You Can’t Win With Money Until You Decide What Matters Most

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show

Episode: "You Can’t Win With Money Until You Decide What Matters Most"
Date: March 24, 2026
Host: Dave Ramsey with Co-Host Ken Coleman and Ramsey Network Experts

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Overview

This episode of The Ramsey Show focuses on the theme that real financial transformation starts when you decide what truly matters to you. Through live calls and candid advice, Dave and his team tackle real-world money woes—from messy family loans and car dilemmas to navigating massive debts and ethical questions about income. The discussion consistently circles back to intentionality, personal responsibility, and the importance of aligning your financial decisions with your deepest values.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Messy Family Loans and Control

Caller: Lacy in Seattle

• Situation: In-laws gave a $300,000 down payment for a house, but the loan structure involves repayment plus a cut of future profits, and the house is technically in the in-laws' name.
• Dave's Reaction: Immediate disapproval of mixing business-family deals and not having clear ownership:

  "That was stupid. You shouldn't have done that... You're renting a house, and your landlord is interfering in your personal life." (03:14)

• Advice: Sell the house to get rid of both the unaffordable mortgage and relational strain.

  "Don't accept gifts that aren't really gifts... When you buy a house and it's not in your name, you didn't buy a house." (05:34)

• Memorable Moment: Dave's passionate plea against allowing parents to control adult children with financial strings.

2. Impulse vs. Intentionality: The Car Conundrum

Caller: Jason in Las Vegas

• Situation: Jason wants a car with A/C but is hesitant to take on debt.
• Advice: Sell the motorcycle and use the cash plus savings to buy a $10,000 car outright, avoiding car payments entirely.

  "What you're gonna have trouble doing... is you're gonna have trouble avoiding impulse if you don't set this in stone right now: I am not going into debt and I'm gonna go pay cash for a car." (15:50)

• Insight: Illustrates the compounding impact of small decisions on long-term wealth.

3. Work, Parenting, and Housing Choices

Caller: AJ in Gainesville, FL

• Situation: New baby on the way, both AJ and his wife working hard. Deciding if one should stay home.
• Takeaway: Your financial path often reflects your values, but if the house requires two incomes, you've limited your choices.

  "You bought a house you can't afford on your income... So you're making choices." (19:03)

4. Surviving Storms: Medical Crisis and Financial Recovery

Caller: Ashley in Boston

• Situation: Both mom and baby have ongoing major health issues with significant debt and uncertain income.
• Advice: Focus on what can be controlled—budget, income, selling assets if needed—and give grace for the things you can't.

  "Give yourself a little grace and give yourself time to heal... If we don't make any progress right now other than healing, that's probably okay for right now." (31:39)

• Memorable Moment: Praise for the supportive husband working multiple jobs.

5. The Pitfalls of Over-Helping

Caller: Hannah in Grand Rapids, MI

• Situation: Rented an apartment at a discount to a struggling friend, now feeling used/enabling poor choices.
• Advice: Don't perpetuate a rescue-fantasy when someone isn't ready to help themselves.

  "I don't think that you can fix her life because she's choosing not to. If you gave her free rent, she would screw it up." (37:06)

• Dave-ism: "Your job is not Jesus. Jesus already took the job." (40:29)

6. Hidden Financial Skeletons and Relationships

Caller: Jerry in Columbus, OH

• Situation: Newly discovered wife's $48k IRS debt and concern about what else may be hidden.
• Advice: Prioritize full financial transparency and seek counseling if needed; pay off IRS immediately to avoid penalties.

  "Financial problems are never the problem. They're always a symptom of something else going on." (50:24)

7. Selling the Family Home to Reset

Caller: Beth in Detroit

• Situation: Massive combined IRS, home equity, and consumer debt; deliberating selling the highly appreciated family home.
• Dave: Sell the house to remove pressure and stress—"You have to get your life back for the kids. The definition of your kids having a good life is not where they live. It's who their parents are and how they act." (57:01)
• Insight: Addresses emotional ties to places vs. family's emotional well-being and reset after financial mistakes.

8. Ethics in Income and Investing

• Christian Perspective on Earning:

  "Am I in any way making money through some type of Ponzi scheme right now?... Making money off of evil actions would be your meter. Otherwise, you're overthinking it." (75:55)

• Stocks and Bank Deposits: Buying stock from another private seller does not make you complicit in a company's actions, unless your intent is to profit from wrongdoing directly.

9. Inheriting Wealth Without Guilt

Caller: Jamie in Memphis

• Situation: Difficult enjoying inherited money.
• Advice: Honor your legacy by using, growing, and sharing the wealth—don't feel guilty for having loving, generous family.

  "I would be trying to multiply the money and do good things with it to make grandpa proud." (83:11)

10. Financial Strategy Nearing Retirement

Caller: Mary, Washington D.C.

• Situation: Retired, strong pension, considering using surplus to pay off $376k mortgage vs. keep investing.
• Advice: Strike a balance—heavier focus on paying off mortgage while continuing some investing; consider rolling TSP to an IRA for better returns.

  "At 56, you got a lot of gas left in the tank." (91:22)

11. Ethics of Signing Bonuses and Early Job Switches

Caller: Brandon in Fort Worth

• Situation: New job opportunity shortly after receiving a large upfront payment from a current employer.
• Advice: Although not legally obliged, act according to the Golden Rule—consider returning the prorated portion to maintain personal integrity:

  "How would you want to be treated if the roles were reversed?... I'm probably gonna go, 'Okay, I worked here four months and I gotta pay taxes on all this... I'm gonna do something.'" (102:14)

12. Becoming a Millionaire: One Listener’s Story

Caller: John in San Antonio

• Net Worth: $1.7 million at age 55, no inheritance.
• Key to Wealth:

  "Roll up and just get over the mental hurdle. Once you get over the mental aspect, live within your means. Anybody can do it." (108:55) "The world's my oyster now." (111:49)

• Advice for Younger Listeners: Focus on delayed gratification, ignore comparisons, live below your means.

13. Massive Depreciation Mistake: The RV Trap

Caller: Michael, Dallas

• Situation: Owes $63k on a $20k RV; can't use it after buying a house, stuck with multiple monthly expenses.
• Advice: Sell the RV, negotiate a personal loan for the deficiency, cut spending drastically.

  "Truly, I'm stumped. The only thing I know to do—I think I would stop the bleeding by selling it and signing a note for the difference." (121:52)

• Key Point: Highlights why RVs and similar depreciating assets are such financial landmines.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Family Loans:

  "When you buy a house and it's not in your name, you didn't buy a house. Someone else bought a house. Hello?" —Dave Ramsey (05:34)

• Impulse vs. Intentionality:

  "If you don't set this in stone right now and say, I am not going into debt...you're gonna wander onto a car lot and some Porsche is gonna wink at you, and you're gonna leave with an $800 car payment." —Dave Ramsey (15:50)

• Enabling Others:

  "If you gave her free rent, she would screw it up...She would go rent three more couches." —Dave Ramsey (37:06)

• On Guilt and Responsibility:

  "Your job is not Jesus. Jesus already took the job." —Dave Ramsey (40:29)

• On Financial Secrecy in Marriage:

  "Financial problems are never the problem. They're always a symptom of something else going on." —Dave Ramsey (50:24)

• On Resetting After Financial Loss:

  "Sell it and clean up the dadgum mess...set me free." —Dave Ramsey (57:23)

• On Becoming a Millionaire:

  "Live within your means, build your budget, follow your baby steps and it's done." —John (108:55)

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Important Timestamps

• Messy Family Loans & Control: 00:44–08:09
• Car vs. Motorcycle Dilemma: 10:39–17:21
• Work/Parenting Trade-Offs: 17:31–21:32
• Medical & Financial Crisis: 22:59–31:39
• Helping a Friend vs. Enabling: 32:31–42:21
• Marriage, Deception, and IRS Debt: 43:32–52:21
• Selling Family Home for Debt Reset: 53:33–62:42
• Ethics of Income/Investing: 75:47–81:29
• Inherited Money: 81:57–85:16
• Retired and Mortgage Decisions: 85:16–93:47
• Job Switching & Signing Bonus Ethics: 95:02–104:26
• Millionaire Journey (John, San Antonio): 105:56–113:00
• Massive RV Depreciation: 116:37–125:12

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Tone & Style

Ramsey keeps a candid, tough-love style, blending practical advice, personal stories, and Southern humor. The team uses clear, direct language, occasionally sardonic, often warm, with a consistent focus on accountability and values-based choices.

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Conclusion

Throughout the episode, Dave Ramsey’s team reinforces that financial victory isn’t about perfect spreadsheets—it’s about courage, clarity, and the will to make hard choices in alignment with what truly matters most. Whether you’re battling debt, helping a loved one, or debating life-changing financial moves, the path to winning with money starts with deciding what you value—and acting on it, every day.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fair Winds Credit union studio, this is the Ramsey Show. I'm Dave Ramsey. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, number one best selling author and host of the front row seat fabulous show on Ramsey Networks. It's blowing up. He's my coach.

[Ken Coleman]

Voted today.

[Dave Ramsey]

Open phones here at 888-825-5225. The call is free and some say the advice is worth exactly what you pay for it. Lacy is in Seattle. Hey, Lacy, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey. So my husband and I are kind of looking for a little bit of an outside perspective on a situation we're having.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

So our my in laws, his parents helped us with a down payment on our house and now we're receiving a lot of, on my end, unsolicited financial advice about debts and what we're doing with our money. And I guess I just want to know how much influence I should allow them to have in what we're doing with our finances as a unit, the two of us.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know why they would have any. Do you have, do you owe them the money back? Do they loan you the money?

[Caller]

Yeah, well, they have a weird kind of situation. They've done this with his. My husband's sister as well. They kind of use it as a business transaction with their kids. So they'll help with the down payment on the house. And in the future when the house is sold, they would get their down payment back and a certain percent of whatever profit we would make on the house.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, that was stupid. You shouldn't have done that.

[Caller]

Oh, no.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's horrible. What an abusive mess.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much money did they give you?

[Caller]

They put 300,000 down on the house.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And how much is your mortgage?

[Caller]

Our mortgage is about 2650 monthly.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you borrowed 250,000?

[Caller]

We borrowed from them about the 3300,000 that they put down.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I didn't think. I didn't think that was a loan. I thought it had to only be repaid at sale. Are you paying payments to them?

[Caller]

No, we're not paying payments to them.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Do you have a mortgage in addition to them? Other, other than the in laws? Do you have a mortgage?

[Caller]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So they paid cash for this house. So you bought a $300,000 house.

[Caller]

The houses was $800,000 and they put 300 down for us and we are paying the remainder of the mortgage.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you have a mortgage other than the in laws of $500,000?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And your household income is What?

[Caller]

It's about 80,000 between the two of us. My numbers fluctuate a bit, but my husband's is 50k and mine's about 30.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you also bought a house you can't afford.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Your payment's what, 30% or 40% of your take home pay, right?

[Caller]

It's about that. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You guys are not gonna do anything I tell you to do. I can tell. But you bought a house that you can't afford. And you bought it on terms with the in laws that are absolutely cray cray ridiculous. And you've got a mortgage you can't afford. So that you're not going to do this. But what you should do is sell the house and you get out of both problems. The mortgage you can't afford and the in laws that you can't afford.

[Caller]

Dave, this. This was kind of sold to us on in like a dreamscape.

Like we'll.

We'll do this for you guys so you guys can stay in town. They want us close.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

[Caller]

Going to help.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can't afford the house. That's not a dreamscape. That's a nightmare. Yeah, it's a nightmare. You're broke and they helped you get broker. They helped you. But I bet they co signed on this loan, didn't they?

