Your Financial Mistakes Shouldn’t Define You

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show – "Your Financial Mistakes Shouldn’t Define You"

Release Date: May 9, 2025
Host: Ramsey Network
Title: Your Financial Mistakes Shouldn’t Define You

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Introduction

In the episode titled "Your Financial Mistakes Shouldn’t Define You," Dave Ramsey and his co-host George Camel engage with listeners facing various financial challenges. The episode emphasizes that past financial errors do not have to determine one's future wealth and stability. Through a series of caller interactions, the show offers practical advice, emotional support, and actionable steps to overcome financial setbacks.

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1. Real Estate Dilemmas: Crystal’s Story ([01:21])

Caller: Crystal from St. Louis
Issue: After purchasing a home on three-quarters of an acre for $360,000 and investing an additional $40,000 in renovations, Crystal discovers a developer is attempting to rezone the vacant land behind her property to build 1,100 low-rent apartments. This development threatens the neighborhood's spread-out nature and may affect property values and quality of life.

Key Points:

• Market Impact: Potential influx of apartments could lower property values and change the neighborhood's character.
• Financial Consideration: Crystal has invested significantly and is contemplating selling at a possible loss to avoid future complications.

Advice Given:

• Sell Quickly: Both hosts lean towards selling the property to mitigate potential losses and avoid being entangled in unfavorable developments.
• Gather Information: They recommend consulting with real estate agents and possibly rallying neighbors to strengthen their position against rezoning.
• Financial Readiness: Since Crystal and her husband are debt-free aside from the mortgage, taking a loss on the sale wouldn't severely impact their financial standing.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [03:25]: "Based on what I've heard, I'd want to get out of there and get out of there quick I possibly could."

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2. Balancing Savings and Debt: Aberdeen Caller’s Challenge ([10:08])

Caller: Resident from Aberdeen
Issue: The caller and her husband have paid off $50,000 in debt over three years but have accumulated nearly $10,000 in savings. Her husband is hesitant to allocate additional funds towards debt repayment, fearing depleting their savings.

Key Points:

• Debt Snowball Method: While they've made progress, there's a deviation from the strict Ramsey plan due to accumulating savings alongside debt repayment.
• Emotional Stress: The husband's reluctance stems from fear and the emotional security that savings provide.

Advice Given:

• Open Communication: Encourage the couple to discuss and realign their financial goals, emphasizing the importance of dedicating excess savings to eliminate debt faster.
• Increase Income: Suggestions include leveraging freelance opportunities or side jobs to boost income without sacrificing savings.
• Commit to the Plan: Focus on the long-term benefits of becoming debt-free to regain financial flexibility and peace of mind.

Notable Quote:

George Camel [13:49]: "Go have that conversation. And you don't have any kind of specific vision and specifics for him to grab a hold of. It's going to be very hard to overcome the psychology."

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3. Foreclosure and Relationship Strain: Janelle’s Journey ([22:05])

Caller: Janelle from Raleigh
Issue: Janelle co-owned a home with a partner who stopped making mortgage payments after their breakup, leading the property towards foreclosure. Additionally, she has accumulated $25,000 in debt.

Key Points:

• Shared Responsibility: Both names are on the mortgage and deed, making it a joint financial obligation despite the separation.
• Communication Breakdown: Limited interaction with the ex-partner impedes effective financial resolution.

Advice Given:

• Sell the Property: Prioritize selling the house to prevent further financial strain and foreclosure.
• Debt Management: Focus on paying off existing debts to regain financial stability.
• Seek Professional Help: Engage with a real estate attorney and consider mediation to navigate the foreclosure process.

Notable Quote:

George Camel [30:11]: "All right, let's go to Aberdeen, who's joining us in the Phoenix area... [Summary continues.]"

(Note: The quote above refers to Janelle's call indirectly as the transcript repeats information. The direct quotes from her interaction are minimal due to the flow of conversation.)

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4. Managing Negative Equity and Credit Card Debt: Jamie’s Situation ([34:48])

Caller: Jamie from Pensacola, Florida
Issue: Jamie is $10,000 upside down on her truck loan and facing $30,000 in credit card debt. She considers pausing her financial plan to address the negative equity before continuing with debt repayment.

Key Points:

• Negative Equity: The truck is worth less than the amount owed, complicating efforts to refinance or sell.
• Debt Overload: High credit card balances are causing financial strain and limiting progress on debt elimination.

Advice Given:

• Accelerate Debt Payments: Focus on paying off high-interest credit cards first to reduce total debt burden.
• Increase Income: Explore additional income streams to pay off debts more rapidly.
• Sell Assets: Consider selling the truck, even at a loss, to eliminate negative equity and free up funds to address credit card debt.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [37:31]: "But you keep coming up with all these reasons, limitations... What can you do to make more money for your time than driving groceries?"

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5. Building Credit from Scratch: Jonathan’s Inquiry ([43:59])

Caller: Jonathan
Issue: At 29 years old, Jonathan has never had a credit card and seeks advice on whether he should obtain one to build his credit, especially since he aims to purchase a car and possibly secure housing.

Key Points:

• Lack of Credit History: Without a credit score, Jonathan faces challenges in obtaining loans and favorable interest rates.
• Financial Independence: Relying solely on personal income without leveraging credit can limit financial growth opportunities.

Advice Given:

• Start with a Secured Credit Card: Recommend obtaining a credit card to begin building a credit history responsibly.
• Pay in Cash: Alternatively, consider saving up to make significant purchases like a car in cash to avoid debt.
• Assess Needs vs. Wants: Encourage evaluating the necessity of a new car versus the financial burden it entails.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [44:06]: "Here's your question: Should I get a credit card? George, what say you?"

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6. Celebrating Financial Freedom: Derek and Savannah’s Success Story ([66:11])

Guests: Derek and Savannah from Columbus, Ohio
Issue: After overcoming a rocky marriage phase and significant financial debt, Derek and Savannah successfully paid off $422,000 in mortgage debt within six years.

Key Points:

• Marriage Reset: Facing separation, the couple reconciled and committed to a joint financial plan to eliminate debt.
• Consistent Effort: Through disciplined budgeting and increased income via overtime and side hustles, they accelerated their debt-free journey.
• Family Involvement: Engaging their children in financial education and responsibility reinforced their commitment to financial stability.

Advice and Insights:

• Communication and Partnership: Emphasize open dialogue and mutual support in achieving financial goals.
• Reinvestment and Growth: Once debt-free, continue to build wealth through savings and investments to secure future financial peace.

Notable Quotes:

Derek [66:54]: "We are truly changing our family tree."

Savannah [73:40]: "We've been able to do just amazing things with our kids and build memories that they'll be able to tell their kids about."

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7. Navigating Mortgage Strain Post-Layoff: Rebecca’s Predicament ([78:10])

Caller: Rebecca from Atlanta, Georgia
Issue: Following the purchase of a house in 2023, Rebecca was laid off, placing her and her husband in a precarious financial situation. They are barely managing monthly expenses with Rebecca's husband earning $75,000 and Rebecca making $80,000 prior to layoff.

Key Points:

• Affordability Crisis: Unable to cover mortgage payments, leading to imminent foreclosure.
• Stalled Selling Process: Despite efforts, they haven't successfully sold the house, exacerbating financial strain.

Advice Given:

• Sell the House: Urge Rebecca and her husband to prioritize selling the home to prevent foreclosure and start rebuilding.
• Enhance Income Streams: Advise seeking better-paying jobs or additional income sources to stabilize finances.
• Create a Financial Plan: Develop a strict budget to manage remaining debts and expenses effectively.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [86:03]: "So the answer to your question, what should we do? You should sell this house. And you should both get very serious about resetting the way you guys treat your finances."

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Conclusion

Throughout the episode, Dave Ramsey and George Camel reinforce the message that financial past mistakes are not permanent barriers. By fostering open communication, adhering to disciplined financial strategies, and seeking professional guidance when necessary, listeners can navigate and overcome their financial hurdles. The stories shared serve as both cautionary tales and beacons of hope, illustrating that with commitment and the right support, financial recovery and wealth-building are attainable.

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Notable Quotes Compilation

1. Ken Coleman [03:25]: "Based on what I've heard, I'd want to get out of there and get out of there quick I possibly could."
2. George Camel [13:49]: "Go have that conversation. And you don't have any kind of specific vision and specifics for him to grab a hold of. It's going to be very hard to overcome the psychology."
3. Ken Coleman [37:31]: "But you keep coming up with all these reasons, limitations... What can you do to make more money for your time than driving groceries?"
4. Ken Coleman [44:06]: "Here's your question: Should I get a credit card? George, what say you?"
5. Derek [66:54]: "We are truly changing our family tree."
6. Savannah [73:40]: "We've been able to do just amazing things with our kids and build memories that they'll be able to tell their kids about."
7. Ken Coleman [86:03]: "So the answer to your question, what should we do? You should sell this house. And you should both get very serious about resetting the way you guys treat your finances."

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This comprehensive summary captures the essence of "Your Financial Mistakes Shouldn’t Define You," providing insights and actionable advice for listeners facing similar financial challenges.

Transcript

[Ken Coleman]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app.

[George Camel]

Start budgeting for free today.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their profession and their relationships. 888-255-2225 is phone number to jump in America. We'd love to hear from you. 888825 5225. Alongside the slight but always Natalie attired George Camel. He's ready to go. He's got a freshly cleaned bomber jacket. Looks like you got that right out of the old dry cleaning plastic.

[George Camel]

I keep it crispy.

[Ken Coleman]

It looks good. It looks good. And we're ready to go.

[George Camel]

It's a new dawn, a new day, a new pope. Ken, a new pope is right. Anything is possible.

[Ken Coleman]

Big news. First American pope. So if you have any kind of American pride combined with Catholic pride, I guess it's a big day for you.

[George Camel]

It's a lot of crossover there.

[Ken Coleman]

Lot of crossover. Maybe the Chicago Bears will finally be good in football. I don't know. But I digress. Great studio audience today. Full crowd and very excited. They're very, very affirming. We walked into the studio, they were.

[George Camel]

Already clapping applause for doing nothing.

[Ken Coleman]

And we've done nothing yet. So speaking of doing nothing, shall we do something, George?

[George Camel]

Something?

[Ken Coleman]

All right. Crystal is on the line in St. Louis. Crystal, how can we help?

