Geneva Watch Days 2025 — Federico Ziviani, Gerald Charles

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Real Time Show

Episode: Geneva Watch Days 2025 — Federico Ziviani, Gerald Charles
Date: September 5, 2025
Hosts: Rob Nudds & Alon Ben Joseph
Guest: Federico Ziviani, Managing Director of Gerald Charles

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Overview

In this special Geneva Watch Days episode, hosts Rob Nudds and Alon Ben Joseph chat with Federico Ziviani of Gerald Charles in the famed “glass igloo” outside the pavilion. The discussion explores the deep personal and professional ties between Federico’s family and legendary designer Gérald Genta, the revival and evolution of the Gerald Charles brand, and the technical, design, and strategic decisions shaping its exciting new chapter. The conversation is rich with personal anecdotes, horological insights, and big questions about legacy and future innovation.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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1. The Gerald Charles Backstory and Family Ties

[02:51–06:57]

• Federico’s Family and Gérald Genta:

  • Federico’s father, Franco, met Genta in 1982 and was requested to help develop the Gérald Genta brand in Italy.
  • The relationship deepened when Franco distributed Audemars Piguet in Italy and founded its first subsidiary.
  • In 2000, after selling his namesake brand, Genta wanted to start anew with “Gerald Charles,” enlisting Franco and his brother Gian Paolo for help.
  • Early days of Gerald Charles: highly bespoke, artistic pieces with personal involvement by Genta.

• Legacy Quote:

  • “Gerald signed a quotation, a quote, saying that he created Gerald Charles to give pleasure to whoever looks at it and like an artist, included his smile into the case, because we need to smile, we need to be happy in this life.”
    — Federico Ziviani [05:38]

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2. Transitioning Post-Genta & Brand Evolution

[06:57–11:24]

• After Genta’s passing in 2011, the brand continued quietly, mainly with bespoke commissions.

• Federico’s Entry:

  • Returned to the family’s business after Computer Science studies in London.
  • Envisioned a broader audience: “We need to enlarge the scope because...my generation would want to wear some of the last designs of the Maestro.”
  • 2019 marked a strategic pivot:
    • Focus: Single-case design (the Maestro), centerpiece identity.
    • Community: Digital campaigns leveraged his IT background, engaging collectors online.
    • Retail Expansion: From 0 to 110 doors globally in six years; expanded team from 3 to 40.

• Quote:

  • “I say my objective is to deliver long term value to everybody that buys a Gerald Charles. That’s my number one objective. I’m 30 years old.”
    — Federico Ziviani [11:48]

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3. The Maestro Case & Brand DNA

[13:30–14:19]

• The “Smile case” is the Maestro—a design by Genta, now the singular focus.
• Historical Range: Previously, many cases (Renaissance, Turbo, Seaside) were produced in small numbers and are now rare collectibles.
• Future Cases: Deep archive allows many options, but focus remains on Maestro for now.

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4. The Burden and Opportunity of Legacy

[14:39–18:42]

• On Creating New Cases:

  • “Do you guys dare to make a case under the Gerald Charles brand that wasn’t designed by the Maestro himself?”
    — Alon Ben Joseph [14:39]
  • Federico acknowledges the weight of legacy while articulating evolution within respectful bounds.

• Evolution with Respect:

  • New references (e.g., left-handed tennis watch, titanium jumping hour) update classics.
  • The forthcoming “Master Link” uses an unused Genta 2007 sketch, combining heritage and forward-thinking.
  • “I think we need to respect the name that is on that dial.”
    — Federico Ziviani [17:47]

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5. Design Details & Technical Execution

[18:42–22:22]

• Bracelet Innovation:
  • The Master Link’s asymmetrical bracelet, a rare feature in watchmaking.
  • “There is no other…brand that does that. It’s an asymmetrical bracer.”
    — Alon Ben Joseph [19:12]
• In-house Activities at Geneva Atelier:
  • Movement finishing, assembly, regulation, and extensive prototype testing.
  • 55+ iterations refined the bracelet for comfort, reliability, and hair-pulling avoidance.

