You Have to Know Where You Are Financially to Know Where You're Going

Summary

Summary of "You Have to Know Where You Are Financially to Know Where You're Going"

The Ramsey Show
Host/Author: Ramsey Network
Release Date: February 28, 2025

In this insightful episode of The Ramsey Show, hosted by Ken Coleman alongside financial expert George Camel, listeners delve into the crucial importance of understanding their current financial status to effectively plan for a prosperous future. Through a series of real-life caller scenarios and expert analysis, the show emphasizes foundational financial principles such as debt management, budgeting, and strategic investing, all underpinned by Dave Ramsey's proven methods.

Key Sections

1. Introduction and Tour Announcement

• Dave Ramsey (00:00): Announces the upcoming Money and Relationships Tour featuring Dr. John Deloney, encouraging listeners to purchase tickets via ramseysolutions.com.
• Ken Coleman & George Camel (00:28-01:19): Introduce themselves and the show's purpose—helping listeners win in money, profession, and relationships while ensuring the conversation remains engaging and fun.

2. Caller Rob's Debt Dilemma

• Caller Rob (01:42-03:49): Shares his struggle with $250,000 in debt due to past divorces, a car accident, and job loss. Rob is conflicted between using the debt snowball method for his low-interest debts or consolidating high-interest debts via a HELOC to expedite repayment.
• George Camel (03:49-08:47): Advises against rearranging debts and emphasizes the importance of the debt snowball method to build momentum and eliminate debts systematically. He reinforces unity in financial efforts between Rob and his wife, encouraging them to stick to the proven plan rather than seeking quick fixes.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (04:22): "Rob, you are rearranging the chairs on the tit. This is not going to be the solution you're looking for."

3. Caller Sean's Career and Education Choices

• Caller Sean (10:18-16:28): An ultrasound technician contemplating returning to physician's assistant school, facing a $125,000 debt for a marginal salary increase. He's also considering purchasing a home.
• Ken Coleman & George Camel (14:39-16:28): Discuss the financial impracticality of taking on significant debt for a degree that offers minimal long-term benefits. They advise Sean to explore more affordable educational options and focus on saving to avoid unnecessary debt.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (14:56): "I would rather do that than just say yes to the first one that takes me and use student loan debt to do it."

4. Planning for Marriage and Home Purchase

• Caller Scott (16:46-19:18): A young individual planning to marry and purchase a home, feeling overwhelmed by upcoming expenses like engagement rings, weddings, and down payments.
• Ken Coleman & George Camel (17:02-19:18): Recommend a structured approach to financial planning—prioritizing essential expenses first (like the engagement ring and wedding) before committing to larger investments like a home. They suggest using the Financial Peace University resources to align financial goals with marital unity.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (18:07): "I haven't met a 23-year-old who's about to get married, who's like, yeah, we're ready to buy a house, buy a ring, get the wedding, and do it all in cash."

5. Managing Family Debt and Financial Boundaries

• Caller Julie (33:31-51:35): Faces a complex situation where her parents have incurred $50,000 in medical debt, leading to financial strain and tension within the family. Julie seeks advice on managing her own financial health while dealing with familial obligations.
• Ken Coleman & George Camel (33:40-51:35): Emphasize the importance of setting clear financial boundaries and not becoming responsible for parents' debts. They advocate for seeking counseling to address underlying trust and communication issues within the family dynamic.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (49:35): "Your dad decided to take on that credit card debt in his own name. That's on him."

6. Investing vs. Debt Repayment

• Caller Kyle (66:07-74:11): A high-income earner with significant house and vehicle debt contemplates whether to invest further or prioritize debt repayment.
• Ken Coleman & George Camel (66:07-74:11): Recommend aggressively paying off debts, especially high-interest vehicle loans, before allocating more funds to investments. They stress the importance of eliminating liabilities to enhance overall financial stability.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (66:40): "You can do what you want. You have an amazing salary. You can out earn your stupidity for a long time and afford that payment for as long as you want, my friend. But if I'm in your shoes, I'm following the Ramsey plan."

7. Caution Against High-Risk Trading

• Caller Sean (78:34-82:38): Discusses his experiences with day trading options, facing losses and uncertainty about continuing this risky strategy.
• George Camel & Ken Coleman (79:21-82:38): Strongly advise against day trading due to its high risk and low success rates. They promote traditional, long-term investment strategies like index funds and retirement accounts to build sustainable wealth.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (79:21): "97% of day traders who persisted for more than 300 days lost money."

8. Financial Support for Adult Children

• Caller Lynn (83:31-85:03): Inquires about supporting adult children financially by matching their investments to encourage saving and investing.
• Ken Coleman & George Camel (83:37-85:13): Support the idea of financial support with conditions to ensure accountability. They recommend tying financial gifts to specific goals, like retirement savings, and requiring proof of investment to promote responsible financial behavior.
• Notable Quote:
  • George Camel (84:33): "I'd demand proof as. Because I'm that guy. I'd be like, all right, here's the deal. I'm going to give this to you. I need proof in one week that you've actually deposited this money or else I rescinded."

Advertisements and Promotions (Skipped)

The episode includes various advertisements and promotions for services like Zander Insurance for identity theft protection, Health Trust Financial for health insurance, BetterHelp for online therapy, Laurel Road for student loan refinancing, and the upcoming Investing Essentials virtual event. These segments are designed to provide listeners with resources aligned with Ramsey's financial principles but are omitted from this summary to focus on the core content.

Insights and Takeaways

• Debt Management: Prioritizing the elimination of small debts to build momentum (debt snowball) is more effective than attempting to refinance high-interest debts without addressing underlying spending habits.
• Strategic Education Investment: Avoid accruing significant debt for educational pursuits that offer minimal long-term financial benefits. Explore affordable options and weigh the cost versus the potential income increase.
• Financial Boundaries: Establish clear financial boundaries, especially when dealing with family members who have incurred debt. Personal financial health should not be compromised to manage others' debts.
• Investment Strategies: Favor long-term, stable investment strategies over high-risk trading to ensure sustainable wealth growth and financial peace.
• Support for Adult Children: When assisting adult children financially, set clear conditions and expectations to foster responsible financial habits and independence.

Conclusion

This episode of The Ramsey Show expertly navigates through a multitude of financial challenges faced by listeners, offering grounded, practical advice rooted in Dave Ramsey's financial philosophy. By emphasizing the importance of understanding one's current financial situation, the show empowers individuals to make informed decisions that pave the way for financial stability and wealth building. Whether dealing with personal debt, career decisions, family financial dynamics, or investment strategies, Ken Coleman and George Camel provide listeners with the tools and insights necessary to take control of their financial futures.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey, guys. Dave Ramsey here. Me and Dr. John Deloney are coming to a city near you on the Money and Relationships tour. It's happening soon, so don't wait. Get your [e-mail] tour.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey show where we help you win in your life, specifically with your money, in your profession and in your relationships, alongside the incomparable, the delightful George Camel. I'm Ken Coleman. Excited to be with you all. George, you ready to go today?

[George Camel]

I'm.

[Ken Coleman]

It's a Friday. You're not mailing it in?

[George Camel]

No, I don't even know how to do that. I'm a millennial.

[Ken Coleman]

Come on.

[George Camel]

I don't mail anything.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go. That's a very good point. You don't even know what a stamp is. I'll explain that to him during the commercial break. But we're here for you, America. 8882-552258-88825-5225. Now we're going to coach you on saving your money, investing your money, making more money. That's what George and I do together. And I warn you ahead of time, we have fun. This is serious stuff. But we also have fun while we're doing.

[George Camel]

Got to bring some levity to it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Or else we get bored and we don't want that. By the way, great looking studio audience today here on the other side of the glass. So we'd love to see you sometimes. You want to come join and watch the show live? We'd love to see you. All right, let's get started. Triple 882-225again is the phone number. Rob starts us off in Hartford, Connecticut. Bob. Excuse me, Rob. How can we help today?

[Caller Rob]

Hi, George.

[Ken Coleman]

Hi, Ken.

[Caller Rob]

Thanks for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure. What's up?

[Caller Rob]

So I got married about six months ago. Hey, I'm trying to dig us out of this ginormous hole. Our prior divorces, some poor decisions, and a severe case of cancer to wife vitis.

[Ken Coleman]

Hold on a second. Hold on. What was that? A severe case of what?

[Caller Rob]

Can't say no to wife itis.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow, I like that. I thought that deserved. You ran through that too quick. Can't say no to wife itis. Yeah, I've got a similar case. It's called can't say no to daughter itis. My 16 year old's got me wrapped around her finger. I really struggled.

[George Camel]

I don't think insurance covers those. Sorry, guys.

[Ken Coleman]

It doesn't. Yeah, no, unfortunately it's a pre existing condition, so.

[Caller Rob]

But yeah, so long Story short, we're probably about 250k in the hole right now, not including the house. Part of that is, like I said, divorces hit both of us pretty hard. I also got in a car accident in December, then lost my job the next day. So I had like three or four months span that was really tough on us. But I am trying to, you know, we, we make decent income, so we have enough, we have a little bit of margin. So I'm starting obviously, maybe step two, trying to get going on that. But the thing that kills me is I understand the concept of the smallest to largest. But the problem is almost all of our small debts are all 0% and we have large debts that are 28%. And it drives me nuts that I'm going to spend, you know, 12 months paying off 15, $20,000 worth of 0% while the 30% is accruing $1,000 a month in interest. And I was thinking, you know, we can take a HELOC, cut that rate by 70%, it adds another 800 to $1,000 that we can roll into the snowball and get done, you know, eight months to a year faster.

[George Camel]

Rob, you are rearranging the chairs on the tit. This is not going to be the solution you're looking for. And I don't. I know you can crunch the numbers and see how much you're paying in interest and that should make you angry. But here's the deal. The people that actually get out of debt, they don't just move around their debts and get new debts to cover the old debts and pay off the big debt before the. They just do the debt snowball and get so frustrated and so angry that they're willing to work as much as it takes to get rid of the next debt and get rid of the next debt, freeing up the next payment. And you're going to lose all that momentum trying to tackle this giant mountain of the biggest debts with the biggest interest rate.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

So the question is, what are you willing to do and sacrifice to use your savings and future income to get out of this? Yeah, there's stuff we can sell in this 250k. Are there cars involved?