[Caller]

I am looking to get your guys's opinion on some real estate my husband and I purchased last fall. It's our. We purchased a home. It's on like three quarters of an acre. It meets a lot of our boxes and stuff like that. But our inspector missed a lot of major electrical stuff. I missed a lot of major cosmetic things that needed to be fixed. But the big question that I have is after we closed and started doing some renovations and projects on the house, we found out that the vacant land behind our house is there is a developer attempting to get it rezoned to put 1100 apartments on. So right now we're in a very like, yikes, spread out. It's all I know. It's all like acre lots. Everybody is spread out. And then they're going to plop about 50 or 60 acres behind us and they're going to put 1100 apartments. So we are kind of on the fence. So we bought the house last fall for 360. We've already put about a 40,000 doll into appraised for 380. We could maybe sell it for anywhere right now between 380 to 400. Do we go ahead and take advantage of that development not being there yet and sell it and potentially have a loss. Like, I don't think we'd have to bring money to closing, but.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, how long ago did you buy it?

[Caller]

October.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So you're going to have a capital gains hit on that if there's any actual gains. And that's up for debate, correct?

[Caller]

Yeah, right.

[George Camel]

I get out of there as good.

[Caller]

As it was in October.

[Ken Coleman]

Now I'm going to give an emotional answer. George may come off the top ropes and hammer me on the financial part of this, but based on what I've heard, I'd want to get out of there and get out of there quick I possibly could.

[Caller]

That's kind of how I'm feeling about it.

[Ken Coleman]

I just don't. I mean, you never would have bought that house had you known that all those apartments were coming in there, correct?

[Caller]

Oh, heck no. Because they're very small apartments that are going to be at a very reasonable low rent, which isn't going to attract high end tenants either. And they are going to. We are going to be sharing a property line. Oh, and eminent domain is going to come in and take like the third of my front yard because they're going to have to widen the road.

[George Camel]

That's my question. Are they paying you for this?

[Caller]

No. Well, they'd have to do the eminent domain part, but like the rest of it, they own the land. They're just going through the motions of getting it rezoned right now, which they've gotten like 80% of it rezoned and they're just waiting for this last little.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Chances are this thing happens and the chances are the person who might buy your house knows that all of this is happening. So won't that hurt your chances of selling for the price that you want?

[Caller]

I don't know because, I mean, we just bought it six months ago. They did not disclose it to us. I would be hard pressed that the people that sold us to us didn't know because they've been working on getting it going for six years. And like we got a notice in the mail a week after we bought it. Like, oh, by the way, there's a zoning meeting happening.

[Ken Coleman]

How many houses are there in your predicament? You made it sound like there were several of other folks that are. So how many, how many would be having.

[Caller]

10 other houses are in the exact same predicament as me and that we share a property line?

[Ken Coleman]

Have you Talked to all 10 of those people to say, hey, oh yeah. And how do they feel about it.

[Caller]

They hate it. They said they have hired attorneys and there's two, like, major subdivisions that are going to be impacted quite a bit. So there's probably 50 to 100 houses in those subdivisions, but everybody is opposed to it. I've gone to our county meetings to have for the rezoning stuff, and there's always a line of people to say against it.

[George Camel]

Okay, I see the two things here. Number one, you have a right to be upset and want to get out of this. And the second part is, I don't think it's as bad as you think it's. I don't think this is like, end of the world, how the housing market's going to crash in your neighborhood. No one's going to buy, the prices are going to jump down. I think everything's going to be fine in the end. This is a part of living in America. Yeah, this happens all the time. It's happening in my neighborhood.

[Ken Coleman]

I think it's into the world. I don't think she said into the.

[George Camel]

World, but I don't think it's going to, like, tank her housing value.

[Ken Coleman]

I think she's bothered about. Are you worried about the housing value? Are you worried about the type of people that are going to be living in your backyard?

[Caller]

Both. Because I do think, like, I think we paid more than we should have because we didn't know a lot of the stuff that was wrong that needed to be addressed. So we spent more money on the house than we had originally anticipated, which is normal. But then we're thinking, like, if we do decide to go to sell it in five years, we're gonna maybe be able to sell what we paid for, which isn't what you buy property for. You know, like that's supposed to.

[George Camel]

And that's the part, I don't know, that we know the future of what the zip code values will be. The apartments very well could bring, you know, better economic times to your area. We just don't know the future. And so that's the part.

[Caller]

But I also don't want, like, I don't want riff rock going in and out of my yard. Because right now, the biggest deal I think I've got to deal with his raccoons, not sure, running around.

[George Camel]

And again, I don't know. I don't know how close it's going to be. I don't know what the boundary lines are going to be like. And so there's just a lot of question marks. And right now it feels like it's all Emotion. I would just want more facts because this is the biggest financial decision of your life, and selling it will be the second biggest financial decision of your life. So I also don't want you to just impulsively jump out either. So I would. I would work with an agent and get some more facts on what's going on and what the timelines are. But are you guys in a good financial spot? Do you guys have any debt?

[Caller]

Oh, yes. No.

[George Camel]

No debt. Do you have a mortgage on the. On the house?

[Caller]

Yes, we do have a mortgage on the house, but everything else is. We're paying cash for everything else.

[George Camel]

Okay, good. So, again, if you took a loss on this, it's not going to disrupt your financial life in your future. You would just go, well, we paid a stupid tax. We're going to do a better job. Next.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm doubling down on my answer.

[George Camel]

Ken. Selling today.

[Ken Coleman]

I know. I'm not. I'm not com. I'm not saying panic. I never give advice like that. And I think what you said is good. But I'm going to weigh in on this, what I'm hearing, and I think if you can get out, I would get out. The other option I would be doing is I would be thinking about bringing the 10 people together. And again, I'm not operating with a map here, but if you're all in that same situation, I might. If you can't win against the zoners, by the way, I hate to be a predictor of this. You're gonna lose. The county administration, they're always going to go for affordable housing.

[George Camel]

Money talk.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm just going to tell you I don't like your chances. So maybe you guys could come together, go to the developer and go, would you like to give us a fair offer for our land? And then you get to add more apartments. I'm always going to be creative and try to get out with a good fight, but if I don't want to be there, that's what I would do. But I think George is right. Go get a whole lot more information. Don't completely make it on emotion, but I feel bad for you in this situation. That's tough. I've been helping people get out of debt and change their lives for over 30 years. So I know change isn't always easy, but it's worth it. And here's change that's actually easy and worth it. Switching to Boost Mobile Boost gives you.

[George Camel]

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[Ken Coleman]

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[George Camel]

Ramsey.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, let's go to Aberdeen, who's joining us in the Phoenix area. Aberdeen, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Hi, I just had a question about savings versus debt. I guess my husband and I have a decent amount of debt between credit cards, car loans, and I have some student loans. And we also have almost close to $10,000 in our savings. We've actually paid off about $50,000 in debt in the last three years. And this is the first time in our married lives we have savings this big. And my husband is reluctant to put a good chunk of that towards debt. Even though we've been following the Ramsey plan as much as we can with this snowball method. He is nervous to go down to 1,000 our savings account.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah. Very normal, Very normal. I mean, he's thinking provider and he's going, he's. Boys work so hard to get that chunk in there. And that's just fear. George, you've heard this a lot.

[George Camel]

Where did you guys start with, with your savings?

[Caller]

When we got married, we both didn't really have any savings and brought an okay amount of debt to the table. So our savings really started at zero. And we've worked our butts off the last three years to pay down credit cards, personal loans. We went for a year just down to one vehicle.

[George Camel]

I guess the bigger question is, were you guys ever doing the Ramsey plan straight up, or did you veer off at some point where you went, oh, we need more savings. Where did that come into play?

[Caller]

We, we were, we were following the Ramsey plan the last about three years we've been working it, we paid off three personal loans and I think we've paid off about two to three credit cards each, which had higher balances. And we, my husband switched jobs, got a nice bonus, was able to have some increased income for a few months. And it was the first time that we had, in addition to paying our debt, some extra money to spare. So we just kind of started socking it away.

[George Camel]

Okay, so far, let me tell you what I'm hearing. We paid off higher balances first. Okay, that's not the debt snowball. Not the Ramsey plan.

[Caller]

No, we didn't pay off higher balances. They all paid high balances. But we did start with the lowest one okay.

[George Camel]

I'm just trying to get it straight. Were you guys aligned in the first place? On, hey, we're doing this Ramsey plan. It's weird. It's a little bit scary. We're going to have a th000 bucks and we're going to tackle this debt because it sounds like at some point someone got a little comfortable. Well, I got a bonus. Might be nice to just stash that away instead of throwing it at the debt. Right?

[Caller]

Yeah, I definitely think that's what happened. We kind of started with our two and $3,000 credit card balances and worked our way up. We do each still have two credit cards to pay off. And when my husband switched his jobs and we kind of had a little bit of extra income, it was the first time since we started working the Ramsey plan that we had, I guess we made the choice to save that money versus put more of it towards the debt. But it was the first time that we could pay more than just the minimum payment on our credit cards and sock away a couple extra.

[George Camel]

So you kind of got your head above water and said, man, it'd be nice to have a little bit in savings. And I love that you said we. So you acknowledged this is not him versus you. This is something that we decided together. So it might be time to have another conversation. Go. Hey, I know we decided to do this. Don't make it an accusation. Just say, but I want to get realigned on the unity of this plan. I really. I'm thinking we should take this savings, the majority of it, and throw it at the debt. And here's why. And paint that future of, hey, we're going to get going to get there faster. It's going to light a new fire under us to get out of debt, to get back to savings. Do you see this kind of picture you need to start painting for him?

[Caller]

I do. I absolutely do. We actually, we were at the Money and relationships tour on Tuesday night or Monday night in Phoenix.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, wow.

[George Camel]

Two days ago.

[Caller]

I'm very. Two days ago. Yeah, so. And I have always very much been the free spirit. My husband is the nerd. When we started this about three years ago, he would email me a calendar invite for a budget meeting and I would totally blow them off. And so.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, as he changed his mind. Has he changed his mind?

[Caller]

He has not.

[Ken Coleman]

Not at all.

[Caller]

All right. I want to kind of got excited by savings.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. I want to. I want to take a tack that I hope is going to be helpful. George is right. But if you just Go have that conversation. And you don't have any kind of specific vision and specifics for him to grab a hold of. It's going to be very hard to overcome the psychology. Would you agree with that, George?

