Your Future Self Is Counting on You

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ramsey Show – "Your Future Self Is Counting on You"

Release Date: June 24, 2025

In this engaging episode of The Ramsey Show, host Ken Coleman, alongside co-host Jade Warshaw, delves into a variety of financial challenges faced by listeners. The episode, titled "Your Future Self Is Counting on You," emphasizes the importance of making prudent financial decisions to secure one's future. Here’s a detailed breakdown of the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode.

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1. Stephanie’s Debt Dilemma – Oklahoma City [02:18 - 08:45]

Caller: Stephanie, an active-duty military spouse, is grappling with a significant debt load, including $25,000 in credit card debt and auto loans totaling approximately $23,800. With savings of just $8,300, she contemplates whether her husband should withdraw $15,000 from his retirement funds to address their debts.

Discussion: Ken Coleman strongly advises against tapping into retirement savings, highlighting that such withdrawals can lead to taxes and penalties, ultimately exacerbating their financial strain. Instead, he introduces the "Baby Steps" approach, a cornerstone of Dave Ramsey's financial strategy.

Notable Quote:

Stephanie: "I feel like there just has to be another way."
Ken Coleman [02:34]: "It's a bad choice… he'd be taxed on it and… not even enough to pay off the debt."

Conclusion: The recommendation is to sell the truck to eliminate part of the debt and use the savings strategically to tackle credit card balances, thereby avoiding the pitfalls of retirement fund withdrawals.

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2. Curtis’s Medical Bills – Baltimore [10:47 - 14:50]

Caller: Curtis is facing an unexpected $30,000 medical bill for his wife's oral surgery. With an HSA of $15,000, cash savings, and investments, he seeks advice on whether to utilize his HSA funds or his cash reserves.

Discussion: Ken and Jade explore the emotional and financial implications of using HSA funds versus cash. They lean towards using cash first to preserve HSA benefits, emphasizing the psychological relief of avoiding debt-induced stress.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [12:00]: "If you can get out of it and get into a much more reasonable living situation then you've got some margin."

Conclusion: Use cash reserves before dipping into HSA funds to maintain financial stability and protect retirement savings.

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3. MacKenzie’s Graduate School Plans – Provo [14:50 - 20:45]

Caller: MacKenzie and her husband plan to attend law and medical school, potentially accumulating $400,000 to $500,000 in student debt. They are evaluating whether to prioritize paying off existing student loans before taking on more debt.

Discussion: Ken emphasizes the importance of paying off current debts to achieve peace of mind and financial security before embarking on further education. He underscores the risks associated with escalating debt levels and advocates for a disciplined approach to financial planning.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [19:30]: "Choose no stress."

Conclusion: Prioritize paying off existing student loans to ensure financial freedom and reduce future debt burdens.

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4. Laura’s Career Transition – San Francisco [45:30 - 59:17]

Caller: Laura, nearing 58, faces termination from her long-term biotech position and contemplates moving East to be closer to family. With a substantial severance package and a house that could net over $1 million upon sale, she seeks guidance on whether to cash out or remain employed.

Discussion: Ken and Jade analyze Laura's robust financial position, encouraging her to leverage her assets to relocate without financial strain. They highlight the flexibility and security her finances provide, allowing her to pursue personal and familial goals.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [50:30]: "I think you're going to be fine. Follow your heart on this."

Conclusion: Given her financial stability, Laura is advised to pursue her relocation plans, ensuring she makes informed decisions about her assets and investments.

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5. Lori’s Enjoyable Retirement – Columbus, Georgia [54:34 - 74:46]

Caller: Lori, aged 71, enjoys a comfortable retirement with a monthly income of $5,300 from Social Security, a pension, and other sources. She spends an additional $3,000 monthly on leisure activities like traveling and theater.

Discussion: Ken and Jade assess Lori’s financial health, concluding that her spending on "fun" is sustainable given her substantial income and savings. They encourage her to continue enjoying her retirement without financial guilt.

Notable Quote:

Lori: "It's definitely stressful."
Ken Coleman [58:44]: "Good for you. That’s exactly where everybody wants to be."

Conclusion: Lori is affirmed in her financial choices, with Ken and Jade endorsing her ability to balance enjoyment and financial prudence effectively.

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6. Matt’s Investment Queries – Lynchburg, Virginia [85:08 - 111:13]

Caller: Matt seeks advice on selecting effective investment funds, expressing concerns that many financial investors fail to outperform basic S&P 500 funds.

Discussion: Ken and Jade recommend thorough vetting of investment advisors, emphasizing the importance of transparent communication and track record analysis. They stress the need for investors to understand and feel confident in their investment choices.

Notable Quote:

Matt: "How do you determine or what are some good signs or questions to like pick out who's going to actually be just the general funds that you could go get yourself?"
Ken Coleman [110:07]: "Your advisor is there to advise you on what they think you ought to do… you should have a clear understanding…"

Conclusion: Investors should select advisors who are transparent, have a proven track record, and align with their financial goals to ensure effective investment strategies.

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7. Aaron’s Credit Card Points Debate – Dallas, Texas [117:29 - 126:58]

Caller: Aaron and his wife are debating the efficacy of using credit cards solely for points accumulation. His wife views the strategy as inefficient and risky, while Aaron advocates for leveraging credit card benefits.

Discussion: Ken and Jade side with Aaron's wife, arguing that the disproportionate spending required to earn minimal points negates the benefits. They caution against habitual credit card use, emphasizing the potential for debt accumulation despite rewards.

Notable Quote:

Ken Coleman [124:45]: "We don't want to be glib with you, but that's our position on why cash back or points isn't worth the temptation."

Conclusion: Using credit cards primarily for points is discouraged due to the high costs and risks involved. Instead, maintaining financial discipline without relying on credit card rewards is advised.

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Key Takeaways:

1. Prioritize Debt Repayment: Avoid withdrawing from retirement funds; instead, focus on eliminating high-interest debts using structured approaches like the Baby Steps.

2. Financial Discipline: Whether dealing with unexpected medical bills or planning for future education, maintaining discipline in financial decisions is crucial for long-term stability.

3. Assessing Financial Health: Regularly evaluate your financial situation to ensure that spending aligns with your income and long-term goals, especially during major life transitions.

4. Effective Investing: Choose investment advisors who are transparent, experienced, and align with your financial objectives to maximize investment returns.

5. Credit Card Caution: Refrain from using credit cards solely for rewards, as the associated costs often outweigh the benefits, leading to unnecessary debt.

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Notable Quotes:

• Ken Coleman [02:34]: "It's a bad choice… he'd be taxed on it and… not even enough to pay off the debt."

• Stephanie [02:43]: "I feel like we need to get engaged with our baby steps partner."

• Ken Coleman [19:30]: "Choose no stress."

• Ken Coleman [50:30]: "I think you're going to be fine. Follow your heart on this."

• Lori [58:44]: "Good for you. That’s exactly where everybody wants to be."

• Ken Coleman [124:45]: "We don't want to be glib with you, but that's our position on why cash back or points isn't worth the temptation."

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This episode underscores the importance of thoughtful financial planning, disciplined budgeting, and making informed decisions to ensure a prosperous and stress-free future. Whether addressing debt, investment strategies, or lifestyle choices, Ken and Jade provide actionable advice grounded in the principles of financial empowerment and responsibility.

Transcript

[Jade Warshaw]

Brought to you by the EveryDollar app.

[Ken Coleman]

Start budgeting for free today. This is the Ramsey show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their work and their relationships. The phone number to jump in today is 888-8255-225882-55225. Talented Jade Warshaw. I am Ken Coleman and partner. You're looking very bright today. Yes, I like the. The yellow.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's a reflection of the way it feels outside.

[Ken Coleman]

It is scorching hot everywhere. Folks, welcome to Summer. Let's also welcome Stephanie as we get started in Oklahoma City. Stephanie, how can we hike?

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, then.

[Ken Coleman]

Hello? Stephanie?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you there?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, I'm here.

[Ken Coleman]

I feel like we're there with somebody else, too.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's a meeting.

[Ken Coleman]

Are we in a meeting?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hello?

[Ken Coleman]

Stephanie, are you someplace where we can only hear you?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, sorry, I have a contractor here. Yes, I'm here.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, tell the contractor, wait a few minutes, pal. Get yourself a Gatorade. We'll get back to you shortly. How can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi, I am just calling because we are going over our finances and we're looking at our debt ratio and my husband is thinking that he needs to pull out about 14, 15,000 from his retirement savings. He is active duty military, and I feel like there just has to be another way.

[Ken Coleman]

For what? What are we pulling that? What is he considering pulling the money out for?

[Jade Warshaw]

To pull that out to pay off some debt. We've got about credit card. $25,000 in credit card debt altogether. And then we have. He has a truck. I have an SUV and we have 15,000 on his truck. And then we have 8,800 on my SUV and we have about $8,300 in savings. And we homeschool. So we are a one income family.

[Ken Coleman]

So the 8,800 you just mentioned, that's your total savings.

[Jade Warshaw]

In our savings right now is $8,316.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm sorry, 8,300. But my point is that's all the savings you have in this whole world is 8300.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. Well, I don't know how familiar you are with our baby steps. I'm going to bring in my partner here on this one. But the answer to the question, and Jade will explain why. No, I understand. There's an intensity when somebody kind of goes, all right, I'm ready to get rid of this debt. And you think, where can I get the biggest chunk of change? But simply put, you're going to get taxed on. That makes zero Financial sense. Not to mention that's your retirement money. But Jade will walk you through this. You kind of need to get engaged with our baby steps partner. Come in here and tell her all the whys in the house.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, so I don't like the idea of pulling from retirement. Is the 15,000 all that you have in his retirement?

[Jade Warshaw]

I mean, that was just. He said, my husband Kyle said that he just has to look more into it. He seems like he's pretty sad, but I just, I have a bad feeling and I don't want to make a quick decision without.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, it's a bad choice.

[Jade Warshaw]

Everything.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's definitely a bad choice. You're correct. I mean a, he's going to be taxed on it and he's going to get hit with those fees. And even if it's not his only money, I would hate for him to drain that. And it's not even enough to pay off the debt. So I was just wondering how he arrived at 15,000. So I would say immediately no to that in any capacity. By the way, I'm never going to suggest that you borrow from a 401k unless you were, you know, maybe avoiding foreclosure. But in this case, listen, the good news is you've got a little bit of money saved and we can attack this and really see some headway. Very quickly. Let's talk about these cars because I think there's probably some wiggle room here. Tell me about the, the fifteen thousand dollar truck. What's it worth?

[Jade Warshaw]

So it's a lot. I'm not. So our. We have $15,501.86 left on it. It's about $442 a month payment. It's a 2016.

[Unknown Speaker]

What's it worth if you were to sell it? Private party.

[Jade Warshaw]

I thought I had all the numbers for you guys, but I did not look that up. It's a 2016 Ford King Ranch. So I'm okay. I don't know.

[Unknown Speaker]

So let's do a little homework. That'll be thing one on your homework list tonight is I want you to find out what that, what the value is. Private sale, not trade in private sale. And if you find that, you know, you can sell it and maybe get a couple thousand, then I would do that. Or even if you could break even, I might say, hey, let's sell that and can we scrounge up $5,000 and get a $5,000 truck? And now you're, you've made headway of 10,000 right on that. And Then. Or what you could do is go ahead and you could sell that truck outright and then take some of the saved money. Yeah. And put that right towards a $5,000 truck. And then take the other 2,000 and put it towards the SUV and start knocking that thing down. That's what I would do.

[Jade Warshaw]

And go down to one car, though.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, no, no. Because you still have the SUV that's worth 8800. Right. You're probably not going to get, you know, much more for that. I would probably go ahead and pay that one off. But then you said you've got $8,000 saved. So if you can unload that truck and you're not upside down on it, you can just kind of get out of it and you're right side up. I'd get out of that and then take 5,000 and buy a cash truck.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you familiar with our baby steps, Stephanie?

[Jade Warshaw]

I have your book here, and I'm actually. I have something.

[Ken Coleman]

Let's just roll through it real fast. Okay, so baby step one. No, but I just. I feel like we gotta kind of get right back to the basics. Cause here's exactly what we would tell you to do. Baby step one is $1,000 in savings. That's to cover your garden variety emergency. You have $8,300 and some change. Okay. Baby step two is take the smallest debt, and we attack that with a vengeance. And once we get rid of that, we take the minimum payment on that and everything else. We've been attacking the extra money, and it goes to the second largest debt, and we go smallest to largest for momentum. Do you understand what I'm saying? Okay. So that means that today what we would tell you to do is you're going to move $7,300. That's going to leave you with $1,000. If you're still with me, say yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so we've got $7,300 right now to attack the smallest debt. What is your smallest debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Probably my target credit card. It's got, like, $197 on it.

[Ken Coleman]

Great. So now we have $7100, and we're going to cut the target credit card up. Are you still with me, Stephanie? Say yes.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, so what's the second largest debt?

[Jade Warshaw]

Our Platinum American Express card.

[Ken Coleman]

How much?

[Jade Warshaw]

$3,749.

[Unknown Speaker]

Great.

[Ken Coleman]

Now the math's getting more complex for me. I was not a math major. But we got about $4,000 or $3,000 left, right? $3,000 left. Right. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

And so you keep putting that money in there. Now the other option, Jade, is would you put it on the car to get the car situation? Because I know you were talking about that. So that's our baby, Stephanie. That's what you're doing next.

[Unknown Speaker]

So Ken is exactly right. That's. That's the way the baby steps work. A lot of times though, in, in these, in these equations, there's a car situation that we can unload some debt very, very quickly. And that's why I suggested that possibly you sell this truck. Depending on what it's worth. If you look it up and it's worth 13, then you keep it, right? And you start paying it off. But if you find that you can unload it and get that $442 back in your pocket every month, think how quickly you could do that debt snowball that Ken was just talking about.

[Ken Coleman]

Let's say the truck's worth 20 grand because it's a King Ranch. Yeah, I don't think that's unreasonable. I'm making that up. I have no idea. But let's say it's worth 20 grand. You owe 15,5. Like Jade said. You pay that off today. Okay, now we've got the profit that you had left over, plus the 7,300. Excuse me, the 8,300. Minus $1,000. 7,000 DOL. That's how you make up quick ground, but then you attack it. So hang on the line. What can we give them? They got the book, but they need every dollar.

[Unknown Speaker]

Let's make sure you have every dollar. You need that immediately.

