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- [00:00]
Jose Miranda
Foreign.
- [00:07]
Rob Nudds
Welcome to another edition of the Real Time show. With me, your friendly neighborhood watchmaker, Rob Nudds, joined as ever by the friendly neighborhood jeweler, Alain Ben Joseph, all the way in Amsterdam, and today by the leader of one of the most disruptive small independent brands in the British watchmaking scene, Jose Miranda of Isotope. Welcome to the studio, Jose.
- [00:25]
Jose Miranda
Thank you for having me.
- [00:26]
Rob Nudds
Thank you for taking the time and making the effort to get here because you had to deal with British traffic this morning, which is never a fun thing to endure. Are you quite well?
- [00:35]
Jose Miranda
Yes, all good. Thank you so much. I usually walk to work, but this morning was a bit different. But it's all good now. Thank you.
- [00:44]
Rob Nudds
So it's very likely that our listeners, because they're very well informed people, have heard of Isotope. It's quite probable that many of them already own one of your pieces. But for anyone that hasn't heard of Isotope, let's go right back to the beginning. They might have able to tell from your accent that you're not actually from Britain originally. You're from a far more exotic land, far across the ocean on the beautiful continent of Europe. Perhaps you can tell us a little bit about your background and how you came to be one of the most visible figures in the British watchmaking scene.
- [01:14]
Jose Miranda
Oh, thank you. So, yeah, so I'm originally from Porto, Portugal. It's a very, very well known city by the British families as they founded most of the port wine companies back in the 1800s. So it's 1700s as well. So it's been very interesting to evolve from Portuguese culture to adapt to the British culture, which it's not very different, let's say. We have same principles, same morals, expectations. So it's quite easy for us to adapt in the UK and for British people to adapt in Portugal as well. But what happened was I grew up in Portugal. I had a couple of film production companies. Then we had a crash in 2009, 2010, so I opted to move to the UK. Well, I was invited to come to the UK to work in production as well. And here we are. So 10 years later, I still have accent and I will never lose it. I will. It's very difficult. A few years ago I used to collect watches. I was without money when I came to the UK and we had to restart everything. And a few years later I have a meeting with some people that wanted to sell Jumping Hour General because that was my vice back in Portugal. And then they asked me if I wanted to pay 17,000 for it. I said I need to speak with my wife and my wife said, why don't you make your own? So I made my own jumping hour. So 10 years ago or 12 years ago, more or less, I start learning, starting understanding how to be a watchmaker, how to make watches. And between London and Geneva, I spent two years until we were able to make the first one and it was the Reiner, which sold out very fast. And from there, you know, it was supposed to be a one off, but then people start asking for more. So we made more, then asked for a diver, then for a Bronze watch, a GNT. And here we are 10 years later. So next year we are celebrating 10 years and we are going to release a very, very unique jumping hour as well to celebrate our 10th anniversary.
- [04:00]
Rob Nudds
You know, it's so nice to hear about a brand that has been been pulled into existence rather than pushed into existence. You know, you came along with an idea motivated by your own desire to see a jumping hour watch. You went ahead and made it and then there was just a vocal desire for more from you. You didn't come up with this woolly concept that you dropped into the market and tried to force into people's hands or onto people's wrists. It was something that was demanded. And ever since then, the, the sentiment is, from my perspective as a journalist and from someone that's been following the micro and small independent scene for many, many years, is that you've really never struggled. Now I'm sure there's a huge amount of struggles and bottlenecks and pain points in the background that you deal with on a daily basis, especially through all the fluctuations of the market that you've endured in the last decade. But has it been, in your personal lived experience, quite an enjoyable romp so far?