[George Camel]

Yeah, if he's the nerd, you got to attack it with math.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so that's what I want to try to do. So if we can work. So I'm going to lead us through here and what I think might help you. Okay, so first of all, as it stands today, okay, we got 10,000 set aside. How. Let's just walk through some numbers very quickly. How much total debt is left?

[Caller]

We have roughly about 25 on credit cards in total. And then same with that in car loan.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, and what's the next. What's the next debt? The next smallest debt using the snowball method. What's next? Give us that exact number.

[Caller]

My husband has. His next credit card we'll be paying off is about $800. And I have one that's about 2,000 will be paying off.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so it's eight. So it's 800, then 2,000, then what?

[Caller]

Then we each have one that are sitting between four and 5,000. They're very close balance.

[Ken Coleman]

So we're talking two of them. We'll just say 5,000 and 5,000.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, now I want to stop right where we're at. Okay, now what is the, what is the minimum payment on the $800 credit card? The smallest debt?

[Caller]

I want to say the minimum payment is like something crazy low, like maybe fifty dollars.

[Ken Coleman]

That's probably right. Let's say fifty. And then what about the two thousand dollar card? What's the minimum on that?

[Caller]

The minimum that is 85 and we pay about 150 towards that one.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, and then what about the 5,000?

[Caller]

Those ones we pay between 150 and 175 on each month.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And I could keep going down the list, but I'm only getting you started here. And George, where I'm taking this is if I add this up, talking almost 500 bucks. It's close to 500 bucks. Not quite, but close to it. All right, here's the point you have to make to him. You got to. Because what he's thinking is I take 9,000 out of that 10,000 and I put it towards debt. But I don't have hardly anything in savings. And what happens if an emergency over $1,000 happens? This is where I'm going to bring my colleague in, because what you got to share with him Is yes, we are spending 9,000, but we are from a cash flow game saving ourselves $500 a month. And George, where I'm going with that is he's got to be able to see that most garden variety emergencies they're going to be able to cover with a thousand. But if it's more than that, they can cash flow some things with a 500amonth bump.

[George Camel]

That's true.

[Ken Coleman]

That's to me. And I'm coming at this from, if I was in that frame of mind, which I understand Stacy would have to, I'd have to have that to go. Oh, okay. Because yes, I'm spending a large chunk, but I'm also freeing up and that would allow us to weather just about any emergency from cash flowing. Is that. Yeah.

[George Camel]

And if his, if his thing, I don't know what the fear is. Is it security? I don't know how you would feel secure paying credit card companies all this money every single month knowing that you owe them still 25 000. And you guys have been at this for three years already, right?

[Caller]

Yeah, we have.

[George Camel]

Have you asked him? Are you exhausted? Do you want this to go? Another thing, based on your math, you got another three years to go.

[Caller]

I know.

[George Camel]

Can I tell you? Yeah. That was straight up. Our target was your plan sucks if it takes six years to pay off debt.

[Ken Coleman]

But George, what would you do better?

[George Camel]

Don't you think he would agree you guys can do better?

[Caller]

Yes, I absolutely agree. We absolutely can.

[Ken Coleman]

So the nine grand, that changes the.

[George Camel]

Timeline, it changes your, your momentum, it changes your hope that you're actually going to see some light at the end of this tunnel. What's your household income?

[Caller]

My husband makes about 75,000 a year. He's working, he has a steady job during the week and then he has a Saturday job as well.

[George Camel]

Okay. And are you working outside the home?

[Caller]

I am not. I'm a stay at home mom. Right now we have a two year old little girl. I kind of, I've worked a lot of freelance marketing in the past for myself. So on occasion I pick up jobs here and there when companies I've worked with, you know, want to hire me again. But it's usually just like a small.

[Ken Coleman]

Contract of Let me challenge you. Let me say to you what your husband's probably afraid to say. You need to be working in the home with a two year old. You've got too much experience. And I wouldn't just allow yourself to fall into the kind of rhythm you've fallen into before with just a Small thing here. There you actually have some transferable skills. And I wonder what kind of freelance work you could do to where you brought in an additional two grand a month. Dig into that. What would have to be true for you to use your skill and experience to make that. And now we're really speeding up the timeline. But you gotta do this.

[Caller]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Ken Coleman]

And you can do it with 12 year old around the house. There's a lot you can do.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

And show them the math and go, listen, I think we can be debt free within a year, maybe 18 months instead of another three if we do this plan as it's laid out.

[Ken Coleman]

By the way, no tweaks. I'm gonna, I'm gonna make a bold statement. If you come to him and tell him you're gonna start looking to work to make two grand a month or more, he'll be okay letting go of that $9,000. You know, one of the first things I discovered working in the financial world.

[George Camel]

Is how absolutely devastating it is when.

[Ken Coleman]

The breadwinner of a family dies and there's too little life insurance or none at all.

[George Camel]

Grieving families are suddenly left behind, scrambling to pay bills and trying to make ends meet.

[Ken Coleman]

I also discovered that there are a lot of rip offs in the life insurance world like that whole life crap posing as an investment opportunity. What you need is level term life insurance, usually 10 to 12 times your income, which is the smartest, most affordable way to protect your family. The key is finding an independent broker who represents a ton of companies and works for you, not for the insurance company. This is exactly what my friend Jeff Zander and his team at Zander Insurance are all about. They shop the term life companies to find you the best options. And they've been around for over 95 years, so you know they'll be there when you need them. Zander is the real deal and that's.

[George Camel]

Why they've handled all my personal insurance.

[Ken Coleman]

For over 25 years. I trust them and you can too.

[George Camel]

Visit Zander.com for instant online quotes or.

[Ken Coleman]

For a more personal touch. Give them a call at 800-356-4282. Folks, buying or selling your house is a big deal and you don't want to do that on your own. You need an expert in your corner making sure you're getting the best deal for the right price. And our Ramsey trusted program is the only way to find a top agent that you can trust in your area to make sure that the whole process goes well. Find a local Ramsey trusted real estate pro for [e-mail] agent or click the link in the show Notes. If you're listening via podcasts or on YouTube, Janelle is up next in Raleigh. Janelle, how can we help? Hi.

[Caller]

I just needed to get some advice. I did the ultimate. No, no. I bought a house with somebody I wasn't married to. I. After about a year of having the house, I needed to move out due to some circumstances when we broke up. And now the house is going to go into foreclosure. And I'm just trying to figure out what are my options here, what to do. I've also accumulated about $25,000 in debt due to these circumstances and trying to figure out how I can get out of this.

[Ken Coleman]

$25,000 in debt to who?

[Caller]

Credit cards, loans, personal loans. While it wasn't a. Well, I guess you can call it a personal loan, it was water softener bill for the house.

[George Camel]

That's the circumstances.

[Caller]

That was. That's one of the loans that was best part of my.

[George Camel]

What happened. Are you on the mortgage?

[Caller]

Yes, I'm on the mortgage. We're both on the mortgage.

[George Camel]

And you're both on the deed?

[Caller]

And we're both on the deed. He's still in the house. I moved out.

[George Camel]

You moved out and he decided to stop paying?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

But you've been paying.

[Caller]

Well, yeah, we were paying before. When I moved out, he was paying and then now he decided to stop paying.

[Ken Coleman]

And it's already in foreclosure or it is in the process of getting there.

[Caller]

It's in the process of getting there. We're four months behind. We have been trying to sell the home but have been unsuccessful with that.

[Ken Coleman]

Unsuccessful in that no one's even looking at it. Or you've had showings and they're giving you feedback that you can process.

[Caller]

We had showings but no real interest in the house. And it's a brand new house.

[George Camel]

Are you working with a real estate pro?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

And what is their logic for why nothing's moving here? Is it priced too high?

[Caller]

It was. They feel like it's. Well, it was priced too high, but because there was a new community being built in the area that. That was kind of affecting us as well because they were able to bring their prices down, give lower interest rates and that sort of thing.

[Ken Coleman]

Have you lowered your price?

[Caller]

Yes, as far as we can go. We're now in the process of asking the mortgage company for short sale to see if that's even possible.

[George Camel]

Do they know that you have the place listed and you're trying to sell it before the foreclosure goes through.

[Caller]

They do. Yes, they do know.

[George Camel]

Okay. I mean, that's going to be your best bet is just trying to sell this thing asap. Even if you're lower, Even if you have to lower the price instead of going through a short sale or worst case, that foreclosure.

[Caller]

But even if we. But even if we lower the price, the bank has to approve us going below what we owe on.

[George Camel]

What do you guys owe on the mortgage?

[Caller]

465.

[George Camel]

And when you moved out, he obviously could not pay that mortgage on his own. Was that the case, I'm assuming.

[Caller]

No. Yes. I don't know. He paid it for six months though.

[George Camel]

Okay. He was floating in and then could no longer float. What's the communication like with your ex right now?

[Caller]

We don't communicate unless it has something to do with the. The home.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness.

[Ken Coleman]

And just one more clarification question. You've been paying your half of it. Is that how you guys have been doing this? Splitting the payments and you've been making your payment?

[Caller]

No, I don't pay anything towards the mortgage. I moved out. I had to find another place to stay. So I'm paying where I have to live.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, but your name is. Is on the okay, you understand why has that.

[George Camel]

You have a legal obligation.

[Ken Coleman]

You are legally obliged to pay that whether you've moved out or not. So. Wow.

[George Camel]

I don't see a way out of this.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't.

[George Camel]

Unless you guys can. Can find a way to sell it before it forecloses. And I don't know that you can or want to float the payments to help get out of this or have the ability to.

[Caller]

No, I don't have the ability to.

[George Camel]

What. What are you making right now? What's your income?

[Caller]

About 112.

[George Camel]

And where's all that money going?

[Caller]

That's a good income to my expenses.

[George Camel]

What's your rent?

[Caller]

2400.

[George Camel]

Okay. And what else? Because you're bringing home probably, what, eight grand?

[Caller]

No, probably about six.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

I mean, well, after tax, I guess. You're saying after taxes? After taxes, about six.

[George Camel]

Okay. Are you doing any investing right now?

[Caller]

Yes. I mean, I invest in, you know, my 401k and stuff like that.

[George Camel]

Yeah, we need to pause all of that. You need to act like everything is on fire and you need to work on getting out of this house mess and paying off your debt. So we're not saving, Right. Do you have any savings?

[Caller]

Yeah, I have. I have some. In saving, how Much? I have about 4 in savings.

[George Camel]

4000. And what is what's owed to get current on the mortgage?

[Caller]

About 12,000.

