent purses.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, okay, then get rid of. I'd get rid of them.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd like to dig a little further.

[Rachel Cruz]

Get rid of them, Sue.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd like to dig a little further because I know collectors. They're in my family, and thankfully, I've broken the curse.

[Rachel Cruz]

What. What's your true story?

[Ken Coleman]

I come from, like, collectors.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, well, what do you want to dig deeper on her? Why? She's collecting.

[Ken Coleman]

She's got some more valuable stuff in the house. You got some other collectibles that you could sell?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, in the garage, actually.

[Ken Coleman]

What are they, Sue? Tell us.

[Christina Ellis]

I have all of my McDonald toys and Barbies from when I was a child that were never opened.

[Ken Coleman]

Are they worth anything?

[Christina Ellis]

Yeah, a few thousand.

[Ken Coleman]

There we go. And by the way, you're doing yourself a favor to get rid of all that crap. Get it out. 2,000 bucks.

[Rachel Cruz]

Boom.

[Ken Coleman]

Right there. What did I tell you? McDonald's toys.

[Rachel Cruz]

That's impressive.

[Ken Coleman]

Anything else, Sue?

[Christina Ellis]

No, besides that. I. I think that's pretty much it.

[Ken Coleman]

I'd like to get in your attic. I bet you got stuff up in the attic. I think you got stuff in that house that you don't even know about.

[Rachel Cruz]

It is interesting that there's something that we, like, get emotionally attached to our stuff. What is that?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I could tell you it's the hunt for collectors.

[Rachel Cruz]

And you can sniff.

[Ken Coleman]

It's all about the hunt. Yeah, I gotta go find the full set. It's like a game. Oh, yeah, that's what it's about. My grandmother, God bless her, died at 96. You wouldn't believe the amount of Beanie Babies she had. Beanie Babies.

[Rachel Cruz]

Do you remember Beanie Baby people? Yes. Yes. Do you know what they are now? Are you ready for this? I learned this.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm out of the game.

[Rachel Cruz]

We have about 30 seconds. Jelly Cat. It's a type of stuffed animal in New York. And apparently they are, like, huge thing. And we got them for, like, our kids. Like, we got them as, like, baby shower gifts. But we went in our local choice toy store here in Nashville, Brilliant sky. And they had to put them in the back because they said people were stealing them.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, like, you seen the waffle toy? They cook it for you in the.

[Rachel Cruz]

Toy store and it's Jelly Cat.

[Ken Coleman]

One of the jelly cats is a waffle.

[Rachel Cruz]

So crazy.

[Ken Coleman]

And they cook it on fake yogurt.

[Rachel Cruz]

I don't get it. I don't get it. This is the consumerism of America.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the truth. This is a real thing. I know this because my wife told me that Josie likes these things. Yeah. No. No clue. What a jelly. I thought it was a cat. I like a jelly belly.

[Rachel Cruz]

They said, like. Like college students are getting them.

[Ken Coleman]

Sue, get up in that attic. There's more stuff.

[John Delony]

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[Ken Coleman]

The Ramsey Show Question of the day is brought to you by our friends at Y Refi. If you're ready to stop drowning in private stuff, student loan debt, Y Refi can throw you a rope. Talk to Y Refi to see if refinancing your defaulted loans with a low fixed rate is an option for you. You can visit yrefi.com Ramsey that's y r e f y.com Ramsey it may not be available in all states.

[Rachel Cruz]

Today's question comes from Derek in South Dakota. I'm a long term follower, longtime follower, follower of your principles. My wife and I are just, oh, gosh, sorry. My wife is just starting her faith journey. We're working hard to pay off our car, which is our last debt. But she's struggling to understand why we would tithe instead of using that money to go towards the loan. I feel convicted to give, but I also want to be respectful of where she's at. Do I continue tithing or would it be wise to give a smaller amount and put the rest toward the car so it feels like it's a win win for both of us. I don't want her to feel like her opinion isn't valid if I move forward with tithing before she's on board. Oh, that's a great question.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, the first thing that popped in my mind, Rachel, was it appears as though Derek has been tithing all this time. So the way he says, yeah, you know, if I move forward with tithing, he's been tithing. She's new to the faith and she's also new to this point plan. So she's wrestling with this. He's been tithing this entire time or it appears as though he believes in tithing. So I would not pause tithing. I, I wouldn't try to split the difference. I would. If you feel convicted, you got to listen to that conviction. It's a part of your faith. And so this is where you got to get her on board and explain why you tithe what's going on there. You've been tithing this entire time.