[Caller]

Yeah. Well, it's technically a lease to own situation. Until we start, it's in their name equity.

[Dave Ramsey]

The house is in their name.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes, honey.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so mom and dad, we don't want the house. We can't afford it. You know, so we need to put the house on the market so you can get your money back out. Because we can't. We can't pay this.

[Caller]

And what if they don't want to do that?

How do we.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's their problem. Because you can't afford it, right?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

But you're not going to do that because your husband, he's totally bought into this crazy family. It's dysfunctional. He's cut totally on. These people are not a blessing. They're a problem. I don't know what to tell you, honey, but if I were you, I would get out of that as fast like my hair was on fire. There's just everything. Every time you bury the lead. To start with. You didn't buy a house. Hello. You're renting a house. And your landlord is interfering in your personal life. Well, no duh. These people like control. They got their fingers in everything.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Yeah, I mean this is. Again, parents, don't do this stuff, please.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're not being a blessing, you're being a.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

But absolutely right. You're trapping this poor couple. By the way, the whole house was just a carrot to get them to stay locally. And that's the real freaky scary thing here. And this is tough for her because if husband doesn't step up, she's stuck.

[Dave Ramsey]

He's not going to step up. He's not going to step up. He's got to rewrite the script in his mind that his parents who are such philanthropists are actually a curse and he'd have to rewrite his script to be able to sell this house. And he's not going to do it. And instead what's going to end up happening is this is going to end up in divorce or bankruptcy or both. Because this is not going to end well. It's not gonna end well. These numbers are horrendous. And so here's an idea. Don't accept gifts that aren't really gifts. Number one. Number two, when you buy a house and it's not in your name, you didn't buy a house. Someone else bought a house. Hello? Number three. Rent to own is not owning, it's renting. Okay? I mean, let's just use the words the way they're supposed to be used and get it out from under Dreamscape. Shoot me. Oh my God. There's nothing good about. This is such a dysfunctional mess. The poor girl, bless her heart. Oh man, I can't even imagine. The last thing I want to do with my kids is to put this many wedges in between me and them. And because I got to tell you where I was on Saturday afternoon. I was sitting on my daughter's back porch eating hamburgers that my son in law cooked. And everybody was there, all the kids, all the grandkids, all 16 of us were back there. And we had no discussions like this at all.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's true.

[Dave Ramsey]

None. None. Ya.

[Ken Coleman]

None.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Ya.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't even get to choose where we're having dinner. I just have to go where I'm told. That's exactly, that's the truth. It's not even close to me having control of that. Wow. Scary crap. Scary crap. People don't do scary crap with your kids and then expect them to be hanging around with you. Loving grandpa. It's not how it works. I love entrepreneurs. Don't forget guys. I started my company on a card table myself. So I know what it's like to have people counting on you, your team, your family, not to mention your customers. And when you're the one signing the paychecks, you can't afford to fly blind. But I'll be honest. Early on, one thing that nearly sunk us was wasting time with spreadsheets that didn't add up because business units didn't talk to each other. I finally told my team, just fix it. And they did. We got netsuite. That was years ago and we've never looked back. See, netsuite isn't just for tech giants. It's built for growing businesses like yours. Over 43 businesses already run on NetSuite, including a lot that started just like you. And now with built in AI, NetSuite is helping them even more. It's one system connected to every part of your business. For real time Insights, not guesswork, NetSuite AI flags inventory issues, cash flow risks, even supplier delays before they become problems. So you can trust the data, stop wasting time, and make the right decisions faster. Take a free product tour [e-mail] Ramsey that's netsuite.com Ramsey. Jason's in Las Vegas. Hi, Jason. How are you doing?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, sir, how are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I'm having a little dilemma. I have some money saved, and I was thinking of potentially taking out an auto loan. Although I just had a car last year that I was able to sell for positive equity, and I used that positive equity to buy a motorcycle. But now that I'm sure.

[Caller]

You're where?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm in Las Vegas. The summer is right around the corner. If not here, it's starting to heat up. I definitely need to get a car with air conditioning because riding around is kind of killing me and I'm sweating a lot. But I also don't want to fall into a trap where, you know, I'm stuck with the car payment because I'm not a huge fan of payments. I try to minimize them the best I can.

[Dave Ramsey]

How old are you? 22.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm 32.

[Dave Ramsey]

32. Really?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

All right. And what do you make of your Sir?

[Ken Coleman]

Anywhere from 45 to 55,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you do?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm in the hospitality industry.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. In Vegas. No kidding.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you're obviously new to our stuff and to this show. We teach people the shortest method to wealth is to get out of debt and stay out of debt, because your Most powerful wealth building tool is your income. If you take the average car payment of $700 a month and then you invested that from age 32 to age 67, you'd have over $7 million. That's what the car payment costs you. And if you want to ensure that you stay at the middle class level or lower of wealth, keep a car payment your whole life and that will, that will make sure that you stay there. And so that's, you know, that that's the framework that you walked into with this question. And so what is the motorcycle worth?

[Ken Coleman]

I would say anywhere from four to 5,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I'm assuming you have no money. You have no money.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I have about 12 to 13,000 saved in what, just bank account. And then I do have a small, like ira, but okay, I don't. I had to withdraw a lot of it during the COVID pandemic, so it's not as much as it was before, but I'm slowly trying to build it back up.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay. Well, I mean, you had your little run with the motorcycle and it worked out for a while, and then the heat comes up in Vegas and it's time to get an air conditioner. That's logical. Makes sense. You kind of knew that was coming. If you didn't see it coming, there's something wrong with you. It gets hot there in the summer. And so what would I do if I were in your shoes giving you the outline I just gave you? The best way to build wealth is to avoid payments and you need an air conditioner. I would sell the motorcycle. I'd take 5,000 of my 12,000 and I'd buy a $10,000 car for cash and have no payment.

[Ken Coleman]

Idea.

[Dave Ramsey]

Actually, pretty good idea. That's why I have a show.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Or my other idea was just dug it out with the motorcycle and then use what I would be making if I were to take out a car loan and just invest it in an index fund and then just let it grow.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, not. You mean borrow on a car so that you can invest?

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, I'm saying, like instead of getting the car like I originally, you know, thought about doing, oh, just stick

[Dave Ramsey]

it out and just be sweaty.

[Ken Coleman]

Just be sweaty. And then just keep, you know, using the money like the 5 to $700 I would be making for that car payment and just, you know.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, you're not going to have a car payment, though, because you're going to pay cash for a $10,000 car.

[Caller]

Right?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, well, but Then that would deplete a lot of my savings.

[Dave Ramsey]

Deplete 5,000. You'll have 7,000 left. And you got no payments. Remember, you have to pay. And with no payments, if no payments, you can actually build wealth.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

But the sweating, you have to decide, am I going to tough it out with a motorcycle or do I not want to sweat very much?

[Dave Ramsey]

But I'm not saying there's no $500 car payment in the equation here. None. No car payment at all in the equation, if you're asking us. I mean, that's what I would do if I was 32 and I lived in Las Vegas and I was single and I made $45,000 a year. I'm getting an air conditioner to start with, and I'm. You know.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And then build the emergency fund next.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, right.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And then I'm.

[Dave Ramsey]

Then I'm going to start building some wealth and, you know, work more, make more, work more, make more.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

What's the path to six figures? You know, in hospitality, or if it's not a path there, you don't want to be in hospitality. Decide what is it that I want to do, and start to get very intentional. At 32, the good news is you've avoided a lot of crazy debt at this point. Bad news is you don't have a plan. And we do have a plan, so welcome to the show and the baby steps. But all you gotta do is walk this out.

[Dave Ramsey]

What you're gonna have trouble doing, because you've done a lot of stuff in your life to date on a whim, on impulse, is you're gonna have trouble avoiding impulse if you don't set this in stone right now and say, I am not going into debt and I'm gonna go pay cash for a car. You're gonna wander onto a car lot and some Porsche is gonna wink at you, and. And you're going to leave with an $800 car payment. That's what's going to happen. She's going to flirt with you, and then you're done.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you've got to be careful. It's happened to me. You can tell I can't walk by a nice car. They're. They're. I like it. I love a good car, but. Yeah, but it's. It'll kill you. It's the biggest thing that we all buy in America that goes down in value. And they go down in value like a rock. A new car loses 70% of its value in the first four years. That's turning 30,000 bucks into you know, just a few thousand dollars in a heartbeat. And I mean, think about it, how fast? I mean, they go down in value like a rock. That's where Chevy got that, Like a rock. And so, I mean, it's just crazy, y'. All. And you just. You gotta be careful with these things. They're cars or something. You consume only when you have extra money around. And, you know, a situation like that young man's in, he does not have extra money around. And you're right, Ken. A whole series of intentionality moves on his part would make the next five years of his life completely different.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

No question.

[Dave Ramsey]

We can't wander from thing to thing impulsively. It doesn't work. AJ's in Gainesville, Florida. Hi, AJ, what's up?

[Caller]

Hey.

How's it going, guys?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

[Caller]

Hey. So I'm in my late 20s. Me and my wife, we bought a house. We should close our first house in September. And we got our first baby on the way. She's due in May.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yay.

[Caller]

So we just finished baby step three, working on baby step four now. And so I guess my question for you is, I've been working for about the last six months now. I've been working two jobs. My wife works full time also. We're trying to grind a little bit while we can. I work seven days a week, 60 hours a week.

[Dave Ramsey]

What are you doing with all the money?

[Caller]

Saving it, currently.

[Dave Ramsey]

Are you out of debt?

[Caller]

Yes. Yes. We're on baby step three right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay. Good. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller]

So my question is, do we. We're trying to decide if, when the baby comes, if I continue working both jobs so that my wife can stay at home, or if it's more beneficial for our family for me to cut that. Cut back the second job, and then she goes back work full time as well. The baby in daycare.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't think that's happening.

[Ken Coleman]

Dude.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you see her sitting with a brand new baby in her lap, going back to work when she doesn't have to?

[Caller]

No.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I don't see that.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. Our, you know, debate is, but you

[Dave Ramsey]

bought a house you can't afford unless one of you. Unless you work two jobs or she works one.

[Caller]

No, no, no, sir. Not at all.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So why can't both of you quit? I mean, you go down to one job, can't live on your job.

[Caller]

No. We need at least two incomes.

[Dave Ramsey]

I know why. House payment. Right. You don't have any debt.

[Caller]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you bought a house you can't afford on your income,

[Caller]

right? Yeah, because we saw it as household income. So. Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So there's a third option. You know, you know, we can't live here, but I can work 40 hours and you can stay home and we have to live someplace else. That's another option. You're making choices. You're working to buy a house is what you're working for. That's what not, not to live, but to buy that. When you're drowning in credit card debt and collectors start threatening lawsuits, a rep from some call center debt relief company can't protect you. A lot of so called debt relief programs leave people wondering am I actually protected if I get sued? When all you've got is a legal plan added on as an upsell, of course you feel stuck. But Guardian isn't another debt relief company. They're real attorneys. And with Guardian you're assigned an attorney from day one. That means if a creditor sues, you're not scrambling and you're not hit with surprise legal fees. Now look, I'm telling you straight, debt settlement isn't pretty. I'd rather see you get out of debt the old fashioned way. But if you're out of options and you're staring down bankruptcy, Guardian gives you real protection and a path forward. Guardian's attorneys have helped over 55,000 people across the country settle more than $600 million in debt. Not with gimmicks, with legal expertise. So if you want real help instead of a sales pitch, go to guardian lit.com ramsey that's guardian l I t.com/ramsey attorney.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

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[Dave Ramsey]

The Live like no one else cruise is back. If you are on baby step four and beyond, meaning you're out of debt and you have your emergency fund in place and you want to come hang out with us and celebrate some of your financial milestones, we'd love to have you. We completely sold out the first cruise and the second one is, it's not quite sold out, but we're getting there. It's seven days, super high end cruise. Very nice. This is not Walmart on the seas. This is the good stuff. The Neptune Suites have already sold out. We're going to be going in one year in March of 27, one year from right now. And it's the only cruise where you can hang out with us. All the Ramsey personalities will be there. We're going to be doing sessions and teaching and laughing together and hanging out together. We have lots of our special friends from the Celebrity world hanging out with us as well and doing music. All kinds of fun stuff. So lock in your spot with a $600 deposit before it's too late. We're going this time to the Western Caribbean, so Jamaica, mon. Yeah. RamseySolutions.com events RamseySolutions.com events Ashley is in Boston. Hey, Ashley, what's up?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. Hi.