[Caller Rob]

I recently sold my video game collection for like $5,000.

[George Camel]

Hey, that's a start.

[Caller Rob]

But that was painful.

[George Camel]

Well, you got no time to play video games. You're going to have four jobs for the next three years.

[Caller Rob]

Yeah, I'm looking at getting another job to try and bring in some more income to tackle this.

[George Camel]

Now you kept saying, I'm going To start the debt snowball. Where is your wife in all of this?

[Caller Rob]

She's there. She is in the other room.

[George Camel]

No. Is she a willing participant in this process or is she like, hey, knock yourself out. Trying to get rid of this debt. I'm going to go be over here buying stuff.

[Caller Rob]

Yes. She's actually volunteered to get a second job as well. But I. She did that before with her ex husband who had no ambition at all. So I don't really want her to have to do that again.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, why? You're projecting something. If she's willing to get a second job, the answer is, thanks, babe. That's awesome. What are you, the knight in shining armor for the last deadbeat?

[George Camel]

The second job was.

[Ken Coleman]

You guys gotta work together on this.

[George Camel]

Yeah. Her last marriage was not crushed because of her second job. It was crushed because of a lot of other reasons and a lack of unity. And. And what this shows me is that you are actually creating unity because both of you have skin in the game and you're walking through this together.

[Ken Coleman]

Can we dig in the numbers, George, please? All right, I'm going to facilitate.

[George Camel]

I love this.

[Ken Coleman]

Because you're the money guru. All right, Rob, I want you to just walk George through a couple of the. Let's just do the lowest, the smallest two debts in the debt snowball and tell us what the minimum monthly payment is on those. Walk us through those.

[Caller Rob]

The smallest two are. I think my Apple card is like 500 bucks. And I think there's a Samsung card that's like 1500 bucks. Both of those are at zero percent.

[Ken Coleman]

Right. So what's your minimum payments on those?

[Caller Rob]

58 and 133.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so now let's go the next level up. What's the small? The third? Let's go up this. Let's go. You know what I'm trying to say? I'm struggling. It's a Friday, folks. What are the next two? The next two debts?

[Caller Rob]

Yeah, I mean, we got like 2200. And then it starts to jump. From the 2200 we got, it goes up to about 6.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so what are the minimum payments on the 2200 and the 6000?

[Caller Rob]

2200 is. Well, that's a. That's another Apple card. So the way they do that as installments on your phones.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't care. I don't care. I just want to know what the month. 400 bucks a month you're paying towards.

[George Camel]

That for These are for iPhones for that one is. Yeah, I think we can sell some iPhones. We can rock some iPhone eights, right?

[Caller Rob]

Theoretically, yes. I think there's only two payments left on it, so.

[George Camel]

You said 2200 bucks.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. It's more than two payments.

[George Camel]

That's a whole lot of money to me.

[Ken Coleman]

But I'm trying to do what? I'm trying to get George in here. George, I'm trying to show him that.

[George Camel]

600 bucks in payments on the first three debts.

[Ken Coleman]

I knew you would pick up the ball if I passed it. You. Do you see the real momentum here, Rob? Like we're talking about real savings quicker than trying to pay off the other cards. I mean, the high interest stuff, like you need some momentum in this deal.

[Caller Rob]

But I understand that. I wasn't really saying I'm going to switch to paying off the highest one because I know that doesn't work.

[Ken Coleman]

I know what you said. You said you wanted to do the HELOC for it. We get it, but we're just trying to help you get some momentum. The momentum is the issue. Dave has proven this for. For decades through people who followed it. It is about momentum. That's what we're trying to help you understand, George.

[George Camel]

Yeah. Behavior is what got us here. Not interest rates, not math. And so I know the interest rate is the easiest thing to get mad at instead of looking in the mirror and being mad at Rob. And man, you. You were dealt some cards that nobody should be dealt with. But here we are on the other side and the only way out is through it. And that's the debt snowball method. So hang on the line. I'm going to send you guys my book, Breaking Free from Broke, along with Financial Peace University. You and your wife sit down, watch all the lessons, listen to the audiobook, read the book, get fired up, get five jobs. And if your marriage isn't better at the end of this thing, then we've done our jobs wrong. Because I'm telling you, that's the kind of unity that the debt snowball creates.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. All right, quick break. I'm going to try on George's bomber jacket, see if it fits. And we'll be back. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey, listen up. Everyone is at risk of identity theft. I don't care if you're a hermit living off the grid, listening to the show on a battery powered radio. All of your data collected by every company you've ever done business with. Lives online. Your bank, your doctor's office, retailers, the apps on your phone, the gas station where you have loyalty rewards, they all store your info online, making them Ripe for a cyber attack or data breach. That's why I've been telling people for almost 25 years they need an ID theft protection plan. And the only one I've ever recommended is from Zander Insurance. They monitor your. Your personal and financial info, even your home title, and take over the work if you become a victim. It's the most thorough and affordable plan out there. I even have it for my family and our entire team. Visit Zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman. Thrilled to have you with us. 888-2552-288882-55225. Let's go to Salt Lake City, Utah, and Sean is joining us there. Sean, how can we help today?

[Caller Sean]

Hey, guys. I'm currently an ultrasound tech, kind of functioning as a travel nurse. I make pretty good money currently. I'm wondering if it's worthwhile to go back to physician's assistant school for 2 years and incur like 125k in debt to make a little more money long term.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, let's. Let's break that down. You. You set it up wonderfully. You just. I need to get some facts. How much are you making now?

[Caller Sean]

So I probably make like 3,000 a week, so probably like 140 years if I take some time off. So maybe a little less, but somewhere in that ballpark. So I make good money now. But if I was to go back and be a regular person and not do the travel thing, I'd probably make 80 to 90. And I'm kind of tired of doing the travel thing, so I'd like to sit down in a spot for a while and.

[Ken Coleman]

No, I got it.

[Caller Sean]

Traveling forever.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so. So if you. Let's just fast forward and let's say you got the 125. Excuse me, 125,000 in cash to cash flow becoming a physician's assistant, if I heard you correct. What would. What would be your range of income as a physician's assistant?

[Caller Sean]

Probably starting at like 110 and then have to go from there.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Sean]

Be my best guess.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. And okay, so how long if you weren't allowed to take out a loan, how long would it take you to come up with the money off your current income? You should make it pretty good money. I've wrote you down as between 125 and 140 based on how kind of loose you were with that. So. So I think that's a good range. How long would it take you to cash flow your way to come up with the cash to do it without the loan?

[Caller Sean]

Maybe. I have no idea. I'd have to sit down and do the crunch numbers. Probably at least a year, I'd imagine. At least, like, probably two years.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I was gonna say, no way. You're only making 100.

[Caller Sean]

I don't own.

[Ken Coleman]

Go ahead.

[Caller Sean]

Yeah, I don't own a home either. So that's the other thing. I would like to own a home in the.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, but we got to solve the first problem. The first. So. So, Sean, I want you to take a deep breath and slow down a little bit. I'm gonna actually do all the heavy lifting for you and walk you through this. All right, so let me, let me guide you through this. So the first problem we've got to solve is you want to get off the road of being a travel nurse. That's just, it's just. It's just a quality of life issue. I think that makes a lot of sense. That's the first problem to solve. Not the house, Correct?

[Caller Sean]

True. That's. House is part of it, but yes, for sure.

[Ken Coleman]

I know, but I'm helping you by, by understanding what your priorities are. So that's your priority. So the, the move for you is. Is, well, I'm going to take a pretty significant hit if I don't have the physician's assistant situation. If I jump back just to traditional nursing, I'm going to take a pretty big hit. Correct, Correct. Okay, so we start looking at, okay, when we coach people, we want to help you come up with the decision, us not tell you what to do. And so we look at, okay, I'm single, I want to save for a house, and I want to get off the road. But I'm making really good money now. I do take a little bit of downtime. So which is the most important goal? Is it to be a physician's assistant and also make around 110? Is that a huge priority for you, career wise?

[Caller Sean]

Not the biggest. I mean, I really like my job currently. It's just more of, I guess, long term, like what I can do when I'm 60, 65.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. How old are you now?

[Caller Sean]

A job that I just turned 40.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. You're a young guy. Okay. So going through these priorities, Sean.

[Caller Sean]

I'm.

[Ken Coleman]

Going to take the greatest opportunity that I have to stack cash that would then allow me to set myself up when I am 60. So you don't want to be traveling nurse when you're 60, but you got 20 years to get that physician's assistant degree. So putting yourself in debt right now, to me seems completely nonsensical. You know, we're not for debt. You knew that when you called us. Right, but forget our philosophical policy. I mean our philosophical beliefs about this. I don't care who you are in your position, I just think you got to be a little bit patient and just why put yourself in $125,000 worth of debt when in your case, you don't actually have to. You like your job. You're making really good money, George. I want to bring you in here because even if you had a, even if you weren't anti debt like we are, it still doesn't make any sense given where he is in his life.

[George Camel]

And I've been crunching the numbers, Sean, and based on just some quick research, entry level PA in your area, probably making 90 grand, which is what you said you'd make just getting off the road. Now, long term, you could make closer to110,130, but this is not a significant jump to go 125 grand into debt or to even cash.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, he's actually going to go backwards from where he is now.

[George Camel]

Exactly. So I would, to Ken's point, be very patient about this and just stack up cash and live like you're a broke college student right now. Because if you can put away, you know, 40 grand a year, in two years, this thing's cash flowed, and then two years from that, you're a PA, you've got time.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right, Sean, let's play this out. You do what George just said. You're only two years of patience there, and then now you're stacking cash for the house.

[Caller Sean]

That's true.

[George Camel]

And I also saw in state cost, for like example, University of Utah, in state costs should be closer to like 82 grand for this program. So where was the 125? Was that a specific university you were wanting to go to?

[Caller Sean]

That's a specific university. Just because my degrees are old and there's not very many places that will accept my credits since they're so old.

[George Camel]

Have you checked all around, like, have you went to the most affordable options and went, will you take my credits? Can I get into this program? I feel like there's some more check.

[Caller Sean]

Yeah, I've checked quite extensively and I have two bachelor degrees previously. They're just my credits are so old. So if I applied, like say Salt Lake, I'd have to take numerous classes over again, like chemistry. O chemistry. And you couldn't flip out of etc.