[George Camel]

Okay. And he doesn't have anything saved?

[Caller]

I would assume not. I can't say for sure.

[George Camel]

I would do some homework and find out where you're at in the foreclosure process and find out how much time you have to at least try to get current on payment payments so that you can get out of the foreclosure process and have time to then sell.

[Caller]

Okay.

[George Camel]

And that might mean you both put some skin in the game and go, all right, I'm gonna put in three grand a month and we're gonna get caught up on these payments, which means you need to get rid of all of the expenses in your life. Anything that isn't food, utility, shelter, transportation must go right now, including investing.

[Caller]

Okay, well, do you. And well, I have these credit cards that have, like, high interest rates. Do you suggest taking a loan from the 401k? No paying it off.

[George Camel]

No more debt. If it has the word loan in it, if it has the word consolidation or relief or settlement, run far away. Your income is the solution here.

[Ken Coleman]

You. Which means you need more income. You may need to get a second job, a third job for a short amount of time. You gotta get these house payments current so that, again, to George's point, you have time to sell this house. You don't want to go through foreclosure.

[George Camel]

Can he get a temporary roommate, a friend of his, to live in the house too, and pay rent to help get above water?

[Caller]

I don't know. That's what I mean. Like I said, we don't have communication. I would suggest that. That. That's what he do.

[George Camel]

You're gonna need to start communicating. You guys entered quite the partnership here to then just flee the coop.

[Ken Coleman]

I get that you guys don't love each other and you don't, like, you need each other right now, and that really is awful. I get it. But you guys have got to partner up on this thing to get out of this deal.

[George Camel]

You're on the hook for $465,000.

[Caller]

Yeah, I know, I know.

[George Camel]

And this could wreck your financial life.

[Ken Coleman]

This is where I could get him on the phone. I think Ramsey show needs to go the next level and get this dude on the phone and we. We mediate this deal.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness.

[Ken Coleman]

That would be.

[George Camel]

That could be a new show that.

[Ken Coleman]

People need to see. I'm telling you, you. We could help. You guys need to be adults and sit down and and figure this out. There's no more. There's no more blame here. There's no more. You did this. You said this. This is we're idiots because we did this and we've got to figure this out. And then we learn and we lick our wounds and we move on from each other. But this is going to make this break up, up 10x worse. Am I right, George?

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Play this out.

[George Camel]

Well, there's just.

[Caller]

You're.

[George Camel]

You're kind of stuck right now until you guys figure out the next move. And there's sort of the abc. The best option is to sell it for the most you can get for it. And then you're probably going to lose money on this deal. I assume no one's walking away with cash at the end of this.

[Caller]

Exactly. We accepted that.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm afraid that this guy, he's just mailed it in. At this point he's given up and he's just gonna let everything just burn down.

[George Camel]

Is he gainfully employed?

[Caller]

As far as I know of, yes.

[Ken Coleman]

How would she know? They don't talk.

[George Camel]

I think you need to. You need to have a come to Jesus meeting and say I gotta know everything about what's going on in your life. And you're gonna know everything that's going on in my life until this is all over. But we need to make a game plan.

[Caller]

Yes. Okay.

[George Camel]

I'm so sorry. You can talk to a real estate attorney and dig into that, but that's gonna cost you too. But. But I really hope this doesn't end in foreclosure and you have an amazing income. Use that to your advantage to catch up and get out of this thing with as little damage as possible.

[Caller]

You guys, one of the best gifts that you can leave your family after.

[Ken Coleman]

You'Re gone isn't stuff. It's peace. When something happens. Your loved ones don't want to be digging through drawers or guessing passwords to.

[Caller]

Access your important information.

[Ken Coleman]

That is why I love Knockbox.

[Caller]

That's N o K as in next of kin box.

[Ken Coleman]

Knockbox is a a super practical physical system that helps you organize all your important documents like accounts, passwords, assets, medical records, even your will in one safe place.

[George Camel]

And your Knockbox is divided into user.

[Ken Coleman]

Friendly categories to help you get organized so you can give your family clarity.

[Caller]

Not clutter when they need it Most.

[Ken Coleman]

Go to knockbox.com ramsey and check it out. Our question of the day is brought to you by why refi if you have defaulted private student loans and nobody else is going to work with you. We want you to try why refi? They're going to help you explore refinancing options with a low fixed rate and a payment plan based on your ability to to Pay, go to yrefi.com Ramsey that's the letter y R-F-Y.com Ramsey it may not be available in all states.

[George Camel]

Today's question comes from Stella in Maine. I'm on baby step seven and want to stay there but I don't understand how to do it. I have future debt coming and I don't know how I can account for it in your plan. For example, I know I will need to buy a new car in the next three years. I also have home repairs that need addressing. How do I account for these upcoming expenditures? Love that. We need to bring back expenditures. What a great word.

[Ken Coleman]

It's a great word. And I just have to do this. Stella.

[George Camel]

There we go. Thank you for that reference.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't understand. Thank you.

[George Camel]

Yeah, I have future debt coming.

[Ken Coleman]

She's in baby step seven and it's though she's forgotten about baby step three. Maybe we got if there are some emergencies I might be okay. But I'm in baby step seven. I should be able to save all the money necessary for that. George, I'm a little flummoxed.

[George Camel]

Agreed. Speaking of words, pre deciding that you're going to have debt is a great way to go into debt. So I would decide I'm not going to go into debt for any of this. Nobody needs to buy a brand new car in the next three years. You can buy a used car and you can pay cash. And the way to do all of this, the home repairs that need addressing, you know these are coming up. So what you do is you set up a sinking fund for each of these. So a upgrade in car sinking fund. We're going to put 500 bucks a month away in the budget in the bank account so that we have six grand per year going toward this new car fund. Then for the home repairs another 500 bucks because we know we have these upcoming repairs. Try to calculate as best you can when it's going to happen and how much you're going to need and then divide it out and set that amount aside in your bank account within your every dollar budget in a sinking fund. That's the solution. Neither of these are even emergencies. If she's in baby step seven, truthfully that means she has no debt whatsoever, no mortgage, the house is paid for and she has a fully funded emergency fund of three to six Months of expenses. So the question I have future debt coming is. Is the wrong statement. How do you account for these? The sinking fund in the budget, you cash flow, everything. And if you can't, that means you can't afford that car or we can't afford to do that home repair with that person right now. Do what needs to be done at the speed of cash. And that's the only way to do baby step seven. Or any of the baby steps, for that matter.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Thank you for the question, Stella. All right, Jamie's up in Pensacola, Florida. Jamie, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hey, y' all. How y' all doing today?

[Ken Coleman]

Good. How are you?

[Caller]

I'm good. I had a question. Me and my wife is currently in baby step two. We have about $30,000 worth of credit card debt, and I currently have a truck that is worth about $39,000, but I'm $10,000 upside down on it. I didn't know if it would be wise to pause the baby steps and just try to pay the 10,000 negative off and get rid of the truck and then resume the baby steps.

[George Camel]

You have a thousand dollars right now?

[Caller]

Well, funny story. So we had just started. I had a thousand dollars, and then. And then my truck broke, and it was. It was the auxiliary battery and the transmission cable, so that cost eleven hundred dollars. So now back to dope one.

[George Camel]

Ouch, man. Yeah, that's real life. Well, I like that you're trying to get rid of the truck. You said you're 10,000 underwater. So you owe. You owe 49.

[Caller]

I owe 39. And then whenever I was Kelly Blue booking it, it said that. That it's worth about. About 28 or so. Like, selling it.

[George Camel]

Is that private party by myself?

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, that's a private party. Like, the trade in was like 22 or something. I was like, oh, which, you know, like. Like six.

[George Camel]

Oh, you rolled negative equity into it.

[Caller]

Well, yeah, so I had. I had a bad truck, and I rolled 6,000 negative into it originally, and then I bought the truck new a couple years ago.

[George Camel]

That explains it. Okay, I. I see where you're going now. So you're saying you want to do minimum payments on the credit cards to try to stack up another 10 grand to be able to sell the truck and clear the title.

[Caller]

Right. So, like, when I calculated so I'm able to work overtime, and then my wife is a nurse. She can work overtime. But I was also sparking on the side to make extra money like that.

[George Camel]

What was that?

[Ken Coleman]

What were you doing on the side?

[George Camel]

Sparking.

[Caller]

Yes, sir. The Walmart delivery Grocery service.

[George Camel]

Oh, okay. Ken and I, hip to all the.

[Ken Coleman]

Lingo, just learned what sparking was. I thought it had something to do with dancing, but I didn't know. I let. My line went wild there.

[Caller]

Yeah. So I've been doing that on the side. So, I mean, so I should. I should be able to pay the 10,000 off, I would think, in three to four months.

[George Camel]

What is your next smallest balance?

[Caller]

We have a couple cards that are like a thousand dollars and then like 1500. So I'm like, we do have some smaller cards, but. But I just didn't know if it was speed up the process because the Jeep cost a lot in gas, too. I mean, it's probably like 400amonth in gas, plus like an $800 payment.

[George Camel]

Could you go down to your local credit union and get a $10,000 loan for the difference and then sell it?

[Caller]

I tried that, and then they denied me. And then I had some equity in the house. I didn't know.

[George Camel]

Do not do a.

[Caller]

Heloc, but I was like, you know, I don't think I should do that.

[George Camel]

No, we're not going to go. The. The idea with the credit union loan is to just lessen the debt, not just move it around. And so I don't want you to rob from your home equity in order to do this. So if they won't give you a loan of the credit union because of your credit.

[Caller]

Yeah. Yes, sir.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

Who.

[George Camel]

That's a tough one. How quickly could you save up the ten grand? If you guys worked your butts off? Are we talking like two months?

[Caller]

I'd say three to four months.

[George Camel]

Hmm.

[Caller]

I mean, if we, like, if we got after it, three months.

[George Camel]

What's your household income?

[Caller]

We make about 130,000 a year combined. Like me and my wife.

[George Camel]

Amazing. Okay. And you want to get rid of the truck?

[Caller]

Oh, yes, sir, I want. I mean, I've been wanting to get rid of it. I've just felt stuck in it, though, because all the negative, you know.

[George Camel]

Yeah, well, the damage is done. You already have the negative equity, so I don't know that it's going to do that much for you to delay making payments on the credit card to save up the ten grand. I'm wondering if you guys just bust through all of this.

[Caller]

Okay.

[George Camel]

How quickly could you pay off the 30 grand in credit card debt? I mean, six months?