Hi, Ken.

Thanks for taking my call today.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller]

So sorry if I get a little emotional, but we've been in storm and stork mode for a year and a half and we just aren't really sure what to do next.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so that means you have a baby on the way.

[Caller]

Well, he. He's here.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good. When was he born?

[Caller]

I've.

He was born in the beginning of October.

Great.

[Dave Ramsey]

How's he doing?

[Caller]

But he's having a lot of medical challenges. It was.

We both were almost lost during birth, so it's been a really difficult recovery. We're both still in the hospital pretty much every week.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. From what.

[Caller]

So there's a variety of things. For me it's a lot of physical issues related to the birth and some complications. And for him there's a variety of things neurological, his feeding in his intestines and gi. On Friday we had to go because he stopped breathing. And I found out that that's just part of his conditions. So it's.

[Dave Ramsey]

So what. What do you guys. I mean you've been through hell since October.

[Caller]

This is not even even the October before that when I was laid off from my long term job. So it's. It's been a. Yeah, it's been a while.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So what does your husband make?

[Caller]

He has a full time job and side hustles and his full time job is sales. And so he makes at least 55 a year. Some months we're up to 8,000 from his income alone. And then side hustles, a lot of reselling and we've delivered things and done things like that as well.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so since October, you've been down for the count for sure. I mean you're just trying to.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Trying to heal and, and get baby healed and, and get back to some level of normal. Right?

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what did you used to make back in the day?

[Caller]

At my previous long term job, I made 65, 000 a year. And then the job that I started before I went on maternity leave, I was making. It was estimated to be about 40,000 a year.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And the, and how much debt have you guys got.

[Caller]

Well, we currently have. I'm sorry, is it okay if I break it down by, like, credit card and stuff?

[Ken Coleman]

Sure, sure.

[Caller]

And credit cards totals. Based on the credit report, it's about 30,000. I'm reaching out to request details as a lot of them have been sold off to debt collectors. We have a car that we owe 12,300 on. The online payoff amount shows 12,200. I think most of the interest was front loaded, but it's worth about 6 to 8,000. Private party sale due to damage and mileage. We have a home. Our debt on the home is just under 347,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

What's the house worth?

[Caller]

We had it listed and the only interest that we had was for under 370,000 and they wanted us to cover.

[Dave Ramsey]

What did the real estate agent think the house was worth?

[Caller]

He thought it was worth 369,000. No, older home was.

[Dave Ramsey]

No. The only interest you had was at 370. What did you have it listed at?

[Caller]

375.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. All right. Okay. So you don't have much equity. Okay. All right. So what I'm always looking at when I'm in a situation like you're in is there are some things I can't control, and there are some things I can control, and I get anxiety mostly, not from the things I can't control, but the things I can and I'm not. And so what I'm starting to look at is, okay, what can I control in this situation? What can you do? You can't control the baby's health. That's up to God and the doctors. Right. You can't control your health. Exactly. Other than the things you have to follow the doctor's directions in both cases, the baby and you. Right. But right now, right now, the things that are given in this story, as I understand it, is we've got a sick child that's trying to heal and a sick mommy that's trying to heal. And that's okay. That's okay. It's not good. It's not fun. But that's not anything you can do about that. You can't wave a wand and, you know, fix that. Agreed.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So it's going to take a minute. Give yourself a little grace and give yourself time to heal and so forth. Your husband sounds like he's an excellent man. I love this guy. What did he do? He went to work and made sure his family had money.

[Caller]

Wow. He goes above and beyond.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, he does. I like this guy a lot. He's a good man. All right, cool.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you were going to make another point. Well, listen, this is all you can't control is his effort.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So he's going to keep working. Can he get better paying gigs? We're selling everything. We're going to try to whittle this thing down and get some momentum right now with all the health stuff, it has exacerbated all of the financial stress. And Dave just did a great job of really laying this out. You've got to make that switch to the best of your ability, mentally and emotionally, to focus on what we can control. So how can we begin to chip away? We're upside down in the car. We need the car.

[Dave Ramsey]

So it's not out of control.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

It's not completely out of control. That's doable. So really, how do we begin to get some real momentum through additional income, doubling down on the budget, making sure that we are only doing what we have to do right now. And, you know, your husband, again, is doing the right thing and staying with it. I'd like to see his income get a little higher in that sales role. I'd like to see him approach six figures in a sales role. And so maybe. Maybe that's what he's looking for. I know he's working like a crazy man right now, and we admire that. But if I was in his situation, I'd be going, how can I double my income in a sales function? That's what I would be trying to do.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And talk to a Ramsey trusted real estate agent and have someone else come and look at this house and consider if that's gonna work or not. I don't know if it's gonna work or not. It doesn't sound like there's a lot of room there. But if the house payment's bothering you and you can get way down on house payment. So here's the thing. If you can retreat back to safety, give yourself room to heal, one thing's for sure, it'd be very unusual. And I've been doing this a long time, sitting in this thing. I can't think of a single case that I've worked with that 10 years later, you're in exactly the same spot with your health. I mean, you're not gonna be in the same spot with your health ten years from now. So this is a, as you said, a rough patch. It's not a destiny. It's not. It's not the prescription for your whole life. So you guys keep scratching and clawing. And then the sun will start to come out and then there'll be a light at the end of the tunnel that's not a train. Finally. And. But in the meantime, you've been through a hard time and hey, we're with you. You, I'm with you. I think your emotions are real and I would have them too. So keep pushing, keep pushing. But also give yourself a little room to say if we don't make any progress right now other than healing, that's probably okay for right now.

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[Dave Ramsey]

Hannah is in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Hi Hannah. How are you?

[Caller]

Good.

How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

Well, I'm renting an apartment to a former co worker of mine. And originally it started out where I was trying to help her out, get her back on her feet. She was going through a breakup and she had two kids and they were going to be homeless. And now it's to the point where I'm wondering if I'm just enabling her poor financial choices.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long has this been going on?

[Caller]

Two years.

She's been there almost two years.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, well, at what point was she supposed to get back on her feet?

[Caller]

Well, that's a good question. Right now I'm charging her 750amonth in rent and that's including all her utilities. Should, the apartment should be about 1200amonth in rent. She was, she was doing all right. And then she was in a car accident, didn't have any insurance. Now she's got a bill. A bill for that. And then she got into another car with those $40 down deals and she's 20,000 in debt on a car that's only worth maybe six grand. She's, she's paying more on her car than she's paying me for Rent. So I don't see her getting out of the hole anytime soon.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so instead of getting back on her feet, she dug the hole deeper?

[Caller]

Yeah, pretty much.

[Dave Ramsey]

By not having insurance and making a bad car decision.

[Caller]

Yeah. And I just recently found out, well, she missed December rent. She's caught up now, but she missed that for. She was buying Christmas stuff for her kids. Then I found out that she's paying 200amonth almost to rent. Rent couches for her apartment.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

She only makes about 3,000amonth, I think.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, how does this end? Where does this. When does this end?

[Caller]

I mean, either I raise the rent and then she gets behind and I have to evict her. Or. I mean, that's really the only. That's really the only option I see. I could ask her to leave. I don't know how that would go.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't agree with you. I think that. I think if it just keeps deteriorating, you don't even have to raise the rent. She's not gonna be able to pay it because she keeps making stupid decision after stupid decision on top of each other and they're compounding and she's gonna bury herself and then she's not gonna be able to pay even your reasonable rent. Hello?

[Caller]

Hello?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You agree?

[Caller]

Yeah, I agree.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't even have to raise the rent. This thing's gonna go down the toilet eventually anyway.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So, you know, the question is, are we just gonna stand by and watch that happen? Are we gonna take proactive measures on the other side one way or the other? So.

[Caller]

So I do. I do have a lease with her that's out in next March. Yeah, I mean, I guess. Just right.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't think she's going to make it a year.

[Caller]

I don't. I don't. She works a seasonal job and her hours will go down mid summer.

[Dave Ramsey]

What is your job?

[Caller]

Making as much? We both work in the greenhouse.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So we. That's what I'm wondering. Is there an emotional attachment you have to this person that you probably have not or would not with other people that are leasing from you?

[Caller]

Well, we used. We used to work together and we don't anymore. That ended about three months ago. I no longer work with her, so. And I also. I was living in. It's a triplex. I was living there as well. So as long as I was there and seeing her every day, that made it harder. And I no longer live there. So it's really helped me have more of an emotional break. Emotional break from having to see her and see her there. See her at work. And I'm really.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

You sounded emotional when you started talking to us. I could be wrong, but you sounded emotional.

[Caller]

I'm just. I'm just nervous.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Well, you're doing great, by the way. You're doing great.

[Caller]

Well, thanks.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Yeah. I'm with Dave on this one, but I would be planning. I would be planning on. What are we going to do when she can't pay the rent anymore so that you're not stuck with this. You wouldn't do this for anybody else is the feeling I get.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't think that you can fix her life because she's choosing not to. And you're not. You're not going to fix it. If you gave her free rent, she would screw it up.

[Caller]

No, I think if I gave her a free rent, she would go rent three more couches.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's what I meant. She screwed up. Yeah. Yeah. Or. Or a hot tub for the back porch or whatever. Yeah. And so.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. So I think we've got to, you know, you need to sit down, have a conversation with her, human to human, and say, all right, we started this so that I could help you. And here's what's happened since I started helping you. You've gotten worse. You rented couches, you went around without car insurance and made a mess, and then you bought a car that you absolutely can't afford that's killing you. And so I'm thinking this is going to end poorly. Like, you're going to not pay me rent, and then I'm going to have to evict my friend who I was trying to help. And this whole thing breaks my heart. So you and I need to come to an agreement that says that you need to go live somewhere else because I'm not a blessing to you. And I want to be a blessing to you. I want to be helpful to you, and I can't be that while you're here.

[Caller]

So maybe I should ask her to look for somewhere else before the situation gets worse.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, like now. I was talking about. This conversation happens next week, Okay? I want her to leave now. I want her to go buy. Go rent something that she can afford

[Ken Coleman]

that's cheaper, and she can't get anywhere cheaper.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yes, she can.