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6. Movements & Watchmaking Philosophy

[20:37–22:22]

• Technical Focus:

  • Micro-rotor movement, only 2.7 mm thin, with a 22k gold rotor.
  • Shared design and finishing codes between dial and movement for aesthetic harmony.
  • “For us, reliability is the most important thing. We have 0.08% of aftersale return, meaning that only eight watches out of a thousand, they come back. So it’s extremely good, because our movements are reliable…”
    — Federico Ziviani [21:22]

• In-House Caliber Ambition:

  • Step-by-step approach prioritizing reliability over verticalization for its own sake.

• Artisan Collaboration (Legacy):

  • “Les artisans du maestro”—collaborating with the best artisans and partners for each component, reflecting Genta’s own working style.

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7. Relationship with the Genta Foundation and Other Brands

[22:32–24:24]

• No relationship with the Genta family or the Genta Foundation; Gerald Charles is fully independent in vision and direction.
• Healthy mutual respect and indirect kinship with Jean Arnault and other stewards of Genta’s various brand legacies (Gérald Genta at LVMH, Daniel Roth, etc.).
• Both Federico and Arnault are focused on authenticity and personal passion in their contemporary interpretations.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Legacy:

  • “We are already writing the next chapter, but respecting the legacy.”
    — Federico Ziviani [15:54]

• On Family Ties:

  • “It isn’t a refoundation. You are the natural successor.”
    — Rob Nudds [06:37]

• On Evolution:

  • “We improved the ergonomics, so we evolved its legacy. But we don’t want to move away from it, because I think we need to respect the name that is on that dial.”
    — Federico Ziviani [17:47]

• On Innovation:

  • “This bracelet, we did over 55 iterations…You try it, it’s not right, you change again the architecture to make sure it was soft enough, but not too soft, not too rigid.”
    — Federico Ziviani [19:54]

• On Movement Excellence:

  • “Our movements are reliable…This reflects the original idea of Gerald. Again, if you come to the atelier here in Geneva, you can see that the slogan of Gerald Charles was ‘les artisans du maestro.’”
    — Federico Ziviani [21:38]

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Memorable Final Moments

• Rob’s Closing:
  • “Federico, thank you so much for being a very easy guest to have on in the last shift of the day because you just, you ruled the mic. It was amazing. I loved it. Thank you so much for the effort.”
    — Rob Nudds [24:47]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Brand Backstory & Genta Connection: [02:51–06:57]
• Brand Evolution & Digital Strategy: [06:57–11:24]
• Historical Cases & The Maestro: [13:30–14:19]
• Navigating Legacy & New Designs: [14:39–18:42]
• Master Link, Movement, & Technicals: [18:42–22:22]
• Relationship with Genta Foundation: [22:32–24:24]
• Wrap-Up & Final Impressions: [24:24–25:11]

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Summary

This episode delivers a vivid portrait of Federico Ziviani and the Gerald Charles brand—one that balances reverence for Gérald Genta’s legacy with a twenty-first-century entrepreneurial spirit. Federico’s passion for watches, technological savvy, and ability to tell engaging, insightful stories make for a memorable and informative interview. The discussion provides rare behind-the-scenes access to the creative and operational philosophy of a brand at the intersection of artistry, legacy, and modernity.

Transcript

[A]

Foreign.

[B]

Watch fans and welcome back to the glass igloo outside the pavilion at Geneva watch days 2025. We're here for our last interview of the day with Federico Ziviani from Gerald Charles, one of the brands I really struggle to pronounce because I do not speak French. Federico, thank you very much for attending at the end of a very long day.

[A]

It's a pleasure to be here in this warm igloo.

[B]

Yeah, it is a special space. We're very grateful for Geneva Watch Days having provided it for us and for giving us all a lovely suntan, or in my case, just a bright red face. Alon, you've never actually had the chance to visit Gerald Charles before, have you? So you are quite taken by what you see in front of you. Because Federico has kindly brought along three models. I have to commend your team on being the most prepared team thus far. So kudos to them and to you. What do you think? Alon?