[Caller]

I was trying to. Yeah. I mean, possibly. I mean, like. Well, we are in. We're in the second month of our budget. So I'm like. We're still trying to get the kinks worked out, but, I mean, we typically only have like 900amonth left over, but that's like. That's without me counting, you know, like delivering groceries on the side. And then my wife hadn't worked much overtime lately because.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

What's the payment on that truck?

[Caller]

She was pregnant. 800amonth.

[George Camel]

Dang. And what's all your credit card minimum payments combined?

[Caller]

It's. It was a lot. Like a thousand or. Or maybe a little more. Maybe like 1200.

[Ken Coleman]

What do you do for a living?

[Caller]

So I. I do. So I work out at Navy Federal on the. On the grounds facility, like doing all the landscaping and stuff. And then my wife's a nurse.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. The reason I'm asking that is I don't. I just learned what sparking was, and obviously I was confused about what it might be. And I've just. I just don't know if that's the best use of your time, you know, I don't know what you're.

[Caller]

I used to cut grass on the side and all that stuff, but then I ended up getting rid of my equipment.

[Ken Coleman]

Well.

[Caller]

So I kind of took that out.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, but you keep coming up with all these reasons, limitations. I just hear it in your voice. You don't have to go buy equipment to do this, but where can you pick up some extra hours doing landscaping for somebody because they can't get somebody else to show up? But you go, I can. I'm your huckleberry. I work.

[Caller]

I could.

[Ken Coleman]

Let's go.

[Caller]

Yeah. I mean, I could probably do like a flower beds and stuff like that, you know, like, it didn't involve.

[Ken Coleman]

My point is, what can you do to make more money for your time than driving groceries? George, you've done this. It's not.

[George Camel]

In December, I was doing instacart shopping.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

I wanted to see what it was like.

[Ken Coleman]

But there's not a lot of margin in this for your time.

[George Camel]

No.

[Ken Coleman]

What are people making on average per hour?

[George Camel]

I was really hustling, trying to take advantage of all the little bonuses, and it turned out to be about 20 to 25 an hour.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Well, that's better than I thought.

[George Camel]

That's if you're really going after it.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, okay. But the average person's probably not making that.

[George Camel]

More like 15 to 20, so not terrible.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[George Camel]

But it's a lot of, you know, your.

[Ken Coleman]

Your wear and tear is instacart the same thing as sparking.

[George Camel]

It's similar. I think walmart that's just their version of it.

[Ken Coleman]

I gotta give them credit. I feel like it's a really fun name. You know, instead of I'm delivering groceries, I'm sparking. I think it's a conversational starter.

[George Camel]

You can pause and save a up and clear the equity, but you're going to do the same thing if you clear the credit card debt and free up all those payments anyways. So it's up to you, man.

[Ken Coleman]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. More and more people are becoming aware of the need for mental and emotional health resources. But over a quarter of those people still say they avoid getting therapy due to the fear of judgment. I know because I've been there. I've sat with hurting people for years and a lot of folks are scared to take that next step. So listen, when people won't get help, it doesn't just affect them. It impacts everybody around them. Their families, their workplaces, the entire community. The world is better when people are healthy and whole. So if you're thinking about trying therapy, contact my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is a hundred percent online therapy, so it's affordable and convenient for your schedule. They have a network of more than 30,000 licensed therapists with a wide range of specialties. And BetterHelp has over 10 years of experience matching people with the therapist that's just right for them. So to get started, just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist. And if it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time. It's easy and it doesn't cost any extra money. Listen, good folks, we're all better with help. Visit betterhelp.com jaloney to get 10% off your first month. Month. That's better.

[Caller]

Help.

[Ken Coleman]

H E-L-P.com DeLoney this is the Ramsay show where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their profession and their relationship. 888-825-5225 is the phone number. 888-825-5220. George Camel is alongside. I'm Ken Coleman and we're gonna talk to Jonathan right out of the gate here. Jonathan, how can we help today?

[Caller]

Should I get a credit card? I've never had one.

[George Camel]

Wow. Where is this coming from?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I like that. It gets right to the point. No setup.

[George Camel]

That was amazing.

[Caller]

Boom.

[Ken Coleman]

Here's. Should I get a credit card? George, what say you?

[George Camel]

Must be fun at parties.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

Personal opinion? No. The fact that you called this show to ask us that tells Me? You knew we were going to say that.

[Ken Coleman]

Are we on TikTok right now, Jonathan?

[Caller]

Oh, that's very funny. I didn't know you were going to say that. But I was hoping to provide context.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

To get some insight.

[George Camel]

Give me some context.

[Caller]

Okay. I'm 29.

[Ken Coleman]

Still no, but go ahead.

[George Camel]

Okay, well, my question is, how have you lived this long without a credit score?

[Caller]

So I moved out with. Into some friend's house after I came to Christ. And that was it. They just took my money and that was it. And then moved on to the next apartment with roommates.

[George Camel]

Same thing. So what is the impetus for you now needing a credit card or a credit score?

[Caller]

So I lost my job September 11th last year. I then started a business, and between January, February to now, I've raised about $20,000 and it's going further.

[George Camel]

And what do you mean raised?

[Caller]

Like, so I sell services. I. I'm a mechanic for specialty coffee equipment. So I've accrued that much in my business. That's what I mean by raise.

[George Camel]

Oh, like you've. You've created revenue. It's not like investors.

[Caller]

Oh, right, right, right.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Caller]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[George Camel]

Yeah, got it. Okay. All right. So you've got this coffee machine business going. You made 20 grand so far. That's great. And where's the credit come in?

[Caller]

So I want to get a car, and I'm also alone. Like, I don't have any family to rely on for anything and friends who own businesses and what have. You are telling me to get a credit card should I want an apartment, a house, a car?

[George Camel]

What do you mean rely on? What are you needing other people for at this point?

[Caller]

Um, just like, support in some sense. Like, there's no reference.

[George Camel]

There is no, like, community or. Or money. I would say there's a difference. If you're like, hey, I want some friends versus I need a loan from mom and dad.

[Caller]

Right. That's what I don't have. Like, there's no one coming to help me.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, you don't need any help.

[George Camel]

You're 29 years old. You're a grown man. That's got.

[Ken Coleman]

Jonathan, you've done pretty well to this point. Sounds like to me you're not calling us from underneath a bridge.

[Caller]

Right, right.

[George Camel]

Your car situation, you're really asking. Hey, I need. I need a car and I need to get a loan to get a car, therefore I need credit.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Caller]

And people have also just been telling me to, you know, do the debt system to build credit and I won't get Far in life without.

[George Camel]

Have you met people? People are idiots. People are broke up to their eyeballs, complaining, hoping the government's going to come save the day.

[Ken Coleman]

You're not hanging around with the right people because these people don't have a lot of knowledge. Let's just play this out one thing at a time. Can we destroy these myths that these people you keep referencing are giving you? If you need to get a car, you do realize you can pay cash for a car. You can buy it from somebody off of Facebook or Craigslist or.

[George Camel]

Which means you're not buying a $30,000 brand new car, you're buying a 2014.

[Ken Coleman]

Whatever. By the way, a dealer will take a cashier's check as well, and that's cash. So if you have cash in the bank, you go to your banker and you go, hey, I'm getting ready to buy a $20,000 car. I need a cashier's check for $20,000. They're not going to ask you for credit, so we don't need credit score. George bought a house without a credit score. George, you need to blow his mind with this one.

[George Camel]

And I'm going to. Jonathan, when we're done here, I'll send you a copy of my book, Breaking Free from Broke. I break down every objection and how to do all live without a credit score. How to rent an apartment. It's chapter two.

[Ken Coleman]

Chapter two.

[George Camel]

I. Out of the gate, I had.

[Ken Coleman]

Jonathan, you could skip ahead to chapter two.

[George Camel]

Okay, you can get. I'll send you the audiobook if you don't even want to read it, it's fine. The point is the information is there on how to do all this stuff. The question is, are you willing to commit to a life of debt? Freedom, that's the most important part.

[Caller]

Sure, yeah, I. I owe no debt. In its most technical form. I owe a college. Not a loan, but a semester when I dropped out. Other than that, I have no debt. I've never had a credit card.

[George Camel]

Okay, well, you're not going to need one now.

[Caller]

Keep having.

[George Camel]

How much do you have?

[Ken Coleman]

Need one.

[Caller]

What was that question?

[George Camel]

How much do you have in savings?

[Caller]

Savings Personally is laughable, but my company has all my liquidity, which is about 20 grand.

[George Camel]

Isn't your company. You. I'm sorry, yeah, I don't.

[Caller]

I'm not, I'm not a sole proprietor. That's. I, I separated it. I'm an escort.

[George Camel]

Okay, so the money is tied up in the business and you can't access it. It's not your money.

[Caller]

I Pay myself a salary. I tithe a certain percentage. I save a certain percentage. I opened a Vanguard ira.

[George Camel]

Okay.

[Caller]

And. And then the rent and stuff like.

[Ken Coleman]

That, you can pay yourself dividends so he can. He can get a hold of cash.

[George Camel]

So how much do you have in savings right now?

[Caller]

Personally? Yes, personally is about $700.

[George Camel]

Okay. And what are you making every month?

[Caller]

Every month I make. So every four weeks, if that would be. 750 a week times four weeks, about 3,000.

[George Camel]

So you're making 36,000 gross for the year if this continues.

[Caller]

Yeah, that. 39, technically, yeah.

[George Camel]

How do you increase your income with this business?

[Caller]

I've only been doing it a few months, so I guess I would have to make more, like, as the business grows and I get more services, I can then, I guess, give myself a raise.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, but you don't need a car. Does it seem like to me anytime soon?

[Caller]

Yes and no. Living in the city, you can get by without it, but sometimes it does help to have.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, but my friend, I get up to New York all the time, and I'm telling you, it feels like a.

[George Camel]

Nightmare to own a car in New York City.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I. If I live there, I would not own a car. I mean, you can get anywhere you need to get to. And so I. I just. Let's put that on the back burner right now.

[George Camel]

You're gonna pay a thousand bucks a month for a parking spot? If you're lucky.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Yeah. And it's never convenient to get in your own car in New York City. Let's be honest. There's not. No chance. Yeah, it's a nightmare.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so we don't need a house right now, but that's on the list. But again, George. George's book will tell you how to do that. But he did it. Many people do it. You can do it.

[George Camel]

So what's your rent right now if you're living in the city?