[Caller]

I don't know where.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't either. I don't either, but it's not your job. Your job is to remove her. That's it. No, you're right, because you're not. This is not going to work out. It's not a Loving? You're not loving her by just doing nothing and letting this thing go down the drain. If you really do care about her, help her move. You know, I'll give you a free rent. I'll give you a free month's rent, or I'll refund next month's rent if you're gone by the end of the month. And that'll help you get started on your new thing. And give her $750 after she moves out.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I could do that and then

[Dave Ramsey]

go rent the stinking thing for $1,200. And the next time you get ready to help someone, you need to think about what help looks like and where this is taking us. Because you giving her a place to live did not keep her from being homeless. Yeah, hello. That did. Not that. You know, you used that line in your head and you used it on us, but I'm not buying it. She would have figured out something. She's always figured out something. And the only way that I help someone in a situation like that is if I get down under the thing and I start going, okay, we're going to be on a budget. We're going to work six jobs. There's no rental couches. There's no car payments. We keep insurance in place, and we're going to ride herd on doing smart stuff with your money. And if you do smart stuff with your money, after a little while, you'll have some money. It's be to going pretty amazing. It's kind of. It kind of works, like, every time. And when you do dumb stuff with money, you have no money. It works, like every time.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

I was going to ask you, how do you. How do you recommend people, like, in this situation deal with the guilt? Because she's a good person. The caller's a really good person. Obviously trying to help out a former co worker.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can't be. Your job is not Jesus.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right. But how do you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Jesus already took the job. It's his job.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're not. You're not signed up for that, and you don't have the skills for it.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Your job is not to fix everyone. You can't fix other people. The only thing you can do is set up a situation where they can do something. You set up a situation where they could do something and they chose not to do it. That's right. I can't make the lady stop doing stupid stuff.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So a question could be, did I do everything?

[Dave Ramsey]

That's why I end the call here. When someone Calls, and I tell them what to do, and then they argue with me. And I tell them what to do, and then they argue with me. The third time, they argue with me. 100% of the time. Y' all will hear me in the call. I am not going to try to talk you into this stuff. I'll show you what to do. And if you. If you insist on being a stupid butt human being, you're going to be broke, and I'm going to just watch it happen. I am. And I go home with no guilt. I turn off the microphone, get my car, drive home. I don't even remember you called. Because it's not my job to fix your life. My job to help you, show you how you fix your life. You're the hero in the story. I'm not the hero. I'm just a guy on the sidelines showing you what to do. I'm Yoda, teaching you how to swing the lightsaber. If you choose not to get in a fight, I can't help you with it. You know, you got to step into the force yourself. I can't do it for you. And she can't do it for her friend. And just giving her a place to live and calling that. Oh, she would have been homeless otherwise. No, she wouldn't. That's bullcrap. She wouldn't either. She might have had a hard patch and then worked it out. But you've got to stop doing the stuff that you keep doing the same thing over and over again. You expect a different result. It's the definition of insanity. And I got no guilt about that. That's not being calloused. It's just. It's not my job to be Jesus. He's got that job already taken.

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[Dave Ramsey]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show and the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio. Ken Coleman, Ramsey, personality number one best selling author is my co host today. Open phones at Triple 882-55-5225. Jerry is in Columbus, Ohio. Hi Jerry, how are you?

[Ken Coleman]

Hi, Dave. I've, I had a question for you. I've been, I've been married for 11 months and I found out during our joint filing with my wife that she has four years of back taxes with the IRS totaling about $48,000. And I'm looking for your advice on how to handle that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow, that's a bummer. So did she, Is she deceptive or incompetent or both?

[Ken Coleman]

Without sounding derogatory, I'd probably choose the latter.

[Dave Ramsey]

Incompetent?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I mean, like it didn't, it didn't occur to her that this was a problem?

[Ken Coleman]

No, she thought it would fix itself.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Okay. And that's why she didn't bring it up. She wasn't actually hiding it. It just was not on her radar as important.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Where you're like in freak out mode and so am I.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Like. Ah, you're kidding. Holy Jesus. Oh my God. The irs, of all people. Okay, so the first thing I want to pull the thread on, what else don't I know that you don't think is important?

[Ken Coleman]

Agreed. And I asked her this question about two weeks ago when we were filing and then this kind of. She came clean with the rest of it because I saw from 2024, the tax year, that there was stuff that had been penalized. And I asked her about that and if there was anything else, she said no. And then yesterday she brought up these other things.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I mean, like three years ago I got a car repoed and I didn't bring that up, but they're, they're going to come to me for $30,000 one of these days.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

But I don't think it's a big deal, so I thought it'd take care of itself, so I didn't bring it up. I mean, what else is out there that I didn't think is important? So I didn't bring it up.

[Ken Coleman]

Agreed.

[Dave Ramsey]

I really want to dig into that. And. And somehow. Okay, so her reaction is not. It was kind of like a shrug, like, this is just no big deal, or am I missing something?

[Ken Coleman]

She views it as a big deal. Thought she could take care of it herself.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay. All right.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So what did that involve?

[Dave Ramsey]

Because what I'm trying to. What I'm trying to do is establish your relationship pattern going forward.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree. So why. She brought it all to me, and I, you know, now I know what's on the table. We looked at her credit report to identify anything else, like you said. So I have a view of everything that's happening now. I. I just need. Need to know what. What's the best plan of action? Do I pay it all as a lump sum?

[Dave Ramsey]

If you have it, you have it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Yeah. Write a check. Because the penalties and the interest, you can't. They're ridiculous. And there's no discounting with the IRS. They're made whole 100% of the time. So. Yeah. Just the faster you can clean it up, the better. But I really want to make sure relationally that there's nothing else out there riding. You didn't see anything on the credit bureau. And I want to make sure that we're aligned on. This is the worst financial moment of our entire lives. Relationally, it never gets any worse than this. Everything is better from here forward. We really need to both be on that page because, I mean, I'm scared that this could happen again if there's not like a. An acknowledgement that how damaging this is to a relationship by her. So if that's not the case, then you guys may need to sit down for a tune up with a marriage counselor just to get things dialed, get some tools in both your belts to get aligned on that. This is like grown up stuff and you can't freaking ignore it. And me be okay with that. I'm not going to be okay with that. And so we have to be aligned on that. We together know everything, and together we are aligned on every decision going forward so that there's never. I'm never going to be surprised again the rest of my life if I'm you. I'm not okay with surprises of this type. And so.

[Ken Coleman]

And I'm just.

[Dave Ramsey]

Go ahead.

[Ken Coleman]

We just. We have a. We have our first baby coming in two months, so it's kind of all falling on top of me right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Well. And, yeah. And so we're negotiating with the lady in her third trimester, too. This. This is just really not profitable.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wow. Okay. Well, at Some point in this process and it may not be anytime soon, given that last piece of information. If there weren't a baby on the way, any moment I would be in the marriage counselor's office for a tune up to make sure I was aligned. But I may wait until the baby's four months old. But she needs to. You guys need to have a conversation of this that she clearly. Without you shaming her or yelling at her or something like that. But this is just. We're not going to function this way going forward. Okay. And then I'd write a check and pay it off because if it comes back again after you write a check and pay it off and something else pops up or she goes and does something else and forgets to tell you because it's not important. But it is important. I can handle it myself or whatever the bull crap narrative was on this thing and it was bullcrap. Then we don't want a repeat of this. We want to heal this broken narrative. Does that mean. Yeah.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And one of the things I was going to lean into is if you guys aren't already doing combined finances, that needs to happen today. So that again, as we work through the relational stuff here, the financial stuff is also completely. Everything is on the table. This is a tough feeling to have, but I agree with Dave. I stroked the check today. You don't want to be dealing with the IRS on this. And listen, it's going to suck writing that check, but it's going to suck worse not to deal with it and to try to string this response out with a baby on the way.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, no, don't do that. I'll take care of it immediately. I get on the phone with them, find out what it is, clear that. But we have to make sure that there's no repeat. That's the big thing here. And so. And transparency does that. And so if you got fully transparent and then you're looking over her income and her withholding and the two of you are doing your taxes together and then there is a shortfall, then it's now your fault because you're. You got your fingers in there with it. Okay? And to Ken's point, when you combined everything and then it still happens, then now it's on you. So that's the whole process. That's where I would go. But the big thing is this. Financial problems are never the problem. They're always a symptom of something else going on. So you got to go down to ground. Okay, what's the problem? What's Causing this. And what's causing her to not deal with this family of origin? They were. You know, we were ashamed to talk about money. Every time we talked about money, daddy yelled, so. I don't want to talk about money. Afraid you'll yell or, I don't know, whatever the bull crap is that's under there. But there's bull crap under there. I promise you. This is crazy. And because It's. It's not $500. It's $50,000. That's not an oops. Okay, 500 is an oops. 50,000 is bothering me. Yeah, man. And what. What a setup, though. I mean, with a baby coming in two months. W.

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[Financial Expert/Advisor]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Beth is in Detroit. Hi, Beth, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi.

I'm all right. How are you?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Caller]

I'm calling to see if what your advice would be on selling our family home. We've got four kids. In order to pay off a large amount of debt.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, and so how much is a large amount of debt?

[Caller]

So we owe 145 to the IRS. 145,000. And then we have 100,000 on a home equity line of credit. And then about almost 50,000 on medical expenses and car payments.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's your home worth?

[Caller]

Our mortgage is for 470. And we have an offer currently that we just got for 755. So it would allow us basically to clear the decks and restart. But our hesitation is with our. Just our kids.

[Dave Ramsey]

Where did all this debt come from?

[Caller]

So my husband was the primary breadwinner. I was home with our kids, and he got into day trading. And I am guilty of burying my head in the sand and not getting involved in our finances. So he made quite a bit, lost it just as quick, and then turned to credit cards and then didn't pay taxes on the capital gains he made with the trading before losing it all.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. There's not capital gains on day trading. There's ordinary income on day trading. And there's also a loss you can take if you've lost money against that.

[Caller]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you really think you have the whole story?

[Caller]

So I'm not entirely financially literate. This is something that I'm trying to get more involved in just in the last couple of years. Taxes in particular.

[Dave Ramsey]

I mean, when did all this happen?

[Caller]

This happened about. Well, I think it was happening for quite some time, but again, I kind of was burying my head in the sand, and he just came to me three years ago. We had a major health crisis, and he said, you know, I gotta come clean. We owe quite a bit of money. I cleared out our 401. I cleared out all of our savings.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so he's been. You've been limping along with us together for three years with you having. You having knowledge of it?

[Caller]

Yes, sir. Yeah. We've been married for almost 20 years, but we. Three years. I've had knowledge of it.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what. What does he. What does he make a year?

[Caller]

He makes 180 as a base, but he's in. He's in sales. But it's been a tumultuous and very dry coupled.

[Dave Ramsey]

And he's not. He's not day trading anymore.

[Caller]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. So your. Your question was interesting. You said we would do this except for the kids. I think you have to do it for the kids. You have to get your life back for the kids. Your kids, your kid. The definition of your kids having a good life is not where they live. It's who their parents are and how they act.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You live in a house that's way nicer than you grew up in. So do I. So does Ken. And we didn't die from that. And it didn't malform our character from that.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

So sell it and clean up the dadgum mess if the problem has gone away. No more day trading and no more deceiving. And you guys are working together on this. Then he takes his 180,000 and hopefully more 250,000. And you guys work to rebuild your lives and buy another house someday. But in the meantime, I'm going to be free, baby. Set me free. And I think the stress level in the air of your home will go down and the children will benefit from that far more than they will having that particular. Particular set of bricks and mortar.