[C]

They were very professional in the ramp up too today as well. So kudos to them because if the watches are crafted in the same manner, we know we have hotelagerie here. Super excited because I have a gap in my experiences with original Gerald Genti and then Gerald Charles watches going to the jump hours. I was extremely excited to see the amazing jeweled versions. We have an emerald version here and I'm happy I have my diamond loop on me because it's perfect setting. Emeralds are the most difficult. I'm not talking about emerald cut diamonds, but the gemstone emerald.

[B]

Why is that soft?

[C]

Very porous. A lot of imperfections. It's relatively soft compared to sapphire, which ruby is a sapphire current and diamond obviously is hardness. 10 on the scale of moles and.

[B]

Sapphire and rubies and 9 because I corundum. And then emerald is 7. Is it?

[C]

Or 7.5.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Quartz. Quartzes are at 6.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Around 7 ish. And they have a lot of imperfections. Plus how do you get a homogeneous array of colors? So there's a lot of dimensions there that are very difficult. And then obviously you most probably have a name for your cases, your signature cases that I'm too oblivious. So I apologize. But then you need to do suddenly several curves in the case as well, so well done. I want to shut up. There is 25 years on the dial of the watch that you're actually wearing that I had the honor to try on as well. Beautiful watch. Please walk us through how you were able to revive this, I dare to say legendary brand and I believe a lot of people would have want to be in your position?

[A]

Possibly, yes. And I'm happy to be in my position. I have to say there is a fear between General Jaynta, the man, the creator, my family, and Gerald Charles. And I'm here to explain it to you and to our audience today. And my father was a friend with Gerald Genta, whose full name was indeed Gerald Charles Genta Since 1982, when my father organized the exhibition in Geneva, Montre Bijoux, it was something similar to Watches of Wonders, Geneva Watch days back in the 80s and back then my father was working in a communication agency and in that fair he met Genta for the first time. And Genta was immediately caught by my father's way of working precision and passion for watches that asked my father to help him in developing the Gioral Genta brand in Italy, alongside the old Italian distributor of Giorginta. And then in 1990, my father took the distribution of Audemars Piguet in Italy and eventually founded the first subsidiary in Italy, Audemars Piguet sba. And yet to leave the Gerald Genta brand, the marketing position. But he stayed friends with Gerald, having of course in common the royal oak design that was indeed a bestseller for the Marpinge. And then Genta. In 2000, after selling the first brand, Gerald Genta, he spent a few months painting and not working at any watch brand anymore. And he was missing something because watchmaking was his passion. So he comes to my father and he says, Franco, I want to build my second brand. I want to call it Gerald Charles with my two names and I have already some ideas for designs. Can you help me build it? And my father said, look, Gerald, I am very busy building Audemars Piguet. It's already a full time job, but you're my friend and my family is here to support you. So my uncle, the brother of my father, joined Gerald Charles with Gerald Genta himself to start the development of the brand. Back in the days, the brand was mainly focusing on bespoke. Gerald was really creating Gerald Charles Watches for the pleasure. And he left us this message on 2005 catalog that we have in our atelier here in Geneva. It's our headquarters, is our head office, is our workshop and museum, and we have some vintage material from the early days of the brand. And Gerald signed a quotation, a quote, saying that he created Gerald Charles to give pleasure to whoever looks at it and like an artist, included his smile into the case, because we need to smile, we need to be happy in this life until 2011, Gerald Charles Genta and my uncle Gian Paolo worked with each other for Gerald Charles brand. And in 2011 Genta passed away leaving us with an incredible patrimony of the last 11 years of the Picasso of watchmaking. So here you see the differences like Picasso have the pink period, the blue period, Gerald Genta the man has the Gerald Genta Brand period. Yes, creation for many brands and then the Gerald Charles being his last creations.

[B]

That is one of the most incredible, unexpected and professionally delivered backstories I have ever heard in my life. I actually didn't know that your family was inherent to the existence of Gerald Charles. And so it isn't a refoundation. You are the natural successor.