[George Kamel]

Time.

[Ken Coleman]

And this is, this is like any major marital financial decision. Got to get on the same page with it. But yeah, when you try to split the difference when it comes to tithing. And again, I, I don't want to go into some theological explanation of tithing here on the show. But for people who understand tithing, it is a biblical mandate, and it is not just sort of a suggestion, suggestion. And so in that case, if you feel convicted about you don't do it, then there's. There's a bigger issue there. And I don't think you have to sacrifice your faith and conviction in this situation.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. And I would even, you know, do the math side of it. And just to show her, okay, if we stopped tithing, how much faster would we really pay this off? Because sometimes when you get down to it, it's like, it didn't really make that huge of a difference. And, you know, here at Ramsey, when we do teach that giving, giving should be a part of your character and what you do, regardless of where you are financially. And we say that because we know as you continue to win with money and you guys get out of debt, you guys start building some wealth, the character of who you are during that time is what ends up being magnified. And when you can start as a giver, even with debt, there is something in that that creates in you a person that is generous. And this money that you will build over time will become a blessing, and it won't become this, you know, golden handcuffed idol kind of thing where you become all consuming. There's something about that generosity, spirit, living your life with an open hand, that it creates joy, and it does. It creates peace. You know, your perspective changes when you find things that you give to that you love. And there's something about that we always want to cultivate. So it's more, you know, for me, along those lines that I think. I think are really important. So, yeah, I would stay with it. I understand your respect for her, for sure, but you guys are kind of new on this, and. And I think, you know, there may be some give and take in other areas, but this is one I would be like, hey, I just. I do. I feel. I feel pretty strongly this is what I want to be doing. And it's not like you're, you know, going out and gambling. It. It's. It's a.

[Ken Coleman]

It's a.

[Rachel Cruz]

It's a. There's a giving component that's really beautiful. You know, like, there's something, like, really beautiful about it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, Good stuff. Thank you for the question. Mary's up in San Francisco. Mary, how can we help today?

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, thank you so much for taking my call. You bet I am. Thank you. I am calling. I'm just wondering how important it is to pay to have my credit monitored. I have a credit Freeze. I do have. Thanks to Dave and his advice, I have. I work minimal wage jobs and I have amassed over a million doll and my home is paid for.

[Rachel Cruz]

You well done.

[Christina Ellis]

Yes, well, and it's been hard earned and a lot of sacrifice. I'm not complaining, but I don't want to compromise it at this point. But I'm just wondering how important it is to have a credit monitoring system. I pay about $300 a year for it. Well, I need it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Here's what I would say. It's such a low key cost to you where you are financially, 300 bucks, you're not even going to realize it's gone. So if it, if it's something for you that you feel like it's nice for someone else to do it and I can pay a service to do it instead of me do it, then I'm not mad at that. But I do want you to know though, Mary, you can check your credit report once a year for free on different websites. So you can even just pull it up and if your credit is frozen then really no one's going to be able to get to it. Like with an identity theft situation. Even though we still recommend checking your credit report every single year. So you can do it for free just by logging onto a website, TransUnion or Equifax. Like there's sites out there that you can do it once a year for free. And that's what, that's what we do. I mean it's pretty simple so it's not that complicated. But I would say at the same time, I don't know what company that you're talking about, but if they are reputable, 300 bucks to you may be worth it. Where it's like, eh, I'll pay for this service so I don't have to do it. If you want to do that, then that's fine.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, good, good, good call. Thank you, Mary. Now let's go to Amber in Charleston, West Virginia. Amber, how can we help?

[Christina Ellis]

Hi, yes, thank you so much for taking my call. My question is I purchased a home two years ago and was working a great job, had a really good income and divorced, had some alimony and I was injured on the job. I injured my neck and my shoulder and had to go through surgeries and treatments for about a year and a half. I fell behind on my house payments. I put it in forbearance for six months and the bank has now finally come back to me to tell me what they want to do and it's $30,000. And pretty much I'm going to be getting a settlement. But I don't know if I should just short sale my house or just take the loss, you know, with my credit or if I short.