[Ken Coleman]

I get it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Switching banks is a pain in the. You know what.

[Ken Coleman]

But if your bank doesn't line up with your money goals, it's time to.

[Jade Warshaw]

Make the switch to Fairwinds Credit Union.

[Ken Coleman]

Listen, you guys know how I feel about big banks.

[Jade Warshaw]

They make money when you stay broke. Charging you overdraft fees, pushing credit cards and telling you debt is normal.

[Ken Coleman]

And that's why I only work with folks who help you, not just profit off of you.

[Jade Warshaw]

Fairwinds is different. They're owned by their members, their non profit and they share our values. They even advertise with billboards saying they want their members to be debt free.

[Ken Coleman]

So they built the small checking and.

[Jade Warshaw]

Savings bundle just for Ramsey fans.

[Ken Coleman]

You can open your account online in minutes and here's what you get.

[Jade Warshaw]

Free checking with no minimums and no monthly fees.

[Ken Coleman]

Savings with a high APY to help.

[Jade Warshaw]

You in baby step one and beyond. And a mobile app that actually makes sense.

[Ken Coleman]

Plus you also get access to over.

[Jade Warshaw]

33,000 fee free ATMs and more than 5,000 affiliated branches nationwide. So don't settle for a bank that's slow your progress down.

[Ken Coleman]

Choose one that's built to help you win with money. Go to Fairwinds.org Ramsey and open your Smart Bundle today. Fairwinds is federally insured by the ncu. All right, Curtis is joining us now in Baltimore. Moore, Curtis, how can we help today?

[Unknown Speaker]

Hey, guys, how you doing?

[Ken Coleman]

Good. What's going on?

[Jade Warshaw]

Appreciate you taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

So I got an email today that.

[Jade Warshaw]

About dropped me out of my seat. We have an unexpected medical bill that came up. My wife needs some oral dental surgery and we're looking at like $30,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Whoa. Are they putting a whole new jaw in?

[Jade Warshaw]

Pretty much all. It's. Yeah, it's.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's to that point.

[Jade Warshaw]

Lots of new teeth. We'll just. We'll leave it at that.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, well, give us. Give us a little more.

[Jade Warshaw]

I have the money, right?

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, great.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm a. I'm a diligent saver investor.

[Jade Warshaw]

I have no debt other than my mortgage. And so this is kind of a tactical question. I'm one of these guys who has.

[Ken Coleman]

Put a lot of money into my.

[Jade Warshaw]

HSA over the years and was planning on just sitting on it until retirement to try and take advantage of that.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Trickle triple tax savings.

[Ken Coleman]

So I have plenty of money in.

[Jade Warshaw]

My HSA, which I could tap into, but I'm only 41 years old. I also have the money in cash and I have it in investments. And I'm just. Do I break my rule and spend some money out of my HSA and just move on and say that's what it's there, that's what it's there for?

[Ken Coleman]

Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Would you use your hsa, Ken? I would just use my cash. Do you have it. Is it invested in your hsa?

[Ken Coleman]

Why? Tell me why.

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, I would do it. So the way my HSA say is you have to keep a thousand liquid and then you invest the rest. And since the rest is invested, I wouldn't want to unplug it.

[Ken Coleman]

I see what you're saying.

[Unknown Speaker]

So if I had the cash, I'd. I would use the cash. That's what Jade would do. I'm not saying you're wrong, by the way, to use your hs.

[Ken Coleman]

So there's no right or wrong on this one, correct?

[Unknown Speaker]

No, no, no.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. I don't know why I might gut.

[Unknown Speaker]

I like my cash because he's got the money. If he was calling in and he had like 10 over here.

[Ken Coleman]

That's an interesting point. You know what it is for me? I don't know if this helps you at all, Curtis, but I love that she asked me about this psychologically. It's all psychological. That money has been pulled away for health.

[Unknown Speaker]

You're right.

[Ken Coleman]

And my cash. Here's no one loves paying $30,000 for any health care procedure.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, they don't.

[Ken Coleman]

Much less your wife's like, I'm just being honest.

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, wait a minute. You're saying at least it better be your own.

[Ken Coleman]

I think the psychological part is better if you go, well, my knees about ready to fall off. Vers. Because I'm just saying he's a good man. Yeah. I'm saying it's tough psychologically, and I guess that's why I went to. Well, that's what the HSA is for, and I think I'm gonna do that. I want to leave my cash alone.

[Unknown Speaker]

But I'm thinking about it on interest. Obviously, since the HSA money is invested, the hope is that you're earning. Yeah. You're earning a better interest rate than the money invested in you. Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

My point is, I needed to confess.

[Unknown Speaker]

But I agree with you.

[Ken Coleman]

I think I agree with you. The better play is to let that money continue to build and use the cash. But gosh, it doesn't very good to me.

[Unknown Speaker]

It never feels good. I mean, even it. Even it being I'm going with you never feels good.

[Ken Coleman]

You know what?

[Unknown Speaker]

This.

[Ken Coleman]

This pains me cuz we on my side. Well, we like a we. We like each other, but we like a good spat.

[Unknown Speaker]

We do.

[Ken Coleman]

We do. We like a professional. And I think this is hard for me. I'm going, Jade.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. All right. Well, thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

Appreciate you guys.

[Unknown Speaker]

All right, Curtis.

[Ken Coleman]

Absolutely. That was easy enough.

[Unknown Speaker]

Listen, his wife's getting a new grill.

[Ken Coleman]

I think this show as would be just as easy as life if I just said. Yeah, whatever Stacy says. Whatever Jade says. Oh, I'm kidding. Just a joke.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, no, no. I was just gonna say life would be easier for you and Sam Warshaw.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, well, maybe Sam's listening to whatever.

[Unknown Speaker]

They say is right.

[Ken Coleman]

Pains me. But I think I like your play because I'm gonna get more money. I'm gonna get better return. I'd rather use. I didn't want to use the cash, but I'm going with you. You gave me. I think you're right.

[Unknown Speaker]

You gave me some Trump. I like. You gave me some Trump vibes on that. That was. That was that. That gave me.

[Ken Coleman]

I'VE never heard that before.

[Unknown Speaker]

It was like you were, like, doing an impersonation. It was good.

[Ken Coleman]

I like. I like your plan.

[Unknown Speaker]

It was good.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Unknown Speaker]

It was a hand.

[Ken Coleman]

She's a smart one. MacKenzie's up in Provo. Mackenzie, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. I have recently started looking into the baby steps to pay off our debts and everything. And right now we currently only really have our student loan debt at about $20,000. But we know we want to go to grad school, and that will probably put us into about 400 to $500,000 in.

[Ken Coleman]

Whoa. Okay. All right. You got the. You'll be called in maybe on the right show or the wrong show. We'll find out that you be the judge of this. When I hear someone say we want to. And we're going to look at 4 to $500,000, I'm going to lean in and say, for what purpose do you both need a continuing education degree? Some type of master's? What are we getting and why are we getting it?

[Jade Warshaw]

My husband is going into law school and I am going into medical school.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so you answered the big question. Is they graduate degree the only way or is it the best way? By the way, America, those are my two questions and will always allow you to remove the emotion around a graduate degree or a degree. Is it the only way or is it the best way? In your case, you want to be a doctor.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. And he wants to be a lawyer, so we got to do it. Now, I'm going to challenge you on something, and you can check me. Can fact check. We live in a fact check age. Your husband, if he is patient and he is disciplined and he keeps taking the LSAT long enough to get. There's a certain score, and I wish I knew it. I'll look it up in a second if we have time. But you can. He can get a full ride from a smaller, lesser known law school. And in your case, that would be the only way I would do it because you aren't going to get a full ride. But you. You. You need to be patient. And I'm going to tell you something that seems insane, but I just wonder how much money you could save up and delay med school. Is that even feasible to you emotionally? Because I know that that's an emotional question.

[Jade Warshaw]

I think. I think I would be open to that for sure. Yeah. Because we definitely have looked into him going to law school first and postponing me entering medical school.

[Ken Coleman]

I love that. Let me tell you why. What do you expect his legal income to be wherever he thinks he's going, what type of field he's going to. What do you project is his income post law school?

[Jade Warshaw]

We're, we're hoping starting out at least 80 to 90,000. And we're trying to be a little more conservative so we don't get our hopes up too high.

[Ken Coleman]

Love this. Jade, I want to bring you in here. I like this plan. I know we're asking a lot.

[Unknown Speaker]

Listen, I love that you're spreading it out. That already makes me feel better. What my mind instantly went to was last week. I think it was Dave and I, or maybe it was George and I took a call and the young guy called in. He was 500,000. Actually I think he was 600,000 in debt. And he couldn't pass his, his final tests. And so he was now working a job for $50,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh my God.

[Unknown Speaker]

And he was looking on for a way to get out of debt. And I just, I mean my soul ached for him. So that's where my mind goes to. It's like best laid plans. And don't get me wrong, you sound like a genius. You sound like a really smart person. I'm sure you'll go on to do fine. I'm not trying to put any evil on you, but that's the way my brain. That's you know what I'm saying? So if you can find a way to pay for this in cash or slow down to Ken's point and. And cash flowed and do it little by little or you know, find somebody who will pay you to work while you're in school. Whatever those different options out there, please go for those.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So the answer your question. Should we pay off our student loans now?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes. Because to JJ makes a very good point. We don't want to wish ill will on your plans. But man, both of us are old enough to be around and see how our best laid plans, you know, have always changed. And if you pay off your student loans now, you get peace now. Then if something were to change later, you still have peace. This gives us peace now, gives us peace later. There's always time. That would be our hope for you. Because if I can just finish it with this one last question, I want you to give me a yes or no answer. Have you two thought about what it would feel like to have 4 to $500,000 worth of debt hanging over you?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

How's that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Definitely have.

[Ken Coleman]

When you talk about it and think about it, what does it feel like?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's Definitely stressful.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go. Choose no stress.

[Unknown Speaker]

And you don't want to bring that stress into your profession. You don't want that stress of making that payment breathing down your neck every day when you're just trying to go to work to do the work you love. And I actually think Ken is brilliant in telling you to pay off the student loans you have now because paying off what you have now is just a teeny tiny taste of what it would feel like to do 40,000 or 400,000 or 500,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, speaking of that, you're only going to taste Pepto Bismol because that's what you're going to have to drink every day to make it through. I'm talking the peak stuff, 500,000. Don't touch it.

[Unknown Speaker]

Don't do it.

[Ken Coleman]

Statistics show that half of Americans don't.

[Jade Warshaw]

Have enough life insurance or they don't.

[Ken Coleman]

Have any at all.

[Unknown Speaker]

I don't understand this, John.

[Ken Coleman]

Why don't people want to take care of their family?

[Jade Warshaw]

They think they're going to die or something.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life.

[Jade Warshaw]

Insurance is if you hate your wife and kids.

[Ken Coleman]

And I immediately went and got term life insurance.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's a gut punch.

[Ken Coleman]

And. Oh, you're telling me. And for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse, they've lost somebody important to them.

[Jade Warshaw]

Me, too.

[Ken Coleman]

They don't know what to do next.

[Jade Warshaw]

Me, too.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, you're gonna have a crisis.

[Jade Warshaw]

Here and you know, you got two options. While you're sitting and talking to a young widow, she's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly.

[Unknown Speaker]

And not mess this up or she's.

[Jade Warshaw]

Concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow. That's exactly. These are the two options. And turn your dadgum family term life.

[Ken Coleman]

Insurance can replace income, pay off debts, cover funeral expenses. So your family can actually have the.

[Jade Warshaw]

Opportunity to just be sad.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

To just miss you.

[Ken Coleman]

That's exactly what it's supposed to be. It's saying I love you to your family.

[Jade Warshaw]

Term Life Insurance J.E. zander and the team at Zander Insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years.

[Ken Coleman]

They're the only people I trust.

[Jade Warshaw]

Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282.

[Ken Coleman]

Let's go to Cindy next, who's joined, joining us in Dallas. Cindy, how can we help.

[Jade Warshaw]

So I'm 48. My boyfriend's 49. 59. And we have moved in together. I moved into his home. We have discussed marriage a few times. And one of the things that we agreed on is that we keep finances separate. Which after finding you about a month ago, I've learned that that's not recommended.

[Ken Coleman]

Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. You said you found us a month ago, and we don't recommend that. Boyfriends and girlfriend friends.

[Jade Warshaw]

No, no. When you get married, I just want.

[Ken Coleman]

To make sure you knew what our position was right now. You guys should keep them separate. You get married, you bring them together.

[Unknown Speaker]

How long you guys been dating?

[Jade Warshaw]

Three years.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so what's your question?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, so I have almost all my debt paid off. Of course, my income's a lot lower than his. And I say I have it almost paid off. I have a mortgage, but I don't. I recently owner financed my home to where of course, if they pay it off, I will make about $150,000 in interest.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, what's the term?

[Jade Warshaw]

So we did a 20 year note at 15% down in 14% interest, and I sold it for 89,000. And I surveyed off a half acre to keep for myself separate from the property and that title company. You did it legally.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, got it.

[Ken Coleman]

The people that bought your home agreed to a 14 interest.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's what I was thinking. That's wild.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, no, I agree. And I tried to talk her out of it. When she first started saying something, she was renting it from me and she kept saying, you know, I've known them for a really long time, so I know what their finances are. And I kept telling her, you don't. You don't want me to do that because you don't understand how much you're going to end up paying.

[Ken Coleman]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold on a second, hold on a second. You're telling me that the people who bought this house from you, they came up with the idea of a 14 interest rate against your objections?

[Jade Warshaw]

Actually, my banker suggested that she kept saying, please own and finance it. Yeah, please own and finance it. And I said, well, you know, I got to talk to my banker. So I went talk to my banker. And I've been single for a long time. Single mom struggled. He knew I struggled. He knew that my income went from about 58,000 a year to 30, so he knew I was struggling.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, I get all that. I don't want get us on a rabbit trail, but the Only reason I'm digging in here is can they afford that?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah. Is this going to default is what he's saying?

[Jade Warshaw]

They will manage their money. They can afford.

[Unknown Speaker]

Have they been affording it? And how long have you been in this deal?

[Jade Warshaw]

We just closed on it in April for a year. From. One year and a half for me. So they've been paying this note for a year and a half without it potentially becoming theirs. And then we made it to where?

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so the amount didn't change for them.

[Jade Warshaw]

No.