[A]

Indeed, indeed. And of course we have grown a lot lately because we evolved the business model, I have to say. And the brand in the beginning was bespoke, meaning that we had a huge variety of case shapes, we had so many complications models in limited quantities. And the brand was not extremely well known because we didn't have the intention to make it well known. Back in the days, Gerald was walking around with a sketchbook meeting clients and saying, what watch would you like me.

[C]

To design for you like a true artist?

[B]

Well, he is, isn't he? I mean that's how he's regarded and rightly so. But I mean it's hard to build a brand of products or a collection or a cohesive identity that way and very hard to do it when the great man himself is gone. So how did you manage that transition from him passing to you now forming the company in its current image.

[A]

So it was of course a step by step evolution. After Gerald passed away, we kept making bespoke pieces on demand with a very continuous but very low profile operations. And then in 2019 as I studied abroad and I graduated and in a completely different field because I'm graduating in computer science in London, so it's something completely different. But I always had watches in my, in my strings. They were my passion. I grew up seeing the growth of AP during my days and I come back to the family saying I love watches, I'm passionate. We have patrimony, we have a responsibility to bring it up. We shouldn't keep it in a safe for few hundreds of collectors every year. We need to enlarge the scope because I and my friends and my generation would want to wear some of the last designs of the Maestro. That was the beginning, the vocation that I had to get into this crazy adventure that now looking back after having achieved some good early success. I look back and say that I was really daring to take this challenge in 2019. And then Covid came. But we had a very specific strategy. It was based on three pillars. Number one was focus. Compared to a past, that was a free flow of creativity with no real direction. We decided to focus on the maestro case. Only one, visual identity for the brand to be a playground for complications, dials and method art. The second pillar was the digital communication. I said I need to build a community because there is a community of collectors that, that has a palette for this. But how do I reach all of them with the limited resources that we may have at the beginning. And they said let's build a digital community. And this is how I started to engage from my IT background into very smart campaigns online and making it our page, our community, our people wearing the brand, getting involved into the project. So we're reposting collectors buying the watch. We were talking with everybody that was asking questions in a very personal manner and we built a digital community. And the third pillar that we have today came eventually which is the physical element. So in the past being made on bespoke, we didn't have many retailers. We didn't have a physical presence of the brand. And now we have 110 doors. We have our atelier here in Geneva. We are all over Europe. Italy is one of our biggest market. Middle east is incredibly strong. We are in the UK with watches of Switzerland, we are in the us we are in Japan, we are in Hong Kong, Singapore. And all this growth, physical growth in stores happened just in the last six years from zero doors to 110.

[B]

Well that is incredible. But how did you do it? I mean how big is your team? How many watches do you produce a year? That's a huge number of retailers to sustain.

[A]

How did they do it? Working hard with the good ideas and, and the good support from the collectors. I'm really thankful to our collectors that support us every day. I say my objective is to deliver long term value to everybody that buys a Gerald Charles. That's my number one objective. I'm 30 years old.

[B]

You're 30 years old, you've done this already?

[A]

I'm 30 years old. I turned 30 on the 2nd of August just recently.

[C]

Congratulations.

[A]

I was 2129 a few a few months ago. So what we're saying is that moving from 0 to 110 doors needed some team growth as well. And we moved from three people in the team to 40 people right now. We divided the markets with brand and sales Managers, marketing teams, production scaled up. The atelier is one demonstration of this need to have more watchmakers. But we also had to implement our IT system to be efficient. And I really like efficiency. And I managed to get a great friend on board, which is Octavio Garcia, which was a designer at Audemars Piguet and New Genta because they worked together at the 40th anniversary of the Royal Oak. And Octavio is working with our design team to bring this growth, product growth in the recent years as well.

[C]

So just to make sure the company actually never went dormant, your uncle was always there, you studied, you came back from London and joined the family business.

[A]

Exactly. My uncle retired now, today. Yes. Back in 2019 he wanted to retire and I couldn't see that, that great patrimony going dormant. And that's why I wanted to.