- [04:56]
Jose Miranda
No, absolutely. You know, this was my hobby before, you know, collecting watches. So when I had the opportunity to move to make watches, it's still, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's a ugly, rewardable. I love it. Obviously. You know, I wake up every day happy to go to work, but at the same time, every day is a struggle every single day because we don't make our parts. Okay? So we have suppliers and when you work with a chain of suppliers, if something fails, which fails every week, every day, it's a big, big problem, huge problem to try to make everything align. And we don't make easy watches. So the only thing that we are still not making for ourselves are the movements. We are already making a few plates, a few changes on the Movements. We are making new models. Everything else is bespoke. So we don't go to a supplier. Although you have 5 or 10 or 100 of those. Everything is made for us, specifically for us under the requirements in terms of design and quality that we demand. No, it's a long process that makes us try to be as competitive as possible. Although we are making everything from scratch, it's not easy to sell the watches that we make at the price point we are making. It's not easy. It's not easy yet. I hope we can make it easier in the future. But for now, it's still a struggle, a daily struggle, you know, to have the cash flow. Because it's only me, basically, in terms of the company. It's me and my wife. We are the original owners of the company and we still are the original owners. We don't have external investments and the plan is to stay the way we are. So grow slowly but steady. And when time comes, we might open the capital to some investors, but not, not yet. So, yeah, it's a struggle every single day.
- [07:22]
Alain Ben Joseph
Jose, you called the brand Isotope. We obviously know the name as being a nuclear species. Is that what you're referring at or is it something else?
- [07:32]
Jose Miranda
So izotope. It's a name that I thought it will be interesting. The idea came from. Or when I watch, was watching a movie, because I'm a film buff, you know, I love films. I always love science fiction. Lots of our designs reflect what we see on science fiction novels or cinema. And I was watching the Martian and there is a one, one moment where I forgot the name of the actor. But he needs to go from one place to the other. So he takes his isotope with him to warm him up in his vehicle. And when I saw the name Isotope, I remember from my youth, my studies, and I said, okay, Isotope. So in layman terms, it's an atom with different characteristics as the other atoms. Very simply put, it's this. So are watches. So watches that are all the same but with different characteristics. So I said, this is interesting. It's a short name, you know, it's a word that was invented in Scotland, so in the uk it's a. A name that is related to science and to tritium and to super luminova as well. So it makes sense in terms of. It's a component of the luminosity that we have on our watches. I went online after trying to register 20 or 25 names and it was available. And I said, okay, that's it. It's Our name, I didn't want to call it Miranda Watches or something related to my name because I'm not a watchmaker per se. I manage the company, I manage the design. I don't have the knowledge or the studies to be considered a watchmaker, you know, I meant I own the company and I manage the company. It's quite different from being a pure watchmaker. When you are a watchmaker, I think you should have your name on the dial because when you die, you know, that's it, you're gone. The name is gone as well. But on a general company, you can have a different name because the watches will survive you. And that's the idea behind it.
- [10:18]
Alain Ben Joseph
Would you call Isotope a British brand? Yes.
- [10:23]
Jose Miranda
So I started 12 years ago my trips to Geneva to make. To start making. To understand how to make a watch. So officially we opened the company in 2016, but two years prior. So since 2014 that I have been involved with many interesting people in Geneva. And I have Geneva and bl. And not only. And Lashot Fond as well. The people I met back then, they really teach me. They really taught me how to make a watch properly, well done and transporting the knowledge to the uk, because that's where I live, you know, I'm living in uk, so I adapted to the uk. I didn't ask the UK to adapt to me. On the contrary, I love being here. That's why we are here. So we adapted to the uk. My kids, the youngest, he doesn't even speak Portuguese, is trying to learn Portuguese again. You only speak English. So it's, It's. We embrace it, the uk. We are part of the founders of the British watchmakers. It's a comp. We were here already. So we are a British company. You know, we work with lots of international designers, engineers, manufacturers, et cetera. But the core of the company is still in the uk then a bigger part, because our watches are Swiss, Maeve are in Switzerland. But the core of the company, it's British. And even if I move to another country in the future, the company will have been born in the uk, just like Rolex.
- [12:36]
Rob Nudds
Talking of Rolex and looking at big brands that have existed for a long time, do you ever find yourself tempted to cherry pick some of their ideas and integrate those into your own vision for what Isotopes should be? Or do you find yourself totally able to remain removed and drawing your inspirations from tangential industries like cinema and pop culture?