[Unknown Speaker]

Got you. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Got you. Okay. I feel okay. That's what I was trying to make sure.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, that's good.

[Ken Coleman]

Ken, how sketchy do you think their finances are? Because this affects you. Okay, keep going with your what's your dead?

[Unknown Speaker]

And stuff or what your question is.

[Ken Coleman]

I.

[Jade Warshaw]

Without that mortgage, I only owe 42 on the house. Sold it for 89 or selling it for 89. I have about 6,000, 7,000 left that I need to pay off in my name. Credit cards and, like, little loans.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

I recently got out from under a car loan and I bought cash vehicle because upkeep on it. Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

So you got out of the. You got out of the loan. You got a cash car. Okay, that's great. How can. How can we help you?

[Jade Warshaw]

He is like, hey, I've been looking at this Bay Ramsey guy. You should hear this. We can be debt free, yada, yada. He does have a mortgage and he has some credit cards.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And he gets paid once a month. So he charges everything on the credit card once a month. He pays his credit card off.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right, got it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Have a balance. He's talking about getting another credit card for the airline points, which will have a yearly fee, an annual fee. And I'm like, no.

[Unknown Speaker]

So you have a philosophical disagreement on the uses of debt and whether it should be in your lives or not. You feel it shouldn't be. You're working hard to pay it off. He says it shouldn't be, but his actions don't reflect that because he's still going out and getting credit cards is what you're saying.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. And so. Well, he's talking about it. He got it in the mail, you.

[Unknown Speaker]

Know, And I'm like, right, but when you're. When you're done with something, you stop talking about it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right, Right.

[Unknown Speaker]

So how. What's your income? What's his income?

[Jade Warshaw]

I make. I just recently got a raise. I think I'm at 34,000 now. He makes, I think, almost 70, maybe 65,000.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

So my question is, since we're holder in. We've both been previously married. If we do get married, can we become debt free without putting our incomes together? Like, do we need to do that in order to accomplish the ultimate goal?

[Unknown Speaker]

I mean, listen, all things are possible, but it doesn't mean that it's the best way to do it. Like, you could get there. It's going to take a lot longer. You're not going to be on the same page. There's going to be secrets. There's going to be way more arguments because you're not actually working as a team. That's like. That's like. Yeah. I don't know what it's like, but it's.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So my question is, how long you been dating?

[Jade Warshaw]

Three years.

[Ken Coleman]

And do you think he's going to pop the question anytime soon?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, like, we've been discussing it. Actually, he'd already said something about it, and I told him no the first time, but we're discussing it again. What made you say gunshot?

[Unknown Speaker]

Hold on. You can't just speed past that. Like, you didn't say what you just said.

[Ken Coleman]

I was like, oh, what caused you.

[Unknown Speaker]

You to say no the first time?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, because it's not my first rodeo and I decided maybe I wasn't very good at this.

[Unknown Speaker]

So it was more you than him, probably on that.

[Jade Warshaw]

Just because I'm like, I don't know.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, you got it. You know what?

[Jade Warshaw]

I kept the half anchor. Let me tell you what that security.

[Ken Coleman]

Let me, let me, let me. There's the issue.

[Unknown Speaker]

It is? Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Security of your heart is the issue.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Now here's the deal. Most of the time it's dudes not wanting to commit, but you've got everything. You've got all the. All the things except for the real thing. And he's going, I want to marry you. I want to make you my wife. And you're going, I kind of like you as my boyfriend because we got the relationship stuff. I get to keep my finances separate. You got all this is friends with benefits.

[Unknown Speaker]

You even kept your tract of land in case you had to get out of there.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's the thing. I don't mind getting married and all that. In part of it's probably a little bit of control. Like, if we put our finances together, can I just go spend my money and not be like, hey, I know $200? No, I can't do that.

[Ken Coleman]

No, you've got. Let me tell you this. I really believe that you guys should engage in some premarital counseling before he tries to Pop the question again. I'd hate for this dude to be 0 and 2.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, well, we're seriously discussing going forward.

[Ken Coleman]

I know, but you need to be.

[Jade Warshaw]

Seriously put on the table what my issues are, but not with us. It's okay to not put them on the. Like, like, cannot be. Like, yes, we can get married, but let's not put our finances.

[Unknown Speaker]

But what you're saying. What you're saying is a non commitment commitment. You're saying, I wanna. You're saying, I think about it like this. And this is gonna sound extreme, but it's kind of the same thing. What if. What if, what if, Ken, what if you said to Stacy, I want to be 100% committed to you, except on Saturdays. Oh, Saturdays. I get to go out and do my thing.

[Ken Coleman]

I would catch a. I would catch a three iron to the of the head because you're.

[Unknown Speaker]

You're proposing not a full commitment. So if you say, hey, I want to be committed to you, accept my money that I keep over here, that's like, what do you mean?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right? And I don't know that he is willing to put his money in one pot, because when we have discussed it before, we discussed keeping it separate.

[Ken Coleman]

So, Cindy, Cindy, we've given you our financial advice, and I'm being very serious and very hopeful for you too. But I do believe this is premarital counsel.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's a trust issue. You got trust issues, Both of you.

[Ken Coleman]

Both of, of you. And it's okay, by the way. I think you're totally normal, and I think everything that you've got concerned about are very, very normal and real, given that you've been burned before. But this is relationship. And so I think there needs to be healing prior to engagement. And then we talk money. Yes, but like, the money conversation cannot happen in my mind effectively until there's healing on both sides. So my advice would be. We love each other. We've been living together. You live together?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, I've been living with him in his home for a year and a half.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, you guys need to go get counseling and decide, can we actually be together, not just cohabitate together? Right now it seems really easy because there's no skin in the game other than the actual relationship, but the money piece is a big part of it and shared dreams and goals. So my prescription, Jay degrees, premarital counseling. Let's get healthy. Then we talk money. Then we get engaged. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. All right? We all know this. The world is going bananas, and we're under huge pressure to perform and look like we're keeping it all together.

[Jade Warshaw]

Check this out.

[Ken Coleman]

76% of people globally agree that mental health care can help resolve personal problems. Yet 6 out of 10 people still believe that society, society discourages people from asking for help. Listen to me. Real strength, I'm talking real bravery comes from opening up about what you're dealing with and then doing something about it so you can be your best for yourself and for everyone else that you care about. If you're feeling the weight of the world, please talk to someone. Anyone. A friend, a loved one, a family member, or a therapist. I see a therapist every week. If you're thinking about trying therapy, contact my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is a hundred percent online therapy, so it's affordable and convenient for your schedule. To get started, just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist. And if it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time. And it's easy and it doesn't cost any extra money. Talk it out with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com Deloney to get 10% off your first month.

[Unknown Speaker]

Month.

[Ken Coleman]

That's BetterHelp hp.com All right. Who out there is tired of living paycheck to paycheck? Just that exhaustion of just trying to. Trying to stay alive, if you will, month to month? Well, I can tell you if that's you, I can recommend and guarantee that if you get on a budget, you can begin to stop the struggle, that hamster wheel of just trying to make it through. And we're gonna help you by doing free budgeting trainings this month. You're gonna learn step by step how to do it and stick to it. We have live Q and A. You can sign [e-mail] webinar everydollar.com webinar A lot of people doing this. I don't know why you wouldn't. It's free. Kick the tires, come away with some real knowledge and confidence to go with it. Stetson. Now, let's see. Now, this is a name.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's a great name.

[Ken Coleman]

This is a good name. James. If I was Stetson Coleman, I'd be a big deal.

[Unknown Speaker]

You'd be good at football. You'd be. You'd have probably six, three more muscles. Whoa, whoa, whoa. More muscles.

[Ken Coleman]

I like that. You drop more in there.

[Unknown Speaker]

I said it like that the first time.

[Ken Coleman]

No, you didn't. You said I'd have muscles.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm sorry again.

[Ken Coleman]

And I compliment her every Show. I don't know what I got.

[Unknown Speaker]

You know this material. That material is winning.

[Ken Coleman]

You know what? I'm going sleeveless shirt the next time I'm with Jade. People need to see the guns.

[Unknown Speaker]

They need to see what's. What's going on.

[Ken Coleman]

I digress. Stetson, help us out of this mess and let us help you. How can we help you today?

[Unknown Speaker]

Wow.

[Jade Warshaw]

What? The entrance. I don't know how to follow that up.

[Unknown Speaker]

Are you all those things, Stetson? Were you good at football? Do you have. Do you have muscle?

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, my wife thinks so and that's about all that matters.

[Unknown Speaker]

But I did play football.

[Jade Warshaw]

So. You did or did you talk about football today?

[Ken Coleman]

You did or did?

[Jade Warshaw]

I did. Yes, I did. I was the quarterback from the high school. I knew it.

[Ken Coleman]

See, I see. You see guys with the name Stetson. You know what? They aren't, they aren't kickers.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, they're quarterbacks.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you know who was a kicker and has two thumbs? This guy. True story. I can't make it up. Stetson. Oh, man, you got a great name and a great football career. I'm sure. But let's help you with your money. What's going on?

[Jade Warshaw]

Alrighty. Thanks guys. Well, hey, I'm 23 years old, my wife's 24. We have a newborn and we're about $680,000 in debt. Whoa. 250 is her student loan. So she's a stay at home mom now, but she went to school to be a chiropractor. I've got 360,000 in a rental house that is upside down. What I mean by that is it's really worth 225 now. I bought it at the height of COVID and yeah, just the market around it kind of tanked. And then I've got $70,000 in an equipment loan that was going to be leased out to somebody. The lease fell through, so now I'm stuck with a piece of equipment. I make about $60,000 a year, which covers our personal expenses, but definitely does not cover any of the debt that we have to take care of. Another aspect to this is I started a home services business when I was in high school and got the chance to exit that business about a year and a half ago for about $1.7 million. A million of that went to equity. Took about 700,000 of it in cash. So you're probably wondering, why the heck am I here? So 500,000 that invested that in a real estate business is doing really well. 100,000 of that is going to go to taxes, which I have to pay in a couple months. And then the other 100,000 we just spent on various things. So I've kind of got this weird predicamen. One of the biggest questions I have is, other than just general advice, is, is investing in that real estate business a good thing because it's doing really, really well, or should we focus more so on paying down the debt? Which one should take priority?

[Ken Coleman]

Which gives you the worst feeling or the best feeling?

[Jade Warshaw]

Not investing in the real estate business definitely gives me the worst feeling.

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, I wonder about your real estate savviness because of your other rental properties.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm a little surprised. I would have thought you called today because this debt's eating you up. And you were going to say, man, Ken, I don't like the feeling of this debt. And you're so excited about your real estate investment because it's doing so well, but it's not helping you in your actual life right now. So I would get out of the real estate company and get all my debts paid off. Because you've proven you know how to make money.

[Unknown Speaker]

Can you tell us more? Can you tell us more about the $500,000 real estate? What that would be is that one property? What is that? Tell us more.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, so it's a good point. And it's a very different business. So I definitely failed in the rental business in a big metro like Atlanta.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

The business we've got is we're buying lots of land in East Tennessee around Knoxville area. We're putting mobile homes on them, and we're selling about 120 days. So we're making like somewhere between 60 and 70,000 per home. And I'm in it 50, 50 with my mom. So I brough capital. She brought sweat equity. I'm bringing sweat equity.

[Unknown Speaker]

So you're making 60 to 70,000 per home. So you split that. So you come home with 30, 35,000.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. And we've invested everything back in the business.

[Unknown Speaker]

How many times have you come. Oh, okay. So how then, how much is the. How much do you have there sitting in that pool? How many times have you done that and been profitable?

[Jade Warshaw]

We've been profitable every time. We've done it about seven times so far, and we just bought about 33 lots.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, okay, interesting. So you're saying instead of letting that continue to tick on like it has, you want to infuse it with another $500,000?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, ma' am. I already invested.

[Unknown Speaker]

You already did. Got it. Got It.

[Ken Coleman]

Got it. That's the 500 that's left over after he sold that company.

[Unknown Speaker]

So, okay, so how much is in your, like, can I just ask, like, in your operating cost account, how much is in there now?

[Jade Warshaw]

Personally or for my business?

[Unknown Speaker]

For the business. Because you said you put all 500 in there and you guys have been profitable nine times in a row. So what did you turn that 500,000 into is what I'm asking.

[Jade Warshaw]

So we've. We've got about 800, 900,000 in equity, but all of our money at this moment is in deals right now.

[Unknown Speaker]

Got it. Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

We've got quite a few. So we don't have a ton of liquidity, but these properties sell so quickly that, you know, we get liquidity pretty quickly. So really the moral of the story is, like, you know, I have enough cash to pay down my debt for a certain amount of time, but I'm going to run out of cash eventually.

[Unknown Speaker]

And you don't have any retained is what I'm saying. You haven't retained any. Everything is up in the air.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, that's correct.

[Unknown Speaker]

Interesting. I like the sound of that.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't either. And I didn't hear in the details that you have cash to pay off some of the debt right now. I haven't heard that at all. How much cash do you have to actually pay off? Well, first of all, you hit us with a lot of numbers.

[Unknown Speaker]

You did.

[Ken Coleman]

What is your actual debt, debt burden right now?

[Unknown Speaker]

It's the. It's 680.

[Ken Coleman]

Is it 600 or is it. Okay, it's 680. Okay. All right.

[Unknown Speaker]

And then just to clarify, that was your personal debt, even though we believe it's all together. But just for the. That was your personal debt. But on the business, is there any debt on that real estate business or you're doing everything in cash?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, ma' am. Everything is cash.

[Unknown Speaker]

Good. Okay. That's the good thing about what you're doing. What I don't like is there's no savings or retained earnings anywhere. That feels like that's a recipe for disaster. Faster. That's a different call. So the question then is you're asking, do you pay off your personal debt, the 680, is that the question?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, because we could pull. Pull all of our money out, shut down the real estate business and pay off the majority of it.

[Unknown Speaker]

But why do you have to shut down the business to do that? That's what I'm trying to.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

It takes a lot of cash. I mean, because Each, you know, our land and, you know, we pay for that and then we buy these mobile homes. We buy them all cash.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right, but what I'm saying is you said, said. And track with me here, you said we make like net profit. 30. What did you say? 60 to 70 off of each deal. Yeah, and then you said 90. But then you said, but we choose to reinvest that. So I'm saying, if you didn't reinvest it, what would be your profit? Like, would you would be able to con. Pay yourself something and continue going is what I'm saying. So if you can pay yourself something and then use that money to pay off the bad rental that you had, why can't you do things that.

