You Don’t Build Wealth by Ignoring Basic Financial Principles

Summary

The Ramsey Show

Episode: You Don’t Build Wealth by Ignoring Basic Financial Principles
Date: December 30, 2025
Hosts: Ken Coleman, Rachel Cruze
Network: Ramsey Network

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruze take calls from listeners facing a wide range of personal finance dilemmas and decisions. The central theme is straightforward financial fundamentals: avoid debt, budget intentionally, and honor your values. Through live coaching, they debunk myths about tax advantage schemes, credit scores, and asset protection tactics, and guide listeners back to practical, value-based decision-making.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Retirement and Home Renovation: Should You Go Into Debt?

Caller: Dan

• Dan and his wife are retiring, comfortable with around $2 million in retirement savings. They want to spend $100-120k on a home addition. Dan’s financial advisor recommends a HELOC (home equity line of credit) for potential tax advantages and lower interest rates.
• Dan is uncomfortable with debt as a new retiree.

Ramsey Advice:

• Ken and Rachel strongly advise against taking debt and recommend cash-flowing the renovation.
• Rachel emphasizes honoring your personal values and peace of mind over minor tax “wins.”
• Ken: “Trust your gut, Dan. … Your body, your heart, your head—you were right.” (08:29)

Notable Quote:

• Rachel Cruze [04:19]: “Some financial advisors are so stupid, they don’t even think about your values and what you want out of life. … Living a debt-free life has a price tag for you.”

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2. Marriage, Taxes, and Financial Disorganization

Question: From Aiden in New Mexico

• Aiden’s wife is self-employed, disorganized, and constantly late filing taxes, leading to stress and arguments.

Advice:

• Ken and Rachel clarify this is non-negotiable—it’s the law.
• The couple needs systems, not just confrontation.
• Rachel suggests: “What can we do to help you? As a husband, I’m here to help you,” but ultimately, “There is a point she has to be an adult, right?” (14:23)

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3. Extended Warranty for an Unreliable Vehicle

Caller: Sam

• Owns a 2021 hybrid truck, unreliable and expensive to fix. Should he buy an extended warranty or replace the vehicle?

Advice:

• Rachel: Avoid extended warranties, use a sinking fund for car repairs.
• Ken: If the unreliability is about time and frustration, it’s okay to replace the truck and move on.
• “I’m not going to keep dealing with this truck… It’s time. Time is money.” (17:58)

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4. High Income, High Debt, Luxury Car Lease

Caller: Henry from Tampa, FL

• $350k household income, $1 million debt (student, credit cards, mortgage), $1,500/mo Mercedes lease, desires a new financial path.

Advice:

• Sell the luxury lease and get a less expensive car.
• Focus on the “why”—freedom from stress and control over money; communicate openly with spouse.
• Rachel: “You can wander your way into debt. You can’t wander your way out. There has to be an intentional plan.” (29:19)

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5. College Savings Debate: 529 for Child or Build Character?

Caller: Diego from Sacramento

• Diego and his wife disagree: should they fully fund a child’s college or encourage responsibility by not paying it all?

Advice:

• Rachel: You can instill character, grit, and financial literacy in kids by methods other than withholding college savings.
• Ken: “They aren’t you. … They will have different experiences and may not make the same choices as you.” (38:46)

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6. First-Time Home Buyer at 62 with No Retirement Savings

Caller: Antoinette from Fort Worth, TX

• Wants to buy her first home but has no retirement savings, about $8k debt, and limited financial detail retention.

Advice:

• Rachel: “The excuse that I am bad with numbers can’t be an excuse anymore.” (48:40)
• Focus the next steps on getting out of debt, sell a too-expensive car, and only consider homeownership after building financial stability.

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7. Parent Loans to Kids—Is Charging Interest Wrong?

Caller: Lindsay from Nashville, TN

• Her parents lent her $18k for school and charged $3k interest. She feels uneasy after her new husband’s reaction.

Advice:

• Ken: It sounds tight, but not dishonest, and “it’s too late” to revisit with parents.
• Rachel: “Take advantage is a really strong language. … You knew exactly what you were signing up for.” (61:06)

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8. Surviving Identity Theft and Credit Obstacles

Caller: Jessica from Columbia, SC

• Victim of identity theft by her mother; credit is ruined and advisors say she should marry to access credit.

Advice:

• Ken & Rachel: Buying into the “need” for a credit score is a myth. Focus on living debt-free, saving cash for purchases, and building income.

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9. Navigating Long-Term Care, Nursing Home Worries

Caller: Donna from West Virginia

• Concerned about losing her house to Medicaid if she ever needs long-term care.

Advice:

• Ken & Rachel: Signing away your house to kids is legally and ethically questionable (“It feels like you’re hiding assets”). Instead, increase long-term care insurance, use savings/pension, or sell the house if needed.

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10. Recent Graduate Facing Student Loan Repayment

Caller: Caitlin from Charlotte, NC

• $26k in student loans, low income, wants to go to law school later.

Advice:

• Ken: Raise your income, consider getting a higher-paying job even temporarily, and explore free or reduced-cost law schools based on LSAT scores.
• Rachel: “You can pay this off in a year—double your income, live on nothing, and make it a goal.” (92:16)

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11. Should I Sell My Car to Pay Down Debt as a Struggling Small Business Owner?

Caller: Stephanie from Los Angeles

• Single mom, professional organizer, and business owner; behind on taxes, owes $20k EIDL loan, $9k credit card, $13.5k car.

Advice:

• Rachel: Sell the car if possible to remove the monthly debt payment and attack the next smallest debt. “Quick wins” are vital for momentum.

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12. Family Vacation While Paying Off Debt: Right Move or Distraction?

Caller: Thomas from Asheville, NC

• Father is paying for family vacation lodging/food; Thomas is worried about lost income during the trip while aggressively paying off $13k in debt.

Advice:

• Rachel: If it's a rare occasion and financially manageable, it may be worth slowing down slightly for a family memory.
• Ken: “You only got one shot around this globe. … Make memories with family.”

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Rachel Cruze [04:19]: “Some financial advisors are so stupid, they don’t even think about your values and what you want out of life.”
• Ken Coleman [08:29]: “Trust your gut, Dan. … Your body, your heart, your head—you were right.”
• Ken Coleman [29:19]: “You can wander your way into debt. You can’t wander your way out. There has to be an intentional plan.”
• Rachel Cruze [61:06]: “Take advantage is a really strong language. … You knew exactly what you were signing up for.”

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Important Timestamps by Segment

• [02:35] - Retirement home improvement & debt dilemma (Dan’s call)
• [11:54] - Tax troubles and marital strain (Aiden's question)
• [15:07] - Extended warranty vs. new truck (Sam’s call)
• [21:41] - Luxury car lease, high-earning household in debt (Henry's call)
• [33:43] - Saving for kid's college, building grit (Diego’s call)
• [44:02] - Retiring at 62 with no savings (Antoinette’s call)
• [54:15] - Parental loan with interest and lingering resentment (Lindsay's call)
• [64:38] - Identity theft, life without a credit score (Jessica’s call)
• [76:41] - Protecting assets from Medicaid (Donna’s call)
• [85:59] - College grad, student debt, path to law school (Caitlin’s call)
• [106:21] - Single mom, organizing business, overwhelming debt (Stephanie's call)
• [117:25] - Family vacation vs. aggressive debt payoff (Thomas’s call)

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Overall Tone & Style

The Ramsey Show is direct, supportive, and practical, with hosts often using humor but never mincing words when it comes to debt and the importance of clear financial values. They offer both tough love and empathy, focusing on actionable steps that align with listeners’ life goals—not just the numbers. The themes of self-empowerment, intentionality, and living debt-free underpin every answer.

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Useful for Listeners

If you haven’t listened to the episode, this summary provides a comprehensive overview of the questions, Ramsey’s responses, the key philosophy espoused, and tips for navigating similar situations. Wherever you are in your financial journey—retirement, family, business, or just starting out—the bottom line is simple: stick to timeless financial principles, trust your gut, and don’t let industry “advice” override your own values and common sense.

Transcript

[A]

This episode is filled with some of our best calls and advice. But unless you take what you hear and put it to work in your own life, you'll be stuck with the same money stress in 2026. So make a change and download everydollar Today.

[B]

Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey work in the Fair Winds Credit Union studio, this is the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz joins me, and we're here for you. 888-8825, 5225, 888-825-5225 is the number to jump in, and we would love to coach you up today. We start off with Dan in Grand Rapids. Dan, how can we help you today?

[C]

Ron, my wife and I are preparing to retire. Matter of fact, her last day of work is tomorrow, the beginning of February. So 40 years of effort towards this.

[B]

Dan, how are you?

[C]

Very good.

[B]

Dan, I gotta ask you this. This is. I mean, we. We men have to unite because we don't do this. Well, we got Rachel here to help us on this before we dive in. What is the plan when she finishes the day tomorrow and she wraps it up and comes home? Do you got something planned?

[C]

You know, we don't. It came on pretty quick. We both had this date in February picked, and then her department dissolved, and they said you can either take a bio or you can transfer to another department. So this all happened for her in the last three weeks.

[B]

Okay, but she's excited about this?

[C]

Oh, absolutely, yes.

[B]

Dan, listen, I don't want to spend too much time on this. Rachel's here to back me up. This is where you got to step up. I mean, this is. You got to do something special. She comes home, maybe a little surprise. If she hates surprises. Plan a little something, at least.

[A]

A little retirement celebration.

[B]

40 years, babe. You're wrapping it up. We got a celebrator is my point. I don't want to. And I'm glad I said this, Dan, because you might have blown it had I not brought this up.

[C]

You're very. I appreciate that she works from home, but I will bring stuff home and make it monumental.

[B]

She works.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

Rachel, what does he do in that situation? I feel like this is your category.

[A]

Champagne. Pop the bottle there, right outside the door.

[C]

Neither one of us drink, but, oh.

[B]

Man, we're striking out the grape juice.

[A]

Sparkling grape juice.

[B]

Okay. Just do something special. All right, so we. We've now helped you there. That's the help. You didn't know you needed now. Yeah, keep going.

[C]

Plus your marriage. We got by. So we, we are, we've worked very hard to get where we're at and we're very comfortable with what we're planning for retirement. We're very comfortable with our financial advisor. But I have one concerned that he's got me a plan that he's got for me. And we are going to put an addition on our house next spring. So we're planning to spend about 100 to 120,000 to do that. Now my plan was just kind of take that off the top of our 401k and our savings and make that do the addition. What he's suggesting, and he gave me, I guess, good reasons is he's suggesting that I take out like a HELOC or a home equity loan to do this project. And he said we'll chunk it away pretty quick. But he said there's reasons for that. First of all, I'll be paying a lower interest rate than he can make me. That's arguable. The second thing he said was it is definitely be a tax write off. And the third thing was the fact that it'll save me 20 plus thousand dollars next year in taxes because of the tax bracket that he's aligning us with. And it just, it's very hard for me to think about going into debt immediately as I retire.

[A]

Well, yeah, 100% because where is he planning on having you guys pay off the HELOC when he said you can throw a bunch of like a bunch of money at it? Is he thinking just a little bit every year so that you don't mess up the taxes and all of it.

[C]

Yeah, he's saying we'll chunk it away. And I don't know how relevant chunk it away is if it's a year or five years. But he said we'll just make a monthly payment on it and again that it'll give us a tax advantage, it'll save us taxes and all this, which all kind of makes sense, but dang it, you know, just got myself 40 years of work to get out of debt and retire. And then just thinking about going back into debt just kind of scares me.

[A]

Well, some financial advisors are so stupid, they don't even think about your values and what you want out of life. And clearly living a debt free life has a price tag for you. You know, you can't put a price on it, but you know, it's a value of yours that he's not putting into any consideration. And so as he goes around. But so Michael. Yeah, so no, I would not do this. I would 100% just cash flow it. And if the cash flow comes out of. I don't know if it's the 401k, if you guys have money elsewhere, but you have the ability to cash flow. Right, Dan?

[C]

Yeah. We got a set amount that we're going into retirement with that we're comfortable with. And it's going to last this long beyond our retirement.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

And just thinking of taking that 100 or 120 right off the top of that and doing the addition was my plan.

[B]

And so let's. Let's just put your plan.

[C]

Offered a suggestion. Yeah, I'm sorry.

[B]

Yeah. I want to put your plan to the test. Not his suggestion. We hate his suggestion. We hate it. So let's put your plan to the test. Let's assume that you didn't get this advice at all. Okay.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

And you just went ahead and pulled the trigger on your plan. How do you feel emotionally about your plan? Any stress?

[C]

No, I don't think so. We have kind of intentionally. We have this 403B that we've been carrying for a long time. And I've been very aggressive with it. And I took it from 20,000 to. It's about 170 right now. So my thought was that is just some play money we've been actually not planning on that we've accumulated that would do this project for us, the addition. Well, we raised seven kids in our house and it was fine with nine people. But now what we find is with adult children instead of nine people every day, we have 29 people, you know, 10 times a year. So we want to. Yeah. Double our kitchen and our living room.

[B]

How much.

[A]

How much do you guys have in retirement total?

[C]

Just about 2 million.

[A]

Okay. Golly. See, and he's going through all these hoops and stuff about this and then that you guys have $2 million.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do you know what I mean? And you want to take 100,000 of it. And if you go and burn that amount in the middle of the room, like you're not going to have any emotion towards it because it's such a small percentage of your net worth. So that's where the peace of mind of your value system overrides his snaking and maneuvering through where it's gonna be not much money at the end of the day. Do what I'm saying. Like I would write.

[B]

I agree. I mean, Dan, you answered your own question. I asked it that Way just simply for you to hear yourself say, his plan gives me a little bit of heartburn. Enough that the pepsit AC is not working. And you called us today, right?

[C]

It did, yeah.

[B]

Right.

[C]

I think I knew where you were gonna take me, but I just kind of wanted to hear it.

[B]

Yeah. And I appreciate that and we're happy to be here for you. But you, sir, are the ul arbiter on this. Your body, your heart, your head. And man, you're just like, man, if I can put this edition on. Yeah, I'm paying cash. I would want my grandkids to be there.

