The Real Time Show – Pascal Beshu Flies Through The History Of Angelus

Podcast: The Real Time Show
Hosts: Rob Nudds & Alon Ben Joseph
Guest: Pascal Beshu (Managing Director, Angelus and Arnold & Son)
Date: September 14, 2025

Overview

In this episode, Rob and Alon dive into the storied past, present, and future of Angelus with Pascal Beshu, who heads both Angelus and Arnold & Son. The conversation spans the brand’s rich heritage, recent revivals, operating within the Citizen Group, and the strategic marriage of contemporary and vintage-inspired watches. Pascal provides frank insights into manufacture realities, collaborations, and the nuances of modern watchmaking.

Pascal Beshu’s Journey in Watchmaking

[00:36 – 05:47]

• Origin Story: Pascal’s passion for watches began in his teens, driven by a love for aesthetics, fine arts, and business.
• Career Path:
  • Early days at TAG Heuer in marketing (late 1990s)
  • Shifted to Ebel and Movado, moving from marketing to commercial roles.
  • Progressed to Harry Winston (headed Europe sales, then global sales).
  • Pivoted briefly to event organization with MCH (Baselworld), halted by COVID-19.
  • Returned to the brand side with Arnold & Son and Angelus during COVID-era restructuring.
• Leadership Role:
  • Now MD of both Angelus and Arnold & Son.
  • "We took the opportunity to really completely redefine the storytelling, the collection, the distribution of the brand."
    – Pascal Beshu [04:23]

Managing Dual Brands and Japanese Group Dynamics

[05:47 – 10:32]

• Balancing Brands:
  • Angelus and Arnold & Son share a luxurious clientele but have distinct heritages and offerings.
  • Retailers often consider both brands as complementary.
• Working Under Citizen Group:
  • Exposure to French, Swiss, American, and now Japanese management cultures.
  • "What strikes me probably the most is the Japanese culture towards craftsmanship and the importance of long term strategy. Everything is about long term strategy..."
    – Pascal Beshu [08:49]
  • Noted for "excellence in execution" and ingrained attention to detail.

Autonomy Within A Large Group

[10:32 – 11:43]

• Freedom & Trust:
  • Earned autonomy in product design and development.
  • Group acts as a "guardian" ensuring brand DNA is preserved.
  • Financial parameters exist, but creative leeway is “a lot greater than in other groups”.

Deep Dive: Angelus Heritage and Revival

[11:43 – 19:53]

• Brand Genesis:
  • Founded 1891 in Le Locle by the Stolz brothers.
  • Renowned as a caliber manufacturer and for horological innovation.
  • Specializations: chronographs, calendar watches, minute repeaters, alarms, long power reserves.
• Iconic Pieces:
  • Monopusher chronograph (1925), collaborations with brands like Panerai and Tiffany.
  • Chronodate (1942): first chronograph with date and full calendar.
  • Dormancy during quartz crisis; revival in 2011 under Manufacture La Joux-Perret.
• Recent Evolution:
  • 2015: Focused relaunch around Tourbillon models using modern materials.
  • 2022: Reconnected with historical roots via the Chronodate reissue.
  • 2023: La Fabrique collection launched to reissue vintage-inspired pieces.

Notable Quote:
"Angelus was obviously known for its timepieces, but was also very much known as a calibre manufacturer that provided some calibers to a variety of brands of the watch industry... The brand is very much known for being extremely innovative, innovative in development of new calibers."
– Pascal Beshu [12:41]

Collection Structure and Strategy

[19:53 – 23:23]

• Modern vs. Vintage:
  • Modern Chronodate and Flying Tourbillon: share familial design, forward-looking style.
  • La Fabrique: authentic, archival re-editions catering to heritage enthusiasts.
  • Dual-pronged approach creates community between new customers and longtime vintage collectors.
• Case Design:
  • Similarity across collections for cohesiveness, not cost-saving; cases are bespoke to complications.

Customer Response and Model Demographics

[23:23 – 26:03]

• Relaunch of Chronodate:
  • Welcomed by collectors; attracted new fans via unique design and technical content.
• La Fabrique Collection:
  • Dramatic expansion of Angelus’ appeal.
  • Leverages a monopusher chronograph caliber with roots in a movement designed by F.P. Journe and friends for Cartier.
• Teaser: New complications from Angelus' past are forthcoming.