[George Camel]

I just want to say if we can save 40 grand just by doing some homework and research, I'd rather do that than just say yes to the first one that takes me and use student loan debt to do it.

[Caller Sean]

Correct. No, I totally agree with you. My options are limited to go back to school based upon my educational past. And how distant is as far as the medical field goes.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, well, I mean, we've told you what we would do. We just want to save you that burden of debt. You just don't need it. Nobody needs debt. You really don't need it in this situation. Let's go to Scott in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Scott, how can we help? Hello, Scott. Hi.

[Caller Sean]

How's it going?

[Ken Coleman]

Good. How can we help?

[Caller Sean]

So I am 20. I'm 23. I have been dating my significant other for about six years now, and marriage is definitely on the near horizon.

[Ken Coleman]

Gee whiz, I would hope so. Six years, kind of struggling.

[George Camel]

I'm exhausted already.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm exhausted.

[Caller Sean]

Everybody tells us we're young.

[Ken Coleman]

How old are you?

[George Camel]

You're 23. So the high school sweetheart situation, and you're like, all right, we kind of have our bearings. We're out of school at this point. Working full time.

[Caller Sean]

Yes, we're both working full time.

[George Camel]

Okay, and you want to propose in the next six to 12 months?

[Caller Sean]

Yes, I was thinking within the next. Next year.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, what's your question, Scott?

[Caller Sean]

So I'm just wondering. So we've also been thinking of a house as well. And I just feel like it makes me nervous, you know, all these expenses coming up so soon. You know, you have the engagement ring, the wedding, the honeymoon, and then obviously a house. And, you know, everybody seems to be putting 15 to 20% down.

[George Camel]

Who is everybody? Everybody's broke.

[Caller Sean]

You know, that would be.

[George Camel]

I don't know who.

[Ken Coleman]

Everybody.

[George Camel]

I mean, it's rare.

[Caller Sean]

People I work with.

[George Camel]

I've Never met a 23 year old who's about to get married, who's like, yeah, we're ready to buy a house, buy a ring, get the wedding, and do it all in cash. Here's what most people do. They go, we'll finance it and we'll start our marriage off in crippling debt and hope for the best. Yeah, that's normal. And so I want you to be weird, Scott. And that means, hey, maybe a newlywed couple can just rent for a year or two or three, get their bearings underneath them and get a good down payment under their feet before going, well, we're married. Got to have a nice house. Got to have a nice car.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

So I would focus on one thing at a time. Next up is the ring. We're going to do a reasonable ring, one month salary, max. I don't care how wonderful she is. It's not about the ring she deserves. It's about the one you can afford. Next, let's make sure we can cash flow this wedding between family and ourselves. Next, let's talk about the honeymoon. All right, I'm going to pay for a reasonable honeymoon. Next, we can talk about emergency funds and down payments and all that good stuff. So hang on the line. I'm going to send you financial Peace University. This is the roadmap for any newlywed couple. If you guys get aligned on this, it will bode very well for the success of your future marriage.

[Ken Coleman]

That's good, George. One thing at a time. That's it. Very simple.

[George Camel]

So we're such in a rush at 23.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Wow.

[George Camel]

Got a lot of life ahead of Matt's Ken Scott. It's much older.

[Ken Coleman]

So much older. And by the way, the young thing, I got married at 23. You're not too young. All right, we gotta take a break. During the break, I'm gonna share with George what I've learned about Bread. This is the Ramsay show.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey, you guys. I'm not a fan of the big banks and you probably already know which ones I mean, but I like credit unions because they're non profit organizations that focus on their members. And I'm proud to endorse Fairwinds Credit union because they share the Ramsey mission of helping people get out of debt and live generously. In fact, they design products to help keep you from going into debt in the first place. Fairwinds has been in business for over 75 years and they serve hundreds of thousands of members worldwide. You can feel secure because your deposits are federally insured by the NCUA up to $250,000. It's easy to join, and Fairwinds partners with more than 5,000 credit union locations around the country, so you can bank in person wherever you live. But if you prefer the online experience, you can log on to Fairwinds and do anything you could do at a physical location. So go to Fairwinds.org Ramsey to learn more. And while you're there, look at the combined checking and savings account bundle they created just for Ramsay fans to help you take control of your finances. That's fair Winds F A I R W I n d s.org Ramsey.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman. So glad it's that you are with us. 888-882-55-5225 is the phone number. Many of you listen to us, watch us because you want to invest and invest wisely. And the reality is is that investing can be very intimidating, certainly confusing. And you never want to take investing advice on a TikTok. You need to dive deep. And so to that end, our Investing Essentials virtual event is going to teach you everything you need to know. It's coming up March 4 and 5. Tickets started. $199. This is a two night event. As you can tell by the dates. Dave Ramsey and George Campbell are collaborating on this event. You're going to get Dave's personal playbook on real estate investing and George is going to do a deep dive as well. George, you want to give a little.

[George Camel]

Oh, I just did a rehearsal this morning and man, the stuff we have planned for how to choose exact mutual funds in your plan.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, good.

[George Camel]

You can invest with confidence.

[Ken Coleman]

That's great.

[George Camel]

We're getting a lot of questions about this and we're going to just lay it all out in a way where you leave so much more confident about your whole investing plan. We're going to take it all and just make it simple. There's so much noise out there and we're just going to go, here's the 17 things you need to know and nothing else. And so it's going to be a really good time. Looking forward to it. Tickets 199. That's a good deal for five hours worth of coaching from Dave Ramsey himself. And we're taking your questions as well. So you can email those in if you get your tickets, ramseysolutions.com events or click the link in the show notes. If you're on podcast or YouTube, don't miss it.

[Ken Coleman]

We're not, you know, we're not doing.

[George Camel]

This again this year.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right. You were talking about, you know, all the complexity out there around investing. That's why I was telling you during the break about what I've learned about sourdough bread.

[George Camel]

I saw you took a sourdough class like you're an expert.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, there's just a lot out there. What do you do with the starter? How much do you feed it? There's a lot of things out there.

[George Camel]

It's much like investing.

[Ken Coleman]

I signed up for this hour class.

[George Camel]

But you got to do it the right way and you got to have patience.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[George Camel]

You can't rush the process.

[Ken Coleman]

So there you go. I just want to tie all that in together there, George. See, I signed.

[George Camel]

Definitely done.

[Ken Coleman]

You all need to sign up for this investing class. If you don't understand it because it's a class, let's just be honest. Two night event. Going to be great. And maybe George will tell you a little bit about what I've told him about telephone.

[George Camel]

That's too risky.

[Ken Coleman]

We'll see. Let's go to Minneapolis now where Jacob is waiting for us. Jacob, how can we help today?

[Caller Sean]

Hi, I thank you for taking my call, first of all. Yeah, I was curious as to where I should start with my money. I recently had a change in careers or chose to change careers. And I feel a little bit lost on where to go from here.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so you change from what? Making what to what? Making what.

[Caller Sean]

So I used to be a CNC machinist making about $25 an hour. I have changed careers to. I'm going to school to become a nurse. Currently I am a CNA making about 1850 an hour.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, how soon will you be out of the schooling and then making nurse money? And what will that be?

[Caller Sean]

It should be December of 2026.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, and what will you be making?

[Caller Sean]

I believe starting in my area is anywhere from 38 to 40 an hour.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so a temporary step back in order to step forward.

[Caller Sean]

Correct.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, great. I got no problem with that. It's very strategic. Okay, so be more specific. When you said to George and I, I don't know where to start, what specifically, how can we help? Where's the area that you're not sure what to do next?

[Caller Sean]

So when I decided to change jobs, I also decided to change cities, change where I live. I live in a little bit more of an expensive area and I am completely out of debt. I have about $5,000 in my savings for an emergency fund. And I'm trying to decide, you know, at the moment I have a couple hundred dollars after the paycheck hits of room to work with and I'm not sure if I should be investing, you know, at least a little bit. I am 25 years old and I'm not sure if I should be investing that money or if I should just kind of keep stashing that away, especially since I'm in such a volatile area of my life being in school.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Great question. Are you familiar with our baby steps?

[Caller Sean]

I am, yes.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[George Camel]

So you're in baby step three. 5000 feels too tight for me for fully funded emergency fund. So I would take those few extra hundred bucks and start stashing it on top of your 5,000 until you have closer to 10 or 15, depending on what your monthly expenses are. The bigger question is, is. Sorry if I missed this. Is your entire schooling cash flowed from here on out?

[Caller Sean]

Yes. I actually qualify for a. For it to be paid for.

[George Camel]

Amazing. So, okay, that's great. I don't have to pay, so there's no fear. We're going to have to come out of pocket for school.

[Caller Lynn]

Yeah.

[Caller Sean]

Except for like, books and stuff, but I've got all the books for the rest of my time in school. I've bought all those books that I. Cash flow. That's done and over with.

[George Camel]

Then you're in a really good spot. You're cash flowing school, you're going to be going from making. You're going to double your income by December of 2026, which gives me, you know, great joy. And then you'll be moving on to investing once you have that fully funded emergency fund, which will likely happen before you finish school. And so I think we want to get you investing, but you got to get that fully funded emergency fund because right now it could take one or two emergencies to wipe out that entire savings account.

[Caller Sean]

Sure.

[George Camel]

Do you know your monthly expenses off the top of your head.

[Ken Coleman]

There?

[Caller Sean]

It kind of depends. It kind of seems like things have been popping up just about every single month lately. But anywhere from. On a normal month, I'd say anywhere from 1000 to 1200amonth. I'm very. What is your rent with My. My. My rent is actually the majority of it. Rent is about 900amonth, but I don't pay for electricity, water, Internet, none of that stuff. That stuff is paid for for me, so.

[Ken Coleman]

Why? Who?

[Caller Sean]

My parents.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

How old are you?

[Caller Sean]

25.

[Ken Coleman]

And you're married?

[Caller Sean]

No, no, I am in a relationship, but I'm not married.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. You said the girlfriend. Okay, I wasn't sure. I'm sorry. Okay. Wow. 25 years old and mom and dad are paying all your utilities. That's a sweet deal. It's a good deal if you can get it. I don't think I like it very much, but I think it's time to cut the umbilical cord.