[C]

Amazing. So you called the Smile case the Maestro. That's the name. Gerald Genta designed that. Currently that's the only case you have in the collection. In the focus strategy, when you were doing bespoke, were there other cases?

[A]

So many of them. And I invite you to see some of them in our atelier here in rue de Mont Blanc 3 we have the Renaissance case, the Turbo case, the sports side, the Seaside. We made a few thousands of those watches in limited series, limited edition in the past and they're very rare now on the secondary market. Every time I find one, I try to get hold of it because it has a historical value, being a watch touched and manufactured by the Maestro himself.

[C]

So that answered my follow up questions. What will be the next case? Well, we have a lot of options. I'll jump to the follow up question in that case. No pun intended. Do you guys dare to make a case under the Gerald Charles brand that wasn't designed by the Maestor himself?

[B]

Oh, interesting.

[A]

That's a great question. And this the first time I get asked and trust me, I did many interviews.

[B]

Is it really the first? Well done, well done. It is a great question.

[C]

I've been actually thinking about this question for 20 years. We obviously I had the honor to meet Mr. Genta twice and I remember vividly as a child on the bridge in Basel world from Hall 1 to 5, where the AHCI is. So. So I remember that and I'm infected also it's now uber trendy to speak about Gerald Genta and his brand, but I've been actually following his brand because the Tay family bought out his brand, which they later sold to Bulgari. Today it's in the LVMH Vertical. But I actually liked very much what he did under his own brand, your brand. And I've been thinking it creates a burden on your shoulders as a brand. Let's say, hey, am I locked into what he has done or can you do the next chapter? So that's always what I've wondered.

[A]

It's a great question. And I think we're already writing the next chapter, but respecting the legacy. You can see it in the watches on the table today. So we have, for example, the tennis watch. Okay, it has still the Maestro shape, but look at his interpretation, completely different. It's the first ever lefty watch that we made. And you don't see many lefty in the market. And was done for the purpose of playing sports, not wanting the crown to hurt your wrist when you bend it. Colors are extremely vivid, which is also in his DNA. But again, in a modern interpretation, extra thin and waterproof to 100 meters. Compared to another watch that is more close to its original legacy, it has more of a baroque feeling, more of a vintage feeling. The Jumping Hour, which is one of his great classics. But again, in the past, he used to make it in white gold. We brought it to titanium. In the past was only 30 meter waterproof, which means you cannot even wash your hands. Now it's 100 meter waterproof. We improved the ergonomics, so we evolved its legacy. But we don't want to move away from it because I think we need to respect the name that is on that dial. And the strongest evolution that you could see today is the Master Link watch. So the Master Link watch comes from an original sketch of Genta himself, made in 2007 for a full set integrated bracelet made on an order from the Sarawak royal family. Sarawak is in Malaysia. They made a one of one and it was never produced anymore. And going through the archive, I said, look, we have already in the archives the next integrated bracelet for the brand. And you can see clearly the evolution between the Maestro case and the Muslin case. The Maestro case is round, you have no sharp edges. It's more baroque for us, it's more eccentric. It's really for the collector that knows Genta, that has strong, different personality. The Muslin case has a design language that is closer to what we see around today. Sharper edges, thin, more squared, more minimal. And it's something to develop for us in the future on technical complications and develop the two collections in, in parallel, to have a proper life evolve. Because we are in 2025, we're not anymore in the 80s, but I believe that we have a responsibility to defend the legacy.

[C]

And if I remember correctly, I held the bracelet first time. But what's special about it? The bottom part of the bracelet has the waves, the curves and the top is straight. Is that correct?

[A]

That's correct.

[C]

Maybe you can. You can hold it up for the camera. Cuz I know you're using with the glove. So. So that is also special because there is no other. And I don't want. I don't want you to even raise the topic of genus. Is there any other brand that does that? It's basically an asymmetrical bracer.

[A]

Not to our understanding, not to our knowledge.

[C]

So that's. That's uber cool. What do you guys do in your atelier on the movement side of things?