[Jade Warshaw]

That. That. That is the plan. The question is, how soon do we do that? Like, do we stop everything and do that now or do we wait, you know, a year or two again?

[Unknown Speaker]

And I'm saying you shouldn't have to stop everything. If it's really profit, you shouldn't have to stop everything.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, we don't know what you mean by should we stop? Do you mean you and mom sell the entire trailer park in the land and everything? Is that what you mean by stop?

[Jade Warshaw]

Right, right, stop. So basically, pull all of our cash out. Stop buying homes. Homes. Pay off the debt.

[Unknown Speaker]

And I'm saying, yeah, okay, yes, that was my take.

[Ken Coleman]

Yes, I think you should cash out and get out of all this mess. You're saying he should start paying himself and debt snowball.

[Unknown Speaker]

Just like everything I'm saying, he's got a business. He's running it at the speed of cash. There's probably some changes and tweaks that could make it better. But I'm saying if you're really generating enough profit. Because in my mind, the point of a business is to make some profit so I can pay myself.

[Ken Coleman]

So how quickly? So. So, Stetson, we've got about a minute. We have 50, 60 seconds. Quick question. When will you start to actually get your next cash payment instead of putting it back into the company? When would you get the next payment on something?

[Jade Warshaw]

When we'll close on two homes in August.

[Ken Coleman]

And what will you walk away with you personally?

[Jade Warshaw]

About $50,000. My split of it'll be all right.

[Unknown Speaker]

So, great.

[Ken Coleman]

So what Jade is saying, you take it away. You got 10 seconds.

[Unknown Speaker]

Start paying yourself so you can pay off this debt.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go.

[Jade Warshaw]

Let me tell you something. Most home security systems don't work until after someone breaks in.

[Ken Coleman]

That's like putting your seatbelt on after the wreck.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's too late. Late. And that's why I recommend simply safe.

[Ken Coleman]

Their active guard outdoor protection helps stop.

[Jade Warshaw]

Break ins before they happen.

[Ken Coleman]

Their AI powered cameras work together with.

[Jade Warshaw]

Live SimpliSafe agents to monitor your property in real time. So if someone's creeping around your house, those agents can talk to them, trigger.

[Ken Coleman]

The spotlight and even call the police right then and there. It's proactive.

[Jade Warshaw]

Protect not just a dressed up burglar alarm. Plans start at around a dollar a day. There are no contracts and no hidden fees and they offer a 60 day money back guarantee. So see why over 4 million Americans trust SimpliSafe. Cy Newsweek and USA Today both ranked SimpliSafe number one in customer service. NYCNet named it the best home security system of 2025.

[Ken Coleman]

Plus right now you can get 50%.

[Jade Warshaw]

Off a new SimpliSafe system with 24. 7 professional [e-mail] that's 50% [e-mail] there's no safe like SimpliSafe.

[Ken Coleman]

This is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their work and their relationships. The phone number to jump in is, 882-552-5888 825-5225. Alongside the spectacular and very sunny today. Jade Warshaw. I'm Ken Coleman. Trying to keep the positive energy up next to her. Just, you know, your personality's bright enough and then you got a, you, you gotta really one up it with the, with the outfit.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's enough to give you a tan. I like the tan you got, you got baking here.

[Ken Coleman]

This is all from the first hour just kind of coming off of you there. It's just bright, bright in here in the studio. And Laura is joining us now in San Francisco. Laura, how can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi Ken and Jade. I'm so excited to ask you for your perspective. I have been in the biotech industry about 34 years and we recently did a reorganization and I have been impacted and will be terminated in a couple of months, although I have the opportunity to look for internal jobs. And I am interviewing but I thought this question would be for you all. I'm about to turn 58 and I will get a very sizable severance package.

[Ken Coleman]

How much?

[Jade Warshaw]

And a year salary which is about $252,000.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Before taxes.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

All my stock grants at best every year those will be accelerated. I'll get all of those.

[Ken Coleman]

How much is that word?

[Jade Warshaw]

Today's price, probably 75,000. They'll pay out my vacation, which is 10,000. And my 401k has got about $1.4 million in it right now. My house in the San Francisco area has more than doubled in the 18 years I've been here. So that's a big asset. And I have been thinking I'd eventually like to move back east to be closer to family once my son's done with high school.

[Ken Coleman]

If you were to sell that house, what would you stand to make on it?

[Jade Warshaw]

Probably. Well, I think close to a million and a half. But I don't know how much commission would be in taxes, but over a million.

[Ken Coleman]

Over a million actual net to you?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

After taxes and the real estate fee, you feel like you're going to make a million plus. Plus.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, great.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's great.

[Ken Coleman]

That's fantastic. Okay, keep going. These are really good numbers.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah, they're very good. It's very tempting. I do have. I feel like I'm so close. After so many years of being in a regulated environment and being under stress, there's something very tempting about saying, can I, can I do it? Maybe do some part time consulting or. I mean, I am, I'm interviewing for an internal role. I am informed. If they offer that to me, I have to take it. I wouldn't get my severance package, but I would stay with the company.

[Unknown Speaker]

Would the pay be the same or would it be a step down?

[Jade Warshaw]

It's the same.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

It would be the positions. I'm a. It's a huge company and so there are. I'm very thankful. There are, are a variety of internal positions. There are other biotech companies in the area where I live that I'm also looking at. And my first thought was, should I focus externally and sort of cash out this chunk? But there's something to be said for the 34 years if I do secure an internal position, continue with my benefits. All right, let me ask you high school.

[Ken Coleman]

Can I ask you a fun question?

[Jade Warshaw]

Question, Please. Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. Let's say that the severance they gave you was 3x4x. Let's say you cash. Let's say you had the stock. Point is you walk away with a million dollars. A million more. Okay. I'm giving you an absurd thing. I know that's not going to happen, but I'm driving at something. Let's say that happened and you walked away with a million dollars and you got the east coast and your family sitting out there or working in biotech for a different company, which choice would.

[Jade Warshaw]

You make the first one.

[Ken Coleman]

Of course you would.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm also looking at my mom's in good health. But, and, but I think, you know, eventually, you know, I want to be able to take care of her when, when she's gonna need it. And so I'm not, I'm in a good position right now. I'm not too sandwiched as a sandwich.

[Ken Coleman]

Right. But do you, do you know why you said yes? You said, well, if you gave me a million, I'd absolutely go to the east coast and be in your family. Do you know why that is? Why did you say that?

[Jade Warshaw]

I think after such a long and intense career being.

[Ken Coleman]

No, I get that part. But you're walking away with 250. But when I jumped it up to a million, you went, oh, it's a no brainer. So you getting where I'm going. It was, for whatever reason, the million dollars was more financially secure for you to do the thing you want to do. Do you agree with what I'm saying?

[Jade Warshaw]

Saying yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Did you agree that?

[Jade Warshaw]

That's also in my head I was thinking, you know, if this had happened two or three years from now, it would be, no question, it would be like very much.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, this is all I wanted to discover. So, Jade, here's what I was doing.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm with you.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm doing a little psychological digging to get to the point that this is all about do I feel safe financially to do the thing I want to do now. So there's where I want to bring in my partner on this. All right?

[Jade Warshaw]

So that is exactly, exactly where I am.

[Ken Coleman]

I know, I know. I've done this a time or two. And I want to bring you in because here's what I'm seeing. I'm seeing that you're going to get a year's salary to walk so you can move to the east coast and not work for a year if you don't want to, because you've got 12 months coming in the same way it's always been coming in. I also see, let's see, 85 more thousand coming in on top of that. And I see us walking away with a million dollars in my best Dr. Evil Voice, to go back east and just settle in, be near mom, and begin to create a new life all.

[Unknown Speaker]

The while at 1.4.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right. And my point is, is you can get back into consulting six months in if you really miss the work. You can jump back in the industry on the east coast if you really miss the work. But I'm not Hearing missional work right here. I'm hearing. Is it. Is it financially, am I secure and my position. Jade, I want to bring you in. I'm saying she should do it because I think she's got the finances. But I want you to speak to that.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, I think I. Well, yes, I agree with Ken. I think you've got the finances to walk away from this and go to the part of the country that you want to be in. I don't think you're done. Something tells me that she's going to find something else.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah. I. I don't think you're done working. I think you've got time to figure out what that is and, yeah, I think you've got time to figure that out. I mean, your lump sum, if invested well, is going to double every seven years. So that's 1.4 million.

[Ken Coleman]

That's right.

[Unknown Speaker]

You're going to a less expensive part of the country where your million dollars from your home sell is going to go a lot farther. I mean, are you. You're single. Yes. You don't need a. You don't need a giant house. You could probably find something for the median home price around 440,000.

[Ken Coleman]

You never know what San Fran's going to do.

[Unknown Speaker]

You know what I'm saying?

[Ken Coleman]

I'd take that money and run from San Francisco.

[Jade Warshaw]

I have a lot of friends who. Yeah. Who have relocated. I need to stick around here until I get my son graduated from his senior year of high school.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, great.

[Ken Coleman]

Perfect.

[Unknown Speaker]

Perfect. I love this for you.

[Ken Coleman]

I do, too.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's an adventure.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. This is a wise decision for you, not a silly decision. You've got the money. You're gonna be fine. Follow your heart on this. We all know the importance of eating.

[Jade Warshaw]

Fruits and vegetables, but let's face it, life gets busy and sometimes we eat stuff we shouldn't. That's where Field of Greens comes to in. It's a superfood powder made from real organic fruits and vegetables.

[Unknown Speaker]

Mix one scoop with water and you're good to go.

[Jade Warshaw]

Field of Greens is packed with nutrients designed to support your overall health, boost your immune system, and increase your energy levels. And your doctor will notice your improved health. Or Field of Greens will give you your money back. Visit fieldofgreens.com Ramsey to save 20% and.

[Ken Coleman]

Get a free shipping.

[Unknown Speaker]

Shipping.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's fieldofgreens.com Ramsey.

[Ken Coleman]

All right, let's go to Minneapolis where Lori is waiting for us. Lori, how can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi, Ken and Jade. Thanks for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure.

[Jade Warshaw]

I hope you're not going to tell me I'm doing everything wrong, but if you do better knowing it now than later.

[Ken Coleman]

That's, that's true and I promise you will be gentle.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, well, first of all, I'm 71. 70 and a half. I'll be 71 in September.

[Ken Coleman]

All right.

[Jade Warshaw]

Been retired for two years. My 31 year old son who was born with divergencies at birth lives with me, but he's fully employed and does very well and now he's sort of helped taking care of me. Anyway, from the time that I turned 66, which was my sole retirement, I started taking Social Security.

[Ken Coleman]

Lori, I'm so sorry to interrupt. Could you adjust your phone a little bit so we can hear you a little clearer?

[Jade Warshaw]

Address said. How can you hear me now?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, that's better. Just kind of mouth right on the old phone there, I guess, right there. I don't know how to describe that. Hold on, let me try.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm about an inch away from my phone.

[Ken Coleman]

That's perfect. Okay, good, Go for it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay. So when I turned 66 and I'd only been working at a sort of for me, high paying job, like 65,000 a year for about 10 years at that point I worked an additional two years collecting my Social Security and my salary and I threw everything that I could at my mortgage and my second mortgage and credit cards. So everything was paid off when I retired at 68. That's thanks to Dave. I figured I had to do it somehow. Great work longer. Okay. So I think that my income in retirement is pretty good. I've got Social Security, I've got a pension from the city, I've got an annuity. That's my IRA from a job long, long time ago.

[Ken Coleman]

What is the total of all of that coming into you every month?

[Jade Warshaw]

Coming in every month is 5300.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, what's the nest egg amount? What's, what's the nest egg of the pension and the nest egg of the annuity?

[Jade Warshaw]

That's the whole, that's, that's that income right there.

[Ken Coleman]

So no nest egg, that's just, that's just coming to her every now.

[Unknown Speaker]

Got it.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, that's coming. And my son also pays a thousand dollars towards our basic $2,000 expenses. I'm month. My house is worth 425. I've got an investment account of 135. I've got cash in the bank of just shy of 90. And I've got a health savings account of 15,000. The only thing I haven't paid for so far is my cremation policy. Can't quite do that, but I know I have to.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so what is your question for us?

[Jade Warshaw]

My question is I spend probably $3,000 a month on fun.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, great.

[Ken Coleman]

Above and beyond the 2000 that you told us you're. You're.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes. Oh, and also for the past two years I've had a job during the school year that, that annualizes to 800amonth.

[Unknown Speaker]

Great.

[Jade Warshaw]

And that's what. That's what I've been spending. Spending mostly.

[Ken Coleman]

What are you spending? What are you spending $3,000 a month on? Fun. Give us an idea what that comprises of.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, for us, fun is traveling and theater tickets.

[Unknown Speaker]

Great.

[Jade Warshaw]

So in the last two years we went on a seven day cruise. Winter Memorial Day, the Broadway long weekend, been to Vegas a couple of times.

[Unknown Speaker]

Here's the thing, Lori, Laurie, Lori, here's what's great. You've got $5,300 that you're going to be earning really in perpetuity throughout your entire life. It's more than enough. Which is exactly where everybody wants to be. You've got $3,000 of margin that you get to spend in retirement doing things that you enjoy doing. Travel, theater, maybe go, you know, have some nice meals and you're doing it together with your son. Where's the problem?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, no problem at all.

[Unknown Speaker]

I think that's what everybody's hoping for.

[Ken Coleman]

Good for you. And Laurie, the reason we're saying is because you're very responsible. You've really done well with your money. So no guilt, no shame. And by the way, if things change, you need to tighten. Lighten up. The good news in this is that you've got the margin to be able to do it. You got the side hustle. So keep enjoying the theater. That'd be. That's fun. I love that.

[Unknown Speaker]

What's your favorite show? If you're going to a show tomorrow, what are you going to see?

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, something I've seen before. Is that okay?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, it's up to you.

[Ken Coleman]

It's your world. I don't know if this was an all time list or not.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, well, whatever you want it to be, Ken.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm probably gonna go see Les Mis in London.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, that's great.

[Ken Coleman]

It's my all time favorites.

[Unknown Speaker]

Is so sad. It's so like.

[Ken Coleman]

But I love it. It moves me. I loved Hamilton.

[Unknown Speaker]

Never saw it.

[Ken Coleman]

I will say Michael Jackson on Broadway right now is a phenomenal show.