[George Camel]

Is the agreement that this is until you get through school or longer than that?

[Caller Sean]

Yeah, yeah. Once I. Once I graduate and I'm making the money, I plan on moving out and kind of doing my own thing.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, you're living with them? I missed that Too. Okay. All right.

[George Camel]

That makes a lot more sense.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, There you go. Well, thanks for the call. I mean, you're, you're on the way. And love that you're thinking about the margin and George gave you great advice.

[George Camel]

Keep it simple. Just stack it up. Because as soon as you graduate, there's probably going to be more expenses coming your way as you start out on your own, your own adult life.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. All right, let's go to John in Pittsburgh. John, how can we help? Hey. Hi, John. We got about two and a half minutes. Hit me with your question.

[Caller Sean]

My question is, is I'm in baby step two and I just got an opportunity to move to another city. I was wondering if you guys think that's a horrible idea or.

[Ken Coleman]

Tell me about the opportunity. Is it for work?

[Caller Sean]

It is for work. I'm currently located in Pennsylvania and the opportunity would be moving me to Dallas, Fort Worth area.

[Ken Coleman]

Is it more money?

[Caller Sean]

Would be more money.

[Ken Coleman]

How much?

[Caller Sean]

Almost another 30k on top of what I'm making now.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I like that. Is it in the same industry?

[Caller Sean]

Same industry. It would be a higher position too. So doing what I'm doing now, but sort of managing people and overseeing an operation for a client.

[Ken Coleman]

Right. Do you think that sets you up to continue to climb a ladder that you've sort of envisioned? You can see continued growth as a result of this move?

[Caller Sean]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

It's a no brainer. What. What would be the reason for not saying yes and calling us to get our take?

[Caller Sean]

So I'm married. We have a son. They're attached. The son is seven.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Sean]

My wife is.

[Ken Coleman]

What's the attach.

[Caller Sean]

The school attachment. My wife just started a new job that she loves. We also have three horses here on our property that no one wants to get rid of from.

[George Camel]

Of course. Who could get rid of a horse? I can't imagine.

[Ken Coleman]

If the horses weren't the issue or your wife getting a brand new job, would you be doing this and, and, and automatically. Quick answer without it, without a doubt.

[George Camel]

Can you negotiate a relocation bonus to cover those expenses?

[Ken Coleman]

I don't think that's the issue, George. I think it's.

[George Camel]

He's getting bigger problems, Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

The wife. I think the biggest issue is this. Can his wife find a job doing something similar that she enjoys? I think that's the issue. The horses.

[George Camel]

Boy, oh boy, I'm not touching that one with a ten foot pole.

[Ken Coleman]

I will sell the horses. Sell the horses. Is that like. Oh, I forgot you've got a lot of controversy around that.

[George Camel]

It's called ptsd. Ken, I got it.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, we'll talk about the equine population during the break. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsay Show.

[Dave Ramsey]

If you need health insurance for yourself or your family, you might be lost in a maze of confusing terms, overwhelming options and questions about networks. Not to mention high costs and bad service from insurance companies that don't care about what you want. Common concerns like those are why I'm proud to recommend Health Trust Financial. They've been working with Ramsey for over 20 years and they're the only Ramsey trusted health insurance broker. Health Trust Financial takes an unbiased approach to finding you the best health insurance for your situation. They listen to your needs and because they work for you, not the insurance companies, their service is free with no obligations and no pressure. Here's the best part. Health Trust Financial customers typically save an average of $500 a month. Health Trust Financial is your one stop shop for unbiased advice about health insurance options to make sure you don't overpay. So get out of the maze by going to healthtrust financial.com today. Health trust financial.com.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Campbell. I'm Ken Coleman, triple 882-55-5225 is the number. All right, folks, for those of you who are aware of the baby steps, how you doing? How you tracking along? If you want to take a quick quiz to check your progress and receive a personalized plan, we've got it for you. All you got to do is go to the show notes, click on the link titled are you on track with the baby steps? And complete the quiz. And there's some real value in this. George, tell them why.

[George Camel]

Well, a lot of people just, you got to know where you are to know where you're going. And if it'll give you a really clear next step to take in the Ramsey plan with tools, resources, articles, you name it. And so this is a great way to just jump in. Send this link to a friend who isn't aware of us. And I gotta say, Ken, I really appreciated the Joey Tribbiani how you doing? At the very beginning, See what I did? Yeah, it really sold it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Friends, one of the greatest shows of all time. So there you go.

[George Camel]

How you doing on the baby steps? Go find out.

[Ken Coleman]

Click the link in the show how you doing? Do they have a how you doing in Boston?

[George Camel]

Yeah, it's a little more aggressive and probably has more expletives, but, you know.

[Ken Coleman]

Give me a PG version of how you doing Bostonian what's up, my guy? Okay.

[George Camel]

Something like that. Okay, I like that.

[Ken Coleman]

I like that. I like that.

[George Camel]

That's my Ben Affleck.

[Ken Coleman]

That's fantastic. You did well, by the way. By the way. Goes with the bomber jacket.

[George Camel]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

I think the accent, very tough. Yeah. Let's go to Lynn in Madison, Wisconsin. Lynn, how can we help?

[Caller Lynn]

Hi, guys. I do need your help.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, good news. We have got help to give. I mean, I can't think of two guys that are more helpful than us. So you're in. Good.

[Caller Lynn]

Well, yeah, I have. I'm hoping to get a dispute settled.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, I love dispute. Oh, it's between you and your husband.

[Caller Lynn]

It is.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, let me ask this before we get going. Is he by chance in the room with you?

[Caller Lynn]

He's not.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Lynn]

He's not. I wish he were.

[Ken Coleman]

I do, too, because I am now starting this new trend here. George, we've done this one or two times. We get both of them on the phone and.

[George Camel]

Yeah, that's more fun. Okay, we'll hear one side.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, Lynn, let's go. Let's hear your side. And his son.

[Caller Lynn]

Okay.

[George Camel]

All right.

[Caller Lynn]

Well, the question is, I want to know if I'm a Ramsey Solutions hypocrite.

[George Camel]

Oh, I'm fighting words.

[Ken Coleman]

I like how you lead off here. We'll see if you're a pharisee. Go ahead.

[Caller Lynn]

All right. All right, well, some quick background.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Caller Lynn]

This is a second marriage for both of us. We were just married this past December.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Lynn]

I'm age 58. He's age 54. We have a total of four adult children, two on each side. And I think a key thing for me was I was a single mom for 17 years, so my kids were 2 and 3 when I was divorced. And I paid maintenance and I paid child support. I carried the health care and I paid for all the incidental for my kids. I found Ramsey Solutions after a layoff that scared me to death. So the stress left me, you know, not a great place. And I. I dug into the Ramsey plan. I bought in, I listened. I did Financial Peace University, and I started with a net worth of 170,000. My life insurance was more than my net worth. So coming into the marriage, I was baby step seven with a net worth of $1.9 million.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, way to go, Lynn.

[Caller Lynn]

It was a lot of. Well, it was a lot of small vacations at the local park.

[Ken Coleman]

You're a rock star. Don't mess with Mama Bear. Lynn, listen, let's just call that out. That's hard work. Good for you.

[Caller Lynn]

Thank you. It was hard work, but it was worth it because now here I am. So baby step seven. And now my husband, he came to the marriage with a net worth of 150,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Lynn]

And he was one of those guys who never found debt. He didn't like. He had car loans, he had a boat loan, he had credit cards. He kind of had everything. And obviously, since we're married, we financially got into the same place. So I introduced him to Ramsey Solutions, gave him financial peace University. We went through that, and he's come aboard. So we've eliminated the credit card debt, the car loan, got rid of everything I wanted going into the marriage. I wanted a prenup. And this is where the dispute came.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Lynn]

And I wanted the prenup to state that if we divorced, I wanted to the 625,000 that I was putting into paying off our residence accounted for. Now, that was if we divorced. I also asked for a death clause that states that should I die, he gets the house in the entirety. And there's no splitting it with my estate or anything like that. So it's just a divorce. If there was a divorce, I wanted that accounted for, and then anything above and beyond that would be split equitably. And it's our intent that our retirement account would remain separate. So the principle of our retirement accounts would remain separate. If we draw anything out to pay for things for us, that's all commingled. And everything that all the other cash, everything would be split equally if we divorced, I wouldn't be saying like, oh, well, we paid off the car while we were married, so my cash paid that off or whatever.

[Caller Sean]

It was.

[Caller Lynn]

None of that.

[Ken Coleman]

So what specifically. What specifically is he calling hypocritical that.

[Caller Lynn]

I wanted a prenup?

[Ken Coleman]

Just a prenup. Did he have. But was he fine with certain parts of the. That agreement? You just laid out a list. Was he against all of those things?

[Caller Lynn]

All of those things? He's like, absolutely. This is ridiculous. I can't believe that you're going to have. You're going to be asking for a prenup. Once we're married, we're married, and everything should be equal. I'm like, well, it is equal. I'm just saying if we get divorced, because I've been divorced before and I'm now 58, if I split half, which Wisconsin is a 5050 state.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller Lynn]

I don't. I don't have time to recoup that again.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. And how long you Been married.

[Caller Lynn]

Two months.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm going to ask a stupid question, George, that I think you know the answer to.

[George Camel]

I may not. Try me.

[Ken Coleman]

Can you get a prenup post marriage, post nuptial? You can?

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Caller Lynn]

We have the document now. We have it now.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, so he didn't want it, but you went ahead and got it drawn up anyway?

[Caller Lynn]

Yep, we got it drawn up. He was. He got to a place where. Those were the things we agreed on. I was trying to explain, like, hey, all. We're sharing all bank accounts. We're sharing everything.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, I get all that. I get all that. So the question. So is it signed?

[Caller Lynn]

It's signed. The prenup was signed before our wedding.

[George Camel]

But he just resents you.

[Ken Coleman]

So why are you calling us again? I. So what's the dispute? It's all. This is all moot point, right?

[Caller Lynn]

No, no, I'm still a hypocrite.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, he's his words.

[Caller Lynn]

And I don't. I'm not truly into the Ramsey solutions.