- [12:59]
Jose Miranda
Okay, so the. The only thing that Rolex inspired me was to do exactly the opposite. We don't have. We don't use other brands to inspire us. We use other brands like Rolex and many others to understand what they did and to do exactly the opposite. If we do something similar to them and if we realize that what we have or what we are offering is similar to some of those, we cancel the project or we remove the project from our website because it's not what we do. We only do different stuff if we work for niches or peoples. If you like us, wonderful. If you don't, no problem. There are so many offers out there, so many brands that can, you know, fulfill everyone's desires in terms of design, in terms of complications, etc. So we are very unique and we don't make watches for everybody. You know, people need to find us and when they find us, if they like, they buy the watch. And that's, that's the idea. We don't follow rules, we try to create them. We don't follow trends, we try to create them. And we are creating a few trends. Like for example, when we release a professional divers case with the Idrium. Very playful, very enjoyable, very, very unique in terms of design. After those releases. There are lots of similar offers at the moment. Even the chronograph that we released a few months ago, it's completely different from everyone, from everything else. And now we are seeing other chronographs and other three hand watches as well with the discs. With that kind of complexity, that's something that we do. So people are chasing a few things that we do and we try to be as different as possible from everything else. I hope we can still do this in the future. But it's difficult, it's very difficult to keep up. Very difficult.
- [15:37]
Rob Nudds
It sounds to me that far from keeping up, you're actually keeping ahead. And that's kind of my next question, which you've already partially answered at least, and that is if you're not taking ideas from anyone else, do you notice people taking ideas from you? And you've intimated there that yes, it's quite clear that Isotope is doing things ahead of the curve and people are responding to that by bringing out similar emulative models. Now there's two things I want to say to that or questions, shall we say a two parter? Number one, do you think it's plausible that there's something in the air, as they say? So you know, when one person, when one genre of TV show becomes popular, there's suddenly 10 or 15 of them. And it's not so much the fact that, oh, they saw the first one have success and everybody copied them. It's that they've all been in development for a long time because people are inspired by the same stimuli in the environment. And secondly, the British Watchmakers alliance is extremely open and from what I understand, you all share things with each other very convivially. There's. There's no barriers. You'll tell each other which suppliers using. You'll tell each other where you're getting your dials made, you'll tell each other which designers you've worked with on a new typeface. For example, is that in this context, where you see things that you've done, things that you feel have broken the mold and then have been copied, as it were, for want of a. A softer word, is that a great idea or is that something that you think over time will disappear as brands realize that they have to be a bit more protective of their intellectual property?
- [17:12]
Jose Miranda
No, at the level of the British watchmakers, there are no issues. I think people are really friendly and they get along with, you know, I wouldn't say on a daily basis, but when I see them and when I need something and they do the same, we exchange ideas between 10 brands, more or less. I talk a lot more with companies that are far from the uk. I exchange ideas with them as well. Those that I am close with, we don't have this kind of problems of, okay, I'm going to use that idea. I'm going to use this detail or that detail. It's other companies that I don't talk with them, I don't know them, and we can see that they try to. But it's not only us. Okay, but that's. I wouldn't say that copy. I would say these are inspirations. Okay? I don't want to call to ourselves that we are the unique and we are inventive and making, you know, original stuff, blah, blah, blah. No, it's not only that. It's not that. It's the opportunity. Because when we release a watch, we don't know if the market is ready for that or not. We don't know. It's a huge risk that we take on every single release. Even now with the Flyway that we released a few months ago, the complexity of the case, the crystal, it's a saddle. It's like a Pringle. No one has ever done this before. And the technical approach to do something like that, it's extremely expensive in terms of development. And when we have this crystal that has no reflections because of the it's a hyperbolic paraboloid in mathematical terms. And one reflection cancels the other. So you can look at the dial. You almost don't need anti reflective coating. We still have it, but you almost don't need because it's very easy to read the dial. This kind of approaches, I don't see other brands taking them. It's the creative stuff, it's the easy stuff that take us 1, 2, 3 years to get there in creative terms or in design or in design terms or finding a technical way to develop and to apply that design detail that we see reproduced in different ways, different colors, inventive ways as well, obviously. But that's when we start watching a few things coming up. We have in our shop many, many mainstream brands buying our watches. I don't know why, I never ask them why they are buying our watches, but I'm sure it's not to wear it on the wrist. And this is fine. This is interesting. It's cool to know.
- [20:40]
Alain Ben Joseph
Jose, would you call is a top a design brand?