[Caller]

Okay, that's a good word. Yeah,

[Ken Coleman]

yeah.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

I'm just going to add. Just do your own research tonight on how stress affects your physical health. It's not just the mental and emotional. We forget what it does to the body. So I would just add if I had the chance to fix this. And I love the fact that he came forward three years ago. If you guys are on the same page now, I absolutely agree with Dave. This is a reset. A reset with the idea, though, that we never do this again.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. I mean, he has to say, I lost our house.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

This is a day trading. I lost our home. That's how big a deal this is. Okay. By the way, I lost everything and went bankrupt because of my choices, not my wife's. All right. When we went bankrupt 30 plus years ago. All right, so that's, you know, and I get to own that the rest of my life. But I also never did the things again that put me there again. Ever again. Again. Again. Never again. You see, I mean, you say I, you know, I lost everything. I lost my home. We did not lose our home, but we own. The only reason was there was no equity in it. And so, so I survived the bankruptcy, but. And it wasn't that nice a house anyway. But the. Anyway, yeah, we, we just said, you know, we lost everything. We get the opportunity to start again fresh and clean. And in your case, that's the sale of a house. In our case, it was a bankruptcy. And we're never going back here again. And we never went back there. And we. From that point forward, we never. I never bought anything that Sharon and I don't both agree to investments or otherwise. And so, yeah, so I think it's fair to say, just to outline for everybody, just to let you guys know out there, this is not a unique situation. Here's the numbers. And this is the most bizarre number I have almost ever heard in the investing world. If you day trade for 36 months, continuous, 97% of you lose money. That's how stupid that is. I mean, if you said 97% of the time, you walk across the street, you get hit by a car, you would not walk across that street under any circumstances. You wouldn't be the one guy that says, frogger, I got this. You wouldn't be that guy. You'd be going, no, those are not odds. I want to play. And there is something about the arrogance and pridefulness that says, I've got the stock market figured out. If you hear someone say that, laugh at them. They are funny people. They are statistically shocked, stupid human beings. 97% of you that day trade 36 months consecutively, lose money. Now, you need to hear that because some of you get a little fishing story where you hit a lick and you go, oh, I made some money. And it's just like gambling in Vegas. Now I'm going to go back to the table, and the only part I'm going to remember is the time I won. I'm going to Forget about the 16 times I lost. And when you add it all up, you lost. That's how they build those nice hotels in Vegas.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So true.

[Dave Ramsey]

And the same thing is true at day trading. You lost. Poor guy, Poor gal. What a horrible thing they're going through. But some of you people, man, you're sitting out there with Dave Ramsey doesn't understand. Listen, I understand. What I understand is why. What I don't understand is why you don't understand. 97. What other number do you have? This 97% of anything ever that's not statistically significant. That's like a fact. You're going to lose money. Oh, my God.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And it has the same trap that gambling does.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, it's the exact same trap because it's got a feedback loop. It's the same thing as DraftKings. Same crap. Same exact thing. That's why sports betting's gone through the roof. It's a feedback loop, a scarcity feedback loop. And our friend Michael that wrote Comfort Crush, Michael Easter, his second book, Easter, his second book, talks about that a lot. And he went into great depth study on that about the. The dopamine hits and, and how you just keep cycling back into this thing. You cycle back into this thing. And it's. But, yeah, it's just pushing the same button and it's. But it always has at its core, this ridiculous arrogance that I can beat the house. It's just, it's arrogant. Beyond. Pride comes right before. Or you have to sell your house because you lost everything. Wow. Pride comes right before the fall.

[Caller]

Wow.

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[Dave Ramsey]

You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah.

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[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook and that's long term disability insurance.

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Dave Ramsey]

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[Dave Ramsey]

Protect yourself, protect your income, protect your family. Are you sick and tired of working so hard but having nothing to show for it? Feel like a rat in a wheel? Run, run, run, run, run. Get nowhere. Well, that's normal. And normal's broke. Well, you ought to be sick and tired of that. Well, good news is you don't have to live that way. We can show you how to get traction, how to make progress on getting rid of your debt and building wealth. Our every dollar budget app helps you find extra money every month and build you a personalized plan to get out of debt and become wealthy. In just 15 minutes, you'll find thousands in hidden margin and you'll feel like you got a race. So don't live normal when you can live like no one else. Start every dollar for free in the App Store or Google Play. Zach is with us in Colorado Springs. Hi, Zach. How are you? I'M doing pretty good.

[Caller]

How about yourself?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's up?

[Ken Coleman]

I can give context after the question

[Caller]

because I follow you guys and this is going to sound like I don't,

[Ken Coleman]

but I wonder if I should. If there's a trick to increasing some credit problems so that I can get a house within 18 months or if my credit score will go bye bye

[Caller]

in that amount of time.

[Dave Ramsey]

Everything that we've seen, they do not publish this. But everything that we've seen in six to 12 months of the time you had zero activity on any account, your credit score will disappear.

[Caller]

Okay, are there, are there like any

[Ken Coleman]

ways to guarantee that it does that? No, my main credit issue is a collection debts.

[Caller]

Those will be knocked out within a couple of months and I want to make sure nothing appears again after that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, well the, if you have, if you have settled them, if they're not outstanding, there should be no more activity on the account once it's settled, right?

[Ken Coleman]

I believe so.

[Caller]

I'm just, I've just, I've had a couple pop up that I didn't know were even in collection.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I can't, that's why you can't make a guarantee. I mean if you have something pop up, then the whole clock starts over, dude. So I mean you can't, you know, but if you've got stuff that's in collections or been in collections and you're having to settle it, the last thing you need to do is go into debt to build your credit score to buy a house. So you need to freakin do this in the right order, dude. I mean listen to what you're actually saying here. It's kind of crazy. So no, you need to clear, you need to clear the debts, get to zero and zero activity. And if it takes longer than six months or longer than 12 months because something else pops up, well that's something else popping up would have screwed up your other plan too by the way. If you're sitting there and the credit score is going up, up, up because you have a bunch of healthy accounts that you're paying on time merely to drive your credit score up and you have a collection drop in the middle of that, it goes down, down, down. And so anything you have pop up that you know that unexpectedly is going to affect this either strategy negatively. So no, I would clear everything and count on 6 to 12 months after date of last activity, you should see a credit score disappear, become undeterminable and you can go to Churchill Mortgage and get the same mortgage that someone with an 850 score can get same exact mortgage, but they do manual underwriting in order to make that happen.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

I just want to point this out because we take this call all the time. You need to be aware that everybody you know is probably going to disagree with what Dave just said, because they're uninformed. They think that you almost heard Dave wrong is my guess, because this is such a cultural thing. So I'm only bringing this up to say, call Xander and talk to them.

[Dave Ramsey]

You mean Churchill.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Excuse me? Churchill. Thank you. Call Churchill Mortgage and walk through it so that you actually have real data. Because most people that you do life with will think that either A, we're crazy or B, that you heard us wrong. That's how systemic this credit score belief is. So I just want to point that out, that when you get off this call, you might be on the high of, okay, I know what to do. And then you tell anybody, they're gonna look at you like you got horns growing out your head.

[Dave Ramsey]

Tyler's in Atlanta. Hi, Tyler. How are you?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm doing good. How you doing, Dave?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, so right now I currently travel for work. I'm a fiber optics plaster and I make about 130,000 a year. And my wife, we have one little boy and we have a little girl on the way. And I was wanting to try to move back home and my pay will probably be getting cut in half almost, and she's a stay at home mom. And I was just gonna see what y' all thought on that.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

What's the driving reason that you are even considering taking a half pay cut to move back home?

[Dave Ramsey]

Being home with a kid.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

I know, but I want a little bit more on that. I know. What's the driving reason that would make you consider that?

[Ken Coleman]

That. Well, I'm gone for five days a week and then once a month I have to work the weekend shift. And I just want to be home with them more, be more present, and that's it.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Okay. So it's. It's not trying to be near family to make up for the travel. It's. I just don't want to be on the road.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, pretty much. I just want to be with them more.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Is that your only option, to take a 50% cut?

[Ken Coleman]

Probably not 50. It might go from like 130 to like 70 or 80.

[Caller]

Probably doing what?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm a fiber optics block.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So you do the same thing?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

And how. What made you. Where'd you get that number? 70 or 80?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I've just been looking at like jobs in the area I live in and that's about the median for that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Published jobs or friends telling you about stuff?

[Ken Coleman]

Published jobs?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Okay, so that's the median. So what does a path look like for growth? Forget this move for just a second. If you stay in your industry, what is possible for you to get to over time? If you look in the next three to five to seven, 10 years, same

[Ken Coleman]

man, it's growing pretty good. If I move my way up, say I go to supervisor or something like that, I could probably reach back over 100,000 a year while at home.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Okay, what's beyond supervisor?

[Ken Coleman]

Probably like regional and stuff or like director.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Okay, what's that make?

[Ken Coleman]

I'd probably say well over 120.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Is that something you want?

[Dave Ramsey]

Why are you not eligible for that now?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, well, I'm 22 right now and I've been doing this almost four years, which I don't know if I am or not.

[Caller]

I haven't really looked at that yet.

[Ken Coleman]

But I'm just guessing, I'm probably just new, too new to it. And I don't really have any supervisor.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Can I give you some older brother advice? Actually, I'm old enough to be your dad. Sadly, I just realized that. So here's what I think. I think you're allowing the real raw emotion of being away from the family, how bad your heart's hurting, and that's because you're a good dude. You're a good dude and a good dad and I totally get it. But I think you're allowing that raw emotion to get in the way of a long term plan. And at 22, with another one on the way, I would be thinking about the next five to seven years as clearly as I could. Understanding I can't control the future, but I can look forward and I can go, how do I want to take care of my wife and these two little ones five to seven years from now? And if it were me, I would let this sit a little bit bit, get some more wisdom. Besides Dave and I, some older guys in your life say, hey, I'm dealing with this real emotion because I think until you have a plan for what the next three, five, seven years could look like in your industry, I would not leave this job and I would let my heart hurt a little bit more because the babies are little. One baby at home, another one they don't even know. You'd be present when you're home. I would not make this move right now, unless I could clearly tie it to a better move long term, I'm willing. When I came to Ramsey, I actually went backwards a little bit for about a year and a half, but I knew coming here was the best long term play. But it was a part of the long term. And let me also point out, I was able to do it. We made some changes financially to where we weren't scraping.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Let me add one other thing. Okay. Do not just because you saw some job listings at one price, don't accept that as your destiny. Right. So, you know, I don't think that you have to make less coming off the road. I think you can make almost what you're making now, but you're probably going to have to poke around a little bit more to find that one because you are in a wonderful trade right now and the trades are very short on help. And I think you're probably in a stronger position than you feel like you are. You do not have to take a pay cut necessarily to come home. It's not mandatory. Our question of the day is brought to you by why refi if private student loan default has kicked you off? Well, here's how you reset. Why refi works with borrowers and other lenders that other lenders won't. They'll help you refinance defaulted private student loans with a low fixed rate so you can get back on the plan and move forward. Visit yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey might not be in all states.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Today's question comes from Adrian in Romania. I've been wrestling with whether certain ways of making money are morally right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Right.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

From a Christian perspective. I understand working for a salary, creating a useful product or service, or renting housing at a fair price. But I feel conflicted about things like stocks and bank deposits because they seem more indirect and harder to evaluate ethically. For example, when you buy and later sell stock for a profit, it can feel like you're benefiting without really creating value. And with banks, you do not always know how your money is being used. Am I overthinking this or are some forms of investing more consistent with Christian convictions than others? Yeah, I do think you're overthinking it, but I don't take a shot at you there. I think, you know, you've got a great heart. I think you've got to use God given common sense and then also that still small voice of discernment. And I think that when it comes to just your general Investing in banks, you don't need to feel guilty about making money on your deposits or making money on your money market or making money on your. Your investment strategy, certainly what we teach here at Ramsey. So I think while you're overthinking it, I appreciate where your heart is, and I think you just have to back off to. Wait a second. Am I in any way making money through some type of Ponzi scheme right now? That is dishonesty. That is lying. Making money off of evil actions would be your meter. And so outside of that, I think you're overthinking it.

[Dave Ramsey]

But am I bringing harm to someone?