[George Camel]

Okay, well, just let me free you of all of this. There's no hypocrites here. There's no Ramsay Bible that you've sinned against. Prenups are a very nuanced thing. And usually what we say is, unless there's a massive gap in net worth and yours, it truly is not like a, oh, my gosh, you're bringing millions and millions in. You have a family business. There's massive generational wealth here. We're talking about someone who prepared for retirement and someone who's just getting started. And it sounds like he's on the same page. You're on the same plan now, so you're on the edge of, like, is this even necessary? But I understand with your backstory that you're just going, hey, I just can't be left out in a lurch, you know, not unable to retire. Something were to happen. So I think you both need to go to counseling and deal with the underlying trust and communication issues. But there's no hypocrites here. You did nothing wrong, quote, unquote. So let me release you of that. That no one's gonna quote.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, we don't have, like, a blanket policy on that.

[George Camel]

No, it's just most people don't need one.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

And the guy goes, well, I'll make 40 grand, and she makes 20. I need. No, dude, you don't need a prenup.

[Ken Coleman]

This is.

[George Camel]

We're talking about protecting your stuff from the crazy family around you, not from each other.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, and had you called Us. Had you called us before you got it signed, I would have said same thing that George said. But I would have said I personally would not do one because I feel like a prenup is an acknowledgment that we could finish this thing and end this thing. And I'm not judging anybody that's been divorced. I want everybody to hear this. I'm not judging anybody. Okay? I am blessed to come from. My wife and I both come from families where our parents have been married over 50 years. So we have a heritage that we inherit. We inherit. We saw it. And when Stacy and I got married, there was no out. And we've been married 27 years. And there have been times it's been very, very hard. There's no out now. That's our position. I'm not prescribing that to anybody. I'm not proselytizing today, but I would say that I would have said ahead of time. I want you to go to counseling because you've got some very natural fears, Lynn. And I understand. I'm empathetic to go. If I were in your shoes, I could see where you could get to that point. Want to protect yourself. You've been burned, but so is he. And I think that this should have been counseling on the front end. You should not have forced this. I'm going to say something crazy here. If it were me, I'd tear it up and then I'd go to counseling. I think you forced the issue on this, and I think you got to redo it. That's what I would do. Oh, boy, here come the hate mail. This is the Ramsey Show.

[George Camel]

Hey, guys. I'm Jade Warshaw, and I want to talk to you for a quick second about student loan refinancing. If your payment and your interest rate are burying you and you feel like you can't dig out, refinancing your student loan debt might make sense. That's because a lower rate could free up more money in your budget, and a shorter term could help you pay down your debt faster. So reach out to the student loan refinancing experts today@l Laurelroad.com Ramsey There you'll find helpful resources like a student loan rate table, a refinancing calculator, and other tools. Plus, you can get an initial rate in just a few minutes. Laurel Road offers low competitive rates starting under 5%. And you can get your interest rate even lower if you sign up for autopay. But if your situation is more complex, sign up for a free 30 minute consultation with one of their student loan refinancing experts to get your tough questions answered. Listen, not everybody should refinance their student loan. So make sure you run the numbers. But for some people it is the right move. Learn more@l Laurelroad.com Ramsey to find out more about their student loan refinancing. That's LaurelRoad.com Ramsey Laurel Road is a brand of Key Bank National Association. All credit products are subject to credit approval.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome aboard. This is where we help you, America, win in your life. We're gonna help you win with your money, win in your profession and win with your relationships. Triple 882-55-5225 is the phone number. Triple 882-55-2225. I'm Ken Coleman. He's George Camel and he may have the best beard in all of YouTube.

[George Camel]

Now you're just trying to entertain me, but I appreciate that.

[Ken Coleman]

No, I mean you gotta, it's. But it's well coiffed.

[George Camel]

I guess in the YouTube world they can't grow facial hair. So I'll take that.

[Ken Coleman]

Is that right? Yeah. You know, I'm making this stuff up.

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

The fact that you fact checked me on that is, you know, it's just a nice little.

[George Camel]

I appreciate that. And you got a good 5:00 shout out.

[Ken Coleman]

Throw a little something positive your way, you know, I mean, it was a compliment.

[George Camel]

That's the kind of friendship we have.

[Ken Coleman]

You couldn't receive it. I was just trying to say something nice about you.

[George Camel]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

Let me restate it alongside George Campbell, the man with the best bomber jacket collection and all of. Now we're talking content.

[George Camel]

That's that Ken Coleman I know and love.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, so you'll receive that one.

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. I, I mean I can't grow a beard.

[George Camel]

I can choose what I receive. All right, well, I have agency you.

[Ken Coleman]

Figured out by now we like to have fun while we help you out because there's breakthrough on the other side of these calls. So let's get to it. Julie is in Tampa, Florida. Julie, how can we help today?

[Caller Julie]

Hi, how's it going?

[Ken Coleman]

Good, how are you, Julie?

[Caller Julie]

Oh, thank you for taking my call. I prayed and God put you guys, I'm like, I'm just gonna go to the top. My pastor's kid here, so.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, hey, you're talking to a pastor's kid.

[Caller Julie]

Yeah, I didn't know. I'm like, do I go to my dad, my brother in law? I'm like, no, I'm just gonna Go straight to the top and about money and call them. So. Thank you.

[George Camel]

That's brave. I'm glad you made it through.

[Ken Coleman]

So you're here for a reason. What's going on? Julie, Lay it on us.

[Caller Julie]

All right.

[George Camel]

I can feel the weight that's on you.

[Ken Coleman]

I can, too. I'm really interested about what's coming our way here. Okay, Go. Julie.

[Caller Julie]

I just got through a pretty major health crisis that could have killed me. Major surgery. I think we stopped counting it. 17 hospital stays last year.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, my goodness.

[Caller Lynn]

Julie.

[Caller Julie]

So. And then I had complications and was admitted four more times. The problem is my parents have taken on some of the medical debt, and we had to move in with them while this has been going on. Now we owe them 50,000. I don't know, about 16 months ago, we decided to do the financial piece, you know, the Dave Ramsey program, which I refused to do because you reminded me so much of my debt. I didn't want to do it. I'm like, no, it's dad telling me what to do. But we paid off almost 28,000 already and medical debt, so it works. And we have our thousand in our checking account, and we're doing snowball.

[George Camel]

How much is left now?

[Caller Julie]

So now all that's left is my. My mom and dad put 50 grand on, like six 0% credit cards, and they're coming up to expire and go to 30%. They're afraid they're going to lose their house.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness. Why would they take this on?

[Caller Julie]

It was.

[George Camel]

Why couldn't you just go through the hospital to pay them and be in debt to the hospital where you could actually negotiate?

[Caller Julie]

And it was part dental and cars. It was a little bit of cars, dental and medical, those three things. And my dad swoops in and help. Big heart, you know, driving me to appointments. And my husband's working. Just a lot of love. But we all agree we made a terrible mistake. We should have never combined it. And now here we are, and we. My husband, he. We've been married 25 years, and he has never been sick, never been a doctor, and he works a very, very dangerous job. There's been two deaths out at the plant in the last six months. And he fell with extremely high blood pressure and was put on. What is that? Temporary disability for six weeks. So he's struggling with his health, and he doesn't. My question to you is, this is where the rift is with my parents. He doesn't know why we can't move out. Continue. Dave Ramsey, which we have a Track record of doing it and be on our own. Heal. It's a lot better for him with the rotating graveyards to have a quiet dark room. Right now we're in a small house. One little noise.

[Ken Coleman]

Why can't you move out? Julie?

[Caller Julie]

My dad's like, if you move out and you're not going to be able to do these. He wants us to do his plan. I want to do Dave.

[Ken Coleman]

What's it.

[George Camel]

What? It's your dad.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm going to go back to this. Hold on a second. Before we even get. I don't even care about dad's plan because we're going to get lost in details that don't matter. You called, you wanted our help. I'm going to ask the question again. Why can't you and your husband move out?

[Caller Julie]

My dad wants us to stay until the debt's paid back to him.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I'm going to ask it a third time. I'm going to ask it a third time and you're going to see where I'm going. Why can't you and your husband move out of your parents house?

[Caller Julie]

We can. We can afford both.

[Ken Coleman]

Then that's what I'm getting at. Thank you, sir. In the lobby, he was tracking with me. It took three times. Julie, but listen. This is why you called my parents? No, no, listen.

[George Camel]

There it is. That's the real reason.

[Ken Coleman]

That's the real reason. And you have a lot of respect for your dad. You also feel a massive amount of guilt. The heaviness that George. The heaviness that George felt at the top of the call is guilt. Yeah, well, I got news for you. Well, I got news for you. You've done nothing illegal. You've done nothing unethical.

[Caller Julie]

It just happened to me.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah, but you guys did some nonsensical things with the credit card money.

[Caller Julie]

Stuff was really.

[Ken Coleman]

But here's the deal. Your dad doesn't get to tell you what to do. You guys have been married 25 years. How old are you?

[Caller Julie]

Yeah, I'm 47. My husband's 51 and he hit. My husband's telling my father. We have a meeting tomorrow. So this call is perfect timing. They don't talk about it.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you. Are you holding your husband up? In other words, if you had already given him the green light, would he have already moved you guys out?

[Caller Julie]

Yeah, I think I'm part of the problem. Maybe because I'm so concerned about my parents and I think my dad's living in the what if will Covid happen.

[Ken Coleman]

It's not his life. George, I want to bring you in here. I've been. I'm just.

[George Camel]

Here's the deal. Your dad decided to take on that credit card debt in his own name. That's on him. And so he cannot guilt you or manipulate you into doing anything. So have a written agreement of how we're going to pay this back, and it's going to have nothing to do with your living arrangements. He's holding you in a prison.

[Ken Coleman]

You know what's going to happen?

[Caller Julie]

Miserable.

[Ken Coleman]

You know what's going to happen? You're going to end up hurting your husband while trying not to hurt your dad.

[Caller Julie]

Well, that's my fear is because my husband. His blood pressure because of the stress of the job. Just imagine an oil rig that on land. It's so dangerous.

[Ken Coleman]

Julie, Julie, Julie, Julie.

[George Camel]

You're taking on the weight of the world.

[Ken Coleman]

Julie, stop. God bless you. I want to give you a hug. I don't want you to feel me criticizing you, but I want you to hear.

[Caller Julie]

Oh, I can take it.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, no, no, no. Listen, I'm not. I'm not criticizing you, but I'm trying to be so blunt with you. Your husband needs you to support him.