[A]

So we work on finishings, mainly work on assembly, work on regulations, work on testing. Is high technical atelier. So our technical development team, we have engineers that work at the beginning together with our trusted partners on the conception and on the viage. And then we take care of the testing, the finishing, the assembly to make sure that the quality matches our standards. And trust me that you may get surprised on and I got surprised getting into the back office of the watch industry. How much drive and push is needed is required also to the best artisans, the best partners and the best engineers to really achieve the top quality level. This bracelet we did over 55 iterations to avoid. It pinches the hairs. You try it is not right. You change again the architecture to make sure it was soft enough, but not too soft, not too rigid. And the movement is the same. Now the tolerance that we have is plus minus 15 seconds. In the beginning it was plus or minus 20. So you really need to reduce.

[C]

It has to be said it's a micro rotor. So there are different parameters there.

[A]

Absolutely.

[C]

So.

[A]

Absolutely, absolutely. So this micro rotor is 2.7 millimeter thin. This movement, which is to my understanding, one of the thinnest micro rotor movements out there, the corrotor or 10, is a gold.

[C]

Gold rotor.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

22 karat?

[A]

Yes. And you can see the finishing are the vertical cod that you also see on the dial. So there is a transparency between the dial and the movement, which for us is the union between the design and the technology.

[C]

Is there an ambition to make your own caliber? For sure. For sure.

[A]

It's a step by step. Why? Because for us, reliability is the most important thing. We have 0.08% of after sale return, meaning that only eight watches out of a thousand, they come back. So it's extremely Good, because our movements are reliable, because the teamwork between our expertise, our requirements, our needs, and the trusted partners. And this reflects the original idea of Gerald. Again, if you come to the atelier here in Geneva, you can see that the slogan of Gerald Charles was les artisans du maestro, the artisans of the maestro. Meaning that Gerald was looking to go to the best in class in the specific component manufacturing, in the finishing, to develop altogether our final product.

[C]

I have one more. Robin, I'm sorry, I'm hogging the mic. I'm pulling a rob on you.

[B]

Well, I don't mind. When you're as interested as I am, you can do it. Go ahead.

[C]

What I was wondering there is the Gerald Genta foundation, correct. That his wife runs. Do you work with that foundation?

[A]

No. We have no relationship. The brand that was sold to our family and we have no more relationship with the Genta family. We keep it with our vision, with our direction, on our own.

[C]

Yeah, and it's probably a rhetorical question. We mentioned that today the Gerald Genta brand, after being hibernated in the Bulgari vertical, was pulled out to the LVMH vertical. I assume there is no correlation today between the two.

[A]

No, it's very positive, I have to say. It's an indirect correlation. I mean, I know Jean Arnault. I respect him very much. We're both passionate about watches. We're talking also the press conference engineer watch. This couple of days ago, we exchanged the watches on the wrist and he was looking at mine, I was looking at his. So we're the new generation and we both know that we make the watches that we like. When I made the jumping hour watch, yes, I take from the legacy, from the sketches that we have, but I make a watch that I would wear and not that the market would like to buy. And I feel that he's doing the same. He's very authentic the way the Genta brand and also the Daniel Rod brand and in general, the manufacture du temps and even the Louis Vuitton watches that he's making, I think they are improving the quality in a very important way and I'm very happy with it because we are all part of one side of this great artist creation as they are. The other creations he made were all part of a legacy.

[B]

I really enjoyed that. I learned a lot. I love these watches. I do think they wear really well on the wrist. I'm particularly fond of the tennis one with the bright yellow green stripe.

[C]

I knew you would pick that.

[B]

Yeah, you know, I love that color. You love it. It's amazing. Federico, thank you so much for being a very easy guest to have on in the last shift of the day because you just, you ruled the mic. It was amazing. I loved it. Thank you so much for the effort. We need to get you back on for a full hour so I can sit back and just listen to you tell us stories for that time as well. Until then though, we wish you all the best. We wish you a great fair and continue to success with the Gerald Charles brand.

[A]

Thank you so much guys.

[B]

It.