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Yeah, that's the other thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so when you deposit money in a bank and they pay you interest, you're not bringing harm to someone. You can't control what the bank does. It's the same thing as if you go and buy groceries at a grocery store. They now have your money if they go and do something evil with it. You bought groceries, you didn't do anything, they did. And so, same thing with a bank. If you put a deposit in a bank and they do something evil with it. Now, now, if a bank is known for screwing people and you put your money in there, well, yeah, you're kind of participating then, but just, you know, if a grocery store is known for screwing people and you do business with them, you're participating, too. Same thing, right? And so, you know, the trick is we try not to do business with people that have evil intent in any way because they're going to do that. And that is consistent now. And here's another interesting one that comes up also in this thing. It's stocks, you know, buying stock. Now, I don't want to. I've heard people say from a Christian perspective that I don't want to buy stock in X Company because X Company might be doing something wrong. Well, if you buy stock from that company, unless it's an initial public offering or unless it's treasury stock being sold, both of which are very unusual. But if you simply call your broker up and say, I want to buy stock in Home Depot, Home Depot doesn't get the money. You're not buying the stock from Home Depot. You're buying it from Ken, who's selling his Home Depot stock. It's an individual to an individual. It's like my. It's like my buddy has a Chevy pickup up for sale, and you go buy the Chevy pickup. Chevy doesn't get any of the money. Okay, but, you know, but if. So if Chevy. If Chevrolet is screwing somebody somewhere or messing somebody over. You buying that Chevy pickup from another individual is not in any way funding the evil practices. Now, you are driving around a brand that you don't agree with, okay? But aside from that there, you know, it's a used car. The, in the new car dealer does not get. The new car manufacturer does not get any. This is a used share of stock. You know, they don't get any benefit from it at all. Now if the stock goes up in value and that benefit because that company's doing evil things and screwing people, then you have benefited. But the actual purchase of the stock is from another individual. And so there's nothing there. And that's the thing. So you have to be real careful about jot and tittle here, the details. In other words, you have to be careful about how far down in the weeds am I going to try to do that?

[Caller]

This.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so, you know, it's. There's almost no way that you can have any transactions in the marketplace that at some point you can't lead it back to something that you don't like, somewhere, somehow. Yeah, but you're. What, where you have to decide is, okay, how much, what control do I have and is my intent to profit off of this? So, for instance, I would never buy or do business with or put money in any way anywhere near a payday lender. They're charging 800% and they're screwing poor people, okay? So I'm not, I don't want to own one of those secretly on the side that none of you know about, but God would know about it, right? So as a Christian, I'd be screwing poor people. And so I'm not going to have anything to do with a payday lender in any stretch, any way. And, and, but, you know, just because the grocery store, they don't get a pass either because, you know, they sell whatever that I don't agree with in there, you know, and you know, you could say, well, there's some kind of toxic. It's just, you can never get to the end of this if you spend all your time.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

You drive yourself crazy.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I spend a reasonable amount of time saying, this is God's money. Am I doing something that makes him blush? If it does, then I don't do it. But I'm also not going to spend my entire life trying to live in a cave, click, lint and avoid doing business out here in a positive way, helping people in the process and not enjoying the whole process. So there you go. Interesting all right. Jamie is in Memphis. Hi, Jamie. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm doing well.

How about you, Dave?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. What's going on up.

[Caller]

So my question is, how do you enjoy financial peace when the majority of your net worth is money that you receive, like through inheritance and wasn't through your own hard work?

[Dave Ramsey]

Do you have children?

[Caller]

No, I'm single.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. Do you. Will you have children someday?

[Caller]

Most likely not. No, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I want good things for my kids. Most people do. And so someone wanted good things for Jamie and they blessed you with an inheritance. Was it your parents, your grandparents? What?

[Ken Coleman]

Grandparents.

[Dave Ramsey]

Grandparents. Okay. Didn't they deeply love you?

[Ken Coleman]

You? They did.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. And so they wanted to do nice things for the. Their grandkid who they love. I don't know why you couldn't enjoy that. You didn't do anything wrong except to have grandparents that loved you. Right?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So I wouldn't, I wouldn't be wasteful. I would be trying to multiply the money and do good things with it to make grandpa proud. So he's watching from heaven and say, I want him smiling. I want to live out the legacy that he built and do good things, do positive things with the wealth. And part of that is enjoy it. Part of it is multiply it, invest it.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Well, yeah, I would just add, there's a lot going on. We don't have time to dig in. I think a practical answer is how do you start to enjoy money that you didn't earn is a little bit at a time. I think it's like being afraid of riding a bike. If I could take you way back there, you wanted to ride a bike little you was like, I think riding a bike would be amazing. I see older kids doing it, but I'm also equally terrified to try to learn to ride the bike. And I think there's something going on with you and money.

[Dave Ramsey]

So training wheel.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So I do think training wheel. I think just go give. Here's what I would do. I would give some today or tomorrow, not a huge amount, but just something that makes you uncomfortable enough and it's not a crazy amount, but just give it to somebody and watch someone's reaction to you taking that money and doing something good with it. And then down the line, a day or two later, buy something again, reasonable, something that you would like to buy. Maybe it's even a hundred dollar purchase, who cares? But I think little bit at a time to begin to experience something positive with money. Because my belief is you've not experienced much Positive around money. Money at all in your life.

[Ken Coleman]

Foreign.

[Dave Ramsey]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Winds Credit Union Studio. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, is my co host today. Mary is in Washington D.C. hi, Mary, how are you?

[Caller]

Hi, Dave. Fine. Thank you so much for taking my call.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller]

I'm retired with 8,500 monthly pension, $4,600 in expenses. I owe 376,000 on my mortgage and have 249,000 in my 401k and 40,000 liquid. Should I use my surplus to pay off my home early or keep investing?

[Ken Coleman]

H.

[Dave Ramsey]

Interesting. So how much is owed up the house?

[Caller]

376.

[Dave Ramsey]

376.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And so. And you're how old?

[Caller]

56.

[Dave Ramsey]

56. Yeah. So I do want your home paid off. Okay. Going into retirement. Going into retirement. And so I don't, I don't want you to carry a mortgage. I mean, you're early retired at 56. But I'm saying going into your 60s and 70s. I want the house paid off. So we need to get there. But if we did, even 10 years, that's 66 years old, that's $30,000 a year, that's $2,500 a month. You could do that and still invest. Or you could back off of that, or you could back off the investing and be done in six years or five years. If you put 5,000amonth, it'd be gone in five years.

[Caller]

That's true.

Okay.

Is that what you would recommend?

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't like doing nothing on investing, so I would do something there. But I'm gonna put the heavier part of the excess money on the house while still doing something. So if I had 5,000 to play with as an example, which it sounds like, like you don't. Sounds like you got four to play with.

[Caller]

Right, right, right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. What about three and one? What would that do for us? That's 36,000 a year. And get you about, get you out in about seven, eight years, something like that. Yeah. If you put $1,000 in investing, that's only $12,000 a year. And you put 3,000 on the house, you'll be done. I think I'm doing this in my head, but I'm pretty close. I think it'll be between seven and eight years, you'll be out. And here's the thing. If is your 250, that's in the 401k invested in good growth stock mutual funds, earning market rates of return.

[Caller]

I think so I retired from the government. So I have the G fund.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so it's tsp.

[Ken Coleman]

It's not 401k tsp.

[Caller]

I'm sorry, it's tsp.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. I would move it all into the C plant, not the G. Okay. It's been earning about what the S and P does. And so it's been earning around 11 12% a year average. If you're earning 10%, which the G is not, but the C would be if you're earning 10% a year. Your lump sum, your 250 that's in there will double every seven years. You're 56. So that means that 250 will be a million dollars at 7:70 if you don't add anything to it. If you don't add anything to it. And if it's in the C plan now, if you're retired, you can roll that TSP into an IRA with a, with a good Smartvestor Pro and pick mutual funds that'll outperform the C if you're stuck in the tsp. You know, like if you still work there, than I would be in the C plan. Maybe a little bit in the I, a little bit in the S, but mainly the C. If you're working there but you're not there anymore, you can roll that. You could go on ramseysolutions.com, click Smartvestor Pro, roll that 250 and sit down with them and say, hey, If I add $1,000 to this and it's invested in the four types of mutual funds that Ramsey talks about. Growth, growth and income, Aggressive growth and international, which is what my personal portfolio is. And so, so is Ken's. Okay. And we pick good mutual funds that have a better track record than the market, better than the S and P averages, then. Yeah, then your 250 will be a million dollars and your thousand dollars a month will be another chunk as well at 70. And you'd have the house paid off at 4,000 or $3,000 a month in I think seven and a half, eight years, we'll call it. But that puts you at like 65 with a paid for house and on your way to a million dol nest egg. Meanwhile, as soon as the house gets paid off, you, you know, your investments already be on track. You've got some freed up money at that point.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Yeah. And the only thing I would add, and we didn't get into this with you, so I'm not sure if you're single, if you're married or not, but the $4,600 I'd be looking.

[Ken Coleman]

Where.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Where can we cut? There. That feels like that's a little bit high, but I love that you got the $8,500 monthly pension.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's nice.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

It is nice. Another thing I would also throw out there. I'm not saying you have to do this, but I would think about it. Being young like you are, got a lot of experience. How could I take some of that government skill, go to the private sector for three years, 24 months and make some good money? And fast forward the entire timeline that Dave just laid out.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. You drop a couple hundred grand on this formula, all of a sudden everything shifts quick.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Because of her age. I would think about it, you know,

[Dave Ramsey]

between now and 60, you could pay off the house with income only. Correct. Extra income only correct. Make 300 grand between 960. That'd be like $120,000 a year or whatever. I mean. Yeah, I bet. I bet you could.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

It's possible. I would lose. I would look at it as an.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't have to do it as a slave drive. No. Take something that kind of makes you smile. You're happy to go to work.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

And go make some. A little bit of money. And it makes me real happy because I'm paying off my house super fast. And then I can really do. Be serious about investing. That's. That's a really good idea. And think about that because at 56, you got a of lot. Lot of gas left in the tank. Yeah. A lot of things you can do. Yeah. That's very cool. Okay, so the TSP has the thrift savings plan for federal government employees, has several options. The G is the. Is like a guaranteed and it's one of the lowest paying of the options. The C is a common stock and it mirrors the S and P. The S is small company and is like an aggressive growth. The I is international. And so that's like an international growth stock mutual fund, same kind of thing. The S and the I have underperformed though their indexes in the marketplace, so they're not as strong. The C is by far the strongest thing. Not even a close second in the TSP program. And so what we've always recommended is somewhere around 80% for those of you working there, or more in the C plan. And if you want a little bit of spice in the gumbo, you could go 80, 10, 10. 80% C, 10% S, 10% I. And that's starting to approximate the four types of mutual funds. We talk about growth Growth and income, aggressive growth in international in your TSP and you'll get a good rate of return there. But I would have zero in the F or in the G, either one. And they also have new life phase plans. I wouldn't be in any of those at all. Not at all. Don't let the government plan your investing. That would be a bad idea. Sorry if you work for the government but you should know that. Yeah, no, you want to plan your investing and you want to look at the track records of these particular indexes that these are modeled after and they're pretty simple to look at. They, they've got lots of good information on their website on it. But if you're in the, in the TSP plan, that's what we recommend folks. And I would recommend anytime you leave a company or the government that you roll to an IRA because a self managed IRA through your broker in good mutual funds is going to outperform the limited options you had back at the old.

[Ken Coleman]

Foreign.

[Caller]

Hey good folks. Dr. John Deloney here.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Don't you think life is too short to hate Mondays?

[Caller]

Listen, you're worth loving the work you

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

do and where you do it. So guess what?

[Dave Ramsey]

What?

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Ramsey Solutions is hiring. If you're ready to join an amazing

[Caller]

team that's all about changing lives and

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

spreading hope, we want to see your application.