[A]

Yeah. And I would run the numbers too, because I am curious because helocs, like the, the rates go up and down. Like it really is very dependent upon what's going on.

[B]

I don't run the rates at all. I don't want you to be tempted.

[A]

No, no, it's not a temptation, but it's. That versus what? You know what I mean? Like that versus the taxes that you're gonna pay on a hun. Like. Like what I'm saying is I think it ends up being closer to a wash than what you realize. I think that the guy. I think he nitpicking every little thing to say. I'm making this number up. I haven't done the calculations, but to save 10 grand, whatever the thing is. And that's pennies to you guys. So I'm like, the peace of mind is worth that so much more.

[B]

Yeah. Just listening to you describe everything he told you versus your plan. Yours is simple. Boom, we're done. We're done.

[C]

And do you all have money said kind of makes sense.

[A]

Do you? Yeah. Do you have money elsewhere, Dan? Where to his point? Do you have money sitting in a high yield savings or something where you wouldn't necessarily have to pay taxes if you use that cash?

[C]

We have about a $40,000 savings account.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[C]

400, 401K. I have a lump sum pension and a 403B.

[A]

Okay, gotcha, gotcha. No, that's great. Yeah, no, I would not go borrow on my house to do an addition when I freaking have the money for it. Yeah, that's. That's the bottom line.

[B]

Trust your gut, Dan. There's a whole bunch of science on this, that trusting the gut is not this mysterious thing. It's actually the brain sending physical signals to the body. And that we feel it in our body, that's a real thing, has the same validity as the logic. Listen to your heart, listen to your body. You were right. Thanks. For calling, tell the financial advisor, thanks. No thanks. The holidays are supposed to be joyful, but they can also be expensive. Between gifts, travel and about a thousand limited time offers, your budget can start feeling anything but but merry. And that's why I love this. Boost Mobile helps you treat yourself and your wallet. Right now you'll pay just 10 bucks a month for your first two months. Then only 25 bucks a month for unlimited talk, text and data forever. No price hikes, no contracts, no nonsense. Just reliable service that keeps your phone bill low and your holiday spirits high. So stop stressing over your budget and start saving. Instead, go to boostmobile.com Ramsey and unwrap the savings today. That's boostmobile.com Ramsey restrictions apply. See boostmobile.com for details. Well, you know, some days we have a fabulous audience. Most days for the show, we have a fabulous audience. Comes to the lobby here at Ramsey Solutions and, and we can see these fine people looking through the glass. We go out and say hi and all that kind of stuff. And today happens to be a birthday day. We've had a lot of birthday, two birthdays. And so we had young Millie who was 28. And now we just met the fabulous Carol who just turned 80 a couple days ago. And she's got the team out there and notice the glasses. She's got a sash. What do you call that? She's got a tiara and she's got these fabulous glasses.

[A]

James, she's hating this right now.

[B]

By the way. Carol looked as though she was in shock, James. She's very embarrassed by all the attention. And so one of the parts party that she's with loaned me their glasses. So I wanted to say a special happy birthday to you. Carol, you look fabulous. You don't look a day over 50. And we're, we're very blessed that you're here.

[A]

And, and, and they're about to hit the town. They're gonna go to. You should meet them at Broad on Broadway.

[B]

Actually, I'm gonna ask James if I can take the rest of the show off. And I'm just gonna look like you're ready to play Benny and the jets or something right now. Yeah, Bitty and the Jets. So there you go. There you go. How about that? Very fun stuff. So happy birthday again.

[A]

So fun.

[B]

So fun when people spend their special day with us.

[A]

I know we get anniversary, we get honeymoons sometimes.

[B]

Yeah, we do.

[A]

That's always the craziest one. Like, I can't believe you're here on your honeymoon.

[B]

So the Ramsey Show Question of the day is brought to you by why Refi? Why Refi offers a different approach to paying off your defaulted private student loans with a low fixed rate. For less stress, go to y refi.com Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey it may not be available in all states.

[A]

All right, today's question comes from Aiden in New Mexico. My wife is a contract business consultant and is also self employed as an artist. When it comes to paperwork, she's very disorganized. It has gotten to the point where I have taken my tax documents to a tax preparer twice because I didn't want the IRS auditing me. I beg her every year to get her stuff together and to file on time, but it never happens, which leads to arguments. How do I get her to understand the seriousness of this situation?

[B]

Oof.

[A]

That's tough. Well, it's taxes. Like it's back to taxes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But you've got to do it.

[B]

Yeah. And that's what I was going to say. Like, so this is a relationship issue, but in this situation it's not you coming to the, to the table with a, hey, let me tell you about these baby steps. Let me tell you about this Ramsey plan. I'd like to get us on a budget. Like this is the federal government.

[A]

This is the law.

[B]

This isn't. Yeah, there's a wiggle room here. So it seems like it needs to be a reality check. This isn't trying to get her on board.

[A]

Right.

[B]

This is like we will go to jail.

[A]

This is the law.

[B]

And I don't think I look good in orange, sweetheart. You know, or whatever you got to say here.

[A]

I.

[B]

This comes back to a relationship thing. But I hate to make it so simplistic. I want you to weigh in. But I think it is, hey, this is super serious. This isn't my opinion. We have to do this. Let's make this a lot less difficult by. Let's get all our stuff together and be, be on the same page.

[A]

Yeah. And I think self awareness is huge because she's an artist. And I'm not, I'm not pointing fingers, but I do think there is a.

[B]

I think that's a fair point.

[A]

When you are an artist, there is a little bit more of a free spirit within you. Right. Numbers is usually not your strength and vice versa. People that are great with numbers are terrible usually at being creative. So it's, it's a, again, it is how you were wired and gifted. And then I think as a self aware Adult to say, hey, I have things and weaknesses in my life and, and in my personality, I'm gonna be an adult and I have to obey the law. But also, what systems can I put in place to help me in those weaknesses? Cause I'm not naturally good at all of this. Right. She's very disorganized is what he said. So that would be more of the conversation of, hey, what can we do to help you? It's not a point the finger at you constantly. It is, hey, yeah, this is the law, so it has to be done. So what systems can we put in place together? And as a husband, I'm here to help you. And I mean, and he's like on his own, where he's like, I'm just taking my tax docum and blah over here, which I get because he doesn't want to go to jail either. Right.

[B]

So he's got a hedge at his bet.

[A]

Yeah, seriously. But I think it's. It is. Hey, how can I help us help you put some systems into place? But there is a point that she has to be an adult, right? Like you can. You can be on that. You can. You can carve a situation in a conversation a certain way to a point. But there's also a point Kim, with all of this, especially the law. But then other things of like my wife just continues to spend more. There's just a point that, like, you're not able to change that person and they have to be the adult. And it's sad when they're not. But we see that a lot around here.

[B]

Really tough situation. Thanks for sharing the question with us. Knoxville, Tennessee, the home of Rachel's alma mater. Sam is there. Sam, how can we help?

[C]

Yes, I have a question for you. Regarded to my Truck have a 2001 truck and it just rolled out of warranty. I intend to keep the truck for a longer period of time, or at least I hope so, and was offered an extended warranty by the dealership. And so what I did is added up all of the cost of repairs that wouldn't have been covered or were covered by warranty that no longer would. And it came out to about 8,800 bucks in the four years that I've owned the truck. So it hasn't been necessarily super reliable, very expensive to repair. And as I intend on keeping the truck or want to keep the truck, I kind of want to explore my options. Should I buy this warranty for $5,600? Should I risk it, continue driving the truck for another 100,000 miles without warranty, or should I go out and get a new truck with a fresh warranty? What's your opinion? And kind of just want to gauge.

[A]

A direction to go in what's been the repairs? I mean, about 2,000 a year is what it ends up being. What has it been?

[C]

Yeah, it's really little stuff, to be honest with you. It's the motor in the tailgate. It's got one of these automatic tailgates. It was the air conditioning control module in the Bash. It was a sensor in the. I guess the parking sensor system.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[C]

What I'm concerned about.

[A]

Go ahead.

[C]

Go ahead.

[A]

Well, I was gonna say, I mean, you know, as you kind of look through this from a math perspective, it's less than, like, 200 bucks a month is what it ends up being, which just feels expensive. Like, if the stuff isn't being fixed, like, that's one issue. But I'm not a big fan of extended warranties because I'm like, it's. The thing should work, and if not, I would rather it be in my court again. Unless there's some crazy recall right now, Sam, and they're like, you know, giving you some discounts on the extended warranty or whatever it may be. But I. We usually factor in cars. We have a sinking fund that we've set up that if anything goes wrong with the cars, we use that sinking fund. So again, for yours, it's coming out to be around 200amonth. So I would probably just set some money aside and then hopefully most of this gets fixed. Because, I mean, the fact that you keep going in and in for repairs is. That's frustrating.

[C]

Yeah. No, you're right. And for me, it's not really a money issue. You know, the truck's paid off. Right. The 200 bucks a month is really negligible based on our income. It's more kind of a, I guess, a psychological field. Do I keep throwing money at a truck?

[A]

Now, that's a different question.

[B]

That's where I came down.

[A]

Yeah, that's a different question.

[B]

So that's where I came down. I agree with everything Rachel said. I'm going to come down on this one and go, I'm the kind of guy. This is the way I'm wired, where I'm not going to keep dealing with this truck. I'm going to go, this thing's a lemon. Or it's an issue with the manufacturer, and they just don't do a good job making the parts. And I'm just tired of this mess for me because in your situation, I would be in the same boat. Any mechanical work I got to do, I'm not stressed out about it. I got the money set aside, whatever, whatever, whatever. But it's like it's time. Time is money. You remember that old phrase, kind of true.

[A]

It's a 2001, Sam. Is that what you said?

[C]

Yeah, it's a 2001 with 80,000 miles on it. And it's a hybrid. And I don't know if you kind of look into some of these hybrid issues, but if the hybrid motors or the.

[A]

Is it a 2021 or no 2001. I didn't know they were making hybrids in 01. No, it's a 21.

[C]

2021.

[A]

21, yeah. You kept saying 01. I was like, man, they were ahead of their game with 2021.

[B]

I couldn't spell hy.

[A]

Okay, so 2021, that makes way more sense.

[B]

I was like, I get rid of it, I'd sell it, okay, and that's somebody else's problem. And I'd go get myself a truck that had a much higher rating that I'm not in the shop all the time. And again, it's just the nick. These are like little paper cuts. It feels like, what a nuisance, man. I'd be like, why would I buy your warranty? How about you make a better truck? That's what I'd have said to the dealer. But I can be sassy that way. But I feel like that's true.

[C]

Absolutely.

[B]

I got an idea. Why don't you make a better truck? I don't need all this warranty cuz all the stuff seems like it's little piddly stuff. So you got the cash? I'd get rid of the nuisance. Let it be somebody else's problem, You know? One of the first things I discovered working in the financial world is how absolutely devastating it is when the breadwinner of a family dies and there's too little life insurance or none at all. Grieving families are suddenly left behind, scrambling to pay bills and trying to make ends meet. I also discovered that there are a lot of rip offs in the life insurance world. Like that whole life crap posing as an investment opportunity. What you need is level term life insurance, usually 10 to 12 times your income, which is the smartest, most affordable way to protect your family. The key is finding an independent broker who represents a ton of companies and works for you, not for the insurance company. This is exactly what my friend Jeff Zander and his team at Zander Insurance are all about. They shop the term life companies to find you the best options. And they've been around for over 95 years. So you know they'll be there when you need them. Zander is the real deal and that's why they've handled all my personal insurance for over 25 years. I trust them and you can, too. Visit Zander.com for instant online quotes or for a more personal touch. Give them a call at 800-356-4282. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is alongside and we are here for you. 8888-255225-88825-5225. Henry's up next in Tampa, Florida. Henry, how can we help?

[C]

Hi, everybody. Thank you so much for taking my call. How are you guys?

[B]

Good. How are you today?

[C]

I'm all right. Question for you. Quick and easy question, but I mean, not easy question, but I have a lease that I just, I purchased in the last year or two there, but just heard about you guys. The lease is for the next two more years left on it. There's I wondering if I should ever get out of it, pay out of the lease there to get some money, not necessarily money back there, but pay a lease there. I mean sell the car or get out of the lease to be able to pay lower, pay some of my debt.

[A]

Yeah, it's a great question. What are you paying a month?

[C]

1500.

[A]

Oh, what kind of car is that?

[C]

Mercedes GLE. 350 GL.

[B]

It's pretty nice. Pretty nice car.

[A]

Good taste, Henry. You got some good taste.

[C]

Thank you very much.

[A]

But it's eating you alive and it's not worth it.

[B]

Yeah, it's not. We got it.

[A]

We got to get it out of here. Right? Okay.

[C]

Yeah, I just is there a lot.

[B]

Of give us the terms of where you walk us through the terms.

[C]

All right. So if I were to terminate my payoff right now, be about 60, $60,000 there to pay off there. I've looked on, I've heard you guys talking about it. So I looked on Kelly Blue Buck and it's about you get 46, 46, 47,000 on it. And then was that private sale? So. And I was that.

[A]

Yeah, that's private sale.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

So leave you with 13,000 that you would owe, right?

[C]

Yes. Yes.

[A]

And do you have any cash, Henry?

[C]

Not much, no.

[A]

Okay. What do you make a year?

[C]

So I make about 250,000.

[B]

Oh, that's good news.

[A]

Yeah. That's great.

[B]

So you would need another car. Correct.

[C]

Correct.

[A]

To be able to replace it.

[B]

Yeah. So we got to replace. So we got the 13,000 that you would then owe. And then we've got the cost of a replacement car. But with your income, you can get something decent if you really work on your budget. Right.

[A]

Yeah, that would be my goal. Because two more years of this, I mean, that's a lot, right?

[C]

So it's a good amount.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, for sure. So.

[C]

Because, I mean, according to you guys. I mean, I was just. This is the first time I ever thought that I'm broke. But I do. Oh. Have a good amount of debt as well, too. Over a million dollars debt.

[A]

Okay, so tell. Yeah. Give me the rest of your financial picture. I'm just curious where you're at.

[C]

So I. Student loans, 180,000. Credit card debt, about 70,000.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

And then mortgage is about 690,000.