- [20:46]
Jose Miranda
That's what we are selling. We are selling a dream, we are selling a desire, we are selling a unique watch designed in a way that no one is designing them. We don't make our own movements yet we are as explained. We change a little bit the movements. We make models. The new jumping hour that will come in a few months is have a new model that doesn't exist. It didn't exist. So that's what I tell to my suppliers. Because when my suppliers or even my designers try to shortcut something that I ask to be in a specific way, that's what I try to explain them. This is what we sell. We sell the uniqueness, the complexity of making things look simple and easy. If we don't do that, we are not selling nothing because we don't have movement to put on the back. We don't have an aginhoar movement to put on the back. So we need to use a movement from off the shelf. Valjoux, Landeron, La Jouperre, Sellita, whatever it is, adapt them to our needs. Probably make a few new plates and new bridges, new stones as well, decoration. But it's the front of the watch that we are selling. So it's the dial, it's the hands, it's the case. It's what people come after us to try to buy. Because if they want something more complex on the back, they will go to another price point and to another independent or mainstream brand. So yes, I think we are a design company because of that characteristic.
- [23:05]
Alain Ben Joseph
So that begs the question, is it British design?
- [23:10]
Jose Miranda
It's British design, but not only because I absorb, not only me, me and my designers, we absorb design from all, all over the place. So there isn't just one thing as British design or as French design, or Portuguese design or whatever. I think we have all embedded in a culture that it's transatlantic. We. We all. Or at least us. Not that. No, Everybody, it's. It's. Let's. Let's break them all there. Everybody absorbs design and architecture and art from all over the place. You know, if you are closed in one thing only, as the British design, there is not one British design. The British design, just like any other design around the world, they are embedded by what surrounds you and what surrounds you. It's the world. So you can't have, you know, for example, even the best British architects, they have their art, their architecture, spread it around the world, you know, that's a synonym, that is that British architecture around the world. Yes, but at the same time, there are not only British architects working at Fosters, for example, or in other companies. There are designers that are here in uk. They are extremely famous, extremely efficient and amazing. But they came from Scandinavia, they came from the us they came from many other countries that. I know them, you know, and I know them. And they work for British companies. Yes, it's British design, but with, you know, a lot of international influences. Otherwise. No, you can't just subsist with the internal market the moment. We need to make things that are international, that look at everybody. For example, our main. Our major success, what maybe put izotope in the map. A few years ago it was a diver's watch called Wheel Return, inspired by the door sign in North America, where people say, I will be back at 9am or at 10am So I use the hands, I use the colors from that sign. The sign that I had acquired 20 years ago and transformed. A watch diver, a heavy watch diver, a tool watch in something playful. And that what made us famous in brackets. But it's okay. I am in uk, It's a British company, I am Portuguese. The sign was made in the U.S. i don't know. No one knows who designed it. It's a common design. So you know, is it British design? I don't know what to say.
- [26:45]
Alain Ben Joseph
It's Jose design. It's funny, you've referred to the hidrium and the Will return sign, because that is one of my favorites. When you started, do I dare to call it a skin diver? That that the hidrium case is when isotope came on my radar, it spoke to me. But what made me a big fan is the collab with Revel where you guys made the mercury. Ah yes, isotope mercury. That case is splendid. The hands are literally a piece of art. So my question here, Jose, is it seems a eclectic collection of designs, which is not criticism, it's just an observation. Is this something that you've always set out on purpose? Like you see with furniture design, where they work with different collections, different designers and it's all over the place. Whereas usually watch brands have a clear cut style and DNA in their design.