[Caller]

Right now we're hiring for technology, sales,

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

marketing, writing, copy editing and creative roles. Check out all our job postings@ramsey solutions.com careers that's ramseysolutions.com careers.

[Dave Ramsey]

Brandon is in Fort Worth. Hey Brandon, how are you?

[Caller]

Oh, it's another beautiful day in paradise for me guys. How are you gentlemen?

[Dave Ramsey]

Just the same. How come we help, sir.

[Caller]

Good. Glad to hear it. Well, my question revolves around a bit of a moral conundrum for me. I'm wondering whether or not I should give back a prorated amount of money that was a lump sum given to me by a pretty new employer based on the fact that I have pretty much nailed down a new job and whether or not I should give any of that back.

[Ken Coleman]

So that's what so you got, you

[Dave Ramsey]

got, you got paid a signing bonus to come with them.

[Caller]

Less structured than that. Basically what happened is we during the negotiations for this new job we agreed on a salary amount. We walked away. The next day they called me and said that for internal company politic reasons they didn't want to put that amount of salary on paper. So what they were going to do is put me on paper for a lower salary and a third party Tangentially related to the business would give me a lump sum roughly equivalent to 33% of my annual income just up front. And those two things combined amounted to the amount that we agreed on for an annual salary.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long were you there?

[Caller]

I have only been working here for four months. There is not a shred of paperwork that has been wedded with ink that would legally require me to give this money back.

[Dave Ramsey]

But did you handshake and say you would?

[Caller]

Yes, I did. Well, I didn't say I would, but I did handshake and say I would work for them. And I'm having some mixed feelings about leaving so soon.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Why are you leaving so soon?

[Ken Coleman]

Because I have.

[Caller]

It was somewhat unexpected, but a job hiring window opened for a job that is kind of the Cadillac job in the industry in which I work. Within three to five years, I would roughly triple my current income. And it's just too much of a improvement to my family's quality of life to say no.

[Dave Ramsey]

Sure.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And you've already accepted the new role?

[Caller]

Essentially, yes.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

What does essentially mean?

[Caller]

Yes. Yes. Pending a training date is what that means. So I don't know how long I'll be working at the current.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much was. How much was the lumps on?

[Caller]

It was $50,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what did you do with it?

[Caller]

Well, we still have roughly half. My family and I are still in baby step two, so we used a. About half of it to clean up two car loans that we had. So now we're debt free except for our mortgage. But we did chew through a decent chunk of it. But I have about half and about 12 and a half thousand dollars of that is obviously earmarked for taxes.

[Dave Ramsey]

So how.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Okay, it was a part of your salary. It was such a convoluted way of doing it. But the bottom line is that was a part of your salary. They just chose to pay you a different way.

[Dave Ramsey]

They prepaid it.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So how much of the 50,000 over the course of 12 months, how much would that represent?

[Dave Ramsey]

It was for over how many months?

[Caller]

I've been working for the company for four months.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm sorry, but was that for a year to make up the difference? For one year?

[Caller]

Yes. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, okay. Okay.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's what I'm trying to figure.

[Dave Ramsey]

$4,000 a month. Okay. $4,200 a month. Okay. All right. And so. And you've been there four months. That's 16 of it. And you got to pay taxes on this?

[Caller]

Yes,

[Dave Ramsey]

But they didn't. There was no. Like, if we move someone from another state and we hire them. We pay X number of dollars, call it $10,000 in moving expenses. Our employment agreement requires they repay that if they leave within 90 days.

[Caller]

Correct. And that is pretty standard in the industry. However, I. I signed nothing to that effect whatsoever.

[Dave Ramsey]

And they. They. And there's no. There was no discussion of if you leave, you got to pay this back.

[Caller]

Not particularly.

[Dave Ramsey]

No. It's just. It's just. You feel. You feel funny about taking the money and then not being there the whole 12 months. What was going to happen at the end of 12 months, by the way?

[Caller]

Well, so. But one thing we did discuss was that, you know, that. That this third party would help make up the difference every year, and. No, not every year. So when. One thing that we did discuss was that they have to basically allow me to do outside work to make up the. That difference, you know, so basically, I had about 12 months.

[Dave Ramsey]

So you.

[Caller]

Not to go to my new position.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I'm talking about if you had stayed there 12 months. After 12 months, your pay goes down $50,000.

[Caller]

Yeah, that's correct. That. From that wacky primary employer.

[Dave Ramsey]

Wacky. That you took the deal.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's kind of a crazy deal. I have had a decent amount of success with side work making up that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. But that's irrelevant to this. This is like, you know, we don't want to tell the other people that work here, so we're not going to put it on paper. This just got. This got us a bad smell over the whole thing.

[Caller]

Yeah, it's pretty. It's pretty weird. I make no bones about that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not on you, but on them. It's just strange. And a third party has to come to the table. This is very strange.

[Caller]

So third party was like a relative.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I. Okay. The best way to answer a business ethics question is what would you want someone to do if the roles were reversed? Treat other people like you won't be treated. And so just switch roles and try to put yourself in their shoes and say, all right, I hired this guy. I gave him 50 grand. He worked here four months, and he took off for a better job. How would you want to be treated? I would probably, if I were. If I switched and tried to look at it through their weird lens, but they have a weird lens, but I'm trying to sit over there in their shoes. I think they're good gonna. I think they're gonna have. Not a moral expectation or an. I don't think you breached any ethics. I don't think you did anything wrong legally. If you kept the money. You know, they learn a lesson on how not to structure deals. Cause this was a stupid butt way to do this thing. So. But especially with nothing inked on it. But I. How would you want to be treated if the roles were reversed? And that's the kind of person you want to be, regardless of the kind of people that are. And so, yeah, I'm gonna, I'm probably. If I'm switching roles, I'm probably gonna write them a check for something. And then you just decide maybe it's the 25 and you gotta cover the taxes or whatever. I don't know. You got, you know, you got tax problem out of this too. That's mixed in there. But I'm probably gonna go, okay, I worked here four months and I gotta pay taxes on all this. And there's. Here's what's left out of that. And so here's what I'm gonna do. And I'm not obligated to do anything, but I'm gonna do this just as. Because it's the kind of person I am, I'm probably going to do something.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Yeah. That's why I was asking that question of how is that built in so that we could come up with a number. So we've done four months service out of the 15. That's where I was going.

[Dave Ramsey]

16 of the.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know, so 17,000 of the 50. So that's 33 left. He's got 25 in the account. But he's been taxed on 50.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's the other issue.

[Dave Ramsey]

So he's not netted out. And I don't want to pay them back my tax money.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's when I owe taxes.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And I'm not going to do it in a lump sum. I'm going to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Also an idea. What if you said 50 minus tax or 4200amonth minus taxes and did it that way?

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That feels. I'm. So what I'm trying to get to is. Is a good formula that makes sense.

[Dave Ramsey]

Net of taxes.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

The taxes they lost. Yeah.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Because they essentially prepaid him. Is that correct? That's how we're looking at that prepay on work to be done.

[Dave Ramsey]

What they did.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

And you only did four months. So I would feel that way too.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. And. And I don't think again, I'm. I, I wouldn't throw darts at you, whatever you do, because I think they're squirrely. And, and I think the. This whole a smell on it. That's weird. Yeah. And so you Know, they get. They get what's coming to them on that. But if I answer an ethics question honestly, I have to get a tender heart and I have to step on the other side of the desk, and I have to say, how would I want to be treated if I was sitting over there? And how would I expect to be treated? And, you know, that. That's. That's the thing. So we had a guy working for us when the Internet first started and cold fusion was the language. And I spent $5,000 on a cold fusion class and another $4,000 to send him to class in Oklahoma City. And it was in the early days. That was a lot of money for us. In the early days. He came home and, of course, everything's blowing up. You know, brand new Internet, right? And a Guy offered him $50,000 more a year three weeks after he got home from class to go to work over there. More than I could pay or would pay. And he said, I gotta. He said, I gotta come in and tell you about this, but I can't take it because you just invested all this in me. It's why I got the job offer. And I said, yeah, you gotta take it. So I let him loose with nothing, and I didn't ask for anything back. But that was, you know, again, how do I want to be treated?

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Yeah, he handled it up front.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. All right, let's cut to the chase. It's easy to get discouraged about crazy house prices and interest rates. But when you have the right real estate agent to help you buy and sell the right way, you'll have confidence to make smart decisions. Ramsey trusted agents aren't just experts who guide you through buying or selling. They're people you can trust to have your back. From the first call to closing day. Find a Ramsey trusted agent near [e-mail] agent. That's ramseysolutions.com. One of the best things that you can do for your finances. Have a great tax pro in your corner. They'll help advise you on the best moves to make for your situation, for your small business, or if you've had some big life changes in the past year. If you want to know who we trust, who's Ramsey trusted? Go to ramseysolutions.com taxpro to find CPAs and enrolled agents that have been vetted by the Ramsey team. John is with us over in San Antonio. John, I see on my screen you're a baby steps millionaire. Way to go, dude.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Dude.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, I gotta give credit to you, Dave, for putting me on the path.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I'm you. You walked it, man. I ran it or something. So what's your net worth?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, right around 1.7 million I think. I just wrote a check for my house last month.

[Dave Ramsey]

Way to go. That's fun. Congratulations. Okay, so break the 1.7 down for me. How much of it's your house?

[Ken Coleman]

Probably between a little bit over 400k I would think.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, so you've got a four hundred thousand dollar house. Okay. What's the other 1.3 million? Million.

[Ken Coleman]

About 1.2 is probably in 401k and retirement accounts, that kind of thing. Because I've started up a couple of those.

[Dave Ramsey]

And 100 in miscellaneous.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. You know, emergency fund, six months.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, and I keep that in cash and usually just buy like t bills that you know, mature within a month.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. How old are you?

[Ken Coleman]

Cash on hand, but I'm 55.

[Dave Ramsey]

55. And how much of the 1.7 million did you inherit? Inherit?

[Ken Coleman]

Zero.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

I inherited my parents knowledge.

[Dave Ramsey]

There you go.

[Ken Coleman]

And love, love it.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's good news.

[Ken Coleman]

I love it. My mom's still alive too, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

Very cool. And your worst year of income since you've been working. And your best year of income since you've been working.

[Ken Coleman]

Worst year? Probably 50. Best just a little over 200.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. What do you do for a living?

[Ken Coleman]

I'm a project director and medical research. Research.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Four year degree.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

In what?

[Ken Coleman]

Geography and child psychology.

[Dave Ramsey]

Got it. Cool. And your GPA when you were going to school?

[Ken Coleman]

I was worried you're gonna ask me that. I'm gonna say it was close to three but not quite over.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay. That's what mine was. Mom was a 2.97 and I'm still pissed about that. Three one hundreds. Yeah. There you go. Good for you, man. All right, so you didn't inherit anything. You start at zero. At age 55, you got 1.7 million including a paid for house. Very cool. So when you're out there running around today and you see these news reports that the American dream is dead, that it can't be done today, do you think this can be done today?

[Ken Coleman]

Absolutely. And not only can it be done, it can be done easily. It's all mental. My dad immigrated over from Germany when he was in his 20s and accomplished the American dream. My parents instilled me that it is absolutely possible. Take some sweat and just keep your head on straight. I didn't grow up until I was 32. I just wasn't thinking clearly. And then I was And I applied the principles they instilled in me and your baby steps that gave me the path and it's absolutely possible. If I could do it, anybody can do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

So if you got, if you got a 24 year old version of you listening, what would you tell them the key is to being a millionaire? 1.7 million by the time they're 55. What's the key?