[A]

Okay. Henry, you've been living the life, haven't you?

[C]

Yes. Me and my wife. Not. So I guess I. Let me. Let me rephrase that because I know you mentioned total income. My wife is making a hundred thousand, so a total of 350.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

You guys have plenty of money. Money, you just gotta get under control.

[C]

Yes. And, you know, and that's the other thing, too. They're trying to go from that life to hearing about you guys and change completely. I'm. I'm like, let's go hard. And I. And my wife is like, what are you talking about there? So, you know, it's definitely different and hard there to actually talk to her about it as well too. Just the budget.

[A]

Yeah, like, yeah, totally. And I think Henry, too, just as a piece of advice, usually when, you know, when people are in your position, the one that kind of hears, okay, there's a different way we can do this. And you go in and tell your wife we're going to stop shopping and stop eating out. She's probably like, what the. Henry, what are you talking about? You've lost your mind. So I think approaching her in that aspect is the why. So I am curious, Henry, for you, what. What has caused you up to this point, living the way you have with money, both of you. And then you hear us, which is very counter with how you've been living. What's been appealing about that? Like, what is it in you that's like, oh, my gosh, I want that side of money, not what I've been doing.

[C]

That idea of freedom. I'm like, trying to talk with you, but I'm like, holding my breath and like, the heaviness of just owing so much money. Like the fact that I'm like, wait a second. I'd never thought about how much I owe and how much debt I'm in. I've always been thinking about right now how much I owe for the month, which is like, when I calculated all after talking to you guys or listen to you guys, I was like, I owe a million dollars. Like, what in the world?

[A]

Yep. Yep.

[C]

And so. And I'm like, I can't do this anymore. Especially when the wife says, oh, I'd love to have a new summer kitchen. I'm like, what are you talking about? We have no money for that.

[A]

Yeah, that's right. That's right. So, Henry, that's. That's what I want you to communicate to her is I can't breathe. Like I. And we hear that a lot, Henry, that you're not the only one. It's this level of stress and anxiety and weight because you don't own your life. Somebody these credit cards. Right. Everything owns you, and it's exhausting. And to your point, we work hard, and I feel like I have no money. Right. When I ask you how much money you have saved.

[C]

Exactly what I'm thinking. We work so much hard, like overtime sometimes, too. And I'm like, how do I. How am I having nothing at the end of the paycheck here? I'm like, right. Is this what everyone does? I don't understand this.

[A]

Right, exactly. So how much do you guys bring home a month? I was trying to do it with taxes and everything, but when you guys get paid, how much per month are you bringing in both you and your wife?

[C]

So I think I'm about 12 to 13,000. And she is about 4,000. So I would say about 16. 17. 16,000.

[A]

16,000. Okay. And that's after taxes. Are you guys funding retirement?

[C]

Yes. Wait a second. We have been putting in retirement.

[B]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You make $350,000 a year? You do?

[C]

Yes. No, no. Yes. The total.

[B]

Total. So I don't understand those take home numbers. What is your take home? Yours? Just you.

[C]

You have just me. About 16. 16. 16,000. I'm sorry, 12. $12,000 for me.

[B]

And you're off of.

[C]

You asked about putting into retirement. Yes, I've been putting into retirement. Yeah.

[B]

Off of gross. So what's your gross? Your gross and her gross?

[C]

Total gross is 350.

[B]

Right? You're 250. She's so.

[A]

She's 100. And then after taxes, retirement insurance, like after all of that. Right. What hit you?

[B]

I just felt like her take home was really low off of a hundred thousand dollar salary. Her take home only being 4,000. That felt low to me. So I just don't know if you know your numbers. And the reason I'm calling that out is part of this problem is you don't really know your numbers.

[C]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Or she's having way too much withholding taken out and at this point, you're brand new to us. Rachel, explain. The retirement should be paused and all that right now to bring in as much as they can.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. So. So, yeah, so. So Henry, the, the whole concept, you guys really need to dig in because if you're getting a big tax refund every year, that's money back in the paycheck that may not be shown here. I would be pausing retirement. I'd be pausing everything. And you and your wife again, sitting down and, and saying, hey, together. It's really hard to do this without her. So I want Henry to be as honest and vulnerable with, with her tonight and just talk about how scared, I mean, how scared you are with me. I know. We can't. We'll coach you. We'll coach you.

[B]

No, but probably should have had her on this call.

[A]

Yeah. And to show her, and show her the realization and, and the truth is, Henry, for your own mental sake, you can't, you guys can't keep doing this. Right? I mean, you're, you're going to hit a breaking point eventually. And so for you guys, it's going to look different. And so I would sit down with her and just say, hey, here's where I want to go. Here's the goals I want to have and you can kind of map them out ahead of time just to say, okay, you know, we, we have, gosh, yeah, almost, almost a million dollars. Not, not including the mortgage, but the credit cards, the student loan, all of it. Mapping it out to say, with our income and doing a budget and saying if we just cut everything. And Henry, to your point, this is going to be a 180 from the lifestyle you guys have been living. You've been living kind of the high life and enjoying life and it's gonna, to get out of this. We always say you can wander your way into debt, you cannot wander your way out. And so there has to be an intentional plan.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

But, but gosh, I mean, in, in, you know, three or four years, you guys could have a completely different life. Financially speaking?

[B]

I think so.

[A]

And you getting a side hustle, Henry?

[C]

I would love that.

[A]

Yeah. Adding, you know, adding more income and all of that. So, you know, if you stay on the line, Henry, Christian is gonna pick up and we're gonna give you for you and your wife to sit down together and go through it. It's our nine lesson course. And this gives you the basics. And so it can be she can get mad at us, not you delivering the information.

[B]

And Henry, I would say this, I think do what Rachel said as far as your approach to her, but I think you need to show her you mean business by you getting rid of that car.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

That will show her you're not just talking.

[A]

Get it out of here.

[B]

You're making some sacrifice. And then one of these days, you'll be driving one of those bad boys again. But it'll be cash. This is the Ramsey Show. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. All right, the holidays are here. And the holidays are full of traditions. Some of these traditions we love. Some of these traditions we just tolerate. In addition to the traditions, this time of year can also bring a lot of noise, pressure, and even loneliness. Maybe this is your cue this year to slow down and ask yourself, what really matters to me right now. And moving forward, therapy gives you space to do just that. To think, to breathe, and to make room for peace. And if you're thinking about therapy, I want you to check out my friends at Better Help. They've got more than 30,000 licensed therapists on, and they've helped over 5 million people worldwide. With an average rating of 4.9 out of 5 stars, BetterHelp is totally online, so it fits around your schedule even during the chaotic holiday times. You just get online and answer a few questions, and BetterHelp will match you with someone who fits your needs. And if the therapist isn't the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. This month, start a new tradition by taking care of you. Visit betterhelp.com Ramsey to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E L p.com/ramsay.

[A]

Welcome back to the Ramsay Show. When it comes to your money, Ken, one of the largest purchases that majority of people make is their home.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And when it comes to buying and selling your home, it can be very overwhelming. Right? The whole housing market, the industry, when it comes to real estate, it can be really hard to tackle, especially alone. And so that's why we created Ramsey's real estate home base. It's a place with all the tools and resources that you need to be prepared when you buy and sell your home and to give you the confidence that you're doing it the right way. So there you're going to find calculators, a start to finish guide, multiple of them to help you how to articles, a podcast, a book, and even a video course, all packed with actionable steps to help you navigate this process of buying, buying and selling your home. So if you're ready to take the next step towards your home goals with peace of mind, make sure to go to ramseysolutions.com realestate or click the link in the description if you are listening on YouTube or podcast. All right, up next, we're going to Diego in Sacramento. Hey, Diego, welcome to the show.

[C]

Hi.

[D]

Thank you.

[A]

Absolutely.

[C]

My wife and I do. Yeah, sorry, yeah, my wife and I just had a baby and we've been having a discussion about opening a college account for him at 529. And my wife's on the side of saving as much as we can, enough to pay for his whole college tuition. And I'm more on the side of maybe not doing that just because, you know, for me, when I went to school, I didn't have that. And I think it built a lot of character in myself. You know, my parents, they provided a place for me to sleep, you know, they didn't charge me any rent and, you know, they provided food for me every day. So I felt like I was really blessed in what they gave me, you know, what they could. And I felt like it, you know, it built some character. Yeah, I worked through school and it showed me like, you know, the value of money and how, you know, you know, what I'm paying for, for school. It just showed me the value in it. So I just wanted to get your guys opinion on whether maybe there's like a middle point between my wife and I or maybe she just avoided it altogether or.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Saving all of it that we can. And that's a good thing.

[B]

Well, I think this comes down to Rachel, how big of a stressor this is for you guys when you talk about it, are you both pretty adamant and it gets kind of tense and there's a lot of separation? Or are you guys a couple more conversations from going, okay, I see it your way? I mean, what's the real tension level now on this?

[C]

Oh, super low. I mean, we're very good about, you know, communicating. We've never had a problem with that.

[B]

So when you told her your point of view, did she agree with you and go, that's interesting. Or did she go, ah, it's too old school. I want to help.

[C]

No. Yeah. She says, yeah, pretty much what you're saying. Yeah. Like she, she would prefer, you know, us having more, you know, better means than our parents did. She's saying, like, we should know, we shouldn't afford. We didn't have.

[A]

So let me tell you, Diego, your. The way you're going about this in your, Your heart and your thought process, I really love, because I do think that our kids have to have grit, our kids have to have a level of struggle. Our kids have to be able to know how to appreciate things, not be entitled, know how to work hard. Right. Like, all of these elements of who they're going to be, the character part of them, we all want as parents, Right. Or at least I hope parents want that for their kids. And that's what you're wanting, right? And so what you're thinking is you're going to do it through the means of paying for their own college. So where I would challenge you is, are there other places that they can learn those same character qualities and, and, and also be able to have their college paid for? Because, Diego, my parents paid for my college. And I'll tell you, there was stipulations around it. And so we had to go to an. In state school, we had to graduate in four years, and that was kind of the main barriers. So I remember thinking, you know, I wanted to go to Auburn University. And I remember dad being like, all right, well, calculate the tuition and the difference between a school in Tennessee, a public university in Tennessee, minus the tuition of a school in Alabama. You pay the difference. And I looked and I was like, no, thanks, go Vols. I'll go and stay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then it was, all right, well, now I have to take 15 hours every semester while some of my friends were taking nine. So, you know, because people will graduate a semester late or a year later, and they kind of just like, work their way through, I had to be on a screw, you know what I mean? Like, I, I had to have that schedule. So I think it's a misnomer to generalize. If your school is paid for, you're not going to have hard work and grit. I don't think that's true. I think it's a way that you feel that Winston, my husband, you know, he had to work his way through, not the tuition part, but everything else he had to figure out. He had to have a job to pay rent and pay for food and all of that. Right. So, but. So I think that there are ways to accomplish what you want for your kids. And it may look different. And I'll give you one more example, then I'll be quiet and let Ken jump in. But like for us right now, Diego, we have a nine, seven and five year old and Winston sold his lawnmower about three years ago. And we have a lawn company mow our lawn. And he really, really struggled with our kids not growing up watching him mow the lawn because he had a lawn care business in college. And he was like, I want my kids to see physical. I want, you know, he was so hard on that, on himself, on that. But then as we talked, he was like, but right now, my time is better spent with them on Saturdays than going and doing that. What are ways now that we almost have to manufacture a life where they don't get what they want? They're gonna have to work and do things to get what they want. So does that make sense? I just don't want to over generalize that if your college is paid for, you're gonna be some spoiled, entitled brat. Because let me tell you, there probably are some spoiled, entitled brats whose college is paid for and isn't paid for, but it's more of the character of who they are. And.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

And maybe it's revealed to them.

[B]

And I'm glad you really segued nicely for me. You didn't even know. I'm gonna throw a different angle at you, Diego, because on one hand, I love the fact that you're going.

[C]

I don't.

[B]

I don't owe my kids a college education and I don't think you do. But I'm not going to qualify this. I'm just going to say this. And this comes from experience, Diego, just because you worked your way through college and you took all the benefits that you obviously did, doesn't mean that your child or children are going to do the same as you. They aren't you, number one. They really aren't. They aren't you. They will have some of your DNA, but they are not you. And they will have different experiences, they will have different environments growing up. And I think one of the challenges that we face, and I'm just being really vulnerable here, that I've had to learn as a father of three, is that the things that I did, the things that I learned, the way that I handled life is so unique to me. And I know I'm saying something that's completely obvious, but I think we forget this. And I would just say that in this case, if you played this out the way that you desire. Let's say your wife just went, I love that, Diego. Let's do that. There's a really high, high probability that one or both or all of your kids, however many you have, won't deal with it the way that you dealt with it. And they may go, dad's out of his mind, the old coot. He's a goofball. And I'm gonna go get a student loan because I can. And they get it done so effortlessly. And the very thing that you idealized and kind of thought, this is how I see it going. It would even break your heart. And so to that end, I would say if you can fund it, you should as an option in the 529, as we teach. I'll give it back to my partner here. It's very. It's flexible as to how you can use those funds for lots of qualifications. Because the world. Here's the other thing.

[A]

The world's changing.

[B]

The world is changing so quickly right now. What will higher ed look like when these babies are to that age? You and I have zero clue what it's going to look like. So I hope that perspective helps you. I don't think it's as easy as you just going, this is how I want it to be. Because that's how it was for me. And I get that. If anybody gets that, believe me, I actually talk like that sometimes.

[A]

Is that you know me well.

[B]

I'm trying to be transparent.

[A]

And I think that's true. And I think. And again, I want to reiterate, Diego, the sentiment of what you're longing for your kids to have is so good. Like that is so good because we want our kids.

[B]

And you're right. Other ways to do it.

[A]

But I think that there is. I'm like, there's. There's different other. And there's so much between. And like have them pay for their car when they're 60, right? I mean, like, there's things you can implement.

[B]

Have them try and along the way. But sport a hobby.

[A]

Let them fail and they're going to. And the world's hard enough in general, right? I'm like, they're. They're. They're gonna bump up against it. But I think you can create an environment with your. Within your home between now and 18 that creates. You know, I knock on wood. I believe this and I hope it's true. You know, not perfect kids, but kids that you are able to shape under your household and you as a parent get to put some of those guardrails in place. And if you give them everything they want, are they going to be more spoiled?