[Caller Julie]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Period. There is nothing else.

[Caller Julie]

I want to lose my husband.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, then move then.

[George Camel]

He needs a new job, and that's going to be a new chapter for you guys.

[Ken Coleman]

I wish we could call him right.

[Caller Julie]

Now and tell him he's here right now.

[Ken Coleman]

He is.

[Caller Lynn]

Yeah.

[Caller Julie]

You want to say hi to Jake?

[George Camel]

Jake?

[Ken Coleman]

Jake, can you hear us?

[Caller Sean]

Hey, guys, how are you doing?

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, Jake. Julie wants to support you, so you got to make the man move now. We just talked to her about it. We told her she. She's got to follow you. She wants to follow you, but she's also trying not to hurt dad. So now it's time for you to go. Babe, it's gonna be okay. I'll support you dealing with whatever Dad's going to throw at you, but we are going to leave.

[George Camel]

And, Cleave, we got plans tonight. We're going to Home Depot, we're buying some boxes, and we're going out.

[Ken Coleman]

And by the way, not ask you permission. Are you willing to lead? Sir, yes, sir.

[Caller Sean]

Well, and that's been the whole challenge.

[Ken Coleman]

No, no, we got to go. I'm so sorry. I got a commercial break. I'm not being rude, Lead. Go get the boxes. Now.

[Caller Lynn]

You know how when you go against what society thinks is, quote, normal, like avoiding debt, it feels weird at first? Well, I'm here to tell you that is okay. I want you to be weird if that means you're being intentional, including how you budget. And one way to be intentional about how you spend your healthcare dollars is with Christian healthcare ministries. CHM isn't health insurance. They're a biblically based alternative. CHM is a health cost sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families take care of healthcare costs without sacrificing their freedom. As a CHM member, you'll share 100% of your eligible healthcare costs with a dedicated Christian community. And in return, your monthly contribution goes towards other members medical costs. So no matter where you are in your financial journey, CHM can help you reach your money goals and still get the care you need. Plus, programs start as low as $98 a month. So go to chministries.orgbudget to find out more. That's chministries.orgbudget running a business is freaking hard.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's easy to get caught up in the daily challenges and fears that keep you stuck. That's why I want you to reserve your copy of our new book, Build a Business yous Love. Where we share the proven system that helped us break through those challenges and build Ramsey Solutions. From a card table in my living room to a $250 million company in the process. When you pre order today, you're going to get more than $350 in bonuses for free, including an enhanced audiobook experience, early access to the build a business you love ebook, and instant access to our hiring playbook so you can start transforming your business right now. Build a business you love. The essential guide for every business owner like you that wants to grow yourself, lead your team and scale your business. To reserve your copy, go to ramseysolutions.com store ramseysolutions.com store.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey show alongside George Camel. I'm Ken Coleman and it's Camel and Coleman. That's.

[George Camel]

That's a law firm you'd hire right there.

[Caller Sean]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

That is, isn't it? What would we specialize in, you think?

[George Camel]

Probably personal injury would be on like the park benches, buses, you know, real.

[Ken Coleman]

Better call us doing commercials together. Talking about. Call us, you know, like that whole. It's so smarmy.

[George Camel]

Yeah, we'd be very smarmy.

[Ken Coleman]

I think we would.

[George Camel]

And that's the vibe we put off.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right. Tyler is in Dallas, Texas. Let's go to Tyler. Tyler, how can we have.

[Caller Sean]

Hey guys, how's it going?

[Ken Coleman]

Good. What's going on?

[Caller Sean]

So I'm in a position Or a predicament, I guess you could call it. I have two job opportunities. One, being a former employer that I was laid off with. Workforce reduction and a new job. Both have benefits and, you know, both have a downside to them. And me and my fiance were just kind of stuck in the middle of which one it would be best. And I'm just trying to seek out some advice, maybe an opinion of what you think would be best.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, great. So give us the pros of. We'll call it job number one, and let's go with. That's going back to your previous employer. Did I understand that right?

[Caller Rob]

Yes, sir.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so give me the. Give me the pros of going back there.

[Caller Sean]

So the pros for that one are. Is going to be the, the pay. The pay is significantly. It's about 40. 40 to 50,000 more a year.

[George Camel]

What's the total pay?

[Caller Sean]

Well, it's hourly, but like I said, it was previous, so I cleared about a hundred, 110.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller Sean]

I was there.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller Sean]

And they. The retirement is also really good. The benefits are about the same for each, but one of them doesn't have a pension and my former employer does.

[Ken Coleman]

So that's what you mean when you say the retirement's really good, is the pension program.

[Caller Sean]

Yes, sir.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. What's the second job? What's the difference in pay?

[Caller Sean]

Difference in pay? I'll probably making close to 70 there. 60 to 70. And another thing is the shift difference. So that, that's a big one. We. We have two kids and our third's on the way. And that's kind of.

[Ken Coleman]

Where is it the same industry?

[Caller Sean]

It's a little different. Previous job was manufacturing automobiles, and then the new job would be repair and maintenance on aircrafts.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And you're torn between this. I mean, this is a massive pay difference. The shift. To me, shifts can shift. Sorry for being cheesy, but it's not like you're stuck in that shift forever. But my goodness, you're talking about the difference between 110k and 70k.

[Caller Sean]

Yeah, and there's. There's one more thing. So the. My previous employer, they don't. They won't pay for, like, school or anything like that. Like, they have some certain programs that they'll cover, but this new job, starting day one, they'll pay all tuition for any school I want to do.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so where do you want to end up now? This changes the entire conversation for me. Where do you want to be 10 years, 15, 20 years from now? What are you doing professionally?

[Caller Sean]

I want to have my own business doing what? So more than likely construction.

[Ken Coleman]

And would the degree that this second option would be willing to pay for, would that be a absolute must to get into construction?

[Caller Sean]

I see that there's benefits for it.

[Ken Coleman]

I didn't ask you that. I didn't ask you that. So let me put it this way. My policy on any degree has always been and will always be, this is the degree. I don't care if it's undergrad or grad. Is it the only way to do what you want to do, or is it the best way to do what you want to do? So answer the question that way.

[Caller Sean]

No.

[Ken Coleman]

Then don't freaking do it. It is wasted time. Which is our greatest asset as humans is time, and it's wasted money. So, man, I just saved you a lot of time and money.

[George Camel]

And with three kids, is your wife working outside the home or. She went home with the kiddos.

[Caller Sean]

She's at home. She works from home.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

I would not take the new job. I'd go back to the previous employer.

[George Camel]

Yeah. There's not enough pluses on this new one to take it.

[Ken Coleman]

Which way were you leaning?

[Caller Sean]

Well, I was kind of in the middle because, I mean, I know you weren't.

[Ken Coleman]

No, you were not. You know, it's impossible to be in the middle. There was a way that you were leaning before you made the call. Which way were you leaning? You couldn't get a hold of us, and they had to. And you had to make a decision in two minutes, and you're on the phone and they go, I can't get you in with Ken and George today. And you got to give an answer. Which. Which way were you leaning? Tell the truth.

[Caller Sean]

Probably the money.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Because you got a brain and you got people who rely on you, and the money in this equation sets you up better to be a business owner than this degree does.

[George Camel]

The construction business is an expensive business to get into.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[George Camel]

A lot of cash.

[Ken Coleman]

A lot of cushion, too. You know, you have fat emergency fund. You need no debt. And George take it away on the pension thing, too, because we don't want him just relying on that pension. I want to bring you into that.

[George Camel]

Pensions, over time have way underperformed the market. And so I know it sounds alluring because it's like, well, it's guaranteed income, but you can do better investing on your own in any company retirement plan. So I would not make the decision just for the pension alone. That's a fine byproduct if they have it. But I would not make your decision based on that. And then financially, are you guys in a good spot? Do you have any debt? Do you have an emergency fund?

[Caller Sean]

So yeah, we have an emergency fund. We have about two and a half months in that debt. We have just her vehicle left. We've got everything, pretty much what's left in her vehicle. Say it again.

[George Camel]

What's left on her vehicle?

[Caller Sean]

30. 30,000.

[George Camel]

And how much do you have in.

[Caller Sean]

Savings for our personal savings or the.

[George Camel]

All liquid cash you have access to, including the emergency fund, probably 8,000. Okay, we've got some work to do here. If you're going to follow the Ramsey plan, we got to knock out this car loan before we're working on that emergency fund. But you also told me you have a baby, a third baby on the way.

[Caller Sean]

Yes, sir.

[George Camel]

So let's pause and stack up cash. But as soon as baby and mommy are home healthy, let's push play and dump that savings into the car. If you do decide to keep it, you may decide to sell it, but that's, you know, your income supports having a $30,000 car, but not a $30,000 car loan. That's a lot.

[Ken Coleman]

So George and I have, we've spoken. You take the better paying job because of the long term play here. And man, I just want to reiterate this. There's a, there's a, there's a really handsome guy out in the lobby that was shaking his head when I was giving my little Is it the only way or is it the best way degree thing. I want to just reemphasize that because I know that's new to people in the show and, and I have found, because I've coached 10000 people on this very issue. Ken, should I get a degree? Should, should I. What should I do to grow in my, my professional development? And the degree is it. When it is the only way, it's a no brainer. When it's the best way, it's still a no brainer. But you may need to be patient. But this idea that, well, this I can go get a degree and they pay for it. And now I got this degree and all of a sudden, you know, this piece of paper, you know, I can, I can see it, it's a degree.

[George Camel]

People think it's like a Willy Wonka golden ticket Loma.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And it does not guarantee success. And I just can't say it enough, George, because this comes back to Borrowed Future. This comes back to some of the podcasts that you've done I mean, this is what you talk about traps. In your book Breaking Free from Broke.

[George Camel]

I have a whole chapter on student loans, and I quote your very is it the only way? Is it the best way? Because it's a trap so many kids fall into because they think, well, this is the only path. If I don't go to college, I'm gonna be destitute in my little town and never make it anything for myself. And the truth is, I see more people who took on crippling student loan debt for a degree they didn't care about, that had no real marketplace value, they had no passion in, and now they're left picking up the pieces, working a job because they have to, to make the payment. Yeah, this is the insanity. This is the loop. Let's go to college to get a job, to pay off the loans with a job.