- [27:56]
Jose Miranda
It's in a. Yes, I know, because the inspiration comes from science fiction. Most, most things do not exist. But I love to travel and I travel a lot and when we come back home, you know, I, I have all the pictures, I take the pictures, I take the notes and when I'm back home, I, I often organize them and an idea comes up. For example, about 10, 12 years ago in Paris, I watched the. The most beautiful sunset unexpected in Paris because it's the City of Lights. But it's the City of Lights that the name City of Lights comes from a couple of centuries ago when gas came and they installed lights on the streets. And that's why it became the City of Lights. It's not because of the sand, not because of the, the amazing light that surrounds Paris. But when I was there, I saw an amazing sunset and I said, we need to reproduce this. So I took a picture, which is a crappy picture, didn't look nice, doesn't look nice, But I had a memory that it was a red sun with yellowish on the sides. And yesterday we released the watch called the oh la La, dedicated to Paris. And it's almost sold out. I didn't check, but I think if it's not gone, it's about to go. So these ideas are a collection of influences, not only from the uk, but from around the world. And I work with a designer from Portugal. I work with a designer based in uk, I work with another designer based in Finland, I work with another designer based in Russia, which unfortunately now I can't, I can't work with him because it's. It's complicated, as you know. But I have this theme and when I need for example, a new letter font or a new specific detail on a case, et cetera, I talk with each one of them and all of them respond to me. So everything is under one umbrella. And that's how making so many different watches we can then look at them and see. Oh, okay. So this is an isotope. There are specific details that are from an isotope. That's the only way that we can make them look the same. The same within the isotope umbrella, obviously.
- [31:24]
Alain Ben Joseph
Unfortunately, I've never encountered an isotope watch ever and I'm an avid member of Red Bar Crew. I visit fairs. Unfortunately, I've missed British Watchmakers Day now at least two times.
- [31:39]
Rob Nudds
You've never had an isotope on your wrist?
- [31:42]
Jose Miranda
Never.
- [31:44]
Rob Nudds
Good grief. Well, we need to, we need to fix that asap. I mean it is, it is unlike anything else really. I mean, what's going on?
- [31:51]
Alain Ben Joseph
Well, exactly. Hence I canceled all my meat is to be in this recording.
- [31:55]
Rob Nudds
Yep, did.
- [31:56]
Jose Miranda
Yeah.
- [31:57]
Alain Ben Joseph
So I did not spot retailers on the website. Dear Jose, is this a intentional strategy for the brandy Soto we.
- [32:10]
Jose Miranda
Yes, we at the moment we only have one retailer online retailer. It's Chrono Factum. It's based in Germany and we start working with him right after Brexit to try to, to respond to the lack of market because we lost 90% of the European market the same way are losing now market in the US due to the. To the tariffs. So when these things happen, we need to react and try to find solutions to keep on serving the market. But to keep the prices affordable, we cannot work with retailers. If we start working with retailers, I will need to double or to triple the prices of our watches. You know, and it's every, every sale we make with Chrono Factum we are basically losing money, but at least we are. We keep feeding the European market because people hate and most people don't understand that they need to. They pay VAT eventually either to the importer or to us. So you know, it's very difficult to explain how V works but people in the end of the day they keep. They need to pay it however it is. And the same is happening with us now. Now all the imports need to pay 10% from the UK but we don't know what's going to happen in the next couple of weeks or months. We don't know nothing. So if I work with retailers.
- [34:13]
Alain Ben Joseph
I.
- [34:13]
Jose Miranda
Will need to increase our prices. And I think that's not the correct idea at the moment. I think it's. We can still grow slowly but selling almost exclusively from our website and that's it. Oh, sorry. We also have our watches in London at the time and Tide studio in London and that's very useful. That's very interesting because there are lots of clients coming to London. They go there, they visit, they buy the watches there and it's, it's very interesting. And now we have a North America brand, director Mark Levesque and he is pushing for the brand, you know, in North America obviously, but is not working as, as a retailer. No, the brand will still ship, we will still ship the watches from the UK to the, to the US as we always did before. So it's just a price strategy. If we open the market and we have lots of offers, as you may imagine, I don't think it's the right time to start pushing for the prices.
- [35:37]
Alain Ben Joseph
I dare to play devil's advocate right here. I think that the isotope mercury for example, and we didn't talk about the chronograph moonshot yet, which is the next topic. But before I do so, I think it's so unique. I think the quality is there. You seem to respect auto luxury. You understand it, you admire it and you might aspire it, but today still available is the isotope mercury. Mercury. I see a price of €2,300 and a half. So €2,350 about. I don't know if this is with vit or without vit.
- [36:18]
Jose Miranda
That's the deposit. That's the deposit. Start working.
- [36:22]
Alain Ben Joseph
Okay, so how much is the retail price on that model?