[D]

Sure.

[A]

If they got to work and figure out and problem solve, then that's going to be good for them too. So I think there's ways you can do it. But thanks for the call, Diego. Thanks for all the guys in the booth. Thank you. Ken Coleman. Thank you America. We'll be back.

[B]

There's no better time to start protecting your home than right now. This month only my listeners can take 50% off any new Simplisafe home security system during their last chance Black Friday sale. Do not miss this deal. I've recommended SimpleLife for over 10 years and it's simply the best security system you can get for your home. That's because Simplisafe helps stop crimes before they start. Their AI cameras detect threats early and then live agents stop them by speaking directly to intruders, letting them know they're being watched and that the police will be dispatched. Simplisafe stands behind their security with an anti theft guarantee and no long term contracts. That's why Simplisafe was named the best home security of 2025 by U.S. news & World Report. So don't miss Simplisafe's biggest sale. Head to simplisafedirect.com and claim 50% off today. That's simplisafedirect.com there's no safe like SimpliSafe. Welcome back to the Ramsey show. Coming to you from the Fairwinds Credit Union studio alongside Rachel Cruz. I'm Ken Coleman. So excited to be with you today and we want to coach you up. 888-825-5225. Antoinette is joining us now in Fort Worth, Texas. Antoinette, how can we.

[D]

Help? Well, I'm going to be 62 next month and I don't have anything saved for retirement and I want to become a first time homeowner. And I don't know if that's stupid and ridiculous or if it's.

[B]

Possible. Well, I don't think it's stupid or ridiculous. Let's focus on the possible part. Give us a picture of your financial situation given that you have zero retirement or very little.

[D]

Retirement. I have no retirement and I have no money for a down payment. So I would have to go USDA or cefi something with a zero down and so that would make my payments even.

[B]

Higher. No, you don't have to do that. You don't have to do that. Do you have any.

[D]

Debt? Yes, I have some, but not unmanageable. And I'm getting it paid off really.

[A]

Quick. Okay. How much debt do you.

[D]

Have? I think Credit karma said I had about $8,000 or something like that. I'll just paid off $600 worth of two of my accounts in the last month.

[A]

Though. Is the 8,000 credit cards or personal loans? What is.

[D]

It? Let's see. I paid off the personal loan, and so one of them is my car, and the rest of our credit cards, I've got, I think, four credit.

[A]

Cards. How much is in your car do you owe on your.

[D]

Car? Oh, gosh, I can't remember. I'm really bad with money. I mean, numbers. And so I just know that I just got it two months ago, and I had to trade in my other car because it was a 2019. It was convertible, and it didn't convert anymore. And mechanically it was down, but everything else on it was falling apart, so I had to get rid of it. And I was upside down on it because last year it was worth $17,000, and then this year it was worth $5,000, and so I was real upside down on it, and so I owe more on the money. I had to get a minivan because I'm so popular, I can't have a little convertible. So I owe more on my minivan than really I should.

[A]

So. Okay. And as you roll over the negative equity on the. On the.

[D]

Convertible.

[B]

Yes. Into the.

[A]

Minivan. Okay, so how much do you owe on the.

[D]

Minivan? I don't.

[A]

Know. You don't know? Antoinette, you signed a loan. You don't. You don't know how much the total.

[D]

Is. That's.

[A]

Right. All right, all right, all.

[B]

Right. She had to go to credit karma on the other thing. So one of our problems, Antoine, is you don't have a firm grasp of your.

[A]

Numbers. Yeah, she already said she's bad with them, but it's.

[D]

Not. I can't remember.

[B]

Numbers. Oh. But it's not about that. It's about. Do you have a file over in your house somewhere where we got the car.

[D]

Information? Yes, but I'm a truck driver, so my house is, like, 2,000 miles.

[B]

Away. Why do you need a minivan if you were driving a truck all the.

[C]

Time? I go home sometimes, and you're.

[B]

Popular. So you and the ladies are hopping in the minivan. Okay, all right. I'm trying to catch up.

[A]

Here.

[B]

Okay. Because I'm trying to figure out, honestly, if we can Sell the.

[A]

Minivan. What year's the minivan? What.

[D]

Year? Well, I had to go for a. Let's see here, a 20, 23, I.

[A]

Think. Okay. And with the negative, I mean, this could be 30, $40,000. I mean, so. Okay, so, Antoinette, I want to paint you a picture. Yesterday on the show, we had a truck driver, Christopher. He paid off all of his debt and he has hundreds, I mean, tens of thousands of dollars. I mean, he's just absolutely killing it. And he's a truck driver. He was telling us he had a Subaru, brand new. Ended up selling it. Had some, you know, had to take out a small loan because it had gone down and he was upside down a little bit. Bought an $8,000 Lexus. The Lexus gets hit. He gets a check from the insurance company for 9,000. He ends up buying a $2,000 car, takes the rest of that and throws it at the debt. Right? So there's a way to do this. And even someone in your industry, we literally just talked to him. He did his debt free scream yesterday. Here's the thing, okay? So the excuse that I am bad with numbers can't be an excuse anymore, okay? You are an adult, you are smart, you are capable, and we have to get this under control. So the first thing I need you to do when we hang up is I need you to call the dealership or the credit, wherever you got the loan for the van. I want you to pull up the credit karma again and know exactly, exactly which credit cards are out there and know exactly what you owe on them in companies. I want you to write a list down and then take your phone and take a picture of it. So you have it documented. Even if you're out and about, you have it documented. And then the plan is going to be. Homeownership is going to be down the line. Okay, for you. But I think the goal here is to get yourself out of debt. And Antoinette, I would. You're more than likely going to have to sell the minivan, okay? And you're gonna get a beater $2,000 car because I want you to be out of this debt so that you can start saving for retirement. I don't want you driving, you know, have to be a truck driver for the rest of your life. I want you to be able to have a great retirement. And that's not gonna be possible with the habits that you've been in, not only just financially actually, but the way you're going about it and your attitude about it. You gotta. You've gotta make the turn. And it can. And it's gonna be difficult and hard, but you need to get as much facts in front of you as possible because you don't know what you don't.

[B]

Know. Are you an independent contractor? In other words, work for yourself or do you work for a.

[D]

Company? I'm a company driver. I'm not kidding about having a bad memory. And I update all of my bills every other month. I have a piece of paper that tells me I keep it on a book. I look at every one of them. I see how much interest they're charging me. I see how much my balance is. And then I. I tally up my total debt. I also look at credit karma a few times a week. I just have a bad memory. And if had I known that you were going to be asking me these questions, I would have had this.

[A]

Stuff. Antoinette, you called a money show, my friend. You know what I mean? And so we're trying to help. We really are. And so.

[D]

My. I know you.

[A]

Are. My encouragement to you is that when there is something, a big, big missing piece and the car loan, is that for me right now that I need to. I need you to know what it is because I may need you to make a really quick decision to sell it. Because do you know how much the payment is each.

[D]

Month? Yes, the payment is.

[A]

$995. Okay. Almost a thousand dollars. How much money do you get paid once a month per month? What are you.

[D]

Making? Probably about.

[B]

75. Okay, and let me do a quick follow up, Antoinette, because I didn't hear you. That's my fault. Did you say you're independent? And the reason I'm asking this. Did you say.

[A]

No? She works for a.

[B]

Company. Okay. Do they have a 401k or some type of retirement program that you can be contributing.

[D]

To? Yes, but I don't because what. What's the point of that at my.

[B]

Age? Because you have nothing. So we can run these numbers, but I mean for the baby steps, as we teach them, is $1,000 in savings just for basic emergencies. Baby step two is to pay off your debts, smallest to largest. That's why Rachel leaned in there. We want to get the debt out of your life because we just learned that that could save us 900 bucks a.

[A]

Month. That could be thousand dollars. That could be going towards the.

[B]

Retirement. And, and so why would I.

[D]

Want a $2,000 beater card that's going to break down all the.

[A]

Time? Well, a $2,000 beater card doesn't always break down. All the time. You can ask Christopher. Yesterday, he literally had a picture of his. And it runs great.

[B]

It's. And I'm talking to a person who's super popular. Your own words. Have the ladies pick you up when you're not in the.

[D]

Trouble. I want to get all of my family together and take them.

[A]

Places. I hear your heart in.

[D]

It. I want a Lamborghini when I'm going there. I don't mean to.

[B]

Argue. I want to dunk a basketball. But some things are not going to happen because I'm 5 foot 8 and can't jump, you know, if I want to retire with dignity, I've got to start saving money. And I can't save money if I'm in.

[A]

Debt. Hey, Antoine. I want you to keep listening to the Ramsey show for real. I want you to listen every single day for the next six months. Make that be your goal. Just as you're driving, Listen to this show because I want this knowledge to soak in. In this way of thinking, in the way of life. When it comes to money, We all want peace. Peace with our money, our homes, our schedules. But having peace online is important, too. Most of the time, when you sign up for a coupon, enter a giveaway or click yes to another email list, your personal info, like your name, your phone number, your address gets collected and sold by data brokers. And before you know it, your inbox is overflowing, your phone's full of spam calls, and your data's floating around. Who knows where. That is why I love what delete me does. Their team of privacy experts finds your personal info on those creepy data broker sites, gets it removed and keeps it off. It is simple. It's safe, and it gives you more peace of mind. That means fewer spam calls, fewer scams, and way less digital chaos. You have worked so hard to find peace with your money. Now it's time to find peace with your digital life. Start protecting your privacy and your peace. Today, go to JoinDeleteMe.com Ramsey for 20% off an annual plan. That's JoinDeleteMe.com.

[B]

Ramsey. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. We are here for you to answer your questions about your money, your work, your relationships. And I'm Ken Coleman and Rachel Cruz joins me. The phone number is 888-2552-2588-8825-5225. Lindsay is going to join us now right here in our neck of the woods, Nashville, Tennessee. Lindsey, how can we help.

[D]

Today? Hi. Thank you for taking my question. I Am writing in with a relationship money question, actually. So back in college, my parents loaned me about $18,000 to go to college. It was $15,000 in principal and $3,000 in interest to help me pay for college under the agreement that I would pay it off within three years of graduation. Fortunately, I was able to do that. But after listening to many, many episodes of your guys show, I feel a little bit taken advantage of. And my question is, is it worth expressing my feelings to my parents now, despite the loan being paid back, or do I just accept the lesson, don't borrow from family and try to do better with my own kids going.

[B]

Forward? Okay, I'll start because I think I represent my colleague here. I don't know that we can answer that question without understanding why it is you think they took advantage of you based on what you've laid.

[A]

Out. You knew what you're getting into.

[B]

Right? It doesn't sound like they took advantage of you. So what are we missing that makes you feel like they took advantage of.

[D]

You? Correct. So I knew. I knew the full amount when I signed for it. You know, they told me things like, you can go get a loan from a bank, but God forbid something happened while you're paying them back. You know, were your parents. We would be much more understanding of that situation should it present itself. And I guess it's the whole charging interest thing that I guess doesn't sit.

[B]

Right. Okay, another question. You've paid this all back as I understand it.

[D]

Correct?

[B]

Correct. When did you. When did the. Yeah, when did the tension arise over the interest in the middle of it? Before you started paying it back or after you got done with it? Paying the whole.

[D]

Thing? More so after. Yeah, more so after I got done with it, you.

[B]

Know. How long after you got done.

[D]

With was about a year.

[B]

After. What changed? What changed? So I'm digging here on purpose. Rachel, thank you for giving me a little leeway here. It's a very fair question. So let me explain it the audience and to you one time, and then I want you to answer this. So you paid it back. You paid back the. The full 18,000 and about three grand of it was the interest. Is that what I'm.

[D]

Understanding? I was 18. Three of it was.

[B]

Interest. That's what I'm saying. So, okay, so you paid it all back. All right? And a year after you paid it back, at some point at some day, a year after you paid it back, this started to bother you. So that tells me something happened. What happened? Or dare I ask who.

[D]

Happened? So it. I got married a year after. A little over a year after I graduated college and my husband and I were talking about it, and he was shocked that they charged me interest and thought it was horrible that a parent would charge a child. Interesting. On a.

[B]

Loan. And you believed him all of a.

[D]

Sudden?

[B]

Yes. Had it occurred to you before his comment that that might be a horrible, despicable thing in someone else's eyes? Be.

[D]

Honest. Sure it had occurred to.

[B]

You. You telling me at some point you're like this, I appreciate what my parents are doing, but I think this is a little. This is a bit.

[D]

Shaky. No, no, no, no. Sorry, sorry. I misunderstood your.

[B]

Question. I know I'm playing LAWY television shows. Here's my point. The husband said this, and because of his understandable influence on you, and probably just by his sheer reaction, which he's, by the way, has every right to his opinion, this totally shifted everything. So I'm going to get out of the way and let Rachel weigh in, but I'm going to tell you my opinion now. I've gotten everything I need to know. Okay? So my opinion is it's too late. And I don't think there was any tension or resentment at all until your hubs opened his mouth. He has every right to open his mouth. He has every right to opine on what your parents did. I don't like how he said it because I think he should have been wiser and more mature. And if he was on the phone, I'd tell him this. He has every right to his opinion, but he's now created some tension and resentment after the fact and only from his point of view. And so for that reason, no, I don't think you should bring it up to your parents. And I think you need to figure out how to process this. Maybe it's therapy, but to create tension now to me seems.

[A]

Foolish. Yeah. I think what's hard for me, Lindsay, where it does not feel like they took advantage of you, is because everything was up front. If you had called and we've had these calls of people called. They said, oh, my gosh. We pulled my credit report after I got married to buy a.

[B]

House.

[A]

House. And I had a student loan on there. My parents took out a loan. I remember signing papers at 18, but they never told me. You know, that's deceitful people. Parents that. That loan with strings attached, that we'll give you this money maybe for a down payment on a house, but you guys have to live this close to us. We have to see the Grant, you know, there's strings attached in relationships. It's kind of gross. Like, this sounds like even though we're not for. You're exactly right. We are not for family members loaning money, period. But the way they did it, Lindsay, it was. It sounded very clear, very upfront. And the reason they did it, from what I hear, is they did it from a situation that a. It's less risk with the loan being held to them. It was not a, hey, we're gonna give you a deal. We're gonna charge you. And now if the 3. If the $3,000 was unreasonable interest. Right. If they're charging you 50% interest and they're taking advantage of you, that's gross and.