[Unknown Speaker]

Ken, when you sent me that video of them Singing man in the Mirror.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. No, Well, I know because you're. I. I know you have very, very. He's too stiff. Right. You're a performer.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

But I'm telling you, for the average D. Joe, of which I am non musical professional, it was a fabulous show. If you like, like that music. But I gave you the traditional.

[Unknown Speaker]

You did? Yeah, you did. I'm with you on Les Mis.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, unbelievable.

[Unknown Speaker]

Let Broadway be Broadway, is all I'm saying.

[Ken Coleman]

Do you like.

[Unknown Speaker]

I don't like when they turn pop music into Broadway shows.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. I like Hamilton.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, that's. That's good because it was its own. It's its own thing. It's not trying to turn Tina Turner or like, you know, Billy Joel into a show.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. All right. Not sure what. You're really fired up.

[Unknown Speaker]

I got really. I did get really fired up.

[Ken Coleman]

I like that. She's got the margin. That's the point.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

To be able to do the things she loves. And she's been very wise, by the way, in. In her early 70s, so very fun. David is up in Dallas, Texas. David, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, guys. Thank you guys for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

Sure. What's up?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, I have a question about my mom, and I really want to approach it with respect. She's told me to my face that I'm her retirement plan. I want to honor her as her son, and I've been trying to involve her more in my church, but she's in a tough spot after her divorce about two years ago when my stepdad just walked out on her after 25 years. So unfortunately, she tends to deflect any offers of help, seeing herself as a victim in her situation. And I get that she's working as an lvn, but her pay is minimal.

[Unknown Speaker]

What is it?

[Jade Warshaw]

And she's struggling to get by.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm sorry, what is her pay? Do you know exactly?

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't know. Probably somewhere around 20, 22 an hour.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, and how old is she?

[Jade Warshaw]

She's mid-50s.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay. And are you single or are you married?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm married with a child. Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

And so you're saying she straight up to your face said, you're it, buddy?

[Jade Warshaw]

Pretty much.

[Unknown Speaker]

To which you said. What did you say? What was your reaction? In the moment?

[Jade Warshaw]

I really didn't know what to say. I haven't really thought about that. Barely discussed it with my wife. I mean, we've. We've kind that mindset, but anytime we try to help her with finances, she just doesn't want to help herself. And she just keeps going back to that victim mentality.

[Ken Coleman]

So the retirement plan, does that just mean that when she can no longer take care of herself, she just gets to shack up with you? Is that what you think she means by that?

[Jade Warshaw]

Essentially, yep.

[Unknown Speaker]

Wow.

[Ken Coleman]

But she's still young.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's what I'm saying. There's a lot of time to turn this around. But she doesn't want the help.

[Jade Warshaw]

She doesn't know, she every time we try to help her with finances, business.

[Unknown Speaker]

So this is a conversation you got to have.

[Ken Coleman]

This is a lay out the boundary now.

[Unknown Speaker]

Uhhuh. You got to, you really do. This is, you're right. You know, initially he said, how do I do this? Respectfully, if I were in your shoes, I would take, well, hey, I would pray about it for a minute and try to get my, my mind together. Cuz I would be fuming. So I get my head right and then I would sit my mom or dad down and I'd say, listen, I understand that you've caught some bad breaks. I understand. And, and try to be really understanding about the things that you know to be true. The things that you laid out. You said, you know, the guy walked out on her after 25 years. All those things. Acknowledge that. And then I'd say, but here's the thing. I now have a family and I have a lot of responsibility to my family. I do not want to repeat some of the things that we have gone through. And as a result of that, I can't be your retirement plan in the way that you, you're viewing. Instead, I need to help you get yourself on your feet so I can then be on my feet with my family. And if you're not willing to participate in that, then we're all going to lose. And I'm not going to lose. So you have to participate. Like, do you see what I'm saying?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I, I, we're heading into a break, so I put him on hold. But I could not add any, any more to what you just said. This is a tough situation. Situation, David, that she's put you in. So here's what stinks. You realize how tough it is psychologically and emotionally, but she's done it to you, so you're already there. So I get it. You're like, what do we do? What you do is when a parent puts you there, you're there. So you do exactly what Jade said and it's not gonna be fun. Let's be very clear. But I think this has ripped the band aid off. I Never understood that until I got older.

[Unknown Speaker]

To just do it fast, let the hairs get in there. It all rips out at the same time.

[Ken Coleman]

Pulling it off slow never works. It's actually less painful to take it head on. And you have to do this now.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, you guys remember the four walls of a budget.

[Jade Warshaw]

Food, utilities, shelter, and transportation.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right now I want to focus, focus.

[Jade Warshaw]

On food because inflation is driving up.

[Unknown Speaker]

The cost of groceries and we're all feeling it.

[Jade Warshaw]

But Aldi shoppers can save up to 36% on an average shopping trip, which adds up to be about $4,000 a.

[Unknown Speaker]

Year for a family of four.

[Jade Warshaw]

$4,000. Aldi has what you need at prices that won't bust your budget. From bread and milk to organic produce, fresh meat and affordable must haves. So stop paying more more and start shopping smarter at Aldi, where you'll save with the lowest prices of any national grocery store. Find a store near you today at Aldi US That's a L D. I usually.

[Ken Coleman]

All right. Buying and selling your home is a big deal. You know that. And you just would not want to go into something that big without somebody who knows what they're doing on your side fighting for you. The Ramsey trusted program is the only way to find a top agent that you can trust to help make your home a blessing, not a burden. You can find one of those local Ramsey trusted real estate pros for [e-mail] agency agent. That's ramseysolutions.com agent. Or you can click the link in the show notes and you can get right to that. Let's go to Michelle in Miami, Florida. Michelle, how can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, so I have. Sorry, it makes me a little nervous.

[Ken Coleman]

But you're doing great.

[Jade Warshaw]

I have a question. My husband is kind of. He's like a crazy spender and I think I'm being lied to. I know we're behind on a mortgage. It's just been tough.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, I'm so sorry, Michelle. I know you're hurt and I know you're afraid to say the least. And we're going to try to walk through this with you. Do you all by the way you set up the question, I'm guessing or wondering if you have separate finances.

[Jade Warshaw]

So. We have separate finances because it's a second marriage for both of us.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And we've had a prenup since the beginning, which is fine.

[Unknown Speaker]

Who made you. Who made who sign it?

[Jade Warshaw]

He made me sign it.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

But. But now I'm. I'm actually really thankful because he's the spender. And it's very. It's been scary because I just. I know the mortgage hasn't been paid in months. The home has a fair amount of equity, but I can't convince him to sell it because he thinks that he's a developer, so he thinks the next thing is down, you know, around the corner. And it just makes me nervous. We have kids together. They're in high school. And like I said, I do have my own finances, but I have also let him have borrow quite a sum of money. And I just. To the point.

[Ken Coleman]

From you or. Or in your name?

[Jade Warshaw]

From. From me personally. I had to let him borrow some money because. 200,000.

[Unknown Speaker]

Girlfriend.

[Ken Coleman]

Wow.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay. Let me get my head around this. So it's only his name on the mortgage?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so you. Here's what's very difficult about this call you guys. For the last. How many years have you been married?

[Jade Warshaw]

Almost 20. 18.

[Unknown Speaker]

For the last 18 years, you've had different lives.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

And we're seeing the result of that. And we're seeing, you know, you had this prenup, but you both just decided, hey, it's not just the prenup. We're like, we're going to live separate lives. And you have done that to the point of you're even lending and borrowing each other money. And this is not just Venmo me for a sandwich. This is $200,000 that you are expect back. And so there's such a level of. And. And I'm not saying this to be rude or mean. I just am laying the cards out. There's such a level of dysfunction here that it's hard for Ken and I to just kind of pick up in the middle and say, do xyz. There's layers and layers and layers.

[Ken Coleman]

Primarily Jade, because I don't know what your take is, but he's. She can't do anything to stop him.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, you can't.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, it's just like, at this point. Point. What if you. Okay. If you were in this situation, I'm curious, what would you do?

[Unknown Speaker]

It's hard to say because this has gone on so long. I like to think that I would never have let it go this far.

[Ken Coleman]

You wouldn't have. But I mean, in other words, she can ask for counseling. She can say, this has got to stop. I got. You know.

[Unknown Speaker]

But even then, I guess my question is. The question that's burning in my heart for you is what are you trying to sell? Salvage? Because there's not. It's Not a marriage. There's a partnership here that I see. There's some codependency here, probably, that I see. But what is it for you, Michelle, that you're wanting to salvage here?

[Jade Warshaw]

I guess, I know it sounds terrible, but I'm to the point where I'm trying to salvage my own financial stability and I, and I do have some assets of my own and I have some other money of my own.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, here's the good news to that objective. If he loses the house, that doesn't affect you financially. Now it doesn't affect you. But this thing is so weird, as Jade has pointed out.

[Unknown Speaker]

Can I ask another question, Michelle?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

If it weren't for the kids, like if the kids were out of the house, would you still be married to this guy?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, that's a good question. It's fair question. I, I don't know. That's. I, I don't. It's just.

[Ken Coleman]

Is there any fear, Is there any fear of him leaving you?

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh. Oh, no.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's what I thought.

[Ken Coleman]

That's my point. So I hear the emotion in your voice and I think Jade's doing a really.

[Unknown Speaker]

With the kids. I think that's something.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. It's like, what are you trying, what are you really worried about? Because, because this doesn't really hurt you financially.

[Unknown Speaker]

No, but there's 18 years of relationship. There's, there is a relationship. It's, it's not healthy, but there's 18 years of relationship there. So I get it. And anything can start to feel. You can start to develop a normalcy with anything. Right. No matter what. They, like separate.

[Jade Warshaw]

You think it's to stop, that's why it's going to stop. So of course I'm thinking like if he gets some of his business stuff resolved that he can catch up on the mortgage. But, but yeah, I, we have a lot of equity in the house and I have proposed to him, you know, maybe we should sell the house. I said, you know, it's fine. The house is worth over $2 million.

[Unknown Speaker]

Now. If you did that, how close to.

[Ken Coleman]

Foreclosure are you guys? You said it's several months. Where's the status right now?

[Jade Warshaw]

I can only go by what I'm told and not what I know. But I believe that we could be in foreclosure in July at some point.

[Unknown Speaker]

So when you say, Michelle, that there's this equity that really is just his, or have you guys been splitting the mortgage and are you on.

[Jade Warshaw]

No, it's just really. Just his. Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

It's so weird. It's hard for my brain to compute that. But, but again, Michelle, you guys are separate financially, so you're calling us. And honestly, you shouldn't be worried about any financial damage because you guys are already been living for 18 years completely independent of each other. Other than Christmas gifts. Right?

[Unknown Speaker]

I mean, yeah.

[Jade Warshaw]

Oh, no, I don't get those.

[Unknown Speaker]

So. So, really.

[Jade Warshaw]

But we play the pay the yard guy and the cleaning crew and pay, which is that's what, of course, boils me over further. I said, well, if we can't do groceries or we can't do things, you know, for the.

[Ken Coleman]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You can do groceries, you already buy your own. Correct?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, that is true. I, who knows what I'd spent. I mean, not that I don't. I'm fine with paying for this relationship.

[Ken Coleman]

Is so jacked up that you guys have get in. Got to get into counseling on this. You got to ask him because here's the deal. My guess is he's waiting to the absolute last minute to sell the house. Is that what, what it boils down to? To? But again, this is so separate. You guys are so separate. You're calling us going, what do we do together? And it's like you're not even together.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, it's a, it's a marriage counseling discussion. But it sounds like, I mean, tell me if I'm deriving the right thing here for you. The biggest benefit is, hey, I need this guy to sell the house so I can get my 200k back and I can roll out.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'd probably admit to that. There's a little bit of that.

[Unknown Speaker]

Listen, I am not judging you. I, I, I'm not judging you at all. I actually think the best.

[Ken Coleman]

And I'm, I'm, I hope you give her the 200.

[Unknown Speaker]

I think the best thing for you, Michelle, is to sit out and be 100% brutally honest with what you want out of this.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's why I'm asking you tough questions. Because if you can walk out of here having said the words, I wouldn't even be with this guy if it wasn't for these kids. Truthfully, I just want my 200k so I can get out. I don't need him financially. I have my own two legs to stand on. That kind of tells a story. You've never mentioned in this call. Trying to wanting to save anything, any affection towards this guy.

[Ken Coleman]

When I asked her, I go, are you worried about him leaving? She's like, no.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

I think this guy's got it so made with you that I think he needs a wakeup call.

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I. I mean, look, I think we're all human. We don't want to admit to failure and we don't want to give up. I mean, I do care about him, but he's. He's kind of his own worst enemy constantly.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree, by the way.

[Jade Warshaw]

Digging his hole. Digging his hole. And I'm like, stop with the effing hole.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go.

[Unknown Speaker]

Checked out girlfriend.

[Ken Coleman]

I like that statement. But I. We're not saying give up and walk away. We're saying put an ultimatum. If you want to be married to me, we are going to therapy and we're going to try to work through this. If not, there is no future. But I think you got to put your. Your head down now.

[Unknown Speaker]

Look, but you can't just check out and not do anything.

[Ken Coleman]

You can't check out and you've been checked out for a while. And he's not going to change absent a massive, massive bounce to where he has to look. Nowhere but up. The Ramsey show question of the day is brought to you by our friends at Y Refi. All right, let's get real for a second, shall we? Defaulted private student loans do not evaporate. They don't go away. But why? Refi will help you explore a low fixed rate loan based on your unique circumstances. We'd love for you to go to y refi.com Ramsey today. That's y r e f y.com Ramsey. It may not be available in all states.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay. Today's question comes from Kate in New York. New York. She says, hey, at what point is it appropriate to spend your income? My husband and I are in our 50s with three children and have 1 million in retirement and invest about 45000 per year into those funds. Our paid off house is worth 550k and our vehicles are also paid off together. We should gross 200,000 this year and we have a fully funded emergency refund. I would like to go on vacation and drive nicer vehicles which we would pay for with cash as long as we keep saving for retirement. And cash. And pay cash for everything. Is it okay to spend the remainder of your income if you are investing in tithing?

[Ken Coleman]

Girlfriend, I have the feeling that Kate is married to Chuck the cheapskate.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, man, I know you got tycoon syndrome.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, Chuck is tight and Chuck needs to run a lot. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. What do you say to that? Yeah, it's fine to me.