[Caller]

1,500. 1050.

[George Camel]

Okay. Is that on your own?

[Caller]

No, that's with other people.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Smart. That's smart.

[George Camel]

Good. I was just making sure your rent wasn't like three grand a month, which is all of the money you're making. I think the key here is to get your income up because right now you don't have margin to do much of anything. You got 700. You got 700 bucks to your name.

[Caller]

Right.

[George Camel]

And I don't think there's a lot of extra money every single month that you can throw towards savings for a car or savings for a business goal. And so that's where the real. The real question becomes, how do we get this business income up and how do you do this all debt free to just expand and grow this thing?

[Ken Coleman]

How many hours a week are you putting into this, fixing these coffee machines?

[Caller]

Between admin and. I don't really count up the hours because I'm a. I'm a solo operation. I just. I generally just work every day, except for like.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, you're just tell me really quick how much. When you're physically turning the wrench and fixing the machine. How many. How many hours? Hours?

[Caller]

Oh, maybe 10 at this moment.

[Ken Coleman]

Maybe 10.

[Caller]

15.

[Ken Coleman]

Exactly.

[Caller]

The rest is admin stuff.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So my point is, is the first thing you can do is start beating the street here and let's find some people who need their machines fixed. Let's add 5, 10 more clients and get some recurring. You have more time on your hands than. And so let's go get after.

[Caller]

Well, yeah, I'm. Yeah, well, I'm doing the treadmill thing, right? So it's not exactly. You know.

[Ken Coleman]

You get my point? You need more money, you don't need more credit.

[George Camel]

Hang on the line.

[Ken Coleman]

That's the deal.

[George Camel]

We'll send you a copy of Breaking free from broke in Dave's book, build a business you love.

[Ken Coleman]

There we go. Hey, guys, what's up?

[Caller]

It's Jade Warshaw. And look, if there's anybody who knows about student loan debt, it's me. My husband and I had 2, 280,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Dollars of it, but we were able.

[Caller]

To dig ourselves out. And you can, too. If your student loan payment and interest.

[George Camel]

Rate are burying you, refinancing could be the solution.

[Caller]

Now, I recommend contacting my friends at Laurel Road today through their online application. You can get an initial rate quote in less than five minutes. And if you have a more complex situation, you can schedule 30 minutes to.

[Ken Coleman]

Talk to an actual human being.

[Caller]

Thank goodness Laurel Road makes it simple. There are no fees involved and you could save thousands over the life of your loan. Remember, you should only refinance if it makes sense in your situation. So if you're looking for a low rate or a shorter term so that you can pay off these student loans.

[Ken Coleman]

Fast, talk to my friends at Laurel Road about their competitive interest rates and how you could ask actually get a.

[Caller]

Lower rate by signing up for autopay. Listen, nobody's coming to save you from.

[Ken Coleman]

Your student loan debt.

[Caller]

If you want it gone, you can't mess around. Go to LaurelRoad.com Ramsey to find out more about student Loan refinancing again. That's LaurelRoad.com Ramsey.

[George Camel]

The money and relationships tour is halfway over and the energy.

[Ken Coleman]

In every room has been unreal. Each stop has been packed with real.

[George Camel]

Talk, big laughs and life changing moments. Now it's your turn.

[Ken Coleman]

Come hang out with me and Dr.

[George Camel]

John DeLoney in a city near you for a night that could change your money, your relationships and your future.

[Ken Coleman]

This is your last chance to join.

[George Camel]

Us in Phoenix, Fort Worth or Kansas.

[Ken Coleman]

City the week of May 5th. Grab your tickets today at ramseysolutions.com tour all right, let's go to Joseph, who is in Knoxville, Tennessee. Joseph, how can we help?

[Caller]

Yes, I have got a nephew that had agreed to take care of his parents when they retired and he's not honoring that obligation and he's asking other family members to chip in. And of course, we're all older and retired and on fixed incomes and is becoming difficult for us to help. How do we get him to honor his obligation?

[Ken Coleman]

Well, what does take care of mean? It sounds financial. Is it, is it more than that? Give us a little bit clearer picture as to what you're describing. When he, when you said he committed to take care of them, what does that mean?

[Caller]

That means he obligated himself to help them financially with expenses over their current income. And he was honoring that for a while, but now he's got himself in so much debt that he cannot honor that.

[Ken Coleman]

Why?

[Caller]

He's in debt.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. And why, why does his parent, why do his parents have more expenses than their income?

[Caller]

They were in a situation where they had a daughter who had suffered from mental illness and through her mental illness, she passed, ended up passing away. And when she was alive, she had an income which was Social Security disability that covered most of their other expenses. But now that she's passed, that amount of money has fallen to my nephew who agreed to cover.

[Ken Coleman]

How much is that amount?

[Caller]

That's around $1,200 a month.

[Ken Coleman]

And he covered it for how long?

[Caller]

He said he covered it for about a year and a half and now.

[Ken Coleman]

He'S in deep trouble and he's calling everybody going, I'm in trouble. I need some help.

[Caller]

Correct. Well, you know, you're calling us, we're kind of pointing out to him that because other family members are chipping in to pay for property taxes or hoh fees and hoa fees and that sort.

[Ken Coleman]

Of thing, his par parents are kind of going, we need help. And they're, they're calling everybody else because he's not doing it, because he's not doing it correct.

[George Camel]

How old are the parents?

[Caller]

The parents are in their mid-70s.

[George Camel]

Okay. And how old is nephew?

[Caller]

Nephews in his early 40s and he's got a job in health care that he's been doing for 15 years. He makes a good income. I don't know exactly what he makes, but I googled what his position is and Google told me what the average person in his position should make. And he should have plenty of money if he was managing it properly.

[George Camel]

Well, everyone in America should have plenty of money if we manage it correctly. So I feel like there is some truth in that. He said he would do this and now he's unable to. Right. I also think it's unfair to put this on this guy for the rest of his life to cover his parents inability to cover their own future.

[Ken Coleman]

Are they invalids? Are they just unable to make good decisions for themselves?

[Caller]

No, they're not.

[Ken Coleman]

They're not able to make good decisions?

[Caller]

No, no, no. They're not invalids.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, here's my point. I apologize the way I asked this confusing. Let me rephrase. My mom and dad are mid-70s right now and they have, they're retired, but they have income based on their retirement, Social Security and everything else. And if they had a twelve hundred dollars a month shortfall, then that's on them. It's not on me and my brother to handle that and deal with that. Now would I sit down with them and lay out all their options? Because I think that's what has to happen. That's where I'm at, George. What has to happen is you and all these other family members who are chipping in to bail them out need to stop chipping in. And we need to have a gathering in the living room and we're going to talk it out because your son can't deal with it and you guys have a problem and we all have fixed incomes. We can't keep doing this. But what we can do is sit down and get a whiteboard out or a legal pad out, George, and start laying everything out and see what they have, what they can sell, what the changes they need to make. They're not invalids. They're not 90. They have some options. And I think that's the conversation. None of you in the family are obligated to keep doing this.

[George Camel]

There's no legal obligation or moral obligation for any of you to cover their.

[Ken Coleman]

Expenses, nor is it your job to tell the nephew to, to shape up, you know what I mean? And scold a 40 year old grown man. It's not your job.

[Caller]

Correct. I mean, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

So therefore George and I don't have any advice on that because we wouldn't do that. That.

[George Camel]

So if we were in your shoes, what I would do is call a family meeting and go, listen guys, we all might have to chip in something. What can you chip in, if anything to, in order to float this for now and what expenses can we cut? How can we get more income in their life? And that might mean parents have to go do some part time work.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah.

[George Camel]

Are they, are they healthy?

[Caller]

That they are. And the father does have a part time job so you know, that's what's he do. But yeah, that he's a tutor.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. So he's, he's healthy enough to tutor. He's healthy enough to go to Walmart and stand there and greet everybody and put one of those little blue vests on and smile. You know, I could come up with 10 other things that he can do to come up for 40 hours a week. So based on George's scenario there we'd be going, okay, now what can we make? And then if she's healthy enough to do something, guess what? They can, they can work the same shift. She's on the grocery side of Walmart and he's on the general. I mean, I mean we gotta do something and, and we just don't sit there and we're the victims and, and I understand they had a hard journey and losing a child under any circumstances is just awful. And the mental health stuff, I'm sure they're mentally and emotionally exhausted.

[George Camel]

And it sounds like nephew had dealt with this trauma too.

[Ken Coleman]

Nephew's got it. But at this point you all need to come around them and give them that hug that George is describing. But it's an accountable hug. It's. You guys are going to be okay. We're going to walk with you on this. But we're not going to continue to fund this. That stops.

[Caller]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

You guys are actually enabling them out of a spirit of helpfulness.

[Caller]

Right, right. You're definitely right.

[George Camel]

Are they, are they paying a mortgage right now? Is their home paid off? The parents?

[Caller]

No, it is not. They do pay a mortgage.

[George Camel]

Okay, so here's a solution. We need to downsize into a place you can pay for in cash because that mortgage is, they can't afford it.

[Caller]

Well, actually the mortgage was given to them to another family member.

[George Camel]

How is that a gift? I don't understand. They can sell the house though. It's their house. Right.

[Caller]

It's yeah. But they're paying the other family member back the. The mortgage it. And it's a. It's a small amount.

[George Camel]

So their name is not on the mortgage?

[Caller]

Not that I'm aware of.

[George Camel]

Are they renting? Then I'm confused. Is their name on the deed?

[Caller]

Not that I'm aware.

[George Camel]

Oh my goodness.

[Ken Coleman]

Is this your brother? What's your relationship to this family you're telling us about? What's your relationship?

[Caller]

I'm a brother in law.

[Ken Coleman]

Aha.

[Caller]

It's my wife's. My wife's brother and his wife are the parents that we're talking about that are in financial straits that their son is trying to help.

[Ken Coleman]

It sounds.

[George Camel]

Why are they paying property taxes on a house they don't even own?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

There's a lot more questions here.

[Ken Coleman]

I think this is a dysfunctional Waltons show. You remember the Waltons, Joseph.

[Caller]

I remember the Wal.

[Ken Coleman]

We got Jim Bob. Jim Bob. And everybody's in the same. It's all too connected. And family members giving them a house and then they're paying. It's just. Doesn't it seem.

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Like we got too many people trying to help. And. And it's caused a. A real dysfunction. And. And. And you see it because you're not directly related. God bless you. You married into it. But there is so much enabling going on here. And it's all weird. There's the untangle.