[B]

Weird. But did they do.

[A]

That? They pulled the average interest rate and they just said, hey, just do with us, because if something happens, their words will. We can give you grace period. Like, it won't hurt you financially. You know, that's the reason they did it. It wasn't a mathematical. You're going to get a deal for. From us. We're going to give you this half off. So. So, Lindsay, I don't think they took advantage of you. I think you knew exactly what you were signing up for. And I think that the reason they did it was so that a bank wasn't involved. But it wasn't a financial deal on their end. It was just a. Hey, here's.

[B]

This. Did they charge you the going rate on interest? I mean, Rachel brings us a very good point.

[D]

Here. Well, no. So it would have been about. What is that, 20% maybe it was $1,000 for every $5,000 that I borrowed from.

[A]

Them.

[B]

Okay. All.

[A]

Right. Yeah. So that's a little bit. That's a little.

[B]

High. Are your parents super.

[D]

Tight? Yes.

[B]

Very. Okay. So I actually. I'm glad you brought this up.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Rachel. Sorry. I know I was diving in a little bit. Not try truly interrupting, because I.

[A]

Don'T like, go, Ken.

[B]

Go. Okay, well, I personally wouldn't charge my kid interest. And then again, we don't loan our kids.

[A]

Money.

[B]

Right. All right. Nor am I going.

[A]

To.

[B]

Right. But I'm trying to put myself in.

[A]

This.

[B]

Sure. So it. Remember the little classic. We tell you what we would do. Okay, we wouldn't do it. But if I'm sticking myself, I.

[A]

Think it's a little.

[B]

Tight. I think it's a little.

[A]

Tight.

[B]

Sure. But they didn't do.

[A]

Anything. But take advantage is a really strong.

[B]

Language. I don't like that.

[A]

Language. It feels like it was.

[B]

Deceitful. I don't think they did. I am going to say though, Lindsay. So I have another follow up question. I can't wait for Rachel to get involved in this potentially. So the timeline for all of our viewers and listeners here, quick review. It was a year after you paid it off. That hubs and you have the conversation, he gets upset and it affects you. How much time between that first moment where he makes the comment and this phone call today, how much time has.

[D]

Passed? Years. We've been married for almost three.

[A]

Years. Oh.

[B]

Wow. That really concerns me. I was very intrigued by this. So here we are. Are you saying three years ago is when he first got alarmed and you started questioning this deal three years.

[D]

Ago?

[B]

Yes. All.

[D]

Right.

[B]

Yeah. So you've been sitting on this.

[A]

For three years and the loan's been paid off for three years as.

[D]

Well. Four loans been paid off for.

[B]

Four. Yeah, I got, I'm sorry, I'm so in the timeline here. So the question is, Rachel, doesn't that concern you? I'm very.

[A]

Concerned. Concerned? What do you mean? That she's just resisting resentment.

[B]

Yeah. And she's calling us and I'm glad. Glad you called us.

[A]

Yeah. I would really stop talking about it. I would get over it. I would release it, Lindsay. I really would. I think that yes, they're probably cheap to a degree. Like yeah, they're cheap. Okay. But they, but they didn't do anything deceitful. You knew exactly what you were signing up for. And so I think it's one of those things that again, thankfully you have the money to pay them back and all of it. But the, the deal is like this isn't, this is another reason, Right. Why we don't loan money. So I'm glad you, you've been watching the show, Lindsay. Cuz you're exactly right. This is. I would do this because it does feel weird. And it's not only does it feel weird cuz you owe your parents money when we talk about that, but it's also weird in this situation when you look back and you're like, oh, gross. I don't like how that felt. So like all of that is.

[B]

Standard and this is the Ramsey show. The last thing you need this holiday season is more stuff collecting dust or tech that keeps you glued to screens and up too late. You need better sleep. And that's what you'll get with Casper. Their mattresses are made for deep, uninterrupted rest that keep you cool and comfortable. So you wake up feeling ready, not wrecked. Because rest is not a Luxury. It's an investment. And the ROI is your well being. So go to Casper.com Ramsey and use promo code Ramsey for 25% off mattresses and 10% off everything else. You get free shipping, too. That's Casper.com Ramsey promo code Ramsey exclusions apply. All right, let's go to Jessica now, who joins us in Columbia, South Carolina. Jessica, how can we.

[D]

Help? Yes, so my quick question is, I was a victim of identity theft. I found out at 18 my mom had been using my Social Security number since I was 2 years old. Found out at 18 when I went to go get a car, and they wouldn't even touch me with a co signer with an 800 credit score, no money down, found out I had 800. $186,000 in credit card debt just.

[A]

Alone. Wait, say that again, Jessica. One hundred and.

[D]

What? $186,000 in credit card debt that your mom racked up?

[A]

Yes. Oh, Jessica, how long ago was.

[B]

This? Oh.

[D]

My. I mean, all the way back to 2005. The most recent one was in 2021, which was right before I was 18. And I got it with an attorney, and we got my credit wiped, but what it left me with was zero credit history and horrible credit score. Not even a secure credit card will touch me. Now. I have a significant other. We're not married, but we have gone to plenty of financial advisors, and we have been told both that our best option is to get married, because, again, I can't get even a credit card in my name. I'm an authorized user on only one card. I can't be an authorized user on a lot of other credit.

[B]

Cards. Jessica, slow. No, you're not. Actually, this is going to be a great call for you because you're not stuck. But quick question here, and Rachel's going to give you some amazing guidance here, I promise you. But why are financial advisors telling you that the best thing to do is to get married? Because that feels like a financial reason, not a good reason to get married. So I want to dig into that first. What are we trying to.

[C]

Accomplish?

[D]

Yes. They always say sign if I can. And I don't have a car in my name. I can't get a car of my own. We share my partner's car. We moved up here to South Carolina from southwest Florida, away from my grandmother and to live up here near my father. And I work from home, which isn't a big deal, but our biggest issue right now is we have one.

[B]

Car. All right, slow down, slow.

[D]

Down. I'm.

[B]

Stuck. So you're not stuck. This is the theme of this call. All right, I'm just going to ask a quick question here, Rachel. I'll get out of your way, but I want to ask a question.

[D]

Here.

[B]

Yes. What do you do for a living and how much do you make? And I have a quick follow up, so give me the real quick stats. What do you do and how much do you.

[D]

Make? I'm currently a debt collector for Advance America, and I'm currently making about, after commission, 18 to 19 an hour, 40 hours a.

[B]

Week. All right, so if you could save up money for, let's say you could save up $10,000. I don't care how long it takes you. Could you buy a car without a credit card? Could you buy a car with $10,000 cash, yes or.

[D]

No? Yeah, most definitely. I mean, there's plenty of good vehicles for that.

[B]

Price. So I'm challenging some of your thinking here. I want to. Rachel's going to guide you here, but I want to challenge this idea that you're stuck because you have no credit score and that you have to get married in order to have a car. You have a job, and you can go buy a $5,000 car, a $7,500 car. I just want to make sure you catch.

[D]

That. Definitely. Most.

[B]

Definitely. All right. I want to get out of the way, Rachel, because I know you.

[A]

Got some questions, but my goodness, I mean, the paradigm shift that you have to have, Jessica, is a pretty big one, because everything you've been talking about so far on this call has to do with how do I live my life around having a great credit score. And actually, you called the Ramsey show, and we're the opposite. We actually don't care about the credit score because primarily you use a credit score to go into more debt. And you're finding that out when you're trying to go get a car loan. They won't give it to you because you have a bad credit score. You try to go deeper into debt with a credit card, they won't give you a credit card because of that. So living debt free, this is actually a gift, Jessica. You don't even have the option. Most people listening right now could go apply for a credit card. You don't have the option. So see that as a blessing, because I don't want an option for you even if you had a great credit score. So. So how do we live life debt free? Well, number one, starting out your biggest need is what you're saying is a car. I almost think Your biggest need is maybe a new job as a debt collector. That can't be a very fun job. So I want Ken to even talk about.

[B]

That. Yeah, you're limited.

[A]

There. I think you can do some really great work, Jessica. And I think you can work overtime. Do you have.

[D]

Kids? Yes, I do.

[A]

Not. So, Jessica, I have no kids. I would make a priority right now to say here, making a very detailed budget, knowing exactly what your, what you need in life for food, shelter, utilities, transportation, and that's about it. Like, I mean, we're just going on the basics here. Everything else is going to go to save up for a car. And maybe $5,000 is your goal, whatever it may be, because you don't. Do you have, do you have any consumer debt in your.

[D]

Name? No, no, it's.

[A]

All. Okay. And you're fighting this whole $186,000.

[D]

Right? Well, we, we, we successfully sued the credit and it got wiped.

[B]

100%. How much do you have in.

[A]

Savings? Okay.

[B]

Yes. Do you have any savings.

[D]

Currently? No. We just used our savings to move and, you know, get out of southwest Florida because the jobs there weren't any good. And we're currently trying, I'm trying to get back into college. I have one semester left to get my associates, but again, my mother messing with my identity has affected my tax forms to getting grants and.

[B]

Loans. Okay, but listen, listen, Jessica, you don't need a loan to get one more semester paid for. And I think your remaining semester of your associate's degree is secondary to what Rachel's saying, which is let's get some money saved, let's get on a budget and let's buy a.

[A]

Car. Cause Jessica, we have people call the show all the time and they're trying to get out of debt. And so when we talk about getting out of debt, for instance, we say you cut everything and you work extra. And we have people, I mean, in a very normal rhythm on this show that are making an extra a thousand twelve hundred dollars above their income on side Hustles. So let's just make it a goal for you. And especially since you don't have kids, be like, hey, evenings I'm working. Like, whether you're waiting tables, I mean, you are doing something and let's just go crazy. And let's say you earn an extra. Let's go two grand a month. I know that sounds crazy, Jessica, but seriously, like, what if you worked your butt off, earned an extra 2,000. That means sitting right now where we are in the calendar by July, August, you Could have a car. Depending on how much that one semester costs you, between now and December, after you have a car, another couple of months of working extra, you could have saved, you know, six, eight thousand dollars for your tuition. So that's like. That's literally between now and the end of the calendar year, Jessica. So, like, it is possible. You just have to make some really big goals and you have to. Not that you're playing victim to this by any means, but don't be. But don't be leaning on the. On the credit industry to get you out. Yeah, Jessica, you can get you.

[D]

Out. We're fed. We're fed our whole lives that credit is what matters. I mean, again, we moved up here with the intent to buy a home, and we found out quickly that I couldn't be on it. And I guess that's really.

[A]

What. Well, and you don't need to buy a home with someone you're not married to either.

[B]

Jessica. So definitely not married. Or get married at the advice of a financial advisor. So you can get a car. All right, now listen. Listen to this. I just found. This is in the Columbia, South Carolina area. Okay? I just found a 2009 Toyota Camry, 182,000 miles, which, on a Camry, might as well be a new car. Okay? That car can go for.

[D]

482. Oh, I.

[B]

Know. All right, listen to this. $3,700 they want for this car. You walk up there with $3,200 in $100 bills, and that's two months, and say, guys, this is what I'm going to pay you for this car. They'll give it to you so fast, your head will spin. No credit. Do you hear.

[D]

Me? Yes, I do. I've had plenty of. I mean, my first car was in 05.

[A]

Civic. Okay, so I want to know for you, because we've thrown out a couple of things, whether it's cars or college or not buying a house with someone you're not married to. And you're a rebuttal to us. This whole call has been. Oh, I know. Oh, I know, I know. But why. Why are you then still dabbling in this idea? Like, I can't get a credit card, I can't get a car loan. I can't get a student loan. Because. Because you're saying, you know, but you're still giving it an option.

[D]

Why? No, I. I think it's just more so again. I mean, we. I mean, my whole family is. I. I mean, obviously they're not. You know, they got their own troubles. But the whole thing is, you know, to have great credit and to not have this negative stuff dragging behind you. And even though I've got my credit history wiped, you know, everything nowadays, they want to pull some type of credit, even buy your.

[B]

Pay. No, they don't. If you pay cash, buy now.

[A]

Pay later is horrible, Jessica. Like, that's why I'm saying you don't need to worry about those.

[B]

Stuff. You don't.

[D]

Know. I.

[B]

Know. No, you stop saying you.

[D]

Know. It's more so the, the knowing.

[A]

The availability and you know, but you only need it, Jessica. You really only need it to go into debt. And that's what we're telling you is pay cash. Just pay cash for everything and you don't have to worry about it. And if some cell phone company pulls up your credit report, you can just show them the police report and be fine. Like, you can get away with other things, but you, you have to be convicted about this, Jessica, or you're going to keep getting pulled. I feel like you're getting pulled into it even though you're saying, I know. So you need to stand firm, pay cash or anything. It is possible, Jessica, you can do this and keep things separate from the boyfriend right now and live your life, get yourself a car, save up for the semester, get your college degree and ride off into the sunset. And then maybe get married because you love him, not because of his credit.

[B]

Score. She's been hypnotized. Stop staring at the.

[C]

Sun.

[A]

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[B]

It, Rachel the AllNew. Every dollar is here. And folks, it is truly way more than just our world class budgeting app. I've been talking about this on the show. I, I, I got a meeting with the team and I said show me all the, just take me in the thing, give me a tour. And it's amazing. It's literally like a digital version of us on the show. For those who call in the first 15 minutes of answering the questions that the team provides you in this app, they're gonna help you find thousands of dollars immediately in savings. We're seeing this in an average of people who use it. You can start every dollar for free by going to the app store, Google play, tons of advanced features, not just budgeting. Now that's amazing, but the fact that you've got a digital coach, mentor, accountability, partner, whatever you want to call it, all those facets are in there. Fantastic. So you got to go check it out, give it a whirl. It's free and I'm going to tell you, you're going to love it. Donna is up next in West Virginia. Donna, how can we.