[Unknown Speaker]

I Say yes. Like, this is. This is what frustrates me. I would say Ken is a lot of people, you know, they gravitate towards the Ramsey plan, which is our way of teaching things within the baby steps. And they kind of can't let go of the first two baby steps or the first three baby steps, and they drag that mentality into the rest of the plan. And it's not supposed to be that way. So for the folks who don't know, know, you know, we've got this teaching these seven baby steps, and then there's a lot of nuance around those baby steps that kind of are indicative of this. This Ramsey way of life, this Ramsey plan. And the first three baby steps. Yeah, you're getting out of debt. You're living on nothing. You're stacking up as much savings as you can. But once you hit baby step four, you got to switch gears, and the gear shift is okay. I go from being very, very intense to now I can start to go into a mode of being way more intentional. And, yes, I'm still doing things like investing. Yes, I'm doing things like paying cash for college. But I'm also starting to do more the things in life that I enjoy. And you're transitioning into that part of life. And then, of course, by the time you get to baby step, baby step seven, which they've been at, you should be living like no one else. That's the part you live like no one else. So later you can live and give like no one else. And, you know, I just. Travis the tightwad never got there.

[Ken Coleman]

I love that. We've got our. Our ARC archetypes. I got Chuck the cheapskate. You got Travis the tight one. Yeah, I like this. But you know what I wrote down? I just scribbled this down. This is what this boils down to.

[Unknown Speaker]

And I can't read that writing, by the way.

[Ken Coleman]

That looks like. It looks like. It looks like a squirrel who's on cocaine dragging a marker behind him. That's what it looks like. Kate wants to live. Chuck wants to survive. Oh, it's that simple. It's that simple.

[Unknown Speaker]

In other words, know how to thrive. Just thrive in it.

[Ken Coleman]

He's money for him, is all about surviving. The worst case scenario. He hasn't adjusted. I would suggest to you that Chuck was probably a cheapskate before he found Ramsey. And then our rules made him go, oh, I like this. Right?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Because those kind of people are. And Dave talks about it in different counters. He talks about the free spender or the nerd. But. But what's below the free spender, the nerd, I believe, is this. Kate wants to live by a car. Cash. She wants to go on some vacations.

[Unknown Speaker]

Great.

[Ken Coleman]

She wants Chuck. He just wants to survive. Well, you never know what drone pal is going to do. Oh, we're in the war with. You know, it's like, there's always a reason to be uptight with money. And I'm not knocking on Chuck. I'm just saying I believe that when it comes to money, those are the two psychological profiles underneath it all.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, let's take it a step further, so. Oh, I want to take this a step further, so.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I know you do. I just don't know where you're taking it.

[Unknown Speaker]

About this on the live like no one else cruise. And this is actually a lot of what I talked about. So a guy like you called him Chuck.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, Chuck the cheapskate.

[Unknown Speaker]

Chuck the cheapskate. The problem with Chuck the cheapskate is he. He needs a love language. He needs a spending love language, because right now, his only love language is saving.

[Ken Coleman]

Right?

[Unknown Speaker]

Save more money. Save more money. Save more money, and you can only save so much. Whereas Kate, she knows. She's like, hey, I. She's figured out I want to take a vacation, so she knows she likes experiences, right? She's figured out I want. Want to upgrade my car, so she knows, like, there's a level of this that she wants to upgrade her life. So I would say that there's five different spending love languages.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, drop it on us.

[Unknown Speaker]

All right, number one.

[Ken Coleman]

This is good.

[Unknown Speaker]

Experiences.

[Ken Coleman]

Experiences.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so that's like, vacation, save her life. I go to the new restaurant when it opens.

[Ken Coleman]

Can I just tell you without knowing the other four. That's mine.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's yours.

[Ken Coleman]

I want to make memories.

[Unknown Speaker]

You want to go to movies when they drop.

[Ken Coleman]

I want to go. When the NBA finals things comes up last minute, I want to get in the car and go, yes, you. You know me.

[Unknown Speaker]

I do know you. Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

I see a great pair of shoes that I don't need, but I can afford. I get them.

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, that's different. That's a different one.

[Ken Coleman]

That's an experience. Oh, it is. I'm sorry. I'll be quiet.

[Unknown Speaker]

We'll get to that.

[Ken Coleman]

I apologize.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so. But that's good to know. So, Ken is experiences. The next one. This. This could be, you know, generosity. People who are into generosity, they don't care. I know, I know. That wasn't going to be your skin.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm Kidding. But they.

[Unknown Speaker]

They. They get a high off of. Of, you know, going to do mission work, and they love contributing extra money, and they love, like, funds and, you know, foundations and galas. They're the. You know what I mean? They love that. Then there's people. This is mine. Self care.

[Ken Coleman]

You do love some self care.

[Unknown Speaker]

Self care. This is. And I don't have Botox, but this is like Botox. Get yourself wrapped.

[Ken Coleman]

You love those seaweed wraps.

[Unknown Speaker]

Seaweed wrap. Do all of it. Self care. Love that. Right?

[Ken Coleman]

Love that.

[Unknown Speaker]

Anything. Massage.

[Ken Coleman]

I tell you, I'm a big spa guy. I consider myself a. A somewhat of a spa expert.

[Unknown Speaker]

You got that thick robe.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

Self care. That's number three. Okay, the next one. This is my other one. Convenience. All right, so you like spending money. Door dash. You'll. You'll pay a lawn service. No, I'm just saying these people.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, oh, oh, yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

They'll. They'll pay a lawn service.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, I do like the guy cutting my lawn.

[Unknown Speaker]

Cleaning lady.

[Ken Coleman]

Cleaning service of our cleaning folks.

[Unknown Speaker]

Cleaning man, whoever. You know, anything that is convenient.

[Ken Coleman]

I do. I do appreciate those.

[Unknown Speaker]

And then the next one, I. I call this personal joy. Because this is personal to you. Your spouse may not get it. Like you said, the shoes. Oh, yeah, I. I love Jordans. Somebody else would go, you're an idiot for spending that on a pair of Jordans. But I'm like, it's my personal joy. Don't take it away from me. That's my. Live like no one else. So what would be yours?

[Ken Coleman]

Personal joy?

[Unknown Speaker]

Pickleball? Something Stacy may not be like, well, yeah, yeah. Give it or take.

[Ken Coleman]

Well, we like. We like to do really nice restaurants and tea and experience.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's an experience.

[Ken Coleman]

Theater. See, I don't know. To me, experience. I don't know where Experience and personal joy.

[Unknown Speaker]

I think personal joy, like some. Some people could be into, like, Pokemon cards. That's not really an experience. It's just something that you like spending on money that somebody else might not understand. And that's okay. That's your thing. So those are the five love languages. I think that Chuck or Tightwad, Travis, whoever you want to call.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

He needs to find out.

[Ken Coleman]

He doesn't know what his language is.

[Unknown Speaker]

And he needs to put that in the budget every month.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

You know what I'm saying?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I do. I think this is great. Because I would suggest to you. I love that those. Those five is somebody who's uptight like that. And we're having fun, by the way. We have no idea. If that lady's husband's name is Chuck.

[Unknown Speaker]

We just made that up.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm making that up because I like to entertain myself. But I, I do think that he doesn't even know what his love language is. Is that fact fair?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

He's so fear based that there's no love.

[Unknown Speaker]

There's no love.

[Ken Coleman]

You just gave us some love languages for money and those kind of folks. And again, not bashing you, but you just cannot let go of the fear in order to go. In this case, his wife wants to travel and buy a car. That's, that's nice and all that. It's very interesting. And, and I, I also wanted know how much do you think the actual debt itself versus the life experience that you had growing up with money. How much of is it, is it 50, 50? Is it 60, 40? As the. As to where when people come to us.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

They're like in major debt and then they also have this past. Right. Whatever they grew up.

[Unknown Speaker]

You're saying what does that play into it?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. I'm curious.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, I think it plays. Plays. I think the past plays way more than the actual stress than the actual what's currently happening.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Unknown Speaker]

I think so.

[Ken Coleman]

I agree with you. That's why I asked you because we've done a lot of calls and it's really important to understand when we give you coaching, you gotta wrestle with what's really going on.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah. Who you were with money. Who your parents were with money. What you grew up as. A financial framework of money guarantee.

[Ken Coleman]

Guarantee you. The, the Chucks, the cheapskate Chucks of the world. They grew up in a scarcity situation.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

And that's why they're so afraid and tight on that. So really good. I love those love languages. Is there anywhere people can download that, that talk?

[Unknown Speaker]

They'd have to steal my computer from me.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay. There's your answer.

[Unknown Speaker]

Foreign.

[Ken Coleman]

Hey, what's up? Dr. John Deloney here. The new dates have dropped for the money and marriage getaway over Valentine's day weekend in 2026. This is your chance to hit pause on everything in your life and reconnect with your spouse over a long weekend in Nashville, Tennessee. Me and my friend Rachel Cruz will be digging into topics like sex, money, communication and more. More. This weekend is happening on February 12th through the 14th and early bird prices start at $749 per couple. But the prices will be going up soon. Get your tickets [e-mail] events. This, this is the Ramsey show where America hangs out to have a conversation about their money, their work and their relationships. The phone number to jump in today is 8888-2552-2588-8825, 5225, alongside the fabulous Jade Warshaw. I am Ken Coleman. Thrilled that you all are with us. And we're going to start it off with Russell in San Antonio, Texas. Russell, how can we help? Well, hello.

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm so glad to get through to you.

[Ken Coleman]

Good to talk to you, sir.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thank you so much. Well, I'll give you a little story. In 2012, I had a major stroke. I was working. You may know the company, I don't know, Argo Group. It was a major PNC insurance group.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I had a stroke going into work in the steering wheel.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, wow.

[Jade Warshaw]

Sorry.

[Ken Coleman]

My goodness.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. And they carried me out to an ambulance and I've had four more strokes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, gosh.

[Ken Coleman]

Bless you.

[Jade Warshaw]

And you know, and now I'm facing homelessness because my money just plain ran out. Oh, I had a pretty good. I had a pretty good sized nest egg, about 30,000 bucks. And it went, you know, the medical bills, you know, and I'm living here in a extended, say, motel in San Antonio, and I don't have the money to pay for that.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you. Are you still employed?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, no, I. When I recovered a little bit, I worked for Donovan. Those. I worked my way up on the ladder in there, you know, to be a little manager and stuff like that was hiring and firing me. I mean, drivers and.

[Ken Coleman]

So what happened to that job?

[Jade Warshaw]

Had another stroke.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

Bless your heart. So you've all of these strokes keep knocking you out of work. Where are you at physically now as it relates to being able to work?

[Jade Warshaw]

I can't.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah. Are you on any government assistance?

[Jade Warshaw]

There's Social Security and that's about all I got, you know.

[Ken Coleman]

And what's your Social Security payment every month?

[Jade Warshaw]

20. Net is 25.

[Ken Coleman]

10.

[Jade Warshaw]

22,000.

[Ken Coleman]

$22,510.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And gross? Gross is 27. When you get past the paying for your Medicare, you get the twenty hundred bucks for the next, I don't know, three or four or five months or something.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Unknown Speaker]

How old are you?

[Jade Warshaw]

I'm 75.

[Ken Coleman]

Where is the $2,500 a month? What's that going to. If you don't have any money? That means your expenses are eating up all the 2500 and you can't even pay for your hotel. Where's it going?

[Jade Warshaw]

It. Well, my rent is about 400 bucks.

[Unknown Speaker]

A week extended stay right and then do you have a vehicle?

[Jade Warshaw]

I do.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay. And is it, Are you paying payments on something or is it just something you've had for a long time?

[Jade Warshaw]

I've had that thing forever.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so that's paid for cash.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah. There's no expense. Gas.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so we got gas and insurance. Okay, and what's that run you?

[Jade Warshaw]

The gas is almost nice to nothing out that body. 20 folks, 20 bucks a month. Okay, something like that.

[Ken Coleman]

You have no friends and family get to be.

[Jade Warshaw]

I. I've got all kinds of friends and family, but they've all gave up.

[Unknown Speaker]

What does that. That mean?

[Jade Warshaw]

It means they left me alone.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm sorry.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. Well, the reason I asked that, Russell, is because when you have no ability to work because of the strokes, your only income is the Social Security and the $400 a week is just way too expensive for you. So our first and best strategy in my mind. Jade, speak up here if you disagree. Our first strategy is to get you a much lower cost of L situation. And yeah, I don't know if the local government is aware of your situation. And I will be candid to say I don't know specifically what's available to you, but if family has left you alone, then we've got to reach out to some friends. And even if you were to just, for instance, get a roommate or go live with somebody and you paid them 500 bucks a month, that's a lot of margin there because most of your money is going to. To just the hotel.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

I mean, do you know how to budget? In other words, are you able to. If Jade and I were to come meet you right now and sit down with you, could you show us where the rest of the money outside of the $1600 towards the extended stay where the rest of it's going? Do you have a grasp of that?

[Jade Warshaw]

I can show you that to a penny.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so then where can you. Where is the best saving of money? Am I right that your lodging is the number one expense?

[Jade Warshaw]

My lodging is the big problem.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so let's assume that we remove that. Would you have enough margin to live comfortably off the Social Security payment?

[Jade Warshaw]

Absolutely.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, then. Then that's our number one goal here.

[Unknown Speaker]

The hard part is, you know, on that list of friends and family, who do you think you could talk to to say, hey, can I rent a room? Can I? Because at this point, yeah, I'm looking for renting a room out of someone else's space because even an apartment, even an apartment's going to run you 1600amonth. You see what I'm saying? So I understand why you went to an extended stay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Yeah, it, well, here's the situation. I've got two shots, sons. The elder one lives in Colorado Springs and he doesn't hear.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

And the second one lives in, in Plano, Texas.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

About you know, two or three or four hours from here, four or five hours from here. And I tried to contact him and he, he said go to you know where.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, well so you can't go, you can't go to them. But can you get on one of these sites and can you find a roommate? Can you find a room to rent that's a little cheaper than 1600 because I mean even $200 less would break. Would be a big difference for you if you could find something.

[Jade Warshaw]

It would make a. It would make a big difference. Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I, I mean here's the deal. We don't have time to unpack and I'm so sorry about the relationship with your sons.

[Jade Warshaw]

I know.