[Ken Coleman]

And it's sold to us as it sucks, but you gotta do it. No. Getting a student loan or going to get a degree that you can't afford is not like going to the dentist. You gotta go to the dentist. You don't have to go to college. And I just think that that's the cultural message here. And I think it's slowly eroding as we see the crazy compound of student loan debt.

[George Camel]

So that's why people are going to the trades or starting small businesses, because they're going, I don't want to be like that guy. 150 grand in student loan debt, nothing to show for it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that's crazy. Do you floss regularly, George?

[George Camel]

Three times a day.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you?

[George Camel]

Yeah, probably too much.

[Ken Coleman]

I want to learn more about.

[George Camel]

Very offensive. My dentist asked, do you floss? Can you not tell doing it so much, man.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow. I'll learn more about your flossing technique on the break. Thank you. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. You've probably heard people talk about different kinds of flags in friendships and romantic relationships. Red flags, green flags, beige flags. Listen, it can be helpful to look for patterns or unsafe behaviors in potential relationships. But all those labels can distract from what's really important. Your values. And whether you and your potential partner are willing to wake up every day and choose to honor each other's values. And look, I know it can be tough sometimes to even know what's important to you in a relationship. Therapy can help you figure out what your values actually are and decide your boundaries and your non negotiables. And if you're thinking about starting therapy. Try BetterHelp. BetterHelp is a hundred percent online therapy that works with your schedule. To get started, just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist. If it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. So whether you're dating, married, building a friendship, or working on yourself, do it with help from BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com ramseyradio to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E L P.com ramseyradio People ask.

[George Camel]

Me all the time, George, what's your number one money saving hack? I'm glad you asked. Nothing makes me happier than helping another frugal friend. So here's the hack. Get on a budget. Seriously, how are you supposed to save money if you don't know how much you're spending in the first place? And that's what makes the EveryDollar budgeting app a game changer. With EveryDollar, you'll get a clear picture of your spending and from there it's easy to see where you can get more intentional cut back, save more money. So how much money are we talking here? Well, the average EveryDollar budgeter frees up $395 in their first budget. That's the hack. And if you ask me, I think you're way above average and you'll save even more. So what are you doing still listening to me? Go download the EveryDollar app for free and start saving more money right now.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell is with me. This is your show 888-882-55-5225. George is going to coach you up on how to save and invest your money and I'm going to coach you up on how to make more money. So that is the combo today. Time for our Ramsey show question of the day brought to you by why refi? When the payment on your defaulted private student loan is as much as some mortgages, it's hard to get ahead. That's why, when why refi. And it's actually when why refi can help refinancing to a low fixed rate loan built just for you. Find out [e-mail] Ramsey that's the letter y r e f y.com Ramsey it may not be available in all states.

[George Camel]

Today's question comes from Kyle in Colorado. I'm 30 years old and earn around $200,000 per year. I owe 255,000 on my house and 50,000 on my vehicle. I max out my 401k every year with a current balance of 150,000. I also have a Robinhood account with roughly 15,000 in it and invest 500 there every month. Cash on hand is around 20,000. I'm wondering if it's better to invest in the stock market or pay off my truck and home before considering any other investments outside of my 401k and monthly contributions to Robinhood.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, he's almost there.

[George Camel]

Yeah, at least he's questioning his decisions. That's a good start to wonder if you're even doing it the right way. So here's the truth, Kyle. You can do what you want. You have an amazing salary. You can out earn your stupidity for a long time and afford that payment for as long as you want, my friend. But if I'm in your shoes, I'm following the Ramsey plan. I'm going to get rid of that vehicle asap. It's not too much for your income, so if you want to keep it and pay it off aggressively, I would. My guess is your Robin hood account of 15,000 is not retirement. So you could cash that out along with your 20k on hand, and that'll get your loan down to about 15,000 and making 200,000. That thing's done within, what, 90 days or less. Your. Your vehicle loan is gone. Now, regarding the house, would I put extra on the house? I would be on 15 of your income. And so if you're talking about 200, 000, that means 30, 000 a year going into retirement accounts. That means you could max out a Roth 401K. You could do a backdoor Roth IRA, and that would get you to that 30K and then you can move on from there. Two, paying off the house with any extra money beyond that, which you should have plenty of when you free up that 50, 000 vehicle loan payment. Goodness.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Probably an 8, $900 payment right there, if not more. So that'll free you up to start throwing that on the mortgage and get you on track for the baby steps.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I love the advice. Couldn't agree more. I mean, he's putting 500amonth in the Robinhood account. So if we just start moving that over as well to the truck.

[George Camel]

That's going to be gone soon.

[Ken Coleman]

So he's going to knock the truck out quick and then. Then you start working on the house.

[George Camel]

Yeah, he's probably taken home 13, 14,000amonth. And so you could, if you Just get on a real bare bones budget. You could knock that vehicle out in probably two months if you got serious.

[Ken Coleman]

I love that.

[George Camel]

I like this plan.

[Ken Coleman]

I like it. Thanks for the question. All right, back to the phones we go. 888-825-5 225. Andrew is in Austin, Texas. Andrew, how can we help?

[Caller Sean]

Hi, thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure. What's going on?

[Caller Sean]

Yeah, so back when I was going to college, my parents and I took out student loans to pay for them. When taking out the loans, there was no conversation about me having any responsibility for the parent portion of the lo. Now, six years later, my parents are blaming my sisters and I for not having any money in retirement and for filing bankruptcy and saying that after all of that we are going to have to take over the loans because they shouldn't have to worry about that this time in their lives. And I told them no, but that caused a bunch of arguments and I suggested family counseling and that was rejected to. And I guess just want to know, are we in the wrong? Having tried to help them, it seems like they have no willingness to change and letting money come between the family.

[George Camel]

Now what they've done is gross to put that on you. You are not the solution to their financial mess. And they're just in a real pickle and looking at their pile of debts going, well, if the kids didn't cause all of this harm to us, we would be in a very different place. The truth is they have been reckless for a long time with their money. They didn't have a conversation about what was going to happen with college and student loans. They decided to take on all of the debt in their name only with this parent plus loan with crazy high interest. And now they want to pin it on you when they're in a bind. I'm not buying it. And I'm guessing the relationship with your parents has not been great for a long time.

[Caller Sean]

That is correct. Yes.

[George Camel]

It's been transactional and very well, look at what we did for you and this is what you have to do for us. And I'm also guessing there is a lot more debt laying around here than just these parent plus loans.

[Caller Sean]

As far as I know. Yes. You know, they never, they're never open about it, so I wouldn't know for sure. But the bankruptcy wouldn't even.

[George Camel]

Yeah, bankruptcy does not discharge student loans.

[Caller Sean]

Right. So why would they do it if it was only the student loans?

[George Camel]

Exactly. Do you know anything about their financial picture?

[Caller Sean]

I don't know. Exactly. No, they've never been open about it.

[Ken Coleman]

This is just so warped, the way you describe this. I just think you need such clear and very high boundaries that are in stone, like concrete boundaries, not. Not flexible, plastic fencing boundaries. This is just so weird. And I think there needs to be a real clear, clean, brown boundary established and walk away from this nonsense. Because this isn't just coming at you. They're coming at your sisters too. You said so. This is so unhealthy. And so. And I use the word warped on purpose.

[Dave Ramsey]

I.

[Ken Coleman]

You gotta make a clean cut for now and hope for healing, you know, hope for. For something, but there's nothing you can do anyway, so then putting this guilt trip on you because they're desperate and I. And I. And I'm not. I don't want to be too critical, George, of the parents. It is warped. It's crazy unhealthy. But they are hurting and they're desperate. This. This smells of desperation.

[George Camel]

That's usually when you go to blame everyone else, is when you're backed into a corner like this. And so the best thing you can do is be kind, be firm, be respectful, set the boundary and let them know, hey, listen, I'm not in a position to pay this back. We never had this conversation. There's nothing in writing saying that we were gonna be obligated to pay this debt. You guys decided this is how we're going to help and, quote, pay for school. And therefore it's your responsibility. And if you're in a position to help, if you're going, hey, we got the money sitting in savings, and we want to morally do this, that's fine, but you have no legal responsibility to pay this back. And I wouldn't let them guilt trip you into saying, well, if mom and dad are going to be homeless unless you. You foot the bill, I'm not buying that either.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I agree. That's. It just feels so manipulative. Let's see if we can get Eric in. Eric is in Atlanta, Georgia. Eric, how can we help?

[Caller Sean]

Hey, how are you guys doing?

[Ken Coleman]

Good. What's going on today?

[Caller Sean]

Hey, so I have a pretty personal question here. So I would say I'm pretty far well off in terms of financial stability. My question is if I should save for an extra rainy day in that extra rainy day meaning marriage and future kids, most likely. Or should I be a little bit more selfish with my spending and just kind of boost my own standards of living?

[George Camel]

Well, I want to release you from the selfishness. Let's find option C where it's not save for a fictitious family. I don't know what we're saving for or save for me to buy a nice car. What's going on financially with you? Do you have a bunch of money laying around?

[Caller Sean]

Well, let's see. My net worth is right around 350,000. Okay. I already have a house that's already paid off as well.

[George Camel]

Amazing. And you got an emergency fund.

[Caller Sean]

The emergency fund is pretty much whatever is in my high yield.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

How much is there?

[Caller Sean]

200,000.

[George Camel]

$200,000?

[Caller Lynn]

Yeah.

[Caller Sean]

That's what I put in my high yield savings for the maximum ROI on interest.

[George Camel]

Okay, but what do we. I like money to have a goal, and that is way beyond a six month emergency fund for you. And so what would be your next goal? Are you saying, hey, I don't really have one. I have a paid for house. Are you investing 15% or more of your income at this point?

[Caller Sean]

Yeah, 15% is already invested in some retirement funds each year.

[George Camel]

Okay. You sound like you are the eternal saver. And so it might be time to upgrade some things in your life. Reasonably, we're paying cash. We're not going to have this be a large portion of our world. But if you want to buy a few nice toys, go for it.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, but he's in such a position that I'm not worried about him having money for a future family.