[Ken Coleman]

Roll up and just get over the mental hurdle. Once you get over the mental aspect, live within your means. Anybody can do it.

[Dave Ramsey]

By mental aspect you mean believe it can happen or what do you mean?

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, you know, it's not hard. You live with what within your means. You have all the tools there it and don't get tied up in the math. Don't get down into the minutia. Just live within your means, build your budget, follow your baby steps and it's done. And just don't worry about little stuff. Still, you keep your eyes on the big picture and you will take what you've learned. There's so much you can read out there. But again, a lot of it gets done into the breast, you know, I mean not the breast tax, into the nutia. If you just focus on the, on the prize and just don't buy the things that you just want. Just go with what you need and then the day will come where you're going to be giving more and your soul is going to be much more full and you're going to be happy.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Let's talk about that.

[Ken Coleman]

Worried about the next bill that comes along.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

So I love it. You're talking about delayed gratification, right? This idea of mentally get over wanting all this stuff. Keeping up with the Joneses, I think it's a great word. I want to ask you this because you're A young man, 55, you got a 1.7 million net worth. How has paying off that house a month ago come into grips with what you're telling us today of where you're at now at only 55? What does the future look like and feel like to you?

[Ken Coleman]

You know, it gives me options. I mean technically, could I retire now, but I don't want to. But I have options now. I mean, when people call in and yell to the top of their lungs they have freedom, it's no lie, it's no joke. It is that you're given freedom to have much more control over your own life and what you can and can't do. And I saw it, my daughter's eyes when she looked at me, when I Told her I wrote a check from. Just paid off the house. The proud feeling she had for me, which is in the way my mom looked at me, and, you know, they look at you like you're a winner, and you feel like you're a winner, and there's just, you know, the world's my oyster now. What do I want to do? I mean, I enjoy my job. I love doing what I do, and I get paid well for it. But now I. I can pretty much do whatever I want, and I love it.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you have?

[Ken Coleman]

A lot of. Just a lot of. I'm kind of looking for the web. Just so much I could see in our future, and I. The way my kids are growing up, getting on the same bandwagon, and, you know, there's just so much I can do now, so much potential.

[Dave Ramsey]

Amen. Amen. What do you drive?

[Ken Coleman]

I Drive a F150, a 2011 F150.

[Dave Ramsey]

2011 F150. What's your wife drive?

[Ken Coleman]

She has a Kia Sportage. Huh. How old? And it's about. It's about two years old.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, good, good. Okay, so, folks, if you want to know what somebody's worth, $1.7 million drives. That's what they drive.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's. That's an actual thing. That's not. Not a video. It's not an MTV reality show. It's not a. You know, it's not Divorced Housewives of the Moon or whatever.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's my favorite fake show title of all time.

[Dave Ramsey]

And I was trying to think of some bizarre place, but they're all taken, I guess. But anyway. Yeah, way to go, John. Proud of you, man. You're living the American dream, doing it right. Starting from nothing. He's sitting there. So let me help you guys with this. He's 55 years old. He's making $200,000 a year, and he's continuing to invest. If he doesn't do that, this. This net worth will roughly double every seven years because it's invested in 401k and Good Mutual funds, the way we teach. And it's invested in real estate. Okay? And so if it's. That means at 62.3.4 if he does nothing else. And that means at 69.7 million if he does nothing else. And that means at 76. 14 million if he does nothing else. The average death age of a male. And so this guy passes away at 80 years old with a 25 or $30 million net worth. That's what this says. That's where he's going to be just with what he's done so far, and he will be adding to it as he goes along and will have given away hundreds of thousands of dollars. He talked about generosity along the way and changed his family tree completely, permanently. And his mother, he says dad immigrated from Germany. Right. He didn't say his mom, so I was gonna say his mom's proud and very, very cool stuff. Very cool stuff. So is this possible? Yes, this is possible. But you have to quit buying crap you can't afford with money you don't have to impress people you don't really like. You need to quit playing a game for everyone else and start playing the game for you. Start playing the game for your family. When you play that game, it's a different game. That's right. When you take the blinders and put them on and say, I don't care what anybody else thinks. All I care is where we end up. And that's where John is. Very cool stuff, guys. Very few wealthy people are concerned about what other people think. That's how they became wealthy. Hey, guys, Dave Ramsey here. Every day on this show, we help people work through real money problems and figure out what to do next. Now, you can get that same kind of help anytime with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help. It's fast, simple, and free to use. Go to ramseysolutions.com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's ramseysolutions.com. Our scripture of the day. Luke 9:23. Then he said to them all, whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me. James Clear from Atomic Habits says, when you can't win by being better, you can win by being different. Oh, there's a better idea. I like that one a lot. Don't be normal in a world where normal sucks. There you go. I like that. Michael in Dallas. What's up?

[Caller]

How's it going, sir?

[Dave Ramsey]

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

[Caller]

Hey, I owe $63,000 on an RV that's worth about 18 to $20,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

How did that happen?

[Caller]

Well, I'm 25, and when I was about 23, I made a dumb decision and bought an RV and lived in it for about six months. And now I've bought a house. And I have nothing to do with that rv.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I'm saying the rv. Actually, you bought it for how Much.

[Caller]

So when I bought it, it was $68,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

How long ago?

[Caller]

And it's three years ago.

[Dave Ramsey]

So in three years, it lost $52,000 in value?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay, based. Based on what calculation, what they offered you for it at the dealer or what the actual market value is if you try to sell it to an individual?

[Caller]

I've done both. I've looked at selling it on Facebook, those type of things, and nobody's willing to give over $20,000 in dealership. The two that I've taken it to have only offered me about between 18 and 19,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, if they're willing to give you $19,000 for it, they're able to sell it for 27 somewhere.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

They're not going to give you 19 for it when nobody is giving more than 20 for that. So your first Facebook thing, that part of the test failed. But we know what wholesale is because two dealers have offered you basically the same thing.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you owe how much?

[Caller]

I owe $63,000. There's a little bit of complications on to why I owe that much. You know, only a $5,000 difference. They just added some more onto my loan. We had some complications with insurance. I didn't realize I didn't have insurance. So for about a month, and they decided to throw on an extra $5,000

[Dave Ramsey]

on my loan for forced place insurance? Yeah.

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

Have they taken that back off now that you've gotten a policy in place?

[Caller]

Yes, sir. It's. It's not off. I still gonna have to pay that $5,000 is what they told me. No matter what for a month? Yes, sir. I don't know what calculations or how they came up with that number, but. Yes.

[Dave Ramsey]

What do you make a year?

[Caller]

My wife and I, we make about $130,000.

[Dave Ramsey]

How much money do you have in savings?

[Caller]

Not very much.

We are.

We're at the very bottom of the debt snowball right now.

[Dave Ramsey]

And you bought a house?

[Caller]

Yes, sir.

[Dave Ramsey]

While you're broke?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes, sir. Where?

[Caller]

We're not doing too good right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

I don't know how to get you out of this, Michael. I mean, you'd have to borrow the $43,000 and just have an unsecured loan of $43,000. Who holds the loan on this?

[Caller]

Alliant Credit Union.

[Dave Ramsey]

And what's the interest rate?

[Caller]

10%.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

The.

[Caller]

The bad part is I. I'm not only paying the monthly payment, which is $722. I've also got $100 storage fee, and then $115 for insurance every month. So I'm paying about approximately $950 a month for something that I'm not using at all.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, yeah, Yeah, I truly do. I'm stumped. I don't know how you get out of this other than you just pay it down or sell it. And if you have any credit left at all and you can borrow the difference or work with the credit union to sign a note for the difference, at least the bleeding would start, stop because you'd have no insurance and no storage fee and sell the thing for 20 grand and sign a note for 43 and you know, maybe negotiate some of that away because they got, they don't have any collateral. I mean, their collateral is gone. And so, and it's going, it's going away really, really fast. Wow, this is, these numbers are just horrendous. I mean there's most, most things that have wheels and motors go down in value, but apparently RVs are the worst, worst of everything out there.

[Caller]

It was already five years old when I bought it, so it was just, it was just all around bad.

[Dave Ramsey]

So that means there's 100 grand when it was new. Approximately eight years later, it's worth 20. Talk about burning money. That's like lighting hundred dollar bills on fire and just standing there holding them to your hands. Get hot. Wow.

[Caller]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. The only thing I know to do, I think I would stop the bleeding by selling it and signing a note for the difference. If you can talk the credit union into doing that. And the way you do that is just say, hey, look guys, I'm getting ready to hand you the keys to this thing back. Y' all can have it. You can have your little $5,000 insurance charge force place. Insurance is valid, but I'm not paying it. And you guys can just sue me and, or, or I'll sign a note for the difference and work my way through it because I'm the idiot signed up for this trip and I'll get to take it with you, but you're going to have to help me by letting me get rid of it and whatever it brings, we'll put that on the note and I'll sign a note for the difference and that gets rid of the insurance bill and that gets rid of the storage bill and everything else. But also, you've got to start thinking more clearly on your next moves on things because you went and bought a house in the middle of the this and that really puts you at further risk. It's added to this mess and you bought a house by the way where you can't park your rv.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

You know that you already owned before you bought the house.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

It's a lot of work in your future. The good news is you're young and you guys need to be working multiple jobs and get after this thing like crazy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Long time to clean up $43,000. It's like $43,000 in credit cards debt. How fast can you do it making 130. You can do it in a year and you know pay it off in a year and be done with it. And then you just get to look back and go Yep. The dumbest thing I ever did in my life was that RV thing. And the good news is I don't have to do that dumb thing again. I'll have to find something new to do. Dumb.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Why. Why does the. We've talked about this many many times. Do you have a hint as to why they drop in values? Because they're bringing out new models all the time. What would.

[Dave Ramsey]

Cause I don't think the market is large enough. I think the resale market is very limited.

[Ken Coleman]

Aha.

[Dave Ramsey]

The number of people buying a. In this case 8 year old RV.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's what it is.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're right. Would be very.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

There's no demand.

[Dave Ramsey]

There's no demand. And so it's not. You know. It'd be like a 20 year old ski boat. You know. I mean it's really difficult to move that product now. I'm not talking about an expensive ski boat like a Mastercraft. I'm talking about just a stern drive baby. You know your old Bryant's or something like that. That thing just deteriorates and nobody wants it. They'll just spend a little bit more and go get a new one. And so that's. I think that's what's going on here. But I. Good Lord. All of you listening that were thinking about ever buying an rv you should have just went. I don't think so.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

That's right.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's just one. I mean I've bought almost everything else with wheels and 000 motors at one time or another and have done some really really dumb deals on those processes. But the one I've never bought. I never bought a. Never bought a camper. Never bought an rv. Somehow I managed to avoid that one mistake.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

I just can't see you hauling down 65 in a giant.

[Dave Ramsey]

You don't see me.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

People driving by going I think that's

[Dave Ramsey]

Dave Ramsey driving that Winnebago.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

You're waving at people as they drive

[Dave Ramsey]

by Chevy chasing it. Yeah, I don't know. I'm not a snob. I just never had that one. And I never bought a trailer. I never bought a mobile home either. This another one.

[Financial Expert/Advisor]

Same concept on the mobile home as well. Most people are buying something new, so therefore, low demand.

[Dave Ramsey]

And they just go down in value like a rock. They're just horrible, horrible. You can't get out of them. You get stuck in them. And poor Michael's just stuck, stuck, stuck, man. Well, you are wise to be asking questions about it and to be gathering information and try to make the best decision you can. And then just roll up your sleeves and live on nothing. Including no eating out, no vacations until we get the RV paid off. That's an irony. No vacations till we get the RV paid off. That puts this hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace, Christ Jesus.