[Ken Coleman]

But listen, if I'm, you remember Russell, serious as I can be, I'm going to stumble into some churches and I'm going to say, hey, I need help. I'm a 75 year old man who's had a lot of health complications but I have enough money to take care of myself if I can reduce my cost of living and I need to find some other 75 year old dude who's lonely and needs a roommate or something. I mean, I'm just telling you you got to look for that and you got to ask for some help with people that are in the business of helping because here's the deal. We've established, established you can help yourself. If we get you out of that hotel and we get you in a much more reasonable of living situation then you've got some margin. So Russell, I wish we could pull open a Rolodex. I wish I could get everybody listening in in San Antonio to call in and say we can help Russell out. Yeah, I wish I could snap my fingers but you can do this. But you've got to ask for help.

[Unknown Speaker]

You got to go to the bright this.

[Ken Coleman]

You can't do this in isolation, Russell. And you also said there was tons of family and friends. All we talked about was the two sons. I'm going to swallow my pride and I'm calling every family member who will answer me and who will help me and I'm saying please help me.

[Jade Warshaw]

Foreign.

[Ken Coleman]

Does having more money and less stress sound nice but feel impossible? Well, in my Brand new book, Breaking Free from Broke. I share my story of going from broke to millionaire and exactly how I did it. You'll learn about the money traps and cultural lies out there designed to keep you brainwashed and stressed out from credit card schemes to mortgage myths to investing traps. So if you're not where you want.

[Unknown Speaker]

To be financially, I can help you.

[Ken Coleman]

Finally get get ahead. You can get Breaking Free from broke [e-mail] store. That's ramseysolutions.com store. All right. Now when you're tackling debt or you're to trying trying to build wealth, there's one thing that it's very easy to forget about and that's insurance coverage. It could be too little, could be too much and people overlook their coverages. And if you're skimping on insurance, you might think I'm saving some money. But watch out, when life happens, you're going to be happy they have it. So the right insurance, that's the right amount. Not too little, not too much. That's what we're talking about here. And so if you're not sure where you're at on that, we'd really recommend you take a look our free coverage checkup. It's absolutely super easy, about five minutes. It's going to give you an action plan based on your situation. It's the coverage checkup. You can get [e-mail] checkup. That's ramseysolutions.com checkup. Have you done your checkup lately? You're looking at me.

[Unknown Speaker]

I was trying to remember what's the nursery rhyme where it's like not too little, not too much, just enough.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't know. But had you pulled it, you should have sang it. It wouldn't even have phased me. I would have treated it like a voice. Voiceover.

[Unknown Speaker]

Goldilocks and three bears.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

It's like the Goldilocks.

[Ken Coleman]

Something to do with porridge.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

I don't know. I can't remember.

[Unknown Speaker]

I tried.

[Ken Coleman]

It's been a long time. George is up in Nashville, Tennessee. George, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hi. Thanks for taking my call.

[Ken Coleman]

You bet.

[Jade Warshaw]

I recently got engaged.

[Ken Coleman]

Congratulations.

[Unknown Speaker]

Great.

[Jade Warshaw]

And I have, we've had basically it's come out that my fiance has what I consider a significant amount of debt.

[Ken Coleman]

How much?

[Jade Warshaw]

And I'm not really sure. 65, 000 I think is what she told me.

[Ken Coleman]

I think you're correct, sir. That's significant.

[Unknown Speaker]

How long have you been fiang?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, we just got engaged last month. We've been together close to a year year now.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, so how are you handling this information?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I am not sure what to do about it. I, my first reaction was to pay it off for, but she seemed a little resistant to that. I'm not sure maybe if I should wait until, until after the wedding or I shouldn't pay it off at all. I don't really know.

[Unknown Speaker]

You should wait until. Well, here's, here's the good news. The good news is that you heard the news and you weren't like super pissed and like, well, she's on her own. I like that. Your first thought was how can I, how can I come in to the situation and help? That's great. I would say, yeah, don't do that until you're married. And when you are married then it's a, it's both of your issue and both of your problem and both of your debt. And so you both get to help pay that off. And if it just so happens that on your side there's more money to put towards it, then so be it. What would be her, her problem with you contributing towards that after you're married?

[Jade Warshaw]

You know, I think she really, it's, you know, she just says like she, she doesn't want to let me do that. Like she doesn't want to, she wants to do it on her own. Which I can understand.

[Ken Coleman]

But have you guys discussed, since you're newly engaged, have you guys discussed what marriage finance is going to look like? In other words, have you at least discussed when we get married we should combine finances? Or are you guys on the opposite side of this? Which is you're saying, well, we're just going to have. Because the way you just said it makes me wonder if that's what you guys are planning to do. Because she's like, well, I'm just going to take care of it myself. What's the play?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, I think we should combine finances.

[Ken Coleman]

We do too. We do too. I'm just asking you, have you discussed.

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't think she wants to, you.

[Unknown Speaker]

Know, but have you discussed it or are you just guessing?

[Jade Warshaw]

Not really.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay, there we go. Yeah. So A you haven't discussed it and B, the way she's talking, it's exactly right. She think it's separate. So that gets back to the answer to your question. What we always say to people. So we will say it to you. Number one, you should not pay it while you're engaged. You can encourage her, support her, woo hoo. But you don't pay any money. The Day you guys get married. Married. Okay. Now we combine finances, and then you do help, because it is now our student loan debt. Even though it's hers, it's our debt now. That's what we teach. And Jade, there's a reason for this. Give him the pep talk as if you were talking to this young couple over your dinner table as to why they should combine.

[Unknown Speaker]

I mean, it's. For me, it goes back to that old kind of biblical teaching, like two people become one, right? That's what happens when you get married, is you become one flesh, essentially. And that's not. You don't leave anything out of it. I mean, we literally used the same example on a call earlier today. It's all encompassing. You don't leave things out to the side and say, well, kind of like 95%, you. You take the. Take 100% of each other, and that includes the good and the bad, right? Like, you don't say, hey, I really like you, but, you know, I don't like your mom. And so, you know, it's like, no, you take the in laws, you take all of it comes with it, and you can't really compartmentalize it. And that. It's the same thing with money. Now, there's that part of it which is just the factual element, right? And then there's the part of a lot of marriage is vision. You know, creating a vision and going after goals and creating this life that you want for each other and for your family and for your namesake and for your life legacy. And that requires teamwork and partnering together. And it's very hard to partner with someone who is on a completely different life track and has their money over here separately and has decided, I'm with you, but only 90% with you or only 85% with you. Does that make sense?

[Jade Warshaw]

It does. Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

And so, yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

So, George, I know Jade would agree with me. Here we are. We would both recommend that you guys have premarital counseling. Not because it's a crisis, but it's just really smart because money is a issue in marriage. So I would go to her, if I were you, and say, hey, this issue has made me realize we're not on the same page or wavelength when it comes to money. And we need to be. And now's the time for us with no tension, just to kind of go in and let's let a professional therapist walk us through and facilitate our views around money, our desires about money, our fears, all the things, things. And let you two have a professional walk you through this prior to getting married. That's what I would do if I were you.

[Unknown Speaker]

And this has kind of been a theme today. George, you're not the first person I, I. You're definitely not alone. Can we had this earlier? Everybody's got a background that they're bringing into their relationship with money. And so it's up to you, once you become married, to figure out how your spouse ticks when it actually it relates to money. Because guaranteed, it's not going to be exactly the way you tick. Right. And the things that make you scared aren't going to be the things that make them scared. And the things that make you feel comfortable might not be the things that make them feel comfortable. So learning that and starting early is so important, and I think really points to a, A true level of intimacy in your marriage when you un. When you understand somebody at a soul level like that.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I absolutely agree. And again, when we talk about young couples, because we have a lot of people, whether they're living together, not married, or in George's case, I don't know if they're living together or not, but they are now engaged to be married. And we know the data, Jade. We know what the data says about divorce and money because there's so many things attached to money. That's the keeping up with the Joneses. That's the keeping up with the lifestyle that I was raised with. But now all of a sudden, I don't have daddy's money. Right. Whether that's the guy or the gal.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

There's a lot that goes into this.

[Unknown Speaker]

Gender roles, all that.

[Ken Coleman]

And then what we spend on and what we don't, Views of debt. This is a mess.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Ken Coleman]

If you don't get on the same page prior, it doesn't have to be like divorce mess, although it can be. But let's. Can we just own the fact that it's really messy?

[Unknown Speaker]

I think so.

[Ken Coleman]

Trying to blend.

[Unknown Speaker]

You touched on this and I, and I've said it before, Ken, I'll say it again, you know, and maybe we've even been guilty of it here on this show of saying combine your finances as if it's some kind of like, boop, it's done. You have one conversation, it's done. It's really not like that, you know, like you said, Ken, this is a web of emotion. And, you know, some, some things you hold on to with a kung fu grip in marriage. And it's like you don't want to let it go. So a lot of times this is conversation after conversation with a few arguments sprinkled in. Right, Right. Like, that's the way this looks, you know, a few counseling sessions sprinkled in. It's rarely, maybe if you get married super young and you just are ready to go with the flow with everything.

[Ken Coleman]

Right.

[Unknown Speaker]

It can be a little easier, but it's rarely just a light switch. It's mini conversations. It's given its take, it's compromise. It's each person having to get uncomfortable and get very vulnerable. And that's the way it looks.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. So again, you're listening, you're watching us, and you're in a very serious relationship, whatever that looks like. Get on the same page with money. Sooner rather than later. Everything else tends to fall in place there. Because what it takes to get on the same page with money will help you in every other major part of your marriage as well, because there needs to be some discipline and some emotional safety involved in all of this. So here's a plot twist no one warns you about. You budget for the big trip, and you thought of everything, but then, boom, you're at the airport trying to buy.

[Unknown Speaker]

A phone charger that costs more than the checked bag fee.

[Ken Coleman]

Welcome to summer, the season of surprise.

[Unknown Speaker]

Spending and overpriced everything. But don't let it catch you slipping like some dollar store flip flops.

[Ken Coleman]

All right? Stay on top of your your budget.

[Unknown Speaker]

With the EveryDollar app.

[Ken Coleman]

It's the easiest way to make a.

[Unknown Speaker]

Plan for your money and give everydollar a job. Basically, it's you telling your money what.

[Ken Coleman]

To do instead of wondering where it went. Like, how did I spend $40 on pistachio popsicles?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, the plot twist is real, but.

[Ken Coleman]

With EveryDollar, you'll stay a step ahead. So go download the EveryDollar app for free in the App Store or Google Play today. All right, folks, we are so excited about all the new folks that are joining us all the time via podcasts, of course, radio, SiriusXM, YouTube. Just really, really excited. And we. We have more people coming all the time, and they're kind of going, hey, I'm excited about this. It's helping me change my life. I want to help others. And so we created the Ramsey 101 playlist to be able to make it really easy with one click of one link for you to share all the 101 basics, the fundamentals of what we teach. And so it's free, easy to share, and you can get it in the show notes, the link in the show notes, or it's at the top of our YouTube channel and it's our Ramsey 101 playlist. So check that out. Share, share, share. Holly is joining us now in Columbus, Georgia. Holly, how can we help today?

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey there. I am a spouse of an active duty service member. I work full time in a remote W2 position. But I'm wondering and would like to pick your brains about whether or not I should switch to the same position as a 1099 custody.

[Unknown Speaker]

What would be the. In your mind, what's the positive? You're just responsible for your own taxes. Do you also get to choose the jobs you do?

[Jade Warshaw]

The latter, yes. Having that flexibility for not only what the military requires of my husband and our family, but also to have more flexibility for our two toddlers. But then also there's the possibility of an increase to the income which obviously I'd like to pay off my debt. I was looking over my benefits this morning, which I can give you guys all the specifics if you want them, but. And if I'm doing the baby steps correctly, the only one that I am air quote missing out on is the 401 match. But that's not part of my equation right now.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, then what I'm hearing is 1099, I get the opportunity to control my income a little bit bit more. Whether it be, you know, I can take more jobs or let go of jobs or whatever. I get the flexibility of a schedule and getting to choose my work. And the only negative is I don't get a 401k match.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right. Because things like FSA's life insurance, disability, all that stuff covered already. So I don't really need those employer sponsored benefits. Which is why I was like, this 1099 gig sounds really cushy, but I know there's a lot of extras to 1099 that I have no idea what I'm doing dealing with.

[Unknown Speaker]

Not really.

[Ken Coleman]

Not really. I would just, yeah, both of us have 1099 background. The only issue is you've got to have some discipline to do your own withholding and you got to have a good tax pro. And if you're communicating with that tax pro along the way. And I'd start with the tax pro before I switch. Go. Okay, what do you think I need to hold aside, by the way? Change anything that I'm saying wrong. But I'd start with the tax pro. Go. If I move to 1099, what should I I do in what, you know, kind of saving holding money back and then they're going to tell you and then my guess is they're going to say, let's check in once a quarter would be my guess. That's what I would prefer is okay, here's how much I've made this in the last quarter. Here's how much I've set aside. A good tax pro is going to go okay. A little bit less is okay or a little bit more. And I think other than that, I don't think there's anything to it. It's a real breeze, actually.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah. And then when the time comes for you to invest, invest, just, you know, it can be, I do find for folks who are self employed, they can get a little, you know, lazy on the investing side because it's not just there set up for you ready to contribute. You've got to kind of put a little bit of thought into what's the best vehicle for me. Yeah, you could start with a Roth IRA or you could do like an individual 401k, that sort of thing. And yeah, I think other than that, you're off to the races. But I think Ken has a good point. Get the people in your corner that you need. You know, just off the top of our head, we're going to tell you, yeah, put aside 25% for whatever withholding. And if you start doing that at the end of the, you know, when it's time to pay taxes, you're going to be in a really good spot. And it sounds like 1099 is the way for her based on what she's saying.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, I, you know, when somebody calls on something like this, I always ask, where were you leaning before you called us? And I think we. You think 1099 is the way to go?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes, I think so. I make to, I don't know, to help you guys with where I am. I make 2957 an hour. Currently the gig pays anywhere from 70 to 165 per case, which could take 30 minutes to like four hours. But when I've been talking with my colleagues, they average about six cases at the 70 range per day. So I was like, that, that's great. That still puts me over if I were to save like 30% for taxes.

[Ken Coleman]

Right, exactly. Well, you've run the numbers. This sounds like a great move.