- [36:25]
Jose Miranda
So they start at 4,000 and then depending on the complexity, prices will go up. So for example, I have one here that was, it's going to be shipped to our customer next week and it was above 14,000 because of the complexity of the dial. But normal complexity, let's call it, it starts at 4,000.
- [36:53]
Alain Ben Joseph
So who says that you won't sell more at a price point of 6,000 instead of 4 or even, dare I say 8,000 building in margin for retailers and even marketing. Because we could maybe flip the coin and say, you know what, the hardcore collectors that understand Market 3 and would buy, let's say a Patek or Vacheron with marquetry, say, you know what, eight is a bargain. And maybe at a price point of four they'll say, oh, this is probably a China produced watch.
- [37:29]
Jose Miranda
Yes, I understand, but what's happening here is when you want to buy one of those watches, you will have a meeting with me and I will explain how the watch is. So all the material is sourced where, who makes it and where. So you know all the details. From France Burgundy to Paris to Geneva and other places in Switzerland, you know everything. So you need to go through the experience. You also learn that our artisans are the same, working for major luxury brands and what they are charging you is a luxury tax that we don't have. We, you know, I think that the moment we do that we need to create a secondary brand, maybe to make our prices higher. But you know, that's not within my objectives. My objective is to offer something very unique. Even if you pay 4 or 5 or 10 or less, you know that there is nothing like it in the market. And I don't mind to make less money as long as you are happy with what you have on your wrist. It's, you know, a company doesn't need to. We could obviously be selling for a few, few pounds more, but that will be. It's. I think it's unnecessary at the moment. We are offering and giving the opportunity to many, many people to have things that they don't know it existed before they knew us. And also probably some of them expired, but were never able to get them. Just like me. I have, you know, a few braille watches that I never, I will, I will never probably be able to get them. But at this price point we are making lots of people happy, so it's okay. I'm happy with that as well.
- [40:02]
Alain Ben Joseph
Well, kudos to you. I take my hat off to you while I scrolled on the product page of the mercury marquetry dials. The dials are mind blowing. I don't even know which one is my favorite, but maybe I'll vote for the. I nicknamed it the malachite dial, which it isn't. You mimicked the behavior of the malachite natural stone in wood because marquetry is basically a parquet for your dial. So kudos to you.
- [40:37]
Jose Miranda
The dials you are making are made of straw, not even wood at the moment. So Bernardo, which is our artisan, he has been working in the area for more than 10 years and only now he's able to start making micromarketry because there are only three in the world that can do that. So you can see that they are not only supplying us, they are supplying other brands as well, but none of them at this price point. Because what we do is to buy the dials from them and then all the production, the movement, etc. It's done by us or assembled by us. And that make us able to control the price point and the. But it's a different approach because it takes a lot of time. It's very unique. You said you like one specific design, but the interesting part here is that we can make your own design. We can design, we can create a dialogue that you dream of. We have a client that last week, last Friday, bought three new marquetry dials for him. One based in one painting and two based on existing shapes. Because it makes him remind something from his youth. And that's exactly what we have there. We have from example the parquet design. We have a customer from the Emirates that studied in London and his room in London had the same parquet as the design we have on our dials. And he wanted one because of the good memories. So this is very interesting. For example, we also have one called the Tennis, which has a clay representation, the clay set and the tennis ball. And that was designed in partnership with a customer that made five to celebrate the 10th anniversary of the Millennium Open in Portugal. But that's it. We will not make those designs anymore. So we have the opportunity to create new designs. Speaking with the client, speaking, understanding what's the idea behind the dial. And then we can make something very unique. That's why some of the most interesting ones are not even on the website because it's. We didn't have the authorization to take pictures and to place them. That's how unique they are.
- [43:50]
Rob Nudds
Well, that's quite exciting. I love stuff that's off catalog. Nothing really gets me going as much as hidden watches that people don't know whether or not they exist. And then you see them years after they've been released and people are running around like headless chickens trying to figure out whether they're legit or whether they're Frankenstein pieces. That's always exciting as a collector and as someone that never gets tired of unearthing these weird and wonderful treasures. So you don't have retailers, so getting the pieces in front of people is something that you have to do yourself, really. And I know that you do put a lot of effort working on the grind at events and whatnot and standing across the table and talking to people and hearing their ideas, as you just mentioned, and assimilating those with your own. But tell me about your event and travel schedule. You do a lot around uk? Do you do much internationally? Where can we expect to find you? Where should I listeners look for you if they want to like alon get a isotope on their wrist for the first time.