Notable Quote:
"The interest on the brand is getting higher and higher. We have the advantage of working with a couple of beautiful in house movements in our collection, especially with the La Fabrique, with this monopusher chronograph, which is actually originally the tha chronograph that has been created by Journe and his friend for the Cartier torture Monopouche conigrasses in the 90s."
– Pascal Beshu [24:43]

Manufacture Realities: In-House or Not?

[26:03 – 37:22]

• Addressing Skeptics:
  • Angelus, Arnold & Son, and La Joux-Perret form a single legal and physical entity.
  • "We are in the same building. We are working daily with all the teams." [26:28]
  • ~98% of caliber components made in-house, except hairsprings.
• Industry Comparison:
  • Parallels drawn with Swatch Group’s ETA/Blancpain relationships—major companies use shared manufacturing.
  • Independent production, as with Roger Smith, is the rare exception.
• Servicing and Longevity:
  • Being deeply integrated ensures future serviceability for customers’ watches.
  • "When you have a fully integrated manufacturer, I mean definitely in many years we will be able to fully service the timepieces that have been purchased by by customer."
    – Pascal Beshu [33:29]
• Transparency Approach:
  • Open about La Joux-Perret’s role but do not market the manufacturing link aggressively.
  • Movements are exclusive by brand and branded accordingly, not as La Joux-Perret references.

Collaboration Culture

[40:02 – 45:24]

• Significant Collabs:
  • Alain Silberstein – Reimagined U10 Tourbillon in bold style (8 pieces, sold out); revived brand buzz around modern Tourbillons.
  • Massena LAB (William Massena) – Co-created Medical Chronograph, launched La Fabrique, generated major collector interest and influenced future strategy.
• Collaboration Philosophy:
  • Collabs must be meaningful, rooted in DNA, and "win-win" for both sides.
  • Teaser: more collaborations coming in 2nd half of the year.
• Praise from the Hosts:
  • "Now my question to you is, did the collabs put you back on the map?... How instrumental were these collabs? And will you do more in the future?"
    – Alon Ben Joseph [41:29]
  • "We want win, win collabs. I love it." – Alon Ben Joseph [45:17]

Memorable Moment:
"Let's take this beautiful movement, but let's revamp it 10 years after with new design codes inspired by Bohos, always with Alain. And actually this, you had a limited edition of eight pieces that has been made and they all went out extremely, extremely quickly."
– Pascal Beshu [42:29]

Looking to the Future

[22:50, 25:51, 41:30, 44:55]

• La Fabrique collection expected to diversify with more historically significant complications.
• Future collaborations teased, but only if authentic and brand-relevant.
• Angelus aims to harmonize its modern and vintage identities in both its product and customer communities.

Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• On Japanese management:
  "What strikes me probably the most is the Japanese culture towards craftsmanship and the importance of long term strategy." – Pascal Beshu [08:49]

• On brand DNA:
  "Both brands have very different histories and very different product offer that end up being very complementary one to the other." – Pascal Beshu [06:56]

• On collaborations:
  "Collabs, you know, it's not for the sake of collaboration. You must have a meaning. It must be rooted to the DNA of the brand. It must make sense. And we are always extremely cautious. You have collabs where you have winners and losers. And what we want to do is always win, win, collapse, you know." – Pascal Beshu [44:18]

Key Segment Timestamps

• Pascal’s watch industry journey: [01:16 – 05:47]
• Japanese vs. Western group management: [08:18 – 09:56]
• Angelus historical deep dive: [12:26 – 19:08]
• La Fabrique collection explained: [18:31 – 21:32]
• In-house manufacture discussion: [26:03 – 37:22]
• Collaboration highlights: [41:35 – 44:55]
• Future directions and wrap-up: [44:55 – End]

Final Thoughts

This episode offered a transparent, in-depth look at how Angelus balances respect for history with modern watchmaking innovation. Pascal Beshu’s candid answers demystify the inner workings of a contemporary "manufacture" and the corporate realities behind luxury brands. Listeners come away with a greater appreciation for Angelus' nuanced strategies—balancing tradition and contemporaneity, in-house integrity with scalability, and the selective, meaningful use of collaborations.