[Jade Warshaw]

I know, I just need validation.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, listen. Well, first of all, you got the validation, but again, I would go to Ramsey Solutions and look up tax pros in your area and interview them and get somebody and get them on board before you make the switch.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Ken Coleman]

But only to make you feel very secure. In what you need to do. But we don't see any problem with this from what you've given us. So good for you. And by the way, thank you for serving us.

[Unknown Speaker]

Thank you.

[Ken Coleman]

We appreciate that. You're a great American.

[Jade Warshaw]

Thank you guys. I appreciate your help and the vote of confidence.

[Unknown Speaker]

You can do it. You got this.

[Ken Coleman]

You got this. We're behind you. Matt is in Lynchbur, Virginia. Matt, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

Thanks. I'm ready to start investing kind of more for retirement. I'm more or less self employed, so I don't have anything in my company. But my question today is I hear a lot of comments about financial investors. A large percentage of them can't beat the basic S&P 500 type funds. So how do you, when you're sitting down with like a smart investor pro and asking questions, questions, how do you determine or what are some good signs or questions to like pick out who's going to actually be just the general funds that you could go get yourself?

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, you're in, your advisor is there to advise you on what they think you ought to do. Right? But they don't. They're not deputized to make the decisions for you. At least you shouldn't do that. You should have a clear understanding of if they suggest something, if they, they say, hey, we're suggesting this fund for you, you should then be able to understand why is that and do I feel good about that and do I sign off on that? Right. And to kind of answer your question about these mutual funds, plenty of them do. You're right, plenty of them don't. But plenty of them do. Mine, mine do. They outperform. Feel good about that. Anyway, what you're looking at, what I would look at is kind of when you look at the fund, you can go through and look at the track record and see how has this fund performed over, over the past. You can see when it was, when it was created. You can see how well how long it's been a fund. I would not choose anything that's brand new. I'd want to look for something that's been around 20 years, you know, so I'm looking at that track record to see how it's done. And you can actually see that. And that way you're not guessing. It's not as much of a guess as people think it is. You can actually look and see how is this fund performed. And so if you have an professional who you're working with, you can ask to see that. Can I see? You know Can I look at the prospectus on this? Can I look at the track record so I can be in the know as well? And so those are things that I would, if I'm interviewing someone or I'm working with an advisor, if they kind of get frustrated when I ask questions or they're kind of annoyed at the fact that I want to know what's going on, or they kind of get a little huffy or whatever when, when I'm, you know, poking my nose in, quote, their business, I'm not working with them. I want somebody who knows this is my money, I care about it. I want to understand what's going on. I am keeping my eye out. I want somebody who encourages that, not somebody who's annoyed by that. You know what I'm saying, Ken?

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. And I, I love what you said. The only thing I'd add, this is personal to me, Matt. But I give you this as an example for you to go, well, how you do. How do I like people to communicate with me? So if I were you, I would think about maybe a professor that you really enjoyed, a coach that you enjoyed, and I would be looking for some of those attributes. I know for me when it comes to this, because of the minutiae of our plan. So Stacy and I sit with our advisor every January, and even though I'm sitting here co host the Ramsey show all the time, I'm not an investment expert. I don't even know half of what Dave has in his pinky sharing mean. But what has been big for us is can he explain it to me and to Stacy to where we both walk out completely clear and completely confident? That's always been the test for me because we're very different personalities. You know, me, I got 47,000 questions.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, and she kind of dives into things that she cares about. And so I just think it's really important that you get somebody that really does get you and can adjust to you. They're all different personality types or whatever, but that chemistry to me, to where you get what they're saying and they teach you to where you go, oh, okay, how are we doing on this and what are we going to do on this? I think that's key.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah. You got to. They have to want your shared vision and care about that, as opposed to them just having a vision of what they think you ought to be doing.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

And that's, that's a huge part of it. Just remember, remember you're hiring them to do a job for you. So you're interviewing them and they work for you. Sometimes it can feel the opposite and you don't want that.

[Ken Coleman]

Our scripture of the day comes from Job 23, verse 10. But he knows the way that I take. When he has tested me, I will come forth as gold. And our quote of the day from George Bernard Shaw. A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support.

[Unknown Speaker]

Of Paul co. Wow, that's them. That's shots. Fire.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, the team bringing some. That's one of my all time favorites. I'm going to leave that alone because that's a rabbit trail that James doesn't want me to go down. But I love that statement. I think that's great.

[Unknown Speaker]

You know, you're my. My go to vote, right?

[Ken Coleman]

I appreciate it.

[Unknown Speaker]

If it all goes down, I'm voting for Ken Coleman.

[Ken Coleman]

I appreciate that all day. And you would be on the ticket. Who's going to say no to a Coleman Warshaw ticket? I mean, that's a landslide.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yes.

[Ken Coleman]

Are you kidding me? People be like, the only problem with that is you need to be on the bottom of the ticket. It needs to be Warshaw Coleman, pal.

[Unknown Speaker]

I don't know. Ken, know your role. I'll be. It'll be a puppet regime and you'll be controlling the whole thing.

[Ken Coleman]

I love everything about it. Let's go to Aaron in Dallas, Texas. Aaron, how can we help?

[Jade Warshaw]

So want to see if you can clear up a debate that me and.

[Ken Coleman]

My wife are having.

[Unknown Speaker]

Ooh, my favorite.

[Ken Coleman]

Me too.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's a credit card usage only for getting the points and paying it off, you know, before any interest occurs.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay. Are you team credit card points or are you team. No credit card points.

[Ken Coleman]

I'm team credit card points.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, boy.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, your team. Have you ever heard us talk about this on the show? And it's an honest question.

[Jade Warshaw]

Not about.

[Ken Coleman]

The points part of it. Oh, great. Well, I'll see the balance of my time to the lady in the yellow.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, so I think that it's pretty clear whose side we're on. If it's your wife who doesn't want to do the credit card points, we side with her. Let's talk a little bit about why. Fair enough.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay. So you tell me, you tell me how the point system is working. Tell me, how much do you have to spend to get X amount amount of points?

[Jade Warshaw]

Well, it depends on which credit card. For instance, you use my Hilton honors one.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay.

[Jade Warshaw]

For every time I go to work, you know, I put it on there so I get the points.

[Ken Coleman]

You know, get like 10 times the.

[Jade Warshaw]

Points for per dollar. So you know, $160, 1600 points and how much?

[Unknown Speaker]

So $160 gets you 1600 points. And then how many, how many points equals a dollar? So you have to hold it. You said it. You have to spend $160 to get 1600 points.

[Jade Warshaw]

Right.

[Unknown Speaker]

And do the points equal when you go to spend the points? Do they equal dollars?

[Jade Warshaw]

No, they only equal, you know, stay.

[Ken Coleman]

So like a room at the Hamptons, about 30,000 points, which would be about.

[Jade Warshaw]

$3,000 in credit card usage.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, and how long does it take to you to get $3,000 in credit card uses?

[Jade Warshaw]

About 10 business trips.

[Unknown Speaker]

And that gets you a stay for how many days a weekend?

[Jade Warshaw]

One night.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, that's terrible. You guys spend $3,000 to get a one night stay.

[Jade Warshaw]

Only on top of the Hampton points.

[Ken Coleman]

That I get too. So it's like doubling the points.

[Jade Warshaw]

So really it's five stays, I guess.

[Ken Coleman]

But just from the credit card itself.

[Unknown Speaker]

But if I, if I go on Hilton. Let me just, let me just say this real quick.

[Ken Coleman]

If I go on so nice right.

[Unknown Speaker]

Now, do this for me, Ken Coleman.

[Ken Coleman]

Okay.

[Unknown Speaker]

Pull up one night, a one night stay at a Hilton in Orlando, just a vacation destination. Because you're telling me you got to spend $3,000 to get what I'm pretty sure you're going to get for about 120 bucks a night.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's all right.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's where my, there's part of the crux of my argument right There is.

[Ken Coleman]

Your SO range cost of a one night stay at a Hilton hotel in Orlando could vary between 131, up to 500 a night. So you were spot on.

[Unknown Speaker]

So you got to go, you got to work a whole month and put a whole month's worth of work on this credit card to get one night, which is not a vacation on the credit card. So which means to just get a weekend, you got to put $9,000 onto this credit card just to get a weekend stay at a hotel where you really could just, I don't know, at that point, probably cash flow.

[Ken Coleman]

It.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, I just, that's that, that's where my reasoning starts, is we're stepping over quarters to pick up pennies. That's, that's just where the reasoning starts for me. And then we can keep walking down the road of. Now in order to pick up these, these pennies, we're putting ourselves at a habitual risk. And the reason I say habitual risk is because the Whole point of credit cards is to create a habit forming way of life where it's my habit that I put all of my money on these cards and I'm dependent on these cards to where when it's time to let go of the cards, I actually feel a little bit of fear or like I can't let go of these cards because I've created this habit of forming lifestyle. So that's step two of why I'm like no to credit cards. Step three of why I say no to credit cards is I'm stepping over the quarters to pick up these really expensive pennies. I'm creating this habit forming life and now I've got this piece of debt to where if any rain comes in my life, Junior needs braces. I fall and break my arm and I have a hospital stay and it's $500 to go to the error or Brenda gets married in the Caribbean and you're going to be the best man and best woman at the wedding. Now I've just got this credit card laying around that I said I was only going to put points on and I was only going to put my normal budget on, but now suddenly I could get more points and now you go to Brenda's wedding in the Caribbean. Do you see what I'm saying?

[Jade Warshaw]

I see what you're saying.

[Unknown Speaker]

It just creates domino effect.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, I got to hear his butt.

[Jade Warshaw]

Okay, so what if you have nervous debt, like everything like including the house.

[Ken Coleman]

Paid off and then the only thing that you are putting on that credit.

[Jade Warshaw]

Card like for the Hampton, like the.

[Ken Coleman]

Hilton credit card is just the hotel.

[Jade Warshaw]

I don't use it for anything else.

[Unknown Speaker]

I would say. Is that true? Do you have your house paid off?

[Jade Warshaw]

Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Way to go. That's pretty awesome. I would say, I think to that and I am saying I'm just shocked that you care enough about the $130 that you would work to put $9,000 on a credit card to get just feels like a lot of rigamaro. There you go. There's a word.

[Ken Coleman]

There you go.

[Jade Warshaw]

Rigamaro.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, she's not for it. You're not going to talk her out of it. So I feel like you two are at an impasse because when your house.

[Unknown Speaker]

When your house is paid, when your.

[Ken Coleman]

House is paid off. Two women against you. You should go ahead and surrender now, my friend Jade and your wife. This is a lost cause.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm just like when your house is paid off, you're not, you're not going through the rigama row to get 130 bucks. You're just like, oh, my house is paid off. I'm not gonna introduce debt into my life.

[Ken Coleman]

Listen, here's the deal, Aaron. Jade is speaking on our behalf. My behalf. That's what our answer is. Every time we get this call, we get this call a lot. It's going to always be the answer. You can play the mind game that well, I have no debt. Other people aren't disciplined. I play it off. I pay it off every month, by the way. It's true. Okay. I know people that do.

[Jade Warshaw]

Credit card.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah, we don't always. That's the one that, you know.

[Unknown Speaker]

That's.

[Ken Coleman]

That's the other one.

[Jade Warshaw]

That's that one.

[Ken Coleman]

We get 5% cash back at times.

[Jade Warshaw]

It's just the Chase Freedom Card.

[Ken Coleman]

Yeah. But again, the reason we're against all this. And I don't think you're going to change unless your wife puts the. Puts her foot down. And at which point, you need to listen to that. Trust me, I've been married 27 years. Just go with the flow on that one.

[Unknown Speaker]

But 5% cash back, that's a game.

[Ken Coleman]

That's a game. And Jade's right. They play those games with points and cash back to keep the plastic in your wallet so that when life happens, you will use it. And then they make money off of you. You at an absurd interest rate. You agree with that? Yes or no?

[Jade Warshaw]

They do.

[Ken Coleman]

The interest rate is absurd. We talk about an emergency fund. Three to six months of cash so that you don't need the plastic. So I want to make sure you understand. I don't want to be glib with you, but that's our position on why cash back or points isn't worth the temptation.

[Unknown Speaker]

And we didn't even talk about how your spending increases when you use plastic of any kind. So cred credit cards are at the top of the list of spending increases. And it really depends on what it is that you're buying. They've even done studies that show if you're buying something like experiences or concert tickets, people are willing, in some cases willing to spend 100% more than what they would have spent had they had cash. So, for instance, I'm going to Beyonce. If I had a credit card, I'd be willing to spend double the amount. Three T shirts versus cash. Cash.

[Ken Coleman]

And those T shirts are overpriced. About five bucks. What are you going to drop on Beyonce?

[Unknown Speaker]

I don't want to talk about it.

[Ken Coleman]

I do. America wants to know.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm not talking about it.

[Ken Coleman]

Ken Cole oh, she's going to spend a lot.

[Unknown Speaker]

Let me just say. Let me just say I'm going to be able to reach out and touch.

[Ken Coleman]

Oh, no. Oh, you're close.

[Unknown Speaker]

I'm getting in there.

[Ken Coleman]

Ken, I need footage. I need footage on Instagram or it didn't happen. This is the Ramsey Show.

[Jade Warshaw]

Hey, you guys. I was shocked to learn that 88% of you out there are sharing the Ramsey show. I mean, that is so incredible. Thank you so much. And I want to tell you that we're making it even easier to share. So this June, we have pulled together the brand new Ramsey101 YouTube playlist. A quick start collection of how to get started walking the Ramsey plan. Now, this playlist is perfect for that.

[Unknown Speaker]

One person in your life who needs.

[Jade Warshaw]

Help winning with money and just doesn't.

[Unknown Speaker]

Know where to start.

[Jade Warshaw]

So here's what's inside.

[Unknown Speaker]

What the baby steps are and why they actually work.

[Jade Warshaw]

How the debt snowball helps you pay off debt fast. And how to build wealth and invest.

[Unknown Speaker]

For the future and so much more.

[Jade Warshaw]

So here's what you need to do. Click the link at the top of the show notes.

[Unknown Speaker]

It'll take you straight to the YouTube playlist. Copy it, text it, send it in a group chat.

[Jade Warshaw]

Just say, hey, I thought this might help. Because one playlist shared at the right.

[Unknown Speaker]

Time could be the turning point.

[Jade Warshaw]

One share, one playlist, one step could change everything for that one person in your life. So click the link, share the Ramsey show and subscribe. And let's help someone out there start winning with money.