[George Kamel]

Should.

[Rachel Cruz]

Can you.

[Christina Ellis]

I have travel nurses right now.

[Rachel Cruz]

You have travel nurses? What?

[Christina Ellis]

Renting out right now to.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, the home. You're not even living in the home.

[Christina Ellis]

I am. I'm living in here also.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, okay. Oh, I'm sorry. Okay. And you have people. Okay. And you need these travel nurses to help pay the mortgage.

[Christina Ellis]

Yes.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. So it's just too much house for you, Amber. So no, I would not have the bank short sale it. I would just try to sell it. I would go to Ramsey Solutions.com real estate and we have some real estate agents that you can look up in your area. And I would get that on the market as soon as possible and I would get it. I would get it sold on the market.

[Christina Ellis]

I've had it on the market for three months already.

[Rachel Cruz]

I.

[Christina Ellis]

It's just lifted too high. Yeah. And the bank now will allow me to try to short sale.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, usually. I don't know. Usually. That's not always. It's not usually the best situation. I wonder from a real estate agent perspective, do you, you have it too high marked up? Have you mar. Have you marked it down at all? Just see, just to be able to cut your losses.

[Christina Ellis]

We did.

[George Kamel]

We.

[Christina Ellis]

We lowered it two times and still nothing.

[Rachel Cruz]

I mean, have you run comps in the area? Is there. Is it? And you have.

[Ken Coleman]

What's the problem with the house?

[Christina Ellis]

The interest rates that are scaring people away.

[Rachel Cruz]

I mean, could be, but also people are buying houses still. Okay, how much is it worth?

[Christina Ellis]

It's 375,000. Okay, I'm back. 30,000 on it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Well, how much do you owe on it total?

[Christina Ellis]

It would be like 395.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, so you are underwater on it. Yeah.

[Christina Ellis]

Man, I know. It's a hard one.

[Rachel Cruz]

I know, I know. Well, my, my fear is you're running out of options. Yeah, I mean, my fear is you're running out of options if you can't get this sold. And the problem is the bank will take it and will short sale it and you'll just be in that situation. So are they giving you a time frame at all?

[George Kamel]

September 1st.

[Rachel Cruz]

September 1st. Okay, well, so through the summer and I may find another real estate agent. Amber, honestly, I would.

[Ken Coleman]

Cuz I, I try to sell this thing with every reckless abandon. I. I try to sell it, you.

[Rachel Cruz]

Know, because you're going to probably get more out of it, which you're doing, than the short sale of the bank. So I may even change realtors and just see where you can, where you can market it in other places. But yeah, that's, that's tough. But that, that would be what I would do. And then at the end, if there's no options, there's no options. Options.

[Ken Coleman]

Our scripture of the day comes from Jeremiah 1, verse 19. They will fight against you, but will not overcome you. For I am with you and will rescue you, declares the Lord. Our quote today from the Iron lady, Margaret Thatcher. You may have to fight a battle more than once to win. It seems appropriate for the baby step process. Keep fighting. Tyler's up in Raleigh, North Carolina. Tyler, how can we you help help today?

[George Kamel]

Hey there. Can you hear me?

[Ken Coleman]

I can hear you loud and clear. What's going on?

[George Kamel]

Excellent. Yeah, so thanks. I've been listening to your show for a few years. I just actually about three months ago finally paid off all my debt.

[Ken Coleman]

Congratulations.