- [44:45]
Jose Miranda
Yeah. So this year we have been almost every weekend on a watch event. So we are visiting all the. The British events. Unless if we are not invited, obviously we. We will. We will not be there. We have also been in most of the US events. We are next week going to LA to intersect and then watches any minutes. Then we will have Toronto. Then we Will have Brighton, then we will have Dubai, Philly, Austin. What else? We are also going to Europe, to Prague. Yeah. So we still have a very, very full agenda until the end of the year. But basically, if there is an event, we will probably be there for sure.
- [45:54]
Alain Ben Joseph
I want to swing it back to design. Sorry, gentlemen, I'm so intrigued. I'm actually jumping for joy on my seat and I'm blown away and I'm racking my brain. What market you dao I would design. But before I do so, let's talk Moonshot. I see a render on your website. Is that watch ready? Dear Jose, Yes.
- [46:15]
Jose Miranda
So the moonshot was released in December, last year, November. And we start shipping them in March, April. And it's a steady and continuous shipping of watches. We can ship three to four watches per week. That's how fast we can make them. It's a very unique approach. I can explain more about that watch if you want. I think it's very unique approach because when Covid started, I had a few investments in a. In a startup in London. And when that happened, the month before everything closed down, I was. I sold my shares. So I have money in the bank and I had time to think about new designs. So I say I thought myself, okay, so there's nothing to do. Let's start making watches for when this opens up again. And that's when I started thinking about the chronograph. And we were working on a very traditional design. And that same year, or 2021, if, if I'm not wrong, or 22, there were about 70 new chronograph released by most brands. All of them safe, a couple of exceptions. They all look the same. Very traditional, very classic approach. The same and the same and the same and the same. And I said, we can't do this if we release a chronograph. Needs to be something that people are not expecting. So after 100 designs, I sold my designer. Let's stop. We are going into circles. We are not working in the same way we should work for, you know, to. To make something different. And one weekend, so that this was two years later, 2022, I was. We went away for a weekend and I took a graphic novel that I usually love when I travel to read. It's called the Incalculable, designed by Moebius and written by Alexander Jodorowsky. And I was going through the pages and I started seeing shapes because if you read the Incal, you'll see that it's engineering in the future, but with the concepts of the 1970s. So it's sort of retro engineering, but very, very creative. It's absolutely beautiful. Everything, all the details, all the shapes, the streamlined shapes, the alpha cut shapes, the rounded. All the reflections that you see, the turbines, the shapes. You need to see it to understand what I'm trying to explain. And when I was looking at it, I start seeing these specific shapes and I was transmitting to my designer, let's do this, let's do that, change this, change that, let's go there. And then you start adding a few more details. And when the watch was ready and I was really happy with basically what you see on the outside, I said, why don't we only show what we need to show on the dial? Let's add some circles, some disks over the sub dials. And this. What if we do this? Took two more years to develop. Because. Because there is nothing. There was never a chronograph made like this. We had already used the discs on our gmt. We were making a few innovations on other models that will come next year with the discs as well. But on a chronograph with that pinion size, with the strength and the torque that is necessary to reset secondhand and. Sorry, the chronograph, chronographs of dials, there is nothing like that. It didn't exist. So we start testing and it took about two years to do that. So it's a project that took four years from inception to start delivering. And the design is so unique. It's so many levels, so many details, so many easter eggs. Most people take months to find them, but when they find, they send us an email. I just discovered this. It's beautiful. It's incredible. It's so nice. It's so. Thank you. So it's really cool that when people understand the complexity, although it looks so simple and so easy when you look at it, that's the principle. Even the bracelet, so it's a titanium grade 5. It's really hard. And then we apply a coating of DLC as well. The taper on the bracelet and on the rubber is the same, so they taper vertically and horizontally, which means that to make each link, it's a specific CNC programming. They are made one by one, you know, and to sell everything we offer, including a Valjoux 7753 inside for £3,000. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's. It's bonkers, you know, it's. It's ridiculous, you know, if you don't get one watch like that at that price. Sorry, you know, you don't know what you are doing, basically.