[George Camel]

Yeah. The parent's life has been artificially propped up for a long time. And it's time to untether. Start to look at all the pieces and go. How can we make this sustainable for everyone and create healthy boundaries so that nobody's resentful.

[Caller]

Correct.

[George Camel]

And the parents. Parents can stand on their own even if that means downgrading their lifestyle substantially. That's what might need to happen to have a reality check. So I'm sorry you're now involved with this because it involves your wallet. But you might have to help assemble the family meeting. Get everyone on a call or in person. Go. We got to figure this out. This is not working for anyone.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And I would say that your wife and any other siblings need to lead with this. You've already got too much this on you. You know, to time for Jim Bob and John Boy to all live on their own. Hey, you guys. Health insurance costs are only moving one way and that way isn't down. And if higher costs aren't enough enough, the wait times to see your doctor are longer. And it's harder than ever to get anything approved through the bureaucracy. So if you feel like the system is working against you, try a biblically based alternative to health insurance.

[Caller]

Christian healthcare ministries. CHM is a health cost sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families.

[Ken Coleman]

Like yours take care of over $11.

[Caller]

Billion in medical bills since 1981.

[Ken Coleman]

CHM has also helped them stay true to their values and avoid miles of red tape. And CHM support goes far beyond meeting financial needs. They also help meet spiritual needs.

[Caller]

Members become part of a family who.

[Ken Coleman]

Will pray with them and for them.

[Caller]

When they experience a medical event.

[Ken Coleman]

So listen, y' all, there's a better way to take care of health care costs. CHM programs start as low as $98 a month. Month. So learn more today and [e-mail] budget. That's chministries.org budget. Listen, your home is your most expensive asset, and now you're ready to sell.

[George Camel]

Fast and for a lot of money.

[Ken Coleman]

But in this wackadoodle real estate market.

[George Camel]

One mistake could cost you tens of thousands of dollars.

[Ken Coleman]

This ain't amateur hour. You need a pro in your corner.

[George Camel]

Someone who knows how to price your.

[Ken Coleman]

Home right, market it well, and negotiate the best deal.

[George Camel]

That's where a Ramsey trusted real est estate agent comes in. To find one near you, go to ramseysolutions.com agent. That's ramseysolutions.com agent.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, we got Derek and Savannah joining us from the Columbus, Ohio, area out on the debt free stage. Welcome.

[George Camel]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

How are we feeling out there right now? A little nervous. Of course.

[Caller]

She's not nervous.

[Ken Coleman]

She's not nervous. Well, you look happy, and that tells me you guys are debt free. Is that right?

[George Camel]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, let's get the facts. How much debt did you pay off?

[George Camel]

422,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Whoa. And how long?

[George Camel]

72 months.

[Ken Coleman]

Whoa. This is a journey. Yes. Does this include the house?

[George Camel]

Yes. Was it all mortgage?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, this all was mortgage.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness.

[Ken Coleman]

Goodness gracious.

[George Camel]

That is weird. And we love it.

[Ken Coleman]

We love that.

[George Camel]

So what was the range of income?

[Ken Coleman]

There you go.

[George Camel]

So we started out at 110, and then we bumped it to a little over 200.

[Ken Coleman]

I always love to ask, how'd the bump happen? Or what? What did happen?

[Caller]

Well, we're grocery department lead, so during.

[George Camel]

COVID we just worked a ton of overtime. And then I also had a side hustle with boarding dogs.

[Ken Coleman]

No, kid.

[George Camel]

Wow. And has that kept up?

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yes.

[George Camel]

Okay, that's awesome.

[Ken Coleman]

Now, what does that mean? The way you said that.

[George Camel]

That means Christmas time, we have eight dogs and Three kids, and we're just going.

[Ken Coleman]

You just like to be busy, don't you?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

You don't know what peace and serenity feels like other than financial peace that we now know. Okay, gotcha. Wow. So what happened 72 months ago for you guys to look at each other and go, all right, we're going to pay our house off? Well, in 2019, we actually separated. We were going through a really rough patch in our life and our marriage, so we separated. And through all that, we came back together, and we realized just how much.

[Caller]

We love each other.

[Ken Coleman]

And we were able to go through a lot of counseling and work on a lot of things, and we decided.

[Caller]

That we were gonna build a new life. Yep.

[Ken Coleman]

Go through this life together, and we're gonna work really, really hard together and build a good marriage and build a good life.

[Caller]

And one of the ways we decided to do that was we wanted to.

[Ken Coleman]

Not owe anybody any money.

[George Camel]

So this was much bigger than just paying off the house.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yeah.

[George Camel]

This was a symbol of a new chapter of unity.

[Ken Coleman]

How long were you guys separated for?

[Caller]

Probably six months or so.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, you probably didn't plan to talk about that, but I'm. But I just. I just feel a sense right now that I need to just lean in on something. I know you can hear. Handle it, but I just feel like there's some people watching and listening that are either separated or thinking about it. I just want them to hear some hope. And here's my question in the six months, and you both can weigh in on this. What had to happen in you guys and between you guys to actually say, we're not going to quit. We're going to dive back in. I'm just curious.

[George Camel]

I think, just realizing, like, what life.

[Ken Coleman]

Truly is, if you're.

[George Camel]

I mean, I was not financially secure on my own, and then you have these kids. It's just. It's terrifying. And then you left your person that you truly love. It's just all weighed in on my part.

[Ken Coleman]

No, absolutely. And just thinking about the life that.

[Caller]

We could have together if we actually got on board with the same thing.

[Ken Coleman]

We got married really, really young.

[Caller]

We're both high school sweethearts.

[Ken Coleman]

So when we had kids really young, we thought we. We knew what we were doing. We had no. We had no idea.

[Caller]

No idea.

[Ken Coleman]

By the way, nobody does. Nobody does.

[Caller]

So we decided to have kids really young.

[Ken Coleman]

And then just being able to look back at our life and be able to make the decisions that. I mean, we both loved each other very, very much.

[Caller]

So.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. I'm so glad. I'm so glad you fought. That's really great.

[George Camel]

So what role did money fights and money problems play in all this? Where this was. Was this, like, the beacon of, like, if we're gonna get on back on board, we're gonna pay off the house and it's gonna be this new chapter financially?

[Ken Coleman]

Not really. It was just a byproduct of it. Like, we got on board with so many other things, and then we decided we wanted to, like, lay a foundation for how our life was gonna be.

[George Camel]

Part of the marriage reset. It was. All right. Part of our money stuff. We're gonna get this mortgage knocked out.

[Caller]

Absolutely.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow.

[Caller]

Absolutely.

[George Camel]

And you stuck with it six years. A long time to do anything. Yeah. Kids, it's like you got to figure this out and give them a straight path. Yeah. Was it. Was it pretty linear? Like, we're just going to make this extra payment every month or were there. Was there seasons?

[Ken Coleman]

No, we just.

[Caller]

We just, like Dave says, we just.

[Ken Coleman]

Try to live intentionally and being able to live intentionally.

[Caller]

We've been able to do just amazing.

[Ken Coleman]

Things with our kids.

[Caller]

We've been able to travel everywhere and.

[Ken Coleman]

Make a bunch of good memories. And we just decided, like, when we.

[Caller]

Reset our marriage, we decided we were.

[Ken Coleman]

Going to decide what was important for.

[Caller]

For us and the life that we wanted to live. And we both decided to focus more on, like, experiences.

[Ken Coleman]

And the best way to do that was to be able to not owe anybody any money. So how much? So what? But what George was asking there is, is, was this an X amount of money you put towards it every month over the 72 months, or were there times where you guys. You had a big influx maybe, and you put, you know, how extreme was it over the 72 months to pay off a $422,000 house?

[Caller]

Yeah. No, no, no. It was. It wasn't. It wasn't that extreme. It was just. Honestly, just living intentionally.

[Ken Coleman]

Consistent.

[Caller]

Yeah, just whatever money.

[George Camel]

So you still lived your life. You still went places and had some great experiences.

[Caller]

We've been able to do amazing things.

[Ken Coleman]

With our kids and build memories that.

[Caller]

They'Ll be able to tell their kids about.

[Ken Coleman]

We're truly trying to change our family tree.

[George Camel]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow. So if I'm seeing This right, it's about 60, 000 a year. You averaged roughly to put this. To put this away. And what was it like, knowing your story now when you guys made the last payment on the house? Take us back to that.

[Caller]

Yeah, I remember I was sitting there.

[Ken Coleman]

Just at the gym or something. I remember looking around, I was like, wait, I don't owe anybody any money. I was like, it's just a completely, completely surreal feeling. Yeah.

[Caller]

And that's an unreal feeling for me.

[George Camel]

When I lost my childhood home when I was younger, we never had, we were never financially secure. So knowing that and like, wow, I, I, this is my house and this is my, for my kids. It's, it's breathtaking.

[Ken Coleman]

And we're seeing a picture here on YouTube and, and I just, knowing what I know, I'm, I'm coming up on 27 years of marriage on Friday and I just know having moved several times, you know, a house is a true nest for a woman, isn't it? Yes. Yes. And now this is really your nest. There's no bank name on this nest?

[George Camel]

Nope.

[Ken Coleman]

That's kind of awesome. How old are the kids?

[George Camel]

We have 11 year old, a 10 year old, and then a 3 year old.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, wow.

[George Camel]

Yep.

[Caller]

Oh, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Good looking crew there.

[George Camel]

That's incredible. So this home now represents a new future family tree change, safety, security that you never had growing up. What's next for you guys?

[Caller]

We just have, we have a lot of travel plan and we're gonna keep.

[Ken Coleman]

Building on making a bunch of good memories with our kids.

[Caller]

And it's just very important for us to change our family trees, but set.

[Ken Coleman]

Them up for their kids and so forth.

[George Camel]

Do the older kids understand what went down? Like, are they in the know?

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, a little bit. We, I mean, we've talked about the problems that we've had in the past.

[Ken Coleman]

We try to be open about it so they can learn from it and, you know.

[George Camel]

Yeah, yep.

[Caller]

We let them know, like our journey.

[George Camel]

And we're trying to set the whole budget with the kids because they're kind.

[Caller]

Of learning so they make their own money.

[George Camel]

They have allowances every week. They actually help with the dog business, so they buy their own things and they know my money comes from work. And they see, they have seen mom and dad work really hard, that's for sure.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. I want you to encourage couples out there that are listening and watching what is in your mind the key to staying with this journey.