[D]

Help? Hi, Ken and Rachel. I love all the personalities, but Ken, I'm really glad you're there today. I love the way you spin a tail. You really make me chuckle. And I love your story from a few weeks ago about the welfare chicken. I GRE up on a farm and can relate to.

[B]

That. Thank you. Yes, thank.

[D]

You. The welfare chicken didn't get in trouble for telling them to sell the.

[A]

Chicken. I think I was on there.

[B]

With you during the not get in trouble and I had forgotten about that, Donna. So thank you. That's really fun. Thank you. You're sweet lady. By the way, I have to ask, where in West Virginia are.

[D]

You? Oh, geez, Romney. Do you know that.

[B]

Town? I think I've heard of it. Do you know Point Pleasant by any.

[D]

Chance? Oh, that's way far away. We're in the panhandle between Winchester, Virginia and Cumberland.

[B]

Mary. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Okay. I was born in that little teeny town of Point Pleasant, west.

[C]

Virginia. Point Pleasant.

[D]

5000. Word is I've been.

[B]

There. Well, I'm going to tell you.

[D]

Not many people across the state. Yeah, that's right across the.

[C]

State. But all.

[B]

Right. Donna, my sister from another Mr. Here in West Virginia. How can we help.

[D]

Today? Well, I'm, I'm 69 and my husband is almost 71. And we started our careers in the 70s. And at that time people were Saying, oh, you're so lucky you have a pension, you'll have Social Security, you don't have to worry about retirement. So we didn't and we're doing fine now with our pension and our Social Security, but we haven't saved a lot of money. And we had to put my mother in a nursing home last year, an extended care nursing home. And it really scared me and shocked me at the cost per month for that stay. And what my question is today, and I've been having friends tell me, you know, you need to sign your house over to your kids to save it from being taken and all of this. I know Dave says that you shouldn't do that. I have heard him, I haven't heard him talk a lot about that, but I have heard him say that. And I was just wondering what the pros and cons are to that and if there's no pros, what can we do? Or is there something we can do to save our.

[B]

House? Well, let's go back a step. What are we, what are we a fear. What are we afraid that's going to happen that would even allow us to consider that advice. What are you afraid is going to.

[D]

Happen? Oh, for the signing your house.

[B]

Over.

[D]

Yeah. Oh well there's I guess a lot of things. I mean I've been listening to the stove store show long enough that I know if you have kids, if anything happens to your kids then, then that can. If they're in an accident or anything like.

[B]

That. Yeah, but you're talking about, but you're talking about your.

[D]

House. I'm talking about my house, yes, in your house that my husband and I.

[A]

Own. Sure. And you're worried you're going to lose it to who or.

[D]

Why? Oh, Medicare. I mean if you can't pay, if you go into a nursing home.

[A]

Medicaid, they're going to be looking at.

[B]

Your. Okay, now we're caught up. Sorry we weren't 100.

[A]

Sure. And the reason we do we say that is because a little bit it feels like you're hiding assets when you just sign it.

[D]

Over. Wonder. I mean I.

[A]

Don'T. I know. So yeah, not a great, not a great thing because you're basically lying to the government that you don't have an asset when you really do. So okay. Do you have long term care insurance?

[D]

Donna? We do, but I got it. It's been probably before I realized the cost. My father in law went into just an assistant living and his was about $3,500 $4,000 a month. So when we got our long term care, it was very expensive anyway because I have some health issues.

[A]

So.

[D]

Sure. And ours is only.

[A]

3,000Amonth.

[D]

Okay. Then my mom's came up and it was 14,500amonth. And I'm like, I just, I was just in shock that it was totally.

[A]

Expensive. Totally. Well, okay. So a couple of things to think about that we don't know yet because. How old are you.

[D]

Guys? I'm 69. My husband's 71.

[A]

So. So a lot of different things. Number one, you don't know if you guys are going to need a nursing home anyways. Number two, if you did get to a point of a nursing home, you know, there are things you can do. You can sell the house and use that to fund if you need to. There's also, what are you guys doing with your pension and all of that? What do you have coming in per.

[D]

Month? You mean what we have? We have. It's like.

[A]

$9,942.

[D]

Okay. So I mean it's, it's decent. And we did just start two years ago. We have started putting some away. We both bought. I bought us and my husband. I'm still working a little.

[A]

Bit.

[D]

Okay. And I made enough money to be able to max out both Roth for me and a spousal Roth for my husband. I did that when we got, we got one of your.

[A]

Pros. Good.

[D]

Great. And he, he said to get what we got him in April. And he said, oh, hurry up and get a Roth before April 15th for the.

[A]

Tax. That's.

[D]

Right. So we did that. And then when we finally sat down with him, we had enough money saved to do another one for 20.

[B]

25. So what do you have? What do you guys have.

[D]

Total? We have 32,000 in Roth right now. And then we were playing around just during the years and we have about 50 that our financial advisor is rolling about 50,000 that he's rolling over into IRAs now that we're still in with the companies that we retired.

[B]

From. So just below 100,000. And then what is your house.

[D]

Worth? About.

[C]

400,000.

[A]

Okay. Yeah. So it would be one of these things if you guys did get into that situation, whether it's the insurance, some savings, you know, whatever you can put together to get into a nursing home. And I'll be honest on it, it sounds horrible, but there is a stat that once you enter into a nursing home, on average, there's not that long of a stay usually. Sometimes it is, sometimes it's not either. So it is kind of one of the last steps that family members will take if they're not able to care for, you know, their family member. And, and so that would be kind of that. That last step, if you will. So if I was in your shoes, I may ask about upping the long term care. I'm just curious what other options are out there for you guys. I would be looking at that because that's going to be very helpful type of insurance for you all if the time comes that you need in house care, nursing home, all of it. And you guys also are sitting on a great asset and you know what I mean? If something were to happen to either you or your husband and you did get to a point that you guys didn't have the money to cash flow it, and yet there was a nursing home that you knew we he. They needed to be in, you know, him or yourself. There's always the possibility of selling the house, you know, and figuring out what to do.

[B]

There. So, Don, I'm going to give you something. Rachel made a great point. I looked it up. The average length of stay in a nursing home is 485 days. Now of course, this varies, but averages do play out. So you're looking at about, you know, a year and three, four months. So, you know, it's horrible to. But that's the reality and we're talking about that. So, you know, between the pension and everything. Rachel, you make a very good point. It's not like you got to fund this crazy amount for five.

[A]

Years.

[B]

Yeah. You know, so I think you guys are doing everything you can. What? How much longer do you think you're going to.

[D]

Work? As long as I.

[C]

Can. I love.

[A]

It.

[B]

Okay. Do you work full.

[D]

Time? No, no. I do occasionally. I'm a teacher and sometimes I'll take a long term sub job and sometimes. Right now I'm just doing day to day and I'll bet the kids.

[B]

Love when Donna shows up to be the sub. You seem like a really nice.

[D]

Sub. I hope they do. They always say they do, but, you.

[B]

Know. Yeah. Well, that's good. And what about your husband? Is he officially done working or still.

[D]

Working? Yes, no, he's officially done. He's a.

[A]

Golfer.

[D]

He's. He's fallen into the.

[A]

Golf. I love it as much as good for him. Well, at least there's a little bit of a foreshadowing of watching your mom and how expensive it has been for or your mom or your dad that you guys can start planning that if that time comes. How we'll be able to cash flow that. So thanks for the.

[B]

Call. Donna. Do we know if people can search welfare chickens on Spotify or YouTube and find that rant? Do we know? We.

[A]

Don'T. I'm not sure. You could.

[B]

Try. Well, they can't. Oh, you all missed it. It was really great. Donna said. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio alongside Rachel Cruz. I'm Ken Coleman. Thanks for being with us. We're here for you. 888-255-2225 is the phone number. Let's go to Caitlin, who joins us in Charlotte, North Carolina. Caitlin, how can we.

[D]

Help? Hi, good afternoon. I'm a recent college graduate from West Virginia University, and I will start paying student loan debt come January, and I want to know what is the best and effective way to go about.

[B]

That. How much student loans do you.

[D]

Have? They will be around.

[B]

$26,000. And is it multiple.

[D]

Loans?

[B]

Yes. Okay, so what's the smallest.

[D]

Amount? The smallest amount, I believe, is about.

[B]

$5,000. Okay. All right, so what we. Is that the only debt you.

[D]

Have? Yes, that is the only debt I.

[B]

Have. All right, Rachel, walk her through the baby.

[A]

Steps. Are you.

[D]

Working? Yes, ma'. Am. I work a full time.

[A]

Job. Great. How much do you make a month? How much do you bring.

[D]

In? About a month. Maybe. Maybe 15 to $1,800. A.

[A]

Month. A month. Okay. What are you.

[D]

Doing? I work at a.

[A]

Boutique. A boutique?

[B]

Okay. What kind of.

[D]

Boutique? A women's boutique. Just a locally.

[B]

Owned. Like a.

[A]

Spa? No, like a clothing.

[D]

Store. Women's.

[B]

Clothing. Oh, sorry. A little slow on.

[A]

That. Didn't.

[B]

Know. Well, there's lots of different boutiques. There's like boutique hotels, boutique spas.

[A]

Sorry.

[B]

Fair. Okay, none of this matters. Why do you. I have a question on your income. Yeah, For a college grad, that is way below what your expectations were, I'm guessing. Yes or.

[D]

No? Yes. So I've had this job for about two years. I worked this job throughout college, and that is the job I'm still currently.

[B]

At. Okay. What'd you get your degree.

[D]

In? Business and.

[B]

Marketing. So what do you want to do? And I'm not going to put you under pressure here on a show live, but give me a general idea. It doesn't have to be a company and a title, but describe the work you that. That you went to school for that you would love to have. If I could just wave my pencil in the air and give it to.

[D]

You. Well, the work I would be interested in is Going into law.

[B]

School. Okay. So we went for business and marketing, and we're like, this is not what I want to do, but I'm just going to finish it. And then somewhere along the way, we discovered I want to be a lawyer in a specific type of.

[D]

Lawyer. Corporate law.

[B]

Sir. Corporate law. Okay, so a tie into the business and.

[D]

Marketing.

[B]

Yes. Okay, what's law school going to cost.

[D]

You? Law school is probably going to cost me around probably.

[B]

$100,000. And where are you.

[D]

Going? I have not yet made my decision, but I'll be taking the LSAT.

[B]

Soon. Okay, great. I want to make a quick commercial and I'll hand it to Rachel, but you got to get your two things. Number one, you need to get your income up.

[A]

Right? You should be making. You should be making.

[B]

Double. I don't even care what you're.

[A]

Doing.

[B]

Yeah. At this point, you need a target of 40 to $50,000. Let's just put it out there. I don't want to limit you to that, but you just need to get out there and find something, because more cash the better. Now. And Rachel tell you what to do with that cash. But I just want to make a point on the lsat. Years ago, I interviewed a law school expert on this. And this is a fact, by the way. Way there are certain schools, you're gonna have to do your homework on this. But you can figure it out easily that based on your LSAT score, Rachel, if you get a high enough LSAT score, they will give you a full ride. And the reason is these aren't the prolific ones. Let me just go ahead and tell you, this isn't Harvard. It's not the big time schools. These are the schools who nobody wants to go to their law school. So therefore, they're trying to get people into their law school because they want lawyers out there and they will give full rides. So these are going to be smaller schools, not as well known, but they have legit law schools. And let me just make my, my pitch on this. Nobody cares where you got your law degree from. And so the, the trade off is, Caitlin, you have to pay for the lsat. And if you need to take the LSAT five times, take it. If we're aiming for, and we feel like the tutors will tell you we can get you to this score, which gets you a free ride. So that's my.

[A]

Commercial. Yeah. It's worth investing, you know, five, six grands or like. Yeah, honestly, when you think about it, it totally with tutors and.

[B]

Everything. But I don't know what the current lsat cost.

[A]

Is? $100,000 degree for.

[B]

Free. Yeah. So that's what you need more money.

[A]

For.

[B]

Yes. Plus we got to pay off these loans. So Rachel, tell her how we pay off these.

[A]

Loans. And that needs to be your way to law school. Caitlyn, I really want you to see that because you're going to be $126,000 in debt if you don't. So we want to really work hard to avoid all those student loans. Yeah. So it's getting your income up, Caitlyn. So, I mean, I really hate to say it, but I, I mean, I would probably be looking for another job. I think it was to get you through college. But now that you're a college grad, you know, you made that investment for a reason. And so now we need to go roi it and we need to go, you know, get a job like ken said, making 40, 50,000 a year. And, and I would limit all my expenses. I would live on nothing. And I would make it a goal to get this paid off in 18 months, 16 months, 14 months, you know, and so, I mean, I really think you can, if you, do you have rent, Are you living at home? What's your, your living.

[D]

Status? I live at home with my.

[A]

Family. Okay. So no rent. So I would take full advantage and make a really, really aggressive goal of getting this paid off and then at the same time be looking at the LSAT stuff and make that also a part time job. So I don't know if it's a, I don't know right now if it's a full time job that you go and find, you know, a receptionist, I mean, anything, like just go and answer phones, I mean, do something. Or if you do the boutique during the day and you wait tables at night and you're doing a two day, you know, two job a day kind of thing to double this income, but this income needs to be doubled. Caitlin, you're a college grad and I think that you have things to offer. And again, it's kind of back to this college degree conversation that you got your degree for a reason to go and create a career. And so taking that knowledge and going and doing that, that and upping this income is going to be, is going to be your number one.

[B]

Goal. Because, Caitlin, here's the deal. You are young enough and this debt is small enough that you can pay this off in a year, but you got to make more income to where you're putting two grand a month away. So like Rachel said, What must be true for me to be able to sock two grand, $2,500 a month away at the $26,000 loan. Knock that out out and get it out of the way before the interest starts hurting you. Okay. Because I know people that are. That have your amount of loan debt and they're paying it for 15, 20 years because they're never catching up because the interest payment. So you want to get this out of your life. And I just. I'm telling you, if you trust me and you do your research, you can go to law school for free or for a very reduced amount that you can cash flow. And most people don't know that. And please do that. That because you're going to just be so much more at peace. So there's your homework assignment. Pretty straightforward, but you got to.