- [53:32]
Rob Nudds
Nicely put. And you're absolutely right, of course. And I think the, the proof, as Alan would like to say, is in the pudding there.
- [53:38]
Jose Miranda
So it's.
- [53:39]
Rob Nudds
So it's a wonderful piece. It's unlike pretty much anything else I can point to. And the only drawback is it sets quite a high bar for you in the future. And that's my last question really, to round out what has been a very easy, relaxed and informative show. We've certainly enjoyed it, that's for sure. I know Alon's already counting his pennies and wondering how many isotopes he can buy. Now he's probably also going to put some crazy pitch into you so he can stop them in Amsterdam as well. But hold fast, Jose. Hold on to that profit margin. You need it. Tell me what is coming in the future? What can we expect to see throughout 2026? What can you share with us? Remember, it's a podcast, so nobody can see anything. So you can give us an exclusive and nobody will be sure exactly what you mean until it does finally drop visually next year.
- [54:25]
Jose Miranda
Well, some of them can't be explained without showing them, so I'll skip those. But we have new future versions of the chronograph. We will have the adrium, but on a titanium case in the next few months, or maybe next year, hopefully before Christmas, we will have a new jumping hour that instead of being the hour jumping is the full dial. We have already some images on our Instagram izotope watches that can show you how it works. So it's a prototype. The final design will be introduced in a couple weeks, which is a lot more streamlined, thinner, elegant. It's the refinement that we always apply to our prototypes before starting production, we will also have a new diver. So this new diver, it's the good do 2.0. It's a re edition of the initial skin diver we had a few years ago. But now with more knowledge, more technical solutions, much better constructed, much better design, refined, we are also making a professional diver for 1,000 meters that it's absolutely unnecessary. I call it the unnecessary diver watch. But someone needs to make it. And I love the concept. I love, absolutely love the concept. It came from a very simple idea of an idea with a level when I was hanging a painting on the wall. So expect to see what's coming out from that, from those two things together. I call it the unnecessary because it's going to be our third diver. And you know, it's. Even if you don't. Even if we don't sell, I don't mind. I want one for me. I love the concept. I love the idea. So we need to make it. And we'll also have a new gmt. We will also have a new, very specific fan watch to look at and to play with. And we are also working on other Mercury Evolutions and that's it for now. So we have very, very intense year ahead.
- [57:36]
Rob Nudds
You know, I'd love to see a Mercury in full polished titanium anodized green. Any chance.
- [57:47]
Jose Miranda
It will not be titanium, but we never know.
- [57:52]
Rob Nudds
Exciting, exciting alon anymore.
- [57:57]
Alain Ben Joseph
Well, I have loads more, but I think this was a beautiful episode. I just wanted to say I love the last two sound bites. Somebody has to make it and that says it all what Isotope and Jose are about. And I don't care if nobody buys it. I want. I like it and I want to make it. And you know what? Good for you. Jose. I'm very happy I met you digitally in the virtual studio. I can't wait to shake your hand because you are a man of my liking and I wish you all the best.
- [58:33]
Jose Miranda
Thank you. And likewise, thank you so much. And I'm ready to go, you know, to Netherlands and show you the watches in person. We need to do that.
- [58:43]
Rob Nudds
Well, there you go. Maybe that's a red bar Amsterdam meetup on the table there already. And I'm sure many of our community would love to attend that. They're well accustomed to visiting our lawn in Amsterdam as one of our recent episodes shows with the gang actually speaking live in Ace Jewelers on location. If any of you have questions for us or for Jose, then please do get in touch. You can do so via the usual channels. You can find us on Instagram at therealtime Show. You can use the contact form on the website www.therealtime.show. you can email us directly either Rob Alon or David herealtime Show. And if you want to contact Scarlett, she's on Instagram at scarlintheshire. That's S C A R L I N T H E S H I R E. We will be back soon with more top quality quality watch content and interviews with the industry's finest. Until then, stay safe and keep on ticking.