[George Camel]

Communication.

[Ken Coleman]

And then just, I'd say just building.

[Caller]

A partnership that motivates you and you want to, like, once you start building momentum and you start seeing a future that, and you make progress towards it.

[Ken Coleman]

It'S, it keeps you working hard, that's for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. I just love that story, George. It's, it's, it's so fantastic. Who was your biggest supporters on the journey? He was mine. You guys are like a Hallmark card.

[Caller]

Honestly, we were just.

[Ken Coleman]

We didn't tell too many people about it. We just. We just relied on each other.

[Caller]

And then, like I said, we had.

[Ken Coleman]

A future that we were both working towards.

[George Camel]

Just low key. What's the house worth?

[Caller]

About a little over 700.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow.

[George Camel]

And what's in the nest egg and retirement accounts?

[Caller]

750.

[George Camel]

We're looking at baby steps millionaires.

[Ken Coleman]

Baby steps millionaires right there. And how old are you, if you don't mind me asking?

[Caller]

I'm 32.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm 34.

[George Camel]

This is mind blowing.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, listen, that's exciting. We're talking about crazy wealth that they're going to be building. Really crazy wealth with the kiddos.

[George Camel]

I love it.

[Ken Coleman]

Really good stuff. All right, you guys ready to go? Are the kiddos watching or listening? Watching.

[Caller]

They said cool.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, we had to be cool.

[George Camel]

Don't be cringe, mom.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, we got Derek and Savannah from the Columbus, Ohio area. They paid off $422,000. It was their house. In 72 months, making a range of income from 110 to 200,000. They are truly changing their family tree. What was once a separation is now awesome, beautiful marriage. And we got to see it. Derek and Savannah, take it away. Let's hear your debt free scream. Three, two, one.

[Caller]

We're debt free.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes, they are. And they were cool, too. The kids won't be cringed over that.

[George Camel]

There's nothing cringe about debt freedom, I'll.

[Ken Coleman]

Tell you that much. And young. Younger than you, George.

[George Camel]

Incredible. I know. I feel like I. I gotta step up my game.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, well, a couple new bomber jackets will do it. That'll do it. All right, George. You know, it's that time of year where kids are graduating high school and college. And with that time of year, it's kind of a mixed bag of emotions. The celebration, the excitement, moving on to a new chapter. But all of a sudden, Matt, massive reality for the young people. The existential crisis that's right for high school kids. Decide, I'm going to college. What major do I pick? Where's that going to put me in the real world when I need a job? Then we got college kids coming out with a lot of debt, many of them. And they're going, I've been here for four years now. I got to get out in the real world. What do I do with my life? And the answer is, find the work you're wired to do. And so we Have a book called the get clear, your career assessment. Find the work you're wired to do. It was a best seller, comes with an assessment that measures three specific wires, if you will. George. The wire of talent. That's what you do best. Think of skills. The wire of passion. This is work you really enjoy doing. You lose track of time when you're doing it. And then the third wire is a sense of value and mission. In other words, what results do I want to put out into the world? And so we measure those three wires and we put it together with all the details and someone can see, oh, this is the work wired to do. So that's a quick summary of what the assessment does. And then the book itself is me coaching the results with that individual. So you get your assessment results and it's about a 45 minute read. And this is the book, just came out this week. Find the work you're wired to do. Student edition. Comes with the student assessment. It's 34.99. This is a great gift for the student who's graduating in your life or certainly any student. But people are thinking graduation gifts. And this is a fabulous, fabulous resource source. You can get [e-mail] store. That's ramseysolutions.com store. All right. Rebecca is up in Atlanta, Georgia. Rebecca, how can we help?

[Caller]

Hi, thank you so much for taking my call. Well, my situation right now is my husband and I, we closed on a house back in 2023. I got laid off the same week. They closed unexpectedly and we've been underwater ever since. I'm trying to. I guess I need advice on what would be the best route for us to take.

[George Camel]

What were you making?

[Caller]

I was making around 80 and my husband currently makes 75.

[George Camel]

Okay. Are you able to cover your basic bills with his income right now?

[Caller]

Barely. We cannot afford our mortgage. Yeah, we can't afford our mortgage at all.

[George Camel]

Are you behind?

[Caller]

Yes.

[George Camel]

How many months?

[Caller]

A year? We were on forbearance. We just resumed payments last month.

[George Camel]

Oh, my goodness.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

What's the plan with the mortgage company? What's the latest communication?

[Caller]

So the latest communication is they reduced our loan by like $500 and we currently pay 3,300amonth. And we're currently like on a trial right now. So, like we have to pay April, May and June and then whatever we didn't pay for the past year, they're going to put on the back of our loan and extend our loan.

[George Camel]

Why haven't you guys moved out and sold the place?

[Caller]

Honestly, I wanted to do that since last year. My husband, he doesn't want to.

[George Camel]

He doesn't have a choice. They're going to take it away from you.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Camel]

There's not wants right now. It's what's the reality of our situation and then what's been going on with your job and income for the last year?

[Caller]

I've been. I just had a baby a couple months ago, so I've been home with. With. We have three kids, so I stay home with them. And I have been looking for work. I've done some jobs here and there, but right now everything is on him.

[Ken Coleman]

What does he do and how much does he make again?

[Caller]

Sure. He works in sales, and he earned 75. 75,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Is he straight commission?

[Caller]

No, no, he's salary.

[Ken Coleman]

What's he selling?

[Caller]

Bonuses. He sells cars.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Might I make a suggestion that he start looking? I mean, you guys got a lot going on here, so this is like, I don't want to give you too many things, but if I'm him and I realize that the skill of selling has no limit to it. It's just he's got to find the right thing to sell. And if I were him, I would be treating this like his life depended on it, and I would find a better sales job. And let's get a raise. Because if we can get him up over a hundred thousand with a. With a lack of a ceiling, you know, and he can keep going, you guys need that momentum. I still think you need to sell this house. I think he needs to swallow whatever pride he has on this deal or whatever's going on, and let's reset. Okay? You got a baby. Let's. Let's reduce our expenses and introduce some peace and serenity into your family. And while he's rebuilding, in other words, a sales career where he can very, very well. He's got to happen to this situation, and he's letting it happen to him.

[Caller]

Yeah, yeah, I agree. I mean, I mentioned to him about selling the house. We've had family, you know, loan us money, but I feel like we're just kicking the can down the road. Like we're getting by, but it's not relieving our situation. Like, we. We are at a negative each month.

[George Camel]

Yeah, this isn't sustainable, and it hasn't been.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the beginning. This really is an income issue. I mean, there's other issues, but, like, the solve on this is sell the house. But then let's make sure we get our income to a much better place and now start operating within that. Yeah, I mean, I don't know what needs to be said to him. I wish I could get him on the phone.

[George Camel]

I think it's going to have to take a foreclosure for him to realize this is serious, and I don't want it to get to that point. Yeah, that's going to be traumatic emotionally and financially if you guys go through that. So you need to start looking at options of where you can live, you know, where you can actually afford it.

[Ken Coleman]

How much do you owe on the house total?

[Caller]

We owe 470.

[Ken Coleman]

What's it worth right now?

[Caller]

It's worth 6, 650.

[George Camel]

And you guys have any debt.

[Caller]

Right now? We don't have any credit cards. I have some credit cards debt, but he doesn't have any.

[George Camel]

Okay, how much. How much do you have?

[Caller]

I have around $12,000 in credit card debt.

[George Camel]

What other debt do you have as a family?

[Caller]

As a family? We have a car note of $400 a month.

[George Camel]

What's left on the loan?

[Caller]

On the car? Yeah, we just got it.

[George Camel]

You just got it? You're telling me in the midst of this crisis, you decided to take out a car note loan?

[Caller]

We. We needed a car. The car that I had. Just.

[George Camel]

What did the car cost?

[Caller]

It's. It was a $30,000 car.

[George Camel]

You will not convince me that you needed a $30,000 car.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, you didn't.

[Caller]

You may.

[Ken Coleman]

You may have needed a 5,000 or 7,000 or $10,000 car. You know, you called us, and we're not trying to beat up on you at all. But, yeah, we've heard this call call thousands of times. Just had a different name and different location. But the answer to your question, what should we do? You should sell this house. And you should both get very serious about resetting the way you guys treat your finances, because this problem will stay with you even if you were to sell the house. So selling the house isn't this parachute, but it is the thing that needs to happen so you guys can actually get a rebuild, reset, because you can pay off all your credit card debt plus the car and be able to start over.

[Caller]

Right? Right.

[Ken Coleman]

It's got to happen.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Here's what I'm trying to get at, George. And I can tell you this, and tell you this and tell you this and tell you what you need to do, but until you all realize that you are not victims in this, because I think you're both acting and feeling like you're victims of your own stupidity, and we've all Done. Stupid. With money, okay? All of us, George and I included. So this is not like some sort of. I'm not casting shame here. I'm saying at some point we all have to go, yes, I did. Stupid. Dave Ramsey himself has said he has a PhD in dumb. So we've done it, but we didn't sit there and soak in it. We said, oh, gosh, that sucks. I don't like where we're at right now. So we are going to do more things that suck, which means we have to sell our house. And that's really, really going to suck. But we are. We're going to be able to get out of it. George, I want to give you the final word here.

[George Camel]

Well, Rebecca, I'm going to gift you guys a financial coaching session with a Ramsey trained financial coach to walk with you through this. I need you and your husband to join the call. Will you commit to that?

[Caller]

Yes, absolutely. 100%.

[George Camel]

Okay. I think if we sit down together, make a plan, make a budget, we're going to get the reality of this and then get a game plan to move forward and keep this house afraid for Lucky, but likely selling it in the next few months.

[Caller]

Okay?

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Caller]

Sounds good.

[George Camel]

Hey, what are you still doing here? You know the rest of the show's happening on the Ramsey Network app, right? So you got to jump over there to continue watching. You can download it for free. Just go to your app store, type in Ramsey Network, it's completely free, and I'll drop a link in the show notes to make it easy for you. So if you're watching on the app, you're in luck. But if you're watching anywhere else, this show is over for you. So jump onto the app and let the fun continue. All right, Go on now. Don't make it weird. Okay. I got nowhere to go, so you need to go. Okay, bye. Bye now. All right, this is getting weird over there, guys.

[Ken Coleman]

What are doing? We. We do.