[A]

Hustle.

[B]

Yep. So thanks for the call. You know, Rachel, that is. I love when we get that call. And I. And I'll be honest, I've not interviewed people in other lanes, but I, I would almost bet you there's other professional lanes like that that where certain schools are going, you know, like med schools are going. We want to get people in here. And. And the sticker price on Vanderbilt, which is in the shadow of our campus here. Y versus a small.

[A]

School. Totally. Yes. And it's an. It's an ego play to go to a. If someone's like, hey, where's. Where are you going to law school. And it's a Harvard law that maybe. Yeah. Or you're going to one that no one's ever heard of it take. And you got to have some humility to it, but you're doing it in a wise way. You know what I mean? And so there's.

[B]

Something. But it just rarely comes up. Your clients aren't going to go, hey, I've heard rumors that you got your law degree from Greenbrier.

[A]

State. I mean, you think about vet school, law school, med school. I bet George Camel, when he had took his dogs into the vet, he didn't say let me see your degree before he said save my dogs. That was all last week. So. That poor guy.

[B]

Tanya. That poor guy and his dogs. It's like a soap opera around here, folks. We don't have time to cover.

[A]

It. We'll have him cover it, George. If he hosts here in the next.

[D]

Week.

[A]

Foreign. Hey, do you ever feel like you're doing everything right with money, but still.

[B]

Stuck? I was you in debt, running.

[A]

Hard but taking three steps forward and two steps back. Turns out it's not the numbers, it's the fact that changing our ways with money is emotional. That's why I wrote my brand new book, what no one tells you about Money. To help you push past what's really been sabotaging your progress so you can finally win. You can pre order now and score over a hundred dollars in free bonus items but only if you order by January 5th. Go to ramseysolutions.com store.

[B]

Today. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman and Rachel K. Cruz joins me and we are here for you. The phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. We want to help you win in your relationships, in your work and in your money. And speaking of winning with your money, you know a lot of people right now, Rachel, are watching. What is the Fed gonna do? We've seen the interest rates on mortgages come down a little bit off of a several year high and everybody's going do I buy? Do I sell right now? What do I do? And we've got some great advice, advice for.

[A]

Them. Yeah. And even in the this showed, Ken, I feel like we've had a lot of home questions even about like hey, what's my next step? Well the, the goal is to make your home and home ownership a blessing, not a burden. And so if you are in a place where you're like, okay, I'm thinking about selling, I'm thinking about buying, maybe I'm a first time home buyer. You know, having that 5% down payment is crucial. A 15 year fixed rate mortgage is what we recommend and for your payments we know more than 25% of your take home pay. It's kind of always been our formula for, for, for decades regardless of what the housing market is doing that just keeps your household budget in a good spot. But finding a house and specifically finding an agent that you trust who's really incredible and of high caliber in this area is really important. So the Ramsey trusted program really is the only way to find an agent that you can trust to keep you on track with what we teach here at Ramsey and they're going to get the best offer on your house or is going to help you find the right house. House. We send you to some of the top agents in your area who we trust and you get to review their stats, you get to interview them and decide which one you want to work for. Because we have multiple and different markets across the country. Ramsey trusted agents have years of experience and will help you make wise decisions when it comes to Pricing, the marketing or in choosing the right offer as well, if you're getting multiple offers. So to find a Ramsey trusted real estate agent for free, go to ramseysolutions.com/agent. And again, use this resource, you guys, because this is home buying for majority of people. It's the largest investment you make in your personal finance, your personal finances. So do it well and do it right with an agent that, that we trust so that you can trust as well. So Ramsey solutions.com.

[B]

Agents. Yeah, good stuff. All right, let's get back to the phones. Kansas City is where we're going to go and Jerry's there. Jerry, how can we.

[C]

Help? Yes, my question relates to the national public data breach and what sort.

[D]

Of steps should I be taking to kind of make sure my Social Security.

[C]

Isn'T used to open a line of credit with that or what, what, you know, what kind of things I expect to.

[A]

Do? Yeah, I mean, there's a, there's a couple of things, Jerry. You know, number one, you can just freeze your credit if you're not currently in debt or using debts. You can do that. That's a, that's a line of protection. But having identity theft.

[B]

Insurance. Insurance, yes.

[A]

Yes. Is really, really key. It's really inexpensive. And so I would Recommend going to Xander.com Xander's who we use. They actually, they, that's one of the benefits here at Ramsey Solutions is every employee, every team member gets identity theft as part of working here. That's how much we believe in it because stuff like this is going to happen more and more. So, yeah, honestly, I would go to. Yeah. Xander.com and check out their identity theft protection and I would, I would get a policy on you. I'd get a policy of every person in your household. Honestly too, because even kids, we're seeing identity theft, you know, happening within kids as well and people running up stuff on their credit. And I mean, it's just, it is wild. So I would do that. There's a number here on our screen that you can call as well, Jerry. It's 800-3562-428235-64282. And yeah, that's what I would do personally, Jerry. And then, I mean, that's as much offense as I know to do, Ken, on this. Unless something does happen, then you do have to take action. But if you have identity theft protection, they go in and do a lot for.

[B]

You. So just to kind of catch people up who may not know the story here. And Jerry, I'm glad you Bring this up. Just kind of let people know, because you need to know that. It was widely reported that hackers may have stolen the Social Security numbers of every American. That's me, Rachel. That's, that's all of you. And so there is a notorious hacking group that's, that is claimed to have stolen a ton of information. And so this is being reported across a lot of news networks. And, and you can find this.

[A]

Story. So it happened what, two weeks.

[B]

Ago? Yeah, just last week or last.

[D]

Week.

[B]

Okay. Yeah. So, so that's what you can do. This is how you kind of check. So do that freeze just exactly what Rachel said until you can check everything and then go get protected with Xander Xander Insurance. Xander.com 800-356-4282. That's 800-356. And they do a great job. We get an email every month tells us we're good or what might be something we need to check into. And that protection.

[A]

Is. And there's other services like Delete Me and other places too, that, that are incredible for, for online scammers as well. So identity theft protection, again, you guys, it protects your identity, Social Security, all that. But then you think about how much our, how much our information. Not necessarily Social Security number, but, but just your address, your phone number. I mean, all this. I'm getting blown up. Political, all the political stuff, and I'm like, where did my number get sold to? Like, what list is, you know, is this too. So there's full on companies that help people get their information off. But it's going to be, I mean, that's, that's part of the curse of 2024 and technology. Because, I mean, I don't know about you, Kim, but I do, I plug in my information on stuff. So whether it's, you know, you're, you're shipping something, you know, or buying something, whatever it is, is. It's just your. I mean, it feels like I, I'm putting in my information a lot.

[B]

On website and by the way, and just in the overabundance of giving you all information, the three credit bureaus that Rachel's talking about again, experian, Equifax and TransUnion, you just, it's a free deal. Call them or do it.

[A]

Online. You can pull.

[B]

Yeah. And put a freeze on your credit and, and, and, and that will.

[A]

And pull your report once a year, you guys, regardless of whether it's a data breach or not, make sure you pull your. And you can do that for.

[B]

Free.

[A]

Yeah. Once a year. So use Those. Each of those companies and yeah. Get three reports three times a.

[B]

Year. All right, let's. Let's go to John now in Los Angeles. John, how can we.

[C]

Help? Hey there. How's it going.

[B]

Guys? Good. How are.

[C]

You? Pretty.

[B]

Good. How can we.

[C]

Help? So, yeah, so I've been in college pretty much all my Life. I'm about 33. Be graduating with a PhD next.

[B]

Year.

[C]

Year. My wife just graduated, so she started working. So it's the first time we really have a real income in a shovel. So we have a hundred thousand dollars in debt, no retirement savings, and we kind of want to look into buying a house next year when I graduate. No, but we're not really sure. Yeah, no, John.

[B]

First. No, John, we're interrupting because you're not.

[A]

Catching. No, no, no, no. Okay, John, what are y' all gonna be making household income together.

[C]

Combined. So right now, today, combined, we make.

[A]

170.

[C]

Okay. When I start working, it should be.

[A]

2:30.

[C]

Great. When I finish my postdoc, because I still need a little bit more, it should be about 280 in about three.

[A]

Years. Three years. Okay. But in the next four months, six months, what will it.

[C]

Be? Still 170. While I'm finishing up my.

[A]

PhD. And when will it bump up to. To.

[D]

2:30. How.

[C]

Long? When I find a job? Probably next.

[D]

Summer. So probably a.

[C]

Year. 12 months next.

[D]

Year.

[B]

Yeah. Is the debt all student.

[C]

Loans? It's 60,000 in student loans, 40,000 in car.

[A]

Loans. Oh, okay. What's the car breakdown? What do you own each.

[C]

Car? It is 17 and.

[A]

23,000.

[C]

Okay. Both pay off in about four.

[A]

Years. Yeah. Okay. How are you guys? You guys currently are making 170 though, right? Is what you.

[B]

Said.

[C]

Yeah. So take home is.

[A]

10,000Amonth.

[C]

Okay. And basic necessities is between 3 and.

[A]

4,000.

[C]

Okay. So there's a lot of room there to tackle.

[A]

It. Yeah, for sure.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. No, you guys have a great income, which I'm so thankful for, and it will continue to go.

[D]

Up.

[A]

Up. Yeah, I think Michael, John, for you guys, if I was you between now and next summer, is I would be working on these car loans. And you may run some numbers and see what could you sell the.

[D]

17 for the $17,000 one, they would both break.

[C]

Even. So I was just looking at.

[A]

It.

[C]

Okay. And. Because I just think we owe pretty much exactly what we can trade.

[A]

In. Okay. Okay. You know, I mean, to jump start this, I mean, you're not overly heavy in cars by any means. From our, you know, math, when it comes to, to when we look at car debt versus income. But I would, I would make it a goal. Yeah, John, to, to be cash flowing the rest of your school. I would make it a goal to start paying off that smallest debt. So even if it's a, a small student loan more than before the car, you know, just start working that debt snowball, working the smallest debt to the largest debt debt and then be saving an emergency fund. And then I would save for a down payment on a home. But, but I'm really encouraged though, because your numbers, you guys can make some significant progress really fast if you stay focused and you guys have a plan. So tonight, lay out a timeline between now and the next three years and have some data points to say, yep, we want the car so, you know, paid off here. We want this student loan paid off here. And, and you kind of map it out to know that you guys will get to saving to a down payment asap, which is where I want you guys than for the.

[B]

Call. Thanks for the call, John. We'll be back. This is the Ramsey.

[A]

Show. Listen up, guys, because I've got.

[B]

A big question for.

[A]

You. Where will you be with your money at the end of.

[B]

2026? Will you be better off, worse.

[A]

Or exactly the same game? Believe it or not, you get to choose. Look, I know there's a lot going on that can make you feel powerless over your money, but I want you to hear me. You're more in control than you think. You can turn your finances.

[D]

Around. So let me help you.

[B]

Out. Start your year off with me.

[A]

And Dave Ramsey at our free EveryDollar live stream event on January 8th. We're cutting through all the lies and all the chaos out there that's keeping you stuck so you have the clarity you need to finally get ahead of and you could even win $2,000 just for signing up. Listen, another year is gonna pass anyway, so decide that this is the year you're gonna take back control of your life and your money. Go sign up for the free live [e-mail] live.

[B]

Stream. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Rachel Cruz joins me. I'm Ken Coleman and you are listening and watching the Ramsey Show. So excited that you are with us. 888-255-225 is the number. Stephanie is joining us now in Los Angeles. Stephanie, how can we.

[D]

Help? Hi. Happy birthday.

[A]

Rachel. Oh, thanks, Stephanie. I appreciate.

[D]

That. You're welcome. Okay, so. So I am a single mother of two girls. I've been a single mom for a long time. Now and I own a business. I'm a professional organizer and I actually, like, coach families on how to keep their lives together. Well, I just am really struggling financially. I ended up having to get a full time job. Long story short, my savings just got drained when I put employees on payroll out here in California. It's super expensive and anyway, so I just. I don't know the first thing about, like, good budgeting. I did not grow up. My parents, like filed bankruptcy three times. And I'm just trying to set up a future for my children and I just want to get out of debt. So I need some advice and I want to sell my car and. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. Okay. I got a quick question before Rachel dives in because she can walk you through this. But I'm just curious. How does a person who is really good at teaching other people to be organized not figure out how to do a budget? I'm not saying that in a judgmental way. I'm just curious. Where did you think the disconnect is.

[D]

There? No. So I know how to stick with a budget. What happened was I was going, a custody battle came up in the middle of everything. And then my dad got early on to Alzheimer's. This is all like in a short period of time. And it just threw me for a loop. And a lot of my money went into custody. And then I ended up taking out an Eidl loan, which I. I've never been like a credit card person, a loan person. I actually kind of got talked into getting a business credit card for my business. And then because I was paying everything cash before that, and the custody battle happened, I put the whole custody battle on my business credit card because I was like, desperate. And so, yeah, this is where I'm at. And I never coached anyone on finances. I coach neurodivergent families how to, like, set up systems in their home to keep their homes, like, functional and how to, like, live purposely in their home. But right now I'm just in over my head as far as what to do. Yeah, economy is not that.

[B]

Great. What are you making in your day.

[D]

Job? So my full time job, I make 1908 an hour. It's a sales job. I do like interior design. And so we do get commission on designs, but I've yet to reach that commission because the whole bonus structure is just. It doesn't make any sense. You have to sell at least $80,000 between installs or whatever. I don't know. So I've never reached that. And then my organizing job, I have Three contractors. So I bring in right now. It's not really good. I bring in about maybe 2,000amonth with that. But it's just so slow right now. And I just. Yeah, I was making pretty good money. And now over the last couple years, it just hasn't been that.

[A]

Great. Yeah. And then you throw in things like a custody battle in the midst of it and.

[D]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, I pay for everything for my kids. Like, I don't get any help. I pay for the cars, insurance, everything.

[A]

So.

[D]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah. Well, let me just say, you know, when it comes to your kids, when it comes to your health, like, we are all about fighting the fight, right? I'm like, it is. You wanna, you wanna do it, you know, because those are the important things in life. So that's. I want, I want to free you and, you know, not pile on any level of shame. Give yourself a lot of grace. So. Okay. So how much debt, Stephanie, do you have? Do you.