[George Kamel]

Thank you. Yep, I had about $70,000 between student loans and automobile and credit cards. Right now where I currently stand, I have about $20,000. The bank, I have $50,000 in 401k and then I have about $15,000 in an HSA. So besides that, no debt or anything. And I'm 33 and I just feel a little bit behind. You know, most of my friends have, you know, houses and kids and are much further well off financially. But anyway, so it's just two questions. Just one kind of, you know, how do you level set and sort of get past that anxiety around that and then two, you know, the big thing that I want to do, I own a car too. So I'm completely paid off there. But I want to get a house and I'm trying to figure out how much I should save for a down payment for a house for a single man who's 33.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, let's address the I feel like I'm behind that's actually a myth. Because you look at most 33 year olds, the amount of debt they're carrying, you've cleared that hurdle. And so now it's all multiplication. You've had to slog through this and I get, get that. And it feels like you've wasted time. But the reality is most 33 year old dudes haven't come to the realization of what you have about debt, number one. Number two, they haven't cleared it up. So compound interest is a fabulous thing. And when it comes to compound interest, if you have life until you're 80. You're going to be very wealthy, my friend. So your catch up is coming. That's the first thing. The second thing is let's walk through the numbers. What's your income?

[George Kamel]

I make about anywhere between 130 and 150 depending on commission.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, 130, 150. Rachel, what do you think for a down payment for this young man who's making good money and he's debt free?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. Well, our rule of thumb, Tyler, is when you go apply for a mortgage, the lowest we want you to put down is 5%. And the payments on that mortgage should be no more than 25% of your take home pay. And that would be on a 15 year fixed rate mortgage. And the take home pay is before, before retirement and health insurance and all of that. It's just really after taxes is what you're looking at. And so yeah, I mean I would do the math. I don't have the calculator in front of, of me. If I did, I'd pull it up.

[Ken Coleman]

I can. Do you want to, what do you want me to do?

[Rachel Cruz]

Do ramseysolutions.com realestate oh, I was going.

[Ken Coleman]

To just do it a good old fashioned.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh, sorry. Yeah, yeah. No, because we can type in the. Oh, I got down payment and kind of figure out what it would be. It may take a hot second here, Tyler, but we have, we have about five.

[Ken Coleman]

Let me ask you this. While I'm doing this, the question is does he need to be thinking at 33 and single, a full house?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. I mean.

[Ken Coleman]

Or something smaller.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh yeah. I mean you could totally do just, you know, a town home or something because. Do you think you'll be in the Raleigh area for a while?

[George Kamel]

Yeah, my goal is to retire here.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Yeah, yeah. So I mean you're at the place financially, Tyler. That. Yes, that would be your next step is what I would do is, you know, the only thing that would throw a wrench in it. It'd be a great wrench. But if you married someone you know and it changed the plans, but you can always sell and that's not in your future right now. Right? You're not dating anyone, one that wants to move out of state or something?

[George Kamel]

No, I work at a startup, so I work about 70 hours a week right now.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh my gosh. Is that sustainable for you? Are you fine with that?

[George Kamel]

For, for. I've been doing it for seven years now, so it is getting a little bit unsustainable. But I want to see this thing through until we sell the company.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. Okay. Yeah, yeah, that's great. Well, we'll keep that. Yeah. In mind. So. Yeah. So for you get it.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't. Is this the cost of living calculator? Is that what the one is that you want?

[Rachel Cruz]

No, no, it's the mortgage cal. No mortgage calculator.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh.

[Rachel Cruz]

I'm trying to see how much you can afford for a. Oh, I see. Yeah. Yeah, sorry. But yeah, so, Tyler, it would just be. And again, I would have, you know, if you want to just go ahead and get into the market, I think would be my goal. It's not going to be probably your dream home that you're going to live in forever.

[Ken Coleman]

There we go. All right, I'm ready. Sorry.

[Rachel Cruz]

Got it.

[Ken Coleman]

User, user, user error. What do you want me to punch in?

[Rachel Cruz]

Let's see.

[Ken Coleman]

Home value. What is he thinking?

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. I don't know. Let's just play around with it. Let's say say 200,000. That's what's in there.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Down payment. Let's pretend. Tyler, you put down. Let's go, let's go. 15 grand.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Just for the fun of it.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

Let's see. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

And then 15 year fix interest rate.

[Rachel Cruz]

Interest rate right now is 5.95 on a 15 year fixed.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

All right. What do we have?

[Ken Coleman]

What do I just hit enter. You got the worst person doing this.

[Rachel Cruz]

Scroll up. I can't read that far. Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, here.

[Rachel Cruz]

You got it. Okay, perfect. All right.

[Ken Coleman]

Should just give her my lap.

[Rachel Cruz]

Sorry. That's what we should have done. I know.