[George Camel]

Yeah, you're fine. It's a line item in the budget. A family doesn't show up and you go, I need $100,000. It's just a line item. That's true for a ring, for a wedding. And you'll have the savings ready to go, my friend. I'd get out there. I'd get out of the house and start meeting some people, maybe find a nice lady.

[Ken Coleman]

There we go. All right, this is the Ramsey Show. We'll come up with a dating plan for Eric's life on the break.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey, guys. Our two night virtual event, Investing Essentials is almost here. There's a lot of confusion out there about building wealth, so George Campbell and I are breaking it down and teaching you how to invest with conf. Learn how to maximize your 401k and mutual funds. Plus, I'll be sharing my personal playbook for real estate. But hurry, time's running out. Investing Essentials is March 4th and 5th. Tickets start at 1:99. Grab yours [e-mail] events.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, folks, welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. George Campbell is alongside me. You know, money and relationships are two of the most important parts of our life and a lot of stress, a lot of conflict around those two areas. But you can win in your money and your relationships. But if you need some help, we've got a new tour, the Money and Relationships Tour. Very creative. I wonder how long, how long the.

[George Camel]

Team, sadly, they probably came up with 17 cool names and then decided, let's just make it clear.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. The Money and Relationships Tour. It's Dave Ramsey and John Deloney hitting the road for six nights. And they're going to be taking on all topics. They're going to be taking questions, going to be kind of live and unscripted, unfiltered, raising money, smart kids, how to fight fairly in marriage, finding contentment. The cities are Louisville on April 21, Durham, North Carolina, April 23. Atlanta, Georgia, April 25, Phoenix, May 5. Fort Worth, Texas on May 7, Kansas City on May 9. You don't want to miss this. Go to ramseysolutions.com tour ramseysolutions.com tour and if you're listening via podcast or you're watching on YouTube, click on the link in the show notes. Which, by the way, I should say the show notes are a Trevor treasure trove. I should say I didn't say it well, but I did say it. The show gems, hidden gem, anything we talk about. If you didn't catch it and you're on podcast or YouTube, go to the show notes and we've got a link for you. All right, Jordan's up next in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Jordan, how can we help today?

[Caller Sean]

Happy Friday, guys. How are you guys doing?

[Ken Coleman]

Happy Friday, Sir.

[Caller Sean]

So I'm 26. I have a house that's paid off. Me and my fiance have minimal to no debt, probably the maximum we have. I have around 1100. She has around like 14 to 1500 dollars in debt. I started trading options about 5 years ago. Wasn't successful. Sort of sat down for the past two years, three years, researching, studying markets. You guys are king of investing. So I wanted to get your advice on it. I started about four or five weeks ago with $660 and my account is now sitting at $4,800 and $200. So I don't know if I should continue with the strategy that I'm using of trading options or do I move to a different strategy.

[George Camel]

Well, you've called the right show and the wrong show. You're not going to like what I tell you to do and you probably won't do it. I would tell you to stop Day trading immediately and focus on long term wealth building through your normal day job income. Do you have a normal day job?

[Caller Sean]

Yeah. So that's actually what got me back into trading because I started this current position I'm at, I work for 12 a week, so it gives me two to three days to day trade. I'm currently making 42, 35 an hour, I believe it is, or 3240.

[George Camel]

Okay, so you're making about 85 grand a year if you're doing that 40 hours a week. You said you're doing 48 hours a week, so it's probably a little more than that.

[Caller Sean]

Correct.

[George Camel]

Okay. And what makes you go, I need more? Clearly you're enjoying doing this and you haven't been burned by it yet, Correct? Okay. Let me tell you though.

[Caller Sean]

No, I, I have been burned the first two years. I want to say I've lost close to four to $5,000 within the first two years.

[George Camel]

Okay, so here's the stat and you fell perfectly into it. 97% of day traders who persisted for more than 300 days lost money. And many people go borrow money to make trades, going into debt to leverage. Right. And we've taken some gut wrenching calls in the Ramsey show from people who have lost 30 grand, 150 grand, even $300,000 by day trading. And it breaks my heart. And here's the problem. It's easy to feel like you're the exception when you're winning.

[Caller Sean]

Correct.

[George Camel]

And it's easy to go, well, it's always going to be, I'm good at this. It's just gambling at the end of the day. And if you do your research, it's just researched gambling, which still has a lot of risk. And I'm with Dave Ramsey on this. I just hate losing money. And so the easiest way to avoid that is to not gamble it. And so what I do is I invest into retirement plans. If I want to invest outside of that, I would invest into an index fund and a taxable brokerage account and call it a day. And so I would focus on. Yeah, because I don't. Here's the problem. You're spending hours and hours of week staring at these screens trying to time the market. And instead the better thing to do is instead of timing the market is just have time in the market through compound growth and a long term strategy. This is the tortoise beats the hair. You've heard that.

[Caller Sean]

I've heard that. I've also heard the whole gambling, it's short money gains don't get into it. You might win now, but you're gonna lose it all later.

[George Camel]

Yeah, And I don't think it's worth the mental calories. I don't think it's worth the stress, the anxiety, the risk. Our plan is all about peace. You've heard it. Financial peace. And so can I tell you how many times I've thought about my investments over the last six months? Zero. I go up, market's down. All right, I'm gonna go get a coffee. I just don't care because I'm investing for the long term. And if you're investing for a shorter term purchase, like real estate, just park it in an index fund, let it ride. That's what Dave does. And when he finds a good piece of property, he'll cash out enough to buy the property. But I would never encourage anyone to do single stocks or even a single crypto coin. And day trading falls squarely in that with even more, because now it's a whole career you can make out of it of saying, I'm a day trader. And so, you know, I heard this. You're too smart to do this stuff.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, I heard all the news this morning. Got to get your quick take on it.

[George Camel]

What's that?

[Ken Coleman]

There is now there is a crypto bar in New York City.

[George Camel]

Oh, I have heard about this.

[Ken Coleman]

Have you heard this?

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And I was thinking of you. I heard it. I was like, I wonder what George knows about this. So I guess I'll tell you.

[George Camel]

It's the worst place to meet a woman because you won't find one in there.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

And if you just want to hang out with other.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Stuart Varney was asking. This was on Fox Businesses. Stuart Varney was asking the. The. His female co host who was talking about it. He's like, can you pay for your beer with crypto? And she's like, yeah. And she's like, you wouldn't know how to do it, you know? So I guess Stuart is not jumped on the crypto train, but very interesting.

[George Camel]

Yeah. A crypto bar. I've got a dark curiosity.

[Ken Coleman]

She said it's full of crypto enthusiasts.

[George Camel]

Oh, wow.

[Ken Coleman]

So there you go. So my point is, next time you're in New York doing media, I think you should buy. Do that for TikTok and Instagram. Just do a little drop in.

[George Camel]

Just see if anyone starts filming me saying, I saw George at a crypto bar.

[Ken Coleman]

Mm.

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that could be fun.

[George Camel]

No, thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, let's go to Sarah in Denver, Colorado. Sarah how can we help?

[Caller Sean]

Hi.

[Caller Lynn]

I'm excited to talk to my money heroes. How are you?

[George Camel]

Wow, you're a money hero.

[Ken Coleman]

Second, let me put my cape over the chair here. There it is. There it goes. How can we help?

[Caller Julie]

So my husband and I are in.

[Caller Lynn]

Our 40s, and we're doing great for ourselves. We're maxing out 401ks and IRAs, and we're paying off the house with double payments.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow.

[Caller Lynn]

And we're kind of deciding, trying to decide what to do going forward, you know, once everything's paid off and exploring some options to help our adult kids. So one of the things that we thought about was encouraging them to save even more for themselves and offering them the possibility of maybe if they put forth a third of their Roth max for a year, would we double that and give them the other 2/3? I guess I just wanted to find out what you guys thought about that.

[George Camel]

Yeah. So essentially, you want to gift your children money to help set them up for success and wealth down the road. And there's a lot of ways to do that. How old are the children?

[Caller Lynn]

They are 23 and 24.

[George Camel]

Wonderful. And they're all working full time, gainfully employed there?

[Caller Lynn]

Well, there's one that's doing a little better than the other, employment wise, you know, money wise. And they're still learning for sure.

[George Camel]

That's great. Well, I like the idea of sort of a match because that encourages them to actually do the behavior instead of you doing it for them. But there's a lot of ways to do this. If it's not wealth, it might be, hey, we wanted to gift you some down payment money, and it has to go toward the house. And so there's a lot of ways you could do that. I love the idea of just, you know, contributing to that. I don't know. If you just wrote them a check for $3,000, would you trust that they'd actually go invest that into an ira? That's the question.

[Caller Lynn]

Yeah, I do think that both of them would go do that if that was the intention, yes.

[George Camel]

Okay. I would demand proof as. Because I'm that guy. I'd be like, all right, here's the deal. I'm going to give this to you. I need proof in one week that you've actually deposited this money or else I rescinded. So it's okay to give with strings attached because you're, you know, they're going to benefit from it. And here's what you should do. Sit down with an investment calculator, show them what this money will turn into when they retire to 63 and they're gonna go, oh my gosh, mom, you didn't give me $3,000. You just gave me $150,000.

[Ken Coleman]

That's.

[George Camel]

That'll get them investing.

[Ken Coleman]

I, I love that play. I'm starting to do that with my kids and they're starting to pay attention a little bit. So I love that advice.

[George Camel]

Uncle George will come over. I'll show him the ropes.

[Ken Coleman]

We need more Uncle George around the house. All right, folks, appreciate you being with us. This is the Ramsey show. The right questions are the key to unlock personal and professional potential. That means if you're not where you want to be, you are not asking the right questions. I'm Ken Coleman and this is what my new show, Front Row Seat is all about. Over my career, I've had the distinct privilege to interview successful people from all walks of life and to coach over 10,000 professionals who wanted more. What sets successful people apart is a never ending desire to learn and grow. Each week I'll be joined by industry leaders and world class experts to have a conversation about how to get better, move up and lead well in work and life. But the best part of this year show is you get to be a part of the conversation. Live in studio will have a group of professionals just like you who have the power to ask questions and steer the discussion in real time. It's an opportunity to get real answers to real questions like how to make the right decisions, have hard conversations, live a balanced life and discover your next steps to growth. Join us every Tuesday for conversations that are guaranteed to surprise, challenge and inspire you. Check out Front Row Seat wherever you get your podcasts.