[D]

Know? Yes. So I have my $20,000 EIDL loan that starts. Payments will start coming out in.

[A]

October.

[D]

Okay. I owe almost 9,000 on a credit card. And then my, my car is. I owe about 13,500 on that. And then here's like the really hard part for me. I got behind on taxes. I just got paralyzed with fear, by the way, but I just, I got behind on taxes. Three years. Those are just finishing up being filed. So I don't know what I owe on that.

[A]

Yet.

[D]

Okay. So I'm waiting on that. So those are my, my, those are my debts.

[A]

And. And you're making 2,000 for your organization business. I know you're making 19 an hour for what you're doing, but do you, how much, how much will you bring home a month with that full time.

[D]

Job? So each check is about 1200 and some change after insurance and all of.

[A]

That. And you get two checks a.

[D]

Month each every two weeks, Correct?

[A]

Yeah. Okay. Okay. So it's a little less than five grand. And have you been able to map out. Are you able to pay your bills, Stephanie? Meaning your, your mortgage, food.

[D]

Lights. So I don't even, I don't even have a mortgage. I. So my rent, I'm actually in a great situation as far as that goes. I live in a two bedroom apartment. It's 1200. I've like refused to move because I'm so, like nervous. I wanted to get my, you know, finances in order first. So 1200 for rent. Yeah. And then, and then 404 for my car payments. And then of course, utilities and all that.

[A]

Stuff. How much is. How much is your car? How much is your car worth? Do you.

[D]

Know? I'm not exactly sure. I did look on, like, what other people are selling my car, my type of car for, and I saw anywhere from 15 to.

[A]

19. Okay. So here's what I would suggest. I feel like for you, Stephanie, a good, good win would be just a quick win to feel some level of traction because you're going to start to make. Make some changes right when it comes to your money. And those changes are going to be uncomfortable because you've never done this before. But the fact that you're not underwater on your car, I mean, man, if you could get. If you could get. Yeah. I mean, if you could get 19,000 or something for it and go get a crappy $6,000 car that takes $13,000 of debt that's gone. Just.

[D]

Gone.

[A]

Y. And then. And then looking at. Yeah. Your credit card attacking that neck. And then the. The loan after that, the $20,000 loan. Now, when your taxes come back, Stephanie, if you can't pay them by the tax deadline, go get a personal loan from the bank. I would rather you have a personal loan than owing the irs. Okay, so that will be a.

[D]

Step.

[A]

Okay. And what you're going to do is pay off the smallest debt to the largest debt. And. And again, the car, I think, would give you some traction. Do you have any savings?

[D]

No. My putting employees on payroll just drained my savings. I had.

[A]

About. Okay, so you have nothing grand. So you may want to relook, too. I wish we had more time with you. I would re. Look, maybe the structure of your company. I just. I don't. I don't know if it's for sure. Like, I know it may be a thing. It may be a thing, Stephanie, that you just say. Yeah. That you. That you close it down for now. I mean, like, is there something. You know, is there a way to just take that burden off? You're just carrying a lot, and I'm just trying to relieve some margin for.

[D]

You. So. I do not have any employees on payroll anymore. It's all contractor jobs. I just. Yeah, I just contract. But to be honest, I am thinking about just going back to. Because it is stressful, like owning a business. I've had it since 2016. It's really. It's a great business. We were, like, all around California as far as, like, our reputation and stuff, but I just. I'm so stressed about it. So I am thinking about stepping back and just working full time and you know, maybe taking on jobs by myself for, like, extra income. But as far as selling my car, that was actually what, what the reason why I called you. I wanted to see if you.

[C]

Thought that that was a great.

[A]

Idea. I probably would, honestly. I mean, that would be such a relief not to have that car payment every.

[B]

Month. Yeah. What is the.

[D]

Payment?

[B]

Yeah. What's the.

[A]

Car?

[D]

404. So it's a.

[B]

404. I mean, mean, listen, 400 bucks, Stephanie, how much would you love a $400 raise per.

[D]

Month? I would love to just like take that 400 and put it into, like the rest of my debt and.

[A]

Just write your credit.

[B]

On. No, that's.

[A]

Right. If you, if you stay on the line, Kelly and Austin are going to pick up. We want to give you financial Peace University. It's our nine lesson course, Stephanie, and every dollar premium. It's our budgeting app. And then also I'll have them connect you with a financial coach in your area, be it. I know as a single mom, you're juggling a lot and I think sitting down with someone who has the heart of a teacher who can walk through really specific numbers and scenarios. And it may only just take one session, but it's better than a, you know, seven minute, you know, chat that we were able to have here on the show. But we want to connect you with some of that stuff, Stephanie, because you're on the right track. You're, like, right there and you got to just start making those steps and you're going to feel a lot of traction. So we're excited for you, cheering you.

[B]

On. We're going to take care of you. Thank you. Thank you for calling. This is the Ramsey Show. Buying and selling a home is a big deal and you want an expert in your corner fighting for you to get the right deal at the right price. That's why we only recommend Ramsey trusted real estate agents. They're handpicked pros who know their stuff, listen to your needs and have your back from the first call all the way to closing day. To find a Ramsey trusted agent near you, visit ramseysolutions.com agent ramseysolutions.com agent. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Rachel Cruz is with me in Studio this hour. 888-2552-258882-55225 is the number to jump in our scripture today comes from Titus 2, verses 7 through 8 and everything set them an example by doing what is good in your teaching show integrity, seriousness and soundness. Of speech that cannot be condemned. So that those who oppose your. You may be ashamed because they have nothing bad to say about us. And our quote of the day from Les Paul, don't say you can't until you prove you can't. All right, how about.

[A]

That? There you.

[B]

Go. There it.

[A]

Is. There you.

[B]

Go. Thomas is joining us in Asheville, North Carolina. Thomas, how can we.

[C]

Help? All right, thank you guys so much for taking my.

[B]

Call. Sure. What's.

[C]

Up? So my father has planned a vacation for this summer for the whole family. I'm married. We have two children. My brother's married. He has three children. He gave us a little bit of heads up on it. Basically just asking when the kids would be going back to school. And then he planned this trip for the end of summer. We're right in the middle of baby step two. Should be debt free by looks like November. He's paid for the location and like lodging and everything. But my main concern is I work like 70, 75 hours a.

[B]

Week.

[C]

Wow. And I don't have any paid. I don't have any paid time off. So my, my main concern is, is missing that income while we're on this trip. So I was kind of hoping to get you guys advice on.

[B]

That. So before dad comes to you with this vacation idea, what was the plan? What were you and your wife thinking about? Summer? No.

[C]

Vacation. Yeah, I mean, we've been. We've been busting it, just trying to get everything paid.

[B]

Off. It's Gazelle. Intense. Yeah. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna oversimplify it because I think this is the key issue. You weren't going to go on a vacation. And we, and we agree with that. You guys are going hard, man. You're working 70, 75 hours a week. That's impressive, aggressive. And you weren't planning to anyway. Now dad's asking you to do.

[A]

It. Wait, that's what I. Not to jump in. Did he ask or did he tell you guys? Well, did he say? Well, that's, that's an interesting part of.

[C]

It. A little bit of both. You know, the. Like, my brother has children. Our. Our children have never met their cousins. He's kind of really loving the whole grandpa role and kind of wants everybody to get together. They're getting a little up there in age. So he kind of looked at it as an opportunity to. To get the whole family together one last time and have all the grandkids in one place. Because my brother lives a thousand miles away from where I.

[B]

Live. So I Would. So I think. Well, I'll tell you what. I'll. I'll ask one other question. I want. I want Rachel to see what she says here. Is he paying for everything or just the lodging? Meaning you guys would have to pay for the travel to get there. Plus.

[C]

Meals, food. He's handling food and lodging because I'll be doing most of the cooking. That's kind of how it's always worked out as he buys the food and I prepare it. But we. I mean, we'll basically just be responsible for gas to and from. So it's the. Not so much the expense of the trip, but the missed.

[B]

Income. That's.

[A]

Right. How many days will you guys be.

[C]

Gone? 6 or 7, depending on when we travel.

[B]

Back. All right. The only other question I have is, can you, man, you're already working 70, 75.

[A]

Hours. Wants you to have a.

[B]

Vacation. I. Yeah, but they weren't planning on it.

[A]

Anyway. I.

[B]

Know. So. So I. This is not so much like an opinion. It's. It's advice. And I think I would. I would do what you believe is right to do, and I think I know the answer to.

[A]

That. I don't think you want to go.

[B]

Thomas. I don't think you do.

[C]

Either. I really do. I really want my kids to meet their cousins, and I really want, you know, my parents the opportunity to have all their grandkids in one place because they're, you know, 2, 5, 6, and 7, and they've never all been in one place at the same.

[B]

Time.

[C]

But. But I mean, I'm just. I'm concerned.

[A]

About. But would a week of it. Hold on. I'm gonna be devil's.

[B]

Advocate. Hold on, hold on. Be devil's advocate. I want him to finish that.

[A]

Sentence. Okay, go. Go, Thomas. Sorry cut you.

[C]

Off. I've. We've been working really hard, and I'm just kind of, I guess, very apprehensive about. About what that month's budget will look like with, you know, several hundred dollars missing from it. And I don't want that to take away from what the experience is supposed to be if I'm there, you know, worried about.

[A]

That. So have you added up how much money you will lose out on being.

[C]

There? Probably about eleven hundred dollars or.

[A]

So. And that's.

[C]

Okay. Not counting the gas to and.

[A]

From. Sure, sure, sure. And how much. How much debt do you guys have.

[C]

Left? We've got about 13,000.

[A]

Left.

[B]

Okay. What would it do to your budget? Would it stress you out without the 1100? Would that make it super.

[C]

Tight. Not particularly. We still have to factor in, like, we haven't, you know, the kids back to school stuff is going to be that month and the month prior to that in August, so.

[A]

Loop. Yeah, I mean, it feels like it would be. Here's. I know. Here's. Okay, Thomas, you got to do what you got to do. Here's my. Here's my devil's advocate. What do you do to be with. And again, this is. If you want to, Thomas, if you feel guilted, if there's some weird emotional thing. If Dr. John DeLoney was in here and is asking you, like, psychology questions of family stuff, right? Like, if it was just a healthy situation. I think giving up eleven hundred dollars to be with family for one week because it doesn't happen. It's not like this is a yearly tradition would be worth it for a family situation like that. And everything is paid for. Now, if they're making you pay for everything, that's one thing you can't afford to go. Everything is paid for. And maybe you go half the time. Maybe you and your wife say, hey, we're gonna go for four days. And there's something about living life still. And this isn't taking you guys. Guys deeper into debt. It may. It may slow it down for three weeks. The debt.

[B]

Snowball. I.

[A]

Agree. But there's something about the situation feels. The situation just feels so unique that it's not going to happen. And for eleven hundred dollars, a part of me would say, oh my gosh, like, go be with your.

[B]

Family. I agree with that. If that's what's going on, Thomas wants.

[A]

To. And if that's what Thomas wants to do, I don't know if Thomas.

[B]

Wants to do it, but ask him. Thomas.

[C]

We. We definitely want.

[B]

To. No, I forget the want to. No, here's what I'm asking. You're working 70 to 75 hours a week. Is that to pay off the debt faster or is that to make ends meet and the eleven hundred dollars is going to make things super tight? And it makes me feel like that's the case when you're talking about school supplies and.

[A]

1100. No. 1100. No, hold.

[B]

On. Let's let him.

[C]

Answer. Well, no, I mean, if I wasn't. If I was working 40 hours a week, all our.

[B]

Basic.

[C]

Our. Our budget could sustain on.

[A]

That. The extra work, because.

[C]

We'Re. We're putting about anywhere from an extra probably 1500 or so per month on.

[B]

The. So. So back to Rachel, it's a month behind eleven hundred dollars. Not making that is not going to make life tight. It's just going to slow the snowball.

[A]

Down. That's.

[D]

Right.

[B]

Yeah. Then I would, I agree with Rachel. Now that I have the. Wow. You didn't let me. I was trying to get the.

[A]

Facts through the life raft and Ken said, sure.

[B]

Rachel. No, I actually agree. I just needed to get to that.

[A]

Point. That's.

[B]

Good. That's. I couldn't tell emotionally if he was. What's the 1100 doing in this case? I think because the kids have never seen each other before. Dad and mom are getting older. All the things you already said. Very well. Yeah, Thomas, I'm okay with.

[A]

That. And, and honestly, Thomas, take four days of a paid for vacation as a gift of a little bit of rest too. Right? I mean, y' all been working like crazy, which is amazing. It's.

[B]

Exactly. I'm so proud of.

[A]

You. But this is a unique thing.

[B]

And I, I, I agree with.

[A]

You. I would say.

[B]

Go. You only got one shot around this globe. And I would do the family vacation knowing that the 1100$, you're not going to have that. The subtraction of that, it's not going to make things tight to where you can enjoy the vacation. And I also want to point out to Thomas, I would like to vacation with you because I'm all for buying the food and you cooking it for me. I would like to point that out, Rachel. This guy's great to vacation.

[A]

With. It sounds.

[B]

Great. Hey, Thomas is.

[C]

Coming.

[B]

Great. Let's go get the brisket. You know, Thomas, here you go. How do you feel now? You feel like this is the right move, you're going to do it. You got to talk to the wife. What's the.

[C]

Story? Yeah, I'm going to talk to her about it. I think it's, there's a mentality shift that needs to take place because I've been, we've been doing this since.

[B]

August. Yeah. I think it's a memory and.

[A]

I don't want you to. And I don't want you to lose momentum either. So just see this as like a quick pause, a breather paid for vacation, and then you're back at it. But I think the, the scope of family and cousins and all of that, there's something really special there that I would hate for you guys to miss out on because you wanted to pay off debt one month.

[B]

Later. That's right. And I'd make the old man cook one meal for.

[A]

Heaven. Yeah. Maybe go half the.

[B]

Time. All right. Good hour, Rachel Cruz. Thank you. James Childs and our team. Thank you, America. This is the Ramsey.