[Ken Coleman]

So I'm basically the senior citizen, literally, of the group.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh my gosh. Because you're bringing home how much a month, Tyler? Right now.

[George Kamel]

After taxes and everything, It's. It's about six, 6200.

[Rachel Cruz]

Okay. If it was before health insurance and retirement, how much you think it would be? Closer to maybe eight?

[George Kamel]

Yeah. Yep.

[Rachel Cruz]

Probably closer to eight. Okay. So yeah, around 2K. Okay, that's it. That's about right. All right, so we're looking, looking at a home value around 200,000 actually ended up being just right. 2100 payment, which is about 25% of your take home pay before everything.

[Ken Coleman]

Is that doable in Raleigh or the surrounding areas?

[George Kamel]

Yeah, that's tough. I probably. I probably would have to go out into a surrounding area just because so many people are moving here right now.

[Ken Coleman]

So that could determine your down payment though. That's what she's. She's running numbers here on.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah. So if you go to Ramsey Solutions.com and do the, do the mortgage calculator. That's all I'm doing right now, just plugging stuff in. So yeah, 25. Yeah. $250,000 mortgage. Be about $2600. Almost $2700 payments.

[Ken Coleman]

Look at it. Populated it for all of it.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah, yeah, it's all right there. Which is. I was over there. So I would run some numbers, Tyler, on that and just see and maybe, you know, you do a little bit more of a down payment, wait a little bit longer, whatever it looks like.

[Ken Coleman]

But what are you saying? Thinking. I'm curious. What down payment size were you thinking? Because you've already thought about this is my guess.

[George Kamel]

Yeah, that's the thing is I, you know, I have some very fiscally responsible. My aunt, uncle who are kind of my advisors here in Raleigh. Right. You know, they told me you should put down about $50,000 just to be safe.

[Ken Coleman]

How long would it take you to get to this?

[George Kamel]

I mean it would probably take a year to be able to put that much away.

[Rachel Cruz]

Oh gosh, that's a big down payment. Yeah, so.

[Ken Coleman]

So yeah, Yeah. I mean, 50,000.

[Rachel Cruz]

I mean it's amazing. Yeah. So you get around a $250,000 house.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Rachel Cruz]

And again, running your numbers and, and get really clear on. Because you're also, you know, pulling that 6200 was from after retirement and health insurance and everything. So I'd go back and run some numbers, Tyler, and just say, hey, if I. Yeah, what, what's the true number that I'm bringing home before all of those things are being taken out and what's realistic of that? 25% of that take home pay. So that's.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you think I'm crazy? Okay, Tyler, I'm going to throw a scenario out here. This is what I think. I don't know what Rachel's going to say. She has no problem telling me I'm wrong. He's 33, he's single.

[Rachel Cruz]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Tyler, we don't have any prospects on the horizon, do we, for a mate.

[Rachel Cruz]

Nope, I already asked him that.

[Ken Coleman]

No, I know, I know you asked him. But it's like, is he thinking, oh, I'm just kind. All right, so. So if it were me in that situation, I would save as though I'm buying something in a year. But I wouldn't feel any kind of pressure because what if six months from now he meets this gal or, you know, and it's all of a sudden it might get serious. I just wouldn't be any hurry to buy as a single guy, I'd save. Yeah, and I know that's. I just.

[Rachel Cruz]

No, I hear you. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

I think he's throwing money.

[Rachel Cruz]

And Tyler, I think. Oh, well, I'm with you, Ken. I think. Think I'd be more with you if he was 23. He's 33. He's established. He wants to retire in Raleigh.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, then why. Why haven't you found the gal? You're 33. What do you do?

[Rachel Cruz]

Dating show Ken Tyler's an eligible bachelor.

[Ken Coleman]

I think we got too many guys that are getting the mid-30s and haven't committed.

[Rachel Cruz]

All right.

[Ken Coleman]

Not seeing.

[Rachel Cruz]

Ken wants a commitment with marriage. And I would do a house commitment in the next two years if I were Tyler. Be my next financial move.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Rachel Cruz]

I. I'd get in the market.

[Ken Coleman]

I can live with it. Two years. All right. This is the Ramsay show.